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From the Thick of It to Borgen

Written By: - Date published: 7:54 am, November 1st, 2013 - 109 comments
Categories: uncategorized - Tags:

The thick of it Malcolm Tucker
We are used to command and control politics here in New Zealand, First Past the Post cultures in an MMP reality. The West Wing, The Thick of It, etc.

But the lead-up to the Labour conference this weekend shows only a real coalition will get Labour back into government. So far, so obvious.

But it doesn’t appear so obvious. Labour has given no signal that it will give Greens accommodation in any electorate. Labour spokespeople like Shane Jones gleefully show their contempt for the Greens. Labour has replied very negatively to Green-Labour cabinet position proposals. Whereas National are far smarter than that and have a PM well schooled in sustaining coalitions no matter how smelly they get.

Has Cunliffe’s leadership just coated the cracks of Labour’s FPP culture with a thick white icing? Is Labour really capable of being as smart in pre-forming coalitions as National clearly is?

What is needed is a signal out of the Labour conference this weekend that Labour are truly ready for a deep, multi-term coalition with the Greens.

If Labour caucus can’t shift from the culture of The Thick of It to Borgen, National sure can. And with that goes the election, again.

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109 comments on “From the Thick of It to Borgen”

  1. Te Reo Putake 1

    Um, what cabinet proposals? And given that the Greens are a list only party, what would an ‘accomodation’ provide? Apart from giving the Nats a better chance of taking an electorate seat back from Labour?

    • mickysavage 1.1

      The Greens stand electorate candidates. In 1999 there was an accommodation of sorts in Coromandel.

      Waitakere last time was screaming out for an accommodation and Sepuloni losing by 9 votes to Bennett when the Greens took 1,800 electorate votes and Mana took 300 electorate votes shows how vital some sort of cooperation can be.

      • Lanthanide 1.1.1

        I asked my BF about this the other day. He doesn’t see any advantage to the greens winning an electorate.

        I note that your example is typically self-serving for Labour: all those green dummies who should have voted for Sepuloni!

        • mickysavage 1.1.1.1

          Um Lanth I made no such reference. I was merely pointing out the glaringly obvious that the slightest degree of cooperation would have resulted in a national Cabinet Minister losing her seat.

          It is strange that some decry the slightest hint of cooperation amongst the left but grudgingly accept the extreme examples of cooperation amongst those to the right.

          • Lanthanide 1.1.1.1.1

            So you were suggesting that Sepuloni shouldn’t have stood in Waitakere, so that a Green candidate could have won?

            • aerobubble 1.1.1.1.1.1

              How much is the Green vote down to people voting for them so they get over the 5% limit. Okay, well given they now are over 10%. I think sure it was necessary to get into parliament but now the Greens are regularly getting split votes. So I guess when their vote is close to the 5% it pays Greens not to do deals, and also not run in a constituency seat. But given how close some seats are, Greens could swing the deal to Labour but this assumes those votes are Labour sympathizers, it maybe the remain Green voters are actually a anti-conservative non-lefty vote.

      • Te Reo Putake 1.1.2

        Precisely, MS. So the accomodation should be that the Greens don’t put up candidates if it’s going to enable the Tories to win. While it doesn’t change the overall allocation of seats in Parliament, I think we all understand having a Tory as your local MP is not a progressive thing.

        • karol 1.1.2.1

          So the Greens should just lie down and do as Labour people tell them?

          • marty mars 1.1.2.1.1

            Leopards can change their spots but it takes generations and patience – I am so not looking forward to the machinations as we move towards the election – too much mind not enough heart for my liking – good luck Greens.

          • Te Reo Putake 1.1.2.1.2

            No, Karol, the Greens should work out for themselves that it’s counter-productive to stand in marginal seats they have no hope of winning. Labour have actually done the sums once in favour of the Greens (Coromandel); I’d like to see the Greens show some common sense so that we don’t have to endure another 3 years of Paula Bennett claiming legitimacy by representing an electorate that should be a left held seat.

            • Pascal's bookie 1.1.2.1.2.1

              So the Greens never stood there before Labour lost the seat then?

              Labour need to stop making excuses for themselves. Oh it all would have been different, bring back buck, whatevs.

              People don’t vote Labour for reasosn. Find out what they are, change their minds.

              Begging for help from the Greens is just laughable. Labour didn’t throw too many bones to the Greens when they were last in govt. If they want assists, they gonna need to earn them.

              Oh but wagh wagh you guys are stupid and you’re stealing our votes and give them back or don’t stand against us it’s not fair.

              • Lanthanide

                I generally agree with PB’s sentiment.

                I think Labour and the Greens *should* be coming to some sort of arrangement to benefit them both. But all too often we see people here suggesting that it is the Greens that are at fault and that they’re the ones standing in the way of Labour winning more electorate seats by splitting the vote (as TRP has said, and ms).

                • Pascal's bookie

                  It’s just weird as far as I’m concerned.

                  Sur Bardford got 300 odd votes. Why isn’t it Mana’s fault?

                  Nope it was that damn high profile Green candidate ‘TOLLESTRUP, Steve’. People couldn’t resist. And everyone knows that the Greens are great at their get out the vote campaign.

                • aerobubble

                  Labour gave us Goff and Shearer, and were close to giving us Robertson. Stands to reason there’s the reason why Labour isn’t getting over the line. Not the Greens.

            • karol 1.1.2.1.2.2

              So the Greens should work out for themselves to do what Labour tells them?

              • Te Reo Putake

                Diddums, Karol. Labour’s not telling them to do anything. I personally reckon the Greens should learn how MMP works, and vote tactically, but I don’t speak for the LP.

            • weka 1.1.2.1.2.3

              TRP: “No, Karol, the Greens should work out for themselves that it’s counter-productive to stand in marginal seats they have no hope of winning. Labour have actually done the sums once in favour of the Greens (Coromandel); I’d like to see the Greens show some common sense so that we don’t have to endure another 3 years of Paula Bennett claiming legitimacy by representing an electorate that should be a left held seat.”

              So says a Labour PR merchant. Silly GP, don’t know what they want or what they are doing. Here’s the thing TRP, the GP have boxed more clever than Labour in recent years. I don’t agree with no concession (and certainly think there should have been concessions all round on the left in the case of Waitakere), but as a GP voter I also understand why they are doing what they are doing. Having two ticks as standard raises the GP profile and garners list votes. They don’t have to win an electorate seat to benefit from that. I would have thought that was pretty self-evident. So when it comes to Waitakere, would the shame of Bennet losing her seat be worth the loss of votes and profile for the GP in that part of the country? I doubt it.

              btw, ‘concession’ implies that they get something in return. What would Labour offer exactly? Hence the usefulness of Ad’s post.

              • Te Reo Putake

                You’d make more sense if you got your head around MMP, weka. Any wasted electorate vote does nothing for the Greens and only helps the right. But your comment about the balance between Bennett keeping her seat and some vague profile gain for the Green candidate strongly suggests you just don’t see the damage that wasted vote does. Because it’s an entirely negative vote, it helps the National Party.

                And if you were right about the Green’s boxing clever, they wouldn’t be languishing down near single figures in the polls. Mind you, as I’ve said regularly, their branding seems designed to limit them to the low teens at best.

                Clearly, the fact that Bennett is the MP for Waitakere suggests that Greens voters, or the Green candidate, didn’t’t understand the unintended consequence of wasting their electorate vote. Which, actually, is to enable the National Party to win elecorate seats they really shouldn’t be winning and leaving the locals with no support in Parliament. As Ad notes in the post, the Nats get it. So why don’t Green voters?

                Still, the next time a Waitakere beneficiary with a problem gets laughed out of Bennett’s office, I suppose they can comfort themselves by knowing that weka’s cool with that. Grrrrr.

                On the plus side, there’s a reasonable chance that the LP can put together a minority Government with NZF, so if the Greens don’t get at least as smart as National, well, they can stay outside the cabinet room for yet another term. Happily, I don’t think the Green’s leadership are actually that dim or unambitious. They’re mature, they’re ready for Government. I really hope they directly instruct their candidates in marginal seats to big up the party vote and leave their egos behind.

                • karol

                  So, it’s all the Greens fault that Labour’s vote has been on the decline in the last couple of elections? It’s all the Greens fault that not enough people were inspired to give their electoral vote to the Labour candidate?

                  I’m glad the Greens don’t use National’s approach as their guide.

                  And Labour supporters trying to bully another party into using the strategies decided by Labour supporters, really isn’t a good look.

                  How about some negotiation and dialogue rather than presupposing the outcome?

                  • Te Reo Putake

                    “So, it’s all the Greens fault that Labour’s vote has been on the decline in the last couple of elections?”

                    Yeah, I didn’t say that, Karol. That’s the third time this post you’ve twisted my words and/or failed to comprehend my point. Putting words in my mouth does you no credit.

                    I’ve been banging on here for years about the need for pre-election blocs. But in the absence of that arrangement, there still needs to be a mature approach to the electorates.

                    The narrow loss of those marginal electorate seats is entirely down to votes wasted elesewhere on the left. Now, I don’t expect Mana to be bothered, but if the Greens want to be in partnership with Labour next year, then both parties need to talk about this issue.

                    Labour’s overall vote is entirely down to Labour. But Paula Bennett’s presence in Waitakere, and Kaye’s in Ak Central, and whoever the non-entity in Chch central is, are down to Green voters not voting in a way that maximises a positive left result under MMP. Like it or not, the Green leadership, in particular, needs to address the problem or else Green voters may again ensure that the people of those electorates are stuck with worse than useless MP’s.

                    Having said all that, I think there is room for Labour to do something similar up north. I think Mana, and Hone, are deserving of recognition for their good work in TTT and a wink and a nod there would be fine by me.

                    • karol

                      I’m not putting words in your mouth, TRP. It’s all there in the implications of your comments. You talk about dialogue and agreement with the Greens while presupposing that the Greens should agree to your strategies. You are dictating to the Greens.

                      that’s not dialogue and negotiations.

                      You also assume that Green List MPs are not available to people in electorates like Waitakere. As with many other electorates with National MPs.

                      It really is a side issue, because it is the List vote that really counts.

                      And Waitakere really isn’t crucial to the overall numbers of MPs – unlike the possibilities in Epsom and Dunne’s electorate.

                      You are overstating the case about the role of electorate MPs. I would prefer that Labour MPs everywhere take more of a stand against Bennett’s beneficiary bashing than they are doing now. That will do far more of a service to beneficiaries.

                    • Pascal's bookie

                      http://www.electionresults.govt.nz/electionresults_2011/electorate-57.html

                      Look at the results TRP. Closely.

                      Compare the list and electorate votes and see who is vote splitting and who isn’t.

                      This is just tiresome horsehit that does nothing but piss Greens off.

                      Labour would have won if they’d turned out 20 more votes. End of.

                      or they would have won if just 10 Labour list voters hadn’t voted for Bennett.

                      Gosh. What fun.

                      And your implication that if voters elect a Nat mp then that’s the only person they’ll have fighting for them or representing them isn’t an idea I’ve ever heard coming from a Green. That’s well fucked up T.

                      Seriously, you need to stop lecturing people about how MMP works, and try and get your own head around it.

                      19 votes. That’s how much Labour fell short. Don’t fucking beg Greens to vote for you, or threaten them. just find the votes.

                    • tinfoilhat

                      Quite frankly Labour can go and get fucked, more of the same condescending attitude of entitlement to government after a couple of pathetic terms in opposition when the greens have done all the work.

                      Come on all you people thinking the Cunliffe is the answer, party vote green and we’ll have a Green led green/labour coalition and finally see some change for the failed neolib experiment of the last thirty years of national and labour governments.

                    • Te Reo Putake

                      Implications, Karol? Or,as they say in the real world, putting words in people’s mouths.

                      I did have a look at the results, P’s B. And that was before my first comment, not just after yours. I like to do my homework ;) Like it or not, Paula Bennett won that seat because of the immaturity of Green voters. One less good MP in Parliament, thanks to people who didn’t think it through.

                      Anyway, it’s no biggie. The tail ain’t gonna wag the dog and teh Greens need Labour a lot more than the other way round. A Labour/NZF minority Goverment will be a lot easier to manage than L/Greens and a lot less scary to swing voters. Be careful what you wish for, fullah.

                    • felix

                      “teh Greens need Labour a lot more than the other way round.”

                      Yeah, I suppose Labour do always have the option of just winning a majority on their own.

                      Maybe they should.

                    • Te Reo Putake

                      There are other options, felix. But, happily, the Greens leadership have a good grip on reality, so I think a Lab/Green Government is still the go.

                    • Pascal's bookie

                      Lol trp.

                      If you look at those results and whinge that it’s the Greens fault for not vote splitting then you need math tutoring.

                      Fuck sake. Your mates in NZF didn’t even run a candidate, and if the 2000 odd of them voted for Sepuloni then Labour voters must have been voting for Bennett.

                      Simple obvious fact is that Sepuloni benefited most from the net split voting (+1877), and the Green candidate suffered most (-1453).

                    • Te Reo Putake

                      Say what? What point do you think you’re making, bookie? You’ve just proved me right, ho ho!

                    • Pascal's bookie

                      The Greens are already giving you a hand out TRP, to the tune of nearly 1500 votes. And you think the problem is they aren’t gifting you enough.

                      Sort out your own campaign. Try and get Labour voters to not vote for Bennett would be a start. You only needed to convince ten of them mate.

                • mikesh

                  If the Greens don’t stand in electorates it is harder for them to “get their message across” and attract party votes. It’s the voters themselves who should be “boxing clever”, not the Green Party. The Greens do their best to stress the fact that it is party votes they want, not electorate votes.

                  • felix

                    “If the Greens don’t stand in electorates it is harder for them to “get their message across” and attract party votes. “

                    Maybe. But if that’s what it’s all about then surely they could still have a specific person in each electorate as the face of the Greens, doing all the meetings and messaging and canvasing and hustling that the candidates do now, and do everything except put their name on the ballot.

          • David H 1.1.2.1.3

            Karol, what is needed is some calm heads to sit down and work this out. It could be the difference in having another round of Paula, or with a little deal, said Paula is kicked back to the list. And maybe this could pave the way for the first Green seat in Parliament.

            Oh and Key probably buggers off back to Hawaii, and becomes a currency trader with the specialty of upsetting the NZ dollar,

            • karol 1.1.2.1.3.1

              To me this is a side issue, and looks mainly like some Labour people trying to blame the Greens for their own shortcomings. Let the strategists do their thing, but I see elections as mainly about policies, and principles, rather than as a game to be won one way or another.

              Policies and principles are the key things I’d like to see discussed and promoted – with the public and between potentially allied parties.

              • greywarbler

                I think the Greens have saved Labour. If it wasn’t for them people would have entirely forgotten what a principled left wing party should look like.

                So don’t kill the goose that laid the golden egg Labour. Or another hack saying, -Don’t be the hangers-on that wanted to harvest the goodies that The Little ‘Green’ Hen had nurtured and worked for, and claim it as from their own labour.

        • Auto_Immune 1.1.2.2

          I wouldn’t assume that all potential Green electorate votes would automatically become Labour electorate votes if a Green candidate didn’t stand.

          The Greens have, so far, only ever campaigned for the party vote (Coromandel aside) and yet candidate votes still flow their way. It could just be that voters rather vote for someone they liked, even if their chances of winning were slim, rather than hold their noses for someone they didn’t like… regardless of the overall outcome.

          • Pascal's bookie 1.1.2.2.1

            Exactly. With 19 votes, the obvious solution is getting out the vote.

          • weka 1.1.2.2.2

            “The Greens have, so far, only ever campaigned for the party vote (Coromandel aside) and yet candidate votes still flow their way.”

            The GP campaigned for two ticks last election. I can’t remember how overt that was, but have heard Norman say so in a meeting. The fact that they put up electorate candidates suggests they want two ticks.

      • Jim Nald 1.1.3

        In addition to or besides accommodation, overtly inclusive and non-adversarial policy conversations between Labour and other potential coalition party members/MPs are vital to keeping the door open as well as sharing the space for policy development or alignment.

        Will there be a session or two at this weekend’s Labour conference inviting a Green/Mana/NZ First party member/MP who will participate, lead or chair a discussion about a particular policy or set of policies? If not, will there be such kind of a session at the next conference?

      • McFlock 1.1.4

        what would it have changed if bennett lost the seat? She was number 14 on the party list. Would it have changed labour or green lists?

        Frankly, saying that the refusal of two >5% parties to divvy up electorate seats has something to do with “FPP culture” is to hoist yourself with your own petard.

  2. millsy 2

    We have to give credit where credit is due here…

    National know how to play the game better than Labour. ACT wouldnt have had Epsom otherwise, likewise UF Ohuariu-Belomt. Not to mention the fact that it gave its partners some substantial policy gains — ie charter schools, etc.

  3. richard 3

    Why would the greens want to be in a coalition with labour? Apart from the gratifying the egos of those MPs who get to be ministers, I can’t see any advantage for the party. That is, unless they have a masochistic desire to shoulder the blame for every bit of bad news and bad policy from the government and consign themselves to political oblivion.

    • weka 3.1

      I can see your view makes sense if you think that the only reason for becoming a Cabinet Minister is to feed one’s ego.

    • Ad 3.2

      Absolutely reasonable quation to ask.
      The New Zealand Greens are the globally strongest Green Party in the world right now.
      Going into coalition government in Germany, for example, cost the Greens branding and political standing for many years.
      Going into coalition can be highly corrosive.

      And Labour, arguably, cannot conceive of attaining power again without the Greens as part of a coalition. In that sense, Labour need the Greens a whole lot more than the other way round.

      The question for the Greens is whether they want to be in power enough to risk their brand and standing.

      The question for Labour is to make it sufficiently worth their while, and to say so early enough to clarify the electoral picture.

      • MrSmith 3.2.1

        Exactly Ad, Labour need the Greens more than the Greens need Labour, so Labour better start kissing some ass, the Greens are going to won’t a lot out of an coalition with Labour and rightly so, because they have more to lose.

      • karol 3.2.2

        And Labour, arguably, cannot conceive of attaining power again without the Greens as part of a coalition. In that sense, Labour need the Greens a whole lot more than the other way round.

        Agreed. There needs to be dialogue and negotiation rather than one party dictating to another.

        The question for the Greens is whether they want to be in power enough to risk their brand and standing.

        To me it’s more about principles and policies. “Branding” is the language of “neoliberal” marketing.

        • yabby 3.2.2.1

          Karol – principles will default to the Groucho Marx school – that is the “those are my principles, and if you don’t like them… well, I have others”.
          That is the real politiks of being in a coalition government and the price to be paid for selling your soul to the middle. However you spin it, the nuts and bolts of government will degrade your brand.

  4. Philgwellington Wellington 4

    Xox
    Wasn’t the SUPERCITY accommodation another policy from ACT that National were happy to enAct?

  5. karol 5

    I haven’t ever noticed the two headlined programmes on Free-to-Air TV in NZ. I have never seen the programmes and so don’t understand the references.

    • mickysavage 5.1

      Hi Karol.

      The Thick of it is a UK comedy where the central figure Malcolm Tucker is a OTT swearing tantrum throwing political fixer, sort of like Trevor Mallard with tourettes!

      Borgen is a Danish drama about Birgitte Nyborg, a leader of a minor party who unexpectedly becomes the first female PM of Denmark after the leaders of the two major parties have major personal crises. The series is in part about the stitching together of a coalition and the continuous deal making she has to achieve to keep her administration afloat.

      • karol 5.1.1

        Thanks, micky for the info.

        My point, though is that the heading makes references to programmes, that as far as I know, don’t show on NZ Free-to-Air TV and are thus not known to the majority of Kiwis.

        • The Gormless Fool formerly known as Oleolebiscuitbarrell 5.1.1.1

          Let’s agree that all popular culture references that karol doesn’t understand should be banned.

          • karol 5.1.1.1.1

            It’s about using references relevant to NZ that will get wide understanding from the general population, and in a way that would be fairly widely understood, rather than ones known to a few politically-tuned to overseas popular culture. It might be popular culture, but seems a bit elitist to me.

            • richard 5.1.1.1.1.1

              As an aside, I didn’t realise Borgen has been on the telly here but I do recommend getting a copy from the video shop.

            • Populuxe1 5.1.1.1.1.2

              “It might be popular culture, but seems a bit elitist to me.”

              Hahahahahahahahahahaha *snort* hahahahahaha *snort snort* hahahahaha

              Please don’t pretend you have any interest in the pop cultural tastes of the general NZ population – it’s almost certainly too masculinist and patriarchal for your standards with an extra helping of organised sport and frivolous neoliberal glamour. You don’t even like Breaking Bad – I dread to think of the scorn you’d pour on people who liked Desperate Housewives or Devious Maids.

              And there is this thing called the internet by which means vast numbers of New Zealanders are continually learning about pop culture outside of New Zealand and downloading it. It’s actually very common, even among older people who just want to be up to date with Coronation Street. Just because you personally have failed to access these things by readily available means, does not make it elitist. Elitism is saying that they don’t matter because you personally don’t care about them and that somehow your opinion is more valid.

              • Rogue Trooper

                oooh

              • karol

                *yawn* – and I said this:

                and in a way that would be fairly widely understood

                The post does not clarify how these programmes are relevant to the ideas in the post. It implies we all have an assumed knowledge of them. Which is far from the case.

                Yes, yes – I know about the internet and downloading. I’ve downloaded a few in my time from various countries. That’s not the point. I don’t assume that other people know anything about them.

                Whether I would like the programmes or not is also not the point. I may well do. I made no criticism of the content of the programmes.

                A lot of people still only watch stuff that’s showing on NZ TV (including young people), or don’t watch at all.

                • Populuxe1

                  ” or don’t watch at all.”

                  Guess why? They’re watching it on line as part of a globalised peer group.

                  • karol

                    Nope – some don’t do that either. And it is a pretty fragmented globalised peer group. That’s part of the way it works – as you indicate by the variety of programmes you mention.

                    How many Kiwis watch the programmes referred to in the post?

                    These days I largely watch what comes through my TV. I have no burning desire to see the latest US (or on occasions UK) dramas as soon as they hit overseas screens. If they are good, they’ll still be good when they get here. The things I have watched online tend to be largely foreign language shows that would never get shown here.

                    But, these days, I am also keen to see more focus on what is produced here for Kiwis – whether it’s public broadcasting, NZ made films and videos, NZ radio, NZ music, or what Kiwis deliver online.

                    Too much of the globalised online is merely a vehicle for US cultural imperialism. (though probably not true of the 2 programmes mentioned in the post).

                    But that’s all beside the point – it wouldn’t have mattered if the relevance of the programme had been mentioned in the post, rather than knowledge of them assumed.

                    • The Gormless Fool formerly known as Oleolebiscuitbarrell

                      Hey, karol. You didn’t get the reference in the title to the post. So fucking what? Maybe this isn’t a problem that is crying out for a solution.

                      Fucking socialists.

                    • karol

                      Maybe not, TGFfkaO. But it does probably mean not understanding the full meaning of the post, other than it has something to do with an FPP comparison with MMP. IT doesn’t really explain how National has been more media savvy about alliance-forming. Shane Jones is an outlier in this issue, and not so relevant, I would have thought. And I don’t think Cunliffe has been negative about proposals for Green cabinet positions.

                    • ghostrider888

                      Consideration of the extensive tapestry of human social history and development and the tenacity with which capitalist power opposes socialist thought and government suggests to many of us on the ‘left’ that subscription to other socio-economic paradigms than socialism is a form of false consciousness , or unconsciousness, whichever position is more convenient for your partner. ;)

            • Lloyd 5.1.1.1.1.3

              I agree karol. I just didn’t understand the headline at all.

              This is a demonstration that any communications with large numbers of people needs to be multifaceted. We don’t have just one TV channel any more.

              Similarly the left vote will not all go to one party. A party which doesn’t have candidates in most seats will not generally be regarded as a serious party, unless of course its mates own the media.

              The Greens need to have candidates in electorates. Labour needs candidates in electorates. This will split votes. I suggest a cup of tea to discuss these issues would be a good solution.

        • Disraeli Gladstone 5.1.1.2

          Did Yes, Minister ever air in NZ Free-to-Air TV. Because I’m not willing to let go of the still very relevant treasure trove of political references just because of some alleged cultural elitism.

          That would be very -courageous-.

      • chris73 5.1.2

        Trevor Mallard with cunning, intelligence and charisma…

  6. The Gormless Fool formerly known as Oleolebiscuitbarrell 6

    But I thought the deal the Nats did with Banks in Epsom was grubby and sordid and shows how cynical they are. I thought this was to be derided.

    Instructions, please.

    • Lanthanide 6.1

      Yes, seems like cognitive dissonance to me as well.

      I guess the difference here is that the Greens are supported by more than a few thousand people in one electorate.

  7. BM 7

    I think Cunliffe’s in a tough position.

    Currently 33% of voters would vote for Labour
    How many of those 33% would vote for a Labour/Greens government?

    I have a sneaking feeling if Cunliffe came out and unequivocally stated that the Greens are going to be part of the next government and they’re going to get cabinet positions and be involved in all the major decisions that shape our country, Labours share of the vote would drop like a stone.

    Which is why he’s being all vague and noncommittal.

    • Pascal's bookie 7.1

      two words.

      Colin. Craig.

      • BM 7.1.1

        I agree, it’s the danger the main parties face when they have to deal with the nutbars out on the fringes.

        Here be dragons.

        • Jim Nald 7.1.1.1

          Can’t argue against the main parties like Labour and Greens having the stomach to deal with nutbars out on the fringes such as Colin Craig, that’s for sure.

    • One Anonymous Knucklehead 7.2

      “He sees a role for a senior Green MP to being part of a future coalition Government’s economic team”.

      Good luck finding a better strawman next time.

    • weka 7.3

      “How many of those 33% would vote for a Labour/Greens government?”

      I would think the number is significantly higher then the number of Labour voters who think that Labour can govern alone with 33% of the vote :roll:

      Try better logic next time.

    • Ad 7.4

      If that logic of contamination worked National would have dropped like a stone long ago. National are doing fine.

  8. marsman 8

    Ohariu-Belmont might have been taken from Peter Dunne if EITHER Labour or the Greens had indicated to voters to vote a certain way. That is what Bolger did in Wellington Central when Prebble first reared his ugly Act head, he told Nat supporters to vote for the arsehole so as not to split the vote and let Labour win the seat.

    • RedBaronCV 8.1

      The Greens did. I was at a meeting where they indicated the candidate vote should go to Charles

  9. northshoreguynz 9

    To broaden the argument a little. Would it be in the realms of possibility to form some sort of Grand Alliance to include NZ First as well. If sustainable it could lock out the right wing for some 3/4 elections.

    • Lanthanide 9.1

      Except Winston is likely to retire in 2017, and when he goes, so does the rest of the party.

      • weka 9.1.1

        But one term of a 3 or 4 way coalition, IF it worked, would be encouraging for those NZF voters to stay voting left once NZF dies.

  10. Sable 10

    This speaks to comments I have made many times on this site regarding Labour’s inability to “play well” with others. There is something very anti social about Labour’s attitude to alliance partners. They are akin to the greedy child who wants all the toys for themselves and see’s no reason in the concept of sharing.

    People demanded MMP because they desired more inclusive, truly representative government. Failing to acknowledge this desire is dangerous for Labour.

    National are indeed very good at sustaining alliances and Labour need to learn from this or face not one but two probable outcomes. In the short term they will face election defeat. In the long term their already shrinking voter base will become even smaller.

    Voters are slowly moving away from Labour much as children tend to spurn selfish children. People are looking to parties such as the Greens and yes, NZ First who can work together and as a result stand a good chance of being elected to office.

    It well be in years to come that Labour becomes the smaller partner in alliance with a more dominant Greens/NZ First. Given we have an aging population Peters pro retiree policies will become increasingly more attractive to many voters, such as the baby boomers, the most affluent section of the NZ population. Climate change is also of growing concern so its likely that the Greens will attract more support as the outcome of climate change becomes more pronounced.

    If Labour want to be a part of the political landscape in New Zealand over the longer term they best learn not just to share power but also ideas. Failure to do so will see them rendered irrelevant.

    • Ad 10.1

      Who knows whether the Green share of the vote has plateaued now, but it’s growing slowly but consistently for a while.

      Were it just those two parties that were abole to form a coaltion together, we would face a government in which the coalition partner was far stronger as a percentage of Cabinet seats than we have ever seen in New Zealand.

      So far National has been able to get by with a few minor tack-ons for Confidence and Supply. What I am signalling is a whole new style of political management is required of Labour in order to deal with this kind of government.

      • Sable 10.1.1

        Agreed Ad. I think Labors attitude is a hang over the from the dictatorial and often naive arrogance of the Clarke years. Time to grow up Labour.

    • Rogue Trooper 10.2

      well put Sable and Ad (looking like Cunliffe “knows when to hold ‘em”).

  11. George D 11

    When I talk to people ‘outside-the-bubble’, they’re big on things like the ‘living wage’ and housing affordability. If either party make what’s important to New Zealanders their focus, and continue to promote themselves positively as an alternative to a government which is failing to deliver the quality of life we want – then we’ll succeed.

    This isn’t, and can’t be a zero sum game for Labour and the Greens.

  12. Pete 12

    The Greens don’t need any such accommodation. They’re not limping along needing an electorate seat to prop up the party. What left bloc voters need to do is vote smart. E.g. if Labour and Green voters had held their noses and voted for Paul Goldsmith in Epsom in 2011, they would have kept Banks out.

    Does anyone think Dunedin North would flip from David Clark to Metiria Turei?

    • tamati 12.1

      Doubt it. David Clark is a former university hostel rector, so has a pretty good personal image on campus. Also quite a working class socially conservative area outside the student area, Labour heartland really.

      Greens best chance for an electorate seat is probably Auckland central, depending where the new boundaries are.

      • bad12 12.1.1

        I would suggest that Russell Norman is likely to take the Rongatai seat after the retirement of Labour’s Annette King,(whenever that is)…

  13. ak 13

    If no Green leader addresses the conference, it’s a massive opportunity missed at a crucial time.

    The Jim/Hels hug gave us three terms. Labgreen, not Labled, is the accepted govt-in-waiting. Face reality or infight to oblivion.

  14. Philgwellington Wellington 14

    Xox
    If you don’t have your greens you’ll never get your just deserts! ;-)

  15. red blooded 15

    If Labour shuffles sideways and leaves the Greens out of government yet again ( especially after supposedly redefining itself with a more openly left wing philosophy) then I and many others will take our votes back to the Greens, partly as a punishment to Labour, who have given explicit indications that they and the Freens will be buddying up in the next term of government, and party to strengthen the Green position to the extent that they simply cannot be excluded again. Labour needs to think tactically, including a longer term view in their thinking.

    • weka 15.1

      Maybe voters like yourself could consider voting GP one last time as a way of ensuring accountability for Labour instead of taking the risk this election?

  16. red blooded 16

    A decision to make closer to the date.

  17. Rich 17

    The only place where an electorate accommodation might help is Ohariu-Belmont.

    Apart from that, the Greens are polling two or three times the threshold and don’t need electorates, nor do Labour. If Labour lose electorate seats in three way contests, they’ll be compensated by the list.

    The Greens run for electorates to boost awareness (you can’t appear at candidate meetings unless you’re a candidate – although I think some allow regional list candidates).

    It’s only if you think that electorate MPs are more *worthy* (because they got votes from one small area rather than the whole country) that electorates matter at all.

    • bad12 17.1

      Funnily enough i agree with you, Electorate Seats are simply fossils from the First Past the Post era, a party like the Green Party should put all it’s effort into securing the Party Vote deliberately leaving the Labour Party the chore of fighting with National over the electorate seats…

      • Lloyd 17.1.1

        Electorate seats are not list seats. List seats are selected in order by the PARTY. When you vote your party list vote you don’t quite know who you are getting (its like a box of chocolates).

        An electorate vote is for a PERSON who represents the party. If you don’t like the person you may not vote for them, even if you agree with the party’s policies. This can be a matter of morality over logic. Further, in the past persons of principal have jumped waka, and that is appropriate for an electorate representative. They were elected as a person first, party second.

        A list candidate is only there as a representative of the party, selected by the party alone and a vote for the party was not a specific vote for a specific person. Waka jumping by list candidates should be grounds for immediate removal from Parliament and a new list candidate replacement.

  18. Tracey 18

    Bm

    surely the average labour voters knows the greens are the likely partner. I think you have this wrong.

  19. Tracey 19

    Pete

    to a large extent they did tht in epsom but most national voted act.

  20. Ed 20

    “National are far smarter than that and have a PM well schooled in sustaining coalitions no matter how smelly they get.”

    I don’t see it. Trader John doesn’t play well with anyone. He will trade anything for power though, and what is notable is that every party that thought they had deal has found themselves helped to oblivion. In contrast, the Clarke governments were notable for cooperation and smaller parties being allowed their ‘day in the sun”, including the Green party even when it had no formal agreement. The relationship with Jim Anderton is the closest to that of National with Banks and Dunne – I don’t see any lower capacity for Labour to ‘play nicely’ either during an election campaign or in government – if anything Labour comes out better from any comparison.

    Their are perception advantages for holding electorate seats but it does not affect whether Labour or National lead a coalition in government. Any accommodation between Labour and Green for an electorate needs to be based on who the electorate will vote for – on Coromandel the Greens had a candidate that deserved support, and it was tacitly given. It is nuts to imply that Sepuloni should have stood aside for a Green candidate, but if the Green party developed a candidate – probably over more than one election, who gained a reasonable level of support, it maybe suitable for Labour to concentrate on the party vote; I would hope they would do that if it would otherwise mean a National list MP.

    Where National have gained is through promoting ‘satellite’ parties that are too small to get into parliament without an electorate seat. In Te Tai Tokerau Labour came second to Mana ahead of the Maori party – no accomodation would have helped defeat National. In Waiariki, the Maori party won by less than a thousand from Mana, with Labour third but picking up the highest number of party votes. With hindsight, perhaps it would have been better to have supported Mana for the electorate in exchange for the Mana candidate encouraging more to give the party vote to Labour, but I don’t think that was obvious pre-election, or will necessarily be appropriate for 2014.

    As for public pronouncements, there is no advantage to either party beyond what has already happened – some policies are well aligned; the joint announcement about electricity was well handled. It woul not surprise me however to find that this conference recognises the reality of coalition requirements by leaving caucus a little freer on policy detail, and concentrating on principles and priorities.

    New Zealand is still not used to coalition governments; Australia had years of Liberal / Country governments, thankfully we do not have their complexity of senate and state governments. Coalitions are not helped by strong public positioning on matters best left for private negotiation (beyond saying that Labour will work with other parties as necessary to form a stable and progressive government, its not clear what signal Ad is looking for. Certainly having supporters of potential coalition parties looking for blame in potential allies is not helpful; publicly both Labour and Green parties have significantly toned sown comment on each others policies in favour of fighting the common enemy – is that not all is needed?

  21. red blooded 21

    What’s needed on top of this is genuine good will after the election. Assuming that Labour has the chance to lead the next government (& let’s remember that this is still a hope, not an inevitability), they need to look for genuine allies who are likely to be an ongoing force on the NZ political landscape. NZ First has sold out Labour and more importantly the people elected them based on their assertions that the only way to get rid of the Nats (in the 90s) was to vote for them (remember the wait before they decided to prop up their avowed enemy in the first MMP coalition?) and later embarrassed Labour in the most recent coalition. If Labour were to sign them up again and push the Greens aside it would demonstrate poor tactical thinking and a shallow commitment to what should be core social and environmental policies. One sure way to push people like me out if the party and towards the Greens is to leave suspicion that Cunliffe and the new team would deal with Winnie and his mates before the Greens, especially if the two were mutually exclusive. In that situation I would do everything I could to strengthen the Greens’ bargaining position, and I’m sure I wouldn’t be alone.

  22. outofbed 22

    I reckon we (the Greens ) could do a deal in Ohariu
    Get rid of Dunne
    Maybe Labour should just ask?

    • Jim Nald 22.1

      It would be nice to see an agreement and arrangement crystallise in Ohariu, as well as seeing that reciprocated.

    • Sable 22.2

      I’d be amazed if anyone wanted to vote for Dung after his shenanigans. He has all the political appeal of a rotten egg. I think the Greens stand an excellent chance of knocking him off his rather pungent perch.

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    Labour | 24-08
  • Labour’s 21st century transport pledge
    The next Labour-led Government will create a 21st century transport system for New Zealand that promotes the most efficient and sustainable combination of transport options, says Labour’s Transport spokesperson Phil Twyford. “Labour will rebalance the Government's transport spending away from...
    Labour | 23-08
  • Housing under National: the facts
    1.       House prices in Auckland Council valuations indicate Auckland house prices have gone up by one-third over the last three years. (Auckland Council) The average Auckland house price has gone up by nearly $225,000 since 2008, up over $75,000 in...
    Labour | 23-08
  • Labour irons out low income tax issue
    The increasing casualisation of work has led to many New Zealand families being disadvantaged through the tax they pay, Labour Leader David Cunliffe says. "Many low paid workers are having to work two or three jobs to make ends meet...
    Labour | 22-08
  • Cornered Government comes out swinging
    The National Government is so desperate to keep its dead-in-the-water expert teachers policy alive, it has refused to rule out forcing schools to participate through legislation, Labour’s Education spokesperson Chris Hipkins says. “John Key today attacked the Educational Institute for...
    Labour | 22-08
  • Pacific people continue to go backwards under National
    A report from Victoria University highlights the fact that Pacific people are continuing to go backwards under a National Government, said Labour’s Pacific Affairs spokesperson Su’a William Sio.  “The report shows the largest inequality increases were in smoking, obesity, tertiary...
    Labour | 22-08
  • Wellington transport plan needs to keep moving
    The failure of the Transport Agency to properly look at alternatives to the Basin Reserve flyover is not a good reason for further delays to improving transport in Wellington, Labour MPs Grant Robertson and Annette King say. “The Board of...
    Labour | 22-08
  • Labour’s focus on inequality, kids and better job prospects
    Tackling child poverty and removing barriers to people working part time to enhance their prospects of moving into a fulltime job are highlights of Labour’s Social Development policy. Releasing the policy today, spokesperson Sue Moroney said while part-time work was...
    Labour | 21-08
  • Political staff should give answers under oath
    The Inspector General of Security and Intelligence should use her full statutory powers to question witnesses under oath about the leak of SIS information, says Labour MP Phil Goff. “Leakage of confidential information from the SIS for political purposes is...
    Labour | 21-08
  • High dollar, hands-off Govt sends workers to dole queue
    The loss of up to 100 jobs at Croxley stationery in Auckland is devastating news for their families and the local Avondale community, Labour’s Employment, Skills and Training spokesperson Grant Robertson says. “The company’s inability to compete in international markets...
    Labour | 21-08
  • National’s flagship education policy dead in the water
    National’s plan to create executive principals and expert teachers is effectively dead in the water with news that 93 percent of primary teachers have no confidence in the scheme, Labour’s Education spokesperson Chris Hipkins says. “The fact that teachers are...
    Labour | 21-08
  • Dunedin will be a knowledge and innovation centre under Labour
    Dunedin will become a knowledge and innovation centre under a Labour Government that will back local businesses, support technology initiatives and fund dynamic regional projects, Labour Leader David Cunliffe says. “Nowhere has the National Government’s short-sightedness been more apparently than...
    Labour | 21-08
  • Inquiry into SIS disclosures the right decision
    Labour MP Phil Goff says the Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security has done the right thing by launching an inquiry into the disclosure of SIS documents about a meeting between himself and the agency’s former director-general. “This inquiry is necessary...
    Labour | 20-08
  • Labour – supporting and valuing carers and the cared for
    Placing real value on our elderly and the people who care for them will be a priority for a Labour Government, Labour Leader David Cunliffe says. Releasing Labour’s Senior Citizens policy today David Cunliffe promised that a Labour Government would...
    Labour | 20-08
  • By Hoki! It’s Labour’s fisheries policy
    A Labour Government will protect the iconic Kiwi tradition of fishing by improving access to the coast, protecting the rights of recreational fishers and reviewing snapper restrictions, Labour’s Fisheries spokesperson Damien O’Connor says. “Catching a fish from the rocks, beach...
    Labour | 20-08
  • Mighty River – Mighty Profits – Mighty hard to swallow
    Mighty River Power’s profit increase of 84 per cent is simply outrageous, says Labour’s Energy spokesperson David Shearer. “Demand for electricity is flat or declining yet the company has made enormous profits. It is the latest power company to celebrate...
    Labour | 19-08
  • Collins’ actions were wrong, not unwise
    John Key’s moral compass remains off-kilter as he cannot bring himself to declare Judith Collins’ actions outright wrong, not simply ‘unwise’, said Labour MP Grant Robertson. “Under pressure John Key is finally shifting his stance but his failure to condemn...
    Labour | 19-08
  • Public servants behaving with more integrity than their masters
    The State Services Commission's new report on the integrity of our state services reflects the yawning gap between the behaviour of public servants and that of their political masters, Labour's State Services spokesperson Maryan Street says. “This report, which surveyed...
    Labour | 19-08
  • Phil Twyford Speech to NZCID
    "Labour's plan to build more and build better: how new approaches to housing, transport and urban development will deliver cities that work" Phil Twyford, Labour Party spokesperson on housing, transport, Auckland issues, and cities.  ...
    Labour | 19-08
  • Labour commits to independent Foreign Affairs and Trade
    “Labour is committed to New Zealand’s Foreign Affairs and Trade policy being independent and proactive, Labour’s Foreign Affairs spokesperson David Shearer says. “We are a small but respected country. Our voice and actions count in international affairs. Labour will take a...
    Labour | 19-08
  • Key must sack Collins over abhorrent actions
    The latest revelations that Judith Collins sent the contact details of a public servant to WhaleOil in a desperate attempt to divert media attention from a bad story is abhorrent, Labour MP Grant Robertson says. “John Key and Judith Collins...
    Labour | 19-08
  • It’s downhill from here under National
    The forecast drop in exports and predicted halving of growth shows that it’s downhill from here with National, Labour’s Finance spokesperson David Parker says. “Growth under this Government peaked in June and halves to two per cent in coming years....
    Labour | 19-08
  • John Key loses moral compass over Collins
    John Key has lost his moral compass over Judith Collins’ involvement with Cameron Slater and lost touch with New Zealanders’ sense of right and wrong, Labour MP Grant Robertson says. “Whoever is Prime Minister there are expectations they will not...
    Labour | 18-08
  • Mana Movement General Election 2014 List confirmed
    The MANA List is now confirmed with all the candidates as below (the numbers are the respective Internet MANA rankings). Candidate, Electorate, Internet MANA List Position Hone Harawira, Te Tai Tokerau (1) Annette Sykes, Waiariki (3) John Minto, Mt Roskill (4) Te Hamua Nikora, Ikaroa-Rawhiti...
    Mana | 18-08
  • PREFU likely to confirm dropping exports
    National’s economic management will be put under the spotlight in tomorrow’s PREFU given clear signs the so-called rock star economy has fallen off the stage, with plummeting prices for raw commodity exports, Labour’s Finance spokesperson David Parker says. “Under National,...
    Labour | 18-08
  • Record profits while Kiwis face a cold winter
    The record profits by two of New Zealand’s largest electricity companies will be a bitter pill for New Zealand households who are paying record amounts for their power, says Labour’s Energy spokesperson David Shearer. “No doubt the Key government will...
    Labour | 18-08
  • Time for John Key to answer yes or no questions
    John Key’s train-wreck interview on Morning Report shows he is no longer capable of a simple yes or no answer and has lost touch with what’s right and wrong, Labour MP Grant Robertson says. “John Key has become so media...
    Labour | 18-08
  • Key must clarify who signed out SIS OIA
    Yet again John Key is proving incapable of answering a simple question on an extremely important issue – this time who signed off Cameron Slater’s fast-tracked SIS OIA request on Phil Goff, said Labour MP Grant Robertson. “John Key’s claim...
    Labour | 18-08
  • Time to invest in our tertiary education system
    A Labour Government will fully review the student support system – including allowances, loans, accommodation support and scholarships – with a view to increasing access and making the system fair, transparent and sustainable, Labour’s Tertiary Education spokesperson Maryan Street says....
    Labour | 17-08
  • Labour will facilitate regional Māori economic development agencies
    The next Labour Government will facilitate the creation of regional Māori economic development groups lead by iwi and hapū to work in partnership with business and public agencies as part of its Māori Development policy. “Labour is committed to working towards...
    Labour | 16-08
  • PRIME MINISTER’S DENIAL AT ODDS WITH NATIONAL PARTY STATEMENT
    Labour’s New Zealand Council has today released an email from the General Manager of the National Party that directly contradicts recent statements from the Prime Minister in relation to the 2011 breaches of Labour Party website databases. In his stand-up...
    Labour | 16-08
  • Labour committed to a healthier NZ for all
    A Labour Government will shift the focus of the health system from narrow targets and short term thinking to make public health and prevention a priority, Labour’s health spokesperson Annette King says. Releasing Labour’s full Health policy today she said...
    Labour | 15-08
  • Labour Policy vs National Policy
    John Key’s favourite defence spin at the moment is people want to talk about policy and not hear answers on the ethics of trawling brothels, why Slater was given SIS information, blackmailing MPs into standing down, rigging candidate elections and hacking...
    The Daily Blog | 28-08
  • The Green Room live streamed on TDB 6.30pm tonight for First Leaders debate
    The ‘Green Room’ will stream 6.pm tonight on The Daily Blog during the TV One leaders’ debate.Use #GreenRoomNZ to join in. The Green Room will be hosted by media commentator Russel Brown, and will feature Green Co-leaders Metiria Turei and Russel Norman responding...
    The Daily Blog | 27-08
  • Manukau East – the next Coalition in action
    A couple of weeks ago I had the pleasure of opening Voice Up – a youth forum run by young people in Otara. I had been asked as Chair of the Local Board to set the scene, encouraging young people...
    The Daily Blog | 27-08
  • GUEST BLOG: Kelly Ellis – The Big Bang Theory
    It’s a shame that it took a brain injury for me to start seeing things with such startling clarity. The realisation that lawyering, fishing, parenting, selling cars and racing yachts had common themes was stunning. Not perhaps as stunning as...
    The Daily Blog | 27-08
  • Jeremy Wells’ Mike Hosking rant on Radio Hauraki: Today, how much Key aro...
    Jeremy Wells’ Mike Hosking on Radio Hauraki...
    The Daily Blog | 27-08
  • 5AA Australia – New Zealand’s Dirty Politics Aftermath and Polls
    MIL OSI – Source: Selwyn Manning – Analysis Headline: 5AA Australia – New Zealand’s Dirty Politics Aftermath and Polls 5AA Australia: On this week’s Across the Ditch bulletin on 5AA Australia, host Peter Godfery and Selwyn Manning discuss the aftermath...
    The Daily Blog | 27-08
  • La’o Hamutuk calls for inquiry into Timor GAP ‘mismanagement’ of oil ...
    The Suai project on the South Coast … “liberated” land but confused communities.Photo: La’o Hamutuk David Robie also blogs at Café Pacific. AN INDEPENDENT Timor-Leste development and social justice agency has called for an inquiry into the Timor GAP corporation...
    The Daily Blog | 27-08
  • What Is Nicky Hager?
    WHAT WILL HISTORY MAKE of Nicky Hager? That slight, perpetually boyish, journalist who descends periodically, like the admonishing angel in a medieval mystery play, to trouble our consciences and wreak merry havoc with the orderly conduct of our political affairs....
    The Daily Blog | 27-08
  • Can anyone in msm explain how after Dirty Politics that they all got played...
    Would you not think, that after reading Dirty Politics, that our mainstream media wouldn’t allow themselves to get tricked and played again by the VERY SAME discredited pundits? The best new feature on Radio NZ is their ‘Blog Watch’ and their...
    The Daily Blog | 27-08
  • Crusher Collins caught out lying about Privacy Commissioner – is this her...
    Crusher angry. Crusher smash own career. Crusher more angry. You would think that after getting outed as such a nasty, vicious piece of work in Dirty Politics, that Crusher would be scrambling to dial back the lies and manipulations. Apparently...
    The Daily Blog | 27-08
  • Cunliffe vs Key – first leaders debate
    This is your election ‘moderator’ – just one more reason an incoming Government need to sack everyone at TVNZ and reform it into an actual public broadcaster. The first leaders debate happens this Thursday, 7pm on TV One. I have...
    The Daily Blog | 26-08
  • GUEST BLOG: Kate Davis – An Old and Honourable Profession
      When Dirty Politics started to reference an ex-prostitute I began to get antsy. My first response was “come on Nicky, we decriminalised in 2003. Its sex worker.” My second response was “Ah oh. Who was it and did they...
    The Daily Blog | 26-08
  • Bought and paid for: the dirty politics of climate denial
    Has climate denial in New Zealand been bought and paid for by corporate interests? We already know that the ACT Party’s routine denial is closely linked to the financial support the party receives from wealthy free market fundamentalist Alan Gibbs,...
    The Daily Blog | 26-08
  • If the msm read The Daily Blog, THIS wouldn’t be a surprise – explainin...
    Yawn. How embarrassing for Hamish Rutherford and Andrea Vance, their breathless article today suggests that the idea of Labour and NZ First cutting a  deal over the buy back of assets  is some how new news. Silly mainstream media  journalists. If...
    The Daily Blog | 26-08
  • How much tax does John Key pay compared to a minimum wage worker??
    Yesterday I did some calculations to find out what tax John Key pays compared to a worker on the minimum wage. And I put out this media release for the Mana Movement: MANA Movement Economic Justice spokesperson John Minto is...
    The Daily Blog | 26-08
  • Hip hop death threats – the selective outrage of our media
    PM death threat in hip hop songAn Auckland hip-hop crew slammed for releasing a song with lyrics that apparently include a threat to kill Prime Minister John Key are urging young people to enrol to vote. Kill The PM, by...
    The Daily Blog | 26-08
  • Watch Slater turn into Key right before your eyes
    Watch Slater turn into Key right before your eyes...
    The Daily Blog | 26-08
  • I don’t always agree with Patrick Gower – but he didn’t deserve this!
    I don’t always agree with Patrick Gower – but he didn’t deserve this weird spear tackle from behind by his own company. I was listening to this interview at the time, and the awkwardness of it must be the worst...
    The Daily Blog | 26-08
  • Is it weird Radio NZ ban me yet still have….
    Is it weird Radio NZ ban me for life because I criticised the Prime Minister yet still have Matthew Hooton, David Farrar and Jordan Williams, 3 of the main protagonists revealed in Dirty Politics as part of their ongoing political...
    The Daily Blog | 25-08
  • Christchurch GCSB meeting – why mass surveillance matters in 2014
    This is the video for last weeks GCSB meeting in Christchurch. Don’t forget Nicky Hager’s public meeting Wednesday night in Auckland, TDB will live stream the event in the interests of our democracy. Broadcast starts 7.30pm here on TDB....
    The Daily Blog | 25-08
  • Assange, Greenwald to appear at Town Hall meeting? + KDC is not the hacker ...
    Wikileaks founder and the engineer of revealing some of the largest abuses of power in the modern era, Julian Assange, is rumoured to be appearing at the September 15th Town Hall meeting. Assange would join award winning investigative journalist Glen...
    The Daily Blog | 25-08
  • Why Paula Bennett will be the next leader and Hooton throws the Prime Minis...
    I don’t think the public have any idea of the behind the scenes meltdown now occurring within National. There are plenty of decent right wingers who all have ethical standards who have looked at what their leaders have been doing and...
    The Daily Blog | 25-08
  • GUEST BLOG: Curwen Rolinson – That Awkward Feeling When Your Campaign Goe...
    Urgh. It’s a thankless and nearly impossible task politically firefighting some days. Somebody (who isn’t you, but who’s in your care, or whom you’ve got a close professional relationship with) does or says something stupid; somebody from the Media’s there...
    The Daily Blog | 25-08
  • GUEST BLOG: Joe Trinder – Dirty politics goes viral
    Join the latest social networking craze this election that every Dog Cat and Jabba is putting on their facebook pages.     Joe Trinder – Ngāti Awa Born and born in Ōtepoti Ōtākou, Ex RNZN he is an Information Technology...
    The Daily Blog | 25-08
  • Blogwatch: An open letter to David Farrar: Please, be that guy
    Dear David, In light of  Nicky Hager’s book Dirty Politics, you wrote a blog entitled ‘Some changes on Kiwiblog’ and you suggested it was time to tighten up ship on your website, saying “I want to improve trust in myself,...
    The Daily Blog | 25-08
  • What The Hell Was That! Reflections on the media’s coverage of the Intern...
    WHAT, EXACTLY, DO WE KNOW about the confrontation outside Internet-Mana’s campaign launch? Well, we know the news media was there in force. We also know Internet-Mana’s media person, Pam Corkery, blew her stack. We know that Corkery’s outburst led the...
    The Daily Blog | 25-08
  • NZ First candidate – homophobic, bennie bashing anti-intellectual clown
    Oh God, apart from Ron Mark, Tracey Martin, Curwen Rolinson and Winston before midday, the woeful cavalcade of political circus freaks NZ First seem to attract has picked up another hitchhiker. This time Epsom candidate Cliff Lyon who said this about Labour… “If...
    The Daily Blog | 25-08
  • Nicky Hager Public Meeting LIVESTREAM on The Daily Blog 7.30pm Wednesday 27...
    As part of our commitment to the 2014 Election debate, The Daily Blog will Livestream the Nicky Hager public meeting in Auckland, 7.30pm live from the Mt Eden War Memorial this Wednesday on this site. Doors open at 7pm. It...
    The Daily Blog | 25-08
  • GUEST BLOG: Curwen Rolinson – Opening Night. It’s like an opera!
    On Saturday night just gone, we collectively experienced one of the premier panegyrys of political pageantry in our three yearly electoral cycle. For one glorious weekend evening every three years, it’s not the All Blacks or some Super 14 team, or...
    The Daily Blog | 25-08
  • Jeremy Wells’ Mike Hosking rant on Radio Hauraki: Today, Unions – what ...
    Jeremy Wells’ Mike Hosking on Radio Hauraki...
    The Daily Blog | 25-08
  • Timor-Leste’s Parliament handed ‘humiliating’ defeat over harsh media...
    East Timorese journalists raise their hands to approve the Timor-Leste JournalistCode of Ethics in October 2013. Photo: Tempo Semanal/Cafe Pacific   David Robie also blogs at Café Pacific. PACIFIC SCOOP reported this week that East Timor’s Appeal Court had scrapped...
    The Daily Blog | 24-08
  • THIS is why we need a public broadcaster!
    The richest 20% of us in NZ own 70% of the wealth, with 18% in the hands of the second richest quintile, and 10% in the hands of the middle quintile. Just 2 per cent was owned by people in...
    The Daily Blog | 24-08
  • A vote for Key is a vote for this
    A vote for Key is a vote for this...
    The Daily Blog | 24-08
  • Why the Secret Intelligence Service feeding Cameron Slater information is s...
    Folks, it doesn’t matter if you are Right or Left, the issue of the Secret Intelligence Service being forced to feed a far right hate speech merchant like Cameron Slater with sensitive information is an ‘us’ issue. The SIS are...
    The Daily Blog | 24-08
  • How lost and irrelevant are ACT?
    So ACT had it’s ‘launch’. Well, what passes as an ACT launch these days. Lot’s of anorak’s with that 1000 yard star and dreams of a Milton Friedman Free Market dancing behind their eyelids all crammed into a room small...
    The Daily Blog | 24-08
  • National Party rowing advert aimed at Gen Xers
    Unkind wags such as myself would suggest that if the above were a real representation of National, it would look more like this…   National know they have the rural mob and the angry provincial vote locked in, with their...
    The Daily Blog | 24-08
  • National Housing propaganda – McGehan Close Revisited
    .   . Housing has become a major, defining issue in New Zealand. We have critical shortages and escalating prices in  in the main centres and falling house values in the regions. The National government has addressed the supply &...
    The Daily Blog | 24-08
  • The boldest, most creative and dynamic policy on employment for two generat...
    If you watched TV news last night you could be forgiven for thinking that a circus was on when Internet MANA launched its election campaign today. The reporting was abysmal but I won’t rehash it here because it’s been described...
    The Daily Blog | 24-08
  • Call for Aaron Bhatnagar’s resignation from govt body
    .   . One of the many sordid “bit”-players in Nicky Hager’s book, “Dirty Politics“, and one of Cameron Slater’s inner-cabal, is businessman, National Party card-carrying cadre,  and former city councillor, Aaron Bhatnagar; . . In 2008, Bhatnagar was caught...
    The Daily Blog | 24-08
  • Internet MANA announce free tertiary education & full employment – me...
    Internet MANA launch their campaign after an extraordinary road tour and after gaining 4% in the Colmar Brunton Poll, today should have been the start point for a momentous occasion  in progressive political history. It was, but sadly most won’t...
    The Daily Blog | 24-08
  • Privilege denies true representation of disability rights
    The human right of people with disabilities in New Zealand has come back into the spotlight by the Human Rights Commission. The report named ‘Making Disability Rights Real’ highlights some of the main issues as being adequate data collection, accessibility,...
    The Daily Blog | 23-08
  • Election TV campaign ads – Opening Night
    . .The infamous National Party ‘Dancing Cossacks’ Attack advert  NZ, 23 August -  The election campaign “kicked off” on Saturday evening, with a one hour “televisual feast”. Party advertisements were broadcast for National, Labour, Greens, NZ First, United Future/Peter Dunne,...
    The Daily Blog | 23-08
  • Blogging vs Journalism vs Politics – The 7 latest revolting revelations
    So we now enter the most dangerous phase for National, the phase where the minutia of detail is so great now, the media have all the ammunition to keep asking questions that clearly show Key isn’t being honest in his...
    The Daily Blog | 23-08
  • A positive story of political co-operation!
    .   . Wellington, NZ, 23 August - The following is a true story and shows how the natural inclination of the rank-and-file of our main left-wing parties is to work together… I’ve been in contact with both the Green...
    The Daily Blog | 23-08
  • “Dirty Politics” – the fall-out continues…
    . . As the shock-wave from Nicky Hager’s book, “Dirty Politics” continues to engulf everything in it’s path, it’s worthwhile looking at the damage caused by the ever-expanding fallout… Fallout Dispersal Zone: 1oom Farrar wrote on 19 August  (and later...
    The Daily Blog | 23-08
  • #TeamKey’s sinking boat
    #TeamKey’s sinking boat...
    The Daily Blog | 23-08
  • Cat vs Key – I know nuffin
    Cat vs Key – I know nuffin...
    The Daily Blog | 23-08
  • Israel’s sudden fixation with Hamas
    Israel’s sudden fixation with Hamas...
    The Daily Blog | 23-08
  • A Matter of Whether John Key is Credible
    Headline: A Matter of Whether John Key is Credible Analysis by Selwyn Manning. Prime Minister, John Key.WITHIN NATIONAL’S STRATEGY TEAM there is an acceptance that the facts revealed in the book, Dirty Politics, is chewing away at the party’s popular...
    The Daily Blog | 23-08
  • TDB Political Diary for 2014 Election
    Here are the political events TDB will be covering this election. I will be live tweeting these events and  blog reviews will follow the next day. Internet MANA launch – August – Sunday 24th – 1pm, Western Springs School Green...
    The Daily Blog | 22-08
  • How Much Higher Can Auckland Prices Go?
    National's plan to liberalise the use of Kiwisaver funds and its proposal to raise ts cheap "Welcome Home" loan thresholds to help buyers purchase a new home has been welcomed by home building companies but attacked as a "welfare scheme...
    Scoop politics | 28-08
  • OPC submission period extended
    We have extended the submission period for the modified reassessment of a bee control affecting five organophosphate and carbamate insecticides (APP202142)....
    Scoop politics | 28-08
  • Vinay Deobhakta struck off roll of barristers and solicitors
    The New Zealand Lawyers and Conveyancers Disciplinary Tribunal has ordered former Tauranga lawyer Vinay Deobhakta to be struck off the roll of barristers and solicitors....
    Scoop politics | 28-08
  • Major parties to front up for Climate Voter election debate
    New Zealand’s main political parties will take part in ‘The Great Climate Voter Debate’ on September 3....
    Scoop politics | 28-08
  • Family violence… too big to be ignored
    As Annah Stretton gears up for her New Zealand Fashion Week show on Thursday she is utilizing her spotlight to help change the face of family violence in this country saying “the problem is far too big to ignore”....
    Scoop politics | 28-08
  • Candidate’s SOS to northern Maori voters: Save our seats!
    (Extract from address by Rev Te Hira Paenga to Kura Hourua Maori Political Leaders hui, in Whangarei this evening)....
    Scoop politics | 28-08
  • Mary O’Neill to Stand for the Alliance in Napier
    The Alliance Party has confirmed Mary O’Neill as the Alliance candidate in the Napier Electorate for the 2014 election....
    Scoop politics | 28-08
  • TONIGHT [28/8/14]: The Great Political Comedy Debate
    It's a night for debating. You could stay home frowning at tonight's Leaders debate, or laugh it up with us at BATS!...
    Scoop politics | 28-08
  • Cunliffe against personal responsibility over billboards
    The accusation by David Cunliffe that the Conservative Party is subscribing to a surveillance society by protecting its billboards via the use of motion sensor cameras reveals an anti-personal responsibility position by the about-to-be-retired Leader...
    Scoop politics | 27-08
  • Groundbreaking health and climate conference
    The World Health Organization (WHO) is holding its first conference on climate change and health at its headquarters in Geneva this week, with New Zealand health experts in attendance....
    Scoop politics | 27-08
  • Te Tai Tokerau Party
    Last night at the Leadership Academy of Company A debate Clinton Dearlove announced the creation of a new political party supported by Whanau and Hapu....
    Scoop politics | 27-08
  • Significant fallout from Dirty Politics allegations
    Dirty politics ... costing National up to 3.8% of its pre-publication support Large numbers of New Zealanders are aware of and talking about the issues raised as a result of the publication of Nicky Hager’s book, Dirty Politics, according to...
    Scoop politics | 27-08
  • Colin Craig is “deluded and dangerous” – Act
    “Colin Craig is proposing a radical transformation of our constitution. The Conservatives are proposing to overthrow of one hundred and fifty odd years of parliamentary democracy and replace it with binding referenda” said ACT Leader Dr Jamie Whyte....
    Scoop politics | 27-08
  • WoF law will evict the poor and students from their houses
    The Green warrant of fitness law will evict the poor and students from their houses, if they’re lucky enough to find a place to rent in the first place...
    Scoop politics | 27-08
  • Police response to IPCA report on ‘out of control’ parties
    Police accept today's Independent Police Conduct Authority report recommendations regarding the handling of 'out of control' parties and has already improved its policies and practices for managing these complex and sometimes violent situations....
    Scoop politics | 27-08
  • Review of Police handling of ‘out of control’ parties
    An Independent Police Conduct Authority review has found that Police are working to ensure officers called upon to deal with out of control gatherings in future are better trained to deal with the situations they may face....
    Scoop politics | 27-08
  • Wynyard and NZ Police Announce Ground-breaking Partnership
    Auckland, 28 August 2014 - Wynyard Group, a market leader in advanced crime analytics software and services, today welcomed the New Zealand Police as a long term partner in its Crime Science Research Institute (CSRI)....
    Scoop politics | 27-08
  • Polls confirm dirty politics out and the Conservatives in
    The latest 3News-Reid Research poll has the Conservative Party on 4.6 per cent which means they are virtually on their way to Parliament. Garth McVicar, the Conservative Party candidate for the Napier electorate believes the polls are proof that the...
    Scoop politics | 27-08
  • Toke the Vote 2014: NORML’s guide to NZ cannabis policies
    NORML’s policy, renewed at our recent national conference , is to encourage supporters to vote for parties and candidates who will work to reform our cannabis laws....
    Scoop politics | 27-08
  • Internet Mana List Embodies Modern Aotearoa
    An impressive mix of personal and professional skills, cultural backgrounds and ages marks the release of Internet MANA’s combined party list. “Our list highlights the calibre of talent woven throughout Internet MANA,” said leader Hone Harawira....
    Scoop politics | 27-08
  • The Dirty Politics Fallout
    Tonight’s 3News-Reid Research poll shows that the Conservative Party is on the verge of making it into the next Parliament, even without an electorate deal with National. The poll, conducted in the week following the release of Nicky Hager’s...
    Scoop politics | 27-08
  • Te reo Māori trending at New Zealand Fashion Week
    Language and fashion express culture and identity so it’s fitting for the Māori Party to launch its te reo Māori policy at New Zealand’s premiere fashion event in Auckland....
    Scoop politics | 27-08
  • Party And Candidate Lists for 2014 Election Released
    The Electoral Commission has released the nominations for the 2014 General Election, with 15 registered political parties and 554 candidates contesting the election....
    Scoop politics | 27-08
  • Take Steps Against Child Poverty with Us!
    TAKE STEPS AGAINST CHILD POVERTY WITH US! Britomart to Aotea Square, Auckland, 11am, Saturday 6 Sept Music * Interactive Art * Stilt Walkers * Great Speakers * Plus more!...
    Scoop politics | 27-08
  • Leading politicians to debate NZ’s role in the world
    Have you ever wondered where New Zealand stands when it comes to issues beyond our borders? Join Amnesty International's North Shore Group on Monday 1 September for a lively cross party debate and the chance to find out the answer...
    Scoop politics | 27-08
  • Political Debate on Family Violence – Livestream
    The Dunedin Collaboration Against Family Violence is happy to announce the upcoming political debate on Family Violence chaired by Professor Nicola Atwool of the University of Otago. Family Violence is a huge problem in our community and we invite representatives...
    Scoop politics | 27-08
  • Politicians ignore 20% of New Zealanders
    Despite 20% of New Zealanders supporting it, none of the parties currently represented in Parliament endorse the legalisation of cannabis....
    Scoop politics | 27-08
  • Company tax rates
    The Op Ed pages of the left-leaning New York Times are full of articles by economists supporting proposals to dramatically lower Company Taxes. These economists are urging the United States to lower company taxes and point to Canada where the...
    Scoop politics | 27-08
  • Stephen Dudley Case: No appeal or review of discharge
    On 8 August 2014 Crown Law received a request from the office of the Auckland Crown Solicitor to consider a Crown appeal against the discharge without conviction entered in respect of M in the High Court at Auckland on 7...
    Scoop politics | 27-08
  • Dudley Family Statement
    “We are utterly devastated at the news regarding the law not allowing for this unjustified discharge without conviction to be appealed....
    Scoop politics | 27-08
  • Chief Judge: Chief Sized Offender Bias
    “Justice by name, not by nature” states Ruth Money Sensible Sentencing Trust National Spokesperson, of Justice Helen Winkelmann’s decision to discharge without conviction the offender charged with the fatal attack on 15 year old schoolboy Stephen...
    Scoop politics | 27-08
  • Confusion over BPS Reducing Crime and Reoffending Results
    A survey has revealed widespread confusion – even amongst professionals in the justice sector – about what the government’s reducing crime and reoffending progress reports actually mean....
    Scoop politics | 26-08
  • Commission condemns violent attack on Gay Wellingtonians
    The Human Rights Commission has condemned a violent attack on staff and patrons at a gay bar in central Wellington last Friday. GayNZ reported that the alleged attackers were abusive and violent when they realised the bar and the people...
    Scoop politics | 26-08
  • One down, 12 to go says Community Housing Aotearoa
    The Waimahia Inlet is a step in the right direction for community housing to deliver 20% of New Zealand’s social and affordable housing by 2020, says Community Housing Aotearoa. CHA Director Scott Figenshow says the sector has been set a...
    Scoop politics | 26-08
  • Research considering changes to pedestrian crossing laws
    A University of Canterbury research project has been considering the costs and benefits of a range of potential changes to pedestrian crossing laws that would bring New Zealand in line with the rest of the world....
    Scoop politics | 26-08
  • Dairy farmers and consumers at risk from unapproved GE Grain
    The Ministry for Primary Industries (MPI) must immediately test all maize and soy for presence of unapproved GE lines coming from the Americas....
    Scoop politics | 26-08
  • NZ on Air Refuse to Condemn “Kill the PM” Song
    New Zealand On Air has refused to condemn @peace’s 'Kill the PM' song, and will not provide any assurance that no further taxpayer money will be used to support groups that promote violence and political hate. Earlier today the Taxpayers’...
    Scoop politics | 26-08
  • iPredict Ltd 2014 Election Update #32
    The combined wisdom of iPredict’s 8000 registered traders suggests National has begun a recovery after its prospects crashed last week following the release of Nicky Hager’s book Dirty Politics . The governing party’s forecast party vote is back...
    Scoop politics | 26-08
  • Juicy carrot for prisoners alarming suggestion – McVicar
    The Conservative Party Justice Spokesman, Garth McVicar says the public will be alarmed to learn that the only tool the Corrections Department has available to get prisoners to behave is to offer them a juicy carrot....
    Scoop politics | 26-08
  • Panel: Fiji’s Return to Democracy
    Fiji’s post-coup elections and their impact in the Pacific o What is the role of the media in the Elections? o How might New Zealand help Fiji on its return to democracy?...
    Scoop politics | 26-08
  • Cross-party consensus on climate change critical
    Senior NZ health professionals welcome recent policy announcements on climate change by major political parties, saying cross-party consensus is critical to address this leading health issue....
    Scoop politics | 26-08
  • Minister of Transport to Attend Election Debate Tomorrow
    Organisers of tomorrow night's transport debate in Auckland are delighted that Minister of Transport Hon. Gerry Brownlee will now be attending....
    Scoop politics | 26-08
  • Society Applauds Proposed NZ-Wide Risk Assessment
    The Wise Response Society is heartened to see that Labour' just released Climate Change policy includes formal support for the Society's call for a New Zealand-wide Risk Assessment. The Green Party has also formally acknowledged support for the Wise...
    Scoop politics | 26-08
  • Iwi Leaders welcome Labour policy on climate change
    Labour’s policy to stamp out price – gouging by big polluters that has cost New Zealand tax-payers $1.4 billion over the last 3 years and especially impacted low – income Maori households has been welcomed by Dr. Apirana Mahuika, Chairman...
    Scoop politics | 26-08
  • Auckland Broadcasting Debate this Sunday
    Auckland Broadcasting Debate 6.30pm, August 31st 2014 (doors open 6.15pm) Pioneer Women's Hall High Street, Auckland City...
    Scoop politics | 26-08
  • New Zealand First Party List 2014
    New Zealand First is pleased to release the Party list for the 2014 election. We believe the list is a balance of experience, youth, skill and ability. These candidates, many of whom will be in Parliament after the election, will...
    Scoop politics | 26-08
  • Refugee Policy in Election Year
    Leading politicians representing major political parties will be highlighting their policies, answering questions and ebating the issues in the lead-up to the coming election in an event organised by RCNZ this coming Saturday in Auckland. The present...
    Scoop politics | 26-08
  • Intueri shareholders celebrate corporate welfare
    New Zealand's largest tertiary education company Intueri, which announced a $1.6 million profit yesterday, has received an increase in public funding over the last two years of at least $1.8 million....
    Scoop politics | 26-08
  • Response to “Kill The PM” Song Coverage
    I do not want to literally kill this man. I do not wish to have sexual relations with anybody related to him. Let's not pretend a silly little song ever changed anything. Last I seen famine was still going pretty...
    Scoop politics | 26-08
  • Sarjeant Gallery redevelopment resource consent approved
    Mayor Annette Main has welcomed the granting of resource consent for the Sarjeant Gallery Te Whare o Rehua Whanganui redevelopment project....
    Scoop politics | 25-08
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