Daily Review 22/11/2017

Written By: - Date published: 5:30 pm, November 22nd, 2017 - 78 comments
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Daily review is also your post.

This provides Standardistas the opportunity to review events of the day.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).

Don’t forget to be kind to each other …

78 comments on “Daily Review 22/11/2017”

  1. Bruce 1

    The news at the moment seems to be filled with reports of the lunacy in North Korea. Yet I see nothing about the madness in Thailand as the new king (check out his record for sexual harrasment) and dictator ship steer the country back to the stone age. People are disappearing , dying and being detained for attitude adjustment but not a whisper. Is it because there is profit to be made here.

    https://thaipoliticalprisoners.wordpress.com

    Or Google murder island

    • Bill 1.1

      Your link mentions Yingluck Shinawatra (ex Thai PM) and the fact she’s “completely disappeared from public view.”

      Well, since it seems she skipped the country and has been reported as being in Dubai and also London (seeking asylum)…then yeah – it stands to reason she’s not in public view.

      Throw in the continuing ban on “political activity” and I guess a good number of people will be “not in the public view”.

      • Bruce 1.1.1

        Yes that’s the latest story, the link was just an example scroll a bit further , the young Karen activist executed, the young man in Koen Ken imprisoned for being one of 1000 clicked like on a BBC story on face Facebook , the prison in the palace.

        • Bill 1.1.1.1

          Not seeing any of that stuff. But the page offering a partial list of “pending and acquitted” cases and “convictions” are illuminating.

          Clicking on names leads to pages about the accused/convicted and related media coverage.

          • Bruce 1.1.1.1.1

            https://www.japantimes.co.jp/opinion/2017/06/02/commentary/world-commentary/dhaveevatthana-prison-hell-earth-thailand/#.WhUv_o2laf0

            Try this one but I guess the point I was trying to make is all the news on Nth Korea when other stories ; Cambodia too, is perhaps softening us up for some military action against the rogue state

            • Bill 1.1.1.1.1.1

              Thanks.

            • One Two 1.1.1.1.1.2

              http://www.thenewatlas.org/2017/11/west-already-targeting-thailands-new.html?m=1

              From a more informed position, speaking directly to the article you linked to

              Your sources and information regarding NK, Th and CAM are woefully incomplete

              Not a good position to form an opinion from..

              • Bruce

                Well,I can’t say I’ve never heard that before.But over 20 years experience and a bit of reading I’m happy to defer and continue to enjoy living among some of the most beautiful people I’ve met. I

                • Bruce

                  Russian propaganda agency Sputnik News is trying to undermine the pro-democracy movement in Thailand with the encouragement of “Tony Cartalucci”. Cartalucci is not a real person, it’s a fake name used by elderly Bangkok-based American troll Michael Pirsch and others to praise the junta and launch vicious attacks on anyone he disagrees with. Sadly, many royalist Thais believe this nonsense.

                  Sorry I just cut and pasted this from a comment I found searching the writers name from Facebook.

                  I understand there is to sides to all conflict and opinions differ but for me the ability to think freely is what makes Kiwis what we are and being denied this I believe holds the people of Thailand back

                  • One Two

                    You’re right that it is very difficult to know which sources to think through…

                    Unfortunately those free thinking kiwis you refer to are mostly a myth, Bruce.
                    Nz is a heavily regulated propaganda machine from end to end.

                    What do you actually know about Thai people, Bruce?

                    Do you live in Thailand, study the history or perhaps have Thai family there?

              • Bill

                So first you assert (with no reason given) that an extensive piece that’s been linked to is not a good position to form an opinion from

                Then you assert that it is very difficult to know which sources to think through…

                You ever heard of critical reasoning?

                I’m guessing not, since the wordpress piece you yourself linked to as being more informed follows the tired old pattern of right wing tosh – ie, take some reasonably well accepted facts or opinions and then shoe-horn in some unsubstantiated, or at best very tenuous stuff about Soros*- and all in defence of some authoritarianism.

                * A Rothschild and/or vast secret conspiracy are employed to similar effect too

                • One Two

                  Critical reasoning..

                  Yes Bill, of course..

                  It comes after comprehension, though, which I’ll help you out with…

                  The japan times link bruce posted…ok yes I read it and it is not accurate and missing simple important ‘facts’, just like the Al J link you posted to..

                  The link i posted , is closer to the mark, I know this because of the details contained, and the background and experiences I have in the area

                  Does that make it ‘accurate’ or ‘precise’, yes and no…but its more of both than the other links…

                  So, whose sources to ‘believe’…as per my comment to Bruce…it’s difficult, but not impossible..
                  There are some clear points of difference between the links, readily identifiable with knowledge and experience with Thailand

                  There is also foreign funding seeking to undermine nations, and Thailand geo-politicaly is in the middle of it..

                  While severing ties with ‘The West, it is simultaneously strengthing ties with is neighbors, including China.
                  Yes I have seen this in Thailand, first hand with my own eyes, Bill

                  You let yourself down making references to ‘conspiracy’

                  Of course the media are are being manipulated by international funding…

                  • Bill

                    I was commenting in relation to the original link provided by Bruce – thaipoliticalprisoners.wordpress.com – not the Japanese Times link.

                    And yes, media is manipulated and/or runs agendas.

                    • One Two

                      Either way, Bill, as you acknowledge…

                      They’re all somewhat suspect to varying degrees..

                      Without first hand, and or prolonged experiences inside the country (or any other country for that matter), ability to decern information within articles, is diminished..severely in most circumstances…

                    • One Anonymous Bloke

                      Glad to see you could get some “help” with that comprehension problem of yours 😈

    • Bill 1.2

      And for anyone who’s forgotten all the “red shirt/yellow shirt” divide…

      http://america.aljazeera.com/articles/2014/1/24/explainer-in-thailandwhyyellowandredclash.html

    • One Anonymous Bloke 1.3

      The military authorities further restricted human rights. Peaceful political dissent, whether through speech or protests, and acts perceived as critical of the monarchy were punished or banned. Politicians, activists and human rights defenders faced criminal investigations and prosecutions for, among other things, campaigning against a proposed Constitution and reporting on state abuses. Many civilians were tried in military courts. Torture and other ill-treatment was widespread. Community land rights activists faced arrest, prosecution and violence for opposing development projects and advocating for the rights of communities.

      A whisper.

      And yes, follow the money.

      Shameful eh.

      • Bill 1.3.1

        Oh. I thought your second link might go to something related to frozen potato chips (under “Agreement Highlights”) 😉

        • One Anonymous Bloke 1.3.1.1

          Estimates of tourism receipts directly contributing to the Thai GDP of 12 trillion baht range from 9 percent (one trillion baht) (2013) to 17.7 percent (2.53 trillion baht) in 2016.

          Wikipedia. (No doubt some wise old fuckwit will be along in a moment to inform us that Wikipedia is another ‘useful tool’ of The West.)

          But then so are tourism and trade 😉

          • Bill 1.3.1.1.1

            Tourists eat frozen chips, aye?

            • One Anonymous Bloke 1.3.1.1.1.1

              😆

              Not sure I’ve ever eaten a chip in Thailand. When in Bangkok I always made a beeline for the noodle carts though. Does that count?

              • Bruce

                Well today’s the day , I struggle a bit on the diet side , not eating chicken or pork, but the avocados are plentiful and this evening I will be demonstrating making guacamole and having chips and dip. Monday I was in Burma and found a new dish that involves slow BBQing long eggplants; well that’s what my wife calls them a version of the round ones that are used in som tum. When cooked they burst open so you can peel back the skin add some oil ,chillies and coriander and eat off the skin, simply delicious.
                Yes it’s an old culture with many wonderful aspects but times change and people must adapt and so I think traditions too and while the people I see have no interest in politics or really care who’s in charge they just get on and live life but I’m a silly old falung who thinks they deserve better and don”t think it’s fair that their lives should be getting harder because of who they vote for. The road has now detiriated to a dirt track and the town supply water is no more as spending on infrastucture has stopped, but with no voice the locals just get on .
                I get a pretty good view of the life involved with most of the goings on, not the cock fighting or prostitution. And with no one to talk too, no English, I read a lot of both sides, although that’s harder with the blocking of sites.
                I don’t live here but work hard in Nz to make the money for extended stays and being in the golden triangle it’s easy to trip too Burma and Laos to get new stamps.

                • One Anonymous Bloke

                  When cooked they burst open so you can peel back the skin add some oil ,chillies and coriander and eat off the skin, simply delicious.

                  Fresh coriander? Definitely trying that. Best eggplant dish I know is “The priest fainted”, but that’s another story 🙂

                  My brief time in Thailand is a memory of great food, awesome rock towers, good tailors and Wats. From wider reading, there seems to be an “acceptance” that this, one of the oldest continuous cultures in the world, is punctuated by regular military takeover of the government.

                  Sometimes I think we falung are a bit stoicism-challenged. Or maybe just intolerant of torture.

      • One Two 1.3.2

        “A whisper”..

        No, that’s Amnesty International, which is ‘a useful tool’ of The West

        Thai institutions, history, culture and present time circumstance, will not be something you’re familiar enough with to ‘join those dots’..

        • One Anonymous Bloke 1.3.2.1

          🙄

          Oh please teach me, wise old fuckwit.

          • One Two 1.3.2.1.1

            Go and live in Thailand for an extended period of time, study the ancient culture and institutions, understand what ‘being Thai’ is about..

            Or keep posting links to AI,it shows just how little you care to understand..

            You don’t ‘know’ Thailand or its peoples..

            • One Anonymous Bloke 1.3.2.1.1.1

              That’s pretty much what you said to Bruce, who lives there.

              Your ego deludes you that you are much wiser and more profound than everyone else, but all you ever bring to the table is a cock-measuring competition.

              However, since I never claimed to ‘know’ Thailand, or its people, your cock appears to be made of straw.

              Deepak Chopra random wisdom generator says: “Perception is only possible in nonlocal marvel”.

              • One Two

                “All you ever bring to the table is a cock measuring competition…”

                Your interpretation/observation is terribly distorted…and incorrect…

                So as a statement from a handle with a long history of negative and abusive , angry commentary, it is fitting that a core reason for the rage and hostility has come out…

                Now the reason has been tabled, and admitted, by you…

                Accept it, and move towards a more positive contribution

                Or don’t ….

                • One Anonymous Bloke

                  In summation:

                  OAB: links to evidence of human rights abuses in Thailand, as reported by Thai people. Adds references to Thailand as a tourist and trade destination, as a hint that these abuses are being largely ignored and possible even exploited locally.

                  One Two: “You don’t know, care, or understand Thailand or its peoples.” Offers precisely zero in explanation other than the entirely uncontroversial observation that media sources are biased (well duh!)

                  You bring precise;y zero to this discussion and you want to lecture me about manners. Your new name is Cockstraw.

        • Colonial Viper 1.3.2.2

          It seems that colonial-era mindset White Skins still enjoy lecturing coloured people on how to run their countries. The righteous morally superior west, spreading democracy since the Belgian Congo 🙄

            • James Thrace 1.3.2.2.1.1

              I really don’t get the epithets you keep throwing around OAB. It is possible to discuss someone’s opinion without restorting to schoolyard name calling. Ie fuckwit, dickhead et al

              • One Anonymous Bloke

                The “opinions” in question are ad hominem attacks. I often respond to those “in kind”. Yes, it’s probably not the best response from an ethical perspective.

                On the other hand, good manners are a useful tool of the West. Come and see the violence inherent in the system.

                • Zorb6

                  A lousy justification for your juvenile behaviour.

                  • One Anonymous Bloke

                    English comprehension isn’t your strong suit, eh.

                    I didn’t “justify” a damn thing. I didn’t even make any excuses. Read it again and see if you can figure it out.

                    • Zorb6

                      Read this again s l o w l y and let it sink in.’The “opinions” in question are ad hominem attacks. I often respond to those “in kind”. Yes, it’s probably not the best response from an ethical perspective.’

                    • One Anonymous Bloke

                      ’The “opinions” in question are ad hominem attacks. I often respond to those “in kind”.

                      That is a fact. I do often respond in kind. Not an excuse. Not a justification.

                      Yes, it’s probably not the best response from an ethical perspective.

                      That’s me agreeing with James Thrace that my behaviour is sub-optimal. Not an excuse. Not a justification.

                      On the other hand, good manners are a useful tool of the West. Come and see the violence inherent in the system.

                      …and that’s me lampooning One Two and CV’s virtue signals. Not an excuse. Not a justification.

                      Need any more assistance?

        • Bill 1.3.2.3

          I’d agree that AI is a tainted organisation these days and it’s stand alone reports can’t be taken at face value. But given the plethora of information from Thai sources and others that accords with aspects of the report in this case, and that, crucially, don’t rely on the report at all (ie – no reinforcing echo at work), I’d probably give this report some more credibility than some other AI reports I’ve come across.

          Yes, they are compromised. No, they are not entirely worthless.

          • One Anonymous Bloke 1.3.2.3.1

            All individual sources are compromised. Trite I know, but it’s worth repeating.

  2. ScottGN 2

    Apparently Vernon Small has left Fairfax to take up the job of Press Secretary in David Parker’s office. Hopefully he can lend some grunt to efforts around messaging right across the government.
    Today’s efforts were pretty bloody crap.
    Increasing student allowances is a good thing. Helping students to get through their studies, right across the tertiary sector, without racking up crippling debts is a good thing.
    And it turns out that increasing student allowances by $50 a week is going to be cheaper than Labour budgeted for in the election campaign.
    So why not lead with that? Why not put out a press release practically trumpeting how delighted you are that you can meet a campaign promise at less cost than initially assumed?
    Instead of releasing the new policy with no numbers, leaving the PM to defend that and then 2 hours later undercutting her by hurriedly putting out the costings?
    Ditto the school starting age. No one in the education sector supported National’s, frankly odd, decision to move to cohort entry. So why not take some time to build an argument around that before simply announcing another policy change that has left Hipkins open to National’s new favourite “nanny state” attacks?

    • Anne 2.1

      Not surprised to hear it. Vernon Small is one of our best journos who knows how to put professionalism into journalism. David Parker is regarded as having the best intellectual credentials on offer in our parliament. They should work very well together.

      • Craig H 2.1.1

        Random fact – Vernon Small is also one of NZ’s strongest ever chess players, and represented NZ back in the day.

      • Colonial Viper 2.1.2

        Anne, David Parker is intellectually arrogant and doesn’t know how to listen, seemingly because no one else knows better than him. He’s also a great believer in the unaffordability of NZ Super and the need to lift the retirement age to 68 or 70. Hopeless.

  3. joe90 3

    Central Europe… where never again is turning into ,…perhaps not…?

    News server iDNES.cz reported last week that Jaroslav Staník, the secretary for the Freedom and Direct Democracy (SPD) movement chaired by Tomio Okamura, has been reported to the state prosecutor on suspicion of criminal activity. Activist Jan Cemper filed the complaint after Staník made remarks about minorities that included calls for their murder.

    According to the testimonies of several members of the Czech lower house, Staník is said to have declared that “Jews, homosexuals and gypsies should be gassed.” He is said to have made the remarks approximately two weeks ago in the club room of the Chamber of Deputies.

    http://www.romea.cz/en/news/czech/crime-report-filed-after-czech-politician-calls-for-murder-of-minorities

  4. timeforacupoftea 4

    Hello Wellington

    Upsurge in big earthquakes predicted for 2018 as Earth rotation slows
    Scientists say number of severe quakes is likely to rise strongly next year because of a periodic slowing of the Earth’s rotation

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/nov/18/2018-set-to-be-year-of-big-earthquakes

    Must be all that ” Man-Made ” CO2 😉

    * The government appoints a body to provide it with the advice it wants, in order to pursue the policies it wants.

    • greywarshark 4.1

      Avaaz has something interesting today as well.
      But scientists have discovered something astounding — if we free 50% of our planet from human exploitation, our ecosystem will stabilise and regenerate. Life on earth will recover!

      They say we could make a huge difference in 24 months. It would be great.
      Read here:
      Alice Jay – Avaaz

  5. adam 5

    New Zealand ah, where there is not a list of groping men in the media.

    But we seem more than happy to give a guy who bashed his girlfriend – a promotion, more wages, and a new tv show.

    Must be nice to be have so much white male privilege.

  6. Muttonbird 6

    More comment on China’s involvement in Zimbabwe affairs. This from former British foreign secretary, William Hague. He says…

    All over Africa, there are foreign ministries, presidential palaces and infrastructure built with help from China.

    There is nothing wrong with that in principle, except that such aid comes with few qualms about poor governance, absence of democracy and serious violations of human rights.

    Indeed, how can a country which has serious shortcomings in the promotion of transparency of governance and the fighting of corruption in governance, serious shortcomings in even the concept of democracy, and a very poor human rights record be expected to be concerned about those values when ‘investing’ in other country’s affairs?

    Indeed, how is it possible to say China’s 40 year involvement in Zimbabwe affairs has been anything but a corrupt failure?

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/world/africa/99130973/zimbabwe-could-become-a-mini-china-after-the-slowmotion-collapse-of-robert-mugabe

    • Ad 6.1

      The British critiquing China for failing in Zimbabwe.

      Wednesday comedy gold.

      • Muttonbird 6.1.1

        You can laugh at Britain for the Rhodesian regime in Zimbabwe if you like, just as some others recently held up King Leopold’s Congo and the Kaiser’s Namibia as a defence of China’s foray into modern Africa, but pre-contemporary Europe’s behaviour there is of a brutal era consigned to history.

        Why overlook lack of democracy and tolerance of corruption now because ‘Europe did it too’? That’s like saying no developing country should have to consider emissions reduction targets because Europe and American never had to when they were getting rich.

        The effort is to make a fairer world not to slide back into opaque authoritarianism.

        • Colonial Viper 6.1.1.1

          but pre-contemporary Europe’s behaviour there is of a brutal era consigned to history.

          And hilarity ensues.

          Robert Mugabe studied at University of London. He must have picked up more than a few ruling tips from the British, as well as the English sense of irony!

          That’s like saying no developing country should have to consider emissions reduction targets because Europe and American never had to when they were getting rich.

          Yep the west grew fat and rich off fossil fuels, now it wants the rest of the world to not follow suit but stay on a tight diet instead.

          The effort is to make a fairer world not to slide back into opaque authoritarianism.

          What effort? Whose effort? Did you notice US, UK and NATO turn Libya, the wealthiest most secular nation in North Africa into a slave trading terror camp hell hole just a couple years ago?

          China and Russia laugh at western posturing over democracy, freedom and transparency in Africa, they know you don’t mean it because your track record – recent and historical – shows that you don’t.

  7. Ed 7

    So you need that smart cuckoo clock for Christmas, do you?
    George Monbiot

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/nov/25/christmas-selling-things-nobody-wants

  8. The fielding rattler 8

    Wasn’t that chap by the name EXF who got a 1 mth ban trying to explain this to everyone and was accursed of being a racist and Sino- phobic. By the Mods here when Mr Wei attack attack him as being a racist etc.

    Now Adani in QLD are seeking Chinese funding for their coal mine and wouldn’t the Chinese try bring their own Labour over like they to do during the mining boom in Oz. Our are to piss weak to stop them if they tried it and we need to remember what happened with the reo- bar inquiry last yr from our piss weak pollies.

    I’m starting to think EXF was on to something here and appeared to have bigger understanding than as smug Kiwis here in NZ with his knowledge of geo-political power of China’s soft power in the region. I was I gut the guts or balls to do what his done and stand to bullies like that male did in Wellington yesterday at the train station.

    • Colonial Viper 8.1

      Kiwis need to stop being so naive over the shifting balance of power in the Pacific. we have to open our eyes and employ strategies which pursue our national interest and economic sovereignty.

      The Chinese are hungry for resources, produce and farm land. They’ll give us all the keyboard produced electronic digits we want to get their hands on our real resources.

    • Ad 8.2

      We’ve been lucky to have their capital, often deployed where locals wouldn’t invest, including integrated retail-and-dairy factories in Gore, Pokeno, South Canterbury and elsewhere, as well as Silver Fern Farms. I don’t like a lot of foreign capital, and would prefer locals to take their place, but this country is in many ways stronger for Chinese-originating investments.

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