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Open mike 07/04/2014

Written By: - Date published: 6:40 am, April 7th, 2014 - 201 comments
Categories: open mike - Tags:

openmike Open mike is your post.

For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).

Step up to the mike …

201 comments on “Open mike 07/04/2014 ”

  1. Not a PS Staffer 1

    Paula Bennett was detained by Police this morning on her way Whenuapai Airport.
    She was threatening to bash two English tourists, surnames Windsor, who are unashamed benefit rorters.

    The one child family are know to claim millions in England and to live an extravagant lifestyle. Bennett was particularly enraged when she heard they would be claiming English benefit while on holiday and then claiming food, board and travel from NZ taxpayer. The Windsors are known to drink and watch flat screen TVs during the day.

    Unfortunately Bennett will be released when the spongers leave the country to do nothing somewhere else.

    • mickysavage 1.1


      It has been said of the Windsors that they are the best paid social welfare beneficiaries in the world …

      • Rodel 1.1.1

        Enjoyed Pagini’s disdain today for the ‘ God like’ Royals on Mora’s afternoon programme. His obvious discomfort with her disrespect. I wonder if her contract will be terminated.

        A change from the obsequious fawning servility of the common media fearing for their jobs.

    • bad12 1.2

      Unfortunately for the Woyals the weather in Wellington is dismal with fog/cloud down to sea level and there is a chance that they could be forced to land at Palmerston North…

      • wyndham 1.2.1

        No! No! Anywhere but Palmerston North !

      • Tracey 1.2.2

        I wonder if johnny will make his car go really fast to get there in time?

        • The Lone Haranguer

          He can ring Helen for instructions on how to get the driver to speed while not noticing. Only other option would be to get Lundy to drive

        • Tracey

          no, surely he would never drive too fast, that would be too heinous

        • Rodel

          betcha he manages to get a photo op of him holding george or at least trying to get a handshake on or near him…betcha

          • Clemgeopin

            A four way handshake with Key, William, Kate and George with a special lovely little Troty present for Key from George. Will help Key get some more votes for inviting them in an election year. How cool is that!

    • One Anonymous Bloke 1.3

      A gilded cage is a cage nonetheless. The only compassionate response is to offer them asylum.

      • bad12 1.3.1

        It just so happens that i have a good used asylum going cheap,the Woyals could spend years enjoying the comforts of its cells and straightjackets having spent years roll playing doing the doctors and nurses thing should come quite naturally to them…

      • Jenny 1.3.2

        Noticeably absent from our airwaves during this royal tour is the modern international youth anthem “We will never be Royals” by Lorde.

        Instead of glorifying privilege, Lorde held up a light up to the nobility of those without money or privilege. But this not a message that John Key and his born to rule tories want us to hear in an election year, hence the need for this extravagant tax payer funded glittering royal tour. Where the modern kiwi MSM continue to grovel and tug its forelock in the traditional peasant way at this symbolic embodiment of enshrined privilege and inequality.

        But that kind of love affair ain’t for us, we seek a different kind of buzz

    • Awww 1.4

      loling at your comment.

      But, seriously….I’m excited about the royals! Is nobody else feeling it?? They are the most level headed/sane of all of the bunch and they are gonna love it here : )

      • bad12 1.4.1

        Are you sure you are not confusing ‘level headed’ with this pairs ability to adhere to the old adage ”better to keep the mouth firmly shut and be thought of as idiots than open it and provide proof”…

      • Rosie 1.4.2

        “But, seriously….I’m excited about the royals! Is nobody else feeling it??”

        No Awww. I’m about as indifferent as that weather that bad12 is describing for Wellington today. Besides I descend from Irish and Scots, so the representatives of the English Crown are nothing to get excited about The only excitement they ever got in the past was fighting them.

        The flat screen that Not a PS Staffer talks of though, may well be in their itinerary. During a tour of Government house we were informed by the tour guide that previously Wills had enjoyed being entertained in the whatever- it -was -called -room where there IS a large flat screen attached to a wall above a gas fire as well as billiard table and drinks cabinet. I think he was watching the world cup. I wasn’t really listening – I was more interested contemplating the future of the NZ wool industry having being inspired by the ultra plush carpet, made in Christchurch by Di Lana.

      • Tracey 1.4.3

        I don’t understand what you are looking forward to? Couldn’t you just read about them and others who make a career out of being themselves in the screeds of shallow magazines?

      • The Lone Haranguer 1.4.4

        What, is there a royal tour this year? Who won the “holiday in Enzed” this time?

        • Akldnut

          I want to know how many contenders played Paper, Sissors, Rock – we know who lost.

    • Rosie 1.5

      Lols Not a PS Staffer 🙂

    • Tracey 1.6

      and they can afford to travel overseas. Have they stopped receiving income while overseas?

    • Wyndham, George 1.7

      This is how to shut down the whole Royal nonsense .
      In the 1930 the Irish Free State had not yet become a republic. DeValera won the 1932 election and when he had to appoint a new DG he appointed a shop keeper who remained behind his store counter!

      “De Valera explicitly instructed Ua Buachalla as governor-general to keep a low public profile, and not to fulfil any public engagements. This was part of de Valera’s policy to make the governor-generalship an irrelevance by reducing it to invisibility. While he continued to give the Royal Assent to legislation, summon and dissolve Dáil Éireann and fulfil the other formal duties of the governor-generalship, he declined all public invitations and kept himself invisible, as advised by “his” Government. In fact in his period in office he performed only one public function: the receipt of the credentials of the French Ambassador in the Council Chamber, Government Buildings, 1933, on behalf of the King, George V. However, de Valera subsequently had that duty moved from the governor-general to his own post of President of the Executive Council. (One of the few other occasions Ua Buachalla was mentioned at all in public was when, in the aftermath of the death of King George V in January 1936, he had to reply to messages of condolence sent to the Irish people by United States President Franklin D. Roosevelt and the United States Secretary of State Cordell Hull.)

      On de Valera’s instruction, Ua Buachalla did not reside in the official residence of the governor-general, the Viceregal Lodge (now called Áras an Uachtaráin, the residence of the President of Ireland). Instead a house was rented for his use. The official English title Governor-General was largely replaced by the official Irish title Seanascal or its direct translation, Seneschal; however, Governor-General remained the legal form used in official English-language documents and proclamations.” Wiki.

  2. Jenny 2

    A natural disaster will not occur as a result of deep sea oil and gas exploration: Govt.


    (Since an oil spill would not be a natural disaster, giving an assurance that a natural disaster won’t occur due to deep sea oil and gas drilling is a pretty meaningless statement.) That climate change resulting from chasing down every last possible and remote and difficult and risky source of oil would also be a disaster makes the above statement doubly ridiculous.

    Simon Bridges the government minister for energy says he is more than 100 percent confident that that oil would not spill onto New Zealand beaches.

    Speaking on TV One’s Q+A programme this morning, the Energy and Resources Minister said he was “confident” oil would not spill on to New Zealand beaches.

    Asked if he was 90 per cent or 100 per cent confident, he said: “Well, I’m more than that.”

    NZ Herald April 6, 2014

    So how confident is the minister that oil won’t spill on our beaches?

    101 percent?

    200 percent?

    110 percent?

    What on earth does this mean anyway?

    In other idiocy Simon Bridges said:

    “If you look at the permitting process, this is a two-way street – in one way, yes, we need those companies to come here, we want them to spend their money on that, but remember when they do come, when they do put in their application, they must be at best practice, we assess their financial capability, their technical capability and their experience, and if they’re not good enough in New Zealand’s interests they don’t make the cut.”

    “They don’t make the cut”, really Minister?

    Did even one of the companies that put in an application, have their application declined, did even one, “not make the cut”?

    My guess is that every single company that applied got approval, which if true would prove that every single utterance that passes this minister’s lips is pure gooblygook meant to mislead and confuse.

    • North 2.1

      Pleasingly little ex-Crown prosecutor Simon is looking somewhat harried and tired. Unpleasingly that will probably go only to exponentially advancing his hubris and bullshit. Watch ShonKey Python’s recently anointed Minister of Pacific Island Affairs Sam Lotu-Iiga for a simiar effect. Such biddable wee bullshitters and trough-guzzlers.

    • Tracey 2.2

      it’s this Anadarko Bridges defends, right?

      “Top toxic sites in Anadarko Petroleum settlement

      The Associated Press

      Top toxic sites among thousands that are part of the $5.15 billion settlement with Anadarko Petroleum Corp. with approximate amount of funding for cleanup efforts and details about the sites, as provided by the Justice Department:

      —Henderson, Nev.: $1.118 billion for prospective cleanup costs.

      Groundwater at a former chemical manufacturing facility in Henderson, Nev., has been impacted by hexavalent chromium and perchlorate, a chemical used to produce rocket fuel, due to the since the 1940s.

      —Navajo Abandoned Uranium Mines: $985 million for prospective cleanup costs.

      Kerr-McGee left abandoned uranium mine sites, including contaminated waste rock piles, in the Lukachukai mountains of Arizona and in the Ambrosia Lake area of New Mexico. The Lukachukai mountains are located immediately west of Cove, Ariz., and are a culturally significant part of the Navajo Nation; the Ambrosia Lake area is just outside the Navajo Nation. The mining occurred from the late 1940s through the 1960s in the Lukachukai area and from the 1950s to the 1980s in Ambrosia Lake.

      —Manville, N.J.: $217 million for past response costs; $4.5 million in natural resource damage penalties to be paid to New Jersey as natural resources trustee.

      The proceeds the Environmental Protection Agency will receive for this site cover EPA’s past costs expended at the site. While they will not address ongoing threats to human health and the environment, they will reimburse the significant response costs EPA spent at the site out of the Superfund. From 1910 until the mid-1950s, the site was used as a wood treatment facility, which occupied approximately 50 acres in the Borough of Manville.

      —Riley Pass, S.D.: $179 million for prospective work.

      The site is located in the North Cave Hills area of Harding County, S.D., primarily on a series of bluffs within the Custer National Forest where strip mining of uranium-bearing lignite took place in the 1960s.

      —Chicago (Lindsay Light Removal Sites, Streeterville Rights-of-Way and DuSable Park): $119 million for prospective work.

      Beginning in 1904 and continuing through the mid-1930s, the Lindsay Light Chemical Co. processed ore to extract radioactive thorium and manufactured gas mantles containing radioactive thorium at three locations in an area in downtown Chicago known as the “Streeterville Area.” Lindsay Light merged with American Potash & Chemical Corp., which was acquired by Kerr-McGee.

      —Columbus, Miss.: $67 million for prospective work.

      The site is a former wood treatment facility, which began operations in 1928. Kerr-McGee purchased the facility in 1964 and operated it until its decommissioning in 2003. At the facility, wood products were treated with creosote, coal tar, and, until 1976, pentachlorphenol. Open ditches were used by Kerr-McGee for years to transport surface water runoff from the site to Luxapilila Creek. Numerous floods throughout the years spread the creosote contamination and polyaromatic hydrocarbons into the neighboring yards of residents.

      Read more here: http://www.miamiherald.com/2014/04/03/4037611/top-toxic-sites-in-anadarko-petroleum.html#storylink=cpy

      • greywarbler 2.2.1

        A very telling set of incidents Tracey which are not often told. Now are we to be for whom the bell tolls?

  3. North 3

    With the arrival today of the Duke and Duchess of Cambridge batten down the hatches for days and days of terminally obseqious yet sly arse-licking from soon-to-be Sir ShonKey Python of Grossbee-Texter-Upon-Knees.

    A display to trump the gold standard in the same set by Rowan Atkinson’s Sir Edmund Blackadder in the court of a royal personage past. Madness marries Merill Lynch.

    No offence intended to a calculatedly vaunted sweet couple, fabulously privileged and mercifully immune from the sociopathy of Hurrah Henry Cameron and ATOS.

    • Rosie 3.1

      Lols at you too North:-)

    • The Lone Haranguer 3.2

      A royal tour with Sir Edmund Blackadder as the guest of honour would surely restore our love for the monarchy

      King Edmund of New Zild, has a nice ring to it

    • Tracey 3.3

      or Rowan Atkinson’s Marcus Browning, MP

      You need to listen to the audio to get the best impact. For some reason I am put in mind of Dunne.

      Listen here

      Sir Marcus Browning MP

      Announcer: Welcome to your seats, ladies and gentlemen. I hope you enjoyed the buffet dinner, but even if you didn’t, I know you’ll enjoy our guest speaker tonight who’s taken time off from his rigorous parliamentary schedule to be with us. We are very honored to welcome Sir Marcus Browning MP. Thank you.

      Sir Marcus Browning: My Lord Mayor, my Lady Mayoress. My lords, ladies and gentlemen. There comes a time when we must all stand up and be counted. I am therefore standing up now and can be counted. One. To each of you I say you are a one. And ones are about to become singularly important. Because Britain is facing the gravest economic crisis since 1380. And you know many of us still remember that day. The eternal torment, worry, exesperation and all manner of (?). And if we are to quit the lights go out on our lives once more (?), we must ask ourselves crucial questions. Where are we? How did we get here? Why did we come? Where do we want to go? How do we want to get to where we want to go? How far do we have to go before we get to where we want to be? How would we know where we were when we got there? HAVE WE GOT A MAP? Why did we leave places to get to where we are? Where were we before that we had to leave to get to where we before we knew we’re going to go to where we want to be? Where would we end up if we had the choice? Where would we end up if we didn’t have the choice? What would we choose given the choice? Do we have that choice to choose? Or indeed can we be choosy about the choice choosings? What are the choosings? Choices! Do we want to stop now? (Rhetorical.) Or do we want to go right back to the beginning and start all over again. Perhaps not. But surely you can see my point. Because what I’m talking about is life. Because life is one of those things that most of us find it very difficult to avoid. In the words of (?) “life is uncertain.” My life certainly has a certain uncertainty about it. And I’m certain yours does too. So with my uncertainty and your uncertainty there’s certainly a certain degree of uncertainty about, of that we can be quite sure. So let’s buckle down, shall we? Purpose is what we’re striving for. We must have purpose. We mustn’t be purposeless. We mustn’s exhibit purposnessless. We must be purposelessnessless. Because we don’t want to end up, do we? Because we don’t want to end up, do we? Like the blind man in the dark room looking for the black cat that isn’t there.


      • greywarbler 3.3.1

        You would be a fan of How to Win an election or not lose by very much by lesley bricusse and co. I should think. And what I always say….

  4. tricledrown 4

    How come simon bridges is 100%+ sure.
    I can tell you the wheels have fallen off Nactionals drill it mine it at any cost policy.
    Its dead in the water gone along with Anadarko no reoverable amounts of oil or gas have been found.
    So bridges is desperate by expanding the exploration area is trying to rescue a Failed policy.

    • Jenny 4.1

      tricledrown. I had forgotten how closely Simon Bridges words resemble the “Newspeak” of George Orwell’s novel.

      Doubleplus good, for reminding me.

    • Tracey 4.2

      did you ctch the 6 billion payout anadarko is having to make for its fucking up of the environment in the US since about 1930? I would say they probably consider it money well spent…

      • nadis 4.2.1

        Not a very good example given Anardarko was started in 1959 and only started activities outside of Texas in 1986. All those examples you listed earlier are historic superfund sites that Anardarko inherited through acquisitions. Your story is really more that “Anardarko owns sites they didn’t pollute in the first place, Anardarko pays to have the sites cleaned up under EPA settlement”. It ‘s likely that when Anardarko acquired a lot of these sites, they didn’t know the full potential liability. Interesting link here which kind of summarises how this generally works:


        The real issue for allowing any entity foreign owned or not – to do anything in NZ is to have protections in place so they can’t pull a Union Carbide (or a Kerr-McGee from the above link) if something goes wrong. That’s where I think we need to be really careful. Anardarko is actually recognised as a pretty good corporate citizen – of course that may be relative praise rather than absolute.

      • greywarbler 4.2.2

        It might have been an amount set for them to pay but now comes the extracting of the money, well, well, well that won’t be so simple – lot’s of delaying tactics will be resorted to. And probably some time meeting at resorts too.

        And don’t be too nitpicky nadis. Andarko may not have owned them once, but now has them in its portfolio. The point is that An-ko is just a name and other firms doing their damage are just like Andarko and vice versa. The nature of the operation is destructive whatever company does it.

  5. dv 5

    i think he goes to the same speech coach as parata.

  6. Halfcrown 6

    The only comment I would like to make about the visit by the Windsors is this. I understood a constitutional monarch was not allowed to get involved in politics. Black Rod and all that medieval crap. Why is it then they are opening the controversial Velodrome in Cambridge hosted by Wardell (he will get a knighthood for playing at life) where 80% of the ratepayers were against having rate payers money used to fund it, but the regional council aided and abetted by Keys pack of shits ignored what the ratepayers said and went ahead with it.
    I think this sets a precedent, the Royals are being used politically by Key during an election year.

    • srylands 6.1

      I assume “Keys pack of shits” = the New Zealand Government.

      Just checking.

      How are they being used politically? There are no conventions in New Zealand about royal visits in election year. Visits in 1981 and 2002 were both within 6 months of the elections in those years.

      In 2002, the Queen visited Team New Zealand. Many on the Left and the Right had opposed funding for the Americas Cup. Was that the “royals being used politically” by the then Labour Government? No, of course not.

      So stop drawing a long bow. Nobody cares much. Just enjoy Kate and the baby. It will take the bitter taste out of your mouth for a while. Maybe you can even enjoy life during the royal tour.

      • One Anonymous Bloke 6.1.1

        As ignorant of this topic as you are of real world economics, S Rylands.

        In 2011 Prince William didn’t come to the Rugby World Cup because it was too close to the last election and while the Queen was in Australia that year she decided against crossing the Tasman.

        • Pete George

          The Rugby World Cup was much closer to the election than this tour is to this year’s election.

          The cup final was on October 23rd. The election was just over a month later on 26 November.

          This royal tour is over four months from the upcoming election.

          • felix

            Where are you drawing the line, Pete?

            4 months? 3 months? 6 weeks?

            • Pete George

              I’m not drawing a line. I don’t care about the royal tour and I don’t see any reason why it should affect the election this year. Much fuss about something irrelevant to modern New Zealand.

              • Tracey


                on this and the polls i think your are being very naive. of course journalists know they are cherrypicking polls, as do their editors.

                you need to read more psychology and less politics to understand impact of winning rugby teams, royal visits and so on.

                • felix

                  But Petey thinks the All Blacks have nothing to do with politics.

                  That must be why John Key doesn’t bother trying to associate himself with them, eh?

                  • Clemgeopin

                    Key’s only interest in the Rugby World Cup was to touch the troty and do a three way handshake to make Nuzlind, and indeed the world, happy.

              • felix

                So you mean there is no time that would be too close to an election in your book?

                If so then why compare the four months to the one month?

          • Mary

            Pete you should write for The Civilian. In fact whenever I see anything of yours longer than three lines I start thinking I am reading The Civilian. I particularly like this one although you can pretty much take your pick:

            Bugger the polls!

      • bad12 6.1.2

        i assume such a ‘pack’ includes you SSLands…

        • One Anonymous Bloke

          Nah, S Rylands is unelectable. He does his politics on the job.

          • bad12

            True OAB, i was meaning more the inclusion in the ‘pack of shits’ for SSLands as 99% of what It writes here at the Standard is full of it…

      • idlegus 6.1.3

        check the front cover of the womens weekly, mr & mrs key holding fluffy puppies (!!!) with the headline ‘john & bronaghs royal surprise’ & tell me again how this whole tour is not a publicity stunt for john key/national party.

        (how can i ‘enjoy kate & the baby’ ‘enjoy?’ what a weird word in that context. celebrity culture, P.R, idiots gettting sucked in. i could not give a fuk about the royals, but i do give a fuk about the news being hijacked by this BS.)

        • MaxFletcher

          “tell me again how this whole tour is not a publicity stunt for john key/national party.”

          Are you suggesting the royals are actively supporting John Key and National? That’s a long bow you are drawing.

          • idlegus

            id say it was the other way round. but i cannot think why else a royal celebrity would PR for NZ in an election year.

            ‘long bow’ … i love how our language is peppered with so many phrases from our history.

        • ffloyd

          @idlegus. Thought you were kidding about magazine cover until I went to buy the Woman’s Day and there they were!! That man has no class at all. What was the surprise? Was it a copy of steffi’s attempt at art of which mom and pop were so proud. Oh, and no, I did not buy the magazine, nor will I be in the near future, unless of course if it is featuring our new Prime Minister David Cunliffe.

    • Tracey 6.2

      Labour has never been averse to the royal effect. Although Clark did break protocol and wear slacks to a dinner with the queen…

      I hope Johnny is wearing incontinent pants when he meets them today, he will be so excited, they’r e like family to him.

    • Anne 6.3

      I think this sets a precedent, the Royals are being used politically by Key during an election year.

      We knew that from the day it was announced they were coming.

      I was amused a few days ago to hear that John and Bronagh invited them to a “home cooked dinner” at their home but the D&D (very wisely) turned them down on the grounds “they wanted to get back to George in Wellington”. Can you imagine how he would have milked that little tete a tete for all it was worth. Fancy having the gall in election year to even issue the invitation.

      • Tracey 6.3.1

        is this the dinner key is cooking for John Campbell? After shopping at the market? Is that the Parnell market and la cigale or the Otara market?

        I cringe whoever does it, Cunliffe, Hairdo anyone.

        They say they dont want their private life as part of public scrutiny… unless it suits them…

        IF politicians want to paint themsleves in a particulaar light through their private life then all bets are off imo. Children using class A drugs should be able to be written about. If going tot he market and letting cameras watch them cook dinner at home is ok, when it paints them as family and homely etc… then why not scrutinise their parenting via drugs and rinking transgressions of their kids?

      • Jenny 6.3.2

        Sycophancy to your betters and stepping on those below you, is all part of the National Party tory born to rule class culture that they are trying to stamp on the rest of us.

        The sooner these agents of privilege and wealth leave our shores the better.

      • Clemgeopin 6.3.3

        I am surprised that Key didn’t invite the queen for a game of golf.

        (Or at least planking!)

      • North 6.3.4

        That wouldn’t be (Pete) George would it ? Wow Pete, you’re connected my bro’ ! Use that one well ya could probably squeeze a reasonable list placement outa ShonKey Python himself.

        Nah, Wills and Kate couldn’t handle the prospect of a menu jam packed with the host’s ‘mince’ and “Georgie Pie tickle tickle tickle say hello to uncle”. Kid spews on that shit I’m told.

        Seemingly though the final straw was the spot of preprandial tennis ShonKey planned for out the back at facsimile Gushing Meadows.

    • bad12 6.4

      i havn’t got the link, but, someone on ‘open Mike’ as late as last week provided a link that showed far from the common perception the Queen does have power of veto over the English Parliament,

      This power of veto has apparently been used numerous times, Yay for the good of society we all might think as the descendant of an Irish Piss Pot emptier refused to allow Legislation that would hurt the masses,

      Hardly, it seems the only Legislated that attracts the Woyal veto is that which threatens the income stream of the Bludgers…

      • nadis 6.4.1

        The queens power of veto (as wielded by the governer general) was used in Australia in 1975 when the Whitlam Labour government was dissolved.

        • bad12

          True, i must have a little look to see if She that wears the Crown and warms the seat had an actual involvement…

          • bad12

            It appears that Her Maj was not consulted about the intentions of the Australian Governor General to dismiss the Whitlam Government, although appears may change in time as Government documents of a secretive nature become less secretive,

            The claim is that after the ‘dismissal’ both Whitlam and the Australian Speaker of the House at the time contacted Buckingham Palace and were told the Queen would not intervene,(which begs the question why have a Queens representative if She will never either agree or disagree with such actions),


            John Kerr, the Governor General who dismissed the Whitlam Government was on 30 March 1977 awarded the Knights Grand Cross an award only able to be bestowed by Her Maj, so She was obviously not displeased,


            • nadis

              The constitutional arrangement is that the Queen doesnt intervene ever even though technically she is head of state. From memory the Whitlam situation was pretty cut and dried – his government could not pass matters of supply as they didn’t have a majority, and Whitlam being a complete cock refused to negotiate with any of the opposition. So the govt was dissolved. At the time I’m not sure anyone except his hard core supporters were offended. Wonnder what would have happened if he had continued to be recalcitrant. Trespass order banning him from parliament??

              • Not a PS Staffer

                I attended a conference in Australia many years ago at which Whitlam spoke…and spoke and spoke. He came across to me as a self obsessed bore with very little social sensitivity. He argued at length that the behaviour of Australians towards Aborigines was evidence that Australians were not racist. An arse.

  7. ffloyd 7

    Simon bridges is one of the few people who looks and sounds crap on Tv AND Radio.in fact he sounds worse on radio than he looks on TV.

    • Tracey 7.1

      he sounds like john key

    • Enough is Enough 7.2

      They are talking about him as a future National leader.

      Shit they are desperate.

      He is even more of a lightweight than the fool they have in charge now. Will they ever learn what turns off New Zealanders.

      Smug, rich aresholes.

      • The Lone Haranguer 7.2.1

        I would suspect thats hes already cooked his leadership goose. And as Mrs Collins doesnt have good long term prospects either, its either Jonny B Good staying on longer, or you get Steve Joyce.

        And as the leader of the Nats is quite likely to also be the PM, who would you choose?

  8. Chooky 8

    Kim Dotcom to speak at Mana AGM….looking GOOD for Mana and Kim Dotcom !


    • Populuxe1 8.1

      No it doesn’t. MANA was pretty unequivocal in rejecting an alliance last time. Gareth Morgan is also speaking at the AGM – don’t think he’s wanting to start a party. In any case I really can’t see MANA wanting to associate itself with a leering charicature of every egocentric arrogant rich prick capitalist ever. He’s basically just a larger version of John Key with more criminal convictions and less restraint.

      • bad12 8.1.1

        Gareth might be looking for a political vehicle to promote His UBI theme, i can well imagine He could become a major donor to the Mana Party should they begin to openly campaign for such a major change to Welfare/Tax policy in New Zealand,

        i would say the Mana/internet alliance is far from dead in the water, should DotCom cede welfare/housing/employment policy to Mana while Mana does the same adopting the Internet Parties internet policies then we have the foundations of a workable alliance of the two,

        It then becomes a negotiation over how much resources DotCom and/or the Internet Party are willing to commit to such a Mana/Internet alliance and just as important WHEN,

        Along with this will be the possibly more fraught negotiation over the divvying up of any electoral spoils after the election and just who the Internet Candidates who might enter the Parliament will be, as i doubt that the rules would allow both Mana and Internet to campaign as separate entities during the election and then combine their votes after the count,this will be the tough part of any negotiation,

        I would suggest that Mana approach this part of the negotiation on a 2 to 1, 2 to 1 basis so that the first 2 seats would go to Mana the next one to the Internet Party and so on, so with four seats if that were the possible gain from this alliance Mana would have 3 seats and Internet 1 in the next Parliament,

        Such an outcome would be one that i am very likely to vote for…

        • Populuxe1

          You only have a workable alliance of the two if MANA is going to completely chuck out the ideologies and values they are telling the voters they represent. I don’t have a problem with Labour doing that sort of thing because the shine came off their apple a long time ago and we urgently need rid of the Nats. MANA would look like they are cosying up to their token amoral capitalist cartoon for power over values, and that is entrely contrary to how they want to position themselves in the public view.

          • bad12

            Thats a ridiculous statement PoP’s and deserves no other answer than Ha–Ha,what a load…

            • Populuxe1

              Are you saying that Dotcom isn’t a cliche stereotype of the egocentric amoral capitalist?

              • bad12

                Nah, i am saying what a load, nothing unusual as far as what you produce goes tho…

                • Populuxe1

                  Sill me – I forgot I was dealing with a purile little creep

                  • bad12

                    Yes i understand your loathing having to deal with yourself on a daily basis must be a real struggle…

        • nadis

          If mana had any self respect and internal consistency they should tell Dotcom we’ll do a policy deal but your guys come way down the list, like 10 at best. Do we really want individuals handpicked by Dotcom for their compliancy (to him) to potentially go into parliament. Lets not lose sight of the fact that the Dotcom party is a single issue party and that single issue is deportation.

          Mind you #3 on the mana list is a low probability slot anyway.

          • felix

            I agree, I don’t see why a shallow flashy international multimillionaire with only a superficial connection to NZ should get to hand-pick mps based on their compliancy to him.

            But that’s the National Party List for you, eh?

      • Chooky 8.1.2

        Pop you are too too old!!!!..in fact methinks you could be fossilised

        …I like the look of Hone and Kim( look like the Blues Brothers)….almost tempted to VOTE for HONEY’SKIM

        ….but us CHOOKS love our greens……however the teenage son will be voting for them.

      • felix 8.1.3

        Populuxe1: “He’s basically just a larger version of John Key with more criminal convictions and less restraint.”

        Ha, exactly right. As others have noted, if Key hadn’t ruined Dotcom’s life, he would’ve been Key’s biggest, most public, and richest supporter.

        • MaxFletcher

          “Ha, exactly right. As others have noted, if Key hadn’t ruined Dotcom’s life, he would’ve been Key’s biggest, most public, and richest supporter.”

          That wouldn’t have surprised me in the slightest

        • Tracey


      • northshoreguynz 8.1.4

        I’m getting a subtext here that its not ok for someone who has money to have any socialist leanings.
        So following that line of thought David Cunliffe shouldn’t be in the Labour Party. So the Nats were right all along./sarc

        • Tracey

          Can you point to examples of DotCom’s socialist leanings?

            • felix

              Examples please.

              I just played it and I didn’t hear anything that suggests he’s particularly socialist. Certainly no more socialist than any ordinary kiwi.

              • Tracey

                certainly no more socialist than national.

                i think dotcom mistakenly thought banks was a libertarian.

              • Bill

                “Do you believe in a welfare state?
                yes. definitely.
                Should a health system be free?
                Should the rich pay a higher tax rate?

                Given that the questions were from a left social democratic framework, then sure, not socialist. But a very long way away from unadulterated right wing tosh or even the pap fed us via mainstream media.

                Yes, he prefers deregulation and decriminalisation of cannabis, with the former being arguably a right wing perspective and the latter…well, both a left and right perspective.

                • felix

                  “But a very long way away from unadulterated right wing tosh or even the pap fed us via mainstream media.”

                  There’s a distinction between the pap and the tosh?

                  • Bill

                    Mostly just the sources I was meaning to refer to felix 😉 The mainstream pap might not be as extreme as right wing tosh, but from my perspective, the difference is kinda irrelevant…they are on the same (to me, unacceptable) area of the traditional political spectrum.

                • Rodel

                  And you actually believed .com was telling the truth? Or that any politician does? Naive.

                  • Bill

                    Well Rodel. Obviously I was only listening to what he said. And since people were asking what it was that he said that indicated ‘leftness’…

            • Tracey

              perhaps you misused socialist in your first comment.

              he did say he thinks the rich should pay more tax but he also said the ip is for the “tax savy”.

              he believes in welfare.

              mostly he believes in nz having a data and internet industry within which he can be an entrepreneur.

              i agree with someone else, dotcom is mostly libertarianz and kim dotcomz

        • Populuxe1

          I’m waiting for you to explain what Dotcom’s “socialist leanings” might be – Not respecting IP sounds more libertarian to me.

        • Chooky

          the Queen HRH Elisabeth II is a Socialist, she lives very frugally and she hated Margaret Thatcher….. and her son Charles is a Greenie…not sure about the Duke though…he is a stirrer so he could be a Winnie type or a Trotskyite or a UFO expert ( say no more ) …under cover of course

          really darhls !…money is such a burden …and having to be on your best behaviour ALL the time!!!!!….what a pain…no swearing in public ….no saying “sod off you bloody FUCKWIT”…no farting in public or picking your nose and …… it……and having to be polite about the IRA when they blew up your favourite uncle….no toe sucking at the beach, even if it is discreet …..or naughty conversations to your lover over the telephone…because the GCSB is sure to be watching with field glasses and listening in!!!!….but worst of all you may find your self on the front page of one of those scurrilous, disgusting rags that goes for British newspapers…

          poor bastards….i feel sorry for them…..they earn their money as PR agents for the Realm and a certain order of ‘civilisation’ imo


    • Jenny 8.2

      The MSM headlines next weekend will predictably be dominated with the boring going ons of the gilded royal couple, with some mention of the Mana conference on the inside pages. But just as sure as the odious grovelling of the MSM will be dominated by news of the royals, the alternative and social media will be white hot with the goings on at the Mana conference.

      Asset sales and the TPPA and even deep sea oil drilling may not have mobilised the young as they may have past generations. But internet use is central to their lives. A freerer, cheaper, faster internet, with less government interference, surveillance and spying, and with whatever other youth friendly policy concessions for the low paid that Mana will wring out of Dotcom, I imagine it could be quite a heady mix. Especially if backed up with Dotcom’s money and Mana’s activists.

      • Tiger Mountain 8.2.1

        And for those whinging about lack of TIP policy–there is some on their website https://internet.org.nz–that looks pretty good compared to what the Key gang was originally elected on; a a few meagre A4 sheets of ‘bullet points’, barely a “policy” as we know it to be found. Thats how Crosby Textor and the Hollowmen operate.

        Mana has already bumped TIP off supporting National, Te Mana Movement has had more publicity in the last month than the previous year. Mana members have even more reason to want to put the choker chain on the GCSB/SIS/Cops special ops etc than Kim does. And would support removing NZ from 5 eyes.

        Hone has also spoken to some of the hard left in Mana about this initiative and a common position is a “sure talk, take it to the members, but no compromise on the social policies”. Sue Bradford may become an outlier on this one, and no disrespect to her being the only standard bearer for beneficiaries for years in parliament, but she is a leaver of organisations. She often leaves a group and then sets up a new one with her loyal coterie from People Centre days. Currently AAAP.
        At the end of the day Mana members will determine this and it might not be via some kind of formal vote at Rotorua, may take a bit longer.

        Gareth Morgan will also be at the Mana Rotorua conference and supports a form of UBI (though originator Keith Rankin imo seems to retreat further and obfuscate as time goes on http://thedailyblog.co.nz/2014/04/04/universal-basic-income/) and taxing the rich. Hone has no problem talking to rich white guys without wanting to become one.

        • Jenny

          “Gareth Morgan will also be at the Mana Rotorua conference and supports a form of UBI”
          Tiger Mountain

          Gareth Morgan is also a noted advocate on promoting climate change issues, and I believe there is some policy motions to be voted on around climate change at this conference.

          It is quite possible that Mana could steal the ground from under the Green Party on this issue as the Greens in line with the other mainstream parliamentary parties seem determined to do a repeat of their strategy at the last election, and play down climate change.


          “The snake has swallowed the elephant in the room…..” election 2011

          You know what really strikes me about climate change in the election? It’s the absence. It is as if climate change is nearly completely absent from the campaign. When climate change does pop up, it’s portrayed in simplistic soundbites.
          The Greens say anthropogenic climate change is real and we have a detailed wonk-friendly exposition on our website, but for this election we are running with “jobs, kids, rivers”

          And in this election as well….


          No explicit talk of cutting back emissions, or stopping new coal mines, or deep sea oil.

          Though fracking is mentioned this is all mute as the Green Party say they will have no bottom lines in their quest for cabinet positions.

          In contrast to this, a motion to be voted at the Mana conference, and coming with the recommendation of the leadership, is that Mana will not seek to go into coalition with the Labour Party, leaving the Mana MPs free to push their issues and not bound by Labour’s majority in cabinet forcing them to go along with every issue that government imposes.

          • Tracey

            Hopefully Gareth can convince Dotcom to build a wind and solar farm to power a server farm in NZ…

        • idlegus

          tiger mountain yes!!! & what bad12 said above, its makes sense that mana keep all the social & housing issues, & the internet party have some incredible & NEW ideas about the internet. & if anyone would cozy up to some rich guy & not get compromised imo it would be ppl like hone & annette sykes. i hope they go for it.

        • weka

          Odd broken link there Tiger. Try this https://internet.org.nz/mission On the face of it, given they’re a brand new party, the policy looks interesting.

          “Hone has no problem talking to rich white guys without wanting to become one.”

          A crucial point.

    • Mary 8.3

      Here’s their new logo: http://www.mana.com/

    • Enough is Enough 8.4

      Why the fuck would you want a progressive party to join forces with Dotcom.

      Who is more important to the party, activists like Sue Bradford, or an overweight foreign capitalist thug??

  9. Tracey 9

    Bear in mind who will be leading TVNZ’s election coverage this year and read and weep.

    It’s less about bias than the awful combination of ego and lack of intelligence.

    Generation Zero has given permission for their article to be reposted everywhere.

    Is Mike Hosking the smartest man alive?
    Apr 3, 2014 // by Jimmy Green // Uncategorized // No Comments

    Did you see Seven Sharp on Tuesday?

    Presenter Mike Hosking made a revolutionary announcement – that he doesn’t believe in science, and you shouldn’t either.

    You can see it here – at 22:46

    Referencing the recent IPCC report that outlines the current state of climate science, he said,

    “That’s of course, if you believe them, which as it turns out I don’t.”

    Mike went on to lay out his counter-argument, in an admirably bold attempt to overturn the entire global 20 year scientific consensus,

    “I mean if Metservice struggles with the accuracy of a 5-day forecast I’m thinking a long range prediction that takes in 86 years might be a bit dodgy.”

    What Mike apparently doesn’t know is that, believe it or not, short term weather forecasting and climate change science are two totally different things. People get this wrong a lot – check out these guys trying to dispel the myth using the powerful force of British humour! Scientifically, there’s as much certainty that humans are the main thing causing climate change as there is that smoking causes cancer. If a journalist just decided they didn’t believe that and told the people of New Zealand to go out and smoke to their hearts content, they’d probably get fired.”

    Full story is here


    remember herald columnist Rodney Hide also thinks weather is the same as climate.

    • srylands 9.1

      Wow we agree on something. Yes it was fuckwited and shameful. We should debate the best response to climate change. But when some on the right simply say it is not happening, I shut down.

    • Rosie 9.2

      Wow Mike Hoskings. Thats more face slam than face palm

    • Jenny 9.3

      Come mothers and fathers throughout the land
      Don’t criticize what you can’t understand
      Your sons and your daughters are beyond your command
      The old road is rapidly aging
      So get out of the new one if you can’t lend a hand
      For the times they are a changing

      “Bear in mind who will be leading TVNZ’s election coverage this year and read and weep.”

      All good Tracey. It will hasten their demise, and accelerate the rise of the alternative media. The sooner the better.

  10. Rosie 10

    Speaking of the vile Simon Bridges…………………..


    This is a public meeting to discuss The Employment Relations Amendment Act and how the proposed changes will affect union members and workers. There will be three guest speakers followed by an open discussion on the changes and what action may be taken to prevent this anti worker bill being passed.

    As as so often been the case in recent years, Peter Dunne holds the critical vote.

    The meeting is being hosted by People’s Power Ohariu and is being held at the Uniting Church, 18 Dr Taylor Terrace, Johnsonville, Wellington. All welcome!

    • Tracey 10.1

      Is Dunne attending?

      • Rosie 10.1.1

        He was invited Tracey, but we were informed he “had other engagements that evening”. There wasn’t a Party representative available to attend either.

        • Tracey

          Ah, Peter Dunne, the man of the people. I bet if he was suddenly asked to dine with kate and Wills, his diary would free up pronto.

  11. captain hook 11

    yes he has a little sled pulled by a corgi pack. he should make it in time to palmy north. mush mush.

  12. ianmac 12

    Suppose it is a slow news day but Morning Report seem to drift aimlessly from one non-story to another non-story this morning. Even the Monday morning slot now dedicated to the flat sounding PM was a bit pointless. Tomorrow will be the weekly slot for David Cunliffe. Hope that is a bit sharper Guyon.
    Maybe it is just me? Maybe I am so excited about the royal visit that everything else is so ordinary? Ha!

    • ScottGN 12.1

      Luckily the dog was demanding his walk just as Espiner introduced the PM. I didn’t have to endure even a moment of the mangled whining that passes for comment from John Key.

      • ianmac 12.1.1

        You didn’t miss anything. The PM was maybe very tired having spent his sleepless night scheming of ways of getting his photos took multiple times – with those Windsor Beneficiaries. Baby kissing little George perhaps or a threeway handshake? That would work well.
        Or he perhaps he had a hangover?

    • Anne 12.2

      You have only a couple more hours to wait ianmac. The Royals arrive at noon and TV1 will be reporting it live – that is, if the blanket of fog lifts in time otherwise they’ll have to hot-foot it to Palmy? 🙂

      • ianmac 12.2.1

        In my day we kids were forced to line the streets and watch the Queen sweep past in a blur. We cheered but that was because we were given most of the day off school. Hooray! And then to curry favour NZ schools were given a Royal Public holiday as well. Hooray!

        • idlegus

          i heard that very boring rnz morning show too, def wasnt just you. seemed to be the same 3 stories over & over, & same information over & over. i turned off key, but heard some of the replays during the news, & he was all muffled. also a strange silence to the whole show, def needs some pepping up otherwise i might try some other monring station (i know radiolive sux but marcus lush at least puts a bit of effort into it).

  13. Bearded Git 13

    44% of repondents “not at all excited” by royal visit in today’s Herald poll (i.e. 50% plus in representative sample).

    How does this stack up with Key’s “80% of population would support keeping the monarchy” reported on RNZ this AM?

    • joe90 13.1

      Sixty years ago Grandad was a town councilor when he and Grandma were scheduled to greet Queenie at the local railway station. Reputedly Grandma refused saying – that woman’s family have already had two of my sons so I’ll be buggered if I’ll curtsey to the bitch.

      • bad12 13.1.1

        Lolz, as kids we were all taken off to the local hall,an ex US army facility left over from world war 2, to watch the Saturday movie,

        As they did in those long ago days, god Save the Queen was played befor the fillim got to roll, everyone including all the kids,obviously obeying their mum or dads instructions/example stood to attention while this drab dirge blared out of the speakers,

        Except us four kids and 1 mum who kept their buttes firmly attached to their seats refusing to acknowledge there was any respect attached to the House of Windsor having not that many years previously dropped its German title in favor of the more English sounding one…

        • Disraeli Gladstone

          I have to ask.

          When we talk of the British royal family being German, aren’t we engaging in the very immigration bashing that liberals should despise (also for argument sake since I know what you’re like Bad12, I recognise that you didn’t actually call them German in that post but I’m speaking of several occasions on the Standard where I’ve seen people do this).

          The current royal family are British. They were born in Britain. The last monarch who was actually born outside of Britain was George II in 1683. By the time George III came around, he was born in Britain, spoke English as his first language and never visited his ancestral homeland. The Royal Family have been British for nearly three hundred years. They’re no more German than every non-Maori person of New Zealand is the nationality of their European descent.

          All this “they’re actually German” rubbish just reinforces the right-wing trope that immigrants can never truly become a part of their new country. Which leads to disquiet and unease and general negative attitudes towards immigration.

          Words matter.

          Also, even leaving out the immigration side of things, it is absolutely idiotic. They really aren’t German. The family has been British since before New Zealand was a country.

          • bad12

            And Phillip, the grand-daddy of the current pair of bludgers arriving to sup at the New Zealand trough is the epitome of English breeding right Gallstone…

            • Disraeli Gladstone

              So you’re saying that to be truly the part of a country, you must have four “pure” grandparents?

              So you’re not a New Zealander unless all of your grandparents are also from New Zealand?

              This is what you’re saying?

            • Tracey

              be fair, phillip is one of our twenty greatest living nzers, according to our leader.

            • bad12


              From 1714 to 1901 all those on the throne of Britain were German on the current seat warmers side of the family,

              Obviously from both sides of His family the Husband of the current seat warmer was thoroughly German even if this was somewhat masked by His attachment to the Greek and Danish thrones,

              The fact is that this ”oh so British royal family” celebrate Christmas not on the 25th of December as the masse of their ‘subjects’ do, instead as is the thoroughly German tradition they celebrate Christmas on the 24th of December,

              Are they British, Pfft, they are British Germans just as Samoans born in New Zealand as a majority do not use the term New Zealander as a self descriptive preferring instead the term New Zealand Samoan…

              • Disraeli Gladstone

                Seriously? You’re saying that Queen Elizabeth and her children and grand-children are still German (albeit “British German”)?

                If you are, I’m just flabbergasted. There’s no way I can even logically respond to such a stance. It’s absolute stupidity.

                This is the entrenchment of national identities. When you’re having a dig at the Royals, it’s harmless. But when extended across society, this leads to all types of anti-immigration and xenophobia drivel.

                And if you’re saying you only do it to the Royals, then it’s hypocritical.

                It’s incredibly sad.

                (Furthermore, your link doesn’t even work.)

                • bad12

                  Exactly Gallstone, they are Britons of German extraction, as i point out above they still retain at least one significant German custom,(and who knows how many more when ensconced behind closed doors),

                  Given a DNA test they all would show by genetics a strong line of German inheritance from the gene pool,

                  The fact that you are flabbergasted is of little surprise to me and since when has lack of logic prevented you from replying to anything,

                  Your illogic would include labelling me as a ‘liberal’, ask any of the Island Bay Italians for instance,(having already pointed out to you the New Zealand Samoans), they will happily describe themselves as Italian even where at least 3 generations have been born here in New Zealand and have never been to Italy…

                  • The Al1en

                    My hybrid GB/NZ daughter, born here, considers herself to be 100% kiwi – Do I tell her she’s wrong, despite her passport and citizenship saying otherwise?

                  • Disraeli Gladstone

                    But that’s a straw man. It’s their right to culturally identify with what they culturally identify with.

                    That’s my whole point.

                    The Royal Family culturally identifies as British and have been born and lived in Britain for the past three hundred years. If they want to be British (and they do), then their British.

                    When you call them German, you’re removing the ability for them to determine what they feel most culturally akin to. Some immigrants (like myself) may regard ourselves still of the nationality we came from. Some other immigrants want to regard themselves of their new country.

                    All your talk of DNA and having the right grandparents is exceedingly xenophobic and conservative.

                    (Also, my family have opened one present on Christmas Eve. I guess I’m German as well now, even though I’ve never been there and have never identified with that part of my heritage (beyond opening a present on Christmas Eve).

                    • The Al1en

                      Me, I’m English, for better or worse, ’til death do us part and all that, but my girl is as kiwi as the rest of yous 😉

                      As long as she doesn’t wear an all black jersey with it’s white feather logo in my house we’ll be good. At least she knows what to put on my headstone :smirk:

                      If I should die, think only this of me:
                      That there’s some corner of a foreign field
                      That is for ever England. There shall be
                      In that rich earth a richer dust concealed;
                      A dust whom England bore, shaped, made aware,
                      Gave, once, her flowers to love, her ways to roam,
                      A body of England’s, breathing English air,
                      Washed by the rivers, blest by suns of home.

                      And think, this heart, all evil shed away,
                      A pulse in the eternal mind, no less
                      Gives somewhere back the thoughts by England given;
                      Her sights and sounds; dreams happy as her day;
                      And laughter, learnt of friends; and gentleness,
                      In hearts at peace, under an English heaven.

                    • bad12

                      Yes the Woyal family ‘claim’ to identify with all things British so as to ‘fit in’, that same family hastily changed their name from a German one to a British one in an attempt to hide that fact that two German Royal households, one in Germany and one in England were engaged in a war,

                      The English version of this German dynastic family are simply leeches bludging off of the fabric of the British people and have moved speedily to try and expunge any memory of their German Bloodlines….

                    • karol

                      British? You mean , Scots, Welsh as well can strongly culturally identify with these German-Anglo-Saxon hybrids?

                    • @ bad
                      I can understand why they did that – it seems quite similar to highlighting a particular strand of whakapapa as opposed to another strand. Some of the nastiest fighting i can remember hearing/reading about were between relations – brothers, cousins and so on – all kin. All closely blood related.

                    • Populuxe1

                      Karol, the Queen Mother was a Bowes-Lyon, a very old Scottish family, and amny Scotts identified closely with Victoria.

                    • Disraeli Gladstone

                      Aye. My Scottish father and the Scots on his side of the family were the ones who always identified with the monarch most of all.

                      It was the English side of my family that were more indifferent to the Royal Family.

    • Disraeli Gladstone 13.2

      The two statements are not contradictory. I couldn’t care less about the Royal Visit.

      I would support keeping the monarchy. I know I’m an outlier being a Brit myself, but I suspect much like in Britain, there’s a fair few Kiwis who don’t buy into the personality cult of excitement of the royals daily lives while still supporting the system of the monarchy itself.

      And to pre-empt the various arguments over how silly it is to keep the monarchy, I agree with you completely. But rather like my desire for Scotland to stay in the UK, it’s a heart over head matter.

      • Tracey 13.2.1

        I guess for me it comes down to why we need to have them here spending our money on hosting, travel, security. If they want to come, they can pay for everything.

        They may be lovely people and every other nation that has become a republic remains int he Commonwealth. They attend the commonwelath games and the CW forum etc…

        It’s merely a statement that we are our own nation.

        I have no idea if it means Key would have to get s his knighthood or from Jerry or could still go to buckhouse to get it, like Doug Graham did.

        I find the title system far more offensive than the queen as pretend head of state frankly.

        • Disraeli Gladstone

          I like the title system when it used correctly. Again, I’ll have to talk from my UK-centric perspective, but a while back the honours system was used to celebrate the unsung heroes of society. Sure, some celebrities and sports stars have always been honoured. But a lot of charity workers, community workers, authors and artists and so on were the recipients of honours. A small thanks for a life of service.

          It’s only lately where it’s been given to bankers and footballers and so on that I feel the honours system has lost it’s way.

          Again, heart over head matter. I like the trappings of history if we can avoid the baggage of it.

      • Tracey 13.2.2

        when you say you are British and you want Scotland to stay a part of the UK, are you English? Or Scottish?

        Why is it important if you are not Scottish?

        • Disraeli Gladstone

          I don’t consider myself English or Scottish. I’m British. I was born in England. But my father was Scottish. A section of my ancestors were Scots. Another part was English. I spent time in both Scotland and England. I value both those culture together and regard myself as British. I love New Zealand, but Britain is still my home and my country. Ever since I was a little boy I was British. Despite the arguments in favour and against, I can’t really engage in the debate because all I can see is the tearing apart of my home.

          It’s very much my heart taking charge of the debate.

          • Tracey

            thanks for the answer.

            my heritage on both sides is scottish.my dads side leaving scotland not long after the clearances.

            i cant recall a time when an unsung hero got knighted or damed.

          • Anne

            I have empathy with Disraeli Gladstone’s viewpoint. My parents were English – born and bred. They arrived here the day NZ declared war on Germany in 1939. Despite the fact they spent most of their adult lives in NZ, they always regarded themselves as English. Its what you feel in your heart that matters, and there is no doubt that the generations of the British monarchy since George V at the least saw themselves as totally British.

        • Bill

          Scottishness doesn’t have anything to do with it Tracy. I’m Scottish…born and bred there, both parents Scottish. But I don’t get to vote. Meanwhile, a woman born in Chelsea whose parents are Indian and English, but who lives in Scotland does get to vote. (Tasmina Ahmed-Sheikh) And that’s how it should be.

          It’s about economic and political power, not patriotism. And that principally affects only those who live there.

          • Tracey

            i have no reason to disbelieve what you say bill. i am surprised that born and bred scotts living in scotland see it as a political and economic decision only.

            • Bill

              hmm…I wasn’t really claiming to second guess peoples’ perceptions or motivations as much as simply point out what the actual issue is.

      • Bearded Git 13.2.3

        So DG you would be happy with a monarchy that was never allowed to visit NZ then?

    • Draco T Bastard 13.3

      Monarchy of New Zealand

      On 21 April 2008, New Zealand Republic released a poll of New Zealanders showing 43% support the monarchy should Prince Charles become King of New Zealand, and 41% support a republic under the same scenario.[76] A poll by the New Zealand Herald in January 2010, before a visit by Prince William to the country found 33.3% wanted Prince Charles to be the next monarch, with 30.2% favouring Prince William. 29.4% of respondents preferred a republic in the event Queen Elizabeth died or abdicated

      80% seems to be somewhat exaggerated.

      • Tracey 13.3.1

        john key exaggerated?

        • Draco T Bastard

          Ok, lied.

          Latest poll:

          The poll, by Curia Market Research, was commissioned by New Zealand Republic. It shows support for a New Zealand Head of State has risen to 44%. Support from people aged 18-30 is at now at 66%. Support for using the next British Monarch as our next head of state has fallen to 46%.

          • Populuxe1

            Given that it was commissioned by New Zealand Republic and the questions were specifically leading, I’m not going to rush to anything.

  14. freedom 14

    on a non-royals related topic, here’s some (all too accurate) giggles

    • veutoviper 14.1

      LOL, but the language is far too simple and clear for Parata!

    • ianmac 14.2

      We might well laugh but sadly it is not too far from the reality. Have to get rid of those pesky teachers. All they seem to want to do is teach kids instead of balancing the books.

  15. freedom 15

    and from John Key’s FB page is an image that makes one wonder, is “YES WE CAN” next?

    note: link is to the image only, I won’t expose you to the bile-inducing hysteria that oozes off the page itself


    • Tracey 15.1

      if you look inside the 3 it looks like mickey mouse ears on their side…

      • freedom 15.1.1

        Mickey Mouse’s ears are freaky. Aside from being one of the most recognisable character icons ever created, did you know they are exactly the same in every image? This is regardless of Mickey’s posing. Be it a profile view, front of face or Mickey looking back over his shoulder at whatever mayhem Pluto is creating. They never change!

  16. Scott 16

    On a wall in suburban Auckland, a young Tongan artist has turned the Nazi flag into a symbol of anti-racism and anti-imperialism. Kim Dotcom could learn a thing or two from him…

  17. Scott 17

    On a wall in suburban Auckland, a young Tongan activist and artist has created a new, anti-imperialist Nazi flag:
    Maybe Kim Dotcom could learn something about history and politics from Benjamin Work…

  18. joe90 18

    Lots of ground water used in Canterbury too.


    A photo in a 1999 USGS report on subsidence captures the drama vividly. It shows scientist Joseph Poland standing next to a utility pole outside Mendota. On the ground is a placard marked 1977. Twenty-eight feet overhead, another sign is nailed to the pole showing where crops once grew: It reads 1925.

    As the land subsided, bridges slumped, levees sank and well casings failed. Canals sagged, too, inviting water to loiter in low spots and spill over banks. From 1955 to 1970, damages topped $1.3 billion (in 2013 dollars), according to a new report by the California Water Foundation. All kinds of water conveyance infrastructure was harmed, from pumping plants and canal berms in the Tulare-Wasco area to bridges, pipelines and drain inlets on the Delta-Mendota Canal west of Firebaugh. And then, thanks to massive volumes of surface water that arrived via state and federal aqueducts and canals, pumping slowed and subsidence largely stopped.


    • Draco T Bastard 18.1

      It’s amazing how people keep thinking that they can do whatever they like and there not be consequences despite those consequences having happened before. Oh well, I suppose it won’t be long before we see the end of Californian wine production.

      Big question: Are we monitoring this stuff in NZ or are we doing the same as the Californians and just using it as if there’s no limit?

  19. aerobubble 19

    Okay, why do cyclists run reds? Well firstly they don’t
    run reds, that would be quite legal as getting off the
    bike and running carrying the bike over their heads is
    quite legal.

    Second, red light don’t detect cyclists and so cyclist
    if they were to obey the rule would have to wait for
    a car to drive up behind and flip the lights over.

    Third, cyclists are slow, so not only do they have
    more chance of being hit when slowing down (increase
    cross sectional opportunity for a crash), but they
    are also observed for long periods. Especially at lights and so
    seen more often running them (even though car drivers
    may well run lights more often). Fourth, cycle
    lane turns left onto another cycle lane means
    cycles only need worry about other cyclists, when red
    and cyclist are slow moving and easily avoided,
    so transition from lane to cycle lane without any
    threat from cars.

    Finally, cycle take longer to slow, take more effort
    to get moving so cyclist have a predilection to not
    stop, whereas red light car jumpers are just gunning
    the lights (what cyclist would never do that since no way
    could they win!!!)

    And finally, finally, car drivers
    who run lights are likely when they cycle themselves to also do,
    so blame the culture of gunning lights by car drivers for cyclist
    running reds.

    Roads are designed for motor vehicles, cyclists have
    no protection, are unstable at slow speeds (esp. on slopes),
    roads have pot holes that effect them far worse,
    and so cyclist should be given any benefit of the doubt.

    A cyclist rides about twice as fast as a runner, its hardly
    a competition between them and cars.

    The idea that drivers have equal rights to cyclists is absurd and
    abusive, since those disabled by using their own strength
    without recourse to an engine, seat belts, power brakes, etc
    are always going to come off worse, so drivers should always
    err on their side, and be cautious.

    And so when Moro again brings up the issue why is it so anti-cyclists,
    why does Moro defend the strong against the weak and exposed?

    • McFlock 19.1

      1: that would be jaywalking
      2: Press the button to cross, like I do on my motor scooter
      3: But the percentage of cyclists observed seems to be quite high, in my experience. Compared to motor vehicles.
      4: They don’t need to worry about the law? That’s how accidents happen.

      finally1: gunning vs not stopping doesn’t make much difference when they’ve built up some downhill speed.
      finally2: if car drivers jumped off a cliff, would cyclists? And as you point out, cars can brake quickly or gun the throttle if they misjudged while braking the law. Cyclists can’t. And cyclists are the least obvious and most vulnerable on the road. On a motor scooter, I have similar vulnerabilities – I choose to not take gambles.

      Cyclists should also err on the side of caution, because they are the most vulnerable. And they’re choosing to take themselves into close proximity of heavy machinery that moves at speed and is often controlled by dickheads. If a car strikes a cycle, it’s usually the car driver at fault (or at least another vehicle driver that put the cyclist in front of the car), AFAIK. However, it’s the cyclist who always comes worse off. If you advocate for cyclists to break the road code, you’re opening the door (so to speak) for idiot vehicle drivers to use the same excuses for their illegal behaviour.

      • aerobubble 19.1.1

        The laws are different for cyclists, cyclists are more like pedestrians, the idea that they are the same is what is causing the angst.

        • McFlock

          cyclists are allowed to run red lights?

          • aerobubble

            Cyclists who get off can walk their bike across any junction, lights or not. As long as they don’t cause an accident, which they wouldn’t since they would get hurt far worse than any car driver. And in that way cyclists are pedestrians, pedestrians cross roads, all the time, red lights or not. Put it another way, Cyclists, like pedestrians, are not motor vehicles that HAVE to OBEY red lights and can’t get out and push their vehicles through red lights.

            • McFlock

              I can do that on my motor scooter: a pedestrian with a 2 wheeled trolley.
              But we’re talking about cyclists who just ride through the red lights. No walking involved.

              • aerobubble

                If its safe its legal in my opinion because pedestrians do it all the time.

                Its like noise. Its the source of the noise that has to turn it down. with respect of vehicles, its the source of engine power.

                A Jogger can run as fast as a bike, its no different.

                Child ride bikes on the pavement.

                Posties do.

                Its just a hangover from the motor industry using their abuse of power to deny
                alternatives to their industry.

                Its actually wrong to frustrate cyclists travel based on the false belief that somehow
                someone has actually died from cyclist riding on the foot path. Its wrong because
                forcing them into the road where that happens.

                Cars have the power to stop, to speed, to evade, they have the safety, they have the technology, the have all the options. As long as a cyclist crosses safely I don’t see a problem. However its just political correctness gone mad to expect a cyclist to walk their cycle across a junction when they can ride across much more safely (quicker!).

    • ianmac 19.2

      As a cyclist growing up in Christchurch I assumed that every car was out to get me. That way I was alert to the potential of injury whenever a car in front or behind or across alerted my consciousness. As a small town NZ cyclist now, I still behave that way to stay alive if possible.

      • aerobubble 19.2.1

        Same for any pedestrians. All the horse power and human making mistakes, makes for caution.

  20. freedom 20

    Have spent the day doing a bit of ‘royal watching’.

    Wandering through various news sites, but mainly exploring the explosive multitude of Facebook pages that are covering the Tour, and reading the comments. The comments…. The comments…

    I have witnessed clichés and melees, saw fracas and face offs and every page was rife with half-stated hate speech wallpapered over with carbon copy happy faces. My sincere and undeniable conclusion is an epidemic of cognitive dissonance is running rampant across New Zealand.

    our friend Douglas Adams summed it up best
    “Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent disinclination to do so.”

  21. RedBaronCv 21

    Banks application thrown out – nz herald

  22. Clemgeopin 22

    COINCIDENCE or INTUITION or DESTINY or KARMA?…An interesting Lotto story

    A Takaka couple who won more than $7 million with Big Wednesday say it’s all thanks to trusting a woman’s intuition.

    After doing the weekly shopping last week one of the winners had a sudden gut feeling that she should pick up a Big Wednesday ticket.

    “As I walked to the car I thought, ‘I should get a Big Wednesday ticket’, but I couldn’t really be bothered. But as I walked away my intuition told me that I would regret not buying that ticket – so I popped back into the store and grabbed one,” said the winner, who wishes to remain anonymous. The couple watched Big Wednesday that night and soon knew they had won a big prize.

    “I just started screaming,” said the winner. “I fell to my knees and shouted to my husband: ‘We’ve won!’ He grabbed the ticket, took one look and started screaming too.”

    The winners double checked their numbers against the official results online before getting too excited.

    “We jumped online to MyLotto and stared at the computer screen waiting for the results to come up. We were refreshing the page every couple of seconds . . . it was a painful wait.”

    When their prize was confirmed, the couple say they got so excited that one of them hurt their leg jumping up and down.


  23. Penny Bright 23

    John Banks is going to trial for electoral fraud – case starting Monday 19 May 2014 in the Auckland High Court:

    Judgment of Wylie J available here:


    Banks loses bid to have prosecution thrown out



    Penny Bright

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