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Open mike 12/11/2012

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, November 12th, 2012 - 51 comments
Categories: open mike - Tags:

Open mike is your post. For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose.

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Step right up to the mike…

51 comments on “Open mike 12/11/2012”

  1. Logie97 1

    A question many may be asking is whether the PM, in private conversations with HRH and his missus, would think it appropriate to use such words as “thick as bat… et cetera”.

    • RedBlooded 1.1

      Perhaps one would wonder if once HRH leaves our shores how long before the PM refers to him as Big Ears and says he dresses like a Queen. That would be on form for our joker PM and I guess get a giggle from the schoolkids he is trying to impress.

  2. AsleepWhileWalking 2




    Hope they crucify him. No doubt there are other workers whom he treated this way. Is it a sign that workers in this country are so fearful they dare not stand up for their rights?? When I read the article this looks to be the case.

    • felix 2.1

      And I guess that gets recorded in the stats as $40,000 worth of “welfare fraud”.

    • One Tāne Huna 2.2

      “Crucify” – “blacklisting” him certainly isn’t enough, but I doubt much more is going to happen. They’re going to go after him for money? lol

      “Behind a string of failed businesses” – but was nevertheless deemed suitable for the subsidies. What, if anything, did W&I do to vet this cowboy they vouched for?

      • Draco T Bastard 2.2.1

        “Behind a string of failed businesses”

        Nothing wrong with that but there should be a look into why he failed. It’s not always bad luck and, considering what the article said, it would seem that his businesses failed because he’s corrupt.

        What, if anything, did W&I do to vet this cowboy they vouched for?

        At a guess, they didn’t. They would have just looked at his business card, probably checked that the business had a phone number and that would be about it. I would be surprised if they checked the registered businesses list.

        • Uturn

          The article gives the impression that a helpless person was exploited, but there is nothing to say reality didn’t happen.

          Darien Fenton talked about this sort of stuff happening, almost two years ago, in Parliament and recieved the now infamous “…any job is a good job…” reply from Paula Bennett.


          As I see it, if we play the blame game we also net the “innocents” i.e. people acting against thier own interests because they either have no choice or are unaware how their beliefs about work snooker them. The only way I can see round this problem, under our current approach to industrial relations, would be to legislate some kind of multicultural law where employers must have an equal percentage of race/culture in their employ. Honestly, I think the chance of that being sold to the electorate, as it stands, is nil. Darien Fenton talked about this stuff in May 2011 and it was old news then; it was happening before the current bunch of Nats came to power; it was happening while Helen was in power; it happened when I was kid. Employee versus employer mentality in our economic reality leaves big gaps that can’t be covered by laws wanting to make things fair. It’s a systemic problem. While people believe work = profit and that profit is a virtue, people will comply with exploitative methods. Change the system and the problem will be reduced. Chances of that happening… very slim.

    • Draco T Bastard 2.3

      That person should be in jail for theft, fraud and god knows what else.

      • prism 2.3.1

        This carwash scheme is a whitewash. Funny how businesses can be guilty of trying to get money they aren’t entitled to. I thought it was supposed to be beneficiaries who did that.

    • Rosie 2.4

      Hi AWW. I read that article about the car wash dude this am and wasn’t surprised. I was given a voucher in December last year to take our car in for a wash at the “Shop n Shine” in Wakefield St, Wellington. The guy was lecherous with his female customers which made me feel concerned for his female staff. Everything about him was “dodgy geezer”. It felt like a real fly by night operation. I noted the staff were working really hard in the hot sun and I said to a group of young guys “I hope you’re on good money for the great job you’re doing”. I said it because they WERE doing a great job and I had the feeling with a boss like theirs they would be minimum wage and their worth needed to be acknowledged. That business lasted for a few months before it was gone.

      The problem is that people will continue to bleat on about individual “bludgers” whose reality and hardship they know nothing of but won’t bat an eyelid at dodgy geezer dude being fraudulent and exploitative because he’s being an “entrepreneur”. Its that scenario where people feel they can beat up on beneficiaries through their own perverse justifications yet somehow business is derserving of sympathy. Watch for his response – He’ll probably claim that he is a victim. He’ll blame everyone but himself.

      • Vicky32 2.4.1

        The problem is that people will continue to bleat on about individual “bludgers” whose reality and hardship they know nothing of

        I am reading a beneficiary bashing thread on the IMDB community boards, and they’re even more vicious in the USA than here, as you’d expect.

  3. David H 3

    Now I wonder what sort of Privacy issues this will bring up. I already have serious misgivings about the courts passing information to a bunch of Debt collectors, whose staff will not be under the same rules as to accessing private data as the justice dept would have.


  4. uke 4

    Today is one hundred years since the killing of Frederick Evans on 12 November 1912. Evans was the first trade unionist to be killed in a labour dispute in New Zealand:


    This weekend there was a conference at Waihi commerating the bitter 1912 strike that climaxed in Evans being batoned and kicked to death by a mob of strikebreakers out the back of the Miner’s Hall, while police either actively joined in or watched on. This was followed by the remaining Waihi strikers and their families being violently hounded out of the town. The conference was well attended, with a number of well-known historians, trade unionists, and politicians present. For more details, see:



    Yesterday, Robert Reid, secretary of First Union, gave a powerful speech by the commerative placque to Evans on Seddon Street. He pointed to the significance of martyrs of NZ trade unionism like Evans, Ernie Abbott, and Christine Clark, and the need to honour their memory. Although sceptical of the present government’s good intentions, Reid also expressed cautious optimism that the Pike River inquiry may lead to improvements in workers’ health and safety conditions, which have been seriously weakened over the last twenty years.

  5. One Tāne Huna 5

    Talent 2 unavailable for comment.

    “Key said there were 60,000 teachers and their pay roll system was complex, with three layers of rates teachers could be paid at.”

    Oh noes! The software has to work with numbers!

    • marsman 5.1

      Talent 2, which installed Novopay, is an international payroll systems company. Funny that.

      • Dv 5.1.1

        From the same article.
        Associate Education Minister Craig Foss told Radio New Zealand today the security breach was a one-off because of human error in entering an incorrect school code.

        How does this match with secure systems!!!!
        It wasn’t an incorrect code it was another schools!!!

        Dont they have a passworded system Craig?

        Prime Minister John Key today said it was essential to bring in the Novopay system because the previous system was “effectively falling over”.

        Not as badly as NovaPay it seems.

  6. Morrissey 6

    National Radio: Sensible Sentencing Trust is a “Victims’ Advocacy organization”
    9 a.m. News, National Radio, Monday 12 November 2012

    The grieving mother of murdered teenager Christy Marceau has made a bizarre press statement, announcing that Garth McVicar and the Sensible Sentencing Trust have supported her, rather than her daughter’s killer, ever since the murder. “Garth has been there for me a hundred percent of the way,” insisted Mrs Marceau. “He’s never pushed himself, the trust, nothing.”

    Many people will share my suspicion that this statement was concocted not by Mrs Marceau, but by Louise Parsons, Phil Kitchin, Peter Jenkins or one of the S.S. Trust’s other spin doctors.

    Most of us are by now inured to the S.S. Trust’s cynical and depraved manipulation of vulnerable parents; however, the really concerning aspect of this news item was to hear the newsreader refer to the S.S. Trust as “the victims’ advocacy organization.” Those who remember the brutal and sustained campaign of vilification mounted by McVicar and the S.S. Trust against a slain boy in South Auckland, and recall the ridicule and abuse they heaped on the boy’s mother and family, will be mystified as to why Radio New Zealand’s copywriters call them “victims’ advocates”.

    Or does Radio New Zealand, like Mrs Marceau, have its scripts written for it by someone from the S.S. Trust?

  7. prism 7

    NCEA is starting. Here are some ideas from Rimmer of Red Dwarf on ways to cope or not.
    Rimmer’s study habits on youtube
    and on his belief – If you don’t win the first time, try, try again.

  8. (FYI folks – forwarded in the public interest on behalf of Sue Henry who doesn’t have a computer.)

    12 November 2012

    “Housing New Zealand – call off the dogs!”

    Press Release Sue Henry Housing Lobby Spokesperson.

    “The latest Housing New Zealand (HNZ) Statement of Corporate Intent 2012 – 2015, quite rightly sets out the statutory obligations which HNZ is required to follow by law.”

    The Crown Entities Act 2004 stipulates HNZ ” must exhibit a sense of social responsibility by having regard to the interests of the community in which it operates.”

    The principal Housing NZ Corporation Act 1974 also stipulates these very same social responsibility obligations.

    On 5 November 2012 the new CEO of the Tamaki Redevelopment Company, Deborah Lawson stated in a letter to the NZ Herald:

    ‘There has been some confusion about the Tamaki Transformation Programme.
    It does not include the Northern Glen Innes Housing Redevelopment Project. Housing New Zealand is responsible for this.’

    “This is quite correct,” continues Sue Henry.

    “This means HNZ are bulldozing through policies in total conflict with their legislative statutory duties.

    There is no lawful basis for the removal of State houses in Glen Innes North.

    Our community is being ripped apart.

    On what lawful basis are Police enforcing the removal State houses in Glen Innes North?

    The Housing Lobby demands that the unlawful removal of State houses from Glen Innes North cease forthwith, and calls for support from opposition parties for an immediate inquiry into how HNZ has breached its statutory duties.”

    Sue Henry
    Housing Lobby Spokesperson

    Ph (09) 575 6344



    1) Housing New Zealand Corporation is a CROWN AGENT ( a type of STATUTORY ENTITY).

    2) The ’empowering’ legislation for Crown Agent, Housing New Zealand Corporation is the Housing Corporation Act 1974.

    3) As a Crown Agent – Housing New Zealand Corporation comes under the CROWN ENTITIES ACT 2004.

    4) Under the Housing Corporation Act 1974 (s.3B (a) (i) – HNZ has a STATUTORY DUTY to be an organisation that –

    “exhibits a sense of social responsibility by having regard to the interests of the community in which it operates;”

    5) Under the Crown Entities Act 2004, (s.139) as a Crown Agent, HNZ has a statutory duty to prepare a Statement of Intent.

    6) In the HNZ Statement of Intent 2012 – 2015 (pg 25) – it states:

    “The Corporation is accountable under legislation to give effect to the Crown’s social objectives by providing housing, and services related to housing, in a businesslike manner and to exhibit a sense of social responsibility by having regard to the interests of the community in which it operates. ”

    7) Under the Crown Entities Act 2004, (s.14 (1) (a) the functions of HNZ as a ‘Statutory Entity’ are:

    ” the functions set out in the entity’s Act”.

    (The Housing Corporation Act 1974).

    Under the Crown Entities Act 2004, (s.14 (2) )

    ” In performing its functions, a statutory entity must act consistently with its objectives.”

    8) Under the Crown Entities Act 2004 (s.19) – “Acts in breach of statute are invalid”.

    “(1) An act of a statutory entity is invalid, unless section 20 applies, if it is—

    (a) an act that is contrary to, or outside the authority of, an Act; or
    (b) an act that is done otherwise than for the purpose of performing its functions.”

    So – how is what HNZ is doing in Glen Innes ” exhibit(ing) a sense of social responsibility by having regard to the
    interests of the community in which it operates”?

    How is HNZ not breaching their statutory duties as defined in the Housing Corporation Act 1974
    (s.3B (a) (i) to be an organisation that –

    “exhibits a sense of social responsibility by having regard to the interests of the community in which it operates;”

    How is HNZ not breaching their statutory duties as defined by the Crown Entities Act 2004, (s.14 (2) )

    ” In performing its functions, a statutory entity must act consistently with its objectives.” ?

    Arguably – the actions of HNZ in removing GI state houses are therefore ‘invalid’ (s. 19 (a) Crown Entities Act 2004) because they are:

    “contrary to, or outside the authority of” the Housing Corporation Act 1974 (s.3B (a) (i) )

    to be an organisation that –

    “exhibits a sense of social responsibility by having regard to the interests of the community in which it operates;”

    and the Crown Entities Act 2004, (s.14 (2)

    ” In performing its functions, a statutory entity must act consistently with its objectives.”


    • Jimmie 8.1

      Dear Penny & Sue,

      Thank you for your wonderful contribution.

      Your post was most enlightening – I have printed it off to read in detail the next time I suffer from insomnia.

      Please keep up the good work – in fact are you able to go in to more detail next time about Housing NZ’s responsibilities – these brief summaries are just too insufficient to get a good grasp of the issues which you are espousing.


      PB supporter

  9. Jackal 9

    Japans nuclear free future

    It’s been somewhat annoying to read through the plethora of propaganda articles that have been published about the Japanese governments policy on nuclear power. Many of these articles are obviously produced by the nuclear power industry and bear no resemblance to reality. In fact some of the articles are so manipulative that they’ve spurred The Jackal into looking a little deeper into Japans nuclear free future…

  10. Draco T Bastard 10

    Oh, look at that, conservatives spreading lies – again.

    This week’s New Yorker features a blistering investigation by Jane Mayer into Hans von Spakovsky, a leading propagator of voter fraud myths. His work has led to a flurry of legislation and voting restrictions pushed by Republicans.

    I suppose that would be similar to the benefit fraud BS we get from National.

  11. prism 11

    Novopay the new innovative remittance paying scheme that hackers will never be able to break because it changes every time it is used with one-off unpredictable alterations, a fine example of chaos theory. Who knows where it will end up. Buy this novel program and be prepared for surprise and amazement.

    • marsman 11.1

      With a jingle that goes ‘In Multinationals we trust for we are the Hollow Men’?

    • Fortran 11.2

      The new system is part of the old adage – GIGO – never changes as computers cannot read minds – yet.

  12. karol 12

    Goodness – a Stuff author advocating a 30 hour working week – and it’s not even April 1st.  It’s a suggestion written by a reader though, not one of the regular journos.

    I suggest that all employment contracts be required to include this, as well as to introduce another clause in that respect: That any employee working more than 30 hours per week be paid time-and-a-quarter for every hour worked after the 30th hour. 

    • Draco T Bastard 12.1

      In order to avoid harming businesses, they should be able to deduct from their taxes (or otherwise be refunded) part of their losses incurred due to this change for the first years after the introduction.

      He obviously doesn’t understand the reasoning behind penal rates.

      The idea is that penal rates encourage the employer to invest in capital and thus being able to do more with less people. Our productivity increase has decreased from where it was due to the removal of penal rates. As a secondary effect it also helps to encourage full employment.

  13. Morrissey 13

    Family First’s ideal of motherhood

    Sue Bradford and other “do-gooders” wanted to stop good parents like this from lovingly chastising their children…

  14. joe90 14

    Uruguayan president Jose Mujica addressing the Rio +20 Summit: Human happiness and the environment .


    Are we ruling over globalization or is globalization ruling over us? Is it possible to speak of solidarity and of “being all together” in an economy based on ruthless competition? How far does our fraternity go?


    But if life is going to slip through my fingers, working and over-working in order to be able to consume more, and the consumer society is the engine-because ultimately, if consumption is paralysed, the economy stops, and if you stop economy, the ghost of stagnation appears for each one of us, but it is this hyper-consumption that is harming the planet. And this hyper-consumption needs to be generated, making things that have a short useful life, in order to sell a lot.

    El presidente Mujica concludes:

    And one asks this question: is this the fate of human life? These things I say are very basic: development cannot go against happiness. It has to work in favor of human happiness, of love on Earth, human relationships, caring for children, having friends, having our basic needs covered. Precisely because this is the most precious treasure we have; happiness. When we fight for the environment, we must remember that the essential element of the environment is called human happiness.

    • Rogue Trooper 14.1

      In addition to a big awhi to joe, I would just like to awhi all you folk on the left end of the political spectrum; the socio-political tension to endeavour course correction is essential.
      A thinking person would have to be “blind” to not see the implications of unfolding global and local environmental, economic, political, social and cultural events; it is not going to end well for the majority, which is ironic seeing as Fukuyama once argued that the modern democratic capitalist state was the “end of history” (never bothered reading his entire books, but he is changing his tune as the days unfold).
      After catching up on the latest Standard “revelations”, I am actually speechless, and have nothing else political to say,
      there is certainly more to this life than meets the eye.

  15. rod 15

    Paul Henry gets the elbow in oz and likely to come back to TVNZ. shit.

    • Colonial Viper 15.1

      The Australians send back the failure of a racist redneck crasspot. What is wrong with the world.

  16. weka 16

    Anyone heard what happened to the dude up north who smashed the window of the WINZ office and then went on a hunger strike? He was meant to be going to court for the window.
    Also the other dude in Dunedin, who got awarded a huge backpay from WINZ because they were so incompetent at managing his case, but WINZ were appealing.

  17. tc 17

    Henry’s finally been put out of viewers misery, from crikey’s Glen Dyer:

    ‘This morning it did a public service when it said it was axing Breakfast…That’s bad luck for the good co-host Kathryn Robinson. But it is good news because Ten is finally getting rid of the apparently useless Paul Henry, imported from NZ at a reported cost of $1 million and who was simply offensive beyond belief, in my opinion..’

    The comedians will miss all that material he generated though.

    • prism 17.1

      Has anyone ever diagnosed Henry with Tourettes Syndrome. He has an advanced version of it I think.

  18. feijoa 18

    Have standardistas noticed this??
    Article in Fridays Dompost saying Polytechnics have lost millions of dollars which has been shifted to (guess where) the private sector. EIT is losing 12 jobs beacause it has lost $2m government money. Stephen Joyce the man responsible

    • Colonial Viper 18.1

      Yeah this has been on the cards for months. Kids wanting to do trades and learn hands on skills fucked over.

      • Rogue Trooper 18.1.1

        HBDHB budget blowout; for example, increased elderly care etc etc (where do all these folk carrying on, lifestyle as usual, think all the extra money NZ needs to maintain status quo is going to come from? air?)
        here is a man with a “point of view”
        something for Draco

        also open at the moment
        Allah: A Christian Response. by Miroslav Volf

        A Confession. Leo Tolstoy. foreward by Helen Dunmore
        Hesperus Press Ltd.2010
        (this work influenced Gandhi) and includes the essay
        “What is Religion, and What does it’s Essence Consist Of?”

        The Politics of Hope. Jonathan Sacks (it’s all about covenant, you know, making a promise or commitment and keeping it)

        and for bedtime Lynn, “the telling” -Ursula K. Le Guin (makes the caravan cosy: I hope all the politicians appreciate that a person cannot afford to live independently under their own roof in this country on a single persons income support, meet the “market rent” and have any money left over for contingencies!)

    • Draco T Bastard 18.2

      Yeah, that was mentioned a couple of weeks ago. It’s how this government operates – Stop funding public services so that private profits can be boosted.

    • prism 18.3

      The polytechnics seem to be made culpable of not solving the unemployment problem. We don’t have enough trained builders and tradesmen, so that’s their fault. Pollies feel sure that if all the work classified as ‘jobs’ could be filled, why there would be only very low unemployment.

      There are barriers to young people getting further training too, costs including living and then a debt that is a burden if you can’t get a job and which is a continuing burden.

      So the government technics and institutes, who now and then mess up their budgets as well as the other gripes about them, are to be punished. Private will do it better, be more onto it etc.and government can be milked to provide business opportunities for people who have no original ideas for start ups.

  19. prism 19

    I am just listening to radionz with a piece on housing for the lower income and ‘new entrants’ into the housing market. They said that Hobsonville is the site of a development, with Housing NZ carrying out a large portion of new housing. They gave the job to an Australian firm and many of the properties are in the $600K to $800K bracket. Sigh!

  20. Colonial Viper 20

    I’ve started receiving stacks of notification emails from The Standard telling me whenever a new comment has been posted. Can anyone tell me how to turn this off? (Not even sure how I turned this on…)

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