Eagle vs Window Pane

81 comments on “Eagle vs Window Pane ”

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1. Paul 1

   10 July 2016 at 5:24 pm

   Once Corbyn wins, these traitors must be deselected by their local constituencies.
   • RedBaronCV 1.1

     10 July 2016 at 6:28 pm

     One of the media outlets interviewed some of the Constituency Labour Party Chairs whose comments where less than happy about the MP’s behaviour.
     It also suggested that the reason the MP’s wanted a secret ballot when they voted to oust Jezza was to prevent their constituents knowing how they had voted to prevent deselection.
     Meanwhile I see Jezza saying very sensibly that Brexit is too important to leave just to the Tories. Quite right! Perhaps the Labour MP’s need to concentrate on the enemy without . The only “good” that seems to be coming out of all this is that political involvement seems to be going up.
     • Sanctuary 1.1.1

       10 July 2016 at 7:12 pm

       I think the die is now cast. The Blairites cannot wait for the party conference, where if Corbyn is still in chagre he’ll lead a populist revolution designed to bring the PLP to heal. Both the momentum wing and the hard line Blairites are heading for a show down where psychologically they are prepared to take the plunge and split the party. Labour is heading for a crisis similar to when the traitor Ramsay MacDonald went with the conservatives in 1931.

       The Blairite plan is to take as many MPs as they can if they lose, and rely on millionaire donors like this guy http://www.leftfutures.org/2015/09/assem-allam-dont-let-the-door-hit-you-on-the-way-out/ to fund them. They’ll probably even go to court to try and steal the Labour name. They will be the very essense of an establishment elite cadre party, that only exists to manipulate the FPP system to ensure real change cannot occur. They’ll be walking, talking symbol of the utter disfunctional decadence of Westminster politics and the collapse of representative democracy in the UK.

       There is no ground swell for a SDP part II in the UK. Politics in the UK is polarising. The breakaway parties leaders probably know it won’t survive a general election, it deliberately will want simply to split the vote and allow dozens of extra UKIP and Tory MPs to be elected. The survivng revanchists, having postponed democratic change for another 5 to 10 years, will then seamlessly merge in the liberal democrats or Tories or into well paying jobs in the political establishment.

       Of course, the right wing is completely out of touch with Labour voters. Their script is a spin doctored up piece of political unreality. Remember, there is no real demand for a new centrist party in the UK. The Guardian and the rest of the liberal intelligensia are hopelesssly out of touch with British public opinion. The alternative scenario, which is at least as likely and supported by more empirical evidence, is by throwing out the traitors a united Labour recovers ground and (as absolutely every actual election held so far has shown) the Blairites are wiped out by the electoral efforts of a wholly mobilised base. And remember my reference to the huge crisis of 1931 in the UK Labour party? Remember that they then won a crushing electoral mandate for real, radical change under Attlee in just the second British election since MacDonald’s defection, some 14 years later.

       We can only hope!
       • Greg 1.1.1.1

         10 July 2016 at 8:02 pm

         The Tories aint out of woods yet either.

         Gee wizz, and women are not above scathing attacks about each other,

         http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jul/09/tory-leadership-leadsom-may-children

         http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/jul/09/andrea-leadsom-remarks-childless-theresa-may-not-naive
       • Jenny 1.1.1.2

         12 July 2016 at 9:08 pm

         ”
         The Blairite plan is to take as many MPs as they can if they lose, and rely on millionaire donors like this guy http://www.leftfutures.org/2015/09/assem-allam-dont-let-the-door-hit-you-on-the-way-out/ to fund them. They’ll probably even go to court to try and steal the Labour name. They will be the very essense of an establishment elite cadre party, that only exists to manipulate the FPP system to ensure real change cannot occur. ”
         Sanctuary

         In a message that could apply to the whole Left.

         “We are trying to change a system that resists change”
         Hone Harawira

         The system has many mechanisms to resist democratic change and confound the popular will of the people.

         From Syriza in Greece, to Podemos in Spain, to the Democratic Party in the US, to the British and New Zealand Labour Parties.

         From within and from without these movements, all sorts of pressure and manipulation are employed to resist any challenge to the established system of power and money to influence public policy.

         https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8MKW4AnXwqY

         https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XkfyZOh49aY
   • Gosman 1.2

     10 July 2016 at 9:22 pm

     I love a good left wing purge of non true believers. Reminds me of Post Revolutionary Russia.
     • Sanctuary 1.2.1

       10 July 2016 at 10:31 pm

       Why? We’re you there?
     • Bill 1.2.2

       10 July 2016 at 10:40 pm

       Democratically driven processes of de-selection aren’t in any way like a purge.

       And people looking to be better represented is absolutely nothing like the top down ideological purges that happened in the aftermath of the Bolshevik’s grab for power.

       On reflection, a relatively small cadre of the Party within the PLP looking to grab power might be reasonable if ironically viewed as a bit Bolshy mind.
     • Anno1701 1.2.3

       11 July 2016 at 8:31 am

       “Reminds me of Post Revolutionary Russia.”

       https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vBecM3CQVD8
2. Peter Swift 2

   10 July 2016 at 5:37 pm

   Good, glad Corbyn has been challenged. If Eagle wins, maybe there’s a hope for UK labour after all.
   I’m hoping Corbyn has to get nominated by the plp to run. That will cut off at the knees the $6 temp members distorting the process.

   Popcorn time. 🙂
   • Colonial Viper 2.1

     10 July 2016 at 5:59 pm

     Oh look, yet another Labour establishment loyalist backing disloyal MPs against the Leader and against the general party membership. What a surprise.
     • Peter Swift 2.1.1

       10 July 2016 at 6:04 pm

       I’m not scared of your amateur framing attempts, so bang on as much as you like.
       • Colonial Viper 2.1.1.1

         10 July 2016 at 6:45 pm

         people just need to read your comments to come to the same conclusion. Thorndon bubble type who thinks himself superior and smarter than the general membership of the party.
         • Peter Swift 2.1.1.1.1

           10 July 2016 at 6:50 pm

           I’m still not scared of your amateur framing attempts, so bang on as much as you like with as much pointless abuse as Bill allows in his thread. 😉
           • Colonial Viper 2.1.1.1.1.1

             10 July 2016 at 6:58 pm

             the Labour Party, here and in the UK, has been taken over by a rather narrow set of Parliamentary careerists and courtiers to those careerists.

             These are people who regard the general membership of the party as being too left, and too naive.

             While they themselves, have adopted the very same “born to rule” mentality that they accuse the Tories of.
           • Bill 2.1.1.1.1.2

             10 July 2016 at 6:59 pm

             There’s no abuse coming from me – pointless or otherwise. There are people wedded to notions of authoritarianism. They exhibit peculiar and predictable habits. All I’ve pointed out, is that by your comments on this thread, you’ve placed yourself within a working framework of authoritarianism as laid out in the post.
           • One Two 2.1.1.1.1.3

             11 July 2016 at 11:36 pm

             Hypocritical comment given your tendancy to stalk others

             Some comments are entertainment value, if nothing else

             For mine, your comments don’t even add up to , nothing else
         • Bill 2.1.1.1.2

           10 July 2016 at 6:55 pm

           I’d disagree on the ‘Thorndon Bubble’ take. That suggests a certain demographic and a certain geographical location. But authoritarians can live anywhere and be of any demographic.

           That their opinions merely echo those they would see as being the ones to follow is what marks them. And the ones to follow are always those most embedded in establishment or tradition.
           • Draco T Bastard 2.1.1.1.2.1

             10 July 2016 at 10:47 pm

             +1
   • Sanctuary 2.2

     10 July 2016 at 6:01 pm

     Yes, because if you can’t win an election democratically then jacking the system to deny the popular will of the membership is a REALLY REALLY REALLY good idea. /sarc/ You are a tit, Peter Swift. Please deselct yourself.
     • Peter Swift 2.2.1

       10 July 2016 at 6:06 pm

       I want Eagle to win, I want Corbyn out, I want the UK labour party to win and I agree with the 172 mps in that they don’t have a chance in hell now.
       If you want to insult me for that view, for wanting a labour victory, then join comrade kitty cat and have at it. lol.
       • Sanctuary 2.2.1.1

         10 July 2016 at 6:21 pm

         Ah, there we have it. The Labour right making it’s sole pitch for legitimacy. They can’t say they are popular with the party, because they are deeply unpopular. They can’t say they are socialists, because they manifestly are not. The only fig leaf they have is a nonsensical claim to “electability”. Only they are not electable, are they? They’ve lost everything since 2010 in the UK and 2008 here.

         And even – if for the sake of imagination – we swallow the lie of their superior electability, for what? The stated goal of supporting the establishment neoliberal status quo? Is Labour really about just being an “electable” soft Tory managerialist alternative? That is a doomed approach, people will always prefer the rude, deep blue Tory shout to it’s pale, pastel pink urban elite echo, and into the political vacuum of the abandoned working class that the Labour right arrogantly abandoned in the assumption it had nowhere else to go is going a populist, neo fascist UKIP. In short, the 1990s political strategies designed to protect 1980s neoliberalsim are dog tucker in the UK. The population is revolting against the establishment. The only people who don’t understand this are the dead men and women walking of the British PLP.

         Everytime you buffoons on the right of Labour have your grandiose claims of legitiamcy via electability put to the litmus test of the voters, you have your arse handed to you on a plate.
         • Peter Swift 2.2.1.1.1

           10 July 2016 at 6:29 pm

           I’m not on the right of the labour party at all, just not as ‘left’ as the vocal minority, unelectable left, but don’t worry, I’m not going to insist you validate the statement you’ve just made up and presented as fact.

           For everything else, I’ve said my bit in 2.2.1
           I don’t need to add more to that, it’s pretty categorical, and I don’t need to enable your inner/outer anger by expanding on your rage.
           • Sanctuary 2.2.1.1.1.1

             10 July 2016 at 6:34 pm

             To right I am angry, when I see injustice and arseholes in power I get angry, what do you do? Hold their dicks while they take a piss in the hope they might listen to you?

             Anyway, I can see you’ve retreated to the standard neoliberal fallback, the “I think my argument is so powerful that it’s not necessary to talk about it… …especially to such an UNREASONABLE person” defence. Typical.
             • Bill …

               10 July 2016 at 6:43 pm

               I’d suggest the Peters’ of this world do it less “in the hope that they might listen to you” and more in the hope that some of that golden piss of power splashes their way.

               You can almost see the facebook post with the photo of the venerated piss-wet jeans leg and the swooning commentary about the day they came that close to power.
       • Bill 2.2.1.2

         10 July 2016 at 6:35 pm

         Third to last paragraph of the post, Peter Swift. You give an account of yourself that fits perfectly inside that “desperate rag tag army of dim-wits and authoritarians to uncritically regurgitate the lines and faux concerns of the reactionary section of the UK Parliamentary Labour Party too. As MPs incessantly yell ‘Broken!’ off the back of some stupid belief that no-one can see they’re brandishing crow bars and holding lump hammers aloft, expect dimwits and authoritarians to uphold the illusion that ‘there’s nothing to see here’…and then watch as those people ‘get in behind’ who-ever winds up winning.”
         • Peter Swift 2.2.1.2.1

           10 July 2016 at 6:37 pm

           You’re protected as an author so enjoy the free shot.
           If that’s how you need to roll, so be it 🙂
           • Bill 2.2.1.2.1.1

             10 July 2016 at 6:48 pm

             Protection?

             If you feel that para doesn’t in any way apply to you and your mind set,(ie – the opportunistic and hedge betting, authoritarian mindset) then feel free to explain.

             If you feel that para is being unfair on those MPs backing the challenge to Corbyn’s leadership, then again, feel free to explain.
             • Peter Swift …

               10 July 2016 at 6:52 pm

               I’m not being baited in to a ban by you, Bill, so I choose to leave your topic.
               Let the record show any insults and bullying behaviour are absolutely nothing to do with me.
               • Bill …

                 10 July 2016 at 7:01 pm

                 Correct. You aren’t being baited into a ban by me. But you can leave the topic – even on the false grounds that you put forward. No worries.
               • ropata …

                 10 July 2016 at 8:44 pm

                 What a lot of hot air Peter Swift. Your throwaway comments (at 2 and 2.2.1) fail to convince anyone that your hero Eagle is worthy of anything more than a humiliating faceplant. Bye then.
                 • GregJ …

                   11 July 2016 at 8:57 pm

                   Swiftly here,
                   Hastily gone,
                   Insubstantial as air
                   Trailing his Blairite pong
                   • Peter Swift …

                     11 July 2016 at 8:59 pm

                     Wrong on all counts, but lol for the poem anyway
                   • Grant …

                     12 July 2016 at 8:34 am

                     *bong
       • Andrea 2.2.1.3

         10 July 2016 at 9:55 pm

         “the 172 mps in that they don’t have a chance in hell now.”

         You have a preference for Ms Eagle (calm down, dear) – and that’s fair enough.

         However, your fretful few 172 MPs are far outnumbered by the many thousands who have recently joined, signed up and paid to become new Labour members who have taken the Party’s membership numbers to their highest in thirty odd years.

         And it wasn’t because of any efforts by the said Ms Eagle.

         On voting day, it’s those left-leaning six pound sign-ups who have the only voice that matters. They seem to prefer a quiet bloke who stands up at PMQs and politely, without insult or vitriol, reads out questions from constituents for the PM to answer. Not an MP whose own constituents have started a petition for her to go before she’s pushed.
       • leftie 2.2.1.4

         11 July 2016 at 8:04 am

         If anything, it’s the trouble making self interested 172 MPs that are ruining UK Labour’s chances Peter Swift. I want Corbyn to win, and I am pretty sure that he will.
   • KJT 2.3

     10 July 2016 at 7:31 pm

     Can’t even have the most basic level of Democracy.

     The people selecting the leader of their country, can we?

     After all we are to thick to know what is good for us?
3. Jenny 3

   10 July 2016 at 5:56 pm

   “We are trying to change a system that resists change.”
   Hone Harawira
   August 2014

   And boy did they resist change with a vengeance.

   When the Right of British Labour say, “Corbyn is unelectable”, what they mean is, “We will make you unelectable. ”

   As Chris Trotter likes to say of the Right Wing of the NZ Labour caucus, and which could just as easily apply to the British troughers in the Labour Party caucus “They would rather keep control of the losing side, than lose control of the winning side.”
4. Incognito 4

   10 July 2016 at 6:17 pm

   Et tu, Angela?
5. Anne 5

   10 July 2016 at 6:26 pm

   I have a picture of Angela Eagle too. Red eyed and bawling on TV cos she tried so hard… I don’t want any leader who can’t keep him/herself under control in stressful circumstances. Who wants a leader like that??
   • Colonial Viper 5.1

     10 July 2016 at 6:46 pm

     …no man could make that comment on The Standard.

     [Unnecessary comment, not true and liable just to start a pointless flame thingee. Please drop it] – Bill
6. Ad 6

   10 July 2016 at 7:10 pm

   Corbyn will not continue to lead the party on the virtue of his cause and the membership alone.

   If he can’t find a way to reconcile the PLP with the membership, there will be the most almighty party split.

   Some on both left and right of the Labor Party may like a split, so that the Scots and the Greens and the Mega-Lefties and the rump of Labour will all inevitably align around their political polarities as extreme as they like, somehow coalesce happily into a united front, and then somehow win the hearts and minds of the electorate.

   Whereas the more likely outcome in their system is that the more the leftie side splits, the more the Conservatives win, and win, and win, and win.

   Corbyn needs to show he has what it takes in leadership chops to unify his party.
   • Bill 6.1

     10 July 2016 at 7:22 pm

     Isn’t it the responsibility of the PLP (sections of) to reconcile themselves with the membership? Why would it be down to Corbyn to do that for them? And how would he do it – besides placating the PLP at the expense of giving political expression to the wishes of the membership?

     If the PLP are out of step with both the membership and the leader, then why are they there?

     By way of illustrative comparison, when the politics and opinions of that section of the PLP challenging Corbyn held sway in Scotland, Scots turned to the SNP who had – they openly admit this – stolen the garb of ‘Labour before the Blairites and Kinnocks’. And Labour, still to this day controlled by Blairites in Scotland, is dead but not quite buried.

     Now sure, there is no alternative for Labour voters in England and Wales bar the hopelessly destructive protest vote for UKIP. But if ‘the Eagles’ have their way, then that’s where peoples’ votes – votes of despair and anger, will fall.

     edited for clarity – had missed a ‘not’.
     • Colonial Viper 6.1.1

       10 July 2016 at 7:50 pm

       Clearly, Corbyn is by definition a poor leader because he won’t bow down low and scrape before a bunch of Blairite born-to-rule MPs who will be satisfied with nothing less. Of course, it’s nothing to do with all these MPs being in completely the wrong party, or being in politics for completely the wrong reasons.
     • Ad 6.1.2

       10 July 2016 at 7:57 pm

       No, the PLP’s job is to be a good opposition in Parliament.

       Corbyn’s job is precisely to be at that point which leads both the PLP and the membership: i.e. to lead and to unify. He wanted the job, and is not doing it.

       The PLP are there because they are selected and elected. You don’t have to like it.

       I have not seen evidence that Corbyn has the qualities to unify his party and his people together. Corbyn is fast running out of time, out of media space, and out of Parliament.

       The more this drags on with no process and no admission from Corbyn anything is wrong, the more Corbyn’s Labor is going to make the Conservative leadership contest – for the Prime Ministership itself – look like as well ordered, magisterial and and calm as Queen Elizabeth’s coronation.
       • Colonial Viper 6.1.2.1

         10 July 2016 at 8:01 pm

         The PLP are there because they are selected and elected. You don’t have to like it.

         And they can be deselected. In fact, I hope Corbyn contacts all the relevant electorate committees personally about this.

         Trying to unify a bunch of snakes is a dangerous exercise in futility.
         • Ad 6.1.2.1.1

           10 July 2016 at 8:06 pm

           The selection and deselection is for another election, just under five years away.

           Corbyn on current trajectory won’t last five months.

           I sincerely hope Corbyn can last, and unify, and lead. It’s in no way apparent.
           • Colonial Viper 6.1.2.1.1.1

             10 July 2016 at 8:17 pm

             No, you cannot unify a disloyal group of snakes. You should not even try because the moment you turn your back for even a second they will bite you in the arse. Is there something about this you do not understand?
             • Cricklewood …

               10 July 2016 at 10:09 pm

               Andrew Little seems to have managed to some degree… maybe he has has won his colleagues around (something Corbyn hasn’t managed) but he was also unpopular with parliamentary colleagues.
               Like it or not the key job of a party leader is to unify both sides by providing a focal point for the convalescem around. Corbyn has failed at this and given they are in a fpp system any split will be disastrous.
               • Ad …

                 11 July 2016 at 9:39 am

                 Exactly.
               • Bill …

                 11 July 2016 at 9:58 am

                 No. In a system where the vote for the leader is weighted, then an Andrew Little has to play politics for the sake of his own survival.

                 But in the UK system for leadership, a leader can give expression to the wishes of the membership and be done with the Machiavellian bullshit.

                 Andrew Little hasn’t brought a caucus round. He’s been brought round by the caucus – and Labour have lost members in the process.
           • Wayne 6.1.2.1.1.2

             11 July 2016 at 9:20 am

             Ad

             How does a leader unify a party when he has suffered a vote of no confidence from 75% of his fellow MP’s?

             I guess by getting new MP’s (or at least candidates). Will the voters actually vote for a slate of Labour candidates (replacing deselected MP’s) who are substantially more left wing than they are used to. The voters might prefer the deselected MP’s, who won’t just meekly disappear.

             So a real prospect of two Labour parties.
             • Bill …

               11 July 2016 at 10:00 am

               Will the voters actually vote for a slate of Labour candidates (replacing deselected MP’s) who are substantially more left wing than they are used to.

               If the example offered by Scotland is anything to go by, yes.
       • Bill 6.1.2.2

         10 July 2016 at 9:49 pm

         No, the PLP’s job is to be a good opposition in Parliament.

         That would entail giving parliamentary expression to the people who voted for them and more, to elevate the concerns of party members, who not only voted for them, but who support the same political body they serve in.

         But they either don’t want to do that or are incapable of doing that. Manufacturing a leadership crisis to distract from that, well…it ain’t working out for them at the moment.

         But I fully expect moves will be made to keep Corbyn off the ballot sheet, skew or screw the voting rights of £3 ‘supporters’ and to game the general member’s voting rights in any and every way they can think of.

         Which might mean they get to claim the brand name of “Labour” at the end of the day.
       • Psycho Milt 6.1.2.3

         11 July 2016 at 6:43 am

         No, the PLP’s job is to be a good opposition in Parliament.

         Correct. And just at the point when the governing party is in a state of disarray and wide open to attack, the PLP mounts a coup against its leader that effectively distracts from the governing party’s disarray. That is being a bad Opposition in Parliament, in fact it’s hard to imagine a more crap Opposition than the one these MPs have modelled for Labour supporters over the last few weeks. The coup leaders’ electorate committees should deselect them for that alone.
         • miravox 6.1.2.3.1

           11 July 2016 at 7:18 am

           +1

           Appalling behaviour by a supposed opposition. No matter what they think of Jeremy Corbyn, as a party with the job of holding the government to account the timing of a leadership coup could not be worse. Moreover, to double the idiocy of the plotters, if they’d paid attention they would have known Corbyn would not readily abandon the people who elected him.
   • Draco T Bastard 6.2

     10 July 2016 at 11:19 pm

     Corbyn needs to show he has what it takes in leadership chops to unify his party.

     And the best way to do that is to get rid of the people tearing it apart and that’s the PLP members who voted against him and that means he should be talking to the members and encouraging them to deselect those those people as candidates.

     We saw what happened to Cunliffe when he tried to keep the back-stabbers happy.
7. stunned mullet 7

   10 July 2016 at 7:14 pm

   I was sent the piece below from the UK… no one does character assassination like the brits.

   ‘I’m sure it seemed like a good idea when various non-Labour party people paid their £3 and voted for Jeremy. I was tempted to do it myself, but the thought of giving Labour £3 was enough to put me off. We all knew that he would make the Labour party completely unelectable as a potential party of Government. I very much doubt, however, that ANYONE could have predicted how he would have turned out. His rise to power has preceded the return to prominence of scumbags like Livingstone, Galloway, and 80’s scouse [deleted], Derek Hatton.
   We’re talking about someone who has gone against the wishes of most of his MP’s by voicing his opposition to replacing Trident. He even ordered his MP’s to vote against a government bill, while HE attended a happy clappy anti-nuke demo. Someone who is supposedly anti-EU, but advocates us staying in. And even then, his hatred of the Tories means you won’t see him sharing a Pro-EU platform with Cameron or Gideon anytime soon. In fact, he’s done the square root of fuck all since the campaign started.

   As I mentioned in my [deleted] of Naz Shah, there has been a noticeable rise in Anti-Semitism since he became leader. And again, apart from making a few very unconvincing statements about how bad it is, he’s done absolutely nothing about it. And by doing nothing, he has shown how utterly unfit he is to be leader of the Labour Party. And this bearded clam has pretentions of being our next Prime Minister? I’d sooner have Jim Hacker as PM than this limp penis.

   His Judgement was called into question the moment he appointed John McDonnell as Shadow Chancellor. A vile creature, who despises Britain and is known to have supported the IRA. This is a man who claims to be for the working class, but like his predecessors, has as much in common with the working class as Christiano Ronaldo has with a fucking Womble.

   He sacked Hillary Benn from his role as Shadow Defence Secretary because he dared to defy Corbyn by voting for air strikes in Syria, and promoted Emily Thornton, a known hater of the working class, and someone who knows fuck all about defence, simply because she agrees with him on replacing Trident. And he’s given a Shadow Cabinet post to Andy Burnham. That shiny faced lickspittle who has been, depending on the leader, a Blairite, a Brownite, a Millibandite, and now a Corbynite.

   The fact he shagged that arrogant, racist, [deleted], Diane Abbot should have been a clue that his judgement was seriously impaired. Look at his performances at PMQ’s, he’s a fucking disaster. Limp as a soggy slice of bread. He actually manages to make Cameron look competent. In fact, the only time that Cameron looks bad, is when he allows his arrogance to get the better of him, and he starts to sneer at and insult people who disagree with him. What’s particularly pathetic though, is his tactic of asking questions from supposedly ‘ordinary’ people who’ve contacted him. You know, Bill from Portsmouth, Rita from Stoke, Mohammed from Pakista…err…Bradford, Julie from Manchester. I know that one turned out to be a fairly well paid employee of the BBC, and a Corbyn Supporter. This actually did surprise me, because I genuinely thought these people were made up.

   Even with a Government as limp and useless as our current one, I think that Corbyn and his mob of Britain hating bell ends has fucking Buckley’s chance of getting into Downing Street as anything other than a guest. Statesman? He can’t even hack it when the Tory back bench jeer him. His face when Hillary Benn gave his speech on bombing Syria showed what a nasty prick he is. And the fact he really doesn’t give a fuck about the UK , or the British people, make him eminently unsuitable to be Prime Minister.

   Mind you, that may turn out to be a moot point. There are rumours that many Labour MP’s are sharpening their knives and planning their Ides of March moment. They’re just waiting for the result of the Local Elections next week. I doubt anything as dramatic as a coup will take place if, as predicted, Labour suffer a major loss of Councillors. There’ll be much feet stomping, but ultimately, Corbyn will remain as Leader. Even if they did get rid, who would replace him? I’m sure Burnham would stand again, and then clamp [term denoting a degree of sycophancy] of the MP who eventually becomes the new Leader.

   It says a lot about the man that, even with the current government being so contemptuous and malignant toward the British people, Labour will not win the 2020 General Election. Corbyn is as much a leader as I am a member of the Avengers.’

   [Have deleted the more offensive expressions that would have been removed from any comment submitted here-abouts. Pain in the arse. You want to cut and paste? Then do the work of making them fit with ‘standard’ culture. Cheers.] – Bill
   • Bill 7.1

     10 July 2016 at 7:43 pm

     So apart from deleting out a pile of ‘ist shite, what strikes me about that comment (where’d it come from btw?) is that it packaged up just about every snide attack line that’s been published in main stream media in one go. Now sure, it’s got a right wing bent to it, but the Blairites or ‘New Labour’ or whatever that gaggle in the imagined center calls itself these days make essentially the same arguments – without the steroids of overt hate and with a bit of civilised tinsel to make the package presentable and even a bit innocuous to anyone not really paying attention.
     • stunned mullet 7.1.1

       10 July 2016 at 7:53 pm

       strange…same source as this rant about Blair…

       ‘Blair has once again stuck his head above the parapet. As we know, we need to negotiate our new relationship with the Fourth Reich over in Brussels. As we also know, this will be pretty complex. So, up pops Tony Blair, like the eternal foul stench, once again pretending to be our saviour and offering his services as a negotiator.
       Apart from the fact Blair is a filthy, murdering, money whore, lying, arrogant, ignorant, dishonourable, dishonest, conniving, warmongering, bloodthirsty traitor. He never does ANYTHING unless there is something in it for Tony Blair. His chances of a cushy job in Brussels have been shot to shit, so I can only imagine that Blair considers this an opportunity to once again raise his profile and be seen as some kind of hero. He seems to need the adoration of the public. The big problem he faces, is that everyone on Planet Earth knows that he’s a massive [DELETED].

       Still, he can’t resist the opportunity of taking part in a high profile negotiation. Whoever turns out to be our next Prime Minister, their first job should be telling Blair to fuck off, [deleted] up his arrogant arse. Let’s not forget, it was Blair who gave up part of our rebate on the money that the EU steals from us each year.

       Though not for much longer…’
       • Bill 7.1.1.1

         10 July 2016 at 8:20 pm

         Why strange? A right winger (ie – presumably a Tory Party or genuine UKIP supporter) attacks both Jeremy Corbyn and Blair? Can’t see the strangeness.

         edit – you missed the direct appeal to violence in your last comment. Still, thanks for at least partially editing. You got a link to this dross?
         • ropata 7.1.1.1.1

           10 July 2016 at 9:12 pm

           link to sweary/dull rant unworthy of the great trolls of yore
           https://is.gd/nWxrOx
           • Bill 7.1.1.1.1.1

             10 July 2016 at 9:34 pm

             Serves me right for asking.
8. whateva next? 8

   10 July 2016 at 9:02 pm

   Thankyou Bill, that is exactly what will happen, but makes it a little less tedious to see it in print, naming and predicting the spin, it makes it less potent/aggravating.
9. Sirenia 9

   10 July 2016 at 9:12 pm

   This has echoes of the 1980s Labour Party here. Some of the MPs led by Douglas and Prebble took the party way off to the right against the wishes of the membership and many of the MPs. But they were too powerful to be effectively challenged. It has taken decades to heal.
10. fisiani 10

    10 July 2016 at 9:30 pm

    Corbyn is the leader chosen by the members. The fact that most of his colleagues do not want him to be the leader is unusual but they do not give him his mandate. Same applies in NZ.
    • Pasupial 10.1

      10 July 2016 at 11:04 pm

      Hmmm; I find myself in agreement with fisiani on this point. Most unusual.

      Edit: No, missed that last; “Same applies in NZ”, which is not true for the NZLP where there is a 40/40/20% split (from memory) between MPs/ general members/ union affiliates. The selection process for National and Act is opaque to me, but is unlikely to involve the members voting.
    • Stuart Munro 10.2

      13 July 2016 at 10:39 pm

      Not true of Gnat selection though – secretive, arcane and completely undemocratic as befits the embodiment of political evil.
11. weka 11

    10 July 2016 at 9:54 pm

    Something caught my eye the other day, a piece in one of the UK papers quoting an unnamed source within the PLP who said that the numbers of members supporting Corbyn was dropping but that they just kept signing up new people so there was no winning now (for the challenge). I had to laugh at that (although who the fuck knows what is truth and what is spin).

    I hope Corbyn thrashes them, or failing that that the party splits. If 63% of Labour voters voted Remain, then 37% voted Leave (although that probably doesn’t take into account the non-vote). 37% is a significant proportion. Time for some radical change that looks at everyone’s needs and desires.
    • Bill 11.1

      10 July 2016 at 10:18 pm

      Neil Kinnock – the guy who arguably started Labour’s downfall all those years ago – had a piece in The Guardian imploring people to join up in order to vote against Corbyn.

      I’ve no idea why these people think they might have any support from the general population.

      Maybe it’s in recognition of a lack of legitimacy that Project Fear Mk III will be rolled out. Afterall, it worked so well for them in the Scottish referendum (killed the party dead), during the EU debate (any change away from this certainty will do)..
12. Pasupial 12

    10 July 2016 at 11:01 pm

    Corbyn’s team have to keep the attention on Eagle’s voting history; especially regarding her support for Blair’s war (and opposition to any investigation of the Iraq war afterwards). Also, her fondness for; ID cards and a National Identity Register for UK citizens, but resistance to; any register of professional parliamentary lobbyists, seems to show where her priorities lie.

    http://www.theyworkforyou.com/mp/10182/angela_eagle/wallasey/votes
    • Colonial Viper 12.1

      10 July 2016 at 11:09 pm

      Thanks. Helps make crystal clear why the Establishment want her as their woman.

      Why the hell are people like this tolerated in Labour anyway.
13. DS 13

    11 July 2016 at 4:06 am

    If Corbyn is on the ballot, he wins. The Right of the party jump or are pushed out. The Soft Left makes its peace with Corbyn.

    If Corbyn isn’t on the ballot… things get seriously ugly. The members and the unions will not be amused – good luck running a Labour election campaign without money or volunteers.
    • Bill 13.1

      11 July 2016 at 10:18 am

      Slightly loose thought – but if things get ugly and ‘the Eagles’ take the Party, then where do Labour voters turn?

      I mean, it’s not a MMP environment and so there are no viable alternatives to the Tories and Labour (I doubt anyone would give the SDP another shot).

      So apart from an angry and frustrated vote going to UKIP, what’s the option besides pitchforks, in a situation where the positioning of both parliamentary wings means that UK politics flap in clockwise spirals?
14. save nz 14

    11 July 2016 at 8:21 am

    +100 Bill
15. Tautoko Mangō Mata 15

    11 July 2016 at 9:41 am

    Media biassssssss!
    “Even the traditionally left-wing media — not only the Guardian and Observer, but also the Daily Mirror — have been more than willing to join the chorus of voices calling for Corbyn to step down. This is not a response to the market but rather a political decision, as their own research demonstrates that their readerships do not agree with this editorial line.”
    …….

    “Jeremy Corbyn’s rise to the leadership of the Labour Party was an earthquake in politics which reflected a deep disillusionment in the political and economic system. His tenure in that position has been shaped by a media environment which is no less in need of such an earthquake.”
    https://www.jacobinmag.com/2016/07/jeremy-corbyn-media-coup-bbc-labour/

    Lest we forget, just another reminder of the damage that newspapers can do!
    Time to recall the NZ Herald 22 Jun 2014 attack on David Cunliffe/Labour.
    “Businessman gifts $150k to Labour/List includes $100,000 for bottle of wine signed by Helen Clark” supposed donor Donghua Liu.
    Donation turned out to be $25,000 to National’s Jamie Lee Ross campaign after a dinner at Donghua Liu’s house attended by John Key, PM.
16. Tautoko Mangō Mata 16

    11 July 2016 at 9:49 am

    Jeremy Corbyn has backed a parliamentary motion declaring Tony Blair guilty of “contempt”, following the release of the Chilcot Report.
    ….
    Mr Davis, who is tabling the motion, also told the Andrew Marr Show: “I’m going to put down a contempt motion, a motion which says that Tony Blair has held the House in contempt. It’s a bit like contempt of court. Essentially by deceit.”

    He added: “If you look just at the debate alone, on five different grounds the House was misled, three in terms of the weapons of mass destruction, one in terms of the UN votes were going, and one in terms of the threat, the risks. He might have done one of those accidentally, but five?”

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/jeremy-corbyn-tony-blair-iraq-chilcot-contempt-war-crimes-impeach-motion-david-davis-a7129256.html
17. rhinocrates 17

    11 July 2016 at 2:06 pm

    A summary of the ballot process here:

    http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-36654418

    Legal advice is that Jeremy Corbyn would automatically be on the ballot paper, but some dispute this.

    However, if he is left off…

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/jeremy-corbyn-labour-leadership-challenge-legal-advice-nec-ruling-sue-ballot-paper-a7129516.html
18. Peter Bradley 18

    11 July 2016 at 7:24 pm

    When do we in NZ get our JC or Bernie to lead our middle of the road – don’t scare the second home owners – Labour party back to the left?
    • Colonial Viper 18.1

      11 July 2016 at 7:31 pm

      The Labour caucus has long eliminated (or at least marginalised) any such potential candidate from their ranks.
    • Dennis Frank 18.2

      11 July 2016 at 8:27 pm

      Doesn’t really matter, Peter, even if a suitable contender were to emerge. The electorate has been split three ways in most western countries for years, so the old binary frame is irrelevant. The left & right have been reduced to rumps of roughly the same size as the centrists.

      I’m sympathetic to the pro-Corbyn folk (despite never having self-identified as leftist). He seems authentic, and a true gentleman. Insufficiently savvy to be an effective leader, perhaps, but as long as the members support him there’s a slim chance true Labour values can regenerate in political form in the UK.

      Bill’s critique of the opposition to Corbyn is valid. The MPs/Guardian/Blairite group have spent years trying to reinvent Labour as a centrist party (Sirenia’s analogy to the Rogernomes last night was correct). Such pragmatism was a natural response to the long track record of failed socialism. Unfortunately for this group it is devoid of principle, so even to a centrist like myself its lack of authenticity renders it unworthy of respect.

      A principled centrist path in our era of globalism must be radical & present viable solutions to current major economic, political & cultural problems. My personal critique of Corbyn is that he lacks the lateral-thinking & creative imagination required to see that leftists & centrists must work together on this endeavour of the intellect in all western countries. Its the only way representatives of the people can wrest some control over their destiny from the ruling class.

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