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Many questions left unanswered in Banks affair

Written By: - Date published: 9:54 am, September 26th, 2012 - 43 comments
Categories: corruption, john banks, john key - Tags:

“Ignorance gets us nowhere”, it’s National’s new slogan and it certainly applied with Key’s feigned ignorance in answer to questions on Banks’ corruption last week. Key’s behaviour is jeopardising our reputation as a democracy that doesn’t tolerate corruption. And he’s got a lot of questions still to answer.

Two particularly interesting angles are what exactly Banks told Key’s office and the donation from SkyCity.

Key has never been specific about what Banks told his chief of staff other than that he complied with the law – which the Police found to be untrue. Did Banks tell the CoS that he had received no donation from Dotcom and SkyCity, that he couldn’t remember any such donations, or that he had returned those donations but he had not broken the law?

Banks denied having known about the donations at all, and that is presumably what he told Key’s man. The evidence, of course, shows that Banks was intimately involved in receiving the donations – although the focus has been on the Dotcom donation, it was the SkyCity donation that Banks received in person from the CEO. What did Banks tell the CoS about this?

And, then, there’s the questions of the other anonymous donations – there are a dozen or so large anonymous donations, all of them are the same size as at least one other anonymous donation. This was clearly a strategy to hide politically risky donations. Who were those other large donors; whose donations did Banks cover up?

And finally, what is in Banks’ statement to the police? Does Key know, if not why hadn’t he asked or required Banks to make his statement public?

43 comments on “Many questions left unanswered in Banks affair”

  1. ed 1

    If the people asking the questions shut up and let the people answering them answer we might well get some asnwers.
    Key and co get away with too much because the constant interuptions give the speaker the chance to divert instead of forcing the answer.

  2. vto 2

    What astounds me is the easy acceptance, seemingly by all parties involved, that providing a donation will result in help being provided to the donor once the donee is in power.

    That is pure corruption.

    That dotcom expects such means he should resign.
    That banks promised it means he should resign.
    That key and everybody else ignores this means they should all resign.

    What is the difference between this and Taito Phillipfield?

    • Akldnut 2.1

      Fields – corrupt Polynesian – Labour
      Banks – corrupt European – Act (ex National)

      I’m going for Political Party and Race.

    • bbfloyd 2.2

      So, what should Kim Dot Com resign from? the human race? The Helensville country club? His library membership?

      Do you have information that proves Dot Com was only donating because he was expecting some “payola” from banks?

      I’m all ears….

      • vto 2.2.1

        Resign from politics silly. And the local library.

        Clearly there can be more than one reason for a donation but if just one of those links to something like expectation of a favour then it is corruption.

        As for direct quotes you will have to go back and find something yourself. I am just going off his expectation that he would get preferential treatment when in the clink and preferential treatment over his residency. In addition, I recall Dotcom saying somewhere that Banks had said to him that it will be easier to help if the donations were split in two, directly implying that the donations would lead to preferential treatment and assistance.

        Over to you now for splitting the hair ….

        • freedom 2.2.1.1

          late yesterday when i first saw this new line being spun across the vaults of amnesia that decorate the PM’s office, I had to have a good think .. .. .. and I do not recall a single instance where Kim Dotcom has been reported as instigating or expecting preferential treatment and that this was conditional to his donating NZD$50,000 to the failed Mayoral Campaign of John Banks.

          John Banks is the only one wearing that particualar party hat

  3. Dr Terry 3

    Possibly best that Banks does not resign, for then he will continue to make an ass of Key and be a thorn in the side of this Government! I really think that many of Key’s supporters are enjoying the game of “corruption”! He is a great entertainer, but there it stops.

  4. vto 4

    Hear ye. Hear ye.

    Come one and all. Get your political favours here. Only an anonymous donation required. A Minister for $50,000. Get your political favours here.

    (have i got this wrong? after all, this is what dotcom has said he was doing… buying political assistance)

    • bbfloyd 4.1

      Once more…. do you have a direct quote that shows dot com saying his donation was contingent on getting “help”. or was that what he was offered by banks?

      Bit of a difference there….. an important one though….

      • Tim G 4.1.1

        Yeah, he asked Banks to bring him an extra bwankie in Mt Eden remand.

        I’d have done that for $50k (if I could find a blanket big enough), even if it meant flying back to NZ (shudder), probably could have got a stop over at HK and Dotcom’s suite while I was at it, too.

      • felix 4.1.2

        Not sure why you think it matters whether the donation was contingent on him getting help, but the relevant quotes you seek are in the sworn witness statements and affidavits from Kim Dotcom, his lawyer, and his security people.

        No-one is going to show you a quote where Banks says “Give me 50 grand and I’ll do you these favours” because while Banks is several flavours of fuckwit he’s not a complete idiot. Experienced crims don’t talk like that.

        However according to those sworn statements he did say

        “I want to help you Kim and I can help you more effectively if no-one knows about this donation”

        and that’s as close as it gets in real life.

  5. calltoaccount 5

    Just wondering, a wild “smoking gun” in the dark…

    This Dec/Jan spying of Dotcom, would Banks have called during this time? Would it be on tape, will it be revealed?

    It would be the “…gate” to end all “…gates”! :-)

  6. ianmac 6

    Q6 today: GRANT ROBERTSON to the Prime Minister: Does he stand by his statement to the House yesterday, “The police statement quite clearly said that there was insufficient evidence, that there is a statute of limitations, and that he has complied with the law.”; if so, where in the police statement do they say that Mr Banks complied with the law?
    Wonder if the PM will be in the House today?

  7. Balanced View 7

    This post is tagged to “corruption”

    Can someone explain to me where the corruption is?

    • bbfloyd 7.1

      You can find “corruption in any dictionary you choose to open…. remember those? they’re the books with no plotline in them, and everything is strangely alphabetic…

    • Te Reo Putake 7.2

      Receiving $50k and later offering to ‘help’, if it’s kept secret. Hiding the $50k and then lying about it. Being in ACT.
       
      That’s all I can come up with in 2 or 3 seconds. You may want to add to the list yourself, BV.

      • Balanced View 7.2.1

        “Receiving $50k and later offering to ‘help’, if it’s kept secret.”
        Where is the proof of this taking place?

        “Hiding the $50k and then lying about it.”
        This is dishonest – not corrupt

        “Being in ACT.”
        OK – I’ll give you this one

        • McFlock 7.2.1.1

          “Receiving $50k and later offering to ‘help’, if it’s kept secret.”
          Where is the >The order is quibblable, but the substance seems well-supported.

          “I want to help you Kim and I can help you more effectively if no-one knows about this donation.”   
           

          “Hiding the $50k and then lying about it.”
          This is dishonest – not corrupt

          lol
          Public dishonesty about a public official offering help when requesting tens of thousands of dollars is pretty fucking corrupt. 
          Fail your ethics class, did you? Or did you never take one? Or if you passed, did you cheat in the exam?
             
          Typical tory. 

          • Balanced View 7.2.1.1.1

            “Public dishonesty about a public official offering help when requesting tens of thousands of dollars is pretty fucking corrupt.

            Completely agree. But where is the proof of this offer to help – and this time don’t use a quote of a man so obviously angry that his $50,000 didn’t get him “help” when he wanted it.

            There is no corruption in this case, just an instance of a dishonest and foolish man crossing paths with a larger than life German so used to buying favours.

            • Te Reo Putake 7.2.1.1.1.1

              “a larger than life German so used to buying favours.”
               
              Well, clearly then, you think that Dotcom believed he had ‘bought’ Banks. Doesn’t that trouble you? Doesn’t a senior politician getting himself into a position where a rich man feels he has him in his pocket, and then lying about it, evidence of Bank’s unsuitability for office?

              • Colonial Viper

                Damn you’re good.

              • Balanced View

                Nope.
                And let’s be honest – most political donations are designed to provide the donator some sort of benefit.

                We don’t need this pathetic carry on to provide us with evidence of Bank’s unsuitability for office.

                • Te Reo Putake

                  Well, clearly you have a high tolerence for corruption, BV. No wonder you can’t spot it in this case. There is a huge difference between trying to influence a polly and trying to buy them. It’s the difference between lobbying and criminality. But you’re Ok with the latter apparently.
                   
                  ps The donator? The donator!? The word is donor.

                  • Balanced View

                    I’m glad you recognise the difference TRP – so you will understand that Bank’s wasnt bought – hence why Dotcom went public.

                    I’ll bet that many returns wouldn’t stand up to the scrutiny that Bank’s has. The law is as much of an ass on this as Banks himself. But corrupt – no.

                    Donator – I’ll give you permission to use my made up word for 24 hours.

                    • Te Reo Putake

                      Nope, Banks was bought, but he bottled it when Dotcom was jailed. All irrelevent anyway. Simple question: given what you believe about Banks, should he be sacked?

                    • Colonial Viper

                      I’m glad you recognise the difference TRP – so you will understand that Bank’s wasnt bought – hence why Dotcom went public.

                      Dotcom went public to expose Banks’ lies over anonymous donations. Dotcom’s recorded evidence showing Banks’ corrupt nature was nice to have.

                    • Balanced View

                      TRP – Simple question: given what you believe about Banks, should he be sacked?

                      If I was working on gut feelings – gone
                      If I was working on hard evidence – private warning
                      If I was working on personal preference – gone, in fact he wouldn’t be there as I wouldn’t have had a cup of tea

                    • Colonial Viper

                      Balanced View – you have better judgement than our Prime Minister.

  8. karol 8

    http://www.parliament.nz/en-NZ/PB/Business/QOA/2/f/3/00HOH_OralQuestions-List-of-questions-for-oral-answer.htm

    GRANT ROBERTSON to the Prime Minister: Does he stand by his statement to the House yesterday, “The police statement quite clearly said that there was insufficient evidence, that there is a statute of limitations, and that he has complied with the law.”; if so, where in the police statement do they say that Mr Banks complied with the law?

    Key’s reply was that it was he, JK, who concluded: that he has complied with the law not the report.

    • mike 8.1

      Yep, Robertson got Key to retract his statement.

      • karol 8.1.1

        Transcript here – Key dancing on a pin:

        http://www.parliament.nz/en-NZ/PB/Business/QOA/a/e/d/50HansQ_20120926_00000006-6-Hon-John-Banks-Inquiry-into-Electoral.htm

        Rt Hon JOHN KEY (Prime Minister) : Yes, I stand by my statements that the police statement quite clearly says that there is insufficient evidence and that there is a statute of limitations. What I should have said was that I believe that Mr Banks complied with the law.

        Grant Robertson: How does submitting a false return, which the Prime Minister acknowledged Mr Banks did, constitute complying with the law?

        Rt Hon JOHN KEY: Well, no charges have been laid against Mr Banks.

        …. and on it goes. But ultimately no big hit.

        • mike 8.1.1.1

          I saw. Either he’s not answering the question, or his answer to that question implies that he thinks not getting charged means you didn’t break the law. Which is absurd, people break the law everyday without getting charged. Rhubarb indeed.

          And when Robertson later asks whether submitting a false return is against the law, Lockwood gives him a faceplam by saying he’s asking for a legal opinion so Key doesn’t have to answer.

          Why doesn’t the opposition ask Key why he puts his personal trust in the word of John Banks ahead of his duty to the public to read a police report which contradicts the word of John Banks?

        • Poission 8.1.1.2

          Grant Robertson: Why is he continuing to protect Mr Banks when sworn statements from the chief executive of Skycity and a senior partner at Simpson Grierson show that he lied to the New Zealand public while he was a Minister of the Crown?

          Lied Then it gets better as Peters asks why no one in the house (including the speaker) defended banks.

          not a whisper

          • karol 8.1.1.2.1

            Actually I thought Peters asked why Robertson was allowed to accuse a minister (Banks) of lying because he thought it was against standing orders. Yet Lockwood defended Robertson saying that because he had said it nicely he could ask about Banks lying – or something like that – strange indeed?

            • Poission 8.1.1.2.1.1

              He had 2 points a to windup lockwood ,and to entice someone to defend Banks,which no one was prepared today,

              • karol

                OK. Gottit, Poission.

                And the Nats behind John and Bill in the House have been looking quite glum the last couple of days. The cheer seems to have gone out of the cheerleaders, except for a couple of odd moments when Key tried his stand up, blame-the-opposition routine.

                • Poission

                  No one wants to hug the Leper, death by association ,A cynic might suggest the word association connotations with National is the coincidental reason for ANZ rebranding today as well.

  9. Poission 9

    Corruption is defined in wiki say for the police is .

    Another example is police officers flouting the police code of conduct in order to secure convictions of suspects — for example, through the use of falsified evidence.

    This is relevant to the intentional lie that Inspector Wormald supplied on Oath in the DC case.as observed by Davison.on RNZ.

    Do the police have zero tolerance for perjury ? There was a nice moment on Campbell live where Wormald reached for a cup of water to help swallow his tongue.

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  • Saying it Loud on Climate in Christchurch
    The Government’s Christchurch consultation meeting on New Zealand’s emission targets was inspiring – not for what was in the Ministry for the Environment’s (MFE’s) defeatist video about the obstacles to changing to a low carbon future, but for what the… ...
    GreensBy Eugenie Sage MP
    8 hours ago
  • Budget silent on small business
    The Government has completely ignored one of the most important sectors of the economy – small and medium-sized enterprises – in Budget 2015, Labour’s Small Business spokesperson Jacinda Ardern says. "A stunning 41 per cent of jobs were created by… ...
    8 hours ago
  • Thank you John, it’s been bloody marvellous
    The departure of John Campbell is a blow to current affairs investigative journalism, Labour’s Broadcasting Spokesperson Clare Curran says. “Campbell Live stood out in its field. Its axing comes as local broadcasting in New Zealand remains in a state of… ...
    8 hours ago
  • KiwiSaver cut shows no long-term plan
    National’s cutting of the KiwiSaver kickstart is incredibly short-term thinking, typical of a Budget that is woefully short on ideas to generate wealth and opportunity, Labour’s Finance spokesperson Grant Robertson says. “New Zealand’s savings rate is far too low. KiwiSaver… ...
    10 hours ago
  • National hits the panic button for its 7th Budget
    National has hit the panic button for its 7th Budget in a desperate attempt to look like they’re taking action to reduce our shameful child poverty rates, but they are giving with one hand and taking with the other, Opposition… ...
    1 day ago
  • Panic and back-flips can’t hide twin deficits
    National’s token measures to fight fires they have left burning for seven long years can’t hide a Budget that is long on broken promises, short on vision and fails to reach surplus, says Labour’s Finance spokesperson Grant Robertson. “After being… ...
    1 day ago
  • Auckland land measure seven years too late
    National are so desperate to look like they are doing something about the Auckland housing crisis they have dusted off Labour’s 2008 inventory of government land available for housing and re-announced it, says Labour’s housing spokesperson Phil Twyford. “Despite National… ...
    1 day ago
  • Access to gender reassignment surgery essential
    I was frankly disgusted to hear the Minister for Health say that funding gender reassignment surgeries is a “nutty idea”. A recent study found that in New Zealand 1% of young people identified themselves as transgender, and 3% were unsure… ...
    GreensBy Jan Logie MP
    2 days ago
  • Global milk prices now lowest in 6 years
    The latest fall in the global dairy price has brought it to the lowest level in six years and shows there must be meaningful action in tomorrow’s Budget to diversify the economy, says Labour’s Finance spokesperson Grant Robertson. “Dairy prices… ...
    2 days ago
  • Big risks as CYF checks stopped
    Revelations that Child, Youth and Family is no longer assisting home-based early childhood educators by vetting potential employees should set alarm bells ringing, Labour Children’s spokesperson Jacinda Ardern says. “Doing away with an extra mechanism for checking potential new employees… ...
    3 days ago
  • Housing crisis about real people not numbers
    The Government’s continued failure to tackle the housing crisis is seeing thousands of vulnerable Kiwis being kept off social housing waiting lists, while others, who are on the list, are being forced to live in cars and garages, says Labour’s… ...
    3 days ago
  • Housing crisis about real people not numbers
    The Government’s continued failure to tackle the housing crisis is seeing thousands of vulnerable Kiwis being kept off social housing waiting lists, while others, who are on the list, are being forced to live in cars and garages, says Labour’s… ...
    3 days ago
  • State of origin
    Kiwis are increasingly concerned about the food they give their families. New Zealand consumers have the right to know where their food has come from, particularly when it involves animals, and should be able to expect our Government to label… ...
    GreensBy Steffan Browning MP
    3 days ago
  • Relationships Aotearoa
    It is disturbing that Relationships Aotearoa, a voluntary organisation set up in 1949 to help couples struggling with their relationships following the upheavals of World War II, may be forced to close, says Acting Spokesperson for the Voluntary and Community… ...
    3 days ago
  • An economy that is just working for some is an economy that is not working
    The National Party presents itself as a great manager of the economy, but if the economy is only working for some we really need to question that assertion. Alongside the perpetually elusive surplus, the levels of risk in our economy are… ...
    GreensBy Jan Logie MP
    3 days ago
  • An economy that is just working for some is an economy that is not working
    The National Party presents itself as a great manager of the economy, but if the economy is only working for some we really need to question that assertion. Alongside the perpetually elusive surplus, the levels of risk in our economy are… ...
    GreensBy Jan Logie MP
    3 days ago
  • House prices to a crack $1 million in 17 months
    The average Auckland home is on track to cost $1 million in 17 months’ time if nothing substantial is done to rein in soaring price rises, Labour’s Housing spokesperson Phil Twyford says. “Auckland’s house prices have skyrocketed 63 per cent… ...
    4 days ago
  • Vital support services can’t be left in lurch
    The National Government has big questions to answer about how a provider of services to thousands of vulnerable New Zealanders is set to fold, Labour’s Finance spokesperson Grant Robertson says. Relationships Aotearoa which provides support and counselling to families, individuals… ...
    4 days ago
  • Treasury and IRD on a capital gains tax
    Both the Treasury and IRD have been advising the National Government on the benefits of a capital gains tax. Documents released to the Green Party under an Official Information Act request show that John Key has been selective with the… ...
    GreensBy Russel Norman MP
    4 days ago
  • Charity legislation needs review
    It is unacceptable that the big corporate based charities claim  millions in annual income tax exemptions, while small community based and operated non-profit organisations  struggle to gain official charity status, Labour’s acting spokesperson for the Voluntary and Community Sector Louisa… ...
    4 days ago
  • John’s panic-Key response to housing crisis
    John Key needs to tell New Zealanders what caused his sudden change of heart that led to the Government’s scrambled and last-minute housing measures, Opposition Leader Andrew Little says. “The Prime Minister’s sudden rush of blood to his head followed… ...
    4 days ago
  • Keep our Assets Christchurch Campaign: An update
    I recently presented my submission to keep Christchurch Council assets at the Christchurch City Council’s public hearings on its 10 year plan on 13 May. The hearings are live-streamed and recorded so you can watch them on www.ccc.govt.nz. The Council’s… ...
    GreensBy Eugenie Sage MP
    4 days ago
  • John Key finally admits there’s a housing crisis
    John Key’s weak measures to rein in the astronomical profits property speculators are making are an admission – finally – that there is a housing crisis, Labour Leader Andrew Little says. “But yet again National is tinkering with the housing… ...
    5 days ago
  • Government stifles voices in CYFs review
    The Government’s exclusion of the Māori Women’s Welfare League in a panel on the future of CYFs is a cynical ploy to stifle views, says Labour’s Māori Development Spokesperson Nanaia Mahuta. “It's unbelievable that a significant review on the future… ...
    1 week ago
  • Speech to the Otago Chamber of Commerce
    Thank you very much for the opportunity to be here today. It’s a pleasure as always to be back in the town that raised me. Growing up in St Kilda meant that there was one thing that was a big… ...
    1 week ago
  • Key can’t just be Prime Minister for Parnell
    John Key must show New Zealanders in next week’s Budget that he is more than the Prime Minister for Parnell, and is also the Prime Minister for Pine Hill, Putararu and Palmerston North, Labour’s Finance spokesperson Grant Robertson says. In… ...
    1 week ago
  • Stop the conversions
    This week, some Waikato locals took me and intrepid photographer Amanda Rogers on a tour of some  lakes and waterways in their region, and up to the massive dairy conversions in the upper catchment of the Waikato River. It… ...
    GreensBy Catherine Delahunty MP
    1 week ago
  • More regional jobs go in Corrections reshape
    News that 194 Corrections staff are to lose their jobs will have ramifications not only for them and their families but for the wider community, Labour’s Corrections spokesperson Kelvin Davis says. Prison units at Waikeria, Tongariro and Rimutaka face closure… ...
    1 week ago
  • Government’s climate meetings off to a bumpy start
    On Wednesday, I attended a hui and an evening meeting that the Government had organised in Nelson as part of its climate change consultation tour, to support the Nelson community telling the Government to take meaningful action on climate change.… ...
    GreensBy Steffan Browning MP
    1 week ago
  • Taxpayers the only ones left feeling blue
    Ministry of Social Development bosses could have saved themselves thousands of dollars in consultants’ fees by providing staff with rose-tinted spectacles, Labour’s State Services spokesperson Kris Faafoi says. A report out today reveals the Ministry is spending over half a… ...
    1 week ago
  • Why are the regions still facing restrictions?
    Labour's Housing spokesperson Phil Twyford is questioning why the regions should continue to be saddled with LVR lending restrictions announced by the Reserve Bank today. “Labour has been calling for the regions to be exempted from LVRs for the best… ...
    1 week ago
  • The high costs of weak environmental regulation
    Te Waihora/Lake Ellesmere is described on the Department of Conservation website as “Canterbury’s largest and New Zealand’s fifth largest [lake], and an internationally important wildlife area.” But the lake is also polluted by nutrients leaching from farms in the catchment.… ...
    GreensBy Eugenie Sage MP
    1 week ago
  • Submissions to Wellington City Council on their Gambling Venues Policy
    Every three years Councils across the country are required to check that their gambling venue policies are still fit for purpose and they can choose to consult on their policy if they are thinking of making changes. Councils don’t have… ...
    GreensBy Denise Roche MP
    1 week ago
  • Reserve Bank action shows Govt out of touch and out of ideas
    The Reserve Bank’s unprecedented measures today show it understands the serious risks of the overheating housing market – in complete contrast to John Key’s refusal to acknowledge the crisis, Labour’s Finance spokesperson Grant Robertson says. “The Bank is right to… ...
    1 week ago
  • Send us your snaps: 25 Years of the Green Party
    This year we've hit a milestone. We're turning 25.To help celebrate a quarter of a century, please send us your photos from the last 25 years of the Green Party Aotearoa New Zealand! Note: Photos must be jpg, gif or… ...
    1 week ago
  • 25 Years of the Green Party
    This year the Green Party sends 25. To help us celebrate a quarter of a century please send us you photos of 25 years of the Green Party!Photos must be jpg,gif or png and smaller than 2MB. If you are… ...
    1 week ago
  • Bay growth plan too little too late
    Today’s Bay of Plenty growth study from MBIE is another example of Government spin - lots of talk but little action, says Labour’s Regional Development spokesperson David Cunliffe.  “This is a region that desperately needs to develop the downstream processing… ...
    1 week ago
  • Government bows to ACC pressure
     The Government has finally buckled to pressure from Labour and the New Zealand public in making a half billion dollar cut to ACC levies, but the full benefits are two years away,” says Opposition Leader Andrew Little.  “$500 million over… ...
    2 weeks ago
  • False figures cloud Auckland transport facts
    The Prime Minister should apologise and issue a correction after both he and Transport Minister Simon Bridges have been caught out misrepresenting facts on Auckland’s transport spending, Labour’s Housing spokesperson Phil Twyford says. "Both John Key and Simon Bridges have… ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Govt books confirm National can’t post surplus
    The last publication of the Government’s books before the budget shows National will break its promise of seven years and two election campaigns and fail to get the books in order, says Labour’s Finance Spokesperson Grant Robertson. “The Government is… ...
    2 weeks ago
  • US state joins NZ with GE food labelling
    New Zealand has a similar law making the labelling of many GE foods compulsory, but the Government seems to let it slide.  Because the government has not monitored or enforced our GE food labelling laws since 2003, it seems the… ...
    GreensBy Steffan Browning MP
    2 weeks ago
  • Labour Pays Tribute to Erima Henare
    “E ua e te ua tata rahi ana, Ko te hua i te kamo taheke i runga raa. No reira e te rangatira Erima takoto mai I roto I te ringa o Ihowa o nga Mano e moe e.” ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Labour Pays Tribute to Erima Henare
    “E ua e te ua tata rahi ana, Ko te hua i te kamo taheke i runga raa. No reira e te rangatira Erima takoto mai I roto I te ringa o Ihowa o nga Mano e moe e.” ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Labour Pays Tribute to Erima Henare
    “E ua e te ua tata rahi ana, Ko te hua i te kamo taheke i runga raa. No reira e te rangatira Erima takoto mai I roto I te ringa o Ihowa o nga Mano e moe e.” ...
    2 weeks ago

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