Labour’s conference

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1. The Real Matthew 1

   6 November 2015 at 1:47 pm

   Any word on how many people are attending?

   A different blog site is suggesting attendance is likely to be down this year.
   • r0b 1.1

     6 November 2015 at 1:51 pm

     I have no idea, but I would expect it to be down on the last conference (an election year congress).
2. Colonial Viper 2

   6 November 2015 at 2:21 pm

   I understand turnout this year is dismal. Less than half last years. Palmerston Nth also an inconvenient expensive venue to hold Conference at.
   • Lanthanide 2.1

     6 November 2015 at 3:33 pm

     “I understand turnout this year is dismal. Less than half last years.”

     Not surprising, since it’s not election year and obviously there’s a re-adjustment period under LIttle after Cunliffe came out guns-firing with a leftward bent (before the media dogpiled him).
     • Chris 2.1.1

       7 November 2015 at 12:24 am

       “Very few parties made major policy announcements a year after an election, she said.”

       It’s in fact the right time now to start making a mark and sticking to it. Trouble is that our current Labour party doesn’t know how to do either. Heck, Labour can’t even take a position on the TPPA. It’s sickening to see. That’s why Labour at the moment is irrelevant. And that, in the our present political environment, including how the poorest of our poor are now voting for Key, is how Labour is selling out not only the poor but an ever-increasing number of NZers. Labour deserve nothing but disdain. Whenever I see that red Labour logo I get very close to being physically sick.
       • Raf 2.1.1.1

         7 November 2015 at 1:04 am

         Shouldn’t they be allowed enough time to read the actual document before “taking a position” on the TPPA?
         • Chris 2.1.1.1.1

           7 November 2015 at 1:12 am

           Yes, probably. I’m going on Little’s flimsy non-committal remarks made today. They must’ve read some of it. But I’d bet my house that after reading all of it Labour still won’t oppose it. Their track record is strong. Labour tries to compete with Key because they do not know how to oppose him.
3. mickysavage 3

   6 November 2015 at 2:22 pm

   Stephanie Rodgers and I will both be there and will no doubt report on things that we can.

   I also expect numbers to be down. I know quite a few people who will not be there for various reasons. Palmerston North is more out of the way and after last year there is still a bit of fatigue.

   Some of Ad’s recent posts indicate the importance of making sure that things ramp up next year and I think the Party needs to think about doing things for activists to increase enthusiasm.
   • sabine 3.1

     6 November 2015 at 2:27 pm

     yes work is interfering.
     Personally I think it’s actually not bad holding the conference in other places than just Auckland, we do seem to talk a lot about the regions, so it seems fair to hold conferences there as well.
     But I think the time might not be the best, so short before the big spending madness of christmas.

     Looking forward to the updates.
     • Colonial Viper 3.1.1

       6 November 2015 at 2:29 pm

       Holding the Conference is Palmerston North doubles or triples the cost of attending from regional areas of NZ like Otago, as compared to holding it in Auckland. Which means that ordinary people can’t get there. The Labour Party of the 10%.
       • sabine 3.1.1.1

         6 November 2015 at 2:52 pm

         yes dear.
         • greywarshark 3.1.1.1.1

           6 November 2015 at 4:11 pm

           That’s a bit smarty farty sabine. It’s a good practical point about the cost of attending the conference, rather than a feel-good idealistic one about loving a region.
           Everyone who knows about the cost of getting around NZ knows that the cheap fares are between the main centres. Often to get from one region to another will involve travelling to a city hub, and then on to the destination region.
           That can cost in multiple hundreds, while a cheap return fare between the big cities may be under $100.
           • sabine 3.1.1.1.1.1

             6 November 2015 at 4:33 pm

             its, but it has come to the point with certain posters that no matter what labour does its wrong.

             have a conference in akl, and its only for the jaffas
             have a conference somewhere else and its to hard for others to attend
             have a conference in general whohohoho no one attends.

             conferences need to be held all over the country in my humble opinion. and yes, not always is it convenient for some in fact most of the time it is not. I would like to attend, but can’t because of work. I am however not accusing the others attending of being lazy arses.

             I think it is good that the conference is held were it is, simply because some that might never make it to akl or wlgtn or chch find it easier to travel there….others might find it harder. equally I would like for Labour to have a conference in Dunedin or Invercargill and Gisborne, as it is an excellent opportunity to meet n greet. But one can not please all.

             however with dear CV it is clearly that nothing Labour does or will do or not do or what ever will ever please him. So yes, Yes dear it is.
             • Colonial Viper …

               6 November 2015 at 4:40 pm

               Labour is the party of the ruling class and the establishment.

               Labour is for continuation of the paradigm of economic growth, digging up more fossil fuels and sourcing money from debt.

               Vote for pro-spying legislation.
               Can’t oppose the TPPA.
               Chinese sirnames are stopping Kiwis buying $750K Auckland houses.
               Not repealing 90 day right to fire – just making it fairer.
               • sabine …

                 6 November 2015 at 4:47 pm

                 you know what, they are all the ‘ruling class’ and unless we go for full fledged anarchy we will always have a ruling class.
                 we can however opt for one that has semi decent people with semi decent policies and may be capable of working with other parties to achieve a little bit of good before this planets implodes.

                 so i really don’t care.

                 I grew up with 90 day trial in germany, its not the end of the world.
                 i grew up in appartments with cellars and attics for storage, its not the end of the world
                 i grew up using trams, busses and trains, and only got a car for a year before going back to using trams busses and trains, and I am still alive.

                 but what is killing this country is a government that does not invest in its current generation working – training budgets / winz/ etc cut, gutted and on the way out.
                 what is killing this country is that people can’t find a fucking house to live in and still have a meal for dinner
                 what is killing this country that people loose their friggin teeth because they can’t afford a friggin doctor

                 and no National is not gonna fix it, maybe the Labour Party, the Green Party and if on the way back the Mana Party can fix it. But this defeatist attitude of Labour is fucked and all theothers are the ruling class is not gonn do anything.
                 • Colonial Viper …

                   6 November 2015 at 4:58 pm

                   Wake up Sabine.

                   The Labour Party was, and is, instrumental to the creation and sustenance of neoliberal pro-corporate record banking profits New Zealand.
                   • Leftie …

                     7 November 2015 at 3:02 am

                     Serious question CV, why are you a member of the Labour party that you clearly hate so much?
                 • the pigman …

                   7 November 2015 at 1:36 am

                   +100 sabine

                   And your observations about the attitude taken by certain disaffected posters/activists is certainly well-heard.
                   • Chris …

                     7 November 2015 at 1:57 am

                     sabine talks about the “killing” of New Zealand including through the gutting of social services such as social welfare benefits, yet Labour last year supported the government on the passing of a nasty anti-poor, anti-beneficiary piece of legislation. This was gobsmacking. You can’t put criticism of something like that down to so-called disaffected activists. Hone Harawira and the Mana Party were written-off as far left lunatics when a close examination of Mana’s policies show they’re not too far off what we now might call “traditional Labour”. That’s how far Labour has moved to the right. To keep supporting Labour is to abandon everything you may have thought Labour stood for. It’s attitudes from within Labour like yours that play a big part in making sure Key and his mates remain in government.
                   • Colonial Viper …

                     7 November 2015 at 2:14 am

                     yep, blind support for a Labour Party so scared of being labelled soft on benes that it votes for National’s shite social welfare legislation.
                 • Chris …

                   7 November 2015 at 1:41 am

                   “we can however opt for one that has semi decent people with semi decent policies and may be capable of working with other parties to achieve a little bit of good before this planets implodes.”

                   Surely “a little bit of good” achieved by “semi decent people with semi decent policies” is kind of setting our sights a tad low? If that’s what Labour’s become then I don’t want one little bit of it.
                 • greywarshark …

                   7 November 2015 at 1:16 pm

                   Sabine
                   It appears that you care about getting better conditions and policies here in NZ. CV does also and notes the gaps in Labour’s promises, and the way that they seem set to pour oil on troubled waters so to speak. But not change the waters, underneath – some showcase caring policies then it’s BAU. That was what the last Labour government did.
                   So don’t shoot the messenger.

                   Intelligent analysis promotes understanding and that means just not stating what is hoped for and then hoping it will arrive. Some of us are very aware that we personally have been doing this since 1984 and now at this late stage know that NZ has lost its way in the intervening years despite efforts to bring about change.

                   So if you don’t like the message don’t blame the messenger, we have to be reminded of the sad facts and goaded to think apparently. Good on CV for helping us along that path.
               • Et Tu Brute …

                 6 November 2015 at 5:03 pm

                 Cool now that would be a party I could vote for.

                 A Party for: “…for continuation of the paradigm of economic growth, digging up more fossil fuels and sourcing money from debt.
                 Vote for pro-spying legislation.
                 Can’t oppose the TPPA.
                 Chinese sirnames are stopping Kiwis buying $750K Auckland houses.
                 Not repealing 90 day right to fire – just making it fairer.”
             • Colonial Viper …

               6 November 2015 at 4:42 pm

               The Labour Party you are so proud of defending Sabine exists only in one place – your imagination.
               • Tracey …

                 6 November 2015 at 7:13 pm

                 Have you left the party CV?
                 • Colonial Viper …

                   6 November 2015 at 10:20 pm

                   Basically counting down the days, I reckon. And for sure the party isn’t going to get another cent from me.
           • Colonial Viper 3.1.1.1.1.2

             6 November 2015 at 4:38 pm

             people like Sabine don’t seem to give a fuck that ordinary Kiwis outside of the main centres can’t easily come up with $550 for flights to Palmerston North plus a couple hundred more for accommodation and costs.

             As I said, its the Labour Party of the 10%. Union organisers, school teachers, uni lecturers and those paid by Parliamentary Services.
             • sabine …

               6 November 2015 at 4:48 pm

               yes dear. 🙂
               • Colonial Viper …

                 7 November 2015 at 2:17 am

                 arrogant piece of shit.
                 • the pigman …

                   7 November 2015 at 2:58 pm

                   That’d be the intelligent analysis greywarbler was talking about… 😉
             • Et Tu Brute …

               6 November 2015 at 5:04 pm

               Or their fucks go elsewhere?
             • weka …

               6 November 2015 at 6:04 pm

               I don’t know if anyone still does this, or if it can be done for a conference this size, but back in the day one way to make national meetings equitably accessible was to have everyone pay a flat rate fee for the conference and then the conference bought the plane tickets. You could do this with accommodation, childcare etc too as well as fund people with no money at all. It’s about priorities.

               I think there are benefits to meeting in places like PN, but I agree that the costs are prohibitive for many. However many people couldn’t get to conference from Dndn if it were held in a main centre either.
       • McFlock 3.1.1.2

         6 November 2015 at 4:12 pm

         But on the other hand, circulating the conference around regional centres as well as Auckland means that every few years almost everyone is within road trip distance of a conference, rather than it just becoming an Auckland event.
         • sabine 3.1.1.2.1

           6 November 2015 at 4:34 pm

           this.
           • Colonial Viper 3.1.1.2.1.1

             6 November 2015 at 4:46 pm

             Nope. This isn’t a hobby meet. Important constitutional, operational or policy decisions are made at every single Conference, without exception.
             • sabine …

               6 November 2015 at 4:51 pm

               it is however important to be accesible to people.
               We want people to vote, then we need to show the people whom to vote for, especially when the media does not work for us, or even acknowledge us.
               So yes, i think there should be conferences all over the country.
               Or else, we get accused of making policy in Jaffa land for peeps that live on the country side.
               • Colonial Viper …

                 6 November 2015 at 4:56 pm

                 Well, it’s going to be the smallest Conference in years.
                 • sabine …

                   6 November 2015 at 4:57 pm

                   yes dear. 🙂
                   • Colonial Viper …

                     6 November 2015 at 5:00 pm

                     *shrug*

                     You have Labour Party arrogance and condescension down to a fine art.
               • Ad …

                 6 November 2015 at 4:58 pm

                 I think “be accessible to people” is CV’s point.
                 • McFlock …

                   6 November 2015 at 5:19 pm

                   And auckland will always be inaccessible to some people.

                   When I was a member of a political party, I couldn’t afford to go to the Nth Island conferences. I could chip in for petrol money and go on a road trip, though, so I could afford to go in those years that the AGM was in the south island.
                 • Tracey …

                   6 November 2015 at 7:16 pm

                   Are party conferences aimed at a kind of bystander pop in notion? Surely its for people who are members already… do they have proxy voting? Streaming and then online voting so people can watch and vote usig special log in?
             • McFlock …

               6 November 2015 at 5:16 pm

               Indeed. And if the conference is always in Auckland, it’s always cheapest for Aucklanders to attend, and Aucklanders will therefore be disproportionately represented, always.

               Same thing if you restrict it to just 3 or 4 main centres – Labour becomes the party of the main centres. Regional issues become an afterthought.

               Yes, some regional centres are more expensive for some people to get to than others. What you forget is that Auckland is always too expensive for some people to get to, expensive fares work both ways.
               • Raf …

                 7 November 2015 at 1:11 am

                 PN is a good idea. Reasonable for most of lower NI , and any Sth Islanders who can make it to Wgtn can do the hop to PN too.
                 That’s most of the country.
       • Ed 3.1.1.3

         6 November 2015 at 5:27 pm

         I understand at least one bus went from Wellington – whether that was mainly for those flying in to Wellington or coming over on a ferry, or for Wellington people I don’t know. Time was, there was a good rail link between Wellington and Palmerston North . . . I think the locations shows that Labour does care about the regions. I expect the conference venue and hotels/motels are cheaper than in a main centre as well.
   • Colonial Viper 3.2

     6 November 2015 at 2:27 pm

     Doing that is as simple as being able to hold on to some strong and highly differentiated policy positions which clearly contrasts with National. We’ve had nothing from Andrew Little. Useless cruising to defeat 2017.
   • Whateva Next 3.3

     6 November 2015 at 8:54 pm

     More out of the way for whom?!
4. Karen 4

   6 November 2015 at 2:32 pm

   For a quick check on what is happening you can go to
   https://twitter.com/hashtag/nzlpconf?src=hash

   Looking forward to reports from Mickey and Stephanie.
5. Ad 5

   6 November 2015 at 3:06 pm

   I don’t mind the Deputy Leader watering down expectations from “very little” to “infinitesimal”.

   We can’t expect any media exposure out of it – they banned it.

   We can’t expect any policy – apparently too early.

   We can’t expect to not be attacked on our own site by a sitting Labour Member of Parliament.

   So, I’d like to know what the entire point of this Labour Party conference is.

   Maybe some other Labour MP can come on to this site and tell me.
   • proud poppy wearer 5.1

     6 November 2015 at 3:58 pm

     “So, I’d like to know what the entire point of this Labour Party conference is.”

     Comedy relief ?
6. Tory 6

   6 November 2015 at 3:45 pm

   It’s clear that the “rank and file” party members are deeply unhappy, just read the comments around Stuart Nash, comments about Chris Trotter and some of the bile frequently chundered up on TDB. Add to that the “media ban” and this is a party in real trouble (no doubt there will be the usual leaks and innuendo to the media by the vested interests of MP’s looking after number 1, which simply adds fuel to the fire). A slow death by a thousand cuts, it’s certainly been entertaining so far 🙂
   • r0b 6.1

     6 November 2015 at 3:49 pm

     Don’t mistake those who comment on blogs for “rank and file” party members. There is very little overlap between the two.
   • One Anonymous Bloke 6.2

     6 November 2015 at 3:51 pm

     Wishful thinking, malice, and ignorance of history (since when did Lefties not argue among ourselves?) make Tory a dull boy.
7. b waghorn 7

   6 November 2015 at 3:46 pm

   I personally hope it goes well and they build on the quiet but solid first year of the Little years.
   The most important thing for me in 2017 is that the right wing barstards are gone by election time.
   • Michael 7.1

     6 November 2015 at 4:05 pm

     They won’t be and that, I reckon, is the reason for the media ban. It’s no secret that caucus is split on the TPPA, while most of the rank and file hate it. I agree with Chris Trotter when he writes that the dividing line in NZ politics runs through Labour’s caucus, not between National and Labour. Until that line is removed from the caucus Labour cannot present a united front to the people and seems destined to fade away in permanent opposition until it either (a) forms a coalition with National; (b) is overtaken by the Greens as the primary opposition party; or (c) is replaced by another political grouping (hopefully centre left).
8. jenny kirk 8

   6 November 2015 at 4:19 pm

   Frankly, I think many of you are talking thru holes in your individual heads !

   First item of news that I’ve seen from the Labour conference is the new line-up of the Maori policy committee – all new, youngish, talented people. The link is on Waatea News. Go and look for it, and then have a think about what you’ve just read.
   New, young, talent ……. all coming through in Labour. That’s a turnaround if ever there was one.

   And remember – Andrew Little said he’d spend the first year of his leadership getting things sorted out. Unlike candy-man Key who plays constantly to the so-called “celebrity” vote, Andrew Little shows depth, intelligence, and a commitment to NZ which will be of benefit to us all – not just to the celebrities.

   ps the link might be on Te Kaea. Can’t remember and I’m not at my usual easy-to-use computer so can’t easily find it for you, but it was posted somewhere at about 2pm today.
   • sabine 8.1

     6 November 2015 at 4:35 pm

     +1
   • Anne 8.2

     6 November 2015 at 4:53 pm

     Andrew Little said he’d spend the first year of his leadership getting things sorted out.

     Yep. And that is exactly what he has done. It doesn’t just happen overnight and people should bear in mind National took nine years to sort things out including 3 leadership changes.

     Little hasn’t deviated from the tasks he set himself for 2015. One of them was to visit every LEC and affiliated body in the country – no mean feat and he’s done it. If the response was the same as the LEC I belong to, then he succeeded in earning their full support and trust. I expect next year he will be out and about among the public doing the same thing.
     • sabine 8.2.1

       6 November 2015 at 5:06 pm

       +1
     • Tracey 8.2.2

       6 November 2015 at 7:22 pm

       I cant work out what Little has done wrong either. So he hasnt moved the polls more than 5% but thats still a decent move. He seems to choose exactly want he wants to comment on and what he doesnt. He seems to be mastering the short pithy soundbitey answer…
       • RedLogix 8.2.2.1

         6 November 2015 at 11:51 pm

         So far I don’t think Little hasn’t done anything wrong. I understand he may well be very visible inside the Party. But in voterland not so much.
         • Colonial Viper 8.2.2.1.1

           7 November 2015 at 2:21 am

           Little has done shitloads wrong. The most critical of which is that he’s repeatedly shown that Labour is too timid or incapable of opening up clear daylight between itself and National.

           This is symptomatic of Labour thinking that the tide will go out on National in 2017 and that its coming up Labour’s rightful turn in power.
           • Chris 8.2.2.1.1.1

             7 November 2015 at 2:38 am

             Our current Labour party is so far gone that not even a landslide win for Corbyn would make them see the light. It would be a significant moment in Labour party history if that were to occur, yet that’s precisely where we’re headed.
             • lprent …

               7 November 2015 at 5:26 am

               …that not even a landslide win for Corbyn would make them see the light

               I haven’t heard that he’d won a general election yet? Winning internal party elections isn’t of that much import to anyone apart from the terminally credulous and those who don’t spend much time talking to people who vote. Winning elections within the whole electorate is.

               So far he hasn’t won any elections apart from his electorate, and it will be a while before there is a possibility that he can even contest one.

               So fluff up his “victory” as much as you like. There is exactly one test that I am interested in – does he bring UK Labour votes in the general voting population.

               So far that looks quite ambiguous. More Scots are likely to desert the SNP and vote for Labour. About a fifth of English Labour voters are more likely to vote conservative. I haven’t seen anything that indicates that a Corbyn Labour party is more likely to get more people to turn out to vote.
               • Chris …

                 7 November 2015 at 11:36 am

                 I agree entirely. My point is that even if Corbyn and Labour are successful at the next election and that he takes UK Labour back to traditional Labour values I don’t think this will be enough to move our Labour party in the same direction because our Labour party is too far gone. If this happened it’d be a change because our Labour party in the last few decades have played follow the leader with UK Labour. So, as I’ve said, I don’t think that even a Corbyn/UK Labour victory in every sense of the concept would be enough to persuade our Labour to follow suit. That’s how fucked our Labour party is. For those here who don’t agree, just wait for Labour to vote with the government on the next welfare bill full of hatred towards the poor.
                 • Leftie …

                   7 November 2015 at 1:11 pm

                   Given your diatribe, wish you refrain from calling Labour “our” you sound like that disingenuous right winger Josie Pagani. I would say that Labour is not your political party at all.
                   • Chris …

                     7 November 2015 at 8:42 pm

                     I say “our” meaning NZ’s Labour party.
9. mickysavage 9

   6 November 2015 at 5:23 pm

   I just arrived and the mood is remarkably upbeat. Numbers are apparently much stronger than some have talked about with 500 being mentioned.
   • sabine 9.1

     6 November 2015 at 5:34 pm

     have fun.
     • weka 9.1.1

       6 November 2015 at 5:59 pm

       +1. Look forward to any reports.
       • Saarbo 9.1.1.1

         6 November 2015 at 10:07 pm

         +1
     • mickysavage 9.1.2

       6 November 2015 at 5:59 pm

       Will do and bound to 😀
       • sabine 9.1.2.1

         6 November 2015 at 6:04 pm

         love to be there, but work and such.
         also remember, pictures or it did not happen 🙂
         • Anne 9.1.2.1.1

           6 November 2015 at 6:51 pm

           …pictures or it did not happen.

           Definitely. We know the MSM isn’t going to give us an accurate view. More of the same – creating supposed dissension and conspiracies where they don’t exist – so we’re reliant upon you micky and Stephanie and others to give us the facts and figures. 🙂
       • Macro 9.1.2.2

         7 November 2015 at 1:53 am

         I hear you ate all the pies Micky 🙂
         http://thedailyblog.co.nz/2015/11/06/why-brooke-sabin-highlights-the-media-ban-labour-party-conference-2015-after-hours/
   • The Fairy Godmother 9.2

     6 November 2015 at 5:50 pm

     I would have liked to be there but too much on with work and family. Wish evetyone the best and look forward to the report at our Lec on Monday. I have a sense that we are all working hard and building up. My challenge to all you who are complaining about Labour’s direction is you get off your keyboards join up and come to meetings and work together to change things. Of course it does take a lot of time and effort buy I believe it will be worth it.
     • Tracey 9.2.1

       6 November 2015 at 7:25 pm

       I would love Labour to be more than it is. But my work off the keyboard is for the Green Party and other projects to try and improve tings for some of NZs vulnerable. But i reserve the right to criticise Labour and anyone else, including the Greens
       • Reddelusion 9.2.1.1

         6 November 2015 at 9:26 pm

         But never a good word for national no matter what, so not a totally objective free thinker
         • Macro 9.2.1.1.1

           7 November 2015 at 1:58 am

           But as National are so completely hopeless its very hard to put in a good word for them. Can’t actually think of anything they should be congratulated upon …. oh wait …. they did agree to insulate a few uninsulated homes on the recommendation of the Greens.
         • Chris 9.2.1.1.2

           7 November 2015 at 2:16 am

           So if we were in Germany in the 1930s you’d say “But never a good word for the Nazis no matter what, so not a totally objective free thinker”? It is possible to oppose everything something stands for based on an objective analysis, you know.
       • The Fairy Godmother 9.2.1.2

         7 November 2015 at 9:52 am

         Sorry Tracey I didn’t mean you I should have added or the greens or any other party or group determined to make new zealand a more equitable fairer and environmentally friendly society.
     • Chris 9.2.2

       7 November 2015 at 12:50 am

       “Of course it does take a lot of time and effort buy I believe it will be worth it.”

       I admire your optimism but Labour is so far gone that the process cannot save it.
       • Leftie 9.2.2.1

         7 November 2015 at 3:19 am

         @Chris

         Repeating bullshit doesn’t make it any more true. People must have thought back in 2002 that National was “so far gone” that the process “couldn’t save it” too. Just goes to show that what people may think, may turn out to be not the case at all.
         • Chris 9.2.2.1.1

           7 November 2015 at 11:27 am

           In 2002 National wasn’t gone at all. It’s bad showing was due to Clark’s personal popularity and English coming across like a boring old has been. Unlike current Labour, there was no fundamental disagreement in philosophy, and National certainly hadn’t given up on traditional right-wing thinking. It was nothing like what’s happened to the current Labout party. That’s why I think what’s happened to Labour is terminal. Far from repeating bullshit, I’m simply expressing an opinion that I think Labour’s fundamentally broken and quite possibly beyond repair. The old adage you can judge a nation on how it treats its poor applies equally to political parties. Most people now of course don’t take any notice of this, but if you follow Labour in this regard you would’ve seen that they’re now voting with the government supporting their ongoing attacks on the poor. I’d love to be wrong but that’s why I think Labour’s “too far gone”.
           • Leftie 9.2.2.1.1.1

             7 November 2015 at 12:57 pm

             @Chris

             National got the worst general election result ever with 20.93% in 2002. Labour has never gotten anything as bad as that, and no matter how you want to spin it with shrill wanting emotionalism because that’s what you want to see happen, National went through the same thing that the Labour party are going through now.
             • Chris …

               7 November 2015 at 8:51 pm

               National went through a lot, I know. But they didn’t have to deal with anything like the ongoing fundamental identity crisis Labour’s been going through for a number of years now. That’s the difference.
               • Leftie …

                 8 November 2015 at 8:04 pm

                 @Chris

                 National did go through the same thing, the only difference was National weren’t constantly attacked by the msm over it.
                 • Chris …

                   8 November 2015 at 9:00 pm

                   I should’ve written you off as a lunatic a long time ago. Gave you the benefit of the doubt but got kicked in the guts. As I’ve said, you’re amazing.
                   • Leftie …

                     8 November 2015 at 10:35 pm

                     @Chris

                     Get over yourself, you are not that important. As I have said you are not amazing. You are one of those right wing nut jobs with a big ego, who uses insults instead of an intelligent argument.
       • The Fairy Godmother 9.2.2.2

         7 November 2015 at 10:13 am

         Where do you get that from? From your own activism and involvement or are you just quoting the likes of Sabin?
         • Leftie 9.2.2.2.1

           7 November 2015 at 12:59 pm

           National got the worst general election result with 20.93% in 2002. A lot worse than any result Labour have gotten.

           If your question is directed @Chris, I would say he got that rubbish from Brook Sabin and/or Slater.
           • Chris 9.2.2.2.1.1

             8 November 2015 at 2:47 pm

             Slater says Labour’s stuffed because he hates the left. You have no analysis.
             • Leftie …

               8 November 2015 at 8:06 pm

               @Chris,
               Neither do you. What I am reading from you is the usual rants from a right winger.
               • Chris …

                 8 November 2015 at 8:59 pm

                 You’re amazing.
                 • Leftie …

                   8 November 2015 at 10:26 pm

                   @Chris

                   You are not.
         • Chris 9.2.2.2.2

           7 November 2015 at 8:49 pm

           See the above comment to Leftie, but I get it from observing Labour’s behaviour towards NZ’s vulnerable, how this has been getting worse and worse since 1999 (and before) to a point where Labour now votes with the government in support of nasty welfare bills that are part of the right’s war on the poor. The trouble is that few people follow Labour’s attitude and behaviour towards those less fortunate than themselves so are often completely oblivious to what’s going on. Labour’s position on poverty and the poor is akin to colluding with Nact in support of the neo-liberal agenda.
           • Chris 9.2.2.2.2.1

             7 November 2015 at 8:59 pm

             And while Little et al are talking about cooperating with the Greens in 2017 and other things that are of course very necessary and better than a poke in the eye (save axing the CGT) until Labour starts showing greater concrete signs of changing basic ideas towards those less well off I won’t be convinced anything’s really changed.
           • Leftie 9.2.2.2.2.2

             8 November 2015 at 8:08 pm

             @Chris

             Yawn… get off your right wing soap box.
             • Chris …

               8 November 2015 at 8:59 pm

               Tell me the things I’ve said that make you think I’m a right-winger? By the way, I do have to say that I think your moniker is rather ironic.
               • Leftie …

                 8 November 2015 at 10:25 pm

                 @Chris

                 Your diatribe tells me you are a right winger, and you can think what you like, it makes no difference to me.

                 [lprent: Perhaps you’d care to click on to their name and see the previous comments they have left before rushing to judgement. But Chris isn’t right wing. More disillusioned. ]
   • Magisterium 9.3

     7 November 2015 at 12:28 am

     “500 being mentioned”

     jesus wept
     • Leftie 9.3.1

       7 November 2015 at 3:20 am

       @Magisterium

       Why?
10. Mike the Savage One 10

    6 November 2015 at 7:02 pm

    Things can only get better for Labour and the left of centre, so despite of endless worries, I keep hoping for things to actually improve, perhaps starting with this conference. I do not expect that much to come out of it though.
11. vaughan little 11

    6 November 2015 at 7:25 pm

    I’m looking forward to news from the Robertson on his work on the future of work.

    and housing.

    and le provinces.
    • Reddelusion 11.1

      6 November 2015 at 9:09 pm

      You will find it in the economist
12. Mike the Savage One 12

    6 November 2015 at 9:28 pm

    Brook Sabin was already at it tonight, saying Little had no guts to take clear stand for or against the TPPA. He is one little worm allowed to report on the conference, so he will try all to rubbish Labour, no matter what happens. Considering that, I do understand that Labour do not want the MSM attend all sessions and discussions. You do not invite the reaper to your baptism or birthday, do you?
    • Paul 12.1

      7 November 2015 at 9:11 am

      Son of a National MP.
      What should we expect?
      • Leftie 12.1.1

        7 November 2015 at 1:18 pm

        Exactly Paul, Sabin has a conflict of interest, which it seems many like him within the media have. No such thing as fair and unbiased reporting in NZ, real journalism doesn’t exist. msm is just the mouthpiece for the National Party.
        • Chris 12.1.1.1

          7 November 2015 at 10:48 pm

          “Sabin has a conflict of interest”

          Are you saying then that an MP’s son or daughter shouldn’t be allowed to pursue a career as a journalist? That’s the logical extension of your belief that Sabin has a conflict of interest. There’s no conflict. I think what you’re trying to say is that Sabin’s a crap journalist. You should just say that.
          • Leftie 12.1.1.1.1

            8 November 2015 at 8:18 pm

            @Chris

            I meant what I said. Clearly, you do not understand the meaning of a “conflict of interest.”

            Brook Sabin is the son of recently ex Nat MP Mike Sabin. That is having a conflict of interest. Audrey Young is the sister of Nat MP Jonathan Young, that is having a conflict of interest. Kate Bradford is the daughter of Sue Bradford, that is having a conflict of interest.
            • Chris 12.1.1.1.1.1

              8 November 2015 at 8:56 pm

              Therefore I ask again: Are you saying that an MP’s son or daughter shouldn’t be allowed to pursue a career as a journalist? Simple question.
              • Leftie …

                8 November 2015 at 10:15 pm

                @Chris

                It’s an irrelevant question, and it is still a conflict of interest no matter how you may want to look at it.
13. peterlepaysan 13

    7 November 2015 at 12:13 am

    Palmerston North is problematic for people to get to for a national conference?

    Given the size and shape of this country what venue is not problematic?

    The geographic position of conferences decides policies?

    I do not think so.

    Kaitaia/ Westport
    invercargill/New Plymouth
    Oamaru/Blenheim
    Dargaville/Nelson
    Gisborne etc etc .

    Maybe it is ok for Wellington to be the source of all policy after all.

    Niue, Chathams, Stewart Island have their own appeals.

    Perhaps someone should put forward a remit that include the above locations.
14. Leftie 14

    7 November 2015 at 3:31 am

    Just read a very positive report on TDB by Martyn Bradbury, who has, in the recent past, been no friend of the Labour party. Worth a read, look forward to more reports on the conference.

    <a href="http://thedailyblog.co.nz/2015/11/06/why-brooke-sabin-highlights-the-media-ban-labour-party-conference-2015-after-hours/
    • lprent 14.1

      7 November 2015 at 5:16 am

      Well, apart from impugning the way that two of our authors were eating 🙂
      • mickysavage 14.1.1

        7 November 2015 at 7:31 am

        Its not even true!
    • Chris 14.2

      7 November 2015 at 10:50 pm

      I hope Martyn’s right.

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1. Blogs on first day of Labour conference | Your NZ: posted on 7 November 2015 at 7:21 am

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