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The new right wing party

Written By: - Date published: 10:53 am, December 10th, 2013 - 172 comments
Categories: act, capitalism, conservative party, don brash, john banks, national, uncategorized - Tags:

Penny Bright ACT

Yesterday on politics from the left and the right on Radio New Zealand Matthew Hooton sounded what may be the death knell for ACT’s future.  He mentioned how tens of millions of dollars have been spent over the past two decades on a failed political experiment.  He suggested that there should be a summer reflection on the issue.  When asked he pointedly did not want to rule anything in or out.  He also spoke disparagingly about how the current Government has been highly interventionist.  It is interesting that the left and the right are becoming incensed at this Government’s foray into crony capitalism.

Obviously National is in a very difficult predicament.  Do they ditch the ACT brand and start again?  Or do they try and resuscitate an increasingly morbid looking political corpse?

ACT’s basic problem is the quality of its more recent MPs.  David Garrett presented one of the largest challenges.  Selected as a tough on crime MP with links to the sensible sentencing trust his parliamentary career was trashed when it was revealed that he had previously stolen the identity of a dead baby.  The fact that he was selected as an MP even though the hierarchy knew about this rather huge skeleton in his closet made things worse.

Rodney Hide carefully constructed a reputation as a perk buster but then got busted misusing the perks of office in a most egregious way.  And Hillary Calvert’s presence in Parliament showed how shallow ACT’s talent pool was.  It was clear even back in 2011 that ACT was all but finished as a political force unless something drastic happened.

National obviously became increasingly concerned at that time that the ACT party faced extinction as Epsom voters showed signs they were no longer willing to hold their nose and vote for the yellow jacketed one.

So National did what all good corporates do.  It sent the receivers in.  Hide went without a fight and Don Brash was installed as leader with John Banks installed as Epsom candidate.

This event showed how much of a National Puppet party ACT had become.  When the former National leader and someone who had been a loyal National MP for decades become highly placed on another party’s list while holding no complaint with National then ACT was obviously an independent party in name only.

It sounds like National is prepared to send the receivers in again but this time ACT may be liquidated rather than allowed to trade out of its problems.  Bank’s difficulty in reconciling an electoral return that he signed showing a large anonymous donation with a helicopter trip to the mansion owned by a 6 foot 8 german who personally promised the donation in question has resulted in Banks facing a charge of electoral fraud and is probably the last straw for ACT’s backers.

ACT’s and National’s predicament has been commented on by Tracy Watkins this morning in Stuff.  She said:

Hooton leads the charge among right-wing thinkers who believe the Key government is dangerously interventionist and middle of the road.

Surprisingly, there are even areas where the likes of Hooton agree with Labour – corporate welfare and cronyism are labels both sides use to describe some of the Key government’s intervention on behalf of players like Warner Bros or  Chorus. National would call that pragmatism. The free market purists would argue that if the economic settings are right everyone would flourish.

Whether there is enough life to fuel a new party in a movement which has struggled to find heroes since the heyday of Don Brash, Ruth Richardson, Sir Roger Douglas and Richard Prebble remains to be seen.

The only decision so far seems to have been to pause for thought over the summer break following the initial flurry of interest.

She also points out the challenge that coalition with the Conservative Party presents, pointing out that some of the party’s economic policies are left leaning and labelling the party as “decidedly flakey”.

So National’s difficulties are clear to be seen.  It needs friendly parties in Government.  The two most likely parties either have the potential of making National look stupid or are most unlikely to be returned to Parliament.  And on the right are wealthy people incensed at the failure of National to abide by pure market principles.

I suspect that there will be a few barbecues over christmas where the funding of a new political party on the right will be discussed.

172 comments on “The new right wing party”

  1. framu 1

    corporate welfare and cronyism are acts MO – i dont see what they are complaining about

  2. Ennui 2

    Mickey, get it right, all “Right Wing” parties reside in the “Centre”. Did you not know that? There is no such thing as the Extreme Right, that is actually just a little “Off Centre”. Now just stop, listen to Matthew, and read the editorial and you will be much better informed!

    • ghostrider888 2.1

      just insert a /sarc tag

    • Crunchtime 2.2

      Yep, Labour’s recent move from centre-right to centre was actually Left veering (or swerving, or even LURCHING) HARD-Left. anything that involves increasing company or high income earners is hard left, of course. And must be beaten to death with a large heavy piece of lumber, then incinerated, then drowned.

      /sarc

  3. aerobubble 3

    Now lets see, say Dunne gets back at the next election and is needed to form a coalition. Sitting opposite is Key, or Cunliffe, and Dunne announces as part of the deal he wants his old seat back on the intelligence committee. And why not, he’s done nothing wrong, in his own words.

    • Rich 3.1

      If it’s Cunliffe, one could hope that he’d actually be keen to cast some light into what the intelligence agencies are up to.

      The only “secrets” the intelligence agency hears at the moment are stories of imaginary terrorism fabricated by the intelligence agencies to justify their existence. They’re only kept secret so that they aren’t exposed as bullshit.

      • aerobubble 3.1.1

        If Cunliffe had any sense he’d review the whole oversight business, having single leaders of small parties in that position. Hell, the whole idea of working politicians being capable of protecting us, the committee should be one of former public servant, retired politicians, judges, who have had a life long career protecting liberty (which problem shrinks the pool considerable given how poorly NZ is run by said public servants, politicians and lesser extent judges). Leak homes.

  4. Tanz 4

    Colin Craig is the man, the man, the man!!! Thank Goodness for true tories, not purple dipped ones.

    • Daveosaurus 4.1

      Yes, if I ever need a politician to rescue me from the insidious menace of Chemtrails, I’ll be sure to look up Colin Craig. When I’m on the lookout for someone to represent me in Parliament, however, Craig would be in a dead heat with John Banks for absolute last.

      • Arfamo 4.1.1

        I’m thinking of joining the party and proposing endless policies which will sound good to Craig but be completely idiotic to anyone else.

  5. karol 5

    So is Hooton contemplating leading a new “neoliberal” party. Doesn’t he realise the “neoliberal” ideology was only ever a front for right wingers doing whatever was needed to maintain the power and relative wealth of the elites? It always was interventionist in practice – and always will be.

    • blue leopard (Get Lost GCSB Bill) 5.1

      +1 Karol

    • Lanthanide 5.2

      I thought it was funny the various commentators putting up Hoots as a potential Act leader / MP.

      Hoots is far too astute to tie himself to a bloated corpse bobbing on the waves of electoral sentiment, with only few scant months to go before it finally out-gasses and sinks without a trace.

    • McFlock 5.3

      Hooten doesn’t want to be the leader. He’s one of nature’s eminence grease

    • emergency mike 5.4

      But wait, we already have the Libertarianz! They’ve contested every election since 1996, and got 0.07% of the party vote in 2011. All that hard won support base just waiting for the NACT financial bankers to switch horses and work their chequebook magic.

      Maybe a new name – The ACT Again Party? The ACT Some More Party? The ACT No Bullshit This Time Party? The Same Shit Different Decade Party?

      As for Hooten, I agree with McFlock about the grease, but stranger things have happened.

  6. Tanz 6

    Lots of people believe that the moon landing was a con job, that does not make Craig a flake. I believe the left is worried about the inpact that Craig is having on voters, and the swing votes he is capturing. Good deal, and he has God on his side.

    • Arfamo 6.1

      He has God on his side? How do you arrive at that conclusion? If you mean he must have because he’s successful in his business, then history suggests so did Hitler, but only until June 1941. Then God went off him I guess.

    • framu 6.2

      what makes craig a flake is craig.

      Nothing wrong with old school conservatism, in fact i welcome it – but the conservative party dont seem to have much solid footing, both in terms of policy platform or candidates.

      sure theres many slogans they have that some might agree with, but at the same time those same people will be turned off by some of the other policies

      Currently they have all the hallmarks of other such parties that have occupied, or tried to occupy this space – a lack of clarity and a lack of well thought out and well researched policy that fits an overall standpoint

      take craig’s work for dole policy – have they accounted for two rather obvious issues? – 1) if someone works they should be paid minimum wage at the least and 2) how do you stop it putting current workers on the dole queue and how do you stop it putting downward pressure on wages?

      and thats before we discuss the rather stark fact that its a party essentially funded from one source – craig himself

      I for one arent that worried – at some point he and his collection of oddities will self immolate, either on the campaign or after

      • Flip 6.2.1

        ‘at some point he and his collection of oddities will self immolate, either on the campaign or after’

        God was rather keen on burnt offerings in the Old Testament.

    • Te Reo Putake 6.3

      “Lots of people believe that the moon landing was a con job, that does not make Craig a flake.”

      Indeed. It makes lots of people, and Colin, flakes.

      “I believe the left is worried about the inpact that Craig is having on voters, and the swing votes he is capturing.”

      Quite correct. The left is worried that he isn’t pick up enough right wing swing voters. We’d prefer it if he could convince slightly more than 1.5% of them to waste their party vote on him. Around 4.99% would be perfect, ta, God.

      • Tanz 6.3.1

        Gee, the left is so tolerant of differing views….not. Hypocrisy indeed.

        • framu 6.3.1.1

          umm… having an honest discussion is intolerance now? Would you prefer we agree with you or something?

        • Arfamo 6.3.1.2

          Not at all. I tolerate the views of flakes. Flakes are as entitled to be stupid as lefties and righties. Those hoping to enter Parliament in my opinion should be given every opportunity to advertise their flakeiness. Probably should even be made compulsory.

        • One Anonymous Knucklehead 6.3.1.3

          Views? You right wingers all have your very own facts too.

    • McFlock 6.4

      Lots of people believe that the moon landing was a con job, that does not make Craig a flake.

      Yes, yes it does.

      What helps is that he claims to neither believe nor disbelieve in the moon landing because he’s not an expert, yet he believes in God and the power of prayer. Apparently he thinks he’s an expert on the supernatural.

      • Colonial Viper 6.4.1

        The power of prayer and of faith is pretty awesome, McFlock.

        • McFlock 6.4.1.1

          It’s spelled “placebo” or “confirmation bias”

          • Colonial Viper 6.4.1.1.1

            I think the term is “mechanistic reductionism.”

            • McFlock 6.4.1.1.1.1

              Not surprised you think that.

              Either way CC is a numpty for thinking he’s an expert on it when he can’t make a belief call on the moon landings.

              • Colonial Viper

                Turning atheism into a religion and launch pad for bigotry McFlock? Rational and scientific thinking didn’t lead us down this dead end (although it helped provide the tools to get us here), and it’s not going to get us out of it either.

                • McFlock

                  No. I agree with you. CC’s thinking on both the moon landings and prayer is, as you suggest, not rational. He is therefore a flake.

                  but Dara O’Briain expresses it much better than I.

    • Tanz:

      The people who believe the moon landing is a fake, are not cemented in reality or are lying to themselves, if it was mother russia that got on the moon first, these same people wouldnt call
      it fake, or else they are nut jobs who love alex jones, or religious type who beleive the world is only 5000 years old and dinosaurs didnt exist.

      Colin Craig’s party will do more damage to our country than even TeMana. Hes a bigot, he is a million times worse than the density church guy.

      He is the anti science.

      • Arfamo 6.5.1

        If the moon landings were fake the USSR would’ve exposed it decades ago.

        • Lloyd 6.5.1.1

          If you have a big enough telescope and a powerful laser you can bounce a reflection from the prism reflector sets left at most of the Apollo Moon landing sites. The Russians did manage to land a couple of reflectors with robot landers, but they are small and the Apollo 15 set is the biggest. There is no other believable way that those reflectors got where they are without the landing of the American lunar landers. There are several observatories around the world that use the reflectors to regularly and accurately measure the distance of the Earth from the Moon.
          Unfortunately to my knowledge no-one in New Zealand has done this. It would be educational for Mr Craig to be introduced to an astronomer who is doing this measurement.

          • McFlock 6.5.1.1.1

            but that’s all part of the cover story that’s been in operation for over 40 years! :)

            • Lloyd 6.5.1.1.1.1

              Science is even better than politics at cutting through crap. The reflectors are real. Too many different observatories in too many countries have used them. The laser beam from the earth spreads to a circle about 4 kilometers across on the Moon, so the position of the reflector has to be within that circle. The reflector positions align with the stated Lunar landing locations.
              The Americans landed on the Moon, QED.

              • McFlock

                hang on – 4km spot diameter would include the lander platforms as well as the reflectors.

                Sooooo:

                NASA put mirrors on the moon so we could shoot spaceships with lasers

                Fuckin’ A.

        • Frank Macskasy 6.5.1.2

          @ Arfamo +1

          Indeed. It would have been the biggest propaganda coup in human history for the Soviets. It would have destroyed US infuence in the world and propelled the Soviet Union as the pre-eminent super power on this planet.

      • Flip 6.5.2

        ‘Density church guy’

        Very funny. Typo or spoonerism.

  7. Arfamo 7

    Craig’s party will be incoherent and be led by an idiot. And those are its good points.

  8. Anne 8

    I don’t see the former backers of ACT (Craig Heatley, Alan Gibbs, Michael Fay and David Richwhite – to name the most well known) wanting to be actively involved this time. However they are probably more than happy to finance a new right wing party into existence. A Labour/Green coalition govt would be anathema to them. Who would they choose as leader? Hooton doesn’t fit the bill.

    • Colonial Viper 8.1

      Don’t forget international financing from the USA.

      • alwyn 8.1.1

        You have some evidence for that do you CV?
        Or is it just another conspiracy theory?

        • One Anonymous Knucklehead 8.1.1.1

          cf. Simon Lusk’s recent little indiscretions.

          • Colonial Viper 8.1.1.1.1

            I reckon we see not even 10% of what is actually going on. The neoliberal revolution was globalised and highly co-ordinated.

            The corporate led neo-feudal revolution is just getting underway #TPP

            • The Gormless Fool formerly known as Oleolebiscuitbarrell 8.1.1.1.1.1

              “I reckon we see not even 10% of what is actually going on.”

              I reckon you might see a bit less.

      • I have no doubt that National has received and will still receive help including financial,help through its membership of the Democratic Pacific Union of which the Republican Party USA. is the senior member, The disgusting Hanna Barber TV adverts were never explained ,and don’t forget the “Gone by Lunch Time ‘Brash had with the DPU members. The wealthy DPU and National’s friends Crosby Textor are there to help Right-Wing parties gain power and there is no doubt uses it membership of both the above to help it to power Aotearoa .

    • Steve Wrathall 8.2

      Alan Gibbs hosted this year’s ACT conference at his property on the Kaipara Harbour.

      • McFlock 8.2.1

        how many delegates turned up?

        • Te Reo Putake 8.2.1.1

          Rodney Hide and several giraffes, from memory. And it was billed as a ‘relaunch’ of the ACT party. Relaunched … and straight down the gurgler.

      • alwyn 8.2.2

        If you ever get the chance to visit the place it is well worth it. He has a wonderful collection of outdoors sculpture.
        It is open once a month I think. You have to book a few months ahead as there are only a limited number of visitors each time. Hey, you don’t have to like the guy but the collection is great.

        • felix 8.2.2.1

          Looks fantastic from the pics I’ve seen. Is it Alan or Mrs Gibbs who curates the work?

        • Rogue Trooper 8.2.2.2

          are you for reel?

          • alwyn 8.2.2.2.1

            If you mean “Am I a roll of film” then no.
            If you mean does the place exist. Yes indeed, about a 1000 acres of it.
            If you mean is it worth seeing. Very, very much so. People travel internationally just to see it.
            It is free by the way, but it’s only open a day per month.
            Just Google it and admire.

            • Arfamo 8.2.2.2.1.1

              I’m too busy manufacturing guillotines and tumbrils from the materials in dumpsters outside fancy restaurants. Also I’m learning how to knit. These things need to be done properly.

              • alwyn

                I trust that you will be careful. Remember that Robespierre, who instituted the Reign of Terror after the Revolution, himself, and a lot of his followers, ended up on the Guillotine.
                http://www.wikipedia.org/Thermidorian_Reaction#Death_of_Robespierre
                When you go, of course, I am sure you will be as polite as Marie-Antoinette who accidentaly stood on the executioner’s foot and apologised to him, saying that she hadn’t meant to do it. Mandela clearly wasn’t the first person to forgive people who were out to mistreat them.

                • Arfamo

                  I’ve made a note of the things they did wrong. I’ll just sell the wares and stick to my knitting.

            • Rogue Trooper 8.2.2.2.1.2

              have been turned off by Michael Hill’s taste in art deposited on his property- ‘Michael Hill, trite’

              • alwyn

                I am inclined to agree about Hill’s stuff, although I’ve only seen photographs of it and it may be better if seen in real life. A hundred odd wolves does seem a bit excessive and the other works don’t really excite me either.
                Gibb’s items are magnificent though, provided you don’t mind the fact that they are on a monumental scale. The place really is worth a visit.

  9. gobsmacked 9

    The best thing for ACT – or some other re-invention – would be a Labour/Green government.

    Then they would be able to righteously (sic) oppose, instead of propping up.

    They would also have a party political landscape in 2017 without Dunne or Peters. Chances are they would be re-invigorated by opposition, railing against the Thieving Socialists in the Beehive.

    Better to have a funeral pyre, and a phoenix rising, instead of a comatose patient on life support, neither dying not living.

    (This advice is free of charge, so it’s both cheaper and smarter than Hooton’s)

  10. Steve Wrathall 10

    Lefties predicting ACT’s “imminent demise” again. Keep it up guys. You’re great PR.
    I note MICKYSAVAGE isn’t taking the Keith Locke wager and pledging to walk naked down Queen St if ACT get back in.

    • framu 10.1

      i notice you keep saying the same thing

      whats your opinion on ACTs record of sticking to its claimed principals steve?

      • Paul 10.1.1

        He won’t answer

      • Steve Wrathall 10.1.2

        There are some excellent principals out there that ACT will stick up for. Especially those who are giving more choice in education by opening charter schools.

        • Colonial Viper 10.1.2.1

          I guess even the yakuza have principles.

        • framu 10.1.2.2

          thats not what i asked steve

          what are ACTs claimed principals and how well are they living up to them?

          donna awatere huata – fraud wasnt it?
          rodney hyde – perk abuser
          david garret – identity thief
          heather roy – kicked out for daring to challenge
          john banks – alleged fraud, and ex national minister, parachuted in at behest of funders
          don brash – ex leader of national, parachuted in at behest of funders

          so – no side step this time please

          • McFlock 10.1.2.2.1

            he’s weazeling on the difference between “principle” and “principal”, just fyi

            • Colonial Viper 10.1.2.2.1.1

              Yep. It’s juvenile. All to justify public education dollars going into private hands.

              • Steve Wrathall

                As long as public education education objectives are being met, what does it matter who provides?

                • One Anonymous Knucklehead

                  They aren’t being met. Glad we could get that out of the way. I have a question: do you copy failed education policy because failure is your middle name, and if not, what is your excuse?

                  • Steve Wrathall

                    The Charter schools haven’t even opened yet, so how can you say that they aren’t meeting educational objectives? What we do know is that 20% of students are leaving your state monopoly system functionally illiterate, because it is a system more concerned with protecting the privileges of unionised teachers rather than students.

                    • Arfamo

                      Ah yes, that’ll be the reason. Jesus wept man, you’ve got the analytical skills of a gnat.

                    • Rogue Trooper

                      there have been plenty of links made to The Standard, h/t joe90 particularly, concerning the failure of charter (profit) schools internationally. (apologies for the abuse, you know how it is).

                • Colonial Viper

                  Exactly – what does it matter who provides? But you seem to think that it matters a great deal. You and the privateers.

          • Lanthanide 10.1.2.2.2

            Don’t forget Calvert’s little sideline: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10728580

            Funny that for such a small party, their MPs are so notorious. We hardly know anything about NZ First MPs, for example.

            • Rogue Trooper 10.1.2.2.2.1

              just another piece of something one would scrape and hose off their shoe.

            • you_fool 10.1.2.2.2.2

              That is because they know they are there to be silent and let Winnie speak… even Horran keeps his mouth shut in parliment.

            • Steve Wrathall 10.1.2.2.2.3

              What is your problem with legal massage parlours? Would you prefer they were illegal and therefore leaving sex workers vulnerable to criminal gangs?

          • Rodel 10.1.2.2.3

            Some years ago I think it was 12% of ACT MPs were convicted.Is it higher now?
            If John gets his come -uppance it’ll be 100% this year.
            Hey! wasn’t today the day?

          • Steve Wrathall 10.1.2.2.4

            You forgot the ACT MPs who fraudulently signed paintings, used Thai slave labour to tile their property, assaulted Tau Henare, had election sign vandalism organised out of their office, had a teenager run naked and screaming from their property….Oh, wait

            • framu 10.1.2.2.4.1

              but arent act better than that?

              cmon steve stop dancing around the cat poo on the floor and pick it up

              also – i think labour are crap too

              • Steve Wrathall

                People are people. Ultimately it comes down to which systems incentivise people to thrift and hard work, and which inventivise them to sloth and bludging.

                • Arfamo

                  Ultimately it comes down to which systems incentivise people to thrift and hard work, and which inventivise them to sloth and bludging.

                  Lol. Certainly true that “inventivising” is what you do. Bit of a freudian slip there eh?

                • Rogue Trooper

                  you are a tryer , give you that, Honest Injun.

                  • Arfamo

                    Yup. What Steve’s arguments lack in depth they make up for in scapegoating.

                    • Rogue Trooper

                      so revealing the ol’ blogs; one learns a lot, steps back, has a laugh…carries on. ‘Least they are exposed to the reality of Logos . Word :-D (been great meeting up with you from time-to-time).

                • KJT

                  Yes. I have noticed that paying high salaries, and giving high status, to the marginally competent and blinkered, makes them into even more useless, entitled, anti-social and mean spirited bludgers.

                  ACT MP’s being a glaring example.

                • framu

                  still dancing around the cat poo on the floor steve?

        • KJT 10.1.2.3

          And, “if you don’t like those principles we have others to sell you”.

    • mickysavage 10.2

      There is a statistical possibility that ACT may survive and I have far too much respect for my fellow Aucklanders Steve :smile:

      • lprent 10.2.1

        It is like the probability statement in the IPCC AR5. I think that it is highly unlikely that Act will survive this election.

        Maybe that will get Steve off his lazy duff to find out what highly unlikely is in probability terms. He certainly always treats anything that is not absolutely certain as being invalid. Unless of course it is an Act (of mercy)

        • Steve Wrathall 10.2.1.1

          Just like the “highly unlikely” probability of ACT surviving in 2005 and 2011. And yet…

          • Pascal's bookie 10.2.1.1.1

            Modern medical science is pretty good at keeping a corpse ticking over. Wouldn’t call it a life but.

          • McFlock 10.2.1.1.2

            Most parties need a coalition agreement to form a government.

            For the last three elections ACT has needed a gifted seat just to stay in parliament.

            ACT aren’t dead – the’re in a persistent vegetative state on tory life support. And keyster looks like he wants to flip the switch and find someone new.

            edit: snap pb :)

            • Steve Wrathall 10.2.1.1.2.1

              In 2005 Epsom was not gifted. Michelle Boag wrote 40,000 letters to voters telling them to vote for Richard Worth.
              And spare me the faux outrage at electoral accomodations. Labour repeatedly gifted Anderton Wigram by running mutants with peppercorn campaign budgets.

              • McFlock

                not outrage.
                Just laughing at the fact you think ACT is still relevant as a party.

                • Arfamo

                  Act now looks more like the results of an out control party the night before. Everyone waking up nursing major hangovers and trying to work out what the hell happened.

          • KJT 10.2.1.1.3

            Just shows that 2% of the population are terminally, daft.

      • Chooky 10.2.2

        ..the statistical possibility becoming a reality could lie in a closet Act female agreeing to become a candidate …a very attractive and intelligent one…..one who hasn’t been mentioned here yet ….but if they were to stand they could revive the corpse…on the other hand they may not wish to chance their hand on a dead horse

        • Murray Olsen 10.2.2.1

          If you mean that Cactus thing, I have never found her either attractive or intelligent. She has the attractiveness of a corpse, all cold and unfeeling, and the intelligence of a mosquito. The difference is that she homes in on bank balances instead of carbon dioxide. She may be attractive to the adolescents on WhaleSpew and Kiwiblog, who probably fantasise “getting a root off her” in exchange for a vote, but not to any red blooded man or woman that I know.

    • ghostrider888 10.3

      I’ll just adopt Lyn’s role for a mo’ GET FUCKED STEVE WRATHALL YOU IGNORNANT FUCKING DOORSTOP! :-)

  11. FYI

    The Queen vs John Archibald Banks CRI 2012 -085 -9093

    Next hearing:

    WHERE: Auckland High Court
    Waterloo Quadrant

    WHEN: Wednesday 11 December 2013

    TIME: 9am

    See decision of J Heath 3 December 2013

    http://www.dodgyjohnhasgone.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/JOHN-BANKS-R-v-Banks.pdf-J-Heath-3-December-2013.pdf

    Penny Bright

  12. One Anonymous Knucklehead 12

    Will the new right wing party have better wingnuts?

    Will they be able to handle evidence-based arguments, or will it just be business as usual?

    • The Gormless Fool formerly known as Oleolebiscuitbarrell 12.1

      Will you ever get a new line?

      • One Anonymous Knucklehead 12.1.1

        Yes. When you get some evidence based policy and learn that your opinions are not facts.

        • The Gormless Fool formerly known as Oleolebiscuitbarrell 12.1.1.1

          Oh. And what, exactly, are my policies?

          • ghostrider888 12.1.1.1.1

            let us in on the joke then

            • The Gormless Fool formerly known as Oleolebiscuitbarrell 12.1.1.1.1.1

              Yeah, OAK, tell us, why don’t you?

              • One Anonymous Knucklehead

                Ah, did you not register that by “you” I mean “right wingers”? There I go overestimating your capacity for understanding again!

                • The Gormless Fool formerly known as Oleolebiscuitbarrell

                  Sorry. I didn’t read it like that, because I am not as smart as you. When I said “Will you ever get a new line?” To clarify: I meant you singular, not the entire left wing.

                  Twat.

                  • fappity

                    There’s no need for that.

                    OAK is not a twat he’s a cunt !

                  • One Anonymous Knucklehead

                    Temper temper :lol:

                    To clarify further, “your” policies are the ones you vote and shill for. The ones that lower our per capita GDP and increase the infectious disease admission rates.

                    Would you mind not calling me a twat? I like cunt better.

    • TightyRighty 12.2

      your evidence, almost without exception is cocked up while you smoke a fatty. you are yet to make one cogent, structured argument that arrives at a rational conclusion. even when you do use (questionable) evidence, you throw in so many assertions along with large helpings of supposition to render the whole laughable. ignore the fact that conservatives made this world as awesome as it is though. just label them all wingnuts. That’s evidence based.

      • ghostrider888 12.2.1

        well OAK has consistently demonstrated improvement on your own predatory fawnings.

      • One Anonymous Knucklehead 12.2.2

        Tighty I haven’t got any evidence to call my own, only anecdotes. The Lancet or Nature, they have evidence, which is why you’ll find me citing them and other authorities where there are questions of fact.

        Conservatives opposed the abolition of slavery, denied women the vote, denied climatology, called Nelson Mandela a terrorist (but are now queueing up to claim his corpse). You routinely go beyond victim blaming to actual victim vilifying on every subject from rape culture to welfare. Meanwhile, away from your grasping echo chamber, progress happens. So nah, you’re not as awesome as you think you are.

        But all I’m asking is that you provide the evidence for your beliefs. Not anecdotes, evidence. Not your existing bias (nor mine for that matter), evidence.

        Until you do that one basic decent thing I’m going to treat you like a barrel of motherfuckers.

  13. Pascal's bookie 13


    ignore the fact that conservatives made this world as awesome as it is though.

    hilarious.

  14. Yoza 14

    Workers made this world as awesome as it is, not conservatives.

    • Colonial Viper 14.1

      Let’s be real here; corporate interests are what has shaped this world and how we relate to it, particularly over the last 50 years. Colonial interests in the 100 years before that. And “awesome” is not the word I would use.

    • One Anonymous Knucklehead 14.2

      Nope. Natural processes like chemistry and physics made the world as awesome as it is, and without them there wouldn’t be any workers or conservatives.

      We’re all just freeloaders.

      • Rogue Trooper 14.2.1

        interesting thought. Viruses, as that ‘attack’ fellah used to proclaim.

        • One Anonymous Knucklehead 14.2.1.1

          The viruses are free-loaders too. I had just finished reading about ubuntu (the perspective not the software).

  15. tricledrown 15

    Tighty almighty rewriting hisTory.
    No doubt you have been sucking on colin craigs vapor entrails.
    ACT is finished.
    Which idiot is going to take over leadership of a damaged brand.
    Cactus Cate
    Mat spewton
    RodneyHide
    Tighty almighty
    Camoron slater brewer

    • you_fool 15.1

      I am actually hoping they will leave it to Young Act and let them rebuild and get us a decent liberal/libertarian party that might gain 5% of the vote and provide a good counter balance to idiot face right wing hysterics.

      • framu 15.1.1

        i wouldnt put money on that

        young act are the most dishonest little turds of the whole sorry bunch

  16. vto 16

    political parties must not be funded by private donation.

    because they simply get bought by the person with the biggest cheque

    it astounds me that this absolute and fatal flaw in our political system continues.

    it is absolute pure corruption.

    • One Anonymous Knucklehead 16.1

      Have to say I agree.

      Solution: require all political donations to be split among the parties according to some equitable formula. No more Waitemata Trust. Send cheques to the Electoral Commission if you want to donate to democracy. No other funding sources allowed.

      There are plenty of (intelligent, philanthropic) wealthy people, not to mention unions etc, who will see the value in this.

      PS: or implement “one person one dollar one vote” funding.

      • chris73 16.1.1

        Typical, you can’t get enough funding for your own party so you want either people to pay. Maybe the problem lies with your parties not being deemed worthy enough for donations.

        • Rogue Trooper 16.1.1.1

          wotteva, and maybe you comment on The Standard out of the goodness of your heart.

        • Te Reo Putake 16.1.1.2

          Chris, the funding models in these kind of systems are usually based on popularity. ie. the more popular you prove yourself to be, the bigger your allocation. The idea is to deliver a level playing field, without corruption. I would have thought you’d be ok with that concept.

          • One Anonymous Knucklehead 16.1.1.2.1

            Chris73 is having problems with “equitable” – English comprehension problems, that is.

        • One Anonymous Knucklehead 16.1.1.3

          I missed the part where money gets to talk the loudest, Chris73. That’s your plan, eh – for the sound of money to drown out all other voices.

          One person, one vote, one dollar.

        • North 16.1.1.4

          You measure up to the Topp Twins upper class ladies skit in that photo Penny.

  17. Sanctuary 17

    Political parties should not be allowed to have any source of funding at all except for membership dues.That way, the astroturfs are easily sorted from the real McCoys.

    • One Anonymous Knucklehead 17.1

      Membership fees: One million dollars each. There are only three of us, but we can still buy a lot of votes advertising.

      Sorry to burst your bubble.

      • Sanctuary 17.1.1

        Nope, that would expose a party for exactly what it is – a vehicle for the super rich.

        • One Anonymous Knucklehead 17.1.1.1

          Three million dollars buys a lot of spin: being a vehicle for the super rich doesn’t stop National getting elected.

          Any self-funded party can buy more influence based on its members’ incomes. In a country of four million people, one dollar per person ought to be enough. It might need to be $1.34 or something. Whatever :)

    • Flip 17.2

      Been here.

      Party funding.
      State funding based on set membership numbers. Member fees set.
      Keeps business noses out and reduces corruption. (purchasing power)

      Wondering if any party is going to promote this to improve democracy…

      • One Anonymous Knucklehead 17.2.1

        One person one vote one dollar is simpler and fairer and would probably increase voter participation. You get your “dollar” – your allocation of your party funding – when you turn eighteen (say). You get to review it whenever you like, or if that proves too hard to administer, on a set date each year.

        The system can be funded through taxation and philanthropy.

        • framu 17.2.1.1

          sort of like acts ol favourite for education – the voucher system

          bet they would hate it in this context

          • Rogue Trooper 17.2.1.1.1

            voucher system for health would rattle some specialist’s cages.

          • One Anonymous Knucklehead 17.2.1.1.2

            :lol: Framu now I’m having second thoughts. An ACT policy you say? Better check for fish-hooks.

  18. captain hook 18

    meet the new boss.
    same as the old boss.

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