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Transmission Gully to cost $15 per trip

Written By: - Date published: 9:52 am, August 30th, 2013 - 187 comments
Categories: transport - Tags:

If you had $3 billion to spend on transport over 25 years, what would you do with it? Increase spending on cycling facilities six-fold and give all our cities Amsterdam-like sustainable transport? Increase the amount spent on public transport by over a third? Or, build a duplicate motorway for 3% that Wellington’s population will use, at a cost to the taxpayer of $30 per commuter per day?

If you chose the third option, congratulations, you could work in Gerry Brownlee’s option. That’s right – the $3 billion Transmission Gully project, which will carry only 20,000 vehicles a day (basically, 10,000 commuters), will cost the taxpayer $15 for each trip driven on it for 25 years.

If you know why we need a duplicate motorway for a rout where traffic volumes are declining, and why it’s the best use of $3 billion for the country, well, could you tell me? Because I just can’t work it out.

tg cost per trip

187 comments on “Transmission Gully to cost $15 per trip”

  1. Stever 1

    I guess if you’re massively lobbied by the roading companies (how would we know?) and/or hoped for a good directorship with them once you’re out of government, you might make these sorts of plans.

    • Tom Gould 1.1

      Or, you have enough sense to realise that the current route out of Wellington is stuffed and after 25 years of procrastination it’s time to get on an build Transmission Gully? It recently took me two hours to drive the 60km from the airport as far as Waikanae early afternoon on a week day. I guess I could have rode a bike, in the wind and rain, and taken all day? Maybe we should bring back the horse and carriage?

      • ghostwhowalksnz 1.1.1

        Heard of the train ?

        Its the same anywhere Friday afternoon, bad weather , gridlock early on.

        Wont change with a new motorway. Just check out Aucklands motorway to Puhoi, the queues stretch back along the motorway .

        Capacity of motorway 2500 cars per lane, capacity of road at end of motorway 1200 cars per lane.

        Its simple maths

        • srylands 1.1.1.1

          “Heard of the train ?”

          The train is grubby, with school kids and viruses. It is also (mostly) slower than the car. I used it for 20 yearsm so I have a sound point of comparison.

          • Daveosaurus 1.1.1.1.1

            In other words: “oooh, icky young people”.

            Sounds like a great advertisement for congestion charging. A 100% avoidable stupidity tax, paid only by the sort of people who regard their fellow citizens as “oooh, icky young people:”.

          • QoT 1.1.1.1.2

            Sorry, srylands, I don’t see why someone living in Australia is qualified to comment on the current state of Wellington public transport.

        • Tim 1.1.1.2

          Speaking of the train, if this route is to be pursued, 3 metres to the side of the Gully road could provide an alternate train route (with tunnels where necessary), and pick up Pauatahanui, Whitby, all those Porirua East Suburbs and newer ones to the south before relinking with the Main Trunk Line.
          No so expensive if its done in conjunction with TG, and a better option for the future.

      • Conor 1.1.2

        Well, you lobby for electrification to Waikanae and more train services, as well as the Bus Rapid Transit to the airport. Far cheaper. Even with Transmission Gully you’ll still get bottlenecks.

  2. TheContrarian 2

    Whether Transmission Gully or not something still needs to be done. The Centennial Highway is not only inadequate, it is also dangerous.

    And cycle ways are all well and good but I don’t fancy anyone cycling to the Kapiti Coast for a weekend away with the family.

    • bad12 2.1

      Dangerous, get with the play, since the wire barrier was installed along the ‘dangerous’ part of the Centennial Highway there have been how many deaths on that stretch of road…

      • TheContrarian 2.1.1

        Motorcyclists certainly aren’t a fan. And yes the wire barriers save lifes but doens’t stop the accidents themselves.
        Nonetheless it is in dire need of an upgrade or something because as it stands it is extremely congested and inadequate for a growing capital city.
        I know, I know “more public transport” but even with more public transport you still have families, trucks and holiday makers using the road which is in a terrible state. Having to sit on it for three or more hours after a holiday weekend isn’t any fun.

        I’m not stumping for transmission gully itself, more that I recognise the current road is inadequate

        • Lightly 2.1.1.1

          $3 billion seems like a hell of a lot of money to spend on a duplicate motorway if the problem is improving a few stretches on the existing road…. and how does TG fix that anyway?

          • TheContrarian 2.1.1.1.1

            It needs another lane in each direction – particularly that stretch that goes around the sea with the cliffs on the other side. Also coming up into Raumati there are stretches of dual lanes but they bottle neck into a single lane a bit further down the road. Very frustrating on long weekends.

            • Lightly 2.1.1.1.1.1

              So, because there’s a few hours of congestion on public holidays for a few thousand people, we should build a $3 billion road?

              This is why we have benefit/cost ratios and assess them for the country as a whole, not just for the people who sue the road. The few who use the route get a great benefit, but everyone else shoulders a huge cost. There are other things we could do with that money that would create more good for more people.

              • TheContrarian

                “So, because there’s a few hours of congestion on public holidays for a few thousand people, we should build a $3 billion road?”

                I think you missed the bit where I said ‘I’m not stumping for transmission gully itself, more that I recognise the current road is inadequate”

                • weka

                  “I know, I know “more public transport” but even with more public transport you still have families, trucks and holiday makers using the road which is in a terrible state. Having to sit on it for three or more hours after a holiday weekend isn’t any fun.”

                  I gather that the Dutch stagger their holidays in order to avoid road congestion. I’m sure there are many varied and complementary solutions to Wellington road congestion, that would be solved with intelligent and creative/lateral thinking* and planning. Unfortunately we have a govt with an agenda that has little to do with the wellbeing of NZ.

                  *lateral for NACT. But if you listen to people thinking outside the neoliberal box, it’s just normal thinking.

        • bad12 2.1.1.2

          i am not about to provide the likes of you with research, BUT, i suggest that what you have just posted as a comment is Bulls**t,

          If you are going to post comments on fact where’s the links to the accident rate befor the wire barrier was installed and the accident rate after the wire barrier was installed???

          As far as what i have commented about Transmission Gully there has been NO call for further upgrading of public transport from Kapiti to Wellington, there is a perfectly adequate and underused double track railway connecting the two,

          What i believe needs building is a number of car park buildings at all of the high use rail stations including Paraparaumu, Pukerua Bay, Plimmerton,Mana/Paremata,Porirua, Linden, Tawa/ Redwood, thus allowing a greatly expanded use of park and ride for commuting,

          To make such parking buildings both more affordable and more effective they could be built in conjunction with apartments above the car park levels and shopping complexes on one floor or another…

          • TheContrarian 2.1.1.2.1

            Are you really suggesting using a wire barrier over a concrete one actually prevents accidents from happening in the first place? Magic Wire!

            Fact remains that stretch of the highway is notoriously narrow and unforgiving – no matter what barrier one uses.It needs to be widened at least and build out over the sea to add a passing lane, do that same on the other side too. You could have, as you suggested carparks at either end say so there is the option to take rail if ones choses

            • bad12 2.1.1.2.1.1

              TC, what i am suggesting is that the wire barrier has dramatically reduced ALL accidents along that stretch of the Highway, and, i cannot remember a fatal accident having occurred along the ‘wired’ stretch of Centennial since that barrier was installed,

              i still await your posting of the Proof of the first assertion you made at 10.20,

              The rest of my post does not suggest that we simply stick a carpark at each end of the Centennial Highway, please god send us some wing-nuts with a higher intellect than the current crop…

              • TheContrarian

                Proof that the road is dangerous? Or proof that a wire barrier doesn’t stop people still having accidents?

                I’m not a wing-nut by any stretch of the imagination. Sorry pal.

                • bad12

                  All roads are inherently dangerous especially those that have traffic hurtling toward each other at 100K an hour with a painted line separating them from each other,

                  Even those that have concrete barriers are dangerous, less so than those which rely on a simple painted line as the means of separation admittedly, but as all modes of transport are controlled at the whim of Humans they are simply as fallible as the average Human is,

                  Your claim is that accidents still happen on the stretch of Centennial Highway that has had the ‘wire barrier’ installed,

                  Such a claim is bullshit, such a claim insinuates that the wire barrier achieved nothing, when the facts are that the installation of the wire barrier has been the catalyst for there to be a dramatic fall in the amount of accidents on that stretch of Highway, and what accidents do occur are far less severe than those that previously occurred resulting in far less severe injury than befor…

                  Provide us the proof, accidents befor the barrier was installed versus accidents after the barrier was installed…

                  • TheContrarian

                    No, no, no. Fuck man, pay attention
                    The wire barrier has dramatically reduced the risk of death and serious injury. Yes, we know that and I never ‘insinuated’ the wire barrier achieved nothing.

                    People are still crashing because it is a narrow, twisting road with little room for error. The wire barrier can’t change the shape of the road, the width of the road etc. It just stops people from careening into oncoming traffic or smashing into a heavy concrete median.

                    Here, page 23. It conclusively shows the wire barrier saves life’s and serious injury and the road is safer. But 81 people still crashed on that stretch of road – as it is a fast piece if highway then such crashes are more than a mere ding, carry on your way. The road is too narrow so when a crash occurs there is no way to get around it so traffic backs up. This road needs upgrading because it is a high accident area and once a crash has happened traffic backs up because there is no where else to go.

                    “Your claim is that accidents still happen on the stretch of Centennial Highway that has had the ‘wire barrier’ installed,”
                    Because they do

                    accidents befor the barrier was installed versus accidents after the barrier was installed…
                    Done.
                    Page 23
                    http://www.kiwirap.org.nz/pdf/KiwiRAP%20FINAL%20Intro%20and%20Performance%20Tracking%20for%20website.pdf

                    • srylands

                      Yes well said. I have had vistors from Australia laugh (literally) when I tell them this is the main road to Wellington. My sister asked me why we put up with it.

                      The fact that there is any debate about this speaks volumes about the mindset of too many New Zealanders. I am lost about how this happened – maybe we need to look at the school curriculum? I also think that many of this mindset just don’t get out and about enough around the world and look at the roads OECD nations employ – even countries with comparble GDP per capita (Slovenia for example) have much better roads.

                      It comes back to the big problem of productivity and supporting an underclass on welfare at $25 billion plus PER YEAR to do nothing (or have more kids – rinse and repeat).

                      So a couple of billion for TG over 25 years is nothing. How about $250 billion over 25 years for welfare checks that just take the country backwards.

                      I have answered my own question – Slovenia doesn’t spend $25 billion annually on welfare checks.

                    • McFlock

                      Slovenia vs NZ:
                      half the population,
                      half the GDP,
                      4 times the population density

                      Oh, and much lower GINI than NZ. Might have an effect on welfare cheques, you cherry-pickin’ liar.

                      And you’ll probably find that Slovenia pisses less money away on holiday highways, too

                    • srylands

                      “you cherry-pickin’ liar. ”

                      Another example of bad manners.

                    • McFlock

                      the first example being your cherry pickin’ lyin’.

                • McFlock

                  Actually, a physical barrier prevents dangerous passing manoeuvers as well as providing a stronger perception that the margin for safety ends in the driver’s own lane (much stronger than a thin white line with all this apparently empty space to the right).

                  So yes, physical barriers do prevent accidents, as well as minimising their effect.

                  • TheContrarian

                    Indeed, but nonetheless it is an infamous accident area, wire barrier not with standing. It is narrow, congested, and there are frequent accidents. If not Transmission Gully then the current road should be upgraded in some fashion.

                    • McFlock

                      The barriers were part of that ongoing upgrade.

                      Still no actual accident rate data, then?

                  • Greywarbler

                    srylands @ 1.11 pm
                    How can saying cherry pickin’ lying be bad manners? If it is true -
                    1 That you’re cherry picking.
                    2 That you’re deliberately putting false figures into the argument.

                    Don’t try to throw a cloak of affronted prissyness over the thread when people address your comments directly and find them wanting.

        • fender 2.1.1.3

          ” …..inadequate for a growing capital city.”

          Key told us Wellington was a dying city.

        • Lightly 2.1.1.4

          traffic volumes are falling between wellington and the kapiti coast – all TG would do is subsidise more sprawl – we all get to pay so a handful of commuters get a faster drive

          • TheContrarian 2.1.1.4.1

            The current road has been inadequate for quite some time. It’s not a new problem. The volume would have to fall pretty low for it to be as viable as when it was built. But yeah – forget TG, just widen the road and add a few more passing lanes/dual carriage ways and it should suffice for the time being

            • alwyn 2.1.1.4.1.1

              There used to be passing lanes in parts of the road. They were removed because the tend to cause both more accidents and greater hold-ups when the road is heavily used.
              Cars, attempting to pass, tend to speed up at the end of the passing lane and then, trying to merge, hit vehicles in the other lane. The merging of two lanes also slows down the traffic to below the peak flow speed and creates a disturbance in the traffic flow that propogates backwards up the highway.
              That they don’t work in heavy traffic volume situations is why they are generally closed off during holiday weekends.

    • Jack 2.2

      More cycle lanes are NOT a serious solution to transport issues in Wellington. Investment in improved public transport along with promoting car pooling (eg faster lanes for cars with 2 or more people in them) may help. But frankly the Centennial Highway problems won’t be solved by cycle lanes (my grandmother won’t be using them). And frankly Wellington Streets are dangerous for cyclists and the council should be actively encouraging cyclists to stay at home.

      Transmission Gully doesn’t have to be a bad thing – it may make bus services to Kapiti more efficient. Not investing in core infrastructure isn’t environmentally sustainable.

  3. framu 3

    youve got this all wrong – srylands has told us that he drives this route everyday from australia. So he should know right?
    :-)

    • srylands 3.1

      “youve got this all wrong – srylands has told us that he drives this route everyday from australia. So he should know right.”

      No I fly from Australia. I drive from the Kapiti Coast.

      Last night was typical. Road works on the wire barrier section. One lane closed. Wire barrier down with traffic directed across it one direction at a time. 10 minute delay getting home.

      We need better transport infrastructure all round. Hopefully TG is the first installment in a motorway standard road from Wellington to Auckland.

      Note that in 1975 Australia had our standard of SH1 between Syd and Mlb. It is now a motorway standard all the way, with no traffic lights between Syd and Mlb.

      TG is a 100 year asset. And traffic volumes will increase over the next 100 years.

      • Lightly 3.1.1

        I’m happy to pay my share of $3 billion so you don’t occasionally have a 10 minute delay. Where do I sign up?

        The comparison with Australia and Melbourne is stupid. each of them have the same population as the whole of New Zealand and several million more live in close proximity to that route. Kapiti has a population of 50,000, only 10,000 of whom commute to Wellington

        • framu 3.1.1.1

          oddly enough – thats the exact claimed time saving for the orewa tunnel north of auckland

          but the ticketing/payment system is such ill thought out bollocks, and because everyone uses the tunnel, its actually comparable time wise and just plain easier to just go through orewa like we always did.

      • framu 3.1.2

        yeah whatever mate – its a joke, get over it.

        “No I fly from Australia. I drive from the Kapiti Coast.” – yeah i make up stories too, fun isnt it? Face it, you got caught out in a massive lie the other day (or you let the appearance of the lie persist)

        “Road works” – yeah road works happen all over the place all the time, its hardly unique to that bit of road in australia, i mean kapiti, whoops – i meant 15% gst

        “in 1975 Australia had our standard of SH1 between Syd and Mlb” – so in 100 years will the population travelling whatever routes out of wellington, be the same as the amount travelling the syd > melb route today?. Without any data its kinda pointless. One could equally point to all sorts of roads all over the place. Without comparable data its pointless

        :”And traffic volumes will increase over the next 100 years.” – evidence please (real evidence , not some dross from rodger kerr)

        • srylands 3.1.2.1

          ” yeah road works happen all over the place all the time, its hardly unique to that bit of road in australia,”

          No I was referring to SH1.

          • framu 3.1.2.1.1

            so i take it you cant answer any of the points raised or questions addressed to you?

            because if you could, you would.

            The distraction/derailment game is the first identifier of trollism

        • srylands 3.1.2.2

          “(real evidence , not some dross from rodger (sic) kerr)”

          Roger Kerr did more for high quality public policy analysis than any other New Zealander in the last 50 years. We all owe him gratitude.

          This tribute by Janet Albrechtsen says it all really.

          http://nzinitiative.org.nz/site/nzbr/files/1110%20Tribute%20to%20Roger.pdf

          • framu 3.1.2.2.1

            so no evidence then?

            thought so

            • srylands 3.1.2.2.1.1

              Calm down. You don’t have to use TG when it is built. You don’t pay any taxes or own a car so it won’t cost you.

              • framu

                im actually in the top tax bracket and own a car, and as pointed out to you earlier the funding comes from taxation of one form or another

                still no evidence though.

                • srylands

                  “im actually in the top tax bracket and own a car,”

                  I’m impressed. Are you an Oriental bay Green? They park their Beemers in those cute little garages and walk to work in Jervois Quay. Then the Beeners come out on Sunday for the trip to Martinborough. (I am not making this up.)

                  Sorry I’ve lost the thread. I’m bored, and busy. The reality is that 14 months from now those big Komatsus sill be clawing away at the escarpement. Gerry will have had his “turning the first sod” thing with the silver shovel.

                  I suggest you investigate things you can change (the wisdom to know and all that :-) :-))

                  • framu

                    so im lefty that works hard, owns a car and gets paid well – its not really that impressive

                    “Sorry I’ve lost the thread. I’m bored, and busy.”
                    - ahh, no evidence then. Thought not.

                    • srylands

                      “a comment from yourself that occured some time ago and in a different set of replies ”

                      sorry I have lost the thread again :-)

          • McFlock 3.1.2.2.2

            The fact you had the stupidity to write that says it all about you.

            That fucker killed people with a pen.

          • thatguynz 3.1.2.2.3

            Good god man, now you’re seriously taking the piss..

    • srylands 3.2

      “youve got this all wrong – srylands has told us that he drives this route everyday from australia.”

      Just to clarify – I said i drove this route when I was NOt in Australia.

  4. srylands 4

    So charge a $15 toll to use it. Problem solved.

    • TheContrarian 4.1

      Does that include the cost of the flight from Australia?

    • Lightly 4.2

      except no-one will pay a $15 toll, especially not when the existing road is free (and there legally has to be a free alternative to toll roads)

      And the way National is setting it up, the taxpayer pays the 4120m a year to the private consortium regardless of traffic volumes…. so your ‘solution’ actually on succeeds in slashing the number of people using TG to nearly nothing and the taxpayer pays anyway.

      • srylands 4.2.1

        “except no-one will pay a $15 toll, especially not when the existing road is free (and there legally has to be a free alternative to toll roads)”

        The existing road would not be maintained to highway standards so would become unattractive. It will not be a viable alternatve for long.

        People would not pay a $15 toll. Well not every day. I predict the toll will be $5. ($200 per month if you commute Monday-Friday)

        My commuting costs (when I am in NZ) are (per month):

        $400 petrol (About $100 of this is fuel excise)
        $380 parking
        $200 (approx vehicle maintenance tyres etc)

        Total = $980 per month

        So this will rise to $1180 per month. (There may be some minor clawback with fuel savings).

        • bad12 4.2.1.1

          SSLands, the boss says you should get back to the adding machine as he wants those figures by lunchtime and is sick of you wanking about online when you are supposed to be, as the mere serf you are, making Him money…

          • srylands 4.2.1.1.1

            We have not had adding machines in this place since 1986.

            • bad12 4.2.1.1.1.1

              Lolz, keep the fantasy working overtime SSLands, the place you claim to work wasn’t ‘there’ in 1986,

              Compulsive Liars when called on their lies cannot help but further complicate the original lie by adding too it layers of what they think will be believable…

              • srylands

                It is “srylands” not “SSlands. Warping the identity of others was a technique comminly used by the Stasi. It was also applied grotesquely by pakeha to Maori. Maori children at school were prevented from using their names. What you are doing is exactly the same.

                “Compulsive Liars when called on their lies cannot help but further complicate the original lie by adding too it layers of what they think will be believable…”

                I don’t know what you are on about. You simply resort to bad manners when called out on policy ideas that will make New Zealand a poorer place. My motivation in commenting on the site is totally altrusitic. I am concerned about the welfare of workers and the poor. The policies that you promote will harm these New Zealanders. It is exactly the same motivation that drove Roger Kerr (RIP).

                I accept you mean well but you are misguided. The world is moving in the polar opposite direction to that which you advocate. That makes you frustrated. That boils over into bad manners. I understand.

                • McFlock

                  So making fun of your online pseudonym is exactly the same as the Stasi or systematic cultural oppression. Bit of a long bow to draw even for you, spylands.

                  whoops, just oppressed you over generations. My bad.

                • bad12

                  Roger Kerr, (RIPOFF) is what you mean??? aw SSLands have i bent your silver spoon,

                  Better go get it extracted, bent silver spoons create gastric congestion,(which may in turn lead to a restricted ability for you to create a fantasy) in essence as my forbears would have said to you,

                  ”Kaore Kai, kaore tutae, kaore tutae,koe mate,

                  PS, i do tho find my funny bone is definitely activated with your appeal to my better nature via the ”Maori kids were not allowed to use their own names” and could well imagine myself moved to tears if this were to be accompanied by a violin solo,

                  i can assure you i have full knowledge of what ‘Maori kids’ have been subjected to and can even tell you that at least one ‘Maori kid’ was hauled out of a social studies class in the early 1970′s and whipped with a piece of cane for inquiring where the brown half of the class was when Captain Cook discovered New Zealand,

                  Your having an internet debate with that ‘kid’ right now Boyo so save your f**king faux sympathy…

                • Murray Olsen

                  Yeah, yeah, Roger Kerr loved the poor so much he just wanted to make more of them.
                  I think Sorrylands needs professional help. After his performance the other day, with more fucks per line than a WhaleSpew thread, he’s talking about bad manners? FFS. Seriously, get help before you do yourself some real harm.

    • Colonial Viper 4.3

      For someone who is against high taxation, and is also a believer in the Laffer Curve, you have weird ideas.

      • Steve Wrathall 4.3.1

        Do you believe govt revenue would be maximised at 100% taxation? If not, you believe in the Laffer Curve

        • Colonial Viper 4.3.1.1

          You asked me a question about a point feature, and then said it means I believe in the whole curve.

          That’s really stupid.

    • Macro 4.4

      “So charge a $15 toll to use it. Problem solved.”

      Yeah Right! You know about toll roads don’t you!? User pays? Check this out:
      http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/overpriced-and-underused-m6-toll-road-is-going-nowhere-fast-8606755.html
      Why waste money on what will be ulimately another white elephant!

      • srylands 4.4.1

        “Why waste money on what will be ulimately another white elephant!”

        It will be highly used and wildly popular. It will be a valued asset for a century. In 20 years people will go on walking tours through the old road and gape in amazement that it was the road to Wellington.

        That’s why.

        • Macro 4.4.1.1

          Do you have ANY understanding of History?
          http://www.historylearningsite.co.uk/roads_1750_to_1900.htm
          Those who don’t are destined to repeat it – the fate of toll roads has always been one of disuse and ultimate falling in to disrepair and collapse. TG and all the other white elephants will be no different. A complete and utter waste of money for no good purpose other than to polish the egos of a few idiots.
          And read the other link in my comment above – you never know you MIGHT learn something.

        • Ad 4.4.1.2

          If that was the case then Treasury’s procurement conditions for Transmission Gully would not stipulate that the PPP will not include road usage – and all its attendant modelling problems. Treasury has seen the utter failure of all those Australian tolled ppp’s over the last decade.

          Can anyone explain why New Zealand is one of the last countries in the world to keep pouring huge funding into motorways?

          • srylands 4.4.1.2.1

            “Can anyone explain why New Zealand is one of the last countries in the world to keep pouring huge funding into motorways?”

            You are kidding right? What huge funding? What motorways?

            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_OECD_countries_by_road_network_size#Motorway_network

            • Macro 4.4.1.2.1.1

              Do you actually READ the links you provide? Or are you capable of understanding the content? Your link shows that NZ has a length of public roading per capita that exceeds the USA, and is the 4th highest in that category.
              It also carries this warning:
              “The factual accuracy of parts of this article (those related to tables) may be compromised due to out-of-date information. Please update this article to reflect recent events or newly available information. (November 2011)”
              Furthermore, you will note that according to the table Australia has NO motorways whatsoever! NZ’s are mostly expressways and do not count either – but they are nonetheless expensive to build.

              • srylands

                “Do you actually READ the links you provide? Or are you capable of understanding the content? Your link shows that NZ has a length of public roading per capita that exceeds the USA, and is the 4th highest in that category.”

                You are misreading the table! NZ has the 4th LOWEST quantum of motorways per capita (41.3) (And 1,2,3) are outliers).

                yes the data has limitations but the conclusion is unambiguous – in the OECD NZ stands out as having woefully under invested in high standard roads. The paucity of motorways in NZ compared to any other industrial country is very notable.

                Not sure why Australia is missing from the table. But they would rank in the top half. I can get the data if you insist.

                • srylands

                  OK I re read your post:

                  Your link shows that NZ has a length of public roading per capita that exceeds the USA, and is the 4th highest in that category.

                  So what – “public roads” includes ANY road. Big deal.

                  My point was about the paucity of motorways. I stand by the data. We have under invested in high quality roads. TG will add 27 km. A tiny start. We really need a high standard motorway from Auckland to Wellington. It could probably be built for the equivalent cost of 2 years welfare payments ($50 billion)

  5. srylands 5

    “according to the Green Party, tolls are likely to contribute just a fraction of what the Government will pay back to a consortium over 25 years, with taxpayers still footing the lion’s share of the bill.”

    Also if teh article is quoting the Greens correctly, that claim is wrong. Taxpayers pay nothong for transmission gully. It is all out of the NLTF – it is all user pays. A toll would be better policy. In practice we will have a combination of both.

    It is a lot of fuss over a tiny 27 km motorway repalcing a third world road.

    Anyway it is a done deal. Time to move on.

    • Lightly 5.1

      Um. Where does the money in the NLTF come from ? the land of pixies. No, it comes from TAXES on fuel and road use (and some from the general taxation pool). So, it is funded by taxpayers.

      And it’s not ‘user pays’ if every taxpaying road user int he country pays for a road that only 10,000 people use. That’s, like, the opposite of user pays.

      • srylands 5.1.1

        “(and some from the general taxation pool)”

        What taxes are used to pay for state highways? (apart from fuel excise and road user charges)?

      • srylands 5.1.2

        “And it’s not ‘user pays’ if every taxpaying road user int he country pays for a road that only 10,000 people use. That’s, like, the opposite of user pays.”

        I don’t see the Greens arguing that all users of the rail service between the Coast and Wellington should pay for the full cost of the service. the current return trip from Paraparaumu costs about $22. That would be close to $50 if it had to cover the full cost.

        Road users subsidise rail (rightly) because it reduces road congestion.

        • framu 5.1.2.1

          whoop-dee-do

          for extra points can you show how this is even relevant to your claim that “Taxpayers pay nothong for transmission gully”?

          you are making this incredibly easy by the way.

          • srylands 5.1.2.1.1

            “you are making this incredibly easy by the way.”

            I’ll remember that over the next 6 years as I drive past giant Komatsu earth movers cutting through the escarpement next to macKays Crossing :-) I can’t wait.

            • framu 5.1.2.1.1.1

              whoop-dee-do

              can you show how this is even relevant to your claim that “Taxpayers pay nothong for transmission gully”?

  6. infused 6

    Can’t wait for it.

    Longer it’s left, the more expensive it’s getting. Hurry up and build the fucking thing.

  7. infused 7

    What’s the Greens alternative?

    • Lightly 7.1

      by alternative do you ‘where would they spend the $3 billion instead’ or ‘what would they spend on the Kapiti route, which has falling traffic volumes?’

      • infused 7.1.1

        Thanks for pointing out your short sited views. I love how you guys think. Can’t see past your feet.

        • Lanthanide 7.1.1.1

          I would have thought spending $3b on a road with declining traffic volumes was short sighted, with the definition of “short sighted” being “only looking at the near future and not long-term trends”. Silly me.

  8. jaymam 8

    $15 per trip, that’s a very good way of showing what projects cost.
    May I ask everyone to work out all expensive projects on a per-something basis?
    e.g. the cost of a road as a cost per metre of one lane
    the cost of a building as a cost per square metre
    a sewage treatment plant as a cost per ratepayer
    an airport extension as a cost per metre
    etc
    then any outrageously expensive project is really easy to spot.

    • swan 8.1

      Cost of the CRL in Auckland is even worse. It is in the order of $20-$40 a trip depending on patronage projection etc.

      • Melb 8.1.1

        We won’t see the Greens make a nice picture about that!

      • Macro 8.1.2

        link?
        or just out of your arse?

        • srylands 8.1.2.1

          It is close. But of course the Greens only apply CBA when it suits. Thats why we have a Green Wellington mayor advocating a loner runway at Wellington airport and light rail TO the airport. Cost benefit rations? oops. We only apply those to NASTY roads. Then oppose building them anywhere any time forever.

    • alwyn 8.2

      A couple that spring to mind are.

      Auckland,s CRL is estimated at about $3 billion for 3.5 km.
      That’s about $860 million/ km.
      The extension of the Wellington runway, so beloved by the city’s Green mayor, is estimated at about $300 million for 300 metres.
      That’s a nice round billion dollars per kilometre.

      Transmission Gulley seems like a real bargain compared to those.

      • srylands 8.2.1

        “The extension of the Wellington runway, so beloved by the city’s Green mayor, is estimated at about $300 million for 300 metres.”

        Thats what gets me about the Greens. CBA is applied selectively. Why on earth did Celia think it was a good idea to give corporate welfare to Infratil? And then raise expectations the ratepayers would subsidise a runway?

        Back to TG. Isn’t the solution to privatise all transport ? – i.e sell all the current roads to the private sector and charge for their use. Do the same for PT. Then the market can determine capital projects and any subsidies for uneconomic transport can be visisble.

        The current debate over TG could be avoided. We have (mostly) got the Government out of decisions on which electricity assets should be built, and which aircraft Air NZ should purchase. The same can be done for roads. Those who can and will pay get roads to a standard thet are willing to pay for. Everyone else can stay out of it.

        • framu 8.2.1.1

          ” sell all the current roads to the private sector and charge for their use”

          god – thats got to be one of the stupidest ideas going and for the ideology that bangs on and on about choice i amazed you cant see the colossal hole in the argument.

          If a private company owns a road and you dont like their pricing how do you get your car to a different one?

          Ive bought the road out side your house in kapiti, australia – dont like my prices – tough shit because youve got no way to avoid paying me to connect to the wider network

          and thats before we even get to the dead weight of pointless duplication

          large scale, nationwide infrastucture is more efficient if its run as a single operator network. And its even better if there arent rentseekers squatting on it sucking profit out

          • srylands 8.2.1.1.1

            You realise I am referring to the Kapiti region north of Wellington? It is not in Australia.

            • framu 8.2.1.1.1.1

              oh god – youve gone all brett dale

              Its obvious that im reffering to the thread the other day when you were caught out in regards to you being in australia and kapiti at the same time.

              Just address the questions put to you wonder boy.

        • bad12 8.2.1.2

          SSLands, i have no objection for the Transmission Gully route to be sold at market value to the likes of you to build a road on,

          i see no reason then to add even a cent of public money including fuel taxes to the building of Transmission Gully,

          You and your ilk can buy the land, pay to build the road ,and charge people whatever you want to drive on it,

          Problem solved, why are you not busy pressing the current Government to sell you the Transmission Gully route…

          • srylands 8.2.1.2.1

            “Problem solved, why are you not busy pressing the current Government to sell you the Transmission Gully route…”

            Because construction is about to start. Problem solved.

            • Macro 8.2.1.2.1.1

              So now is your chance – get in quick and make a killing!

              • srylands

                Get in quick on what? It is not even clear which of the two consortiums will win the tender. Luckily they are both high quality candidates. I am sure they will do a great job. It will be exciting to watch the road being built from next year. New Zealand has so much wasteful public spending, it is heartening to finally see an investment in something truly worthwhile.

                • Macro

                  Look just put your tender in and make sure you leave some money on the table ;) – it’s all yours and then you can charge whatever you like and if you make your toll high enuf then no one else will want to use, it and you can zip up and down to your hearts content!

  9. bad12 10

    What the advocates for the ‘white elephant’ Transmission gully cannot seem to grasp is that in ‘rush hour traffic’ Transmission gully will allow them to access the Wellington Motorway at Linden/Tawa in a far faster manner than the Centennial highway in it’s present form accomplishes,

    What then, as the Ngaraunga interchange is currently a major ‘choke point’ for South bound traffic which at peak use times backs the traffic up on the Ngaraunga Gorge section and slows this back up to a stop start crawl adding further traffic from Transmission Gully to the Wellington Motorway in a faster time frame than is currently achieved via the Centennial Highway will simply exacerbate the wait times in the current peak time snarl up on the Ngaraunga Gorge,

    Thus Transmission Gully will have No benefit for the peak time traveler in either time or fuel savings, simply giving the illusion of speed over the Kapiti to Linden/Tawa stretch of Motorway whereupon the ‘choke point’ of the Ngaraunga interchange will remove any and all savings in time and fuel gained,

    As far as roads goes, the only possible means of achieving any time and/or fuel savings from building Transmission Gully would necessitate the addition to the Wellington Motorway at the point where the Ngaraunga Interchange disgorges the contents Kapiti/Porirua/Tawa traffic onto the Urban Motorway the addition of at least 2 extra lanes,

    The problems thus created tho would make this a 5 lane spaghetti junction with both Hutt and Kapiti traffic bound for Wellington having to negotiate 5 lanes so as to be traveling in the ‘right’ lane in a very short length of motorway to be able to exit the Urban Motorway at their desired off-ramp,

    One mistake on any give day would simply result in chaos with the whole South bound system blocked for hours…

    • srylands 10.1

      I agree with that. The solution is twofold:

      1. Improve the Ngaraunga interchange (widening the urban motorway to 4 lanes would do the trick)\

      2. Introduce congestion charges to smooth out the peak. In the morning the congestion is only a real problem at that interchange from about 0740 to 0850. At school holidays when traffic volumes at that time fall by 10% the problem largely goes away. So simple – introduce pricing to move 10% of the traffic to earlier or later.

      • bad12 10.1.1

        SSLands, you need not exercise your particular ‘intelligence’ with this particular question, simply close your eyes and change the fantasy you are in, Wellington, flick, Sydney, flick, Melbourne,and flick, back to Wellington,

        While as a ‘thought’ this sounds like a simple solution it would simply create a ‘high accident zone’ where the two flows Kapiti v Hutt would have a very small stretch of highway to negotiate over 4 or 5 lanes to ensure they were in the correct lane so as to be able to exit the Urban Motorway at the particular off ramp for their destination…

      • bad12 10.1.2

        So now the solution moves from $3 billion + to 5 billion plus dollars, each trip now being 25 dollars each way as any such ‘fix’ would require an extra lane on the North bound stretch of the Urban motorway from the Aotea Quay on ramp to the Ngaraunga interchange,

        Congestion charges???so that in your fantasy we should spend 5 or 6 billion dollars for you to shave 3 minutes off of as your little fantasy tells us is a non peak time journey in both directions,

        We simply come back to a perfectly adequate and underused rail system where it was shown that tripling the number of car parks available at Paraparaumu rail station tripled the number of people making use of park and ride,

        Paraparaumu rail station’s car park is now full again on every working day and turning the one level of tarmac into 2 or 3 parking buildings with apartment complexes built on upper levels would take 100′s more vehicles off of the road network…

        • srylands 10.1.2.1

          “Paraparaumu rail station’s car park is now full again on every working day and turning the one level of tarmac into 2 or 3 parking buildings with apartment complexes built on upper levels would take 100′s more vehicles off of the road network…”

          Good grief. I missed that gem of an idea.

          Living in an apartment above the Paraparaumu railway station would be so cool. (NOT!)

          Is this where the Kiwibuild places are going to go? The only people that would live above the railway station at Paraparaumu are refugees and long term welfare no hopers and gang members. Welcome to the ghetto. It woud then become a cesspit that nobody would go near. End of park and ride.

          • McFlock 10.1.2.1.1

            only if the apartments were built to the lowest standard possible by absentee property developers.

            • srylands 10.1.2.1.1.1

              “only if the apartments were built to the lowest standard possible by absentee property developers.’

              Um no. Even if they were built to the highest building standards, living above the Paraparaumu railway station would be a nightmare. Hence the only way to get people to live there would be to make them cheap.

              • McFlock

                Um yes.

                Decent building standards with a couple of levels of parking and maybe a small shopping complex as sound and vibration buffers would work wonders. Probably be better than quite a few inner-city apartments/hotel rooms I’ve been in.

                • bad12

                  indeed, considering that such apartment complexes would be built above any numbers of floors of car parking and if required a shopping floor such apartments would be ‘interesting’ places to live along with a great use of the space and providing the means for reducing number of vehicles on the Highway system at peak flow times…

                  • srylands

                    “such apartments would be ‘interesting’ places to live along with a great use of the space and providing the means for reducing number of vehicles on the Highway system at peak flow times…”

                    Great – why don’t you approach a bank with that idea and develop the complex? You could be known as the Kapiti ghetto master.

                    • Ad

                      They already have in Auckland. The whole lot sold off the plans, and it’s now under construction. Check it out it’s in New Lynn. It’s a partnership between Council and Infratil Properties Ltd.

                      The transit station, shared space area, library etc have all won massive architectural and construction awards.

                  • srylands

                    “indeed, considering that such apartment complexes would be built above any numbers of floors of car parking and if required a shopping floor such apartments would be ‘interesting’ places to live along with a great use of the space and providing the means for reducing number of vehicles on the Highway system at peak flow times…”

                    Right so propert developers always have an idea to making a buck. Why do you think this might not have happened?

                    • McFlock

                      Right so propert developers always have an idea to making a buck. Why do you think this might not have happened?

                      Too busy selling bush-girt mansions with sea views at the end of the proposed holiday highways. /sarc

                      Seriously, is your argument against an idea simply that every single idea worth doing has already been done?

                    • bad12

                      Its obviously had one drink to many again, i suppose we are providing some good in the world by keeping it busy, if it were not venting its bile here it would probably be engaged in some act of drunken family violence..

                    • srylands

                      “Its obviously had one drink to many again, i suppose we are providing some good in the world by keeping it busy, if it were not venting its bile here it would probably be engaged in some act of drunken family violence..”

                      You are the one that vents bile. Typical Left nastiness. You can really see how the Satsi managed to recruit so many citizens. A state in NZ I am sure you sould be totally at home at.

                    • McFlock

                      spylands, did you ever notice that you’re a hypocrite as well as a fucking cherry pickin’ liar?

                    • srylands

                      “spylands, did you ever notice that you’re a hypocrite as well as a fucking cherry pickin’ liar?”

                      No but I noticed you are rude.

                    • McFlock

                      just a different flavour of rudeness from your own.

                      you cherry-pickin’ lyin’ hypocrite

                    • Ad

                      You should also have a good look at what Cooper and Co have done around and over Britomart over the last decade. It’s commercially successful and people love it.

                • srylands

                  Whooa, no no. You are taking the piss.

                  Why would anyone want to live in the middle of Paraparaumu near the bloody railway station !!? Within 10 minutes drive there are fantastic places for housing (or exisiting houses) with waterfront, beach, or bush vistas.

                  The whole centre of Paraparaumu is vile. It is a great place to buy your groceries, or go to Mitre 10 and then race home again. The railway station is great becuase the train does provide an important alternative transport mode. But living above the railway station? If this is the thinking that goes into Kiwibuild it will be a source of homes for the poor and desperate. But maybe that is what is intended.

                  • McFlock

                    Lol

                    I thought your objections were about the engineering practicality, but apparently it’s because you couldn’t imagine anybody wanting to live in that area. Even if things really are that bad, it’s called “urban renewal“. Look it up some time.

                    • srylands

                      Of course my objections were not engineering based.

                      If it happens it will be a Hoisng NZ ghetto for the poor. Maybe that is what you meant. If so my apologies – that would work.

                    • McFlock

                      You’re such an ugly little soul, aren’t you.

                      If national do it, it would be a ghetto.
                      If it were done by someone who hates people on less than $100k p.a., like you do, it would be a ghetto.

                      If it were done by people with half a brain who realised that the target market included commuters to the CBD, as well as providing a hub for local infrastructure beyond transport, then it could be quite a good plan for the developers and especially the community.

                      It can go either way, yes. But done by someone competent, it would probably be bloody good.

                  • fender

                    There is no actual centre as such in Paraparaumu, and there’s no “vile” areas either. The new council/ library area would be ideal to develop into a “centre”.

                    There’s merit in the idea to have apartments near the railway station for those who wish to live there. The Paikakariki railway has something similar sounding nearby.

                  • Ad

                    You should also check out what is being planned in Otahuhu, and Panmure, and Avondale, and others.

                    In fact the really big one is the $100m+ development straddling the Manukau rail station by Manukau Institute of Technology. Close to weathertight on that job, with opening mid-2014.

                    The market is speaking and it’s simply people want that choice to live and work around public transport.

          • bad12 10.1.2.1.2

            And you whine like a beaten dog about me being rude, that’s just one long spew of rudeness, fuck off TR0LL people live above and next to railway lines all over the world,

            Considering that you do not even know where the large carpark at the Paraparaumu rail-station is i will just put your latest idiocy down to a faulty fantasy facility within your wee cranial cavity,(better get that bent silver spoon checked out),

            i also recommend building such parking facilities at most of the rail stations on the Kapiti-Wellington rail line, along with apartment complexes built above them all,

            My preference would be an apartment built above a park’n’ride at Paremata rail station..

            • srylands 10.1.2.1.2.1

              “My preference would be an apartment built above a park’n’ride at Paremata rail ”

              ha ha ha

              NOBODY WOULD LIVE THERE. It would be a GHETTO.

              • bad12

                Obviously been hitting the bottle with ‘its’ latest splurge of idiocy, a ghetto really, say four stories of parking, probably more like 7 when the Whitby commuters are factored in with any number of apartments built above,

                A grand view up and down the Porirua Harbor, fishing in the channel a few steps from the door, a major sports field across the bridge as well as a supermarket and cafes,

                Enough land around Paremata rail station to build 5 or 6 such buildings, sounds like a real ghetto to me….

                • srylands

                  “Obviously been hitting the bottle with ‘its’ latest splurge of idiocy, ”

                  More left vileness. A prelude to the NZ version of the Stasi. First dehumanise. Second off to reeducation camps.

                  • bad12

                    Finished slapping the wife and kids into line have you, nah a re-education camp by definition would suggest that there is something salvable, in your case it’s obvious that there aint…

                • srylands

                  ” grand view up and down the Porirua Harbor, fishing in the channel a few steps from the door, a major sports field across the bridge as well as a supermarket and cafes,”

                  So invest your money and build it. Oh I forgot Kiwibuild is coming.

            • srylands 10.1.2.1.2.2

              “i also recommend building such parking facilities at most of the rail stations on the Kapiti-Wellington rail line, along with apartment complexes built above them all”

              ha hah hahahahahaha bwuh hahhahhaha

              • Ad

                Most suburbs near rail lines in Auckland are having this planned precisely. Over half are already in commercial discussion.

            • srylands 10.1.2.1.2.3

              “people live above and next to railway lines all over the world,

              Yes – poor people live next to railway lines all over the world. Show me one example of a desirable residential property right next to a railway line? (no no above the subway near Knightsbridge in London) – next to a railway line like the line going through Paraparaumu?

              If you are suggesting that Housing NZ build flats for poor people next to Paraparaumu railway station, I agree that is fine. They can’t afford cars and it is great that they have access to transport. For the rest of us – FORGET IT.

              • bad12

                Oh we forgot about you the first time you polluted the atmosphere round here by posting a comment…

              • happynz

                Show me one example of a desirable residential property right next to a railway line? (no no above the subway near Knightsbridge in London) – next to a railway line like the line going through Paraparaumu?

                Adjacent to just about any BTS station in Bangkok you’ll find luxury high-rises.

              • McFlock

                Any house one the west side of otago harbour, with the exception of Ravensbourne because it gets fuck-all sun.

              • fender

                Yeah Srylands these projects look like ghettos.

              • Ad

                Brtitomart. Some of the country’s most expensive real estate. And multitudinous apartment towers. All one massive public-private concession.

    • TheContrarian 10.2

      “One mistake on any give day would simply result in chaos…”

      Yes, just like the Centennial highway.

      • bad12 10.2.1

        The traffic on the Centennial Highway is insignificant when compared to the flows at the Ngaraunga Interchange/Wellington Urban Motorway,

        Want to avoid traffic accidents, try park and ride on the train…

        • srylands 10.2.1.1

          “Want to avoid traffic accidents, try park and ride on the train…”

          The train takes too long when you add in transfers to and from the station. Plus you get wet if it rains. Then there are the viruses and dirt and school kids you get exposed to.

          I used the train for 20 years before switching to a car. I wouldn’t use the train now even if it was free. But.. I would invest more money in PT – it is great for the poor and the old and those who can’t drive – so it reduces road congestion. That is why road users subsidise PT users.

          • bad12 10.2.1.1.1

            It’s pretty obvious to us all that the only train you have ever used is ‘the fantasy train of thought’ which allows you to hop aboard and be a million different people in a multitude of places at the blink of an eyelid…

            • Murray Olsen 10.2.1.1.1.1

              He’d be the closest to Walter Mitty that I’ve ever come across in real life.

            • srylands 10.2.1.1.1.2

              “It’s pretty obvious to us all that the only train you have ever used is ‘the fantasy train of thought’ which allows you to hop aboard and be a million different people in a multitude of places at the blink of an eyelid…”

              When you lose the battle of ideas as the world goes in the opposite direction to your dream, you resort to rudeness. I have seen this before and it is predominantly Lefties that do it. That is why Lefties are under-represented at the cool parties. Nobody likes rude people.

              You can keep it up. It just reinforces the stereotypes that mainstream New Zealanders have of the Left.

              • bad12

                Having never met Bobody i cannot begin to imagine what He or She likes or dislikes, and a ‘cool party’ is a matter of opinion and your’s dont count for much round here buckwheat in case you haven’t noticed…

                • srylands

                  “Having never met Bobody i cannot begin to imagine what He or She likes or dislikes, and a ‘cool party’ is a matter of opinion and your’s dont count for much round here buckwheat in case you haven’t noticed…”

                  What?

              • fender

                Right wingers have boring parties….and they ring up noise control on themselves…

                “What?” saved by the edit eh
                I was going to ask about this Bobody person too.

              • McFlock

                spylands, you don’t like public transport because you don’t want to be in the same carriage as youths (and probably beneficiaries), and you say that making fun of a pseudonym is exactly the same as generations of oppression.

                And you whine about “rude”.

                fuck off.

              • Ad

                Auckland will always now be car dominated, but don’t mistake that for people choosing it. When the choice was taken away for public transport in the form of trams being stopped, the generation who used public transport fell massively and did not return. The dominance of the motorway system with arterial roads remains

                But we know when we give them the choice, the public take it. The evidence is on the routes in which public transport has had the same dedicated infrastructure spent and built as the car has had. That’s the North Shore busway, among others.

            • Greywarbler 10.2.1.1.1.3

              Is there a system in the world where you drive your car onto train pallets and travel by train with your car behind you, or even sitting in your car, so getting to destination with transport and not clogging roads?

              • bad12

                From memory, the Channel Tunnel uses a system something like that, but it would be a bit ‘bulky’ to try and use such a system as a form of mass transport for the daily commute…

              • McFlock

                lol

                That was fun to spitball in my mind!

                Carriage halts next to carpark – side lowers to be vehicle ramp into carriage – cars drive straight up into carpark perpendicular to line of train – side raises and train departs – when station reached, other side lowers and car drives straight off, fee charged according to license plate like congestion charge – egress side raises, ingress side lowers for cars at that station to drive straight on board, and so on…

                Does nothing for inner city congestion, though, so I suspect that’s where it’ll fall down. Might have other uses, though. Also rests on the concept that the vehicles don’t need to be tied down (unlike ships), and that the carriages have enough ventilation in case some numpty leaves their engines on, even in a tunnel.

  10. captain hook 11

    Hey dont knock it.
    This is so kiwis can live their dream.
    You know.
    Get to Palmerston five minutes quicker on a Saturday morning so they can go to Mcdonalds and then go home again.

    • Hayden 11.1

      Palmerston North, unfortunately. I remember the actual Palmerston being quite scenic.

  11. Greywarbler 12

    I think the deliberately obtuse like srylands should have to pay to continue their argument, as in the John Cleese and was it Eric Idle or Michael Palin sketch. Perhaps the system could freeze up after 5 until money changed hands.

  12. Sable 13

    As long as National politicians have fat share packages in the companies building the motorway I’m sure its money well wasted (oops I mean spent or is that squandered?) Stuff it I’m off to buy some shares…..

  13. billbrowne 14

    Just make the trains from Kapiti free for like, forever, with the caveat that no coasters are allowed to complain about roads or trains ever again – or they have to use the Akatarawa road for the next, say, ten trips.

    Then we can just forget about them and get on with our lives.

    • Macro 14.1

      Hehehe! The Akatarawas was my favourite route for getting from Upper Hutt to Paraparaumu Airport when flying on the weekends – used to do it in under an hour in a low flying spitfire.
      The first car a mate and i owned was a standard 10. cost us 10 quid. After school we would take turns in driving up to the top of the Akatarawas and seeing how quickly we could do the round trip. It all stopped when the car ran its big ends. His dad (obviously knowing what was going on) suggested we wreck it – which we did and netted 15 quid! it paid for our petrol. Every other car since has cost me money..

      • bad12 14.1.1

        That’s a grand old road apparently chiseled out of the hills by pick and shovel during the 1930′s depression years,

        Closed as often as it is open by the atrocious weather that the mountain range attracts, monster slips and bridges washed out in the valley on the Hutt side by the huge amounts of rainfall,

        i have only recently stopped being a regular user of the Akatarawa road as my use of the Forest Park accessed from the ‘saddle’ has been curtailed by my failing laborers bones,

        Funnily enough i remember during the earlier years of the Transmission Gully debate someone from within the Kapiti District Council calling for the Akatarawa Road to be upgraded and used as the alternative route for Kapiti traffic to access the Hutt Valley,

        The idea didn’t fly too high and my thought at the time was that the Kaptiti Council was floating such because of the high cost of maintaining the road and they were using aspot of wishful thinking hoping the Government would take it off their hands…

      • Greywarbler 14.1.2

        Memories, those were the days of our youth.

  14. Chooky 15

    From the Perches…need for long term transport planning for all Nzers….not short term financial gain for a few crony capitalists

    *All state highways and motorways should be free…there should be no tolls, which will only penalise the poor

    *Multi- billion motorways should not be built…in time of recession and oil crisis ( this is crazy!)

    * Emphasis should be placed on fast efficient rail in both islands….also economical state subsidised public transport (future oil crisis)…cf Switzerland with very efficient public economic transport

    * …Existing roads should be upgraded for safety but not rebuilt…(eg coastal run out of Wellington is great with the no passing wire barriers!)… Note: road accidents happen everywhere ….even and especially on straight , infrequently used roads in the country side…human nature being what it is …people nod off, get drunk,get careless etc..People have to learn to drive for the conditions and take more time)

    * all transport systems should be for the public good of ALL NZers….not the greasy pockets of VULGAR GREASEY CRONYIST CAPITALISTS and their dreams at the end of roads eg the proposed alternative to Wellington airport out at the coast (incidentally on fiercely contested Maori land)

    * we should be thinking TOURISM….(huge motorways in a small scenic country is a no! no! … tourists can go to LA or Germany for that…they come here to get away from that!)….cute scenic roads safe for biking is the way to go( rail for fast safe public transport and heavy goods transport… heavy trucks should be discouraged )

    • Populuxe1 15.1

      “*All state highways and motorways should be free…there should be no tolls, which will only penalise the poor”

      Tolls are a useful way of encouraging use of car pooling and use of public transport. The poor are more likely to be using public transport anyway – penalise the rich for the privilege of driving.

      “*Multi- billion motorways should not be built…in time of recession and oil crisis ( this is crazy!)”

      Um, isn’t that what they used to do during the Depression?

      “* Emphasis should be placed on fast efficient rail in both islands….also economical state subsidised public transport (future oil crisis)…cf Switzerland with very efficient public economic transport ”

      Which is probably why tolls would be a good idea.

      “* …Existing roads should be upgraded for safety but not rebuilt…(eg coastal run out of Wellington is great with the no passing wire barriers!)… Note: road accidents happen everywhere ….even and especially on straight , infrequently used roads in the country side…human nature being what it is …people nod off, get drunk,get careless etc..People have to learn to drive for the conditions and take more time)”

      To properly upgrade existing roads for safety would actually cost significantly more than simply building new ones to code. Your fatalism also suggests you have a misanthropic hatred of humanity.

      “* all transport systems should be for the public good of ALL NZers….not the greasy pockets of VULGAR GREASEY CRONYIST CAPITALISTS and their dreams at the end of roads eg the proposed alternative to Wellington airport out at the coast (incidentally on fiercely contested Maori land)”

      Nurse! Nurse! Time for Chooky’s dried frog pills. He thinks it’s the nineteenth century again!

      “* we should be thinking TOURISM….(huge motorways in a small scenic country is a no! no! … tourists can go to LA or Germany for that…they come here to get away from that!)….cute scenic roads safe for biking is the way to go( rail for fast safe public transport and heavy goods transport… heavy trucks should be discouraged )”

      Tourists don’t want to drive shitty roads in their campervans. They want roads like they’re used to. Cute scenic roads are distracting and known death traps.

  15. Greywarbler 16

    Disagree that all state highways should be free. Toll roads, which are alternative to state highways, should be charged for. But buses and trains should have low cost options for poor people’s travel. I went to Christchurch from Nelson for $54 the other day, nice trip. I might go by train and put up with the waiting round between bus arrival and train arrival if the cost wasn’t about $100. That is if it is running at all. If the round trip ticket was sold at reduced price for age one way, and half that for the return trip, I might consider it. But NZ Ril marketing and strategic planning hasn’t been able to cope with such ideas apparently. I may be wrong about this particular matter but it would have to compete with bus travel for me to consider.

  16. Swan 17

    Macro,

    Using the available patronage projections you get to about $20-40 depending on assumed cost of capital. The key thing about the CRL is even after the $3b investment, operational costs alone will have to be subsidised, and obviously capital costs 100% subsidised.

  17. Hilary 18

    Develop the airport at Paraparaumu into an international one. There is already double tracked electric rail between Paraparaumu and Wellington with quite new carriages (all upgraded a couple of years ago). It just needs to be extended from Paraparaumu airport to Wellington airport and for the line to Palmerston North to be electrified with regular day services. The remaining road traffic would shrink. Look what Sydney has done over the last 30 years. Rail is frequent and efficient and each of those double decker carriages takes about 100 passengers in speedy comfort. It would cost a lot less than the outdated Transmission Gully and the Kapiti Expressway.

    • fender 18.1

      “Develop the airport at Paraparaumu into an international one.”

      Not enough space for that to happen without another expressway style eviction/demolition edict. For years this area has become increasingly built up with new homes. But since we are going to have this expressway soon where overpasses are going to be ugly structures dominating the skyline, what’s a bit more destruction in the name of “national significance”.

  18. Martin 19

    Let’s have another ME war [for cheap gas/oil]
    import more cars and build more/bigger roads to run them on.
    Lets fly everywhere, everyday.
    Let’s get drunk on infinite growth on a finite planet
    and then when the weather burns go “it’s not climate change”

    when we could have localised,
    lived within our means and
    developed real communities instead of
    stuffing a capital city into a tight space and
    its lemming culture of mass commuting 30km x 2 everyday..

    probably too late now.

  19. RedBaronCV 20

    1. Take Srylands free Wellington Carpark away from him.
    2. Allow him for a large fee to hook up his own personal railway carriage – then he could blatantly consume – “this is more expensive than a beamer..”
    3. Even by the standards of the Righties Transmission Gully is expensive. Shifting the airport would be cheaper?

    • srylands 20.1

      “Take Srylands free Wellington Carpark away from him.”

      It is not free. It is $360 per month (GST excl)

      “Even by the standards of the Righties Transmission Gully is expensive.”

      I assume you meant to say “even by the standards of the eighties”?

  20. Erentz 21

    Better option:

    Upgrade centennial highway: $500 million (unfortunately bad planning has started to get in the way)

    Deep bore bypass for SH1 from the Terrace tunnel to Kilbirnie: 1-1.35 billion (they will be spending about 800-1000 million on the current ad hoc flyover/tunnel/underpass/Tce-tunnel-duplication anyway), so that should be:500 million difference

    High quality light rail to miramar and the airport: 700 million

    1.7 billion. Not sure what else is reasonable to spend 1.3 billion on in wellington at this stage, other than the various regional improvements already planned. So put that into other things: housing and Auckland rail.

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    Labour | 22-08
  • Pacific people continue to go backwards under National
    A report from Victoria University highlights the fact that Pacific people are continuing to go backwards under a National Government, said Labour’s Pacific Affairs spokesperson Su’a William Sio.  “The report shows the largest inequality increases were in smoking, obesity, tertiary...
    Labour | 22-08
  • Wellington transport plan needs to keep moving
    The failure of the Transport Agency to properly look at alternatives to the Basin Reserve flyover is not a good reason for further delays to improving transport in Wellington, Labour MPs Grant Robertson and Annette King say. “The Board of...
    Labour | 22-08
  • Labour’s focus on inequality, kids and better job prospects
    Tackling child poverty and removing barriers to people working part time to enhance their prospects of moving into a fulltime job are highlights of Labour’s Social Development policy. Releasing the policy today, spokesperson Sue Moroney said while part-time work was...
    Labour | 21-08
  • Political staff should give answers under oath
    The Inspector General of Security and Intelligence should use her full statutory powers to question witnesses under oath about the leak of SIS information, says Labour MP Phil Goff. “Leakage of confidential information from the SIS for political purposes is...
    Labour | 21-08
  • High dollar, hands-off Govt sends workers to dole queue
    The loss of up to 100 jobs at Croxley stationery in Auckland is devastating news for their families and the local Avondale community, Labour’s Employment, Skills and Training spokesperson Grant Robertson says. “The company’s inability to compete in international markets...
    Labour | 21-08
  • National’s flagship education policy dead in the water
    National’s plan to create executive principals and expert teachers is effectively dead in the water with news that 93 percent of primary teachers have no confidence in the scheme, Labour’s Education spokesperson Chris Hipkins says. “The fact that teachers are...
    Labour | 21-08
  • Dunedin will be a knowledge and innovation centre under Labour
    Dunedin will become a knowledge and innovation centre under a Labour Government that will back local businesses, support technology initiatives and fund dynamic regional projects, Labour Leader David Cunliffe says. “Nowhere has the National Government’s short-sightedness been more apparently than...
    Labour | 21-08
  • Inquiry into SIS disclosures the right decision
    Labour MP Phil Goff says the Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security has done the right thing by launching an inquiry into the disclosure of SIS documents about a meeting between himself and the agency’s former director-general. “This inquiry is necessary...
    Labour | 20-08
  • Labour – supporting and valuing carers and the cared for
    Placing real value on our elderly and the people who care for them will be a priority for a Labour Government, Labour Leader David Cunliffe says. Releasing Labour’s Senior Citizens policy today David Cunliffe promised that a Labour Government would...
    Labour | 20-08
  • By Hoki! It’s Labour’s fisheries policy
    A Labour Government will protect the iconic Kiwi tradition of fishing by improving access to the coast, protecting the rights of recreational fishers and reviewing snapper restrictions, Labour’s Fisheries spokesperson Damien O’Connor says. “Catching a fish from the rocks, beach...
    Labour | 20-08
  • Mighty River – Mighty Profits – Mighty hard to swallow
    Mighty River Power’s profit increase of 84 per cent is simply outrageous, says Labour’s Energy spokesperson David Shearer. “Demand for electricity is flat or declining yet the company has made enormous profits. It is the latest power company to celebrate...
    Labour | 19-08
  • Collins’ actions were wrong, not unwise
    John Key’s moral compass remains off-kilter as he cannot bring himself to declare Judith Collins’ actions outright wrong, not simply ‘unwise’, said Labour MP Grant Robertson. “Under pressure John Key is finally shifting his stance but his failure to condemn...
    Labour | 19-08
  • Voting starts tomorrow!
    On the telly, in the papers, on the Net, billboards on almost every street corner – it’s hard to miss the fact that there’s an election coming up. Everyone’s trying to win your vote on Election Day, September 20, (this...
    The Daily Blog | 02-09
  • Collins inquiry a whitewash before it has even started
    The farce whitewash that Key is trying to push through here for the inquiry into Judith Collins role in a hit on the SFO should enrage any NZer, regardless of how they vote. Whaleoil won’t be forced to appear, it’s...
    The Daily Blog | 02-09
  • Press Leaders Debate – Round 2 – 7pm tonight
    This debate is live in a Town Hall, Key has done well at these in the past, but since the hate politics exposed in Dirty Politics, expect real fury directed at Key. My guess is that Key will attempt to use whatever he...
    The Daily Blog | 02-09
  • MANA hit speed wobbles – why Annette Sykes will win Waiariki
    MANA are my favourites. But of late, their transition from crawling to sprinting has hit some speed wobbles. Hone’s and Pam’s aggressive attitude towards the media recently is very understandable in light of how connected many of the media were to...
    The Daily Blog | 02-09
  • Soz Cam – PaknSave boycott of whaleoil continues – time to start a boyc...
    Cam is so carcinogenic now, not even his mates in the Tobacco Industry are talking to him any longer. I suspect only the Israeli Defence Force propaganda department are paying for content on whaleoil now. Cam says that PaknSave have dropped their problems...
    The Daily Blog | 02-09
  • The Rock Fuels NZ Roastbuster Rape Culture
    This is making me feel pretty uncomfortable. Here we have an instance of Jono and Ben posing like “exposed celebrities”. But do you know what I’m seeing? I’m seeing two dudes who basically “roasted” a woman online (exposed pictures of...
    The Daily Blog | 02-09
  • GUEST BLOG: Kate Davis – Why beneficiaries need advocacy
    There are times when I am wrong. I was wrong recently when someone suggested to me that AAAP should be eligible for government funding to continues its advocacy work. That was before. Before dealing with advocacy on a weekly basis...
    The Daily Blog | 01-09
  • TheDailyBlog September Political Poll Has Been Kicked Off
    The Daily Blog’s August poll has concluded and the September poll has been kicked off, asking readers: What party will you likely vote for at this year’s General Election? You will see this month’s poll in the right-hand sidebar of...
    The Daily Blog | 01-09
  • GUEST BLOG: Kelly Ellis – Jamie Whyte, leave that poor seal alone!
    Worse than showing mere lip service to Rainbow inclusion, ACT leader Jamie Whyte showed stunning arrogance when appeared at a candidates debate on rainbow issues hosted by the Auckland University Students’ Association last Thursday. The stunning hypocrisy was evident as...
    The Daily Blog | 01-09
  • Right wing can’t help but use scum
    Some people have been shocked that the traditional right wing party in New Zealand politics is so deeply embedded with scum like the blogger Whale Oil. We need not be so surprised. It takes a certain type to support the...
    The Daily Blog | 01-09
  • EXCLUSIVE: National’s Ohariu candidate admits contact by Simon Lusk
    . . Wellington, NZ, 31  August – At a meet-the-candidates public meeting in the Rongotai Electorate, National’s Ohariu candidate, Brett Hudson, confirmed that he had been approached by “a mate”, who passed on a message from  National Party operative, Simon...
    The Daily Blog | 01-09
  • Coalition for Better Broadcasting – Auckland Broadcasting Debate 2014
    Coalition for Better Broadcasting – Auckland Broadcasting Debate 2014...
    The Daily Blog | 01-09
  • Petition for Governor General of New Zealand to Investigate all the allegat...
      Now we see the inquiry will be a whitewash, that is secret, won’t be consulted with the Opposition, will have limited scope and will ignore Nicky Hager’s book, we must demand the Governor General step in and demand an...
    The Daily Blog | 01-09
  • Ashburton, 1 September 2014
    I NEVER WENT BACK to Aramoana after the killing. I had been a frequent visitor to the tiny seaside village back in the late 1970s and throughout the 80s. Its tall cliffs and broad beaches providing a colourful backdrop to...
    The Daily Blog | 01-09
  • Checkmate in 1 move – how could Slater have known what was in OIA request...
    And now we get down to the final few moves before checkmate. If the following investigation is right, how could Slater and Collins have known what was in the Secret Intelligence Service Official Information Act request that hadn’t been released...
    The Daily Blog | 01-09
  • The Edge Posts Naked Photos Of Jennifer Lawrence Without Consent
    Today the Edge website – owned by Media Works – published fully naked photographs of Jennifer Lawrence without her consent. It is not OK to publish naked media of any woman without her consent, full stop. It is absolutely disgusting...
    The Daily Blog | 01-09
  • Bomber, Laila and Maggie – a highlight from Auckland Broadcasting Debate ...
    Bomber, Laila and Maggie – a highlight from Auckland Broadcasting Debate 2014...
    The Daily Blog | 01-09
  • Jeremy Wells’ Mike Hosking rant on Radio Hauraki: Today, how good was I i...
    Jeremy Wells’ Mike Hosking on Radio Hauraki...
    The Daily Blog | 31-08
  • Maggie Barry slags Laila Harre & blogger, audience erupt
    The Coalition for Better Broadcasting held their public meeting in Auckland last night and it became a fiery shouting match when Maggie Barry decided to slag Laila Harre and me off. 250 people packed into the Pioneer Hall off High...
    The Daily Blog | 31-08
  • It has to be a full independent public inquiry and Key MUST front
      You know things are bad when images like this start appearing in the media.  It isn’t a ‘left wing conspiracy’ to point out the over whelming evidence of what is clearly a right wing conspiracy! If it looks like a conspiracy, sounds like a conspiracy...
    The Daily Blog | 31-08
  • Political Party social media stats – National playing Dirty Politics on s...
    Interesting data from friend of the blog, Marty Stewart, on social media likes and it shows an interesting question that post Dirty Politics should probably get asked…   …it’s interesting that Key has so many personal followers.  One wonders if...
    The Daily Blog | 31-08
  • The depth of the National rot and the compliance of our news media
    I’m so tired. Aren’t you? I don’t want to read the news anymore. It’s awful and I feel ashamed of it. We live in a country that people all over the world would give an arm, a leg; their life...
    The Daily Blog | 31-08
  • Conservative Party candidate links smacking ban with suicide, sexually tran...
    If Chemtrails, faked moon landings and climate change denial weren’t enough, welcome to your new Minister for Spanking,  Edward Saafi... The anti-smacking law is to blame for youth suicide, youth prostitution and even sexually-transmitted infections, a leading Conservative party candidate...
    The Daily Blog | 31-08
  • A brief word on the canonisation of Matthew Hooton
    Before we all start the canonisation of Matthew Hooton, let’s consider some home truths here shall we? While the Wellington Ruminator Blog, the blog who was previously mates with Judith Collins, now seems to have a crush on Matthew Hooton… …I...
    The Daily Blog | 31-08
  • A brief word on undercover cops in bars
    Dunedin police booze operation labelled ‘creepy’ Undercover police officers drank in Dunedin bars as part of an operation targeting liquor licensing offences. While police said the inaugural operation was a success — with most bars found compliant — the Hospitality...
    The Daily Blog | 31-08
  • Judith Collins press conference
    Judith Collins press conference...
    The Daily Blog | 31-08
  • GUEST BLOG: Angry Lawyer – Collins, Odgers, Williams and legal ethics
    We deserve better lawyers than Judith Collins Three of the worst offenders exposed in Dirty Politics are lawyers: Judith Collins, Cathy Odgers, and Jordan Williams. What Nicky Hager exposed them doing would be out of line for anyone, but from...
    The Daily Blog | 31-08
  • GUEST BLOG: Pat O’Dea – Necessary Defence
    Increasingly climate change is becoming the main fracture line between political parties. Where political parties stand on climate change defines political parties and movements like no other issue. The Mana Movement like the Maori Party it sprang from, came out...
    The Daily Blog | 31-08
  • Why it is all over for John Key
    Image: Melanie D I’ve been confident that National will lose this election and that our focus should be on what a progressive Government needs to establish as its agenda in the first 100 days. Past that point, the establishment pushes back...
    The Daily Blog | 31-08
  • A brief word to everyone who voted National in 2011
    I received this interesting email from a National Party supporter today… …let me say this to anyone who voted National last election – you should be ashamed by what has been revealed and what your vote ended up enabling but...
    The Daily Blog | 31-08
  • EXCLUSIVE: Déjà Vu All Over Again: John Ansell confirms his participation...
      THE MAN BEHIND the Iwi-Kiwi billboards that very nearly won the 2005 election for Don Brash and the National Party has confirmed his involvement in businessman John Third’s and former Act MP Owen Jennings’ campaign to drive down the...
    The Daily Blog | 31-08
  • Public Broadcasting Auckland debate 6.30pm tonight now with Colin Craig &am...
    The Coalition for Better Broadcasting debate on public broadcasting happens tonight at 6.30pm in Auckland at the Pioneer Women’s Hall, High Street, Auckland City.  In the light of Dirty Politics and the manipulation of the media, public broadcasting is more important for...
    The Daily Blog | 30-08
  • Winners & Losers in Collins sacking plus what’s the latest on Slater...
      Make no mistake, there was no way this was a resignation, it’s a face saving way out for Collins, she was sacked.  My understanding is that National internal polls are haemorrhaging and that the powers that be within National...
    The Daily Blog | 30-08
  • Third party propaganda attacks incoming Labour-led government
    . . Further to a report by Daily Blogger, Chris Trotter, on receiving information regarding planned attack-billboards, the following billboard is highly visible to traffic on the southbound lane of the Wellington motorway, just prior to the Murphy St turn-off....
    The Daily Blog | 30-08
  • Labour wins the Internet
    I’m sure I’m not the only one who tried to vote online for the leaders debate and couldn’t because the website was down. The next option was the txt vote, 75c a pop of course. So I’m not surprised that...
    The Daily Blog | 30-08
  • GUEST BLOG: Anjum Rahman – Rotherham and the need to challenge willful bl...
    I haven’t been following the events in Rotterham too closely.  I’ve read about the basic issues and the culture of silence that stopped action been taken even after complaints were made.  That culture of silence is incredibly familiar, and described...
    The Daily Blog | 30-08
  • Review: Hairspray
      Oh Hairspray! What fun! Somehow I managed to miss the movie when it came out, I had no idea really what it was about though I felt it had a vague relation to High School Musical. In retrospect, that...
    The Daily Blog | 30-08
  • Mounting global pressure against Timor-Leste’s ‘death sentence’ media...
    East Timor’s José Belo … courageous fight against ‘unconstitutional’ media law.Image: © Ted McDonnell 2014 CAFÉ PACIFIC and the Pacific Media Centre Online posted challenges to the controversial ‘press law’ nine months ago when it emerged how dangerous this draft...
    The Daily Blog | 30-08
  • GUEST BLOG: Curwen Rolinson – Spies, Lies and When Campaigns Are Fried
    Like most of the rest of the nation’s political classes, I was eagerly affixed to TV One from 12:30 on Saturday afternoon to witness the downfall of Judith Collins.Whenever we witness the crumbling of a titan of the political landscape...
    The Daily Blog | 30-08
  • BREAKING: Whaleoil crushes Crusher
    Judith ends up shooting herself A new email has been released suggesting that Collins was attempting to undermine the head of Serious Fraud Office with the help of far right hate speech merchant Cameron Slater. Unbelievable!   She has been forced...
    The Daily Blog | 30-08
  • BREAKING: Rumours Judith Collins gone at lunchtime
    Brook Sabin first of the mark with rumours Judith Collins is about to resign – PM announcing a statement at 12.30pm… …Paddy follows… …Vance confirms..   …if Collins is gone by lunchtime, it will be because the PM understands the...
    The Daily Blog | 29-08
  • BREAKING: UPDATE on DIRT ALERT!
    Thanks to the information passed to Chris Trotter by “Idiot/Savant” from No Right Turn it is now possible to identify at least some of the persons involved in this latest example of attack politics. What follows is Chris’s response to Idiot/Savant’s timely assistance: Well done...
    The Daily Blog | 29-08
  • Comparing burning puppets, hip hop lyrics and drunk student chants to black...
    Watching the mainstream media try and obscure Cunliffe’s surprise win in the leaders debate  is a reminder the Press Gallery is in depressed shock. The current spin line from the Wellington bubble media in the wake of Dirty Politics is that...
    The Daily Blog | 29-08
  • Why has it all gone quiet on Charter Schools?
    They’re one of ACT’s flagship policies and the National Party have been gung ho in supporting them. So how come we’re not hearing Hekia Parata, Jamie Whyte, Catherine Isaac, et al singing from the rafters about what a resounding success charter...
    The Daily Blog | 29-08
  • Moment of Truth – September 15th – Auckland Town Hall
    Moment of Truth – September 15th – Auckland Town Hall...
    The Daily Blog | 29-08
  • EXCLUSIVE: Dirt Alert! Are the Greens and Labour about to become the target...
    WE’VE SEEN IT ALL BEFORE. In 2005 pamphlets began appearing all over New Zealand attacking Labour and the Greens. For a couple of days both the parties targeted and the news media were flummoxed. Who was behind such an obviously...
    The Daily Blog | 29-08
  • The Donghua Liu Affair: the Press Council’s decision
    . . 1. Prologue . The Donghua Liu Affair hit  the headlines on 18 June, with allegations that David Cunliffe wrote a letter in 2003,  on  behalf of  business migrant, Donghua Liu. Four days later, on Sunday 22 June, the...
    The Daily Blog | 29-08
  • The difference between Cunliffe & Key in the debate
    It was with much interest that I watched the leaders debate on Thursday night.  I watched with an open mind, always happy to have my opinion changed.  Maybe John Key is all the wonderful things that many say about him,...
    The Daily Blog | 29-08
  • GUEST BLOG: Denis Tegg – When Did We Agree To Our Data Being Shared with ...
    New shocking evidence has emerged from Edward Snowden’s trove of documents about a program called ICREACH under which data collected by the GCSB is shared with 23 US spy agencies. Under new sharing agreements which appear to have commenced immediately after...
    The Daily Blog | 28-08
  • Why Internet MANA are the best political friends the Greens could ever get
    Metiria at last nights #GreenRoomNZ: standing on the shoulders and camera cases of giants  NZers, regardless of political spectrum or apathy level, have a wonderful beach cricket egalitarianism about us. If we can objectively conclude a winner, then that person...
    The Daily Blog | 28-08
  • Independent Epsom Candidates ‘One Strike’ Crime Policy
    Best wishes to all of those who live in Epsom, Mount Eden, New Market, Remuera and of course the rest of New Zealand....
    Scoop politics | 02-09
  • Large majorities of NZ First voters would prefer Labour deal
    67% of those who voted for New Zealand First at the 2011 general election would prefer Labour to lead a coalition government if one is needed after September 20’s general election....
    Scoop politics | 02-09
  • Jointly owned urban development agency for Christchurch
    “Given the strategic importance of the Canterbury rebuild, it is logical that the transition from emergency governance arrangements is overseen by the Prime Minister’s office, but to maintain momentum in the city centre an expert development agency...
    Scoop politics | 02-09
  • Collins inquiry at best a Band-Aid, a permanent fix needed
    Collins inquiry at best a Band-Aid, a permanent fix is needed The Public Service Association (PSA) says the inquiry into Judith Collins’ behaviour must be accompanied by a process to restore the lost trust between Ministers and public servants if...
    Scoop politics | 02-09
  • Association welcomes new Chief Executive
    “The New Zealand Police Association is pleased to announce the appointment of Heather Verry to Chief Executive. Heather picks up the mantle from Chris Pentecost, who recently retired from this position,” Police Association President Greg O’Connor said...
    Scoop politics | 02-09
  • Young Voters Want Politicians to Grow Up
    Young voters want answers to the questions that directly affect them – but it seems as much as anything, they want politicians to grow up....
    Scoop politics | 02-09
  • Climate Voter election debate to get big audience
    Auckland, 2 September 2014 - Tickets to tomorrow night’s first-ever Climate Voter election debate have sold out but an online audience will also get to see the event live....
    Scoop politics | 02-09
  • The Edge show disregard for consent
    The Edge has shown complete disregard for consent, for women’s bodies and in doing so has contributed to the wider issue of rape culture in New Zealand says specialist sexual violence prevention organisation, Sexual Abuse Prevention Network. Yesterday,...
    Scoop politics | 02-09
  • The Rock is Fuelling New Zealand’s Roastbuster Rape Culture
    The Rock are still displaying without-consent images of Jennifer Lawrence and other celebrities online. They are making fun of this without-consent action, saying that she was "asking for it", etc. They appear to be supporting this kind of...
    Scoop politics | 02-09
  • HRLA Condemns Murder of Filipino Human Rights lawyer
    Attorney Rodolfo R. Felicio, a member of the National Union of Peoples Lawyers , was gunned down while working on a land dispute in Rizal, east of Manila. Two caretakers of the disputed land were also injured in the attack....
    Scoop politics | 02-09
  • SFO lays charges for procurement fraud
    Two individuals have been charged in the Auckland District Court today with Crimes Act charges laid by the Serious Fraud Office for alleged fraud against Mighty River Power Limited relating to procurement for the Company’s Southdown power station....
    Scoop politics | 02-09
  • Commitment to lifting wages good for New Zealand
    The Service and Food Workers Union has applauded the Green Party workers’ policy announced today....
    Scoop politics | 02-09
  • Sykes: There’s Only One Poll That Counts
    “One of the oldest sayings in politics is that there is only one poll that counts – the one on Election Day – and that’s the one that I am focusing on” remarked the MANA Movement candidate for Waiariki, Annette...
    Scoop politics | 02-09
  • Winston Peters Shown up by the Civilian Party
    Even the satirical 'Civilian Party' has now offered the Taxpayers’ Union more credible figures for the ' Bribe-O-Meter ' than Winston Peters’ New Zealand First. The Taxpayers’ Union Bribe-O-Meter now includes, National, Labour, the Greens,...
    Scoop politics | 02-09
  • Further criminal investigation into CTV Building collapse
    Police has today confirmed it will be advancing the criminal investigation into the collapse of the CTV building in February 2011....
    Scoop politics | 02-09
  • Greens policy to restore link between effort and reward
    The Green Party’s new workers policy articulates an alternative to wage repression and job insecurity based on restoring the link between effort and reward, according to FIRST Union. The core tenets of the policy include implementing an $18 minimum...
    Scoop politics | 02-09
  • Greens workers policy supported by union movement
    The CTU is supporting the Green Party’s policy launched today focused on improving life for working New Zealanders. “This policy shows the Greens commitment to collective bargaining as the best and fairest way to improve workers terms and conditions. It...
    Scoop politics | 02-09
  • Research Scholarships for Cannabis Treatments
    Medical cannabis research will be boosted by $140 million if the Aotearoa Legalise Cannabis Party is elected on September 20. Pediatric epilepsy treatment will be one of the main priorities for the research scholarships....
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • Ngai Te Rangi Change to Tribal Elections
    Ngai Te Rangi has begun a postal vote of beneficiaries to change the way representatives are elected to the two Ngai Te Rangi tribal organisations....
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • Greens’ commitment to pay equity welcomed by workers
    The Public Service Association (PSA) says the 58,000 workers they represent will benefit from the announcement by the Green Party of a commitment to pay equity and to a living wage for core public servants and contractors....
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • Real People Powering Real Policy
    New Zealanders from all walks of life have helped the Internet Party create a full platform of strong, progressive and realistic policies that will create a better future for everyone, says leader Laila Harré....
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • University of Canterbury to help with forestry safety
    The University of Canterbury is to launch a new research project to make sure New Zealand’s new forestry roads are safe and are established with minimal environmental impact....
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • Time to get serious about ending homelessness!
    New Zealand needs a comprehensive set of policies that address the housing and support needs of homeless people as well as significantly increasing the supply of affordable, good quality houses and flats....
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • Hundreds to join domestic, sexual violence march
    Several social service providers from across New Zealand have come together to call for an end to the epidemic level of domestic and sexual violence in New Zealand....
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • Students helped with debt repayments
    New Zealand students now living in Australia are being reminded not to ignore their student loan debt as Inland Revenue expands its latest tool to help with repayments....
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • Launch of GenderNeutral.co.nz website
    GenderNeutral.co.nz are excited to announce the launch of their new website, GenderNeutral.co.nz ....
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • Factory farming debaters to look chicken in the eye
    MPs participating in a panel discussion about factory farming will come face-to-face with a real live hen, rescued from the claws of the intensive farming industry. Hettie the Hen will demonstrate to the MPs what little space is afforded to...
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • Leadership stands strong behind Internet MANA relationship
    “There is now, and always will be, a range of views about many issues within our movement and members are free to express them, but Georgina’s views on Kim Dotcom are not shared by the MANA Movement leadership or the...
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • Personal Statement by Matthew Hooton
    Personal Statement by Matthew Hooton 1 September 2014 For Immediate Release “This morning I made comments on Radio New Zealand’s Nine to Noon programme about an attempt by staff in the Prime Minister’s Office to interfere in the appointment...
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • The Worm turns down for John Key
    John Key struggled to coax The Worm above the line in Thursday’s Leaders Debate, according to Roy Morgan’s Reactor, the original Worm. John Key struggled to coax The Worm above the line in Thursday’s Leaders Debate, according to Roy Morgan’s...
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • The Edge Posts Naked Photos Without Consent
    The Edge website, owned by Media Works have published fully naked photographs of Jennifer Lawrence without her consent....
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • Statement from the Governor-General on Ashburton Shootings
    The Governor-General, Lt Gen The Rt Hon Sir Jerry Mateparae, has expressed his deep shock following the shooting of three people in Ashburton today....
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • Update on IGIS inquiry into release of NZSIS information
    In recognition of the public interest, the Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security, Cheryl Gwyn, took the unusual step of providing an update during the course of an inquiry and confirmed today that she would be summoning a number of individuals...
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • An Open Government Plan developed in secrecy
    The State Services Commission sent NZ’s Open Government Action Plan to the international Open Government Partnership (OGP) Secretariat on 31 July. The countries involved in the OGP since its inception - from the UK and US to Indonesia and Brazil...
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • KiwiRail; another year older and deeper in debt
    That is a lot of money and there are lessons that need to be learnt before we pour in another $1 billion....
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • Fonterra China Deal Demands Safe Supply Chain
    The future success of Fonterra’s deal to sell infant formula in China [1] requires all milk it uses be safe and for Fonterra to secure its supply chain from contamination by GE DNA and pesticide residues. There is now significant...
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • HRC praises Auckland mum for speaking out
    Race Relations Commissioner Dame Susan Devoy has praised an Auckland mother of four who went public after humiliating treatment by staff at The Warehouse....
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • Southern DHB refers disputed issue to Serious Fraud Office
    Following advice from forensic investigation firm Beattie Varley Limited, Southern District Health Board has referred the expenditure at the centre of its long running dispute with South Link Health to the Serious Fraud Office. The parties have been...
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • The Letter 1 September 2014
    Last night’s TVNZ Colmar Brunton poll puts the left and right 60 MPs each. United and the Maori Party say they will go with the side that gets to 61 MPs. ACT just needs just 1.3% or 28 thousand Party...
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • Shopping Giveaway Harmless Fun For Kids
    Family First NZ is rubbishing claims by critics including Gareth Morgan that the New World ‘Little Shop’ promotion is harmful for kids, and says that kids should be allowed to be kids. “Children love acting like their parents and pretending...
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • Red Cross launches employment service for former refugees
    New Zealand Red Cross is encouraging employers to give refugees a fresh startwith the launch of Pathways to Employment, a nationwide work assistance service....
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • EDS welcomes Labour’s Conservation Policy
    The Environmental Defence Society has welcomed Labour’s Conservation Policy including the key objective of halting the current pattern of indigenous biodiversity decline within ten years....
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • Poverty is falling and income inequality is not rising
    “A Roy Morgan poll shows that the issue people are most concerned about is income inequality. This just goes to show how the persistent repetition of a lie bewilders the public. Income inequality is not in fact rising. And the...
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • Rotary NZ responding to Fiji water and sanitation issues
    Clean water and sanitation are vital to health. In Fiji Rotary New Zealand have been targeting 22 communities that are experiencing severe hardship mainly because they don’t have access to clean water for their drinking, cleaning and cooking needs....
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • Work & Income shooting a Tragedy
    Kay Brereton speaking on behalf of the National Beneficiary Advocacy Consultancy group says; “Two people shot and another wounded, this is a tragedy and our deepest sympathy goes out to the family and whanau of the victims, as well as...
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • 1080 Poison Deer Repellent not Effective – Farmers
    Four deer have been found dead within a farmer's bush block, after an aerial 1080 poison drop applied with deer repellent. The drop was part of a 30,000 hectare drop across the Northern Pureora Forest Park....
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • Employment Charter will strengthen migrants’ rights
    Establishing an Employment Charter for construction companies is a critical step to strengthening the rights of migrant workers that are fast becoming the face of the Christchurch rebuild, according to an alliance of union groups. The charter has...
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • Global March For Elephants and Rhino
    It’s a trans-national business that funds terrorist organisations, fuels conflict in Africa, and poses environmental, development and security challenges. The illegal wildlife trade is also a lucrative business, generating an estimated USD$20 billion...
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • New series of videos aimed at disengaged youth
    From the people who brought you 'NZ Idle' (NZ's favourite web series about an artist on the dole) comes a new series about election time: Choice Lolz....
    Scoop politics | 01-09
  • Picket Of Leaders Christchurch Debate
    KEEP OUR ASSETS PICKET OF LEADERS CHRISTCHURCH DEBATE TUESDAY SEPTEMBER 2nd, 6 p.m. ST MARGARETS COLLEGE, SHREWSBURY STREET, MERIVALE...
    Scoop politics | 01-09
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