Lining up for charter schools

34 comments on “Lining up for charter schools ”

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1. ianmac 1

   23 May 2013 at 11:16 am

   Ominous development. Peter O’Connor says it all.
   I have yet to hear just what a NZ Charter School will actually do. I have not heard that question asked.
   What will it not do that State Schools currently do?
   What will it fill the school day up with?
   What will happen to the kids who do not respond?
   And perhaps those parents who work long hours, might welcome a long school day. Baby sitting?
2. Dv 2

   23 May 2013 at 11:36 am

   I saw a Parata comment the other day that charter schools will improve NZEA passes BUT they are not obliged to offer the national Curriculum.
3. Winston Smith 3

   23 May 2013 at 11:37 am

   Good call, gotta protect the teacher unions…
   • Te Reo Putake 3.1

     23 May 2013 at 11:39 am

     It’s actually about protecting children (and taxpayers), but then, you knew that already.
     • Winston Smith 3.1.1

       23 May 2013 at 11:56 am

       No its about protecting unionists, using kids and scare tactics.
       • One Anonymous Knucklehead 3.1.1.1

         23 May 2013 at 12:03 pm

         Sorry, do you have a problem with teachers joining unions? Who do you think you are, trying to trample all over their freedoms of speech and assembly? Piss off to North Korea.
       • Colonial Viper 3.1.1.2

         23 May 2013 at 12:09 pm

         Unions and union membership is critical for the balance between employers and employees, Winston. Unions should be encouraged and supported.
       • framu 3.1.1.3

         23 May 2013 at 12:18 pm

         really? – you of course have evidence of this i expect
       • One Anonymous Knucklehead 3.1.1.4

         23 May 2013 at 12:19 pm

         …scare tactics.

         Really? Funny that, I thought they were using pedagogy and overseas experience from multiple countries. Do you think we should just check to make sure you aren’t a mendacious wretch?

         Yep, I checked, and they’re using pedagogy and overseas examples. You need better lies.
         • McFlock 3.1.1.4.1

           23 May 2013 at 6:11 pm

           Nah. The chap who believes Orwell was only talking about left wing totalitarianism is being straight with us.

           References to educational studies and overseas experience scare the shit out of tories.

           Tories are afraid of references to the real world, what with reality’s known liberal bias 🙂
     • Rob 3.1.2

       23 May 2013 at 3:48 pm

       Yes we must protect them and ensure that their studies do not drift away from the important issues of being able to pack a bowl of K2.
       • One Anonymous Knucklehead 3.1.2.1

         23 May 2013 at 6:09 pm

         Is drivel the best you can do?

         Why is it that no wingnut can use facts or reason to explain why they want the National Party’s clients to run schools? Is it a case of “failed NCEA level 2, join the National Party”? Because that’s what it looks like.
         • Rob 3.1.2.1.1

           24 May 2013 at 10:53 am

           Maybe if you looked at the way you frame your questions, you might get a more engaged coversation if that is in fact what you are after.

           People who think that charter schools may offer a large percentage of low acheivers and ultimate under qualified leavers an alternative method do not think that it’s all about Nationals clients.

           In regards to evolution debate I am struggling to even recall any more than a few periods on it in the 5th form for School C. The ammount of time devoted to evolution was almost non – existant and in fact I learnt more of it watching David Attenborough “Life on Earth” .

           Also why would you pour scorn on me for failing NCEA 2. Plenty of kids are doing that every year and some us are concerned. You are obviously not because you will just use it to demean them even further.
           • One Anonymous Knucklehead 3.1.2.1.1.1

             25 May 2013 at 9:28 am

             Oh, you’re concerned? What is it that’s concerning you? The fact that we’re copying failed right wing education policies from countries with worse education systems than ours, as opposed to successful education policies from countries that do better?

             Or the fact that (despite the excellent work that our teachers do) household income is the largest factor in education outcomes?
   • One Anonymous Knucklehead 3.2

     23 May 2013 at 11:48 am

     Yes Winston, strong teachers’ unions help protect education standards and are well worthy of support, but this is about protecting children from the National Party’s clients.
4. Tiger Mountain 4

   23 May 2013 at 11:39 am

   Let the “Lord” provide for these religious nutters experiments surely, not us secular taxpayers.
   • ghostwhowalksnz 4.1

     23 May 2013 at 12:12 pm

     They can allready use their own funds to establish semi private schools, with the government only paying the teachers salaries.

     But , hey throw money at a problem, and the answer is there all along , apparently
5. tracey 5

   23 May 2013 at 12:45 pm

   Will they be like Private schools which don’t have to publish results the way Public schools do.
6. ghostrider888 6

   23 May 2013 at 1:49 pm

   Give ’em enough rope. Just another step down on the slide into the abyss; Consider the conflicts that will arise in the near future between institutionalised, radicalized, worldview bearers. Another gang-nail in the corpse of democracy, and as Draco concurred some time ago, hopefully in the carcass of capitalism as presently practised.
   One thing about a small country social laboratory, the effects are magnified.
7. ghostrider888 7

   23 May 2013 at 2:03 pm

   Furthermore, from the “Church and state, defines debate” link;
   “let the funding of religious studies … be in the context of theology…” – those church leaders that do have a sound theological understanding appear to keep it amongst themselves and not release it to empower the body; those that do not have a sound theological understanding- they are the majority!
   If they teach scripture to adults as “bed-time” stories, then it will be nursery rhymes for the students.
8. prism 8

   23 May 2013 at 5:25 pm

   Centrepoint Potter was very interested in girls’ education. Passionate even!
9. Descendant Of Sssmith 9

   23 May 2013 at 8:50 pm

   So when the NZ education was set up it was clearly secular and funded from taxation.

   Several private schools set themselves up for fee paying elites and several groups of Christians, predominantly Catholics, set up their own schools rather than have a state funded secular education.

   Both groups consciously opted out of a state funded education system – although some like Wanganui Collegiate still relied on the state to give them their land.

   In the 70’s as religious beliefs started to decline the religious schools were not able to sustain themselves due to both declining rolls and increasing costs. They then started filching funds from the state by becoming “integrated” when in fact they simply should have shut their doors.

   Since 85 as the middle class have slowly vanished due to neoliberal reforms private schools are struggling for enough pupils to fund their fancy schools, their lower to student to teacher ratios and their expensive property and despite the wealthy have more of the countries income than ever they don’t apply the market philosophy they profess to love (stand on your own two feet, if no demand for your service then market forces say shut the business down, reduce taxation esp on the wealthy, user pays) they instead look to also filch from the taxpayer whether via lump sum payments, integration or voucher systems.

   The religious schools have integrated and accessed taxpayers money and benefited by way of student numbers from white flight in the last 15 years or so many parents of such pupils lying about their religious affiliation, still faced declining rolls still don’t want to close and now want unique funding specifically for them. Minority religions also want to jump on the bandwagon.

   Neither of these groups are advocating that increased taxation pay for the schools they set up independently. Quite the contrary they predominantly advocate for less tax and less government.

   This can only get worse if we keep going down this track.

   It’s time we went back to a clear unequivocal govt only funding free secular education and non secular and private education rising or falling on it’s own merits.

   Public schools are closing due to reduced demand in both population size and location and their is no good reason why these independently set up schools shouldn’t do the same.

   What is needed is a no more than 10 year plan to remove state funding from all private and religious schools. No ifs no buts.
   • Populuxe1 9.1

     23 May 2013 at 9:51 pm

     “Since 85 as the middle class have slowly vanished due to neoliberal reforms private schools are struggling for enough pupils to fund their fancy schools, their lower to student to teacher ratios and their expensive property…”

     Given that the expensive property is actually a big part of what funds the fancy schools, I’m calling bullshit. Kings and Christs seem to be doing just fine.
     • Colonial Viper 9.1.1

       24 May 2013 at 9:37 pm

       Yes they are…but a bit of extra tax payer funding is pretty handy too.
10. Descendant Of Sssmith 10

    23 May 2013 at 9:57 pm

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/education/6696317/Pinched-private-schools-ponder-integration

    Collegiate is the most obvious but if you look you’ll easily find evidence that it’s the case.
    • Nordy 10.1

      23 May 2013 at 10:04 pm

      Yes DoS – a ‘no-brainer’ really…probably why P1 is having real difficulty with it……

      One of the ‘wonderful ironies’ of the hollowmen is that the so-called ‘price signal’ of the market never applies to them (only everyone else), they clearly think that a govt subsidy is OK for them but not for anyone else……pure unadulterated hypocrisy.
      • Descendant Of Sssmith 10.1.1

        23 May 2013 at 10:30 pm

        And we should also remember that despite being private they do receive government subsidies which are increasing at alarming rate while the state school my kids go to for instance has lost over 100,000 dollars in funding in the last three years.

        http://thedailyblog.co.nz/2013/04/18/does-it-get-any-more-rich-than-this/

        2009 2010 2011

        Kings College 1,663,585 2,152,669 2,325,587

        St Cuthbert’s 2,027,070 2,553,203 2,836,908

        Kristin School 2,222,284 2,734,602 2,912,394

        AGC Parnell 789,880 1,206,459 1,426,547

        Diocesan School 2,057,681 2,740,298 2,940,455

        Scot’s College 1,072,920 1,378,084 1,509,437

        Christ’s College 1,172,637 1,461,804 1,633,170

        Rangi Ruru 1,160,013 1,446,897 1,580,950

        Kings College has had it’s funding increased by $700,000 dollars – no wonder it’s doing just fine.
        • kiwicommie 10.1.1.1

          24 May 2013 at 1:10 pm

          I never went to those schools, even though I could have. They appeared to be snobbish, homophobic and pretty boring.
11. Descendant Of Sssmith 11

    23 May 2013 at 10:37 pm

    From memory schools like Woodford, Iona and Lindisfarne in Hawkes Bay also became integrated in the 90’s as rolls and finances dropped.
12. Murray Olsen 12

    23 May 2013 at 11:26 pm

    It worries me that Hipkins says this: “Those are their beliefs – but the state should not be paying for it. Those parents and kids can choose to believe and to receive a religious education. But not to the exclusion of other sciences, and I think in this case that is really inappropriate,”

    This indicates that he considers creationism to be a science. To be fair though, it’s far from being my biggest worry about the authoritarian little git.
    • peterlepaysan 12.1

      24 May 2013 at 9:27 pm

      Hipkins is the final straw for me. I have voted labour all of my adult life.

      While hipkins and his cronies control the caucus cabal I will never vote labour.

      hipkins is why
13. kiwicommie 13

    24 May 2013 at 1:04 pm

    What New Zealand has to look forward to:

    A charter school mogul has been charged in a multimillion-dollar charter school fraud…

    Charter School Fraud: If This Were Public School, Libertarians Would Scream
14. The Pink Postman 14

    24 May 2013 at 3:47 pm

    I grind my teeth with amger every time I drive past St Peters Cambridge which is about 3 times a week . Because the place is flood lighted like a city and must spend more on lighting than Cambridge High Schools spends on any single subject .Yet recieves taxpayers money to subsidy it’s wealthy clients,,
15. Clockie 15

    25 May 2013 at 3:06 pm

    Did anyone miss seeing this?

    http://www.thecivilian.co.nz/government-to-introduce-charter-hospitals/

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