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	<title>Comments on: Climate Change: The Looney Lord Responds</title>
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	<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/climate-change-the-looney-lord-responds/</link>
	<description>The New Zealand labour movement used to have its own newspaper. A group of us thought that now might be a good time for it to be digitally reborn: The Standard v2.0 - now in a new format The Standard v3.0</description>
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		<title>By: Tony</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/climate-change-the-looney-lord-responds/comment-page-1/#comment-171437</link>
		<dc:creator>Tony</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Nov 2009 11:30:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=24752#comment-171437</guid>
		<description>Well said ben, hardly surprising though is it that an AGW booster such as Salmond avoids engaging the issue, lol.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well said ben, hardly surprising though is it that an AGW booster such as Salmond avoids engaging the issue, lol.</p>
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		<title>By: Tony</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/climate-change-the-looney-lord-responds/comment-page-1/#comment-171436</link>
		<dc:creator>Tony</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Nov 2009 11:24:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=24752#comment-171436</guid>
		<description>Hear hear, ben.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hear hear, ben.</p>
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		<title>By: ha ha ha (I'm stupid)</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/climate-change-the-looney-lord-responds/comment-page-1/#comment-171274</link>
		<dc:creator>ha ha ha (I'm stupid)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 20:46:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=24752#comment-171274</guid>
		<description>God you are an obnoxious hypocritrical wanker Lyn, why don&#039;t you pull your head out of your arse ; at your age you should know better.

&lt;b&gt;[lprent: Why can&#039;t you learn to write rational comments? I&#039;ve just had a look at the ones you&#039;ve written previously. They don&#039;t show any signs of being able to discourse on any of the topics you&#039;ve discussed. 

Are you really as stupid as your comments suggest? Why should I care about your opinion? 

Ummm I&#039;ll demonstrate my opinion of you. Name amendment coming up...]&lt;/b&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>God you are an obnoxious hypocritrical wanker Lyn, why don&#8217;t you pull your head out of your arse ; at your age you should know better.</p>
<p><b>[lprent: Why can't you learn to write rational comments? I've just had a look at the ones you've written previously. They don't show any signs of being able to discourse on any of the topics you've discussed. </p>
<p>Are you really as stupid as your comments suggest? Why should I care about your opinion? </p>
<p>Ummm I'll demonstrate my opinion of you. Name amendment coming up...]</b></p>
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		<title>By: ben</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/climate-change-the-looney-lord-responds/comment-page-1/#comment-171264</link>
		<dc:creator>ben</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 20:28:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=24752#comment-171264</guid>
		<description>Rob, assuming it is you who is responsible for this post - it is pathetic. You do yourself no credit whatsoever by attacking the personal foibles of your critics and so studiously avoiding the topic at hand. In fact I almost can&#039;t believe that a learned individual such as yourself would either knowingly stoop to such a level or fail to recognise the age-old fallacy that is the ad hominem. Monckton wins this argument hands down merely by being willing to engage the issue.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Rob, assuming it is you who is responsible for this post &#8211; it is pathetic. You do yourself no credit whatsoever by attacking the personal foibles of your critics and so studiously avoiding the topic at hand. In fact I almost can&#8217;t believe that a learned individual such as yourself would either knowingly stoop to such a level or fail to recognise the age-old fallacy that is the ad hominem. Monckton wins this argument hands down merely by being willing to engage the issue.</p>
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		<title>By: Graeme Edgeler</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/climate-change-the-looney-lord-responds/comment-page-1/#comment-171258</link>
		<dc:creator>Graeme Edgeler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 20:15:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=24752#comment-171258</guid>
		<description>That was basically what I was saying. I said &quot;The alternative is option 3 &lt;b&gt;but that will not always mean that the hypothesis is completely wrong, rather that needs to change in some respect&lt;/b&gt;.&quot;

A particular hypothesis is thrown out. But it is replaced by a similar hypothesis that differs in some small respect.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That was basically what I was saying. I said &#8220;The alternative is option 3 <b>but that will not always mean that the hypothesis is completely wrong, rather that needs to change in some respect</b>.&#8221;</p>
<p>A particular hypothesis is thrown out. But it is replaced by a similar hypothesis that differs in some small respect.</p>
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		<title>By: Graeme Edgeler</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/climate-change-the-looney-lord-responds/comment-page-1/#comment-171256</link>
		<dc:creator>Graeme Edgeler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 20:12:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=24752#comment-171256</guid>
		<description>I wasn&#039;t really referring to anything in particular. Mostly I was talking in the abstract about what the scientific method is. But yes, that&#039;s a good example.

That a particular year is cold because of cyclical effects is evidence that is not inconsistent with climate change.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I wasn&#8217;t really referring to anything in particular. Mostly I was talking in the abstract about what the scientific method is. But yes, that&#8217;s a good example.</p>
<p>That a particular year is cold because of cyclical effects is evidence that is not inconsistent with climate change.</p>
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		<title>By: Canada Guy</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/climate-change-the-looney-lord-responds/comment-page-1/#comment-171221</link>
		<dc:creator>Canada Guy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 18:07:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=24752#comment-171221</guid>
		<description>Everyone knows that preventing climate change, or at least the worst consequences of it, is not going to be easy.  While the task required is large and difficult, there are some simple, quick, and easy fixes that can make a real difference, and perhaps even buy us more time. But they are being ignored.

&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.selfdestructivebastards.com/2009/11/low-hanging-fruit.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://www.selfdestructivebastards.com/2009/11/low-hanging-fruit.html&lt;/a&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Everyone knows that preventing climate change, or at least the worst consequences of it, is not going to be easy.  While the task required is large and difficult, there are some simple, quick, and easy fixes that can make a real difference, and perhaps even buy us more time. But they are being ignored.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.selfdestructivebastards.com/2009/11/low-hanging-fruit.html" rel="nofollow">http://www.selfdestructivebastards.com/2009/11/low-hanging-fruit.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Blog Bits &#124; Kiwiblog</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/climate-change-the-looney-lord-responds/comment-page-1/#comment-171220</link>
		<dc:creator>Blog Bits &#124; Kiwiblog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 15:52:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=24752#comment-171220</guid>
		<description>[...] Rob Salmond and Lord Monckton exchange climate change barbs. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Rob Salmond and Lord Monckton exchange climate change barbs. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: gomango</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/climate-change-the-looney-lord-responds/comment-page-1/#comment-171014</link>
		<dc:creator>gomango</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 00:48:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=24752#comment-171014</guid>
		<description>Slightly off topic but there are some very interesting developments going on right now re ETS in Europe.  And before anyone attacks me personally let me acknowledge up front I believe in the need for reducing greenhouse emissions, but I&#039;m not sure a flawed ETS will actually do what people expect.  In fact it is probably a worse outcome than doing nothing as a flawed scheme has no effect but also takes away the imperative to do something.

I&#039;ve long believed that the way the European ETS is set up is close to corrupt.  Exclusion of certain French and German industries on employment grounds, careful selection of base line date to advantage Europe, and the lack of verification of emissions levels particularly in eastern Europe and Russia are all problematic.  Imagine Russia, home of the most concentrated polluting industries in the world on a per capita basis being a net seller of credits!  Its just like money - you can invent as many credits as you need.  This time though the oligarchs will be stealing off other countries rather than their own.

Anyway, back on point, recently Poland and Estonia won a court case which essentially said the European Commission does not have the right to impose caps on member states.  So at least for the next 3 years Euopean states essentially have the right to set their own cap levels - voila they are all net carbon absorbers rather than emitters.  And whatever emissions countries dont use in the next 3 years can be carried forward into the 2013-20 period.  And you can be sure there&#039;ll be plenty of other fiddles once 2013 rolls around.

Credits are now trading at EUR15 a tonne - well down and going lower.  There is plenty of research around that values carbon on a &quot;no cheating&quot; basis of 25 to 40 EUR a tonne.  The discrepancy is the amount of cheating going on.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Slightly off topic but there are some very interesting developments going on right now re ETS in Europe.  And before anyone attacks me personally let me acknowledge up front I believe in the need for reducing greenhouse emissions, but I&#8217;m not sure a flawed ETS will actually do what people expect.  In fact it is probably a worse outcome than doing nothing as a flawed scheme has no effect but also takes away the imperative to do something.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ve long believed that the way the European ETS is set up is close to corrupt.  Exclusion of certain French and German industries on employment grounds, careful selection of base line date to advantage Europe, and the lack of verification of emissions levels particularly in eastern Europe and Russia are all problematic.  Imagine Russia, home of the most concentrated polluting industries in the world on a per capita basis being a net seller of credits!  Its just like money &#8211; you can invent as many credits as you need.  This time though the oligarchs will be stealing off other countries rather than their own.</p>
<p>Anyway, back on point, recently Poland and Estonia won a court case which essentially said the European Commission does not have the right to impose caps on member states.  So at least for the next 3 years Euopean states essentially have the right to set their own cap levels &#8211; voila they are all net carbon absorbers rather than emitters.  And whatever emissions countries dont use in the next 3 years can be carried forward into the 2013-20 period.  And you can be sure there&#8217;ll be plenty of other fiddles once 2013 rolls around.</p>
<p>Credits are now trading at EUR15 a tonne &#8211; well down and going lower.  There is plenty of research around that values carbon on a &#8220;no cheating&#8221; basis of 25 to 40 EUR a tonne.  The discrepancy is the amount of cheating going on.</p>
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		<title>By: Zorr</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/climate-change-the-looney-lord-responds/comment-page-1/#comment-170777</link>
		<dc:creator>Zorr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Nov 2009 06:10:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=24752#comment-170777</guid>
		<description>zelda, if you had just bothered to read the comments section there has already been a commenter who has
a) brought up some serious issues with the data in the paper
and
b) posted links to more fully worded write-ups of the errors in the paper with both the data and the findings

I will repost the link to the latter here:
http://www.drroyspencer.com/2009/11/some-comments-on-the-lindzen-and-choi-2009-feedback-study/

Do me a favor, and stop leaving me to tidy up after your messes.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>zelda, if you had just bothered to read the comments section there has already been a commenter who has<br />
a) brought up some serious issues with the data in the paper<br />
and<br />
b) posted links to more fully worded write-ups of the errors in the paper with both the data and the findings</p>
<p>I will repost the link to the latter here:<br />
<a href="http://www.drroyspencer.com/2009/11/some-comments-on-the-lindzen-and-choi-2009-feedback-study/" rel="nofollow">http://www.drroyspencer.com/2009/11/some-comments-on-the-lindzen-and-choi-2009-feedback-study/</a></p>
<p>Do me a favor, and stop leaving me to tidy up after your messes.</p>
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		<title>By: zelda</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/climate-change-the-looney-lord-responds/comment-page-1/#comment-170774</link>
		<dc:creator>zelda</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Nov 2009 05:57:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=24752#comment-170774</guid>
		<description>Just when you thought it was all settled.
 
&lt;strong&gt;[deleted]&lt;/strong&gt;

http://masterresource.org/?p=4307

&lt;strong&gt;[deleted]&lt;/strong&gt;

&lt;strong&gt;[lprent: One of my troll signatures is someone who copies and pastes stuff from the net without bothering to indicate what is quoted (use blockquote - see the&lt;a href=&quot;/faq&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt; FAQ&lt;/a&gt; on &lt;a href=&quot;/faq/comment-formatting/#quoting&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;quoting&lt;/a&gt; ) and what is their comment. In this case you didn&#039;t even bother to make any substantive comment on the topic. This site is here to debate. It isn&#039;t a copy paste area. Take a week off for being stupid and reflect on how to contribute. Oh and read the &lt;a href=&quot;/policy&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;policy&lt;/a&gt; of this site. 
For anyone interested, I&#039;ve left the link in and zelda&#039;s &#039;contribution&#039;. However this is plastered over the CCD net&#039;s at present. ]&lt;/strong&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just when you thought it was all settled.</p>
<p><strong>[deleted]</strong></p>
<p><a href="http://masterresource.org/?p=4307" rel="nofollow">http://masterresource.org/?p=4307</a></p>
<p><strong>[deleted]</strong></p>
<p><strong>[lprent: One of my troll signatures is someone who copies and pastes stuff from the net without bothering to indicate what is quoted (use blockquote - see the<a href="/faq" rel="nofollow"> FAQ</a> on <a href="/faq/comment-formatting/#quoting" rel="nofollow">quoting</a> ) and what is their comment. In this case you didn't even bother to make any substantive comment on the topic. This site is here to debate. It isn't a copy paste area. Take a week off for being stupid and reflect on how to contribute. Oh and read the <a href="/policy" rel="nofollow">policy</a> of this site.<br />
For anyone interested, I've left the link in and zelda's 'contribution'. However this is plastered over the CCD net's at present. ]</strong></p>
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		<title>By: zelda</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/climate-change-the-looney-lord-responds/comment-page-1/#comment-170762</link>
		<dc:creator>zelda</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Nov 2009 04:53:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=24752#comment-170762</guid>
		<description>If you looked at this weeks  publication of &#039;Nature&#039; you would see a  list of errors and ommisions made in published articles ( and a story about an  published paper that was complete bullshit).
It happens.
Does it mean that Nature is a fabrication because they  have  small errors  and their &#039;facts&#039; arent ironclad ?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you looked at this weeks  publication of &#8216;Nature&#8217; you would see a  list of errors and ommisions made in published articles ( and a story about an  published paper that was complete bullshit).<br />
It happens.<br />
Does it mean that Nature is a fabrication because they  have  small errors  and their &#8216;facts&#8217; arent ironclad ?</p>
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		<title>By: Bright Red</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/climate-change-the-looney-lord-responds/comment-page-1/#comment-170756</link>
		<dc:creator>Bright Red</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Nov 2009 04:33:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=24752#comment-170756</guid>
		<description>the looney lord is holding himself up as an expert on climate change matters. Salmond has ripped his credibility to shreds with the facts.

The issue is about Monck, not Salmond but you want to make it about Salmond because you&#039;re a climate change denier who sees Monck as a hero and you can&#039;t defend him against the facts Salmond has exposed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>the looney lord is holding himself up as an expert on climate change matters. Salmond has ripped his credibility to shreds with the facts.</p>
<p>The issue is about Monck, not Salmond but you want to make it about Salmond because you&#8217;re a climate change denier who sees Monck as a hero and you can&#8217;t defend him against the facts Salmond has exposed.</p>
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		<title>By: zelda</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/climate-change-the-looney-lord-responds/comment-page-1/#comment-170753</link>
		<dc:creator>zelda</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Nov 2009 04:30:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=24752#comment-170753</guid>
		<description>Hello ... Salmond has made a point of a personal attack on the ...looney lord !! What a dispstick

&lt;strong&gt;[lprent: If you look at the origional post, it was actually targeted on John Ansell and others from the sewer holding the Lord Moron up as credible speaker on climate change. The mere fact that it was possible to tear the Lord Moron&#039;s claims to pieces was a by-product. It wasn&#039;t targeted at him. BTW: Have you found the edit button yet. Mis-spelling doesn&#039;t help your credibility. ]&lt;/strong&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hello &#8230; Salmond has made a point of a personal attack on the &#8230;looney lord !! What a dispstick</p>
<p><strong>[lprent: If you look at the origional post, it was actually targeted on John Ansell and others from the sewer holding the Lord Moron up as credible speaker on climate change. The mere fact that it was possible to tear the Lord Moron's claims to pieces was a by-product. It wasn't targeted at him. BTW: Have you found the edit button yet. Mis-spelling doesn't help your credibility. ]</strong></p>
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		<title>By: Bright Red</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/climate-change-the-looney-lord-responds/comment-page-1/#comment-170747</link>
		<dc:creator>Bright Red</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Nov 2009 04:19:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=24752#comment-170747</guid>
		<description>bizarre strain of personal attack on Salmond here. It&#039;s totally irrelevant to Monck&#039;s self-professed credentials on climate change issues.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>bizarre strain of personal attack on Salmond here. It&#8217;s totally irrelevant to Monck&#8217;s self-professed credentials on climate change issues.</p>
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