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Open mike 01/06/2015

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, June 1st, 2015 - 88 comments
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openmikeOpen mike is your post.

For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose. The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).

Step up to the mike …

88 comments on “Open mike 01/06/2015 ”

  1. mickysavage 1

    One of the bloody Tally brothers received a knighthood for in reality services to the National Party by way of donations …

    • ScottGN 1.1

      I never, ever buy Talleys at the supermarket.

    • Roflcopter 1.2

      Never mind that he was responsible for ensuring that overseas fishing fleets fell under NZ labour laws, or that he donates to many charities, aye?

      • mickysavage 1.2.1

        What are you saying? Not wanting third world employment conditions in New Zealand deserves a knighthood? Besides I am pretty sure that he was not being rewarded for his contributions to workers rights.

        • Roflcopter

          No, it’s you being a cock by saying that it’s only because of his “services to the National Party by way of donations” that got it.

          • mickysavage

            Are you saying that the largesse that Talley displayed to a number of National MPs’ campaign funds was totally irrelevant?

        • Paul

          RNZ’s article suggests he was….
          Amazing they don’t report the other side of his treatment of workers.

          ‘Mr Talley is a joint managing director of Talleys Group Limited, one of New Zealand’s leading producers of primary food goods.
          He has spent his lifetime promoting the employment of New Zealanders in the fishing industry, including attempts to place Foreign Charter Vessels under the control of New Zealand labour laws.’


      • He only has money to make charitable donations because he rips his workers off. No different to that bloke that makes those arse-achingly overlong fantasy films in Wellington.

        • halfcrown

          “No different to that bloke that makes those arse-achingly overlong fantasy films in Wellington.”

          I have heard a lot of descriptions about the crap Jackson makes, but that beats them all. Excellent.

      • Typical rightwing approach, give all the credit to the individual motivated by personal profit and none to the collective motivated by protecting the workers …

  2. DH 2

    How many holes can people find in this story?

    Student becomes property investor


    My first question is how did he borrow the money, investors are treated differently to first home owner-occupiers. Have banks changed their rules on loans to investors? Last I heard a first time investor needed around 35% for a deposit, it was only existing investors who could get low deposit loans by using their equity as collateral.

    • dv 2.1

      “he could while living a modest life rent-free at his parents’ home.

      He only has a 15% deposit.

      And no real income

      He must have guarantor.

      • David H 2.1.1

        Looks like he’s the LEECH of the family, live rent free, and then what? Hit them up as Guarantor. When’s he going to fix them up for the ‘free’ rent life he’s enjoyed?

        “that today’s first-home buyers needed to make sacrifices.”
        Or their Parents do. Another half written Advertorial (Can’t call that crap an article) from the Granny

        • Paul

          Article paid for by the BNZ and Barfoots.

          ‘He was adamant the nondescript one-storey brick house he now owns would not be his last, and echoed sentiments expressed by Barfoot & Thompson director Peter Thompson that today’s first-home buyers needed to make sacrifices.’

          ‘He is now working full-time for BNZ….’

      • DH 2.1.2

        “And no real income”

        It does say near the bottom he’s now working full-time for BNZ. I’m wondering if that job includes some perks on borrowing money.

      • millsy 2.1.3

        Good on him for getting those 2 properties, but he should credit his parents for helping him at least.

    • Paul 2.2

      Typical appalling Herald story with an overt dishonest agenda.

    • Presumably as it’s a “first home” he only needed 20% deposit by glossing over the fact he’ll never live there. His parents may also have given him money or acted as guarantors.

      But the key thing which the article keeps trying to hide under phrases like “through hard work and modest living” is that he worked a 40-hour week while living rent-free at his parents’ place. This is simply impossible for the majority of people, and not because they don’t “work hard”.

      Not to mention he was fortunate enough to have lecturers who were okay with him recording and listening to lectures later rather than participating in class.

      I don’t want to hate on a guy I know next to nothing about, but having the Herald portray him as some kind of everyman who proves you can ~do anything if you want it enough~ is repugnant.

      • Paul 2.3.1

        This quote by the Herald’s Ayn Randian John Galt hero suggests there might be reasons to not admire the guy.

        “It’s not going to stop at one. There will be another purchase – it’s just a matter of time.”

      • DH 2.3.2

        “Presumably as it’s a “first home” he only needed 20% deposit by glossing over the fact he’ll never live there. ”

        That was my first thought too Stephanie but banks are pretty tough on that and since he was granted an interest-only loan it suggests the bank knew they were lending on an investment property (the usual home loan is a table mortgage)

        “His parents may also have given him money or acted as guarantors.”

        Yeah that’s a more likely scenario, I’d expect to find a sugar-daddy in there somewhere. His $45k is only a 15% deposit and I’ve not heard of banks making commercial loans like that. Commercial property, which is what investment properties are, usually requires a 35-40% deposit or at least guarantees amounting to the same.

    • millsy 2.4

      He will probably end up becoming one of those fine specimens that lurk over here

  3. Ad 3

    I strongly recommend you all go to werewolf.co.nz to read the critique of the convention centre cult we have going. Gordon Campbell drives a bus through the Auckland, Hamilton, Wellington, Christchurch, Dunedin, and Queenstown business cases, showing them to be worse than our sports stadium cult of the 1990s. They are no substitute for an economic development plan from governments local or Central. And they suck hard earned money out of our pockets for dubious benefit. With thanks to Tussock:

    “The name’s Lanley, Lyle Lanley. And I come before you good people tonight with an idea. Probably the greatest -Aw, it’s not for you. It’s more a Shelbyville idea.

    Mayor: Now, wait just a minute. We’re twice as smart as the people of Shelbyville. Just tell us your idea and we’ll vote for it.

    “All right, I’ll tell you what I’ll do. I’ll show you my idea. I give you the Springfield Convention Centre!”

    (Everyone gasps!)

    “I’ve sold convention centres to Brockway, Ogdenville, and Noth Haverbrook, and, by gum, it put them on the map!
    Well, sir, there’s nothin’ on earth like a genuine, bond fide, hotel-attached, 3,000 seat, convention centre!
    What’d I say?”

    Everyone: Convention Centre!

  4. North 4

    Obviously a very dishonest article which is published in the knowledge that its dishonesty can never be challenged in a degree commensurate with its reach. And thus the cargo cult and its devotees are further aggrandised.

    • Paul 4.1

      Which article?

      • aerobubble 4.1.1

        I can think of an example, not an article. But Boag g bringing up free trade and the greens aren’t for free trade, on the nation or q&a, and it is dishonesty on several levels. Firstly she did not specify what the Greens failure was, does Boag not get that the Greens are for global trade in carbon, for fair international trade, and implicitly want uniform global governance to save the planet. National are even opposed to tax reform to bring us into alignment with oz, distortions create opportunities where there was none. So how dishonest on Boag to keep bringing up an issue that National are weaker on, Saudi business get special treatment, so much for free trade. And its a theme with Boag, she does not have to be all that smart if she keeps to the prepackage attack that the other guest spend time deconstructing when that’s what its designed to do undermine the TV shows purpose talk about issues of the day, not mislead us into believing National are free traders, they are not. Free trade requires governance to create a fair trading system where all agents get to compete on similar merits. National hate that, they want distortion how else are the wealthy to stare down the newer brighter leaner smarter new competitors.

        Its a damn shame that Boat is never pressed and expose or the intellectual fraud she is.

  5. Chooky 5

    A Middle Eastern woman analyst gives her opinion on how to beat ISIS

    Sharmine Narwani is a commentator and analyst of Middle East geopolitics. She tweets @snarwani

    ‘To beat ISIS, kick out US-led coalition’


    …”An objective look at US interests in the region paint an entirely different picture. The Americans seek to maintain absolute hegemony in the Mideast, even as they exit costly military occupations of Iraq and Afghanistan. Their primary interests are 1) access to low cost oil and gas, 2) propping up Israel, and more recently, 3) undermining Russian (and Chinese) influence in the region…

  6. The Murphey 6

    McKinsey ‘assessing’ Fonterra ….. again

  7. Michael 7


    “Challenging Hillary Clinton, Bernie Sanders Gains Momentum in Iowa”


    “The AFL-CIO was blunt in the call that went out to Rep. Scott Peters, a Democrat who represents San Diego: Vote yes on fast-track authority and the Trans-Pacific Partnership, people familiar with the conversation recall, and they’d spend a million dollars to knock him out in next year’s primary. If he managed to win, they’d drop another million against him in the general election.”

    Some good reads about US Democrats, TPP, Bernie Sanders, and Hillary Clinton.

  8. The Murphey 9


    Australia’s capacity to tackle important public issues – such as climate change, growing inequality, tax avoidance, budget repair, an ageing population, lifting our productivity and our treatment of asylum seekers – is diminishing because of the power of vested interests, with their lobbying power to influence governments in a quite disproportionate way.

    Lobbying has grown dramatically in recent years, particularly in Canberra. It now represents a serious corruption of good governance and the development of sound public policy

  9. AsleepWhileWalking 10


    TV show is The Briefcase. I can’t boycott it since I already don’t watch TV now Campbell is gone.

  10. The Murphey 11


    It had taken just fifty-three days from the announcement of the government’s mining tax proposal to the overthrow of its author, the prime minister. No election, no vote in parliament, no public debate. Greens leader Bob Brown said the mining companies spent $27 million on their lobbying campaign and saved themselves $10 billion when Gillard restructured the tax package

    [lprent: Be careful about using too much shouting in conversation. ]

  11. The Murphey 12


    In just 24 hours, Wyden and five of those Democratic holdouts – Michael Bennet of Colorado, Dianne Feinstein of California, Claire McCaskill of Missouri, Patty Murray of Washington, and Bill Nelson of Florida – caved and voted for fast-track.
    Bennet, Murray, and Wyden – all running for re-election in 2016 – received $105,900 between the three of them. Bennet, who comes from the more purple state of Colorado, got $53,700 in corporate campaign donations between January and March 2015, according to Channing’s research.

    Almost 100% of the Republicans in the US Senate voted for fast-track – the only two non-votes on TPA were a Republican from Louisiana and a Republican from Alaska

    [lprent: Be careful about using too much shouting in conversation. ]

  12. The Murphey 13


    EU moves to regulate hormone-damaging chemicals linked to cancer and male infertility were shelved following pressure from US trade officials over the Transatlantic Trade and Investment Partnership (TTIP) free trade deal, newly released documents show.

    Draft EU criteria could have banned 31 pesticides containing endocrine disrupting chemicals (EDCs). But these were dumped amid fears of a trade backlash stoked by an aggressive US lobby push, access to information documents obtained by Pesticides Action Network (PAN) Europe show.

    [lprent: Be careful about using too much shouting in conversation. ]

  13. Anne 14

    Received Andrew Little’s latest monthly newsletter to members and he talks about the budget of course. However he also had the following to say:

    In the last week there has been some talk
    about Labour and means testing of NZ
    Super. This has been a bit of mischief from
    the government and some other quarters,
    but I’d like to make it very clear that Labour
    will not be considering means testing of NZ
    Super while I am leader. Universal
    superannuation is a cornerstone of a
    progressive society.

    A bit of mischief sounds like an understatement and it highlights what a bunch of wholesale bastards this government and sections of the media are proving to be. Dirty Politics rolls on and on…

    Craig H gave us a good idea what really happened over Little’s original comment and I hope that in future Labour and Little will stop taking this crap and sue the bastards if necessary.

    Labour and the Greens

  14. mickysavage 15

    Latest Colmar Brunton is out. National is at 48% Labour 31% Greens 10% NZ First 7%. No budget bump or maybe the budget bump was affected by Ponygate …

    • Anne 15.1

      There may also be a growing realisation that this government is not helping those on the breadline as they claim… or maybe more and more people are finding themselves on the breadline…

    • b waghorn 15.2

      Nice on the way to L 35% G15% nzf 4.5%

    • Colonial Rawshark 15.3

      Still need to keep an eye on the polls over the next month or two to fully assess the impact of the Budget.

      LAB + GR + NZF = 48%. Still 3% to 4% shy of forming a solid govt.

      • weka 15.3.1

        12% refused to answer or undecided. Would be good to see a margin of error analysis.

        Alex Coleman retweeted
        Colmar Brunton ‏@ColmarBruntonNZ 3 hrs3 hours ago

        ONE News Colmar Brunton poll (1/4): NAT 48%(-1), LAB 31%, GRN 10%(+1), NZF 7%, CNS 2%, MAO 1% #nzpol

        ONE News Colmar Brunton poll (2/4): Refuse to answer 3%(-1), undecided 9%(+4). Fieldwork conducted 23-27 May #nzpol

        ONE News Colmar Brunton poll (4/4): Report has now been uploaded to our website – http://www.colmarbrunton.co.nz/index.php/polls-and-surveys/political-polls/one-news-colmar-brunton-poll … #nzpol

      • Monty 15.3.2

        What makes you think that Winston would go left? In the past he has ( I think gone with the largest party. Also Winston has a very blue seat. This will be part of his thinking. And then would Winston want to play second fiddle to the Greens,

        Personally I doubt Winston will never go into a coalition with the greens. He will go withnNational. I have no doubt about that

        • Colonial Rawshark

          NZF could indeed go with National in the future, but John Key would have to be gone for that to happen.

    • Incognito 15.4

      As far as I can tell the same (as in: the first poll after Budget Day) One News Colmar Brunton Poll in May 2014 showed a 4.0% increase for National and a 1.0% drop for Labour.

      This year’s budget supposedly left the Left for dead and we see National dropping one percentage point and Labour staying steady. Interestingly, the fraction of undecided voters rose 4 points to 13%.

      National is playing a very strategic game so I would not read too much into this result.

  15. Jester 16

    Can’t be a hit from Ponytailgate Mickey, Key’s PM popularity rises to 44. Littles popularity now even with Winston on 9%

    • mickysavage 16.1

      Margin of error stuff Jester. The result is in stark contrast with the last Roy Morgan so the next poll will be interesting.

      • jester 16.1.1

        Maybe but it’s a bit deceptive trying to apply margin of error to only select parts of the Poll. But agree the next poll will be defining for Andrew Little and Labour.

        • mickysavage

          No it won’t. National will throw a lot more stuff at him and this may or may not work. Politics is a medium term game.

    • Anne 16.2

      Littles popularity now even with Winston on 9%.

      Yes, and that is because he is largely invisible these days. I don’t know whether this is intentional and he is quietly gathering momentum in the ‘provinces’ which won’t show through in the polls yet, or whether he has run out of steam for some reason. Its time he again started to show the mettle we saw late last year.

      • jester 16.2.1

        Why won’t the momentum in the provinces show through in the Poll Anne?

        • Anne

          Because it always seems to take longer to show through jester. That is something that was well known back in the 70s and 80s (when I was first involved in politics) and I don’t think it has changed much despite improved technical methods.

          • The Murphey

            Q. In a world rife with data manipulation why would the polls be given even a modicum of kudos ?

          • Colonial Rawshark

            My worry is that Little is getting sucked into the perspective of the inward looking Thorndon Bubble, exactly as Cunliffe did by the end of his first 6 months as leader.

            Labour has to aggressively rebrand and reposition itself to put daylight between it and National. It is running out of time to do so convincingly before 2017.

      • maui 16.2.2

        He did bring out the call for means tested Super, and since that has been shot down he might be a bit gun shy for a while longer yet. I’m hoping to see some more passion from him, I think that’s what people want to see, something to break steady as she goes Key.

        • Karen

          Little had a bad couple of weeks leading up to and during this poll, while the Nats, superficially, looked as if they were actually doing something about Auckland’s housing problems and child poverty. I am actually really relieved that it didn’t support that last Roy Morgan poll.

          I notice there are a large percentage of refused and don’t knows (13% in total). I suspect there are a lot of people not that interested at this stage. I’d expect the Greens to get a boost in the next poll because of having a new co-leader and the extra media coverage that provides.

          As far as Labour and Little go, there won’t be any dramatic increases, but hopefully there will be some slow steady progress once the policy reviews have concluded. I’m also hoping Labour and the Greens can get some joint policy ideas out there as that would help both parties I think.

          • Anne

            Agree Karen but I think Little needs to up the ante now. He’s slipping out of people’s minds and leaves himself vulnerable to a DP type perception campaign that… he hasn’t got what it takes. Those of us who have met and heard him know that he has – in dollops – but once that perception is allowed to set in, he’s in big trouble.

            • Colonial Rawshark

              Correct IMO. ‘Waiting for policy to be finalised’ is exactly the wrong strategy. Policy is irrelevant. And Little must avoid being sucked into the Thorndon Bubble perspective which will be the death of his leadership. Cunliffe started off strongly as well but the moment he let himself slip into the Thorndon Bubble perspective he was stuffed.

              Being forthright, trust worthiness on working class values and willing to stand up and speak plainly about how the current socioeconomic paradigm is screwing ordinary NZers and how he stands for change is 100x more important.

      • Clemgeopin 16.2.3

        “Yes, and that is because he is largely invisible these days. I don’t know whether this is intentional and he is quietly gathering momentum in the ‘provinces’ which won’t show through in the polls yet, or whether he has run out of steam for some reason. Its time he again started to show the mettle we saw late last year”

        I agree, although I don’t think he is the sort of guy to run out of steam. He is a quality person with integrity, with his head and heart in the right place. And he has good genuine values unlike Key who is simply untrustworthy and a very good deceptive actor in my opinion. I will trust Andrew Little any day over Key, English, Joyce, McCully and Bridges combined. That is for sure!

        I also think once the Labour review is completed and the party decides on the major new policies and direction, Andrew Little will begin to get more and more visible and thus increase his preferred PM ‘popularity’. Key has been known to the public for the last 14 years from 2001 to 2015, while Winston has been in politics and is known by the public for over 37 years, from 1978 to 2015.

        Whereas, Andrew Little has come from obscurity, from being an unknown in politics to be the leader of the Labour party and the leader of the opposition. He has been in this position for only about 7-8 months. Compare that to Key and Peters tenure of 14 & 37 years!

        When Key first appeared on the popularity stage (In Aug, 2006, after being in parliament for 5 years) his initial popularity was 8.5, while at the same time Helen Clark’s preferred PM rating was 52.4.

        Herald–DigiPoll[13] 31 August 2006 [nb 1] HC=52.4 Key= 8.5
        Herald–DigiPoll[16] 22–24 September 2006 HC=50.8 Key =9.2

        But Key did climb up quickly after the ‘under class’ speech in parliament about McGehan Close where Key met 12 year old Aroha and invited her to accompany him to Waitangi celebrations. After his noble act (or stunt) Key’s popularity soared. [Incidentally, Aroha left NZ within 3 years, and while in Australia, she made scathing remarks in an interview about Key, referring to him as an ‘ ‘arsehole’, who has done really nothing for the poor. He is just making every thing better for the high earners’, she said. However this did not diminish Key’s popularity]

        Hopefully, Little’s preferred PM rating will grow little by little as time goes by.

        • Colonial Rawshark

          Little’s popularity as PM will only go up if both he and Labour can demonstrate a direct understanding and cultural connection with the NZers they are supposed to represent.

          Otherwise, its not a rational expectation to hope that Little’s popularity amongst voters will go up as a result of this or that other Labour Party internal process being conducted.

          • Clemgeopin

            That IS what Labour is about. Check out their social, economic ans environmental policies from before the last election. Don’t get suckered in by the nasty tactics of our enemies and supposed friends as well as by the RW BS, dirty politics, lies and spin.


          • weka

            Hey CV, did you see the bit in Shaw’s speech about if the GP want to govern the country they need to be representative, and that people vote for who they feel a connection with? I thought of you 🙂

          • Karen

            I do agree with you CR, that Little needs to be front footing a lot more during the policy review and he needs to talk more emphatically about growing inequality and the damage it is doing to NZ.

            He also needs to do speak a lot louder, or get a phone that enhances his voice. I always have to turn the radio up when he is speaking on National Radio in order to hear what he is saying. This has been the case since he got elected. Am I the only one who has noticed this?

  16. Morrissey 17

    Nasty little incident right at the start of Seven Sharp
    Television One, Monday 1 June 2015

    Mike Hosking’s away tonight, but the nastiness quotient has not abated one little bit on this travesty of a show. I’m sure I was not the only viewer to have enjoyed the following bit of cattiness from the smiling assassin/attack dog/cat Pippa Wetzell. Meeeow….

    PIPPA WETZELL: Hey you’re a dog… person aren’t you?

    ….[Slight but significant pause]….

    NADINE CHALMERS ROSS: I like dogs, yes. More doggy discourse later in the program.
    PIPPA WETZELL: First up, though….

    Anybody with a brain, however, will be watching Road Cops over on TV3— it’s much funnier and has more thoughtful people on it.

  17. nigela 18

    “PIPPA WETZELL: Hey you’re a dog… person aren’t you?

    ….[Slight but significant pause]….”

    “Anybody with a brain, however, will be watching Road Cops over on TV3— it’s much funnier and has more thoughtful people on it.”

    This explains why you were watching seven sharp Mozzy.

  18. weka 19

    I got sick of explaining over and over again about the Green Party and James Shaw’s position on forming government with National (tl;dr, they won’t), so I wrote a synopsis, with quotes and links, that can be linked to whenever people are confused or when the NACT spinners are out and about (great quote about the spinners from Anarkaytie at the end).

    Labour and the Greens

    (wouldn’t mind someone proof reading it).

  19. Colonial Rawshark 20

    Short sharp shock felt here in Dunners 3 to 4 mins ago

  20. weka 21

    Quake just inland from Dunedin (4.4). How rare is that?


    snap CV.

    edit, upgraded to a 4.7

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