Is it somehow significant that the words are aligned left of centre this time, whether they were hard right last time?
How about
Get them into debt,
not into education.
And what is National’s Youth Guarantee? are they seriously guaranteeing that no youth will get into trouble under a National Govt? Or do they not know what guarantee means? (And if they fail does that mean we get our money back?)
Guarantee certainly is a strong word. Not that I would wish that such an approach be unsuccessful, but they are setting a high-bar to clear here – such language at face value is simply incredulous.
i think that artistically they’re a mess – you’ve got three different lines of text with three different colours, three sizes, and two fonts. the background colour changes too behind the words.. all of which makes it hard to read.
This is quite laughable. The limited policy Key announced on Breakfast this AM largely replicates existing policies. What’s unbelievable about this is that Labour’s done a great job at improving youth transitions through various initiatives including changes to TOPs, the implementation of Modern Apprenticeships, Gateway and massive increases and improvements to Industry Training. Plus of course, NCEA. All the numbers on NZ education show improvements in absolute and relative terms.
English was looking like he’d come up with a meaningful educational alternative to the current government’s; his move was unfortunate and their subsequent position on tertiary education has been inconsistent, ridiculous and simplistic… a lot like this billboard.
“All the numbers on NZ education show improvements in absolute and relative terms.”
What about reading standards?
“Professor Nicholson, who co-heads Massey’s Centre of Excellence for Research on Children’s Literacy, advocates teaching how to sound out words using phonics, which has been largely dropped by the New Zealand education system in favour of a “whole language’ approach.
He says that approach is failing Maori children particularly because phonics is well-suited to learning to read Te Reo and would provide an easy transition to English.
New Zealand was first in the world for reading achievement in 1970, dropped to 13th in 2001 and was ranked 24th out of 40 countries and five Canadian states by the latest (2006) Progress in International Reading Literacy Study statistics for 10-year-olds.”
Ben R: The whole language/phonics debate in language acquisition is a live debate upon which reasonable and properly-qualified people can and frequently do differ. It’s not something you can obviate by citing one expert in a field.
I’m not disputing your data; just that it’s not an open-and-shut case as your comment implies.
“I’m not disputing your data; just that it’s not an open-and-shut case as your comment implies.
Not that it’s anything to do with the billboard.”
Indeed, it was in response to the claim that all the numbers show we’re improving in absolute & relative terms (maybe we are, but I’d like to see a link with the evidence).
I have a lot of respect for Prof Nicholson having studied under him, but there’s nothing in the curriculum etc that precludes a school from using phonics. I don’t believe his comments should be directed towards government policy, but more towards educators in general to consider wider approaches to literacy education. In particular, to consider using a mix of approaches according to the needs of the children.
The govt has done a good job preventing the curriculum from becoming too rigid and encouraging schools to find methods that work for them.
“Ben R – The best thing that can be done for reading standards is for parents to take time to read to their children.”
i agree one hundred percent, the biggest impact on a child’s success at school is the role that the parent chooses to play.
The students that achieve well at school, have parents that are involved with them, the school, and their learning.
More work needs to be done building relationships with parents and teachers, as is done in early childhood.
Although Labour have not got it completely right yet, the answer is not to establish national education standards and then hold teachers and students accountable to them,
Ben R, what Lew said – I’m really reluctant to get into a phonics v whole language discussion, not least of all because I’m not nearly qualified to do so.
However, regarding this question/statement:
Indeed, it was in response to the claim that all the numbers show we’re improving in absolute & relative terms (maybe we are, but I’d like to see a link with the evidence).
My earlier comment, about absolute and relative improvements, is backed-up by our performance in a number of international studies which show, for instance, that reading literacy for Year 5 students which is “better than the international average”, and that NZ is continuing “its high performance in reading literacy at the senior secondary level, with only two out of thirty OECD countries achieving significantly higher mean scores than New Zealand.”
Jasper, you ignoramus. Clearly you’ll benefit from the improvement National will offer you in terms of your education.
I imagine that the National team are hoping some dole-bludging vandal DOES tag their billboard. It’ll prove the point of the staggering rise in youth crime, and generate a free media opportunity that flies under the EFA.
lprent…sorry I dont know about this link stuff and it was Peter williams QC who said it.
Have no idea where I go t the george liggins bit… I was in a hurry this morning. It is probably availlable on replay radio. anyway Randals sister saw Hooton on tv3 last week and he was beside himself and even the old biddies on snakeoil radio (talkback)are beginning to complain about how nasty the nats are getting.
I think that the fact that both billboards have gone right over your heads is proof that they aren’t aimed at you, and are not designed to appeal to your concerns. However, to a wavering old-skool (sorry) Labour-voter, they speak volumes, and this is who they are targeting. Your responses suggest an out-of-touchness with ‘middle-NZ’ which of course is a big part of Labour’s (correctly place apostrophe) problems as they cruise into the election, hell-bent on erecting a papier-mache statue to Helen’s legacy in the form of the ETS. That’ a lot of hyphens.
extra extra read all about it ‘Mathew Hooton is hysterical and has a mental complaint’ George Liggins QC this morning on nine to noon
Actually in:
RNZ NTN:
Audio clip: Adobe Flash Player (version 9 or above) is required to play this audio clip. Download the latest version here. You also need to have JavaScript enabled in your browser.
Peter Williams, QC, is the lawyer acting for Winston Peters. He says his client is the subject of an hysterical witchhunt.
michael, there might be some clever vandals out there, which could be funny, but I suspect they’d be politically motivated, rather than just some pissed off young taggers…
Further irony – the ‘youth’ that is implied to have tagged the billboard can at least spell the words ‘not’, ‘into’ and ‘trouble’ and even added a full stop at the end of the phrase. I would question how much training this young person needs.
Your responses suggest an out-of-touchness with ‘middle-NZ’ which of course is a big part of Labour’s (correctly place apostrophe) problems
Can you be more specific? Do you mean that the criticisms of National’s billboards – that they promise unquantified tax cuts as a solution to emmigration and the continuation of existing education policy – are missing the point? If so, I assume that you genuinely believe tax cuts will stop people heading offshore? Bizarre. I wonder if it’s us or you that’s out-of-touch?
Shall we get into semantics and claim that National is a collective? So seeing as National is a party, made up of many members, it’s therefore a “plural” ownership of the Youth Guarantee.
So therefore, Nationals’ would be more accurate, as National’s implies only one individuals guarantee.
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Yes, just wondered up to see it in the flesh (along with two TV news teams – obviously this is where you go for National policy announcements).
Spend the whole time walking back trying to think of something to say about it, but it speaks for itself really.
I suppose the only way’s up from here.
Is it somehow significant that the words are aligned left of centre this time, whether they were hard right last time?
How about
Get them into debt,
not into education.
And what is National’s Youth Guarantee? are they seriously guaranteeing that no youth will get into trouble under a National Govt? Or do they not know what guarantee means? (And if they fail does that mean we get our money back?)
They’ve thoughtfully left a nice space below for some real graffiti. I give it 24 hours max.
“Not into power”?
Guarantee certainly is a strong word. Not that I would wish that such an approach be unsuccessful, but they are setting a high-bar to clear here – such language at face value is simply incredulous.
Better than the previous billboard. Clearer message & some alliteration to make it more memorable.
I like how the area beneath ‘National’s youth guarantee’ is empty, just like that particular policy.
i think that artistically they’re a mess – you’ve got three different lines of text with three different colours, three sizes, and two fonts. the background colour changes too behind the words.. all of which makes it hard to read.
Heh, a cow-orker of mine saw it and thought it WAS a parody.
There’s a tricky little dog-whistle in there about training – going along with the boot camp idea. It’s not `Get them into education’.
L
I’ve commented on this over at Public Address.
This is quite laughable. The limited policy Key announced on Breakfast this AM largely replicates existing policies. What’s unbelievable about this is that Labour’s done a great job at improving youth transitions through various initiatives including changes to TOPs, the implementation of Modern Apprenticeships, Gateway and massive increases and improvements to Industry Training. Plus of course, NCEA. All the numbers on NZ education show improvements in absolute and relative terms.
English was looking like he’d come up with a meaningful educational alternative to the current government’s; his move was unfortunate and their subsequent position on tertiary education has been inconsistent, ridiculous and simplistic… a lot like this billboard.
extra extra read all about it…”Mathew Hooton is hysterical and has a mental complaint”…George Liggins QC this morning on nine to noon
[lprent: I've always thought so... but how about a link. It should be available by now.]
It’s Classic Crosby-Textor. Just compare it to the 2005 Uk Conservative Party billboards.
Parole will be next. Then racism.
“All the numbers on NZ education show improvements in absolute and relative terms.”
What about reading standards?
“Professor Nicholson, who co-heads Massey’s Centre of Excellence for Research on Children’s Literacy, advocates teaching how to sound out words using phonics, which has been largely dropped by the New Zealand education system in favour of a “whole language’ approach.
He says that approach is failing Maori children particularly because phonics is well-suited to learning to read Te Reo and would provide an easy transition to English.
New Zealand was first in the world for reading achievement in 1970, dropped to 13th in 2001 and was ranked 24th out of 40 countries and five Canadian states by the latest (2006) Progress in International Reading Literacy Study statistics for 10-year-olds.”
[link]
Get them into military training
And then we’ll send them to Iraq. Or Iran. Or whatever war the US decides to start next.
Oh, this is true yukkiness.
Ben R: The whole language/phonics debate in language acquisition is a live debate upon which reasonable and properly-qualified people can and frequently do differ. It’s not something you can obviate by citing one expert in a field.
I’m not disputing your data; just that it’s not an open-and-shut case as your comment implies.
Not that it’s anything to do with the billboard.
L
“I’m not disputing your data; just that it’s not an open-and-shut case as your comment implies.
Not that it’s anything to do with the billboard.”
Indeed, it was in response to the claim that all the numbers show we’re improving in absolute & relative terms (maybe we are, but I’d like to see a link with the evidence).
And the apostrophe is in the wrong place..
National is Youth Guarantee?
So if we vote national we guarantee our youth? Woohoo, I’ll keep being 22 thanks.
Typical – want higher education standards, yet are barely educated themselves.
I’m with gobsmacked. I predict that it will become a badge of honour to put a bomb or tag on one of those billboards.
A perfect opportunity for graffiti.
Awesome, I can’t wait!
Jasper: The apostrophe is fine. National’s == belonging to National.
Glass houses, stones, etc regarding your last comment – epic fail.
L
I have a lot of respect for Prof Nicholson having studied under him, but there’s nothing in the curriculum etc that precludes a school from using phonics. I don’t believe his comments should be directed towards government policy, but more towards educators in general to consider wider approaches to literacy education. In particular, to consider using a mix of approaches according to the needs of the children.
The govt has done a good job preventing the curriculum from becoming too rigid and encouraging schools to find methods that work for them.
Ben R – The best thing that can be done for reading standards is for parents to take time to read to their children.
Now that would be a much better billboard and yes it would probably help ‘Youth’ to get into training.
I wonder what ‘Youth’ think of this billboard, is there anyone under 20 who reads this blog?
Rocket Boy,
“Ben R – The best thing that can be done for reading standards is for parents to take time to read to their children.”
i agree one hundred percent, the biggest impact on a child’s success at school is the role that the parent chooses to play.
The students that achieve well at school, have parents that are involved with them, the school, and their learning.
More work needs to be done building relationships with parents and teachers, as is done in early childhood.
Although Labour have not got it completely right yet, the answer is not to establish national education standards and then hold teachers and students accountable to them,
Get ‘them’ into training…it’s what some old smelly guy at a bus stop might rant at me while we’re both waiting for the 7:10am…
I don’t understand how this scheme works. If you stay in school, do you get money?
Who will be administering this? WINZ? How will National cut the public service if they give them more to do?
Get them into the Army
And into Iraq
Ben R, what Lew said – I’m really reluctant to get into a phonics v whole language discussion, not least of all because I’m not nearly qualified to do so.
However, regarding this question/statement:
My earlier comment, about absolute and relative improvements, is backed-up by our performance in a number of international studies which show, for instance, that reading literacy for Year 5 students which is “better than the international average”, and that NZ is continuing “its high performance in reading literacy at the senior secondary level, with only two out of thirty OECD countries achieving significantly higher mean scores than New Zealand.”
These quotes are taken from the various reports available online at the education counts site, here: http://www.educationcounts.govt.nz/indicators/education_and_learning_outcomes
It just is not true that NZ education standards are low or are slipping; they’re high and are improving.
Jasper, you ignoramus. Clearly you’ll benefit from the improvement National will offer you in terms of your education.
I imagine that the National team are hoping some dole-bludging vandal DOES tag their billboard. It’ll prove the point of the staggering rise in youth crime, and generate a free media opportunity that flies under the EFA.
lprent…sorry I dont know about this link stuff and it was Peter williams QC who said it.
Have no idea where I go t the george liggins bit… I was in a hurry this morning. It is probably availlable on replay radio. anyway Randals sister saw Hooton on tv3 last week and he was beside himself and even the old biddies on snakeoil radio (talkback)are beginning to complain about how nasty the nats are getting.
I think that the fact that both billboards have gone right over your heads is proof that they aren’t aimed at you, and are not designed to appeal to your concerns. However, to a wavering old-skool (sorry) Labour-voter, they speak volumes, and this is who they are targeting. Your responses suggest an out-of-touchness with ‘middle-NZ’ which of course is a big part of Labour’s (correctly place apostrophe) problems as they cruise into the election, hell-bent on erecting a papier-mache statue to Helen’s legacy in the form of the ETS. That’ a lot of hyphens.
Actually in:
RNZ NTN:
Audio clip: Adobe Flash Player (version 9 or above) is required to play this audio clip. Download the latest version here. You also need to have JavaScript enabled in your browser.
Peter Williams, QC, is the lawyer acting for Winston Peters. He says his client is the subject of an hysterical witchhunt.
3:34 and 8:26 in
michael, there might be some clever vandals out there, which could be funny, but I suspect they’d be politically motivated, rather than just some pissed off young taggers…
Further irony – the ‘youth’ that is implied to have tagged the billboard can at least spell the words ‘not’, ‘into’ and ‘trouble’ and even added a full stop at the end of the phrase. I would question how much training this young person needs.
So when are Labour going to release some new policies?
Can you be more specific? Do you mean that the criticisms of National’s billboards – that they promise unquantified tax cuts as a solution to emmigration and the continuation of existing education policy – are missing the point? If so, I assume that you genuinely believe tax cuts will stop people heading offshore? Bizarre. I wonder if it’s us or you that’s out-of-touch?
Shall we get into semantics and claim that National is a collective? So seeing as National is a party, made up of many members, it’s therefore a “plural” ownership of the Youth Guarantee.
So therefore, Nationals’ would be more accurate, as National’s implies only one individuals guarantee.
Actually, I stand corrected Lew et al. My apologies.