Written By: - Date published: 12:14 pm, November 11th, 2008 - 86 comments
Categories: national/act government -
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A few months ago I asked National supporters who comment here what they wanted to see in terms of hard policy from National. What I got was a lot of Labour bashing but not much else.
Now National is in government there’s a lot of sentiment about how great it is that Labour is gone but nobody has said in any detail what they expect from the National/ACT government.
Interestingly neither have any of the right-wing blogs.
Prior to the election I had been thinking about what I would post on the first day of a Labour/Green victory if it eventuated and I decided it would be a list of what I would like to see done including:
Raising benefit entitlements
Universal student allowances
Strengthening workers’ rights with greater MECA protections and a commitment to a $15 minimum wage
More rehabilitation for criminals and a move away from the punitive model that’s filling up our prisons
Changing the Reserve Bank Act to focus on employment and economic growth
More state housing
Entrenchment of the Maori seats
Greater participatory democracy (including use of citizen juries)
Strengthening the EFA to remove anonymous donations
There were many more but, of course, this is now a hypothetical argument. My point is that we on the Left knew what we wanted and we were ready to push for it. Supporters of the Right don’t seem to know what they want. National talked a lot about ambition and vision during their campaign but never actually declared what that entailed.
Once again I invite those of you who voted National or ACT to explain what change you want.
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It does matter what John Key says. John Key can not do a lurch to the right. He needs to keep is promises. His promises were rather vague. I find that on the left as well. John Key and Helen Clark have both over the years campaigned on higher wages. But they do it in such a vague way that aren’t even beholden to it. But I really feel had Clark moved more to the left and had a clear direct left message she could possibly have got four terms. John Key needs to do what he said during the election, that is a centrist regime. But eventually he also needs a clear right message. Just not something too extreme.
Rave: love the ,“spinsters” Ha Ha!
Remember both Key and English have said “We will do what it takes.” To me in sounds unscrupulous. And what about next time? What if everyone “does what it takes”? It amounts to lies by commission or omission to me.
The Education debate will be very interesting. The Primary school curriculum does currently cover all of National’s policies. Standards for literacy and numeracy are there and have been for some time. ALL 6 year olds are currently tested individually.
The change National may suggest is in the testing itself, this has been tried in the UK and the US with disastrous results eg young children sitting exams, teachers teaching to a subscribed test. However its not clear just what John Key has in mind for education.
My hope would be that any government takes education standards one step further and actually explores and addresses the reasons why children might be failing, and the key is to identify these reasons before they start school. 10 years old is too late.
Oh and just a comment on tertiary students, those poor bastards will still be stuck in a perpetual mire of debt. Many leave university because they cannot afford to live! This has to be fixed fast.
SlightlyRighty:
I want the RMA streamlined.
Already is for almost all applications. Obviously massive projects need a good looking over, and also those that are going to result in huge environmental damage. I suspect what you really mean is you want the standards required by the RMA lower.
I want government spending curtailed by identifying where the wastage is. We need a civil service that is outcome orientated, not process orientated. I want a health service that is patient focussed, not politically focussed. If that requires an under-utilised private health system to take up the capacity the public health system can’t, then so be it. What is the point of spending public money to develop services that already exist?
Your falling for a big dose of kiwiblog spin, the public service already is very efficient compared to most countries, the health service is already very good, and does utilize the private sector to some extent, that’s a decision to be made by an expert not a blog hack though.
I want an education system that focusses more on the basic skills of reading, writing and arithmetic. There has been too much of a focus on secondary education at the expense of the primary sector. Our children need to be taught HOW to learn, and not WHAT to learn. We need a ministry of education, not indoctrination.
Falling for more kiwiblog lies, and how exactly does giving kids exams from a younger age improve anything. As soon as you hit 5th form these days your learning how to pass the NCEA exam, not learn the subject.
We need environmental policies that are not just rhetoric, but results. We need an ETS that acknowledges that the growth of the economy is a priority too, and points to an achievable result.
Your probably going to have to stick that one in the too hard basket then.
I want a government that is inclusive because it wants to be, not because it has to be. Reaching out to the Maori party is a great first step. Not the last cab on the rank anymore are they?
Touchy feely bull shit that has no meaning in reality.
I want a government that understands the challenges that are faced by all new Zealanders and acknowledges problems, not ignores them.
And I want a pony.
I want a pragmatic government that is prepared to admit it is wrong and change it’s mind when faced with alternatives.
You mean a party that’s a slave to opinion polls, will do anything to get elected, and is happy to let a majority trample the rights of a minority?
Lastly I want a government that does what it needs to, not what it wants to, and in doing so, only takes what it needs from us, not what it wants from us.
Make that two ponies.
Brett Dale:
Less State Housing.
Fuck you. I’m sure John Key would just just chuffed too.
Tougher Policies on Youth Crime
New Zealand is an internationally respected model for reduction in youth crime. The policys are exceptionally good, the implementation is average and still its considered a world leader. Yes I’m sure you can point to the little girl murdered up north and so on, but that is definitely the exception too the rule. If you knew anything about youth crime, you wouldn’t be calling for it to be tougher
More emphasis on individual responsibility taught in the school system.
Can you say nanny state? that’s for parents to teach.
A Set amount of time given to the unemployment benefit, then food stamps and accommodation benefit paid.
Does that apply equally to John Keys middle class redundancy welfare? I sure hope so.
Tougher Policies on Youth Crime.
Shut the fuck up.
No Government interference in who a PRIVATE holder can or cannot sell their shares too.
I see why your saying private, with John Keys impending massive fuck up on forcing nz based investment with super annuation funds.
An open debate and discussion on Climate Change.
Your not going to like the outcome.
An Immigration Policy not based on race.
Gee, you’ll be lucky with National, I hope you haven’t been dog whistling over Ahmed Zaoui too.
Tougher Policies on Youth Crime.
Moron.
Tax Cuts.
Pony please. I think we’re up to three now actually.
No resource consent needed for a person’s private property.
Because obviously nothing I do to my property is able to inflict an externality on my neighbors.
Gay marriage should be legal.
Faimly first will not be impressed.
Dope should be legal (to keep the hippies quiet)
Flying pig to go with my three ponies thank you very much
Free speech applies to everybody and not just socialist protesters.
More mind-numbingly stupid kiwiblog talking points. Ever considered your ideology might have clouded your judgment? I didn’t think so! Show me where in the law it specifically refers to socialist protesters.
Tougher Policies on Youth Crime.
Your contributing to making NZ a more dangerous place, I hope your proud.
Cut the waiting Time at Hospitals.
And cut taxes? That deserves another pony.
Support Small Business owners and their rights to hire/ fire who they like.
I want the right to rob what banks I like. Maybe if those small business owners had a clue what they were doing it would not be such a problem.
Tougher Policies on Youth Crime.
I hope your the victim of the bad policy your advocating.
Less Anti American BS.
I’ll get the thought police onto it immediately.
Tougher Policies on Youth Crime.
Tell me when you are a victim of it, I want to come and laugh at you in court.
Personally from John Key I’d like four ponies and a flying pig.
There’s no more simplistic slogan-based and idiotic a policy than ACT’s “limit government spending increases to the rate of inflation plus population growth”.
What happens with a recession (economy shrinks as currently), will the spending be cut accordingly?
What happens with all the extra spending Key has promised already? Instantly you have two diametrically opposed positions.
At least with ACT apparently rolling over for some minor ministerial position(s), lefty Key has a nice out if the economy is shrinking now but spending increases are bedded in….. over the mid-term he will be able to apply ACT’s policy but still have government spending in both absolute terms and proportional to the whole economy much higher than Labour ever did.
Longstanding core ACT supporters should shudder – Roger’s philosophical and fiscal purity has been thrown out the window of expendiency in favour of Rodney’s sloganeering.
KITNO: No ponies for you until you learn the difference between `your’ and `you’re’.
L
Bill.
My point about education, in that children should be taught how to think, and not what to think, seems to have eluded you somewhat.
You may consider this somewhat paradoxical, but the place of teachers in society is a special one. I do not want to see any situation where the teachers are used by any political faction to indoctrinate students to a certain political point of view.
We have seen this in other parts of the world. In the US for example, primary school textbooks are having pictures of food deemed non-nutritious removed. References to the Founding Fathers are deleted, Mount Rushmore is not mentioned for fear of offending Native Americans.
In 1988, Stanford University voted to change the Western Culture course, one of the most popular on campus, to “Cultures, Ideas and Values.” The fifteen-book requirement was dropped and replaced with the admonition to give substantial attention to issues of race and gender. The reading list now had to include a quota of works by women and minorities. Out goes Shakespeare, in comes Burgos-Debray.
Shakespeare is deemed to be racist, sexist, and classist, a product of the ultimate evil–Western Civilization. French writer Elisabeth Burgos-Debray is, on the other hand, politically correct. One of her works, now part of the Stanford curriculum, describes a Guatemalan woman’s struggle against capitalist oppression. She rejects marriage and motherhood and becomes a feminist, a socialist, and finally a Marxist, arguing politics with fellow revolutionaries in Paris. According to the author, this simple Guatemalan woman speaks for all the Indians of the American continent.
An ironic twist to this revolution is that when writings of third- world authors are included in the curriculum, they rarely are the classics from that culture. Instead, they tend to be recent, Marxist, and politically correct works.
Even maths and science were cited as culturally biased because they failed to give credit to contributions from other cultures.
These are the sort of areas I am talking about when I talk of our children being taught what to think. I’m not saying they should not be exposed to these ideas, but to all ideas appropriate to the level of the student. Education must be apolitical. It cannot allow a student to be led to conclusion, but must allow that student to reach his or her own conclusion, based on all the information.
If you think education in NZ is not so biased, look at any noticeboard in any teachers staffroom.
“If you think education in NZ is not so biased, look at any noticeboard in any teachers staffroom.”
You saying they all vote Labour?????????
Killinginthenameof:
That has to be the most pathetic and immature reply I have even seen on any forum and I have been to the freerepublic.
Saying Shutthefuckup, doesn’t really add to the debate.
How old are you by the way?
SR,
I’m not in any way arguing with your opinons of Stanford’s curriculum as I have no personal knowledge of it, but I would be interested to see any concrete examples like these within NZ’s curriculum. I’m not claiming that our education system is perfect, but having been a recent product of the education system, and having younger siblings enrolled in primary and secondary schools, I don’t believe that schools are teaching children what to think. Is there any specific part of what is taught in NZ schools that you feel is biased?
Brett Dale – you said Gay marriage should be legal I think most here would agree with you, but most national MPs voted against civil unions and not because they wanted to go whole hog with gay marriage either. Do you remember Franks saying gays marrying is like someone marrying their dog.
Less Anti American BS. You mean like we should join in their wars or something. Tell us Brett, because I presume you’re talking about government here otherwise this conflicts with you free speech stuff, how was our government anti-american?
Dope should be legal (to keep the hippies quiet)
Do you or do you not realise that National are conservatives? Because you’re dreaming if you think there is going to be anything socially progressive like gay marriage and drug law reform from these conservatives.
And Brett what on your list was actual National policy? FA
slightyrighty: Education. Unfortunately the more that education focus on testing, the more restrictive it gets. It is easy to measure factual recall. Hard to measure thinking skills. I like the: “Children are not vessels waiting to be filled. They are fires waiting to be lit.” And the fires are dampened by testing and ranking as apparently John Key is going to instigate.
Will Private schools be part of the Testing regime?
Further to the politicisation of Education under Labour.
The situation in NZ is not as bad as some other countries, thanks in part to vigilance on the part of many, but consider these questions from the 2004 NCEA economics paper.
The 2004 Level 3 Economics exam included the questions “The New Zealand government provides ‘free’ education at state secondary schools. Explain why this results in a better resource allocation than the free market,” and “Explain why using ‘free market’ policies causes income inequality”
Daffodil Gal, this is a more blatent example. The only way you could be totally aware of bias in education would be to compare what you have been taught to what your parents may have been taught.
Can you make that comparison? If you can within that school system then my point is not valid. I’m hoping that you can, and that the school does not restrict that information to you.
(Captcha: Unearthed how)
“Brett Dale
Killinginthenameof:
That has to be the most pathetic and immature reply I have even seen on any forum and I have been to the freerepublic.
Saying Shutthefuckup, doesn’t really add to the debate.
How old are you by the way?”
I’m 21, how old are you?
Please go and read a bit about youth crime, or even run the (population corrected) statistics on the statastics nz site. Youth crime is one of the biggest unknown success stories around.
Basically a lot of teenagers do dumb things growing up, most of them are delt to with a stern talking to, their parents being told about it, and in the case of vandalism, informal arrangements are made at repairing the damage.
Each additional incident of police involvement greatly increases the chance of future criminal behaviour. For the most part, a stern talking to be the police is enough to get teenagers back on the straight and narrow, this is best done with dedicated youth aid officers, who have a range of tools at their disposal so they can respond in an appropriate manner. With a range from stern talking to, youth aid intervention, family group conferences ect, there is a low rate of re-offending.
What you’re (Wohoo I got it right!) suggesting is probably I assume along the lines of New York style broken windows policy. Coming down harshly on all teenagers turns them from kids doing something dumb with out considering the consequences into criminals. What the studies do point to how ever is a small group of persistent offenders (around 5% comes to mind but I’m not entirely sure) who this approach does not work on. Often neglected badly and\or from families of criminals. They are a much harder nut to crack, sending them to prison is appropriate.
My problem is groups like the sensible sentencing trust, and other tough on crime groups is they want to throw out the massive progress made on the part of almost all youth crime, in order to try and deal with a tiny minority. This only comes about through either ignorance of the statistics and assessments, or from an ideological position that pushes for revenge.
Either way, I sincerely hope the National Party ministers look at the numbers, and see what’s happening, before they go and act upon it. They are elected to reduce crime, personally I think the country has been duped by the sensible sentencing trust and similar groups into thinking that harsher sentences are a way to achieve this.
The right seem to think education is more about being taught how to think, do we need new entrants exams for 5 year old’s , most teachers today can see a child that isn’t doing well by everyday classroom activities or by noticing which parents don’t turn up to meet the teacher nights. I’m all for more resources going to kids who are falling behind at school with extra help , teacher aids or what ever works. Maybe National want to be more like Japan with cram schools for kids who are not doing well in tests?
“slightlyrighty
but consider these questions from the 2004 NCEA economics paper.
The 2004 Level 3 Economics exam included the questions “The New Zealand government provides ‘free’ education at state secondary schools. Explain why this results in a better resource allocation than the free market,’
Because the education has a positive externality, that is the social marginal benefit is greater than the personal marginal benefit. By subsidizing education this externality can be internalized.
Hardly controversial?
and “Explain why using ‘free market’ policies causes income inequality’”
I don’t know what you’re arguing here, on a Lorenz Curve, due to the policies of the previous 20 years income inequality has increased, they aren’t making a value judgment on it, they are stating a fact and asking for an explanation.
If anyone’s interested here’s the exam http://www.nzqa.govt.nz/nqfdocs/ncea-resource/exams/2004/90631-exm-04.pdf
bobo – you’ve got it right there.
We don’t want an education system here anything like that in Japan or Korea which is the way the righties seem to want to go. These systems may get good outcomes out of some people but they destroy others. Righties have you ever heard of Hikikomori – complete social withdrawl in young people. If you put too much pressure on young people whose mind’s are just developing that can be the result and that is often the result in countires with the kind of perverse educational systems you are proposing.
I wasn’t sitting Level 3 in 2004, but I know that my own economics classes (from year 11 – Scholarship) did not demonise capitalism or free-market policies. In fact, we were taught that in most cases the market is the most effective tool for resource allocation. The question you referred to may have used an example that could be construed as political, but it was allowing students to demonstrate that they had also absorbed the lesson that leaving everything up to the market isn’t ALWAYS 100% fine and dandy. It wasn’t until I reached university that I was even introduced to alternative economic theories.
It also concerns me that National have placed such a focus on standardised testing in primary schools. It has been shown time and time again (in USA, for example) that creating testing standards leads to the inevitable “teaching to the test” approach by educators. Look back to your school exam days- do you really recall the things you had to memorise? I can honestly say that I learnt more through class debates and being read aloud to at intermediate than I learnt and retained through studying for any exam. And I’m not just b*tching. I was good at exams. But not all kids are, and it’s not what education is supposed to be about.
What does your child’s school report look like? My sister’s (who is about ten) has sections for reading, writing, numeracy, social skills, art etc. The teacher indicates whether the child “needs improvement” is “developing well” or “exceeds expectations” (not sure if that’s the wording though) which already makes it pretty clear whether or not she is where she should be. I don’t think that handing Mum a piece of paper that says “Little Mary is better than 100% of kids in her class at reading and 95% at maths” when she comes to pick you up from Queen Margaret in her BMW is going to make a huge difference. I will be interested to see what actually happens in education in the next three years. I suspect (okay, hope) that Key will take a look at his proposed national standards and realise it’s not practical or sensible.
Mandatory assessment of national standards throughout primary and secondary school will place a massive burden on already-overworked teachers, taking more time away from them to actually teach. This is somewhat ironical from the party of cutting red tape. If not very carefully implemented, or not accompanied by increased funding for teachers or hiring of bureaucrats to do the admin work it’ll worsen teaching outcomes. Ironically it’ll make the poor outcomes easier to measure. Speaking as a former teacher, this sort of thing already saps enough of your soul and detracts enough of your time away from the business of equipping people to participate in society, where funding and staffing won’t be such an issue.
A more cynical person might argue they’re a means of driving students and their families to private schools.
L
I’ve had two people at work tell me they’re glad National is in power, because they’re sure John Key will repeal the s59 changes and dump Kyoto.
That’s the trouble with not having any actual policy on the table for the election campaign – the mouth-breathing nutbars in your support base will simply Make Shit Upâ„¢, so it should be highly entertaining watching them go feral when it’s apparent John Key has no intention of following through with the policy assumptions from loopy-land.
IMHO, National will do about nine of the policies I stated.
Ah this discussion of education doesnt add up.
Where is the revolutionary critique of capitalism?
How come there is no NCEA question on ‘surplus value’?
How come the curriculum doesnt mention ‘alienation’?
Oh dear I’m going to have to write to the minister about bourgeois hegemony.
Hope s/he can think.
I want them to give the cops orders to flush out and destroy all the the creepy little dweebs with noisy cars or is that too much to ask!
“randal
I want them to give the cops orders to flush out and destroy all the the creepy little dweebs with noisy cars or is that too much to ask!”
NOOOOOOOO (Though I did spend a significant amount of money quieting my car down, Japanese car enthusiasts (me) are massively persecuted due to the behavior of predominantly Japanese car owning boy racers (them), I will not stand for it!)
As a side note there is a significant legal abnormality in some of the legislation dealing with car modification, but I’m not sure The Standard is the place to be discussing that!
Brett – The post said: Once again I invite those of you who voted National or ACT to explain what change you want.
And by your own admission a National led government won’t do most of the things on your list (which are platitudes and not policies anyway). So it proves the point of the post you righties don’t know what you’re voting for.
Lampie said:
“”Making the Education system more transparent.’
Ha, what a joke, elaborate please”
It might involve replacing the walls of classrooms with glass?
One of the things you said you wanted in the original post was more stae housing.
This is important to me, I would like a country with no state houses. No state houses because nobody needs one. A country where people are equipped through education and the desire to work and can take care of their own housing needs,. Having people need a state house represents a failure by society to equip people. Sure there are a few who with illness etc will need help but why don’t we try to build a society where we need less state houses not more, less welfare dependence not more. less reliance on the state not more.
Would that not be a better society.
Everyone who needs help should get real meaningful help and we should strive to reduce this need.
Giving people an inadequate welfare payment, as both previous governments have done does not help people in fact the effect this has had on more and more people in NZ is shameful. So lets help these people by giving them independance from the state.
Robin
Yet again, that is an irrelevant wishlist. Nothing to do with voting National.
…and ponies. Ponies with cute little faces. That do no crimes and earn lots of money cleaning up after office workers, and serving them food.
That’d be sweeeet.
I want a black and white pony. With a nice long tail.
World peace?
Look, you idiots – the question wasn’t `what do you want’, but `what policy do you want the government to implement to make it happen?’
If you don’t know, just say so, for fuck’s sakes.
L
Gingercrunch:
I’m not sure what there is to like about the Key FTTH (fibre-to-the-home) plan. It will simply not create economic value to NZ in proportion to the investment required.
The Australian Government has launched a similar initiative for FTTN (fibre-to-the-node, ie streetside cabinet). This is what we are getting in NZ ‘free’ thanks to Labour and specifically Cunliffe, and the Commitments they got from Telecom as part of it’s Operational Seperation Undertakings. FTTH is far more ambitious, involved and costly than FTTN. In Australia the programme is starting to come apart, with the companies that initially got onboard gradually jumping ship.
What’s more, just in the last day The Age newspaper has published a well-written and critical op-ed validly questioning the economic value of the Aussie FTTN initiative. If with Australia’s scale such a relatively simple initiative is uneconomic (and I acknowledge their greater geography, but observe their population is much more urbanised) then how will the much more complex FTTH be economic for NZ?
As it is most if not all NZ businesses that would benefit from fibre have access to it already. There is already considerable fibre infrastructure available around the country on a commercial subscription basis, in the places where it would most be utilised (see http://www.broadbandmap.govt.nz/map and select “Telecom Group: Fibre Optic Network” for an indication).
So the FTTH plan is really about homes/consumers rather than business (after all it’s the consumers that had the vote). Based on the commitment, we the taxpayer would fund fibre into every building including both Key’s Omaha holiday home and the shabbiest shack out the back of the Hokianga.
This may deliver some economic value, for example by enabling more effective teleworking, but nothing in proportion to the investment. As Allan Freeth, TelstraClear CEO observes, the main benefit would be faster downloads of porn and movies into peoples homes.
Such a plan really is the worst example of government largesse since Think Big.
Thankfully, I don’t expect this expenditure to ever happen. My guess is that given the lack of actual detail around the plan, the fiscal and economic conditions, and ACT’s involvement at some level in the government, that it will be some time before the plan is launched if at all. If it is, it will then suffer the same slow, lingering death that the Australian initiative appears to be afflicted with.
That said I watch with interest what eventuates. This promise was the first major one from Key, and the only really significant difference from Labour policy apart from the get-tough-on-crime rhetoric and sloganeering. If as I believe most likely it fails, then his first commitment made is the first broken, with more to come. Meanwhile the glaringly acute philosophical differences between “often to the left of Helen Clark” Key and ACT that have been buried in shallow ground will be exposed and gnawed over.
Remember… you read it here first.
Quoth the Raven – I know a bit about hikikomori and NZ has had such a high youth suicide rate which has parallels i’m sure, anyone remember the problem japanese kids that got sent out here and they ended up killing one of them in a group bashing?
I hope primary school remains a time of fun and learning the basics with teachers that encourage and inspire, not just cramming for exams, there is plenty enough time the rest of your life for that.
Yes but Robin that’s all very nice but what happens when everyone in this new, equal society wants to go out and eat at a restaurant? Who will wait on them?
Bad example I know, but this whole we will all be equal one day thing will never work, not even under communism, there will always be hegemony, the key is how vulnerable and transparent said hegemony is. Also, the goal really shouldn’t be to make everything equal, because that destroys incentives, rather make things less inequal, as progressive tax and WFF do. Take money off those who can afford it at the margins to help those who can’t compete in the market better and try and invest and save out of dependency.
And, no welfare? The problem is not that there’s too much welfare, it’s that there isn’t enough for the poor and uneducated. Remove the burden of supporting a family through training allowances and allow them to pick themselves up. Don’t cut their benefits and make the other illegal options more desireable.
captcha: for overtook