On supporting the Rugby World Cup

113 comments on “On supporting the Rugby World Cup ”

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1. Anthony 1

   2 June 2011 at 1:35 pm

   My main gripe is the amount of people being kicked out of their flats so the landlords can make some money off the RWC.

   The 42 day ‘landlord moving back in’ notices seem to be flavour of the month.

   Because of the rental market they will have no trouble getting tenants afterwards.
2. John D 2

   2 June 2011 at 1:51 pm

   That video is brilliant!
   • ianmac 2.1

     2 June 2011 at 2:20 pm

     +1 🙂
     • John D 2.1.1

       2 June 2011 at 6:02 pm

       ” ball shaped like a giant testicle” it says in the song

       I am getting worried now. Are they supposed to be that shape?
       • Bunnykinz 2.1.1.1

         3 June 2011 at 1:25 am

         You could always ask Bob Clarkson so give you a quick squeeze to make sure they’re the right shape. I have heard he is something of an expert on the subject.
   • marsman 2.2

     2 June 2011 at 3:24 pm

     A funny video. Gay men will laugh, I know.
     After paying for the RWC hooha tax-payers are now urged to get behind it. What are the returns? Less than zilch it seems, but that’s NAct all over.
     • Jim Nald 2.2.1

       2 June 2011 at 3:31 pm

       Thanks to National’s incompetence and mismanagement, the losses and debt from this and their other failed policies that may result would be their legacy of a Brokeback Mountain for Kiwi taxpayers to climb.
       • Chris 2.2.1.1

         2 June 2011 at 7:07 pm

         I’m all for criticizing politicians when they’re shut but I’m not sure how national have mismanaged this? When they came to power it was already pretty set what was happening.

         Not saying that means labour mismanaged either. From a political perspective I don’t see that it has been mishandled.
         • Colonial Viper 2.2.1.1.1

           3 June 2011 at 2:29 am

           The mismanagement has come from throwing good public money after bad, subsidising private interests each step of the way with tax cuts etc, and pretending that there will be a pay off for NZ at the end by labelling the money spent as an “investment”.

           This at a time the public is being told to tighten its belt and to expect public services and public sector staffing to be slashed.
     • Morrissey 2.2.2

       3 June 2011 at 10:14 am

       True enough, marsman—but let’s not forget it was a Labour government that went all out and actually secured the enormous debt tournament.
       • Jim Nald 2.2.2.1

         5 June 2011 at 11:54 am

         When Labour went out to secure the tournament, it was not an inevitable debt but it would, with competence and good management (and a RWC minister who hasn’t been caught napping), have been an opportunity to make some profit and use the event to leverage off many spin-off projects and initiatives.

         McCully’s and co’s handling at many steps of the way have been poor and, quite frankly, really dismal. The eye-rolling “cloud” and tupperwaka have been symptomatic of how not to manage your way through and deliver a significant event. The inertia in deciding and announcing the move of fixtures from Christchurch was badly handled and wasted the time of travel agent and visitors who were trying to plan.

         Oh great, looks like “Kiwi taxpayers face a loss of close to $100 million” – so we have about 90 days lead up to RWC and what will be done to turn things round? (I’m in two minds whether to suggest or generate urgency here .. should Nats be left to wallow in their RWC tomb?) So Nats are good with business? Whose business? What business?

         Let’s await the report card on the government come post-RWC. Labour, Winston, Greens and Mana – are you making notes?
3. happynz 3

   2 June 2011 at 1:59 pm

   I quite like to watch sport (not all sport mind you – especially not soccer nor excruciatingly boring motor-racing). I also participate in sport to the extent that my physical ineptness allows me. Work can be grim and boring at times so a little bit of entertainment doesn’t go amiss.

   The media’s ‘call to arms’ to get behind the Rugby World Cup does make me cringe a bit. I’m not the flag-waving sort.
4. vto 4

   2 June 2011 at 1:59 pm

   lprent that is a bit disappointing. Imagine if similar had been posted about some gay outfit bazaar. Or perhaps the gaggle of gays comment by O’Connor recently. Or similar about Otara Markets. Or… the list goes on. Smells bigoted. It is reverse red-neckism. Sheesh.

   I thought the left were all about tolerance for their fellow manwoman no?
   • lprent 4.1

     2 June 2011 at 2:07 pm

     Bearing in mind my behavior pattern not only of banning people but also attempting to humiliate them when their behavior causes me too much effort moderating this site. And you still think that I’m a tolerant person?

     I’m tolerant of people arguing a position. I’m not tolerant of idiot behavior and I’m not shy of saying so.

     That doesn’t mean that I either have to agree with a position partially or fully. I will make up my own mind on everything after I have looked at whatever material is going. You should look closely about what I say about people like Damien O’Connor (nothing as I recall). On some things I will express my opinion quite strongly (Chris Carter for instance). I get regular complaints about it.

     In this case it means that I will respect my brother who is a bit of a sports maniac and makes a living from it. It doesn’t mean that I think it is a particularly good idea being a sports spectator like he sometimes is. I will tolerate him talking about it in the same way that he will tolerate me talking about science or computers.

     But I’m afraid that I draw the line at drunken idiots talking about rugby in the street at 2am. I think that is bad behavior – don’t you? That is the position I’m arguing, and I’m attributing it to the boorish behavior that seems to be associated with a lot of rugby supporters. You’re welcome to disagree.

     And the video is just funny….
     • vto 4.1.1

       2 June 2011 at 2:22 pm

       Yea partly. The video is funny… in the same way that people make jokes about other races and genders and religions and sexual orientations. And look how upset those various groups get when the mickey is taken out their arses. Don’t get me wrong – I’m all for pulling people’s tits. It’s just that so many people seem to get upset at tit pulling yet laugh their own tits off when such humour is directed at people other than them. Hypocrisy of a type.

       And yep anyone yelling in the streets at 2am is a cock-sucker. (may as well get into the swing of things).

       Just pushing the double-standard button that’s all. Doesn’t worry me – get into it I say. Just don’t complain when some other group of people get the mickey taken out of them.

       And on that note… have you heard the one about the maori gaybo riding a horse down Queen Street?
       • stever 4.1.1.1

         2 June 2011 at 3:25 pm

         Making fun of other people’s free choices and opinions (religion-if it IS a free choice-, sport, dining habits) is OK—might not be popular, or appropriate at some times, or comfortable, but the things we freely choose to do and say (as competent adults) are fair game for criticism and ridicule.

         Things we have no choice over (where we’re born, our orientation, some disability, the colour of our skin, or gender) when ridiculed or argued against in some way is wrong for a competent adult, and such behaviour is rightly criticised.

         Why is it wrong? Because it’s cruel and harmful.

         A video about rugby is surely in the former category.
   • Carol 4.2

     2 June 2011 at 2:37 pm

     Actually, I thought the video is taking the p**s out of the hard man rugby attitude that uses gay as a term of ridicule -. I’ve seen gay men run a similar line in send-up.
   • felix 4.3

     2 June 2011 at 3:11 pm

     Haha “reverse red-neckism” v?

     Is that like “reverse stupidity”?

     You must hate those bloody firefighters too v. After all it’s just “reverse arson”.
   • Puddleglum 4.4

     3 June 2011 at 9:15 am

     vto, if you think through your position through then the equivalent video clip would involve playing the public’s suspicions of latent heterosexuality at the Big Gay Out (or something) for laughs.

     The problem is that I’m not sure it would get many laughs – and there are a number of reasons for that. Those reasons show why your point doesn’t really ‘scan’.

     I get your sentiment but, by the same token, we shouldn’t make fun of corporate executives who claim they’re innocently running their companies to ‘help society’ or ‘save the environment’. But the fact is that we can (successfully) parody them because of the suspicion that that isn’t their real motive. That’s what so much satire depends upon.
   • Morrissey 4.5

     3 June 2011 at 10:20 am

     vto, what the HELL do you mean by “reverse red-neckism”?

     You need to read this…

     http://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-17052011/#comment-331423
5. ianmac 5

   2 June 2011 at 2:30 pm

   The ultimate rugby players are the Golden Oldies. Never before, apart from kids games, have I watched such huge pleasure expressed by big old men plodding around the paddock. When one gets a bit puffed he drags off his jersey and hands it over to someone, anyone standing on the sideline. In the first match a brittle old chap fell, wasn’t pushed, and broke his forearm. One of the team rushed off to the sideline, kicked a beercrate to bits, and rushed back on ready to make a splint. They did get proper medical help for him, the injured him I mean.
   So I think the people to be admired are those who play the game at whatever level, and find the manic spectator hard to figure. The few times that I went to watch a “big match” I spent most of my time just watching the watchers. Fascinating.
6. Brett Dale 6

   2 June 2011 at 2:30 pm

   I wont be supporting the RWC either.

   One of the reason is the lies coming out the media about how global this thing is.

   The other is in my personal exoperience, Rugby fans dont support other sports.

   Its always the rugby fan that is homophobic and calls a soccer fan a poofter.

   Its always the rugby fan that knocks league.

   Its always the rugby fans that knocks basketball.

   I have never heard a feild hocky fan knock another sport.

   I have never heard a netball fan knock another sport.

   But rugby fans tend to do this, perhaps they have some sort of chip on their shoulder??

   So rugby fans enjoy your rwc, but dont exopect non rugby fans to get behind it, because you guys dont get behind our sports.
   • The Voice of Reason 6.1

     2 June 2011 at 2:57 pm

     Nicely put, Brett. I like to regularly remind my few rugby head friends that NZ are currently World and Four Nations Champions in league and that was acheived against the odds without massive media/government/industry sponsorship. And that Rugby Union is just a pension enhancing option for league players who can’t hack it anymore.
      
     The facts are straightforward. Rugby has ceased to be a significant player sport in NZ, most rural and provincial clubs are amalgamating or folding, bugger all money comes from on high down to the grass roots and if it wasn’t endlessly on the telly, it would quickly whither and die.
      
     It’s a dangerous, ridiculously complex and desperately boring game, mostly played by people who aren’t hard enough for league or bright enough for football. And speaking of football, god spare us from the thugby fans who think they know about the game they play in heaven. There are more teams than Chelsea or Man U, you dimwitted tools and no, you don’t know the offside rule.
      
     I’ve decided to get out of NZ for the whole thing. I’m moving to Abbottabad, Pakistan in late October for a month or so just to avoid the whole World Cup circus. Doing a home swap with a nice bloke with a rather distinctive Saudi accent. Mind you, he hasn’t been in touch recently … hope there’s nothing wrong?
     • Morrissey 6.1.1

       3 June 2011 at 10:24 am

       The Voice of Reason: So you don’t like football. That’s fine. Just say it, but leave out the ridiculous, tortured rationale.
       • The Voice of Reason 6.1.1.1

         3 June 2011 at 10:30 am

         I love football, Mozza. Played it all my life and and I’m West Ham Till I Die. It’s rugby union I don’t like.
         • Morrissey 6.1.1.1.1

           3 June 2011 at 10:37 am

           You don’t like football. This is New Zealand, my friend. Your reasons are unconvincing, by the way. How much do you know about rugby? Not much, judging by your comments.

           Perhaps you’re a rugby journalist?
           • The Voice of Reason 6.1.1.1.1.1

             3 June 2011 at 11:05 am

             Ha, I’d make a great rugby journo. I’d be the only honest one in the press room for a start and the only one not grovelling to the RFU. It amazes me how anything the TV commentators say can be understood, what with their tongues so firmly lodged in Graham Henry’s arse. I’d still eat the free tucker and drink the sponsors product, though, but only out of contempt.
              
             Speaking of Henry, in football, he would have been shown the door years ago with a record that awful. Hell, even having a good season doesn’t always save you from being sacked. You’ve got to actually deliver meaningful silverware not promises.
              
             Is it too late to cancel the whole thing? The rest of the world won’t care, because they don’t know it’s happening anyway.
             • Morrissey …

               3 June 2011 at 11:19 am

               Why do you think the commentators support Henry? Their comments after the last RWC were extraordinarily vitriolic, and ignorant, just as they were before and after the 1999 tournament.

               Speaking of Henry, in football, he would have been shown the door years ago with a record that awful.

               Henry is “in football”. I’m intrigued about this: would you insist on calling soccer “football” if you were in the United States?
               • The Voice of Reason …

                 3 June 2011 at 11:37 am

                 I think they support Henry because their jobs rely on it. To be fair, though, I’m sure there was criticism after the last RWC when they felt safe to comment because they expected him to be sacked. But they would have returned to type as soon as they realised he was staying on.
                  
                 The language is interesting. I don’t know anyone bar you who refers to rugby as football anymore, though there are plenty in football here who still call that game soccer. Footie in Oz is Rules if you live in Victoria, League if you live on the East Coast. And, of course football is Gridiron in the states. NZ Football has made a conscious effort to go with FIFA’s preferred usage and I think it’s only the States that still formally stick to soccer in their national organisation’s name.
                  
                 One of the great things about football is that you don’t need to know what it’s called or indeed even share a language to play the game. It’s such a simple concept and with only only 11 primary rules compared to Rugby’s labrynthine mess it’s no wonder it remains the world’s favourite game. One of my favourite sporting memories was playing in a Moscow park in a pick up game between two sets of students. Russia vs the Rest of the World (mainly Africa) and I didn’t understand a word anyone said from either team, but still managed to slot into the game without difficulty. Fantastic!
                 • Morrissey …

                   3 June 2011 at 11:49 am

                   The language is interesting. I don’t know anyone bar you who refers to rugby as football anymore..
                   Nonsense. You need to get out more.

                   Footie in Oz is Rules if you live in Victoria…
                   No, it’s football. “Footie” is a puerilization.

                   And, of course football is Gridiron in the states.
                   No, football is football. The gridiron is a slang term for the field.

                   NZ Football has made a conscious effort to go with FIFA’s preferred usage…
                   Actually, that stems from a directive by John “Possumhead” O’Neill. Until then, NZ Football had called itself Soccer New Zealand.

                   Your other comments (about rules, etc.) are all very interesting, and I endorse them wholeheartedly.
                   • Samuel Hill …

                     3 June 2011 at 12:45 pm

                     You old fellas might still call rugby “football”, but history and the rest of the world will absolve that.
   • Morrissey 6.2

     3 June 2011 at 10:35 am

     Its always the rugby fan that is homophobic and calls a soccer fan a poofter.

     Nonsense. I’m a rugby fan and I have never said that, or thought that, about a soccer fan. Same goes for most rugby fans I know. They are far more informed and generous than you say they are.

     Of course, there are certainly halfwits like Andy Haden, who publicly taunted the dying Lew Pryme as a “mincing poofter”, recently slammed rape victims as “sluts” and told lies about the Canterbury Crusaders having a quota policy for Polynesians. The fact is: some rugby fans and players are like that, and unfortunately a disproportionately large number of rugby commentators certainly say demeaning and ignorant things about all manner of things.

     I’ve snipped the rest of your ridiculous comments.

     By the way: you’ve mis-spelled it’s all the way through your splenetic and untruthful rant.
     • Brett Dale 6.2.1

       3 June 2011 at 12:09 pm

       I go by my own experiences, the amount of times I have been verbally abuse for liking another sport that isn’t rugby, the amount of times I have heard a rugby fan has been ripping into another sport must be in the hundreds.

       I have yet to hear fans of other codes do this, it seems to be ina rugby fan’s mindset to do this.
       • Pascal's bookie 6.2.1.1

         3 June 2011 at 12:50 pm

         Certainly Rugby fans in NZ can be pricks about it, but it’s the same all over with dominant sports. In Britain football fans deride minority sports, rugby is a ‘poofters game’ etc. To say that it’s particular to some sort of rugby mindset is just showing the exact behaviour yourself.

         To ask the obvious question, what preparations have been made to stem the expected tide of rugby hooligans, in comparison with a FIFA event?

         —————————

         I stopped playing several years ago, and I don’t watch as much as I used to. I don’t like many of the new rules, as they seem to have changed the game from one that was basically all about a contest for possession, (genuinely contested scrums, lineouts, rucks, and mauls) to one about field position where the rules do most of the protection for you and you only lose possesion through fucking up. It’s a faster game to watch, but it’s a fundamentally different game from what it was. I’m finding the contests to be boring in the way that I find league to be boring. Which is not to say that others can’t like it.
       • Morrissey 6.2.1.2

         3 June 2011 at 4:52 pm

         I go by my own experiences, the amount of times I have been verbally abuse [sic!] for liking another sport that isn’t rugby, the amount of times I have heard a rugby fan has been ripping into another sport must be in the hundreds.
         I suspect these “hundreds” of people were “ripping into” you and your absurdly bloviated sense of injustice.

         I have yet to hear fans of other codes do this, it seems to be in a rugby fan’s mindset to do this.
         Nonsense. Utter nonsense. Just looking at some of the resentful anti-rugby comments on this thread blows your ridiculous excuse for an argument out of the water.
   • Deadly_NZ 6.3

     3 June 2011 at 3:00 pm

     not only That Brett you forgot the biggest lie from the media: It’s going to be exciting. Yeah right who effing cares???? it has to be the most boring game, so full of Prima donna’s it’s starting to make English soccer seem more blokey..

     I will be so glad when it’s over and we can get back to sanity with league and cricket.

     how do you make Rugby interesting????

     6 tackles then kick or chase!
     • Morrissey 6.3.1

       3 June 2011 at 4:59 pm

       how do you make Rugby interesting????
       Good point, my friend. I think for a start, all kicks at goal should be drop-kicks, and a team should not be rewarded for putting the ball out of play, as happens now. Quick throw-ins, and quick KICK-ins as well, in any direction.

       6 tackles then kick or chase!
       That’s not the answer. For all its faults, and there are many, Rugby Union is far more spectacular than Rugby League.
7. Jim Nald 7

   2 June 2011 at 2:40 pm

   Wasn’t that a high tackle there ?
   • lprent 7.1

     2 June 2011 at 2:48 pm

     I thought it was more of a fondle…. 😈

     I tell you what though – that is good comedy.  I don’t think I’ll ever be able to look at rugby in quite the same way after watching that clip.
     • Jim Nald 7.1.1

       2 June 2011 at 2:50 pm

       fondle? lemme watch again …
       • Jim Nald 7.1.1.1

         2 June 2011 at 3:06 pm

         Hmm .. ok, that could be an ambiguous fondle/tackle.

         The best part of the video is the two guys who, unlike the guys playing rugby, are openly kissing: about 1’45”.
         • prism 7.1.1.1.1

           2 June 2011 at 9:30 pm

           Perhaps we have the opportunity of spawning a new word to ‘fonkle’. Only the in-people who congegrate on The Standard will know this one, and all the rugby types will be bewildered and confused.
     • Bob 7.1.2

       3 June 2011 at 11:09 am

       Have you seen the clip that Dead Cat Bounce made on Golf , just as amusing . They are very funny.
       • lprent 7.1.2.1

         3 June 2011 at 1:53 pm

         Yep. But that is better visually than in the song.

         Even better in the song is the one about the driving instructor with little kids being viewed as obstacles to learning how to drive.
8. Carol 8

   2 June 2011 at 2:47 pm

   I thought it was Murray McCully calling for getting beind the RWC.

   http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/rugby-world-cup/5082817/Get-in-behind-Rugby-World-Cup-boss-urges

   One hundred days out from New Zealand’s biggest international event, and after a year overshadowed by tragedy and recession, Rugby World Cup organisers and the Government are uniting in a call to Kiwis to get behind the tournament.
   • Jim Nald 8.1

     2 June 2011 at 2:49 pm

     Sounds like he has been caught napping until now and was just suddenly being nudged awake. Yesterday.
     • lprent 8.1.1

       2 June 2011 at 2:58 pm

       Yeah, McCully is a natural for The Party of the Walking Dead when he finally says Bye Bye .
   • lprent 8.2

     2 June 2011 at 2:53 pm

     Could have been.

     There was also some travelling troupe that the RWC organizers had wandering the country that Key was involved in.

     It was something on the TV news background noise that I wasn’t paying attention to. At least not until I woke up and started fuming while I was debating leaving the nice warm bed to hurl abuse on the spectator yobs (they staggered off before I decided – the bed was warm).
9. randal 9

   2 June 2011 at 2:52 pm

   all the local tory boys on the dole are rooting for ozzy becuz they know if the AB’s lose then the gnats will be zapped.
10. Maui 10

    2 June 2011 at 3:38 pm

    lprent: you have my sympathy. I lived through the RWC in Sydney. It turned out that some of the English tourists I met were a lot better behaved than many of the locals – although in Sydney rugby is generally the game of well-bred private schoolboys while aspiring working-class boys play league.

    This too shall pass.

    What worries me is that the next election seems to hang on the fate of the NZRFU national team.
    • lprent 10.1

      2 June 2011 at 5:25 pm

      I think that is more the political commentators being their usual simplistic selfs. This kind of stuff works well a long way out from the election in the same manner that sports commentators fill the airwaves with idiotic blather when they are in dead time.

      The reality is that voters tend to firm up markedly close to an election when they actually make up their minds and their minds won’t be swayed by minor trivia unless they don’t think that there is much choice (the united future result in 2002 comes to mind as an example of the latter).
      • Maui 10.1.1

        2 June 2011 at 6:06 pm

        “The reality is that voters tend to firm up markedly close to an election when they actually make up their minds and their minds won’t be swayed by minor trivia unless they don’t think that there is much choice (the united future result in 2002 comes to mind as an example of the latter).”

        Yes, except that this election date is soon after the end of the RWC when emotions may still be high in various swinging electorates.

        How soon ? I’m frankly not sure. Does anyone have the dates ?
      • Treetop 10.1.2

        2 June 2011 at 8:02 pm

        Key just wants rugby to be an escape from reality. The problem is when the rugby is gone the reality has to be faced.
      • Morrissey 10.1.3

        3 June 2011 at 10:40 am

        sports commentators fill the airwaves with idiotic blather when they are in dead time.

        Correction: Sports commentators fill the airwaves with idiotic blather ALL of the time.
11. M 11

    2 June 2011 at 6:42 pm

    Lynn

    LMFAO almost ROFLMAO but not quite although my office chair was groaning in protest. Just the pick me up I needed after a hard out day at work – will be forwarding to friends, thank you.

    ‘But I’m afraid I’ve never quite grasped the point of having lard-arses who are not playing sitting around squealing with vicarious childish excitement as other people do all of the work. Mostly I look at them and wonder if the supporters are just having a new age moment. Does assiduously watching others exerting effort will somehow transfer its effects to themselves?’

    Magic words those and they echo my sentiments exactly – the new age thing, priceless!
    • Carol 11.1

      2 June 2011 at 6:57 pm

      I enjoy watching some rugby on TV, though I’ve lost interest lately. But to me sport is more like watching a live drama unfold. Sometimes I watch it while working out on the exercise machine – so not everyone is sitting & non-active while watching. I gave up going to matches many decades ago. I grew up in a rugby playing & watching family. In my younger days I spent quite a bit of time socialising with rugby players & spectators. As a teenager, I found much of the misogynistic attitudes, and other expressions of conservatism quite offensive.

      I think all the hype and political maneuvering over the RWC has been putting m off rugny generally lately. I enjoy watching some sports matches on TV, but I am not interested in all the pre- & post match hype & discourse. I dislike the way sport has become extensively commodified & usually am not interested in watching those extravagant opening & closing ceremonies – what a massive waste of money that could best be spent elsewhere!
    • lprent 11.2

      2 June 2011 at 10:46 pm

      Thanks, I think I was inspired by sleep deprivation…
12. Robert Atack 12

    2 June 2011 at 6:44 pm

    Dr John Robinson on Radio NZ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6uRJXcchOWI&feature=channel_video_title

    World Cup don’t come campaign http://ibwswrc.blogspot.com/
    RUGBY WORLD CUP – DON’T COME
    AN ISLAND BAY WORLD SERVICE CAMPAIGN

    At the 2010 ECO AGM a motion was passed “that Island Bay World Service inform ECO member bodies of its Rugby World Cup, don’t come campaign”. Here is that information, introducing the campaign.

    Rugby fans across the world must stay home and watch the games on television, and thus refuse to waste valuable oil and produce tonnes of greenhouse gases just for a game. That unambiguous call will send a clear message to the world to announce that we understand, we care and we are taking action.
    http://ibwswrc.blogspot.com/
13. burt 13

    2 June 2011 at 8:09 pm

    lprent

    Great post lprent, and love the clip. I was just explaining to a person reasonably new to kiwiana a few days ago I’m not a Rugby supporter so I’m not really excited about the World cup. For a Kiwi male it’s like coming out of the closet (I imagine) admitting you don’t really give a toss about Rugby.
    • Lanthanide 13.1

      2 June 2011 at 8:40 pm

      “For a Kiwi male it’s like coming out of the closet (I imagine) admitting you don’t really give a toss about Rugby.”

      Having done both, they really are nothing alike. Sorry.
      • chris73 13.1.1

        2 June 2011 at 8:54 pm

        Well played
      • burt 13.1.2

        2 June 2011 at 8:56 pm

        Cheers, I won’t use that comparison again.
    • lprent 13.2

      3 June 2011 at 1:13 am

      It was a pretty amusing clip. They do have some other good clips out there as well.

      I enjoyed playing rugby when I was playing it. But that was about as far as it went. The RWC just leaves me totally bored with the inanity of the marketing and that just annoys me to active hostility.

      But I have exactly the same feelings about all sport. Enjoy doing it, bored with spectating, and as hostile to marketing it to me as I am to door to door religionist dogma.

      Bu I have always been like that. It was not that much of a hassle even inside my largely sport mad relatives or being a barman in the equally sport crazy public bars of Hamilton
14. chris73 14

    2 June 2011 at 8:33 pm

    Yep looking forward to the RWC (less then 100 days now!) but each to their own I say
15. Zaphod Beeblebrox 15

    2 June 2011 at 8:43 pm

    For a professional sport Rugby gets a huge amount of taxpayer support. The Auckland and Dunedin ratepayers are shelling out stadiums which will be controlled by non-public entities. Given the poor state of crowds we get for rugby in this country- you can guarantee these stadiums will need further public support unless you could guarnatee them 1/2 a dozen All-Black tests a year.

    You can see the NZRU are heading for big financial problems after the RWC since they simply can’t get enough people to come to games. Pretty sure the government can’t keep propping up the old boys club. Whats the solution? They need to amke the game more fan friendly and acessible IMO- how about a few S15 day games? You can’t take kids to sport in the dark and rain.
    • Morrissey 15.1

      3 June 2011 at 10:45 am

      They need to make the game more fan-friendly and accessible IMO- how about a few S15 day games?

      Hear, hear! In fact, how about nearly EVERY game being played in daylight? And certainly no night games after the end of April.

      You can’t take kids to sport in the dark and rain.
      I don’t really think the intellectuals morons running the game even care about the fans. Or the players, who hate the night games.
      • J Mex 15.1.1

        3 June 2011 at 2:34 pm

        Hmmm, I’m pretty sure the timing of games has more to do with the enormous European television market, and would have been a condition of our bid.

        We would never have won if the UK viewers had to get up at 3am to watch games.

        Commercial/Commercials reality.
        • Morrissey 15.1.1.1

          3 June 2011 at 5:25 pm

          You’re right, J Mex. Mind you, in balmy October, night games will come across well.

          The real sin against the players and spectators is night games in the middle of winter.
16. Sam 16

    2 June 2011 at 10:08 pm

    Didn’t Helen Clark secure New Zealand the rugby world cup? It’s not rugby’s fault that John is using the RWC to hide his shitty policies and shitty government.
    • lprent 16.1

      2 June 2011 at 10:49 pm

      She did indeed, at considerable effort. Well she was not always right.
      • McFlock 16.1.1

        3 June 2011 at 12:13 am

        ” Well she was not always right.”
        bzzt…bzzt…a.Standard.moderator.does.not.100%.support.everything.HC did… bzzt…tory.brain.melting…bzzt…does.not.compute…bzzt…*pop*
        • lprent 16.1.1.1

          3 June 2011 at 12:57 am

          There are some who like things simplistic, and definitely prefer not to deal with reality.

          I worked with Helen in her electorate for about 17 years. We always disagreed at some level on most things because our backgrounds and skills were so different. But she was worth supporting, and evidentially I must have been doing a good job. I wound up targeting the local campaigns for much of that period with good results.

          It was always amusing watching the RWNJ’s with their idiotic ideas about her.
      • Morrissey 16.1.2

        3 June 2011 at 11:32 am

        In fact, she was often utterly wrong. Remember how she and her party went into panic mode after the Orewa speech by Don Brash? She listened to some genius of a strategist (Paul Holmes’ ex-classmate Mike Williams perhaps?) and swiftly moved to dissociate Labour from too close an association with Maori, lest Labour suffer pillorying from the likes of Leighton Smith, Michael Laws and Paul Holmes. Hence the abolition of “Closing the Gaps”, and unleashing the likes of Trevor Mallard to make demeaning public comments about “overlong and boring” Maori ceremonies. Then she contemptuously dismissed the ensuing Maori protests.

        Have you forgotten her foul and dishonest treatment of refugee Ahmed Zaoui?

        And perhaps most disgustingly of all, she sat back and grinned as Michael Cullen, Mallard and her friend Winston Peters casually and cynically defamed Keith Locke in the House.
17. jackal 17

    3 June 2011 at 12:06 am

    I think this is a particularly difficult topic to gain traction on. There’s the unfortunate effect of sower grapes in attacking National over their obvious electioneering a sporting event. It creates a juxtaposition in that such a widely supported event will be predominantly accepted despite the political taint of corruption. That’s why the left has to be careful on this issue; any criticism could be easily utilized against them.

    Hang on a sec, the neighbors nutting off again. 😈 Now where was I?

    Like yourself lprent, I played rugby and league and was pretty damn good at it, if I do say so myself. However unlike you I enjoy watching a good rugby game. I like to set the bar pretty high on the politics VS sport conundrum, as there are vast benefits to having a sporting nation. There are vast benefits to being principled as well of course.

    What I really don’t enjoy is the huge amounts of commercialisation that has largely overtaken any enjoyable experience available from these sporting events. That’s where I take the bar down again and feel like smacking a few National politicians and media moguls about the head. They have commercialised the RWC for their own purposes effectively making sport play second fiddle to the almighty dollar. National has paid for that whoring with around $500 million taxpayer dollars, removing employment laws, importing cheap labour and generally doing the dirty all over our Natioanl sport.

    The publics going to lap it up… Be sure that you don’t tell them its poison before they start feeling sick.
    • Colonial Viper 17.1

      3 June 2011 at 2:43 am

      There’s the unfortunate effect of sower grapes in attacking National over their obvious electioneering a sporting event.

      No real need for the Left to be labelled as “good sports” this election year. Especially when the only families who can go to RWC All Black games in our own country need to be willing and able to spend many hundreds of dollars on tickets alone to do so.

      Ordinary NZ’ers being priced out of eating, living and playing in our own country, why pretend that we like it?
      • jackal 17.1.1

        3 June 2011 at 9:10 am

        After reading the comment of PeteG below, I tend to side with your analysis there CV. “The gloves are off.” Perhaps PeteG thinks that a kinder gentler form of fascism is acceptable, or that the some $500 million dollars that taxpayers are stumping up for the RWC is OK! In my book, when you rob the poor to pay for a sporting event for the wealthy, that’s a line in the sand that should not have been crossed. I’m not saying that flower bombing is appropriate in these circumstances, but a good dose of reality in the form of anger might be just what the hobbits need to wake the fuck up!
        • higherstandard 17.1.1.1

          3 June 2011 at 9:46 am

          Go for it [name deleted], I look forward to you protesting outside the All Blacks games during the cup………. especially if they lose the game.
          • terryg 17.1.1.1.1

            3 June 2011 at 11:51 am

            nice implied threat there.

            last year I went to the AB-vs-dont_gice_a_shit_who game in Hong Kong – my SIL and her husband are mad keen rugby fans. the game was OK, although I cant recall who won.

            Afterwards, however, the behaviour of the drunken hordes of fuckwits (AKA “spectators”) made me truly ashamed to be a kiwi. boorish doesn’t even begin to describe it.

            Having watched that most hilarious video above, I can now posit a hypothesis explaining the aggressive behaviour – its all due to the internalisation of angst over their own repressed homosexuality. this would also nicely explain the rampant, overt homphobia of rugby fans, as evinced by the frequent usage of “faggot” etc. as insults.

            I cant help but wonder how many current or former all blacks have permanent name suppression for violently assaulting their spouses? Its fun to ask that of rugby-heads, but look out for violent responses 🙂

            wrt the RWC itself – fuck the RWC. I cant not support it as I’m, a taxpayer and we’re coughing up the bulk of the dosh (for no aparent reward), but I do hope NZ gets knocked out in the quarter-finals.

            And I’m still confused as to why the 2nd Mangere bridge was required for the RWC – I can only presume the influx of RWC tourists is expected to include their vehicles as well.
            • higherstandard 17.1.1.1.1.1

              3 June 2011 at 2:31 pm

              No I’m not threatening [name deleted] – but I admit it would be a laugh to see him get a good kicking and have a cry.
              • The Voice of Reason …

                3 June 2011 at 2:34 pm

                Too late, HS, you should have been here yesterday!
                • higherstandard …

                  3 June 2011 at 2:45 pm

                  I did have a titter thanks to yours and Eve’s efforts.
                • J Mex …

                  3 June 2011 at 2:45 pm

                  “No real need for the Left to be labelled as “good sports” this election year. Especially when the only families who can go to RWC All Black games in our own country need to be willing and able to spend many hundreds of dollars on tickets alone to do so” – CV

                  That will be a winning strategy for the left – Come out against the Rugby world cup.

                  First, Peter Jackson
                  Second, Rugby World Cup

                  Third? Maybe diss the Memory of Sir Ed Hillary?

                  You need to be in the strategy brains trust mate.
    • PeteG 17.2

      3 June 2011 at 7:43 am

      I’m a keen rugby supporter too, and also don’t care for the overdose of commercialism, but unfortunately that’s part of any high profile game these days, in any sport.

      I’m interested in the RWC and I’ll follow it keenly, but I haven’t decided if I will see any games live yet, even though I live not far from the new Dunedin stadium.

      Whether you like rugby or sport or commercialism or not, the RWC (as an event) is very important for New Zealand, financially and image-wise.

      As much as I don’t like the commercialism, I detest the attempted politicising of it. If Labour was still in government I bet they would be pushing it as much as they could – or at least they should. It’s not yet another great RW conspiracy.

      It’s coincidental that it happens to be in the same year as an election. The timing of the election is logical and very much as expected and as it should be. Get over it.

      The RWC won’t defeat Labour. They are making a good job of doing that themselves.

      And I – and I expect many others – will be very very pissed off if the RWC is disrupted and adversely affected by political opportunists. It would be like kicking trying to kick the country in the guts. (Reasonable peaceful non-disruptive protest is ok)
      • lprent 17.2.1

        3 June 2011 at 2:05 pm

        I haven’t seen Labour politicizing the RWC? I wish that they would.

        As far as I’m concerned the state should not be putting ANY money into most sports (as sports) outside of the school-kid level (which does serve some social purpose). There are a few adult sports that do also perform a useful social need – for instance the ones for surf-guards.

        Most of the sports appear to be there entirely for the entertainment industry. If there are state funds put into them, then they should compete with the rest of the entertainment industries rather than running from separate funds as they are now. The amount of state and local govt money that has been pushed into just the upgrades on Eden Park this last year or so would dwarf almost every other levels of support for any other part of the entertainment industry for decades.

        That is the type of political discussion I’d like to see.
        • higherstandard 17.2.1.1

          3 June 2011 at 2:28 pm

          “Most of the sports appear to be there entirely for the entertainment industry. If there are state funds put into them, then they should compete with the rest of the entertainment industries rather than running from separate funds as they are now.”

          I agree with you completely Lynn (with the odd exception) but can you imagine the howling you’d get if you replaced ‘sports’ with ‘the arts’ ?
          • lprent 17.2.1.1.1

            3 June 2011 at 2:39 pm

            I really don’t care that much if it is arts or sport or NZ on-air or film commission or whatever.

            It is the silo’ing of such funds that I object to more because of the evident inequities it causes. The amount of state funds that go into sport (including such things as state gambling) completely dwarf those that go to all other types of entertainment. The amount of money that goes into making frigging game shows and reality TV probably dwarfs what is put into airing any other on-screen programmes.

            You could argue a pretty good case that arts that examine local mores and culture have valid place for funding. For instance historical programs like Belich’s series on the Moari wars have been massively influential on our culture. Ditto for such things as museums and art galleries. But at present the silo’ing means that these things are fighting for part of a very small budget while sport takes the bulk of the entertainment money.
            • higherstandard 17.2.1.1.1.1

              3 June 2011 at 2:43 pm

              “The amount of money that goes into making frigging game shows and reality TV probably dwarfs what is put into airing any other on-screen programmes.”

              I attempt not to think about such things lest I get testy (.. ….well more testy)
        • PeteG 17.2.1.2

          3 June 2011 at 2:42 pm

          I haven’t seen Labour politicizing the RWC?

          Neither have I. I’m sure most Labourites aware of the importance of getting some sort of return on a major investment – for the country and for their own efforts on bringing it to NZ, without a huge (Labour) government effort it wouldn’t be happening here.

          It tends to be would be radicals on the fringes who are political opportunists, like Hone’s Mum, and the odd one on the blogs.
18. Sookie 18

    3 June 2011 at 12:48 am

    I’ve never liked rugby and the majority of its meatheaded fanboys, and now my rates are paying for a stupid bloody white elephant of a stadium no one really wants, I REALLY don’t like it. I hope the AB’s lose, simply to deprive Smug Key all the faux feel good buzz. Go the Springboks.
    • Carol 18.1

      3 June 2011 at 5:52 am

      Heh. But I believe Aussie may be a stronger contender for the RWC title this time than the Boks.
    • Morrissey 18.2

      3 June 2011 at 10:56 am

      Go the Springboks.

      You mean, “Go the French”, surely. It’s the only team capable of actually thrashing the All Blacks….
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KNcyK5JtFZ8&feature=related
      • Lanthanide 18.2.1

        3 June 2011 at 11:54 am

        They make good calendars, too:
        http://www.google.com/search?q=french+rugby+calendar&hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=mVI&rls=org.mozilla:en-GB:official&prmd=ivns&source=lnms&tbm=isch&ei=6yDoTazZLsLniAK6rMCZAQ&sa=X&oi=mode_link&ct=mode&cd=2&ved=0CAwQ_AUoAQ&biw=1680&bih=889
19. tc 19

    3 June 2011 at 7:51 am

    Rugby is perfect foil for the NACT, elitist with little of the ‘trickle down’ to where it’s needed to produce the next meads etc. It’s disconnected from it’s roots and has forgotten what makes a strong league/competition, tribalism.

    European football has strength and depth because it allows teams to rise and fall and they all enjoy strong local connections that see them through. In contrast to the NZRU wrecking the NPC and generally having f’all idea about how professional sport actually works.

    Carter and Mccaw are at the end of their careers in terms of being top AB’s so a 5 year contract stifles the next gen players desperately needed…..richie will be injured more often than not and DAN chokes when it matters most.

    Not selecting overseas players is a joke, Brazil has won 5 world cups because they pick their best players not just brazillian based players. I find there’s many comparisons between the incompetence of the government and the NZRU.

    This RWC is a celebration of a boys club game that isn’t global, easy to watch nor our national game IMO as the brand has been devalued by the chumps in charge and if the AB’s don’t win then they only have themselves to blame for reappointing failure in Henry
    and his yes man culture club.

    We were great when we had onfield leaders…..don’t see any leaders just Henrys yes men. Professionalism levelled the playing field and we haven’t stepped up.
    • Morrissey 19.1

      3 June 2011 at 11:40 am

      …if the AB’s don’t win then they only have themselves to blame for reappointing failure in Henry
      and his yes man culture club.

      Errr, you’ve forgotten one extremely important factor that just might have something to do with the All Blacks possibly failing to win. The opposition? You do know they have FRANCE in their pool, don’t you?
      • sean maitland 19.1.1

        3 June 2011 at 3:22 pm

        Yeah but the top two teams get out of their pool anyway, so its a given that both the AB’s and France will qualify for the next round. I think Tonga will relish the chance to bash up the Frenchies and will keep them on their toes for a while, but will still end up getting well beaten. No-one else in the pool will challenge either team.
        • Morrissey 19.1.1.1

          3 June 2011 at 5:06 pm

          I agree with you. Bear in mind, though, that in 1999, Tonga actually beat France, on that absurd tour which culminated in the 54-7 thrashing by the All Blacks in the last test ever at Athletic Park.

          Fools like Murray Deaker, Wynne “Sensible” Gray and Martin Devlin all seemed to think that would be how France played when they actually made an effort in the World Cup a few months later…
20. sean maitland 20

    3 June 2011 at 8:27 am

    I’m going to 5 games in Wellington and have category A seats for the final. I love that our country is hosting such a big event, and am sure its going to be an awesome time for a lot of NZers.

    Its fine not liking it and being over the media exposure and hype (even though the hype will only increase from here), but the people having a go at it and criticising the fact that we are even having it just come across as being mean-spirited old farts who can’t enjoy themselves.

    People complaining about ticket prices are off the mark too, as the 5 games in the Wellington pool pack only cost $60 each, which is far less than you would be paying for a normal test match ticket.

    The influx of 80,000 tourists is going to be a massive boost for our economy and couldn’t have come at a better time after the proverbial crap our economy has been going through lately.

    My only major gripe is the douchebag companies (airlines, hotels etc) who have put their prices up, and the douchebags trying to rent out their accomodation for astronomical prices while kicking their tenants out for a few weeks – I hope karma comes back and hits them somehow – maybe in the form of their rental properties being trashed.
    • PeteG 20.1

      3 June 2011 at 8:36 am

      I don’t agree with trashing property, not even suggesting it, but I agree with the rest of your post.
      • Samuel Hill 20.1.1

        3 June 2011 at 12:47 pm

        I think a lot of folks are gonna get a shock as to how few people actually turn up.
        • Colonial Viper 20.1.1.1

          3 June 2011 at 1:18 pm

          Attending the RWC during a global recession? I dont even think that many australians will turn up – at least not as many as the rosy forecasts. Australians are saving at the moment, not spending.
        • Morrissey 20.1.1.2

          3 June 2011 at 5:31 pm

          Anti-football guy goes down on knees: “Please Lord, make them stay away from the games. I’ll never lust after Nikki Kaye again, Lord, if only you make the people keep away from the RWC. And Judith Collins too. I won’t lust after her from now on. If only you keep the people away from the games, Lord!.”
          • M 20.1.1.2.1

            3 June 2011 at 8:19 pm

            Nikki Kaye? All right, but Judith Collins as an object of lust?

            The set of Jude’s mouth should serve as a warning to any potential suitor that is unless he’s planning on buying her some leathers.
            • Morrissey 20.1.1.2.1.1

              3 June 2011 at 8:36 pm

              Judith Collins as an object of lust?

              Yes of course. She has that Rosa Klebb thing happening.
      • sean maitland 20.1.2

        3 June 2011 at 3:20 pm

        I don’t really agree with it either – just couldn’t think of other ways karma could come back to such people.

        I don’t believe the way to run a good business is by treating clients badly and/or simply as a source of income. They need to get a good deal in return. Some people don’t have morals and/or consciences I guess.
21. tc 21

    3 June 2011 at 12:57 pm

    So we reappoint a coach who’s failed to figure out how to beat France and given the history at this tournamnet between us shouldn’t he have had a game plan specifically to counter them ….sorry I’m still not getting it Morrissey.

    Your logic suggests we’ve got france, give up now…..you pay coaches to overcome this (and there’s 3 of them !) but as I see you’ve already got the excuses lines up…..like the NZRU.
    • Pascal's bookie 21.1

      3 June 2011 at 1:15 pm

      bwahahaha, not this shit again.

      Watch that game again. It’s not the AB coaches’ fault that we were getting penalised again and again and again and France wasn’t. What that means is that France played a blinder and our on-field leadership couldn’t adapt to what the ref was telling them. But criticising the blessed cantab is something the AB fan cannot do, ergo “Blame Henry!’

      Beyond that, since when does the RWC become the be all and end all of judging performance. Union is not soccor. It doesn’t have ‘friendlies’. Which is what happens if you think that winning the rwc is the only thing that counts.

      The RWC doesn’t determine who is the best. Look at the format. It’s clearly not designed to find the ‘best team’. It’s a carnival, enjoy it. If you want to judge a coach, look at their overall win/loss records. Do that, and tell me how henry stacks up.
    • Morrissey 21.2

      3 June 2011 at 5:16 pm

      So we reappoint a coach who’s failed to figure out how to beat France and given the history at this tournament between us shouldn’t he have had a game plan specifically to counter them ….sorry I’m still not getting it Morrissey.

      Are you seriously trying to suggest that Henry, one of the the most technically brilliant, diligent and well organised coaches ever, didn’t have a game plan for the quarter-final? Where did you get THAT piece of intelligence from?

      Your logic suggests we’ve got france, give up now…..
      That is not what I said at all. What I said was: we’ve got France, and they should be respected. The players and coaches do, of course; the problem is with uninformed boosters posing as rugby journalists.

      you pay coaches to overcome this (and there’s 3 of them !) but as I see you’ve already got the excuses lines up…..like the NZRU.
      What an absurd statement. You’ve completely misconstrued what I wrote.
22. tc 22

    3 June 2011 at 4:34 pm

    That’d be the onfield leadership that still gets Henry’s backing as the right bloke for the job and a fat new NZRU contract.

    A real onfield leader like say mourie all those years ago being a classic with haden’s lineout dive, would as you say adjust to the ref’s performance so how do our chances look with that same structure in place from 2007.

    Agree about the format and it being a carnival to enjoy but if you stick with henry, who sticks with Mccaw then as you say it doesn’t matter as the winner’s not the best based on the format so who really cares….lets sit back and enjoy the plastic waka.
    • Pascal's bookie 22.1

      3 June 2011 at 5:13 pm

      I guess my main point is that the wrc is a really hard tournament to win, and you need luck. From that. I think it is pretty funny that lots of people seem to think that winning a WRC is what we should judge a coach or a team on, rather than their record over time.

      Let’s look at Graham Mourie, rightly regarded as a top AB captain.

      http://www.sporting-heroes.net/rugby-heroes/displayhero.asp?HeroID=7010

      His performances earned him the captaincy for the tour of France later in the year, and that drawn two test series would be the first of six encounters against the Cockerels….

      ….In partnership with legendary coach Jack Gleeson, Graham orchestrated victories over all four home nations, and was named player of the tour. In 1979 the French arrived in New Zealand and were able to draw the series 1-1 with Graham blaming the second test loss on lineout problems. That game saw Mourie score the first of four test tries when he capitalised on good work by Murray Taylor near the end of the game. However, the season ended rather disappointingly when he captained the All Blacks to a 12-6 defeat in Sydney, their first loss on Australian soil for thirty years.

      Nowadays that would be considered a failure. A drawn series against france in france, and another in NZ, and a loss to the then awful aussies in Sydney.
      • sean maitland 22.1.1

        3 June 2011 at 6:05 pm

        Clearly tc never actually watched Mourie play and is just pulling stuff out of a hat without thinking people might know better.

        One needs to look no further than what Clive Woodward achieved with England over two World Cups to see what investment in a coach can achieve. They have only ever beaten the AB’s in NZ twice in the history of the game and they managed it once during that purple patch.
        • Morrissey 22.1.1.1

          3 June 2011 at 8:03 pm

          One needs to look no further than what Clive Woodward achieved with England over two World Cups to see what investment in a coach can achieve.

          Sean, you should take care to not over-praise Woodward. The strength of that England team was due to the leadership on the field of a small group of exceptional players—Johnson above all, and his inspiring lieutenants Dallaglio, Back, and Wilkinson. As we saw only too clearly on the Lions tour in 2005, Woodward was neither tactically astute nor particularly good at man-management.
23. Craig 23

    8 June 2011 at 12:06 pm

    Me, I only watch rugby if the Crusaders are playing (it’s genetic- I’m from ChCh originally). I’m more into Super 15 than AB stuff. And while I hate to be disloyal, what if we end up losing the forthcoming RWC, again…??? Oooh. No economic spin- oops, sorry, I meant spin *off* (although, come to think of it…) for N/ACT. Hmmmm…

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