Key denigrates All Black jersey

Written By: - Date published: 8:30 am, July 25th, 2014 - 324 comments
Categories: john key, national - Tags:

John Key all black poster

The Rugby News’s latest cover features John Key wearing an All Black jersey and being proclaimed as the All Black’s number one supporter. My first response was amazement at the lengths National will go to win this election. The timing is extraordinary. I wondered at the cooperation of the New Zealand Rugby Union and the publishers of the magazine.  The Rugby Union in particular should not be picking sides during an election campaign.

The more I thought about it the more I thought it was a bit weird. It is very pretentious. Key has never been an All Black and the All Black jersey is something that holds mystical powers in New Zealand culture. Using it for political purposes seems wrong.

Then I thought about the hysteria whipped up by the right about Helen Clark’s signing of a painting.  Clearly she had not painted it but the scandal went on for months and months.  Even now it is used to denigrate her.

Pretending to be an All Black should be just as bad as pretending to be the painter of a picture.

It is a shame that the cost of the magazine will not be counted towards National’s election spend. Because a clearer example of party propaganda you will never see.

324 comments on “Key denigrates All Black jersey”

  1. Gosman 1

    Do you think people shouldn’t wear replica All Blkack jersey’s then?

    Perhaps some party on the left could introduce legislation banning people wearing them unless they actually have played for the AB’s.

    • freedom 1.1

      🙄

    • Colonial Viper 1.2

      It’s interesting that Key’s PR people have gone for the North Korean style propaganda. Personally, I think NZers will see right past it.

      • Saarbo 1.2.1

        Normally NZ Rugby go to great lengths to protect their IP, this is weird on their part. They need to remember that 50% of kiwi’s don’t support National, having a fraud like Key wearing the jersey is risky. Has Key ever pulled on a rugby jersey, I doubt it some how.

        • anker 1.2.1.1

          info@nzrugby.co.nz

          Here’s their email address. I am going to write to them challenging them about this.

          • Murray Olsen 1.2.1.1.1

            I sent this:

            To whom it may concern

            I am not happy to see John Key dressed in an All Black jersey on the cover of Rugby News. As far as I know, John Key was not a rugby player, whereas David Cunliffe and Winston Peters were. Neither of them would use the All Blacks for party political propaganda.

            I would like to see a public statement by the Rugby Union that it does not support any particular political party. It’s purpose is to support the game, not take sides in an election.

            Yours sincerely,

            Dr. M.K. Olsen

        • fdx 1.2.1.2

          Rugby is a team sport.

      • Rodel 1.2.2

        CV No . I heard that the first time Jon ki moon played golf he scored eleven-yes, eleven! holes in one.

    • tinfoilhat 1.3

      Gawd don’t be a idiot Gosman, if it was a politician you didn’t agree with e.g. Russell Norman you’d be making all kinds of outraged noises.

      • Gosman 1.3.1

        Why would I or should I care what an independent media publication chooses to put on it’s front cover?

        The problem with many on the left is that they want to control the media instead of allowing multiple views to be available. It is why Louisa Wall is wasting her time and money taking a case to the Human Right’s Tribunal.

        • framu 1.3.1.1

          stop pretending you dont know how marketting and branding works

          they are tying the all blacks brand to a political leader during an election

    • Weepus beard 1.4

      It’s more than that though, isn’t it? The cover states John Key is the pack leader (over Richie) and the #1 All Blacks fan (not even close).

      If the NZRU were asked permission by Rugby News to runs this cover, and then granted it they have made a clear political statement of position and an endorsement of the National government.

      This is concerning.

      A wide section if the NZ community have high level of emotional investment in rugby and especially the All Blacks. The All Blacks are our team. “The Stadium of Four Million”, banged on Martin Snedden and the government.

      To see the All Blacks high jacked in this way for political gain is quite distressing. I feel like my team has been stolen from me.

      • Melb 1.4.1

        The NZRU asked for the disclaimer to be added that the photo is not an endorsement from them, and it has.

        • Weepus beard 1.4.1.1

          Thanks for that. Where is the disclaimer printed? On the cover, or inside?

          • Kiwiri 1.4.1.1.1

            Disclaimer or not, many words come up when looking at that pathetic laughing *ock in the front.
            A few begin with ‘f’. And the one that stands out is: false.
            That picture of the dickey is just so false.

        • Tom Jackson 1.4.1.2

          It’s a meaningless disclaimer. It’s like painting your car red, and then leaving a note under the wiper that says “BTW, this car is not intended to be seen as red”.

    • disturbed 1.5

      Gosman – you’d better read up on the Electoral Authority act as you being a Nat should know that your own Leader’s message was a political advertisement.

      As a community NGO we just completed a four day Electoral Commission review process where we were placing a public notice in the local paper announcing the event of a public meeting with NZ First Transport policy unveiling at a venue in Gisborne on Sunday 13th July.

      The rules around the Election cycle of any suggested political advertisement such as the Prime Minister having his picture transposed onto a all black poster can be seen as the All Blacks suggesting they support Key, must first be reviewed & legally scrutinised by the Electoral Commission, we found out.

      As a Nat’ you would be aware of the election cycle rules right?

      Therefore if we as a community group had to go through a four day Electoral Authority procedure with a simple public advertisement for a meeting (not deemed political) finally by Electoral Commission standards,
      according to their lawyers thorough investigation of the following, why did John Key not go to the Electoral Commission for the four day scrutiny as we had to as common public citizens?

      It must be because they think like the latest Brownlee jumping the security queue at Christchurch Airport, Key also thinks as a Government minister he has immunity also? ,

      • Gosman 1.5.1

        I don’t know why you assume I am a National party supporter. I have never stated I support them.

        • Weepus beard 1.5.1.1

          You are a RWNJ. That’s all that matters.

        • Puddleglum 1.5.1.2

          Hi Gosman,

          Do you have any comment about the substance of disturbed’s response to you or is this minor point the only matter from disturbed’s comment you contest?

          • vto 1.5.1.2.1

            Puddleglum, gosman is a tro1l and when he gets exposed he refuses to answer – you will get no answer to your very fair question. He is a dishonest coward.

            • Rodel 1.5.1.2.1.1

              vto Agree about the troll. Just asks inane questions.. multi marketing ploy- he who asks the questions controls the discourse.Or so they imagine. Best to ignore.

          • Gosman 1.5.1.2.2

            By all means take this to the Electoral Commission. I doubt you will get much purchase with it. It seems similar to the profile that Campbell live did with Key and Cunliffe recently. Was that in breech of the Electoral Authority Act as well?

            • Weepus beard 1.5.1.2.2.1

              Not similar at all. They were outside the electoral period for a start.

          • The Other Mike 1.5.1.2.3

            Ummm…. that would be a NO… (to the comment bit).

            He trolls other sites too using the same tactics.

      • Weepus beard 1.5.2

        Do you know how to make a formal query/complaint to the Electoral Commission? I’ve been looking into it but can’t see a specific process. Any help on this would be appreciated.

        • Kiwiri 1.5.2.1

          Yeah, I would be happy to get a few people involved in launching a complaint about that picture to the Electoral Commission.

        • Kiwiri 1.5.2.2

          I will ask around for more information.

          Here is something from the Electoral Commission webpage:

          http://www.elections.org.nz/media-handbook/part-5-complaints

          • Weepus beard 1.5.2.2.1

            Thanks Kiwiri, done.

            • ghostwhowalksnz 1.5.2.2.1.1

              Dont waste your time, its not any policy or inducement to vote.

              Its a very very good look is all. Plus its not an advertisement by National

              • Weepus beard

                The question I asked the electoral commission was about the apparent endorsement of Mr John Key by the NZRU which receives taxpayer monies. Disclaimer notwithstanding.

        • disturbed 1.5.2.3

          Hi Weepus beard

          In our experience we were warned before advertising NZ First meeting in Gisborne, to send the proposed public notice we prepared to drop in mailbox’s as there was a legal penalty.

          We had to call the Electoral Commission on this for advise and we were advised it was necessary legally at this election ycle to forward a copy to them for legal scrutiny, so we advise you to call them and ask as we did.

          No not be shy as they are quite accommodating, and helpful.
          Even if this surrounds the PM I wouldn’t sweat it, we have our rights to open scrutiny of our elected officials.
          Blog me if you need any further help or call me at 06 862 4007. Cheers. KC.

          • Weepus beard 1.5.2.3.1

            Thanks for that info. I managed to find the right email from Kiwiri’s post above. Sent off a query to the EC about the whole thing. Will update the board upon receiving an answer from them.

    • appleboy 1.6

      F@@kwit – he’s photoshopped in, it aint a replica.

      • ghostwhowalksnz 1.6.1

        Best way to answer this is parody.

        There are heaps of action shots of All Blacks , with photoshop Key will look like the tosser he is

      • Gosman 1.6.2

        The Jersey has been photoshopped in has it? Why would you go to that sort of trouble when he could have just been photographed wearing a replica?

    • meconism 1.7

      What a lot of reductionist crap, by that reasoning ‘Crime and Punishment’ is about a bloke who’s an axe murderer.

      He’s not ‘people’ and he’s not just ‘wearing’ it. Dumber than a sack full of fucking doorknobs aren’t you.

    • Linz 1.8

      John Key as an All Black? Priceless. Comedic gold. Go see
      https://twitter.com/ArchieDaRival/media

  2. “the All Black jersey is something that holds mystical powers in New Zealand culture”

    No it doesn’t and it is actually just a photo and everyone knows he’s not an all black – back to the campaign now?

    • tinfoilhat 2.1

      Fair call Marty it’s just another distraction from things that matter.

    • Mainlander 2.2

      Spot on there Marty, since our latest apology and promise to focus on the things that matter to NZ we have the Hosking drama, bitching about Brownlie, now crying over a photo op that i could give a rats about (bit jealous actually) and that over the course of a couple of days, i actually dont know anyone outside blogs and the political savvy that gives a stuff about all these issues, so David Cunliffe please get your team and s%#t together

  3. Tiger Mountain 3

    whadarryaaa Key?

    oh thats right…
    • disremembered what you thought about the ’81 Springbok Tour (what does it matter–well a people divided would have been of little interest to students when you were at uni eh?) I will eat my beret if every executive of the NZ Rugby Football Union does not recall exactly their personal views on that nation rocking tour.
    • your bizarre three handed shake at the World Cup
    • the unforgettable “Prime Mincer” effort on the catwalk
    …real heartland rugby stuff

    not Foreskins Lament perhaps, but definitely a prize dick.

  4. Once was Pete 4

    You ‘guys’ aren’t doing Labour any favours with this continual bleating about trivia. This incessant parade of attention diverting nonsense is completely drowning out any public airing of policy announcements. No wonder the media is giving Labour such a hard time. If Cunliffe is not shooting his own feet off, then Labour is moaning about some perceived injustice.
    Who made the decision to photoshop key onto the magazine cover? Who cares! Did Nationally actually influence Rugby News? Again, who cares? Just another thing to feel aggrieved about. Another thing to moan about. Another PR disaster to confirm to the rest of us that Labour currently is a shambles. What choice is Labour providing for the bulk of centre left voters?
    If Labour got its act together an appeared to be a really cohesive alternative to the current lot, then all these little things would be seen as the non events that they are.
    If you don’t understand why many people were upset about the ‘painting fiasco’ and you are representative of the general Labour approach then heaven help us all. Everyone knows Key is not an All Black and the Rugby Union has already distanced themselves from the front page by declaring it to be photo shopped. Personally, I wouldn’t presume to know who individual All Blacks supported, and frankly I don’t want to know.
    Best approach for Labour would have been to go and seek their own PR opportunities. The real issue here is that again Labour has been ‘wrong footed’.

    • Gosman 4.1

      To be fair this is an opinion on a left wing blog rather than an official Labour party position but you do raise a good point. Even Labour complaining about Hoskings is not helpful to them I would suggest. Does it convince anyone to think about voting for Labour? – Unlikely. Does it make some people think Labour is a bunch of whining linp wristed cry babies? Quite possibly.

      • Once was Pete 4.1.1

        Point taken.

      • Crunchtime 4.1.2

        What a load of poisonous garbage you spout, Gosman. If I were a LOTR fan I’d probably call you wormtongue, lol.

        National spout things about Labour all the time, but that apparently is ok and people dont think National “is a bunch of whining limp wristed cry babies”.

        This is about democratic process, it needs some semblance of impartiality. If the bias in was in the other direction you would be throwing yourself on the floor kicking and screaming. The crocodile tears would be flowing.

        • Gosman 4.1.2.1

          Have you a recent example of National complaining in a similar way to Labour?

          • The Other Mike 4.1.2.1.1

            Does not apply Gosman. I hardly call complaints about Nat shill (not to mention car and Sky City sellout) Hosking appointed as moderator of TVNZ debates “incessant parade of attention diverting nonsense”. The bias against anyone who is not your beloved Key in the MSM is blatant.

            This is called “setting/dictating the message” and the MSM in the US (mainly set by Rupert Murdoch, along with GE and a few other MNCs who own the TV networks) are also just as blatant. The few own pretty much all of the media, including here with just two foreign MNCs owning both the radio and TV industries. I know, I used to work in it – and got out because of it.

            I worry about the “incessant parade of attention seeking nonsense” from the MSM alright – how about “Holidaygate” – JK in his Hawaii bolthole for a week or more vs a holiday in Queenstown for THREE DAYS for DC while he was getting over the flu. How about DC being taken out of context about the “Ashamedgate” beatup when he was taking responsibility for the horrendous record of violence by men against women and kids in NZ. The right wing like you obviously does not care about this… obviously – just take a speech out of context and use a caring moment to turn around and bash the guy.

            Gos – there is plenty of attention seeking nonsense coming from the Nats. Oh and by the way, what is with putting the goofy Key pic on all the campaign signs? One of your gurus (Whalespew? DPF?) recently said the Nats are not campaigning on personalities! So why the focus on “person” pic? On every sign? He is everywhere. Including the MSM.

            That’s the problem. We need issues please, not pictures or affirmations from blatant TV and radio entertainers.

    • redfed 4.2

      It is a relevant topic of discussion. The article will have a political effect. I am not the Labour Party.

  5. riffer 5

    Well I think it’s pretty damn obvious to anyone with half a brain where John Key stood in 1981 isn’t it?

    • srylands 5.1

      Don’t be stupid all your life. Yes it is clear where he stood. He was not interested. He was interested in his new girlfriend, his university mid year exams, and his mum. Good luck with portraying that as evil.

      You come across as a twit.

      • fender 5.1.1

        Only a twit would suggest someone can’t have their personal interests and a stance on the major political issue of the times.

        You come across as a shrunken-glands..

      • Blue 5.1.2

        Key later said that he was “probably mildly pro-tour”. Instead of just saying that in the first place he lied and said he couldn’t remember. He was too gutless to admit that he was pro-tour on national TV during an election campaign.

      • appleboy 5.1.3

        Key couldn’t remember his opinion on the tour – what and you believe that? Yeah, you can’t remember your views on the major event of the year because you had a girlfriend and were studying. Moronic.

        We all know Key was pro tour and was too gutless to say it, so fuck off.

      • felix 5.1.4

        “Yes it is clear where he stood. He was not interested.”

        Bullshit Rylands. He said he can’t remember. Are you calling him a liar?

      • Tracey 5.1.5

        oh I bet he gave a shit. I bet he was pro tour and believed sport and politics shldnt mix.

        slylands has started talking to himself I see

    • Murray Olsen 5.2

      I reckon Key bought a home gym and started bulking up with the dream of going out and bashing anti-racists, like his heroes the Red Squad. There is a rumour that at his first attempt, he was chased off by Margaret Jones. I’d be ashamed to remember that too, if I were him.

  6. Adrian 6

    This may just be the “jumping the shark” moment that makes a few percent gag.

  7. fender 7

    Calling the PACK (of lies) LEADER the #1 All Blacks supporter is an insult to genuine supporters who have spent their lives following the team.

    This idiot just looks like Kim Key Jong-un.

    • Colonial Viper 7.1

      So he was their number 1 supporter eh. Wonder which side John Key supported during the Springbok tour?

  8. s y d 8

    the rugby union always picks sides, and only one side.
    just like a whole bunch of others – chambers of commerce, mike hoskings,the NZ initiative etc.

    Just laugh it off – it’s the most of John Keys forehead I’ve ever seen, Richie looks like he might’ve given the rug a tug….

  9. Brian 9

    John Key looking like a pratt in a jersey he could never earn? – Priceless!

    • Chooky 9.1

      Crosby Texter decided to put him in a NZ ALL Black rugby jersey because they knew he did not look good in his speedos

      …not fit and good looking at all against David Cunliffe , Russel Norman, Hone Harawira and Winston Peters… Left Alliance Coalition Team

  10. s y d 10

    “Prior to taking over the reins at Rugby News, Calverley worked ….as the head of PE and director of rugby at Wanganui Collegiate School” (Stop Press)

    “Wanganui Collegiate has boasted low class sizes in paid advertisements after the Government provided a $3 million bailout” (Herald)

  11. Chooky 11

    The real rugby players in Parliament are Winston Peters , who actually was an All Black!…..and Hone Harawira….who also played a large part in protecting NZ Rugby’s integrity during the Springbok Tour

    Remember John Key couldn’t even remember that Springbok Tour ! ( too busy )

    John Key’s PR phoney pretence and TAKEOVER of the rugby image is an insult to real rugby players Winston Peters, Hone Harawira and all REAL New Zealand rugby players!

    …many of the best New Zealand rugby players are Maori working class and Pakeha working class

    John Key probably never played rugby in his life….the only thing he has played are the money markets and politics and PR

    • One Anonymous Bloke 11.1

      Sorry to burst your bubble: Winston Peters has never been an All Black, unless someone edited it out of Wikipedia.

      It transpires that no-one with the surname Peters has ever been an All Black. Key neither.

      • Chooky 11.1.1

        OK AOB…you are correct…Winston Peters played in the Prince of Wales Cup for the Māori All Blacks trials and for the Auckland Maori Rugby team and Auckland University Rugby Club…It was his brother Wayne Peters who played for the Junior All Blacks

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winston_Peters

        After attending Whangarei Boys’ High School and Dargaville High School Peters studied history, politics and law at the University of Auckland and graduated BA and LLB before working both as a lawyer for the prestigious law firm of Russell McVeagh[4] and as a teacher.

        He was a member of the University Rugby Club in Auckland and captain of the Auckland Māori Rugby team. He also played in the Prince of Wales Cup for the Māori All Blacks trials.[citation needed] One brother, Wayne, played rugby for Otago and North Auckland in the then National Provincial Championship and was in the Junior All Blacks while another brother, Allan, represented Wanganui in rugby.

    • Puckish Rogue 11.2

      I realise hyperbole is part and parcel of the left but:

      He was a member of the University Rugby Club in Auckland and captain of the Auckland Māori Rugby team. He also played in the Prince of Wales Cup for the Māori All Blacks trials.[citation needed] One brother, Wayne, played rugby for Otago and North Auckland in the then National Provincial Championship and was in the Junior All Blacks while another brother, Allan, represented Wanganui in rugby.

      He was a decent player but to claim he was an All Black is a tad too far

      • Chooky 11.2.1

        deeerrh …already said…you are too slow off the the mark Puck! ( cooking sherry?…for breakfast)

        …nevertheless Winston Peters was a New Zealand rugby player of significance! …unlike your master King John Key, the Pretender

    • JohnO 11.3

      Winston was never an All Black. He made it as far as trialing for the Maori All Blacks though, so could play a bit.

      Hone never played rugby to any representative level.

      You wouldn’t class either as a team player, based on their history of falling out with their team.

      • Chooky 11.3.1

        i expect that they can catch and kick a rugby ball however…much better than your master

        …maybe he would like to do a REAL PR demonstration of his rugby skills on the field?!…i am sure many NZers would like to view his prowess on tv

        ….and does your master even have a team? ( Colin Craig? Act?)…he is solo

        • Kiwiri 11.3.1.1

          The balls that Winston should be kicking (metaphorically and politically speaking) in the next couple of months would be Key’s and Craig’s.

  12. Blue 12

    The whole thing is embarrassing for Rugby News. Why the hell they would put John Key on their cover in an All Blacks jersey pretending he is the ‘No 1 Fan’ when he clearly isn’t? How many ABs games has he gone to? How much support has he shown them over the years? Umm…pretty much none, except for his three way handshake at the World Cup trying to get in on the glory. It’s just plain weird. I suspect many rugby fans will be having a ‘WTF?’ moment when they see that cover.

    • Craig Glen Eden 12.1

      Maybe he became their biggest fan after the Spring box tour because he obviously didnt give a shit at that time as he cant even remember if he was for or against the tour. He was to busy to be an All Black fan then he was busy being a Uni student ( what ever the hell that means).

      Key in a All Black jersey on the Rugby News being headlined as leader of the Pack sums him up. Its all image, no substance, adds no value and the only way he can lead anything is to be photo shopped a head of others.

      Its sad the Rugby Union has agreed to this but it is not surprising. They tried to run the line that politics and sport should not mix during the Springbok’s tour I guess they have changed their minds.

      • Tiger Mountain 12.1.1

        Excellent point Craig Glen Eden, sport and politics do mix when National are vote herding!

        The Rugby heads usually keep it on the informal tory network like Fed Farmers, EMA, Lodges, tradies and business associations rather than publicly blast it like on the Rugby News cover.

        Always think of Key’s hairpiece when I see those “Rug Doctor” ads.

    • Rosie 12.2

      It would be good if all non National Party voting subscribers to Rugby News cancelled their subscriptions in protest at such a poorly timed and inappropriate magazine cover.

      Less than two months before an election they are cheerfully endorsing a Party Leader despite their efforts to say nah nah , not an endorsement eh? The mixed messages don’t work. Clearly this is an endorsement of the PM.

      A shameful one too. Yet another 🙄 Key photo op moment.

  13. greywarbler 13

    Haha on radionz this am they said that football is fast growing and nearly up with rugby and women like football too, also other tauiwi than pakeha NZs.

    He’s beginning to look like a doll being dressed up in its variety of outfits. Perhaps Barbie’s friend Ken, I think his name was.

    So Key is on a different planet again.

  14. ianmac 14

    A few years ago there was hoha in Tauranga I think, that ruled that donated billboards were an election expense. Is this different?

    • redfed 14.1

      It looks like it is editorial comment in a periodical so it is excluded. Otherwise the Herald could be deemed to be an electoral expense!

  15. Rosie 15

    Cunliffe stands with and demonstrates genuine empathy with victims of domestic violence.

    Key refuses to apologise to Tania Billingsly and stands with those who have a culture of abuse towards women:

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11146215

    Just one example, but one too many for a group of men that young boys look up to.

    • jingyang 15.1

      Rosie, this brings to mind a certain prominent Dunedinite who recently pleaded guilty in the Dunedin District Court to a charge of performing an indecent act intended to insult or offend a woman.

  16. Sable 16

    This might be blatant self promotion but that’s the name of the game. Labour need to understand the value of marketing but its abundantly clear they don’t. I think their view is they represent a certain group of people therefore they will naturally vote for them. This is simply not the case.

    By contrast the Greens do a great job of promoting themselves to their electorate which is why they have held firm in their support.

    • Ergo Robertina 16.1

      It is not easy for Labour to play the self promotion game, as National owns the commercial cultural space and it’s embarrassing when Labour tries to match. Remember when Key named his ‘top 5’ women and then Goff did so too?
      Labour lost its social identity when it lost its economic identity. This was a delayed effect of Labour embracing neoliberalism as in the Clark years it could define itself socially around having the country’s first elected woman prime minister.

      • Once was Pete 16.1.1

        Do you really believe that or is it tongue in cheek? Any ruling party gets the lions share of the headlines. The Clark government was very good at it. Helen and Clark and Mallard, milked the headlines when they won the rugby world cup for NZ. And good on them, they deserved it. The opposition has to work hard to compete for the public eye. Think Shane Jones with his supermarket campaign. This constant carping and whinging is just BS.
        Labour, for heavens sake toughen up. Drop this dummy spitting stance about TNZ and the Rugby Union. It just comes across as more sour grapes. Do you think National had it easy in the second and third terms of the Clark government?

        • Ergo Robertina 16.1.1.1

          How do you think Labour was able to hold on to the benefits of incumbency for nine years though?

        • DS 16.1.1.2

          Actually, I do recall the media being blatantly pro National for the entire second half of the Clark Government (from Orewa 2004 onwards), and then promoting Key over Brash as Opposition leader, even when Brash was doing OK in the polls.

        • Tracey 16.1.1.3

          can you show me a sports mag cover with helen clark on the front during an election campaign.

  17. vto 17

    This is the perfect excuse to raise the issue of Key’s position on the 1981 Springbok Tour again. Ask him again, and when he says “can’t recollect” call horseshit… and laugh in his face …

    can’t recall ……. what a lying bastard

    • BM 17.1

      Apart from a few lefty saddos, nobody cares about the Springbok Tour.

      Jesus, it was 30+ years ago, don’t think it’s time to move on?

      • vto 17.1.1

        Wake up BM, the question is around Keys being a liar now and that issue of his honesty is current right now today, not 30+ years ago.

        • BM 17.1.1.1

          You guys are really slow learners, you’ve been pushing this “John Keys a liar” wankery for years now and look at the results, Labour hovering around 20% and probably still sinking

          I think it’s you that needs to wake up.

          • vto 17.1.1.1.1

            John Key is a liar BM.

            You clearly don’t mind having a liar for a PM as long as he wins the election for you. You avoid the issue of deception and fraud and dishonesty because it is to your advantage.

            You are a poor poor soul BM, poor …

          • Tracey 17.1.1.1.2

            he is a popular liar. is that what you have taught your kids? lie lie lie and if it makes you popular good onya

        • marty mars 17.1.1.2

          I agree vto – this is a gift for labour – they can ask the pointed questions, laugh at the answers and cause key to misstep as his ego gets bruised and his vanity gets prodded.

      • Puckish Rogue 17.1.2

        Don’t you remember the debates with Clark, its was Clarks big weapon and it turned out to be a damp squib which really annoyed a whole bunch of lefties because it was the lefties time in the spot light and time has marched on

        • BM 17.1.2.1

          I get the feeling it was only time where they felt any purpose in their lives , hence the reason why they think it’s such an important event and can’t let go.

          • vto 17.1.2.1.1

            In your world the dishonesty of our Prime Minister is not an important matter – says it all about you right wing pricks and how you go about life.

            • Kiwiri 17.1.2.1.1.1

              Key’s dishonesty matters to Progressive Voters and the ‘protest’ votes against the government. What counts is getting those voters to the ballot box to vote the Fraud out of government.

    • Rosie 17.2

      +1 vto.

    • Gosman 17.3

      How would that motivate people to vote Labour or at least not support National?

      • vto 17.3.1

        Why do you think that is the reason for my comment?

        • Gosman 17.3.1.1

          You stated it was the perfect time to do so. There must be a reason for doing this at this perfect time. What outcome would you expect from doing so?

          • vto 17.3.1.1.1

            why do you think I stated it was the perfect time to do so when I did nothing of the sort?

          • vto 17.3.1.1.2

            why is it more important to “be a winner” than to conduct oneself with honesty?

            this is the question for you right wing people at the moment.

            • idlegus 17.3.1.1.2.1

              +100! thats what stands out for me too vto, right wingers like liars? their whole lives must be lies.

            • Once was Pete 17.3.1.1.2.2

              It is equally a question for the left wing. Like it or not Labour has a poor record in this area as well. Remember the $800k of misappropriated funds for the pledge card? Remember Helen’s painting? Or the denial about the Owen Glenn donation? How about Cunliffes trust fund, or his about turn on whether he knew the identity of the the sex offender he met with?
              So how about less of the conducting oneself with honesty BS because Labour are clearly as bad as National. And how about the group you are so keen to get into bed with? Winnie and his abuse of the public purse, and his deceit over Owen Glen, or the convicted criminal (more than once) who now leads the Internet Party.
              What a load of the proverbial…! You think the public can’t see this and judge for themselves.

              • vto

                what a load of proverbial. You clearly do not recall my calls on Labour’s dubious actions when in power.

                However we currently have a PM who is the biggest liar of the lot. Blatant liar in a vein not seen before. Outright liar.

                And having the right wing mob saying that being a liar is fine as long as they are “winners” is entirely enlightening as to their approach to life. It all adds up you see – reflected in the adoration of Key by you lot. He is one of the boys isn’t he. He is a winner – never mind the dishonesty.

                • Once was Pete

                  Your emotions and anger have clearly taken your brain hostage. From my reading of the comments no one said being a liar is fine as long as they are winners. You have conflated different statements into one to ge a new meaning.
                  As for your statement about Key being the ‘biggest liar of the lot’ you are so emotive and extravagant with your statements that you can’t be taken seriously!

                  • vto

                    There have been entire threads and posts about Key’s lies. In fact BLiP has a list a mile long that is infamous. Key is the biggest liar of the lot. There is nothing extravagant about it.

                    Being a liar is what defines John Key.

                    • Kiwiri

                      Lies, incompetence, cronyism, very selective amnesia ….. time for an entertaining interlude and a dance, courtesy of KDC:

                      “I don’t know who gave me money, I can’t remember … I can’t recall”

                      Almost 203,000 views.

                  • North

                    Once WasPete, how come when tested your first port of call is often the wail – “Your emotions and anger……..blah blah blah” ? I reckon you’re hiding when you do that. Which is pretty weak. And intellectually dishonest. Makes me understand that your elevation of form is to hide your lack of substance, which deficit has you all emotional and angry. So you project onto others. You and I had the same business the other day over Gaza.

              • ghostwhowalksnz

                Dont be silly, National stole $110,000 of TV time for the 2005 election. You cant buy it so it was the only way they could get more than their share

            • Enough is Enough 17.3.1.1.2.3

              Because you can’t achieve anything meaningful from opposition.

              I wish a few on our side would begin to understand that winning is everything in Election Year.

              Sideshows, apologies and debates about social issues from 30 years ago will do fuck all to convince the public to vote for a progressive party.

              • Once was Pete

                Sideshows, apologies etc…. Could not agree more. more policy less extraneous garbage.

                • Enough is Enough

                  We just have to look at the last 9 posts on the Standard to show where in my view the left is steering way off course. There are only 2 out of 9 posts dedicated to new policy. The majority of the rest are sideshows.

                  We are drowning ourselves out. Our message is not being told because we whinging, complaining and crying about the media, John Key, big bad world, airports and the colour of the sky.

                  We have a wonderful positive story to tell about how fantastic this country can be under a progressive government. That is all we should be talking about for the next 8 weeks. We need to inspire.

                  • BM

                    Face it, lefties aren’t happy unless they’re endlessly moaning and getting all negative about stuff.
                    Seems to be hard wired into the DNA.

                    • vto

                      Face it, righties are happy when they win. Doesn’t matter how it was arrived at – dishonesty, fraud, deception no matter nobody cares.
                      Seems to be hard-wired into the DNA.

                  • lprent

                    Unfortunately the rate that new policy gets shipped out is slower than the rate that we need to post at. A lot of the time the policy requires considerable reading to decide if they are worth much.

                    Right now I (for instance) can only expend that kind of time on the weekend. First week in a new job is always a bugger for chewing up most of my available CBU (central brain unit) and unfortunately I haven’t been able to teach my computer to write posts. Normally I’d leaven it out with posts from other sites. However I haven’t had tike.

                    Other authors have similar problems. So we tend to write a lot of reaction pieces.

                    • Enough is Enough

                      Thanks for your response lprent.

                      I was not intending to be critical of you and the other authors as by and large The Standard is fantastic. I was simply venting my frustration at what to me looks like a train wreck of a campaign with daily mistakes.

                  • Tracey

                    how many policy posts have you submitted in the past month?

            • Tracey 17.3.1.1.2.4

              and the silence is deafening ….

    • john 17.4

      There wouldn’t be a person in the country who didn’t change or make up their mind on something over half a lifetime.

      That would only show that a sad lot of losers have nothing major to whinge about – go for it.

      • jingyang 17.4.1

        It’s a bit john that you can’t seem to understand that there is a rather large difference between ‘changing one’s mind’ as you imply Key does, and ‘outright lies’ – which he has been caught out on many times. What sad lot of losers you Nats are.

  18. Puckish Rogue 18

    Winners are grinners and thats why John Keys grinning all the way to the next election and lets be honest its a good fit as well

    • Sable 18.1

      I’m sure someone said the same thing about Hitler and Mussolini once upon a time….

      • Puckish Rogue 18.1.1

        That must be the quickest use of godwins law ever

        • vto 18.1.1.1

          yes because it is entirely apt.

          godwin dimwit

          • Gosman 18.1.1.1.1

            Why? Do you really think John Key is in the same category as Hitler and Mussolini? Has John Key ever openly advocated for the dismantling of democractic institutions and the cancellation of elections?

            • vto 18.1.1.1.1.1

              John Key openly advocated for the dismantling of the demographic institution of Environment Canterbury and cancelled the elections. Twice. Just like H1tler and Mussolini

              bloody dimwit

              godwin law is entirely apt, as pointed out.

              • Gosman

                FFS. No wonder many people think the left has lost touch with reality. Equating the actions taken in regard to Environment Canterbury with what the Nazis did to the Weimar Republic or with Mussolini’s march on Rome is ridiculous. But by all means keep pushing that nonsense as it just highlights how wacky and out there your views are. I am sure you will capture the support of some fringe dwellers though.

                • vto

                  You asked for the evidence and there it is. Open your eyes gosman

                  • Gosman

                    Question for you vto. If your views in any way reflected reality i.e. National is on par with the anti-democratic nature of Mussolini and Hitler wouldn’t you expect the opposition to actually highlight this and fight tooth and nail to protect our democracy? Because that is not what I am seeing. I don’t see Labour, the Greens, nor Mana telling the public how much like Hitler and Mussolini the National led government is. Why do you think that is vto?

                    • vto

                      Many in opposition have been fighting this tooth and nail. This is reflected in, for example, the stone urn in Cathedral Square in Chch. You haven’t seen it have you and you have no idea what is represented in it of the people down here. You live in a bubble.

                      And I am not a politician so I can opine whatever I want – politicians have parameters for expression that don’t exist here. Your questions are useless.

                      Why don’t you accept the evidence that you asked for? Just to be clear – this was the question you asked… “Has John Key ever openly advocated for the dismantling of democractic institutions and the cancellation of elections?”

                      The answer was “John Key openly advocated for the dismantling of the demographic institution of Environment Canterbury and cancelled the elections”

                      Did John Key do those things or not gosman?

                    • Macro

                      National’s abuse of parliamentary process and its persistent arrogance and sense of entitlement with all its incumbent corruption is entirely consistent with Fascism. That they are perhaps just to the left of Hitler is sad but true (remember the people of Germany too thought that Hitler was wonderful – until he lead them into the abyss). There is only a world war to separate Key from them. Their continual attack on the rights of people is relentless. The Bill of Rights is bypassed consistently in legislation brought by them before the House. They have little respect for people (e.g. the Brownlee incident – let anyone else try that!)

                    • Gosman

                      Ummm…. objecting to the situation in relation to Environment Canterbury is not the same as agreeing with your position that it is equivalent to what Hitler and Mussolini did in the respective countries prior to WWII. What would be the same is if an Opposition party representative comes out and states categorically that the actions of the National party in this area is just like what Hitler and Mussolini did prior to WWII. Has anyone on the left of the political spectrum in Parliament done that?

                    • Macro

                      How is the denial of democratic rights to the people of Canterbury and Auckland – to name just 2 instances -the persistent abuse of the democratic process in the House through “urgency” – the degradation of the “Bill of Rights” to the point that now any referral to it is just a joke – the consistent corruption by Ministers ( NZ has lost count of the number who have been found out with their snouts in the trough); and the wholesale nepotism and cronyism that pervades this disgusting excuse of an “administration”; not comparable to that which pertained in Germany and Italy before 1939? I think you would find – were you to really do some historical research – that many of the practices of this current shower – are very similar to that of 1930’s Germany. The only difference is that whereas Germany improved its economy, NZ’s is going down the toilet.

                    • Gosman

                      And I will repeat my question to you. If it is so obvious that National and Key are acting just like the Nazi’s why isn’t any opposition politician in Parliament screaming this to high heaven?

                    • tinfoilhat

                      I’m probable one of the Nat’s and Key’s harshest critics but to suggest many of the practices of the current government are similar to those of 1930s Germany is both absurd and has the effect of turning off a large section of the voting public.

                    • blue leopard

                      +1 Macro

                      It is their obvious aims of appealing to base instincts through the use of symbolism and the divisive effects of that activity as opposed to appealing to peoples’ better nature and intelligence where I see the most parallels to the one Macro is drawing.

                      The results of such tactics is discouraging sound informed democracy and turning it into mob-rule.

                    • Macro

                      “If it is so obvious that National and Key are acting just like the Nazi’s why isn’t any opposition politician in Parliament screaming this to high heaven?”

                      And the obvious answer is that they would be ignored by a complacent media and a public – such as yourself tinfoil who are in awe or who have no sense of history (just as the public were in awe and the media complacent and silenced in the 1930’s)- but that does not mean that there are not obvious similarities.

                      It is not absurd to make comparisons and I have highlighted some already. NZ is asleep and on a slippery path towards loosing all that has been gained democratically – The TPPA will be just another step along the path of NZ loosing its sovereignty. Tinfoil – if you cannot see how our democracy has been handed over to corporate influence, then you are asleep.

                    • tinfoilhat

                      Macro I spent many years teaching history at school and still relieve on occasion, Key and the Nats are a poor government who I’d like to see removed, they are however next to nothing like the Hitler and Mussolini.

                      I the kind of breathless, schoolboy rubbish that suggests they are is why people like Martyn Bradbury drive me to distraction.

                    • felix

                      Gosman you are lying again.

                      You asked vto if Key had ever advocated dismantling a democratic institution or cancelling an election.

                      The answer was given. Yes, clearly. It is a matter of record.

                      From that point on you have accused vto of claiming Key is equivalent to, on par with, and behaving just like the nazis.

                      You are a sad little man. You asked. It was answered. Put the goalposts back where you found them.

                    • Tracey

                      I cant find any of your dressings down to recent posts accusing the greens of being like the taliban. wrongthinking you agree with I guess?

                    • Macro

                      I’ve been thinking about your reply Tinfoil and I understand that the excesses of the regime in Germany are not quite to be found in NZ – but all the same there are factors that – while not as extreme – are very very similar. Take for instance the subjugation of the Jewish and Homosexual communities, this is replaced in NZ by the denigration of the poor. The hate speech of “Bludgers” and worthlessness – the constant cuts in welfare and living allowances. The Accommodation supplement hasn’t been increased since 2008! yet rent in auckland – well you know the story. So we don’t throw them into “work camps” but we throw them into cars and tents and overcrowded houses. (it’s cheaper that way). over 20% of our population is treated in this manner – and as you well know, if Key gets back in it will only get worse.
                      No there are no brown shirts and crystal nights – as yet! But we do have a black shirt! is this the start of it? and remember the crystal night was in November 1938.
                      Secret surveillance was also being carried out. Well the passing of the GCSB Act and the incredible ruling on the “illegal” spying of NZers making it legal if your boss says its ok means no one is safe.
                      The sharing of information with the USA on NZ citizens and the assassination of a NZer by drone missile without trial are just further examples of a Government that has lost all sense of morality and decency and the care of the most vulnerable in it’s society.
                      So I stand by my comment that this Govt is acting in the manner that characterised Hilter’s. Maybe not as extreme, – but where does one draw the line when it comes to the lack of moral behaviour?

    • vto 18.2

      “Winners are grinners ”

      Yes we get that “being a winner” is all important and that means even if you have to do so by being dishonest, deceptive and an outright liar. We get that this is how right wing people think and live their lives. We see it in our daily interactions with people like you PR – you are dishonest and not trusted. You are not winners at all, you are just arseholes to be very wary of.

      • vto 18.2.1

        no wonder you like john key, he is the epitome of you people

        • Puckish Rogue 18.2.1.1

          You become the people you associate with so yes I like to associate with winners whereas you on the left like to associate with Cunliffe

          • vto 18.2.1.1.1

            completely as expected.

            entirely in confirmation of point made

          • Tom Jackson 18.2.1.1.2

            You become the people you associate with.

            You must be friends with some really stupid assholes then.

  19. Sanctuary 19

    If I were the NZRFU I would be incandescent with fury at Rugby News. The very LAST thing they need is for the All Black jersey to be politicised. They won’t want people thinking you havre to support National to support the All Blacks, and they last thing they want is the taxpayer money they get being dependent on who is in power. If I were Steve Tew, I’d be yelling long and hard at the editor of rugby news down the phone, to the point of demanding a recall if things get to controversial.

    • Puckish Rogue 19.1

      Settle petal, the NZRFU will be stoked to have John Key as hes popular and well-liked, John Key is well known for supporting the All Blacks whereas Helen Clark knew she had to be seen at the tests but didn’t really have any interest in rugby

      • fender 19.1.1

        Yeah, Key is well know for supporting the All Blacks since way back, circa.2007

        Hope he doesn’t gatecrash the Commonwealth Games seeking selfies and a medal..

        • Kiwiri 19.1.1.1

          Key is hard at work preparing and practising to gatecrash with his three-way handshake.

          • fender 19.1.1.1.1

            Followed by a get together with Farrar and Slater for a three-way-masturbate..

            • Kiwiri 19.1.1.1.1.1

              Gosh. What a mental picture … three-ways, handshakes-cum-selfies etc etc

              • fender

                Yeah sorry, it’s a mental picture only BM, Puckish, Once was Pete-Now only George, could find arousing..

                • Kiwiri

                  Commonwealth Games Alert & Warning:

                  Kiwi medalists are strongly advised to wear disposable gloves with them to the podium in case their attention-seeking Prime Minister gatecrashes with his three-way handshake!

              • Gosman

                And people here have the nerve to call Kiwiblog the sewer.

                • TeWhareWhero

                  Is the view nice from the moral high ground Gosman?

                  I dislike laddishness / blokiness whoever it’s coming from – but I have a dossier of comments made by right-wingers about Helen Clark in the lead up to the election that bestowed the Pack Leader on us – and it’s a catalogue of savage misogyny and baleful, spiteful vindictiveness. I’ve never seen anything remotely as abhorrent as that from left wingers. True, some people here can get a bit hyped up on the old testosterone and adrenaline mix but mostly lefties tend towards the cerebral – it’s those structural differences in the brain at work.

                  • Gosman

                    Key has essentially been called a Nazi who engages in activity that most people would find a tad sexually perverted on this very article comment section and you honestly don’t think that is in any way abhorent do you? How bizarre if true.

                    • McFlock

                      Nobody’s judging a threeway circle-jerk except you.
                      Even the thought of Key ham-fisting it is probably less cringe-worthy than watching him fuck democracy on a daily basis.

                • Kiwiri

                  Hey you cooked goose,
                  In your hurry, you didn’t include that other wailing rubbish blog which does not deserve to be named but here is an attention-seeking pic (uploaded on TDB) of the trysting threesome:

                  http://thedailyblog.co.nz/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/BnFqAvWCEAIE7AO.png-large.png

      • Murray Olsen 19.1.2

        Helen Clark is a rugby league fan. She did a lot for the Mt Albert Rugby League Club. I never saw her surrounded by armed police on the occasions I came across her.

    • Gosman 19.2

      Who is going to make a big deal about this ?

      • Sanctuary 19.2.1

        Rugby News just published a 1330 word semi-apology on their FB page, so I guess they know they stuffed up.

        • Gosman 19.2.1.1

          Yep. They admitted there was nothing untoward in relation to the reason for the article and admitted the timing was unfortunate. Huge apology there.

          • McFlock 19.2.1.1.1

            lol

            and yet when cunliffe makes comments even less than that in the last few days, apparently he’s weak, rolling over, and apologising for an apology.

            At least you’re slightly less biased than Hosking, I guess.

  20. Ron 20

    As long as the picture has the required authorisation notice and that a portion of the sales of magazine are counted in Key’s electoral finance return

  21. The Baron 21

    This post is a case study in “Key Derangement Syndrome”. Poor RedFed. All rational argument goes out the door.

    What’s really sad is that we will probably see a Lab Party complaint to the Press Council about this, while simultaneously Cunliffe goes looking for a photo-op with the Black Caps. Heh.

  22. wonderpup 22

    Its a coup for Key: great positioning in their prime market: fat white old men.

    Now, let us get on with things that affect the rest of the country, including the fat old white men like me who can think beyond the next round of bread and circuses.

    • Once was Pete 22.1

      Your joking right? Have you actually looked at the composition of rugby teams and and the crowds?

  23. Chauncey Gardiner 23

    THE ALL BLACKS, MIKE HOSKINGS, FRAMMING & THE STRICT PARENT/NURTURANT PARENT FAMILY

    HARDEN UP NZ

    What?

    At present, this post mentions the choice of moderator. Of course this is important; they have influence over the tone, language and the means to steer the debate. Bill Rolaston interviewed on Morning Report today seems to think otherwise, and that the Labour party leader is behaving like Robert Muldoon? No framing of peoples opinion there Bill, the Labour Leader never apologises does he. Mind you, Bill did mention that Keys only wanted a certain number of debates because it was in his interests. Again, they didn’t interview anyone with a counter opinion to Bill. Also he snuck in a criticism that Labour were to busy dealing with the minutiae instead of core issues.

    Funny how the majority of MSM seem to be steering the interviews toward this minutiae, don’t worry about child poverty a, it’s not trivial enough.

    Unfortunately with the selection Mr Hoskins, it could fall into a tag team debate (a 2 on 1 scenario). Not so innocent? The question then is who and how many people were involved at TVNZ and in the wider community into making this decision? A little social network analysis may well reveal their potential leanings, financial backgrounds, wealth etc. There are plenty of better interviewers.

    As people have mentioned a labour candidate had to resign while working in public broadcasting due to using the broadcaster’s premises etc. He was seen by the right as being biased (even though, the investigation showed that he was balanced and fair). To his credit he resigned straight away. He should not have been doing using the premises. In direct contrast we now have a known National supporter (declares it on TV) who has been earmarked for the job of moderator/chair.

    How can this be reconciled, particularly when the real argument in peoples mind for the labour candidates removal was framed in terms of him being biased (not use of equipment) sorry, but I am at a loss. Who picked him? Have you had a look on the board members of TVNZ lately?

    So, what is going on, how is it that National appear to be controlling the debate even down to interviews on radio/TV and live panel discussions before they have even began? National seem to have permeated into every edifice of society. Now John appears to be the number one All Black supporter.

    So how can all these events be reconciled, Framing?

    An article some years ago by Bonnie Azab Powell, NewsCenter 27 October 2003, may shed some light.
    http://www.berkeley.edu/news/media/releases/2003/10/27_lakoff.shtml

    They asked the question, why was the Democratic Party (leftish when compared to the Republicans) losing out to the Republicans.

    She interviewed George Lakoff (UC Berkeley professor of linguistics and cognitive science who was part of the Rockridge Institute).

    Here are just some modified (i.e. summary)/unmodified exerts that may shed some light on what is going on in NZ. Maybe some lessons to be learned:

    Republicans have spent decades defining their ideas, carefully choosing the language with which to present them, and building an infrastructure to communicate them.
    The work has paid off: by dictating the terms of national debate, Republicans have put Democrats firmly on the defensive.

    She then asked Lakoff what was the Rockridge Institute purpose:

    “The background for Rockridge is that Republicans (Republicans), especially Republican think tanks, have framed virtually every issue from their perspective. They have put a huge amount of money into creating the language for their worldview and getting it out there. Democratss have
    done virtually nothing…..

    “Rockridge’s job is to reframe public debate, to create balance from a Democrats perspective. It’s one thing to analyze language and thought, it’s another thing to create it. That’s what we’re about. It’s a matter of asking ‘What are the central ideas of Democrats thought from a moral perspective?”

    “The interviewer, then asked Why do Republicans (aka the right) appear to be so much better at framing?”

    “Because they’ve put billions of dollars into it. Over the last 30 years their think tanks have made a heavy investment in ideas and in language.”

    “Why haven’t Democrats done the same thing?
    “There’s a systematic reason for that. You can see it in the way that Republican foundations and Democrats foundations work. Republican foundations give large block grants year after year to their think tanks. They say, ‘Here’s several million dollars, do what you need to do.’ And basically, they build infrastructure, TV studios, hire intellectuals etc. They do all of that. Why? Because the Republican moral system, which I analyzed in “Moral Politics,” has as its highest value preserving and defending the: “Strict Father” system itself. :This means building infrastructure. As businessmen, they know how to do this very well.”

    “Meanwhile, Democrats conceptual system of the “nurturant parent” has as its highest value helping individuals who need help. The Democrats foundations and donors give their money to a variety of grassroots organizations. They say, ‘We’re giving you $25,000, but don’t waste a penny of it. Make sure it all goes to the cause, don’t use it for administration, communication, infrastructure, or career development.”
    “So there’s actually a structural reason built into the worldviews that explains why Republicans have done better.”

    “Whats meant by strict father and nurturant parent frameworks”

    “The Democrats worldview is modelled on a nurturant parent family. It assumes that the world is basically good and can be made better and that one must work toward that. Children are born good; parents can make them better. Nurturing involves empathy, and the responsibility to take care of oneself and others for whom we are responsible. On a larger scale, specific policies follow, such as governmental protection in form of a social safety net and government regulation, universal education etc.”

    “The Republican worldview, the strict father model, assumes that the world is dangerous and difficult and that children are born bad and must be made good. The strict father is the moral authority who supports and defends the family, tells his wife what to do, and teaches his kids right from wrong. The only way to do that is through painful discipline – physical punishment that by adulthood will become internal discipline. The good people are the disciplined people. Once grown, the self-reliant, disciplined children are on their own. Those children who remain dependent (who were spoiled, overly willful, or recalcitrant) should be forced to undergo further discipline or be cut free with no support to face the discipline of the outside world.”

    “So what is the problem for the left?”

    “Do any of the Democratic Presidential candidates grasp the importance of framing?
    “None. They don’t get it at all. But they’re in a funny position. The framing changes that have to be made are long-term changes. The conservatives understood this in 1973. By 1980 they had a candidate, Ronald Reagan, who could take all this stuff and run with it.

    The progressives (Democrates) don’t have a candidate now who understands these things and can talk about them. And in order for a candidate to be able to talk about them, the ideas have to be out there.”

    “You have to be able to reference them in a sound bite. Other people have to put these ideas into the public domain, not politicians.”

    The question is, How do you get these ideas out there? There are all kinds of ways, and one of the things the Rockridge Institute is looking at is talking to advocacy groups, which could do this very well. They have more of a budget, they’re spread all over the place, and they have access to the media.

    Right now the Democratic Party is into marketing. They pick a number of issues like prescription drugs and Social Security and ask which ones sell best across the spectrum, and they run on those issues.

    They have no moral perspective, no general values, no identity. People vote their identity, they don’t just vote on the issues, and Democrats don’t understand that. Look at Schwarzenegger, who says nothing about the issues. The Democrats ask, How could anyone vote for this guy? They did because he put forth an identity. Voters knew who he is.”
    End of exerts.

    Lessons Learned
    1. “You have to be able to reference policy/values in a sound bite. Other people have to put these ideas into the public domain, not politicians (so if you are not involved with big business/media how do you do that)
    2. How do you get these ideas out there? There are all kinds of ways, and one of the things the zRockridge Institute is looking at is talking to advocacy groups, which could do this very well
    3. People vote their identity, they don’t just vote on the issues
    4. The framing changes that have to be made are long-term changes
    5. How do you get the message across of being firm but fair (i.e. not too apologetic)

    However, let’s take a look at the implications of what being a Strict Father type party.
    Strict Father (Conservative)
    In a harden up society, where apparently it is ok not to apologise, not to resign, to be strict and leviathan like, one could see which one would appeal, even to woman (sadly). In perverse terms, this has been shown to happen when a victim falls in love with the “strict father like” kidnapper. We see this strict father figure transformed into strict mummy figures, aka Nationals Collins and Bennett. This is also evidenced in Nationals attempt in attacking the current legal system and trying to destroy the right to silence (i.e. everyone is guilty before proven innocent and needs a Strict Father to sort them out). Can you see now why Schwarzenegger appealed to conservatives? No wonder Colin Craig and the conservatives are courting Nationals.

    Is this what is fundamentally the undercurrent of Nationals campaign “The Strict Father”:
    “Exactly. In the strict father model, the big thing is discipline and moral authority, and punishment for those who do something wrong. That comes out very clearly in the Bush administration’s foreign and domestic policy”

    Anything less would be patronising wouldn’t, it, particularly to those woman and men who have been put through the cultural harden up school. Any hints of apology, kindness etc would be seen as weakness.

    If votes were truly turned in Nationals favour just for a simple apology by the Labour leader (i.e. for being a man), what does it say about the fickle nature of the voter. Surely one would look at the core values of the each party? then decide, or is it just down to the basis of not being a strict enough father (hard/tough enough). My impression (biased of course), is that Labour are firm but fair. But, yes, the Labour leader did come across patronising (but really, thats a one off).

    In my own experience, this type of ‘Strict Father’ type devotees will never mention the economic hand outs they get (i.e. they have been sanatized in the form of grants, tax breaks, bail outs etc) and are soft on their ‘friends’. They also demonise the beneficiaries, and poorly educated or lowly paid on whom they depend to do the drudge work. Secretly do they think Darwin would have wanted it that way?

    To be fair to the Strict Father type model, yes children in particular require guidance; they may not require Authoritarian society with a capital A, but more of an authority with a lower case ‘a’ or nurturant parent family type.

    Nurturant parent family
    Are we seeing an ideological war between Authoritarian ‘A’ type societies (which typically benefits the status quo) and more Liberal (no not neo liberal or hug tree liberals). Liberal in the sense of ability to critical think, to question authority, to be ‘well educated’ (not just school standards pumped into ones brain). Yes I can hear some people say, you partronising git, people from strict backgrounds can be critical thinkers to.

    The book The War for Children’s Minds: by Stephen Law, may give insights into why a more Nuturant parent family approach maybe better.
    http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2006/jun/03/family.family7

    In his stance he takes on the authoritarian rhetoric (strict father figure) and states that children (and I would suggest adults) would be better educated through the hard one values of the enlightmentment or if you like a more liberal approach. Liberal in this sense of using authority with a lower case ‘a’ defined as nurturing and caring, guiding and developing. A liberal or a nurturing society does not mean one without rules. It means to develop ones critical facilities to be able to debate and discuss.

    The MSM does not particularly like considering it is funded by big business. They know kiwis like black and white, hard men and woman prefer it that way, the constantly employ heuristics (rules of thumb) to make political decisions as they are probably far to busy working HARD, playing Hard and Hardening Up. Not that the ‘left’ side are angles either.

    So, in a perverse turn, does the left need to ‘harden up’ to at the very least be seen as firm but fair? Keep its messages simple and to the point on the main issues, not drawn into the minutae by corporate funded big business media.

    John, the All Blacks are hard, you just look, well impotent and quite frankly flaccid. What a pr flop. Slimy handshake anyone?

  24. AB 24

    Laughed out loud when I saw it. The guy is such a pathetic wannabe arse.
    From short, chubby, pasty, parasitic, currency speculator to All Black forward in one delusional bound.
    Kim Jong Key.

    Message for the left – ridicule not outrage is the best response. Remember Muldoon, – it was ridicule that brought him low.

    • framu 24.1

      absotutely – point laugh repeat

    • Stuart Munro 24.2

      Now that he’s opened that door there are so many places Key can be photo-shopped into…

      Between Hilary & Tenzing
      At the last supper (there in spirit)
      Shackleton’s expedition
      In the iconic Titanic scene

      Key is the classic 3rd way leader even down to the handshakes.

  25. TeWhareWhero 25

    Gosman 4.1 9:17 am
    “To be fair this is an opinion on a left wing blog rather than an official Labour party position but you do raise a good point. Even Labour complaining about Hoskings is not helpful to them I would suggest. Does it convince anyone to think about voting for Labour? – Unlikely. Does it make some people think Labour is a bunch of whining linp wristed cry babies? Quite possibly.”

    ‘Limp wristed’ eh? Unlike the ‘real man’ who leads the National Party – I bet John Key’s handshake could crack walnuts.

    I do understand your anger Redfred but I don’t agree the AB jersey has mystical powers – if I thought it did I might kill myself.

    We don’t know if the blazers who run the RU conspired with the publishers of Rugby News and the spin doctors who are running the Nat’s election campaign, to cynically use the AB ‘brand’ to give Key a boost among rugby supporters two months out from the election.

    The fact that the cover and the image it promotes dovetails very nicely with the attacks on Cunliffe for having ‘disparaged men’ and being a serial apologiser (something ‘real men’ with stiff wrists never do) is probably just a coincidence.

    As is the choice of Hoskings as moderator for the Leaders’ debate. The heads of TVNZ may well have made their choice based on what they genuinely believe is Hoskings’ proven record as a man of keen intelligence and political acumen who is held in high esteem by all New Zealanders.

    After all, the sort of people who advise Key and National never use dirty tricks – they are the very epitome of professionalism and impartiality, and besides we all know that the NZ media is dominated by the Left so the choice of a right wing airhead is only fair to redress the very obvious imbalance. Ok, enough sarcasm.

    Bill Rawlston on Morning Report today claimed that, as moderator of the leaders’ debate, Mike Hoskings job would just be to ‘keep people on track’ so Labour’s complaint is ‘childish’. I suppose it was as childish for Winston Peters to have refused to take part in a debate moderated by Rawlston.

    Rawlston then went on to say that Cunliffe could have used his dossier of the unprofessional remarks made by Hoskings about him in the past, ‘if Hoskings throws him a curly one’.

    He needs to make his mind up whether Hoskings is a neutral moderator there to keep people on track or a partisan interviewer likely to throw the candidates (read Cunliffe) awkward questions?

    The Rightwing bias the NZ media is displaying is becoming seriously embarrassing – but at least it might quieten the raucous claims that the mainstream media is dominated by the Left.

    • Gosman 25.1

      “We don’t know if the blazers who run the RU conspired with the publishers of Rugby News and the spin doctors who are running the Nat’s election campaign, to cynically use the AB ‘brand’ to give Key a boost among rugby supporters two months out from the election.”

      According to the statement on the Facebook page there was no collusion at all.

    • Visubversaviper 25.2

      Bill Ralston has a bloody great National/Nikki Kaye billboard up in his front yard.

      • Gosman 25.2.1

        So?

        • Puddleglum 25.2.1.1

          I think that was to indicate that Ralston may well have right wing sympathies – hence asking him to commentate (on Morning Report) about whether Hoskings’ similar sympathies might affect the debate was, to say the least, unwise.

          Of course, Ralston’s openness to allowing a National Party billboard on his front yard – assuming it is correct – could just be his impartial attempt to support the democratic process. Presumably other parties just don’t happen to have approached him yet.

          Happy to help out over your inability to see a relevant connection.

          • McFlock 25.2.1.1.1

            actually, it might be an interesting media experiment for a journo to put up a variety of billboards in their yard and see which ones get targeted by vandals – even do one of those “why did you do that?” interviews with an offender.

            Replace them all fresh at the beginning of each day. Document the damage and you could even do a cool timelapse visual. Easy way to pad out a ten minute report 🙂

            • Puddleglum 25.2.1.1.1.1

              An interesting idea but, like all research, the real question is how the data are interpreted not what they are.

              For example, all Labour Party billboards get defaced = ‘See how unpopular Labour are?’
              All National Party billboards get defaced = ‘See how nasty Labour supporters are?’

  26. Ffloyd 26

    Maybe seeing he is now an honorary AB he should play in the next game they play against SA. In the front row.

    • fender 26.1

      Great idea if we want to lose, but it could be a small price to pay to see Key get his ear head bitten off 😈

  27. Ennui 27

    Key apparently played rugby as a child, so did I until my mid 20s…..I would not have the effrontery to done an AB jersey in the presence of a real AB. The jersey needs to be earned, Key cheapens it.

    • Puckish Rogue 27.1

      Meh, its just a jersey

      • Weepus beard 27.1.1

        Wash your mouth out.

        • Puckish Rogue 27.1.1.1

          The jersey is nothing its the getting selected that counts and Im pretty sure no one in NZ thinks John Keys in the All Blacks (at least I hope not)

          • BM 27.1.1.1.1

            All blacks used to mean something 20 years ago, now they’re just a brand.

            Rugby is unbelievably dull these days, it’s all so robotic and one dimensional.

            • RedLogix 27.1.1.1.1.1

              Just this once BM – I agree with you.

              Just a branding exercise all round.

            • framu 27.1.1.1.1.2

              “now they’re just a brand.”

              yes – and what are brands used for?

              selling you stuff

              “Rugby is unbelievably dull these days, it’s all so robotic and one dimensional”

              I guess key is a good fit there after all

            • Tracey 27.1.1.1.1.3

              robotic and one dimensional… it makes sense they would make key their fan club leader

          • Weepus beard 27.1.1.1.2

            Bomber does:

            Cutting deals with the United States to entrap a permanent resident and lying about it is one thing, handing over top level intelligence to a far right hate speech merchant however is probably going too far even for All Blacks Captain John Key to get away with.

            – Martyn Bradbury

      • Puddleglum 27.1.2

        Yes, so it makes you wonder why on earth the Prime Minister’s Office agreed to this kind of complete trivia that would fool absolutely no-one and yet suggests that the PM would rather be chatty-chatty about the All Blacks rather than discuss “the things that matter”.

        What were they thinking?

  28. Once was Pete 28

    Go to a test match and you will see 000’s of jerseys. As for donning the jersey, according to NZRFU it was photoshopped.

    • ghostwhowalksnz 28.1

      of course the players didnt pose with Key. But did Key put a jersey on for the photo ?

      Perhaps we will see some pictures of Key in his younger days in a rugby team? High School or University.

      Surely his love of the game goes deep ?

      Perhaps someone in an interview should ask him a basic rule from the game, something every player should know ?

      • Gosman 28.1.1

        Such as you have to pass the ball backwards or you score either from placing the ball in a controlled manner over the tryline or from kicking it via either a place kick or a drop kick between the posts but above the cross bar. Yeah I can imagine that would be difficult for someone with only a passing knowledge of the sport to know.

      • felix 28.1.2

        🙄

        gww: ‘hey let’s think of a tricky question’

        gos: ‘oh like how many wings does a chicken have? real tricky question, idiot’

      • felix 28.1.3

        ps I’d go for trivia. How many points a player scored in a particular season, what year someone was first selected, details of provincial competition games etc.

        You know, stuff that real rugby fans know.

  29. Hami Shearlie 29

    I think we should see this photo EVERYWHERE accompanied by a loudspeaker playing that old classic “The Great Pretender”!!

  30. Populuxe1 30

    You mean “desecrates” – “denegrates” would mean that he said something nasty about it. This is basic English comprehension people.

    • ghostwhowalksnz 30.1

      One of the meanings of ‘denigrate’ is sully. So do think it would be possible you checked something for once in your life.

      • Populuxe1 30.1.1

        Sigh.
        DENIGRATE: criticize unfairly; disparage.
        “doom and gloom merchants who denigrate their own country”
        synonyms: disparage, belittle, diminish, deprecate, cast aspersions on, decry, criticize unfairly, attack, speak ill of, speak badly of, blacken the character of, blacken the name of, give someone a bad name, sully the reputation of, spread lies about, defame, slander, libel, calumniate, besmirch, run down, abuse, insult, slight, revile, malign, vilify.

        den·i·grate verb ˈde-ni-ˌgrāt
        to say very critical and often unfair things about (someone)

        to make (something) seem less important or valuable
        den·i·grat·edden·i·grat·ing

        Full Definition of DENIGRATE

        transitive verb
        1
        to attack the reputation of : defame <denigrate one’s opponents>
        2

        to deny the importance or validity of : belittle
        — den·i·gra·tion noun
        — den·i·gra·tive adjective
        — den·i·gra·tor noun
        — den·i·gra·to·ry adjective
        See denigrate defined for English-language learners »
        Examples of DENIGRATE

        Her story denigrates him as a person and as a teacher.
        No one is trying to denigrate the importance of a good education. We all know that it is crucial for success.
        denigrating the talents and achievements of women
        Origin of DENIGRATE

        Latin denigratus, past participle of denigrare, from de- + nigrare to blacken, from nigr-, niger black
        First Known Use: 1526
        Related to DENIGRATE

        Synonyms
        bad-mouth, belittle, cry down, decry, deprecate, depreciate, derogate, diminish, dis (also diss) [slang], discount, dismiss, disparage, kiss off, minimize, play down, poor-mouth, put down, run down, talk down, trash, trash-talk, vilipend, write off
        Antonyms
        acclaim, applaud, exalt, extol (also extoll), glorify, laud, magnify, praise
        Related Words
        discommend; abuse, scold; disapprove (of), dislike; censure, condemn, criticize, denounce, reprehend, reprobate; asperse, defame, malign, rip, slander, slur, traduce, vilify; discredit, disgrace
        Near Antonyms
        approve, countenance, endorse (also indorse), favor, recommend, sanction; commend, compliment, eulogize

        Sully only applies if you were to sully someone’s reputation with deliberate intent by deliberate act.

        You can go back to sleep now, much as you did through English class.

        English, fool do you speak it?

        • Zorr 30.1.1.1

          Funny how what ghost was saying is right there in your definition:
          “to make (something) seem less important or valuable”

          That is exactly how the OP was meaning it

          • Populuxe1 30.1.1.1.1

            To make in the active sense, not simply passively by one’s presence. I would have though that was obvious by all the synonyms being active as well, whereas you seem intent on fixating on the one or two that also have a passive use not intended here. Were you correct, the definition would also contain words like desecrate and defile, no?
            Something seems to have gone horribly wrong with your education.

            Logic, my friend, it is an excellent tool.

            • McFlock 30.1.1.1.1.1

              although his presence was as active as an act can be: intentional and deliberate insertion into the image.
              Denigration by association, maybe? 🙂

        • ghostwhowalksnz 30.1.1.2

          How apt “from de- + nigrare to blacken, from nigr-, niger black”

          It was the All Blacks after all, so a clever word play to boot

          But your little effort at research proves what. And how much did it cost for a quick subscription to the OED ?. Or did the “office” pay for it

          • Populuxe1 30.1.1.2.1

            No, dear, it’s the internet. It’s free.
            What it proves is that your mastery of your native tongue is hopelesly inadequate and you can’t tell the difference between related but different words.
            See, I am denigrating you for your ignorance. Your ignorance defiles the English language. See, that’s not so very hard is it?

            • lprent 30.1.1.2.1.1

              No, dear, it’s the internet. It’s free.

              Not according to The Standard’s bank account. Saw that we’d sent out over a terabyte so far this month.

  31. vto 31

    politics and sport should not be mixed, so the rugby people said

    so wtf?

    • TeWhareWhero 31.1

      Clearly they meant liberation politics and sport shouldn’t be mixed.

      Allowing the leader of a rightwing party to pose in an AB jersey for the editor of ‘the biggest rugby magazine in the world’ to photo shop onto an official AB photo captioned with ‘Pack leader’ two months out from an election is not political and only a Leftie would see it as such.

      Damn, I can’t stop being ironic.

      I assume the four players all agreed to have the PM’s smug mug grafted onto the picture – or their agents did.

      Given how ‘jealously’ the RU guard the AB brand, this really is quite extraordinary – however much the Right is trying to slide out from under it. Truth is, if Labour had done something similar the Nats would be howling their outrage from the roof tops – with their pack leader at the forefront.

      • Tracey 31.1.1

        exactly its only bad when you use mix sport and politics to oppose and highlight oppression…

  32. john 32

    Keep trying to score political points over irrelevant minutiae like politicians wearing AB jerseys, and you’ll be able to keep sleepwalking straight to an election defeat.

    • One Anonymous Bloke 32.1

      Reality check: the Herald and Fairfax are talking about Gerry Brownlee, and Coleman’s lies over Dotcom (looks like the noose is tightening nicely). Can you point me to the press-release from a Left-wing party on this latest Key disgracing himself issue?

      No, you can’t.

      People from all different parts of the political spectrum are discussing it. If you want them to shut up why don’t you say so?

      • john 32.1.1

        There’s a whole post here, including over 150 messages, most having a whinge about Key wearing the AB jersey, including more than one from yourself, but you can’t see see anyone “trying to score political points over irrelevant minutiae”?

        You need to prise the blinkers open enough to let a slither of light in.

        • One Anonymous Bloke 32.1.1.1

          The last time I checked I am not standing for election, nor am I a member of any party, so I’ll comment on anything I damn well please. Dear Leader looks foolish and you expect people not to remark on it?

          • john 32.1.1.1.1

            Why would I want people not to comment on it?

            As I said, the more irrelevant minutiae is focused on – red scarfs, skiing in Queenstown, apologies for being male, photos in rugby jerseys, applogies for mistakes that someone else made etc – the more Labour sleepwalks off the election cliff.

            By all means, keep it up.

            • One Anonymous Bloke 32.1.1.1.1.1

              Dimwit, I’m a Green voter: they keep going up in the polls, go whine about Labour to someone else.

              • john

                The Greens? Are they still in the election?

                They’re getting squeezed out of the media attention by Dotcom, Mana, NZ First, Conservatives and the Apology Parties.

                Which might be why the this weeks Herald Digipoll puts them at under 10%, and down to 6.6% for male voters.

                • One Anonymous Bloke

                  Trending up according to Roy Morgan, and they rely a lot more on social media than the spoonfeeds you prefer.

                  • john

                    Big trend – up from 12.3% a year ago to 12.4% in the latest poll.

                    And Metiria Turei has now reached 0.8% as preferred Prime Minister in your preferred poll.

                    Meaning even 90% of Green voters don’t see her as preferred PM.

                    • One Anonymous Bloke

                      Yep, we’ll see how it goes on election night. For as long as I can remember, popularity has been a measure of mediocrity; the Sheeple’s preference for John Key is testament to that.

                    • john

                      Winning an election is now a measure of mediocrity?

                      Wow – I don’t think I’ve ever heard such a weak excuse for losing.

                    • One Anonymous Bloke

                      I’m sure that’s your interpretation, you poor thing.

              • Gosman

                You are a hard core leftist. That’s all that matters.

                • One Anonymous Bloke

                  Yep, I prefer evidence based policy and an actual future for my kids.

                  • Gosman

                    Whereas I just want to send you lot to the gas chambers apparently.

                    • McFlock

                      That might be a bit harsh.
                      But I honestly don’t get the impression that you’d care either way.

              • Tracey

                wow… how quickly he changed his point of attack… its like he temporarily forgot he hates labour cos of his sudden need to hate the greens.

        • Colonial Viper 32.1.1.2

          People are noticing John Key’s North Korean approach to Leader worship.

        • Tracey 32.1.1.3

          you need to stop believing comments here are from people standing for parliament. its a blog… you are too used to nationals mouthpiece at kiwiblog and gheir rubbish bin at oil slick which are part of that partys overt and covert machinations.

          I dont presume anyone or any publication gives anything to my opinions.

  33. tricledrown 33

    Bought
    Media
    pathetic attempt to excuse the ruling elites manipulation of the media.
    11.6% of undecided voters has got the right using dirty funding to win this election at all costs.

  34. joe90 34

    meh – the soft flabby prick hasn’t got the stones to do a Putin and get his gear off and kill something so he’s done a dear leader and made a goat of himself in an AB changing sheds fantasy.

  35. Northshoreguynz 35

    If John Key reckons looking like a prat wins him votes, good luck to him.

  36. TeWhareWhero 36

    The Rugby News editor’s explanation

    “Dear readers,

    Given the media exposure around the current edition featuring John Key – in the spirit of openness, I wanted to explain the thinking and reasoning behind the WHOLE process and be totally upfront about ALL aspects.

    Firstly – as owner/editor, I am not aligned to the National Party in any way. I am undecided who my vote will go to. Rugby New standpoint (and mine) is that we are not wanting ,or trying, to endorse a candidate or party.

    WHY THE ARTICLE?

    Firstly – I think if you have any kind of opinion worth listening to you need to read the article too and put it in to context with the front cover.

    Over the last 7-8 months, of me putting stories together, I have often come across popular pictures of the PM in the All Blacks changing room, after winning a game. The picture of the PM and Richie having a beer was one. I thought – from an editorial viewpoint – that this was an interesting picture and the seed for an article.

    Some of my thoughts were: “Lucky bugger – how cool would that be having a beer with Richie and being in the changing room”. Closely followed by – “How come he gets that and everday supporters don’t.” Unfair maybe, but that’s how things work.

    From there I began thinking that like the PM, or loathe him, he does seem like a genuine rugby fan and obviously a proud Kiwi. This was the start point for the article, but I didn’t want that to be the main aspect.

    The main aspect of the article was to see how big the All Blacks brand was overseas from our elected leader’s standpoint – not something that we would know about necessarily. Are we just big in NZ and rugby playing countries? Are we big, just in knowledgeabe sporting circles, or does the All Blacks winning brand extend to business/politics in countries that weren’t large rugby nations? In short, the All Blacks brand and how global it is. I imagined that many Kiwi’s may not realise how big-a-deal the AB’s were globally – especially in non-rugby mad countries – and if they did, isn’t it nice to be that respected and in that position?

    These two aspects underwrote the article content. It does state that ‘whatever your politics.’ Nowhere did it glorify the PM as a leader, nor did it mention the General Election, or National Party.

    As such we wrote an interesting article. I stand by its journalistic credibility as one of a number of rugby themed stories that some people would identify with more than others.

    THE FRONT COVER:

    The front cover came about through a synergy of ideas. As the issue was about the Rugby Championships, it HAD to have the All Blacks on it. Another article (by Craig Dowd) highlighted the importance of the forwards in the Championship. Hence, the choice of all forwards in the cover picture. We also wanted the PM on the cover issue as having him in the magazine – regardless of his/you/our politics – was something of a coup.

    The poses struck were showing the players in a ‘V’ shape – this was to symbolise ‘Victory’. Having the PM at the front of the V (in his supporters jersey) was symbolising all NZ rugby fans – from the lowest/youngest right up to the PM – were right behind our All Blacks, as they went for a world record of wins and in to the (very hard) Rugby Championships.

    The title ‘Pack Leader’ was a play on words for the player i/c the forwards in a team and the ‘leaders’ being Richie McCaw (AB’s) and the PM.

    #1 All Blacks fan – I am sure people would look at that and think ‘He’s not the number one fan, I am!’ This aspect was about getting people’s attention.

    In truth what we set up to do was to produce what, on the face of it, appeared to be a typical, traditional Rugby News cover. What we were looking for is – as people walked through Whitcoull’s – they would walk past and glance, do a double-take, come back and then pick up the magazine to check it out and hopefully buy it. All magazine covers aim to try to draw people in and that is what we were trying to do here beyond our regular, staunch, rugby intelligent customers.

    THE TIMING

    This is the area where – in retrospect – I will concede some journalistic naeivity in this regard and also apologise to anyone who was offended. Certainly not what I wanted. I am passionate about rugby at all levels and only interested in the development of the game at all levels and the NZRU/All Blacks brand and value.

    We started work on the magazine some 6 weeks before it hits the shops at this time there was nothing/very little around the election. Our thoughts about the election only surfaced very close to the actual print date – when the NZRU (who were kept fully aware of the article and the cover. It was them who asked that we made it sure that there was a note saying “*Cover image Photo-shopped. Not an official All Blacks/NZRU endorsement.”

    I made the decision that we would go with the cover – for the reasons outlined above. I didn’t for a second imagine it would be swallowed up by the political propaganda machine and make the headlines it has. If I had suspected this, I would not have had the same cover and opted for a quieter life! I simply believed it’s maximum impact would be the Whitcoull’s ‘double-take’ moment. I was wrong and as said before, I apologise to those who feel it was wrong and ill-timed.

    I cannot change the decisions and issue now and hope that sincere apologies goes some way to expressing my concern at having upset some people.

    PERMISSION

    I chased the PM’s press secretary to do the story and take his photograph. The National Party/PM’s office did not offer nor give any financial incentive (or other kinds of incentive) and nor did they initiate the story/cover. The PM’s office was kept fully aware at all times.

    The NZRU was aware of the story and the cover at all times and allowed it to go to print – they asked that the disclaimer around being photo-shopped and not an NZRU endorsement was included. (We did that on the contents page and the article page.) The NZRU are fantastic supporters of Rugby News and outstanding guardians of the game. They are not in any way to blame or responsible for this article and cover.”

    • Ffloyd 36.1

      What a load of bollocks

    • Marksman33 36.2

      This guy is So full of shit,anyway I haven’t watched a game of Union in 25 years,it’s a boofhead game and if most NZers didn’t have a small penis complex the game wouldn’t command anywhere near the media time it gets.Don’t worry about the gangs in this country ,the NZRU are the real Mafia.

    • T Downey 36.3

      So if the NZRU are not “to blame” as you so rightly put it I guess that leaves “the blame” totally at your feet. You chased the PM’s press secretary for this story????? Man what kind of John Key toe sucker are you?
      Do you think this blatant suck up to the National Party is going to go away in a hurry?
      I hope your readers demonstrate their displeasure by ceasing to purchase your magasine

  37. Macro 37

    Right! lets see the next issue with John Minto on the cover.

    Headline

    “The man who really understands what it means to be a Representative!”

  38. TeWhareWhero 38

    “Some of my thoughts were: “Lucky bugger – how cool would that be having a beer with Richie and being in the changing room”. ”

    An unfortunate choice of words.

    “Nowhere did it glorify the PM as a leader, nor did it mention the General Election, or National Party.”

    The article didn’t need to – the image did that.

    “The poses struck were showing the players in a ‘V’ shape – this was to symbolise ‘Victory’. Having the PM at the front of the V (in his supporters jersey) was symbolising all NZ rugby fans – from the lowest/youngest right up to the PM – were right behind our All Blacks, as they went for a world record of wins and in to the (very hard) Rugby Championships.”

    So this was a specially posed photo, not a stock photo that the PM was PSed onto. The RNZFU certainly went to a lot of trouble to cooperate with the article.

    “The title ‘Pack Leader’ was a play on words for the player i/c the forwards in a team and the ‘leaders’ being Richie McCaw (AB’s) and the PM.”

    Yep we get the pun – but it doesn’t say ‘pack leaderS’ – it’s singular it’s clear that the phrase refers to the PM. As he’s obviously nothing to do with the ABs forward pack, the words take on a very specific and political meaning – IMHO.

    “All magazine covers aim to try to draw people in and that is what we were trying to do here beyond our regular, staunch, rugby intelligent customers.”

    What, you mean draw in people who are not staunch and intelligent?

    “The timing: This is the area where – in retrospect – I will concede some journalistic naeivity in this regard and also apologise to anyone who was offended. ”

    The word ‘naivety’ doesn’t do justice to this situation. The editor was clearly aware of the implications for the election of linking the immensely popular – and avowedly apolitical RFU with the PM at a critical point in the election campaign.The inclusion of a note inside the magazine that the image is ‘not an official AB/NZRFU endorsement’ does nothing to offset the impression, which the editor himself has noted, that will be made on the people who will not read the magazine but will see the cover – the ‘double takers’.

    I really want to let this go but it’s too much fun. Maybe the editor did not stop to consider the ramifications of this, but there’s no way that Key and his media team were unaware of the political advantages of linking Team Key to Team All Black.

    • john 38.1

      Do you not like living in a free country where people are free to be photographed with who they like?

      Or just annoyed David Cunliffe wasn’t asked?

      Or that Key promotes himself with the All Blacks while Cunliffe similarly tries to promote himself with a well know person, except they’ve just been convicted of being a sexual predator?

      • One Anonymous Bloke 38.1.1

        Or perhaps struck by the Prime Minister’s latest graceless display of narcissism and vainglorious posturing, and wondering whether it’s good for the jersey to be so closely associated with such a person as an ex National Party MP, for that matter.

      • fender 38.1.2

        “….photographed with who they like?”

        Wrong, John (Banks?), Key was photoshopped into the picture.

      • TeWhareWhero 38.1.3

        Don’t be trite john.

      • Hami Shearlie 38.1.4

        I know for certain that members of a different tint are much much closer to the “well-known person” of whom you speak!

  39. Tarkwin 39

    I think the real winner here is the Rugby News. I’d forgotten it even existed till this happened. Be interesting to see how many copies they sell. As they say, the only thing worse than being talked about is not being talked about. I can’t see why Cunliffe couldn’t pull a similar stunt – at least it gets the people talking.

    • john 39.1

      He did, but the well known person he chose to be seen with had just been convicted of a sex crime. Whoops!

      • One Anonymous Bloke 39.1.1

        The ex National Party MP.

        • john 39.1.1.1

          Yeah/Nah

          Yeah, Cunliffe wanted to be seen with him. Nah – didn’t really.

          Yeah. Three days skiing is a good idea. Nah – it’s not really.

          Yeah. I’m sorry for being a man. Nah, I’m not really.

          Yeah, I’ll debate Key (quote) “anytime, any place, anywhere, I’ll even do it on Mike Hosking’s show.” ……….. Nah – won’t do that now.

          • McFlock 39.1.1.1.1

            Are you saying the TVNZ election debate would be limited to housing affordability?

            Because that was the debate that Key ran away from, because the issue is so easy for the left to win on that they could “even” kick key’s arse on it if the mc was hosking.

            But not every issue is so clear cut, and it would be a shame if one side in the debate had to constantly argue against both their official opponent and the moderator.

  40. Mike the Lefty 40

    What would you expect from the Minister of Photoshops?

      • McFlock 40.1.1

        Actually, that twitter pic doesn’t seem to have been photoshopped.
        The lighting is washed out as much as possible and the make-up is professionally applied, but normal facial imperfections seem to be present.

        Unless you can point to some specific features that appear to have been smoothed or touched-up, I suspect you’re full of crap again.

        Unlike the outright fabrication under discussion. Are we to assume that each of the All Blacks pictured with dunnokeyo will vote national, I wonder?

        • john 40.1.1.1

          Having just spent over 40 hours on photoshop this week, I can clearly say you’ve got no idea of what you’re talking about. There’s a lot of work on on teeth, eyes, neck, heaps of wrinkle work, chin – pretty much everything. It also looks like face dimensions have been changed.

          Here’s a quite nice and reasonable flattering picture of Helen Clark – try comparing the two.
          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helen_Clark#mediaviewer/File:Helen_Clark_UNDP_2010.jpg

          Or just google photos of Helen Clark and you’ll see what looks like different people.

          • McFlock 40.1.1.1.1

            Maybe you should get out from behind the computer and see what can be done with a decent photographic studio, a hairstylist, and a make-up artist.

            But then the thing she isn’t doing is standing in front of four All Blacks as if they’re going to vote for her. For that dunnokeyo needed photoshop.

            edit: try googling some katy perry pics with and without makeup. Let alone lady gaga.

          • framu 40.1.1.1.2

            “Having just spent over 40 hours on photoshop this week,”

            wow an expert

            • felix 40.1.1.1.2.1

              lolz.

              Makes me wonder how he fit it in around his 80 hours commenting on political stories.

          • Puddleglum 40.1.1.1.3

            Very revealing john. And they accuse the left of focusing on trivia.

            Sigh! – moats and beams.

  41. blue leopard 41

    Our A.I.G style PM wearing an A.I.G jersey seems somewhat fitting.

    A.I.G are the ones that gave bonuses to those that brought their company to the brink of collapse Just the type of behaviour I percieve Mr Key would support.

  42. reason 42

    I thought key was trying to promote himself by refusing to apologize to a victim of a sexual predator ..

    Now lets play some thugby ………… He’s leader of the pack 😉

  43. reason 43

    my previous comment was for john boy …….

  44. blue leopard 44

    The Rugby Union should take more care who they choose to be associated with their sport.

    Mr Key has recently shown poor judgement in the stance he chose to take over diplomatic incompetence re the Malaysian diplomat accused of attempted rape and how he chose to relate toward the alleged victim.

    Rugby players also seem to often feature in the limelight for the wrong reasons – such as accusations of rape and poor judgement in their drinking habits. (If Aussie internet disclosures are anything to go by it would appear from recent topical news events that some of this bad behaviour gets suppressed by our ‘justice’ system too.)

    I perceive the above two issues compound one another and makes for very bad publicity – particularly for Rugby.

  45. johnb 45

    I see that the Greenies have high jacked a few photos for their billboards, totally out of context and showing what (little) is wrong with NZ, instead of celebrating what is good. Same PR team as Cunliffes Crew I expect.

    • karol 45.1

      It’s just providing a contrast to the images they usually use. Past ones have been nicely filtered aspirational ones. This year, the print message is providing a direction towards a better NZ – “Love NZ”, while the images highlight some of the things that need changing as soon as.

  46. infused 46

    The Title is Pack Leader.

    if you can’t work out where this is going, you’re retarded.

  47. Mike the Savage One 47

    Who would still be surprised, after the events over the last weeks and months, bias and favouritism all over the show, and no shame is noticeable in any of the participants, who openly promote the PM and this government, led by his party.

    Yesterday I listened to Radio Live (“Dead”) for a while, and got sick of Sean Plunket promoting himself as the best alternative to moderate the leaders’ debate, claiming he was “independent”. That after months of rubbishing Labour and Cunliffe at almost every opportunity in his 9 to Noon talkback slot.

    The incredible audacity, or is it stupidity, of TVNZ suggesting Mike Hosking as their best man for this, is mindboggling.

    Those who still doubt this country is NO LONGER run in any democratic way, better wake up, as you will have to be well informed while ignoring the mainstream media, to be able to get what is happening, and to base your vote on independent information.

    But as still over 2 thirds or even 3 quarters of the population rely on the mainstream media like main TV stations, their news and current affairs programs, on the two large print corporates and the almost exclusively commercially run radio stations, it is no surprise we get the polls we have been getting. With the way the media operate, and this is one prime example, they are clearly in bed with the business and right leaning politcal forces, that control New Zealand Inc..

    To change this, a real revolution is necessary, but in New Zealand, I am afraid, such things just do not happen, do they?

    And when Labour and their leader raise their concerns and issues, they even get criticised for being “wingey” whimps.

    “Hail the Leader” the school kids will soon shout before the start of school every morning, and they may bow together in front of pictures like the one above, I fear. That is if the Nats get a third term.

  48. Wearing that shirt probably is a nice indicator of who he really works for AIG or another nice big banking financial institution such as the BOA where he has most of his money anyway. Sure isn’t for NZ even though that seems to be their slogan this year!

  49. Penny Bright 49

    Meanwhile – out in the wilds of Helensville yesterday – it was interesting to see that John Key’s electorate hoardings were just calling for the National PARTY vote!

    That’s the one.

    Why would the good folk living in the Helensville electorate waste their ELECTORATE vote on John Key when he’ll be Number One on National’s Party list and get in anyway?

    Seems that John Key can’t be too interested in the Helensville ELECTORATE seat when he’s just focused on the PARTY vote?

    I am.

    REALLY looking forward to debating the issues with the ‘Poodle of Wall Street’ ……

    Cheers!

    Penny Bright 🙂

    • DS 49.1

      That Key would win Helensville is a given. Presumably the party vote campaign is to minimise vote splitting, because the Tories know they need all the party votes they can get.

      As for the Rugby thing, the objection is simply that it’s the unwarranted and unnecessary politicisation of a national (small “n”) symbol. Something like the All Blacks are above political parties.

    • jpwood 49.2

      God you are an idiot Penny – do the left a favour and shut up.

  50. Penny Bright 50

    Really? So – you were one of the tiny minority who correctly predicted that John Banks would be found guilty of electoral fraud and would have to resign from Parliament? Talking to members of the Helensville voting public – seems lots of them are rather keen to have a proven Public Watchdog to vote for – rather than a proven Wall St poodle (who is STILL a shareholder in the Bank of America) ….. follow the dollar …… Kind regards – Penny Bright

  51. RedBaronCV 51

    So why isn’t the NZRFU hard at it protecting it’s intellectual property from photos like this.

    Imagine the uproar they would be creating if John Minto was in a jersey promoting something or other (hat tip above) or if the Woman’s Refuge ran a poster of a battered woman in a AB jersey with a caption like “lets hope they win tonight so I don’t get beaten up” (DV increases when the AB’s lose).

    Nah they would rather support JKey who doesn’t want to apologise to the attempted rape victim or Graham Henry who makes statements about Tony Veitch -convicted of domestic assault -like this:

    “Tony has many supporters in the community and they all hope that he gets an opportunity as soon as possible to be able to get on with his life”.

    On their own heads, mothers have a lot of influence on the sports their sons play.

    • Colonial Viper 51.1

      So why isn’t the NZRFU hard at it protecting it’s intellectual property from photos like this.

      Like espionage laws, the corporate powers that be have wide latitude in when to enforce infringements and when to ignore them.

  52. Sookie 52

    The All Blacks are a bunch of smug, overrated, inarticulate bores so having that wanker ‘shopped into the their team to win more votes from munters is rather fitting. A country gets the government it deserves, someone wise said once.

    • Anne 52.1

      Well said Sookie.

      You only have to look at the bimbos they marry to get a pretty good idea there’s not a lot of substance up top. Of course that includes the chief wanker himself.

  53. Repateet 53

    The sight of the imposter in the jersey had me thinking that rucking, stomping, eye-gouging and ear biting should be welcomed back into the game.

    Then it struck me how in political and security terms Key himself has already introduced those and other unsavoury tactics into our game of life as New Zealanders.

  54. Kat 54

    “Looking for answers? Political scientist, golfer, Booker Prize winner and All Black captain John Key has got them.”

    Good send up by Toby Manhire over at the secret Herald portal: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=11298638

    • karol 54.1

      Excellent! Many great lines.. and this on the Conservative Party:

      His bottom line – bottom! – is that referendums returning more than two-thirds support for something or other shall be binding. Polls show more than 98 per cent of people do not particularly want the Conservative Party in Parliament.

      “Let me get back to you on that one,” said All Black captain John Key.

  55. Jenny 56

    The hypocrisy is just mind blowing.

    Wasn’t it the Rugby Union that refused demands by protesters to stop playing against racially selected teams from South Africa by repeating. “Keep Politics Out Of Sport”.

    What they meant is keep your politics our to sport.

  56. TheContrarian 57

    Totally fucking weirded out by this seemingly obvious puff/propaganda piece (the magazine, not the blog post).

    However this is stupid and Redfed should feel stupid:

    “Then I thought about the hysteria whipped up by the right about Helen Clark’s signing of a painting. Clearly she had not painted it but the scandal went on for months and months. Even now it is used to denigrate her. Pretending to be an All Black should be just as bad as pretending to be the painter of a picture.”

    • felix 57.1

      Why? I think it’s an astute observation.

      • TheContrarian 57.1.1

        You should feel stupid too then.

        • felix 57.1.1.1

          Are you going to say why? I’ve got to go out soon so I’d appreciate it if you would make your point.

          • TheContrarian 57.1.1.1.1

            Drive safely.

          • TheContrarian 57.1.1.1.2

            “Then I thought about the hysteria whipped up by the right about Helen Clark’s signing of a painting. Clearly she had not painted it but the scandal went on for months and months. Even now it is used to denigrate her. Pretending to be an All Black should be just as bad as pretending to be the painter of a picture.”

            http://www.kiwipolitico.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/06/clark-wiki-2.png

            • Te Reo Putake 57.1.1.1.2.1

              I’m with felix. What’s your point?

              ps the link goes to a photo of a female league fan celebrating with a Warriors player. Not sure what you think the connection is.

            • Te Reo Putake 57.1.1.1.3.1

              And your point is …?

              Ps nice photo of league fan Helen Clark with the Warriors. Isn’t it great that it’s not photoshopped, she’s not referred to as the leader of the pack and is 100% genuine?

              • TheContrarian

                Helen Clark dressed in Warriors gear, with the Warriors, after a match a few weeks before the general election in a major NZ newspaper – TRP can’t see the connection between that and John Key in All Blacks colours, profiled in a rugby magazine.

                But the connection between Clark signing a piece of art work and passing it off as her own is totally the same as John Key trying fool everyone into thinking he is an All Black.

                The gymnastics of this are….conservapedia worthy.

                Ahhhh fuck it. I’m too tired and cynical for this shit now

                • Te Reo Putake

                  I think what’s tiring you is the mental gymnastics of trying to find a connection where none really exists. One is of a fan in a news photo a couple of months before the election, the other is a front page splash, photoshopped and prominent, with accompanying article describing Dunnokeyo as an All Black leader. One is news, the other is an election advertisement.

                • Tiger Mountain

                  I don’t think new All Black captain Key would agree with you Contrarian bar the tired and cynical bit.

                • felix

                  “But the connection between Clark signing a piece of art work and passing it off as her own is totally the same as John Key trying fool everyone into thinking he is an All Black.”

                  Yes Contrarian, they are similar in that neither of those things is true. Helen didn’t actually try to pass a painting as her own, and Key isn’t actually expecting people to think he’s the captain of the all blacks.

                  That is kinda the point. A lot of people who comment here thought it was valid to criticise the former, but refuse to accept that the latter is open to the same.

                  I still don’t see why you think it’s stupid to point this out.

  57. T Downey 58

    Here is a copy of my leter to NZ Rugby

    Dear Sirs

    I am writing to let you know in no uncertain terms how appalled and disgusted I am that you have authorised the Rugby News front cover feature of John Key posing with four of our All Blacks.
    Surely NZ Rugby should be impartial and apolitical and should not be seduced into grubby political PR stunts such as psychologically linking Team Key up to Team All Blacks????
    Is this the beginning of a very slippery slope?
    Who will feature next month with the All Blacks?
    The Conservative Party?
    Surely you are aware of just how influential the All Blacks are in this country? That is why corporations such as Coca Cola pay you millions of dollars to have their products linked to the All Blacks.
    I think the Executive of NZ Rugby owe all NZers a public apology for overtly inferring a bias to any one political party. Such action is totally inappropriate if NZ is to remain a truly democratic country.
    Please note that I will also be posting a copy of this letter to social media.

    T J Downey

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