Written By: - Date published: 6:00 pm, October 29th, 2008 - 159 comments
Categories: corruption, election 2008, john key -
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A little more detail to flesh out Tane’s post. The core of the H-fee story is this:
In 1987, head of Equiticorp Allan Hawkins illegally helped Elders Merchant Finance in New Zealand with the takeover of another company. In return, Elders paid Hawkins $66m through a series of sham foreign exchange transactions. There were two so-called ‘H-Fee’ payments, which were fraudulent and illegal. When all this was uncovered, it was described as the biggest fraud in Australasian history. Hawkins and Kenneth Charles Jarrett, the head of Elders, went to jail.
John Key had joined Elders Merchant Finance in 1985. He was head of foreign exchange from 1985 until he left Elders. Key told the media and the Serious Fraud Office that he left in 1987, before the H-fee transactions took place in January and August 1988: “Just one small issue: Three months before any of those deals got decided, I had left Elders.”. Key has also said that, if he had been working at Elders when the H-fee transactions went through, he would have been making the transactions.
Actually, as now established by the Herald, Key left in June 1988, after the first H-fee. That means John Key was the head of Elders Forex when massive illegal transactions were being conducted by that business group. Key himself says that he would have been the one making the transactions. It remains to be seen if Key actually signed off the deals, but he clearly knows more than he led us to believe. Why else would he lie about the date that he left Elders on multiple occasions?
As so often with Key, we are left asking the same question: ‘if he has nothing to hide, why all the lies?’
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Scoopit!
Well at least Labour knew it was time to “call the vet”
& put Hodgson on the job. Time that old nag of a party was put down. What the public really need to know is whay Williams & a team of Labour party researchers used taxpayer money for this latest sojourn to Melbourne. Also Clark distancing herself from the issue, meant she had prior knowledge of it in that she knew there was a very good chance of blowback. If there was anything it the story she likely would have front footed it.
Sounds like the Standard and Labour are awfully close to libel.
You don’t want to make accusations that are untrue and the SFO have made clear are untrue and you can’t prove, do you?
Another drop of the ball by the research team.
H1 and H2 must be incandescent.
[lprent: Nowhere near libel. Perhaps you should read the actual posts rather than other peoples comments. But thats right you're a troll.... You haven't been able to read in the past, why should you now? How many times have I banned you?]
Clark says the story is not one she is running…
Huh? I don’t know who she thinks would believe that. The master/mistress of deception. Surely that is a lie.
Another example of the reins of power tainting those who hold them too long (one of many several for Clark). As ever in the filed of human history.
She must go. And if she doesn’t I predict whe will blow apart during a fourth term.
Carol, you’re asking people not involved in Labour Party’s strategy to justify Labour Party strategy.
Labour have clearly been talking up rumours of a neutron bomb for some time. These rumours have appeared from various posters here at the Standard, through comments made by press gallery journalists, to hints from senior Labour politicians. This has several effects: if a neutron bomb did exist (even if they didn’t have it), it flushes it out. If they didn’t have the neutron bomb, then it potentially intimidates John Key in a game of psychological warfare. Thirdly, if they didn’t have one, the mere hint that there was one, and consistently talking it up, convinces many (including several Standard commenters) that the neutron bomb must exist.
Why wait for the last week for Melbourne? I suspect, and it’s just my opinion, that Labour realised it didn’t have the smoking gun, felt desperately about the poll position and desperately hoped that the smoking gun existed in the court documents.
It is my belief that the Labour Party campaign has been structured entirely around rumour-mongering of the smoking gun: the “this one is about trust”, the “two Johns”, the “slippery John” attacks, the obsession among Labour Party sympathisers with John Key–have all been pre-cursors to the neutron bomb, supposed to be released today–which would confirm and validate every claim the Labour Party has made about John Key’s credibility. Instead of validating those claims, the non-existent neutron bomb has destroyed those claims, and destroyed Labour’s credibility.
Coge excellent news the vets on the case! I said last night the story is not H-Fee but what Key told the investigators and it seems Hodgson agrees with me. Either he lied to the Herald about leaving Elders in 1987, and ultimately lying to the New Zealand public or he’s lied in 1991 when being investigated as one of many H-Fee witnesses.
This is truly hilarious. You guys were soooo excited at the top of this thread and now you’ve just kind of…run…out…of…steam.
Williams’ phone is switched off. Pete Hodgson is in hiding and Helen has said all she has to say about the issue.
Ms M,
How can we trust a man who got wrong by six months the date on which he left a job 20 years ago?
Make a sentence out of these words: clinging power desperately to.
IrishBill: let me reiterate my earlier comment: So what you’re saying is after it came up on the radar as a serious issue and knowing that it could be used by Labour against him and having filed a statement with the Australian authorities about it he then got the date wrong in an interview with the Herald? An interview which he set up to set the record straight on the matter? Excuse me if I find that very hard to believe.
Ms M, the vet came by this morning, at approximately one minute after four o’clock, to euthenaze the horse. It has been dead for five hours. You may find it therapeutic, but you aren’t achieving anything by continuing to flog it.
There isn’t any evidence Key “lied to the Herald about leaving Elders in 1987″. There is evidence Key made a mistake in referring to his departure year as 1987, which he subsequently corrected as 1988. That departure year did not change the substance of Key’s story–that he wasn’t involved or had any knowledge of the first H-Fee transaction (which was undertaken by Elders Australia, where Key did not work), and that he departed Elders New Zealand three months before the second transaction.
Boooooooooooooooring. The Herald won`t have anything juicy tomorrow. there’s nothing to write about. The smoking gun had no smoke and wouldnt fire.
Sorry I was wrong. the Herald did have something. to write about. Neutron bomb on Key proves fizzer for the Government
Bwhahahahahahahahaha.
Tim, my qestions aren’t to anyone in particular. They are just ones that occur to me, and indicate things that don’t quite add up for me. I think the righties are speculating pretty wildly about this, and drawing conclusions too early.
There seems to be a lot of stuff going on behind the scenes on both the left and right IMO.
The Herald breaking of the story yesterday always seemed strange to me, and I wasn’t expecting it to result in any conclusive evidence.
I am really just waiting to see how things play out.
Billy Hmm.
Major major fuckup by the Research Unit – and the NZH journo’s will be as livid about the duplicity as H1 and H2 are about the rank incompetence.
Ms M,
I suppose the only sensible conclusion we can come to is that it is part of an international conspiracy of bankers and media-owners. I am pretty sure George Bush is part of it too (although how he found time after master-minding that whole 911 thing I do not know). One thing is for sure, if they could fake a moon landing covering up a 26 year old’s involvement in a major international fraud would be easy-peasy-lemon-squeezy.
Noticed how the serious lefties have gone quiet and its only the conspiracy nuts who are left trying to run this?
IrishBill,
It seems you are kind of on your own on this. Mike Williams has turned his phone off. Pete Hodgson has nothing to say. Neither does Helen. Why I wonder? Maybe because this thing barks like a dog, Phil.
Carol, my guess is the left will defend this story to the hilt, too late for them to back down having thrown their weight behind it. They are still trying to work out an angle to spin it.
How do Kiwi taxpayers feel about their money being
wasted on this Melbourne sojourn? Appalled. I’m curious to know the amount it costed us.
Carol:
There were two possible conclusions to what Labour Party was doing, digging up dirt.
1. Conclusive evidence that John Key is a crook, or;
2. Conclusive evidence that the Labour Party is prepared to rumour-monger and throw mud at John Key, in a desperate attempt to smear him.
Both of those options are big, big stories. Mike Williams lured the Herald to Melbourne, purportedly to show the Herald evidence of the first option. The evidence didn’t exist. The smoking gun–John Key’s signature on the dealing slip–did not exist. Mike Williams was unable to uncover anything that the SFO didn’t uncover relating to the complex H Fee. The SFO found that Key had nothing to do with the H Fee. He wasn’t even investigated, he was so remote from it.
So there was not conclusive evidence that John Key is a crook. Therefore, the other option, given that the Labour Party has been promising for a long time that they would produce evidence of Key’s misdeeds–and find out not to have that evidence–shows the Labour Party as being involved in the most disgusting dirty-tricks campaign that New Zealand has seen. That is a huge story.
It’s okay – if Key becomes PM he’ll be dethroned by the lie(s) that he’s told that are still waiting to bite him in the bum but that simply haven’t risen the surface yet.
Karma…it’s a great thing.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WhcjRoU0C7g
Not so much a bomb, more a dance.
If you’re gonna have a smoking gun, make sure you’re holding it the right way around before pulling the trigger.
There seems to be a bit of an effort by the right to defuse this whole Key issue on this site. Says much – they are really fearful that even if the details are fuzzy Key is tarred with the brush of the nasty money trader mentality that has caused the current crisis. Well this has just reminded people that self-centred, money grabbing, don’t care who or what you hurt attitude is anathema to NZers. But this is the ‘fresh face’ of the National Party.
Here is a man who was involved in selling NZ Rail to Fay Richwhite, and doesn’t think it is necessary to declare his shareholding when an MP asking questions about the companies involved.
It is all so unethical. How can anyone justify it?
Tim, you’re speculating wildly. I’m just asking questions and waiting to se how things play out. IMO, the left doesn’t need any neutron bomb. Even if they get elected, key won’t last long
The right has spent a lot of time over the last 2 years trying to dig dirt on & smear Labour MPs and NZ 1st. How much money have they spent on that? It’s not surprising that Labour has retaliated with similar tactics.
It seems the righties have taken over the Standard. Viva la revolucion.
Get the feeling they’re all just a little bit embarrassed?
“if he has nothing to hide, why all the lies?”
Indeed, you really do have to wonder. Either he:
1. has a remarkably idiosyncratic selective memory, a bit like Owen Glenn
2. has a tendency to make shit up on the go, a bit like Jenny Shipley
3. has something to hide, a bit like Rodney
Careful one of those multiple blog personality nutters like Billy Vlad the impaler might get upset and come after you.
It’s okay – if Key becomes PM he’ll be dethroned by the lie(s) that he’s told that are still waiting to bite him in the bum but that simply haven’t risen the surface yet.
I’d expect this kind of post on Facebook or Bebo but not a site that purports to hold serious discussions about politics. Maybe you’ve come to the wrong place – seriously.
LOL.
Labour have just burnt all bridges with the Nations media on this one!
The ‘brains trust’ on the 9th floor have really really fucked this one up!
Labour trawls for Key ‘smear’
‘Not a scintilla of evidence’ linking Key to scandal
By VERNON SMALL and ELISABETH SEXTON – The Dominion Post | Thursday, 30 October 2008
ACCUSATIONS: National leader John Key is facing questions about his time at Elders Merchant finance.
LATEST: Labour has been digging through John Key’s past in an attempt to link him to sham currency deals, in what National is labelling a desperate smear campaign.
Janet:
No, Janet. That is wrong. John Key was currency trading at BT at the time. Clearly a very different unit that worked on SOE privatisation. I don’t know what you do for a job, but surely you understand the concept of different business units within an organisation. Like, let’s say, for example, that there is evidence that Pete Hodgson, Mike Williams, Helen Clark, some Standard posters, Heather Simpson, and much of the Labour Party Research Unit are actively involved in digging up dirt and spreading innuendo about a supposed “smoking gun” linking John Key to corrupt activity. Just because there is evidence of that doesn’t mean that Phil Goff is involved in that activity.
You’re engaging in some pretty weak guilt-by-association there Janet. By your standard, you must think pretty lowly of Helen Clark’s association with Winston Peters, who has been found by the Privileges Committee to be a liar.
vto, whe?
Freudian slip?
Let’s say, for example, that there is evidence that Pete Hodgson, Mike Williams, Helen Clark, some Standard posters, Heather Simpson, and much of the Labour Party Research Unit are actively involved in digging up dirt
Let’s say that Helen Clark has already come out and said its not a story she is involved in. I believe her.
I’m in and out of touch with real world due to various commitments so was interested to see how things panned out this morning.
What a joke. There are some decent people here on the left who one day will front up and admit what a cock-up this has been. Labour has indulged in high-risk personality politics and seems to have failed. Couple this with their treatment of Owen Glenn and you paint not a particularly pleasant picture of where Labour is at.
Frankly it is quite sad. Helen clearly has talents, is driven, and manages her team well. But these desperate events so how far Labour has plummeted if this is how it believes it needs to win the election.
You’d have to think if this is all Labour has got, National will continue to sleep walk to victory. I agree than National has failed to sparkle this campaign but it looks like there will get three years to rebuild while sitting on the treasury benches.
hee hee felix, no. just big fingers hitting the ‘w’ instead of the ‘s’. perhaps i need some filipino fingers…
“Mike Williams lured the Herald to Melbourne, purportedly to show the Herald evidence of the first option.”
He lured them there? I heard he went there – I didn’t hear that the Herald went with him. Is that true?
“ Therefore, the other option, given that the Labour Party has been promising for a long time that they would produce evidence of Key’s misdeedsand find out not to have that evidenceshows the Labour Party as being involved in the most disgusting dirty-tricks campaign that New Zealand has seen.”
As I understand it, the ‘neutron bomb’ call came from the right. Labour have not been promising any such thing. Do you really think that the media and Labour would sit happily on something substantial? That’s just not credible, Tim. The Dominion Post mentions that Fairfax, along with a govt department in Victoria, investigated the signature, and found it to not be Key’s.
They considered it worthy of investigation. It turned out that it was not Key’s signature. In your mind, Tim, does that mean it should not have been investigated. Do you feel the same way, for example, about unsolved crimes – that they should not be investigated (ignoring the clear logical flaw in your reasoning)?
Given the remarkable similarity between Key’s signature and the one on the cheque, it would only be prudent to investigate. Imagine if Labour did not do so, nor Fairfax, Key became PM and then the cheque was uncovered? That would be a disaster, far beyond the National Party.
Why you consider this investigation to be part of “the most disgusting dirty-tricks campaign that New Zealand has seen” is beyond me, Tim. Just because the cheque was not signed by Key does not mean it should not have been investigated.
According to you, Tim, every police investigation that does not result in a sentence must also be a dirty tricks campaign against the accused, if that is your criteria.
I assume that you also think The Herald, Fairfax Newspapers, TV1 and TV3 are all complicit in this dirty-tricks campaign that labour was “involved in”. Off ya high horse, lad. You also might want to check out what a dirty ticks campaign looks like – this ain’t one, and to throw allegations around like that makes you look very naive and very excitable.
Mat
It had been investigated at length around 20 years ago by the SFO.
Sturt the head of the SFO at the time was on the radio this morning.
“John Key was simply one of scores of innocent people interviewed by the SFO in this investigation.”
There was “not a scintilla of evidence” linking him to anything untoward, Mr Sturt said.
The Labour party was looking for dirt to smear Key end of story.
In relation to the H-Fee people have also conveniently forgotten that the government of the time was also criticised for benefitting at the expense of Equiticorp creditors and shareholders by turning a blind eye to the H fee transaction.
The government was ordered by the courts to pay $268m as its share of liability for the sale of NZ Steel. The judge at the time said the government “unjustly enriched’ itself through the shonky deal.’
Now who was the government at that time ?
More to the point can we get this election over and done with and get stuck into planning to do about the current state of NZ’s economy ?
“The Labour party was looking for dirt to smear Key end of story.”
If they had found something, then it would still be ‘dirt’ to ‘smear’ him with? Oh, that’s an interesting take. Is that what the police do? I’m not equating teh two, because Labour, the New Zealand Herald, Fairfax, TV1 and TV3 are clearly not the police, but if they found he did something wrong then he deserves to have it brought up. Like Tim, you look very naive and excitable.
“More to the point can we get this election over and done with and get stuck into planning to do about the current state of NZ’s economy ?”
I believe both parties are working towards that, as both parties would want to have a plan, should they win. Unfortunately it’s not as sexy as h-bombs or Monaco! Incidentally, gosh our economy is doing well, compared to our trading partners and other countries. Aren’t we lucky the good Doctor got rid of all that debt.
r0b – absolutely my judgement is biased, No question. And yes I enjoy a good bit of political invective, (as do you). Sometimes I’ll get the better of you, and sometimes you or your friends will get the better of me. But I do try hard not to engage in personal attacks and intellectual dishonesty.
If you can find cases where I have done so, well I’ll eat my electrons.