NBR: Laila Harre to lead the Internet Party

Written By: - Date published: 3:17 pm, May 28th, 2014 - 302 comments
Categories: election 2014 - Tags: ,

Twitter is reporting that NBR, behind its paywall, claims (sources say) Laila Harre will lead the Internet Party.

I honestly don’t know what my reaction is (and of course it’s all unconfirmed at this point) … so provide yours in the comments!

302 comments on “NBR: Laila Harre to lead the Internet Party”

  1. Ant 1

    Wow, that’s kind of awesome in some way.

  2. lprent 2

    I’ve been reading that. If true it would be inspired at conforming the general direction of the Internet Mana party.

    It would piss the Greens off. But I suspect that wouldn’t have been the objective.

    • mickysavage 2.1

      I agree the Greens will be concerned …

      • KJT 2.1.1

        This Green is not concerned.

        In fact I do not care which party is in power, so long as we reverse the destruction of New Zealand by the Neo-Liberal religion.

        National adopting more left wing policies to stay in power, even if only as a façade, shows they are losing the battle of ideas.

      • Pascal's bookie 2.1.2

        Only Greens I’ve seen upset are fairly excitable ones anyway. I’m not concerned at all.

      • Skinny 2.1.3

        Norman on the tv news tonight certainly gave the impression of the ‘green eye of envy’ I saw a similar reaction from him when The Internet Party was first mooted. I guess he is experiencing what some within Labour must feel as the Greens chip away at ‘their perceived’ cut of the party vote.

        With Harr’e as leader the game has changed significantly as many of us on the left respect her immensely. It also shows The Internet Party has a chance of longevity regardless of what happens to DotBlobby. What a bugger they linked up with alpha male Hone. Still they are separate and has the promise of a real Left alternative to both Labour & Greens. Now 3% to 5 % looks quite on the cards.

    • lprent 2.2

      Oh. Not an issue. I wasn’t aware that she’d stopped working for them.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laila_Harr%C3%A9

      In 2012 she was employed by the Green Party after working for the International Labour Organisation in Fiji since 2010.

      Harré resigned from her role with the Green Party in 2013 and is currently co-owner of an upmarket Auckland restaurant accredited as one of New Zealand’s first living wage employers.[9]

      I missed that last year. Too much work. I am feeling it now as I wrangle a bit of a holiday. Wound up leaving the project with 6 weeks holiday pay. Holidays that I hadn’t taken over the last 4 years

      • Ron 2.2.1

        I thought she was working for Labour presently?

      • karol 2.2.2

        Turei has been reported this afternoon as saying, Harre quit the Green Party in December 2013 to do other stuff. She has been working for the “Get out the Vote” campaign.

        I also don’t think Harre leading the IP is a problem for the Greens – more of a problem for Winston, the Maori Party and National.

        • Grantoc 2.2.2.1

          Why would Harre be a problem for the National Party?

          Her hard left/green/unionist credentials will have zero attraction to National Party supporters I would have thought.

          It looks like Dotcom is going to end up paying the bills for a hard left party, which makes me wonder what on earth he’s going to get out of the deal.

          • Colonial Viper 2.2.2.1.1

            Thanks for identifying for us the National attack line of choice: “hard left.” Handy to know.

            Her hard left/green/unionist credentials will have zero attraction to National Party supporters I would have thought.

            Clue – they aren’t going after dyed blue National Party supporters.

            • Lanthanide 2.2.2.1.1.1

              You don’t need to get it from a pseudonymous commenter on this blog to work out their attack line is “hard left”.

              John Key said the election was between “extreme left and centre right”. I think it’s a miscalculation on his part, because while there are a lot of drones that repeat what he says, there are also a lot of people that actually think for themselves and would recognise Labour as centre-left and Greens as left, which does not an “extreme left” government make.

              • Colonial Viper

                I agree, it actually sounds disingenuous of Key when he uses the line.

          • Cancerman 2.2.2.1.2

            He gets his extradition blocked when the courts say he should be extradited.

            • Colonial Viper 2.2.2.1.2.1

              Nah, NZ, for the most part, is still under the rule of law.

            • One Anonymous Bloke 2.2.2.1.2.2

              Are you such a fuckwit you think Imp has a chance of heading the MoJ, or are you just a dishonest low-life parroting lies you’ve been spoonfed?

              I’m going with dishonest and spoonfed.

              • Cancerman

                Yeah i figure its not going to happen but i can’t see what Kim Dotcom is doing otherwise. He is not left wing and I don’t believe he cares that much about NZ infrastructure.

                • One Anonymous Bloke

                  Paucity of imagination must be familiar to you by now.

                • felix

                  “Yeah i figure its not going to happen but i can’t see what Kim Dotcom is doing otherwise. “

                  I can’t see what my neighbours are doing. Guess they must be fucking a goat.

            • Stephanie Rodgers 2.2.2.1.2.3

              Okay, so we’ve established Cancerman doesn’t understand how extradition orders work.

            • Stuart Munro 2.2.2.1.2.4

              Unlikely – extradition is only for criminal actions. Copyright violation is civil.

              • Markymark

                Dotcom is facing criminal copyright charges you fuckwit.

                • Colonial Viper

                  Why should a major step such as extradition be allowed for bullshit US copyright charges?

                  Especially when the processes and procedures around Dotcom’s arrest were completely arsed up by the authorities who seem only intent on getting a scalp for their US Hollywood mates.

                  • Markymark

                    Any decent society must have protections for IP and intellectual endeavour and not simply allow convicted white collar criminals to steal other’s ideas and creativity, and profit out of such theft.

                    It’s not bloody rocket science.

                    Also on what basis do you say the US charges are bullshit? Dotcom’s Mega patently allowed for the sharing of copyrighted work and did not remove such infringing material even after they were contacted by the right’s holder

                    The cases very similar to past litigation in Australia (with Kazaa) and Napster overseas – in which btoh file sharing entities were shut down.

                    Just because the victim here is Hollywood, doesn’t nullify the rule of law or the fact that stealing other people’s content is illegal and unethical.

                    • Colonial Viper

                      Any decent society has to respect a rule of law which doesn’t include sending in USA style SWAT teams into a family home, stealing property from that home not covered by any warrant, illegally shipping said property off to the USA, then organising for the private property of clients (business files, family photos, home videos, etc.) stored on KDC’s servers to be arbitrarily destroyed with no compensation.

                      So sorry, the authorities with their blatant disregard for due process (and your miserably inaccurate statements of the facts of the case) deserve to get knocked back to show them that THEY are not beyond the law and not beyond respecting due process.

                      and did not remove such infringing material even after they were contacted by the right’s holder

                      I believe you are making this up. Link please.

                      Just because the victim here is Hollywood, doesn’t nullify the rule of law or the fact that stealing other people’s content is illegal and unethical.

                      Stealing (and destroying) other peoples content as stored on KDC’s servers is exactly what the authorities have done, yet you are (unsurprisingly) backing only your big business paymasters.

                      Go away you corporate rights freak.

                    • Colonial Viper

                      And the fact that you think a “decent society” is predicated on the property rights of corporations first and foremost tells me that you can go get fucked.

                    • Populuxe1

                      Um, CV, the law goes both ways. Otherwise the big corporations would be ripping off the little gut left right and centre (or, at least, even more so than usual)

                • Stuart Munro

                  Charming – but the criminal charges descend from the civil case. If KDC fits into the same bracket as Youtube for example, the moneys he obtained cannot be judged to be laundered or racketeered. Recent precedent tends to support KDC’s position.

                  You’ll have to do better than that – moron.

  3. Andre 3

    24 hours then we can debate

  4. Kaplan 4

    That’s definitely a big win for them if it’s true.

    • One Anonymous Bloke 4.1

      Yep. Her brand is stronger than theirs in my book.

      • Colonial Viper 4.1.1

        Indeed – that’s what corporates look for in their front people.

        • One Anonymous Bloke 4.1.1.1

          They should go for intellectual and moral purity and choose you instead. I tried telling them, honest.

          • Colonial Viper 4.1.1.1.1

            All I know is that I’m not a Drone Democrat.

            • One Anonymous Bloke 4.1.1.1.1.1

              The thing with barbs is they need a little truth to poison the tip. Since I am unequivocal in my opposition to the deployment of military resources against civilians your barb lacks bite, armchair MP.

              • Colonial Viper

                Since I am unequivocal in my opposition to the deployment of military resources against civilians your barb lacks bite, armchair MP.

                Armchair MP? But not a Drone Democrat like you are.

                Continue to studiously ignore how these weapon systems have actually been used in the field over many many years by USA, Israel and others if it makes your conscience feel cleaner.

                A world where you can give the thumbs up to a weapon system like the Reaper while taking moral cover for doing so by saying, oh, I wouldn’t ever sanction inappropriate use of it so its OK.

                • One Anonymous Bloke

                  What the fuck are you drivelling now?

                  I suggest you read my comments carefully with a dictionary to hand and come back if you can’t figure out how they represent total opposition to the use of drone attacks.

                  Your bigoted failure to comprehend that is your problem not mine.

                  • Colonial Viper

                    I suggest you read my comments carefully with a dictionary to hand and come back if you can’t figure out how they represent total opposition to the use of drone attacks.

                    So you’d support a complete ban on armed UAVs around NZ?

                    • One Anonymous Bloke

                      The law already makes deployment of weapons against civilians in peacetime illegal. Remember the bows and arrows or do I have to walk you through that again?

                      Our peacekeepers might find them useful, and I’d leave that up to them but I’d prosecute anyone who deployed them the way the US has.

                      You can commit war-crimes with a shotgun. Shall we ban those too?

                    • Colonial Viper

                      I’m not talking about a ban on attacking civilians.

                      I’m asking whether you would support banning armed military UAVs in NZ air space.

                      Or are you OK with armed military drones (NZ ones, and also with govt approval American, Australian or otherwise) flying in our airspace?

                      You can commit war-crimes with a shotgun. Shall we ban those too?

                      A beautiful argument, worthy of the NRA in fact.

                    • Populuxe1

                      Were you against our skyhawks flying in our airspace too, CV?

                    • One Anonymous Bloke

                      🙄

                      You are still confused on this point? Let me see if I can spell it out: war crimes are a bad thing, and we don’t support bad things, do we?

                    • Colonial Viper

                      OK OAB – I take it you are fine with armed drones – even foreign ones operating in NZ airspace. No ban from you on Reapers and Predators over NZ soil then.

                      Pop: Skyhawks, F-16’s are fine no problem there. You can tell where the plane is piloted from (the jet’s cockpit), not a drone control station in Texas or North Carolina.

                    • One Anonymous Bloke

                      Then you take it wrong. You got the wrong end of the stick yesterday and you’re grimly hanging onto it, flailing around with your querulous bullshit and double standards.

                    • Colonial Viper

                      I’ve got it wrong OAB? So you support the banning of armed UAVs over NZ airspace then?

                      It’s a simple question, feel free to answer yes you would ban Reapers and Predators, or no you wouldn’t.

                    • One Anonymous Bloke

                      Piloted by whom from where to what purpose?

  5. Tamati 5

    Stand by for an almighty turf war on the far left. The Greens will livid that Harre crossed them and will now be targeting the same voters.

    Good score for the the internet party though. Plenty of experience is a plus in such a new party.

    • hoom 5.1

      I don’t see why Greens would be upset about this.

      As a Green supporter & voter I welcome the prospect of seeing another good leftie voice in the public space.

      Prospect of Greens + Hone + Laila + Annette Sykes etc being in next Parliament is pretty awesome.

      • Tamati 5.1.1

        You views demonstrate exactly why the Greens will be so concerned by this. Both parties are now competing for the same slice of the electorate. The far left is now a crowded market place and Green backbenchers will be look over their shoulders.

        • Tracey 5.1.1.1

          So far four green party supporters have posted they are thrilled if its true but will still vote green party.

          • Tamati 5.1.1.1.1

            Believe it on not, Standard posters aren’t a representative sample of the whole population.

            • Colonial Viper 5.1.1.1.1.1

              So apply that to yourself, please.

            • bad12 5.1.1.1.1.2

              A representative sample of the whole population according to popular belief Tamiti is to be found in something like the Roy Morgan poll,

              Off the top of my head this is what happened to the next Roy Morgan poll after the week long ‘speculation’ over the proposal to form an alliance of Internet/Mana,

              i havn’t got the relevant poll in front of me to give you the exact %’s for Labour/Green, BUT, this is how the message ran,

              Labour UP,
              Greens UP,

              Internet, from zero in the previous Roy Morgan to 1.5%
              Mana, from 1/2% in the previous Roy Morgan to 1%

              Read that shit and weep Tamiti, the Internet/Mana % of vote did not come from the left, it came from off of the ”did not vote” fence,

              Green/Labour have little to fear from InternetMana, my view says that like last time round its a 2% election, if InternetMana pull 2% off of the ”did not vote” fence, Slippery and this abhorrent Shyster National Government are history,

              Its a science fiction double feature, Tamiti, Doctor X will build a creature, i will leave it to your overworked imagination as to who Doctor X is, but, believe me, come September it really is going to be a late night double feature picture show, you know back row, for you Tamiti it will be a Horror…

        • Macro 5.1.1.2

          Not so. The IM party are looking first for an electorate MP and then as much of the party vote as they can muster, where as the Green’s are looking first at the Party vote, and an Electorate MP will be an added bonus. Their targets are quite different and they appeal to two different sectors of the Left vote. This hopefully will get more disenchanted voters out as they won’t vote for a Labour Party that is perceived as National lite.

      • Bearded Git 5.1.2

        +1 hoom. I’m a Green voter and think Harre will simply help grow the left’s vote.

        • Rich 5.1.2.1

          For sure. The Greens (well most of them) are sensible people and wouldn’t see this as a problem at all.

          Jobs on the organisational side of politics are often filled by people who aren’t lifetime supporters of the party (e.g Matt McCarten). They aren’t the same as candidacies.

          (And National/ACT have a total revolving door. Don Brash, John Banks and Stephen Franks have all been candidates for both parties in the recent past. [Ok, they’re all dicks])

          • KJT 5.1.2.1.1

            Not to mention all the Labour politicians, including one who has just left, whose natural home is the ACT party.

        • lprent 5.1.2.2

          I’d agree. There is a lot of left vote to get out to vote.

      • lprent 5.1.3

        I don’t see why Greens would be upset about this.

        I thought that she was still working for them specifically running the the campaigning side. The issue would have been losing someone in such a crucial position close to the election.

        But see above. She dropped out of that at the end of last year.

    • Tracey 5.2

      livid?

      • Tamati 5.2.1

        She worked for them few months ago and now joined their biggest rivals. Yeah, they’d be livid.

        • Colonial Viper 5.2.1.1

          Is there a problem with some kind of contractual non-compete clause?

        • lprent 5.2.1.2

          Nope. 9 months before the election..

        • felix 5.2.1.3

          “She worked for them few months ago and now joined their biggest rivals.”

          Nope. The Greens’ biggest rivals at this point are the National Party. Just like IMP.

      • Tracey 5.2.2

        i think you are showing how little you understand the way the greens operate. Fortunately they are nowhere near as emotional as you.

    • Ant 5.3

      Yep, a slightly more “mainstream” IMP will hurt the Greens vote % no matter which way you look at it. They might grow the left vote a bit and alleviate vote wastage, but they will definitely draw some off the Greens.

      To deny it would be like saying the Greens don’t cannibalise some of Labours vote, its not necessarily a bad thing for the left but of course it happens.

      • Macro 5.3.1

        Frankly I can’t see that happening. The election strategy for both parties is quite dissimilar. Also they appeal to to different but complimentary areas of policy. I believe that they will incentivise more non-voters from 2011 to actually turn out to vote.

        • phillip ure 5.3.1.1

          @ macro..+ 1..

        • weka 5.3.1.2

          I’ve voted Green as long as that’s been a choice. My first response on hearing that Harre would be standing for and leading IP was that I might party vote for them instead. That’s my heart response, I’ll think it through more at a tactical level during the campaign.

          As a GP member I don’t have any problem with Harre standing for the IP, I think it’s great which ever way I vote. My estimation for the IP just went up significantly.

          The IP will be after the party vote too, and I expect some voters that the GP might have picked up to vote for Harre instead. I don’t actually see this as a problem for the GP, they just need to adjust their game. The best thing that could come out of this is coalition building. The next best thing would be some serious looking at concessions.

  6. karol 6

    I say, Cool choice! I voted for Harre for electorate MP back when there was a possibility of her winning as part of the Alliance. She didn’t get in though.

    I do have one quibble – her role in the setting up of Auckland Supercity.

    I was never quite sure if she helped tone down the right leaning Hide construction of the council and was a force for the good, or if she colluded with something opposed to her earlier political stances.

  7. TheContrarian 7

    I really like/respect Harre but if this is true I feel really conflicted.

    Anyone that can work with and tacitly endorse anything to do with a hypocritical, dishonest gasbag like Martyn Bradbury is a real turn off.

    • One Anonymous Bloke 7.1

      So you won’t be voting Imp then?

    • Tamati 7.2

      If Harre really wants to do well. The first thing she must do in banish Martyn Bradbury. $8000 a month is a hefty price for the most obnoxious person in politics.

      [lprent: That was part of a quote that was not taken up. Reviewing your comments you have been doing that kind of inaccurate astroturfing misinformation crap pretty continuously. I also suspect that you are doing it deliberately which makes you a troll. Banned 2 weeks. Come back with a different attitude or I will rapidly escalate the bans on a no tolerance policy. To be precise you will be required to link every assertion you make until it is clear that you know the difference between fact and fiction. ]

      • Tracey 7.2.1

        really? For what?

      • Bearded Git 7.2.2

        Rubbish Tamati. Bradbury is one of the clearer thinkers on the left. He has done a wonderful job pushing and explaining genuine left-wing ideas and exposing the lies, corruption, unfairness and paucity of ideas in the present government.

        I don’t see what he earns has to do with it.

        Anyone who gets banned from Jim Mora’s panel must be ok.

        • Tamati 7.2.2.1

          Speak for yourself. There’s a whole litany of left wingers who have had a fistful of Bomber and his blog. Just ask any of his former columnists if they have been paid lately.

        • TheContrarian 7.2.2.2

          “Bradbury is one of the clearer thinkers on the left.”

          No he isn’t – he is a self-aggrandising hypocrite.

  8. karol 8

    The MSM is going with this choice, too.

    Stuff.

    Harre would not answer calls today, but sources close to Harre confirmed the selection and others have refused to rule her out.

    The party leader is set to be announced tomorrow.

    Party spokesman John Mitchell refused to comment, saying it was “speculation at this point”.

    • Anne 8.1

      Is being discussed this moment on The Panel.

      A woman of substance and integrity. They are very, very lucky.

      • Tracey 8.1.1

        there is a woman of substance and integrity on the panel? Boag will be on the phone to griffin as we write 😉

        • Anne 8.1.1.1

          She was on yesterday. Pity. Wonder how she would have handled it?

          No, Key will be talking to Griffin as we speak. What’s the bet Harre gets left out of the campaign debates on the basis they have no current MPs.

          • Tracey 8.1.1.1.1

            she would have said that harre was no john banks when it comes to honesty and integrity… And she would have been right.

    • Tracey 8.2

      herald say ” it understands” Harre is new leader…

  9. Pascal's bookie 9

    Pop will pop in any minute to explain why voting for Richard Prosser to get Winston Peters makes more sense for lefties than voting for IMP and getting mebbe, Hone, Sykes, Harre and Minto.

    • @ pascal..heh..!

      ..doesn’t that just roll off the tongue so sweetly..?

      ..that ‘Hone, Sykes, Harre and Minto’…

      ..eh..?

    • One Anonymous Bloke 9.2

      Nice one PB 🙂

    • Populuxe1 9.3

      Why would I do that? Vote for whomever you want. We’ll all have to work together to form a government anyway if we’re to get NACT out. What a strange thing to say.

  10. northshoreguynz 10

    Now that is seriously cool LH will bring real Mana (pun intended) to the party. They can’t be considered lightweight any more, and their left wing credentials have been strengthened. All power to the IMP.

  11. joy..!..joy..!..joy..!

    i could not think of a better person for the role..

    ..i am doing cartwheels here..

    • one of the questions i asked at the meeting to vote/decide to do the deal..

      ..when we were told we couldn’t know the name of the person who wd lead the internet party..

      …before we voted..

      ..i asked:..’can you give us yr word that the person chosen is someone you have full confidence in..?

      ..so that we can put to bed any concerns we may have about that..about not knowing who it is before we vote..?’

      we were assured of that..

      ..and they weren’t lying to us..eh..?

      ..woo-hoo..!

      • Tracey 11.1.1

        if they knew before the vote did they not say because they wanted to draw out the media coverage?

        • Colonial Viper 11.1.1.1

          I suspect so, which would be good media management. Also, Mana and IP will not have wanted personalities to over-shadow the substance and policies around bringing the alliance together.

        • phillip ure 11.1.1.2

          i don’t think i am breaking any confidences by passing on that harre wanted the int/mana deal locked in..

          ..before she would sign on the bottom-line..

    • lprent 11.2

      Hasn’t been confirmed yet and the announcement is tomorrow. Be cynical and get excited then…

      • phillip ure 11.2.1

        i can’t help it..!..aarrgghh..!!!

        ..and doesn’t the left in labour..and the left in the greens..

        ..now look up for grabs..?

        ..just before i got this news..i took a $20 bet with a friend..

        ..that int/mana will get 5%…

        ..that bet is now looking very secure…

        • phillip ure 11.2.1.1

          and bradbury has confirmed it is so..

          “..Left wing blogger Martyn Bradbury who has worked on strategy for the Internet Party this afternoon wrote: “The secret is out. Laila Harre will be the new leader of the Internet Party.

          So if this works the way we hope it will, Hone Harawira, Laila Harre, Annette Sykes and John Minto will be in Parliament.

          “Where’s all that left wing angst and screams of sell out now?”

          ..i would expect sue bradford is feeling a bit ill about now…

          • Colonial Viper 11.2.1.1.1

            Bradford would have already known of the choice of Harre.

            • Tracey 11.2.1.1.1.1

              Was thinking that when i read phil’s post too CV. So harre and minto’s agreement didnt hold sway with bradford.

              • i wd bet that bradford did not know that harre wd be leading the internet party..

                ..had she known that..i am sure she wd have stilled her tongue..

                ..and wd not have walked..

                ..bradford was spitting tacks from the get-go..

                ..from when the idea was first mooted..

                ..i am sure she wd have been one of the last people confidences on this wd have been shared with..

                • karol

                  Interesting comment on TV One News on the (alleged) appointment of Harre as leader – quote from Harre on Qu & A last month:

                  Last month, Ms Harre told TVNZ’s Q+A programme there were “risks” associated with the prospect of the Internet Party jumping into bed with Mana.

                  “I can see why Sue Bradford wouldn’t want to be engaged in that process and I think there are real risks and questions for the party in going down this track,” she said.

              • Skinny

                Good for Sue she has principals beyond reproach. Let’s face it if DotBlobby was free of the charges he is facing he could well have tossed some political donation money National or ACT way. For him to be pro deregulation about sums up just why Bradford walked.

                Harr’e could well have negotiated a take-over should Kim get forced to stand trial in the States. She could of course be merely using The Internet Party as a vehicle to get the vote out. I will say one thing these should pull 4% and if the Left win it will help push Labour left. Good bloody job there I say, the LP has to weed out the pretend Lefties who have ruined the party for too long.

            • Jenny 11.2.1.1.1.2

              Unfortunately for her, no.

          • fisiani 11.2.1.1.2

            So 4 IMP MP’s at least. That will have National scared. They will attract the missing million and give the Labour/Green/NZF/IMP block about 51% or 62 MP’s with the 4 IMP MP’s holding the balance of power and getting IMP policies agreed and overturn any extradition move by the court.

            • Macro 11.2.1.1.2.1

              You’re a bit slow off the block tonight Fiss! Couldn’t you lot sort out what the spin was to be? Didn’t w.o. give you the “lines”? poor ol fiss..

      • TheContrarian 11.2.2

        Thedailyblog, I mean, Bombers Vanity Project has already announced it

  12. Tracey 12

    I am a big fan of Harre. She has achieved aot, inside and outside of parliament.

    Her role in the supercity surprised me.

    There has been a great deal of foaming and frothingover two parties collectively polling about 2.5%. Not to mention vitriol by some, which strikes me as odd.

    Her presence wont move me from voting green at this pointbut if being leader makes her number two on imp i am even more certain the kelvin should campaign on party vote only, and get a higher listing.

    • karol 12.1

      Agreed. I am going with Green Party this election. I will still need to see how the IMP shapes up before I would vote for it, and I still have concerns about KDC’s role in it. Ee need a strong Green Party in Parliament. following this election.

      • Karen 12.1.1

        +1
        If it is Laila that would reduce some of the concerns I have about the Internet Party but not all. The Green Party still seems a much better option for my party vote.

        • lurgee 12.1.1.1

          I’m very confused now. I voted Mana in 2010. I’d previously stated an Internet-Mana tie up was a deal breaker for me. But Harre is no fool and her involvement is making wonder if I should reconsideration my repudiation.

          • lprent 12.1.1.1.1

            You should be like me. I always make my decisions mid-term because then I can ignore all of the silly posturing close to the election. I’m interested my actions being based in strategy, tactics like the election year fiddling is just how that gets implemented.

            So it will be a Green party vote and (looks up Find My Electorate) David Shearer because I am one house inside the Mt Albert electorate boundary. Hey! I am in the electorate that I have been a Labour party member of for decades (it was 1990 that I moved my membership there) for the FIRST TIME!

            The irony is that David Shearer’s time as Labours leader was what made me shift my party vote. But I have no problem voting for him as a local MP and probable minister. And I curse the fools in the party that shoved him unprepared into a role that he didn’t have the experience or support to do well. Lousy way to waste people.

            • phillip ure 12.1.1.1.1.1

              i agree with yr shearer comments..

              ..benificiaries-on-a-hot-tin-roof to one side..

              ..i think he still has much to give..

              ..(he was my choice for internet party leader..

              ..but i am much happier that harre is it..)

              ..and i think shearer was more ‘played’ by hoots & co…

              ..they wound him up into believing he cd do the job..)

              ..but with his rightwing/b.o.a.h.t.r-inclinations kept in check..

              ..he cd still do a good job..

            • Anne 12.1.1.1.1.2

              I curse the fools in the party that shoved him unprepared into a role that he didn’t have the experience or support to do well. Lousy way to waste people.

              My sentiments too from Day 1. A good man nearly destroyed. Give Shearer credit for recognising it and he now has real mana among a large section of the populace.

              David Cunliffe would have had plenty of time to present his admirable credentials to voters if he had been anointed in the first instance, and it would have been reflected in much higher current poll ratings. Instead he is going to have to perform a near miracle if he’s to succeed.

              • Ant

                I sometimes feel sorry for Shearer, but then I think of dole fiddler on the roof and I don’t feel so sorry, then I’m glad that although I’m technically in his electorate, I’m on the Maori roll.

          • Pascal's bookie 12.1.1.1.2

            I’ve kind of staid out of this for the most part, on account of ‘It’s not my party they can do what they like”, but here’s my take on this, and the Harre thing hasn’t changed it.

            If uou were going to vote Mana, don’t not do so just because of the DotCom party deal.

            That deal, when you look at it, is basically a hack of MMP.

            In the same way that the Rotten Borough of Epsom is a hack, and using trusts to avoid income tax is a hack.

            You might not like one, another, or all of those hacks, but the answer to that is to close the loopholes. Shooting yourself in the foot won’t help you do that.

            What we’re looking at is two parties, (Mana and IP) setting up a shelf party that will contest the list vote, with an agreement that they won’t compete against each other in the electorates.

            The marginal benefit to both of them is that they might get an MP (or two) into the House who agrees with them on some stuff both think is important. Without the deal, that ‘last list MP’ seat in parliament could go to National. Not wanting that to happen is what the agreement is about. End of.

            (In this sense it is exactly like the nat Epsom deal, which is aimed at getting that last list MP for the right. Only the method is different.)

            After the election, should they choose, the parties can formally split. Waka jump from the shelf back to the actual party, to continue, and mix up, the metaphor.

            On that score, it still makes sense to vote for Mana as long as you don’t actually hate the person who is likely to be the waka jumper post election.

            With Harre as the IP candidate likely to get in if the votes go that way, it seems like a sitter for Mana voters. At least to me.

          • phillip ure 12.1.1.1.3

            yes lurgee..!..come on back..!

            ..all is good..!

            ..and only going to get better…

    • Tracey 12.2

      I dont see harres presence peeling votes away from greens as some are suggesting. Those voters imo will already have drifted to mana with the likes of bradford and minto over there.

      If dotcom is extradicted it doesnt necessarily collapse the ip, but its funding would surely dry up.

      • Tamati 12.2.1

        She’s intelligent, charismatic and firmly left wing. She will suck some left wing voters from the Greens and Labour.

      • JAK 12.2.2

        If he could set up a trust it would protect their funding.

  13. TightyRighty 13

    Isn’t Laila harre the one who tried to ban dihydrogen monoxide?

  14. Marius 14

    well now if i was going to waste a saturday morning bothering to vote, Harre and the internet/mana folk might just be my chur, bro. Fortunately im not foolish enough to believe that once her star has begun to burn really brightly she won’t do exactly the same as all the others before her and give me a damn good anal cleansing with a sybian, all with the knowledge that i neither needed nor condoned it. She’s kind of interesting to listen to when speaking, though – and so is Hone, only not as aesthetically pleasant. I know i know – ‘if you dont vote you have no right to moan’. Piss off.

  15. Colonial Viper 15

    Time for Labour to step in and play the MMP game to the hilt.

    1) Eliminate National’s coalition partners. Do this by finishing off the Tory pet Maori Party by not standing a candidate in Wairiki thereby letting Annette Sykes take the seat.

    2) Have Davis campaign for the party vote only in Te Tai Tokerau to ensure a Hone win and hence 2-3 MPs for the Left.

    And that’s a Labour led government in September, right there.

    • Bearded Git 15.1

      CV-It is not necessary for Labour to not stand a candidate in Te Tai Tokerau.

      I think Labour voters in Te Tai Tokerau will work out that they should constituency vote for Hone when Labour (hopefully) puts Kelvin Davis at (say) number 25 on the list.

      This way they will get both Hone and Kelvin.

      I’m sure Standardista’s could help get this message out.

      • Colonial Viper 15.1.1

        CV-It is not necessary for Labour to not stand a candidate in Te Tai Tokerau.

        Agreed, and I’m not suggesting otherwise. My suggestion was that Davis stands as candidate but campaigns for the party vote only. And I think that it probably should come from Labour’s NZ Council, certainly not from DC.

        I’m sure Standardista’s could help get this message out.

        Already on to it 😉

        • Skinny 15.1.1.1

          No we fancy our chances of wining his seat and we will campaign hard to get it. Sykes I agree a deal can be done. Hone is way too loose and unstable, you don’t know him up close and personel cobber. Some of us do and know better.

      • weka 15.1.2

        +1000 CV

        Bearded, I was under the impression that many Māori vote for who they respect and support, rather than tactical voting.

        The ball really is in Labour’s court on this. Time for them to make a smart post-FPP move.

    • Anne 15.2

      Have Davis campaign for the party vote only in Te Tai Tokerau…

      And make sure he has a high place on the list this time.

    • @ c.v..

      ..+ 1..

      ..but will they/labour see this..?..and do the right thing..?

      ..and my hopes for real change after september have suddenly risen..

      ..i was getting mildly depressed about the prospect of a do-very-little labour party..

      ..with a green party crippled by their ministers-deals..

      ..blocking any real change..

      ..but now..we have the very strong possibility of a int/mana/grn-grouping..

      ..having the muscle/will to lean on labour..

      ..to make them do what needs to be done..

      ..my depression-cloud has lifted..

      ..and i repeat my first reaction:..

      ..joy..!..joy..!..joy..!
      ,

    • Tracey 15.4

      agree but they wont. Cunliffe endorsed kelvin for the seat on monday…

      • Bearded Git 15.4.1

        Irrelevant if Kelvin is in top 25 on Labour list.

        Cunliffe is not dumb-he can pretend Labour is fighting the seat while giving a message to any Labour voter with 2 brain cells to rub togther that they should constituency vote Hone.

        • weka 15.4.1.1

          Concessions should be overt and transparent. Not only because it’s more honest, but because lots of voters don’t take any notice of the election campaign and will miss messages from Cunliffe or whoever, esp subtle ones.

          There are still many voters who don’t understand how MMP works.

          • Jenny 15.4.1.1.1

            Maybe David Cunliffe could have a cup of tea with Hone Harawira at a well known prominent waterfront cafe in Whangarei.

            Just saying.

            After all, what’s sauce for the goose, is sauce for the gander.

            • hoom 15.4.1.1.1.1

              I think its very important for Labour to understand the importance of working the system.

              Have heard several not very promising statements recently, that this IMP is some sort of rort & that the Epsom candidate will be fighting to win the seat.

              Epsom needs to be a campaign of ‘Electorate hold your nose & vote Nat guy, Party vote whoever you actually want in Govt, YES really do it! Seriously please.’.
              Likewise Te Tai Tokerau should be ‘Electorate Hone, Party vote whoever you want in Govt’.

              It should be open & clearly stated.

              If Labour campaigns for Electorate & takes a significant chunk of the Electorate vote away from Nat & Hone then all they will do is hurt themselves.
              Labour itself doesn’t need a couple more Electorates, their Seat numbers are set by Party vote.

              If they win off Hone then the Left is down at least 1 seat.

              Last election Epsom was only won by Banks with a 2261 margin over Nat guy.
              Even though there was clearly a bunch of tactical voting there were still 5911 Electorate votes to Green & Labour candidates so its definitely possible to make the difference here.
              (depending on boundary change effects)

              • Bearded Git

                Agreed Hoom. After all it is National’s fault that we still have the “coatail” electorates.

                National had the chance to remove them with support from parliament this term but cynically decided not to because they counted on Epsom and Mr. Chemtrails delivering them seats while polling below 5% as ACT/Conservative parties.

                How nice it would be to see them hoist with their own petard!

    • Hone + Kelvin in Parliament sounds like a win-win to me!

  16. My only observation is how some on the far left are so ready to take the cash from a very un-left rich bloke with a grudge.
    An opinion, of course, but so far there’s Hone, Minto, Harre and Bradbury.
    So much kudos to Sue Bradford for keeping her principles off the for sale list.
    I’m guessing when it’s all played out and dotcon is long gone, Ms B will still be able to hold her head up high.

    • heh..!..you’re funny..!

    • JAK 16.2

      KDC is not an un-left bloke. He has messed with and threatened media moguls and big shot politicians.

      • The Al1en 16.2.1

        “KDC is not an un-left bloke”

        $50k to john banks in secret cheques says he’s not exactly un-right either.

        • JAK 16.2.1.1

          True. But I reckon voters will be thinking about bigger fry – Hollywood and the Prime Minister of New Zealand.

          • The Al1en 16.2.1.1.1

            “True” – That’s all I need to know.

            As for the rest, I’ll send in a request to mythbusters, maybe they’ll confirm his left wing credentials, but I wouldn’t count on anything other than busted.

        • Jenny 16.2.1.2

          $50k to john banks in secret cheques says he’s not exactly un-right either

          The Al1en

          I think a few nights in Mt Eden, (the prison) sleeping on a hard concrete bench in the heart of his erstwhile friend’s electorate would have concentrated the mind.

      • Populuxe1 16.2.2

        So has Bob Jones and Donald Trump. What’s yer point?

        • JAK 16.2.2.1

          I think potential voters will be attracted by his challenging of authority, which I see as a left wing trait.

          • Populuxe1 16.2.2.1.1

            Authority isn’t by default “the Right” – the entitled also will carry a grudge as high it will go if they think they are being belittle.d

          • meconism 16.2.2.1.2

            I agree, my memory is we are quite keen on the ‘protest vote’. Values, Social Credit, Mana Motuhake, Bob Jones even ACT. The electorate provides minority governments with slim and precarious majorities and I see no reason for that to change. Will definitely keep the political analysts busy.

          • Murray Olsen 16.2.2.1.3

            You must love the TeaBaggers then, JAK. They challenge Obama and the Federal Government all the time. Does that make them revolutionary Marxists?

    • Jenny 16.3

      It’s just an accident of history that an internet tycoon who would normally be expected to be at home on the Right has been been thrown under the bus by his old BFFs.

  17. there will be much wailing/gnashing of teeth/renting of clothes..

    ..in circles right..

    ..(..mmm!!!..(schadenfreude..!..warm and toasty..!..)

  18. on nat-rad..mora and scott york fretted/puzzled over the choice…

    ..but mai chen called this a masterstroke/’brilliant!’..

    ..and her takeaway was that harre must think this entity has a real chance..

    ..to get up and run..

    ..because if she didn’t..she wouldn’t have taken on the role..

    ..harawira..harre..sykes..minto..+..

    ..in the next parliament…

    ..commenting on q-time..(which i have been hitting a wall on over lately..it is so fucken trite/mindless/boring/irrelevant..)

    ..will suddenly become a lot more fun..

    ..and i have just joined a couple of dots..

    ..the greens kicked arse last yr..this yr they haven’t really fired..

    ..harre left them at the end of last yr..

    ..(when she left..i stated @ whoar how bummed i was..because i wanted to see her back in parliament again..expecting her to be high on the green list this election..)

    ..but that wasn’t meant to be…clearly this is..

  19. gobsmacked 19

    I think this can work out well for the Greens.

    They aren’t fighting Mana for electorates, and they can position themselves as ‘Moderate’, just as Key says “nuffin to do with me” when ACT do their nutty stuff. It works.

    I don’t much like the Dotcom deal, or Bradbury (too much self-indulgent ego, not enough focus on knowing when to shut up and win votes). But it’s happened, so I can only hope the egos let Harre become the party’s voice, that’s a net gain for the left.

    • Colonial Viper 19.1

      The Greens as the moderate choice on the political spectrum.

      Excellent framing!!!

      • phillip ure 19.1.1

        @ c.v..aye..!..

        ..bring on those ‘green’ nats…!

        ..they will feel ‘safer’ voting for the greens..

        ..(and i don’t believe that every person who votes/ed national..wants to trash the planet..)

        ..and what will john key say now..?

        ..with his loony-lefty riffs..?

        ..norman just has to keep mum..and point @ harawira..

        ..heh..!

        • The Al1en 19.1.1.1

          “..bring on those ‘green’ nats…!

          ..they will feel ‘safer’ voting for the greens..”

          I can’t actually believe there is such a voter, being such extremes between the two parties.
          It would be like a mega millionaire with a history of donating to far right parties hooking up with a 1% left party pitching themselves as the next best thing…. Oh, wait 😆

          • the pigman 19.1.1.1.1

            “It would be like a mega millionaire with a history of donating to far right parties”

            Are you talking about KDC? In which case, [citation needed]. You don’t get to compare donations to Banks’ mayoral campaign with donating to far right parties…

            Further, he’s German, so let’s remember that your average German conservative party voter occupies a political space somewhere left of the NZ Green Party.

            • The Al1en 19.1.1.1.1.1

              I’ll amend for clarity

              “It would be like a mega millionaire with a history of donating to far right mayoral candidates”.

              Unless of course, seeing as we’re being generous to kdc and calling him a leftie, we now change banks’ history of nasty politics of the right to something more palatable because it screws up the current fairy tale telling.

      • geoff 19.1.2

        The green perspective is increasingly mainstream.
        My impression is that the Greens are angling more for the urban liberals who aren’t particularly political (unlike mana voters) but who are aware of the impending implications of climate change, and environmental degradation due to the negative effects of capitalism and human overpopulation.

    • heh..!..it’s not a matter of them ‘letting harre be the party voice’..

      ..harre will be running that ship..

      ..be in no doubt of that..

      ..and she will be ‘the voice’..

  20. Anne 20

    Could this be why Key’s been looking a bit haggard lately?

    • Colonial Viper 20.1

      No, it’ll be National Party internal polling and internal politics.

      • His tendency lately to stand up and ask supplementary questions of his own Ministers, usually to try to get a cheap anti-Labour shot in, really points to National’s insecurity.

  21. outofbed 21

    I think Laila is a pragmatist

    I am a Green Party member but my party vote will go wherever I can get most bang for my buck
    in the battle to get rid of National.
    Mana /IP seems to be that party at the moment.

    I obviously would prefer that party not to involve KDC

    But getting rid of KEY must be the priority, and overides everything

    National will be shitting themselves and I daresay Labour too

    • weka 21.1

      “I am a Green Party member but my party vote will go wherever I can get most bang for my buck”

      Me too. We just have to remember that the party vote can get wasted, and figure out how is the best way to use it. I haven’t done the figures recently, but the relationship between IMP’s party vote and how many MPs they get from the electorates is not that straight forward. It’s going to be a tricky election.

      “National will be shitting themselves and I daresay Labour too”

      NACT yes, but Labour at least have the choice of finding themselves a decent toilet before it’s too late 😉

      • bad12 21.1.1

        Weka and outofbed, Taiho, lets get the confirmation of who the leader of Internet actually is out of the way as the first port of call,

        Secondly, this then becomes a balancing act, lets watch the polls closely as far as the relative support goes vis a vis InternetMana and Greens,

        What we dont want is for InternetMana to start eating into the Green Party % of suppport, this is a vital piece of the September election that we HAVE to keep in mind,

        i would strongly advise this, IF you voted Green in 2011 keep your vote there, full stop,

        My reason for saying this is that i believe that InternetMana can pull 3–4% of the party vote in September either off of the did not vote fence sitters and/or the fast collapsing Maori Party % of party vote,

        It is of vital importance that we ascertain as close to the election as possible the relevant positions of the left bloc befor we all start abandoning a party like the Green Party for the InternetMana alliance,

        This is a message that i cannot stress enough and will keep repeating it…

        • Jenny 21.1.1.1

          People are happy! People are very happy!

          With Laila Harre in parliament, the current “no bottom lines” leadership of the Greens will find it very hard to join a cabinet that will continue with deep sea oil drilling, and Denniston.

          I am sure they feel the ground shifting under their feet, as we speak.

          With Laila Harre to take up the slack, the Greens can no longer afford to dump their “bottom lines”.

          Therefore the pressure will be on Labour to front up.

          No deep sea oil drilling!

          No new coal mines!

          No more of THIS SORT OF GARBAGE

          • bad12 21.1.1.1.1

            And out comes Jenny with her one stringed violin playing the same old tune in what looks like a attempt to have us all become Lemmings,

            IF Laila Harre is to be the Number 2 on the InternetMana list it means no such thing as the utter rubbish You assume Jenny,

            Internet have a specific set of policies which whoever is their MP(s) will be charged with pushing,

            Attempting to strong-arm Labour i would suggest will simply have them passing Legislation with National’s votes,(which is what i expect to occur with superannuation)…

            • Jenny 21.1.1.1.1.1

              Attempting to strong-arm Labour i would suggest will simply have them passing Legislation with National’s votes

              bad12

              Now you are being truly unhinged. This would spell the end of the Labour Party.

              • bad12

                Don’t kid yourself Jenny, consider this, The Greens and NZFirst oppose raising the age of entitlement for superannuation,

                Labour openly campaigned last election and look like doing the same this time with a policy of raising the age of entitlement,

                God knows how much support such a policy has so far cost Labour, but, i would suggest it is significant,

                There’s only one way that Labour can ever hope to have the numbers to raise that age of entitlement, that involves both NZFirst and the Greens selling out their policy,or, Labour getting the votes from National,

                NZFirst sell out the only policy that keeps it in the Parliament??? and you think i am deluded…

                • Colonial Viper

                  A grand coalition limited to specific issues is not beyond consideration. And why not. Labour voted with National to pass the brutal Welfare Reform legislation in 2012 afaik.

                  Other potential areas of co-operation in the face of staunch opposition from I/M, NZF, GR might include the TPPA, raising the retirement age and offshore drilling.

                • Jenny

                  There’s only one way that Labour can ever hope to have the numbers to raise that age of entitlement, that involves both NZFirst and the Greens selling out their policy,or, Labour getting the votes from National,

                  bad12

                  But Bad, Labour’s very existence depends on Labour’s ability to maintain the perception that they are different to National.

                  Of course I agree that raising the retirement age will require Labour to go cap in hand to the Nats. That, as well as all the other Right wing stuff that Labour supports, like deep sea oil and Denniston, like Labour’s support for raising GST and Labour’s dumping of their promise to remove GST from fresh fruit and vegetables as well as dumping their promise to remove the income tax on the first $5000 earned, all ernest Right wing stuff, that with the rise of the Internet/Mana alliance keeping the Greens on track, will see Labour having to go more and more to National for support.

        • weka 21.1.1.2

          Bad, in all likelihood I will party vote Green this year. In part because I think that this is not just a crucial election but a crucial term. The GP have done the long hard yards and if this is to be their first time in govt they deserve all the support they can get (and I can give). The next left wing govt needs support too, and while I think that in the longer term having a bigger Mana presence (and possibly IP) is good, I think at this stage getting the GP cemented in a left wing govt and having a term under their belt will change politics in NZ permanently.

          However as I said above, my heart’s response to hearing that Harre might be in parliament again and might be leading the IP, was as Jenny said, very happy. I can’t recall the last time I felt like that in politics. This is a seriously interesting development.

          The other issue, which is the one I will keep repeating 😉 is that party voting for a small party can waste the list vote and cost the left the election. Might sit down at the next Roy Morgan and do the maths on possible scenarios, although it looks to me like the Māori seats are the wild cards (plus that old bugger Peters).

          • bad12 21.1.1.2.1

            Weka, you are pre-supposing that InternetMana cannot and will not get 3–4% of the Party vote without taking it off either the Labour or Green Parties,

            As i have pointed out twice tonight already, after the week of media hysteria surrounding just the proposal to form the InternetMana alliance the next Roy Morgan showed that between them InternetMana had gone up in the poll to a combined 2.5%,

            In the same poll did Labour or the Green Parties lose support or mark the previous spot, NO, in that poll both Labour and the Green Parties also made gains in their %’s,

            There is a huge demographic out there in voter land who are simply not moved by the thought of a Labour/Green/NZfirst Government, the thought of maybe having a Labour/Green/InternetMana Government rocks your world, rocks my world, and i would suggest, for various reasons rocks the world of a hell of a lot of other people out there who otherwise wouldn’t bother if the option weren’t there,

            Here’s a little indication, i put it to a couple of the younger members of the whanau that Dotcom was just ‘a rich crim playing ego games with the coin’, the reply, ”He’s the shit uncle and your just jealous that He’s better at it than you”,

            Lolz there maybe a lecture needed there about certain of the whanau’s moral compasses but if that lot have decided that ‘He’s the shit’ then the debate is definitely not worth having that would attempt any form of changed minds…

            • Colonial Viper 21.1.1.2.1.1

              😀

              and I suppose your younger whanau members were not likely to have voted LAB GR of NZF in any event…

              • bad12

                Lolz CV last time they voted, despite my warnings, was for the first Maori Party MP’s into the Parliament since that election they havn’t…

            • weka 21.1.1.2.1.2

              “Weka, you are pre-supposing that InternetMana cannot and will not get 3–4% of the Party vote without taking it off either the Labour or Green Parties,”

              No I’m not. What makes you say that?

              “In the same poll did Labour or the Green Parties lose support or mark the previous spot, NO, in that poll both Labour and the Green Parties also made gains in their %’s,”

              Polls, including RM, don’t show how voters move around.

  22. Chooky 22

    From Martyn Bradbury “Laila Harre to be the new leader of the Internet Party..

    Boom, it’s been leaked by the NBR, so the secret is out. Laila Harre will be the new leader of the Internet Party? So if this works the way we hope it will, Hone Harawira, Laila Harre, Annette Sykes and John Minto will be in Parliament.
    Where’s all that left wing angst and screams of sell out now?
    You wanted a game change? Here’s your game changer!
    Now let’s go beat John Key.
    Game on.

    http://thedailyblog.co.nz/2014/05/28/laila-harre-to-be-the-new-leader-of-the-internet-party/

    • Jenny 22.1

      From what I understand this news was supposed to be heavily embargoed until the official release on Thursday. With only the top trusted leaders and aides of both parties privy to this information.

      This begs the question: How did a Right Wing journal like the NBR get hold of the story?

      With this leak the NBR has somewhat spoilt the official launch.

      With their Right wing journalistic line this must have been the intention.

      But where did they get their information?

      Was it another GCSB illegal wire tap, followed by an anonymous tip off?

      Is this a sign that the spooks are getting tired of all the embarrassment that usually ensues from their, disreputable, usual preferred media outlets Farrar and Slater?

  23. Class Awareness 23

    I am really, really disappointed by this.

    I voted Minto at the last Mayoral election and Mana was going to be my 2014 election choice. Until this unholy alliance with the kulak (bourgeois? boyar?). Count me in the Sue Bradford corner.

    Let’s get it straight, any party led by a fatcat capitalist like Dotcom is not one that any class-aware member of the left can align him/herself with. I would rather have a government led by John Key than have the fraudulent scum living in New Zealand’s most expensive house involved.

    I believe the term is cognitive dissonance or similar; the mere fact we can imagine Dotcom (a convicted fraud, a rich-lister, a noted abuser of the working class) linked to a supposedly left-wing party… simply disgusts me. To the point of wanting to throw up.

    Whatever happened to class awareness? Whatever happened to creating a world where scum like Dotcom can’t exist?

    In terms of outcomes from the 14 election, I rank them this way
    1. Labour majority (unlikely)
    2. Labour/Greens majority (possible)
    3. Labour/Greens/NZF majority (possible)
    4. Ongoing National-led government
    5. Any Labour-led coalition involving Dotcom.

    • weka 23.1

      “Whatever happened to class awareness? Whatever happened to creating a world where scum like Dotcom can’t exist?”

      Just out of curiosity, what is the wealth cut off point for being scum?

      • Bill 23.1.1

        You do know you’re addressing a wee Stalinist, right? So the cut-off point of being scum, for them, is anywhere outwith the Party Line (that being what the ‘Good Book’ says – as written and edited by the exulted and greater Comrades)… or any weaker faction within the Party.

        • Colonial Viper 23.1.1.1

          or any weaker opposing faction within the Party.

          Opposing factions within the party which are subservient and agreeable are fine

          Although in a proper Stalinist regime they do sometimes end up shot/indefinitely imprisoned anyways

        • weka 23.1.1.2

          Thanks Bill. I was just wondering which of my extended family and friends would be up against the wall, and whether I would be with them for not condeming them. Not that I know anyone in KDC’s league, but I would guess that I do know too many very comfortable middle class people who never think about class and still vote. But hey, I’m probably suffering from cognitive dissonance because I still consider them human.

    • bad12 23.2

      No Class, that’s a perfect piece of rhetoric which in reality to me intending to vote for InternetMana in September definitely leaves me hoping you and Bradford immediately establish your own political vehicle to contest the 2017 election,

      Meanwhile ‘scum’ as a label is subjective, that you bandy it about with such ease has me thinking of you as just that, Scum…

      • One Anonymous Bloke 23.2.1

        Scum have more low cunning than Class Awareness can muster.

      • Class Awareness 23.2.2

        I think any large-scale capitalist is scum. If you disagree, I don’t see how you can call yourself left-wing.

        • bad12 23.2.2.1

          No class, i find your reasoning to be little more than absurd rhetoric, Les Mills gym owner donating 60 odd grand each to the Labour and Green Paries is scum too then???…

        • Tracey 23.2.2.2

          i am sorry you think so little of ms harre that you consider her nothing other than kdc sock puppet. She must have changed an awful lot in the last few months for that to be so.

    • Huginn 23.3

      Class Awareness? What are you talking about?

      Kim Dotcom is poor white trash who made money out of the internet. The Megaupload takedown was very much about putting him in his place – look at the language of the police press briefings that followed the raid.

      He grew up poor. He knows what it’s like to be a scared, hungry little kid – he has that in common with many people in Mana electorate (and also, incidentally, with John Banks).

      Everyone’s talking about Mana getting into bed with the Internet Party, but I’m picking that with KDC, it could just as easily go the other way.

      • TheContrarian 23.3.1

        “Kim Dotcom is poor white trash who made money out of the internet.”

        By internet you mean fraud, embezzlement and insider trading right?

        • One Anonymous Bloke 23.3.1.1

          Tell me, which electorate is Kim.com standing for? Where is he on the IP list?

        • One Anonymous Bloke 23.3.1.2

          PS: tell me, why does the German government fund Gnu Privacy Guard? Is it possible you have a limited and ethnocentric perspective on such matters, and that this is distorting your opinions of Mr.com’s motives for financing a political party that promises similar policies?

        • KJT 23.3.1.3

          Good description of Key and several other 1984 Labour, National/ACT MP’s. Though we can add theft of public property, and abuse of 250 000 children, as well.

          Look how many vote for them.

      • Class Awareness 23.3.2

        Except KDC did not grow up poor. He was upper-middle-class from birth despite his assertions otherwise. Kulak for generations, not a vehicle for the poor and dispossessed.

    • One Anonymous Bloke 23.4

      Class Awareness has failed the class awareness test.

    • felix 23.5

      Class Awareness, that is by far the worst bit of astro-turfing I’ve ever seen. Go sit in the corner.

      • Class Awareness 23.5.1

        I’m not sure how pointing out the inherent paradox of an anti-capitalist party aligning itself with a rich-lister/owner of most expensive mansion in NZ is “astro-turfing.”

        What makes KDC better than John Key? All of this “let’s get rid of Shonkey!” Wonderful, let’s replace one capitalist with an even BIGGER capitalist.

        • I feel pretty sure that an “even BIGGER capitalist” than Key wouldn’t trust his political vehicle to an obvious veteran feminist leftie trade-unionist.

        • Psycho Milt 23.5.1.2

          What makes KDC better than John Key?

          That’s hilarious – the apparent Bolshevik on the thread can only think about a political party in individualist terms. You should trade in that ‘Class Awareness’ handle and go with something more appropriate – ‘Singular obsession’ is free…

        • felix 23.5.1.3

          Who said anything about replacing John Key with Kim Dotcom? He can’t even run you fool.

          As I suspected though, it’s the “getting rid of John Key” bit that bothers you.

          edit + what Psycho said

        • Tracey 23.5.1.4

          am pretty sure mr liu lives in the most expensive mansion in nz… Cost heaps and cost williamson his job.

    • Jenny 23.6

      Class awareness is knowing which side you’re on. Class consciousness is knowing who is there with you.

      Bertholt Brecht

      Some food for thought CA?

      Maybe it is time to take the next step up and you and your Citizen Smith mates can stop meeting in a phonebox.

  24. meconism 24

    I wonder when Sue Bradford found out?

  25. BM 25

    I honestly thought Harre was in her late 50’s early 60’s.

    Surprised to see she’s not much older than me, if there’s anyone screaming out for a make over it’s her, she does reminds me a bit of Julia Louis-Dreyfus so there’s certainly a bit of potential there.

    Time to take the weed eater to the armpits and chuck a bit of dye in the hair.

  26. One Anonymous Bloke 26

    I was sorry to see Laila Harre leave Parliament, if not politics. I hope this will bring her skills back in House.

    • Jenny 26.1

      Due to a sectarian hatchet job from Labour in Waitakere. An act that on all form Labour are likely to try and pull off again, this time in Te Tai Tokerau. This time the stakes are much higher the cost will be seeing in another Nat led government.

  27. kenny 27

    Why do I find this the most exciting development in politics for years? For some reason I feel very optimistic about the election – are we about to see the start of something big?

    Laila has impressed me more on Q&A than any other panellist – a real talent with common sense ideas and not to be distracted/brow-beaten.

    Great news.

    • karol 27.1

      Apparently Willie Jackson is considering standing for IMP – thus spake twitter.

      • Populuxe1 27.1.1

        If true, they can’t be all that fussy

        • Chooky 27.1.1.1

          spoken like a prissy old Pop

          • Populuxe1 27.1.1.1.1

            If prissy means zero tolerance for misogyny, homophobia, rape apologism, victim shaming, and animal neglect, by all means colour me as charged. The man is a pig.

      • Chooky 27.1.2

        @ karol ….yes time will tell as to who it is …am a wee bit suspicious that it was NBR that broke the news that it was Laila Harre…also heard the name John Tamihere mentioned randomly through the radio grape vine

        …as far as I am concerned whoever can pull in the most disaffected youth and non-voter votes would be the best choice….they all look like good choices to me!…..and Laila Harre is supersmart

        ….the Nacts will be shivering in their shoes ( eh Pop?)

        • Populuxe1 27.1.2.1

          Disaffected youth are probably not that keen on bullies who tear down rape victims in the mainstream media tbh

          • Colonial Viper 27.1.2.1.1

            afaik JT has worked directly with and continues to work directly with a lot of disaffected youth. Pretty sure he can get good traction there.

            • Chooky 27.1.2.1.1.1

              thankyou CV….yes I think he has …JT made a gaffe ….as many have before and since …sort of like he was telling off or grilling his daughter ….i dont think he should be damned for all time because of it…he has a lot of reach with the disaffected male working class and youth

              • Colonial Viper

                Too many in Labour are willing to quickly damn – and in the next breath declare themselves the party of tolerance and a broad church. The hypocrisy is clearly noted by the electorate.

              • Populuxe1

                Could he reach out to disaffected male working class and youth without being a homophobic misogynist animal-neglecting douche? K’thanx,bi

              • felix

                The only reason I wouldn’t support a party with JT in it is because he’s a bad person.

                ymmv.

                • weka

                  +1 felix. JT’s handling of the rape gang issue was just another example of who he is as a person (the good things he does in community or whatever notwithstanding). I wouldn’t support a party with him in it even before the rape gang stuff happened.

                  • Tracey

                    interesting that anyone is suggesting he would join ip, with a female leader, but not mana, given it appears that mana pushes for some stuff he pushes…disaffected maorimales… Is the ip able to offer a better salary to campaign?

                    • weka

                      I don’t even know why we are having this conversation lol, JT in the IP? Seriously? I can’t see Willie Jackson either to be honest.

                    • Colonial Viper

                      disaffected maorimales…

                      Good old racist slur there; ‘maorimales’ make up 51% of our prison population so yes, JT has done work with many of them inside and outside the system, so yeah you might consider this group “disaffected.”

                • Populuxe1

                  Well I certainly have second thoughts about parties that court homophobes, misogynists and rape apologists, yes. I prefer my parties to be a bit more evolved than that. Screaming that you value the bigot vote more than human rights is not the best look.

                  • weka

                    well put Pop. Taking in WJ or JT would be a huge step backwards for the IP. And IMP.

              • Tracey

                a gaffe? One? You jest

            • Tracey 27.1.2.1.1.2

              his fixation with identity politics doesnt bother you cv?

  28. Stuart Munro 28

    Well I’m old Alliance so very glad to see Laila – reinforces my liking for KDC.

    And strategically? It is brilliant – the pissing and moaning on the right completely missed the threat as usual. Laila is … unlikely … to waka jump to prop up the tottering shambles of the Key debacle.

    Makes her a safe bet.

  29. Clemgeopin 30

    Laila Jane Harré : Bio

    Laila Jane Harré (born 8 January 1966) politician and trade unionist. She was a Member of Parliament for the Alliance party, and became the party’s leader for a brief period after the group experienced a schism in 2002.

    She gained Bachelor of Arts and Bachelor of Laws degrees at the University of Auckland. She worked as a lawyer specialising in industrial relations and employment law, developing close links to the trade union movement.

    Harré joined the Labour Party in 1982, representing the youth wing on the party’s New Zealand Council. Throughout her seven-year membership of the party she was a critic of the policies advanced by Roger Douglas, an advocate of free market economics, introduced a programme of radical reforms (Rogernomics) which alienated many of Labour’s traditional supporters, including Harré.

    In 1989, Harré resigned from the Labour Party and became a founding member of the NewLabour Party, an organisation led by dissident Labour MP Jim Anderton. NewLabour later amalgamated with several other parties to form the Alliance. Harré stood as the Alliance candidate for the Te Atatu electorate in the 1993 elections, but was unsuccessful

    After the 1999 elections under MMP, the Alliance formed a coalition government with Labour (which had by then backed away from many of the policies introduced by Douglas). Harré became Minister of Women’s Affairs and Minister of Youth Affairs and Associate Minister of Labour and Commerce with additional responsibilities as Minister of Statistics.

    She led the parliamentary campaign for the introduction of paid parental leave from Opposition and as a Minister sponsored the legislation to introduce 12 weeks paid parental leave in 2002. Other causes championed by Harré included legislation protecting the interests of building industry sub-contractors, significant minimum wage increases and the removal of age discrimination in the minimum wage. She re-launched the pay equity debate as Minister of Women’s Affairs, and a campaign to increase annual leave from three weeks to four weeks.

    In 2002, however, the Alliance began to show signs of internal strain. In particular, some members of the party felt that it was losing its independent political identity and failing to make it clear where the differentiation was between itself and the Labour Party on issues such as free trade, tertiary education funding and other core areas of difference. The decision of Jim Anderton and a majority of Alliance MPs to back New Zealand’s involvement in the US-led invasion of Afghanistan brought these tensions to a head, dividing the caucus and from the majority in the non-parliamentary party organisation (ed by Matt McCarten. Harré, however, was aligned to the grass-roots party view, and became its de facto leader in parliament.

    The collapse of the Alliance soon became inevitable, with Anderton and his supporters deciding to contest the 2002 elections as a new party (the Progressives). Harré, considered to be the foremost of the MPs who remained behind, was chosen to lead what remained of the Alliance into its election campaign, aiming to at least retain a presence in parliament. Harré herself was seen as the party’s best chance of keeping a parliamentary seat, having a relatively strong chance of winning the seat of Waitakere. In the election itself, however, Harré placed second, being defeated by Labour’s Lynne Pillay.

    The following year, Harré stepped down as leader of the Alliance, being replaced by Matt McCarten. She was not aligned to any other political party from 2002-2011 but in 2012 accepted a role as issues director of the Green Party.

    From 2002 to 2005 Harré led the industrial work of the New Zealand Nurses Organisation, including its successful pay equity campaign for public sector nurses. She was General Secretary of the National Distribution Union from 2005 to 2009, after which she joined the Auckland Transition Agency.

    Harré was diagnosed with breast cancer and because she has a family history of the disease, opted for a double mastectomy and breast reconstruction. She made a full recovery.

    In 2012 she was employed by the Green Party after working for the International Labour Organisation in Fiji since 2010. She participated in the 2013 Boston Marathon, and was only a few hundred metres away when one of the bombs exploded.

    Harré resigned from her role with the Green Party in 2013 and is currently co-owner of an upmarket Auckland restaurant accredited as one of New Zealand’s first living wage employers.

    [P.S: A strong rumour has it that tomorrow at 2 pm, she will most likely become the LEADER of a new political party. This will be the MOST interesting election in NZ history! The Internet Party. Key, Brownlee and Joyce have already started putting their boot into her, even before she has been confirmed in the position!]

  30. North 31

    Remember how the New Zealand Party was reasonably helpful in screwing Muldoon in ’84, albeit from a different position on the political spectrum as I recall ? Will this election be in similar vein, that is one in which the feverishly vaunted greatest asset proves an electoral liability. Fingers crossed…….

    • Colonial Viper 31.1

      You must be talking about the Conservatives. Looking forward to them taking then trashing 2%-3% of the Tory vote.

  31. millsy 32

    Have been offline since Sunday (very long story!!) so catching up on all the goss..

    I have to say, that this is very welcome news (if true).

    Bring it on. We are going to have one hell of an election campaign.

  32. Te Reo Putake 33

    Well,this Labour supporter is well chuffed by this news. I’ve known, and worked with Laila for years. She’s a formibable organiser and a great strategist. I’ve just been chatting with 3 first-time French voters, whose complaint about the recent euro elections was the lack of fresh ideas on the left, which left a vacuum for the extreme
    right. That’s clearly not going to be an issue in NZ now.

    • Jenny 33.1

      Very good news to see you on board on this TRP.

      Of course you know that it all falls over if Kelvin Davis and Labour achieve their determined intention to roll Harawira in Te Tai Tokerau.

      Time for a cup of tea and scones date for David Cunliffe and Hone Harawira perhaps?

      • Te Reo Putake 33.1.1

        Maybe a cuppa behind closed doors? From my perspective, there would need to be an explicit understanding of the IMP’s intentions post election. Laila is not exactly pro LP, so some care needs to be taken. But, as others have noted, if KD gets a decent list spot, then a party vote campaign could be the go.

        Greetings from Catalonia, by the way, Jenny. I’m off to the ‘hidden’ cemetery on the south side of Barcelona’s Montjuic tomorrow. A homage to Catalonia’s martyrs. Viva la republica!

        • weka 33.1.1.1

          Labour is not exactly pro other left-wing parties, so some care needs to be taken 😉

          • Tracey 33.1.1.1.1

            didnt cunliffe say on monday that labour and davis are going all out to win te tai tokerau?

            With the joint party seeking support from young disengaged voters rather than cannibalising the vote on the left, the Herald understands Labour has given some thought to pulling its punches in Te Tai Tokerau to give the alliance a better chance of bringing in additional left-block MPs. But Mr Cunliffe said Labour’s Te Tai Tokerau candidate, Kelvin Davis, would be running hard to win the seat.a

  33. Mike the Savage One 34

    Laila Harre would be a formidable person to be the leading candidate for the IP in the Internet Mana alliance. Her experience and skills will make a difference. A concern must be, will she, as a rather mature female activist and politician from the left, be able to excite and appeal to the young voters that the IP is actually trying to motivate to vote?

    With all the excitement by some here, bear a thought, this may rather be mixing up the left of centre, and lead to more competition between Greens and Internet Mana, and perhaps also some representing more progressive voices within Labour, all competing for the same kinds of votes from the so far less interested young voters.

    Harre is unlikely to appeal to prospective voters that have little interest in socialist, social democrat and left of centre policies. Her CV will not be of much interest or even relevance to most disillusioned young voters.

    Where are the YOUNG candidates, that they need to actually CONNECT with the young ones they say they want to vote for them? I do not see much of a prospect for major shift here, to counter or even reduce the right block of Nats, ACT and UF.

    As for Dotcom, he must be so desperate to get Key dealt to, he does not care whether the candidates are heavily left leaning. It seems to indicate that he is himself only interested in stirring things up. Once the election is over, he will likely pull back his financial support.

    • Murray Olsen 34.1

      That’s about the third time I’ve been reading down a thread, thinking of what to say, then arriving at your post and finding you’ve already said most of it. My concern as to how well Laila Harré fits with the IP is exactly this:
      “Harre is unlikely to appeal to prospective voters that have little interest in socialist, social democrat and left of centre policies. Her CV will not be of much interest or even relevance to most disillusioned young voters.”

      I’m still happier to see her there than a couple of others who’d been mentioned, such as Bomber Bradbury and Sealord Jones, but I’m not sure if she’ll do much at all to inspire the disaffected young net nerds to vote.

      The way I saw things last week was that my electorate vote might have enabled Annette Sykes or Marama Davidson to get a seat. Yesterday I thought it could be some unnamed internet nerd or Marama. Today it seems my choice is Laila Harré or Marama, along with whatever their respective parties bring to the table. I know how the Greens are likely to disappoint me and I have my doubts about the Internet Party. In terms of getting rid of Key, I think either vote will be just as effective. In terms of building a better country, I haven’t seen much I agree with the Internet Party on except for opposition to the spy agencies. My view on them is that we should dismantle the lot and stop paying the bills for the US and A. That’s been my view for about 40 years, well before Dotcom turned up on the scene.

      I also remember getting involved in the opposition to Muldoon, which gave us the first ACT government. My suspicions of the IP are because they seem closer to the 1984 Roger Douglas than I’m comfortable with.

      Kumar says the Internet Party are neither right nor left, but will look at the data and choose the best solution from either side. Ding, ding, ding…..warning bells. Or maybe I’m just too old to understand.

      I suppose we’ll see, but in the meantime, I wish people would stop slagging off Sue Bradford. One thing she does have is integrity and she walked because she couldn’t be part of what she saw happening. We could do with a bit more of that in Kiwi politics.

      • karol 34.1.1

        Totally agree with much of what you say, MO – especially the last paragraph.

      • weka 34.1.2

        Thanks for that insight into the Muldoon/ACT/Labour context Murray.

        Re Harre and the nerd vote. I doubt that CV reading is high on the list of things to consider. It will be how the IP/IMP use the internet, especially social media that will make the difference. Harre gives mainstream cred to the party. She’s a competent leader with suitable skills and is high profile enough for people to not just go “what?” I also think she can bridge the ‘hip’ divide irrespective of her age (we should also look out for who else ends up on the list).

        The party itself will be doing the promotion to the voters they are after. These voters won’t be primarily be watching MSM news. I don’t think we should underestimate how much IT is going to change this election. I don’t know what the IP are planning and have no idea how this will play out, but it seems likely that while the IMP will use the MSM as well, where they will excel and out trump the other parties (except maybe the GP) is via social media and online.

        For all the concerns about KDC’s motives and how using his money affects left wing values, the other thing that will change this election is that the MSM won’t be able to control and dictate the agenda to the same extent as they are used to.

        Whether this all works for the left, only time will tell, but I feel more hope than I have for a very long time. My view is biased by the fact that I like and respect Harre enormously, but the more I look at what IMP are doing the more I just see smart, very smart.

      • Mike the Savage One 34.1.3

        “Kumar says the Internet Party are neither right nor left, but will look at the data and choose the best solution from either side. Ding, ding, ding…..warning bells. Or maybe I’m just too old to understand.”

        You are right with that concern.

        But we may also consider that Dotcom, being of Finnish and German origin, having grown up in Northern Germany, grew up in a country rather more “regulated” and “socially designed” than the Germany of today. Also while things have changed there, like everywhere in the world, and while they have their ACT comparable party, the Free Democrats, it is still a country that is believing in a “social contract”.

        They are not like the Scandinavians (who have also changed), but Germany is probably less neoliberal in political direction than New Zealand is.

        While Dotcom, and his IP leaders, are leaning more towards libertarian ideas, he himself will be familiar with how things are in his country of origin, and indeed, what MANA stand for, is not that far from the “centrist” political ideas common in Germany.

        It shows how far to the right New Zealand has moved, being one of Anglo Saxon economies, looking more at the US as the “guiding example”, rather than Europe. Here the Nats shout out that Europe is “socialist”, and that this was the reason for them suffering the GFC.

        That is BS, and it exposes the Nats as far right, nearly there where ACT are, and MANA actually being more “social democratic” than “socialist” in much of what they stand for. This is perhaps also, why Dotcom, donor and creator of the IP, may not view MANA the same way as the NatACT idiots do. For Kim Dotcom MANA are just good meaning idealists, who may be worth a gamble, to unseat Key, whether he really likes their politics or not. He will not see MANA as such a great “risk”.

  34. Harry Holland 35

    Laila has a vehicle.
    KDC has a weapon.
    Hone has funding.
    Sue has principles.

  35. Clemgeopin 36

    My main worry is that the left vote may splinter away among the left parties and may adversely affect their votes, causing the Nats, ACT, Dunne, Craig and the Maori party to hold power again.
    One way is for the left block parties, Labour, Greens, Internet.Mana to hold talks privately and quickly to work out an election winning strategy of preventing that by doing some sort of electoral adjustments in some marginal seats, as well as in the Maori electorates.

    • Colonial Viper 36.1

      It’s MMP, and as you suggest there’s no need for any “splintering”.

      But it will take Labour to hold back in Waikari and TTT; the Maori Party will be over and Mana will get their seats.

      If the IP give Mana a 1% to 2% boost they might get 2 extra MPs.

      That’s a big Left win right there.

      • Murray Olsen 36.1.1

        Labour would have to acknowledge that they are, at best, part of the “left” before they’d do that. I don’t think they have been since 1984, but they seem to hold the quaint notion that they are “the left”. I think a grand coalition would come more naturally to most of them than any accommodation with the rising new parties.

        • Colonial Viper 36.1.1.1

          Such analysis is verboten! Verboten I say!!!

          I suspect accommodations could be reached between National and Labour on things like – welfare reform (there is a track record of this), raising the retirement age (John Key will be long gone), free trade agreements (including the corporate rights TPPA), security and surveillance state (a nice US friendly arrangement, maybe with a touch more transparency and review), money for the ag/hort industry, offshore drilling, etc.

          This would effectively lock out the ‘crazy minority parties’, forever.

        • Tracey 36.1.1.2

          i think labour still yearns for FPP no matter how often it fucked them in the past.

          • Tiger Mountain 36.1.1.2.1

            yep they will go all out for Kelvin Davis who blames Hone rather than his Lab listing and party for losing both Te Tai Tokerau and his parliamentary seat last time

  36. finbar 37

    Now it is rumoured that Willie Jackson is going to throw his hat in the ring with the Internet Party.

    Is it shaping up to be the Internet Alliance/Mana coalition.

  37. Awww 38

    I think it’s great. Strategy meets determination : )

  38. Observer (Tokoroa) 39

    Drones have been mentioned a few times in this commentary collection. The bad news is that John Key supports the arbitrary use of Drones.

    The good news is that any nation can and will use them.

    A killing field that is even, will be a new experience for Militarists and their weak minds.

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