Open mike 03/10/2024

60 comments on “Open mike 03/10/2024 ”

• Comment on post

1. SPC 1

   3 October 2024 at 6:42 am

   A new ultrasound test can detect 96% of ovarian cancer cases (the current test used in the UK is at 83%).

   Of the six diagnostic tests investigated, the IOTA ADNEX model – which looks at how the lump appears on an ultrasound – had the best accuracy of all and could detect up to 96% of women with ovarian cancer.

   “It is crucial that new ways of working like this are rolled out as quicky as possible.”

   https://www.bromsgroveadvertiser.co.uk/news/national/24620427.accurate-ultrasound-test-can-detect-96-women-ovarian-cancer/

   Reply
   • Belladonna 1.1

     3 October 2024 at 9:52 am

     Sounds like a great diagnostic tool.
     Of course, we need better referrals from GPs to specialists, and quicker treatment timeframes – to actually make a difference.

     Reply
     • bwaghorn 1.1.1

       3 October 2024 at 1:05 pm

       We need GPS fullstop

       Reply
2. Sanctuary 2

   3 October 2024 at 7:48 am

   Tell me you are a bunch of middle aged right wing white men rating politicians based on their looks without telling me you are a bunch of middle aged right wing white guys rating politicians based on their looks…

   https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/business-reports/mood-of-the-boardroom/mood-of-the-boardroom-chief-executives-rank-government-ministers-and-labour-leaders/6RXK5735GRHC5AZCUJH5MGZ5YM/

   Reply
   • ianmac 2.1

     3 October 2024 at 11:48 am

     They did place their top man, Luxon, as number 6 on effectiveness/success/performance.

     Reply
   • AB 2.2

     3 October 2024 at 1:52 pm

     My preferred soothsaying tool is not "Mood of the Boardroom", but "Mood of the Earthworm".

     Take a garden fork, turn the garden gently and ask any emergent worms how they view life and the universe in general.

     Reply
3. gsays 3

   3 October 2024 at 8:54 am

   Can't help but reflect, at this late stage of the neo-liberal experiment, how our current government keeps highlighting this.

   Pre 80's the state used to build roads, ports, hospitals, rail and other key infrastructure.

   Since the market 'reforms' you don't go a week without hearing cost 'blowouts', over budget etc etc. Also everyone acknowledges there is a massive infrastructure deficit in this country.

   The fringe, looney end of this coalition (Gordon Brittas and company) are wanting PPP to solve the issues. Always remember PPP means privatise profits and socialise costs.

   The time is overdue for Ministry of Works 2.0. Call it Ministry of Infrastructure if it avoids the old cliched objections.

   The state has the capacity and access to funds. It can also provide top notch apprenticeships across several trades. I benefitted from a cheffing apprenticeship in the Army. An opportunity that no longer exists.

   Somehow, I doubt Hipkins will get this advice out if Starmer's Labour party.

   Reply
   • Hunter Thompson II 3.1

     3 October 2024 at 9:28 am

     The government's Q4 action plan, recently announced, contains the ominous statement that it will:

     "2. Pass the first Resource Management Amendment Bill to reduce the regulatory burden on farmers and the primary sector."

     I presume by "regulatory burden" the PM meant the laws prohibiting farmers from dumping dairy waste in waterways (a common industry practice for some, judging by court reports).

     That liberal approach could be extended to other areas, as we all live under the yoke of some regulatory burden. Why not have no speed limits on the road? Faster delivery times for trucks would surely boost production.

     Reply
     • mikesh 3.1.1

       3 October 2024 at 9:37 am

       Why not get rid of road rules altogether. I remember, some years ago, reading of a town which did just that. I think it may have been in the Netherlands. Apparently it reduced accidents; I suppose because its motorists became more cautious.

       Reply
       • Bearded Git 3.1.1.1

         3 October 2024 at 10:03 am

         Or get rid of government altogether and let Seymour run the country…..hang on, that is already happening.

         Reply
       • PsyclingLeft.Always 3.1.1.2

         3 October 2024 at 10:46 am

         Why not get rid of road rules altogether. I remember, some years ago, reading of a town which did just that.

         Well..not quite sure about that? A link? Anyway, as you said the Netherlands. I do know that after ww2 with the advent of so many vehicles, cars mainly, there were so many Children killed or maimed, that caring people changed things.

         The trend away from the bicycle and towards motorised transport only began to decrease in the 1970s when Dutch people took to the streets to protest against the high number of child deaths on the roads: in some years over 500 children were killed in collisions with motor vehicles.[10] This protest movement, initiated by Maartje van Putten (later an MEP),[11][12] was known as the Stop de Kindermoord ("Stop the Child Murder").

         Read the Overview…Infrastructure (Simeon the anti Cycle Brown would hate )

         https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cycling_in_the_Netherlands#Overview

         And Liability..

         A form of strict liability has been law in the Netherlands since the early 1990s for bicycle-motor vehicle accidents.[15] This means that, in a collision between a car and a cyclist, the driver's insurer is liable for damages

         https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cycling_in_the_Netherlands#

         Reply
       • Incognito 3.1.1.3

         3 October 2024 at 11:21 am

         https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shared_space#Netherlands

         Reply
       • ianmac 3.1.1.4

         3 October 2024 at 11:55 am

         Mikesh. The effect was that drivers were much more careful at crossing intersections etc because there were no traffic lights or other signals.

         That happened at a busy intersection in Auckland a while ago. The light went down. The traffic managed itself until a traffic officer arrived to direct and traffic slowed right down.

         Reply
       • tWig 3.1.1.5

         3 October 2024 at 12:35 pm

         I think that was a removal of SIGNAGE, not of national road rules. In such a built-up country you are forever accelerating and decelerating.

         Speed restrictions stay in place. There are bike lanes and mixed bike-moped lanes everywhere, too, increasing safety for all users. Plus a heinous camera system.

         Reply
     • Jenny 3.1.2

       3 October 2024 at 10:44 am

       Professor James Hanson said, the real extremists are those who are prepared to change the climate for short term gains.

       Shane Jones accuses protesters against the Q4 action plan, and the fast tracking oil and gas exploration, of being extremists and ignorant of the facts.
       Jones also accused the climate protesters of being 'hysterical'.

       Disclaimer:

       The AI generated transcript is lightly edited and corrected to aid comprehension and to more closely follow the soundtrack.

       @0:28 minutes:

       [Resources Minister Shane Jones]

       "You're being extreme. You're losing sight of [fact]. You're being hysterical"

       @0:42 minutes:

       And little did they know the government had just signed off on [Q4] action plan, which includes a commitment to pass the controversial FastTrack legislation which could allow new [mines] and a commitment to reverse the ban on new offshore oil and gas exploration….

       Reply
   • bwaghorn 3.2

     3 October 2024 at 1:08 pm

     Isn't it odd that it's always a cost blowout and not a failure to correctly price the job by the know doubt expensive consultants/engineers that priced the job??!!

     Reply
   • Graeme 3.3

     3 October 2024 at 2:49 pm

     The old MOW was more than capable of making things blow the budget. Back in the day this would have been quietly kept in house and some careers might have not gone so well afterwards.

     Things changed a bit in late 70's with a bit of controversy at the end of Twizel, but that was more about the scope of a part of the project being adjusted to provide a rowing course. The shit hit the fan in early 80's with the Maniototo Irrigation Scheme. on this MOW seriously exploded the budget with a project that had a Rolls Royce scope for the benefit of a few farmers. Resulted in a very hurried re-design 3/4 way through and a much truncated scheme. I was involved in Maniototo and another MOW contract at Herbert where they went completely the other way and only identified 1/4 of the work required. That one got quietly re-designed and re-negotiated.

     Reply
     • gsays 3.3.1

       3 October 2024 at 5:29 pm

       Thanks for the insights.

       My father-in-law used to use rail to move vegetables back in the bad old days. He claims he would account for 1/4 of the stock going missing each time.

       The things you cite probably still occur to varying degrees. Which we have to pay for plus a margin for the profit of these companies.

       Then there are the other intangibles that don't show up on a balance sheet. The upskilling of local workers, workers pay and conditions improve as we are not importing migrant (exploitable) labour.

       Reply
       • Obtrectator 3.3.1.1

         3 October 2024 at 6:37 pm

         My father-in-law used to use rail to move vegetables back in the bad old days. He claims he would account for 1/4 of the stock going missing each time.

         Yeah, in the late 70s there was a long-running TV ad for the railways whose soundtrack had self-congratulatory words set to the tune of John Brown's Body. The last line of the chorus went We're the first step along the way

         • which got parodied in one satirical stage revue as We're the first theft along the way.

         Reply
   • Rosielee 3.4

     3 October 2024 at 3:49 pm

     

     Reply
4. aj 4

   3 October 2024 at 9:22 am

   With the middle east slowly going up in flames, how close are we to a nuclear disaster? In this discussion between sane people (Historian Peter Kuznick, journalist Amanda Yee and political analyst KJ Noh) they discuss the issues although this is prior to the escalations with Iran. At the moment, every morning I wake up wondering if there has been a nuclear strike and it's starting to terrify me, not for myself but for my children and their children.

   If you were in Beijing and you saw what's going on in Korea and you saw the debates going on among American policy makers and agreed with your analysis of what's happening, wouldn't you consider expanding your nuclear arsenal.

   I think the first point to make there is that if that is the case, and it's unclear if that is the case, then certainly it is a reaction to us threats and not the other way around which the US is always inverting causality but the second point I would make is that there are many
   things that can be done in short of a nuclear escalation or moving further up the escalation ladder.

   I totally agree with that that you know in a sane world that's where we go, and then we go further and get rid of those last couple hundred nuclear weapons also unfortunately we're not in a sane World. We're in a world in which the lunatics have taken over the the asylum and they're making policy. Maybe they don't think it's going to lead to full scale nuclear war, but even if it's a partial you know you you know the reports about even a 100 Hiroshima size nuclear weapons exchange between India and Pakistan would
   lead cause partial nuclear winter and produce up to two billion deaths around the planet. We don't have a hundred, we've got 12,000 and then at Hiroshima's size most of them are between 7 and 70 times as powerful as the bomb that was used on Hiroshima and about 5,700 belong to the US and about 5,000 belong to Russia.

   I think we're all extraordinarily worried, I agree with you absolutely we are in this insane upside down world where nuclear first strike is part of US military Doctrine, and it's almost like a school shooter who wants to shoot up the entire school. Except for them the entire world is a school, so then the question falls on us what do we do? I think the most important thing is not to buy into the delusions of the school shooter about the paranoid other, but rather to do our best as citizens in the Imperial Corp to see what we can do to restrain our our own leaders.

   U.S. Barreling Toward Nuclear War with China, Russia and North Korea

   Reply
   • Jenny 4.1

     3 October 2024 at 12:15 pm

     Pro-Kremlin troll aj, tries to turn facts on their head

     aj @4

     3 October 2024 at 9:22 am

     …..U.S. Barreling Toward Nuclear War with China, Russia and North Korea

     What?

     The only one threatening to use nuclear weapons in the war in Ukraine is Vladimir Putin.

     'Do what I say, or I will nuke you'

     Ever since the end of the cold war the super powers have been exploring ways to fight a world war without nuclear weapons.

     The war in Gaza and Ukraine are showing us how World War III will be fought.

     In the Middle East; The war in Gaza has demonstrated that modern, so called 'Conventional Weapons' and delivery systems can be just as destructive as nuclear weapons. (without the fallout menace).

     Israel hit Gaza with 3 times more firepower than Hiroshima nuke

     Israel has battered the Gaza strip with over 65,000 tons of explosives that yielded over three times more firepower than the U.S. nuclear bomb that destroyed Japan's Hiroshima…..

     Israel hit Gaza with 3 times more firepower than Hiroshima …

     In Europe; The US and Nato claim they have the ability to totally destroy Russia's army and navy with modern conventional weapons systems. And say they will not hesitate to do so, if Russia uses a nuclear weapon in an attempt to win the war in Ukraine.

     Petraeus: US would destroy Russia’s troops if Putin uses nuclear weapons in Ukraine

     Former CIA director and retired army general says Moscow’s leader is ‘desperate’ and ‘battlefield reality he faces is irreversible’

     Edward Helmore, The Guardian Sun 2 Oct 2022

     The US and its allies would destroy Russia’s troops and equipment in Ukraine – as well as sink its Black Sea fleet – if the Russian president, Vladimir Putin, uses nuclear weapons in the country, former CIA director and retired four-star army general David Petraeus warned on Sunday……

     https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/oct/02/us-russia-putin-ukraine-war-david-petraeus

     Reply
     • aj 4.1.1

       3 October 2024 at 1:25 pm

       You have missed my point and those of the participants of that discussion entirely. You sound relaxed about the number and size of conventional weapons being used, personally I am appalled by the number of innocent casualties and destruction caused by them.

       Reply
       • Jenny 4.1.1.1

         3 October 2024 at 6:18 pm

         aj @4.1.1

         3 October 2024 at 1:25 pm

         You have missed my point and those of the participants of that discussion entirely…..

         I don't think I have missed your point, you are just trying to change it.

         You were promoting a video discussing, as fact, that it is the US that is the one threatening nuclear armageddon. When it is in fact your buddies that are threatening to use nuclear weapons.

         I pointed out to you, that the US has made it very clear that they will react to any use of nuclear weapons by this scum with conventional weapons.

         You then tried to change the point of discussion by saying, you are appalled at the number of innocent casualties.

         Who isn't?

         But this was not the point being pushed in your so called "discussion".

         From the transcript of the video you supplied

         @0:00 minutes

         Is the US preparing for nuclear war with China Russia and North Korea that's what a new leaked nuclear strategy seems to suggest?

         @25:50 minutes:

         There's this report, very troubling report out of the Financial Times last week, again not a credible Source, but uh, but in some ways a worrisome source, uh that uh, the Russian's nuclear threshold, Russia's threshold for use of nuclear weapons is actually considerably lower than the United States or the west or NATO….

         @26:42 minutes:

         ….there's so much coming out that's so troubling, even insane at this point. Because anybody who contemplates nuclear war is certifiably insane.

         Is Putin certifiably insane?

         Jenny @1.1.2.1.1

         30 September 2024 at 9:03 am

         '

         …..Putin's supporters on thius site just don't want to whisper this truth, even to themselves;

         “Could Putin be more insane than Hitler?”

         Weapons of mass destruction WMDs are not a new phenomenon, nor is the reluctance to use them.

         Putin, for all his apocalyptic bluster will not use nuclear weapons for the same reason that Hitler did not gas London.

         Even as his Nazi regime was exterminating millions in the gas chambers, Adolf Hitler resisted calls to use the deadly nerve agent against his military adversaries….

         ….. In late 1938, the German scientist Gerhard Schrader was tasked with inventing a cheaper pesticide to kill the weevils that were damaging German fields and orchards. By mixing phosphorus with cyanide, he came up with a substance that was way too toxic to use for agriculture purposes.

         After Schrader’s employer, drug conglomerate I.G. Farben, informed the German army of his discovery, some impressed army scientists dubbed the liquid “tabun,” after the German word for taboo. Back in the lab, Schrader tinkered some more and came up with something even more toxic. He called the new substance sarin, an acronym for the names of the four scientists who developed it.

         By the end of World War II, Nazi Germany had produced some 12,000 tons of the deadly chemical compound, enough to kill millions of people. From early in the conflict, high-level military officers pressed Hitler to use sarin against their adversaries. But despite such pressure, Hitler declined to employ it as a chemical weapon against the Allied Powers…..

         https://www.history.com/news/the-nazis-developed-sarin-gas-but-hitler-was-afraid-to-use-it

         You were promoting a discussion group that was claiming that it is the US that is the one threating nuclear armageddon. When in fact it is your buddies.

         aj @4.1.1

         3 October 2024 at 1:25 pm

         ……I am appalled by the number of innocent casualties and destruction caused by them.

         Let us have a little quiz to see if you are sincere about being appalled by the number innocent casulaties, or whether you are a pro-war troll.

         aj Yes or No

         Do you think Putin's invasion of Ukraine was justified? Yes/No

         Do you think Putin's justification for invading Ukraine that Ukraine had been committing genocide in the Donbas is true? Yes/No

         Do you agree with Putin that Ukrainians are neo-Nazis, or governed by neo-nazis? Yes/No

         :P.S.Your silence is the same as a Yes.

         Reply
         • aj 4.1.1.1.1

           3 October 2024 at 9:14 pm

           I normally wouldn't grace that style of comment with any response but to label me as 'pro war' is a revolting insult, and your little 'quiz' is a meaningless way of judging anyone's attitude to war.

           The invasion was clearly illegal, ' a clear violation of the rules governing the use of force enshrined in the United Nations Charter'

           https://www.cambridge.org/core/blog/2023/02/22/russian-invasion-of-ukraine-is-not-an-exception-or-rupture-but-a-continuity/

           Given Gaza sets a new benchmark for 'genocide' then the Donbass war wouldn't qualify. Then again western leaders don't think up to 186,000 Palestinian dead is a genocide either. So a genocide is in the eye of the beholder. And the hypocrisy is a mile deep.

           https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/7/8/gaza-toll-could-exceed-186000-lancet-study-says

           As for neo Nazis, it was widely acknowledged as a difficult issue prior to 2019. Like all politicians Putin would have been playing a home stadium.

           https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/ukrainealert/ukraine-s-got-a-real-problem-with-far-right-violence-and-no-rt-didn-t-write-this-headline/

           That video deals as much with the insanity of nuclear war as anything else, and that is at the heart of my quote. The US has a first strike policy. All other nuclear armed nations will have red lines when they will use these weapons. The current conflagration in the middle east is quite likely to erupt into a nuclear war. Israel would strike first, and their genocide has been fully supported to date by the US government. That's a hard truth to swallow for some. If the US supported them after using nuclear weapons it's all over for the rest of us.

           https://www.armscontrol.org/act/2022-04/news/biden-policy-allows-first-use-nuclear-weapons

           Good luck.

           Reply
     • weston 4.1.2

       3 October 2024 at 1:31 pm

       Russia needing to use nuclear weapons in Ukraine ; They dont need to theyre prevailing as it is with conventional weapons . Saying putin is desperate just reflects your own desperation imo theres zero evidence of that and why would there be ?His country has very successfully fended off the negative effects of western sanctions the economy is doing well and theres no lack of demand for Russian energy products etc around the world .I guess that there would be increasing demand for Russian weapons around the world also due to their success on the battlefield .Added to that his internal polling is excellent and at all times at least those ive seen of him in public he appears composed relaxed and entirely rational unlike a great number of his western counterparts !!

       The country most likely to use nukes is obviously Israel because its government is made up of a mad hatters teaparty of ethno supremist psychopaths hell bent on fulling some mystic prophesy involving ruling over the whole of the middle east !!

       Reply
       • aj 4.1.2.1

         3 October 2024 at 3:34 pm

         The country most likely to use nukes is obviously Israel

         Exactly my point which was too obscure for some.

         Reply
         • joe90 4.1.2.1.1

           3 October 2024 at 7:10 pm

           which was too obscure for some.

           So U.S. Barreling Toward Nuclear War with China, Russia and North Korea meant Israel…right?

           /

           Reply
         • Jenny 4.1.2.1.2

           3 October 2024 at 8:26 pm

           Israel won't use nukes for the same reason Putin won't.

           It would be the end of them.

           Reply
       • Jenny 4.1.2.2

         3 October 2024 at 11:32 pm

         aj4.1.1.1.1

         3 October 2024 at 9:14 pm

         …..to label me as 'pro war' is a revolting insult.

         I am glad to hear you think so, In my defence I did not label you as a pro war troll I merely asked you a a number of questions to deteetrmine whether you were or were not a pro-war troll yes or no.

         I see you have gone to some length to answer them. And I thank you for that.

         Jenny: "Do you think Putin's invasion of Ukraine was justified? Yes/No"

         aj: "The invasion was clearly illegal, ' a clear violation of the rules governing the use of force enshrined in the United Nations Charter' "

         I didn't ask if it was legal, I asked if it was justified. But I will put that in the 'No' column. You don't think Putin's invasion of Ukraine was justified.

         Jenny: "Do you think Putin's justification for invading Ukraine that Ukraine had been committing genocide in the Donbas is true? Yes/No"

         aj: "Given Gaza sets a new benchmark for 'genocide' then the Donbass war wouldn't qualify….."

         The official measure of genocide is the destruction of a people 'in whole or in part'. The other measure is 'intent'. Genocide is not a matter of size or graduation. Genocide doesn't sit on a scale. If the 40 thousand Palestinians killed in Gaza was half that number or a quarter of that number would it still be genocide? In my opinion it still would be. In your opinion maybe not.

         I am afraid I am having to put this answer in the 'Weird' column.

         You obviously believe Putin's claim that some sort of genocide was going on in the Donbas, but it was smaller than the Gaza genocide.

         Jenny: "Do you agree with Putin that Ukrainians are neo-Nazis, or governed by neo-nazis? Yes/No"

         aj: "…..Like all politicians Putin would have been playing a home stadium."

         That's pretty clear, Putin made it up to please a home audience to get their support for invasion and war.

         That goes firmly in the 'No' column. You don't think Ukrainians are neo-Nazis or governed by neo-Nazis.

         Two out of three correct answers. Puts you in the non-troll column.

         Congratulations. And thank you again for taking time out to participate in my little survey.

         Reply
5. Adrian 5

   3 October 2024 at 9:42 am

   So what is your solution to the problem that Ukraine faces? Just take a second and think where Putins Orks would be today, if Ukraine had been denied arms ?
   This is Putins war , not the Wests, so where to after Warsaw or Vilinuis or Tallin, Riga or Copenhagen.? And don’t say he only wanted Lviv, he’s a meglamaniac, he wants the world under his dominion.

   Reply
   • weston 5.1

     3 October 2024 at 2:05 pm

     Where would Ukraine be if it hadnt been provided arms ; I thought about it for a nano second Adrian an i would say that hundreds of thousands of Ukrainian men would still be alive and trillions of dollars worth of infrastructure would still be intact .You cant say that the Russians didnt try to negotiate there was Minsk one Minsk two and then the agreement almost reached brokered by Turkey in april 2022 All of these negotiations were rejected either by Ukraine or their sponsors in the west so having made their bed Ukraine has to sleep in it .

     Theres no evidence whatsoever that Russia has any intention or ability for that matter of expanding the war beyond the territories it claims it needs to maintain a bufferzone from it and the ever expanding Nato presence .

     Saying stuff like Putins a meglomaniac and wants the world under his dominion etc besides just being very cheap propaganda just makes you sound like a lunatic …just saying ,

     Reply
     • Belladonna 5.1.1

       4 October 2024 at 10:12 am

       an i would say that hundreds of thousands of Ukrainian men would still be alive

       Given Ukraine's experience of Russian occupation during the Holdomor, over even the human-rights abuses of the current regime against Ukrainians in Crimea, after the illegal annexation – I'd find your claim dubious. Trusting that Putin's Russia won't illegally detain, torture and kill is naive.

       Now, the claim that hundreds of thousands of Russian men would still be alive – is much more believable. If they hadn't launched an illegal invasion into a neighboring state – they'd all be safe at home in their barracks.

       No doubt you'd also have believed Hitler over the limits of German territorial ambitions in the 1930s.

       Reply
       • weston 5.1.1.1

         4 October 2024 at 1:33 pm

         I fail to see why you would think the events around the Holodomor of 90 years ago have anything to do with the present day US/NATO proxy war in Ukraine .Stalin is long dead as is the soviet union .

         if you dont think that hundreds of thousand of Ukrainian men have been killed in a war that never needed to happen why do you think Ukrainian recruiters have to go the rather extream lengths of grabbing men waiting at bus stops for example and throwing them in vans for their four or five weeks of basic training then its off to the front ??Could there be a shortage of men ….?? noooooo surely not !!

         And no i wouldnt have beleived Hitlers limit of territorial ambitions 90 years ago because he had the MILLIONS of men to do it .Russia does not .

         Reply
         • Belladonna 5.1.1.1.1

           7 October 2024 at 12:48 pm

           Maybe you don't think that the events around the annexation of Crimea (just over 10 years ago) are relevant either.

           https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Annexation_of_Crimea_by_the_Russian_Federation#Transition_and_aftermath

           Scroll down to Human rights situation.

           In December 2016, the UN General Assembly voted on a resolution on human rights in occupied Crimea. It called on the Russian Federation "to take all measures necessary to bring an immediate end to all abuses against residents of Crimea, in particular reported discriminatory measures and practices, arbitrary detentions, torture and other cruel, inhumane or degrading treatment, and to revoke all discriminatory legislation". It also urged Russia to "immediately release Ukrainian citizens who were unlawfully detained and judged without regard for elementary standards of justice"

           Given that Putin appears to adopted the worst of the Soviet regime excesses – why should anyone trust that he won't implement them on Ukraine (should he succeed in taking over). The Ukrainians don't. Why is your opinion worth more than theirs?

           Dear me – do you really believe that Hitler's Germany had a greater population than Putin's Russia? Perhaps time for a little more self-education.

           Reply
6. Anne 6

   3 October 2024 at 10:16 am

   Funny in a way but also very sad:

   https://www.stuff.co.nz/nz-news/350438242/man-who-wanted-build-gallows-hear-jacinda-arderns-neck-snap-guilty-threats-kill

   Reply
   • Tiger Mountain 6.1

     3 October 2024 at 10:25 am

     No wonder Jacinda departed, there were scores of these types on her personal trail…
     https://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2023/02/threats-against-politicians-jacinda-ardern-jump-massively-over-past-year-peaked-during-parliament-protest.html

     Reply
   • Mike the Lefty 6.2

     3 October 2024 at 11:15 am

     Incredible irony here.

     Jacinda tries to save the country and she gets vilified???

     Luxon and his cronies are trying to shaft everyone outside the wealthy 10% and so many treat him as the Lone Ranger???

     Is there any hope for this sad depressed messed-up country?

     Reply
     • adam 6.2.1

       3 October 2024 at 8:34 pm

       Come on we are fubar and have been for a while.

       Classic example – The country voted to let doctors kill patients, but said pain relief for those dying was bad.

       Reply
7. PsyclingLeft.Always 7

   3 October 2024 at 10:33 am

   Climate Change . Its happening. You have been warned. And now, no good hiding your head in the sand….bag.

   Flood victims who have fair warning may have less case for compensation, MPs warn

   Flood victims who have fair warning of the risk may have less case for government compensation, a cross-party committee of MPs has said.

   The Finance and Expenditure Select Committee released a report on Wednesday about adapting to climate change ahead of a new law expected next year.

   Hundreds of thousands of people live on land exposed to river or coastal flooding already, and the frequency and severity of flooding is increasing.

   MPs on the committee agreed that: "Individuals should be responsible for managing their own natural hazard risk."

   They said: "The longer the information about the risk has been available, the less case there is for socialising the cost if the risk is realised."

   Nat MP Stuart Smith (he was quite the Climate denier , anyone know if he has changed his views ? )

   National MP Stuart Smith is chair of the Finance and Expenditure Select Committee, which produced the report.

   He said the government cannot afford to keep bailing out flood-hit residents from cyclones such as Gabrielle and Hale on a regular basis.

   "lower the risk" !? Oh the Irony, given fast track mining, wild goose gas chasing, more massive roads for more massive trucks et al !

   Treasury has warned that ongoing bailouts could become financially unsustainable if nothing happens to lower the risk, and the government continues to be seen as the insurer of last resort.

   https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/529659/flood-victims-who-have-fair-warning-may-have-less-case-for-compensation-mps-warn

   And quite a pertinent weather update..

   Warnings ratchet up with intense downpours forecast to hit

   Parts of the South Island could see up to two months' worth of rain fall in a single afternoon, the National Institute of Water and Atmospheric Research says.

   https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/529596/warnings-ratchet-up-with-intense-downpours-forecast-to-hit

   Re Nat MP Stuart Smith..I knew this..

   National MP alleges climate change cover up: 'The science of bullsh*t'

   Smith, who is the National Party's climate change spokesperson, confirmed that he was making official parliamentary enquiries with Climate Change Minister James Shaw around the legitimacy of the report during the meeting which sparked several heated reactions from patrons.

   https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/ldr/448464/national-mp-alleges-climate-change-cover-up-the-science-of-bullsh-t

   Surprise, surprise: climate change minister James Shaw doesn’t agree with Nobel laureate John Clauser that the climate crisis isn’t real.

   We know this because the National Party spokesperson for energy and resources, Stuart Smith, asked him the following written parliamentary question last month:

   “Do you agree with Nobel Laureate Dr John F Clauser “In my opinion, there is no real climate crisis. There is, however, a very real problem with providing a decent standard of living to the world’s expanding population, especially given an associated energy crisis. The latter is being unnecessarily exacerbated by what, in my opinion, is incorrect climate science,” and if not why?

   Shaw, unsurprisingly, replied: “No.”

   https://www.carbonnews.co.nz/story.asp?storyID=28663

   And Nat Stuart Smith's example of John Clauser ?

   https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Clauser#Climate_change_denial

   As I, (and many others) say…this NACT1 govt is leading a war on our Environment. Stand Up. Push Back !

   Reply
   • PsyclingLeft.Always 7.1

     3 October 2024 at 11:22 am

     Weather update…RED Warning !

     Live: Red heavy rain warning issued after downpours cut power

     https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/529732/live-red-heavy-rain-warning-issued-after-downpours-cut-power

     Climate Change…and its warning.

     Reply
     • Graeme 7.1.1

       3 October 2024 at 2:21 pm

       The climate change warning for Otago is that Otago Harbour in the 80's and 90's had a thriving salmon fishery. That has now been displaced (eaten) by a thriving yellowtail kingfish fishery. Water that was once cold enough for salmon is now warm enough for kingis.

       Reply
       • PsyclingLeft.Always 7.1.1.1

         3 October 2024 at 6:28 pm

         Hi, I didnt know about the Salmon in the harbour…was interested and looked up. Used to be some prize fish there !

         And yea all around NZ the warmer water has brought some interesting visitors..and changes. Some good, most not so…

         Reply
         • Graeme 7.1.1.1.1

           3 October 2024 at 7:37 pm

           Yeah, the salmon in Otago Harbour was really good while it lasted, then they disappeared. Now they are catching kingis, and quite a few by accounts, haven't had a chance to get over there but it's on the list now I'm trying to pretend I'm retired

           https://www.odt.co.nz/news/dunedin/kingfish-harbour-climate-sentinels

           https://www.odt.co.nz/news/dunedin/big-kingfish-caught-otago-harbour

           Reply
     • I Feel Love 7.1.2

       3 October 2024 at 4:07 pm

       Just popped over to the ice skating rink car park to fill the car with sandbags for myself & the neighbour. Great bunch of people working in the rain filling bags & helping to load into cars. My backyard is flooded but it floods in any downpour, though this is a bit more flooded than usual (had to bring the guinea pigs inside). The streets & gutters in South Dunedin look good, thank you Delta & DCC. People driving like maniacs which is annoying & weird. I see Mark Mitchell is coming down to save the day & look important.

       Reply
       • PsyclingLeft.Always 7.1.2.1

         3 October 2024 at 6:13 pm

         Ah good on you for being Neighbour support ! And the Community as well ! Great stuff. I remember reading about the last big floods in South Dunedin.

         Re my earlier comments…how are the NACT1's gonna manage…managed retreat for South Dunedin ?

         And Mark Mitchell !? Wtf's he going to do ? Look staunch like some kinda mercenary Canute ?

         Take care. Hope no flood damage for you…

         Reply
         • I Feel Love 7.1.2.1.1

           4 October 2024 at 12:42 pm

           The Nats already refused to help South Dunedin, Labour were willing to listen to the DCCs plan & go from there but the Nats refused point blank, "fuck the poors" which bewildered me because there are some very expensive suburbs here in South D, + all the businesses, yet those bozos vote Nats, anyways…

           Yes we got through it, got the alarm at midnight & had a look outside & the streets were flood free so decided to stay at home, checked again at 3am & still fine. Woke to many messages from friends & family all around the country asking if we were ok so I popped out again & the street was still flood free. Wasn't until I looked at the news & saw the damage all around us, bummer.

           But interestingly it's not just us down on the flat, the outskirts & hills were hit hard too/.

           Reply
           • PsyclingLeft.Always 7.1.2.1.1.1

             4 October 2024 at 5:31 pm

             Hi good to hear you ok ! Major disaster though, all around. Oh re

             those bozos vote Nats, anyways…

             Its in their DNA. Unlikely to ever change. Oh also did Mark Mitchell do much ? As I said, I reckon if anything he would be maybe channelling a mercenary Canute. Some kind of canute anyway : )

             Take care.

             Reply
   • Mac1 7.2

     3 October 2024 at 5:22 pm

     I'm no defender of Stuart Smith. I believe he has changed his climate views. However, he is not the Minister for Climate Change. That is Simon Watts. Here is Smith last year on the National web site explaining National's position then.

     https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=378182643989120

     What ever that means, the way this National government will support communities through the effects of climate change such as flooding is what is at issue here.

     Smith's committee has reported. I've not read it , but the news article days this. "Individuals should be responsible for managing their own natural hazard risk when making decisions … the longer the information about the risk has been available, the less case there is for socialising the cost if the risk is realised," the report said.'

     So, less insurance, more 'shoring up' and managed retreat.

     Smith will have been made aware of climate change from viticultural scientists if nowhere elae through his connections to the wine industry- they are saying that grape phenological development is starting earlier as an effect of climate change.

     https://deepsouthchallenge.co.nz/wp-content/uploads/2024/06/Projected-Wine-Grape-Cultivar-Shifts-Due-to-Climate-Change-in-New-Zealand.pdf

     Reply
     • PsyclingLeft.Always 7.2.1

       3 October 2024 at 6:05 pm

       Thanks for reply. I dont know him at all…so can only go by what he has previously said…as I linked.

       Re Simon Watts..and of course The Five Pillars….mixed message? Oxymoron? (Climate morons anyway)

       Watts stated that the government would "advocate for the global phase-out of fossil fuels" despite reopening the country to oil and gas exploration.

       https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simon_Watts#Second_term,_2023%E2%80%93present

       Anyway, Im sure there will be much more to see and hear about "managed retreat" and user (loser) pays…..

       Reply
       • Mac1 7.2.1.1

         3 October 2024 at 6:18 pm

         I think the Nats never read about the four pillars of wisdom which rests upon the four pillars of knowledge, logic, empathy, and experience……..

         Reply
         • PsyclingLeft.Always 7.2.1.1.1

           3 October 2024 at 6:40 pm

           My thoughts exactly. Whoever thought their quite strange 5 Pillar phrasing must have been completely unaware..or maybe sending some kind of odd Ironical message? Who could figure them?

           Anyway..NACT1 certainly lacking in any of those Good Qualities you list…

           Reply
           • Mac1 7.2.1.1.1.1

             4 October 2024 at 10:33 am

             The Nats have added another colonnade in their temple plans. First we had Watts' 5 Pillars of Climate Change.

             Today's Marlborough Express has Andrew Bayly's five pillars of small business- "One is access to talent, and two, how do we get better? The third is about digitising business…. the fourth was reducing regulations and the fifth was about better promoting industries."

             The Nats must have had a seminar on how to look like you've got a plan while floundering- "The Five Pillars Philosophy of Government". This 5 Pillars approach is found everywhere, from Wikipedia to Islam, from educational leadership to health.

             It feels like the Nats want to be seen as being organised and with-it by appropriating their versions of five P's.

             One 5 Pillar plan they seem to be using is 1. lie, 2. deny, 3. hide, 4. disguise and 5. blame 'them'.

             Reply
             • PsyclingLeft.Always …

               4 October 2024 at 11:20 am

               Re the Nats 5 Pillars… If not plagiarised through some kind of a Black Mirror, could it be some kind of Readers Digest generic effort?

               Ah enough of them. While searching 5 Pillar Versions..I found this.

               Looks good to me….

               https://unibocconi.libguides.com/c.php?g=701685&p=5042927

               Reply
8. ianmac 8

   3 October 2024 at 12:05 pm

   I just read on X a list of 25+ times this Government has lied or misrepresented information about their actions. Don't know how to get it onto here.

   Confirms my impressions.

   It was "Nick @StrayDogNZ

   Dunedin Hospital

   Maths Results

   School attendance

   Te Reo education

   Etc etc

   Reply
   • joe90 8.1

     3 October 2024 at 7:20 pm

     Here.

     @StrayDogNZ

     Not even a year in and this coalition government's legacy so far is one of lies, misinformation and obfuscation.

     Here's a thread of the many times Luxon's government has misled the public with false claims & refused to release evidence to justify their damaging policies 🧵

     https://xcancel.com/StrayDogNZ/status/1841320320709382653

     Reply
9. adam 9

   3 October 2024 at 12:11 pm

   It's class war.

   Get with the real.

   Lola describes how I view our insane rulers. So enjoy.

   Reply
10. SPC 10

    3 October 2024 at 1:48 pm

    Like other small economies, New Zealand needs a sustained commitment to infrastructure and exporting, and investment in science and innovation to support the small business sector.

    https://www.1news.co.nz/2024/10/03/analysis-why-nzs-small-businesses-may-be-worse-off-than-during-the-gfc/

    I would add a fully functional tax system to maintain first world society governance.

    The real productive economy needs to flourish, this is not based on increased reward for speculative investment in the residential sector/housing – the smaller this is to the total economy, the better.

    The article notes the impact of the economic cycle on the small business.

    They are often financed by loans on a house. The combination of a rising cost (mortgage) on a business and declining demand (as their consumers mortgage payment cost has gone up too) is of the disaster capitalism realm – a boon to the receivership industry (they love liberterianism).

    In an environment of rising rate cost and in some places property insurance, difficult.

    The country would do better with progressive company/business taxation and small business loan insurance. The stress test on a small business is becoming the ability to finance a longer term mortgage cost (or the short term lease and operating only when the mortgage rates are lower) and to work with others to survive a downturn – shared premises etc.

    Reply
11. SPC 11

    3 October 2024 at 2:23 pm

    Once upon a time …

    the government charged a rate of return for any investment in new hospital buildings. This deterred any HB asking for such money, till … they all needed significant infrastructure investment at the same time. But, if they got it they could not afford to pay the return and still afford to provide their health service.

    One answer, centralisation.

    Another, exploit this manufactured crisis to say we cannot afford the buildings – see ACT policy – lease buildings built by others. Boiling the public health system frog. This is all deliberate. Why else have Murray Horn involved in preparing the way for this on the National Health Board (with the deep diving out of our depth, got the bends yet sidekick)?

    UPDATE

    https://www.1news.co.nz/2024/10/03/health-nz-headed-for-likely-near-1-billion-deficit/

    Unf…believable.

    What absolute nonsense.

    Reply
12. newsense 12

    3 October 2024 at 5:08 pm

    From thinker’s link in the other thread:

    Fiscal restraint is right for the times but where good investment stacks up we should get on with it,” said an industry association chief. “Labour did spend way too much and profligately so, but New Zealand doesn’t have a significant public debt issue relative to other nations; we have productivity and growth ones that require sensible investment. Finally, let’s see more policy boldness.

    “It doesn’t need to be full Rogernomics or Ruth Richardson style, but more than English or Robertson incrementalism is required given New Zealand’s serious problems.”

    From a cowardly ‘industry chief’.
    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/business-reports/mood-of-the-boardroom/mood-of-the-boardroom-chief-executives-rank-government-ministers-and-labour-leaders/6RXK5735GRHC5AZCUJH5MGZ5YM/

    To translate: what you’re doing is wrong! We need to acknowledge climate change and move with our neighbours. We need to invest in people living without cars. We don’t need culture wars. We need rail freight across Cook Strait. We don’t need to be firing all our public servants and releasing them to Australia. We can’t prioritise landlords and property ahead of our economy. That’s borderline corrupt and negligent at a minimum.
    Maori is our international brand. Deal with that. The only excuse for this government is that they wanna give government companies to their friends in breach of treaty obligations.

    People don’t distinguish NZ by another white middle management devotee of Chicago school economics. Our visibility is our Maori art and the haka. Alongside Lord of the Rings.

    Attacking both Maoridom and our film industry just makes you think that Treasury can’t get laid. And that Luxon is Canadian middle management who’s never appreciated his home country.

    WE DON’T HAVE A SIGNIFICANT PUBLIC DEBT ISSUE. Put your name to it coward. Don’t back your team just because if they’re wrecking the joint.

    Reply

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