Climate change: Farmers can afford the ETS

Written By: - Date published: 8:52 am, May 25th, 2011 - 45 comments
Categories: ETS, farming - Tags: ,

Reprinted from No Right Turn:

Climate change: Farmers can afford the ETS

Phil Goff’s announcement over the weekend that agriculture will be brought into the ETS has met with the usual response from farmers: whining. They can’t afford it. It will bankrupt them. We should “revere” them as the backbone of the country (and no doubt offer them rows of nubile young sheep into the bargain). So, how much would it actually cost them?

2.5 cents per kg of milk solids, according to the Ministry for the Environment [PDF, p. 4]. Compare that to their expected payout this year of over $8 per kilo, and you can see that they’re bullshitting us. They can afford it; its just that they’d rather shirk their responsibility and force us to pay in their place.

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In related news, Phil Goff reported that Fonterra CEO Andrew Ferrier told him there would be no increased cost to consumers from agriculture coming into the ETS. When given the chance on camera to deny that, Ferrier declined. He wouldn’t confirm it either, because it would kill agriculture’s excuse-making.

Fed Farmers’ head Don Nicholson, meanwhile, says we should “revere” farmers and stop asking them to pay for a fraction of their greenhouse emissions, or stop polluting our rivers, or pay their damn taxes like the rest of us have to.

45 comments on “Climate change: Farmers can afford the ETS”

  1. vto 1

    Look, business does not do what it does not have to. It plays by the rules in play. And does its best to bend the rules and get them changed to suit. It is brutal but that is it.

    The only way to get these bludgers to stop demanding rural welfare is to change the rules on them.

    btw, got a link for the typically ignorant Don Nicholson comment?

    • Draco T Bastard 1.1

      Not quite what you’re looking for but he does get around to saying that farmers want to pay taxes on gross profit like PAYE people. After telling us that he wants farmers to be able to right off expenses, you know, unlike PAYE people who get to pay tax on their gross income.

  2. marsman 2

    Farmers are fouling our waterways, they should be forced to stop doing so immediately and should pay to have them cleaned up. They should also pay for their share of whatever other pollution they create. They have been subsidized by the taxpayer for far too long. Welfare for business has to stop!

  3. 2.5c a kg of milk solid???????
     
    The way they have been carrying on you would think we wanted them to surrender their first born.
     
    It is like the fart tax fiasco where a $12m levy to put into research for reducing animal ruminations almost caused a riot.
     
    Farmers really do need to change their mind set and realise they are part of a community and there are benefits in acting collectively.  Like having gold plated roads running outside their farms, marketing, trade agreements …
     

  4. ianmac 4

    David Ferrier did state on Campbell Live that milk prices were set by overseas markets. See Red Alert:
    http://blog.labour.org.nz/index.php/2011/05/24/who-knows-better-fonterra-or-key-on-setting-dairy-prices/

    • Lanthanide 4.1

      It’s true, but no one has asked him how the international price is actually mechanically translated back into NZ price.
       
      It seems to me like the price we pay on the shelves hasn’t changed more in line with the milk solids price, than it actually has changed with the NZ $.
       
      In other words, when the NZ $ goes up, how come the milk price on the shelves doesn’t go down?
       
      It reminds me of Microsoft. They have a fixed currency conversion for selling their enterprise software to distributors in NZ. This currency conversion cost ignores the NZ dollar. When the NZ dollar goes over about 70 US cents, it is cheaper for companies in NZ to simply buy the software from retailers/distributors in the US. Meanwhile the distributors in NZ have a hard time actually selling it because it’s more expensive than what people can otherwise buy it for online from overseas, but their contracts with Microsoft specify that they must buy all software direct from Microsoft and no one else. Stuck between a rock and a hard place.

      • Blighty 4.1.1

        they probably use their NZ price as a bit of a hedge by pricing it against a constant exchange rate.

    • Herodotus 4.2

      You are being played here by Fonterra and co. Sure the raw material input I accept is based on international pricing. But the wholesale price of the finished product and pricing to the end consumer is not, that will depend on the likes of volume, market position, brand worth and value the brand can extract out in pricing, competition, product substitution, price elasticity and many other variables. From these links all I see is that Fonterra is a cost + coy. If that is the case they should be assigned with the likes of the Dodo
      How was Fonterra able in Feb to freeze their prices? Did they know or believe that prices had hit a ceiling and that there were now just “doing good PR”, was there resistence by the consumer by purchasing less, they were willing to take a minimal risk and forgo a few $ profit should the price of dairy continue to increase? I also note (no links sory) that there was reported that Fonterra had increased its prices just before the freeze and that these price increases were working their way through the system this was given from memory as to why we the consumer were still experiencing price increases after Feb 11.

  5. Jen 5

    And shame on Simon Mercep this morning for letting Fed Farmers spin him that outrageous line that farmers are already in part of the ETS through power prices and the like. He needs to man up if he wants to play with the big boys.

    • Lanthanide 5.1

      The reader emails that they read out made this point several times, which was good.

  6. GP 6

    I’d love to hear you guys tell this to sheep and beef farmers.

    They are the ones that are going to get screwed by this, not dairy farmers. While prices are high at the moment, many have come off years of poor returns and drought meaning most of the income they will get this year will be used to pay off debt and I doubt there will be much income left over. Their input costs, such as fuel and fertiliser are also increasing meaning margins are still tight and while there are a few things farmers with cattle can do stop emissions, there is still nothing available for farmers with sheep to mitigate their emissions.

    It could also threaten our export markets as it would lead to a drop in production, meaning we would be unable to fill up our quotas, particularly in Europe.

    Oh, and one other thing, while Key is wrong about dairy prices rising, the prices consumers pay for meat will skyrocket as these guys will have no choice but to pass their added costs onto consumers.

    • vto 6.1

      Such farming is clearly not profitable then and the land should be vacated.

      Why do they continue to flog a dead horse?

    • vto 6.2

      Also, there has been no drought. “Drought” as described by the farming sector is their own definition based on farming in a manner which is entirely unsuitable for the place they farm. It is not an actual drought. It is their own foolishness in relying on unreliable rainfall.

      In addition, if they hadn’t exposed the soil to the harsh sun and wind, and not burnt off the bush cover, there would be no problem of dry soil.

      These problems are entirely of their own making.

      • Colonial Viper 6.2.1

        +1

        Just like sheep farmers lambing earlier and earlier in the year to get better prices, and then bleating when a snow storm kills half their stock.

    • wtl 6.3

      If you look at the PDF, you will see the estimate costs for meat farmers as well:

      – around 6 cents per kg of sheepmeat
      – around 3 cents per kg of beef
      – around 6 cents per kilogram of venison

      These numbers sound pretty low to me.

  7. vto 7

    If you listened to Don Nicholson (shallow dimwit head of Fed Farmers) you would think that the New Zealand farmer invented farming.

    And invented food.

    And even invented eating.

    You would think that without the New Zealand farmer we would all shrivel up and die.

    This is his thinking. And he represents the most farmers. This is the mindset.

    It is quite mind-boggling.

    • Colonial Viper 7.1

      Less than half of farmers are members of Federated Farmers. There are smart farmers out there who can see exactly what is going on. But in small rural communities they are not going to stick their necks out to say it out loud. They are there however.

      • Bored 7.1.1

        Well spotted, CV that less than half of farmers belong to Feds….my experience years back was that the farmers who worked for extra cash at the freezing works were the loudest unionists when it came to the wage round. Back on the farm they joined another Union to get the best returns…Federated Farmers. Hypocrites want everybody else to do individual wage bargaining.

  8. GP 8

    VTO, that is such and offensive, ignorant statement.
    It would take me too long to write a rebuttal. So I’ll simply say this:
    This policy is threatening an $8 billion industry and also, if you think our farmers are inefficient and unprofitable, go overseas and see how they farm in China where there is no such thing as a resource consent, or Europe and the US where they have subsidies.
    Our sheep farmers are the best in the world. Anyway I have to get to work.

    • Colonial Viper 8.1

      No seriously, if farming is not profitable, farmers should give their land up and let other people take it over.

      That’s what the free market says should happen. Failing marginal industries should be allowed to fail and be marginal.

      Unless of course it’s just PR from Federated Farmers, and they do benefit more (much more) from their $700,000 payouts from Fonterra than their income tax returns might indicate.

    • vto 8.2

      Intresting that you find it offensive. Why is that?

      “This policy is threatening an $8 billion industry and also, if you think our farmers are inefficient and unprofitable, go overseas and see how they farm in China where there is no such thing as a resource consent, or Europe and the US where they have subsidies.
      Our sheep farmers are the best in the world. ”

      I looked at your post and answered simply and clearly.

      I don’t know if sheep and beef farmers are unprofitable, that is their own admission (and effectively yours too). Recently too. I will ask the simple question again – if it is unprofitable then why do they continue?

      What does China and USA have to do with this?

      You claim they are the best in thw world in one breath and in the next claim that they struggle to make a profit…. what the fuck? it is one or the other. shheeeeessshhhh, maybe some basic business lessons wouldn’t go astray.

      Instead of getting heated up (like happens EVERY time this conversation is had with rural folk) how about objectively answering the issues.

      Go on.

    • This policy is threatening an $8 billion industry.”

      Given that the estimates seem to be talking at the level of a few cents per kilo of milk solids, beef, venison, etc. and, given the prices received per kilo of these commodities by farmers, your statement implies that any reduction (at all) in prices received would send the industry to the wall. Yet, received prices have been lower than current prices so how come the industry hasn’t been destroyed?

      Also, the talk from farmers is usually that the world will always need their commodities and that demand is growing. That would surely mean that they are capable of paying what all other industries are being forced to pay even though those other industries may not have so secure a future, in terms of demand.

      The argument that agriculture should be left out of the ETS makes no sense. Am I missing something?

      • vto 8.3.1

        Well put Mr Puddle.

        Come on GP, please give us your accurate assessment of these issues.

        It would help immensely if such accurate assessments are put into the public arena for consideration. Unfortunately it seems that never happens. Which creates doubt of course.

        Not being smart. I would genuinely like to hear it.

        I am all ears… over to you (or someone similar)

  9. Tom Gould 9

    It’s been like a walk down memory lane. It must be 25 years since I heard that characteristic high pitched whine coming from the rural sector, the one triggered when they have their absolute privileged right to subsidies questioned. And it is getting louder.

  10. ianmac 10

    When I have talked to farmers they rightly say that their industry is the backbone and they hope I appreciate that fact. Yes I do. But I suggest to them that they are not farming for the good of NZ. They are farming because the know about it, and because they like the lifestyle, and because they get a good income from their work.
    So, if a particular action is good for their backbone and good for NZ will they do it? Emissions for example and a fart tax for another.

    • vto 10.1

      ianmac, good time to ask the question – what do they actually mean by the backbone?

      And how do they figure that they are the sole component of that backbone? as one example, how good would NZ farming do if no farmers had been taught how to read or write? Does that make teachers the backbone of the backbone??

      And what about the domestic housing sector? How well would NZ farming do if farmers had no house to sleep in at night? Another backbone of the backbone..

      Or the solicitors who look after the port facility contracts without which there would be no ability to export? Another backbone backbone..

      Or the urban wage and salary taxpayers, who as we all know now are the ones that pay the tax to pay for the rural roads and the rural health services and etc?? Another backbone of the backbone.

      So what do they mean??

      • PeteG 10.1.1

        More like the guts than the backbone? Farmers supply the guts of the country.

        As the saying goes, if you don’t eat you don’t shit, and if you don’t shit you die.

        • Colonial Viper 10.1.1.1

          As the saying goes, if you don’t eat you don’t shit, and if you don’t shit you die.

          Hmmmmm. Then maybe NZ farmers should be making it easier for NZ’ers to eat affordable food, instead of pricing their produce for wealthy international markets.

        • vto 10.1.1.2

          yea good one. Do you think we need farmers for our food??? How did humans eat before farming camle along??

          If ya dont sleep under cover at night you die too.

          If ya dont get medical help when sick you die too.

          If ya dont dress warmly you die too.

          ffs peteg your posts are hopelessly useless. Try some thought first.

          • PeteG 10.1.1.2.1

            You could try your own advice.

            Do you think we need farmers for our food??? How did humans eat before farming camle along??

            Two wee things have changed:
            – the population has increased heapsfold and most people don’t have enough land
            – many people hardly know how to cook let alone produce food now

            • vto 10.1.1.2.1.1

              such a silly ding dong.

              NZ has 4 million people and is capable of growing food for, I dunno, maybe 100million people. So what on earth are you on about?

              And yes preparing food for eating is indeed very difficult you are right. I just leave you to it and hopefully someone else can provide some decent feedback in relation to the various questions above.

              • Colonial Viper

                Sad that in a land full of milk and lamb, so many New Zealanders cannot afford to put milk and lamb on the dinner table.

                • grumpy

                  France has a law limiting the price of wine on the domestic market. That is so the average Frenchie can afford to buy good wine……….

            • Armchair Critic 10.1.1.2.1.2

              It takes about 10m2 to feed a person with a healthy (although kinda boring) diet for a year. For the 4 million people in NZ, that’s 400sq.km. By contrast, the country has a total area of 268,000 sq.km.
              Large scale farming operations have not been developed by farmers alone. They’ve relied on:
              – huge irrigation schemes, built by others, and
              – transport companies, to get them supplies (fertiliser, seeds, feed etc.) and to take away their produce to market, wherever that market may be.
              – oil companies, which provide the fuel for their machinery and are an essential ingredient in fertiliser, and in the aforementioned transportation,
              – government, (that’s a proxy for “the rest of us”) to give them a hand when their crops fail e.g. when their land is ruined by flooding.
              – government, again, to provide the routes along which the transport companies operate
              – you may also wish to consider the relationship between dairy farming and the development of hydroelectricity and the national electricity grid before you carry on with your “Farmers = Atlas” argument. It’s coming across as contradictory and one-dimensional.
              – finally, farmers need their customers, which is very much the side of the coin that you have been ignoring.
              What it’s all pointing to is that we are all very much dependent on others.
              Farmers are an important and valued part of society, but they are no more important or valued than other parts. Putting themselves on a pedestal and proclaiming that they are better, while wilfully ignoring their flaws is pure arrogance. It is also very disrespectful to the large group of people who help farmers do the good things that farmers do.

              • PeteG

                It takes about 10m2 to feed a person with a healthy (although kinda boring) diet for a year.

                Interesting. If that’s the case then most people in NZ should be able to provide all their own food. Maybe food banks should hand out seeds with every food parcel so they won’t need to be back next year.

                Putting themselves on a pedestal and proclaiming that they are better, while wilfully ignoring their flaws is pure arrogance.

                I’m not sure how much this happens, farmers I know tend to be fairly down to earth people.

                • MrSmith

                  “farmers I know tend to be fairly down to earth people.”
                   
                  PeteG, They are also the most miserable, out of touch, bunch of beneficiaries I have ever met.
                   
                  And before you say it, I know and have worked for plenty of farmers, they are business men thats all, we owe them nothing!

                • Armchair Critic

                  Maybe food banks should hand out seeds with every food parcel so they won’t need to be back next year.
                  It’s not that easy. People who tend to need foodbanks tend also to have a less secure relationship with their land. In other words, they are tenants and their lifestyle (poorly paid jobs with little job security – 90 day trial and all that, for example) requires them to move at relatively short notice. This is a strong disincentive to plant and tend a garden.
                  I’m not sure how much this happens, farmers I know tend to be fairly down to earth people.
                  I am sure. Various talking heads from FF get on TV, the radio and into the papers, then wannabe cheerleaders pick up the FF memes and repeat them, ad nauseum, on the internet.

              • Draco T Bastard

                How much land to feed one person?

                The minimum amount of agricultural land necessary for sustainable food security, with a diversified diet similar to those of North America and Western Europe (hence including meat), is 0.5 of a hectare per person. This does not allow for any land degradation such as soil erosion, and it assumes adequate water supplies.

                10m2? Not bloody likely.

                • Colonial Viper

                  Indeed. 0.5ha = 5000m2 for those non-farmers amongst us.

                  That’s just a bit bigger than a piece of land 3.25m x 3.25m.

                • Armchair Critic

                  10m2? Not bloody likely
                  I have a 40m2 garden to feed five people. It provides enough so that we only need non-seasonal vegetables.
                  There are some times, when I have not planned my planting properly, when we would starve if we had to rely on the garden. Conversely there are times when we have so much being produced I have to give stuff away, or compost it.
                  I’m expanding it to about 100m2, because I want to plant potatoes and kumara, because I want to be sure I always have too much of every vegetable, and because I have the room.
                  In short – I’m speaking from years of practical experience. How big is your garden?
                  Also, I acknowledge that the garden does not produce eggs, meat, milk, cheese, sugar, or essentials, like coffee and chocolate.
                  Producing meat requires a lot of land, and I expect you will find that that accounts for much of the 4,990m2 difference between your figure and mine.

                  • Draco T Bastard

                    Wish I could have found the article I read a few years ago. That one actually pointed out that you needed 1.5ha (AFAIK, there isn’t a precisely determined amount but educated guesses). Not so much in growing area but in natural support systems – water (catchment/cleaning), composting, air cleaning etc etc.

                    You can grow enough in 10m@ but could you do it without the car, artificial fertilisers*, water pumped from far away?

                    Yes, I noticed you do composting but did you count that area in your growing area?

                    • Armchair Critic

                      Personally:
                      It all comes back to maximising utility – the roof is used to keep us dry and to provide us water. All the water is recycled, from washing the dishes, running the washing machine and even old water than cats and dogs didn’t drink. It’s all off the roof, no groundwater or water from a stream, and it gets to the garden by gravity.
                      I compost on the unused parts of the garden beds and don’t count that in the food-producing area. I also compost separately. People who want some compost (I have too much) are welcome.
                      The car gets used to get me to town to get seeds, and things to kill creepy-crawlies. Though I understand rhubarb leaves make great bug killer. I don’t need fertiliser. If I lived in town and could walk to get seeds, or if I kept more seed from my garden I’d have less of a need for a car for gardening.
                      And it’s true, we would all be skinny if we had to rely solely on the garden. But we wouldn’t be dead.

  11. Sunny 11

    When Fonterra was in the spotlight over its involvement with the Chinese company that poisoned baby milk I believe it offerred to build a children’s hospital. This was, if I recall correctly, instead of paying compensation to the families of the sick, dying and poisoned babies. Wonder how that’s going..how about MSM ask Fonterra sometime? Now would be good.

  12. Tanz 12

    Talk about biting the hand that feeds. Farmers take a huge risk and are being picked on, again. Ridiculous. They need all the support and help they can get, and deserve it.

    Topsy turvy world.

    • ZeeBop 12.1

      Says the debt junkie.

      When a farm pollutes the waterway, the town that takes drink water has to pay more
      to clean the water.

      When farmers take on too much debt and taxpayers subsidies their pollution then
      that tax money does not go on services to taxpayers.

      There is a problem in the NZ economy, its private debt levels, its far to rewarding
      to exporters to carry debt. Why? Because they avoid paying tax.

      If we produce milk, surely as a country we should be able to afford the milk,
      if taxpayers can’t afford milk why should taxpayer subsidies milk production?

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    With crunch time for new Zealand climate policy approaching, most of the New Zealand media have got on board with a global reporting effort to cover the issue. There's one strand of stories today about polling and what it shows about changing public attitudes to the crisis, but the strand ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    4 days ago
  • Pissing-Off The Israelis Is A High-Risk Strategy.
    Dangerous Foes: For those readers of Bowalley Road who feel disposed to dismiss any prospect of an Israeli destabilisation of New Zealand politics, the example of the United Kingdom repays close attention. Ever since the election of Jeremy Corbyn as leader of the British Labour Party, the Israelis have sanctioned, funded and ...
    4 days ago
  • Something to go to in Wellington
    Make It 16, the youth-led campaign to lower New Zealand's voting age, is holding an official campaign launch at Parliament this Friday from 16:30. If you'd like to attend, you can register using EventBrite here. ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    4 days ago
  • A founding member responds to Peace Action Wellington
    by Don Franks It was a lovely sunny Wellington afternoon with blue skies above  the beaches.  In Courtenay Place, political activists packed out a stuffy upstairs room for an important meeting. The assembled pacifists, anarchists, communists and independent young radicals of Peace Action Wellington felt the need for a mission ...
    RedlineBy Admin
    4 days ago
  • “Mistakes and errors”
    Current and former NZDF top brass are being publicly grilled this week by the hit and run inquiry over their public responses to allegations of civilian casualties. Previously, they've claimed there were no casualties, a position which led them to lie to Ministers and to the public. Now, they're saying ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    4 days ago
  • “Homosexuality is same-sex attraction and relationships, not heterosexuals with delusions of gende...
    by Rafael D. Quiles (gender-critical gay man from Puerto Rico) The writing on the wall is right in people’s faces and people just don’t see it or don’t want to. What could actually possess a heterosexual male to want to feminize himself and claim that he is a lesbian? Because ...
    RedlineBy Admin
    4 days ago
  • Trump: “Where’s my favourite dictator?”
    From the Wall Street Journal:Inside a room of the ornately decorated Hotel du Palais during last month’s Group of Seven summit in Biarritz, France, President Trump awaited a meeting with Egyptian President Abdel Fattah Al Sisi. Mr. Trump looked over a gathering of American and Egyptian officials and called out in ...
    5 days ago
  • Magdalen Burns, 1983-2019, fighter for women’s liberation
    by the Redline blog collective At Redline we are very saddened to hear of the death of Magdalen Burns who passed away on the morning of Friday, September 13 (British time). Magdalen was a great fighter for the rights of women in general and lesbian women in particular, a defender ...
    RedlineBy Admin
    5 days ago
  • Parliament and the Executive
    The Brexit issue has certainly brought with it a series of apparently difficult constitutional issues, many of them concerning the respective roles of the executive and parliament. Most of them arise because of the unwillingness of MPs, despite their professions to the contrary, to be bound by a constitutional rarity ...
    Bryan GouldBy Bryan Gould
    6 days ago
  • The Abigail Article; Martyn Bradbury’s Article, and My Response
    . . This blogpost is different to my usual format of reporting on issues… Since July 1011, I have blogged on a variety of political issues; near always political and/or environmental; mostly highly critical of the previous National Government. Other issues included Israeli occupation of Palestinian lands and repression of ...
    Frankly SpeakingBy Frank Macskasy
    6 days ago
  • Police will have to wear silly Buckingham Palace hats from now on, says Police Minister
    Those close to the Police Minister believe the initiative may be the result of Nash “seeing a great deal” on AliExpress. In a move that comes seemingly out of nowhere, Police Minister Stuart Nash announced this afternoon that he expects all frontline staff to don bearskin hats, famously worn by ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    6 days ago
  • A sensible crackdown
    The government has released its Arms Legislation Bill, containing the second tranche of changes to gun laws following the March 15 massacre. And it all looks quite sensible: a national gun register, higher penalties for illegal possession and dealing, tighter restrictions on arms dealers and shooting clubs, and a shorter ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    7 days ago
  • California bans private prisons
    Private prisons are a stain on humanity. Prison operators explicitly profit from human misery, then lobby for longer prisons terms so they can keep on profiting. And in the US, prison companies run not only local and state prisons, but also Donald Trump's immigration concentration camps. Faced with this moral ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    7 days ago
  • Why PPPs are a bad idea
    When National was in power, they were very keen on Public-Private Partnerships (PPPs) - basicly, using private companies to finance public infrastructure as a way of hiding debt from the public. They were keen on using them for everything - roads, schools, hospitals. But as the UK shows, that "service" ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    7 days ago
  • A Movement That No Longer Moves.
    Moving And Shaking: There was a time when people spoke matter-of-factly about the “labour movement” – a political phenomenon understood to embrace much more than the Labour Party. Included within the term’s definition was the whole trade union movement – many of whose members looked upon the Labour Party as ...
    7 days ago
  • NZ ‘left’ politically embracing extreme postmodernism
    by Philip Ferguson Much of the left, even people who formally identify as marxists, have collapsed politically in the face of postmodern gender theory of the sort pioneered by American philosopher Judith Butler. For Butler even biological sex is socially constructed. “If the immutable character of sex is contested, perhaps ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    1 week ago
  • The obvious question
    The media is reporting that the (alleged) Labour party sexual assaulter has resigned from their job at Parliament, which means hopefully he won't be turning up there making people feel unsafe in future. Good. But as with everything about this scandal, it just raises other questions. Most significantly: why the ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • The moment I found out that you found out, I acted swiftly
    By Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern I am every bit as angry as you are. I am every bit as disappointed as you must be. The people with power, oversight and the ability to do something about these processes within the Labour Party should be ashamed. Whoever those people are, I ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 week ago
  • This is why people hate property developers
    Property developers think there is an "oversupply" of houses in Auckland:High turnover rates and falling prices may be a sign that there are too many new houses going in to some parts of Auckland, commentators say. [...] Property developer David Whitburn said there was a "bit of an oversupply" in ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Australia to Pacific: “Fuck you, you can all drown”
    World leaders are meeting in New York in two weeks for the 2019 Climate Action Summit, where they are expected to announce new and more ambitious targets to stop the world from burning. But the Australian Prime Minister won't be there, despite being in the USA at the time:Scott Morrison ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Implausible ignorance
    Labour Party president Nigel Haworth resigned yesterday over the party's sexual assault scandal. But while that's good news, its unlikely to take away the stench of a coverup. Because according to Paula Bennett in Parliament yesterday, pretty much everyone in the Prime Minister's office was involved as well:I have been ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Labour’s Fatal Flaw.
     Two-Faced? Labour insiders' commitment to the neoliberal status quo puts them at odds with their party’s membership; its trade union affiliates; and a majority of Labour voters, but this only serves to strengthen the perception they have of themselves as a special elite. Among the lesser breeds, they’ll talk up a ...
    1 week ago
  • Ten reasons the Tories do NOT want an election
    There has been a lot of talk about Boris Johnson wanting an election, and he has blustered with great gusto about 'chicken' Jeremy Corbyn refusing one, but I think there are many reasons why he is secretly glad he has been refused the opportunity:The Tories are an utter rabble,tearing themselves ...
    1 week ago
  • Prorogation Illegal, rule Scottish judges
    Scottish appeal court judges have declared that Boris Johnson’s decision to suspend parliament in the run-up to the October Brexit deadline is unlawful. The three judges, chaired by Lord Carloway, Scotland’s most senior judge, overturned an earlier ruling that the courts did not have the powers to interfere in the prime ...
    1 week ago
  • Let me explain what I meant by Everyday New Zealanders
    By Simon Bridges. The following is a press release from the office of Simon Bridges, leader of The National Party. Key ora, New Zealand. Happy Maori Language Week. Look, I’m writing to you today because I want to clear something up. There’s been a lot of kerfuffle around some things ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 week ago
  • Yes, the SIS is subject to the Public Records Act
    I understand there's some stuff going round about how the SIS "was removed from the list of public offices covered by the Public Records Act in 2017". The context of course being their records derived from US torture, which will be disposed of or sealed. The good news is that ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • An evidence-based discussion of the Canadian fluoride/IQ study
    Dr. Christopher Labos and Jonathan Jarry discuss the recent Canadian fluoride/IQ research. They provide an expert analysis of the paper and its problems. Click on image to go to podcast. The critical debate about the recent ...
    1 week ago
  • Climate Change: Australia in denial
    Australia is burning down again, and meanwhile its natural disaster minister is denying climate change:Australia’s minister responsible for drought and natural disasters, David Littleproud, has said that he doesn’t “know if climate change is manmade”. Clarifying earlier comments that the question is “irrelevant” when considering the Coalition government’s response to ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Philippines activist speaking on the Duterte tyranny
    Auckland Philippines Solidarity is excited to host Professor Judy Taguiwalo for a speaking tour of NZ in September. She is a well-known activist in the Philippines and was a political prisoner under the Marcos dictatorship. Professor Taguiwalo briefly served as a Cabinet member under President Duterte but was forced from ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    1 week ago
  • Disgust
    I have no special insights to offer on the Labour sexual assault coverup. All I have is disgust. Disgust that an organisation could fail its people so badly. Disgust that they punished the victims rather than the perpetrator. Disgust that its party hacks are apparently blaming the victims for demanding ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Speak Up for Women calls out Greens’ censorship
    This open letter to the Green Party was penned after an opinion piece by Jill Abigail, a feminist and founding member of the party, was censored by the Greens’ leadership. (Redline has reprinted her article here).The intolerance of the Green Party leaders and their acceptance of the misogyny of gender ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    1 week ago
  • Member’s Day: End of Life Choice, part 3
    Today is a Member's day, and David Seymour's End of Life Choice Bill continues its slow crawl through its committee stage. They're spending the whole day on it today, though the first hour is likely to be spent on voting left over from last time. After that they'll move on ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Flight to Los Angeles turned back after passengers decide they don’t want to go anymore
    An ambitious plan to fly to Los Angeles petered out into a brief sight-seeing trip and a desire to return home and get some sleep before work tomorrow. Air New Zealand has confirmed a flight to Los Angeles last night was turned back about a quarter of the way into ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 week ago
  • Indigenous Futures: defuturing and futuring – an analytical framework for policy development?
    There appears to be consensus – by omission – that the concept of indigenous futures should be accepted at face value. So I scavenged the internet to see if I could locate an academic descriptor or a framework around how we think about it as a concept, and whether it ...
    EllipsisterBy Ellipsister
    1 week ago
  • Cadbury rumoured to be releasing the Pineapple Trump
    Here’s another novelty chocolate to shove in your gob, New Zealand Cadbury could be seeking to make itself great again with a rumoured new release: Pineapple Trumps, a spin on its classic chocolate-encased pineapple treat and do-it-yourself tooth remover. The global confectionery manufacturer and bumbling “before” character in an infomercial, ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 week ago
  • The coming resource war.
    During my time in the Pentagon I had the privilege of sitting down with military leaders and defence and security officials from a variety of Latin American nations. Sometimes I was present as a subordinate assistant to a senior US defence department official, sometimes as part of a delegation that ...
    KiwipoliticoBy Pablo
    1 week ago
  • Māori Language Week with The Civilian
    Kia ora, Aotearoa. It’s that magical time of year. Te Wiki o te Reo Māori. In English, the week that frightens talk radio. As you probably know by now, all your favourite media outlets are participating, some more successfully than others. Stuff has changed its name to Puna for the ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 week ago
  • Will Horizons act on climate change?
    Local body elections are coming up next month. And it looks like all Palmerston North candidates for Horizons (the Manawatu-Whanganui Regional Council) want to take action on climate change:Climate change is set to be a key issue in Palmerston North for the next three years if those wanting to get ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • BORA reform is stalled
    Eighteen months ago, the government promised to strengthen the Bill of Rights Act, by explicitly affirming the power of the courts to issue declarations of inconsistency and requiring Parliament to formally respond to them. So how's that going? I was curious, so I asked for all advice about the proposal. ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Corbyn and Brexit
    As the Brexit saga staggers on, the focus is naturally enough on the Prime Minister and his attempts to achieve Brexit “do or die”. But the role played by the Leader of the Opposition is of almost equal interest and complexity. The first problem for Jeremy Corbyn is that he ...
    Bryan GouldBy Bryan Gould
    1 week ago
  • A ditch for him to die in
    Last week, English Prime Minister Boris Johnson boldly declared that he would rather die be dead in a ditch than delay Brexit. Unfortunately for him, the UK parliament accepted the challenge, and promptly dug one for him. The "rebellion bill" requires him to ask for and secure yet another temporary ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Warning! Warning! Danger Jacinda Ardern! Danger Marama Davidson! Warning!
    Lost In Political Space: The most important takeaway from this latest Labour sexual assault scandal, which (if I may paraphrase Nixon’s White House counsel’s, John Dean’s, infamous description of Watergate) is “growing like a cancer” on the premiership, is the Labour Party organisation’s extraordinary professional paralysis in the face of ...
    1 week ago
  • Union solidarity with Ihumatao land occupation
    by Daphna Whitmore Every Sunday for the past two months unionists from First Union, with supporters from other unions, have set out to the Ihumatao land protest, put up gazebos and gas barbeques, and cooked food for a few hundred locals and supporters who have come from across the country. ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    1 week ago
  • Climate Change: The wrong kind of trees?
    Newsroom today has an excellent, in-depth article on pine trees as carbon sinks. The TL;DR is that pine is really good at soaking up carbon, but people prefer far-less efficient native forests instead. Which is understandable, but there's two problems: firstly, we've pissed about so long on this problem that ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • No freedom of speech in Turkey
    Canan Kaftancioglu is a Turkish politician and member of the opposition Republican People's Party (CHP). Like most modern politicians, she tweets, and uses the platform to criticise the Turkish government. She has criticised them over the death of a 14-year-old boy who was hit by a tear gas grenade during ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • Speaker: Tadhg Stopford: Why I’m standing for the ADHB
    Hi there, just call me Tim.We face tough problems, and I’d like to help, because there are solutions.An Auckand District Health Board member has nominated me for as a candidate for the ADHB, because her MS-related pain and fatigue is reduced with hemp products from Rotorua.  Nothing else helped her. If I ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Good little vassals
    The Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security has published their report on whether the SIS and GCSB had any complicity in American torture. And its damning. The pull quote is this:The Inquiry found both agencies, but to a much greater degree, the NZSIS, received many intelligence reports obtained from detainees who, ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • Who Shall We Turn To When God, And Uncle Sam, Cease To Defend New Zealand?
    Bewhiskered Cassandra? Professor Hugh White’s chilling suggestion, advanced to select collections of academic, military and diplomatic Kiwi experts over the course of the past week, is that the assumptions upon which Australia and New Zealand have built their foreign affairs and defence policies for practically their entire histories – are ...
    2 weeks ago
  • The Politics of Opposition
    For most of the time I was a British MP, my party was out of government – these were the Thatcher years, when it was hard for anyone else to get a look-in. As a front-bencher and shadow minister, I became familiar with the strategies required in a parliamentary democracy ...
    Bryan GouldBy Bryan Gould
    2 weeks ago
  • More expert comments on the Canadian fluoride-IQ paper
    The Green et al (2019) fluoride/IQ is certainly controversial – as would be expected from its subject (see If at first you don’t succeed . . . statistical manipulation might help and Politics of science – making a silk purse out of a sow’s ear). Anti-fluoride campaigners have been actively promoting it ...
    2 weeks ago
  • The return to guerrilla war in Colombia
    by Gearóid Ó Loingsigh On August 29th a video in which veteran FARC (Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia) commander Iván Márquez announced that they had taken up arms again was released. There was no delay in the reaction to it, from longtime Liberal Party figure and former president Uribe, for ...
    RedlineBy Admin
    2 weeks ago

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