Moving beyond wtaf?

Written By: - Date published: 9:57 am, February 5th, 2025 - 49 comments
Categories: us politics - Tags: , ,

The news coming out of the US is unbelievable, in the sense of ‘can that really be happening?’

This from political commentator Jim Wright at Stonekettle on Facebook,

Musk and his team of dodgy 18-year-olds went into sensitive government networks, hooked up their own storage systems, and downloaded the personal information of every American.

Various politicians, some even Republican, are in the words of Susan Collins “very concerned.” The press is variously surprised, appalled, and aghast. There are rising calls for Musk’s removal.

This is bad enough. One of the tactics of the US 47th administration is to overload people with chaos. That’s 47’s base position anyway, just keep up with a lot of misinformation and bullshit as well as trashing convention. But it’s also in the sheer amount of legislative, policy and functional changes in government (sound familiar New Zealand?). The purpose is to leave people reeling, induce feelings of powerless, both of which stop people acting.

Of notable concern here is how people in the media will also be reeling and trying to make sense of the chaos.

What’s the point of this? To entrench power so that they get to keep it aka removing democracy.

Stonekettle continues,

BUT, here’s the part they’re all missing: Even if we throw Musk out, HE STILL HAS OUR INFORMATION.

He still has our personal information. All of it. All of your private information. Everything the government knows about you. Your identity, your bank accounts, your credit cards, your tax information, the property you own, all of it. Every detail. There’s a reason why that information was protected. Musk’s companies now have it and whoever they decide to sell it to has it. If one of those unvetted, uncleared, unknown 18-year-olds made a copy, they have it. If any of them are compromised, if Musk’s corporate data systems are penetrated by our adversaries, then they have it too. China. Nigeria. Hackers. Thieves. Enemy intelligence agencies. Marketing executives.

There’s nothing to stop Musk. He doesn’t work for us. He’s not accountable to the people or their representatives in any fashion. And he has repeatedly demonstrated that his loyalty to American is tenuous at best. His only allegiance is to profit.

What do you think Trump will do with that information?

This is the greatest Identity Theft in history.

I’m not sure there is any coming back from that. New Zealand please take note, every time there is an attempt to centralised personal data, this is the end game. Remember Bill English’s Big Data plans? That were only averted because Labour won the election that year. This is the end game: to give all the data and power to the people who want to rule the world.

For weeks now I’ve had the feeling that the planning this time around is much much worse than 2017. They know what they are doing, and now they have the tech bros on the team. This is incredibly dangerous.

Stonekettle finishes with a grimlol. He’s on bsky if you want an ethical follow space.

Addendum: Musk now has all the personal and financial information of his rivals. Bezos. Zuckerberg. Trump even.

Give that some thought.

49 comments on “Moving beyond wtaf? ”

  1. Patricia Bremner 1

    Very dangerous and unhappily very familiar. Power corrupting.

    We need to protect ourselves as best we can.

    For some reason, Dotcom's warning about the bad actors comes to mind.

    Did he try to warn us of Theil and Key et al? Was the Internet Party a warning?

    Now the planned chaos of attacks on Public Services, or anything seen as a road block to MNCs. "Bringing Governing back to Basics" by underfunding to limit expertise and weaken structures and systems, so private groups scoop up the best money making bits, the rest left to the Public Purse. Data is the new gold, and Musk gave his victory salute.

    At this stage I feel sorry for future generations. At 83 life is still precious, as each day is a gift. I hope to live to vote our destructive followers out of office, as they admire Trump and Musk which does not bode well.

    Weka, a transcript of the talking points of the presentation made was the power wielded by the rich in using the internet and Data came to mind. How it could be used to target individuals with few if any protections.

    • tWig 1.1

      I began commenting at TS in response to the anti-mandate occupation at Parliament. Because the group refused usual media access, and I had the time, sites like debunking conspiracies aotearoa gave links into the SM content of the occupying groups so I could watch as things happened, eg, during the riot, from the occupiers’ POV.

      The wound-up, distorted, and often fantastical reports coming from the groups themselves shocked me. The blatant physical threats to Ardern and others in placards horrified me. And I was chilled to the bone, when the day Putin invaded Ukraine, a NZ-based Daily Telegram site, one of the main alt-news sites for the occupation, came out overtly in support of Putin's invasion. The rest of the world was still getting their head around the event, so clearly pre-produced Russian propaganda.

      That day I realised that much of the anti-mandate SM reporting was being amplified by external actors. I have also written about buying SM advert time to recruit participants for a drinks trial. The effectiveness was astonishing, as was my realisation about the darwinian nature of the adverts.

      You write some content, a paragraph or two. The advertising then generates a multitude of stock photos and tag-line clips emphasising this or that feature. Then seeds the multitude into the SM audience you are targetting. Ones that don't work aren't further amplified. Ones that do, proliferate, or mutate slightly. Darwinian ads, a thousand or more times effective than the ol’MSM adverts, and trad news.

      Put bad faith actors, local and international, with darwinian social media messaging, and you have the new democratic reality. Add tech-platform overlords, and the democratic process, and nations, are seriously fkd.

      • Dennis Frank 1.1.1

        I made tv ads mid-'70s to mid-'80s & get your darwinian point. The constraint on effectiveness is attention, which naturally wanders, so suck them into a narrative & dress it up with imagery to glamourise. I could see how the ad agency hotshots manipulated consumers. That blend seems the basic design formula. Nowadays you'd add an algorithm to scale up that formula.

      • Patricia Bremner 1.1.2

        100% tWig

  2. tc 2

    Id put money on elon targeting anyone he sees as a threat so look out Sam Altman…..you dared to question him.

    Then theres single mums on govt benefits he believes are part of a criminal conspiracy etc etc.

    Trump will likely let him run probably hoping he implodes as having largely served his purpose.

    • Obtrectator 2.1

      Who's serving whose purpose here? I'd have said the Orange Tragedy seems likelier to reach obsolescence first. He signs his little bits of paper with a mighty flourish, cavorts in front of the cameras from time to time, but essentially he becomes more irrelevant by the day as the real dirty deeds are done elsewhere.

      • Patricia Bremner 2.1.1

        In actual fact, the laws of America could bite Musk much harder than the President.

        If the judiciary decide Musk is taking their power and that of Congress… he could be as dispensable as some of Trumps past friends.

        Trump is known for wild changes of direction if he feels ignored.

  3. SPC 3

    Musk will need a POTUS pardon. Presumably he has been guaranteed one.

    The access to government data and payments applications is of huge intellectual property value of itself. It is a heist by the unpaid intern. Planning for X as the western We Chat payment system (CSG partner?).

    The USA grown ups will have to watch Musk and a few of the others as a threat to national security for decades.

    Musk is making an effort to create a corporate government cartel concept, where anti-trust is history and government favour to "industry" normal.

    In Russia, the oligarchs did to seek to partner Putin, just get out of his way (live offshore) and keep their wealth.

  4. Ad 4

    It may tempt those on the hard left to get into power and be just as revolutionary.

    Don't.

    95% of people are ordinary folks wanting reliable government, and part of being left is sustaining public institutions and public trust with good, honest reliable government.

  5. Patricia Bremner 5

    Another thought… If your Bank Account could be wiped your Data wiped, you become a non person who can't buy or pay except through Barter. Perhaps gold/diamonds?

  6. Patricia Bremner 6

    I remember Zuckeberg saying "They GAVE me their information" (Data). for peer to peer sharing.

  7. Psycho Milt 7

    $200 million well spent, from Musk's perspective. Instead of going to all the labour and stress of building a social media platform on which only some people will give you only some of their information, why not instead spend the money on getting a president elected who'll let you ransack the state's data storage? $200 mil for all govt-held data on all US citizens is the bargain of the century.

  8. Ad 8

    Not even started.

    Most radical change in US government since Roosevelt.

  9. Bearded Git 9

    The American election system is totally crap when you can elect a leader 49.9 to 48.4 and that leader then has so much random power. Third Reich anyone?

    This system needs to be changed.

  10. Obtrectator 10

    Just wondering: by any standards, the amount of data these "18 year olds" are supposed to have downloaded is immense – where would it all be stored?

  11. mikesh 11

    There seems to have been nothing on the TV1 news, or the stuff website about this. Has there been any coroboration.

    • Karolyn_IS 11.1

      It's mentioned briefly now in this 1News article:

      Article is about the protests against Trump & Musk.

      "Catie Miglietti, from the Ann Arbor area, said Musk’s access to Treasury Department data was especially concerning"

      "Demonstrations in several cities piled criticism on Musk and the Department of Government Efficiency."

      "DOGE is not legit," read one poster on the state Capitol steps in Jefferson City, Missouri, where dozens of protesters gathered. "Why does Elon have your Social Security info???""

  12. Belladonna 12

    The Treasury has said that Krause part of the DOGE 'team' has only access to the 'coded' part of the data.

    The letter stated that Tom Krause, a member of Musk's DOGE team who has been brought in as a Treasury Department employee, will "have read-only access to the coded data of the Fiscal Service's payment systems" as part of an "operational efficiency assessment."

    "This is similar to the kind of access that Treasury provides to individuals reviewing Treasury systems, such as auditors, and that follows practices associated with protecting the integrity of the systems and business processes,"

    https://www.cbsnews.com/news/musk-treasury-social-security-access-federal-payment-system-trump/

    Not to say it's a storm in a teacup – any access to government owned data about people is a significant issue. But not quite the end of the world scenario that some of the more alarmist Democratic spokespeople are claiming.

    • Patricia Bremner 12.1

      Rational Republicans seem thin on the ground, and being alarmed is hardly thinking it is the "end of the world" Belladonna.

  13. roblogic 13

    If Musk takes control of the Treasury and government payments system, it's a coup.

  14. Michael Scott 14

    If Musk's team has access to Federal servers as reported I predict a storm of shocking announcements daily.

    It looks like he is beginning with USAID because it had become bloated and politicised. There will be lots of revelations there I'm sure

    His decimation of Twitter is probably a good indication of his intent. He sacked 80% of the staff.

  15. SPC 15

    The USA is a land with neither a state church nor religion

    HUAC 1947 and identifying UnAmericans and the beginning of conenction between the White House office and religion.

    1.1953, DE and the National Prayer breakfast

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Prayer_Breakfast

    2.2001, GWB and the White House Office of Faith-Based and Community Initiatives (OFBCI) renamed by Obama White House Office of Faith-Based and Neighborhood Partnerships

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_House_Office_of_Faith-Based_and_Neighborhood_Partnerships

    At this years NPB

    Trump took the occasion to announce he would appoint Florida Pastor Paula White to lead his White House Faith Office.

    President Donald Trump spoke about the centrality of religious belief to the United States and announced that he would create a new presidential commission on religious liberty.

    “We have to bring religion back. We have to bring it back much stronger.”

    Trump did not give any other details about the commission, other than saying: “It’s going to be a very big deal, which will work tirelessly to uphold this most fundamental right. Unfortunately, in recent years, we’ve seen the sacred liberty threatened like never before in American history.”

    Trump, once identifying as a Presbyterian but in recent years calling himself a nondenominational Christian, closed his speech to lawmakers with an endorsement of religious belief. “I really believe you can’t be happy without religion, without that belief,” Trump said.

    “This week, I’m also creating the White House faith office led by Pastor Paula White, who is so amazing.”

    The president also said he will create a task force, which will be overseen by Attorney General Pam Bondi, that will “eradicate anti-Christian bias,” making good on a promise he made on the campaign trail.

    https://religionnews.com/2025/02/06/at-two-prayer-breakfasts-trump-calls-himself-champion-of-religion/

    Vought is the appointee heavily opposed by Democrats, they call him the quarter-back of the far right Christian nationaists.

    https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2025/02/russell-vought-confirmed-senate-omb-project-2025-christian-nationalism/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=slack

  16. Michael Scott 16

    Wa just reading a Guardian opinion piece on Gaza and realised that Trump has taken total control of the narrative. A few weeks ago the US were supporters of Israel and urging them into ceasefire talks

    All of a sudden Trump is in charge. Addressing Gaza directly with a plan so outrageous everyone is talking about it. Like one of Bobby Fischers best crazy chess moves.

    Everyone knows the 2 state solution is dead but no one has any idea for a permanent solution. Then Trump proposes getting all the Gazans to leave and rebuilding.

    Perhaps he envisages a modern Gazan state rising from the ruins funded by the wealthy Arab nations and the US with security guarantees.

    And a Trump Tower and golfcourse of course.

    • Obtrectator 16.1

      Bobby Fischer was most definitely not one for making "crazy chess moves". His play was a lethal combination of soundly-conceived tactics aimed at achieving far-sighted and worthwhile strategic objectives. A better example of "crazy" chess would be his predecessor as world champion Mikhail Tal.

  17. At first I was surprised at the opposition of the Left to dismantling USAID because of past opposition to it from the likes of Chomsky, carried on more recently by JacobinUSAID’s Trojan Horse:

    Behind the heartwarming photo ops, USAID's projects in El Salvador are stealthily advancing the interests of the Salvadoran corporate class

    Natsios, former USAID administrator under George W. Bush, told the magazine. “I don’t think they understand what the role of USAID is, what USAID’s mission directors are. USAID’s mission directors are among the most influential foreigners in the country.”

    Natsios’s frantic remarks are revealing: He essentially admits that USAID’s mission has nothing to do with development, but rather political intervention on behalf of US interests abroad. This is no great secret, but it is a fact that most agency officials in the field would be reluctant to advertise.

    Which fits with its title of United States Agency for International Development, and Kennedy's original mission for it to combat the USSR's influencing operations.

    But it's now apparent that the modern Democrat Party, and much of the US Left, support it for two reasons:
    – it pushes modern Left-Wing ideas in nations around the world.
    – grift to NGO's and the like that the Left support.

    Ironically, given Jacobins’ story above, the current President of El Salvador, Nayib Bukele, has no time for it, writing:

    Most governments don’t want USAID funds flowing into their countries because they understand where much of that money actually ends up. While marketed as support for development, democracy, and human rights, the majority of these funds are funneled into opposition groups, NGOs with political agendas, and destabilizing movements. At best, maybe 10% of the money reaches real projects that help people in need (there are such cases), but the rest is used to fuel dissent, finance protests, and undermine administrations that refuse to align with the globalist agenda. Cutting this so-called aid isn’t just beneficial for the United States; it’s also a big win for the rest of the world.

  18. joe90 18

    I love how these morons assume that prophylactic medical supplies means condoms and that the US ships pellets of cash around the world.

    /

    @justinbaragona.bsky.social‬

    GOP Rep. Buddy Carter wildly claims that DOGE found that the United States paid "$15 million for condoms for the Taliban," prompting a flabbergasted Boris Sanchez to wonder if he's conflating other false claims about Gaza. Carter: "That's what they discovered! … I am not [conflating things]"

    […]

    Boris Sanchez: $50 million for condoms to the Taliban? The U.S. government apparently procures condoms at about $0.03 each one. That‘s a lot of condoms. Are you standing by that, sir? We‘re going to fact-check it. We‘re going to have you back on and ask you about it. Buddy Carter: That's fine.

    https://bsky.app/profile/justinbaragona.bsky.social/post/3lhjwgh3ujc2b

  19. AB 19

    If billionaires cannot be controlled, cannot be taxed out of existence and cannot be prevented from coming into existence, what options are left to secure a democratic polity? Is there only one, and it appalls me to even say it out loud: but are we left only with violence?

    • Obtrectator 19.1

      As I've quoted more than once already on this site: "The appalling thing about fascism is that you've got to use fascist methods to get rid of it." (Kevin Brownlow / Andrew Mollo)

      [Note to mods: that's the last time I'll be saying it.]

  20. Jenny 20

    Oh Dear

    Elon THREATENS His Critics With ARREST!

    Hey better not be a critic of Musk, or God forbid support the people of Gaza in any way, because Pam Bindi has vowed to hunt you down. (Hamas supporter and Palestinian supporter being interchangeable)

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