‘interestingly’, the ‘thing’ hanging between the baboon’s legs was probably not its ‘thing’ but its scrotum – other apes are relatively modestly endowed compared to humans (gorillas are the size of a pencil, ‘hung like a gorilla’ is an insult in parts of africa) but have much larger testes. other apes also have bones in theirs. sorry, just thought you might be interested
Helen Clark: A lot of people aren’t comfortable with beatings but they don’t want to see, you know, stressed and harassed parents, you know, pulled in by the police because they, they smacked a child.
Bob McCroskie: So you do not want to see smacking banned?
Helen Clark:Absolutely not, I think you are trying to defy human nature.
Fister: There was a point to that comment? That is exactly what Helen said (and for that matter what the cartoon said).
Doesn’t mean that parents shouldn’t be judged by the police and the judiciary for using excessive force. Removing s59 allowed that to happen for some of the really abusive parents who were hiding behind their interpretation of ‘reasonable’.
Helen Clark: A lot of people aren’t comfortable with beatings but they don’t want to see, you know, stressed and harassed parents, you know, pulled in by the police because they, they smacked a child.
Looked at that quote again. Looks like you only see what you want to see. Why didn’t you highlight the bit I did above?
You like hitting kids with lumps of timber? Or your fists ?
a) children are not reasonable adults
b) children need protection and boundaries
c) children sometimes run wild and need forcible restraint and correction
labour’s solution to the above: create a police state and criminalize 90% of parents.
I think you may not have realised that when repeal of S59 legislation was passed over a year ago now, there was included specific guidance that effectively exempted ‘transient and trivial’ assaults… ie what most people would be comfortable calling a smack.
I would be interested to know why you think this exemption is not sufficient for your purposes?
RedLogix, it’s probably because he believes 90% of parents hit their children with such force that it would not be described as ‘transitory an trifling’. If you believe that, you probably think children need a good hiding, and that this really is a police state. Maybe it’s just ill-informed hyperbole, but it is rather sickening.
Redlogix and Matt Pill – is the anti smacking bill a pathetic attempt at addressing our appalling child abuse statistics? It’s a bit like putting a band aid on a festering wound! At least we are GOLD MEDALISTS in infanticide due to the culturally sensitive pc crap adopted by an out of step government and disgraceful police force. Shame on Labour because the evidence is bloody sickening.
Every politician has blood on their insidious hands. The blood of slain vulnerable children, for example the Kahui Twins, etc…etc…. the list is endless!!!!!
The Kahui Twins – the list is endless…. That’s just one there mate. Endless would be lots more than that.
Can’t hit a man
Can’t hit a woman
Can’t hit an inanimate object and cause damage
Can’t hit a dog
Children? Yeah lets hit them.
I agreed with the repeal of s59 before it happened but now that I look back it seems a big mistake. It has caused a lot of damage to this government.It was the Greens that set it in motion –
Sue Bradford isn’t the sharpest tool in the shed and I don’t think she really thought about all the blowback that a policy change like this might make.
Congratulations on that Sue. Now NZ is polarised into two extremist camps about this issue. Children are still getting thumped. Imbeciles like Simon Barnett and dad4justice are coming out of the woodwork telling people how its their right to beat the love of God into their children.
This looks like the issue that will push the public into the hands of Mr Key.
How many kids you got savage mongrel and the list , oh yes, CYFS helped murder Coral Burrows, how long ago was that retard savage git ? Have another drink Ruth !!
Researchers have done a study of European nations and guess what, they found a direct correlation between nations that allowed physical correction and high violent death rates for children. Brutalising in the name of “correction” is a problem.
A recent police report indicated that a total of 4 (yes 4) new prosecutions had occurred within 6 months because of the bill. One was diverted, three remain to be resolved.
It is pretty obvious that the bill has nothing to do with our child mortality rate. If you want to do something about our child mortality rate support the Bill and don’t support the beating of kids …
D4J: “Redlogix – is the anti smacking bill a pathetic attempt at addressing our appalling child abuse statistics?”
No, not in the short term. This is a common misconception. The S59 repeal was an attempt to de-ligitimate violence in society, thereby making all forms of violence (including child abuse) less socially acceptable; and to provide certainty to those prosecuting child assaults, so they can do so without fear that the defendants will mount a spurious defence based on the Timaru Riding Crop precedent (or others like it).
Get real Lew, forget the riding crop as scum use hammers to bash kids too death. Oh that’s right have a Hui and make an alibi.
This country doesn’t care about our children and it’s beastly that we don’t respect our most valuable assets.Save the snails and whales but forget the kids !!!!
Now now dad4justice. No need to resort to silly name calling.
That’s two cases you have named now – hardly endless.
It was Steven Roger Williams that killed Coral Burrows, not CYFS.
You can’t go on blaming the government and government agencies for the acts of others dad4justice. Have you ever had a really good long look at yourself and thought about what has made you into such an angry and abusive person?
Savage: I think you’ve hit on something here, but haven’t quite got the emphasis right. I agree with your analysis that the bill has polarised the electorate and given undue credence to D4J and associated nutters, but it’s not Sue Bradford’s job to run damage control for the government over her own private member’s bill. As far as she’s concerned, members (or parties) voted for or against it of their own free will, and good on them for supporting it.
Labour are the ones in the gun here, for adopting this bill in apparent contravention of their own leader’s statement, for whipping their members when other parties allowed a party vote, and especially for failing to play the symbolic issues at stake here properly – allowing the debate to be framed as `criminalising good parents’ rather than `protecting the most vulnerable members of society’.
So while I believe it’s good law and will remain materially unimpeded for the future, referendum or not, in a sense the government deserves to lose this election for its handling of this issue; and National deserve to win it for Key’s masterful stroke of playing both sides – appeasing the smackers with good rhetoric and an attempted compromise, and supporting the bill anyway when the compromise was spurned.
D4J: But the fact remains that the authorities were reluctant to prosecute child assaults by parents because the Timaru Riding Crop case could be used as a defence (and was used, quite effectively, to gain acquittal in a number of cases). This means that many potentially winnable child abuse cases weren’t even brought to trial because the police didn’t want to risk scarce resources, money and public goodwill on losing cases.
Is that good? Isn’t it good that police can now bring all winnable child abuse cases to trial without fear of losing due to precedent?
D4J: It’s just pointless trying to discuss anything with you, but then, I ought to know that by now. Speaking of frothing, you’ve been doing a lot of it lately, even by your own foamy standards.
A cowardly creep am I? I take that as a compliment from a keyboard tough-guy such as yourself dad4justice.
No laws are ever really going to protect those children in need. There are things that might lessen the amount of child abuse occurring – but it will never stop.
I don’t really see why you are so upset. If you told me a little bit about yourself and your situation then I might have some sympathy.
And in d4js defence if anyone could prove to him that the repeal of S59 will save any young lives from the plague of abusive parents I’m sure he’d be the first to support it.
HS: “I’m still of the opinion that the vast majority on both sides of the debate want what’s best for children and despise child abuse.”
I entirely agree. The trouble is that their causes tend to be polarised by the extremists on either side, and the symbolic issues take precedence over the practical issues to the point where people lose sight of what should be done because they’re too busy taking up a place in one trench or the other.
Edit: “And in d4js defence if anyone could prove to him that the repeal of S59 will save any young lives from the plague of abusive parents I’m sure he’d be the first to support it.”
How can it be proved if it’s not given a chance? D4J is arguing it shouldn’t be given a chance. Whether passed or not, this would always have been a case of one side arguing `oh, if we’d just done it my way things would have been fine’. Any discussion of the matter on these grounds is simply getting foamy about a counterfactual – not very productive in either case.
Can’t blame d4j too much — the Standard and others repeatedly (and dishonestly) use silly hyperbole on this issue. FWIW the cartoon ironically illustrates some things that Kiro, Bradford and co. fail to recognise: that children can be naughty monkeys. But Labour seems to live on a different planet where it is imagined that all children are angelically innocent.
[lprent: Read the Rules. Address it to a person, not to the machine, because programs don’t have opinions (as you should know, your site uses the same one). There are about 14 post writers and innumerable commentators here – address whoever you want to disagree with. The posters here would have problems agreeing on all topics. ]
Sorry Savage Ruth – I couldn’t resist one more dig. If you think that some anonymous internet person can make me angry then you don’t know much about me. Must go, fish pie and Monkeys brains for tea. Haha 😉
ropata: “But Labour seems to live on a different planet where it is imagined that all children are angelically innocent.”
They presume no such thing. They simply believe that children – like all other human beings – should not be subject to systematised assault, ever, for any reason; guilty, innocent or otherwise.
I see ropata eventually returns; but noteably fails to answer the very simple question I asked him.
I have to conclude that he does not want to answer it.
No laws are ever really going to protect those children in need. There are things that might lessen the amount of child abuse occurring – but it will never stop.
Contrary to what people imagine, laws do not stop crime. The only thing that stops crime is when people are too ashamed by their own consciences to commit the act.
The purpose of the law is two-fold. One is to punish and deter, but more importantly, it serves to set boundaries and standards..
Laws are big clumsy things that will only on occasion be of use to a child in an abusive home.
The bill was introduced with good intentions but has been hijacked by rightist idealogues, pro-family nut-jobs, scaremongering newspaper editors and rabid talkback hosts.
Violence against anyone is a bad thing. The use of force in parenting is a shortcut remedy to poor parenting. If mutual respect is there between parent and child then there will be no need for smacking. How do teachers cope with over thirty children in a class with no option of violence against the students?
“The direct use of force is such a poor solution to any problem, it is generally employed only by small children and large nations.”
Lew, Didn’t National also whip it’s MP’s after ‘the amendment that didn’t change anything’ was added? But like you say the point of this debate is symbolic. The substantive debate is over, the anti smackers won and the law won’t be changed.
The whole saga has been bad for Labour, the Greens, and the left in general, but if wasn’t this it would be something else. It’s all very well being evenhanded but when all’s said and done, the Nat’s know it’s a good law, they voted for it, and like the Civil Unions or any of the other base enragers, they have no intention of changing it. Partly because there would be an equally damaging backlash against them if they did, from the other direction.
The Nat’s followers and surrogates (but not so much the Party itself) are happy ranting about these things because they are easy propaganda points that keep a small sector energised. But that’s the only point of the exercise, and they’ll keep at it for years.
It’s akin to the religious right in the States on abortion. Talk, talk, talk, collect bucketloads of money and campaign assistance but for gawds sake never seriously challenge the legislation. ‘Cause then you lose the benefit of the propaganda. Which is money and a cheap stick to beat your opponents with. Symbolically of course.
Essentially they are encouraging the anger of a segment of the population, but they have no plans to calm then down by addressing their complaints. It’s pretty shitty stuff in view. But I don’t know how the LP or the Greens can combat it.
They don’t combat it. They just do some thinking before enacting legislation that might be turned into an almighty weapon to lever them out of government.
Redlogix: I think you may not have realised that … there was included specific guidance that effectively exempted ‘transient and trivial’ assaults
Is that so? In that case what was wrong with Chester Borrows’ amendment?
I would be interested to know why you think this exemption is not sufficient for your purposes?
My ‘purpose’ is concern for the welfare of children and families, and the potential for abuse by government agencies.
Mathew Pilot corrected me above, I should have used the words “tifling and transitory”… which still to my mind defines ‘a few open handed smacks on the bottom that might leave a red mark, but not bruising’. Does this exemption put your mind at rest? And if not, why not?
All laws have the potential to be abused by govt agencies. Do you propose getting rid of all of them for this reason? I didn’t think so. If a govt or it’s agents misuses the powers we give them, then that is a political problem entirely separate from the question of child abuse.
Fister: Don’t avoid it – there was no volte-face. You just didn’t bother to read the whole quotation. Read it again. This time ask yourself what the difference is between assault and discipline.
Then you may (but I am always an optimist) actually understand where she was drawing the distinction between Beating and smacking.
Then attempt to understand the changes to the Act. The police still have the discretion to decide which they consider constitutes an assault.
The only difference is that the judges can’t be stymied by parents that consider beating a child with a riding crop, a lump of timber, fists, etc as being ‘reasonable’.
I don’t think that any of the ones I listed are. Do you? Where would you draw the line? Define your ‘mu’ – don’t just use it to avoid defining what you consider is reasonable.
BTW: I started in the anti-s59 reform side. I didn’t see why the bill was required (I was a shit of a kid myself). The opponents of s59 reform convinced me otherwise. What some considered as reasonable in the way that they raised their kids appalled me. The legal situation got interesting after I read some of the judgments where s59 was raised as a defense made me realize how daft the old law was. It came down to deciding what is ‘reasonable’. The short answer is that it wasn’t definable without listing all of the limits. It is simpler to let the police decide as they are closest to the coalface.
Indeed Lynn, the politicized police and the dangerous CYFS idiots are working at the coalface in the Aunty Helen mine of corruption. Arrest that father,destroy family loyalties because they’re so hard to control said H2, go girls go!!!
Despite what people think, New Zealand *does* let parents smack their children in four defined circumstances, writes JOHN CALDWELL.
Certainly the use of “reasonable force”, including “smacking”, is now prohibited for the specific purpose of “correction” – a concept which had never been crystalline in its clarity. However, strikingly, the use of “reasonable” parental force against a child, the age of whom is left undefined, was declared to be permissible in four new circumstances.
These circumstances were (a) preventing or minimising harm to the child or another person; or (b) preventing the child from engaging or continuing to engage in conduct that amounted to a criminal offence; or (c) preventing the child from engaging or continuing to engage in offensive or disruptive behaviour; or (d) performing the normal daily tasks that are incidental to good care and parenting.
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Text and photos by Gearóid Ó Loingsigh Colombia has lived through one week of protests against the economic measures taken by president Duque. What looked like a protest that would fizzle out after its first day on November 21st is still going strong. Part of the reason for the continuance ...
Around a million billion pass through you each second, almost all originating from our sun, but few of them are likely to interact with you enroute. I was reading in a physics magazine earlier in the week about the nature of neutrinos. These are extremely numerous elementary particles, but only ...
By Pallab GhoshThere’s value in covering new research advances, even when the underlying science is unsettled. But there are also risks.The recent announcement that scientists discovered water on the planet K2-18b, 110 light years away, prompted a media swoon. News stories, including a piece written by me, billed ...
I wrote this review a couple of years ago when I was still in the process of getting my head around the politics of transgenderism, and specifically the claim that intersex conditions lend support to the notion that sex is ‘socially constructed’. Since writing this review I have come across ...
Climate Explained is a collaboration between The Conversation, Stuff and the New Zealand Science Media Centre to answer your questions about climate change.If you have a question you’d like an expert to answer, please send it to climate.change@stuff.co.nzHow much does our use of air travel contribute to the ...
Minor planet/asteroid (2309) Mr. Spock is named not for the character in Star Trek, but for a cat that was itself imperturbable, logical, intelligent and had pointed ears. In a preceding blog post I introduced one of my favourite asteroids, (2472) Bradman, and also mentioned (6581) Sobers amongst a few ...
Today the death toll from measles in Samoa rose to 32. All but four of the dead were less than 5 years old. Absolutely terrible, heartbreaking, news. That statistic alone should be enough to give the lie to the common claim by antivaccination activists plague enthusiasts that “measles is a ...
by Gearóid Ó Loingsigh It is late here in Bogotá, almost 11.30pm on Monday the 25th of November as I write this. The day began full of hope with yet more massive marches throughout the country, a mix of the International Day of Non-Violence Against Women and the National Strike. ...
Anti-fluoride activists are rubbing their hands in glee over what they claim is “yet another study” showing fluoride harms the brains of children. But their promotion relies on IQ relationships which the paper’s authors acknowledge disappearing when outliers or other factors are considered. And they completely ignore other relationships ...
New Zealand First MP Darroch Ball’s bill introducing a six-month minimum sentence for assaults on first responders has passed its first reading in Parliament. Mr Ball said the new offence of "injuring a first responder or prison officer with intent" would target people who attacked paramedics, police, firefighters, and corrections ...
New Zealand First leader Winston Peters gave his final interview for 2019 on The Country to tell farmers they have never had it better under the current coalition Government. “Here you've got these record returns [for farmers]. These returns would be nothing like a record if the currency under the ...
Foreign Minister Winston Peters said that New Zealand's Cook Islands High Commissioner, Tessa Temata, has died over the weekend. Ms Temata, 52, died in Palmerston North and had returned to New Zealand for medical treatment. She was the first New Zealand High Commissioner to the Cook Islands of Cook Island ...
A new defence report has mapped out how New Zealand's soldiers will navigate rising seas, and a year after the Defence Force announced its need to prepare for climate change. In the “Responding to the Climate Crisis” report, the Force restates its operational plan and sets goals to tackle climate ...
Mark Patterson, Spokesperson for Primary Industries New Zealand First spokesperson for Primary Industries, Mark Patterson, has called for awareness to be raised and more stringent biosecurity checks to be put in place for African Swine Fever (ASF), a widespread virus that is uncontrolled in most of Asia and a serious ...
Jenny Marcroft MP, Spokesperson for Human Rights A critical step has been taken to end gender based violence against women and girls in Parliament this evening. New Zealand First Spokesperson for Human Rights Jenny Marcroft MP has welcomed the passing of the first reading of the Crimes (Definition of Female ...
New Zealand First MP Shane Jones says it's time to recognise market forces haven't led to the expected reduction in Māori smoking rates and try a new approach. The Party had recently invoked the agree to disagree clause in their Coalition Agreement with the Labour Party, and will not support ...
Live from the Whanganui Opera House, on the final day of the 2019 Labour Party Conference, Jacinda Ardern announced the largest investment in school property in 25 years. ...
The Coalition Government will be banning foreign donations to political parties and candidates, ahead of next year’s general elections. Legislation will be introduced to Parliament and passed under urgency – emphasising the need for such restrictions to safeguard our democracy. The bill introduces a new requirement that party secretaries and ...
Associate Transport Minister Shane Jones opened Taipā's $19 million bridge recently, improving transport infrastructure in the Northland region. The two-lane bridge is 107m long with a 2.5m-wide shared walking and cycling path, and will reduce the congestion that the old one-lane bridge was notorious for. The project had also included ...
The Overseas Investment Office have rejected the application of Mercury Agriculture LP, which is 92 per cent controlled by Canadian interests, to purchase more than 2000 hectares of South Canterbury and Otago land. Mercury wanted to buy 2000ha at Rangitata, 1494ha near Ashburton, 816ha near Cromwell and 212ha near Temuka. ...
This weekend was Labour's 103rd Party Conference! We welcomed over 500 of our Labour whānau in red to Whanganui, where we reflected on the last two years in Government, and looked ahead to 2020 and beyond. We know the long-term challenges facing New Zealand won't be tackled overnight, but we're making ...
Regional Economic Development Minister Shane Jones announced that the Provincial Growth Fund will invest $9.6 million to seal the final unsealed section of State Highway 43 from Stratford to Taumarunui. The Minister said sealing the 12-kilometre gravel section of the highway – also called the “Forgotten World Highway” - through ...
Former Finance Minister and former chair of the Tax Working Group, Sir Michael Cullen, has voiced his support for New Zealand First’s decision to oppose the planned increase in tobacco excise tax. In an interview with The Weekend Collective, he said that increasing the price was no longer effective in ...
Māori are natural storytellers. On the marae we use stories to tell our history, to teach the next generation life lessons and to let people know, in our most creative of ways, who we are and where we have come from. ...
Rt Hon Winston Peters, New Zealand First Leader New Zealand First has invoked the ‘Agree to Disagree’ provisions of the Coalition Agreement because it cannot support the announced 11.46 percent increase in the tobacco excise from 1 January 2020. “Studies show that the automatic tobacco excise increases are having less effect ...
Taupō-based company Geo40 has made a breakthrough in extracting near battery-grade lithium from geothermal fluid which its says could be a gamechanger. Its chief executive John Worth said the earth mineral was highly prized, with battery-grade lithium selling for US$10,000 (NZ$15,600) a tonne. Geo40 was founded in 2010 to find ...
Crown research institute AgResearch Ltd, as part of its Future Footprint plan, had intended to relocate top scientists and support staff — particularly those focused on sheep genetics and genomics — from Invermay to Lincoln. However, those plans seem to have been shelved at the request of the Coalition Government. ...
Ten engineering firms in Southland are receiving a total of $2.13 million in Provincial Growth Fund funding to lift productivity and create new jobs. Regional Economic Development Minister Shane Jones announced in Invercargill that the 10 engineering and manufacturing firms would receive funding to assist them with buying equipment that ...
The number of new residents to New Zealand is the lowest it has been in nearly two decades and it has earned the ire of the immigration industry. The industry alleges that 'Trump-style extreme vetting' is being put in place aimed at keeping a lid on immigration numbers. June Ranson, ...
The Royal New Zealand Air Force is one step closer to modernising its fleet after the United States State Department recently approved the sale of five new C-130J Hercules aircraft to New Zealand. Arms manufacturer Lockheed Martin, in Fort Worth, Texas, will provide the aircraft, but as a "foreign military ...
Forestry Minister Shane Jones wants to create a log barging facility at Hicks Bay and turn the area into a Special Economic Zone. The move would be part of protecting New Zealand's forests from being depleted by India and China, he said. It follows his announcement last week to strengthen ...
New Zealand First supports the changes recommended by the Winter Grazing Taskforce to improve animal welfare outcomes through the winter months, and the establishment of a pan-sector action group to implement them. New Zealand First Primary Industries Spokesperson Mark Patterson says the report highlights areas of concern about the animal ...
Former prime ministers Helen Clark and Sir John Key, formerly from the Labour and National parties respectively, have joined forces in support of New Zealand First’s plan to relocate Auckland's port to Whangārei. While Ms Clark and Sir John spent their political careers on opposite sides of the political divide, ...
Foreign Minister Winston Peters is in Japan for the Foreign Ministers' meeting of the G20 grouping of countries as one of nine "invited" countries. He has used the opportunity to cast a spotlight on the plight of Pacific countries, calling out countries which still offered subsidies or Government assistance to ...
It's been a great week of progress: we've celebrated Children's Day, we've made communities safer with 1800 new police, and we've seen almost 90% of eligible schools take up Government funding to scrap school donations - taking pressure off the families of more than 416,000 students. ...
Hon Shane Jones, Minister of Forestry The Government will further strengthen New Zealand’s wood processing sector as part of our focus on ‘value over volume’ in our forestry industry, Forestry Minister Shane Jones says. Minister Jones will today meet with forestry representatives in Northland to signal new measures to help the ...
New Zealand firms expanding beyond the start-up phase are set for more support after today’s passage of the Venture Capital Fund Bill, Associate Finance Minister David Parker said. The Bill, which establishes a $300 million Venture Capital Fund, puts in place a key initiative of the Wellbeing Budget’s economic package. ...
E ngā mana, e ngā reo, e ngā iwi, e ngā rau rangatira mā. Tēnā koutou, tēnā koutou, tēnā koutou katoa. Señora Presidenta, Excellencies, Delegates. International action A common thread that runs through the Paris Agreement is the commitment we have made to each other to do what we can to ...
Budget 2020 will continue the Coalition Government’s focus on tackling the long-term challenges facing New Zealand while also investing to future-proof the economy. When the Government took office in 2017 it was left with crumbling infrastructure, severe underinvestment in public services, degraded rivers and lakes, a housing crisis and rising ...
The Government is lifting capital investment to the highest level in more than 20 years as it takes the next step to future-proof New Zealand. Finance Minister Grant Robertson has announced $12 billion of new investment, with $8 billion for specific capital projects and $4 billion to be added to ...
The Government is forecast to run $12 billion worth of surpluses across the four years to 2023/24 as the economy continues to grow. The surpluses will help fund day-to-day capital requirements each year. These include fixing leaky hospitals, building new classrooms to cover population growth and take pressure off class ...
The Minister responsible for the Marine and Coastal Area (Takutai Moana) Act 2011 (te Takutai Moana Act 2011), Andrew Little has welcomed the launch of an online geospatial tool that provides data-rich, dynamic coastline maps that will significantly boost research and evidence-gathering under the Act. Te Kete Kōrero a Te ...
The Chief Victims Advisor to Government Dr Kim McGregor, QSO, has been reappointed in her role for a further two years. Dr McGregor has held the role since it was established in November 2015. She provides independent advice to government on how to improve the criminal justice system for victims. ...
Foreign Affairs Minister Winston Peters and Civil Defence Minister Peeni Henare have today announced the deployment of a network of DART (Deep-ocean Assessment and Reporting of Tsunami) buoys. “New Zealand and the Pacific region are particularly vulnerable to natural disasters. It is vital we have adequate warning systems in place,” ...
DART Buoys Announcement Aotea Wharf, 9.30am 11 December 2019 Acknowledgements Acknowledgements to Minister for Civil Defence Hon Peeni Henare also here today. White Island It is with regret that this event shadows the tragic natural disaster two days ago. The volcanic eruptions on White Island have claimed 5 lives, ...
Racing Minister Winston Peters has welcomed the first reading of the Racing Industry Bill in parliament today. This is the second of two Bills that have been introduced this year to revitalise New Zealand’s racing industry. “Our domestic racing industry has been in serious decline. The Government is committed to ...
Minister for Disability Issues, Carmel Sepuloni, is pleased to announce that $291,321 is to be awarded to national and local community initiatives to maintain and promote the use of New Zealand Sign Language (NZSL). “New Zealand is one of the few countries in the world where Sign Language is an ...
Minister for Veterans Ron Mark has announced today the Coalition Government’s initial response to work completed by the independent statutory body, the Veterans’ Advisory Board. “When Professor Ron Paterson completed his review of the Veterans’ Support Act in 2018, he made a number of recommendations, including one which I referred ...
The Government will fund the bulk of the cost of a rural water supply for the Ohakea community affected by PFAS contamination, Environment Minister David Parker announced today at a meeting of local residents. This new water scheme will provide a reliable and clean source of drinking water to the ...
I have had the opportunity to be briefed on the details of the volcanic eruption of Whakaari/White Island, off the coast of Whakatane in the Bay of Plenty. The eruption happened at 2.11pm today. It continues to be an evolving situation. We know that there were a number of tourists ...
Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern and Minister of Civil Defence Peeni Henare have today confirmed initial Government support of $100,000 for communities affected by the severe weather that swept across the South Island and lower North Island over the weekend. The contribution will be made to Mayoral relief funds across the ...
New Zealand's High Commissioner to the Cook Islands, Tessa Temata, died in Palmerston North over the weekend, Foreign Minister Winston Peters said today. Ms Temata, 52, had recently returned to New Zealand for medical treatment. "On behalf of the Government and the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and Trade, we extend ...
Transport Minister Phil Twyford today announced construction is underway on Wellington commuter rail upgrades which will mean more frequent services and fewer breakdowns. The upgrades include converting the Trentham to Upper Hutt single track section to a double track, with a new signalling system, upgraded stations and level crossings, and ...
Minister of Defence Ron Mark and Minister for Climate Change James Shaw have announced the release of a Defence Climate Change Implementation Work Plan, titled Responding to the Climate Crisis: An Implementation Plan. The plan sets out a series of recommendations based on the 2018 New Zealand Defence Assessment, The ...
A medium-scale adverse event has been declared for the South Canterbury district, which will see up to $50,000 in funding made available to support farming communities which have been significantly affected by recent heavy rain and flooding in the area, says Agriculture Minister Damien O’Connor. “Two weeks of solid rain ...
Thank you Professor Juliet Gerrard and your team for the comprehensive and extremely helpful report and recommendations. Thank you too to all the stakeholders and interested parties who have contributed ideas and thinking to it. “Making best practice, standard practice” is a great framework for change and the action plan ...
The Government will phase out more single-use plastics following the success of its single-use plastic bag ban earlier this year and the release today of a pivotal report for dealing with waste. Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern has welcomed the Rethinking Plastics in Aotearoa New Zealandreport, released by her Chief Science Advisor ...
International education continues to thrive as the Government focuses on quality over quantity, Education Minister Chris Hipkins said. The tuition revenue from international education increased to $1.16 billion last year with the average tuition fee per student increasing by $960. The total number of international students enrolled in New Zealand ...
I want to talk about one of the most pressing issues in our national life: the housing crisis and the poor performance of our cities. The argument I want to make to you is that generations of urban land use policy have lacked a decent grounding in economics. The consequences ...
Health Minister Dr David Clark says new appointments to DHBs represent a significant changing of the guard, with 13 new chairs including four Māori chairs. Today 76 appointments have been announced to complement elected board members, as well as eight elected members appointed as either chair or deputy chair. Four ...
Parliamentary Under-Secretary for Foreign Affairs, Fletcher Tabuteau, is travelling to Germany, Poland, Austria, and Spain next week to bolster New Zealand’s political and trade relationships in Europe. While in Spain, Mr Tabuteau will represent New Zealand at the 14th Asia-Europe (ASEM) Foreign Ministers’ Meeting in Madrid. “New Zealand strongly supports ...
“I’ve spoken to Minister Faafoi, who has apologised for his poor handling of this issue,” Jacinda Ardern said. “I have confidence in Kris as a hardworking and effective Minister, but this should have been dealt with in a much clearer manner, and I’ve made my views on that very clear ...
Deputy Prime Minister Winston Peters met with Tongan Prime Minister and Foreign Minister Pohiva Tu'i'onetoa in Wellington today. The pair signed a Statement of Partnership setting out joint priorities for cooperation out to 2023. “We welcomed Prime Minister Tu'i'onetoa on his first visit to New Zealand as Prime Minister. Tonga ...
The Minister of Police Stuart Nash says his sympathies are with the family of a man who died after being shot by Police in Kurow. “Initial reports are that Police were called by a family member to help the man who was threatening to harm himself,” Mr Nash says. “However ...
Ethnic communities will be able to plan and deliver more community initiatives thanks to an increase in Government funding, Minister for Ethnic Communities Hon Jenny Salesa said today. “Ensuring Aotearoa New Zealand is a place we can all be proud to call home has been a key priority of our ...
Healthier waterways, better productivity and farmer wellbeing are front and centre in a new project involving more than 1000 Southland farmers and growers. Minister of Agriculture Damien O’Connor today announced that the Thriving Southland Change and Innovation Project is the first region-wide extension programme supported by the $229 million Sustainable ...
Work to look after nature and restore freshwater quality in Te Hoiere/Pelorus River catchment is getting a significant boost, thanks to new Government funding support Minister for Conservation Eugenie Sage announced in Canvastown today. “Every New Zealander should be able to swim in their local river without getting sick, and ...
Eight Queen’s Counsel have been appointed under a process that includes the new criterion of a commitment to improving access to justice, Attorney-General David Parker announced today. “The new criterion was included this year. It emphasises that excellence and leadership in the profession can be seen through a wider, community ...
Onslow College in Wellington will get 20 new classrooms for more than 400 students, Education Minister Chris Hipkins announced today. The much-needed investment will relieve growth pressure the school has been experiencing for some time. Seven existing classrooms which have deteriorated over time will also be replaced, bringing the total ...
More than 250 young New Zealanders will add international experience to their education, thanks to the latest Prime Minister’s Scholarships for Asia (PMSA) and Latin America (PMSLA), Education Minister Chris Hipkins announced today. This round of scholarships supports 252 recent graduates or current students to undertake study, research or internships ...
Consumers will benefit from a more competitive, transparent retail fuel market as a result of changes the Government will be making in response to the findings of the Commerce Commission’s study of the fuel sector. “We accept the Commission’s findings and, as the Prime Minister has said, we’re ready to ...
Five new cancer medicines have now been funded this year, meaning thousands of people have more treatment options PHARMAC has today announced that it has approved two new medicines for funding – fulvestrant for breast cancer and olaparib for ovarian cancer. This follows earlier decisions on advanced lung cancer treatment alectinib, ...
The Minister of Local Government, Hon Nanaia Mahuta says the Government will consider making changes to local electoral legislation before the 2022 elections to fix the problems that have arisen where elections are settled by a coin toss. The Minister says the recount process in the Murupara- Galatea ward at ...
New Zealand will sign up to new international maritime regulations to reduce ship emissions and lift air quality around ports and harbours, Associate Transport Minister Julie Anne Genter announced today. Subject to completion of the Parliamentary treaty examination process, New Zealand will sign up to Annex VI of MARPOL, an ...
New legislation to transform our urban areas and create sustainable, inclusive and thriving communities will tomorrow be introduced to Parliament, Urban Development Minister Phil Twyford said. “The Urban Development Bill gives Kāinga Ora-Homes and Communities the tools it needs to partner with councils, communities, mana whenua and private developers to ...
Today’s launch of He taonga te Tamaiti: Every child a taonga: The Early Learning Action Plan 2019-2029 provides the foundation for long-lasting changes to early learning, Education Minister Chris Hipkins says. “Early learning will be one of the Government’s top education priorities going into 2020,” Chris Hipkins said. ...
The Chief Ombudsman is launching a follow up investigation to see whether government agencies have improved their Official Information Act compliance. ...
How to watch the Rugby World Cup? How to make spaghetti bolognese? Who is James Charles? Google just released what New Zealanders looked for the most in 2019, and it says a lot about us.Another year on the internet, another year of Google searches you hope nobody excavates. Until now!Our Google ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Rachael Burgin, Research associate, Monash University The NSW Law Reform Commission will hand down its final recommendations for a reformed definition of sexual consent in the new year, following draft proposals in October. The commission’s inquiry is largely the result of the ...
Auckland Mayor Phil Goff says he welcomes the government’s announcement of $12 billion in extra infrastructure investment, including $6.8 billion for new transport projects, and looks forward to working with the government to ensure that a fair ...
“We’re delighted with today’s announcement of $12 billion in new capital investment by the Government,” says Infrastructure New Zealand CEO Paul Blair. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Eric Brymer, Reader, Psychology with Outdoor and Adventure studies, Leeds Beckett University Review: Finke: There & Back, directed by Dylan River The Finke Desert Race takes place in the harsh desert environment near Alice Springs. Scores of motorbikes and cars are raced ...
Climate action organisations 350 Aotearoa and Coal Action Network Aotearoa commend New Zealand’s Crown Research Institutes’ phase-out of coal burning in their operations, with the final two users, Plant and Food Research and Landcare Research decommissioning ...
The government’s books are now expected to go into the red this financial year with a forecast deficit of $900 million, down from a budget forecast surplus of $1.3 billion.The government will borrow $12 billion to spend on transport, schools, hospitals and investment in the regions over the next five ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Blanche Verlie, Postdoctoral research fellow, University of Sydney I moved to Sydney less than five weeks ago and the city has been shrouded in smoke haze on and off since then. I joke this is my “Sydney hazing” but it’s only now ...
Curator and art writer Justin Paton on the process of writing McCahon Country, homesickness, and uncontemporary art. Plus his top tips for art writers. Justin Paton is theauthor of the award-winning How to Look at a Painting. A book so popular it inspired aTV series of ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Jacob Blokland, Palaeontology PhD Candidate and Casual Academic, Flinders University A new species of extinct penguin has been discovered. It’s helping us bridge the gap between modern penguins and their counterparts from the Paleocene epoch – the 10-million-year period following dinosaur extinction. ...
The Environmental Protection Authority (EPA) is placing greater controls on the use of the herbicide paraquat. Paraquat is the first active ingredient on our priority chemicals list, announced in October 2018, to be reassessed. ...
Today the Government revealed its plan to spend an extra $12bn on infrastructure projects following public pressure for them to do more. Irrigation New Zealand supports government investment to ensure New Zealand is future-ready however, the organisation ...
The grim statistics set out in the Child Poverty Monitor report issued this week underscore yet again the need for bolder action to reduce entrenched inequality, Peter Malcolm, spokesperson for the income equality project Closing the Gap, said ...
The Public Service Association strongly supports Labour MP Ginny Andersen’s bill to give three days paid leave to parents who experience a miscarriage or stillbirth. ...
From Waipukurau to Waipawa, Hastings to Havelock North, how did a humble crumbed meatball reach cult status? Fiona Fraser investigates the origins of this east coast delicacy.I was halfway out the door of a client’s premises when he bellowed “Have you had lunch? I’m just nipping out to get some ...
Back in September, when the NZ Herald issued its supplement “Mood of the Boardroom”, Commerce Minister Kris Faafoi featured as the politician who most impressed top chief executives on ministerial performance. The newspaper reported it was the first time in the history of the Mood of the Boardroom survey that ...
"The Government’s announcement that an additional $12 billion capital will be available to address backlogs in our deteriorating schools, hospitals and rail infrastructure and for regional development is welcome news and sensible policy", ...
Whether tourists should have been allowed to visit Whakaari-White Island in the past and whether tourists should be allowed to visit in future are among the questions inevitably raised in the aftermath of the tragic volcanic eruption this week. Concerns have extended beyond the operations of White Island Tours, which ...
Government books are now expected to go into the red this financial year with a forecast deficit of $900 million, down from a Budget forecast surplus of $1.3 billion. ...
Responding to the Minister of Finance’s Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update , which includes a $900 million deficit for the next financial year, New Zealand Taxpayers’ Union spokesman Louis Houlbrooke says: “At at time of high commodity ...
The Maniapoto Māori Trust Board (MMTB) is pleased the Waitangi Tribunal’s report has agreed that the Crown was correct to recognise it as the appropriate body to hold the settlement mandate for Maniapoto. ...
Government books are now expected to go into the red this financial year with a forecast deficit of $900 million, down from a Budget forecast surplus of $1.3 billion. ...
Government books are now expected to go into the red this financial year with a forecast deficit of $900 million, down from a Budget forecast surplus of $1.3 billion. ...
In this hard-hitting episode of current affairs show OTR 24/7, lady journalist Leonie Hayden comes face to face with one of society’s most elusive figures.“Hey baby, show us ya [insert weird word for body part here]!”To many women and non-binary folks this is a common greeting, usually delivered with great ...
Start learning te reo Māori anywhere in Aotearoa with this list of introductory, part-time classes.‘Learn te reo Māori’ is at the top of a lot of people’s New Year’s resolutions. The problem is, it can be hard to enrol after the new year, which is typically when resolutions are meant ...
Last year, we published the anonymous account of a Koru Club member who was denied their mandated birthright entry into the Koru Club. This Koru Club member returns to give us their harrowing, haunting account of the day the Koru Lounge went dry.“Bye, bye miss American Pie. Drove the Chevy ...
A Labour MP’s private members bill which allowed for bereavement leave for a miscarriage has been withdrawn and resubmitted , in seemingly a deliberate attempt to exclude post-abortive women who may also be suffering grief and loss. It will receive its ...
The police are not ruling out starting the recovery operation today for eight people missing after the Whakaari / White Island eruption but say safety comes first ...
Power Play - The latest report on moving the bulk of Auckland's port operations to Northport will be released tomorrow, but Jane Patterson asks whether it will be possible for Cabinet to press ahead prior to next year's election. ...
Toby Manhire gazes back at the last almost-10 years in New Zealand politics, leadership and tragedy.When I returned to New Zealand after 11 years away in 2010, John Key had been prime minister for a couple of years and it felt like he’d been prime minister forever. He was a ...
The Chief Ombudsman is launching a new inquiry into whether central government agencies have addressed any weaknesses identified in a landmark investigation five years ago. ...
Op-Ed by Kaveh Zahedi and Van NguyenKaveh Zahedi, Deputy Executive Secretary for Sustainable Development, United Nations Economic and Social Commission for Asia and the Pacific (ESCAP).“The 2030 Agenda is coming to life”, declared the Secretary General at the opening of the first SDG Summit, a quadrennial event for ...
Editor’s Note: Here below is a list of the main issues currently under discussion in New Zealand and links to media coverage.New Zealand Parliament Buildings, Wellington, New Zealand.Whakaari/White Island eruption Gordon Campbell: On the Whakaari/White Island eruption MIchael Lueck (Stuff): Should NZ look again at risky adventure tourism? Brook ...
The senior doctors’ union, the Association of Salaried Medical Specialists, is welcoming a report from the Medical Protection Society which provides further evidence of doctor burnout and high workload pressures. ...
Responding to reports of New Plymouth District Council’s $1.6 million rates surplus, New Zealand Taxpayers’ Union spokesman Louis Houlbrooke says: “A rates surplus means the Council has taken more from the people of New Plymouth than it needs. It ...
The fatal eruption on Whakaari on Monday may force the tourism industry to review its current rules, writes tourism professor Michael Lueck.The official death toll is six and eight people are still missing, presumed to have died, in Monday’s volcanic eruption at Whakaari/White Island. The people on the island were ...
The Council of Licenced Firearms Owners (COLFO) is calling out Police for stepping up their intimidation campaign of licenced firearms owners as the deadline for firearms compensation draws near. ...
Belong Aotearoa alongside leading organisations working in the resettlement (refugee background) sector is calling on the New Zealand Government to play a greater role in responding to the international refugee crisis, ahead of the Global Refugee Forum ...
Protest groups and human rights supporters are preparing to “unwelcome” bulk carrying cargo ship ‘Federal Crimson’ as it arrives in Dunedin on Wednesday. The ship has carried over 50,000 tonnes of ‘conflict phosphate’ from the non-self ...
Tower boss quits after turning around $6.3m loss with risk-based insurance pricing strategy; and Prime Minister meets with rescuers of Whakaari / White Island survivors. ...
Should we modify the process of government formation to ensure no future incoming PM has the authority and mana of their office compromised from the outset? ...
A petition to Government that would see e-scooters and other personal transport devices banned from New Zealand footpaths is to be presented to the Honorable Tracey Martin, Minister for Children and Seniors on Thursday, 12th December, at 1.00 pm on the steps ...
All eyes today will be on Treasury and Finance Minister Grant Robertson when he releases his "significant infrastructure spending package" at 1pm today. ...
The Auckland Rotuman Fellowship Group Incorporated (ARFGI) is marking today’s International Human Rights Day to draw attention to the NZ Government’s discriminatory policy of only supporting selective Pacific Island languages. ...
Western Australia’s move to legalise voluntary assisted dying continues a worldwide trend supported by a clear majority of New Zealanders, the End-of-Life Choice Society’s President, Dr Mary Panko, said on Wednesday. ...
School support staff have voted to accept collective agreement offers from the Ministry of Education, with the Living Wage of $21.15 as the new minimum pay rate. ...
Our pop culture superfans at The Real Pod look back at the local celebrities who defined the last decade in Aotearoa.If there’s any group of people we can turn to in these uncertain times, it’s celebrities. And lucky for us, New Zealand suddenly seems to have heaps of them. The ...
Wellington’s newest local body political party, the Wellington Party , welcomes the news that if returned to Government, the National Party will accelerate the construction work on the proposed duplicate Mt Victoria tunnel. Party President, David Lloyd, ...
Sweeping law changes proposed by an official inquiry into last year's election and foreign interference have taken too long to be of use for next year's election. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Cameron Webb, Clinical Lecturer and Principal Hospital Scientist, University of Sydney Mosquito-borne disease is a concern for health authorities around Australia. Each year, thousands fall ill to Ross River virus disease caused by mosquito bites. Tracking mosquito populations can help us respond ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Elaine Pearson, Adjunct Lecturer in Law, UNSW As we approach the last days of the decade, it’s important to reflect on the fight for human rights, the setbacks and successes over the past year in Australia and around the world. Our list ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Nathan Kettlewell, Chancellor’s Postdoctoral Research Fellow, Economics Discipline Group, University of Technology Sydney Every year private health insurers raise premiums and every year we rue the hit to our hip pocket. This cycle is heavily regulated: insurers apply to the health minister ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Jenny Johnston, Lecturer in Primary Education, Southern Cross University It’s the end of the first year of school for many children and proud parents. Some children may be reading quicker than their classmates, others slower; some can add double digits, others only ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Sarah Ann Wheeler, Professor in Water Economics, University of Adelaide For the thousand or so farmers in Canberra in the past week venting their anger at the federal government, it’s the Murray-Darling Basin Plan to blame for destroying their livelihoods and forcing ...
A collective of former refugee leaders, resettlement, human rights, faith-based and humanitarian organisations have signed and sent an open letter to Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern and Immigration Minister Iain Lees-Galloway. The letter asks the Government ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Peter Ellerton, Lecturer in Critical Thinking; Curriculum Director, UQ Critical Thinking Project, The University of Queensland As bushfires rage and our cities lie shrouded in smoke, climate change is shaping as a likely topic of conversation at the family dinner table this ...
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A zoo ?
Looks more like parliamentary question time to me !
Overheard outside the Baboon enclosure at Wellington Zoo;
“Eugh, what’s that thing dangling down between it’s legs?”
Overheard at Singapore Zoo;
“Ooh, look at that Chimpanzee carrying its baby on its back… just like a kangaroo!”
Anthropology FAIL
Anthropology?
I remember when cartoons were funny.
Anthropology?
zoology, perhaps?
‘interestingly’, the ‘thing’ hanging between the baboon’s legs was probably not its ‘thing’ but its scrotum – other apes are relatively modestly endowed compared to humans (gorillas are the size of a pencil, ‘hung like a gorilla’ is an insult in parts of africa) but have much larger testes. other apes also have bones in theirs. sorry, just thought you might be interested
Savage was that back in the 1970s when Bromhead was a leading cartoonist, a sexist bigoted one?
Bah, science fail for me…
Steve, the breadth of your knowledge for useless information is astounding
Nah Bromhead is about as funny as knee-surgery. I myself like Tom Scott. Have a read of ‘The Unauthorised Version – a Cartoon History of NZ.’
Sexism and bigotry can be very funny.
Helen Clark: A lot of people aren’t comfortable with beatings but they don’t want to see, you know, stressed and harassed parents, you know, pulled in by the police because they, they smacked a child.
Bob McCroskie: So you do not want to see smacking banned?
Helen Clark: Absolutely not, I think you are trying to defy human nature.
I don’t get it. Is that meant to be Clark giving Mallard a clip around the ear?
And why is that guy wearing Charlie Brown’s jersey?
Fister: There was a point to that comment? That is exactly what Helen said (and for that matter what the cartoon said).
Doesn’t mean that parents shouldn’t be judged by the police and the judiciary for using excessive force. Removing s59 allowed that to happen for some of the really abusive parents who were hiding behind their interpretation of ‘reasonable’.
Fister:
Looked at that quote again. Looks like you only see what you want to see. Why didn’t you highlight the bit I did above?
You like hitting kids with lumps of timber? Or your fists ?
I think I should be able to smack and kick my kids.
Also thump my wife if she gets lippy and doesn’t have my dinner on the table when I expect it.
And shoot my dog if it barks when it shouldn’t.
Does Aunty Helen smack the crap out of her Teddy Bears?
Exbrethren, is your real name Chris Farter? Pooh you stink, wipe it please.
How did that man ever work out the mechanics of breeding?
If I did that at the Wellington zoo I’d get thrown out by the speaker!
George, wooden leg would throw another hissy fit and peanuts would fly everywhere again.
a) children are not reasonable adults
b) children need protection and boundaries
c) children sometimes run wild and need forcible restraint and correction
labour’s solution to the above: create a police state and criminalize 90% of parents.
piss off noddy
ropata,
I think you may not have realised that when repeal of S59 legislation was passed over a year ago now, there was included specific guidance that effectively exempted ‘transient and trivial’ assaults… ie what most people would be comfortable calling a smack.
I would be interested to know why you think this exemption is not sufficient for your purposes?
RedLogix, it’s probably because he believes 90% of parents hit their children with such force that it would not be described as ‘transitory an trifling’. If you believe that, you probably think children need a good hiding, and that this really is a police state. Maybe it’s just ill-informed hyperbole, but it is rather sickening.
Redlogix and Matt Pill – is the anti smacking bill a pathetic attempt at addressing our appalling child abuse statistics? It’s a bit like putting a band aid on a festering wound! At least we are GOLD MEDALISTS in infanticide due to the culturally sensitive pc crap adopted by an out of step government and disgraceful police force. Shame on Labour because the evidence is bloody sickening.
Every politician has blood on their insidious hands. The blood of slain vulnerable children, for example the Kahui Twins, etc…etc…. the list is endless!!!!!
The Kahui Twins – the list is endless…. That’s just one there mate. Endless would be lots more than that.
Can’t hit a man
Can’t hit a woman
Can’t hit an inanimate object and cause damage
Can’t hit a dog
Children? Yeah lets hit them.
I agreed with the repeal of s59 before it happened but now that I look back it seems a big mistake. It has caused a lot of damage to this government.It was the Greens that set it in motion –
Sue Bradford isn’t the sharpest tool in the shed and I don’t think she really thought about all the blowback that a policy change like this might make.
Congratulations on that Sue. Now NZ is polarised into two extremist camps about this issue. Children are still getting thumped. Imbeciles like Simon Barnett and dad4justice are coming out of the woodwork telling people how its their right to beat the love of God into their children.
This looks like the issue that will push the public into the hands of Mr Key.
How many kids you got savage mongrel and the list , oh yes, CYFS helped murder Coral Burrows, how long ago was that retard savage git ? Have another drink Ruth !!
Dad4justice
Researchers have done a study of European nations and guess what, they found a direct correlation between nations that allowed physical correction and high violent death rates for children. Brutalising in the name of “correction” is a problem.
A recent police report indicated that a total of 4 (yes 4) new prosecutions had occurred within 6 months because of the bill. One was diverted, three remain to be resolved.
It is pretty obvious that the bill has nothing to do with our child mortality rate. If you want to do something about our child mortality rate support the Bill and don’t support the beating of kids …
D4J: “Redlogix – is the anti smacking bill a pathetic attempt at addressing our appalling child abuse statistics?”
No, not in the short term. This is a common misconception. The S59 repeal was an attempt to de-ligitimate violence in society, thereby making all forms of violence (including child abuse) less socially acceptable; and to provide certainty to those prosecuting child assaults, so they can do so without fear that the defendants will mount a spurious defence based on the Timaru Riding Crop precedent (or others like it).
L
Get real Lew, forget the riding crop as scum use hammers to bash kids too death. Oh that’s right have a Hui and make an alibi.
This country doesn’t care about our children and it’s beastly that we don’t respect our most valuable assets.Save the snails and whales but forget the kids !!!!
Proud to be kiwi – yeah right!
Now now dad4justice. No need to resort to silly name calling.
That’s two cases you have named now – hardly endless.
It was Steven Roger Williams that killed Coral Burrows, not CYFS.
You can’t go on blaming the government and government agencies for the acts of others dad4justice. Have you ever had a really good long look at yourself and thought about what has made you into such an angry and abusive person?
Savage: I think you’ve hit on something here, but haven’t quite got the emphasis right. I agree with your analysis that the bill has polarised the electorate and given undue credence to D4J and associated nutters, but it’s not Sue Bradford’s job to run damage control for the government over her own private member’s bill. As far as she’s concerned, members (or parties) voted for or against it of their own free will, and good on them for supporting it.
Labour are the ones in the gun here, for adopting this bill in apparent contravention of their own leader’s statement, for whipping their members when other parties allowed a party vote, and especially for failing to play the symbolic issues at stake here properly – allowing the debate to be framed as `criminalising good parents’ rather than `protecting the most vulnerable members of society’.
So while I believe it’s good law and will remain materially unimpeded for the future, referendum or not, in a sense the government deserves to lose this election for its handling of this issue; and National deserve to win it for Key’s masterful stroke of playing both sides – appeasing the smackers with good rhetoric and an attempted compromise, and supporting the bill anyway when the compromise was spurned.
L
D4J: But the fact remains that the authorities were reluctant to prosecute child assaults by parents because the Timaru Riding Crop case could be used as a defence (and was used, quite effectively, to gain acquittal in a number of cases). This means that many potentially winnable child abuse cases weren’t even brought to trial because the police didn’t want to risk scarce resources, money and public goodwill on losing cases.
Is that good? Isn’t it good that police can now bring all winnable child abuse cases to trial without fear of losing due to precedent?
L
“Have you ever had a really good long look at yourself and thought about what has made you into such an angry and abusive person?”
Several Christchurch judges would disagree with your mental frothings you cowardly creep. Have another stiff one Ruth red face.
Lew – proud of our child abuse stats are you? Good on ya mate give yourself a whipping with a riding crop.
D4J: It’s just pointless trying to discuss anything with you, but then, I ought to know that by now. Speaking of frothing, you’ve been doing a lot of it lately, even by your own foamy standards.
Say it, don’t spray it.
L
Lew
you might be interested at some stage that the debate still goes on in other countries as I expect it will in NZ.
http://www.festivalofpolitics.co.uk/business/research/pdf_res_brief/sb02-102.pdf
I’m still of the opinion that the vast majority on both sides of the debate want what’s best for children and despise child abuse.
A cowardly creep am I? I take that as a compliment from a keyboard tough-guy such as yourself dad4justice.
No laws are ever really going to protect those children in need. There are things that might lessen the amount of child abuse occurring – but it will never stop.
I don’t really see why you are so upset. If you told me a little bit about yourself and your situation then I might have some sympathy.
And in d4js defence if anyone could prove to him that the repeal of S59 will save any young lives from the plague of abusive parents I’m sure he’d be the first to support it.
HS: “I’m still of the opinion that the vast majority on both sides of the debate want what’s best for children and despise child abuse.”
I entirely agree. The trouble is that their causes tend to be polarised by the extremists on either side, and the symbolic issues take precedence over the practical issues to the point where people lose sight of what should be done because they’re too busy taking up a place in one trench or the other.
Edit: “And in d4js defence if anyone could prove to him that the repeal of S59 will save any young lives from the plague of abusive parents I’m sure he’d be the first to support it.”
How can it be proved if it’s not given a chance? D4J is arguing it shouldn’t be given a chance. Whether passed or not, this would always have been a case of one side arguing `oh, if we’d just done it my way things would have been fine’. Any discussion of the matter on these grounds is simply getting foamy about a counterfactual – not very productive in either case.
L
I help many parents within the judicial system and I detest child abuse in ANY shape or form.
Must cook tea for my daughter.
Goodbye!
Never cook when you are angry dad4justice – your meal will turn out very bitter.
Savage: Sounds like your advice could be shortened to `never cook’ in this case.
L
Can’t blame d4j too much — the Standard and others repeatedly (and dishonestly) use silly hyperbole on this issue. FWIW the cartoon ironically illustrates some things that Kiro, Bradford and co. fail to recognise: that children can be naughty monkeys. But Labour seems to live on a different planet where it is imagined that all children are angelically innocent.
[lprent: Read the Rules. Address it to a person, not to the machine, because programs don’t have opinions (as you should know, your site uses the same one). There are about 14 post writers and innumerable commentators here – address whoever you want to disagree with. The posters here would have problems agreeing on all topics. ]
Sorry Savage Ruth – I couldn’t resist one more dig. If you think that some anonymous internet person can make me angry then you don’t know much about me. Must go, fish pie and Monkeys brains for tea. Haha 😉
ropata: “But Labour seems to live on a different planet where it is imagined that all children are angelically innocent.”
They presume no such thing. They simply believe that children – like all other human beings – should not be subject to systematised assault, ever, for any reason; guilty, innocent or otherwise.
L
Ropata
You forget it is Sue Bradfords bill not Labour’s – Helen Clark called it right first time with her comment as above from lprent.
heck I suppose beasts dine everynight on hot tongue and cold shoulder
I see ropata eventually returns; but noteably fails to answer the very simple question I asked him.
I have to conclude that he does not want to answer it.
No laws are ever really going to protect those children in need. There are things that might lessen the amount of child abuse occurring – but it will never stop.
Contrary to what people imagine, laws do not stop crime. The only thing that stops crime is when people are too ashamed by their own consciences to commit the act.
The purpose of the law is two-fold. One is to punish and deter, but more importantly, it serves to set boundaries and standards..
Who do I think of Michael Cullen and Trevor Mallard when I look that cartoon??
Laws are big clumsy things that will only on occasion be of use to a child in an abusive home.
The bill was introduced with good intentions but has been hijacked by rightist idealogues, pro-family nut-jobs, scaremongering newspaper editors and rabid talkback hosts.
Violence against anyone is a bad thing. The use of force in parenting is a shortcut remedy to poor parenting. If mutual respect is there between parent and child then there will be no need for smacking. How do teachers cope with over thirty children in a class with no option of violence against the students?
“The direct use of force is such a poor solution to any problem, it is generally employed only by small children and large nations.”
David Friedman
Lew, Didn’t National also whip it’s MP’s after ‘the amendment that didn’t change anything’ was added? But like you say the point of this debate is symbolic. The substantive debate is over, the anti smackers won and the law won’t be changed.
The whole saga has been bad for Labour, the Greens, and the left in general, but if wasn’t this it would be something else. It’s all very well being evenhanded but when all’s said and done, the Nat’s know it’s a good law, they voted for it, and like the Civil Unions or any of the other base enragers, they have no intention of changing it. Partly because there would be an equally damaging backlash against them if they did, from the other direction.
The Nat’s followers and surrogates (but not so much the Party itself) are happy ranting about these things because they are easy propaganda points that keep a small sector energised. But that’s the only point of the exercise, and they’ll keep at it for years.
It’s akin to the religious right in the States on abortion. Talk, talk, talk, collect bucketloads of money and campaign assistance but for gawds sake never seriously challenge the legislation. ‘Cause then you lose the benefit of the propaganda. Which is money and a cheap stick to beat your opponents with. Symbolically of course.
Essentially they are encouraging the anger of a segment of the population, but they have no plans to calm then down by addressing their complaints. It’s pretty shitty stuff in view. But I don’t know how the LP or the Greens can combat it.
They don’t combat it. They just do some thinking before enacting legislation that might be turned into an almighty weapon to lever them out of government.
Redlogix:
I think you may not have realised that … there was included specific guidance that effectively exempted ‘transient and trivial’ assaults
Is that so? In that case what was wrong with Chester Borrows’ amendment?
I would be interested to know why you think this exemption is not sufficient for your purposes?
My ‘purpose’ is concern for the welfare of children and families, and the potential for abuse by government agencies.
Mathew Pilot corrected me above, I should have used the words “tifling and transitory”… which still to my mind defines ‘a few open handed smacks on the bottom that might leave a red mark, but not bruising’. Does this exemption put your mind at rest? And if not, why not?
All laws have the potential to be abused by govt agencies. Do you propose getting rid of all of them for this reason? I didn’t think so. If a govt or it’s agents misuses the powers we give them, then that is a political problem entirely separate from the question of child abuse.
lprent: You like hitting kids with lumps of timber? Or your fists?
Oooh nasty! All I did was point out Clarke’s volte-face on the issue.
By the way, the answer to your question is, of course, “Mu”. http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/M/mu.html
Fister: Don’t avoid it – there was no volte-face. You just didn’t bother to read the whole quotation. Read it again. This time ask yourself what the difference is between assault and discipline.
Then you may (but I am always an optimist) actually understand where she was drawing the distinction between Beating and smacking.
Then attempt to understand the changes to the Act. The police still have the discretion to decide which they consider constitutes an assault.
The only difference is that the judges can’t be stymied by parents that consider beating a child with a riding crop, a lump of timber, fists, etc as being ‘reasonable’.
I don’t think that any of the ones I listed are. Do you? Where would you draw the line? Define your ‘mu’ – don’t just use it to avoid defining what you consider is reasonable.
BTW: I started in the anti-s59 reform side. I didn’t see why the bill was required (I was a shit of a kid myself). The opponents of s59 reform convinced me otherwise. What some considered as reasonable in the way that they raised their kids appalled me. The legal situation got interesting after I read some of the judgments where s59 was raised as a defense made me realize how daft the old law was. It came down to deciding what is ‘reasonable’. The short answer is that it wasn’t definable without listing all of the limits. It is simpler to let the police decide as they are closest to the coalface.
Indeed Lynn, the politicized police and the dangerous CYFS idiots are working at the coalface in the Aunty Helen mine of corruption. Arrest that father,destroy family loyalties because they’re so hard to control said H2, go girls go!!!
PB
“And why is that guy wearing Charlie Brown’s jersey?”
lol
‘a few open handed smacks on the bottom that might leave a red mark, but not bruising’
How many is a few?
How big is the red mark allowed to be?
How soon after correction is the red mark measured?
How soon after correction is bruising checked?
Define a bruise, how small can the blue patch be before it’s no longer a bruise?
This article in the Press cleared up a lot of misconceptions — The Standard should blog it!
Despite what people think, New Zealand *does* let parents smack their children in four defined circumstances, writes JOHN CALDWELL.
Certainly the use of “reasonable force”, including “smacking”, is now prohibited for the specific purpose of “correction” – a concept which had never been crystalline in its clarity. However, strikingly, the use of “reasonable” parental force against a child, the age of whom is left undefined, was declared to be permissible in four new circumstances.
These circumstances were (a) preventing or minimising harm to the child or another person; or (b) preventing the child from engaging or continuing to engage in conduct that amounted to a criminal offence; or (c) preventing the child from engaging or continuing to engage in offensive or disruptive behaviour; or (d) performing the normal daily tasks that are incidental to good care and parenting.