Open Mike 05/02/2018

104 comments on “Open Mike 05/02/2018 ”

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1. Ed 1

   5 February 2018 at 6:08 am

   Rodeo has no place in a civilised country.

   ” The death of a bull at a Wairarapa rodeo on Friday night will add fuel to the fire in the debate on whether the sport should be banned.

   ….rodeo-type activities would not be tolerated on a farm or when inflicted on a pet, but they are allowed “in the name of fun” for a cruel and outdated form of entertainment.

   The difference with rodeo is that the events pit humans against distressed animals in an arena with the expectation that the human will come out on top. Is this really how we want to have fun in a supposedly civilised country in the 21st century?”

   https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/101161365/rodeo-pitting-humans-versus-animals-belongs-to-the-past
   • Whispering Kate 1.1

     5 February 2018 at 8:34 am

     I remember going to a bull fight in Spain in the late 1960’s – it was supposedly the “done thing” if you went to Spain. In a way bullfighting is a more extreme form of rodeo – it goads and angers the bull by injuring it and the entire event was very distressing for me personally. Nothing sporting about it – rodeo is the same, nothing sporting about it, legging the animals when they haven’t a chance of escape, pissing the bulls and horses of with the aggravating strap around its belly – what chance is that for the animals.

     Do away with it – its enough we kill thousands of the beasts each year just for our pleasure of eating them – give them respect at least until then.
     • Anne 1.1.1

       5 February 2018 at 10:02 am

       I remember going to a bull fight in Spain in the late 1960’s – it was supposedly the “done thing” if you went to Spain.

       Been there done that – lasted less than 15 minutes. Wholeheartedly concur with your sentiments.
2. Ed 2

   5 February 2018 at 7:02 am

   Jacinda 5 days at Waitangi
   Bill. ‘elsewhere in the country.’

   One historic
   One elsewhere

   Bomber writes well on this on the Daily Blog.

   https://thedailyblog.co.nz/2018/02/05/waitangi-day-2018-the-joy-of-a-leader-who-understands-the-treaty-maori-will-vote-jacinda-forever-how-iwi-leaders-have-to-acknowledge-the-political-rise-of-urban-maori/

   I really hope Bill stays on as National ‘s leader.

   “ ‘In the middle of a historic five-day stint at Waitangi, Prime Minister Jacinda
   Ardern will lead a large contingent of Labour MPs at Monday’s official welcome.

   National’s Steven Joyce will be among 11 National Party MPs at the powhiri with leader Bill English elsewhere in the country.”

   http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11988199
3. Morrissey 3

   5 February 2018 at 7:45 am

   Russell Brown lacks the energy to do his job any more. Time to give up?

   past it (informal) too old to be of any use or any good at anything.
   synonyms: past one’s prime, not as young as one was, not as young as one used to be

   After the death of Nelson Mandela in late 2013, Russell Brown suffered the indignity of having his blog hijacked by the cynical National Party provocateur Matthew Hooton, who had the effrontery to claim that Mandela was similar to Margaret Thatcher and Ronald Reagan. The thread naturally dissolved into chaos after that, and by the end of the day Brown was at the end of his tether. I satirized the imbroglio here…

   Open mike 30/12/2013

   Brown clearly has no stomach for robust discussions any more. After the recent attempt to smear Lorde, he wrote a thoughtful piece about the whole shameful affair, but then at the end, where the discussion should have been,we find this sad little note….

   Hi folks. Normally, I’d welcome comments here, but I honestly don’t have the energy during the holiday period to oversee a discussion that would undoubtedly need pretty much constant watching. Sorry, but comments are off.

   https://publicaddress.net/hardnews/lordes-call/

   [I personally feel uncomfortable with you using The Standard comments section to smear another left wing blogger because of a long running grudge you hold towards him. I haven’t talked to the other authors about this, but given you have a history of posting misleading comments I am just going to put some boundaries in place.

   If you want to reference a conversation at Public Address, you now need to link directly to the conversation *each time*. If the comments section is pages long, you need to link to the specific part of the conversation you are referring to. This is so that people reading your comment can make up their own mind by seeing the conversation itself and in context. *You need to do the work of linking.

   Putting you into moderation until you supply a link for the above comment.

   Others have dealt with your views on Brown’s suspending commenting – weka]
   • Ad 3.1

     5 February 2018 at 8:35 am

     Russel Brown is an excellent commentator.

     Note it was a public holiday.

     Which is where people are entitled by law not to work.
   • Wensleydale 3.2

     5 February 2018 at 9:53 am

     Shame on Russell Brown for wanting a little peace and quiet during the holiday period. Doesn’t he realise it’s his job, nay duty, to supervise frothing toddlers bickering on the internet 24/7? The audacity of the man!
   • Andre 3.3

     5 February 2018 at 10:04 am

     When you set up and run a blog that lots of people find interesting and choose to spend time debating on, you too can spend your holiday time monitoring and moderating said blog.

     Or not.
     • One Anonymous Bloke 3.3.1

       5 February 2018 at 10:06 am

       +1
     • Psycho Milt 3.3.2

       5 February 2018 at 12:04 pm

       +2.
   • Sanctuary 3.4

     5 February 2018 at 11:44 am

     It should be noted Russell Brown was a close friend of musician Grant Fell, who died last week.
     • weka 3.4.1

       5 February 2018 at 2:41 pm

       The post that had its comments closed was from Jan 3rd.
       • Sanctuary 3.4.1.1

         5 February 2018 at 6:31 pm

         I know, I was just noting he might have other things on his mind than posting new stuff right now.
         • weka 3.4.1.1.1

           5 February 2018 at 6:44 pm

           oh right, that makes sense.
   • Morrissey 3.5

     5 February 2018 at 4:51 pm

     weka, the direct link to the conversation is here….

     https://publicaddress.net/system/cafe/hard-news-mandela/?i=200#replies

     …you have a history of posting misleading comments…

     Really? Could you support that claim with at least one example, please?

     [thanks. And sure, try this https://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-14112017/#comment-1414280 (which funnily enough also involves your beef with Russell Brown) – weka
     • Morrissey 3.5.1

       5 February 2018 at 5:07 pm

       Sorry, weka, but you have provided not one bit of evidence of my posting even one “misleading comment.”

       [I count inaccurate transcripts that are presented as transcripts as ‘misleading’. And in that conversation I linked to, you appeared to accept that. – weka]
       • Morrissey 3.5.1.1

         5 February 2018 at 6:59 pm

         You are willfully misconstruing my rush transcripts—unlike my present ones, they weren’t always perfect, but they were far from “inaccurate”—as though I was deliberately misleading my readers. I did not do that; if I was of that cast of mind I’d be working for the National or Labour Party propaganda units, or for something even worse, like the three “news” team.

         [sigh. read the links in the link. We’ve been over this ad nauseam, and the links show the inaccuracy because people went and linked to the actual audio and demonstrated the mistakes. I haven’t said it was intentional on your part, I’ve said you have a history of misleading comments – weka]
4. eco maori 4

   5 February 2018 at 8:15 am

   Morning Breakfast people its good that you are keeping the debate on weed going it was a good article you ran with MR Cameron that name is quite strong in
   Te Taiwarhiti .
   I had one quip with the article that is that know mention of all the people who get a criminal record because of the way these ancient laws are forced on us .
   I will wait for the correct time for me to have more input on the subject of weed in Aotearoa there are some issues that I stay out of so as to not have a negative effect against the good cause I.E rally the neolibrals against it . I think Fair GO is a show that fights for the common peoples causes to be treated fairly Like the wealthy are one should not have to have heaps of money to expect to be treated humanly by our society but that’s the way it is .
   May be I should approach Fair Go to help me fight the NZ justice system for the facial way they are treating a broke brown person/human like ECO MAORI .
   Yeah Right the sandfly will shine there hypnotic object and spin anything to stop that.
   You see people the follow me everywhere I go trying to break my WAIRUA but know I have to much MANA for that to ever happen. P.S ITs good to see you all Eco likes the good kiwi Karma you good people on Breakfast are displaying Ka pai.
   Ka kite ano
5. eco maori 5

   5 February 2018 at 8:43 am

   Morning Rock radio people give us a sore face please Ka pai
6. Jo Smith 6

   5 February 2018 at 8:45 am

   Who is this Harvey Weinstein everyone keeps talking about ?
   • alwyn 6.1

     5 February 2018 at 9:36 am

     He was a major fundraiser for the Democratic Party.
     With the Republicans in the ascendancy he isn’t quite as popular anymore.
     Barack Obama, Hillary Clinton and Elizabeth Warren, among others could probably tell you all about him although I expect they have probably developed very convenient selective amnesia.
     Time to move on though. Nothing to see here.
     https://www.businessinsider.com.au/harvey-weinstein-political-donations-2017-10?r=US&IR=T
     • dv 6.1.1

       5 February 2018 at 9:41 am

       Heard of METO alwyn?
       • Cinny 6.1.1.1

         5 February 2018 at 10:10 am

         Many Democrats are now giving their ‘harvey’ donations to charities since the sexual harassment stories broke. At least they are trying to right a wrong.

         METO?

         Like the time I ended pretending to be married in an attempt to put an end to the ongoing sexual harassment from my then employer. It worked due to his culture.

         In reflection I should have spoken out as my actions did nada to prevent the same happening to any other women he may have employed after I eventually quit, I feel bad about that now, but young and naive I was.
         • patricia bremner 6.1.1.1.1

           5 February 2018 at 2:16 pm

           And Cinny, not supported by the “mores” of the day.

           You were fighting back on the only terms they would respond to. Very understandable … don’t beat yourself.
           • Cinny 6.1.1.1.1.1

             5 February 2018 at 11:14 pm

             🙂
     • joe90 6.1.2

       5 February 2018 at 12:32 pm

       Yeah, but unlike the RNC’s finance chief Steve Wynn, Weinstein wasn’t a party functionary.

       And unlike the their call for Weinstein’s donations to be returned tout suite, the RNC hypocrites are touting due process before they even think about returning any of Wynn’s donations.

       RNC chairwoman on Fox says RNC won’t yet return Wynn $: “Steve has denied these allegations. There is an investigation that is going to take place. He should be allowed due process. If he is found guilty of any wrongdoing, we will absolutely return 100% of the money."— Rebecca Ballhaus (@rebeccaballhaus) January 30, 2018

       In an interview with CNN from October, Republican National Committee Chair Ronna McDaniel praised Sens. Elizabeth Warren and Chuck Schumer for returning donations from Weinstein, but added: “The DNC should do the same thing. They’re keeping 90 percent of his donations. I don’t understand. If you stand for treating women well and you stand for the respect of women, you shouldn’t take money from somebody who treated women with the absolute highest level of disrespect.”

       But in January 2018, the GOP is singing a very different tune after a Wall Street Journal investigation found that Steve Wynn, casino magnate and finance chair of the RNC, allegedly sexually harassed and assaulted dozens of women over the past two decades. The party accepted Wynn’s resignation as finance chair.

       But it isn’t isn’t looking to return his donations anytime soon. “He should be allowed due process,” McDaniel said on Fox on Tuesday morning.

       […]

       You don’t need “due process” or a criminal investigation to fire a private employee or return an alleged harasser’s political donations. Weinstein wasn’t investigated by the New York Police Department (at first) — he was investigated by Ronan Farrow at the New Yorker and by Jodi Kantor and Megan Twohey at the New York Times.

       Former Today show host Matt Lauer was fired by NBC — without investigation by police. And, of course, conservatives — and the GOP — have long noted a number of allegations of harassment and sexual assault against former President Bill Clinton that never reached the courts.

       https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2018/1/30/16950296/rnc-steve-wynn-donations
       • alwyn 6.1.2.1

         5 February 2018 at 5:15 pm

         That makes it alright then.
         The Republican Party also has skeletons in its closet.
         What is that phrase? We can ignore it. They did it too.
         As I said. Nothing to see here. Time to move on.
         • joe90 6.1.2.1.1

           5 February 2018 at 5:49 pm

           It’s quite clear, liberals have acted decisively and removed harassers and conservative hypocrites have routinely labelled accusers liars, hidden behind due process and trotted out apologists like Sarah “Sen. Franken has admitted wrongdoing and the president hasn’t” Huckabooboo.
       • Cinny 6.1.2.2

         5 February 2018 at 11:18 pm

         Cheers for the links and info Joe

         How does it go…. want to know what people are really like, wait until money is involved.

         Alwyn re 6.1.2.1 Well said, Alwyn, well said.
7. eco maori 7

   5 February 2018 at 9:36 am

   You know what’s so hard case Rock people it’s when I drive past a road work site the workers are looking at the ground or star gazeing. What was Jen talking about when she pulled her calf mussels that would be good to know now there is someone at a business I mowed when they are never there anther play by the sandflys Ka kite ano
   • Ad 7.1

     5 February 2018 at 9:50 am

     The main reason workers pause when cars are going past or trains are going past, is because it’s good not to be run over and killed. So they step out of the way.

     Note also: for every one person on the end of a shovel, you also have to have other people “standing around”:
     – health and safety
     – site engineers
     – site supervisors
     – client
     – subcontractors waiting for another part of the job to complete
     – traffic staff
     – machine operators eg cranes, trucks, hi-ab, all of which wait for other epople to do their jobs

     So before you do the usual thing again thinking: why is only one person working and the rest of them standing around, the simple answer is:

     they are not your personal performing monkeys who jump up and down just because you and yours rolled up in a car.

     They are a team.
   • eco maori 7.2

     5 February 2018 at 10:33 am

     Morning Jim how’s the new Moko there must be some in the water at The Rock radio station all those new mokos well all the best to you all.
     Road workers what eco meant was the sandflys are going ahead of me and telling you people not to notice me they bull you people and say that they have a court order to stop any publicly for me you people on the ground work hard and all deserve a pay rise. Ka kite ano
     • Eco Maori 7.2.1

       5 February 2018 at 7:13 pm

       Man can not even have a private conversations with his Whano and the sandflys spinn it up to use what I say in private as a weapon thatssssss right a poor Brown man has no rights I forgot that is accepterable in OUR society. Eco is not impressed with the talent and leadership of our Maori leaders over the last 50 years .
       My problem is they let crown con them that the justice system is humane and fair mean while the jails are over flowing with Maori. They throw there hands up in the air and say we don’t know what’s wrong with the system. They have let MSM publish all the bad stories about Maori and say it ok it’s true what about all the positive thing Maori achieve .There are many things that the powerful Maori have just let happen they were just looking after there own.It’ got that bad that everyone looks down there noses look at US never give us the respect and trust . We are all tared with that same brush that is published on MSM that the neolibrels instergated ECO MAORI is going to change that disrespectful view of all MAORI like I’m doing NOW KA PAI
       P.S. Many thanks for that positive article on Maori in KOREA Kimberly Downs.
       ANA TO kai
       Eco Maori is backing your show Hillary and Jeremy we just have to interactive a bit and your ratings will rise sharply Eco has been waiting patiently for this new show on TVNZ ON 1 at SEVEN Pm Ka kite ano
       • Eco Maori 7.2.1.1

         5 February 2018 at 8:11 pm

         I not impressed with the Maori leaders we got now either . They know how this system works and chose to say nothing to WARN OUR Mokos It’s algood Eco Maori has told all the people about this corrupt justice systems of the western society. And crime is dropping 2 reasons 1 being informed about the bullshit systems 2 they have a swarm following me around all the time the sandflys don’t have the time to harass OUR Mokos Ka pai I can handle the sandflys heat.lol Ana to kai.
         ECO MAORI has been reassing his views on Barack Obama he is m8 with shonky key who I know is a racist bigot who main goal was to destroy MAORI Mana and full his pockets and his m8 how many billions did he spend down South irragation schemes bailing out that finance company giving our money to people who are already rich WTF .
         So Big No to Obama coming to Aotearoa at OUR expense just to lift AMERICA IMAGE .Shonky key would get some positive publicity out of that visit to after what key has done to Aotearoa no fucken way .ANA TO KAI
         • Eco Maori 7.2.1.1.1

           5 February 2018 at 9:19 pm

           Eco Maori knows that Hillary Barry and Jeremy wells won’t caste a subliminal message to all the people of Aotearoa that it’s OK to drive a million dollar car own a million dollar’ house talk about all the bags his wife has when they go on holiday to America and kiss shonky ass whenever he can and ridicule OUR poorest people who have slipped on there ladder of life. Then give his m8 dairy dack dune a pat on the back while his son m8 is poisoning OUR people for a profit heres a person form that party he likes on this link bellow ka pai Hillary & Jeremy
           Ka kite ano

           https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/feb/04/paul-ryan-tweet-school-secretary-tax-bill
8. Ad 8

   5 February 2018 at 11:18 am

   Seriously outstanding coverage for Prime Minister Ardern coming through TV1 news from Waitangi:

   https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news

   Great to see her rise to this – a real Big Norm moment.
   • mauī 8.1

     5 February 2018 at 12:05 pm

     Heard her speak about problems for Māori, poverty and inequality, poor housing, rangatahi suicide rate and mental health. Major, major issues that the Government plays a large part in.

     You have to wonder how many times Māori have heard a politician promising change, and many of these things won’t be able to be turned around quickly either. She appears genuine, but who knows if the rest of the Labour caucus is.
     • tracey 8.1.1

       5 February 2018 at 12:09 pm

       Well at Waitangi just now she told them to hold her to account when she comes back next year. You can bet they will do just that.
   • patricia bremner 8.2

     5 February 2018 at 12:17 pm

     Yes Ad, a speech I’m proud to listen to. A P.M. we can be proud of.

     Her call for the people of the Marae and else where to hold her and the government to account each year, with face to face meetings, to discuss progress during Waitangi Week.

     We can do this. We can change lives working together.
   • Rosemary McDonald 8.3

     5 February 2018 at 1:52 pm

     I’m thinking back, and I can’t remember an occasion where the spouse/partner of a Prime Minister played such a central role at Waitangi as it seems the Current Incumbent’s is.

     Even to picking up the wero…a task that should more appropriately gone to a male colleague rather than a partner.
     • JanM 8.3.1

       5 February 2018 at 5:07 pm

       Do you know something we don’t? You are obviously exercised about this because it is the second time you have mentioned it!
     • Jenny Kirk 8.3.2

       5 February 2018 at 8:43 pm

       That was Labour giving the PM’s spouse an honour – maybe so he wouldn’t be feeling “left out” of all the proceedings. Maybe it was as simple a gesture as that.
       Get over it Rosemary. It was a nice thing for him to be able to do.
9. Draco T Bastard 9

   5 February 2018 at 12:01 pm

   Cancer “Vaccine” That Wipes out Tumors Ready for Human Trial

   Researchers at Stanford University have developed a compound that when injected into a tumor destroys it along with all the other cancerous masses present in the body.

   The combination of two agents that stimulate the immune system sparked a body-wide reaction in mice, destroying cancer cells both near and very far from the initial injection point. The success of the treatment, which worked for different types of cancer, means that human trials will be starting soon.

   Sounds promising.
   • patricia bremner 9.1

     5 February 2018 at 12:19 pm

     Here is hoping for this to be a breakthrough, and it is priced right!!
   • Incognito 9.2

     5 February 2018 at 8:11 pm

     Thanks; interesting. Fingers crossed.

     https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT03410901
10. Puckish Rogue 10

    5 February 2018 at 12:37 pm

    Makes me glad i live in NZ however whether its true or not its damn interesting…as long as it happens in someone elses country

    https://www.truthrevolt.org/commentary/greenfield-memo-reveals-coup-against-america
    • Andre 10.1

      5 February 2018 at 12:51 pm

      Geez Puckish, I thought your filter was better than that. The memo doesn’t stand scrutiny, let alone the wild allegations and conclusions being spouted about it.

      https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2018/02/02/the-nunes-memo-makes-no-sense-216928

      Meanwhile here in New Zealand, you heard of a book called Dirty Politics by Nicky Hager? It’s got all sorts of interesting bits, including stuff about the office of the incumbent head of government misusing the nation’s spy services to smear the opposition.
      • Puckish Rogue 10.1.1

        5 February 2018 at 1:33 pm

        My take on it is that both sides are probably right in some respects and both sides are probably wrong in others

        Its more I’m glad we don;t have anything like that going on here and we’re all the better for it
        • McFlock 10.1.1.1

          5 February 2018 at 1:40 pm

          What, you mean we don’t have the overseas mega-wealthy with possible foreign government connections paying visits to politicians in order to acquire favourable treatment?

          Good to know.

          On a different note, have they repealed the hobbit employment law yet?
          • Puckish Rogue 10.1.1.1.1

            5 February 2018 at 2:04 pm

            We don’t have anything like that, to the degree that the USA has 🙂
            • One Anonymous Bloke 10.1.1.1.1.1

              5 February 2018 at 2:13 pm

              I agree it’s to a lesser degree here: the National Party just doesn’t cost that much.
              • McFlock …

                5 February 2018 at 2:18 pm

                Rick Blaine: I don’t mind a parasite. I object to a cut-rate one.
    • JohnSelway 10.2

      5 February 2018 at 2:42 pm

      I love the fact the Trump wing of the Republican party still think Obama is president and Clinton is some sort of shadow president pulling the strings. Or something – it’s hard to make sense of what the fuck they actually think or are trying to infer.
      • Puckish Rogue 10.2.1

        5 February 2018 at 2:50 pm

        Well if true, and thats still a big if, it means Trump was spied on illegally and it was endorsed by the highest office in the land so they probably think its a big deal
        • Andre 10.2.1.1

          5 February 2018 at 3:01 pm

          It said nothing about Trump, it was about Carter Page. Even leading Republicans such as Trey Gowdy say it has nothing to do with the investigation into the Trump campaign.

          https://www.politico.com/story/2018/02/03/trey-gowdy-nunes-memo-russia-probe-389083

          If the name Trey Gowdy vaguely rings a bell, it was he who decided 8 investigations into Hillary and Benghazi weren’t enough and conducted a ninth. And came up with nothing that could even be spun as culpability on Hillary’s part.

          edit: although, to give him his due, that investigation did highlight the issue of her server.
          • Puckish Rogue 10.2.1.1.1

            5 February 2018 at 3:11 pm

            The issue has been that muddied that I don’t think anyone can honestly (or truthfully) state what did or didn’t happen
            • One Anonymous Bloke 10.2.1.1.1.1

              5 February 2018 at 3:34 pm

              🙄

              Wouldn’t that be convenient for your white supremacist leader.
              • Puckish Rogue …

                5 February 2018 at 3:44 pm

                Hes as much your leader as he is mine
                • One Anonymous Bloke …

                  5 February 2018 at 3:46 pm

                  …and yet you’re the one trying (and failing) to make excuses for him.
                  • Puckish Rogue …

                    5 February 2018 at 4:21 pm

                    Nope sorry you’re wrong
            • Andre 10.2.1.1.1.2

              5 February 2018 at 3:35 pm

              Just in case you’re interested, here’s a reminder of Nunes’ previous clusterfuck of an attempt to blow a smokescreen for Hair Fuhrer to hide behind and claim vindication. He’s got form for embarrassingly inept stunts like this.

              https://www.wired.com/2017/04/devin-nunes-white-house-trump-surveillance/
            • McFlock 10.2.1.1.1.3

              5 February 2018 at 3:39 pm

              Bullshit.

              It’s not muddy at all.

              Half a dozen close members of the Trump campaign have either been indicted or disclosed their own emails detailing activities they believed to be on behalf of the Russians. The nunes memo is an attempt to poison one of the initial warrants that exposed this poisonous tree, because the one commonality all of these people have is Trump.

              I doubt they have enough to nuke the investigation via court appeals – the FISA warrants against page don’t cover Flynn, for example – but they’re looking for enough PR shielding to excuse interfering in the investigation.
              • One Two …

                5 February 2018 at 3:58 pm

                “Not muddy at all”

                None of those who comment on this have a clue what’s actually going on or why…

                The propaganda behind ‘russiagate’ is outrageously blatant…trying to decifer it is a waste of time…

                Claiming to understand what’s going on or taking a position….Schoolboy mistake…
                • McFlock …

                  5 February 2018 at 4:13 pm

                  fuck off. Claiming to know nothing aids and abets all of the world’s ills. Better to take a stand (and be wrong once in a while) than to exercise Cartesian doubt as a dodge from moral culpability.
                  • One Two …

                    5 February 2018 at 4:27 pm

                    Taking a stand…

                    Against what, exactly…

                    Wrong once and a while = 100% of the time with the volume of propaganda and deceit involved

                    I get that folks like to feel they have some understanding of what’s going on…they need to feel involved…empowered…

                    But that’s not realistic…
                    • McFlock …

                      5 February 2018 at 5:11 pm

                      Oh bullshit. You’re just too much of a coward to form a reasoned belief on the world around you. If you actually believed something, you might one day actually have to commit to it.

                      The other thing that pisses me off about the “oh no, it’s impossible to know anything” approach is that not only are you helping corruption run rampant, you try and pretend like you’re better than people who do actually engage with their surroundings. Fuck you. People like you are part of the reason people don’t vote, which favours tories and demogogues. You are actively trying to keep the corrupt in office.
                    • One Two []

                      5 February 2018 at 9:36 pm

                      That you can’t read my ‘opinions’ in my comments is your limitation…

                      So you reach for the abusive comments…how very base…

                      Picking ‘a side’ by believing your opinion is somehow ‘preventing/fighting’ corruption is the purest form of illogical and irrational…

                      Your opinions, energy and position are part of the problem…you can’t be part of the solution…

                      Not with that primitive level of ‘thinking’…
                    • McFlock …

                      5 February 2018 at 10:07 pm

                      It’s ironic that the only thing you pretend to have a firm opinion on is your intellectual superiority.

                      And yes, the proposition that sowing apathy and encouraging political disengagement does indeed provide fertaile soil for corruption is logical:

                      Corruption multiplies most when out of the public view;
                      Saying that we can never know the truth instead of looking for it and exposing it keeps the truth out of the public view;
                      therefore:
                      Saying that we can never know the truth instead of looking for it and exposing it provides the most ideal environment for corruption to multiply.

                      Logical enough for you, fucko?

                      One thing I don’t know is why you bother commenting here – surely your extreme epistemological skepticim means that you must have overwhelmig doubt that your computer even exists? Your desire for attention betrays your arguments as a fraud: if your doubt were genuinely that extreme, there could well be no attention to be gained and any effort commenting here would be wasted.

                      Your pretension creates a paradox that exposes itself. You’ve been hoist by your own canard.
                  • greywarshark …

                    5 February 2018 at 8:23 pm

                    That’s a handy excuse that no-one will understand for me to give out when I have come out with something off the wall – sorry didn’t want to waffle with Cartesian doubt so posited that.

                    McFlock I enjoyed that but will try to keep out of the way when you let fly.
                    I was thinking the other day about people who won’t have children because they don’t want to bring little ones into such a bad world. That seems cowardly too, though I think China was trying to do the right thing, limiting to two would be best.
                    • McFlock …

                      5 February 2018 at 9:06 pm

                      Funnily enough, I don’t recall ever having been irked by your comments in the slightest, so you needn’t fear me going off the handle.

                      I think some people are overly pessimistic about the world – especially those people who are in a position to choose their fertility based on bets about what will happen in thirty years.

                      The kids who really suffer will be born to parents who had no choice because healthcare wasn’t available.

                      China was/is in a major demographic bind, but its solution has had some unforseen negatives, like a hefty gender imbalance.
                • reason …

                  5 February 2018 at 5:00 pm

                  I doubt they will go after Trump on dodgy Russian money flows …. Given the extent of involvement by u.s.a firms in the world wide laundry business ….https://www.wsj.com/articles/u-s-probe-of-malaysian-fund-looks-at-rap-stars-political-donations-1511951401

                  Glass houses every where …..

                  “Morgan Stanley reports having 210 subsidiaries in offshore tax havens. ”

                  “Citigroup reported operating 427 tax haven subsidiaries in 2008 but disclosed only 41 in 2014. Over that time period, Citigroup nearly doubled the amount of cash it reported holding offshore. ”

                  “Bank of America reported operating 264 tax haven subsidiaries in 2013 but disclosed only 22 in 2014. ”

                  If the Russians did hack the U.s elections …. It was by calling all their diplomats home on the eve of the election …. giving the impression of a war footing preparation for a Clinton win.

                  Whether this induced any u.s voters, specifically those afraid of nuclear war with russia ….to give their vote to Trump instead of Clinton….. is unknown and unexplored to the best of my knowledge.

                  There are more obvious reasons she lost …
                  • One Anonymous Bloke …

                    6 February 2018 at 4:59 am

                    The Trump investigation has nothing to do with But But But Hillary. Nor Morgan Stanley, nor Citigroup, nor anyone else who might have “done it too”.

                    And if money laundering isn’t an issue, why have formal charges of money laundering been laid?

                    Please try and live up to your handle.
                    • reason …

                      6 February 2018 at 6:37 pm

                      I’m not that invested in the continuation of criminality that both Trump and Clinton represent ….

                      I think it would be good if Trump was arrested over his profiteering from criminal russian money laundering …… criminal oligarchs stealing from the poor should be prosecuted … just like war criminals should….Convictions for either are like rocking horse shit.

                      I’d be very surprised if ‘creative’ business structures do not provide Trump with Wayne Mapp / Bill English standards of legal plausible deniability…. and then he could quote John Key ” We observe the law”….. ” every thing is above board ” ….. ” Its all a political smear”.

                      When watching an American circus you’d be silly to spend all your time on the russian clowns …. you’ll miss the main events https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w44lApffH30
                  • One Anonymous Bloke …

                    6 February 2018 at 6:48 pm

                    you’ll miss the main events

                    I can’t recognise Disaster Capitalism and pay attention to the FBI’s investigation at the same time, eh, because I’m inattentive and stupid, and don’t know how.

                    Thanks for clearing that up.
                    • reason …

                      6 February 2018 at 11:17 pm

                      Good for you OAB …..

                      You’ll no doubt be aware of the NZ shell company connections to the russian laundromat …. if not just ask cathy odgers … https://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2014/08/new-zealand-companies-offices-612mn-money-laundering-snooze.html

                      Given that your up with the play …… what fraction of influence over u.s politics do you think the russians wield …..compared to Israel ??

                      
                      Israel own u.s politics ….. Hacked it with money.
        • joe90 10.2.1.2

          5 February 2018 at 3:11 pm

          Trump was spied on illegally

          Well, he did hire someone intelligence services were interested in because of their connections to Russia, so he can’t really bleat about turning up in incidental collection.

          NEW: I just found this video of Carter Page in Moscow, Russia speaking in support of Vladimir Putin, while working on the Trump campaign. He calls the American international affairs strategy "hostile," then goes on to talk about the "failure of US analysts & leaders" #TrumpRussia pic.twitter.com/LE2T6mMrcC— Scott Dworkin (@funder) February 5, 2018

          Carter Page, the energy industry consultant who was linked last year to Donald Trump’s presidential campaign, is the unnamed man identified in a federal complaint as having met with a Russian intelligence agent four years ago, Page himself revealed on Monday.

          Page confirmed his role in the 2013 FBI investigation to NBC News after ABC News and Buzzfeed identified him as a subject called “Male 1” in a criminal complaint filed in 2015 against Evgeny Buryakov, an undercover agent posing as a Russian bank executive in New York.

          https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/trump-campaign-associate-carter-page-revealed-target-russian-spies-n742356
          • Andre 10.2.1.2.1

            5 February 2018 at 3:49 pm

            I s’pose calling yourself an adviser to the Kremlin might spark a wee bit of curiosity from intelligence agencies.

            https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2018/02/carter-page-reportedly-bragged-about-being-an-informal-adviser-to-the-kremlin-in-2013.html
11. joe90 11

    5 February 2018 at 12:46 pm

    The GOP supported a sexual predator, Trump. an accused child sex offender, Moore, and now with a former head of American Nazi Party, white supremacist and Holocaust denier running unopposed as nominee for Congress, dollars to donuts Republicans will go for the threefer and vote for him.

    https://chicago.suntimes.com/news/holocaust-denier-arthur-jones-republican-3rd-congressional-district-lipinski-newman/#.Wnd7_R4X1CI.twitter
    • Puckish Rogue 11.1

      5 February 2018 at 2:43 pm

      Just for a bit of balance:

      http://www.newsweek.com/did-hillary-clinton-help-bill-clinton-intimidate-and-discredit-his-accusers-714636

      “Mr. Trump may have said some bad words, but Bill Clinton raped me, and Hillary Clinton threatened me,” Broaddrick added. “I don’t think there’s any comparison.”
      • tracey 11.1.1

        5 February 2018 at 4:41 pm

        Appalling behaviour which only makes me ask again…

        Why oh why didnt the Dems nominate bernie sanders
12. Draco T Bastard 12

    5 February 2018 at 1:39 pm

    Interesting Twitter thread by @BexGraham:

    What they don’t say though, is that part of the problem is that there are some very wealthy people who make a lot of money from ultra-processed products. These wealthy groups fund some very good lobbyists who actively oppose laws designed to reduce the impact these non-foods
    • Draco T Bastard 12.1

      5 February 2018 at 1:55 pm

      It’s how we get op-ed pieces in our major media publications extolling the virtues of individual choice & downplaying the role of obesegenic environments. These pieces work to drowning out the actual research and minimise long-term health implications on population groups
13. greywarshark 13

    5 February 2018 at 4:24 pm

    It has been a subject of conjecture for a long time – the secretive Freemasons, who must be a body of conservatives that have had antipathy to lefties over centuries and interested in protecting the status quo when it rewards them satisfactorily. A very solid union or group of self-protecting business or professional people.

    https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/feb/04/two-freemasons-lodges-operating-secretly-at-westminster

    The disclosure that both political journalists and politicians are Freemasons comes after the outgoing chair of the Police Federation alleged that Freemasons were blocking reforms in policing and thwarting the progress of women and officers from black and minority ethnic communities.

    After three years as the chair of the Police Federation, Steve White said: “I found that there were people who were fundamentally against any kind of change and any kind of progress, and they always happened to be Freemasons.”

    The charge brought an angry denial from the UGLE. In a letter to the press, Staples said: “We are quietly proud that throughout history, when people have suffered discrimination both in public and social life, Freemasonry has welcomed them into our lodges as equals.” He added that many Freemasons chose to keep their membership secret in order to avoid being discriminated against.

    This Mirror article below is interesting as it lists many famous men and has photo portraits of those who have been just names in history books.
    https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/how-secret-group-freemasons-kept-6886802
    • tracey 13.1

      5 February 2018 at 4:38 pm

      ” when people have suffered discrimination both in public and social life, Freemasonry has welcomed them into our lodges as equals.”

      Grey do you know when they began admitting women to their lodges?
      • greywarshark 13.1.1

        5 February 2018 at 8:11 pm

        Sorry tracey. I just saw that item about there being three different lodges in the Commons, I think. And then that other bit with the images but hadn’t got any further.

        Then I wondered about the possibility of them forming a defensive circle when one of their number got into trouble (I see that it didn’t help Oscar Wilde). I wondered about such cases as the CTV in Christchurch where inexplicably it seemed, that no fault could be found and no atonement ordered. Anne Perry who likes Victorian crime themes has written of a powerful elite group exerting authority called the Inner Circle in her books and shows them prepared to wreck people’s reputations if thwarted. Fiction, but I think she has delved into the times fairly thoroughly.

        Women were not allowed to be members till lately I think. There was supposed to be a group of blokes who were in good standing in the community, and who belonged to different work sectors and could keep secrets. As women were all, well women, what else to say about them, and everyone knew they couldn’t keep secrets, I think entry for the femmes would be fairly late in the piece.
        Better put sarc/ for protection.
      • greywarshark 13.1.2

        5 February 2018 at 8:29 pm

        tracey
        I think you saw something ironic in that quote hah!
14. Andre 14

    5 February 2018 at 4:45 pm

    Yeah. Finally the Eagles won the Superbowl. Can’t wait to hear what Adolf Twitler has to say about his buds Tom Brady and Bill Belichick being losers.
    • Ed 14.1

      5 February 2018 at 4:52 pm

      I am sure this information is interesting to many around the world.

      However you appear to be posting the information in the wrong place.

      This is New Zealand.
      This not a sports blog.
      • fender 14.1.1

        5 February 2018 at 5:26 pm

        Don’t be so rude.

        This is Open Mike, we even get veganism fanatics trying to convert others posting here!
        • Ed 14.1.1.1

          5 February 2018 at 5:29 pm

          Climate change is the number 1 political issue facing the world.
          Sports isn’t even a political issue.

          There is quite a difference.
          • fender 14.1.1.1.1

            5 February 2018 at 5:41 pm

            Oh OK Ed, I missed the announcement from LPrent that this is now Climate Mike.

            Obviously you haven’t a clue how obnoxious many of your comments are.
            • McFlock 14.1.1.1.1.1

              5 February 2018 at 5:45 pm

              yeah dude, sport isn’t political. Go “take a knee” while Ed arbitrates what other topics are worthy enough to discuss 😉
              • fender …

                5 February 2018 at 5:58 pm

                LOL
                • ropata …

                  6 February 2018 at 6:44 pm

                  “Adolf Twitler” 😂
    • joe90 14.2

      5 February 2018 at 4:54 pm

      Cracker fumble by wee Tommy.
      • Andre 14.2.1

        5 February 2018 at 5:21 pm

        Maybe if his diet included a bit more easily digestible protein, iron and B12, he might have been able to hang on to the ball.
        • Ed 14.2.1.1

          5 February 2018 at 5:31 pm

          This expert doctor disagrees with you.
          • One Anonymous Bloke 14.2.1.1.1

            6 February 2018 at 7:06 pm

            A vegan doctor believes a vegan diet is all good. In any other context you’d be decrying his “Big Pharma” conflict of interest.

            I suggest you watch the documentary “Alphago”.
15. greywarshark 15

    5 February 2018 at 4:50 pm

    I wonder if the inability to get satisfactory action against the engineers involved with the CTV building collapse and deaths of 115 people in the Christchurch earthquake in 2011 could be as a result of a cover-up by the ‘old boys club’.

    This article is very thorough and contains information on the CTV building that appears more solid than the structure itself for those who are interested in the background!
    https://failures.wikispaces.com/CTV+Building+Collapse+%E2%80%93+Christchurch+NZ+Earthquake

    The failures of proper procedure compound as time went on with this building. This is one paragraph about it.
    In 1990, major design defects were first brought to light. Holmes Consulting conducted a review of the existing structural system for a potential tenant looking to evaluate the safety of the building. They found that there was inadequate strength in the connection between the floor slab and shear walls, especially the walls at the north shear wall core. When alerted to the issue, Reay took 21 months to implement a fix. During the retrofit process, however, permit applications were never filled and the local building council was not alerted to the structural renovation that was being done. The lack of disclosure to the council prevented their involvement in the consultation and review process (Macfie, 2014).
    

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CTV_Building
    The Royal Commission of Inquiry heard evidence into why the CTV Building collapsed during the 2011 earthquake from 25 June 2012, and was scheduled to run for eight weeks.[35]

    Witnesses before the Commission debated whether the building was code-compliant when it was built, and whether the engineers designing and approving the building had adequate experience. Consulting firm head Alan Reay stated that the building did not meet his own standards, and he thought the engineer he employed for the design, David Harding, had adequate experience.[36] Harding had not designed buildings of more than two floors before. He said he relied on Reay for guidance, and that the developers wanted a minimum-cost design to (just) meet the code; no extra reinforcing was to be added or you “got your hand smacked”.[37]

    Witness Arthur O’Leary, a structural engineer, said that a “critical eye” should have been cast over the building design.[38] The “pioneering” structural design could have been beyond the experience of council staff to evaluate, though the “pioneering” design meant that non-compliant elements in the building columns were not obvious. Panel member Barry Davidson also disagreed with an “opportunistic and legalistic” interpretation of the code that found they were compliant.[39]

    The commission’s findings were released on 10 December 2012. The report found the building’s design was deficient and should not have been approved. The building’s engineer, David Harding, of Alan Reay Consultants Ltd, was found to have no experience in designing multi-storey buildings and was “working beyond his competence.” His supervisor, Alan Reay, left Harding unsupervised then pressured city officials to approve the building design even though several members had reservations about the design.[40]
    • Ed 15.1

      5 February 2018 at 4:53 pm

      We are a cowboy country without laws to protect us and without regulators with decent teeth
    • ropata 15.2

      6 February 2018 at 6:49 pm

      Alan Reay and his litigious arse should be nailed to the wall. http://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/news/9590396/Stigma-behind-CTV-firms-rebrand-father

      The police say that current law prevents them from prosecuting the designers after 1 year of the design being complete. Even the Consumer Guarantees Act is better than that.

      Lobby the new Govt to bring in restrospective legislation and stop the buck passing between designers/contractors/council/police. Fuck sometimes the NZ number 8 wire approach is shit.
16. Sparky 16

    5 February 2018 at 5:03 pm

    Add your voice to those opposed to the CP-TPP before its too late:

    https://our.actionstation.org.nz/petitions/open-letter-to-jacinda-ardern-put-people-before-planet-in-tppa11?bucket
17. Ed 17

    5 February 2018 at 5:24 pm

    Global economic crisis on its way.

    “Sharemarket declines in sympathy with US nerves.

    Underlying that is a deeper fear that dust swept under the carpet in an effort to tidy up the balance of sheets of financial institutions in the wake of the 2008 global financial crisis could resurface……

    …..Greene said the proportion of New Zealand shares that were foreign-owned had increased over the past few years, so if US investors did cash in equities and switch to bonds that might have more of an impact than it once would.”

    https://i.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/101171629/sharemarket-declines-in-sympathy-with-us-nerves
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/101064349/crash-warnings-intensify-heres-what-you-should-do-when-it-happens
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/world/100831022/it-is-frankly-scary-world-financial-system-as-stretched-as-before-2008-crash
18. eco maori 18

    6 February 2018 at 4:22 am

    Here is what trumps getting up to

    http://www.euronews.com/2018/02/03/how-the-us-plans-make-nuclear-weapons-easier-to-use

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