web analytics
The Standard
Advertising

Back to school for Parata

Written By: - Date published: 8:01 am, May 22nd, 2012 - 26 comments
Categories: education - Tags:

Parata on The Nation: “what we’ve had is a five-fold increase in the number of teachers while we’ve only had a 2% increase in students”. There are 52,500 teachers. Is Parata really saying there were only 10,500 a decade ago? The minister needs remedial maths, methinks.

This is the tragedy: our kids’ education being toyed with by nincompoops and dullards whose objective has nothing to do with education and everything to do with crushing teachers’ unions for ideological and political reasons.

Update: It also turns out that Parata has been saying teachers are paid an average of $71,000. In fact, that’s the average including head teachers and those in management. The real average wage for all teachers is $47,000. Guess Parata needs to do some primary school level set theory too.

26 comments on “Back to school for Parata”

  1. Carol 1

    Aha! So here we have the truth about that claim by Parata that the average teacher pay is $71,000.

    http://www.nbr.co.nz/article/police-paid-more-teachers-because-life-line-parata-ck-119149

    Speaking on yesterday’s TV3’s The Nation programme, Ms Parata conceded that while police started their careers at a salary of around $45,000, teachers got around $10,000 less.

    Ms Parata said the average pay for teachers, including head teachers and those in management positions was $71,000 but for the full range of teachers was it was only $47,232.

    • Aha.

      I also could not understand that figure and my wife who is a senior teacher was wondering what happened to her pay … 

  2. Clashman 2

    It’s called lying.

  3. Colonial Viper 3

    Five times more teachers means that class sizes must now be around the 6 students per teacher mark. Amazing!

  4. Dv 4

    If you divide the amount teachers are paid by no employed ie principals to first year teacher the average is about 71k

    • Carol 4.1

      But using that stat is misleading because most people take it for the median wage: ie that 50% of teachers earn more than that.

    • Colonial Viper 4.2

      If you divide the amount teachers are paid by no employed ie principals to first year teacher the average is about 71k

      Yeah, just like how port of Auckland worker is paid $200,000 p.a. if you average in the pay of the Tony Gibson CEO and the rest of the executive team.

      • Dv 4.2.1

        This is the comment i made on 19th may.

        19 May 2012 at 5:41 pm

        Parata is quoting average teacher salary of 71,000 , only reached after several years experience.

        that is the top of the scale for a class room teacher AND it started on the 13th of may this year.

        So the 71k cannot be the average for the ‘ordinary’ teacher.

        I smell spin.

  5. tc 5

    WTF is wrong with the so called MSM when they allow a minister to lie so blatantly.

    Are they so under the thumb of this gov’t or are they badly prepared, or both, that they’ve no numbers at their fingertips to be able to refute and challenge a minister.

    Key and his ministers have been doing this for years and continue unchallenged, what a joke our media is.

    • ghostwhowalksnz 5.1

      Tolley generally stayed away from interviews as she couldnt give any coherent message.

      It seems that Trish Parata is stuck in the same babbling brook

    • muzza 5.2

      TC – This is what you get when you have coporations (media), which depend on advertising revenues, being driven by tabloid style politics, aimed at an ever declining public cranial capacity! Not forgetting that global media is the propaganda arm of those same warmongering, government controlling banking cartels!

      Those who pass as journalists and reporters these days are the epitomy of uninformed (faces), who do not have the thinking capacity or time for proper research. If they lack the numbers to challenge, that is one thing, if they are being told not to challenge, that is another!

      We can expect nothing from the MSM, that is not in their best interests, its as simple as that!

  6. captain hook 6

    so parata cant do sums.
    its a fair bet she cant read either.

  7. fabregas4 7

    I equally find it hard to believe that the average wage of teachers alone is $47k (and I am on their side). There is a consensus I think that the average age of teaching staff in the country is increasing and this would mean that a great number of teachers would have passed through the salary steps. Unit payments would also play a part. That said haven’t met too many teachers who don’t deserve their pay. The cost of training to be a teacher also needs to be considered. Most teachers end up with substantial student debt – too be even greater now with 4 year qualification. If you want to make the comparison with the police – they get paid whilst training and begin their working life, as difficult as it is, without the burden of student loans.

  8. prism 8

    That’s the trouble with percentages. You need to know the base amount that it refers to. They seem such an easy way for us ordinary people to make judgments but are just part of the picture. There’s a cynical saying that 100% rise from 0 is still 0. Percentages are not simple measures and give wrong understandings as in the use of confusing. statistics.

    I read that figure of $71,000 and thought it was amazingly high from my understanding of teacher’s salaries. That it refers to principals and head teachers and secondary specialist teachers in science etc. would be more likely. The throwaway figures given to the media to disseminate amongst the unwary public is another indication of the irrational and sly way that pollies treat their preparation and presentation of policy. In a modern society we expect better than being led by the nose as poor ignorant peasants.

  9. Wayne 10

    Why are so many of the stats in The Standard in the primary articles often so demonstrably wrong. It has been known for a long time that the $71,000 covers all teachers, those starting through to those with management responsibility. The $47,000 is a starting salary for graduates. I know the scale starts lower, but that is for teachers without a graduate qualification and is really a relic of the past. The reality is that all new teachers need a graduate qualification. ZETETIC could have easily checked all of this before he posted.

    [Parata herself has admitted the average for all teachers in $47,000. Teachers start on $35,000 and the peak base rate is $71,000. It’s in the collective. It’s funny how the right begrudge teachers their modest pay when many of them are on massively higher incomes and do fuck all. Zet]

  10. Ross 11

    Earlier this year I asked the Ministry of Education for details of secondary school teachers’ pay. I got dicked around but eventually was informed that the average pay is $65,659 (and this figure excludes the pay of principals, deputy principals, assistant principals, and relievers and also excludes allowances). I was further informed that 6,075 employees (secondary teachers?) were paid below this figure and 15,708 employees above this figure.

  11. Stephen D 12

    I was told once that some time back, a teachers pay and a backbenchers pay were the same rate. Is there any way to verify that? Can’t find my round the Statistics Dept.

  12. captain hook 13

    All this focus on teachers.
    what about the pupils.
    how are there percentages.
    are they getting any smarter?

  13. Wayne 14

    As the Collective demonstates (good that it was included in the comment by Zet) the starting salary for a Q3 teacher (a person who has a 3 year degree) is $45,568 and a Q3+ teacher (a person with a 3 year degree and a diploma of teaching) is $46,908. I suggest it would be very difficult for anyone now to get a first time teaching position without these qualifications. That is why $47,000 is not the average.

  14. sunshine 15

    So is this the same math that says port workers get 91,000 a year?
    Every day we see more and more common trends, privatisation, reduction of services, figures that don’t add up…pretty obvious really. How thick do they think we are?
    Oh yeah, they want to cut education, so they make sure people don’t have the thinking skills to analyse their spin.

  15. Hateatea 16

    Payrates for Primary teachers
    Pay for primary school teachers varies depending on qualifications and experience.

    With a three-year Diploma of Teaching qualification, you start on $34,847 a year. Pay rises each year for seven years to $55,621 – the maximum on this pay scale. 
    With a three-year Bachelor of Education (Teaching) or equivalent, or an Advanced Diploma of Teaching, you start on $45,568. You can reach a maximum of $67,413 after seven years.
    With four years’ tertiary study, you start on $46,908 a year, and can reach a maximum of $70,877 after seven years.

    and for Secondary
    Pay
    Secondary school teachers with four years’ tertiary study start on $47,023 a year, but can earn more depending on additional qualifications and experience. 
    Pay increases each year for seven years according to a fixed scale, with the maximum pay $71,000 a year.

    Secondary school teachers may earn more than this if:

    they take on management roles such as dean or head of department
    they teach the shortage subjects of maths, physics, chemistry, English, or te reo Māori, where they receive an extra $3,500 a year for up to five years, paid in their third, fourth and fifth years of teaching
    they teach in a school that is identified as one that is hard to staff, where they receive an extra $3,500 in their third, fourth and fifth years of teaching
    they teach in a private or independent school, which sometimes pay an extra $2,000 to $3,000 a year.

    Source: ‘Secondary Teachers’ Collective Agreement’, 2011, and Ministry of Education website.
    Either the minister assumes that all are on the maximum or she is feeding us spin in the hope that we will believe her uncritically. Surely not?

  16. DH 17

    Something I think Labour & Greens need to improve on is their research & challenging of this Govts abuse of statistics. We’ve had this discussion on average teachers pay before and it’s still not settled. This link shows the numbers;

    http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/ED1009/S00093/teacher-pay-figures-are-correct.htm

    Note a couple of points they make;

    “The total base salary bill for secondary teachers for that fortnight’s pay was $46 million. The total allowances bill for secondary teachers was $4.5 million. ”

    Then they say;

    “Added together, base salary plus allowances provided the total pay for secondary teachers.

    “We divided that total pay by the 18,522 secondary teachers on the teacher salary payroll, and arrived at the figure of $71,110.”

    But, and here’s the big but, their factoid says….

    • Payday: 7 April 2010

    • Number of FTE secondary teachers: 18,522

    • Total base salary paid: $46,023,875

    • Total allowances paid: $4,494,135

    • Total pay: $50,518,010

    • Total pay divided by number of teachers = $2,727.46

    • $2,727.46 multiplied by 26.07 (total number of pay periods per year) = $71,110.

    Note the bit about FTE teachers. That’s stands for Full Time Equivalents and it cannot exist on a teacher salary payroll, it’s a calculated number not a real one. Yet they claim to be using payroll figures. That suggests the numbers are not simple maths as stated in that article and may have been manipulated to give a false average.

    It also still hasn’t been resolved whether the average includes the 310 principals and 627 senior management who are counted as teachers by MED but don’t actually teach. They’d take the average up a lot since they get paid heaps more than teachers. Info on that here;

    http://www.educationcounts.govt.nz/statistics/schooling/teaching_staff

    Would be nice to see this settled for once & for all.

    Also note that Paratas 52,000 teachers is not FTE, they use the big numbers when it suits them.

  17. Simon 18

    So using these figures.

    50,518,010 as total pay for fortnight and 26.07 pay periods

    for 18522 FTEs you get $71,110

    for 52,000 teachers average is actually $25,327.
    This also includes all part time teachers.

    Median will be somewhere in between

Important links

Recent Comments

Recent Posts

1 2 3 7

  • Time for NZ to prohibit the killing of great apes
    That ban was widely hailed, and spurred efforts in other countries to get similar bans. However, apes are still being exploited, abused and killed, both in captivity and in the wild. Examples of cruelty, neglect and abuse abound. Apes are… ...
    GreensBy Mojo Mathers MP
    1 day ago
  • Auckland building consents: Tragic
    The only word to describe the latest building consent figures for Auckland is ‘tragic’, Labour’s Housing spokesperson Phil Twyford says. “Whatever the Government is doing to address the Auckland housing crisis, it is clearly not working. ...
    1 day ago
  • A whiff of a new biosecurity scandal?
    A pest which could create havoc for New Zealand’s horticulture and agriculture sector must be as much a focus for the Government as hunting out fruit flies, Labour’s Biosecurity spokesperson Damien O’Connor says. “While the Ministry for Primary Industries is… ...
    1 day ago
  • Government shrugs off health sector crisis
    Despite new evidence showing that cuts to health spending are costing lives the Government continues to deny the sector is struggling, Labour’s Health spokesperson Annette King says. “Health services in New Zealand are in crisis. ...
    2 days ago
  • Parata lowered the bar for failing charter school
    When Hekia Parata became aware that the Whangaruru charter school was experiencing major problems her first action was to drop standards by reducing the number of qualified teachers they had to employ, Labour’s Education spokesperson Chris Hipkins has revealed. “Hekia… ...
    2 days ago
  • National not being straight about the economy
    John Key and Bill English need to be straight with New Zealanders about the damage their failure to diversify the economy is doing, after new figures show export growth plunged due to a collapse in dairy exports, says Grant Robertson.… ...
    2 days ago
  • Mind the Gap
    This week the International Monetary Fund released a report on the wider economic value in closing the gender pay gap. When even the bastions of free-market economics start to raise concerns about gender pay gaps, we have to realise how… ...
    GreensBy Jan Logie MP
    2 days ago
  • Labour will hold National to parental leave promise
    Labour will hold National to its promise to increase the support given to new parents of premature, multiple birth and babies born with disabilities, Labour’s paid parental leave campaigner Sue Moroney says. "I am naturally disappointed that after battling for… ...
    3 days ago
  • It was all just pillar talk
    Steven Joyce’s confession that he can no longer guarantee a pillar-free design for the New Zealand International Convention Centre shows the Government has abandoned its dream of creating an ‘iconic’ ‘world-class’ structure, says Labour Economic Development spokesperson David Clark. “Steven… ...
    3 days ago
  • Australians move on offshore speculators
    John Key might want to have a quiet word with Australian Prime Minister Tony Abbott about Canberra's just-announced crack down on offshore speculators when he visits New Zealand this week, Labour's Housing spokesperson Phil Twyford says."Tony Abbott's centre right government… ...
    3 days ago
  • Government at odds on overseas driver crashes
    National backbencher Jacqui Dean has spoken out about overseas driver crashes, putting herself at odds with Prime Minister John Key who is on record as saying it’s not a big issue, Labour’s Transport spokesperson Phil Twyford says. “I’m not surprised… ...
    3 days ago
  • Human Rights and the Palestine Crisis
    Last week I heard two Palestinians speak at Wellington events about the ongoing crisis in their country. Samar Sabawi spoke to a full house about the history of Palestine and gave us a lucid and disturbing account of the situation… ...
    GreensBy Catherine Delahunty MP
    3 days ago
  • Time to take real care of our kids
    An Amnesty International report has once again criticised New Zealand’s track record on looking after our kids, Labour’s Children’s spokesperson Jacinda Ardern says. The annual report, which looks at global human rights abuses highlights not only the fact that high… ...
    3 days ago
  • John Key wrong about Labour’s war vote
    John Key’s desperate claims that the former Labour Government didn’t put combat troop deployment to a Parliamentary vote are simply wrong, Labour’s Defence spokesperson Phil Goff says. “It was disgraceful that the Prime Minister ran rough shod over democracy and… ...
    3 days ago
  • Māori language bill needs work
     It is clear that the first draft of the Māori Language Bill was about structures and funding rather than the survival of te reo Māori, Labour’s Māori Development Spokesperson Nanaia Mahuta says.  “Labour is pleased that the Minister of Māori… ...
    3 days ago
  • Report proves troubled school shouldn’t have opened
    The long-awaited release of an Education Review Office report into Northland’s troubled Whangaruru charter school proves it should never have been approved in the first place, Labour’s Education spokesperson Chris Hipkins says. “This report identifies problems with absenteeism and disengaged… ...
    4 days ago
  • Reply to PM’s statement on deploying troops to Iraq
    “The decision of any Government to send troops to a conflict zone is a very serious one, and it is right that this House takes time to consider it, to debate it, and, ideally, to vote on it, but we… ...
    4 days ago
  • Minister must take action on death trap slides
    Workplace Relations Safety Minister Michael Woodhouse must take urgent action to ensure inflatable amusement rides don’t become death traps for children, Labour’s spokesperson on Labour Relations Iain Lees-Galloway says. “No one wants to stop kids having fun, but horror stories… ...
    4 days ago
  • Manus Island and the New Zealand Government
    This week the Greens have participated in awareness activity about Manus Island, the refugee camp on an island in Papua New Guinea where Australia dumps asylum seekers. John Key says that he has every confidence in the Australian Government’s claim… ...
    GreensBy Catherine Delahunty MP
    1 week ago
  • Election Inquiry – Getting accessible voting on the agenda
    James Shaw has been doing a series of blogs on the Election Inquiry into last year’s general election.  I thought this was a great opportunity to raise an issue very dear to me – accessible voting. Last year’s general election… ...
    GreensBy Mojo Mathers MP
    1 week ago
  • RMA changes no solution to Christchurch housing
    Housing will continue to be a big issue in 2015. The latest Consumer Price Index, released last month, shows both good news and bad news on the housing front. After years of being the most expensive place to build a… ...
    GreensBy Eugenie Sage MP
    1 week ago
  • Saving kokako in South Auckland’s Hunua Ranges
    It is amazing that you can hear the song of the endangered North Island kokako in South Auckland’s Hunua Ranges, less than 50 kms from the central city. A heavy schedule of policy workshops at the Green Party’s Policy… ...
    GreensBy Eugenie Sage MP
    2 weeks ago
  • Let’s not turn a blind eye to human rights
    The Cricket World Cup has just opened in New Zealand, and it’s an opportunity for us to shine on the world stage. International sport can be a chance for us to build relationships with other countries, and examine what it… ...
    GreensBy Catherine Delahunty MP
    2 weeks ago
  • Its Just Not Cricket
    This week it was my privilege to work with Sri Lankan Tamil communities in this country and host Australian journalist and human rights advocate Trevor Grant. I knew a bit about Trevor from his biography but I didn’t know just… ...
    GreensBy Catherine Delahunty MP
    2 weeks ago
  • Time for NZ to #BeCrueltyFree
    The Government is about to progress the final stages of the Animal Welfare Amendment bill. This will be our last opportunity to get changes made to improve the bill to ensure a better outcome for animals. I have put forwards… ...
    GreensBy Mojo Mathers MP
    2 weeks ago
  • We want access!
    Access to buildings is a big issue for many New Zealanders. It looks like that, due to the hard work and persistence of people in the disability community, the Government may finally be starting to take access to buildings seriously.… ...
    GreensBy Mojo Mathers MP
    2 weeks ago
  • Greens call on Super Fund to divest from fossil fuels
    The Green Party today called on the New Zealand Superannuation Fund (the Fund) to divest from fossil fuels, starting immediately with coal. The call was accompanied with a new report, Making money from a climate catastrophe: The case for divesting… ...
    GreensBy Russel Norman MP
    2 weeks ago
  • Young Kiwis’ housing crisis
    Shelter is a fundamental human need along with food, water and clean air. All humans need adequate shelter; it’s a human right. Warm, safe, stable accommodation is critical for young people to be able learn and grow and just be.… ...
    GreensBy Jan Logie MP
    2 weeks ago
  • On the River Patrol in Te Tai Tokerau
    Last Wednesday, I went on a tour of some of Northland’s rivers with  Millan Ruka from Environmental River Patrol as he monitored water quality throughout Te Tai Tokerau. The dry conditions meant we couldn’t use the boat but we visited… ...
    GreensBy Catherine Delahunty MP
    2 weeks ago
  • Opening of Parliament 2015
    Russel NormanOpening of Parliament Speech February 2015 Tēnā koutou Tēnā koutou Tēnā koutou katoa. A brief history of climate change What a summer! It's been hot, even here in Wellington, hotter than any summer I can remember. All… ...
    GreensBy Russel Norman MP
    3 weeks ago

Removed at the request of The Daily Blog.
Public service advertisements by The Standard

Current CO2 level in the atmosphere