Written By: Zetetic - Date published: 9:37 pm, July 8th, 2013 - 98 comments
Categories: racism -
If Maori get it they want it to… do what? Cryptic.
First time I’d even heard of these non-factors… now that I do a google search I see that they’ve been getting some oxygen today…
Ah, see, they think “the Maori” isn’t a group of people, but rather a hivemind, like the Borg Collective.
So if The Maori get something, they want The Maori to get it. They’re really supportive, see?
Aha! We should have known there was a non-racist purpose buried within their mashing of the English language.
I liked Toby Manhire’s take at the Listener
“If the Maori get it, we want it to!” Yeah! But want it to what? The missing word, almost certainly, is “thrive”.
Unfortunately the very funny wiki page that included mention of Manhire’s satire has been edited and recommended for deletion.
I think Tā moko will look impressive on them.
I see they are looking to change their name already – how about “One Nation” after Pauline Hanson’s Australian party? Seems to suit.
This is obviously pretty poor satire.
[um. no it’s not. you fucken idiot. Zet]
Oh I thought it was satire like the “Billionaires for Bush” thing.
That familiar nagging sensation in your head is you being wrong and shooting your mouth off before doing any basic research. Again.
It seemed like satire, it’s that bizarre.
Brett. The post isn’t a screen shot of the site page.
Yeah, could do with a better explanation and a link to the FB page.
The fb page is worse than WO:
[…] i thought I would remind you of how you are, in-fact, the only people to enslave your own race. sure white people enslaved others, at least we were united enough not to enslave ourselves.
Although the guy talking about people on hilltops seeing the page and “screaming racism from the top of their lounges” made me smile.
I know, it’s part horror part hilarity
“Hand’s up whos here to laugh and troll?”
For those that haven’t have the pleasure yet
Yeah I assumed it was a troll page, just because there was way too much U MAD BRO? etc
Beholdth Brett Dale, the man without a brain.
Marvel as he stumbles and makes an ignorant arse out of himself on anything more complex than eating.
Be dazed at the depths of his stupid as he tries and fails to understand relatively simple issues.
And lastly, laugh as he digs himself in deeper Every. Single. Time.
Stick to sports m’kay? At least in that you can successfully bluff to some state of “knowledge”. At least until a true sports geek noms on you.
What is the point of that comment?
This reveals more about you than you might want to actually admit to.
Does it reveal that many Pakeha got where they are today because of their ethnicity rather than their talents? Positive discrimination is such a handicap, eh.
“This reveals more about you than you might want to actually admit to.”
Kia ora whanau – I’d really like you all to stop being so greedy and start sharing the myriad of riches that we have (which are listed above) with all of our Pakeha brothers & sisters. I fully tautoko this party who wish to share in the undeserved lifestyle that we so ungratefully complain about and wish that they could enjoy the bountiful riches that have been bestowed on us by themselves.
When the working class are abandoned and ignored by social democracy and a lot of white/pink people wind up genuinely in the shit, see no way out and are looking for answers/explanations, racism will always come along and offer easy answers; answers that largely blossom from (in the case of NZ) society’s pre-existing and utterly ingrained casual racism.
Both liberal and conservative elites and all governing institutions will, of course, continue to pretend that economic injustice is not an integral part of the market economy and so simply decry the racism. And ‘the best’ of it? Some of the targetted ‘identity politics’ policies of recent years that sought to ameliorate economic disparity while denying the existence of class, is going to be feeding right on back into this shite.
Maybe some chickens are looking to be coming home to roost.
Bill, while I think you may be right that a rising tide lifts all boats, for some identity politics are always going to be more compelling than economics. Far better to accept that and move on rather than this impotent railing, no?
Nothing wrong with identity politics if class is factored in or acknowledged too. And it works the other way too race and gender should be factored in or acknowledged when looking at class.
And if you accept the fact of class being made invisible by politicians and their parties/policies, then the fucking racism that is clearly evident from comments on that fb page is going to continue to fester and grow.
btw. What exactly was it Hone said about housing and how was it reported so that some guy came to be thinking that there was going to be ‘Maori only’ housing? And has that been put to rights and explained amid all the jibing and piss taking that, to be honest, seems to be more about the fb guy’s political naivity and lack of media savvy?
And what about all that racism being expressed in comments and the apparent popularity of those sentiments? Is the idea just to ignore all that cos, y’know, it’s just stupid white trash speak and worth nothing beyond ridicule and superior smirking silences?
Because if that is to be the broad response in NZ, then NZ is setting itself up for some ugly shit some time in the future.
Right now, people are focussed on racism. I’d suggest it be taken seriously and underlying causes addressed and misconceptions challenged. But, y’know, I expect that suggestion and concern to fall on stoney ground. I expect to see a couple of days of ridicule topwards the likes who are commenting on that fb page alongside expressions of dismissive anger from leftists. And then for it to ‘go away’ and allowed to fester until next time around.
What exactly was it Hone said about housing and how was it reported so that some guy came to be thinking that there was going to be ‘Maori only’ housing? And has that been put to rights and explained amid all the jibing and piss taking that, to be honest, seems to be more about the fb guy’s political naivity and lack of media savvy?
From what I remember, and this is only from the MSM and ts, Mana’s first press releases were about housing for Maori. After the reaction to that, they came out and said that the policy would be for all people. I don’t know if that was a policy change, or if they just presented it differently. The thing that struck me at the time was that either Mana were being very naive in how they presented that whole policy (or they didn’t care), or they were very clever (if you look at the timing with the Ikaroa-Rawhiti by-election, they sent a clear message of support to Maori, and then a few days later they pacified Pakeha). I don’t know which I think is true.
Nothing wrong with identity politics if class is factored in or acknowledged too. And it works the other way too race and gender should be factored in or acknowledged when looking at class.
I agree. I’m not sure quite what you mean about the connection with other identity politics, as I don’t see NACT or Labour as engaging in that majorly other than with some individual policies like gay marriage. That they’re removing class from the debate is definitely happening, and I agree there needs to be a conversation about why so many people agree with the Pakeha Party. The main problem here, on ts, is that that conversation has largely been initiated by vto, who’s race politics are too near the John Ansell end of the spectrum, so the discussions never get passed that. Personally I’d be interested in having the conversation amongst people that are already grounded in acceptance of the Treaty etc.
I think maybe what you are saying is that white, working and underclass men are getting a very hard time and that this needs to be acknowledged and responded to. I agree. The question is how to frame that debate, and how to engage with people who already frame that debate in racist and proto-racist ways.
Let me know if I’ve missed the mark there with how I’ve read your comment.
The Mana housing policy was originally released in a Maori electorate, to Maori voters. The release was targeted at them, which in the circumstances was fair enough. I asked if it would be extended to all people in need of housing and the unequivocal answer was yes. I asked on the day of public release. Even though I think Mana need to learn a lot about using social media, there was no intent for this to be a Maori only policy.
“And ‘the best’ of it? Some of the targetted ‘identity politics’ policies of recent years that sought to ameliorate economic disparity while denying the existence of class, is going to be feeding right on back into this shite.”
Can you give some examples Bill?
Just go to the fb page comments for some examples. The whole ‘Maori are privileged by the education system’ tripe is just one of many you will see being said over and over again.
I can’t take the comments on that page as serious examples of identity politics policies. Can you give some examples of what you mean? eg which education policies. Or were you meaning perception of policies rather than actual policies?
I know that the Clark govt removed much of the funding available directly to Maori community projects, to the great detriment of many grass roots initiatives. That happened in direct response to people complaining about race based funding and Labour being afraid of losing votes. Despite the removal of race based funding, we still hear alot of criticism of things like Whanau Ora, Tariana Turia’s project, despite Whanau Ora funding being open to all ethnic groups.
I’m sure there are some targetted policies, and it would certainly be very useful to know what they are and analyse them. At the moment it looks like another case of us all arguing about something without the facts (not you and I, but the whole country).
Between this lot and the Conservative Party, holding Winston 1st to 4.9% ought to be a doddle.
and the Maori Party aren’t racist? Talk about double standards.
No, they aren’t. Glad we could clear that up.
Looks like John Key’s got a coalition partner after all.
Nothing like stunning ignorance to further divide and hurt our country. When we are as weak as we are, pathogens like this silly Pakeha Party can really infect the minds of already deluded folks.
What do you think is diving the country now?
“What do you think is diving the country now?”
Diving? Well, I ‘d have to say that ultimately John Key is responsible for sending the country into a nose dive, but he has been aided by the likes of Sky Casino, Warner Bro’s, and of course his trusty pals Paula, Hekia, Simon, Peter, John and so on. Then there’s a media that feeds all the petty misinformed jealousies of the fools of this country. It’s a social, moral and economic nosedive. Although if you meant to say divide, it would be all of the above as well.
Oh, and not to mention the increasingly hostile approach of employers in this country. At this rate there will be no turning back to a time of fairness, dignity and trust in the workplace. The NZ workplace has been divided by mistrust and power grabbing by employers. See Helen Kelly’s excellent article as an example of this
Could be good for the Left. Would never get an electorate seat and unlikely to get to 5% of the vote but still take enough support from the same pool of rednecks who would otherwise vote for Keys, so could help push a Left coalition over the line. When things get as tight as they have done in NZ over the last two general elections the slightest variable could make a big difference.
Stop calling bigots “rednecks”. That’s an ignorant and elitist term of contempt for working people.
Rebuke uncalled for.
While redneck’s etymology is not clear Wiki offered rural origins, and the modern US usage as ‘used broadly to degrade working class and rural whites that are perceived by urban progressives to be insufficiently liberal’
Your view is unnecessarily narrow, focusing on ‘working'(class) ie origin, rather than on the illiberalism ie attitude, that it connotes for majority users in NZ. You might like to consider the extent to which the term is gendered, too.
I’m sort of with Morrissey on this one. If redneck doesn’t denote prejudice then neither does wetback.
There’s nothing wrong with the term being used to describe a farmer or a manual worker. The problem is when it is foolishly and inappropriately used to mean “bigot”.
The vilest, most ignorant, most illiberal views in this country come from radio loudmouths like Michael Laws and Leighton Smith, a whole raft of complacent newspaper opinionistas, right wing “Think Tank” reptiles like Bob McCoskrie and Bruce Logan, ACT on Campus halfwits, and assorted other bewildered/nasty/lazy/st000pid souls.
Note that nearly all of them are distinguished by their LACK of hard work, and especially by their lack of hard PHYSICAL work. They do not get sunburnt, except when they lie on the beach at a Fiji resort. They are bigots, not rednecks. In fact, I can think of only two bigots who could fairly be described as “rednecks”—John “Hone” Carter and Garth “The Knife” McVicar.
“Redneck”, when used as a term of abuse, is nothing more than a sniffy east coast liberal putdown of ALL working people, who the Eastern liberal establishment, i.e. the Democratic Party, resented because they were unconvinced by the Barack Obamas and Bill Clintons of the late ’60s and early ‘seventies.
You need to stop indolently recycling such abusive, foolish, and inaccurate language.
You’re right. Sorry, that was ignorant of me. I hadn’t realised that the term had that meaning at all. I’d always thought it was limited to white conservative bigots but realise now that’s not the case.
Good on you, Mary. You have provided a lesson in humility and good grace.
Are you watching, Populuxe1?
What this filthy piece of ‘reasonable’ sounding racism reminds me of – whether it’s meant to be satire or not – is that nine years ago the gnat party was at 28%… and then within 2 weeks of Brash’s Orewa speech they surged to 45%
The slippery self-serving neolib that currently heads parliament and who has no idea of what building a nation is all about, has only managed to increase support from Brash’s 45% to 46.5%
This gives me a great deal of hope. We only have to turn one in four of those pre-Orewa gnat supporters and Labour will once again lead in the polls. But how to do it?
Sadly I can’t help thinking that the current Labour caucus seems more intent on winning over some of the 17% that went to the gnats post Orewa.
theres really only two outcomes i can see from this
1) theyre actually well meaning but deluded – so when they start saying what it is they want politically, every one will go “yeah, youve got that already, whats your point again?”, and their support will atrophy and/or no-one will bother working with them
2) they will expose them selves as outright racists and their support will atrophy and/or no-one will want to work with them
either way – i see it as no biggie really. the pefect response to all this “The maori party is a racist party” is “so what?”
If you can get enough people who want to join theres nothing stopping you, go for your life. If you wanted to have a one armed jewish lesbian party theres nothing stopping you if youve got the numbers. If youre just bonkers or dont really have much of a clue – you will expose yourself pretty quickly
sunlight – disinfectant etc etc
there’s more of them than we’d like to think in NZ. Most won’t come out into the sunlight as they prefer to slither around under rocks with their own kind. So they’ll probably stay with the gnats or nzf
On the other hand they can do what they like in the voting booth.
Which is to take votes from Key. Will be interesting to see whether they get more of the vote than UntiedFuture like the Legalise Cannabis Party.
Hmm, I dunno framu.
Remember, this is exactly the same bullshit that nearly got Don Brash elected in 2005. And he never came up with a single concrete example of “special maori privilege”.
Right now they’re just a couple of idiots, but what they’ve got is momentum. And while a stationary idiot is just an idiot, a rolling mass of idiocy can do a lot of damage.
If that momentum is sustained for much longer, they’ll be approached by smarter, shrewder, more calculating players who will quietly take over behind the scenes and try to translate this momentum into real political support for something.
Maybe Lusk for a faction within National. Maybe Gibbs for the rebirth of ACT. It’s open to anyone really, bunch of angry ignorant voters for the taking.
Shit, it may have already happened for all we know.
true – caution is neccessary.
but i still like the approach of giving them enough rope as opposed to trying to make them go away
“a rolling mass of idiocy can do a lot of damage.” gold –
a rolling mass of idiocy can do a lot of damage.
Not if it’s vigorously, publicly cluebatted and ‘anvilled from orbit :3
But yeah, you’re pretty much on the ball on this probably being used to resurrect the Kwi/Iwi zombie or shock ACT back into a shambling half-life
This is a good thing – makes it easier to round them up later
The sad thing about the supporters of this party of ignorance, is that many of them think any attention is proof of the validity of their claims.
infused, you’re one of the sponsors aren’t you? Where do you see it going?
😀 There is one good thing that has come out of it. It’s got a lot of people talking, typically people that don’t vote.
Other than that, couldn’t really care less. Knowing their luck, it will become a political party. New Zealand is crazy like that. I think this will appeal to a lot of people.
If the Pakeha party wanted to have a discussion about untangling the causes from the symptoms of poverty in a marginalised and disadvantaged racial group where they reject what we are currently doing and propose something else, that would not necessarily be an inherently racist thing to do.
But the Pakeha Party isn’t interested in that. They just want to have a whine about Maori because somehow they think Maori are already more “privileged”. They have constructed a mental fantasyland where stealing the land off it’s rightful owners, exploiting that stolen wealth for their exclusive enrichment and entrenching their white privilege somehow makes them martyrs.
The question is WHY do they feel like martyrs? Why this constant bubbling up of ignorant but popular racism? Generally speaking this party appeals to a broad range of blue collar and mortgage belt whites who think they see a lazy brown elite getting rich on unearned rents and handouts while their hard work is rewarded with increasingly unaffordable housing, stagnant wage growth and poor job security. They feel they’ve played the capitalist game honestly but the rules have been changed. The concerns of this constituency is completely ignored or belittled by the neo-liberal intelligensia component of our elites who dominate the race debate. Who, actually, does speak for Joe and Jane Six-Pack on Struggle Street?
The political vacuum left by the captured political and intellectual technocrats in the elite cadres of our political establishment is always going to be filled by increasingly incoherent and radical parties of the popular right, just like it is in Europe. This wave will be beaten back, but every time the sea recedes on an Orewa or a Pakeha Party the tide is just that little further up the beach for the established order.
I can nail it for you quite easily. It’s because of the land/money given to Maori tribes and such. Not that there is anything wrong with it, but that this stuff was meant to be tidied up along time ago, but keeps going on and on and on.
An interesting choice of word. The fact is that the land etc has been returned.
Yeah, I’m not arguing that. Like I said, someone just needs to finish it and let the country move on.
Rubbish. Do you honestly believe the dog whistling will stop? Why would the Right give up the opportunity to exploit the divisions it has manufactured?
Yes I do.
“Not that there is anything wrong with it, but that this stuff was meant to be tidied up along time ago, but keeps going on and on and on.”
Well yeah, it was meant to be tidied up around 1840 or so, but pakeha chose to ignore that and plough ahead as if they owned the place for the next 150 years, largely to the detriment of maori.
Bit rich to turn around after 150 years and blame maori for it going on and on and on.
You know what I mean.
Yep, I think I do.
You mean a bunch of people who have benefited from an imbalance are upset that the situation is being righted and they want to stop the process before they lose any more of their advantage.
You’re such a dickhead felix.
I genuinely think that’s what you mean. Pakeha have an advantage and they don’t want to lose it.
If that’s not what you mean then say what you mean.
Not all Pakeha have an advantage, or privilege.
Its insane to think so.
Not all pakeha are hot under the collar about maori catching up either.
Felix, is some kid posting under your name?
Yep. The last two comments I’ve posted, a child has posted underneath.
ps the “so what” was because your comment doesn’t mean anything in the context of this discussion, Brett.
“Not all pakeha are hot under the collar about maori catching up either.
The point in this context is that white, working/underclass men (and women I guess) have genuine grievances with how society is treating them. One problem is they’re blaming the wrong target. Telling them they are privileged in comparison to Maori doesn’t solve that, it most likely makes it worse (depending on how it is done).
The other problem is that the people with genuine grievances are merged with the people who are simply just racist. But treating those two groups as the same is a mistake.
Yeah that’s a fair point weka.
The other side of it though is that working class/underclass members of the dominat culture are still privileged over working class/underclass members of minority cultures.
” given to Maori tribes and such” GIVEN??!
Well the Maori have their own party and what have they done? Got into bed with the very people who stand to do all of the things outlined in this diatribe. You can not expect change if you are not willing to put in the “hard yards” and so far this party just look like a bunch of opportunists.
The stupid, it burns:
Really need more anvils dropped in high school and documentaries on Te Treati O Waitangi and NZ history to make people realise just how much the Crown fucked over Maori tribes T_T
So do something about it. Start a political party, make some noise, rather than just complaining.
Yes, because pointing out that something is wrong is totes badzors
Envy is a left wing word
And yet the righties keep using it (“envy”) about the left.
As in National referring to the left as “the politics of envy”?
What, with everything I say?
your post about underclass working men and woman.
Ok. Is there a reason you so often fail to use the reply button?
It didnt show up in your post.
“It didn’t show up in your post.”
Then just click on the lowest “reply” button in that thread. So in this instance you should have clicked on the reply button in the 12:14pm comment by felix.
P.s. I’m not trying to encourage you.
Thanks for the tip and lack of encouragement.
You are welcome, just do a little extra homework on some issues before you shoot your mouth off, and I’ll encourage you with a +1 or similar.
Your post 19 should have used the reply button. You do that a lot (don’t use the reply button so your comment is out of whack with the rest of the discussion). Just wondered why.
Your asking me how the internet works???
Lol, no, but I understand now from fender’s comment
To quote The Don,
They’ll be gone by lunchtime…
Can’t even be bothered blogging about them… *yawn*
This is so ridiculous it’s not even funny.
What specifically do these Pakeha want anyway?
To promote their internet business, mostly.
The Pakeha Party: initially I thought it was a clever prank, but apparently not. It’s party purpose-built for Troglodytes, Knuckle-Draggers & Mouth-Breathers: now they’ve found themselves a place to call Home, which is convenient for the rest of us, as it will allow us to keep an eye on ’em.
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