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	<title>Comments on: Dual obligations</title>
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	<description>The New Zealand labour movement used to have its own newspaper. A group of us thought that now might be a good time for it to be digitally reborn: The Standard v2.0 - now in a new format The Standard v3.0</description>
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		<title>By: tc</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/dual-obligations/comment-page-1/#comment-178576</link>
		<dc:creator>tc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Dec 2009 18:33:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=27197#comment-178576</guid>
		<description>Alot of really spot on comments here which I&#039;d sum up as:

Lamenting that TVNZ should become a BBC/ABC is misplaced, it let the talented program makers go in the 90&#039;s and has a commercial management/culture so it&#039;s not achievable.

TV&#039;s a yesterday industry with most of its regular viewers now ageing or habitual viewers.....good broadband/technology sees it attracting very few new viewers to replace old.

It&#039;s a content game and TVNZ produces little or no desired content. Charter was a nice idea but decades too late as it should have been there from the start.

The only saving grace would be a solid news/current affairs section but TVNZ doesn&#039;t have that just kids running around and personality focused egos like Paul henry and Mark Sainsbury who as the flag bearers are shocking examples of it&#039;s top talent.

Sell sell sell......unlike Water/power TV&#039;s not essential, in fact TVNZ are self serving and irrelevant and their election coverage in 2008 was embarrassing, as an example ot an area the nations voice should excel at. So flog it before Recycling Rick devalues it even more.....tis the national way after all.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Alot of really spot on comments here which I&#8217;d sum up as:</p>
<p>Lamenting that TVNZ should become a BBC/ABC is misplaced, it let the talented program makers go in the 90&#8242;s and has a commercial management/culture so it&#8217;s not achievable.</p>
<p>TV&#8217;s a yesterday industry with most of its regular viewers now ageing or habitual viewers&#8230;..good broadband/technology sees it attracting very few new viewers to replace old.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s a content game and TVNZ produces little or no desired content. Charter was a nice idea but decades too late as it should have been there from the start.</p>
<p>The only saving grace would be a solid news/current affairs section but TVNZ doesn&#8217;t have that just kids running around and personality focused egos like Paul henry and Mark Sainsbury who as the flag bearers are shocking examples of it&#8217;s top talent.</p>
<p>Sell sell sell&#8230;&#8230;unlike Water/power TV&#8217;s not essential, in fact TVNZ are self serving and irrelevant and their election coverage in 2008 was embarrassing, as an example ot an area the nations voice should excel at. So flog it before Recycling Rick devalues it even more&#8230;..tis the national way after all.</p>
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		<title>By: infused</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/dual-obligations/comment-page-1/#comment-178384</link>
		<dc:creator>infused</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 12:42:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=27197#comment-178384</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t think I&#039;ve watched much TV at all... I don&#039;t see much of a point. This generation doesn&#039;t watch TV. TV will be gone (in the current model) in 10yrs imo. Most devices stream youtube now and various other broadband services.

Why even bother debating it?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t think I&#8217;ve watched much TV at all&#8230; I don&#8217;t see much of a point. This generation doesn&#8217;t watch TV. TV will be gone (in the current model) in 10yrs imo. Most devices stream youtube now and various other broadband services.</p>
<p>Why even bother debating it?</p>
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		<title>By: Rex Widerstrom</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/dual-obligations/comment-page-1/#comment-178342</link>
		<dc:creator>Rex Widerstrom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 02:51:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=27197#comment-178342</guid>
		<description>I &lt;i&gt;think&lt;/i&gt; what Michael Grade means when he says:

&lt;blockquote&gt;...the UK has a unique system of mixed public and private broadcasting...&lt;/blockquote&gt;

he&#039;s referring to the BBC standing alongside ITV etc, surely? Not that the BBC has had forced upon it some dual personality as a (supposedly) quality programme maker and broacaster on the one hand and a voracious money- and ratings-grabber on the other?

The ABC, for instance, has plenty of commercial operations, from it&#039;s &quot;ABC Shops&quot; in shopping centres and online to various internet ventures to the provision of technology to other broadcasters. But these stand separate to their TV and radio programme making and broadcast operations, which have no commercial imperatives at all.

I&#039;m sure many people would be more than happy if TVNZ were to dump its advertising, start producing quality programming, and make it&#039;s money selling Paul Henry bobble head dolls at the local Westfield because the commercial imperatives wouldn&#039;t impact upon the on-air ones.

And as for your argument that &quot;SOEs can manage it&quot;... well... it was the left which decried the SOE model when it was introduced and is still occasionally critical of it today, so it&#039;s a little disingenuous to fall back on them as an example of supposed success in balancing conflicting obligations now.

It&#039;s an excellent model for &lt;i&gt;some&lt;/i&gt; activities, not so much for others, as was proven with the entire Folole Muliaga debacle. Mercury Energy can&#039;t be highly profitable as an energy supplier and worry whether people can afford their bills. It&#039;s as daft as asking The Warehouse to discount Christmas toys for poor families. TVNZ can&#039;t be profitable (or at least as profitable as it&#039;s expected to be) while producing quality progamming.

Anyway, it&#039;s an apples-with-oranges argument. DHBs, for instance, ration &lt;i&gt;government&lt;/i&gt;&lt;i&gt; money. They&#039;re not out there trying to get sponsorship from the local car dealer to fund the next hip replacement (though that surely can&#039;t be far away).&lt;/i&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I <i>think</i> what Michael Grade means when he says:</p>
<blockquote><p>&#8230;the UK has a unique system of mixed public and private broadcasting&#8230;</p></blockquote>
<p>he&#8217;s referring to the BBC standing alongside ITV etc, surely? Not that the BBC has had forced upon it some dual personality as a (supposedly) quality programme maker and broacaster on the one hand and a voracious money- and ratings-grabber on the other?</p>
<p>The ABC, for instance, has plenty of commercial operations, from it&#8217;s &#8220;ABC Shops&#8221; in shopping centres and online to various internet ventures to the provision of technology to other broadcasters. But these stand separate to their TV and radio programme making and broadcast operations, which have no commercial imperatives at all.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m sure many people would be more than happy if TVNZ were to dump its advertising, start producing quality programming, and make it&#8217;s money selling Paul Henry bobble head dolls at the local Westfield because the commercial imperatives wouldn&#8217;t impact upon the on-air ones.</p>
<p>And as for your argument that &#8220;SOEs can manage it&#8221;&#8230; well&#8230; it was the left which decried the SOE model when it was introduced and is still occasionally critical of it today, so it&#8217;s a little disingenuous to fall back on them as an example of supposed success in balancing conflicting obligations now.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s an excellent model for <i>some</i> activities, not so much for others, as was proven with the entire Folole Muliaga debacle. Mercury Energy can&#8217;t be highly profitable as an energy supplier and worry whether people can afford their bills. It&#8217;s as daft as asking The Warehouse to discount Christmas toys for poor families. TVNZ can&#8217;t be profitable (or at least as profitable as it&#8217;s expected to be) while producing quality progamming.</p>
<p>Anyway, it&#8217;s an apples-with-oranges argument. DHBs, for instance, ration <i>government</i><i> money. They&#8217;re not out there trying to get sponsorship from the local car dealer to fund the next hip replacement (though that surely can&#8217;t be far away).</i></p>
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		<title>By: Rex Widerstrom</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/dual-obligations/comment-page-1/#comment-178341</link>
		<dc:creator>Rex Widerstrom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 02:35:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=27197#comment-178341</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;there never was truly public service television in New Zealand&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Ms Callinghan seems to have forgotten the NZBC, or the short lived BCNZ, let alone the NZBS.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>there never was truly public service television in New Zealand</p></blockquote>
<p>Ms Callinghan seems to have forgotten the NZBC, or the short lived BCNZ, let alone the NZBS.</p>
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		<title>By: Noko</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/dual-obligations/comment-page-1/#comment-178333</link>
		<dc:creator>Noko</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 00:16:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=27197#comment-178333</guid>
		<description>I agree with this, however if it had just one channel dedicated to this I wouldn&#039;t be too disappointed.
BBC is amazing, and the number of times we were shown a BBC produced video in any of the Sciences, Classics, History, English or even Drama throughout high school is more than I can remember. I don&#039;t think we were shown one New Zealand produced video, because they are no resources as nearly as good as those the BBC has generated.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with this, however if it had just one channel dedicated to this I wouldn&#8217;t be too disappointed.<br />
BBC is amazing, and the number of times we were shown a BBC produced video in any of the Sciences, Classics, History, English or even Drama throughout high school is more than I can remember. I don&#8217;t think we were shown one New Zealand produced video, because they are no resources as nearly as good as those the BBC has generated.</p>
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		<title>By: prism</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/dual-obligations/comment-page-1/#comment-178332</link>
		<dc:creator>prism</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 00:08:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=27197#comment-178332</guid>
		<description>DTB Exactly</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>DTB Exactly</p>
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		<title>By: prism</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/dual-obligations/comment-page-1/#comment-178331</link>
		<dc:creator>prism</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 Dec 2009 00:06:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=27197#comment-178331</guid>
		<description>cf TVNZ office and Treasury&#039;s!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>cf TVNZ office and Treasury&#8217;s!</p>
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		<title>By: Draco T Bastard</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/dual-obligations/comment-page-1/#comment-178328</link>
		<dc:creator>Draco T Bastard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Dec 2009 23:19:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=27197#comment-178328</guid>
		<description>TVNZ needs to get back to being a service that, get this, costs us. That service is to inform us of what our politicians are doing/debating and WTF else is happening in the world. It should not be an entertainment service.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>TVNZ needs to get back to being a service that, get this, costs us. That service is to inform us of what our politicians are doing/debating and WTF else is happening in the world. It should not be an entertainment service.</p>
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		<title>By: Draco T Bastard</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/dual-obligations/comment-page-1/#comment-178327</link>
		<dc:creator>Draco T Bastard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Dec 2009 23:15:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=27197#comment-178327</guid>
		<description>Social cohesion comes with talking to your neighbours not from staring at your television screen.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Social cohesion comes with talking to your neighbours not from staring at your television screen.</p>
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		<title>By: Lew</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/dual-obligations/comment-page-1/#comment-178326</link>
		<dc:creator>Lew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Dec 2009 22:44:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=27197#comment-178326</guid>
		<description>This is really the nub of it: the problem with public service broadcasting on NZ TV is not with the broad structural problem of serving two masters, but the narrow implementation problem of a vague and badly-enforced charter. 

L</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is really the nub of it: the problem with public service broadcasting on NZ TV is not with the broad structural problem of serving two masters, but the narrow implementation problem of a vague and badly-enforced charter. </p>
<p>L</p>
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		<title>By: randal</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/dual-obligations/comment-page-1/#comment-178325</link>
		<dc:creator>randal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Dec 2009 22:43:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=27197#comment-178325</guid>
		<description>gosh what a lot of verbiage to describe the personal enrichment of an ideological claque who see any state activity simply as a vehicle to flog off for their own personal aggrandisement and going into government to achieve their desires.
no matter.
If the national party does perpetrate this act then they will be out on their ear very soon and any new government will have a clear field to set up a new state system without the accretions and hangers on that this one has managed to gather since its inception.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>gosh what a lot of verbiage to describe the personal enrichment of an ideological claque who see any state activity simply as a vehicle to flog off for their own personal aggrandisement and going into government to achieve their desires.<br />
no matter.<br />
If the national party does perpetrate this act then they will be out on their ear very soon and any new government will have a clear field to set up a new state system without the accretions and hangers on that this one has managed to gather since its inception.</p>
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		<title>By: Deus ex Machina</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/dual-obligations/comment-page-1/#comment-178324</link>
		<dc:creator>Deus ex Machina</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Dec 2009 22:37:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=27197#comment-178324</guid>
		<description>Oh yes.  Just look at the way Fox News promulgates social cohesion in the US - there&#039;s nothing promotes social cohesion better than a common enemy.

The BBC&#039;s stated mission is &quot;To enrich people&#039;s lives with programmes and services that inform, educate and entertain.&quot;  The moment TV starts PROMULGATING anything it steps beyond that remit and becomes a tool of mass persuasion, and that should never be allowed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh yes.  Just look at the way Fox News promulgates social cohesion in the US &#8211; there&#8217;s nothing promotes social cohesion better than a common enemy.</p>
<p>The BBC&#8217;s stated mission is &#8220;To enrich people&#8217;s lives with programmes and services that inform, educate and entertain.&#8221;  The moment TV starts PROMULGATING anything it steps beyond that remit and becomes a tool of mass persuasion, and that should never be allowed.</p>
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		<title>By: chris</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/dual-obligations/comment-page-1/#comment-178323</link>
		<dc:creator>chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Dec 2009 22:20:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=27197#comment-178323</guid>
		<description>Has anyone been to TVNZ&#039;s offices? They&#039;re quite sad how cramped and small they are

captcha: cumming (lol)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Has anyone been to TVNZ&#8217;s offices? They&#8217;re quite sad how cramped and small they are</p>
<p>captcha: cumming (lol)</p>
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		<title>By: Tigger</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/dual-obligations/comment-page-1/#comment-178319</link>
		<dc:creator>Tigger</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Dec 2009 21:48:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=27197#comment-178319</guid>
		<description>National identity is only one part of the equation.  Social cohesion is, these days, arguably more important.  A public broadcaster can be an immensely powerful promulgator of social cohesion.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>National identity is only one part of the equation.  Social cohesion is, these days, arguably more important.  A public broadcaster can be an immensely powerful promulgator of social cohesion.</p>
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		<title>By: Tigger</title>
		<link>http://thestandard.org.nz/dual-obligations/comment-page-1/#comment-178315</link>
		<dc:creator>Tigger</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Dec 2009 21:31:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thestandard.org.nz/?p=27197#comment-178315</guid>
		<description>So why can we not create a model that works for us and delivers a public-oriented broadcaster?  Let TVNZ make cash, let TV One serve the public and stop expecting it to all return money to the government.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So why can we not create a model that works for us and delivers a public-oriented broadcaster?  Let TVNZ make cash, let TV One serve the public and stop expecting it to all return money to the government.</p>
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