- Date published:
10:01 pm, September 24th, 2014 - 88 comments
Categories: thinktank - Tags:
We have a situation where 4 or 5 blokes with longstanding one-day-i’ll-be-the-prime-minister fantasies all pathetically fight each other for a go as captain of the titanic.
I suggest we lock them up in a room with a keg of Emersons so they can get drunk, beat the shit out of each other, cry, have a group hug and come out singing kumbaya.
270 000 in child poverty.
And the Labour caucus has more important things to discuss.
Yep the Caucus has more important things to discuss. Like who will be the next leader. And who will be the next under cutters and media leakers. Important jobs all.
Fuck the lot of them. They lost my vote and on the way they are acting they won’t get it back anytime soon!
National about to gut the RMA.
And the Labour caucus has more important things to discuss…..
National about to undermine labour laws.
And the Labour caucus has more important things to discuss…..
National about to sign the TPPA.
And the Labour caucus has more important things to discuss…..
National on track for four terms
And the Labour caucus has more important things to discuss…..
[lprent: and you are astroturfing. I’m tired of it. 4 weeks ban. ]
Can I ask what “astroturfing” is?
rather not real, false, insincere commentary and/or concern trolling
“And the Labour caucus has more important things to discuss…..”
Personally, I suggest they all follow David Parker’s lead and go on holiday for a week. They’ve earned it. They need it to clear their heads.
Politics is a brutal business. I am glad someone else is willing to do it. One way evil triumphs is when people of integrity decide the political struggle is not worth the personal price.
Stop beating them up or we’ll really have a parliament of incompetents.
In essense repeating the same message over and over again almost regardless of what they are responding to. It is a way of meme building. I will tolerate quite a lot of it iff it is done imaginatively and woven into the debate.
However if I suspect it (ie I look at comments and start thinking repitition), look at the persons comments in isolation and see it, and I think that the sentiments aren’t genuine, then I find that an effective counter is a long ban. This seems to stimulate the imagination about presentation when they return. If not then they get a lot more cautious.
The name comes from the repetive way of rolling out artifical grass to create fake scenery.
The Urban Dictionary hasn’t decimated the original meaning yet.
Thanks for moderating.
Great comments Paul, and how bloody true.
Can we put Mark Hunt in the room to do the beating?
Yes. Yes fucking yes.
In the movie, they also chuck a blade into the room with the kids before locking the door shut.
Currently drinking the porter.
Have they done another whiskey porter? I’m coming down to Dunedin in November – ahhh Emersons on tap.
@ Paul (1) (2) (3) (4)
In case you missed the election results, National won an absolute majority of the seats. If the Labour caucus put aside all the more important things to discuss, you imply you are concerned about, it will not make a difference to the actions of National.
Yes, Labour do have some very important stuff to sort out. I look forward to Kumbaya at the end of that process.
And panic? Election results are not finalised for a couple of weeks. I’ve got faith that the caucus can adequately handle their opposition duties when that is required, along with the important stuff they are sorting out now.
I would not describe Jacinda Ardern as a “bloke” ~smile~
(I actually like your series of posts)
“If the Labour caucus put aside all the more important things to discuss, you imply you are concerned about, it will not make a difference to the actions of National.”
Well that’s not true. National are signalling they’re going to do something about child poverty (probably not enough, but at least something), which is a direct result of Labour and probably more likely the Greens campaigning on the issue.
Similarly, National are passing extended paid parental leave and free doctors visits for children under 13, both of which were Labour policies first.
Considering that “Kumbaya, my Lord” means “Come by here, my Lord”, wouldn’t it be good if the good Lord came down and taught them a thing or two about what muscular Christianity is about, as He did in the Temple with the money changers.
For applied Christianity was what Michael Joseph Savage called his form of left wing thinking. Doing unto others as you’d have them do to you does imply doing something about it, something that’s acceptable, something that works, something that everyone shares.
Even outside of Christian thinking, the Golden Rule is still good. There was also something about “Blessed are they that mourn for they shall be comforted.” And there’s a bit of that mourning happening within and without Caucus.
Expect the denial, the anger, the bargaining, the blame within them and ourselves.
I think I am beginning to understand why the statement attributed to Michael Cullen so angered those losing an election in his time not so long ago- “We won; you lost; eat that.”
Yes all those things are true.
But these are grown men who have pretensions of either being PM or senior Ministers. When faced with total defeat you keep a straight face, breath through your nose and do your grieving in private.
Anything else merely compounds the loss.
Nah mate, when you come off total defeat, you blame the captain and the coach, the ref, the linesman, the weather, the hotel cook.
These guys are poor losers. This is a team game, being played as if it’s tennis.
The labour caucus are fighting over who gets to sit at the back of the bus, who will play the guitar, what song?
In modern parlance The Golden Rule is: He with the gold, rules. National apply it ruthlessly.
Look, I’ll even buy the fucking keg of Emersons, if it will help.
Emersons? Hipster socialism. Why not Waikato draught or Tui?
Maybe because they want them to get drunk, not fart and piss a lot.
I like the sailors solution.
Or it was in the days we had time to drink.
Get drunk. Meet on the wharf for a punchup. Get drunk some more. Hug each other and swear undying friendship.
Until next time.
Me too. As many as are needed …
You’re on to it Geoff. Most practical suggestion I’ve heard in days.
This is NOT the end of the Labour Party. Key had us borrow $60 billion dollars so we would feel happy and secure about our economy and re-elect the incumbents. He bought the election with OUR money.
You can really feel happy (and vote for the incumbent) when every NZ working person gets $20,000 of borrowed money?
When people discover it has to be repaid, National will be on 24%. Our time is coming. Patience, my friends.
P.S. By my count it is NOT the worst Labour result in 92 years. Labour/Greens are Siamese twins. Labour 24% + Greens 10% = 34%
Hmmmm good thinking, although I suspect there were plenty of other left wing parties on the scene in 1922 as well.
Yes, National kept money flowing into the economy via debt debt and more debt. But that is the only acceptable (to the financial fraternity) way of money supply these days.
1922 was a three party system:
– Reform (Government): rural Tories.
– Liberal (Opposition): the old progressive party on the decline.
– Labour (Third Party): the new progressive party on the rise.
“P.S. By my count it is NOT the worst Labour result in 92 years. Labour/Greens are Siamese twins. Labour 24% + Greens 10% = 34%”
There is always an optimist who can give you a laugh to lift the start of the day.
LOL still way better than English 2002.
Which was said (at the time) to be the worst vote for an Opposition since 1902.
National got 48.1% of 69.7% (approx) of eligible voters.
That’s 33.something of eligible voters, the same percentage that was their core vote in the days when there were only Nat and Labour.
Don’t believe the landslide bullshit.
But that misses a very big and nasty elephant in the room. Those that did not vote. The days when you can sit there and blame apathy or personal responsibility are over. This great majority of people who did not vote are an angry mass. A disempowered, frustrated, angry mass – why do you think Key and co have been playing it calm and cringing at the media’s cowing over the victory? Actually it’s the one time I’ll give a modicum of respect to Key.
How do you think it looks to the non-voters – labour talking about walking away from them even more. Because quite frankly that what this bullshit of moving to the centre really means and guess what, working people aren’t that stupid.
“..How do you think it looks to the non-voters – labour talking about walking away from them even more..”
I know someone’ll jump and scream but I’m thinking [email protected]$K the non voters………… it would serve their self interested arses right if National ramped up screwing the bejesus out of them and the country, and the decimated carcasses of the only political parties that even tried to help them couldn’t get off the ground because people they were trying to help couldn’t tell shit from clay.
Which is why I am disappointed Hone, John Minto and Annette Sykes did not get in.
We can have them in Parliament, or we can have them with pitchforks outside.
Even Craig has his constituency. And the left wing ideas of the first $20 000 income tax free, and citizens democracy.
This is the insane thing about too many in the 1% (and the 0.001%). They can protect their privilege by ensuring that relatively small concessions to the bottom 50% are made.
But of course, the very wealthy and powerful only know the definition of “more” and don’t know the definition of “enough.”
Yes Geoff, labours worst enemy is themselves, as usual to much thinking not enough doing.
If we gave them all guns and locked them in a room, all that would happen is 4 people would accidentally shoot themselves whilst trying to shoot at each other. Like bumbling idiots. If we threw in a keg of Emersons they would shoot holes in it first , all the beer would go to waste then they would shoot themselves.
The best answer for the press would have been to say nothing do nothing about the result apart from say, well the media lost us the election, again, we thank the MSM for it’s continued support of National and look forward to being ridiculed next election as usual, good bye.
I hope that this is NOT what goes on:
This is what would happen.
And another thing, if Shearer thinks he’s the answer after giving up 15 months ago, he’s dreaming.
If Robertson thinks he’s the answer to bring back the 50% of men that walked away after the stupid “gender-mandering” of the list then he’s dreaming.
If Nash thinks he’s the answer after only winning ( and even being there ) because he needed Garth Mcfucking Vicar then he’s completely deluded.
If Ahern thinks she’s the answer after not being able to beat useless Nicky Kaye 3 times she’s dreaming too.
Nash and Ahern may well be the future, but that’s not yet.
Get over yourselves you deluded wannabes and develop a bit of self awareness.
The problem as the voting public has been telling you is that constant change at the top is electoral suicide.
Yep. All seriously deluded.
Which only leaves David Parker?
And now for one of those ‘good grief’ stories…
Lefty wife had a ladies night dinner last night and the consensus was Labour needs a ‘good looking’ leader – i.e. physically attractive. The ladies are apparently much more likely to vote for a handsome or attractive leader or at least a witty humorous one. That’s why some of them like John Key (apparently they find him handsome) and they also like Jacinda.
Millenia of genetic conditioning. We are subject to forces beyond our ken.
So my tongue in cheek question to the ladies of thestandard is, how do you rate David Parker on looks? (Just doing my bit to lift the quality of the debate).
Well given that most women are at least potentially bi-sexual (subject to forces beyond their ken and all) – that makes Jacinda my pick of the bunch.
Or maybe it was a mistake to give the vote to women after all. 🙂
Note how the position of some very vocal left leaning feminist activists doesn’t even reflect the attitudes of significant ‘average Kiwi’ segments of their own gender. Key chooses a caucus with the fewest women in it…and he gets the thumbs up from lots of Kiwi women based on his easy going but still distinguished good looks and success with money.
Giving the vote to non property owning men of colour who don’t go to church was also fucked.
Just over 1 in 8 pakeha men voted Labour this time around is my rough estimate btw.
And look at Tony Abbott’s Cabinet and you can see exactly which church they have to belong to.
Yep. Still gets in.
The other thing which is interesting is this: if Labour ever had a result where just over 1 in 8 women voted for it, the feminists would be up in arms. Major emergency, need urgent overhaul of things etc.
But because it’s pakeha men, all I read from the feminist activists is…patriarchal men who don’t like it can just fuck off to the Trotter party / 3 old white cis men in a row losers at leading Labour / Labour dudebros complain a lot about Labour but they can’t campaign worth shit etc.
The funniest thing is that this is coming from a group of lefties who are oh so into Labour as a ‘broad church’ in society.
Lots of facts in this post.
“Lots of facts in this post”
CV clearly states 1 in 8 is an unexplained personal guess.
It will fall somewhere between 1 in 7 and 1 in 8 pakeha men (including unenrolled voters I should add).
Using the inverse framing, almost 7 out of 8 pakeha men went with an option other than NZ Labour.
..in arderns’ defence..
..as elsewhere..the greens and labour unable to work out how to work together to ensure victory..(!)..(the major-problem for progressives to my mind..i’d throw them in a tent with a keg of booze..to finally work it out..)
..anyway..that split the vote..
..and kaye walked thru the middle..
..and until labour and the greens get that sorted out..
..up and down the country..
..and doomed to successive rightwing govts..
And if Cunliffe thinks he’s the answer after getting less than 25% …
Which isn’t to have a pop at Cunliffe. But you seemed to have missed him off the list.
The point is that the leader is not the answer.
That is my fundamental issue as well. The biggest single problem that the NZLP has is that they can’t settle on a consistent direction to fix their systems and communications because the caucus keep playing stupid dominance games.
By the look of this “review” and the many other failed ones before it, it still isn’t this time either. There won’t be any mention of the silo campaigns in electorates by many MPs or the shameful neglect of critical systems like eTrac over the first two years of the last term.
What will happen instead is that this will be used as an opportunity to change dominance in caucus and a chance to turn over staffer positions to personal favourites. I can see the rather useless Patrick Leyland practically gloating in the side bar
Nett effect – another election lost in 2017
Do you see a party split, if Cunliffe goes or just a mass exodus of members.?
Or do you think it will descend into a fight to the death, cage match type scenario.
+! Two directions- the solution is 2 parties or more of the same.
I agree, I don’t think common ground will ever be reached, too much animosity.
It’s going to be one or the other.
Ardern In a short dress see through top and a bridle, she’d get my vote..:) forever.
In fact you stumbled on the answer to beat the ladies favourite man key, we need a man magnet, and they come In the form of sexy ladies, Just please don’t put King up :/
When my kids were fighting toddlers I did on occasion put them together in the smallest room in the house. (toilet). When at close quarters they just ended up laughing.
Thanks. That’s the most useful information I’ve read here since the election. I’ll try it next time they act up.
Cunliffe has to stay as Leader.
There is no-one else who can lead us to a platform for victory in 2014.
Shearer had his chance until Maryanne Street led the pusch to dump him.
Robertson, who manipulated and humiliated Shearer, is not fit to be a leader.
Ardern never won a seat.
Nash? Whatever the question he is not the answer.
Cunliffe has what it takes. The membership has what it takes.
Cunliffe needs to build the party machine necessary to win an election based on Labour values.
Like British generals, you’re re-fighting the last war …
Someone else who ‘gets it’.
(no sarcasm alert required.)
Wow, you guys deliver comedy gold sometimes. Labour just got the worst spanking in decades from the electorate, but you still think the lurch to the left was a good idea and you still think all the non-voters would surely vote left, if only you went far enough left to reach them.
Meanwhile, Lprent bans whatever he doesn’t want to hear.
Labour – Nine years in opposition at least. Long may this delusional state of denial continue, it’s good for New Zealand. 🙂
Why should Labour take any notice of advice from the National party cheer squad.
Haven’t you already done enough damage to the country by talking up National into absolute power?
Labour would be well advised to ignore “helpful” advice from the right wing.
The constant attacks on David Cunliffe are because he has shown he can take the fight to Key, and he has some concern for New Zealanders.
Of course it suits some to keep Labour as National(tm) light, so their gravy train of shareholdings in ex State assets, immigration designed to keep property speculators, and financiers, profits high and wages low, and their lucrative cosy deals with dodgy foreign companies continues, when everyone is sick of National.
‘I suggest we lock them up in a room with a keg of Emersons so they can get drunk, beat the shit out of each other, cry, have a group hug and come out singing kumbaya’
That is a slur against a great beer, A bottle of ‘aged Claytons’ would be more appropriate.
CV, you’re right, too early in the morning, apologies to Jacinta ARDERN. ( I’ve got a note to ring a bloke called Ahern today.
Lurgee, I hadn’t left David C out, I was making the point that only about a year ago, all the people who do all the leg work, money raising and heavy lifting for Labour at election time choose him overwhelmingly.
Phillip, I think looking at the numbers as many Greens as could be expected voted for Jacinta, and Helen Clark was vehemently opposed to MMP because she said that it eventually leads to centre governments, making them unwinnable from a firm left wing stance.
“..Helen Clark was vehemently opposed to MMP because she said that it eventually leads to centre governments, making them unwinnable from a firm left wing stance..”
..shame she was so ‘right’..eh..?
Helen is a god! A freaking god. Oh god come back, please, come back, all was good with you and Cullen.
People at work call her a dyke, say Denis was a poof, but loved her.
Keys the same. Shit will have to get pretty bad for him, before we(the public) take it in. Helens worst moment was speeding to the ruggers keys had so much more and still came out smelling of roses.
Face it folks if your not a Nat supporter prepare to lose for awhile. Pray for a bigger GFC but no doubt English will fall on his sword to protect Dear leader.
Welcome to the Keyopoly.
“..all was good with you and Cullen..”
..no it wasn’t..
..as just a few examples contradicting that claim..
..the country got more polluted..
..the rivers got dirtier..
..the poor were just left to rot..
..for nine long years..
..(would you like me to polish yr rose-coloured lenses..?..there..?..for you…)
please don’t spoil my adoration of the god that is Helen Clark.
Even though through that labour term hep C was off the treatment funding list and I was just left infected for ten years until about the time National got in.
I was not peeved with national for curing me, it was the fact Bennet took me for a lingerer and Winz forced me back into full time work after chemo and ten years sick without even giving me time to recuperate and get my muscles back or ride out the effects of interferon and get my mind back to normal.
They thought just because I had Hep C it was no reason to be on a benefit and the possibility of me infecting others outweighed my tax burden.
They are uncaring female genatalia and need a good cattle prod up the rectal cavity. The nasty bastards.
and example of their female genalatiaship credentials lies in their hiding and supporting business saving money by not retrieving the Pike river miners. That’s a freaking viginourmous genataliaship.
Emersons should not be the beer of choice for a prospective Labour leader – it reeks of middle class snobbery…. so in this case it really is quite apt
One theory circulating suggests that Robertson would the best choice at this stage to move beyond the identity and gender politics mire they are stuck in, simply because he is who he is. Might be too subtle for the electorate, but on the other hand, maybe not? Who knows?
I think the Nats will use his career history for a very effective “out of touch” meme, it will be an easy outlet for all Grant’s “otherness” — gay, no kids etc without people having to confront their bigotry.
That said, if he can get the democratic backing of the party he has a mandate to try.
Those more obnoxious avenues of attack will be peddled out by the rest of the National smear machine.
Arse, Grant Robertson IS identity and gender politics personified.
You’re not looking at this from the perspective of the very people that Labour has always relied on for its mandate.
They not rednecks or any other diminutive you want to stick on them, they’re probably quite happy to have a beer and a yarn with a gay bloke and almost certainly support him getting a fair go but don’t nesseccarly want themselves to be represented by a gay as PM. That may well change but not just yet.
Is Robertson the gay one? Cripes one of them fooled me, wouldn’t have known if he hadn’t been so upfront about it. Then again I care so much about sexual preferences I cannot remember who it was.
What is it with them, that they feel some need to announce their sexual preferences as if they dare the world to say something about it. Cripes get over it, I couldn’t give a hoot. Next time I’m at the office talking to the receptionist I must remind myself to tell her I’m heterosexual and proud of it. Wouldn’t want her to not know who I like to bed.
Labour need to tone down that. the only people who care , don’t like homosexual men.
I agree axactly with Adrian. I couldn’t give a hoot about them. As long as they do the job they are elected for. However the PM job has a bigger role, international etc. Last thing I need is a camp PM. Probably the very reason I don’t think Keys Fit for the Job, to camp, to clowny, to jokey , he a statesman and PM, freaking act like one.
If key acted like Cunliffe, I’d probably like the dick. But I get three more fkn years of ackshully, gutsy feely, laugh it off, can’t remember camp shyte.
as i write this
I am obviously one of the few who like Cunliffe as on TV now many voted electorate labour but national party vote due to the left to individual and some said Cunliffe as leader, sadly maybe i’ll have to concede for the left to win cunliffe must go. But i see no one but Annett king as replacement sadly.
Fuck it, i was away in the late 80’s and all 90’s, i am definitely missing some political history, how is Culiffe so hated? what has he done in the past?
Ok, I hear on RNZ this arvo the caucus want Robertson and Ardern, so let the wagers begin. How many weeks out from 2017 election will Robertson be seen leaving a male bathhouse ? ( doesn’t have to be true ) .
Nothing will be said for 2 years, 11 months Marksman33, then the Heralds, John Armstrong, will announce their is an eleven year old photo of Robertson writing a letter of subscription to a gay magazine, called leather spankers, for and on behalf of Simon Bridges and he must therefore resign 🙂
Then Armstrong will come out saying how National and Simon Bridges supports gay men as he did not cancel the subscription. They will then return with a majority Gay vote. key and bridges will be seen at the big Gay out skipping up the road holding hands.
after what I’ve seen this election in way of surprises anything is possible.