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Open mike 01/02/2014

Written By: - Date published: 6:57 am, February 1st, 2014 - 139 comments
Categories: open mike - Tags:

openmike

Open mike is your post.

For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).

Step up to the mike …

139 comments on “Open mike 01/02/2014”

  1. Pasupial 1

    Is the BandStand Gathering (/Many Voices/ No Megaphones) on for today at 1pm?

    I’ve speculatively lined up a guest speaker from Oil Free Otago. They are scheduled to talk at 2pm though I don’t know who yet (will have more info later in morn). It would be good if someone (CV?) had an alternative guest speaker, or even prepared a speech themself – to provide a range of viewpoints even if not on the same topic.

    • Bill 1.1

      Is the BandStand Gathering (/Many Voices/ No Megaphones) on for today at 1pm?

      Of course.

    • weka 1.2

      “It would be good if someone (CV?) had an alternative guest speaker, or even prepared a speech themself – to provide a range of viewpoints even if not on the same topic.”

      How about an Open Mike?

      • Pasupial 1.2.1

        Weka

        More of an Open Floor than an Open Mike.

        I personally like the idea of a promenade where different speakers give their talks at the same time on the large grass area in front of the BandStand; so that an audience can walk between them and choose that which most interests them. Not sure if we’ll have the logistics of that sorted out for this time though – even if anyone else does think it’s a good idea.

        And; No Megaphones, goes for microphones too.

        • weka 1.2.1.1

          Crikey, are there that many people going?

          Open Bandstand?

          • Pasupial 1.2.1.1.1

            Weka

            There were less than the; “Fewer than several dozen”, that CV reported for last week, but it was a bit of a grey day verging on drizzle. My speculative speaker was a no-show too this week, but we did hash out a provisional tikanga for such guest speakers in the future. I’d meant to convince someone to come along when I went along to welcome the SV Tiama into harbour, but misread 7:30am for 7:30pm (doh!). Trying to arrange someone to come talk with a group where I couldn’t give numbers or (then) even location with any certainty via email at a day’s notice wasn’t the most effective.

            Anyway, the week after next (I’ll be out of town on Waitangi weekend) at 2pm on the lawn in front of the bandstand (or the duckpond pagoda if raining), there will be someone from OFO giving a brief talk about our activities; followed by a probably much longer q&a/ discussion. This will not be part of the; “Many Voices”, group proper, but as we will be meeting from 1pm onwards at the bandstand I imagine that many of us will head over to check that out.

            Though with the Many Voices theme, I still like the idea of different speakers on the lawn at the same time. But that’s for others to arrange, I’m going to have full enough hands this next fortnight as it is.

      • Pasupial 1.2.2

        Weka

        More of an Open Floor than an Open Mike.

        I personally like the idea of a promenade where different speakers give their talks at the same time on the large grass area in front of the BandStand; so that audience can walk between them and choose that which most interests them. Not sure if we’ll have the logistics of that sorted out for this time though – even if anyone else does think it’s a good idea.

        And; No Megaphones, goes for microphones too.

        [Post moderator: I’m getting glitches trying to submit this comment – please delete any repetitions]

  2. get a taste of just how good little richard was…

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqxNSvFMkag

    (the clip is from an early rock-flick called ‘don’t knock the rock’..you will also see bill haley..

    ..in the audience..watching richard..)

    phillip ure..

  3. freedom 3

    Here’s a question:

    With the gazzillion bandwidths that the Government has been auctioning off in recent years, and the ample availabilty of transmission towers across the land, why does Radio New Zealand still have one of the smallest most pathetic broadcast strengths on the spectrum?

    Run through the stations and you are carpet-bombed with strong clear commercial product and then, if you are very careful and able to fine tune with the delicate touch of a blind safecracker, you catch a murmur of our public broadcaster.

    note: The fact it is available on-line is irrelevant to the question. If the web is broken, or you can no longer afford it, the radio is still required.

    • Ron 3.1

      I agree I have terrible reception in the East Coast Bays for National Programme.
      It used to be that the National Radio transmissions could be heard throughout New Zealand but now both AM & FM are hard to receive.
      I have a memory that we had to reduce power of transmissions because it interfered with Australian stations but have no way of confirming if that is correct. Should we all be complaining to RNZ?

    • Lanthanide 3.2

      My answer is because National have frozen RNZ’s budget for several years now. They have to do “more with less”.

    • greywarbler 3.3

      freedom
      I have wondered this about RadioNZ bandwidth. It can be so hard to get full strength, a fraction of a millimetre, and the voice of a pop star or brain-dead announcer or advert floods your ears.

      Also I feel that their equipment and budget is possibly a little low. Lately they get very poor connections with phone interviews, they can’t get the audio clips lined up in the right place, and the announcer is embarrassed by a hole where the announced audio doesn’t come, and there are breaks in transmission for some reason which they apologise for. I don’t mind fire drill where some wit has prerecorded items, like the song, Baby come back or some other appropriate waiting song.

      Radionz and all that sail in it are precious, and I don’t want any harm to come to it, the buildings, or the people. So I am content for them to have fire drill.

      I’ll not forgive the NACTs for denying them their purpose-built building so they could make some grossly inferior use of the space. Why I can’t remember. I think it was at the time that the NACTS had found the dosh to put the Olde Legislative building on rails and shift it sideways, so they could knock down the Beehive, or add to it so that they would have an edifice suitable for the glory of their golden eminences. I don’t know if they were thinking of something like the Guggenheimer gallery in Bilbao in Spain but I wouldn’t be surprised.
      http://www.panoramio.com/photo/81822284

      • Ron 3.3.1

        I think it was a part of Nationals long term plans to remove public broadcasting. In Auckland they forced RNZ to sell the Durham Street Broadcasting House and RNZ was then dumped into rented premises in Cook Street. Incidentally the money from the sales did not go to RNZ but back to government.
        Same thing happened in Wellington as mentioned above when it was decided to demolish Broadcasting House and RNZ was forced into rented premises. From memory Richard Prebble was involved in that fiasco. Of course once they got RNZ out of their own building and the building demolished it was decided the space was not needed. OF course the object was to harass RNZ and put them at the mercy of private landlords. Anything to weaken public broadcasting and remove an independent news media voice.
        Labour needs to address this problem by strengthening public radio and giving it sufficient funding to carry out its functions. I would love to see it gain some form of charter to make it hard if not impossible for future governments to wreck public broadcasting without the people having a say.
        RNZ should be directed to implement digital broadcasting and if it would help funding give them licences for a commercial network. After all they had one until National sold it off to its mates.
        With the current mess that television is in I would not care if TVNZ was abolished and its licences transfered to a public body. I do not think it is possible for TVNZ ever to regain the ability to produce public service television.

        • greywarbler 3.3.1.1

          Ron
          I echo that bit about strengthening RadioNZ. make it hard if not impossible for future governments to wreck public broadcasting without the people having a say.
          RNZ should be directed to implement digital broadcasting and if it would help funding give them licences for a commercial network.

          Don’t know about commercial radio adjunct with public. There is such a gulf between the ‘thinking’ that goes on the commercial and public, I wouldn’t want to taint public radio.

          I didn’t realise that about RNZ in Auckland. My family once had a house in Cook Street and I went hunting it a while back and saw the Radionz site at the top but unfortunately my family’s house had gone. There were soviet-style apartments in its place. So Richard Prebble was in the deal. The radio, the rail, the rahrah of rolling government and the unions. What a heady mix of maliciousness.
          (Incidentally is Dr Mark Prebble his relative? I was looking at a 2005 nz Listener and it noted he was State Services Commissioner and had announced average 14% pay rises for state CEOs, with his own salary rising to nearly $400,000.)

          And I agree that TVNZ is far away from having anything but the quick quid in its sights. Government of course, demanding its quid has ensured that. Timorous Labour last time could not bring itself to have a quality public service, and drove Ian Fraser mad with the charter constraints plus having their hand out.
          I don’t know that we couldn’t have a channel for public and get someone in from even perhaps the USA where they might have quite a good service, behind the florid bushes of commercial and political patronage. You never know, USA is surprising sometimes. Australia is a bit close, I would like something fresh and untainted by our politicians on either side of the ditch.

          • Ron 3.3.1.1.1

            And one more thing that I forgot. Radio NZ should be required to bring back a weekly intelligent journal. Now that The Listener has been sold off to German interests we need a good weekly that can investigate radio programmes, provide a platform for good literature and the arts as well as other articles of interest to the public. The Listener has long ceased to be anything more than a soap digest competing in the women’s magazine market.
            Incidentally if my memory serves me correct when I used to work for Broadcasting when the Listener magazine was sold the Corporation retained the rights to The Listener masthead. It used to show in the balance sheet.
            Don’t know if it still is owned by the people or was eventually sold off. Would be interesting if it was still publicly owned, maybe we could take it back. If not then we could call new magazine Radio Times maybe

      • millsy 3.3.2

        Im guessing those in charge of cost cutting told them that voice uses less bandwidth and management adjusted appropriately.

        It doesnt help that the quality of radio recivers that are sold has dropped, and that the deregulated environment has overcrowded the spectrum — I am no expert but I belive there are issues there.

        Agree that demolishing Broadcasting House was a mistake. When built, was well ahead of its time (rather like a lot of things in this country — we seemed to lead the world in everything, right up until the 80’s), I belive even Richard Prebble (who imposed the current broadcasting model on us) opposed this.

  4. North 4

    What pray tell makes ACT’s Jamie Whyte a “philosopher” ?

    “The 48-year-old philosopher, author and columnist returned from Britain last year to settle in Auckland with his wife and two daughters, aged 10 and 6.”

    As distinct say from an electoral fraudster (alleged), a botoxer, a love perker, a perkbuster, a hollow man, a grave robber, an ex-Labour scab.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11195091

  5. karol 5

    King Coal – all for profit and energy and trashing the environment. The Guardian:‘Death by sludge, coal and climate change for Great Barrier Reef?’

    he reef is being threatened from all sides. Dredging for coal and gas ports. Increased shipping frequency. Run off from agricultural developments. Increased ocean acidity and rises in sea temperatures from fossil fuel burning. The threats have got the reef surrounded.

    Now the government’s Great Barrier Reef Marine Park Authority (GBRMPA) has decided to allow up to three million cubic metres of ocean bottom to be dredged and then dumped within the borders of the marine park and also the Great Barrier Reef World Heritage area.

    The decision is another necessary block removed in order to liberate millions of tonnes of coal from Queensland’s Galilee Basin, where miners hope to then rail it to shore and load it onto containers at an expanded coal terminal at Abbot Point. The dredging is to make way for the ships as they weave their way through the Great Barrier Reef – a wondrous icon of the blue planet that doubles as the world’s most iconic coal shipping lane.

    Most of the coal is destined for Asia and India, where it will be burned, releasing more greenhouse gases to warm the oceans and the atmosphere.

    Lots of news outlets reporting this, including Aussie’s ABC: Queensland Resources Council spokesperson talks of “increasingly hysterical environmental activists”.

  6. Philj 6

    Xox
    And then there is the tag team, Collins and Tolley, abetted by Key, in attacking Metiria, over her clothing. A cat fight . And the next distraction?

    • Debbie Brown 6.1

      Au contraire, Collins and Tolley have been quite clear.

      According to them, people who care for the poor should only be allowed to dress in opshop rags. It is hypocrisy to dress according to the code of your colleagues or workplace.

      Of course none of these considerations apply to Collins or Tolley. They can wear what they like, as they have never given a rats about anyone but the rich.

      • Will@Welly 6.1.1

        Metiria is a Maori woman, who had a child young, so she “fitted” the stereotypical Maori profile.
        “Problem” is Metiria has since gained an education – shock, horror – and become an M.P. – too much.
        Metiria should have stayed at home, wearing a “grass skirt”, an ill-fitting bra, if one at all, had one child on the hip, and another one suckling, then she would have fitted the National stereotypical profile of how they like to see “poor people”. No, National will howl and protest, and malign anyone who tries to rise above their perceived glass ceiling.
        As for being “race haters” – nailed it in one – some things never change – we learnt that in ’81. Tolley, Collins, Findlayson, and even Key are all hangovers from that generation who stood and chanted pro-tour.

        • KJT 6.1.1.1

          The new right wing rule.

          “Speaking up for the disadvantaged, if you are not one of them, is hypocritical”.

          Convenient.

        • Treetop 6.1.1.2

          Were I Metiria I would wear a tee – shirt with a print of Teina Pora on the front with the following wording, “Justice system is excruciating” and on the back, “Madness at its finest.”

          I would also hold up a sign saying “Legal aid required for Privy Council.”

      • TE 6.1.2

        +10000 collins and tolley just ugly envious bullies

  7. freedom 7

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11195104

    So, based on past years I guess we can all look forward to increasing dairy prices at the supermarket.
    Although butter is about the only dairy I consume, I still say $6.50 (+- a bit) is ridiculous for 500g.

    Funny thing is I thought the great rule of the market economy was meant to work in the opposite direction. When supply is increasing and production is made more efficient, costs are meant to decrease and customers are supposedly the recipients of the savings through reduced prices so as to have more disposable income to raise their own level of well-being.

    That is the entire basis for trickle down right, or am I wrong?

    • Draco T Bastard 7.1

      Funny thing is I thought the great rule of the market economy was meant to work in the opposite direction.

      I suppose that would apply if demand was static or decreasing but the reason for exports is to increase demand which inevitably results in higher inflation in the local market. No local market can support a growing economy when that growing economy is just doing more of the same thing. We really should have stopped the increase in farming once we were growing enough to feed all the population here and then we’d see the improvements that increased productivity promises.

      Then there’s the fact that the supply and demand curve is total bollocks anyway as shown by Steve Keen.

      • srylands 7.1.1

        “We really should have stopped the increase in farming once we were growing enough to feed all the population here and then we’d see the improvements that increased productivity promises.”

        This must be the most stupid thing said in New Zealand today.

        • Colonial Viper 7.1.1.1

          It’s actually an extremely wise comment.

          Anyways, what the fuck do you give a damn about NZ, you overseas foreigner?

          • McFlock 7.1.1.1.1

            awww, but sspylands wrote much of the policy that got us where we are today – broke, fucked infrastructure and the turds have risen to the top.

        • Draco T Bastard 7.1.1.2

          Like most people who think they understand economics you have NFI WTF higher productivity is for.

          Higher productivity is so that a society can do other things, not more of the same. This then allows them to seek knowledge and innovation.

          Today’s economics narrows the focus down solely to profit making society and the individuals that live within it less than what they could be.

  8. my laugh-out-loud political-moment of the weak..

    ..was keys’ claims the greens ‘fight dirty’…

    (said earnestly..hand-on-heart..fixed eye-contact with the (incredulous) journos he was trying to push this pile of stinking bullshit to..it was quite the moment..)

    ..and those journalists..long-trained to swallow/repeat whatever key thrusts at them..were clearly having problems swallowing this whopper..there was all-round journo-gagging..

    ..questioning..even..(whoar..!..how dare they..!..eh..?..their editors will be pulling them aside for a quick word:..’you know we always swallow..around here’..)

    ..and having done commentaries on questiontime for some time now..

    ..i can report that while all these mongrels are flinging crap at each other..the greens sit primly..(prissily even?)..on the sidelines..the most emotion displayed being pursed-lips..

    ..some would say they are just practising/honing their passive-aggression..and that may be so..

    ..but as for slinging-muck/personal-attacks on mp’s from other parties..?

    ..it just doesn’t happen..

    ..and this fact is why those journos were gagging at the latest thrusts from this member..

    ..eh..?

    (but then again..key could be talking about being subsumed by the death-stare so perfected/mastered by green mp kennedy graham..

    ..if you were looking to cast a hang-‘em-high judge..you couldn’t go past graham..

    ..(i keep watching..half-pie expected his eyes to start glowing red..eh..?

    ..it wouldn’t really surprise me if they did…

    ..but kennedys’ death-stare is the nearest the greens get to ‘fighting dirty’..

    ..and what this exercise in/attempt at smearing the greens..

    ..proves to all..

    ..is that there is nothing key will not lie about..

    ..q.e.d..)

    ..phillip ure

    • Will@Welly 8.1

      NOTHING !! ………..never has been …………never will be………….the consummate liar…….

  9. stephen colbert..on pot..

    v. funny..

    http://www.alternet.org/puff-puff-pass-touchdown

    phillip ure..

  10. Rosie 10

    Hi Lprent. It seems that January was an extremely chatty month on The Standard with some articles running into the hundreds of comments, and it all started from Day One!

    Is this standard for The Standard at this time of year?

    Is there a sense of collective anticipation fuelling such chat?

  11. Chooky 11

    Chris Trotter is on to some scarey stuff about the running of Auckland City by an ‘invisible’ group of corporate non Auckalnders….BIG International Business ….a corporate take over of Auckland….the Council and Mayor rendered insignificant ….Trotter acknowledges our very own anti-corruption campaigner Penny Bright for alerting him to this shadow organisation

    http://thedailyblog.co.nz/2014/01/31/falls-the-shadow-everything-you-didnt-know-about-the-committee-for-auckland/

    where is Auckland for New Zealanders?

    Chris Trotters article on the Daily blog deserves to be a guest post here

    ….and it deserves to be made a big election issue by the Labour Party and other Left politicians….Take BACK AUCKLAND FOR AUCKLAND and NEW ZEALANDERS

    • RedBaronCV 11.1

      Perhaps It’s time the IRD made subscruptions to these sorts of entities non deductible for tax purposes and shareholders passed resolutions to forbid companies paying for these organisations that reflect the views of the few.

    • millsy 11.2

      Ironically, the current Mayor of Auckland is giving the Right pretty much everything they want:

      Support for the Skycity deal, “development”, the Glen Innes evictions, “keeping rates increases at inflation” (but not protecting/enhancing services), PPP’s ( I dont know how they will work for footpaths), and he is talking about tolling roads, even existing roads, which will hit the army of cleaners in his “home state” that travel into the city to clean up after the office workers each night. He also sat on the fence in the PoA dispute (leaning slightly to the employers), and has threatened to closed down libaries (before making an embarrasing u-turn after the media got hold of the story).

      The guy has tacked to the right throughout his Mayoralty, im not too sure what his positions were during his tenure as Manukau Mayor/City Councillor though (anyone care to shed light).

      Probably why the right didn’t put up a decent candidate against him last year, supporting some guy from Brooklyn who owned a couple of diners — Brown implemented 90% of their agenda. — probably why the government decided to back the rail loop.

    • ianmac 11.3

      So much for the Democracy of Auckland. No wonder the Right was pissed off that Brown was elected Mayor. Watch the next election for Mayor. Scary stuff.

    • karol 11.4

      This has been something that Penny Bright has been complaining about. So Trotter really must have picked it up from her.

  12. Colonial Viper 13

    Hundreds of millions worth of rotting, abandoned mansions in London

    Saudis and other foreigners have more money and assets than they know what to do with.

    http://www.theguardian.com/society/2014/jan/31/inside-london-billionaires-row-derelict-mansions-hampstead

    • blue leopard (Get Lost GCSB Bill) 13.2

      Interesting article, CV

      I am wondering how the market’s ‘invisible hand’ can be said to be functioning as it is believed it does – supply is not ‘magically’ meeting demand at all; empty houses, lack of housing, lots of money for some, not enough for others.

      Yet we keep following the misguided belief that our problems will all sort themselves out – simply by people following self interest – without any intervention….

      • Colonial Viper 13.2.1

        Remember that markets do indeed work – but only on behalf of the wealthy.

        Neoliberalism has redefined both our culture and even our entire language in ways that ordinary people do not understand.

        • blue leopard (Get Lost GCSB Bill) 13.2.1.1

          It may be true that our system has been corrupted by a very wealthy and powerful section of people, yet I think that what you say re the ‘market working’ isn’t correct CV the theory was that the markets will sort out supply and demand without any need for rules and regulations (such as tax on imports etc). I have a nasty feeling this is still the accepted view despite it being clearly proven false.

          This is an important point because our politicians are still speaking of approaches based on market theory when it is clearly being proven defunct before our very eyes…yet they still keep pursuing it.

          …then again- perhaps you were simply being smart.

          I agree re our culture & language changing more than we realise.

          • Draco T Bastard 13.2.1.1.1

            This is an important point because our politicians are still speaking of approaches based on market theory when it is clearly being proven defunct before our very eyes…yet they still keep pursuing it.

            QFT

  13. captain hook 14

    I see in the morning paper that morons are following LB around and disrupting his meetings. I wonder who is paying them?

    • QoT 14.1

      Well, apparently (I think Russell Brown covered it?) one of them is Cam Slater with a duck-caller, but another is Penny Bright with her usual poorly-photoshopped face/rat banners.

  14. captain hook 15

    And also President Obama is going to pardon low level dope users who have been incarcerated for no good reason. That wouldn’t go down well here because the firm who gets the incarceration contracts would lose business and that is the most important thing for National to pay off its supporters.

    • @ hook..

      ..and here..the useless bastards who rule over us have signed a deal with this american private prison company..

      ..guaranteeing to provide them with enough prisoners to fill their cells..

      ..and that if the state does not deliver this quota of prisoners every year..

      ..the taxpayers of nz have to pay financial penalties to the prison company..

      ..y’know..!..vegans get accused of economic-treason..for opposing how the country exploits animals for money..

      ..but..without even going into how ‘treasonous’ it is to fuck the country/waterways in search of their white-gold.. and black gold..

      ..this gaggle of rightwing/rand-ite detritus .. are the real economic-traitors..

      ..phillip ure.

  15. joe90 16

    Looks like a bloody end is looming.

    Military commanders pledge support to Yanukovych, condemn protesters

    Jan. 31, 8:40 p.m. — After two months of unrest, Ukraine’s army got involved in the ongoing political crisis, when the Ministry of Defense unexpectedly issued a Jan. 31 statement, asking President Viktor Yanukovych to “apply measures for stabilizing of situation in the country.”

    The commanders called protesters’ occupation of government buildings “inadmissible” and said that “further escalation of confrontation threatens to integrity of the country.”

    The decision to send Yanukovych a special letter was made at a general meeting of the ministry’s office the day before and, according to Anatoliy Hrytsenko, an opposition lawmaker and former defense minister, the officers had been pressured to support Yanukovych.

    “I know for sure that officers, who were not agreeing to the ‘common approval’ are now being pressured by their commanders and chiefs,” Hrytsenko said on his Facebook page. In its separate statement, the Defense Ministry also denied the reports that army was allegedly involved in assisting the police during the ongoing political crisis. — Oksana Grytsenko

    http://www.kyivpost.com/content/ukraine/euromaidan-rallies-in-ukraine-jan-28-live-updates-335735.html

  16. weka 17

    Reposting from yesterday, hat tip fender –

    The main reason people gave for not voting in the 2011 General Election was they ‘didn’t get round to it, forgot or were not interested’ to vote. This accounted for 21 percent of the non-voters (and is included in the ‘disengaged’ category). Another 7.1 percent of the non-voters said they did not think their vote would have made a difference. This is a big increase from 3.9 percent in the 2008 election.

    Ten percent of non-voters were ‘overseas or away on the election day’. This was the most frequently selected reason in the ‘perceived barriers’ category.

    Over 12 percent of non-voters said they did not register for the 2011 election, which equates to just over 2 percent of the total population aged 18 years and over. About 15 percent of non-voters cited ‘other’ reasons for not voting in the 2011 election, including not being eligible because of their visa status, or for religious reasons.

    Full report and graphics here –

    http://www.stats.govt.nz/browse_for_stats/people_and_communities/Well-being/civic-human-rights/non-voters-2008-2011-gen-elections.aspx

  17. greywarbler 18

    There was a shocking item from joe 90 on OM yesterday (Jokeyhen OM31/1 24 1 1) about some Utah school children seeing their lunch time food thrown out because their parents hadn’t paid their school charges.

    I looked up Utah on google to get an idea of what goes on. I wondered if we and Utah had anything in common. Had we been doing our usual trawling of the international policy waters for Ideas to a desert idea island, and met with Utah? For those interested in educational moves, I’ve picked out some links and some interesting quotes

    It appears that we may be getting this new Key Education Leadership Policy from Utah.
    It seems that education is a Big Business in Utah. The terminology is of big business and a drive for efficiency and successful test passing. It has a feeling of education, as part of the service economy forecast to be the only one we have, being a big player. And children being pawns in this mind-stuffing program that is part of a vicious circle where it will be a relatively meaningless ritual from the past – educating children for whom there are no jobs and limited life opportunities.

    Information about the Utah Education Policy Center at the University of Utah. … for the Evaluation of Leadership Preparation and Practice ·
    http://uepc.utah.edu/
    Links . Utah Education Network
    http://www.uen.org/k12educator/uels/

    It appears that Utah is raising its interest in digital education: –
    A heading stated -Utah surpasses all others in digital education, new study finds | (There was a link but it is not available now say the Salt Lake Tribune with salty tears.)
    and
    Apr 1, 2013 – Utah ranks No. 1 when it comes to state policies dealing with online education, according to a new national study. (The link for this shows 404 Not Found. How very not transparent, open and available this ‘information’ is!))

    Then other interesting policy surrounds ‘Common Core’ – which sounds better than the National Standards we seem to follow. This is from Huffington Post. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/12/01/common-core_n_4367550.html
    I like the promising sound of the headline.- Common Core State Standards Focus On Critical Thinking Amid Political Debate
    AP | By By PHILIP ELLIOTT Posted: 12/01/2013 8:05 am EST | Updated: 01/23/2014 6:58 pm EST
    Welcome to a classroom using the Common Core State Standards, one of the most politicized and misunderstood changes in education for students and their teachers in kindergarten through high school.
    In 45 states and the District of Columbia, Lawson and other teachers are starting to use the standards to guide what skills students learn and when…
    At the core of the standards is a reduced emphasis on memorization. Students now have to connect the dots and apply critical thinking. It’s what experts call higher-order thinking. Teachers say it’s preparing students for life after high school.
    That has made classrooms much more of a hands-on proposition….

    [Children are being pushed ahead faster.] For instance, subtraction is now introduced in kindergarten instead of first grade….
    Coinciding with the new standards are new tests for students and evaluations for teachers. The tests, mandated under the George W. Bush-era No Child Left Behind education law, help states identify schools that are struggling and provide them extra help.

    The teacher evaluations were not originally part of the Common Core. But in exchange for millions of federal dollars to help them avoid layoffs during the worst of the recession, states agreed to greater accountability for students and teachers. Many opted to go with the Common Core and linked students’ progress with teacher performance…..
    To hear the standards’ critics — mainly tea party-aligned conservatives, but also some parents and teachers — tell it, there are few things more dangerous happening in the country.

    http://neatoday.org/2013/05/10/six-ways-the-common-core-is-good-for-students/?utm_source=nea_today_express&utm_medium=email&utm_content=core&utm_campaign=130515neatodayexpress

    Some interesting stats from Utah’s budget about education.
    http://www.deseretnews.com/article/865591793/Gov-Gary-Herbert-unveils-133-billion-budget.html?pg=1
    The governor released the budget at Utah Valley University, highlighting the focus on public and higher education spending, which adds up to more than $3.6 billion.
    His budget would provide $64 million to pay for the 10,300 new students expected in the state’s public schools and increase the funding mechanism for schools — the weighted pupil unit — by $61.6 million, or 2.5 percent.

    Herbert is also recommending $2 million to improve counseling aimed at lowering the state’s 22 percent high school dropout rate and $7.5 million for early intervention programs, including all-day kindergarten.
    The $157 million in new spending going to public education is fair, said Martell Menlove, state superintendent of public instruction.

    https://news.virginia.edu/content/uva-s-school-turnaround-program-helps-salt-lake-city-schools-make-grade
    Since its inception in 2003, the Darden-Curry Partnership has helped to turn around failing schools across 16 states, including Florida, Illinois, Louisiana, Missouri, North Dakota, South Dakota, Colorado, Arizona, New Mexico, Oklahoma, Utah, Nevada, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Texas and Virginia. Its goal is to work as a partner in helping school systems optimize classroom performance.

    Positive Turnaround Through Collaboration
    “In the state of Utah, a number of districts had persistently low-achieving schools,” said Karl Wilson, state director of Title 1 and federal programs at the Utah State Office of Education. “We have seen these schools implement the principles that were developed through PLE, and they have achieved 20, 30 and 40 percent gains in areas such as reading, language arts and mathematics.”
    (Explanation about the system) –
    “They need to be willing to commit to dramatic growth, to make difficult changes to establish conditions for growth, and be able to demonstrate publicly to their stakeholders that dramatic success and growth are possible,” he said.
    The Salt Lake City school system experienced growth in all four initial partnership schools during its first year with the program. Going forward, it must sustain its positive improvements so that all involved – especially students – continue to get high marks.

    An ambitious retired education superintendent is among leaders pushing this.
    “We needed to intervene quickly and do things differently,” she said. “We sought quick wins by becoming data-driven, suspending beliefs and assumptions about children’s learning abilities (what does this mean – will it be positive for the children’s good education?) and regularly assessing the children’s mastery of what was taught.”…
    “Now, the group will go after the harder goals,” she said. “They will further establish the ‘Salt Lake Way’ and take changes in the curriculum and the way success is measured into all of the district’s schools.”

    (Note expertise, thrusting, demanding, efficiency business approach to education. Teachers will have leaders helping them to get constantly better results. Sounds like an awful, stressful sweat-shop situation to me.)

    Ogden School District Puts UVA Training to Work
    Sunday, May 13, 2012
    Standard Examiner
    The sweeping administrative changes Ogden School District made recently were aimed at getting strong leadership into struggling schools, Superintendent Brad Smith says. And the definition of strong leaders? That came largely from the training district officials have received from the University of Virginia School Turnaround program.
    (Not teachers, not educational practitioners, but officials who will be virtual enforcers of the policy. This is actually a War for Education type of approach, like the War Against Drugs, and other communist style driven ‘five year’ plans that have been disdained by vocal capitalists. Odd.)

    U.S. Secretary of Education Arne Duncan Speaks to Educators in U.Va. School Turnaround Specialist Program
    Darden School of Business
    Monday, August 1, 2011
    “You are doing some of the toughest, most controversial work in education in this country today, and I thank you for your courage” said U.S. Secretary of Education Arne Duncan to the group of principals, state and school district leaders who were gathered for a weeklong event at the University of Virginia Darden School of Business.
    http://www.darden.virginia.edu/web/darden-curry-ple/news/home/

    (This means that the federal government is glad that it can turn people’s attention to education and improvements of outcomes therein, and therefore people may fail to notice that little positive is happening in the country and that it is actually failing as an entity. It is a patchwork of some successful and civilised states and many others falling into disorder and decadence.)

  18. Will@Welly 19

    The “first” of the principals jockeying for a position in John Key’s/Hekia Parata’s new principal leaders group has emerged. Up at Whangarei Boys High, 30 boys were taken out of class, and made to sit in the assembly hall while staff chased up “outstanding” monies owed.
    These monies were for related costs, not course fees, the “education” there is free. So we now see education take a backward step, relegated to that of being subservient to “related fees”. This on the same day “our” first Charter School opened.
    Hekia Parata denies any money demanded is part of her responsibility. “My hands are clean.”

    • RedBaronCV 19.1

      It’s a poor area and a nasty thing to do. Of course this head teacher wants to challenge the way boy’s education is provided. looks like humiliating them is on the agenda

    • millsy 19.2

      This has been going on under the radar for a while now.

      Some years ago, a high school principal in Feilding did the same. The schools think that parents can some how shit out money, we are seeing that with the BYOD trend.

  19. bad12 20

    Nothing like reading yet another ‘Advertorial’ in the Herald online in the ongoing series giving blind,unbalanced support to the National Party to start the day the right way, hoicking a big one in the direction of Granny Herald and the Jonolist who wrote the rubbish,(Armstrong, who else),

    Unbalanced seems to be the province of both the Herald and it’s tired old hack Armstrong as they try and talk up Slippery the Prime Minister and His flag waving as some form of vision for New Zealand,

    ”The trouble is the rhetoric simply does not wash”, unquote Armstrong, your absolutely right John, the rhetoric does not wash, neither your bullshit unbalanced Jonolism or Slippery the Prime Minister’s stupid empty heads ‘idea’ of changing the flag in the face of Labour’s first big policy announcement of the year,(perhaps in the face of the next major announcement from Labour we can expect from National a promise of a free flag in the letter box if only we vote for them),

    ”The trouble is YOUR rhetoric simply does not wash” Mr Armstrong when your writing shows more than just unbalanced jonolism, some might add that such is ‘simply’ the product of an unbalanced mind…

    • Paul 20.1

      The media have been given their marching orders by the corporates.
      “Deliver NZ to us.”
      Gower, Garner, Armstrong, Hosking, Smith, Williams, Roughan, Murphy and all the others are paid 30 pieces of silver to betray their own country.
      Shame.

      • srylands 20.1.1

        Yes those evil “corporates”. Or maybe they are simply trying to save a failed business model in a tiny market. The average journalist in NZ is paid a pittance and over worked. So they right crap. That is more likely the explanation for poor journalism than your “corporate” conspiracy.

    • JK 20.2

      I don’t think you’re being quite fair to John Armstrong, Bad 12 – his column in today’s Herald (which I’ve only just picked up on) gives Cunliffe quite a few good points for the Best Start policy but does state that the media releases and fact sheets have to include all the facts, not just some of them, and he also is quite clear about Key’s behaviour on this matter :

      “As it was, coverage of the baby bonus shifted markedly as Key – like a pig in muck – ruthlessly and sarcastically picked up on and picked over Labour’s …………. ”

      I read that as both a warning to Labour to get a bit smarter, and its a very telling comment on how Key behaves.

      • bad12 20.2.1

        Can’t agree with you there JK, ‘wing-nuts’ love such language, ruthless and sarcastic are the currency of those who think they are ‘real or hard men’

        What i see Armstrong’s latest effort as is the ‘damning of David Cunliffe with faint praise’ approach where the hero in the form of Slippery the Prime Minister uses His sarcasm to ruthlessly expose Cunliffe’s weakness,

        Unfortunately the mistake of not having David Parker,(who i assume knew the nuts and bolts of the policy inside out), on hand to give a follow up explanation of those details to the waiting media pack managed to give Slippery an opening which took a little of the gloss off of the initial announcement,

        Incidently, i fully agree with the ‘explained’ policy it gives the most to those most in need not necessarily in terms of actual dollars, the increased parental leave component is of a far greater dollar value than the $60 ‘Best Start’, it is the fact that this policy doesn’t differentiate between those who have work and those who havn’t that pleases me…

        • srylands 20.2.1.1

          “this policy doesn’t differentiate between those who have work and those who havn’t that pleases me…”

          But it should.

          • McFlock 20.2.1.1.1

            But it should.

            A point of view that would only have validity if the minimum wage was a living wage.
            But thanks for the view from across the ditch, sspylands

          • bad12 20.2.1.1.2

            SSLands, But it WONT, so suck it up, get ready to pay for it, and, know that i will be laughing at you every week while you do…

        • JK 20.2.1.2

          okay Bad 12 – I’m seeing aspects a bit differently to you, but the essence of Best Start being for all pleases me too. Its a start (albeit smallish) against inequality ….

          • bad12 20.2.1.2.1

            JK, oh i think that while we have capitalism we will always have inequality, once implemented tho $60 will be a huge boost to those who have kids while on a benefit or who find themselves on a benefit while they have babies, hopefully as finances improve ‘Best Start’ will be offered for these kids as they get older…

  20. greywarbler 21

    I was pondering the news about the Reserve Bank and the interest rate raising etc. What about, while we have our present system, we raise inflation levels to between 2 and 6 per cent. At present a cautious prudent RB aims at 2 per cent as a mid-level between 0 and 5 I think.

    But below 2% it means that hardly anything is happening. And this inflation screwdown makes holding the value of savings more important than actual business activity and wage growth, (to keep up with the uncounted part of our economy where inflation is rampant – housing).

    The system only partly works as it is, it actually detracts from having a strong thriving economy, and it worries about savings, which are modest and which if there were more would slow the economy down to a crawl or even leave it lying on the floor crying like a baby.)

    So 2-6% with midpoint 3-4 say and allowing to 6% for some upsetting, spiking jolts. And include actions that tend to make the exchange rate, trend downwards. The Reserve Bank should have a few methods to do that.

    We could stage a few strikes so that everything doesn’t seem so hunky-dory in this country of milk and honey, and hokey pokey ice cream, and gradually the exchange rate would go down. Exports and the economy would move upwards, interest rates could go a little upwards, thus cutting down the swingeing profit on playing with our dollar by those wankers who do that.
    Imported goods would become a little dearer, but wage rises on a reasonable but still cautious scale would help that.

    And a biggie, our government will encourage enterprise within the Nation. NATIONAL will proudly present itself as having National Interests at heart (as opposed to more money for themselves and some neat perks), and the two parties will fight for the hearts and minds and jobs of NZ.

    We will then have energy left to face fully all the other challenges that can’t be properly attended to now because of the foul entropy of our major political parties, from which I hope that Labour is emerging, and we will all sing Jerusalem and then God Defend New Zealand with our hands on our hearts. (Which my grandchild’s child care centre is teaching the 3 year olds. How very yank-like!)
    End of diatribe and too bad for any other dia effect you have experienced.

    • KJT 21.1

      Often pondered the idea of a mortgage strike.

      Everyone refuses to pay the extra rises, when the Reserve bank act deals it’s usual destruction.
      A comment I made elsewhere.

      “Time we stopped the sheer lunacy and destructiveness of gifting banks higher profits, and killing New Zealand’s export industries, small business and householders, with mortgages, in pursuit of the stupid idea that higher interest rates will drop Auckland house prices.
      Haven’t you all figured it out yet, higher interest rates attracts even more hot lending money into the NZ housing market”.

      • greywarbler 21.1.1

        kjt
        True higher interest rates just increase the difference between the still very low US federal rates whereby someone can probably make a tidy sum just borrowing from them, and lending it out to us at a 5% differential or more just at the touch of a button.

        And yet people who need some interest to provide a living capital formed from their savings, can’t survive on the US rates – their savings get eaten up by inflation and bank charges if interest is too low. So they have to raise their rates and we might get an even playing field. Have we actually ever had one since the neo libs glibly went on about it decades ago?

        • bad12 21.1.1.1

          ‘Interest rates’ are another Banksters con, consider for a moment where the current 2+% of ‘growth’ is calculated to be coming from within the economy,

          (1), Christchurch and it’s rebuild, growth??? only in the system devised by a race of primitive ape like creatures or the world Banking Cartels,(very hard to tell the difference), without having accounted for the actual losses incurred from the series of earthquakes,(multiple billions),it is then stupid to simply add the spending on ‘replacements’ into the growth figures,

          (2), House price inflation, the main center of this inflation occurring in Auckland with a lesser amount again the result of the Christchurch rebuild, who actually is suffering this inflation that the reserve Bank is hell bent upon controlling,

          i do not live in either Auckland or Christchurch along with some 2.7 million other people so the over-inflation of the Auckland and Christchurch property markets affects me and 2 million seven hundred thousand other people HOW???,

          The fact is that it doesn’t, house price over-inflation has pretty much no effect what-so-ever on the rest of the economy, the price of milk doesn’t rise because of house price over-inflation in Auckland and wages for the majority of New Zealand workers will not rise because of it either so including house price inflation, which in all reality financially effects only the buyer of a house, in the way we measure inflation is plainly stupid…

          • srylands 21.1.1.1.1

            “The fact is that it doesn’t, house price over-inflation has pretty much no effect what-so-ever on the rest of the economy,”

            Thanks genuis – actually it does. Do you think the suppliers of materials and services for house building don’t supply those to other sectors?

            Christ what would you know?

            • bad12 21.1.1.1.1.1

              F off Noddy, only you seem to think i am talking in terms of new build housing when it is obvious that i am talking about the over-inflation in the price of existing houses,

              Jesus, the economic un-genius speaks, such inflation in materials and services for house building is simply down to you ‘wing-nuts’, if you all were not intent on building monolithic structures instead of normal size housing as compensation for the lack of size in a certain of your appendages their would be no problem either in supply of labour or materials,

              Please please economic un-genius give us all the proof of such an assertion…

        • KJT 21.1.1.2

          Higher interest rates have the excellent effect, from Key’s sponsors point of view, of transferring wealth from ordinary working people, most of whom have net debt, to the already rich, and to the financial institutions, whose share of GDP has risen just as workers, and small and medium business owners/contractors, share, has dropped.

          The reserve bank act, more than anything else, blatantly highlights the Neo-liberal indifference to the future of New Zealand.
          Even a capitalist Government, one with principles, would be concerned that New Zealand businesses are dying, and thousands of jobs going, from the double whammy of higher interest rates than offshore competition, and the exchange rate pushed up by those same interest rates.

          I can tell you from first hand experience, what happens when your US competition can get finance at 3%, while it costs you 12% or more. And, that’s if you can get any business finance, at all, beyound your mortgage.

          “If you want more people on welfare, vote National”.

    • RedBaronCV 21.2

      There is an interesting commentary over on the Pundit, Ganesh Nana, about why raising interest rates really isn’t necessary.
      Imagine it’s being promoted so that all those RWNJ’s can get their money out of the country while the exchange rate is way up – no finer way to indicate that you know Nact will lose the election

    • Paul 22.1

      To you

      • greywarbler 22.1.1

        Is the Independent really that? When there is a corporate with the equivalent wealth of a nation in its coffers, it can jiggle media to run a piece that attacks a worthwhile non-profit for the first two-thirds of its article, and for balance, an answer on the end of quite a thorough pasting.
        Greenpeace, however, said that vitamin supplements and the addition of green, leafy vegetables to the diet of vitamin-A deprived children has already shown to work in places such as the Philippines, where vitamin-A deficiency has fallen from 47 per cent to 15 per cent.

        “Vitamin-A deficiency is already dropping so rapidly in the Philippines that it may have ceased to be a significant problem before golden rice comes onto the market,” said Doug Parr, Greenpeace’s chief scientist.

        This Canadian ecologist just looks like any well-fed fat-necked executive. He was in Greenpeace for a while in 1971. What has he been doing for it since then? Why did he not stay doing good things with it? Has he been following up more interesting and lucrative projects?

        • ianmac 22.1.1.1

          Decades ago there was a huge advance in rice growing Yields called the Green Revolution 1968+. The call was that hugely increased rice production could eliminate malnutrition and starvation. What actually happened was the landlords gathered the rice off the rice farmers and made pots of money with sales in foreign countries. Malnutrition and starvation was worse for S E Asian people.
          (Funny how in NZ the better we are at producing meat/milk, the more we pay for it.)

          • greywarbler 22.1.1.1.1

            When famine is talked about it often is not mentioned that there was a governing power that made it a disaster instead of a cyclical shortage. The Bengali one came to mind.I looked up google.

            The first when the British East India Company was powerful. – out of the ordinary, occurred in 1768 and was followed in late 1769 by more severe conditions. By September 1769 there was a severe drought, and alarming reports were coming in of rural distress. These were, however, ignored by company officers.
            By early 1770 there was starvation, and by mid-1770 deaths from starvation were occurring on a large scale. Later in 1770 good rainfall resulted in a good harvest and the famine abated. However, other shortfalls occurred in the following years, raising the total death toll.
            About ten million people,[6][7] approximately one-third of the population of the affected area, are estimated to have died in the famine.

            The second in 1943 – The Bengalis were denied help from their own countrymen, because of competition. The free market prevailed, everybody charged to the max, and there was also protectionism, to look after their own area and prevent civil unrest. There was refusal to act in an honest fashion from neighbouring provinces, with dark words of deliberate hoarding by Bengalis and disbelief in their statements. Transport carrying grain was refused egress, and numbers of barriers put up. Disgraceful stuff.
            About 1.5 million people died.

            The Government of India Act 1935 had removed most of the Government of India’s authority over the Provinces, so they had to rely on negotiation.
            Thus, even when the Government of India decreed that there should be free trade in grain, politicians, civil servants, local government officers and police obstructed the movement of grain to famine areas.[38] In some cases Provinces seized grain in transit from other Provinces to Bengal.[39]
            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bengal_famine_of_1943#Government_inaction

            So any statements accusing of bad behaviour or finding reason to throw dirt when there is food production discussions, should be questioned. In this gold rice case, it probably means more of the big companies taking over and forcing the old varieties out so that their grain must be used and paid for instead of seed stocks being kept freely by prudent food producers.

            They would be self sufficient and what the companies want is people who turn to them for their essential supplies and they hold their lives and money in the palm of the company’s owners and executives. There is of course that Monsanto scam whereby pollen carries their patented genes to mingle with the old varieties and then by growing their own grain, which has been tainted with Monsanto types, the farmers are breaking intellectual protection laws and illegally using Monsanto patented seed.

            • Colonial Viper 22.1.1.1.1.1

              Great famine of Ireland. Another genocide perpetrated by the power elite. On white people, no less. If you were a coloured population, what chance would you have.

          • KJT 22.1.1.1.2

            They forgot to mention all the small farmers in developing countries the so called Green revolution put out of business.

            Making them dependant on imported rice forever.

            Good for Goldman Sacks the world, though.
            http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/goldman-bankers-get-rich-betting-on-food-prices-as-millions-starve-8459207.html

            Or. “How Wall Street made money by starving millions”.

    • QoT 22.2

      Red herring. Let’s fix the inequal situation we have where 10% of people have 40% of the wealth, and 50% of the people only have 1% of the wealth, then see if we need shiny science projects to make sure everyone eats.

      • Draco T Bastard 22.2.1

        +1

      • KJT 22.2.2

        Exactly.

        Plenty of food produced already. The monetary signals are not sending it to were it is needed.

        I remember reading the amount required to end food poverty world wide. It was some small fraction of the world spending on weapons.

  21. Cleo George 24

    Regarding the Key’s ‘out of the blue’ flag change red herring during this election year:

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/stuff-nation/assignments/what-should-be-on-nzs-flag/9671710/Not-right-time-to-change-flag

  22. greywarbler 25

    If everyone isn’t voting for their favourite tv star and voting for Philomena Clunk on Charlie Booker Show then they should be. She is priceless. But then I think a proper value should be set on her in case the tv bosses try to use that line when naming her salary.

    Charlie B says that some pub in Brit is offering drinks that will cause drink and drive problems. Charlie says it is the only pub in the land that comes with a police-car chaser.

  23. could the herald be more craven-servants of the govt..?

    ..here is their online coverage of a damning united nations report on our human rights..

    headline:..’NZ has ‘excellent’ human rights record’

    (teaser/promo-paragraph..)

    “..Justice Minister Judith Collins has welcomed the recommendations in a largely-positive United Nations report on New Zealand’s human rights records..”

    just bold/bare-faced fucken lies..every word of it..

    ..phillip ure..

  24. Jak 27

    Not sure if this has been posted already but a draft copy of the un outcome report that lists the 155 human rights recommendations for New Zealand is avaliable at. http://img.scoop.co.nz/media/pdfs/1401/Draft%20report%20of%20the%20Working%20Group%20on%20the%20Universal%20Periodic%20Review.1.pdf

  25. Flip 28

    I did a post on how a UBI would address inequality here

    http://thestandard.org.nz/ubi-addressing-inequality/

    It turns out I derived something that is already known as a measure of inequality call the Gini coefficient and the Lorenz curve. My results were based on individual incomes rather than households but essentially they give the same result.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gini_coefficient
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gini_coefficient#US_income_Gini_indices_over_time

    This has a description of its limitations and how to interpret it.

    To see NZ’s value over time this report has it

    http://www.nzchildren.co.nz/income_inequality.php

    Have to say successive governments in the last 35 years have not done much to shift it since rogernomics and the 1987 crash which raised it dramatically. The lower this number the greater the equality. Why is OK to have a coefficient of around 33? Surely we’d want to reduce this?

    I’d suggest that governments performance in addressing inequality can be measured thus. I’d expect the next government to make a significant shift in this before I believe they are interested in address inequality.

    The debate is carries on here

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/9672616/Inequality-Is-it-growing-or-not

    Other links

    http://www.parliament.nz/en-nz/parl-support/research-papers/00PlibCIP181/household-incomes-inequality-and-poverty

    A report that is worth a read

    http://www.msd.govt.nz/about-msd-and-our-work/publications-resources/monitoring/household-incomes/

  26. BLiP 29

    Hear Ye! Hear Ye! . . .

    . . . here begineth the inaugural gathering of The Standard’s Chapel of the Printed Poster. It has been proposed that the Big List Of John Key’s Lies make the transition from cyber space into meat world by becoming a printed poster which shall be plastered up across the length and breadth of New Zealand.

    At this inaugural meeting I would be grateful for any comments regarding whether or not

    – this a good idea

    – is it even legal

    – who is interested in handling the operations side of this project (NOTE: lprent has agreed to act as Treasurer and, if this gets off the ground, donations can be made into a bank account he will manage, being made direct into said bank. This seems the easiest solution in terms of having someone we can trust run the books, and maintain anonymity in that donations can be made in person at any branch of the bank concerned) At this stage we first need to establish costs including cost of production and distribution. Also, are there any artistic types out there prepared to have a crack at submitting a design for consideration.

    – how can we go about “spreading the word” and gathering the funds needed to make it happen.

    . . . the floor is open.

    • just saying 29.1

      Brilliant idea.
      Perfectly legal – truth is a complete defence against libel.
      However Key could bring a bogus suit and use every dirty trick to bankrupt you before it even got to court. However, I’m sure you’d find a lawyer willing to represent you for free. You couldn’t buy that sort of publicity for a legal practice.

    • rah 29.2

      Brilliant!!!!!

    • very very good idea..

      ..tell me when and i will publicise/advertise it @whoar..

      ..why not give a koha option for copies..?

      ..phillip ure..

      • greywarbler 29.3.1

        Money from me yes. Practical suggestion – if trying to fit something onto a noticeboard, anything bigger than A4 is a nuisance.

        It might be treated as a serial – make a joke, a trilogy in four parts – collect all the parts and your prize might be a change of government! lt might be divided into chapters for clarity running numerically and advise that the next chapter will be available next week. It would state on the first – this is the first of three/? chapters. It might make a funny (not suitable for bedtime stories for the young or sensitive.) Has it got a title – Remember the Wit and Widom of Muldoon or Richard Prebble’s I’ve Been Thinking.

        It should be printed clearly. Certain colours don’t show up ie yellow. Royal blue is good, colour draws the eye blue/red? Black fine but would need something so the eye didn’t skip over it.

        If meant to be on a large board then font would be bigger for that. But popping a number up and having them available at political stalls would surely be all right. It’s information and there would be no logo on it, and anybody could give it out surely. Though many wouldn’t.

    • blue leopard (Get Lost GCSB Bill) 29.4

      Do you have any idea how much $$ is needed?
      Got a bank account number [that you are o.k about making public] for making deposits into?

    • bad12 29.5

      Lolz, un-budgeted for political activism is always a hard one, count me in for an initial $100 Blip, if this looks like going ahead and then stumbles for any reason can i suggest that any collected donations go toward the future cost of running the Standard…

    • freedom 29.6

      present
      Hello to all

      Certainly we are discussing this idea openly and that is a good thing, but we must acknowledge certain professional details will have to be kept from the public until any authorisation is given for release of any business or personal identities. I actually see no reason for the general public to know any of the details of those who are being paid for a service and this information is touched on later.

      I believe we should have a target of May at the latest, for the beginning of distribution.
      If it’s an early election, paste ups can be bigger, if later in the year a more measured approach would be best with funding being the obvious decider.

      I believe there will be strong need for a certain amount of cross communication on topics where the public forum is ill suited and some suggestions for how best to mange this would be appreciated.

      Perhaps Lprent would allow a specific group of permissions for a locked off ‘Poster Project Page’ (PPP) ;) where those who eventually deal with the details can do so productively. This is not exclusion it is after the brainstorming, when stuff actually has to happen.

      A place where the project can be discussed as per the normal public forum but you know-without the public. I do not even know if this is possible but I envisage a normal chat thread with a ‘PPP’ log-in required which can be distributed via our emails. Obviously this may involve a certain amount of moderation (by request) but let’s be honest here, if we cannot ignore tr–ls who decide it is funny to pop in and stir then why are we even bothering to put any effort in. We are grown ups and if we just work on the project and ignore their gibbering they will get bored and go away.

      I also ask that if this idea has the support of The Standard’s operators, then a public post is opened once a week, a post is opened where those involved and those interested can go to to discuss, catch up and generally keep this rolling along for awhile.

      At this point I make the following statement.
      To my knowledge I am not involved with or associated with anyone in the paste up business in New Zealand. My reference to a certain company in the original proposal, (linked to above) was merely that, a reference to an existing paste up operation and I had no intention of implying any knowledge of this idea by the company referenced. Nor do i have, or am aware of, any association with or knowledge of the company, its staff, and or its interests that has not come from general observation of the businesses during its day to day public activities. (if that need further clarification from a legal point of view please let me know)

      A
      Back to The List.
      The legal issues are critical obviously, but as all information is sourced from publicly available resources I would guess we are clear. MMM… guessing, and the law , always a good combo.. So if one of the many lawyers out there could clarify the project’s legal position sooner rather than later, the better chance we have of making it all happen. This is what your contribution to actual activism can be about if you choose it.

      B
      The next hurdle is the paste up.
      I propose a letter/email is drafted inviting those in ownership of paste up services to view the list on The Standard, and view the proposal on the table. Then they are able to independanty decide if it is a project they are interested in. As a commercial gig they might not give a damn, but there is the serious issue of its content and its potential affects on their business. A theatre poster that pushes the boundaries of public decency is one thing, a list publicly critical of the PM is quite another.

      If we get a green light at that point , it is a negotiation on cost and we will know our primary goal for fundraising.

      C
      Service required.

      I propose that the action is a once a fortnight paste up, incorporated into their existing rounds, and possibly with as few as a half dozen posters per round put up at locations of their discretion. These guys know their job and know which locations would suit for impact and duration ( public’s light fingers aside) Obviously there will be some care needed so as not to waste posters on environs not needing that much persuasion in questioning the PM’s integrity.

      This does not have to be a blitz campaign. Simplicity is our friend here. As yet we don’t even have an Election date but If done in ten locations* nationwide with ten posters being distributed once a fortnight we could sustain a campaign up into November with a print run of under 2000 posters.

      *ten locations is envisaged as being four to five centers with a couple of runs per location.

      D
      Printing
      Once progress with a paste up company is determined we can look at confirming printing prices and the associted freight requirements etc.

      Whilst thinking about the initial idea of printing at different locations to avoid freight, I realised this is potentially problematic to the printer for obvious commercial reasons. So a more user-friendly printer might be required and we find funds for freighting the posters to the paste up operations. It seems the common sense solution and the original idea was an off the cuff effort. (So is this but at least it has more detail :) )

      Is there a willing printer out there?

      I will be making some enquiries with various people re printing and advise others to do the same.
      Please though, be a bit discreet about it. If they are not someone you trust and know well, I would maybe wait a bit before making enquiries.

      What are we looking at for the quotes are a variety of prices and we may as well cover the range so we know our options.

      Quote per 1000 in A0, A1, A2 posters in three colours minimum.
      That will give us options.

      The posters must not be super flashy full colour look I have thirty thousand fonts type deals.
      Two maybe three colours, clear text and practical fonts. i repeat : Simplicity is our friend on this.

      As far as layout I beleive all submissions should be welcome and I do believe it should be an open discussion re the final design. If someone can pitch some ideas for that process please?
      otherwise a simple webpage with designs and vote buttons?

      Once we have relevant data of funding targets we will know if we have a practical chance of going forward and the design side can kick in.
      but let’s take this one step at a time

      To be clear
      Simplicity is our friend on this endeavour.
      People want this information, they are looking for it everywhere
      they just don’t know it yet.

      Quote per 1000 in A0, A1, A2 posters in three colours minimum.
      Two maybe three colours, clear text and practical fonts.
      All submissions welcome but let’s take this one step at a time

      That’s it from me, thank you for your time and I hope we can make this happen.

      -If I missed anything just say so, please forgive me if I have doubled up a bit on some topics, the brain is a bit frazzled. It has been a couple of months of very long hours in the studio, I have just hung a new show, I am knackered. I go sleep now.

      I wish you all well and will catch this page for updates on Monday at the earliest.

      Hei konā

      • BLiP 29.6.1

        ^^^ Wise words are wise.

      • Will@Welly 29.6.2

        I love the idea – a Poster Project Page – and labeling it PPP – shoving it right up John Key & co. With the exception of the few malingers from the right, most here will only be too happy to dig in and reach out to help. It is brilliant. BLiP has done a tremendous job, even the GCSB must be astounded at his knowledge, it probably trumps their capacity !!

    • BLiP 29.7

      Okay!!! I’m getting the vibe this could be a real goer. Please keep the comments rolling in. At this stage I feel suitably enthusiastic to get some data from some bill stickers re costs. Will get started on this first thing Monday – anyone got any contacts or recommendations? I’ll start with this group and see where I get to: http://www.0800phantom.co.nz/

      I love the idea of making poster available for sale. Perhaps we could sweeten the deal by including a disc with the art work and page captures of all the links?? Then again, if the idea takes off and we get, say, a few thousand orders, that could prove to be a bit of a pain. Just brainstorming, I know about the KISS Principle.

      In order to get the message across, should we stick to just the Top 100 Lies – the poster should, IMHO, have a link and one of those bar-code thingywotsits which send people to a internet site with details of all the lies anyway. Again, lprent has agreed to host that somewhere here.

      • greywarbler 29.7.1

        Blip
        You are firing. I was wondering about Facebook, if some could be released there. From time to time to keep up the profile and interest. I’m not a great facebook user, but others can handle it no trouble. And of course we need to be prepared for some nasty comments, on Facebook. It could give handy publicity.

      • Bill 29.7.2

        Aw – the toilet roll idea not a goer then? Shucks. I’d have bought a six pack and then eaten a plethora of figs…just because ;-)

      • freedom 29.7.3

        Hi Blip,

        I think a top fifty lies would be a practical and effective visual. perhaps there is a way to group it as a top ten over five categories. That would be a strong ‘on the street’ image of five paragraph blocks. Catches the eye of a passer by and immediately says ‘there is more to read here than the headline’ without being a tsunami of words. I am sure others will have ideas on what the categories should be, but ‘Lies in the House’ surely has to be one of them.

        The full list will still be available on-line of course, and depending on final funding we may be able to swing different versions as the year progresses.

        I will contact a few printers this week for some quotes, ( without sharing any real details about the content) just letting them know it is a text based three colour run. I will include A3 but for street pasting we should be in the A2 and above scale as outlined above.

        There is obvious support for smaller posters for people to distribute amongst their own networks and again a top fifty list would fit most A3 and even A4 ‘office runs’

        Please, can someone clarify our legal position on this project really soon?

        If people are thinking of printing and distributing materials at or from their places of employment make sure you have checked any contractual obligations you may have signed. JK might not care about you keeping your job, but I and many others do.

        NOTE: It would be good if people read both chains of comments that have been posted before adding new ideas. A PPP can work if we keep it simple and define its objectives as soon as we can. The last thing we want to see is two months of ‘what about ….???’ and no action. Those who have been involved in actual organization of activism before know that the one item no-one here needs to see is the ego. This project is about Blip’s List.

        BLIP’S LIST AND THE FIRST IDEAS
        http://thestandard.org.nz/note-to-media-check-your-facts/#comment-765308

        INAUGURAL GATHERING AND COMMENTS
        (-which is this thread but handy for future reference)
        http://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-01022014/#comment-767017

        THE PPP OUTLINED by freedom
        http://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-01022014/#comment-767077

        note: this last link was included for easy reference to the proposal, not because it is my idea. Ideas need discussion. It is merely a proposal containing practical workable ideas and relevant crucial questions.

    • emergency mike 29.8

      Brilliant BLiP!

      Take a look at Karol’s post yesterday about the “How are you doing?” poster in South Korea. The poster maker make the point that posting online doesn’t have the same impact, it just disappears in 24 hours unless it happen to go viral, even then the impact is limited. But physical posters out there on the street cut through.

      My thoughts:

      – choose the ‘lies’ carefully, pick ones that have clear evidence to back up his bull. I.e. not ones where him stretching the truth could be a matter of opinion.

      – talk to someone who knows what they are talking about re any possible legal issues. You might have to be careful about your ‘liar’ wording, I don’t know.

      – talk to someone who knows design and/or marketing to make sure you maximize impact and message.

      – there are plenty of knowledgable people here on this sight who would be very happy to steer you in the right direction on these points I’m sure.

      – do it!

      • emergency mike 29.8.1

        ‘site’ not ‘sight’ lol.

      • weka 29.8.2

        This is such a brilliant idea. A few thoughts (haven’t read all the comments above yet, so sorry if am repeating something).

        Get legal advice on content. Pretty sure you will be able to get this for free.

        Make the posters available online for people to print out and put up where the live/work. A3, A4 and A5 minis. Not sure what format/size you are going for, so perhaps this could be an edited version?

        I still reckon give the list its own wordpress site and get it linked to from all over the blogosphere/twitter/FB etc. That is alot more work of course, and I like the hardcopy poster as a priority.

        Maybe some crowdsourced funding to make a paid position? There is real potential to use the left-wing social media network here.

        What will the content of the poster be like eg how to transition from a list full of internet links to something that isn’t clickable?

    • Draco T Bastard 29.9

      Would be good to get a few other National MPs, especially Blinglish, with either an outright lie or some contradictory statements.

  27. Anne 30

    Yahoo!!!

    You have done such a fantastic job BLiP that this poster idea should go ahead. It would be such an awful waste of your many hours of work if it isn’t advertised as widely as possible. I will certainly do my bit to spread the posters around my tiny corner of society.

    If this project is handled well I am sure it will receive media attention although I suggest a certain political reporter from TV3 is left out of the loop for the time being.

    My suggestion: there be bill boards erected in every town and city in the country by July of this year.
    The SCotPP is NOT a registered political party so therefore does NOT come under the Electoral Finance Act. It is NOT an attempt to gather votes for a particular political party but rather an attempt to provide information to the public at large.

    I’m willing to do my bit towards bringing this plan to fruition. :)

  28. phil 31

    Hats, badges, paraphernalia, all at a rip off price. So as Tories buy them all up!

  29. swordfish 32

    Great Radio doco celebrating Pete Seeger’s 90th Birthday on RNZ (broadcast last night). Would have preferred a 2-hour tribute though. 1 hour a little too short.

  30. Philj 33

    Xox
    Good to hear National Radio is still doing some quality broadcasting. It’s beginning to degrade.

  31. greywarbler 34

    Can whoever is moderating every day do us a favour and carry any comment about posters over to a thread that starts with the word Poster. I thought that Open Mike doesn’t get archived for long and anyway it is so diverse. We need to have permanent places for ideas so they don’t fall like autumn leaves and get covered with others and then trodden on. Reading others ideas can be a starter for more to pop up, or amendments to improve one, or allow for unforeseen problems.

    So how about it? Yu fullas know how to do it. Good on you. I hope you see the advantage of what I am suggesting.

    Apart from that, I don’t know what lprent thinks but Trademe on their community board have a sticky thread that never goes away and ideas just build up ion it and for useful information it is valuable to have one that appears every day. So that’s another idea. But still it would be useful to have ideas relating to one project on one thread rather than just jammed into a sticky thread in a mixed pile.

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