Control group

Written By: - Date published: 5:04 pm, February 9th, 2009 - 37 comments
Categories: blogs, national/act government - Tags: ,

I’ve got to admit there are days I wonder whether the National Party really have swung leftward. I mean I know they are a party of spin and I know they have enacted some nasty rightwing legislation but when I see them putting the minimum wage up, dancing with drag queens and hobnobbing with iwi I start to think that old school reactionary right might finally be on the outs and “that nice man, Mr Key” might be the real face of National.

On days like this I pop over to David Farrar’s blog and have a read through their comments. It’s like my barometer of National and Act’s far right activist base. The way I figure it is that if Key really is dragging the National Party (and thus its coalition partner Act) left then the bigots that make up Kiwiblog’s comments section will be absolutely rabid.

But they’re not. Which makes me think that the signal to the base is “trust us, there is an agenda to come.”

Well, either that or the whole Kiwiblog Right have been suckered by their own side.

37 comments on “Control group”

  1. As a committed leftie I must admit feeling somewhat confused and conflicted by this. If Key keeps this up I will still work for his removal next election but my worst fears will not have materialised.

    I also read Kiwiblog and I believe that at least some of the contributors are becoming more and more disturbed. Their hatred of Helen Clark is pathological and the suggestion that John is “Helen lite” really sets them off. There are obvious misgivings as John makes more and more decisions that they cannot approve of and the honeymoon may be short.

    He will strike a problem at some stage, possibly soon. When the honeymoon is over his supporters will expect him to revert to type. They will want Maori, gay and beneficiary bashing to become the norm otherwise many will question why they support National.

    And in climate change policy alone National’s decisions will mean that the left will continue to oppose.

    Straddling the centre is one thing but if Key is not careful he may achieve no more than to annoy both left and right. This could be an interesting time!

  2. Daveski 2

    Strange you should also mention this. I popped over there for a brief moment and then ended up back here pronto. This is not nirvana and the bulk are as opinionated but the opinions are more digestable here.

    I agree that KB is the far right of ACT/NP and as such expendable (in the way that the Greens were “expendable” to Labour).

    I think that *some* of the banning is over the top but yes I acknowledge that there is greater tolerance of other views and generally more of an attempt to debate views than at KB.

    Now, does that mean SP will agree he was wrong about Key and the minimum wage 🙂

  3. higherstandard 3

    I wonder which blog DPF visits to get a barometer for Labour and Green far left activist base ?

  4. Redbaiter 4

    Funny ain’t it, that DPF doesn’t show half the fixation with the Standard that the Standard shows with Kiwiblog. Really gets under the left’s skin that people are free to express opinions outside the bounds of your control doesn’t it?

    IrishBill: you’re banned for dissenting. That’s a joke by the way, Redbaiter.

  5. People on the right don’t see Key dancing with a transexual, we see him dancing with a New Zealander, its those on the left that has to label people.

  6. vto 6

    Irishbill, I think you slightly mis-read the situation. The nats have put no more harsh right wing policies in place than labour (recall rogernomics, recall even Clark not reversing the 91 benefit cuts). They are not some ‘reactionary right’. If you recall some history national has generally sat right smack in the middle most all of the time. That is partly why it was always called the natural party of govt etc. They have bent and flexed over the decades to give voice to what they see as ‘all NZers’.

    What is happenning now imo is that national is returning to that old position (which labour had muscled in on, outside of its historical postion, in recent times making national appear more right than it naturally is).

    So, what you see when you see Key hobnobbing with iwi, dancing with trannies and putting the minimum wage up a bit is what most all NZers would do with iwi, trannies, and the lowest paid. Hence the hobnob minimum trannie performance by nationals leader.

    It is entirely no surprise. What is the surprise (or not) is that political bloggers cannot see the bigger picture with regard to the national party.

  7. sweeetdisorder 7

    Sounds like the left is a bit pissed they Key has flanked them yet again. All dressed up and no place to use your prepared attack lines eh?

  8. mike 8

    “On days like this I pop over to David Farrar’s blog and have a read through their comments.”

    and on days like this I pop over to the standard to see if they still gripped by the same blind paranoia – and what do you know…

    IrishBill: mike, you pop over here and comment every single day. You must like our blind paranoia an awful lot.

  9. BLiP 9

    Is it just me and my tired old dial-up and tired old puter – or has someone taken KB offline for a while?

    Most sense I’ve seen there in a long while. 🙂

  10. Quoth the Raven 10

    BLiP – Seems that way to me. Nothing but strings of symbols (long may it last) when I click on it. I just visited to get some of the loving non-sterotyped references from the Kiwiblog right of gays that I’ve read their before to help Brett out with that most erudite point he made and to see if anyone had made any kind remarks about transgendered people. I’m sure brett would’ve appreciated my efforts. Another time then. (note sarcasm I’ll pull you up on that one yet Brett)

  11. keith 11

    “Well, either that or the whole Kiwiblog Right have been suckered by their own side”

    you know what they say: there’s only two sorts of right-wingers, millionaires and suckers.

  12. Rex Widerstrom 12

    “The signal to the base….”?!

    Damn, you’ve discovered our mind implants!!! I’d better warn the other members of the VRWC before you lefties start trying to block the signal with your tinfoil hats!

    Oh, wait…

  13. Rex Widerstrom 13

    Brett Dale suggests:

    …its those on the left that has to label people.

    Brett, meet Redbaiter. Red, meet Brett.

    Oh, by the way… I think Brett once admitted that Helen Clark might possibly have made a good point about something, a long time ago mind…

    😈

    Popcorn, anyone?

  14. IrishBill 14

    Rex, you’ve been around too long to be such a literalist. Or do you really think political language works only on a single surface level?

  15. Rex Widerstrom 15

    No, IrishBill, I was being a smart aleck… but OTOH if Key has developed a successful way of doing one thing while convincing even the most extremist supporters to purr, believing without a doubt that the “real” agenda will be delivered in due course, then he’s better than any political leader I know of.

    I mean there are some people there who’d even switch their anti-abortion stance if there was a reliable test to identify left voters prior to birth 😀

    I think those expecting a radical agenda have been suckered. And that includes some writers here… sadly, from the perspective of real choice in politics, everyone just tacks to the centre line to try and hoover up the maximum number of undecided votes and Key strikes me as the type of pollie most likely to do so… the cautious type with no real ideology to hold them on course.

  16. Anita 16

    Rex,

    I think that Key has learnt that a right wing economic agenda can be separated from a right wing social agenda; but much of the analysis hasn’t. Key’s economic agenda is not centrist, but by high profile socially centrist acts he appears centrist.

    I just used “centrist” three times in 11 words, I’m going to stop now 🙂

  17. Rex Widerstrom 17

    Anita:

    I’ll see if I can beat your score, but with “conservative” 🙂

    Rather than a radical agenda Key seems to me to be pursuing a conservative one… albeit one that reinstates many policies that are far more to the right of the spectrum. But even the “new” stuff is conservative.

    It’s conservative to basically return to the ECA model for employment bargaining. It’s conservative to reach across the aisle to the Maori Party rather than going through with the abolition of the Maori seats.

    I guess I’d concede that the status quo to which Key is falling back was in large part produced by some radical right wing thinkers (by which I mean Douglas, Richardson et al) so I’d say we’re both right. It’s not centrist, but nor is it radical if one defines radical as new, untried, exciting (in a good or bad way) or even different.

    Hmmm… “National: Back to the Future”?

    IrishBill: the ECA is not in the least conservative. It removed the award system which was primarily about government arbitrating for employers and workers. If anything the ECA took governance of a very important part of the economy out of the hands of central government. That’s anything but conservatism.

  18. vibenna 18

    IrishBill – nice post, but I think the frothing Kiwiblog commentators are representative of nothing other than the frothing Kiwiblog commentators. There are plenty of good value commentators there too, but I agree the pathological hatred of Helen Clark from some is … disturbing.

    I was going to make a snarky remark about “lucky there are no bigots on the left.” But there’s no point. I just stand in awe of Brett Dale, for his “gotcha” of the week. Can’t you give him an award, or something?

  19. Felix 19

    Oh yes, Brett’s a special one alright.

  20. Rex Widerstrom 20

    IrishBill:

    With respect, I think you’ve misread my comment. The instinct to return to the previous status quo rather than seek new solutions is what I characterise as conservative. I didn’t… or didn’t intend to… claim the EFA itself was conservative.

    I admitted that the position to which he was returning was an extreme one… but it’s still a return to the past rather than a step toward the future and thus IMHO not strictly deserving of the term “radical” inasmuch as it tends to connote a change from previous forms.

    Incidentally, I’m against almost all measures which remove “governance of a very important part of the economy out of the hands of central government” on principle, regardless of intent, because it invariably empowers an unelected elite. Which is why I oppose the idea of an MPA.

  21. django 21

    Your “nasty rightwing legislation” I see as tax cuts meaning more money for hardworking Kiwis, your “putting the minimum wage up”likewise. “Dancing with transexuals” is typical National inclusiveness and “hobnobbing with iwi” is just National doing what it does better than Labour, and that is delivering real and tangible outcome for Tangata Whenua commensurate with their overarching spirit of people delivering for themselves. We’ve heard Labour yapping about that one, but their “last cab off the rank”, PM not even bothering to turn up at Te Ti Marae was nothing more than their usual “if you’re not with Labour you’re against us” mentality that personified their entire reign.

    As I go about the trappings I find, as you must be, that Kiwis are embracing this new government. Contrary to what you say, it is not a government moving left, it is a government who has cast off the ruthless labelling that successive left wing governments and clever media interests like Edwards have foist upon them. Labour is not the natural government of the people despite their efforts to foster it, and people now know it.

    National never were more than a whisker right of Labour, National cares as much for Kiwis ( in my books more) as does Labour; and I say that Key has shown more respect from to all Kiwis in three months than Clark showed in three terms.

    It feels good out there despite the recession and Kiwis know it and say it. Look at Waitangi Day, look at the flag on the Harbour bridge issue – under Key’s healing words and actions, Waitangi 2009 actually became our default National Day, a day to celebrate. You should put your ear to the ground and take the pulse of the Nation, left and right like this government are sick of the “them and us” Labour way,and most want to build on what positives we can take out of this recession, not bleat on about the divisive and scandal ridden Labour years with cloth-capped fury.

    He aha te mea nui?
    He tangata.
    He Tangata.
    He Tangata

  22. Christopher 22

    where are these transexuals?

    I had a good look at the video, but could only see drag queens, which are in a different field altogether from transexuals.

  23. Tigger 23

    Bill – those are drag queens (‘transvestites’ I guess rather than ‘transexuals’)…I’d also take issue with calling what Key is doing ‘dancing’! 🙂

    Kiwiblog is a misogynisitic, homophobic cesspool. I try to stay away from it whenever I can.

  24. @ work 24

    “Brett Dale

    People on the right don’t see Key dancing with a transexual, we see him dancing with a New Zealander, its those on the left that has to label people.”

    No, but they did feel the need to have a discussion about making sure your son doesnt grow up a ‘homo’, and compare it to picking your nose.

  25. Billy 25

    I wasn’t aware that dancing with transexuals was the exclusive preserve of the left.

  26. higherstandard 26

    Well said django

  27. IrishBill 27

    django, the tax cuts focus 80% of the cash to the top 30% of taxpayers and increase the tax rates for anyone under $41k with kids.

    Christopher/Tigger, Thanks, you’re right. So much for my PC cred. I’ll change the post.

  28. Felix 28

    I’d also take issue with calling what Key is doing ‘dancing’!

    Yeah, well I tried to warn NZ that they were about to elect David Brent, but did they listen?

    Billy every time we find something we enjoy…

  29. Tigger 29

    Billy – no the Left tend to dance with transexuals. The Right just beat them up, literally and figuratively…

  30. lukas 30

    Darn, I must be letting the team down then as I have beaten any in the last 22 years, literally or figuratively.

    Tigger, how can you make such broad sweeping generalisations?

  31. Pascal's bookie 31

    Lukas, JFTR, how old are you? 😉

  32. lukas 32

    22 in two weeks 😀

  33. Pascal's bookie 33

    That’s all right then. Carry on.

  34. Draco T Bastard 34

    That is partly why it was always called the natural party of govt etc.

    Nope, they had the largest base of people enrolled in the party which is why that particular phrase came about. Pity a lot of that membership was from fathers enrolling their wives and children (in other words, it was a load of BS)

    They have bent and flexed over the decades to give voice to what they see as ‘all NZers’.

    You’re deluding yourself – National has never considered anyone but the well off (ie, themselves).

  35. Georgebolwing 35

    I’m with Rex: Key and National are turning into classic conservatives: conserve whatever the status quo is, rather than being true liberals.

  36. You really have a distorted view of the right. I mean really. None of my ACT friends or Nats are anti gay, trannies, Maori or the poor and yet you seem to have a fixation on putting us into some intolerant group so you can throw stones at us.

    Key is a representative of the right and you may as well get over it and try harder next time. 🙂

  37. Felix 37

    That’s an interesting new twist on the time-honoured bigot’s fallback “some of my best friends are…”

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    This open letter to the Green Party was penned after an opinion piece by Jill Abigail, a feminist and founding member of the party, was censored by the Greens’ leadership. (Redline has reprinted her article here).The intolerance of the Green Party leaders and their acceptance of the misogyny of gender ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    1 week ago
  • Member’s Day: End of Life Choice, part 3
    Today is a Member's day, and David Seymour's End of Life Choice Bill continues its slow crawl through its committee stage. They're spending the whole day on it today, though the first hour is likely to be spent on voting left over from last time. After that they'll move on ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Flight to Los Angeles turned back after passengers decide they don’t want to go anymore
    An ambitious plan to fly to Los Angeles petered out into a brief sight-seeing trip and a desire to return home and get some sleep before work tomorrow. Air New Zealand has confirmed a flight to Los Angeles last night was turned back about a quarter of the way into ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 week ago
  • Indigenous Futures: defuturing and futuring – an analytical framework for policy development?
    There appears to be consensus – by omission – that the concept of indigenous futures should be accepted at face value. So I scavenged the internet to see if I could locate an academic descriptor or a framework around how we think about it as a concept, and whether it ...
    EllipsisterBy Ellipsister
    1 week ago
  • Cadbury rumoured to be releasing the Pineapple Trump
    Here’s another novelty chocolate to shove in your gob, New Zealand Cadbury could be seeking to make itself great again with a rumoured new release: Pineapple Trumps, a spin on its classic chocolate-encased pineapple treat and do-it-yourself tooth remover. The global confectionery manufacturer and bumbling “before” character in an infomercial, ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 week ago
  • The coming resource war.
    During my time in the Pentagon I had the privilege of sitting down with military leaders and defence and security officials from a variety of Latin American nations. Sometimes I was present as a subordinate assistant to a senior US defence department official, sometimes as part of a delegation that ...
    KiwipoliticoBy Pablo
    1 week ago
  • Māori Language Week with The Civilian
    Kia ora, Aotearoa. It’s that magical time of year. Te Wiki o te Reo Māori. In English, the week that frightens talk radio. As you probably know by now, all your favourite media outlets are participating, some more successfully than others. Stuff has changed its name to Puna for the ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 week ago
  • Will Horizons act on climate change?
    Local body elections are coming up next month. And it looks like all Palmerston North candidates for Horizons (the Manawatu-Whanganui Regional Council) want to take action on climate change:Climate change is set to be a key issue in Palmerston North for the next three years if those wanting to get ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • BORA reform is stalled
    Eighteen months ago, the government promised to strengthen the Bill of Rights Act, by explicitly affirming the power of the courts to issue declarations of inconsistency and requiring Parliament to formally respond to them. So how's that going? I was curious, so I asked for all advice about the proposal. ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Corbyn and Brexit
    As the Brexit saga staggers on, the focus is naturally enough on the Prime Minister and his attempts to achieve Brexit “do or die”. But the role played by the Leader of the Opposition is of almost equal interest and complexity. The first problem for Jeremy Corbyn is that he ...
    Bryan GouldBy Bryan Gould
    1 week ago
  • A ditch for him to die in
    Last week, English Prime Minister Boris Johnson boldly declared that he would rather die be dead in a ditch than delay Brexit. Unfortunately for him, the UK parliament accepted the challenge, and promptly dug one for him. The "rebellion bill" requires him to ask for and secure yet another temporary ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Warning! Warning! Danger Jacinda Ardern! Danger Marama Davidson! Warning!
    Lost In Political Space: The most important takeaway from this latest Labour sexual assault scandal, which (if I may paraphrase Nixon’s White House counsel’s, John Dean’s, infamous description of Watergate) is “growing like a cancer” on the premiership, is the Labour Party organisation’s extraordinary professional paralysis in the face of ...
    1 week ago
  • Union solidarity with Ihumatao land occupation
    by Daphna Whitmore Every Sunday for the past two months unionists from First Union, with supporters from other unions, have set out to the Ihumatao land protest, put up gazebos and gas barbeques, and cooked food for a few hundred locals and supporters who have come from across the country. ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    1 week ago
  • Climate Change: The wrong kind of trees?
    Newsroom today has an excellent, in-depth article on pine trees as carbon sinks. The TL;DR is that pine is really good at soaking up carbon, but people prefer far-less efficient native forests instead. Which is understandable, but there's two problems: firstly, we've pissed about so long on this problem that ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • No freedom of speech in Turkey
    Canan Kaftancioglu is a Turkish politician and member of the opposition Republican People's Party (CHP). Like most modern politicians, she tweets, and uses the platform to criticise the Turkish government. She has criticised them over the death of a 14-year-old boy who was hit by a tear gas grenade during ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Speaker: Tadhg Stopford: Why I’m standing for the ADHB
    Hi there, just call me Tim.We face tough problems, and I’d like to help, because there are solutions.An Auckand District Health Board member has nominated me for as a candidate for the ADHB, because her MS-related pain and fatigue is reduced with hemp products from Rotorua.  Nothing else helped her. If I ...
    1 week ago
  • Good little vassals
    The Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security has published their report on whether the SIS and GCSB had any complicity in American torture. And its damning. The pull quote is this:The Inquiry found both agencies, but to a much greater degree, the NZSIS, received many intelligence reports obtained from detainees who, ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Who Shall We Turn To When God, And Uncle Sam, Cease To Defend New Zealand?
    Bewhiskered Cassandra? Professor Hugh White’s chilling suggestion, advanced to select collections of academic, military and diplomatic Kiwi experts over the course of the past week, is that the assumptions upon which Australia and New Zealand have built their foreign affairs and defence policies for practically their entire histories – are ...
    1 week ago
  • The Politics of Opposition
    For most of the time I was a British MP, my party was out of government – these were the Thatcher years, when it was hard for anyone else to get a look-in. As a front-bencher and shadow minister, I became familiar with the strategies required in a parliamentary democracy ...
    Bryan GouldBy Bryan Gould
    1 week ago
  • More expert comments on the Canadian fluoride-IQ paper
    The Green et al (2019) fluoride/IQ is certainly controversial – as would be expected from its subject (see If at first you don’t succeed . . . statistical manipulation might help and Politics of science – making a silk purse out of a sow’s ear). Anti-fluoride campaigners have been actively promoting it ...
    1 week ago
  • The return to guerrilla war in Colombia
    by Gearóid Ó Loingsigh On August 29th a video in which veteran FARC (Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia) commander Iván Márquez announced that they had taken up arms again was released. There was no delay in the reaction to it, from longtime Liberal Party figure and former president Uribe, for ...
    RedlineBy Admin
    1 week ago
  • Air New Zealand identifies this enormous plot of unused land as possible second airport site
    Air New Zealand couldn’t believe its luck that this seemingly ideal piece of real estate had so far gone entirely unnoticed. Air New Zealand’s search for a site to build a second Auckland Airport may have made a breakthrough this afternoon, after employees scanning Google satellite imagery spotted a huge, ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    2 weeks ago
  • Redline on the Labour Party
    No-one on the anti-capitalist left in this country today puts forward a case that Labour is on the side of the working class.  There are certainly people who call themselves ‘socialist’ who do, but they are essentially liberals with vested interests in Labourism – often for career reasons. Nevertheless, there ...
    RedlineBy Admin
    2 weeks ago
  • New Fisk
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • Labour’s failure
    When National was in government and fucking over the poor for the benefit of the rich, foodbanks were a growth industry. And now Labour is in charge, nothing has changed: A huge demand for emergency food parcels means the Auckland City Mission is struggling to prepare for the impending arrival ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • Ardern attempts to vaccinate Clarke Gayford live on television to prove that it’s safe
    Gayford, pictured here on The Project, before things got wildly out of control. A bold public relations move by the Government to encourage parents to vaccinate their children has gone horribly wrong. Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern appeared on tonight’s episode of Three’s The Project, where the plan was for her ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    2 weeks ago
  • Has Mr. Whippy gone too far by parking on our front lawns?
    Mr. Whippy’s business model has driven it down a dark road of intimidation. Residents in major centres around the country are becoming disgruntled by the increasingly aggressive actions of purported ice cream company Mr. Whippy, who have taken to parking on people’s front lawns and doorsteps in a desperate attempt ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    2 weeks ago
  • Cleaning up the water
    Today the government released its Action Plan for Healthy Waterways, aimed at cleaning up our lakes and rivers. Its actually quite good. There will be protection for wetlands, better standards for swimming spots, a requirement for continuous improvement, and better standards for wastewater and stormwater. But most importantly, there's a ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • Fronting up
    Today I appeared before the Environment Committee to give an oral submission on the Zero Carbon Bill. Over 1,500 people have asked to appear in person, so they've divided into subcommittees and are off touring the country, giving people a five minute slot each. The other submitters were a mixed ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • Politics of science – making a silk purse out of a sow’s ear
    Anti-fluoride activists have some wealthy backers – they are erecting billboards misrepresenting the Canadian study on many New Zealand cities – and local authorities are ordering their removal because of their scaremongering. Many New Zealanders ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Democracy – I Don’t Think So
    So, those who “know best” have again done their worst. While constantly claiming to be the guardians of democracy and the constitution, and respecters of the 2016 referendum result, diehard Remainers (who have never brought themselves to believe that their advice could have been rejected) have striven might and main ...
    Bryan GouldBy Bryan Gould
    2 weeks ago

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