Nats’ selective science

Written By: - Date published: 6:45 am, November 7th, 2014 - 87 comments
Categories: Abuse of power, censorship, science - Tags: , , ,

As a working scientist I would like to thank Dita De Boni for this piece in yesterday’s Herald:

Govt loath to let facts come between friends

National Party loves ‘helpful’ science, but turns nasty if findings irk its mates

I know John Key is an exceptionally busy man, but it was good to see him take the opportunity to pile on the opposition party back-bencher, the very last man on the Green Party list, and give him a serve for being “barking mad”. … You see, it is important that we follow the National Party’s lead, and respect science at all times.

That is to say, all times except for the times when scientists come out with stuff that makes us feel uncomfortable and make our friends in industry unhappy. Then we should see fit to dump on it from a great height. We may turn it into an equation, thus: Science = good (very good, if supporting it = political point-scoring).

Annoying Science with Expensive Ramifications = bad.

De Boni has summarised the Nats’ attitude to science perfectly. She looks at their treatment of climate change science, of Mike Joy and his work on our water quality, and the “tacit approval” of (Slater’s) attacks on research in on the dietary effects of sugar. Then…

The Prime Minister’s chief science adviser, Sir Peter Gluckman, supports new rules governing what scientists can say in public because Governments are concerned scientists are straying into advocacy (i.e. saying things they don’t like) rather than sticking with their area of expertise.

One proposal that might ordinarily cause alarm is that scientists be gagged from speaking on controversial topics two months before an election, and at all other times, get permission from PR teams before doing so.

We going to have rules to muzzle scientists now? Really? How exactly does that square with Universities’ statutory role as critic and conscience of society? It would be a stupid battle for Gluckman to squander his reputation on.

87 comments on “Nats’ selective science ”

  1. tc 1

    How much of gluckmans reputation has already been devalued being the Nats science spin doctor for a few terms ?

    • Chooky 1.1

      +100….despite his pansy PR interviews on radionz…he is associated with “in the name of science trying to stiffle science and free debate”….words like contemptible spring to mind

  2. evnz 2

    One of the finest essays I’ve read for a while. Farmers are the same, happy to believe in vetinary science for their animals, food technology science for their products but not climate science explaining why they are having more droughts and floods.

  3. Whateva next? 3

    After Hard Talk interview, hard to take anyone seriously in this golf club govt.
    Mr.Key had no problem with the fact he could get any lawyer or scientist to say what he wanted them to say…..

  4. philj 4

    xox
    The dismemberment of the DSIR was a very sad day for science in NZ. Who,which Government did that? Our science has never recovered. Pretty much corporatised…. like most of government these days . Not to forget pulling Gov’t funding for Futures Research. In their wisdom maybe there isn’t a future , and were just saving some money.

    • jaymam 4.1

      According to Wikipedia the DSIR was reconstituted into profit-motivated entities called Crown Research Institutes by the Crown Research Institutes Act 1992.
      I guess that was National’s fault then.

  5. Derek 5

    He must be taking his lead from that jack ass Stephen Harper who has thoroughly gagged Canadian scientists

    • joe90 5.1

      Next up, muzzle the public and burn the books.

      “The new rules are undemocratic. They attempt to restrict the public’s participation in these hearings and prevent a real dialogue about the environmental impacts of the Line 9 pipeline project,” said Adam Scott of Environmental Defence. “Canadians should not have to apply for permission to have their voices heard on projects that carry serious risks to their communities.”

      http://www.newswire.ca/en/story/1141479/new-undemocratic-rules-create-barrier-to-public-participation-in-upcoming-pipeline-hearings-a-consequence-of-weakened-federal-environmental-laws-under

      Scientists say the closure of some of the world’s finest fishery, ocean and environmental libraries by the Harper government has been so chaotic that irreplaceable collections of intellectual capital built by Canadian taxpayers for future generations has been lost forever.

      Many collections such as the Maurice Lamontagne Institute Library in Mont-Joli, Quebec ended up in dumpsters while others such as Winnipeg’s historic Freshwater Institute library were scavenged by citizens, scientists and local environmental consultants. Others were burned or went to landfills, say scientists.

      http://thetyee.ca/News/2013/12/23/Canadian-Science-Libraries/

      • NZJester 5.1.1

        Wasn’t there another group that muzzled the scientists, burned the books, and selectively took pieces of research to prove their scientific theories. I think that group adopted a symbol that used to be a symbol of auspiciousness. I think they also had National in their name.

  6. Macro 6

    The shameful dealing of Dr Jim Salinger by NIWA early on in this “administration” is a case in point. Actually it has had the benefit of allowing Jim to speak out publicly far more freely than he was able to in the past. Nevertheless it was a very stressful time for him.

  7. Al 7

    No – these are crap days to be a New Zealander. I have been going steadily backwards under National, but do admit it wasn’t always good under Labour either (e.g. 1984 – 1989). The fact that the Tory’s chose to ignore Hager’s book was tacit acceptance of a corrupt government – then middle New Zealand followed suit!

    All that shows is the ignorance of the public. Colin is a great example – fully support war and depriving families of the right to bury their own with dignity. Probably supports Whaledump and anyone else within the Key junta. Economists talk about ‘capture’ and this is clearly the case in regards middle New Zealand and it’s lack of ability to critically decry neoliberal economic orthodoxy … despite the FACT that key underlying assumptions have been repeatedly debunked … assumptions such as the ‘efficient market hypothesis’, supply-side economics, self-regulating markets and at the individual level, homo economicus.

    No, it is a crap time to be a New Zealand. Thanks to the freaking Tory’s I currently can’t even afford to get out of this place to another country where rampant neoliberalism and it’s supporters are far away. No this wasn’t always the case, but after the deception leading up to the last election and the way it was all just disregarded as what Key calls “smoke and mirrors” is downright dispicable.

  8. Tracey 8

    as long as selected groups are not going into work camps or suffering pogroms or individuals are disappearing we should just sit quietly while freedom is eroded?

  9. tricle up 9

    There has been no problems with the free voice of science in the past the issues are relevant and must be brought to a full awareness science is sitting on the right side of time as issues are tabled and debated and facts revealed into the real world .freedom of expression resonates quite well thank you ..thanks Dita a good read .

  10. Fahrenheit 451 10

    To Sir Peter Gluckman,

    Your a member of the Royal Society?

    Remember this, or has your pay check & ego clouded your pompous memory:

    The Royal Society’s motto ‘Nullius in verba’ roughly translates as:

    “TAKE NOBODY’S WORD FOR IT”

    It is an expression of the determination of Fellows to withstand the domination of authority and to verify all statements by an appeal to facts determined by experiment. https://royalsociety.org/about-us/history/

    Its amazing how a scientist has suddenly become an expert in Social & Moral Philosophy. According to your rules mate, you cant comment…..

    Tis amazing how Gerry, John, Paula et al all become instant experts when the jump from portfolio to portfolio. This bag of sad egos are definitely not polymaths.

    Take a big running jump, you self important XXXXs.

    You really want a revolution don’t you.

  11. Fahrenheit 451 11

    That Nats and Sir Peter seem to want functional idiots (like useful idiots in the spy game), the ultimate in an intelligent yet stupid labor force.

    Yes thats right folks, as a functional idiot, you wont have any opinions outside of your remit given by the government. Keep working more efficiently and well give your masters a pay rise.

    Thank you Nanny Nat, I was scared of thinking out of the box, thank god you were here to steer me in the right direction.

    Oh, what about this:

    NOTE THE TPPA is coming, so gagging scientist would?

    Example of Gagging Scientists:

    1.Piltz revealed in 2005 that the Bush administration was revising supposedly scientific reports to cast doubt on the existence of human-caused climate change. He leaked copies of the edited documents to The New York Times, after resigning from his job as a senior associate for the U.S. government’s Global Change Research Office. https://firstlook.org/theintercept/2014/10/20/remembering-rick-piltz-fought-government-suppression-science/

    2.US drug firm drops libel action against scientist
    GE Healthcare says it did not mean to stifle academic debate with action against radiologist Henrik Thomsen
    http://www.theguardian.com/science/2010/feb/18/ge-healthcare-henrik-thomsen-libel

    3. The earth round the sun thingy:

    “On this day in 1633, chief inquisitor Father Vincenzo Maculano da Firenzuola, appointed by Pope Urban VIII, begins the inquisition of physicist and astronomer Galileo Galilei. Galileo was ordered to turn himself in to the Holy Office to begin trial for holding the belief that the Earth revolves around the Sun, which was deemed heretical by the Catholic Church. Standard practice demanded that the accused be imprisoned and secluded during the trial.”
    http://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/galileo-is-convicted-of-heresy

  12. Fahrenheit 451 12

    http://www.ucsusa.org/our-work/center-science-and-democracy

    The Center for Science and Democracy
    Engaged scientists + an informed public = a stronger democracy.

    “Science and democracy are powerful partners. The United States was founded on the conviction that an informed citizenry, armed with evidence and reason, can make wise decisions that promote public health, safety and well-being. Throughout our history, science has helped our nation deliver on that promise.

    But today, this legacy is slipping away. Science is sidelined or misrepresented by special interests. Scientists are attacked. Our broken political system struggles to find long-term solutions to urgent problems, while a fragmented, polarized media landscape makes it hard for the public to separate truth from spin or hold leaders accountable.

    Under these conditions, it is more important now than ever for scientists and citizens to work together, engage in our democratic processes, and push for reforms to ensure that our policies are informed by science and evidence. The Center for Science and Democracy was founded to advance these goals.”

    • Draco T Bastard 12.1

      In order to do this, the Patriot leaders of the Revolution used ‘a language inspiring to all classes, specific enough in its listing of grievances to charge people with anger against the British, vague enough to avoid class conflict among the rebels, and stirring enough to build a patriotic feeling for the resistance movement’ (1999: 68). But this was a difficult game for the Patriot leaders to play because it required a balancing act, maintaining broadly popular support for the War of Independence and Revolution by appealing to universal notions of liberty and democracy, on one hand, while simultaneously defending the sanctity of property and the rule of a rich capitalist minority, on the other.

      History of democracy by B. Roper

      And that is what we have in our representative democracy – rule by the rich.

      That said, more fact based information and engagement by scientists and the public will result in better democracy and, hopefully, the eventual replacement of representative democracy with participatory democracy.

  13. dave 13

    How long before they pass an act that makes it illeagle to publish any information or activity that challenges the status quo or disproves corporate or nacts view of reality as we get closer to economic collapse media and individual censorship will increase

  14. Bill 14

    It would be a stupid battle for Gluckman to squander his reputation on.

    Indeed it would. Scientists, academics and others are already effectively gagged, and self-censoring in order to avoid vilification from the Nat Party’s attack machine.

    I’m curious if threats to funding or to employment are also perceived ‘behavioural modifiers’ on the part of those same scientists and academics.

    edit – making noises about potential official censorship suggests no censorship at present. Backing off – as they inevitably will – will leave many people with the false impression that academics and scientists are currently free to comment as they see fit…which is not the case.

  15. seeker 15

    “I know John Key is an exceptionally busy man, but it was good to see him take the opportunity to pile on the opposition party back-bencher, the very last man on the Green Party list, and give him a serve for being “barking mad”……”

    I wonder if our Royalty ‘sychophant’ John Key would be so scathing of Prince Charles or indeed his mother Her Majesty the Queen who actually employs a Court Homeopath!
    The Royal Family are well known believers in the efficacy of homeopathy.(perhaps not for ebola though).

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/prince-charles/10433939/Prince-Charles-and-homeopathy-crank-or-revolutionary.html

    • Chooky 15.1

      +100…yes the Queenie Mother used homeopathy and drank gin and lived to be 101 ! ..in fact they all look rather healthy and well preserved on homeopathic medicine

      Not just royalty use homeopathy ….but our sophisticated scientist John Key of course knows better than most of Europe’s doctors and India’s doctors….such a great scientist he is… (NOT)…. that he can insult a large sector of the world’s medical fraternity and population in their choice of medicine…He makes New Zealand the laughing stock

      ‘Homeopathic Medicine: Europe’s #1 Alternative for Doctors

      http://www.huffingtonpost.com/dana-ullman/homeopathic-medicine-euro_b_402490.html

      ( Question: Who is “barking mad?”)

      • higherstandard 15.1.1

        ‘(Question: Who is “barking mad?”)’

        [RL: Deleted. Pointless abuse.]

        • higherstandard 15.1.1.1

          That was neither pointless nor was it abuse.

          This is abuse.

          Fuck off REDLOGIX you dreary old cunt.

          [RL: Heh – got a bite. I’m not going to delete, or ban you. Just leave this here for our collective amusement.]

          • ankerawshark 15.1.1.1.1

            Sorry whoever is moderating I would very much prefer to see the c word edited out. Would you consider this please?

            • Chooky 15.1.1.1.1.1

              +100 ankerawshark …’higherstandard’ is lowering the tone…however it was left to show him and his example of “pointless” … “abuse”… up

              looks like higherstandard is NOT a higherstandard on The Standard

              …maybe he should change his name to lowerstandard ?

        • Chooky 15.1.1.2

          who is “barking mad”?…well Prince Charles on John Key’s estimation ….and the Queen ….and the French

          “Homeopathy is popular not only among the French public but also among the French medical community. As many as 70 percent of physicians are receptive to homeopathy and consider it effective, at least 25,000 physicians prescribe homeopathic medicines for their patients. Homeopathy is taught in at least seven medical schools: Besancon, Bordeaux, Lille, Limoges, Marseille, Paris-Nord, and Poitiers, and there are numerous postgraduate training programs. Courses in homeopathy are taught in 21 of France’s 24 schools of pharmacy, and also taught in two dental schools, two veterinary medical schools, and three schools of midwivery.”

          and the Germans ( but then they would be wouldnt they ?..they are not very technologically advanced in the sciences…and homeopathy is definitely not scientific )

          “Approximately 10 percent of German doctors specialize in homeopathy, with approximately 10 percent more prescribing homeopathic remedies on occasion. In 1993, there were 1,993 medical doctors who had formally qualified in homeopathy, while in 2006, this number jumped over 100 percent to 6,073 (20)”

          What about the Italians?…”barking mad” as well i am afraid …

          “In 2004 a total of 7.5 million Italians use homeopathic medicines, 2.5 million more than a survey showed in 2000 (33)”

          …and the Swiss “barking mad” ….”The Swiss Federal Office for Public Health issued a report to the government of Switzerland which concluded that “the effectiveness of homeopathy can be supported by clinical evidence, and professional and adequate application be regarded as safe” (30).

          http://www.huffingtonpost.com/dana-ullman/homeopathic-medicine-euro_b_402490.html

          ( Conclusion : John Key and some narrow minded Wasp ‘scientists’ can’t understand homeopathy …but who cares?)

          • higherstandard 15.1.1.2.1

            I see you link to an article written by Dana Ullman

            “Dana Ullman is a notorious quack and one of homeopathy’s most vocal spokespersons. He has no qualifications in medicine or science (or, of more questionable relevance, in alt-med either) and has been arrested in the past for practising medicine without a license, resulting in his now being requested to sign contracts with each client he takes, declaring that he is not a doctor.
            Ullman is famous for claiming that Darwin was a fan of homeopathy, and that were it not for homeopathic remedies, he would not have been able to write ‘On the Origin of Species’. This was checkable, and turns out, unsurprisingly, to be poppycock.”

            “Ullman calls himself an “expert in homeopathic medicine” (which is akin to being a unicorn veterinarian) and since he has never been able to show that his particular health religion has any validity, he lashes out futilely at reality.”

            http://americanloons.blogspot.co.uk/2013/01/393-dana-ullman.html
            http://scienceblogs.com/whitecoatunderground/2010/04/30/dana-ullman/
            http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Dana_Ullman
            http://www.quackometer.net/blog/2007/12/homeopathic-revolution-by-dana-ullman.html

            • joe90 15.1.1.2.1.1

              Dude’s got his own internet law too.

              http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/the-dull-man-law/

            • Chooky 15.1.1.2.1.2

              whatever character assassination hatchet job you do on Dana Ullman who writes for the Huffington Post….. this does not negate the facts that Homeopathy is widely used and endorsed around the world and in technologically and scientifically advanced Western countries like France, Germany, Italy, Switzerland as well as India ….and it is used widely by doctors trained in Western medicine

              http://www.huffingtonpost.com/dana-ullman/homeopathic-medicine-euro_b_402490.html

              …In any case the subject of this post is the John Key Nact government’s closing down of open debate… especially on critical environmental and food issues …..by New Zealand scientists….aided and abetted by the Prime Minister’s chief science adviser, Sir Peter Gluckman

              ….lets stick to the topic and not get conveniently side tracked by red herrings ( by your ridiculing of Dan Ullman and homeopathy )

              • You bought up homeopathy you moron, don’t be upset when you are then presented with evidence that it is quackery of the highest order.

                To say it is widely used by Drs trained in Western medicine is as delusional and bizarre as your anti vaccination and anti fluoridation ravings.

                • Chooky

                  @ lowerstandard…..”you moron”?really?….stick to the facts ……no I didnt bring up homeopathy ….seeker did! (” pointless” …” abuse” again from you ?)

                  ….and stick to the facts…..homeopathy is widely used in Germany, France , Switzerland, Italy and Britain …and by doctors…and endorsed by the medical schools and medical establishments in those countries…..

                  ….”your anti vaccination and anti fluoridation ravings” ( more abuse?)

                  …again you are factually wrong!

                  ..I do not have an opinion on fluoridation (except to keep an open mind and keep learning)… I am sure fluoridation critics have good grounds ….and there are some reputable dentists and scientists among them

                  …..isnt it great in New Zealand that they can air their views freely ? (thus far)

                  I am not anti ALL vaccines …again stick to the facts!…..however like many others ( many doctors, immunologists and vaccine scientists and parents and caregivers with children) I am concerned about the ever increasing use of more and more vaccinations on very small babies and children, especially the combined MMR vaccine ( and now the corporates want to vaccinate pregnant women!)…anyone who has had a child with an adverse reaction to a vaccine and/or long term damage is very concerned!

                  ….( but then again you would like to close this debate down and abuse people who express critical views contrary to your own and the corporates’ multi billion dollar industries ..a mark of fascism imo)

                  • Higherstandard

                    On the contrary I’m happy for you to spout as much nonsense as you want.

                    Each and every time you venture forth to spout your ill informed non referenced and opinionated dross it serves to weaken your position.

                    If homeopathy is so effective why not apply to PHARMAC or DHBNZ for funding ?

                    I also note you have your usual dig at pharmaceutical companies.

                    I have been critical of the pharmaceutical industry for trying to put their thumb on the scale of the scientific process. I also agree with transparency in pharmaceutical payments to doctors, and academic researchers need to maintain their independence as much as possible.

                    At the same time, there are legitimate partnerships between academia and industry that produce tangible benefits for the public. It’s a tricky relationship, and it’s evolving in a good way, but there are problems.

                    However why don’t we look at homeopathic providers approach to their income. They get to charge patients with disposable income cash. They get to give every patient a specific answer, because they are just making it up, are homeopathic companies not making large profits from water, don’t homeopaths have a very vested interest in their claims, profession, and products none of which have any evidence of efficacy.

                    • Chooky

                      @ lowerstandard ….well i think people will make their own minds up about the quality of your arguments ( false accusations, character framing )

                      …your factual inaccuracies

                      ….and your refusal to face legitimate arguments head on

                      ….they will also note your setting up straw man arguments and red herrings rather than confront the topic at hand

                      ……which is freedom of speech of New Zealand scientists to speak out on matters of considerable scientific and public and environmental concern

                      ( btw…I am not against all pharmaceuticals , nor partnerships with academia…as long as it is properly monitored and ethical and the science is legitimate …Nor am I for all homeopathics regardless, nor do I prescribe homeopathics or take them often ( but when I have or my family has ,they have worked) …I merely note that in many Western countries they are used by populations and doctors and are regarded as having efficacy )

                    • higherstandard

                      Chooky as will people make up their minds about the quality of your arguments zero evidence, anecdotes and lies.

                      “…your factual inaccuracies”

                      🙄 the irony

                      “….and your refusal to face legitimate arguments head on”

                      🙄 the irony

                      “….they will also note your setting up straw man arguments and red herrings rather than confront the topic at hand”

                      🙄 the irony

                      “……which is freedom of speech of New Zealand scientists to speak out on matters of considerable scientific and public and environmental concern”

                      I’m no particular fan of gluckman however he only wants to stop scientists from being able to speak with scientific authority on topics that are outside of their area of expertise, such as the numpty bearded git which so many here complained about on breakfast TV.

                      ( btw…I am not against all pharmaceuticals , nor partnerships with academia…as long as it is properly monitored and ethical and the science is legitimate )

                      🙄 the irony

                      ps +100 …..

                    • Chooky

                      higherstandard? …. irony

                    • higherstandard

                      +100..

                      Oh what a riposte, quick send for an ambulance I’m mortally wounded

                    • Chooky

                      @ knucklehead …..stabbed yourself in the nom de plume did you?.

                      … the ambulance should only be called out out for serious injuries ( waste of taxpayer money otherwise)

                    • higherstandard

                      +100 😆 and 🙄

      • KJT 15.1.2

        Drinking water IS good for you!

      • One Anonymous Bloke 15.1.3

        You have to shake it just so. Not stirring. Stirring doesn’t work. And you have to think very hard about Jean Harlowe as you shake it, to calm your spirit and invoke the ether and the higher powers.

        Don’t tell me you forgot the salt on the window-sill!

        • higherstandard 15.1.3.1

          Mitchell and Webb on homeopathy

          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HMGIbOGu8q0

        • RedLogix 15.1.3.2

          Yeah but it’s very effective at invoking the placebo effect if nothing else. It’s just not worth faffing on about.

          Homeopathy isn’t going to raise global temperatures 2- 6 degC.

          • One Anonymous Bloke 15.1.3.2.1

            It might waste a lot of water in a world where water scarcity causes wars.

            • Chooky 15.1.3.2.1.1

              @ oAB…re homeopathy …”It might waste a lot of water in a world where water scarcity causes wars”….bullshit ( ridicule)

              …just because you cant understand something doesnt mean it is worthless or doesnt work …eg quantum mechanics…it works ….but who completely understands quantum physics?

              ….same with homeopathy …it works for many people/cultures/doctors around the world ….so don’t dis it just because you cant understand it..it has scientific validity because it has empirical efficacy

              • One Anonymous Bloke

                Shake it baby, shake it.

                I like the video of Randi overdosing on sleeping sugar pills. How about you?

                • Chooky

                  diversion?

                  • One Anonymous Bloke

                    Well, you were blithering about someone who “doesn’t understand” the Sugar Pill Placebo scam, so you can’t have been talking about me, because I’ve read “Doctor” Peter Fisher’s evidence to the Science & Tech Committee of the UK Parliament, which lays out the scam in plain language.

                    It has high comedic value:

                    Dr Fisher stated that the process of “shaking is important” but was unable to say how much shaking was required. He said “that has not been fully investigated” but did tell us that “You have to shake it vigorously […] if you just stir it gently, it does not work”.

                    Of course, it isn’t funny for the victims.

      • NZJester 15.1.4

        A lot of modern synthetic medicine are derived from copies of compounds found in plants. Some natural medicines can work just as well as or better than some of their synthetic forms. However there are also some that do not work quite as well or are near useless without artificial modification. Because natural products can not be patented drug companies push the synthetics and try to stifle the natural products that are helpful. Another problem also is there are some snake-oil salesmen that have also become involved in the Homeopathic scene. There are Homeopathic medicines out there that can be better for you than some modern drugs but sometimes they are very hard to find due to the drug companies and the snake-oil salesmen keeping people away from them.
        Do your research if you are going to use Homeopathic medicines and do not completely rule out the synthetic drugs.

        • One Anonymous Bloke 15.1.4.1

          Homeopathy isn’t a medicine, let alone a natural one: it was conjured out of whole cloth in the late 19thC, and closely resembles trickledown economic dogma.

          By comparison, digitalin, aspirin, etc etc, are naturally-derived medicines, and honey is good for wounds.

          Shaken, not stirred.

        • higherstandard 15.1.4.2

          “There are Homeopathic medicines out there that can be better for you than some modern drugs”

          Name one “homeopathic medicine” and the disease/condition it treats that can be better for someone than the equivalent treatment as recognised by mainstream healthcare.

          • One Anonymous Bloke 15.1.4.2.1

            Neoliberalism. Thinking very hard about homeopathy and neoliberalism can cure neoliberalism.

            • higherstandard 15.1.4.2.1.1

              Reading your political diatribes is probably quite an effective treatment for insomnia

              • One Anonymous Bloke

                Probably? Where’s your confidence? That’s part of the problem with having a distended amygdala: you’re only confident when you’re calm, and when you’re afraid you go to pieces so fast people get hit by the shrapnel.

                (h/t Douglas Adams)

      • Murray Rawshark 15.1.5

        I’m pretty sure the royals use conventional medicine as well. I’d be quite happy for them to use nothing but homeopathy.

    • RedBaronCV 15.2

      Perhaps if John Key is so medically enabled he could nip down and do some of that elective surgery that’s waiting.

  16. Fahrenheit 451 16

    What guts me the most about National, is that their synapses calcify on hearing the money mantra. They will poke your eyes out to make a buck then laugh at you for being blind.

    Here are lessons learned from European Environmental Agency to see some balance
    Late lessons from early warnings: the precautionary principle 1896–2000

    http://chemicalspolicy.org/downloads/Issue%20Report%20No%2022.pdf

    1. Acknowledge and respond to ignorance, as well as uncertainty and risk, in
    technology appraisal and public policymaking.

    2. Provide adequate long-term environmental and health monitoring and research into early warnings.

    3. Identify and work to reduce ‘blind spots’ and gaps in scientific knowledge.

    4. Identify and reduce interdisciplinary obstacles to learning.

    5. Ensure that real world conditions are adequately accounted for in regulatory appraisal.

    6. Systematically scrutinise the claimed justifications and benefits alongside the potential risks.

    7. Evaluate a range of alternative options for meeting needs alongside the option

    8. Ensure use of ‘lay’ and local knowledge, as well as relevant specialist expertise in
    the appraisal.

    9. Take full account of the assumptions and values of different social groups.

    10. Maintain the regulatory independence of interested parties while retaining an
    inclusive approach to information and opinion gathering.

    11. Identify and reduce institutional obstacles to learning and action.

    12. Avoid ‘paralysis by analysis’ by acting to reduce potential harm when there are reasonable grounds for concern.

    Latest report here:
    http://www.eea.europa.eu/publications/late-lessons-2.

    To end with quotes:

    “With school turning out more runners, jumpers, racers, tinkerers, grabbers, snatchers, fliers, and swimmers instead of examiners, critics, knowers, and imaginative creators, the word ‘intellectual,’ of course, became the swear word it deserved to be.”

    “A book is a loaded gun in the house next door…Who knows who might be the target of the well-read man?”

    Ray Bradbury, Fahrenheit 451

  17. NZJester 17

    Nothing says we are not a fascist government more than gagging scientists and having the police raid journalists houses.

    • One Anonymous Bloke 17.1

      Atrocities. Vicious, organised public violence against minorities (ACT voters, or S Rylands, for example). That would say it more.

      What we have is greedy fuckwits, not fascists.

      • Paul 17.1.1

        Sadly a lot of the upper middle class is wilfully ignorant.

        As long as their foreign holiday is safe.
        As long as they can but either new Audi.
        As long as their house prices keeps going up.

        The house of cards will only collapse when they realise their own position is vulnerable.

        First they came……

  18. Simon 18

    This post represents a wrongful interpretation of Gluckman’s idea. He wants to stop scientists from being able to speak with scientific authority on topics that are outside of their area of expertise.

    A key example comes to mind: On the radio there is a company that sells vitamins, with the owner and pusher labeling himself as a ‘scientist’. For most people, the tacit assumption is that he is a biologist or something related to vitamins etc. In reality he has a masters in geology.

    There are countless other examples of this….and I totally condone Gluckman in this case.

    • Murray Rawshark 18.1

      I don’t believe the Key regime would be looking at this if you were correct. They want to muzzle people like Mike Joy and Peter Wills.

    • One Anonymous Bloke 18.2

      If the media are so lazy and stupid as to cite Geologists on Biology, the problem is media laziness and stupidity. The Geologist has no authority to relinquish since they are by definition presenting a lay opinion.

      However, it might backfire quite spectacularly when politicians (the member for Epsom leaps to mind) start mouthing off their faith based gobshite on subjects of which they are utterly ignorant.

    • Chooky 18.3

      @ Simon….in so far as a scientist is able to use scientific method and evidence to validate his/her claims….. and is open to critique by other scientists ( in the case you cite especially nutritionists, chemists and micro biologists) …i dont see any problem with scientists speaking out on issues outside their particular expertise

      ….the crucial thing is that scientists can support their claims with evidence and are open to critique and further debate using scientific method

      ( afterall is Gluckman a specialist in environmental issues or an ultimate authority on nutrition? …or for that matter is John Key?)

      • Chooky 18.3.1

        and Simon….another point….just because a scientist is trained in a particular scientific field….and a so-called expert ….this does not make them necessarily an unimpeachable authority …or ethical

        …they may have been bought and corrupted by the corporates

        ….there are plenty examples of shonkey ‘scientific’ results to fit in with corporate desires and expectations eg the tobacco industry and pharmaceutical industry

  19. Sable 19

    There’s nothing honest about this government and their dealings with the the institutions of government not to mention the public.

    The media is in their corner as little more than paid scribes and now they are going after the last groups of people in government institutions who could challenge their lies.

    No doubt this is paving the way for the sleazy traitorous TPPA and the selling of this country and its environment to marauding US interests for 30 pieces of silver.

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    4 days ago
  • Govt ignored economic analysis of smokefree reversal
    Costello did not pass on analysis of the benefits of the smokefree reforms to Cabinet, emphasising instead the extra tax revenues of repealing them. Photo: Hagen Hopkins, Getty Images TL;DR: The six news items that stood out to me at 7:26 am today are:The Lead: Casey Costello never passed on ...
    The KakaBy Bernard Hickey
    5 days ago
  • True Blue.
    True loveYou're the one I'm dreaming ofYour heart fits me like a gloveAnd I'm gonna be true blueBaby, I love youI’ve written about the job cuts in our news media last week. The impact on individuals, and the loss to Aotearoa of voices covering our news from different angles.That by ...
    Nick’s KōreroBy Nick Rockel
    5 days ago
  • Who is running New Zealand’s foreign policy?
    While commentators, including former Prime Minister Helen Clark, are noting a subtle shift in New Zealand’s foreign policy, which now places more emphasis on the United States, many have missed a key element of the shift. What National said before the election is not what the government is doing now. ...
    PolitikBy Richard Harman
    5 days ago
  • 2024 SkS Weekly Climate Change & Global Warming News Roundup #15
    A listing of 31 news and opinion articles we found interesting and shared on social media during the past week: Sun, April 7, 2024 thru Sat, April 13, 2024. Story of the week Our story of the week is about adults in the room setting terms and conditions of ...
    5 days ago

  • $41m to support clean energy in South East Asia
    New Zealand is demonstrating its commitment to reducing global greenhouse emissions, and supporting clean energy transition in South East Asia, through a contribution of NZ$41 million (US$25 million) in climate finance to the Asian Development Bank (ADB)-led Energy Transition Mechanism (ETM). Prime Minister Christopher Luxon and Climate Change Minister Simon Watts announced ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 hours ago
  • Minister releases Fast-track stakeholder list
    The Government is today releasing a list of organisations who received letters about the Fast-track applications process, says RMA Reform Minister Chris Bishop. “Recently Ministers and agencies have received a series of OIA requests for a list of organisations to whom I wrote with information on applying to have a ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    8 hours ago
  • Judicial appointments announced
    Attorney-General Judith Collins today announced the appointment of Wellington Barrister David Jonathan Boldt as a Judge of the High Court, and the Honourable Justice Matthew Palmer as a Judge of the Court of Appeal. Justice Boldt graduated with an LLB from Victoria University of Wellington in 1990, and also holds ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    8 hours ago
  • Education Minister heads to major teaching summit in Singapore
    Education Minister Erica Stanford will lead the New Zealand delegation at the 2024 International Summit on the Teaching Profession (ISTP) held in Singapore. The delegation includes representatives from the Post Primary Teachers’ Association (PPTA) Te Wehengarua and the New Zealand Educational Institute (NZEI) Te Riu Roa.  The summit is co-hosted ...
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    9 hours ago
  • Value of stopbank project proven during cyclone
    A stopbank upgrade project in Tairawhiti partly funded by the Government has increased flood resilience for around 7000ha of residential and horticultural land so far, Regional Development Minister Shane Jones says. Mr Jones today attended a dawn service in Gisborne to mark the end of the first stage of the ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    9 hours ago
  • Anzac commemorations, Türkiye relationship focus of visit
    Foreign Affairs Minister Winston Peters will represent the Government at Anzac Day commemorations on the Gallipoli Peninsula next week and engage with senior representatives of the Turkish government in Istanbul.    “The Gallipoli campaign is a defining event in our history. It will be a privilege to share the occasion ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    10 hours ago
  • Minister to Europe for OECD meeting, Anzac Day
    Science, Innovation and Technology and Defence Minister Judith Collins will next week attend the OECD Science and Technology Ministerial conference in Paris and Anzac Day commemorations in Belgium. “Science, innovation and technology have a major role to play in rebuilding our economy and achieving better health, environmental and social outcomes ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    12 hours ago
  • Comprehensive Partnership the goal for NZ and the Philippines
    Prime Minister Christopher Luxon held a bilateral meeting today with the President of the Philippines, Ferdinand Marcos Jr.  The Prime Minister was accompanied by MP Paulo Garcia, the first Filipino to be elected to a legislature outside the Philippines. During today’s meeting, Prime Minister Luxon and President Marcos Jr discussed opportunities to ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    23 hours ago
  • Government commits $20m to Westport flood protection
    The Government has announced that $20 million in funding will be made available to Westport to fund much needed flood protection around the town. This measure will significantly improve the resilience of the community, says Local Government Minister Simeon Brown. “The Westport community has already been allocated almost $3 million ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 day ago
  • Taupō takes pole position
    The Government is proud to support the first ever Repco Supercars Championship event in Taupō as up to 70,000 motorsport fans attend the Taupō International Motorsport Park this weekend, says Economic Development Minister Melissa Lee. “Anticipation for the ITM Taupō Super400 is huge, with tickets and accommodation selling out weeks ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 day ago
  • Cost of living support for low-income homeowners
    Local Government Minister Simeon Brown has announced an increase to the Rates Rebate Scheme, putting money back into the pockets of low-income homeowners.  “The coalition Government is committed to bringing down the cost of living for New Zealanders. That includes targeted support for those Kiwis who are doing things tough, such ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 day ago
  • Government backing mussel spat project
    The Coalition Government is investing in a project to boost survival rates of New Zealand mussels and grow the industry, Oceans and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones has announced. “This project seeks to increase the resilience of our mussels and significantly boost the sector’s productivity,” Mr Jones says. “The project - ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 day ago
  • Government focused on getting people into work
    Benefit figures released today underscore the importance of the Government’s plan to rebuild the economy and have 50,000 fewer people on Jobseeker Support, Social Development and Employment Minister Louise Upston says. “Benefit numbers are still significantly higher than when National was last in government, when there was about 70,000 fewer ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 day ago
  • Clean energy key driver to reducing emissions
    The Government’s commitment to doubling New Zealand’s renewable energy capacity is backed by new data showing that clean energy has helped the country reach its lowest annual gross emissions since 1999, Climate Change Minister Simon Watts says. New Zealand’s latest Greenhouse Gas Inventory (1990-2022) published today, shows gross emissions fell ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • Earthquake-prone buildings review brought forward
    The Government is bringing the earthquake-prone building review forward, with work to start immediately, and extending the deadline for remediations by four years, Building and Construction Minister Chris Penk says. “Our Government is focused on rebuilding the economy. A key part of our plan is to cut red tape that ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • Thailand and NZ to agree to Strategic Partnership
    Prime Minister Christopher Luxon and his Thai counterpart, Prime Minister Srettha Thavisin, have today agreed that New Zealand and the Kingdom of Thailand will upgrade the bilateral relationship to a Strategic Partnership by 2026. “New Zealand and Thailand have a lot to offer each other. We have a strong mutual desire to build ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • Government consults on extending coastal permits for ports
    RMA Reform Minister Chris Bishop and Transport Minister Simeon Brown have today announced the Coalition Government’s intention to extend port coastal permits for a further 20 years, providing port operators with certainty to continue their operations. “The introduction of the Resource Management Act in 1991 required ports to obtain coastal ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • Inflation coming down, but more work to do
    Today’s announcement that inflation is down to 4 per cent is encouraging news for Kiwis, but there is more work to be done - underlining the importance of the Government’s plan to get the economy back on track, acting Finance Minister Chris Bishop says. “Inflation is now at 4 per ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • School attendance restored as a priority in health advice
    Refreshed health guidance released today will help parents and schools make informed decisions about whether their child needs to be in school, addressing one of the key issues affecting school attendance, says Associate Education Minister David Seymour. In recent years, consistently across all school terms, short-term illness or medical reasons ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • Unnecessary bureaucracy cut in oceans sector
    Oceans and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones is streamlining high-level oceans management while maintaining a focus on supporting the sector’s role in the export-led recovery of the economy. “I am working to realise the untapped potential of our fishing and aquaculture sector. To achieve that we need to be smarter with ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Patterson promoting NZ’s wool sector at International Congress
    Associate Agriculture Minister Mark Patterson is speaking at the International Wool Textile Organisation Congress in Adelaide, promoting New Zealand wool, and outlining the coalition Government’s support for the revitalisation the sector.    "New Zealand’s wool exports reached $400 million in the year to 30 June 2023, and the coalition Government ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • Removing red tape to help early learners thrive
    The Government is making legislative changes to make it easier for new early learning services to be established, and for existing services to operate, Associate Education Minister David Seymour says. The changes involve repealing the network approval provisions that apply when someone wants to establish a new early learning service, ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 days ago
  • RMA changes to cut coal mining consent red tape
    Changes to the Resource Management Act will align consenting for coal mining to other forms of mining to reduce barriers that are holding back economic development, Resources Minister Shane Jones says. “The inconsistent treatment of coal mining compared with other extractive activities is burdensome red tape that fails to acknowledge ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 days ago
  • McClay reaffirms strong NZ-China trade relationship
    Trade, Agriculture and Forestry Minister Todd McClay has concluded productive discussions with ministerial counterparts in Beijing today, in support of the New Zealand-China trade and economic relationship. “My meeting with Commerce Minister Wang Wentao reaffirmed the complementary nature of the bilateral trade relationship, with our Free Trade Agreement at its ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 days ago
  • Prime Minister Luxon acknowledges legacy of Singapore Prime Minister Lee
    Prime Minister Christopher Luxon today paid tribute to Singapore’s outgoing Prime Minister Lee Hsien Loong.   Meeting in Singapore today immediately before Prime Minister Lee announced he was stepping down, Prime Minister Luxon warmly acknowledged his counterpart’s almost twenty years as leader, and the enduring legacy he has left for Singapore and South East ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 days ago
  • PMs Luxon and Lee deepen Singapore-NZ ties
    Prime Minister Christopher Luxon held a bilateral meeting today with Singapore Prime Minister Lee Hsien Loong. While in Singapore as part of his visit to South East Asia this week, Prime Minister Luxon also met with Singapore President Tharman Shanmugaratnam and will meet with Deputy Prime Minister Lawrence Wong.  During today’s meeting, Prime Minister Luxon ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 days ago
  • Antarctica New Zealand Board appointments
    Foreign Minister Winston Peters has made further appointments to the Board of Antarctica New Zealand as part of a continued effort to ensure the Scott Base Redevelopment project is delivered in a cost-effective and efficient manner.  The Minister has appointed Neville Harris as a new member of the Board. Mr ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 days ago
  • Finance Minister travels to Washington DC
    Finance Minister Nicola Willis will travel to the United States on Tuesday to attend a meeting of the Five Finance Ministers group, with counterparts from Australia, the United States, Canada, and the United Kingdom.  “I am looking forward to meeting with our Five Finance partners on how we can work ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 days ago
  • Pet bonds a win/win for renters and landlords
    The coalition Government has today announced purrfect and pawsitive changes to the Residential Tenancies Act to give tenants with pets greater choice when looking for a rental property, says Housing Minister Chris Bishop. “Pets are important members of many Kiwi families. It’s estimated that around 64 per cent of New ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    4 days ago
  • Long Tunnel for SH1 Wellington being considered
    State Highway 1 (SH1) through Wellington City is heavily congested at peak times and while planning continues on the duplicate Mt Victoria Tunnel and Basin Reserve project, the Government has also asked NZ Transport Agency (NZTA) to consider and provide advice on a Long Tunnel option, Transport Minister Simeon Brown ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
  • New Zealand condemns Iranian strikes
    Prime Minister Christopher Luxon and Foreign Minister Winston Peters have condemned Iran’s shocking and illegal strikes against Israel.    “These attacks are a major challenge to peace and stability in a region already under enormous pressure," Mr Luxon says.    "We are deeply concerned that miscalculation on any side could ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    5 days ago
  • Huge interest in Government’s infrastructure plans
    Hundreds of people in little over a week have turned out in Northland to hear Regional Development Minister Shane Jones speak about plans for boosting the regional economy through infrastructure. About 200 people from the infrastructure and associated sectors attended an event headlined by Mr Jones in Whangarei today. Last ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Health Minister thanks outgoing Health New Zealand Chair
    Health Minister Dr Shane Reti has today thanked outgoing Health New Zealand – Te Whatu Ora Chair Dame Karen Poutasi for her service on the Board.   “Dame Karen tendered her resignation as Chair and as a member of the Board today,” says Dr Reti.  “I have asked her to ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Roads of National Significance planning underway
    The NZ Transport Agency (NZTA) has signalled their proposed delivery approach for the Government’s 15 Roads of National Significance (RoNS), with the release of the State Highway Investment Proposal (SHIP) today, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says.  “Boosting economic growth and productivity is a key part of the Government’s plan to ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Navigating an unstable global environment
    New Zealand is renewing its connections with a world facing urgent challenges by pursuing an active, energetic foreign policy, Foreign Minister Winston Peters says.   “Our country faces the most unstable global environment in decades,” Mr Peters says at the conclusion of two weeks of engagements in Egypt, Europe and the United States.    “We cannot afford to sit back in splendid ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • NZ welcomes Australian Governor-General
    Prime Minister Christopher Luxon has announced the Australian Governor-General, His Excellency General The Honourable David Hurley and his wife Her Excellency Mrs Linda Hurley, will make a State visit to New Zealand from Tuesday 16 April to Thursday 18 April. The visit reciprocates the State visit of former Governor-General Dame Patsy Reddy ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Pseudoephedrine back on shelves for Winter
    Associate Health Minister David Seymour has announced that Medsafe has approved 11 cold and flu medicines containing pseudoephedrine. Pharmaceutical suppliers have indicated they may be able to supply the first products in June. “This is much earlier than the original expectation of medicines being available by 2025. The Government recognised ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • NZ and the US: an ever closer partnership
    New Zealand and the United States have recommitted to their strategic partnership in Washington DC today, pledging to work ever more closely together in support of shared values and interests, Foreign Minister Winston Peters says.    “The strategic environment that New Zealand and the United States face is considerably more ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Joint US and NZ declaration
    April 11, 2024 Joint Declaration by United States Secretary of State the Honorable Antony J. Blinken and New Zealand Minister of Foreign Affairs the Right Honourable Winston Peters We met today in Washington, D.C. to recommit to the historic partnership between our two countries and the principles that underpin it—rule ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • NZ and US to undertake further practical Pacific cooperation
    Foreign Minister Winston Peters has announced further New Zealand cooperation with the United States in the Pacific Islands region through $16.4 million in funding for initiatives in digital connectivity and oceans and fisheries research.   “New Zealand can achieve more in the Pacific if we work together more urgently and ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago

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