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The view from Australia

Written By: - Date published: 9:16 am, April 17th, 2013 - 67 comments
Categories: economy, im/migration, International, john key - Tags: , ,

Sometimes a certain distance gives the clearest view. A piece on PM John Key from Australian newspaper The Telegraph (ht Blue in comments).

All Blacks only light as Kiwis search for hope

MORE than 600,000 New Zealanders – almost 15 per cent of the Long White Cloud – are living in Australia on temporary visas.

What is the NZ government doing about this mass exodus? To date, seemingly nothing.

Just two months ago New Zealand Prime Minister John Key sidled up to Australian Prime Minister Julia Gillard in Queenstown during bilateral talks and delighted in their announcement his country would take 150 asylum seekers from Australia. At the same time, Key tried his hardest to avoid answering questions on why his fellow countrymen and women were fleeing across the ditch in record numbers. Key was eager to explain, rather poorly, why taking asylum seekers was a great deal for New Zealand. He was not so keen to discuss his nation’s own departing masses.

When questioned back in February about the ever-increasing number of New Zealanders emigrating here each year, Key gave the distinct impression he didn’t care.

But he should. Make no mistake: Kiwis are coming here in droves. Figures show the number of New Zealand citizens in Australia on special category visas jumped 5.4 per cent in the past year, with 54,000 moving here in 2012. That’s an average of 1000 each and every week.

Of course, this flight of the Kiwis is nothing new. But the fact numbers are continuing to grow at such a rapid rate with no sign of abatement surely must be cause for concern for a government in a country with a population of just 4.4 million.

Key at first pretty much fobbed off a question in Queenstown about the astonishing numbers of people emigrating, before being pushed again by journalists to respond as to what his government plans to do about it.

The answer: Nothing. …

The piece continues in a similar vein, noting the wage gap, superannuation gap, living costs, and other factors. A depressing read from an independent voice.

67 comments on “The view from Australia”

  1. karol 1

    Key at first pretty much fobbed off a question in Queenstown about the astonishing numbers of people emigrating, before being pushed again by journalists to respond as to what his government plans to do about it.

    The answer: Nothing. …

    Another “I genuinely have no clue” moment.

  2. Tim 2

    The primary driver for Key is finding any and every tune-tee to ego-trip. The malignant narcissist – not unlike the one promoting the increasingly totalitarian junta to the north.
    IMHO (and many seem to disagree), he actually isn’t the sharpest knife in the drawer. Clueless, unintelligent in the sense of possessing powers of logic and critical thought, preferring animal cunning-like behaviour based on habit, ideology and dogma learned parrot fashion.
    It’s evident even in the cliched language he uses, the repetitious bullshit, the “if this, then that” actions-based on what is ‘supposed to happen’, and so on.
    Meanwhile the hole gets deeper.

    • karol 2.1

      Mental “sharpness” is hard to identify as a general IQ-type of quality.

      Key has some significant skills, that include cunning, linked to ruthlessness and ambition.

      He is into networking, is successful in socialising with those of value to him, but has poor skills in verbally articulating his ideas. He may be have better number than verbal skills.

      He may not be that intellectual, or very good at verbal reasoning, but his ruthless ambition, desire for status and to be the dominant leader in the pack are not to be underestimated.

      • Colonial Viper 2.1.1

        Yep and those same traits, ambition and self interest, are ones he can both see and use in other people very well, in order to lead and motivate them.

      • Tim 2.1.2

        Well I can’t disagree with any of that. I’m just hoping he keeps up with the lying. He’ll start to need ever increasing numbers of minders to remind him of the bullshit he’s already told so that one piece of bullshit doesn’t keep conflicting with others

    • prism 2.2

      Tim
      If Jokeyhen is making “if this, then that” statements surely this implies that he has had some thought as to process and outcomes. Is this actually happening, as I didn’t think it was? He does seem the puppet of ideology and sharp practice, his thinking enhanced by the knowledge that what he knows and achieved has left him rich.

      I see him as more like that light jumping spider that can run across water, so well-designed for its purpose that it never sinks into the meniscus. He keeps himself above and uncontaminated by the unpleasant facts arising from those below him such as just normal people in the citizenry.

      • Tim 2.2.1

        notice I qualified that (had to use the edit facility to clarify) – i.e. based on what he thinks is supposed to happen. When something occurs that is out of the ordinary to him – he doesn’t seem to be able to cope.
        Actually, the sharpest knife in the drawer was a bad analogy too. You could say that’s exactly what he is

    • Mary 2.3

      We need a new strategy to help make everyone understand this. At the moment we don’t have one. That’s obvious in the fact Key’s still so popular. We need a new way of showing people the truth.

  3. ianmac 3

    In these hard times of unemployment, it is possible that Mr Key might just welcome the exodus as it reduces the pressure on the unemployment numbers. Maybe 1 in 4 of 600,000 might be otherwise unemployed. About 150,000 added to the current figures?

    • freedom 3.1

      i don’t like it when i am petty but it is always fun to watch Paula Benehit squirm in her seat anytime that particular scenario is raised in the House.

    • Matt 3.2

      That almost surely must be it. If from Key’s perspective this is just a bunch of unemployed malcontents removing themselves from NZ, what’s not to love?

  4. prism 4

    karol
    I genuinely don’t care. FIFY

  5. BM 5

    OZ is a shit place if you want to do business.
    Arces of red tape and every thing takes for ever, it’s like stepping back in time 30 years.

    The internet and computers seem to still be a thing of mystery to a lot of ocker businesses, bunch of backward hill billies.

    • Colonial Viper 5.1

      The more complex environment teaches skills and discipline. Its one reason that Aussie retailers do great in NZ, but not vice versa.

      • Alanz 5.1.1

        yeah, and among many things to do with money and economy, they don’t run such a stupid absolutist, purist GST system like we do.

      • BM 5.1.2

        The Ozzie companies love it in NZ, the workers actually work, the unions aren’t poking their nose in every 5 minutes, you don’t have to fill out a mountain of forms every time you need to take a shit.
        NZ is a business paradise compared to Australia.

        • One Anonymous Knucklehead 5.1.2.1

          …profits are lower, per capita GDP is lower…your informant sounds as ill-informed and innumerate as you are.

        • prism 5.1.2.2

          BM
          And the Pike River Miners are dead…dead…dead…dead…. Yep its good (for the employers) having no unions. The Oz ones have that particular aggression that has enabled them to remain on top and in certain circumstances to be right crims. But we threw ours out with the bathwater. And Joe Public is the poorer for it. The unions helped by fighting in our corner. Now we just get a bloody nose.

      • infused 5.1.3

        Their red-tape is stupid. We have a partner company in aussie and were looking to setup shop there as well. No way, unless you have thousands to throw at it.

    • One Anonymous Knucklehead 5.2

      Yes, you must be right because Kiwis never do business there, making Australia our largest trading partner.

      • prism 5.2.1

        One Anon Knucklehead
        Some facts to your interesting comment at 5.2? Give us a breakdown of chief items in which sectors?

        • One Anonymous Knucklehead 5.2.1.1

          Knock yourself out.

          • prism 5.2.1.1.1

            Thanx One A Knucklehad
            Wow good stats from your link. I’ve come over all Johnny 5 (Short Circuit) famous for wanting more information.
            Some applicable Johnny 5 quotes after looking at the info.:
            Malfunction. Need input.
            Stupid – foolish, gullible, doltish, dumbell…

            Interesting things I noticed –
            1 Our total export to Australia receipts for commodities have not increased in real terms from 2006 to 2011 if a 5% inflation figure on 2006 was multiplied by the next five years.
            (In NZ$millions)
            2006 32,430
            2011 46,072

            2 Our dairy export receipts have doubled in that time.

            3 There has been some increase in receipts for Logs, wood etc. approx 50%,
            Meat and edible offal approx 20% and
            Fish approx 20%.

            4 Crude oil exports are up nearly 300%

            5 Decrease or flatline in Mechanical machinery and equipment, Fruit, Aluminium.

            So Australia is mainly buying stuff from us that they would have bought in the 1800’s. And dairy is our main product. Oil is a resource that we are depleting so that’s not advantageous as an export. And we aren’t showing improvements in overall receipts, a main concern.

            Looks like Oz is getting more advantage than we are. Manufactured articles, like from our fashion industry, aren’t in this list of Commodities only (though includes machinery) but receipts for that sector will be low in comparison to Commodities, though hopefully will have a higher margin of profit and higher growth trends.

            Where are the jobs for city dwellers? In an article in the Listener the writer said that cities are a great place for innovation and quote Steve Jobs as believing in the value of interchange for creativity and new ideas. It seems that too many of our pollies are boys from isolated farms! We are ignoring our population mass in government thinking. No wonder we are leaving NZ like lemmings.

      • BM 5.2.2

        It’s really hard slog getting established.
        I don’t think people quite realize how slow things move in Australia,it takes weeks and weeks to get anything thing done.

        • One Anonymous Knucklehead 5.2.2.1

          People make more money. I expect the extra paperwork is making it harder for innumerate wingnuts to run the economy into the ground.

        • Rodel 5.2.2.2

          BM’s business relations difficulties in Aus may have something to do with the need for pleasant, positive courtesy and a little respect for business associates in Australia and Australians in general.

        • infused 5.2.2.3

          I wouldn’t even bother mate. These guys have no idea. It shows time and time again.

        • Murray Olsen 5.2.2.4

          BM is dead right. Australia is very slow, inefficient, and one of the most bureaucratic countries on Earth. They get away with it because they can dig so much stuff out of really big holes and sell it to China.

  6. dewithiel 6

    Amazing commentary when you consider that the Telegraph is Murdoch’s Sydney version of the Sun, best known for genuflecting at any image of a right wing politician.

  7. JonL 7

    Key’s a psychopath. – as are many in the top echelons of government, business and the corporates. Once you understand that, their behaviour becomes a little clearer. Psychopaths have no moral sense, no ability to process emotional experience, incl love and caring, except when such experience can be calculated as a coldly intellectual task. They have no conscience. Often charming, when it suits their purpose, prone to crocodile tears, bullying, and if in danger of being thwarted or exposed, viscous and unforgiving! Also impulsive, irresponsible and having a total lack of remorse. I know a couple of total sociopaths, and unless you know what to look for, you’d think them charming and engaging – until push comes to shove and you can read their true colours. Most of you probably have a psychopath in your ring of family & friends, but odds on, you wouldn’t realise it!

    • RedLogix 7.1

      Yes. Personality is something that glitters in the good times; character shines when adversity visits.

    • Draco T Bastard 7.2

      Most of you probably have a psychopath in your ring of family & friends, but odds on, you wouldn’t realise it!

      QFT

      and, yeah, they’re quite good at camouflaging themselves.

  8. vto 8

    It would be very pleasant in NZ if our population dropped back to previous centuries levels.

    Keep ’em going to Oz I say.

    What is the advantage in keeping them here, or having them return?

    • BM 8.1

      I agree, I see no issue with people going to Oz looking for work.
      Australia’s a great labour sponge, not so good for them, great for us.

      Creates new opportunities for those that stay.

      • Colonial Viper 8.1.1

        Losing young motivated talent to Australia creates opportunities for NZ?

        Sure if you like your pie small and cold.

        • BM 8.1.1.1

          The question needs to be asked, Why is the NZ education system only producing such a small amount of talent.?
          I though we had one of the best education systems in the world, NZ should be bursting at the seams with new young motivated talent.

          • Colonial Viper 8.1.1.1.1

            600,000 of them left

            • Lanthanide 8.1.1.1.1.1

              Not really. The ‘brain drain’ of the early 2000’s under the Labour was definitely the more skilled and educated leaving.

              Now that we have interest free student loans if you stay in NZ, the flight offshore has shifted to the less educated and less skilled, who can’t find any jobs due to the global recession.

              • Colonial Viper

                Interest free student loans are nice, but not of somewhat limited help if there is still a shortage of graduate level jobs in the $50K to $60K range.

                Also certain specialty areas of banking, law, finance, engineering, medicine etc, NZ just does not do; you have to go overseas to enter those specific career paths.

      • felix 8.1.2

        Ambushuss fur Noo Ziln.

        • King Kong 8.1.2.1

          Making the, um, ah, um country, kind of thing, um, if you will, kind of more attractive, um, for,ah the people whom um, generally on the whole, um, inhabit this place.

          • felix 8.1.2.1.1

            Eh? Oh, I see you’re doing a funny Shearer voice. Yes, he is a doofus.

            I was referring to one of Key and National’s big election mantras from when they were in opposition and contrasting it with their actual level of ambition now that they’re in govt.

            BM’s comment exemplified one side of the contrast so I expressed the other. I chose Key’s voice because he’s the one who used to say it a lot, but it could just as easily be the voice of any inbred wealthy slurring South Island born-to-rule shithead.

            • prism 8.1.2.1.1.1

              felix
              Good string of adjective invective.

            • vto 8.1.2.1.1.2

              ha ha, well said felix. What do people like that say to the fact the brawn drain has powered up under these losers?

              Also, I am curious as to your seemingly random selection of the southern region to highlight your point. Not that it doesn’t paint a picture of a reality, but why south island?

              • felix

                lolz, only because the inbred wealthy slurring North Island born-to-rule shitheads have a different twang to their accent.

              • pollywog

                Yarp….we got 5th generation dickheads down here who are proud of it.

    • MrSmith 8.2

      “New Zealand’s net loss of migrants in the March 2012 year was due to a highest-ever net loss of 39,500 people to Australia.  Annual outflows to Australia have been at record levels since the November 2011 year. The previous high of 35,400 was reached in the December 2008 year. The latest annual figure resulted from 53,200 departures to Australia (also a record), offset by 13,800 arrivals from Australia. In both directions, most migrants were New Zealand citizens.”

      But:

      “There were net gains of migrants from most other countries, led by the United Kingdom (5,500), India (5,200), China (5,000), the Philippines (2,100), Germany (1,600), and Ireland (1,500).” 
      http://www.stats.govt.nz/browse_for_stats/population/Migration/IntTravelAndMigration_HOTPMar12/Commentary.aspx

      So Kiwis are coming and going, more going and as you can see the void is being filled by migrants.

  9. johnm 9

    I think one of the reasons these mainly young people flee to OZ is the harassment to find jobs that don’t exist and the new punitive sanctions regime all of which is so depressing and demoralising, meaning any excuse we cut your benefit. 🙁 I.E. If you are unemployed it’s your fault! Plus houses are impossible to buy, young people have nothing to lose except to end up destitute on the streets of Sydney and other places, victims of another mean miserable government.

    • prism 9.1

      johnm
      You’re adjectives are lacking – along with mean miserable, add malfunctioning, incompetent, unprincipled, government.

  10. ghostrider888 10

    h/t to aerobubble fore-seeing these issues Men At Work

    be a good toy now johnny

    • prism 10.1

      ghost888
      Great clips. Men at Work Is that the song that had the kookaburra sits in the old gum tree music piece in it that they got hit over the knuckles for?

  11. karol 11

    Very good article today from Brian Rudman on the different treatment given (by Bennett) to beneficiaries, compared with the way wealthy tax cheats are treated in Key’s NZ.

    Victoria University tax lecturer Dr Lisa Marriott estimates that in 2011, tax evaders cheated the country of between $1 billion and $6 billion, while welfare fraud cost $39 million. She told 3 News: “The problem of tax evasion is at best-case scenario 25 to 50 times the financial amount of welfare fraud, and at worst-case scenario, potentially 100 to 150 times the amount.”

    She also found the courts’ treatment of the two groups is far from equal. The average offending of tax fraudsters is $270,000, with those found guilty having a 22 per cent chance of being jailed. The average welfare fraudster gets away with $70,000, but if convicted, has a 60 per cent chance of being jailed. Time to set Paula Bennett loose in Remuera?

    Not surprising then that so many Kiwis, looking for work, have taken their chances with no benefits in Aus.

  12. geoff 12

    Yeah so we haven’t got any jobs and yeah even the ones we have pay like shit and yeah basic human necessities like food and shelter are ridiculously expensive but……

    …what about THE VISTAS!!

    Ya don’t know how lucky you are, mate!

    • Tim 12.1

      plus we’re 100% pure maaaate. Key proved that when he ‘confronted’ Steven Sackur.
      Take it from the horse’s mouth, or the sour’s ear, or whatever it is you’ve made your purse from

  13. infused 13

    Aussie will turn to the shitter soon, and you will see a lot of these people coming back, or living under aussies bridges.

    It seems to me it’s not the high skilled workers leaving (if you class builders, gas fitters etc as high skilled).

    Uni is half the problem as well. They pump these guys out with useless degrees promising them the world.

    • Colonial Viper 13.1

      Uni is half the problem as well. They pump these guys out with useless degrees promising them the world.

      We’e built an economy which doesn’t require workers. What do you expect.

      BTW there is no such thing as a useful degree when our economic set up does not require or value graduates.

    • BM 13.2

      I agree.
      Education is a business,bums on seats and getting people signed up is what it’s all about. For example,the amount of people out there with graphic design qualifications is staggering.
      Absolutely no jobs for them but it doesn’t stop the educators from pumping their young naive heads full of bull shit.

      • Colonial Viper 13.2.1

        You supported education becoming a business for business, you moron.

        • BM 13.2.1.1

          What are you on about?
          What did I support?

          • Colonial Viper 13.2.1.1.1

            And you supported the destruction of trade training, exporting of NZ jobs and closing down of NZ industry. What the fuck are young people supposed to study which will meet with your approval?

      • prism 13.2.2

        And some older heads are full of bull shit that has been pumped in over the years BM.

  14. BrucetheMoose 14

    1000 each week! No wonder Key isn’t concerned. That is 1000 less that won’t reflect badly on him in the polls. It’s not like they were going to vote for him and his lot, so Johnny is quite happy to wave bye bye, thanks for making me look better than I really am.

  15. kiwicommie 15

    I probably will never return to New Zealand, National ruined it for me; truth is that National has done the damage and hundreds of thousands having established themselves in other countries will never return. I have lived in Australia, only to return and see National destroy the progress made since 1999. Now that I am in America, I see no point to return even if it means thousands a year in student loan repayments (which I will have to pay next year regardless); most former students would just become more determined to never return with an icy call from the IRD. Though, it would be interesting to see how National plans to jail people living overseas who can’t afford to pay.

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    Teina Pora spent 21 years behind bars for a crime he didn’t commit, shafted by a Police investigation that prioritised an investigator’s hunch over the pursuit of credible evidence. Yesterday’s announcement that the government is to pay him $2.5m in ...
    GreensBy David Clendon
    1 week ago
  • New Zealand Labour sends condolences to UK
    The New Zealand Labour Party is sickened and saddened by the murder of British Labour MP Jo Cox, Labour Leader Andrew Little says. “Ms Cox was killed in cold blood while simply doing her job as a constituent MP. She ...
    1 week ago
  • Shameful refugee quota increase still leaves NZ at the bottom of the list
    Minister for Immigration Michael Woodhouse announced this week that the government will put off increasing the refugee quota by 1000 places until 2018.  It’s a shameful decision that undermines the Government’s claim that it takes its international humanitarian obligations seriously, ...
    GreensBy Denise Roche
    1 week ago
  • Paula Bennett as a victim hard to swallow
    The National Party spin machine has gone into overdrive to try and present Paula Bennett as the victim in the Te Puea Marae smear saga, says Labour Housing spokesperson Phil Twyford. “Bill English in Parliament today tried valiantly to paint ...
    1 week ago
  • Voters to have the final veto on paid parental leave
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    1 week ago
  • Collins should put Kiwis’ money where her mouth is
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    1 week ago
  • Where is the leadership on equal pay for work of equal value?
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    GreensBy Jan Logie
    1 week ago
  • Kiwis’ real disposable income goes nowhere for the year
    New Zealanders’ hard work for the last year resulted in no increase in real disposable income, showing Kiwis aren’t getting ahead under National, says Labour’s Finance spokesperson Grant Robertson. “Today’s GDP figures reveal that real gross national disposable income per ...
    1 week ago
  • Pora case a case to learn from
    Conformation that Teina Pora will receive $2.5million from the Crown for more than 20 years of wrongful imprisonment does not fix the flaws in our system that led to this miscarriage of justice, Labour’s Justice spokesperson Jacinda Ardern says. “The ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Government needs to start again with RMA changes
    The National Government’s proposed changes to the Resource Management Act have attracted more than 800 submissions, many of them critical of key aspects of the Resource Legislation Bill. There has been much criticism of the new regulation making powers given ...
    GreensBy Eugenie Sage
    2 weeks ago
  • Bennett’s briefing completely unacceptable
    It is completely unacceptable that Paula Bennett briefed her political staff on the police investigation into Hurimoana Dennis after her meeting with him, despite it having nothing to do with her social housing portfolio, says Labour’s Housing spokesperson Phil Twyford. ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Speech to Green Building Council
    Building smarter, greener cities It will be clear to anyone who has been watching the public debate on the housing crisis that housing in New Zealand is sadly far from being economically sustainable when Auckland has the fourth most unaffordable ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Paula Bennett has more questions to answer
    It is unthinkable that Paula Bennett’s press secretary went rogue and tried to smear the reputation of someone involved in helping the homeless, Labour’s Housing spokesperson Phil Twyford says. “Political staff would not take such serious unilateral action without the ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Speech on Notice of Motion on Orlando
    Mr Speaker, The Labour Party joins with the government in expressing our horror at this atrocity and our love and sympathy are with the victims and their families. Our thoughts are with the people of Orlando and of the United ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Tiakina Ngā Wai – Swimmable Rivers Report June 2016
    The campaign to clean up our rivers was launched at the Green Conference at Queens Birthday weekend. However, the work prior to the launch goes back a number of years. Russel Norman and Eugenie Sage deserve full credit for the ...
    GreensBy Catherine Delahunty
    2 weeks ago
  • We can do more: Refugee quota should be doubled
    New Zealand is a better country than National’s miserable increase in the refugee quota that ignores our obligations to the international community and people in need, says Opposition Leader Andrew Little. “It is a sad day when the Government can’t ...
    2 weeks ago

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