web analytics
The Standard
Advertising

Open mike 18/08/2012

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, August 18th, 2012 - 178 comments
Categories: open mike - Tags:

Open mike is your post. For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the link to Policy in the banner).

Step right up to the mike…

178 comments on “Open mike 18/08/2012”

  1. Jenny 1

    Yesterday Carol commenting on open mike posted a link to an article exposing the shameful exploitation of the parliamentary cleaners.

    Here is the link she supplied:
    http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/7486644/Parliaments-cleaners-seek-pay-rise

    Anyone who has ever been to parliament cannot help noticing what a amazing job these low paid workers do. The place glows like a polished jewel. The respect these workers have for this institution and the dedication they put into their work, shows.
    It is morally shocking at how low paid they are.

    For MPs to walk through these polished halls everyday and ignore the exploitation of these low paid workers right under their noses and in their very midst, is in my opinion, dangerously corrosive to their moral compass. (And I am talking about all MPs here). Blatantly turning a blind eye to the injustice of this extreme inequality every day in your own workplace, day in day out, makes it easier for these men and women to ignore child poverty or other extremes of inequality in the rest of the country.

    Draco T Bastard and Vicky 32 both wrote;

    There are many things that the government should do…….

    To which I would like to add that there is also a lot the opposition MPs should/could do, as well.

    The cleaners, backed by the Service and Food Workers Union, recently met representatives from Labour, the Greens and NZ First.

    All three parties have committed to support their bid for a wage increase and other political parties are also being approached.

    Union advocate Jill Ovens said the MPs had agreed to approach Parliamentary Service for the cleaners, agreeing that $13.85 was not enough to live on.

    If the opposition MPs were serious about helping low paid workers out. Of whom the parliamentary cleaners are a representative of.

    And these opposition MPs approach to the Parliamentary Service in support of the clerners demand for $15 is not met, in full, then I would like to challenge the parliamentary opposition parties, Labour, Greens, NZF, Mana to go on strike for one week. During which time they will donate their wages to the Spotless workers to stay at home as well.

    Will they do it?

    Or, is all the expressed concern for the low paid by these opposition MPs just hot air?

    By their actions you shall know them

    • Carol 1.1

      Thanks for this Jenny. Yes, I hope that the opposition parties do take some protest action on this issue.

      However, isn’t it now against the law to go out on strike in support of workers in a different occupation? Or does the law relate to those in a different workplace, and it is within the law to protest for other workers in your workplace?

      • Jenny 1.1.1

        However, isn’t it now against the law to go out on strike in support of workers in a different occupation?

        Carol

        In answer to your question Carol. Yes it is. But I don’t think this prohibition applies to parliamentarians. And even if it did, I don’t think it is likely we would see the police and the courts try to enforce it. They would look like even bigger wallies than when they raided Kim Dotcom, or Tama Iti.

        On a more serious note. Parliamentarians rather than being regarded as workers, (albeit in another occupation), could be more accurately called their own boss and so are free to do as they please. If they called their stay-away a protest and not a strike, then quite likely it would not be illegal.

    • Grumpy 1.2

      Of course they are worth $15/hr, everyone is.

      The question is why the “workers champion”, when they were in power for 9 whole years didn’t do anything about it.

      • Draco T Bastard 1.2.1

        That’s easy Grumpy, they were following the neo-liberal play book that they introduced to NZ three decades ago.

        • Colonial Viper 1.2.1.1

          Labour did push up the minimum wage enormously when they were in power. But in our current political economy, that minimum wage quickly falls behind, and is also irrelevant for those who become unemployed.

          A UI and policies of 100% employment are crucial.

          • burt 1.2.1.1.1

            A tax system that rewards work rather than breeding would also help.

            • Draco T Bastard 1.2.1.1.1.1

              and burt wanders in spouting his usual ignorance.

              It’s not the tax system that rewards work but the wage system and our wage system is designed to keep wages low and profits high.

            • burt 1.2.1.1.1.2

              Oh, that’s right… we only pretend that WFF is part of the tax system when we want to talk about tax credits to argue tax isn’t high on low earners when Labour are in power… It’s part of the welfare system when National are in power… sorry Draco – I didn’t keep up with the fantasy world of pretending we can tax our way to a fair society.

              • millsy

                Its not fantasy, and it seems to work OK. Not like other countries that have no welfare system and vast expansive slums.

              • Draco T Bastard

                WfF is there due to low wages, not high taxes.

                • burt

                  Oh, of course… it rebates the tax burden because …. low wage earners are taxed too heavily… yeah – slice and dice the BS any way you want Draco – it’s a tax adjustment/it’s welfare… – it’s a breeders tax reduction whichever way you look at it.

                  • Draco T Bastard

                    If they weren’t paid so little to begin with then we wouldn’t have to cut the taxes that they pay so that they could afford to raise their families. That is the heart of capitalism – paying many SFA to work hard so that the few can live in luxury and not have to work at all.

                    • burt

                      Right, so your glorious socialist party that identified people were paid too little played with the tax system to be popular enough to win another election so that it could …. play some more with the tax system.

    • blue leopard 1.3

      @ Jenny (& Carol)

      Yes, this would be excellent!
      Would speak volumes if opposition party members took this approach.
      “Walking their talk in pictures” (which speak a thousand words).

      • Jenny 1.3.1

        Thanks for that Blue. Here are two stories from Common Dreams that could have just as easily been written about how our scandalously low paid parliamentary cleaners are treated.

        Here’s to the Houston Janitors

        Dead Woman Working

        Will our opposition MPs act or will they keep walking through their polished halls refusing to acknowledge those who do their work?

        • Jenny 1.3.1.1

          Houston is “Millionaire City,” after all, having added more millionaires to its population than any other city in the US for two years running. These janitors sanitize the bathrooms and workspaces, empty the trash, and vacuum the floors of some of the largest and most powerful corporations in the world: JPMorganChase, Shell, ExxonMobil, Chevron, Wells Fargo, KBR and Marathon Oil to name a few. They do their work in the best-performing commercial real estate market in the US in terms of demand. Many in this predominantly female workforce literally have to run to cleanmore than 100 toilets in five hours each night…..

          Here’s to the Houston Janitors Common Dreams

          …..“It’s clear that our country still doesn’t value the work of service workers. We have to fight harder to make sure that the people who are cleaning the buildings, taking care of the elderly, teaching our kids—all the different kinds of service work—that those folks are coming to the forefront and that people understand and hear their stories,” she said. “And we need to be up front about income inequality. I don’t think people want to accept that people earn $9,000 a year cleaning the offices of billionaires.”

          Here’s to the Houston Janitors Common Dreams

          It was a slow and torturous death, my American dream. And for millions of others, I am guessing it is the same. Nothing this current round of politicos is planning to do can restore it……

          …….No matter whether a Republican like Nixon, Ford, Reagan or Bush — either one — or Democrats like Carter, Clinton, or Obama, the real chances were always next to none that I would actually “make it” and also live a life of purpose I so desperately wanted.

          Dead Woman Working Common Dreams

          My dreams weren’t outrageous and of great wealth. No, my dreams were of a comfortable home, food on the table, children, a meaningful job, and perhaps the “freedom from want” signaled by not being terrified that I wouldn’t make it to my next paycheck. I wanted to pay the bills without fretting. I wanted an occasional vacation from work. And I looked forward to a little time in retirement with enough health left to spend with my husband, kids and grandkids before leaving this earth. Now I am so tired in my late 50s of the struggle and the futility of trying to be heard, that I am angry beyond belief.

          Nothing in my dream was tied to massive wealth or domination over other people. But that killer instinct certainly is present in many people I know. That’s the instinct I apparently lack – the need to be rich and control others even if it means allowing those many others to suffer and die for my personal achievement.

          My real situation is like millions of other people in America. I’ve worked hard – very hard. Vacations were almost non-existent as I either needed to use that time for sick leave when I needed to for children, my husband, or myself or I “banked” the time knowing the next financial storm would come. Retirement security? Come on.

          Dead Woman Working Common Dreams

        • blue leopard 1.3.1.2

          @ Jenny

          Cheers

          I particularly liked the “Dead Woman Working” article:

          “Nothing in my dream was tied to massive wealth or domination over other people. But that killer instinct certainly is present in many people I know. That’s the instinct I apparently lack – the need to be rich and control others even if it means allowing those many others to suffer and die for my personal achievement.”

  2. just saying 2

    Fran Osullivan is interesting today:
    Cloth Cap Cunliffe Pursues Hidden Agenda

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=10827742

    I didn’t think it was possible to cram so many neo-godwin’s law (comparisons to totalitarian communist states) infringements into such a small space.

    However, her final comment is relevant, and who here hasn’t thunk it?

    As with Bo in China, Cunliffe has launched a serious challenge to the prevailing ideology of his party’s political wing. Does he seriously believe the nostrums in his three speeches or has he cynically “gone red” to build votes within the party at large. And will his colleagues succeed in burying him? The ABC club can’t place Cunliffe under house arrest. They might just have to engage instead.

    • Carol 2.1

      Ewww…. so unsubtle, Ms O’Sullivan…. The right must truly fear Cunliffe, meanwhile trying to keep Labour in-fighting front-and-centre.

      However, I did smirk a little at the sideswipe at Nikki Kaye:

      The general rule of politics is to “breathe through your nose” when beginning a parliamentary career; pay endless obeisance to the leader (this is usually achieved by repeating the leader’s name at every opportunity as, for instance, does Auckland Central MP Nikki Kaye in her Facebook announcements detailing the latest event where she has been the PM’s handbag in New Zealand’s commercial capital) but not complacent to the point of being brain dead by the time you are considered for a senior role.

      And that speaks more of politboro politics than Cunliffe’s alleged independence of thought.

      • Draco T Bastard 2.1.1

        That sounds remarkably like how to succeed in large private firms as well.

      • muzza 2.1.2

        not complacent to the point of being brain dead by the time you are considered for a senior role

        Perhaps FOS understands what the “parliamentarians on ‘exchange’ is designed for..

        “It’s a very full schedule we’ll be having a range of meetings with various speakers and senators. We’re meeting with a thinktank, we’re meeting with Mike Moore who is our ambassador over there.

        It is possible that FOS is astute to enough to subtley indicate that the “Think Tanks” which are blatantly not what most simpletons want to believe, are in fact little more than brain (dead)washing?

    • Jenny 2.2

      Would Cunliffe be the one to lead a parliamentary opposition walk out in a solidarity action with the parliamentary cleaners?

  3. Morrissey 3

    LEST WE FORGET

    Here’s the real reason they want to destroy Julian Assange….

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rXPrfnU3G0

    • Grumpy 3.1

      I thought the only person wanting to destroy Assange was Assange…..
      Talk about a self destruct personality, ot uncommon on the left

      • Morrissey 3.1.1

        I thought the only person wanting to destroy Assange was Assange…..

        You “thought”? Here’s what you need to do, pronto…

        1.) WATCH the video.

        2.) READ something about the case. (Something serious, that is. Paul Thomas in the Herald is not serious. The Grauniad and the BBC, from which you draw your opinions, are about as serious and independent as Pravda and Tass.

        3.) THINK.

        4.) READ some more.

        5.) READ, read, read, and think….

        Off you go now.

        • Pascal's bookie 3.1.1.1

          Link to something serious M.

          • Morrissey 3.1.1.1.1

            Link to something serious M.

            I’ve done that virtually every time I have started a thread on this topic. But here’s another one just for you, my friend….

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E9ExSqnuwyk

            • Pascal's bookie 3.1.1.1.1.1

              Ooh, a 2 year old msnbc report and an interview with Ellsberg.

              Ellsberg is a serious historic figure. His leaks of the Pentagon papers went all the way to the Supreme Court and resulted in rulings that clarified that journalists who hace recieved classified material are protected by the first amendment when they publish them, you’ll note in that report that officials were saying that charges were not imminent. Guess why that is? Hint, I’ve already told you in this paragraph.

              Also relevant is that WL has never published anything as secret as what Ellsberg leaked, or what the NYT or the WaPo have published.

              Two years on, and the investigation Holder mentions in that report has still not laid any charges. No charges = no grounds for extradition.

              And to forestall any bleating about the UK–> Sweden extradition; Sweden lays charges much later in the investigation the the UK or the US does. If Assange was accused of rape and sexual offences in either the uS or the iK, or here, he would already be charged.

              Now you dismissed the gaurdian Edit I linked to yesterday in a laughable manner, simply asserting that it could have been written by the Foreign Office.

              Yet two wrongs do not make a right. Just as Ecuador is wrong to pretend that Mr Assange is a refugee, so Britain is wrong to threaten to enter Ecuador’s London embassy. The Foreign Office may have been factually entitled to remind Ecuador this week that a 1987 act allows it, if permissible under international law, to enter the premises. But the reminder is more trouble than it is worth, and risks being massively counterproductive to this country’s interests in places where fewer scruples apply. The threat was a mistake, allowing Ecuador to shift the argument away from the Swedish criminal charges. Our diplomats in hostile or failing states would be put at unacceptable risk if this threat were carried out.

              http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2012/aug/16/julian-assange-wikileaks-refugee-protection?CMP=twt_gu

              I’m sure the foreign office would write that. Yup, aha. I don’t think you even read the editorial.

              I trust you can either argue against the editorials content yourself, or link to someone serious who can do so. It raises some inteesting points that are relevant today, rather than 2 years ago.

              Particularly, the point that if Assange goes to Sweden, international law gives him more protection than he has if he stays in the UK. this is because “both Sweden and the UK would have to sign off on any extradition application” from the US. An application that hasn’t been made yet because no charges have been laid in the US.

              So have at it, be serious. Address these points.

              Or wriggle around and launch ad homs like a fan boy. Your choice.

              • Pascal's bookie

                Here ya Morrisey, jump on this one and address the actual content of the editorial.

                Have at it, should be a piece of cake, seeing you’ve read so much and all.

                List the errors and explain their significance.

                • Morrissey

                  Have at it, should be a piece of cake, seeing you’ve read so much and all.

                  I’ve posted a lot on this topic already, and I’ve linked to many reputable articles and talks by people who know what they’re talking about, rather than poorly informed hacks and out and out propagandists like David Aaronovitch. And now, hilariously, someone who says Daniel Ellsberg and Noam Chomsky engage in rhetoric, wants me to engage in stupid trench warfare with him.

                  Sorry, my friend, your approach is frivolous—rather than argue your case, you’ve tried to belittle me by calling me a “fan boy” on at least two occasions today, but then you’ve also virtually dismissed Ellsberg and Chomsky, so I’m in good company.

                  Not that you would care, but for anyone who does give a damn, the inadequacy of that craven Grauniad editorial has been astutely analyzed here….
                  http://members5.boardhost.com/medialens/msg/1345182455.html

                  • Chris

                    At some point can everyone stop these threads. They say the same thing everyday and noone gets any further but they fill up Open Mike so noone can talk about anything else without scrolling down for ages.

                    I get it Morrissey Assange is a saint – I get it pretty much everyone else he should front the investigation without danger of being extradited to the US.

                    • Morrissey

                      I get it Morrissey Assange is a saint…

                      No, I have never claimed that. He is a man, albeit a very brave man who has dared to tell the truth at a time when that is an extremely dangerous choice.

                      And he is also a man who obviously is not above temptation. There is no evidence whatsoever that he is a rapist, of course.

                  • Pascal's bookie

                    Morrissey, saying “No it isn’t” isn’t analysis.

      • rosy 3.1.2

        Grumpy, what makes you think Assange is on the left? I thought he was more an anarchist / individualist.

  4. Morrissey 4

    The John Banks Trophy for…
    DUM QUOTE OF THE WEEK

    Award No. 1: for week ending 17/08/2012

    This week’s winner—and the inaugural holder of the John Banks Trophy—is the awesome Te Reo Putake. In a field crowded with the uninformed, the cynical, the craven, and the plain stupid, our friend nudged ahead of close rivals Weka, Pascal’s Bookie, and the indefatigable yet ill-informed McFlock with this effort for the ages, posted late at night, quite possibly under the influence of a mind=bending substance…

    “What is so special about Assange that Sweden should change its laws for him?”

    Te Reo Putake, Open Mike, 17/08/2012

    His inanity was, of course, almost immediately seized on and corrected by the superior RedLogix and Colonial Viper; their contributions serve to highlight and immortalize our friend’s achievement.

    • Grumpy 4.1

      Bloody good quote actually and one that most people would be proud to have made……..

      • Morrissey 4.1.1

        Bloody good quote actually and one that most people would be proud to have made……..

        LOL. Classic! You couldn’t make this stuff up!

        Still, good on you, Grumpy. I’ll bet you’re a great friend in a crisis.

        • Grumpy 4.1.1.1

          Assange HAD great friends in a crisis too, until he skipped bail………

          • Morrissey 4.1.1.1.1

            Vaughan Smith is a very nice man, but his brand of timidity is not what you want on your case in a crisis….

            http://members5.boardhost.com/medialens/msg/1345167751.html

            • Grumpy 4.1.1.1.1.1

              Well, I agree with you there…..looks like Assange just took money where he could and “weak”idiots like Smith and Jemima Khan were soft touches.

              For a guy who didn’t think twice about putting a bullet into the back of some poor bastards head, Assange is sure a whiner……..

              • Morrissey

                looks like Assange just took money where he could and “weak”idiots like Smith and Jemima Khan were soft touches.

                Once again, whether deliberately or not, you’ve missed the point spectacularly. Smith is weak not because he has paid money to help a dissenter, but because he lacks the toughness of character, the fortitude, to confront an ignorant bully like David Aaronovitch.

                For a guy who didn’t think twice about putting a bullet into the back of some poor bastards head, Assange is sure a whiner……..

                What on earth are you talking about? Is this another government-sponsored fantasy now?

                • Vicky32

                  What on earth are you talking about? Is this another government-sponsored fantasy now?

                  Interestingly enough, I just this afternoon, was reading a discussion about Assange/Ecuador on an American site, and someone came and answered the (reasonable) question ‘why don’t Sweden say they are not going to extradite Assange to the USA’?
                  This person’s answer “Well, if he’s found to have murdered someone in the US, they may have to”…
                  First, the person did not say “found to be suspected of having murdered’ – which I find interesting in itself, but second and more important – is there such an allegation coming up?

                • Pascal's bookie

                  I wouldn’t read too much into that V, it sounds like a hypothetical to explain why the demands that Sweden promise he won’t be extradited to the US won’t fly.

                  The problem is that they have an extradition treaty with the US. Given that fact, they can’t make that promise. If the US charge him with something, (and given the passing of time it looks like they ahving problems doing so), then Sweden will be legally obligated to consider an extradition request.

                  The demand to ‘promise not to extradite’, is a demand that Sweden abandon it’s treaty with the US.

                  • Colonial Viper

                    If the US charge him with something, (and given the passing of time it looks like they ahving problems doing so)

                    This conclusion is complicated by the fact that a Grand Jury may have been formed to consider charges against Assange, but due to secrecy rules we would never know about their deliberations, or even that a Grand Jury has been called.

                    Further, rule 6e, 4) of the Federal Rules of Criminal Procedure allows for a criminal indictment to be sealed until a suspect was in direct custody. In other words, the US may have already charged Assange – but are keeping the indictment secret.

                    • Pascal's bookie

                      But can they extradite him from Sweden without an indictment CV, or with a secret one?

                      They will need to convince Sweden and the UK to extradite him. That means they will need to say what they want him for.

                      And if they do say what they want him for, Sweden will be legally obliged to consider the request.

                      That’s why Sweden can’t offer him a blanket promise. To do so would be to throw the extradition treaty in the trash bin.

                    • Colonial Viper

                      Yes the US would have to make the details available to the Swedish authorities at a future time.

                      So the key is that those US indictments may already exist. If they do exist, they have been formalised with the intent of seeking Assange’s extradition. But because they are secret, Assange has no way of using their existence, in his defence against extradition to Sweden.

                    • Pascal's bookie

                      That makes no sense at all.

                      If the indictments exist, then it doesn’t matter if he is Sweden or the UK. If he is in the UK, the US will ask the Brits, if he is in Sweden, they will ask the Swede’s. the fact that the US hasn’t asked anyone suggests that they haven’t been able to come up with an indictment. Unless you have another explanation?

                      The only relevant point is that if he is in Seden via extradition from the UK, then both the UK and Sweden would have to agree to a US extradition.

        • Grumpy 4.1.1.2

          …oh, yes……..he had other “great friends” too, until he slipped one into them while they were asleep……….

          • Morrissey 4.1.1.2.1

            until he slipped one into them while they were asleep…

            What have you got to say about the murder video? Or do you spend all your time on state-sanctioned diversions?

            • Grumpy 4.1.1.2.1.1

              The video is shocking, I agree. But, we are talking about Assange the person, he gave up the mantle of “freedom fighter” when his warped personality got the better of him.

              Not worth wasting your time to defend……….

              • Morrissey

                we are talking about Assange the person, he gave up the mantle of “freedom fighter” when his warped personality got the better of him.

                No doubt you now condemn Martin Luther King, who was a tireless womanizer. There is evidence that he was a rapist too—as much as there is against Assange.

                • LOL – a minor morrie? don’t forget to chuck in some miners – your stew is tiresome – much like you.

                  • Morrissey

                    …your stew is tiresome – much like you.

                    Personal attacks now? That’s getting a bit desperate, surely?

                    But in the light of your lack of any other weapons, such as facts or arguments, it will have to do for you, I guess.

                    By the way, you might like to check out my advice to Grumpy, above. Hope it proves to be of some help to you.

                    • thank you my friend, but I hardly imagine you really find “tiresome” too insulting and it’s a pretty mellow “personal attack” if it can even be called that. I admit I did try to be funny – :( my bad

                    • Morrissey

                      I admit I did try to be funny – my bad

                      No need to apologize, my friend. You’ve done nothing wrong. I can take a putdown. You don’t think I’m a delicate creature like Judith Collins, do you?

              • RedLogix

                Lot of people just envious that Assange was getting laid.

                The man has done a thousand times more for the world than any of us will ever do .. and these small minds sneer at him because he had sex.

                • you are a projectionist mate – and that comment is contemptible but not surprising coming from you.

                • Grumpy

                  I have some symathy for that view BUT as the sex seems to have been obtained under, at least, dubious circumstances, that sympathy is pretty limited.

                  Reminds me of the defence for Clinton, “at least we have a President who f*cks”.

                  • Morrissey

                    Reminds me of the defence for Clinton

                    Please don’t mention Julian Assange, who is a champion of democracy, in the same sentence as that disgusting, corrupt champion of dictatorships and mass bombing.

                    Actually, the fact that you have done so tells a lot about just how ignorant and non-serious you are.

                • locus

                  if i were to assume the very best possible interpretation of your comment RL I’d say it was spawned by such awe of Assange’s professional ‘achievements’ that you have misplaced your sense of right and wrong

                  if i were to assume the worst – that you have not only prejudged the rape accusation as a fabrication but also that Assange should be admired for his treatment of women – then I’d have to say you you have no sense of right and wrong

                  • RedLogix

                    that you have not only prejudged the rape accusation as a fabrication but also that Assange should be admired for his treatment of women

                    Ah … only it’s not a ‘rape’ accusation. It’s something else. The women involved invited Assange into their beds.

                    At the same time the Swedes have these relatively laws around regulating what adults can and cannot do in their beds …. and they’ve already had one significant 5 week period where Assange stayed in the country, was interviewed and the proceedings apparently dropped. He was then given permission to leave the country.

                    Subsequent events however cast a great deal of doubt on whether the real motives involved in re-opening and pursuing the case. Given that reality all that is required is for the Swedes to get on a plane to the UK, interview their man, decide whether to lay a charge or not, and make a simple, cost-free, declaration that if he returns to Sweden to face a Court (in a timely fashion) … that he will not be subject to other unrelated actions.

                    Then the desired legal process can proceed in the normal fashion.

                    • weka

                      Ah … only it’s not a ‘rape’ accusation. It’s something else. The women involved invited Assange into their beds.”
                       
                      Rape myth: if you have sex once with someone you cannot then be raped by them.
                       
                      Rape myth: if you invite someone into your bed, you consent to all sexual activity that that person wants.
                       

                    • locus

                      So you think it’s a trumped up allegation to get him back to Sweden so that he can be tried and subsequently extradited to the US?

                      Does your conviction also mean that you have decided the women making the allegations are both liars, and that a Swedish court won’t give him a fair trial?

                      Does your view also give you the right to call the people who are asking for him to face up to those allegations “small minded, sneering and envious” ?

                    • Jackal

                      Although I’m rather bored with this debate, the question is whether the consent to have sex ended? When exactly did one of them or both fall asleep and how long was that for? “You better not have aids,” isn’t exactly a statement that clarifies the situation.

                      In Assange’s mind, he would have thought; ‘I don’t have aids, this feels good, everything is OK’. In the complainants mind, it could have been translated as; ‘He’s not wearing a condom and probably has aids, get the fuck off me you pervert’.

                      She didn’t say stop or get off me though, so the question as to whether the consent to have further sex is not answered, and the speculation on blogs about such things is rather pointless. Only a court of law can answer the question to an adequate degree.

                      I don’t think Assange should risk extradition to the US where he possibly faces the death penalty for the alleged crimes surrounding Wikileaks. I do think he should stand trial for the alleged crimes in Sweden. Unfortunately these are not mutually distinguishable and until they are, which depends mainly on a decision by the US, we’re at an impasse.

                  • Morrissey

                    you have misplaced your sense of right and wrong

                    RedLogix pointed out what you and some others choose to turn a blind eye to: that an enraged U.S. government is conspiring to destroy a whistle-blower by using two women to file a wild and ludicrous sexual allegation. You wouldn’t know, of course, but that’s an old KGB procedure. In your mind, to point that out is “misplacing a sense of right and wrong”, apparently.

                    Could I ask you to have a look at this and then see who has misplaced a sense of right and wrong?….

                    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rXPrfnU3G0

                • weka

                  “and these small minds sneer at him because he had sex.”
                   
                  Look, now we have our own painter on the roof story! Because as we all know, it’s completely possible to tell whether something was rape from the other side of the globe :roll:
                   
                  Also, that’s two clear examples in this thread where the wellbeing of women is expendable according to leftwing men.
                   

                  • RedLogix

                    I’m fairly sure the women involved in these accusations are ok. I stand to be corrected.

                    • weka

                      Red you have no way of knowing whether those women are ok or not.
                       
                      At the very least, stop calling rape sex.

                    • Jackal

                      It’s not proven to be rape yet… There is no question that they had sex. You are guilty of your own accusation that it’s not possible to tell if it’s rape or not from the other side of the world.

                      Please stop inferring that all people who defend Assange are supporting rape culture weka, and that isolated opinion defines what all men who comment here think. It’s insulting!

                    • weka

                      It’s not proven to be rape yet… There is no question that they had sex. You are guilty of your own accusation that it’s not possible to tell if it’s rape or not from the other side of the world.

                      I have no idea what happened Jackal, that is the point. I’m not saying that Assange raped those women. I’m saying that the complainants’ account fits the definition of rape. Other people are saying it doesn’t. We’re not arguing about whether Assange is a rapist, we’re arguing about what rape is, and who gets to define it.
                       
                      Anyone who says that rape didn’t happen is pre-empting the justice system, which is meant to afford justice to victims. 
                       
                      Now, just to be clear, because apparently this is a bit subtle for some people, my last sentence does not read “Assange is a rapist”. Please read it carefully and think about what I have just said.

                       
                      Please stop inferring that all people who defend Assange are supporting rape culture weka, and that isolated opinion defines what all men who comment here think. It’s insulting!
                       

                      Well the difficulty for me Jackal is that there are a number of regular commenters in the ongoing conversations about Assange on TS who DO use  mis-arguments about rape  and promote rape myths to support their politic agenda. Nowhere have I said that all people who support Assange support rape culture. In fact the opposite. If you can’t see that then you really are not understanding my argument at all. This surprises me, because you seem an intelligent person otherwise.
                       
                      Honestly, I think you are reading many things into my comments that simply aren’t there. I’ve been very specific about what I think supports rape culture in this debate. Morrissey’s insistance that rape didn’t happen. RedLogix calling rape sex. The rape myths eg that once a woman has sex with someone once she consents to all other sexual activity. CV’s misusing concepts of consent. Prism’s ideas that rape is only extreme physical sexual violence. Those are all the things that support rape culture, NOT the fact that they side with Assange. Do you get what I am saying now?
                       
                      I’m really happy to keep discussing this with you but would appreciate if you could be more specific about my points and check things out rather than making statements about what I am implying.

                    • muzza

                      “At the very least, stop calling rape sex”

                      Um, unless I managed to miss something Weka, that’s you pretending to know what actually went on.

                      Edit: Just read your reponse above Weka, and would can’t say I read the quote any other way, perhaps I missed a reference or comment in another post?

                      The Assange situation is most likely nothing what anyone who has posted or read on either side of anything to do with WL’s, or other events surrounding Assange, and taking a position on either side of it categorically, means that people are easily fooled, because they think in absolutes!

                      Did he do it , did he not, was he really in charge of WL’s, was it a front etc….

                      See the energy the internet sucks out of people…put that into something physical, and those on this site might actually make a real difference..

                      Whose in….thought not!

                    • weka

                      Hmmm, let me try again Muzza.
                       
                      One of the complainants says that Assange had sex with her while she was asleep (ie he put his penis inside her vagina while she was unconscious). That is an illegal act of rape (unless she gave him permission beforehand). I’m not saying that Assange did that. I’m saying that IF he did that, then that’s rape.
                       
                      When someone describes that act as sex, they’re wrong. The law states that it is rape.
                       
                      As far as I can tell, RL thinks the act of a man putting his penis inside a woman while she is unconscious is sex. He’s wrong. 
                       

                      A person does not consent to sexual activity if the activity occurs while he or she is asleep or unconscious.
                       


                    • Jackal

                      weka

                      We’re not arguing about whether Assange is a rapist, we’re arguing about what rape is, and who gets to define it.

                      ? Much of the debate has revolved around whether Assange is guilty of rape or not. In fact labeling it rape at this stage shows you have already made up your mind. I think most people have a fair understanding of what rape is, which is defined by various laws in different countries.

                      Nowhere have I said that all people who support Assange support rape culture. In fact the opposite.

                      I must have misunderstood this then:

                      Here on TS, where women are deemed expendable.

                      and

                      That’s two clear examples in this thread where the wellbeing of women is expendable according to leftwing men.

                      This could be interpreted as: “People who defend Assange think it’s OK to rape women, and because some people are defending Assange on the Standard, all leftwing men support rape culture”. Can you not see why I object to such generalizations?

                      This is an important point because you run the risk of alienating people and turning them against your cause, even though your cause is justified. Reducing rape culture (which some people have argued doesn’t exist) is a fundamental step in creating a more equal and safe society… Especially for woman.

                      Rape culture is pretty well defined, and although some of the comments here are borderline, categorically saying they support rape culture would to some degree depend on your opinion about what happened between Assange and the complainants.

                      Honestly, I think you are reading many things into my comments that simply aren’t there. I’ve been very specific about what I think supports rape culture in this debate.

                      I understand your points of view, but very much doubt that any of the people you’ve named because you disagree with their comments support rape culture. Your accusations that they do is somewhat detrimental to your cause, and therefore I think you’ve not been as careful as you believe in choosing what comments to rally against.

                  • Colonial Viper

                    weka, Assange should certainly face up to Swedish criminal investigators IMO. I presume he is innocent, but a criminal investigation has been started and he needs to participate in that to either clear his name or be found guilty once and for all. But I also back RL’s statement:

                    Given that reality all that is required is for the Swedes to get on a plane to the UK, interview their man, decide whether to lay a charge or not, and make a simple, cost-free, declaration that if he returns to Sweden to face a Court (in a timely fashion) … that he will not be subject to other unrelated actions.

                    Assange has also offered to do the interview by videolink – completely standard procedure in the modern day – and from there Swedish investigators can either charge him, or follow up with him in person. All that could be done TODAY.

                    IMO the women complainants are being used as pawns by the major governments and their complaints unnecesarily held in limbo by the authorities – you should be angry at that. The criminal investigators have had multiple opportunities to progress their complaints by questioning Assange, but they haven’t – I suppose on the orders of their superiors/political sponsors.

                    • weka

                      Sure CV. But in my world it’s conceivable that Assange sexually assaulted those women AND those women are being used by political powers.
                       
                      Further, I don’t consider Assange’s personal wellbeing more important than the women in the case, no matter how big a hero he is to the left. 
                       
                      And, I don’t consider wikileaks to be a more important issue for humanity than rape culture.
                       
                      Whenever the left puts Assange and/or wikileaks and/or the issue of political interference ahead of the complainants, women’s experience of rape, or the politics of rape*, I sigh and think here we go again. As I’ve said, this is not new to women on the left. It happens alot and until men on the left understand this enough to change culturally there is always a severe limit in their solidarity with women.
                       
                      * let me put that another way: whenever the left undermines the complainants, women’s experience of rape, or the politics of rape, and they do so for another political purpose eg saving the butt of a famous well-off white man, or resisting US imperialism, or whatever, they engage in the very same behaviour they are fighting against, and so we all lose.
                       
                      There is nothing wrong with you wanting to save Assange, or wanting to fight US imperialism. I’m saying you don’t have to do it at the expense of women. I think some men on the left struggle to even understand what I am talking about, but others are well aware of the dynamic and just don’t give a shit (women are expendable after all).
                       
                      I’m not sure where you sit in all that, you seem to understand, but still be playing the game albeit much more lightly than Morrissey or RL.
                       
                      “you should be angry at that.”
                       
                      What makes you think that I’m not?

                • prism

                  Red Logix
                  It is so pleasant for people to cut others down, I don’t see it as being tall poppy syndrome but just a desire to carp and pass judgment. Think Bill Clinton, think Helen Clark’s signed auction item – any way to chip away from them.

                  Look at the covers of women’s magazines in supermarkets. They are quite expensive but stay in circulation as they reveal all, and often just about do in their sneak photos on the covers. The people who become celebrities have searchlights and moral potshots lobbed at them, no overlooking any fault, despite what noble or ground-breaking improvement they are trying to achieve. I’m not including Strauss Kahen? in this as he seems to just have been a well paid jerk.

    • Te Reo Putake 4.2

      “What is so special about Assange that Sweden should change its laws for him?”
       
      Apparently the law should change because international misogyny’s Morrissey and a little light raping’s Red Logix say so. I’m so impressed.
       
      Is it diificult to type with your penises lads? Or are they small enough to hit the keys first time every time?
       

      • Colonial Viper 4.2.1

        No law change would be required mate. Just an assurance that Swedish authorities aren’t going to extradite Assange on completely unrelated and unannounced matters.

        • Te Reo Putake 4.2.1.1

          Such an assurance might satisfy you, CV, but clearly it won’t satisfy Assange. We already know that Sweden won’t extradite if the death penalty is a possibility, so we are left with a cowardly criminal* hiding for no good reason. 
           
          *Criminal in the sense that he has broken UK law by skipping out on his bail. And ripping off his mates in the process. Like you, I believe he should answer and defend the Swedish charges, so I make no assumptions about the criminality there. Though his sexual behaviour is obviously appalling anyway.

        • rosy 4.2.1.2

          “Just an assurance that Swedish authorities aren’t going to extradite Assange on completely unrelated and unannounced matters.”
          Ecuador has said it’s willing to co-operate on that basis.

          Ecuador was willing to co-operate with the British and Swedish authorities over the matter of Assange’s extradition to Sweden. “In the negotiations with the FCO, Ecuador has been proposing that we would be prepared to accept an undertaking from the UK and Sweden that, once Julian Assange has faced the Swedish investigation, he will not be extradited to a third country: specifically the US. That might be a way out of it and Ecuador has always said it does not want to interfere with the Swedish judicial process; we could facilitate it.”

          http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2012/aug/17/julian-assange-extradition-ecuador-embassy

          Assange has probably realised he’s a bit trapped with this move. I agree it’s time for diplomats to do the diplomatic thing and if that’s what it takes to end the stand-off, Sweden should give an explicit, rather than implied assurance and get this sorted.

      • Morrissey 4.2.2

        The John Banks Trophy holder writes wittily: “Is it diificult to type with your penises lads? Or are they small enough to hit the keys first time every time?”

        Considering he’s a Banksy winner, that was a really, really good one.

        But I feel sure others will agree with me that he’s funnier when he’s pretending to be serious.

        • Pascal's bookie 4.2.2.1

          Might start calling you Overhead, on account of how you project so well.

          Or you can get serious any time you like.

          • Morrissey 4.2.2.1.1

            “Overhead”?

            Say… I LIKE it!

            • McFlock 4.2.2.1.1.1

              Or “rear projector”, because you’re talking out of your arse.

              • Morrissey

                Or “rear projector”, because you’re talking out of your arse.

                Not such a good one. That could set you up for a Martin Devlin Unfunny Line award, however.

                I’ll nominate you. Can I get a seconder?

    • Draco T Bastard 4.3

      You know, I’d probably know more, and possibly even care more, about the Assange case if these threads didn’t keep degenerating into what amounts to little more than flame wars.

      • Morrissey 4.3.1

        I’d probably know more, and possibly even care more, about the Assange case if these threads didn’t keep degenerating into what amounts to little more than flame wars.

        No, you’d know more and—unless you’re a moral imbecile—you’ll care more about the Assange case if you do some serious and sustained reading about it.

        Here’s a starter for you….

        http://www.countercurrents.org/todhunter240612.htm

        If you’re serious, though, you’ll read much, much, much more.

        • Pascal's bookie 4.3.1.1

          Lol.

          Serioulsy, that’s serious? Rhetoric. Marginally effective rhetoric I suppose, if what you are after is something to stir the blood of that already convinced, but the analysis is non existent, and the description of Wikileaks is so shallow I’d expect ot see it in a broadsheet article ‘From the Left’.

          that’s Trotter level stuff.

          try again.

          • Morrissey 4.3.1.1.1

            Okay. You’re here and you’re serious. That’s encouraging.

            Is Daniel Ellsberg serious enough for you?….

            http://www.ellsberg.net/archive/public-accuracy-press-release

            Noam Chomsky?….

            http://www.democracynow.org/2010/11/30/noam_chomsky_wikileaks_cables_reveal_profound

            • Pascal's bookie 4.3.1.1.1.1

              Neither of those pieces, which I’ve seen before, really add much to the actual issues of the moment.

              What I’m looking for is analysis and reporting. Not rhetoric, arguments.

              Thinngs that just outline how bad the US is, or what Wikileaks was doing, and to whom, and whether or not we should support wikileaks, don’t add much to a debate about the actual state of play today.

              Just because an individual has cred, that doesn’t make everything they say ‘serious’.

              • Morrissey

                What I’m looking for is analysis and reporting. Not rhetoric, arguments.

                Daniel Ellsberg and Noam Chomsky are not analytical? That’s rich coming from someone who’s just recycled some windy Grauniad propaganda and even praised it as “good”.

                …don’t add much to a debate about the actual state of play today.

                Nonsense. Their analyses touch on the very heart of what we’ve seen in London over the last two days. The fact you choose to participate in the black propaganda campaign waged by the likes of William Hague means your protestations that you are “looking for analysis” are not serious.

                Just because an individual has cred, that doesn’t make everything they [sic] say ‘serious’.

                On the other hand, you are prepared to accept as “serious” the allegations of individuals and organizations with NO “cred”, such as the inveterate liars and governments that are trying to destroy Assange.

                I don’t believe you’ve read those pieces before, either.

                • Pascal's bookie

                  Daniel Ellsberg and Noam Chomsky are not analytical? That’s rich coming from someone who’s just recycled some windy Grauniad propaganda and even praised it as “good”.

                  they are sometimes. those pieces didn’t have any analysis of the recent events that I could see. Why don’t you tell me how the Ellsberg piece sheds light on the extradition issues.

                  And it seems to me that your basis for judging the seriuosness of who is saying it is based on two things. Whether they support your position, and whether you like the author. Prove me wrong, talk about content, discuss the issue.

                  Nonsense. Their analyses touch on the very heart of what we’ve seen in London over the last two days. The fact you choose to participate in the black propaganda campaign waged by the likes of William Hague means your protestations that you are “looking for analysis” are not serious.

                  More tiresome nonsense. Explain to me how those pieces touch on the very heart of what we’ve seen. And what black propaganda campaign am I engaged in? Honestly, because I disagree with you I’m a lackey of Hague/ Grow up Morrisey, cut the bluster and start on the actual issues. Address the content of the gaurdian edit, instead of just rolling our eyes at the mention of the word Gaurdian.

                  On the other hand, you are prepared to accept as “serious” the allegations of individuals and organizations with NO “cred”, such as the inveterate liars and governments that are trying to destroy Assange.

                  More baseless smearing. What allegations have I accepted? Again, show me that your views are driven by more than Assange good, everyone who doesn’t saint Assange, utterly evil and not worthy of listening to.

                  Address some of the actual arguments. All you’ve done so far is attack the sources. Weak overhead is failing.

                  • Morrissey

                    1.) And what black propaganda campaign am I engaged in?

                    Classic! We have an early contender for the next John Banks Trophy.

                    • McFlock

                      Don’t forget to put yourself down for a regional daytime Emmy.

                    • Pascal's bookie

                      So to recap:

                      Your response to the arguments in the editorial I linked to is:

                      Neena neena, The Gaurdian, MSM

                      Your explantion of how your links are relevant to what’s going on now is:

                      It’s Ellsberg!! and Chompsky!! Therefore it must be relevant.

                      And your evidence for me being a part of, or repeating, black propaganda is :

                      You’re like John Banks!

                      That’s some powerful argumentation in support of your positions there Morrisey.

                    • yes Pb. I read both the links supplied by morrissey at least twice because I was searching for something to do with what was being discussed – they almost seemed irrelevant, in that the background issues they raised aren’t even in contention as far as I can tell on this forum.

                      the prof might mark that effort down a bit I think.

      • weka 4.3.2

        Me too Draco.

  5. Carol 5

    This looks like a shambles waiting to happen…. and a load more questions likely to be put to that 3yr old masquerading as Minister:

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10827772

    The YPP, and a similar Youth Payment for teens aged 16 and 17 without children, will still add up to the same as the current benefits, ranging from $136 a week for a young parent living with their own parents up to $293 for sole parents aged 18 and over.

    But under the new system only $50 will be paid in cash.

    Rent or board will be paid directly to landlords or parents, and the rest will be loaded onto a payment card to buy “food and groceries at approved stores”.

    Unfortunately no one has yet told any of the teenage mums at Mt Eden’s Eden Campus teen parent unit what the approved stores are or what exactly they can spend their cards on.

    They have also yet to receive their cards.

    It seems that things, necessary to some teens like tranpsort, will need to come out of the cash payment. There also is supposed to be a local community-based youth service provider that will replace case managers. But many of these “providers” won’t be in place for a few months, leaving many teens with no-one to turn to when there are problems.

    Work and Income head Debbie Power said young beneficiaries would not move onto the payment card until they met their new service providers “over the coming months”.

    She said the payment card could be spent only at food stores.

    • rosy 5.1

      She said the payment card could be spent only at food stores.
      Being the good business people most food store owners are, I’m sure the range of goods they stock will increase reasonably quickly.

      • Draco T Bastard 5.1.1

        Being the good business people most food store owners are, I’m sure the range of goods they stock will increase in price reasonably quickly.

        FIFY

        Normal procedure when a business has a customer base that can’t go anywhere else.

        • rosy 5.1.1.1

          I should have put a little /sarc tag on that one, but anyways, nearly there, how about….

          Being the good business people most food store owners are, I’m sure the range of goods they stock will increase reasonably quickly, and priced at a premium for these customers with restricted access to alternatives markets.

    • Bill 5.2

      So an adult is to cater for their and their child’s non-food needs on $50 a week? ffs!

      • rosy 5.2.1

        No, they simply can’t. It’s all designed to get them moving – out of school, out of motherhood and into the world of low wage employees.

        • Colonial Viper 5.2.1.1

          And since there are no jobs out there at the low end, its actually designed to permanently suppress already low wages by ensuring a massive oversupply of labour.

    • prism 5.3

      Carol
      When I was doing my social policy papers I came across a strong distaste for a condition that welfare was supposed to encourage called ‘learned helplessness’. It seems to me that handing out pocket money to youthful parents is not helping them to learn mature financial handling if they need it. I have heard interviews with numbers of young mothers who have been very serious about their position and acquiring skills that would enable them to cope and live better.

      And this food thing reminds me of the diminishing situation for beneficiaries personal esteem where Shipleys National govt had it set up so that supermarket checkout staff vetted their choice of groceries.

  6. Carol 6

    Dame Anne Salmond’s Sir Paul Reeves Memorial lecture is worth reading and meditating on:

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=10827658

    Like Sir Paul, I am concerned about the current quality of our relations with each other, and fear that these have gone awry. As he remarked, ‘I happen not to believe in the trickle-down theory. I fear we are in the process of creating a stratified society.’

    Here, he was prescient. Over the past four years, according to a recent report, the median weekly income for European families increased to $580, while that for Maori families fell to $460, and for Pacific families to $390. Not just a stratified society, but one ranked by ethnic background.

    She outlines some European and Maori traditional cultural values and ideas, which are a mix of complementary and conflicting ideals (the hierarchic, fragmenting and marginalising order of things, and the more egalitarian and inclusive order of relations, following Foucault).

    Genuine differences do exist between Maori and Pakeha, men and women, Left and Right – but so do networks of interlocking relations, shared values and mutual dependency. Rather than excluding the middle ground, the challenge is to get the networks of relations across it working in ways that are mutually positive and creative, not hostile and destructive. This, I think, is the task that Sir Paul set himself, and why his life mattered so much to us all.
    ….

    Who knows how philosophical shifts occur? When Rogernomics was launched in the mid 1980s,…
    As selves were split from others and nature from culture, the idea of the autonomous individual pursuing his or her own rights and interests without constraint, was reframed as a virtue. Because New Zealand has few checks and balances, it was possible for a relatively small number of people to drive this idea beyond its reasonable limits, as Sir Paul argued at the time.

    As a result, over the past thirty years much of our collective life has been re-shaped in the image of the market, with citizens defined as cost-benefit calculating customers, required to buy and sell even the most basic of their needs – education, health, personal safety and security in old age, for example. As in the case of many finance companies, values such as truth, justice, integrity and generosity have been set aside.

    As a template for running for a small, intimate society, this kind of logic is remarkably ruthless. It is also non-adaptive, cutting across our key advantages as a species. As Homo sapiens, we are social animals, able to think and communicate through language, forge strategies and combine our efforts to achieve them. Our offspring have a long, vulnerable period while they learn these capacities, during which they have to be protected.

    Dame Anne argues, with reference to statistics and current issues in education and politics, that the way forward is to draw on some cooperative traditions from Europe (the order of relations) and Maori (and Asian) approaches to community in order to develop some innovative ways of responding to current problems.

    In this context, old, arrogant, unilateral habits of decision-making are bound to backfire – whether over charter schools or class sizes. Collaborative processes for forging strategies and policies, such as those used by the Land and Water Forum, for example, are much more likely to succeed. With so many lives and the future of the country at stake, surely such an experiment is worthwhile.

    To give another example, one dear to Sir Paul’s heart, inter-ethnic relations on the old hierarchical, bi-polar model are also changing. Rather than seeing Maori and Pakeha, or Maori and Pasifika, or for that matter, Kiwi and Asian as binary opposites with some kind of Berlin Wall between them, these are increasingly understood as linked across the middle ground – the pae.

    In a philosophy based on whakapapa, for example, there is no need to regard oneself as purely Maori, or Pakeha, or Pasifika, or Asian. Rather, an individual is made up of all the relationships in which they participate, with their different taha or ‘sides’ turning from one network to another. One can see how readily such a person can adapt to the diverse, rapidly changing world in which we dwell

    But it’s worth taking the time to read the whole lecture. But this idea of a network of relations and collaborative, non-hierarchical ways of working with diverse groups of people, is one close to my heart.

    • Bill 6.1

      …an individual is made up of all the relationships in which they participate, with their different taha or ‘sides’ turning from one network to another

      Rather than ‘network’, I tend to view this in terms of societies. What I mean by that is that it’s a nonsense to consider NZ as a society. No person belongs to a single society. We all are a part of numerous societies that often overlap and that are connected by various ‘degrees of separation’.

      Once that is understood, then it becomes clear why our current mode of governance – remote authority seeking to legislate or educate or whatever, on a simplistic and mistaken idea of society as some monolithic or homogenous whole – results in an ever growing, unsatisfying morass that’s forever in need of ‘refinement’.

      There is a dominant strain of values contained within the more powerful or dominant expression of culture in NZ (ie, once rooted in Christianity and now largely reduced to so called market values). And to the degree that your cultural identity departs from the mores that inform the governance of so-called ‘NZ society’, the greater the potential for that governance to be inimical, irrelevent or unjust (disempowering) from your cultural perspective.

      It’s not in any way controversial to hold that societies need to be able to govern themselves. But the radical situation we find ourselves in whereby societies are rendered invisible by a false overarching construct that simply labels itself ‘society’ makes that simple and basic need impossible.

    • Draco T Bastard 6.2

      You create serfs by making people dependent upon the few and that’s exactly what’s happening in our society. The rich few are making everyone else dependent upon them – just as they did under feudalism. They’re just using laws instead of swords to enforce that dependency.

    • Bill 6.3

      Now that I’ve read Dame Anne Salmond piece, I’d just say it’s a shame she doesn’t ‘call it’. Seems to me she is almost advocating horizontal or non-heirarchical forms of governance or organising, but can’t take the final necessary step of politically challenging the legitimacy of current heirarchical and centrist approaches.

      And that leaves her trying to square a circle insofar as she’s advocating that current structures persist, but adopt different ways of functioning. I can’t see it myself. They are what they are, and have the influence they have, because of the way they function. And that way of functioning…that defines and maintains their existence… runs smack head-on into how she would rather things fuctioned.

      • Carol 6.3.1

        A very sharp and useful mini-analysis, Bill, pointing to where Salmond falls short.

        Yes, she falls short of taking the strong political position that her argument seems to be heading towards.

        But some good conceptual background to leap from to take a totally new direction in politics.

        Also, while she denounces binaries, there’s a bit of a catch-22 in that the polarities still function in society, relegating the least powerful terms to the bottom of the heap – Maori, low income etc. How do we get from here to a new relational position.

        And I like your use of “societies” over networks. Networks are pretty one-dimensional and linear, and don’t really bring to the fore the dense interaction of multiple relationships that exist in and between societies.

        • Bill 6.3.1.1

          How do we get from here to a new relational position?

          Well, for a start I don’t think NZ as an entity moves to anything. But we are already members of numerous societies. And some of them present open spaces where new forms of governance can be trialed and developed. I’m not talking ‘big cheese’.

          As an example, a ‘Coronation Hall’ near to me is in the throes of attracting community interest and establishing organisational structures for the community facilities it can make available. Traditionally the hall has been run by a typical old style committee and been fairly closed and distant from the community. But now there is an opportunity to introduce more participatory (non-heirarchical) modes of organising and managing. For the sake of argument, lets assume new ways are adopted and succesfully developed.

          In and of itself it’s a ‘nothing’ in the scheme of things. But people will have been introduced to different and more empowering ways of going about things. And if and when those new ways become as habitual and natural to them as the old authoritarian and exclusive ways, then they will naturally introduce some of the facets of the ‘new’ and better ways to other things they are involved in…whether that be the local Pony Club or whatever…and then, hopefully, in time apply it to new business set ups (worker co-ops/collectives) or housing scenarios (housing collectives) .

          In other words, over time and by osmosis, the ‘new’ ways could become the tradition. And the attraction or habit of appealing to or accepting the dictats of remote authority would wane and New Zealand become merely a name that designates a geographical area. And within that geographical area would exist a myriad of self governing, inter-related and highly democratic societies.

        • weka 6.3.1.2

          Also, while she denounces binaries, there’s a bit of a catch-22 in that the polarities still function in society, relegating the least powerful terms to the bottom of the heap – Maori, low income etc. How do we get from here to a new relational position.
           

          Low income… people on benefits for instance could form networks (sorry that word still works best for me) amongst themselves and solidarity with others (low income workers, Maori, Pacifica etc). It’s those relationships that change things. There is a still a need to challenge via the binary opposition IMO, but when that’s the dominant activity and the dominant story, it undermines the Order of Relations that Salmond is talking about. This is why challenging govt is important, but ultimately it’s what communities do within themselves that will generate meaningful and long term change.

          • weka 6.3.1.2.1

            Which is what Bill is saying I think.
             
            You get to the relational way of organising, by practicing being relational.

      • weka 6.3.2

        I’d hazard a guess she isn’t calling it because she doesn’t want to put her foot in her mouth, and because calling it immediately puts us into the binary opposition she is advocating against: old hierarchical model vs new non-hierarchical model.
         
        I think that people engaging in the relational models she talks about will change the structures themselves (assuming the absence of force from those wishing the status quo, which is a big assumption).
         
        It’s a superb piece of writing, one that bears rereading and time for thinking.

  7. Descendant Of Smith 7

    “In the past year, HNZ has sold 15 properties in the city worth more than $700,000, generating $12.8 million.

    A spokeswoman said HNZ had sold the houses as part of its policy to look at getting rid of properties worth more than $700,000 so it could reinvest in cheaper housing.”

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10827509

    No space for state tenants in wealthy suburbs and last I knew John Key was stopping housing developments from going ahead – at least in his own electorate anyway.

    • Draco T Bastard 7.1

      It’s just one more step along the path to gated communities for the rich.

    • bad12 7.2

      That wouldn’t be so bad, it’s pretty oppressive living among those with money, if there was any real evidence that the monies gained from the sales of these properties was actually being used to build more,

      As Glen Innes shows what ‘renewal’ is code word for in the Slippery National Government is to take 150 houses off of those most in need and only make provision to replace half of them,

      As with all of National’s changes in the delivery of social programs ALL of this is done under the auspices of ‘doing better for’, or, ‘helping’ the poor when the reality would give every appearance of being the usual State House sell off to those who are most likely to vote National…

  8. Morrissey 8

    Bizarre news item re U.S. policy about-turn
    National Radio news, Saturday 18 August 2012, 9 a.m.

    Just heard on the news that the U.S. government has condemned the Russian government for the jailing of Pussy Riot. Something about “free speech” and “democracy”. I missed the rest of it because of the gales of laughter and hoots of derision from a couple of my skeptically minded friends.

    Is what I heard correct? Has the United States started to support the cause of free speech and democracy?

    Or is it still, as usual, support for free speech and democracy in other countries?

    • muzza 8.1

      Morrissey, indeed the stories will continue to flow freely from international “news” relay stations here in NZ.

      The continued ramping up of rhetoric against Russia is painfully transparent

      What is stupid little nonsense country the dumbed down have allowed NZ to become.

      America Fcuk yeah!

    • Draco T Bastard 8.2

      My guess is that it’s solely free speech and democracy in other countries.

      Around 40 protesters stood outside New York’s Russian consulate, wearing brightly colored clothing and masks and holding banners that read: “We are all hooligans.”

      Six people were arrested. Among them was Rebekah Schiller, who was wearing a mask. In New York City, it is illegal for more than three people to wear masks without a permit.

  9. Grumpy 9

    Strangely, muzza and Morrissey, I agree with you on this.

    • Morrissey 9.1

      Morrissey, I agree with you on this.

      This is a great moment! (Hugs Grumpy).

    • muzza 9.2

      One dot at a time Grumps, they are interlinked, not the random acts/actions/events most want to believe.

      Slow and steady is the best way, perhaps you get there, perhaps not, just don’t pull a hammy in the process, its not a race eh!

      On ya

  10. bad12 10

    ”Lately one or two have fully paid their due, i’m not working for the clampdown”-The Clash,

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/money/…/accountants-jailed-for-fraud

    7 billion of it year in year out, money that is, gets ripped by the likes of the people in the stuff article, who, having businesses already have the ability to make millions, but, through greed rip the tax system off big-time,

    Its not just some Bene dipping a toe in the trough where that Bene should have had a finger in a different pool, this is systematic THEFT from us all, everyone who pays every week through PAYE is being ripped off by these monied thieves and although this particular little piece of organized theft against the State has been closed down there’s still 7 billion dollars of it going on out there right now,

    So m’bwana Shearer bossmun, in between marveling at how the really poor still have the energy to fight each other over the Mango skinned crumbs off of your table perhaps you might like to consider a little Accountant homily where you make it quite obvious that EVERYONE wearing a suit JUST MIGHT BE AN ACCOUNTANT ripping off the tax system to the tune of 7 billion dollars a year,

    Please m’bwana bossmun Shearer don’t beat me massah boss,i aint done nothing wrong…

  11. Draco T Bastard 11

    It just gets worse and worse for cheap purchasing:

    “Once we get the bugs out of the new locomotives they will be as good as the ones which are nearly due for replacement.”

    And I’m sure that both this government and the management at Kiwirail won’t learn a damn thing.

    • RedLogix 11.1

      I’m reliably informed that 8 of the first 50 DL’s have been cannibalised (temporarily at least) for parts to keep the rest going.

      The Te Rapa workshop is swarming with Chinese techs trying to keep them going. There is no excuse for this whatsoever. There is nothing complicated about a diesel electric loco and they should have been delivered virtually perfect and reliable and a say a modern car from a top-end manufacturer.

  12. BillODrees 12

    A major change has occurred.

    Fran O’Sullivan’s piece is one of a many pieces of evidence that it is now a matter of “WHEN” rather than “IF” Cunliffe takes over the leadership.  

    The sheer stupidity of the briefing to Garner by the faction has shifted the frame in which Cunlffe is viewed. The trite personal shallow stuff that has been repeadly rolled out by most journalists has lost all of its currency.  No journalist will want to be seen to be blindly relaying drivel from the faction. 

    The debate has shifted to genuine policy positioning.  The re-assessment of the last 30 years of economic and social “conventional wisdom” was overdue. Thank you Cunliffe. 

    That the much younger Cunliffe is so much more grounded, skilled and experienced than Shearer has also been glaringly highlighted. Shearers’s gauche and weak handling of the recent issues contrasts dramatically with Cunliffe’s studied calmness and focus under heavy fire.   

    The “WHEN” for Cunliffe and the vast majority of the Labour Membership cannot be thwarted by the faction and the proposed rules.  The membership must make the Caucus respect it’s wishes.  Get your amendments to the proposed rules into HO now. 

  13. bad12 13

    Here was me sailing along in the bubble thinking all was well and i got transported,rudely i might add, by the link on a comment over on CV’s post giving Blubber-boy a tickle,

    I am not sure whether the Pigani comments on Blubber -boy’s blog where deliberately placed there by one of the J. Pigani’s or if Blubber-boy has simply co-opted Her onto it by dint of not having a original thought, other than those provoked by the meds,but, no matter, that particular J.Pigani seems to have found the perfect spiritual home to match Her particular intellect, enough said,

    Time for a bit of light hearted brevity lest you all read the Blubber-boy blog and become despondent, what do you achieve by genetically mixing the genes of a Whale and a Pig,

    The same old Bullshit of course what did you really expect, enlightenment???

    *Here’s the gospel according to J.Pigani, the welfare system is un-affordable, AND, this will not be addressed in any way by focusing our minds upon the 7 billion dollars a year lost to the Government revenue from Tax Fraud,

    Nor it would seem will this supposed unaffordibility of the welfare system be addressed by us focusing our minds upon the appox: 7 billion dollars further lost to the Governments revenue from ‘legal’ tax avoidance, so says J.Pagani in shades of trying to emulate Ruth Richardson,

    This could start getting a little looooong here as i am going to directly quote J.Pagani from Blubber-boys blog, bear with me tho there is a point,

    ”The reason for Labour getting into Government is not to defend welfare-or anything else-against reform”,

    ”It’s so reform can be done our way-fairly-,and, in a way that produces a decent outcome that provides a fulfilling future for everyone”, unquote.

    Now J.Pagani, one or both of them, claims that they won’t comment on The Standard because (a)the J.Pigani’s might receive some abusive replies, and (b), laughably claims that those who disagree with the Post authors get banned for life, (hey where the fucks my life ban),

    In reply i have to do just that, spit a little abuse, Bullshit, Bullshit,absolute f**king Bullshit, to presuppose as one of the J.Pigani’s does that ‘welfare’ is the problem is shortsighted rubbish put forward in my opinion with deliberation by this particular J.Pigani,

    There is in fact nothing wrong with the ‘welfare system’ it is the economic system adhered to by successive Governments both Labour and National which ensures that there WILL NOT be enough employment in the economy so as to employ all those available to work that is at fault,

    The ‘welfare system’ is not at fault one little iota, J.Pigani simply suggests without actually saying so that large numbers of beneficiaries are ‘hiding out’ on benefits thus avoiding work,

    The reality is that the UNAVAILABILITY of work is what makes the numbers of those dependent upon welfare and the number of those AVAILABLE to work has nothing whatsoever to do with the amount of work available,

    If the J.Pigani’s want to ‘reform’ the welfare system they should first ‘reform’ the economic system which fails to provide the required levels of employment, reforming the latter will negate the need to reform the former…

  14. Pascal's bookie 14

    Here’s some serious writing about Wikileaks, just for Overhead:

    http://zunguzungu.wordpress.com/2010/11/29/julian-assange-and-the-computer-conspiracy-%E2%80%9Cto-destroy-this-invisible-government%E2%80%9D/

    Desribes what Assange was actually up to. his strategy if you like. the leaks weren’t ends in and of themselves. It wasn’t about informing people as to what was going on, or at least, not just about that. The informing people was a welcome by-prosuct of the tactic od leaking secrets, and the leaking of secrets was a strategic move aimed at secrecy itself.

    • Pascal's bookie 14.1

      You should actually read this link Overhead. When the post first appeared Wikileaks linked to it repeatedly, saying that it nicely got some of what they were up to. the blogger followed up with more posts, all based on Assange’s essays, which I’m sure you’ve read.

  15. Jackal 15

    Dame Anne Salmond – Hero of the week

    Dame Anne Salmond’s article is a breath of fresh air of intelligent and professional writing that is all too often missing from our mainstream media…

    • LynW 15.1

      +1 Totally agree. Carol also commented above. Definitely an article to ponder over.

    • Carol 15.2

      A very good contrast Jackal

      – the well-reasoned academic piece from Salmond drawing on research, statistics and an in-depth examination of significant ideas and philosophical traditions.

      – then the superficial reasoning of O’Sullivan’s op ed piece that is more propaganda than analysis – arguing by analogy and association, using loaded adjectives in order to smear Cunliffe with ulterior motives and a red scare tactic.

  16. weka 16

    Thought this might be useful all things considered. Thanks McFlock for posting the link the other day.
     

    128AAllowing sexual activity does not amount to consent in some circumstances

    (1) A person does not consent to sexual activity just because he or she does not protest or offer physical resistance to the activity.
    (2) A person does not consent to sexual activity if he or she allows the activity because of—

    (a) force applied to him or her or some other person; or

    (b) the threat (express or implied) of the application of force to him or her or some other person; or

    (c) the fear of the application of force to him or her or some other person.

    (3) A person does not consent to sexual activity if the activity occurs while he or she is asleep or unconscious.
    (4) A person does not consent to sexual activity if the activity occurs while he or she is so affected by alcohol or some other drug that he or she cannot consent or refuse to consent to the activity.
    (5) A person does not consent to sexual activity if the activity occurs while he or she is affected by an intellectual, mental, or physical condition or impairment of such a nature and degree that he or she cannot consent or refuse to consent to the activity.
    (6) One person does not consent to sexual activity with another person if he or she allows the sexual activity because he or she is mistaken about who the other person is.
    (7) A person does not consent to an act of sexual activity if he or she allows the act because he or she is mistaken about its nature and quality.
    (8) This section does not limit the circumstances in which a person does not consent to sexual activity.
    (9) For the purposes of this section,—

    allows includes acquiesces in, submits to, participates in, and undertakes
    sexual activity, in relation to a person, means—

    (a) sexual connection with the person; or

    (b) the doing on the person of an indecent act that, without the person’s consent, would be an indecent assault of the person.

    Section 128A: substituted, on 20 May 2005, by section 7 of the Crimes Amendment Act 2005 (2005 No 41).

     

     
     

    http://legislation.govt.nz/act/public/1961/0043/latest/DLM329057.html?search=ts_act%40bill%40regulation%40deemedreg_crimes+act+_resel_25_h&p=1
     

    • bad12 16.1

      Seeing as, should He ever be, wee Julian aint about to go on trial based upon that set of laws what relevance do they have to the debate….

      • McFlock 16.1.1

        Indeed.
                 
        But it is interesting that if the alleged facts are true, then by NZ standard it’s rape. Not “sex”. Not “not as bad as war so it’s not rape”. Not “oh but he did such nice things so it’s not rape”. Not “you’re black propagandists for the US hegemony so it’s not rape”. Not even “you’re just after feminist brownie points so it’s not rape”.
             
        If the alleged facts are true, it’s rape. And people here are being disingenuous when they minimise it.

      • weka 16.1.2

        I didn’t post that because of Assange, I posted it because there appear to be people here on TS who don’t understand what rape is. A legal definition is a good place to start, although of course it doesn’t define rape in and of itself.

        Plus what McFlock said.

  17. bad12 17

    You have to wonder don’t you at the intelligence,(lack of), inherent in the likes of Fran O’Sullivan who in today’s Herald tries to insult Labour’s David Cunliffe with the banner headline ”Cloth Cap Socialist”,

    Round here the cloth cap is worn with honor, the ‘cloth cap Socialist’ is simply one that see’s the solution to the problems of economy as being easily addressed mostly through the simplest of solutions,

    IF, Cunliffe is as O’Sullivan says a ‘cloth cap Socialist’ then He has my support,

    PS: Fran the only reason we doff em, the cloth caps that is, is to get them outta the cross-fire as we Hoick a big one at you….

    • Colonial Viper 17.1

      Interesting writing from O’Sullivan. She says that Shearer has had to stack his frontbench with lightweights unable to land hits on the Key Government, and she says that Cunliffe is damn capable – both professionally and in politics.

      • bad12 17.1.1

        Do you think that O’Sullivan is trying to ‘do balanced journalism’, at one point She seems to be insinuating that Cunliffe is attempting to inflict a cunning charade upon the electorate by appearing to be ‘more left’ than He actually is,

        Pity the Herald cannot find a truly ‘left’ journalist to provide ‘balance’ to the continuous stream of what gives every appearance of being produced from the mind of a schizophrenic that it presently fobs off on us all…

        • Carol 17.1.1.1

          Yes, it’s curious on FOS’s part, that as well as disparaging him by associating a “cloth cap” with a “hidden agenda” to deviously seize power, but she also smears Cunliffe by comparing him with the Chinese politburo, and the disgraced Bo . Yet FOS has a recent record of talking up China as a great place to do business with, and seems to quite like the infamous Bo:

          But as Kevin Lu wrote in a recent article in Foreign Policy magazine headlined “The Chongqing model worked”: “Bo Xilai might be a crook but he was actually pretty good at his job.”

          Just like Bo, Cunliffe is trying to recreate a new left agenda to attract those who have been disadvantaged by the wealth gap.

          Cunliffe has suggested big investment by the Government in industry, citing the NZ Steel plant of the Muldoon Government.

          As with Bo in China, Cunliffe has launched a serious challenge to the prevailing ideology of his party’s political wing.

          On Aug 11 2012, FOS wrote,

          http://www.nzherald.co.nz/fran-osullivan/news/article.cfm?a_id=13&objectid=10826130

          But former Commerce Minister Bo Xilai – who kicked off free trade negotiations between China and New Zealand in 2004 – won’t be present. Bo was sacked from the Politburo this year and faces disciplinary charges. His wife, Gu Kailai, did not contest murder charges this week.

          But when Bo first talked up the FTA, China was still coming to grips with its entrance into the World Trade Organisation. Its growth has since rocketed. As the East Asia Forum recently emphasised, China is now the world’s largest exporter, largest importer, largest holder of foreign reserves and second-largest economy and is in a much more powerful position than was projected at the time of its WTO debut in 2001.

  18. Air New Zealand’s annual report is due out by the end of August and the signs do not look good. Air NZ is just one company dealing with the general malaise of the airline industry. Jet fuel now accounts for 35 percent of airline industry operating costs compared to 15 percent a decade ago. Jet fuel closely maps the price of crude. Petroleum deliveries are at their lowest point since September 2008, with the weakest July demand since 2005 and yet Brent crude prices are still sitting above $US116 per barrel. Oil prices would not have to raise much higher to create a US$5.3billion loss in 2012. The future of the global aviation industry is in big trouble.

    “Being the most innovative airline company does not necessarily make you the most profitable. Air New Zealand announced a 71 percent earning slump in February 2012. As part of it’s recovery plan the company announced it was cutting 441 jobs. The airline blamed a decrease in passenger numbers as well as as fuel costs NZ$173 million more than forecast. This is despite the airline enjoying “a solid performance from the domestic network including benefits from the Rugby World Cup and improved market share on the Tasman” according to Air New Zealand chairman, John Palmer.

    The outgoing chief executive Rob Fyfe says the price of jet fuel has doubled over the last three years and due to the weak global economy it has been difficult to pass on the higher costs to passengers.The inflation adjusted average price of jet fuel was US$3.04 per gallon for the six months to December 31st. Going off jet fuel prices alone it is unlikely the airline will see much of a turn around in profitability for 2012. In the first six months of 2012 the average price barely moved, up US$0.04 to $US3.08.”

    http://www.southernlimitsnz.com/2012/08/running-on-empty-big-airlines-in-big.html

    • Colonial Viper 18.1

      And the slow grinding, energy depletion driven, end of globalisation continues.

  19. Jackal 19

    Paula Bennett should resign

    What a complete fail for a Minister to not even be aware of (or not want to acknowledge) the information provided by her own ministry…

  20. millsy 20

    “Your town does not owe you recreational facilites”

    Actually, yes it does. Its called a ‘social contract’. The provision of community assets such as parks, sportsfields and libaries are provided in return for payment of rates and various other charges by the community.

    Those who say ‘the world does not owe you a living’ completely disregard the social contract.

  21. Not wanting to draw more fire, as an FYI,  an exemplar of the complexity of dealing with laws in another country and language, and the complexity of dealing with human relationships…

    On 18 November 2010, prosecutor Marianne Ny asked the local district court for a warrant for the arrest of Assange in order for him to be interviewed by the prosecutor. As he was now living in England, the court ordered him detained (häktad) in absentia. On appeal, the Svea Court of Appeal upheld the warrant on suspicion of olaga tvång (duress/unlawful coercion), and two cases of sexuellt ofredande, which has been variously translated as “sexual molestation”, “sexual assault”, “sexual misconduct”, “sexual annoyance”, “sexual unfreedom”, “sexual misdemeanour”, and “sexual harassment”.
    Wikipedia : Assange v Swedish Prosecution Authority

     

    • McFlock 21.1

      Indeed. 
      But irrelevant, unless the translation from the Swedish for “asleep” could equally be “awake and willing”. 

      • William Joyce 21.1.1

        Again you argue from the charges back to the events. What Swedish laws say and means is more complex. You said yourself that you don’t speak Swedish. So here it is. For English speakers on the other side of the planet the actual charges have more nuance that the emphatic English language charges.
         
        It also ignores the complex nature of gender politics in Sweden in which  the sexual offence legislation being written. The prosecutor herself is of the opinion that a man/offender should be locked up first and questions asked later.
         
        Brita Sundberg-Weitman, a Swedish lawyer, professor, retired judge and distinguished jurist, spoke of Sweden’s gender politics and the Assange case…..

        “It is a fact that people like Marianne Ny and Claes Borgström have worked in cooperation on different issues in efforts to produce our new, more stringent sexual offence laws. It is a fact that Marianne Ny was one of the experts for the recent law reform committee which published a report in 2010 recommending even more harsh sexual offence legislation. It is a fact that Marianne Ny approved the contents of that report which concluded that, unlike the law of England and Wales, Swedish rape law is not based upon lack of consent and which specifically rejects any recommendation that Swedish law be amended to adopt the English law approach where rape is based on consent”
        “…Ms Ny .. is known to have said that when a woman says she has been assaulted by a man, the man ought to be detained because it is not until he is in prison that the woman may have the peace to consider whether or not she has been mistreated. Ms Ny has stated that she believes that imprisoning the man has a positive effect, “even in cases where the perpetrator is prosecuted but not convicted”. It is also informative, in regards to the presumption of innocence, that she uses the term ’perpetrator’ rather than ’defendant’ or ’suspect’ in discussing criminal investigation in rape cases.”
        Swedish Gender Politics and the Assange case

         

        • McFlock 21.1.1.1

          I’m happy to leave the interpretation of Swedish law up to the Swedish courts.
                 
          I’m also happy with the concept that if he returns to Sweden, Assange should be detained in custody until the trial is completed. He is after all a repeated flight risk.
             
          I’m also happy with the concept that the allegations against him are serious enough to be considered crimes here (as opposed to homosexuality, adultery, unprotected sex being illegal, etc).
                     
          So what’ your point? 

          • Colonial Viper 21.1.1.1.1

            He is after all a repeated flight risk.

            Sure. As long as you aren’t counting the time he left Sweden with the full knowledge and permission of the Swedish authorities.

            • McFlock 21.1.1.1.1.1

              “Permission”? Being told that they have no power to detain you is not the same as “permission”. 
                             
               

              • Colonial Viper

                If authorities replied “yes you may leave the country” then that’s permission. They certainly didn’t ask him to stay, did they. And, authorities were fully informed of Assange’s intentions to go. He didn’t leave the country hidden in a car boot did he?

                Which is why the event should not be included in any assessment of his flight risk.

                edit…man you should explain why you really have it in for this guy just so bad.

                • McFlock

                  You can only give “permission” if you have the power to prevent something happening.
                           
                  I don’t have it in for him. I just think he’s used every possible means to avoid a sexual assault investigation. 

                  • Colonial Viper

                    You can only give “permission” if you have the power to prevent something happening.

                    Assange was told by Swedish authorities that he was allowed to leave the country. If you like I can reword the sentence in the negative. Assange was told by Swedish authorities that there was no need for him to remain in Sweden.

                    Happier?

                    Regardless, given that Assange voluntarily stayed in Sweden for a full 2 weeks after investigations against him were reopened, then was told he was free to go, after which he left with the full knowledge of authorities, the event should not be counted against him as a flight risk.

                    Breaking his UK bail conditions certainly counts, but not that.

                    • McFlock

                      Assange was told by Swedish authorities that he was allowed to leave the country. If you like I can reword the sentence in the negative. Assange was told by Swedish authorities that there was no need for him to remain in Sweden.

                         
                      Option 3: We can’t stop you leaving. And of course the Swedish prosecutors were trying to arrange another interview via the same lawyer who had asked if they could stop him leaving the country.
                         
                      But the point is strictly whether he’s a “serial done it before flight from detention” or simply a “done it before flight from detention”. Either ay, if he goes back to Sweden I’m cool with him being detained while on trial, if only to stop him fleeing the justice system again.

                    • Colonial Viper

                      You sure you don’t have it in for Assange?

                    • McFlock

                      never met the guy. 
                                  
                      But given his track record, I’m cool with him being held in custody until the end of the process. If he actually ends up in Sweden again.

                    • Pascal's bookie

                      If you are trying to work out if he’s a flight risk, then whether or not he had ‘permission’ is a bit beside the point.

                      The fact remains that he was under investigation, knew he was under investigation, and left the country and refused to return.

                      It’s certainly reasonable to assume from the fact that he didn’t return, that he left in order to avoid the investigation. Do you have another theory as to why he left sweden? If he did leave Sweden because of the investigation, then that is evidence for him being a flight risk. ‘Permission’ or not.

          • William Joyce 21.1.1.1.2

            I agree with you all points except the last one. As the charges are written they do in fact constitute crimes here. No disagreement there. My point is that what is interpret as a sexual crime is harsher in Sweden and so a regular action that happens in the tumble of a sexual encounter can be written up in such damning terms that someone else would think “shit”.
             
            So I guess my point is that :
            Yes, as they are written the charges would also be a crime in NZ
            BUT even though the charges sound so damning, the actions that would warrant such a charge in Sweden, may not do so here.
            Of course, “sticking it in while she is asleep” sounds so serious (and it may well be if that is what happened) but given the state of the gender politics behind harsh Swedish laws its as Lord Cooke famously said, “In law, context is everything” Lord Cooke of Thorndon.
             
            The reason I am continuing to debate is the ridiculous assertions of Weka and the continued emphatic assertions that there is an equivalence between the Swedish charges and what we would be charged with here. There isn’t.

            • McFlock 21.1.1.1.2.1

              How are the “harsh” Swedish charges more severe than NZ or UK rape charges?
                    

              • Have you not been paying attention?

                • McFlock

                  “My point is that what is interpret as a sexual crime is harsher in Sweden and so a regular action that happens in the tumble of a sexual encounter can be written up in such damning terms that someone else would think “shit”.”
                         
                  I just thought that you must have mistyped, given that the allegations if true would constitute sexual assault and rape  here and in the UK. Sweden – that’s what the Svea is for.

        • William Joyce 21.1.1.2

          Also see Professor of English Law at the University of Oxford Andrew Ashworth making comparisons between Swedish law and English law.

          http://justice4assange.com/Allegations.html
           
          The charges in the EAW do not allow for discussion of whether Assange had mens rea (guilty intent) and whether he had a reasonable expectation that he had consent.
          The charges, which appear damning, also hinge on such things as a definition of what constitutes “force” – what actions are “force” and what degree of “force” needs to be applied. Next time be careful when you part you partner’s legs because in Sweden the laws are are more strict about what constitutes force.
          These are all things that will be discussed in court and not dealt with in the EAW.

          • McFlock 21.1.1.2.1

            So what’s your point? 
                 
             

            • William Joyce 21.1.1.2.1.1

              Well, if you haven’t got it by now…..

              *He withdraws from the battlefield to pour the first of what promises to be a number of glasses of wine*

              *Turns the TV up to drown out the screams in suburbia as his beloved country is driven into the abyss*

              • McFlock

                Yeah, whatever dude. You seem to be arguing that we wouldn’t necessarily regard the actions as rape, and that it’s persecution by feminist extremists.
                     
                Whereas Morrissey thinks it’s all the fault of the CIA.

                • Morrissey

                  Whereas Morrissey thinks it’s all the fault of the CIA.

                  No I don’t. That’s another dishonest statement from you.

                  • McFlock

                    ooo I must be a black propagandist…

                    • Pascal's bookie

                      You could always play the Chompsky card.

                      Just link to him mentioning propaganda in any context, and that’s it.

                      Link to Chompsky–> point proven.

                      Doesn’t matter what the point is at all. Just link–>win.

  22. Fisiani 22

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=10827742

    So the only question is when will Cunliffe make his move or will he be beaten to the punch by the evem more arrogant and lazy Grant Robertson

  23. Vicky32 23

    Having briefly seen the beginnings of a discussion about Pussy Riot on Friday’s Open Mike, I when read this –
    http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article32225.htm
     
    Very interesting!

Important links

Recent Comments

Recent Posts

  • New national secretary announced
    The PSA is pleased to announce the appointment of Erin Polaczuk to the role of national secretary.   Erin joins...
    PSA | 17-09
  • The Average Kiwi’s Final Say on Election 2014
    The one thing I have definitely learned over the last few weeks has been how stubborn, and how gullible many New Zealand voters are.  Something else I have learned is how much influence many voters who can barely even speak...
    An average kiwi | 17-09
  • Tim Cook denies ‘rumours’ of NSA back-door into Apple servers
    This 3 minute excerpt of Apple’s CEO Tim Cook talking to Charlie Rose yesterday interested me for a couple of reasons 1) encrypted iMessages with Apple keyless and 2) his very strong denial of rumours/suggestions of NSA back-door access …...
    The Paepae | 17-09
  • Poll of Polls update – 17 September 2014
    Two new polls out today – this afternoon’s Roy Morgan, and this evening’s 3News Reid Research poll. In the Roy Morgan poll, National rise to 46.5% (up 1.5%), while Labour slumps 2% to 24%, and the Greens drop an even...
    Occasionally erudite | 17-09
  • Katie’s banking on winning
    Finding phones and seats for everyone, training new volunteers, distributing lists of names and numbers – and feeding a small army of phone canvassers. That’s been Katie Anderson’s life three evenings a week since May. ...
    Labour campaign | 17-09
  • Join The People’s Climate March, Sunday 21 Sept: Auckland and Nelson
    Whatever the outcome of Saturday’s General Election, urgent action will still be needed to halt and reverse the growth in greenhouse gas emissions and sharply reduce the risk of runaway climate change. As part of a global Day of Action...
    Coal Action | 17-09
  • Good sports Darlene and Gwendoline sign up to Young Labour
    One minute they were in McDonalds, the next Darlene Tusani and Gwendoline Foliga were signing up as the newest members of Young Labour – and getting photobombed by David Cunliffe....
    Labour campaign | 17-09
  • Brief Winston Peters predictions for the record
    If he’s returned to Parliament and holds the balance of power after the election, Winston Peters: Will not support a Labour/Greens government Will not sit on the cross-benches Will be a senior Minister in a National government Will not deliver...
    DimPost | 17-09
  • Brief Winston Peters predictions for the record
    If he’s returned to Parliament and holds the balance of power after the election, Winston Peters: Will not support a Labour/Greens government Will not sit on the cross-benches Will be a senior Minister in a National government Will not deliver...
    DimPost | 17-09
  • Stuart’s 100 #28 Walking to the Supermarket
    28: Walking to the supermarket What if supermarkets cared as much for their walk-up customers? The extent to which the main supermarkets place emphasis on accessing their stores by car is, in a number of locations throughout Auckland and other...
    Transport Blog | 17-09
  • World News Brief, Wednesday September 17
    Top of the AgendaObama to Expand Ebola Efforts...
    Pundit | 17-09
  • Everyone’s a winner, except the fossil fuel industry
    Overnight, while most of us were sleeping (and some of us were trying to soothe a teething baby) two new reports were released. One fills me with hope and the other with dismay. The first, a new report "Better Growth,...
    Greenpeace NZ blog | 17-09
  • A firm prediction about what will happen on September 21
    Imagine, if you will, a scenario on September 21 where the provisional election results deliver a Parliament where National cannot form a majority even with ACT/United Future/Maori Party support, Labour cannot form a majority with Green/Mana-Internet Party support and Colin...
    Pundit | 17-09
  • Climate change: Saving the world might not cost anything
    One of the core assumptions of the climate policy debate has been that stopping climate change will cost us. It might not be very much - a few percent less economic growth over twenty years - but the assumption has...
    No Right Turn | 17-09
  • It’s time we did something about sugar
    I saw this image in the paper: Sheiham, A., & James, W. P. T. (2014). A reappraisal of the quantitative relationship between sugar intake and dental caries: the need for new criteria for developing goals for sugar intake. BMC Public...
    Open Parachute | 17-09
  • It’s time we did something about sugar
    I saw this image in the paper: Sheiham, A., & James, W. P. T. (2014). A reappraisal of the quantitative relationship between sugar intake and dental caries: the need for new criteria for developing goals for sugar intake. BMC Public...
    Open Parachute | 17-09
  • Key admits the GCSB has broken the law
    When on Monday Edward Snowden alleged that New Zealand data was held in the NSA's XKEYSCORE database, and that the GCSB had access to it, Key refused to comment. Now he's come clean and admitted that Snowden "may well be...
    No Right Turn | 17-09
  • 2014 SkS Weekly News Roundup #38A
    $1 Trillion: Annual investment goal puts climate solutions within reach Big firms brace for global carbon price rollout China, the climate and the fate of the planet Climate change report: prevent damage by overhauling global economy Does the new Prime...
    Skeptical Science | 17-09
  • Key declassified secret information in error
    It was unprecedented to see the Prime Minister, John Key, release sensitive information concerning a spying tool called CORTEX simply to bolster his claim that there was no mass surveillance in New Zealand. At the time, some very experienced commentators exclaimed...
    The Jackal | 17-09
  • Politicians not experts on transport – Why trust them to make smart decis...
    Transport has been one of the big dividing lines between the parties in this election. How is a voter supposed to make an informed decision? Given the current state of public information, they can’t. On one hand we have the...
    Gareth’s World | 17-09
  • National plans to cut numbers by 25%
    The National Party has today announced plans to cut all numbers by 25 per cent....
    Imperator Fish | 17-09
  • The Pullman Hotel – Pulled into line?
    Greetings from Barcelona, where I’m currently winding up a 3 week European holiday that has also taken me to Amsterdam, Paris, and Porto. But my thoughts on those cities will have to wait for another day, because right now I want to engage in some bloated,...
    Transport Blog | 17-09
  • Taking a stand against dirty politics
    A month ago, Nicky Hager published Dirty Politics, and set this election on fire. Today, over 2,100 people took a stand against the dirty politics he revealed, through a crowdfunded full-page ad in the Herald (Image stolen from @DirtyPoliticsNZ) Collectively,...
    No Right Turn | 17-09
  • Revealed: Which parties will do the most to reduce New Zealand’s growing ...
    The Equality Network, a group of New Zealand organisations dedicated to reducing inequality, is today releasing a rating of political parties and their policies on tackling income gaps The ratings reveal the Greens out in front, with a rating of...
    Closing the Gap | 16-09
  • New Fisk
    Islamic State: Assad lures Obama into his web...
    No Right Turn | 16-09
  • Fiji votes
    Fijians are heading to the polls today in the first elections since the 2006 coup. Good - Fiji deserves an elected government, not an unelected dictator. But the dictator is fighting hard to stop it. There's the weird ballot paper...
    No Right Turn | 16-09
  • John Key’s Top 69 Lies: Today no. 3 – GCSB mass surveillance would take...
     John Key defends the GCSB bill  “If GCSB this afternoon, were to decide they’re going to listen to every phone call, and read every txt message in New Zealand, do you know how many people that would take? A hundred...
    Arch Rival | 16-09
  • Hard News: Interview: Glenn Greenwald
    I was offered an interview with Glenn Greenwald yesterday in the wake of his appearance at the Moment of Truth event. What follows is the transcript of that interview. It covers both the specifics of what he reported at the...
    Public Address | 16-09
  • Great family policy from the Greens
    I’m not just saying this because I suggested exactly this policy three months ago on Twitter, though it is always satisfying to see great minds thinking alike! The Greens’ Welcome Pack for newborn babies is modelled on Finnish baby boxes...
    Boots Theory | 16-09
  • Sell your house privately in New Zealand – the book.
    Over at 200 Square we help people sell their house by using the latest internet tools, and avoiding expensive print and high agent overheads like fancy offices. Our licensed real estate agents  to the wheeling and dealing for clients, and are very...
    Lance Wiggs | 16-09
  • Population-weighted densities in New Zealand and Australia
    Urban population density is a hot topic – some people complain that it’s getting too high in Auckland, while others worry that it’s too low to get the urban outcomes we want. Either way, density matters – it can have...
    Transport Blog | 16-09
  • Access: Disability: Election Promises for the 24%
    In the latest census 24% of the population were identified as disabled, that is 1.1 million people New Zealanders. Many of those are older people with physical impairments, but for young people learning disability is the most common. Then there...
    Public Address | 16-09
  • Speaker: The plan against the rebuild
    There is a great deal of ruin in a city, to paraphrase Adam Smith’s calm reply to those heralding the doom of Britain after the battle of Saratoga. In other words, it takes a lot to really wreck either a...
    Public Address | 16-09
  • A conspiracy theory too far
    Just over a month ago, the Prime Minister of New Zealand claimed that an award-winning writer was nothing more than a "screaming left-wing conspiracy theorist" and in so doing hoped to dismiss all his exceptional work that documents the National...
    The Jackal | 16-09
  • Attack! Attack!! Attack!!!!
    We’ve had several weeks now since the release of Dirty Politics and just as we thought it might be dying down as our lords and masters in the mainstream media decided followed National’s argument and moved on to reporting about...
    My Thinks | 16-09
  • TPPA a Sellout to American Corporate Greed
    Press Release – Internet MANA New Zealand will become a permanent prisoner to the United States greed and global arrogance if the Trans-Pacific Partnership Agreement (TPPA) isnt stopped, warns Internet MANA.MEDIA RELEASESeptember 17, 2014 TPPA a Sellout to American Corporate...
    Its our future | 16-09
  • 2014 Party Gender Balance
    Out of interest I have looked at each party's list rankings and worked the ratio and percentage of women who would be elected if they got the best possible vote. I compared the parties on the so called 'left' and...
    Local Bodies | 16-09
  • Katherine Rich – resign!
    . I reprint the following from the Herald, in full, as I believe it tells the story better than I could;  . I don’t usually write columns about politics but I’m going to talk about smear campaigns and conflict because...
    Frankly Speaking | 16-09
  • Katherine Rich – resign!
    . I reprint the following from the Herald, in full, as I believe it tells the story better than I could;  . I don’t usually write columns about politics but I’m going to talk about smear campaigns and conflict because...
    Frankly Speaking | 16-09
  • Gordon Campbell on first time voting (centre right)
    For the next two days, I’m turning my column over to two guest columnists who are first time voters. I’ve asked them to explain why they were voting, for whom and what role they thought their parental upbringing had played...
    Gordon Campbell | 16-09
  • It’s time for Key to go!
    Key – it’s time to resign! .   .   John Key is no longer fit to lead this country. Sign the petition. Tell him it’s time to go! Sign Here . . = fs =Filed under: The Body Politic...
    Frankly Speaking | 16-09
  • It’s time for Key to go!
    Key – it’s time to resign! .   .   John Key is no longer fit to lead this country. Sign the petition. Tell him it’s time to go! Sign Here . . = fs =Filed under: The Body Politic...
    Frankly Speaking | 16-09
  • Think of these things: whence you came; where you are going; and to whom yo...
    I gave the ODT my thoughts on "The Moment of Truth" event last night - the tl;dr of which is that there are some important questions about the issue of data collection and surveillance to be addressed, but that the...
    Pundit | 16-09
  • Political joke of the week…
    . NEWSFLASH: Dotcom email almost certainly a fake, says handwriting expert hired by the National party!   . . = fs =Filed under: On A Lighter Note, The Body Politic Tagged: Dear Leader lies through his teeth, GCSB, Hollywood, Kim...
    Frankly Speaking | 16-09
  • Political joke of the week…
    . NEWSFLASH: Dotcom email almost certainly a fake, says handwriting expert hired by the National party!   . . = fs =Filed under: On A Lighter Note, The Body Politic Tagged: Dear Leader lies through his teeth, GCSB, Hollywood, Kim...
    Frankly Speaking | 16-09
  • Certain Arctic lakes store more greenhouse gases than they release
    This is a re-post of an NSF press release New research, supported by the National Science Foundation (NSF), counters a widely-held scientific view that thawing permafrost uniformly accelerates atmospheric warming, indicating instead that certain Arctic lakes store more greenhouse gases...
    Skeptical Science | 16-09
  • A Working Majority
    Constitutional Guardian: Only the person who can assure the Governor-General Sir Jerry Mateparae, that he or she commands a majority on the floor of the House of Representatives has the right to assume the office of Prime Minister. If John...
    Bowalley Road | 16-09
  • Stuart’s 100 #27 Civic Uses for a Civic Asset
    27: Civic Uses for a Civic Asset What if we found better uses for the old Beach Road Rail Station? Continuing the series on forgotten and under-utilised spaces in the city, some of them, like the former Beach Road Railway...
    Transport Blog | 16-09
  • A Matter of Simple Logic
    One of the few journalists to do his job properly over the course of the dirty politics scandal has been Guyon Espiner. He has, without in any way breaching his duty of impartiality, seen it as his responsibility on Morning...
    Bryan Gould | 16-09
  • Eminem Publishers Sue New Zealand National Party
    Ha! Those of us who thought, Gee, that sounds pretty close to Eminem … Will the real Slim Shady please stand up? - P h/t: Radio NZ’s Chris Bramwell...
    The Paepae | 16-09
  • Aussie Liberals embroiled in Key campaign
    John Key needs to explain why Australia’s Liberal Party is interfering in New Zealand domestic politics and is encouraging Kiwi voters across the ditch to vote for National just days out from the election, Labour’s campaign spokesperson Annette King says....
    Labour | 17-09
  • The MANA Plan for Beneficiaries and Income in Waiariki
    Median Personal Income for Waiariki is $21,700. Over 13,000 Maori who live in Waiariki rely upon a form of government benefit including the Unemployment Benefit, Sickness Benefit, Domestic Purpose Benefit and the Invalids Benefit. “If you’re lucky enough to have...
    Mana | 16-09
  • Māori development crucial to New Zealand’s future
    Labour recognises the concern of Māori about child poverty and the rising costs of living, and in Government will make a real difference to the wellbeing of whānau and iwi, Labour’s Māori Affairs spokesperson Nanaia Mahuta says. “As our Māori...
    Labour | 16-09
  • MAORI PARTY – DON’T COMPLAIN … WALK
    “If the Maori Party are serious about stopping government spying on NZ citizens then they should tell the Prime Minister to either stop doing it or they will walk away” said MANA leader and Tai Tokerau MP Hone Harawira, on...
    Mana | 16-09
  • JOHN KEY SUPPORTING LABOUR
    “There is something really sick about a National Party Prime Minister coming out in support of a Labour candidate” said MANA leader and Tai Tokerau MP, Hone Harawira, after hearing that John Key is urging voters to back Labour in...
    Mana | 16-09
  • SHUT DOWN THIS GOVT NOT KAITI WINZ – Nikora
    “I’m going to make it as hard for you to get help as I can” is Paula Bennett’s message to the people of Kaiti  said MANA candidate Te Hāmua Nikora today in response to the news that National will close...
    Mana | 16-09
  • Winegums make for better polling – Harawira
    I wanted to laugh when I saw the Native Affairs poll the other night (Hone Harawira 38%, Kelvin Davis 37%) because it was almost the same as the one they did back in 2011”, said MANA leader and Tai Tokerau...
    Mana | 16-09
  • The Leadership of MTS Lied – Harawira
    “Normally I’m happy to tell people that I was right but when I received the news about the staff cuts at Maori Television, I had nothing but sympathy for the three Maori media leaders who are going to be made...
    Mana | 16-09
  • Privileges Complaint Laid against Prime Minister – Harawira
    MANA Movement Leader and Te Tai Tokerau MP Hone Harawira has today lodged a Privileges Complaint with the Speaker regarding the Prime Ministers denials in parliament that he knew anything about Kim Dotcom before 2012. “Information made public today appears...
    Mana | 15-09
  • Sharples’ new appointments are out of order
    The new appointments to the Waitangi Tribunal announced by Dr Pita Sharples this morning are completely out of order given the election is just five days away, says Labour's State Services spokesperson, Maryan Street. “This Government continues to show disdain...
    Labour | 15-09
  • MANA Movement Housing Policy
    “When families are living in cars, garages, cockroach-infested caravans and three families to a house then we have a housing crisis”, said MANA leader and MP for Te Tai Tokerau, Hone Harawira. “When you have a housing crisis for low-income...
    Mana | 15-09
  • Bigger than the Foreshore and Seabed – Sykes
    “Over the past week I have received some disturbing information that has led myself and a number of Maori lawyers to conclude that this National - Maori Party - ACT and United Future Government are going to put an end to both...
    Mana | 14-09
  • MANA wants Te Reo Māori petition fulfilled
    Hone Harawira, MANA Leader and MP for Te Tai Tokerau Annette Sykes, MANA candidate for Waiariki Te Hāmua Nikora, MANA candidate for Ikaroa Rāwhiti  “More than four decades have passed and the petition calling for Te Reo Māori in schools...
    Mana | 14-09
  • Primary focus on the critical issues
    A Labour Government will prioritise New Zealand’s agricultural sectors by recreating a Rural Affairs Minister and appointing a Primary Industry Council and a Chief Agricultural Adviser. Releasing Labour’s Primary Sector and Rural Affairs policies today, spokesperson Damien O’Connor says the...
    Labour | 12-09
  • Maori Television fears confirmed – Harawira
    ...
    Mana | 12-09
  • More ghost houses from National
    The Government’s desperate pre-election announcement of more ghost houses won’t fool Aucklanders wanting action on the housing crisis, says Labour’s Housing spokesperson Phil Twyford. “These are ghost houses, to go with National’s ghost tax cut. Families cannot live in ghost...
    Labour | 12-09
  • National bows to union pressure over travel time
    National has reluctantly bowed to pressure from unions and adopted Labour’s fair and sensible policy to pay home support workers for the time they spend traveling between clients, Labour’s Associate Health spokesperson Iain Lees-Galloway says. “This decision is long overdue...
    Labour | 12-09
  • Predators on Poverty – Harawira
    “As poverty has ballooned out of control, the Predators on Poverty have emerged to suck the lifeblood from whole families and communities” said MANA Movement leader and Tai Tokerau MP, Hone Harawira. “They are deliberately targeting low-income areas, particularly those...
    Mana | 11-09
  • MANA Movement Policy Launch
    Predators on Poverty (pokie machines, alcohol outlets and loan sharks) 1pm, Thursday 11th September Corner Great South Road and Criterion Street Otahuhu Shopping Centre...
    Mana | 10-09
  • Eliminating Poverty – Sir Edmund Hillary Collegiate, Otara | Internet MAN...
    A campaign to Eliminate Poverty, Feed the Kids, build more houses, and create thousands of new jobs, was outlined by Internet MANA at a public meeting in Otara this evening. When MANA and the Internet Party first sat down to...
    Mana | 09-09
  • Housing in Waiariki – Sykes
    Fact:  Under this National-Maori Party-ACT-United Future Government 61% of Maori in Waiariki do not own their own home and nearly 70% of Maori rentals in Waiariki pay $200 or more per week. “Maori in Waiariki have low rates of home ownership...
    Mana | 09-09
  • Charter school crisis shows time to axe costly experiment
    Dysfunction from day one at a Northland charter school shows it is time to dump this costly and failed experiment by the National-ACT Government, Labour’s Education spokesperson Chris Hipkins says. “Te Kura Hourua ki Whangaruru received $27,000 in government funding...
    Labour | 08-09
  • Labour will crack down on loan sharks
    A Labour Government will crack down on predatory loan sharks by making it illegal both to charge exorbitant interest rates and to exploit uninformed borrowers, Labour’s Consumer Affairs Spokesperson Carol Beaumont says. Labour today released its Consumer Affairs policy which...
    Labour | 08-09
  • Let’s do the FEED before the weed
    “Last week I put out a very strongly worded email to my colleagues about an online promotion about cannabis law reform” said MANA leader and Tai Tokerau MP, Hone Harawira “and I stand by that criticism today.” My concern was...
    Mana | 08-09
  • TE KAEA and NATIVE AFFAIRS live to fight another day
    “I understand that both the chair of the Board of Maori Television, Georgina Te Heuheu, and new CEO, Paora Maxwell, are now saying that my comments this morning about their plans to cut Te Kaea and Native Affairs, were wrong, and that...
    Mana | 08-09
  • How come the PM only pays 2.8% of his income in tax – Harawira
    “Before John Key talks about the piddling tax cuts he plans for low and middle income families today he needs to explain why he only pays 2.8% of his income on tax while a minimum wage worker pays 28% tax,”...
    Mana | 07-09
  • THE DEATH OF INDEPENDENCE FOR MAORI TV
    “If what I’m hearing is true, tomorrow Maori Television Service (MTS) will dump its news programme, Te Kaea, and staff will lose their jobs” said MANA Leader and MP for Te Tai Tokerau, Hone Harawira “and the Minister of Maori...
    Mana | 07-09
  • Labour recommits to Pike River families
    An incoming Labour-led government will do everything possible to recover the bodies of the Pike River Miners and return them to their families, says Labour Leader David Cunliffe. “This tragedy and its aftermath has left the families of the 29...
    Labour | 06-09
  • Voting has started and still no tax plan or fiscal budget for voters to see
    "Even though voting for the election has already begun, National still refuses to provide any details of its proposed tax cuts. And Bill English admitted this morning that he won’t provide any specifics until after the election", Labour’s Finance spokesperson...
    Labour | 06-09
  • National’s partners’ tax plans cost at least $42 billion
    If National forms the next government its partners’ tax plans will cost the country at least $42 billion, and maybe as much as $50 billion, wreaking havoc with the books, says Labour’s Finance spokesperson David Parker. “National claims to be...
    Labour | 05-09
  • Labour: Providing more opportunities for young Kiwis
    A Labour Government will ensure every young Kiwi under the age of 20 is given the opportunity to be in work, education or training, and plans to develop a conservation apprenticeship scheme to help do that, Labour’s Youth Affairs spokesperson...
    Labour | 04-09
  • Candles out on teachers’ slice of birthday cake
    Today may be Novopay’s second birthday, but there’s little to celebrate, Labour’s Education spokesperson Chris Hipkins says. “Novopay has cost the taxpayer tens of millions of dollars already, and the cost is still climbing....
    Labour | 04-09
  • National’s blatant broadband pork barrelling misses the mark by a country...
    National’s blatant pork-barrelling ICT announcement today should reinforce a growing sceptical electorate’s view that they are all about the gift wrap and not the present, Labour’s ICT spokesperson Clare Curran says. “Instead of addressing the real issues - the woeful...
    Labour | 04-09
  • More evidence of the need to clean up the system
    The latest release of emails and messages between disgraced Minister Judith Collins and blogger Cameron Slater are more evidence of the urgent need to clean up politics, Labour MP Grant Robertson says. "This new evidence confirms a near constant flow...
    Labour | 04-09
  • Labour commits to stable funding for voluntary sector
    A Labour Government will establish long-term funding and streamline contract accountability for community and voluntary groups, says Labour’s spokesperson for the sector Louisa Wall. Announcing Labour’s policy for the community and voluntary sector, she said this would give much greater...
    Labour | 04-09
  • Better trained and skilled workforce under Labour
    Labour is committed to a skilled workforce that benefits businesses as well as their workers, and will increase workplace training to improve productivity and drive innovation, Labour Leader David Cunliffe says. “Labour believes the Government should support New Zealanders into...
    Labour | 03-09
  • Labour will make renting a better option
    Labour will provide greater security of tenure for renters, and build more state and social housing, says Labour’s housing spokesperson Phil Twyford. “Labour believes every kid deserves a decent start in life. That means a warm, dry and secure home....
    Labour | 03-09
  • At least 15 new taxes under National
    John Key is the last person to talk about creating taxes, presiding over a Government that has imposed at least 15 new taxes, Labour Leader David Cunliffe says. “John Key tried a novel line in the debate last night claiming...
    Labour | 03-09
  • Labour will strengthen New Zealand’s democracy
    A Labour Government will act quickly to protect and enhance New Zealand’s reputation as one of the most open and least corrupt countries in the world, Labour Leader David Cunliffe says. “The health of any democracy is improved by greater...
    Labour | 02-09
  • MANA Movement says tax cut on GST must be first priority – Minto
    “If Prime Minister John Key has money available for tax cuts then cutting GST must be the first priority”,  said MANA Movement Economic Justice Spokesperson John Minto. GST is a nasty tax on low-income families”, said Minto. “People in the...
    Mana | 02-09
  • The Maori Party’s Mana-Enhancing Relationship with National – Minto
    “First we had Cameron Slater and David Farrar backing Labour’s Kelvin Davis bid to unseat MANA Movement Leader and MP for Te Tai Tokerau Hone Harawira.  Now we have Slater writing a pro-Te Ururoa Flavell article on his website, Whale...
    Mana | 02-09
  • There’s Only One Poll That Counts
    “One of the oldest sayings in politics is that there is only one poll that counts – the one on Election Day – and that’s the one that I am focusing on” remarked the MANA Movement candidate for Waiariki, Annette...
    Mana | 02-09
  • Local communities critical to Civil Defence
    Labour will focus on empowering New Zealand communities to be resilient in Civil Defence disasters, says Labour’s Civil Defence spokesperson Clare Curran. Announcing Labour’s Civil Defence policy, she says that Labour will work with schools, voluntary agencies and community groups...
    Labour | 02-09
  • Labour looks to long-life passports, gambling harm review
    A return to 10 year passports and a review of gambling laws are highlights of Labour’s Internal Affairs policy released today. “More than 15,000 New Zealanders signed a petition calling on the Government to revert to the 10 year system...
    Labour | 02-09
  • MANA Movement Leadership stands strong behind Internet MANA relationship
    “There is now, and always will be, a range of views about many issues within our movement and members are free to express them, but Georgina’s views on Kim Dotcom are not shared by the MANA Movement leadership or the vast majority...
    Mana | 01-09
  • Rebuilding the New Zealand Defence Force
    A Labour Government will make it a priority to rebuild the capacity of the Defence Force to carry out the tasks expected of it, says Labour’s Defence Spokesperson Phil Goff. Releasing Labour’s Defence Policy today he said the NZDF has...
    Labour | 01-09
  • Speech to Canterbury Chamber of Commerce
    Today I'm going to talk about our policy package to upgrade and grow our economy and how we turn that growth into a foundation for a decent and fair society. But first I want to address the issue of our...
    Labour | 01-09
  • Commission of Inquiry must have bipartisan support
    The Labour Party is drafting terms of reference for a Commission of Inquiry, Labour’s Shadow Attorney-General David Parker says. “It is abundantly clear there is a need for an independent Commission of Inquiry, chaired by a High Court Judge, into...
    Labour | 01-09
  • Rapid Transit to unclog Christchurch
    Labour will build a 21st century Rapid Transit system for Christchurch, says Labour Leader David Cunliffe. “The long delayed recovery of Christchurch hinges on a modern commuter system for the city. “We will invest $100 million in a modern rail plan...
    Labour | 31-08
  • Labour’s commitment to public broadcasting
    A Labour Government will set up a working group to re-establish a public service television station as part of our commitment to ensuring New Zealand has high quality free-to-air local content. “We will set up a working group to report...
    Labour | 31-08
  • Live blog: Bainimarama takes early lead in Fiji’s election
    Pacific Scoop’s Alistar Kata reports from yesterday’s voting. By Alistar Kata of Pacific Scoop in Suva Prime Minister Voreqe Bainimarama took an early lead in provisional results in the Fiji general election last night. With provisional results from 170 out...
    The Daily Blog | 17-09
  • Has The NSA Constructed The Perfect PPP?
    Former intelligence analyst and whistleblower, Edward Snowden – speaking live to those gathered at the Auckland Town Hall on Monday September 17, 2014. Investigation by Selwyn Manning. THE PRIME MINISTER JOHN KEY’s admission on Wednesday that whistleblower Edward Snowden “may...
    The Daily Blog | 17-09
  • No way – Key admits Snowden is right
    After claiming there was no middle ground. After claiming there was no mass surveillance. After calling Glenn Greenwald a henchman and a loser. After all the mainstream media pundits screamed at Kim’s decision to take his evidence to Parliamentary Privileges...
    The Daily Blog | 17-09
  • Bad luck National
    ...
    The Daily Blog | 16-09
  • The incredible changing John Key story on mass spying – why the Moment of...
    While the mainstream media continue to try and make the Moment of Truth about Kim’s last minute decision to prolong his battle against John Key past the election into the Privileges Committee, the reality is that the Moment of Truth...
    The Daily Blog | 16-09
  • GUEST BLOG: Curwen Rolinson – Themes of the Campaign
    There’s one area of a political campaign that just about everyone, at some point, falls afoul of. The campaign song. I’m not sure quite why it is, but it seems to be almost impossible for political parties to come up...
    The Daily Blog | 16-09
  • GUEST BLOG – Denis Tegg – The NSA slides that prove mass surveillance
    The evidence presented by Glenn Greenwald and Edward Snowden on The Intercept of mass surveillance of New Zealanders by the GCSB is undeniable, and can stand on its own. But when you place this fresh evidence in the context of...
    The Daily Blog | 16-09
  • Ukraine, United Kingdom, Ireland, Scotland
    The Ukrainian civil war discomforts me. It seems to me the most dangerous political crisis since the Cuban missile crisis of 1962. And it’s because of our unwillingness to examine the issues in a holistic way. We innately prefer to...
    The Daily Blog | 16-09
  • John Key’s love affair with a straw man – the relationship intensifies
    John Key’s love affair with the straw man is now a fully-committed relationship. It’s now the first love of his life. Sorry Bronagh. Yesterday I pointed to Key’s constant assurances that there is no mass surveillance of New Zealanders by...
    The Daily Blog | 16-09
  • A brief word on why Wendyl Nissen is a hero
    Wendyl Nissen is a hero. The sleazy black ops attack on her by Slater and Odgers on behalf of Grocery Council chief executive Katherine Rich is sick. All Nissen is doing in her column is point out the filth and...
    The Daily Blog | 16-09
  • She saw John Key on TV and decided to vote!
    . . NZ, Wellington, 15 September – ‘Tina’* is 50, a close friend,  and one of the “Missing Million” from the last election. In fact, ‘Tina’ has never voted in her life.  Not once. In ‘Tina’s’ own words, politics has...
    The Daily Blog | 16-09
  • Eminem sues National Party for unlawful use of ‘Lose yourself’ bhahahah...
    …ahahahahahahahaha. Oh Christ this is hilarious… National Party sued over Eminem copyright infringment US rapper Eminem is suing the National Party for allegedly breaching copyright by using his song Lose Yourself in its campaign advertisements. The Detroit-based publishers of Eminem’s...
    The Daily Blog | 16-09
  • Are the Greens about to be snookered by a Labour-NZ First Government?
    I wrote last week that it was smart politics that the Greens pointed out they could work with National, the soft blue vote that’s looking for a home in the wake of Dirty Politics isn’t going to Labour, so the...
    The Daily Blog | 16-09
  • BLOGWATCH: Fonterra join 2Degrees and boycott Whaleoil
    In the wake of Dirty Politics, advertisers are pulling their advertising out of Whaleoil. PaknSave, Evo Cycles Pukekohe, Localist, 2 Degrees, Fertility Associates, iSentia, NZ Breast Cancer Foundation, Maori TV, Bookme.co.nz, Dobetter.co.nz and the Sound are now joined by Fonterra...
    The Daily Blog | 16-09
  • PM Key accused of allowing secret ‘spook’ cable sensors to spy on citiz...
    Pulitzer prize-winning journalist Glenn Greenwald (left) and Kim Dotcom at the “moment of truth” political surveillance meeting in Auckland last night. Image: PMW By ANNA MAJAVU of Pacific Media Watch NEW ZEALAND Prime Minister John Key has been accused of...
    The Daily Blog | 15-09
  • Fiji pre-election ‘politics’ blackout stirs media protests, frustration
    BLACKOUT DAY – Monday, day one of the “silence window” in Fiji leading up to the close of polling in the general election at 6pm on Wednesday. And this is under the draconian threat of a $10,000 fine or five...
    The Daily Blog | 15-09
  • “Now the work of movements begins”: government corruption, media bias, ...
    I am so tired of the dirty politics of the National government, aren’t you? I am tired of John Key and his pathetic attacks on award-winning journalists who have spent their careers fighting and digging for truth and good. The...
    The Daily Blog | 15-09
  • Moment of Truth review, smoking guns and the awful coverage by the NZ msm
      There were queues unlike any the Town Hall has seen, 1000 were turned away once it became full…     …full to the rafters. The energy and atmosphere within the room was extraordinary, and it begun…   …Glenn Greenwald...
    The Daily Blog | 15-09
  • Why Maori TV’s Te Tai Tokeraou Poll will be proved wrong
    If Hone Harawira had a dollar every time the media wrote off his chance of winning Te Tai Tokeraou, he would have more money than Kim Dotcom. Remember the by-election? Hone was 1 point ahead of Kelvin in an exact...
    The Daily Blog | 15-09
  • September 15 RNZ interviews – and then the Moment of Truth
    . Acknowledgement: Emmerson . 15 September – Leading up to the Moment of Truth public meeting this evening, these Radio NZ interviews are worth listening to; . Alt link . Alt link . Alt link . Alt link . Alt...
    The Daily Blog | 15-09
  • Live Stream: Moment of Truth Tonight 7pm
    Live Video Stream by eCast: The Daily Blog will Live Stream the Moment of Trust public meeting from 7pm. The meeting will feature Glenn Greenwald, Kim Dotcom, Robert Amsterdam, and a very special guest…...
    The Daily Blog | 15-09
  • The proof Key lied about GCSB mass surveillance
    And we start getting to the evidence that proves Key has lied about mass surveillance. The article by Glenn Greenwald is out and it is beyond damning… Documents provided by NSA whistleblower Edward Snowden show that the government worked in...
    The Daily Blog | 15-09
  • A brief word on the Ede-Slater emails
    Every day I have rushed to read the paper to see if a breaking story on the Ede-Slater emails had broken yet. They haven’t. Day after day, where are these emails? We know Rawshark sent the emails to David Fisher...
    The Daily Blog | 15-09
  • The email that proves Key is a liar
    This is the Email proving Key knew about Kim Dotcom before he claims he did… “We had a really good meeting with the Prime Minister. He’s a fan and we’re getting what we came for. Your groundwork in New Zealand...
    The Daily Blog | 15-09
  • Henchmen
    Henchmen...
    The Daily Blog | 14-09
  • Why it simply isn’t credible that Key stepped in and shut down the mass s...
    Key’s staggering admission that yes there was a year long business model by the GCSB to mass spy on all of NZ but  that he stepped in and shut it down after Cabinet had signed it off just sounds like make...
    The Daily Blog | 14-09
  • John Key’s love affair with a straw man
    Politicians like putting up straw men for the purpose of self-righteously knocking them over. Prime Minister John Key has a particular straw man he loves to punch over. He raises it whenever he’s asked about mass surveillance of New Zealanders...
    The Daily Blog | 14-09
  • John Armstrong turns on Glenn Greenwald
    Where does a mediocre journalist like John Armstrong get off attacking a journalist with the credibility of Glenn Greenwald as he has in his ridiculous column today? Armstrong has the audacity to try and play the terrorism card to justify why...
    The Daily Blog | 14-09
  • GUEST BLOG: Denis Tegg – Which of John Key’s many statements on the GC...
    We already have Glenn Greenwald’s assertion on The Nation that John Key has misled New Zealanders as to whether the GCSB has engaged in mass surveillance of Kiwis. But Key has made many other statements about the GCSB’s powers and...
    The Daily Blog | 14-09
  • Election 2014: Numbers and Faces
    Democratic politics is a game of numbers and faces. How can we translate the numbers into the 120 or more faces that will be in the next Parliament? Below is my prediction of a likely result: 120 people, divided by...
    The Daily Blog | 14-09
  • Scotland the brave
    The possibility that Scotland will vote for independence this Thursday has panicked the British establishment. An unholy alliance of Tory, Labour, Liberal and corporate leaders has resorted to fear-mongering and bullying on grand scale in a last ditch effort to...
    The Daily Blog | 14-09
  • Why Key’s denials sound so off and why Dotcom’s fight is all our fight
    The shrillness of Key is the issue. His denials just too forced and rehearsed. Key has gone from Hollow Man to Shallow Man with his lashing out at Pulitzer Price winning Journalist Glenn Greenwald by calling him a ‘henchman’. This...
    The Daily Blog | 14-09
  • Letters to the Editor – Spies, Lies, Five Eyes, and other matters on a S...
    . . Sharing a few thoughts and observations with newspaper editors around the country… . from: Frank Macskasy <fmacskasy@gmail.com>to: Sunday Star Times <letters@star-times.co.nz>date: Sun, Sep 14, 2014 subject: Letter to the Editor . The Editor Sunday Star Times . Our...
    The Daily Blog | 14-09
  • Letters to the Editor – Spies, Lies, Five Eyes, and other matters on a Su...
    . . Sharing a few thoughts and observations with newspaper editors around the country… . from: Frank Macskasy <fmacskasy@gmail.com>to: Sunday Star Times <letters@star-times.co.nz>date: Sun, Sep 14, 2014 subject: Letter to the Editor . The Editor Sunday Star Times . Our...
    The Daily Blog | 14-09
  • As TDB predicted, Labour to use universal super fund to buy back assets and...
    Greens about to be snookered again?   As The Daily Blog has pointed out several times now, Labour will use a universal super fund to buy back NZs assets in a bid to offer Winston a legacy project… Labour plans...
    The Daily Blog | 13-09
  • A lesson in caring for our most vulnerable
    Some of the comments on this article make me sick. Because I am so very much over people who think they are better than others because things have gone their way in life and think those who aren’t as functional...
    The Daily Blog | 13-09
  • GUEST BLOG: Anjum Rahman – Please vote positive
    One of the features of campaigning is the meet-the-candidates event.  As an opportunity to present policies to the voter, they aren’t the best vehicle but still serve a useful purpose.  The problem is that there are too many candidates and...
    The Daily Blog | 13-09
  • For this who don’t vote this election
    For this who don’t vote this election...
    The Daily Blog | 13-09
  • Where does Key get off abusing a Pulitzer prize winning Journalist like Gle...
    We are seeing the Dirty Politics PM today when Key decided the best way to counter the Glenn Greenwald claims of GCSB mass surveillance was to denigrate Greenwald… Prime Minister John Key says he will prove Glenn Greenwald’s claims by the...
    The Daily Blog | 13-09
  • Teflon Man No More
    . .   On 26 August, as Nicky Hager’s expose on New Zealand’s right wing politics hit public consciousness and confirmed our worst fears, I wrote, “Dirty Politics” has achieved more than simply revealing  unwholesome machinations between National party apparatchiks,...
    The Daily Blog | 13-09
  • Dear mainstream media – regarding Key’s promise to resign if GCSB expos...
    Dear Mainstream media. How’s it all going? I would like to acknowledge the deep depression many members of the Press Gallery are going through as their boy Key looks less and less likely to win. I appreciate how a loss...
    The Daily Blog | 13-09
  • It’s official: ACT’s Jamie Whyte is several-sandwiches-and-a-salad sho...
    .   . There aren’t very many times I agree wholeheartedly with our Dear Leader – but on this occassion I believe he spoke for those 99% of New Zealanders for whom common sense is as natural as breathing air....
    The Daily Blog | 13-09
  • ‘I’ll not be intimidated … by cowards’, says Fiji death threat jour...
    Fiji Sun’s Jyoti Pratibha … death threats via fake Facebook profiles. Image: Pacific Scoop THE PARIS-based media freedom advocacy organisation Reporters Sans Frontières and the Pacific Media Centre have condemned threats and intimidation against political reporters this week covering Fiji’s...
    The Daily Blog | 12-09
  • Glenn Greenwald on TV3s ‘The Nation’ – Everyone remember when Key pro...
    Glenn Greenwald has just given his first NZ interview on TV3s ‘The Nation’ and what he had to say was incredibly damaging. Glenn is here for Kim Dotcom’s Moment of Truth on Monday and what he has just had to...
    The Daily Blog | 12-09
  • What will soft National vote do, why Colin Craig will be a focus in final w...
    In what has been the most unpredictable elections of our time, the final week promises more shocks and bombshells than World War One trench warfare. We have the media who still have the Rawshark emails that detail the Ede-Slater exchanges....
    The Daily Blog | 12-09
  • Would a National-Conservative Party reduce rights to an abortion? Legalise ...
    With the possibility of a Conservative-National Party coalition looming, let’s consider the impact of this new hard right religious Government on social policy. We know Conservative Party candidate Edward Saafi, believes the inability to legally bash your kids is responsible for teenage prostitution, teenage pregnancy and...
    The Daily Blog | 12-09
  • ACTs solution to crime – more guns?
    How insane are the ACT Party? Honestly? Their solution to crime is to arm every shop keeper with a sawn off shotgun??? “Criminals are well aware that shopkeepers are defenceless and are taking advantage of this in brutal robberies. What...
    The Daily Blog | 12-09
  • John Key’s gift to teenage girls…
    Yesterday I was at the MANA Movement policy release on “Predators on Poverty” in the Otahuhu Shopping Centre. Successive Labour and National governments have left vulnerable communities on their own to face these merciless thieves who prey on the poor...
    The Daily Blog | 12-09
  • Poverty denial – Where does National get its advice from?
    National is displaying a quite inadequate understanding of their own policies and worrying inability to respond to criticism. When John Key trots out his old, tired example of how ‘work pays’ on Morning Report this week to justify leaving 260,000...
    The Daily Blog | 12-09
  • Education reformers mean well, so what’s the problem?
    The thing about education reformers is that, mostly, they mean well. Whether it’s charter schools, National Standards, Teach First, or another reform, many people involved have good intentions.  They want to improve things, try something new and innovate, they say. The thing...
    The Daily Blog | 12-09
  • Pregnancy Help Welcomes Green Party Packs for Newborn Babies
    Pregnancy Help applauds Metiria Turei acknowledging that “for many parents the birth of a new child is a highly stressful and financially straining time” and the desire for every child to thrive....
    Scoop politics | 17-09
  • McVicar Welcomes ASA Decision
    Napier Conservative Party Candidate Garth McVicar welcomes the Advertising Standards Authority’s decision to not uphold the pamphlet complaint of Robert Johnson, Campaign Manager for Napier Labour candidate Stuart Nash. The ASA acknowledged that one complaint...
    Scoop politics | 17-09
  • Whyte: In 12 months’ time, here is what will matter
    In three days’ time I will be elected along with a number of ACT MPs. I think the media will be surprised and ask how it happened?...
    Scoop politics | 17-09
  • Internet MANA Will Grant Special Residency to Edward Snowden
    Internet MANA will put the case to the new government to welcome global surveillance whistle blower Edward Snowden, granting him safe passage and residency in New Zealand....
    Scoop politics | 17-09
  • Ten millionth traveller uses SmartGate
    The 10 millionth traveller to pass through SmartGate, Customs’ automated passenger processing system, was greeted by Customs Manager Passenger Operations, Peter Lewis today at Auckland International Airport....
    Scoop politics | 17-09
  • Key vs. Cunliffe: Final Live NZ Election Reactor 7pm Tonight
    John Key and David Cunliffe go head to head for the last time tonight and you can decide who wins by driving the worm. This is the last live Election Reactor covering the debate tonight at 7pm on TV One....
    Scoop politics | 17-09
  • Offenders Get Road Safety Message
    Wellington Community Corrections partnered with emergency services, government agencies, organisations and Kapiti Coast District Council to deliver an innovative road safety programme to 70 community-based offenders at Southwards Car Museum on Tuesday 16...
    Scoop politics | 17-09
  • Proposed law to decriminalise Abortion
    http://images.tvnz.co.nz/tvnz_images/news2011/politics_news/12/q_a_interview__list_mp_jan_logie_n2.jpgRight to Life is disappointed that the Green Party is refusing to provide a response to the seven very important questions that have been addressed to Jan Logie, spokesperson...
    Scoop politics | 17-09
  • Election 2014 Will Be Costly
    The Taxpayers’ Union has today released the final update for its ' Bribe-O-Meter ' election costing website in the lead-up to Saturday’s general election. Taxpayers’ Union Executive Director Jordan Williams says:...
    Scoop politics | 17-09
  • Roy Morgan Poll September 17
    John Key set to win narrow election victory on Saturday as Labour/Greens slump puts Winston Peters in powerful position as NZ First surge to 8% Today’s New Zealand Roy Morgan Poll shows National (46.5%, up 1.5%) set to win a...
    Scoop politics | 17-09
  • Wahakura Package would provide warm welcome for babies
    The Greens Wahakura Welcome package announced yesterday is a wonderful example of child-centred policy which would help all children get a fair and equal start in life, says Child Poverty Action Group. CPAG health spokesperson Innes Asher says,...
    Scoop politics | 17-09
  • TPPA a Sellout to American Corporate Greed
    New Zealand will become a permanent prisoner to the United States’ greed and global arrogance if the Trans-Pacific Partnership Agreement (TPPA) isn’t stopped, warns Internet MANA....
    Scoop politics | 17-09
  • Wintry showers and blustery winds for Election Day
    As we head towards the weekend, it is time to look at what the weather will be for New Zealand's "Have Your Say" Day....
    Scoop politics | 17-09
  • New national secretary announced
    The PSA is pleased to announce the appointment of Erin Polaczuk to the role of national secretary....
    Scoop politics | 17-09
  • Public Secotr & TISA: On the cusp of something very special?
    Is the National Party keeping some things out of sight in case they frighten the electorate? Here is some worrying evidence that this may be the case....
    Scoop politics | 17-09
  • MPI ups yacht biosecurity ante
    Yachts arriving in Northland from overseas this season will face greater biosecurity scrutiny, says the Ministry for Primary Industries (MPI)....
    Scoop politics | 17-09
  • iPredict Election Update
    John Key’s National Party now has an 88% probability of leading the next government , most probably with the support of NZ First, according to the combined wisdom of the 8000+ registered traders on New Zealand’s predictions market, iPredict. There...
    Scoop politics | 17-09
  • Crowdfunding to Save Native Fish
    NZ Landcare Trust is offering an exciting project designed to assist native fish, as part of the launch of a new global crowdfunding category called 'The Landcare & Environment Collection.' This exciting step, aims to help raise funds and support,...
    Scoop politics | 17-09
  • New methods needed to reach non-voters
    Non-voters are much heavier users of the internet than those who do vote, while 43 per cent of non-voters say they never read a newspaper according to research released today by the Election Data Consortium....
    Scoop politics | 16-09
  • Parties sent home with report cards
    More than 2000 New Zealanders came together to run a full page ad in the Herald today asking all Parties what they will commit to do to clean up politics. The answers are in, and ActionStation has graded Parties on...
    Scoop politics | 16-09
  • One in 10 Kiwis want Winston Peters to Run the Country -Poll
    New Zealand First leader, Winston Peters has seen his personal popularity reach a three-year high in the final 3News/Reid Research poll ahead of Election Day....
    Scoop politics | 16-09
  • Shut Down This Govt Not Kaiti WINZ
    "I’m going to make it as hard for you to get help as I can" is Paula Bennett’s message to the people of Kaiti said MANA candidate Te Hāmua Nikora today in response to the news that National will close...
    Scoop politics | 16-09
  • New methods needed to reach non-voters
    Non-voters are much heavier users of the internet than those who do vote, while 43 per cent of non-voters say they never read a newspaper according to research released today by the Election Data Consortium....
    Scoop politics | 16-09
  • Conservatives Break Through 5% Threshold
    Reports in today’s Dominion Post that the Conservative Party is polling at 6% in Nationals internal polling are not surprising says the Conservative Napier candidate Garth McVicar....
    Scoop politics | 16-09
  • The MANA Plan for Beneficiaries and Income in Waiariki
    Median Personal Income for Waiariki is $21,700. Over 13,000 Maori who live in Waiariki rely upon a form of government benefit including the Unemployment Benefit, Sickness Benefit, Domestic Purpose Benefit and the Invalids Benefit....
    Scoop politics | 16-09
  • IGIS: No Indiscriminate Interception of NZers’ Data Found
    “As part of my role as Inspector-General, I review whether the GCSB complies with the restrictions upon interception of New Zealanders’ communications and with the requirement to intercept communications only for authorised purposes. That review...
    Scoop politics | 16-09
  • Conservatives Break through 5% Threshold
    Reports in today’s Dominion Post that the Conservative Party is polling at 6% in Nationals internal polling are not surprising says the Conservative Napier candidate Garth McVicar....
    Scoop politics | 16-09
  • Hundreds of Students Turn Out for Political Debate
    With only a few days left before the general election, over 500 Victoria students packed the central Hub space on campus today to listen to a political debate on student issues organised by the Students’ Association. Victoria University of Wellington...
    Scoop politics | 16-09
  • Ex-prisoners make most of mentoring to make most of life
    It’s not every day that an organisation triples a programme in size, but PARS Inc (formerly known as the Prisoners’ Aid and Rehabilitation Society of the Auckland District Inc) has managed to do just that with their Community Mentoring Scheme,...
    Scoop politics | 16-09
  • Unscrupulous worker highlights why 90-days works
    Federated Farmers believes the experience of a husband and wife farming team in Taranaki underscores why the 90-days provision is so important to small businesses. “Yesterday a member called 0800 FARMING to alert us to a guy doing the rounds...
    Scoop politics | 16-09
  • Eye to Eye Uploaded
    Leading Maori broadcaster and political commentator Willie Jackson previews Eye to Eye Uploaded, a multi-platform series of interviews that he’s aiming to put in front of media radars next year....
    Scoop politics | 16-09
  • Party Rankings against Inequality
    Revealed: which party will do the most to reduce New Zealand’s growing inequality crisis...
    Scoop politics | 16-09
  • Maritime Union backs change of Government
    The Maritime Union says a change of Government is required to deliver secure jobs and decent wages for New Zealand workers....
    Scoop politics | 16-09
  • Green Party package for newborns welcomed
    16 September 2014 Media Release The New Zealand College of Midwives has welcomed a policy announced today by the Green Party which would provide a package of essential items for every newborn baby. The College is a non partisan organisation...
    Scoop politics | 16-09
  • ALCP Release Election Manifesto
    The Aotearoa Legalise Cannabis Party has released its manifesto in the lead up to the election on Saturday....
    Scoop politics | 16-09
  • Election Daily Update #9
    John Key’s National Party appears to have received a major boost from last night’s “Moment of Truth” event, according to the combined wisdom of the 8000+ registered traders on New Zealand’s predictions market, iPredict. Despite no major changes...
    Scoop politics | 16-09
  • Eminem Publishers Sue New Zealand National Party
    Detroit-based music publishing companies sue National Party for damages for unauthorised use of song in election campaign advertising...
    Scoop politics | 16-09
  • Parties Back Rethink of WINZ Shared Care Parenting Laws
    Overwhelming Majority of Parties Back Rethink of WINZ Shared Care Parenting Laws. Press release- Fifty Fifty Campaign, 16 September 2014 National is the only political party willing to defend the way WINZ treats separated parents who share their kids...
    Scoop politics | 16-09
  • Parents Smacking Down Prime Minister
    "John Keys failure to deliver on his promise to change the anti-smacking law is costing National votes, and helping the Conservative Party," says Colin Craig....
    Scoop politics | 16-09
  • Political Debate on Family Violence – Video & Audio
    The Dunedin Collaboration Against Family Violence was happy to host a political debate on Family Violence chaired by Professor Nicola Atwool of the University of Otago. Family Violence is a huge problem in our community and we invited representatives...
    Scoop politics | 16-09
  • Greens Take Nanny State To A New Level
    Family First NZ is labelling the Green’s ‘welcome package’ for newborns policy as wasteful and misdirected. “This policy is taking ‘nanny state’ to a new level but indicates just how much the Greens want to intervene in family life,”...
    Scoop politics | 16-09
  • 2,100 people send message about dirty politics
    2,100 people have signed their name to a full-page open letter featuring in the New Zealand Herald this Wednesday. The letter is designed to send a message to politicians that dirty politics is an important election issue....
    Scoop politics | 16-09
  • Are DoC manipulating Rat Numbers?
    Ban 1080 Political Party co-leader Bill Wallace says there are serious rumours DoC has changed their rat counting technique to cover up the lack of the mythical “Rat Plague” claimed by the Department in Kahurangi National Park, and also that...
    Scoop politics | 16-09
  • Average Full time Student Is in Financial Distress
    A new survey has found that nearly half of all full time students are in significant financial distress....
    Scoop politics | 15-09
  • Key and Cunliffe, research revealed by Ancestry.com.au
    Contrasting family histories of John Key and David Cunliffe, revealed by research from Ancestry.com.au....
    Scoop politics | 15-09
  • Revelations a Damning Indictment of Key’s Honesty
    The Prime Minister’s honesty is now central to the election, says Internet Party Leader Laila Harré, following the revelations of whistleblower Edward Snowden that there is mass surveillance of New Zealand citizens by the GCSB....
    Scoop politics | 15-09
  • Organisations Have ‘Duty of Care’ for Players says Law Firm
    Concussion injuries in amateur and professional sporting arenas are currently highly topical. Concussion potentially appears to have been implicit in the recent death of a young player in Northland....
    Scoop politics | 15-09
  • Media Release from Closing the Gap on Health and Housing
    “Inequality is the biggest problem facing New Zealand at the present time” says Peter Malcolm National Secretary of Closing the Gap. It underlies many of our social ills, poverty, lack of trust, an economy that could do much better, and...
    Scoop politics | 15-09
  • Expanding Whānau Ora – a bottom line for Māori Party
    Leaving the best to last, the Māori Party has launched its Whānau Ora policy today following a fun family event at Te Ore Ore Marae in Masterton last night. “When we change what happens in our homes, we change what...
    Scoop politics | 15-09
  • Colin Craig’s Incredible Claims Continue
    Hot on the heels of a Conservative Party candidate proposing to double the price of a bottle of wine, Colin Craig has come up with an even more fantastic idea to buttress his uncosted tax policy....
    Scoop politics | 15-09
Images of the election
Public service advertisements by The Standard