Haven’t been able to find any English Regional percentage breakdowns yet (ie North-East, West Midlands, South-West, Greater London etc – but, then, that’s probably a plus from your point of view)
Trp said something about it yesterday, and I think it’s been in the media, as a reason for Labour doing badly (I’m rolling my eyes), but it sounded like the same old beat up to me, as you point out there wasn’t a real shift.
Yep, the Undecideds certainly comprise one of the reasons being touted for the “terrible night for us pollsters” (Chief Executive of YouGov ).
Others include: (1) the “Shy Conservative” (though they arguably overlap with the Undecideds – about which, more below), (2) The suggestion that Polls were, in fact, correct but last-minute swing to the Tories, (3) That Pollsters may have been “herding” (ie skewing their polls towards an average) – some analysts are suspicious about just how closely-aligned the various polls were in the final days, (4) Claims that the Final Result was, in fact, within the margin-of-error for most polls, (5) Becoming more challenging to contact a representative sample of voters, (6) The large-ish minority of Labour supporters (28% in one Ipsos-Mori Poll) who told pollsters they preferred Cameron as PM (speculation they could comprise a whole new category of “shy Tory”), (7) Current polling methods haven’t adjusted to the new era of electoral politics (ie the much greater fluidity of the electorate in recent years).
In terms of the argument that a disproportionate number of “Don’t Knows” went Tory on Election Day,…….. a couple of weeks back, I was looking through the detailed breakdowns of a particular poll and noticed that the Undecideds – when pushed to name which Party they were leaning towards – went heavily Conservative. Tories led Labour by more than 10 points among this group. It’s true that Undecideds are somewhat less likely to get out and actually vote on the Day than respondents who name a party on initial prompting, but 10+ points would still have some impact on the final result (not necessarily “shy” but certainly “hidden” Tories).
Labour were targeting 106 marginal seats – most were Tory-held, some LibDem-held.
Have a look at what happened in the most marginal Tory seats of all.
15 Most Marginal Tory Seats of 2010 (ie with smallest 2010 majorities over Labour)
Seat……………….2010 Tory maj over Lab…….2015 % Swing……………….Status
Warwickshire North…………….54……………..CON + 2.1…….LAB – 4.0……….Con Hold
Thurrock……………………………..92……………..CON – 3.1…….LAB – 4.0……….Con Hold
Hendon………………………………106…………….CON + 6.7……LAB – 0.6………Con Hold
Cardiff North………………………194…………….CON + 4.9……LAB + 1.2………Con Hold
Sherwood…………………………..214…………….CON + 5.8……LAB – 2.9……….Con Hold
Stockton South…………………..332…………….CON + 7.8……LAB – 1.3……….Con Hold
Lancaster & Fleetwood……….333…………….CON + 3.2……LAB + 7.0………Lab Gain
Broxtowe……………………………389…………….CON + 6.2…….LAB – 1.1………Con Hold
Amber Valley………………………536…………….CON + 5.4…….LAB – 2.7………Con Hold
Wolverhampton SW……………691…………….CON + 0.5…….LAB + 4.2……..Lab Gain
Waveney…………………………….769…………….CON + 2.1…….LAB – 1.0……..Con Hold
Carlisle……………………………….853…………….CON + 5.0…….LAB + 0.5………Con Hold
Morecombe & Lunesdale……866…………….CON + 4.0…… LAB – 4.6……..Con Hold
Weaver Vale……………………….991…………….CON + 4.6…….LAB + 5.2……..Con Hold
Lincoln………………………………1058……………CON + 5.1…… LAB + 4.3……..Con Hold
Labour won only 2 of the 15 seats it should have absolutely blitzed. And in a majority of the 13 ultra-marginals it failed in – its vote share actually fell while the Tories’ % rose.
Exactly Swordfish-great analysis. My sister lives in Lincoln and will be devastated. The turnout in Lincoln was 63%-pathetic in a marginal. Shows how disillusioned the UK electorate really is.
What has been missed a bit by the analysts is that Labour polled quite well in the north of England compared with last time. That is reflected in the Lancaster vote above, in Burnley and in a number of other results.
Yeah, I was only going to include Tory seats with majorities of less than 1000, but the City of Lincoln’s my old stomping ground. First went to the UK in 1983 in my late teens and spent most of the time in Lincoln/Nottingham area (where I had/have some distant relatives). Did some scrutineering for the Lincoln Labour Party on Election Day – sat next to a very large Tory woman from the Shire* – (and watched one or two Lincoln City games (“The Red Imps”) at Sincil Bank – bottom half of the 4th Division, trend towards pin-striped football Kit in 83 for some bizarre reason, possibly growing obsession with Corporate culture / Thatcherism of more than a few Football Club Execs).
Lincoln’s always been a bellwether seat, clearly still is.
* Yeah, I know, sexist of me to mention her weight. I feel bad about it, but there you go.
Not that bad an article, really. Armstrong has at least spotted the danger for his masters:
“The other lesson to take from Wednesday night’s function – and one National would be wise to heed – is Little’s capacity to surprise, something he first did with his “cut the crap” jibe at John Key. While well imbued with core Labour values, Little is less hung-up about what means are used to reach the goals associated with those values.”
I thought it is an okay article, too – TRP. Phil Ure is just twisting what he has read.
Little has an enormous job to make Labour into a workable election campaign “machine” again – and he’s going about it thoughtfully, carefully, and maybe a bit slowly for some but if you look back at his various statements you’ll see he’s positioning Labour as the Party for Work and Jobs – along with all the other social values that underpins Labour.
So quit sniping at him and let him get on with that job.
Your quotation marks around “radical ideas”, followed by that smarmy little (!), implies this is a quote from Andrew Little. It would be helpful if you provided a citation for that quote, otherwise people might think you were still deliberately twisting things no one has actually said.
You may engage however you wish, but if you don’t want people to point out that you’re implying things that aren’t true and which you can’t back up you should probably either back up your statements, use clearer punctuation, or stop making up lies to suit your political agenda.
I have taken the position of ignoring everything that p u writes on the basis that anyone who refuses to use punctuation and write in coherent sentences and paragraphs can have nothing to say of interest.
It just takes too much time out of my life to read people who write in a stream of thought, blurting manner. Give me someone who makes the effort to write clearly and thoughtfully and, even if I almost always disagree, I will take the time to take their thought on board.
Me too Hateatea, and completely agree about the value of inention in communicating. I sometimes will attempt to read one of his comments in a situation like this (where someone has responded to him in a meaningful way). Sometimes I read the first two lines or so to see if I can make any sense. If he drops vegan links in I’ll have a look because they’re usually fundamentalist and need challenging. I virtually never read the long ones, or even the whole of the short ones. Life’s too short :->
Yep, same here. Some of the subthreads is keyboard-mashing causes can be pretty funny, though.
Especially when he gets called on making shit up and then argues that someone has misinterpreted his intentionally-unorthodox punctuation, grammar, and sentence contstruction.
Double quotation marks would imply a quote. Single ones I would take to mean an implication that some policies were radical ideas rather than a quote, but as you point out it can be hard to tell with phil.
My understanding is that Little is suggesting backing of from certain policies that they’ve recevied feedback are wrong. I wouldn’t have seen Little as seeing those as radical policies, so without some back up, I’ll take it as phil’s interpretation.
It’s funny really, because Little is more likely to take Labour left, and the left calling him a right mover just playes into the right wing spinners’ agenda.
double are quotes which phil used, singles can be used imo to imply irony, sarcasm, disbelief – the exclamation mark implied to me extreme – irony, sarcasm or disbelief.
yep me too – but double around the initial quote commented on.
For me if I write, Little didn’t promise to shed those ‘radical ideas’ etc then I’m saying the ideas are not so radical in my opinion although Little may have thought or even believe they are. What phil means he can explain if he wants but that’s how I read it. Whether he actually promised radical ideas or not is a fair point that Stephanie has raised and tttt {(to tell the truth) just made that up 🙂 } I don’t know if he did or not…
The specific usage of ” vs ‘ isn’t set in stone (hell I have an English degree and I don’t know the “rules” around them).
I would happily accept the idea that phil was paraphrasing the “radical ideas” quote – but then what’s the point of putting “(!)” afterwards?
To me, the obvious interpretation of that is “what a shocking thing to say”. I don’t know why it’s there if pu isn’t trying to imply that Little did indeed say capital gains etc were “radical” ideas.
yep. I got called out on the use of double quotes a while back for something sarcastic I said about something Key had said and someone had a go at me because they thought I was literally making up quoting Key when I thought it was obvious I was taking the piss. I agree there are no set rules, which is why I talked about my impressions of phil’s comment. At this point, in all good conscience I can’t keep talking seriously about punctuation in this context (-;
” is often speech” ‘writing’
But since the advent of “bald neutralising” ” ” have often been used to highlight disagreement with the quoted idea – a bit like sic.
Also the POA publicity machine recently stated that it was essential to have the extended wharf other wise the new cruise ship ‘Quantum of the Seas’ would not be able to berth and New Zealand would miss out on lots of $$$$$$$ ‘cos the company would cancel the visit. ???????
What they didn’t say is that this new vessel whilst a little bigger in displacement is actually similar in size to the ‘Queen Mary II’ which has been here recently with no problems about berthing. She is just two metres shorter than the Quantum but draws 10.1m against the
Quantum’s 8.8m. The other difference is that QMII is rated at 30Knots against the Q’s 22.
TRP you are delusional if you think little has any traction with public as the polls high light labour is now seen as perennial losers globally ( UK Au Nz) No longer is any one buying core labour values beyond those areas trapped on govt handouts ( Scotland Qld etc) , the world has moved on, labours time ( 70 years ago ) has come and gone. All we are seeing now is a slow death, A left shift will simply accelerate the inevitable
we can’t all be landlords and bosses, really we still need a few people to work and get the various jobs that need doing done. You know, like Nurses, teachers, cleaners, admin staff, peeps working in Fonterra factories and the likes. If labour is dead as you say, who will look out for the workers? Surely not National? They have, over the last 7 years and previously under Shipley, shown that they do not believe workers worthy of consideration and might even consider the New Zealand Worker (resident and citizens) to be utterly replaceable by cheap, imported slave type labour from Asia and elsewhere?
What do you tell your children then, if you have any? Move overseas, cause here in NZ you are not going to have a chance to survive?
There needs to be a balance between (to parapharase Bush II) The Haves and The Have Nots or else we are going back to the dark ages where the workers were effectively owned by the Lord of the Manor.
Is that the future that you hope for Red Delusion?
Really what about a 40 hour week, overtime pay, accident compensation, retirement benefits, unemployment benefits, equal education opportunities, public health care and the likes do you not like and think we can do away with?
I’m looking forward to following the nature of work enquiry/report, as it will inform greatly as to how the country should proceed in the upcoming years.
I also look forward to the 40 hour week reducing to 35 or 30 hours for similar pay – this should be a major push from Labour to improve work-life balance (imagine a 4 day week for the same length shifts and same pay!) and also decrease unemployment as mechanisation increases.
hi sabine. i think both you and red delusion can be correct.
i was bought up in a staunch labour household, (my grandfather was an organizer all his life) and constantly told that labour were the party for the working person.
i dont think that relevance is true today.
the radical shift in the 80s to the neo liberal agenda was the final nail in the ciffin for me.
having labour move away from the workers doesnt mean we have to go without 40hour week, overtime etc
i do think the workers you listed do need representing but i feel we dont identify as strongly with our occupations as we used to do.
pollys are there to get elected or re-elected. so we will not be getting a visionary or a radical shake-up from the labour party.
you can argue that proposing raising the retirement age is an anti worker move.
also you can argue that it is a long overdue fiscally responsible move.
as to who is to represent these workers, politically, good question.
probably the mana crew, as i see the greens looking to move right and be seen as respectable enough not to scare the horses.
🙂 – I’d be calling him a lot worse, but then if we delved into it too much, we’d have to start having an in depth discussion on power relations (where Bridges is actually a 40 watt banana masquerading as something quite a few people think is worthwhile), and I’d be living in utter, absolute fear of being ‘sanctioned’.
Inplementing compulsory voting (which I am against) would be a gutsy, definitive, concrete policy statement. Not just talking about considering a policy of talking about policy. So unlikely to come out of Labour.
FYI – here is the EVIDENCE which proves the improvement in ‘transparency’ at Auckland Council, for which. in my opinion, I can claim some credit as a result of my uncompromising ‘one person rates revolt’?
Auckland Council has launched a section on its website providing information on a variety of council activities as part of a commitment to more openness and transparency.
The proactive publication of information on the More about the council webpage, which can be found via the Auckland Council Media centre helps to provide Aucklanders with better, timelier and more accurate information about how council works.
The first release of information includes Auckland Council Group staff numbers, information about annual average rates increases, debt, efficiency savings and progress updates on the NewCore project.
It also includes contracts awarded by the council with a value of $100,000 and greater from 1 July 2014 to 31 March 2015 and spends with suppliers with a value of $100,000 and more from 1 October 2014 to 31 March 2015.
All of the information in the section will be updated regularly to ensure it remains relevant and current.
Auckland Council CEO Stephen Town says the proactive publication of information aims to strengthen Aucklanders’ trust in the council.
“Central government and other local authorities already have similar initiatives, meaning Auckland Council will now be aligned with best practice across the public sector in New Zealand in making information more accessible to the public,” he says.
“In the future we will also be providing more details about how we work and what we do, including information about employee costs, travel expenses, key statistics about council activities and other useful information as and when it becomes available.”
In addition to the proactive publication of information, the council also today began publishing on its website Local Government Official Information and Meeting Act (LGOIMA) responses where the council deems the information to be in the interests of the wider public.
More about the council and LGOIMA responses are available to view now.
______________________________________________________________________________________
We will regularly publish details of awarded contracts and spend with suppliers.
These reports are for Auckland Council (excluding CCOs) and will be updated twice a year, in April and October.
Awarded contracts report
For contracts valued at $100,000 and greater awarded by the council during the period stated (including provisional spending commitments in some instances), this report lists:
a description of the goods and/or services being supplied
the general type of goods and/or services being supplied
the name of the successful supplier
the start date and end date of the contract.
Awarded Contracts Report (PDF 313KB)
Supplier spend report
This report lists the total spend per supplier (across all contracts and purchase orders) for the period stated, where the total is greater than $100,000.
Supplier spend report (PDF 265KB)
All procurement activity at Auckland Council, including tendering and awarding contracts, is subject to the Auckland Council Procurement Policy.
For reasons related to commercial sensitivity and privacy, we do not publish the details of sole traders (ie. individuals who are not contracting through a company).
Detailed information about spend and contracts may be commercially confidential.
We believe that the information we provide in the reports is accurate at the time of publication (subject to the report disclaimers). The information is subject to change if projects, priorities and timeframes are varied for awarded contracts or if financial reconciliations or adjustments are made in respect of prior payments.
And remember, Tim Barnett is the general secretary – he is neither Leader nor President – and has just ordinary member’ s voting rights on policy stuff.
It was part of Labour’s submission to the Justice and Electoral Select Committee.
From the Herald article:
Mr Barnett said the submission was from the party, which did not set policy, and wanted the committee to investigate the idea – not necessarily recommend it.
“It’s not party policy, it’s merely saying, what are the things that could be done? And in Australia that is the system which they formally adopt.
“There is widespread concern, not just Labour, with non-enrolment … there is pretty compelling evidence that there is a continuing pattern of people not enrolling.”
“And in Australia that is the system which they formally adopt.”
Yeah but Australia is also the country currently introducing fascist policy that means citizens lose social security entitlements if they don’t vaccinate their children. Just to make that really clear, they’re targeting beneficiaries as a class of people. So probably not the best country to use as a comparison at this time.
Gotta say the similarity to the vaccination idea is interesting too. The irresponsibility of those parents is astonishing, of course, so I suppose something has to be done. I suspect that beneficiaries are targeted in the enrolment suggestion because they make up a large number of the non- enrolled. If I get a chance later I’ll do some digging or maybe someone else can do some research on what and why Labour are proposing it. For me, footy calls. Ciao.
If this was about irresponsible parenting, the Australian government would make vaccination mandatory across the board. You don’t vaccinate your kids then you get fined and eventually go to prison. But it’s not about that at all, it’s about buying into narratives that beneficiaries are bad parents and punishing them accordingly.
There is nothing wrong with small numbers of unvaccinated kids. If governments want to improve vaccination numbers they can introduce better health policy so that the people who aren’t vaccinating but probably would given the chance can access better health care. But hey, why bother addressing education and poverty issues when you can just bene bash.
So the theory of herd immunity is wrong then? Herd immunity does not work? Do say more, Mr Scientific one. How about the medical ethics framework of patient consent before any treatment? Is that wrong too?
Oh fuck off with your distractions Draco the Scientific and answer the questions.
Does herd immunity require that 100% of persons be immunised for it to work.
Secondly. Do you believe that medical treatment must ethically obtain fully informed patient consent wherever possible, or do you believe that patient consent is a violable nice to have.
Several decades following the vaccine’s introduction, the measles death rate rose, largely because the vaccine made adults, expectant mothers and infants more vulnerable
Early in the last century, measles killed millions of people a year. Then, bit by bit in countries of the developed world, the death rate dropped, by the 1960s by 98% or more. In the U.K., it dropped by an astounding 99.96%. And then, the measles vaccine entered the market
After the vaccine’s introduction, the measles death rate continued to drop into the 1970s. Many scientists credit the continued decline entirely to the vaccine. Other scientists believe the vaccine played a minor role, if that, noting that most infectious diseases similarly petered out during the 20th century, including some, like scarlet fever, for which vaccines were never developed.
The credit for the century-long decline, scientists generally agree, goes to improved nutrition and improved health care, side effects of the West’s growing affluence. In the U.S., the death rate dropped by about 98%, from about 10 per 100,000 population a century ago to one fifth of one person by 1963, the year measles vaccines made their American debut. Both before and after vaccination started, victims tended to be poor
‘If you really want to know just how ignorant Lawrence Solomon is about vaccines, all you have to do is to take a look at this:
The CDC credits the vaccine with the elimination of measles deaths, but measles deaths ended a decade before the vaccine was in widespread use across the U.S., and deaths had all but ended prior to the first child receiving a shot. While the vaccine can perhaps take modest credit for accelerating the decline in the mid-1960s, it is a stretch to claim that eradication would not have occurred without the vaccine, particularly since the 20th century also saw the die-off of diseases like scarlet fever, for which no vaccine was ever developed.
This is an incredibly intellectually dishonest antivaccine talking point, so intellectually dishonest that it shocks me that anyone with half a brain can seriously argue it. Let’s just put it this way: Anyone who pulls out this tired old dishonest trope is so intellectually bankrupt that I don’t really feel obligated to do anything other than link to a post I did a long time ago about this trope, which I derogatorily labeled the “vaccines didn’t save us” lie.
It’s amazing that in 2014 the same old long discredited antivaccine tropes have found a new mouthpiece, but they have. And that mouthpiece is Lawrence Solomon. It’s not “conservative skepticism” that is falling short. It’s Lawrence Solomon. Sadly, it’s not surprising.’
The move to an artificially created vaccine for whooping cough is behind an increase in cases of the deadly disease in the US, a new study suggests.
The findings highlight the need to do similar research in Australia where whooping cough cases have spiralled upward in the past decade, co-author Associate Professor Manoj Gambhir, from the University of Monash, says.
“These results demonstrate that the resurgence in pertussis in the U.S. can be explained by past changes in vaccination policy. However, the authors’ findings also suggest that the efficacy of the currently-used acellular vaccine, while lower than that of the whole-cell vaccine, is not much lower (around 80% protection for the first three doses of acellular vaccine versus 90% for whole-cell), and booster doses may be sufficient to curtail epidemics while novel vaccine research continues.”
I believe that those are reasonable conclusions to make.
I do note that your rather transparent attempt to smear vaccination against pertussis.
I believe that those are reasonable conclusions to make
I believe people who accept the use of terms such as ‘doses’ and ‘booster shots’ when attempting to explain or accepting the manufactured explanation of ‘herd immunity’ are void of logical reasoning
I do note that your rather transparent attempt to smear vaccination against pertussis.
Q. Do you realise you just illustrated my belief – ‘void of logical reasoning’?
Further illogical reasoning from an alleged medical ‘professional’
That you don’t / won’t /can’t recall previous conversations which you and I have been involved in where I stated openly and succinctly my position causes me greater concern for any patients you have may have treated
I have called you out on your ‘bed side manner’ previously and you have shown it once again with an irrational abusive comment
Forgetful illogical abusive and egocentric are not desirable traits of those in the medical profession
To refresh your memory – I am anti compulsion and pro informed consent
2. The drivel you post has far less to do with informed consent and far more to do with promoting an anti vaccination position through half truths, mistruth and misrepresentation.
3. I don’t need to nor do I have any wish to be polite to a troll on a political website as you may or may not have understood by now that the opinions expressed on this website are often done so with vigour.
That you believe I am a trolll serves only to enforce my understanding of your state of mind
1. I am pro informed consent also.
Q. Are you really ?
Q. Which information do you pass on to your patients before you stab them with chemicals that have side effects and adverse reactions which you clearly don’t understand the dangers of ?
If your version of ‘informed consent’ is reflected through contributions on this site you have no comprehension of what ‘informed consent’ is nor any right to claim that you do and should not be practicing medicine nor administering chemicals
2. The drivel you post has far less to do with informed consent and far more to do with promoting an anti vaccination position through half truths, mistruth and misrepresentation.
You can’t recall what I have posted
3. I don’t need to nor do I have any wish to be polite to a troll on a political website as you may or may not have understood by now that the opinions expressed on this website are often done so with vigour.
You should proof read before you post comments not that it would assist with the glaring contradictions you repeatedly make
Q. Which information do you pass on to your patients before you stab them with chemicals that have side effects and adverse reactions which you clearly don’t understand the dangers of ?
If your version of ‘informed consent’ is reflected through contributions on this site you have no comprehension of what ‘informed consent’ is nor any right to claim that you do and should not be practicing medicine nor administering chemicals
Q. Do you think you language leaves anyone in any doubt as to your anti vaccination credentials.
2. The drivel you post has far less to do with informed consent and far more to do with promoting an anti vaccination position through half truths, mistruth and misrepresentation.
You can’t recall what I have posted
A. yes I can… this site also has a very good search engine.
Q. Do you think you language leaves anyone in any doubt as to your anti vaccination credentials.
No because there are some who can read and comprehend english and accept the position I have stated previously including again to you today
What should leave no doubt is your lack of acknowledgement / appreciation of side effects adverse reactions and deaths caused by the ‘drug industry’ of which vaccination is a component sponsored by the the FDA / CDC
2. The drivel you post has far less to do with informed consent and far more to do with promoting an anti vaccination position through half truths, mistruth and misrepresentation.
Stop projecting and start using the search engine you referred to
See if the search engine can tell you how many people in the USA alone die each year due to the ‘medical industry’ approved drugs in particular that are ‘approved’ by the FDA
Q. FDA approved drugs kill / injure [ ] people per year in the USA ?
Q. How many of your patients do you inform such easily identified statistics of before you prescribe /administer chemicals to them ?
Two kids from the same family at different schools – So what
No mention that ‘immunity’ is achieved through the body contracting a disease naturally
Quarantine is sensible and implicitly covers off natural immunity to those who understand how natural immunity is achieved
A: 🙄 although congratulations for finally outing your anti vaccination credentials
No mention of the how many of the 124 from last year were already ‘vaccinated’
A: None, this information is available on the public health website
Summary:
The murphy troll’s medical/scientific knowledge is woeful….. but oh no ! the chemicals the chemicals and the FDA/CDC MONEYMEN ILLUMINATI…Gaia will save us all.
Not only do you not understand ‘herd immunity’ which as an alleged medical professional is shameful but you do not even understand the even simpler definition of ‘trolll’
A: 🙄 although congratulations for finally outing your anti vaccination credentials
You either can’t read or you don’t comprehend the position I take has been stated very clearly to you on multiple occasions
Indications are you’re experiencing some sort of mental incapacity which is what I referred to earlier
Either way I hope you are no longer practicing and if you are I would suggest someone lodge a complaint to have your license removed for the public good
You should be struck off with the exhibition you put in through your comments
A: None, this information is available on the public health website
Yet you chose not to link to it then use a weak attempt at transference about getting me frothing – Oh dear
The murphy troll’s medical/scientific knowledge is woeful….. but oh no ! the chemicals the chemicals and the FDA/CDC MONEYMEN ILLUMINATI…Gaia will save us all.
WOW……You are disqualified as if you weren’t already
No I haven’t Draco. I’ve had conversations with pro-vaxxers on this site where I’ve made the argument that the govt should be putting effort into reaching people who would otherwise vaccinate but don’t due to poverty, inability to access, lack of awareness etc, instead of having a go at the people that choose not to vaccinate via informed consent processes. And that argument has been supported. In fact the NZ govt has processes in place that allow people to opt out. That’s because the very small numbers (maybe 3% at a guess) who consciously choose to not vaccinate via an education process don’t matter.
But I don’t really want to go another round on this. The actual point I was making is that the kind of coercion the Austrialian govt is using is discriminatory and therefore they’re not a good example to use for forcing parts of the population to do something against its will.
Unvaccinated people put those who can’t be vaccinated at increased risk as has been explained to you.
instead of having a go at the people that choose not to vaccinate via informed consent processes.
There’s no such thing as choosing not to vaccinate from informed consent. If you’re properly informed you choose to vaccinate. It really is that simple. Choosing not to vaccinate from ‘informed consent’ ends up with shit like this happening:
And it’s not as if Williams is unfamiliar with science. He has a science degree and he’s turning his invention, the WilliamsWarne homebrew machine, into a global success.
He’s not stupid. If anything, he was just a little bit too smart for his own good.
The Williams are the one in 10 parents who opt out when it comes to vaccination, not out of ignorance, but because they think they know everything. Williams said they believed they’d done their research but now admits they were out of their depth.
“Parents like us make the decision to not vaccinate on very little factual information about the actual consequences of the diseases.”
But it just didn’t stop me getting childhood illnesses.
My two vaccinated children, on the other hand, have rarely been ill, have had antibiotics maybe twice in their lives, if that (not like me who got so many illnesses which needed treatment with antibiotics that I developed a resistance to them, which led me to be hospitalized with penicillin-resistant quinsy at 21–you know that old fashioned disease that killed Queen Elizabeth I and which was almost wiped out through use of antibiotics).
The actual point I was making is that the kind of coercion the Austrialian govt is using is discriminatory and therefore they’re not a good example to use for forcing parts of the population to do something against its will.
These points are actually why I’m for compulsory vaccination. It bypasses the ignorance that some people confuse for being informed, protects those that can’t be immunised and prevents political parties from attacking minority groups for political point scoring.
“Unvaccinated people put those who can’t be vaccinated at increased risk as has been explained to you.”
I was talking about public health policy, not abstract theory. And like I said, my point was about what it means to target groups of people by class. I’m not interested in a debate about forcing health care on people.
I was talking about public health policy, not abstract theory.
What abstract theory are you talking about?
I’m not interested in a debate about forcing health care on people.
And I pointed out that compulsory vaccination prevents the targeting that you want to stop. At which point I think I’ll just point you to this comment from OAB.
I’m not quite sure why an avowed anti-Big Pharma activist is citing Dr. Manoj Gambhir, given his close ties to the medical establishment and career-long support for vaccination programs. Under any other circumstances they’d be howling about his (wholly imagined) corruption and bias.
@ OAB The murphy troll continues to demonstrate his stupidity for all to see.
He is very unlike Weka who wishes to engage in a reasonable manner.
on the matter of pertussis vaccine it has always been one of the more problematic bacteria to get a strong and long lasting immune response to it with vaccines which is why researchers continue to try and look for improvements. It’s a hideous illness to contract in the very young and even in teens/adults can hang about for a long time.
I’m with Weka on this issue: compulsory medication is counter-productive and opposed by the medical profession. Targeting people by class is an abomination.
I’m with Weka on this issue: compulsory medication is counter-productive and opposed by the medical profession. Targeting people by class is an abomination.
So how do we get everyone to vaccinate while not targeting people by class?
I agree that compulsion has negative overtones that will get some peoples backs up. Better education can certainly help but, as the anti-vaxxers have shown, even that will be taken badly by some people.
nah, just providing evidence of cherry-picking. Big Pharma can’t be trusted, until whoops! Suddenly they can!
Then you need to be clear about that reference to The Murphy and others.
to be clear, it was a response to TM’s citation of the Gambhir study.
Thing is, what you said came across as an Ad Hominem against Gambhir while the study itself and its findings seemed quite reasonable.
@DtB I see what you mean – I’d hoped to avoid that by putting ‘wholly imagined’ in parentheses, and the links to ‘Big Pharma’ are only defamatory if you buy into that narrative.
So how do we get everyone to vaccinate while not targeting people by class?
Don’t use carrots/sticks that rely on class, e.g. benefits.
Heck, carrots/sticks are a bad way to go anyway – personally I’d ban the advertising of prescription meds, and take a damned close look at the boundary between “alternative” therapies and “practising medicine without a license”, and make “doctor” a restricted title, alongside public nuisance/recklessness charges against purveyors of some of the more dishonest anti-vax propaganda.
IMO the problem isn’t the number of nutters, it’s the avenues they have for publicity and claiming equivalence with legitimate researchers.
If you look at Andrew Little’s twitter you will see this is not Labour Party policy and not something he supports. The submission is from Tim Barnett and I don’t know how it went through. If this is Tim’s idea then he is in the wrong job IMO. This is an appalling idea and reeks of beneficiary bashing.
Fine to have enrolment forms to give out at government offices, but starving people into submission is not acceptable. If you want the poor to vote then maybe you should make sure your policies address their needs.
I hope Mr Barnett will face consequences for publicly putting his foot in his party’s mouth. Need way better message discipline than that. NZ does not need another party suggesting right-wing policies. He’s welcome to resign and join another which does, if it’s important to him.
so how come this brainfart ended up in the herald, again making the labour party look like the party of brainfarts?
really,
can someone speak to the guys in the party that have any say and make it clear to them that brainfarts are not helpful, and should only be uttered in the confines of ones most private room?
If I could distill the Labour Party’s woes over the last six years into just two words, I’d probably choose ‘bewildering stupidity’. The causes are manifold and complex, but the symptom is that Labour and its leaders often do bewildering, obviously stupid things despite the fact the things they are doing are obviously stupid. Think about David Shearer holding up dead fish in Parliament as his poll ratings flat-lined, or Goff dying his hair orange the day before making a major speech, or Cunliffe railing against secret trusts while financing his leadership campaign through secret trusts . . . The list is very, very long.
Sure, this isn’t as egregious as National’s Sky City deal, or sending our troops to Iraq so we can stay ‘part of the club’. But Key, Joyce et al have reasons for the questionable stuff they do. They have agendas. It’s deliberate; calculated. They have reasons! Labour just does random bewilderingly stupid shit for no comprehensible reason. All the time. People write columns about how Labour should ‘move to the center’, or the left or whatever, but addressing the bewildering stupidity issue should be their primary goal.
I just saw that. WTF are they thinking. Demanding that people behave in certain ways because they receive some state support paves the way for more right wing “do as I say” tactics.
Receiving some form of state support doesn’t give governments the right to run anyone’s life and feeds the meme that state support identifies reckless, lazy, uncaring people who need to be told what to do. Where is the evidence that supports this ? Why don’t they target the asset rich tax dodger who is also living off their fellow taxpayer and is selfish uncaring etc etc.
Oh and this is likely to alienate women
Can’t they spell stupid
It’s not ‘tactics’. It’s the law. Enrolment is compulsory in NZ and it makes sense for the government to try and enforce that law at a point at which they interact with the wilfully non enrolled. Enrolling is easy. Making receiving a state benefit conditional on taking a couple of minutes to sign a form isn’t particularly onerous.
Having said that, there is clearly going to be a minority who don’t want to enrol for compelling reasons. Visa overstayers, for example.
It may be the law but when people are so disenchanted and disinterested (or dodging debt collectors or abusive spouses) that they don’t bother compulsion is only going to increase resentment. Leave the enforcement to someone else.
Maybe I should have said “leave promoting this option to another party”.
And yes it may be the law but at this point, this is policing only one sub group that doesn’t enrol ? Are they even the biggest sub group? Do we know? Why target only this one? What happens if people enrol and don’t keep it up to date? What about people who are dropped off unbeknown to them?
Why not go around the schools and demand that all 17 year olds or university students enrol before they can receive tuition. Or you have to be enrolled to get a drivers licence, WOF, CAR rego, passport, house insurance or if you have an IRD number you have to be enrolled if eligible ? Have a bank account?
All good points. I suspect that this is indeed a target group that figures highly in the non enrolled numbers. Haven’t got time now, but if I get a chance, I’ll see if I can find the full submission and work out what is intended. Might be worth a post.
I imagine this idea has been mooted out of frustration with potential Labour voters who just don’t bother to get on the roll let alone actually vote. However I don’t think its the right way to go about it. Providing an incentive to enroll is a much better idea but how do you do that? You can’t offer money because all the people who have voluntarily enrolled (the bulk of the population) would be up in arms and rightly so.
Some may say the incentive would be in good policies but that ignores the fact that Labour and the Greens have consistently produced policies that would have assisted the poor, the unemployed and those who, for one reason or another, have been left feeling disenfranchised. But the potential recipients don’t even bother to acquaint themselves of such policies.
I guess the answer is acquiring money, money and more money so you can “sell” them to a resistant public. Oh dear…
This is a prevalent kind of comfy authoritarian middle class led Labour thinking, piling requirements on to beneficiaries and the under class so that they will maybe vote for you. And if you don’t comply you get your already miserable benefit taken off you or docked. It’s fucking absurd. But this is what the Labour Party has come to.
Yep. And irrespective of the value of investigating such a policy, the timing is beyond belief. Labour need to be rebuilding trust with voters, and this just undermines that.
“Making receiving a state benefit conditional on taking a couple of minutes to sign a form isn’t particularly onerous.”
Except as you point out for overstayers. Or people with highly dysfunctional lives for whom this kind of bureaucracy IS onerous. I’m sure we’ve had this conversation before, and your comment seems either largely ignorant of the realities of some of the most vulnerable people in NZ, or you think the impact on them is worth the gains of the policy. Both are politically unproductive as well as being punitive.
I forgot another sub group above. Why not make people enrol when they go for some form of medical treatment. That costs the state plenty and nothing onerous about signing a form while you wait and wait.
and why shouldn’t it? Why just target those on a particular sub group of
state support. And while they are there we could target vaccination measures, contraception for any kids they have that are 16 and over. and all the other welfare indignities. if it’s good enough for one group then it’s good enough for all.
You could do that, tax all income at %100 if you aren’t enrolled to vote. Makes more sense than the take away the benefit option. At least it is somewhat equitable and not just a stick to hit the vunerable with…
Except as you point out for overstayers. Or people with highly dysfunctional lives for whom this kind of bureaucracy IS onerous.
You can’t see your WINZ case officer until you make an appointment. (It’s a security precaution). What do you mean you don’t have money to get the phone or internet connected to make an appointment? See your WINZ case officer to sort that out. You’ll need to make an appointment.
The comfy middle class don’t have a fucking clue on how the other half of NZ live, is the issue.
Ok, so you have an appointment. But I don’t have a car and there’s not cheap public transport and the appointment is during the day when my mate with their car is at work.
Why did you miss your appointment? My kid was sick. Why didn’t you phone? I have no credit on my phone until next pay day.
etc, etc, etc ad nauseum
The list of barriers to what trp said is huge. His ignorance or lack of care on this matter is actually pretty gobsmacking for a leftie.
And once you’ve missed a couple of appointments even for reasons out of your control you get classed as a waste of time and its pretty much all over from there.
Or I have three kids under 5, no child support because father has done a runner , live 5 miles from the nearest library (or maybe in the wilds of the provinces 50 miles) don’t have a mate with a car and there is no public transport.
It’s actually a requirement that beneficiaries have a phone nowadays. This despite the fact that many beneficiaries can’t actually afford a phone. Even topping up a prepay by the minimum of $20 can be daunting.
nope the state benefits should not depend on wether someone has the money to call for an appointment, then find the way to a Winz office (no car could be an issue, busses? cost a lot of money that no benefit caters for, somone to look after the kids – ah just fuck it).
Oh so maybe they could go to a Library and use the computer there? And down load the paperwork to fill out and stuff….? See above, no car, no transport etc etc etc etc etc etc etc
Benefits should be given to people in Need. The only factor that should count in the giving out of benefits to people should be NEED! not an enrollment to the electoral votes.
The people that I know that did not vote the last time, where White, Male, Working, MIddle Class and they could not be fucked!
The ones that I know voted, included the mother on a 0 hour contract and winz benefits. The elderly lady that paid herself a taxi to get to vote, the rumanian migrants and so on and so on.
Again the ones that did not vote, white, working, male, middleclass and a can’t be arsed or fucked attitude. Go figure.
Once again – I just have to let you all know that probably what Tim Barnett was saying is NOT Labour Party policy, nor do I ever think it will be Labour Party policy, and they would not be stating its Labour Party policy.
Whoever it was putting up that submission was merely making a suggestion to the select committee.
I think the basic point is this: a comment from the general secretary :
“” <> “”
and it is not at all clear from that Herald story as to who in the Labour Party might have made such a submission – but it is quite clear that Tim Barnett is saying this is NOT a current LP policy, but its something other countries are doing and is this something NZ should look at. A question. Not a recommendation.
Its bad enough when the MSM twists things that Labour people say – its blinkin’ lousy when supposedly leftwing posters on The Standard do it too.
i wd submit that a component of a labour party ‘ submission to the Justice and Electoral Select Committee’…
..is not a matter of no significance…
(or are you saying it is..?..)
and how exactly is the reporting of this fact of this submission..’twisting things”..?
..this is what the submission – by the labour party (authored by whoever..?..won’t the proud parent stand up..?..)- to the Justice and Electoral Select Committee..said..
..and the comparison with australia – used by barnett – is putting the cart before the horse/comparing apples and oranges.. – as aust has compulsory-voting..we don’t..
..and jenny – if national were proposing something like this – would you not be protesting that..?..in this forum..?
Oops – dunno what happened to it, but my post above didn’t include the Barnett quote – about it being just a question to the committee, a request to investigate it – and that it is NOT Labour policy.
This is what he said. (And incidentally, I don’t agree with him on this matter, and I bet heaps of other Labour people don’t either !)
“It’s not party policy, it’s merely saying, what are the things that could be done? And in Australia that is the system which they formally adopt.”
Why would we want to follow the policies of a country that elected someone who might be related to a 20th century family called Abbottini, neighbours of Mussolini?
you test waters to see what the reaction is going to be like and then adjust your plans accordingly – and to ensure there is no further misunderstanding from you – I do not like the idea or the ideology behind it – I hope that is sufficient for an understanding, of what i am saying, from you.
Its not a brain-fart PU – from any official Labour Party policy or statement.
It was just one person’s comment.
Can you please get that into your head. refer to my post at 12.2
I miss the good old days when Labour said good/constructive things would happen that would benefit people’s lives, and then shortly afterwards, they did. When did it get so muddled and complicated? Is there any way we could go back to that kind of politics?
Yeah yeah I know, things have “changed” and only “dinosaurs” want clear policy statements or action anymore. Hooray for TXTSPK and rumours… mumble mumble…
“Labour has proposed withholding state support such as tax credits and Working For Families from people who are not enrolled to vote.
The measure could be justified if it lifts New Zealand’s low voter turnout, the party says.
Getting the vote out is a priority for Labour and in its submission to the Justice and Electoral Select Committee, written by Labour’s general secretary Tim Barnett, the party argues for the idea to be considered.”
maybe such confusion would not be coming up if the supposed leftwing party of New Zealand would finally come up with something that would exite people.
You know….like building houses for young people so they can get married and have kids. ( i know of a few couples that would love to rent a nice place to start their lifes together, alas they are not making enough to cover $ 2200 per month before any expenses or food).
You know…. like promoting long tenancies in private rentals so that families with kids could send their kids to THE ONE SCHOOL for like two years in a row, instead of having to pack up and move about ever friggin 6 month.
You know…..like upping the benefits for unemployed, single parents, the young ones etc etc etc could have a phone to phone WINZ for an appointment and eat….I know its a novelty.
I only want Labour to speak about these things…not about finding a way to punish the already punished for not being on the electoral roll….
How does Labour suppose to punish those not on the roll and not on a benefit? Like National punishes Tax Evader? With even bigger loopholes?
ffs…this is why no one is bothering to Labour and some of their die hard supporters anymore, because of some fuckwit that wants to out do Paula Bennett.
It’s not banning poor people, but banning older vehicles. Sure, that will impact on poor people most under current conditions but we should be questioning if everyone should have a car anyway as doing so costs so much. Or perhaps that should be a question of if anyone should have cars.
A government with guts would make it law that all personal cars would be electric in 10/15 years. Just have to put ruc charges on them to pay for the roads.
I’m looking at heat exchange from brick paved back yards.
Wikipedia on geothermal energy is interesting. What other countries do to use this for domestic use rather than just industrial as we do is interesting. (I don’t think Maori use, which extends back centuries is being counted here.) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geothermal_heating
This is the sort of thing that progressive, thoughtful, and smart countries are doing to use technology that could be thought of as green and sustainable. The cities of Reykjavík and Akureyri pipe hot water from geothermal plants under roads and pavements to melt snow. Geothermal desalination has been demonstrated.
Geothermal systems tend to benefit from economies of scale, so space heating power is often distributed to multiple buildings, sometimes whole communities.
This technique, long practiced throughout the world in locations such as Reykjavík, Iceland,[5] Boise, Idaho,[6] and Klamath Falls, Oregon[7] is known as district heating.[8] Turkey seems to be high in this use.
Background –
” Most high temperature geothermal heat is harvested in regions close to tectonic plate boundaries where volcanic activity rises close to the surface of the Earth. In these areas, ground and groundwater can be found with temperatures higher than the target temperature of the application….
even cold ground contains heat, below 6 metres (20 ft) the undisturbed ground temperature is consistently at the Mean Annual Air Temperature[3] and it may be extracted with a heat pump.”…
“Direct geothermal heating is far more efficient than geothermal electricity generation and has less demanding temperature requirements, so it is viable over a large geographical range.
If the shallow ground is hot but dry, air or water may be circulated through earth tubes or downhole heat exchangers which act as heat exchangers with the ground.”
Looking at an old BBC History magazine I saw they were recalling an earlier September attack on New York than 2001. This was in 1920 when ‘a cart packed with explosives was detonated’ outside the headquarters of JP Morgan. The perpetrators,causing 38 deaths, were never confirmed but may have been followers of the Italian anarchist Luigi Galleani.’
The site 23 Wall Street still bears the shrapnel scars of 90 years ago.
International “free trade pacts” (NAFTA, TPP, TAFTA) are supposed to increase global GDP, thereby making us all richer and effectively expanding the size of the earth and easing conflict. But growth in the full world has become uneconomic–increasing costs faster than benefits. It now makes us poorer, not richer. These secretly negotiated agreements among the elites are designed to benefit private global corporations, often at the expense of the public good of nations. Some think that strengthening global corporations by erasing national boundaries will reduce the likelihood of war. More likely we will just shift to feudal corporate wars in a post-national global commons, with corporate fiefdoms effectively buying national governments and their armies, supplemented by already existing private mercenaries.
In fact, that latter bit is inevitable. There’s no real difference between and the feudal society that preceded it. both are about putting a few people above everyone else in wealth and power and having everyone else pay for it.
Is Labour, or rather the hierarchy (cf. membership), trying immensely hard at working, full steam ahead and on the offensive, on connecting with ‘voters’ ?
Whatever was said in that select committee meting, tinfoilhat and Kiwiri – that is NOT Labour policy, nor has anyone raised it as a possible Labour policy.
IN 1984 we were taken unawares and they hid the economic agenda behind the antinuclear credentials. If they do the same again what are they going to fob us off with to try to pretend to be a Labour party.
It’s good of you to run with The Herald‘s framing of the issue. When they say “proposed”, what exactly did Labour say?
There are advantages and potential disadvantages to the approach, but it is utilised in other countries and we submit that it is incumbent on us to examine all options to see if they are feasible in our context.
That’s the way: it’s important to confine all ideas to the ones you approve of, and a good way to do that is to pretend discussion of outliers is exactly the same as supporting them.
Nice one.
As for the merits of the proposal. I think that before penalising non-enrolled voters, we should penalise anyone who adopts a deliberate strategy of voter discouragement.
+1 PU.
I can’t imagine how this appalling idea got to the submission stage. It may not be current policy, or even likely to become policy, but the idea that someone in a senior position in the Labour Party should even consider it is a good idea is beyond me. Very, very damaging.
No evidence Barnett sought coverage. Media will have been covering the committee, and the Labour Partry should simply be smart enough by now to not provide leads to them like this.
Not that I agree with the proposal to look at the idea (or maybe I do – seems logical to look at things that may provide the desired outcome) but it’s not in the realms of beneficiary bashing is it?
I thought working for families was an employment-related payment?
It’s worth taking a look at the comments on this crazy website National have set up to somehow try and get populous buy-in of this change the flag diversion.
Roughly 3/5 comments disagree with the proposed change altogether. This could turn into another Northland type misfire for Key and another nail in his coffin.
Something I hadn’t considered is raised by this comment:
“…the government tell us the cost to change the flag is $26,000,000 for referendum but the cost to change every flag in every school, building, businesses, NZ Army uniforms, vehicles, NZ Police, NZ Navy the list would be endless – it’s a joke. $26 million is only the start”
The archdruid has been very provocative over his last few posts I have thought but the logic is inescapable and like all great writers with ideas he presents them with a style and content that I find complete and beautiful.
Energy needed to extract energy, again, can’t be used for any other purpose. It doesn’t contribute to the energy surplus that makes economic development possible. As the energy industry itself takes a bigger bite out of each year’s energy production, every other economic activity loses part of the fuel that makes it run. That, in turn, is the core reason why the American economy is on the ropes, America’s infrastructure is falling to bits—and Americans in Detroit and Baltimore are facing a transition to Third World conditions, without electricity or running water.
I suspect, for what it’s worth, that the shutoff notices being mailed to tens of thousands of poor families in those two cities are a good working model for the way that industrial civilization itself will wind down. It won’t be sudden; for decades to come, there will still be people who have access to what Americans today consider the ordinary necessities and comforts of everyday life; there will just be fewer of them each year. Outside that narrowing circle, the number of economic nonpersons will grow steadily, one shutoff notice at a time.
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Struts are an essential part of a car’s suspension system. They are responsible for supporting the weight of the car and damping the oscillations of the springs. Struts are typically made of steel or aluminum and are filled with hydraulic fluid. How Do Struts Work? Struts work by transferring the ...
Car registration is a mandatory process that all vehicle owners must complete annually. This process involves registering your car with the Department of Motor Vehicles (DMV) and paying an associated fee. The registration process ensures that your vehicle is properly licensed and insured, and helps law enforcement and other authorities ...
Zoom is a video conferencing service that allows you to share your screen, webcam, and audio with other participants. In addition to sharing your own audio, you can also share the audio from your computer with other participants. This can be useful for playing music, sharing presentations with audio, or ...
Building your own computer can be a rewarding and cost-effective way to get a high-performance machine tailored to your specific needs. However, it also requires careful planning and execution, and one of the most important factors to consider is the time it will take. The exact time it takes to ...
Sleep mode is a power-saving state that allows your computer to quickly resume operation without having to boot up from scratch. This can be useful if you need to step away from your computer for a short period of time but don’t want to shut it down completely. There are ...
Introduction Computer-Assisted Translation (CAT) has revolutionized the field of translation by harnessing the power of technology to assist human translators in their work. This innovative approach combines specialized software with human expertise to improve the efficiency, accuracy, and consistency of translations. In this comprehensive article, we will delve into the ...
In today’s digital age, mobile devices have become an indispensable part of our daily lives. Among the vast array of portable computing options available, iPads and tablet computers stand out as two prominent contenders. While both offer similar functionalities, there are subtle yet significant differences between these two devices. This ...
A computer is an electronic device that can be programmed to carry out a set of instructions. The basic components of a computer are the processor, memory, storage, input devices, and output devices. The Processor The processor, also known as the central processing unit (CPU), is the brain of the ...
Voice Memos is a convenient app on your iPhone that allows you to quickly record and store audio snippets. These recordings can be useful for a variety of purposes, such as taking notes, capturing ideas, or recording interviews. While you can listen to your voice memos on your iPhone, you ...
Laptop screens are essential for interacting with our devices and accessing information. However, when lines appear on the screen, it can be frustrating and disrupt productivity. Understanding the underlying causes of these lines is crucial for finding effective solutions. Types of Screen Lines Horizontal lines: Also known as scan ...
Right-clicking is a common and essential computer operation that allows users to access additional options and settings. While most desktop computers have dedicated right-click buttons on their mice, laptops often do not have these buttons due to space limitations. This article will provide a comprehensive guide on how to right-click ...
Powering up and shutting down your ASUS laptop is an essential task for any laptop user. Locating the power button can sometimes be a hassle, especially if you’re new to ASUS laptops. This article will provide a comprehensive guide on where to find the power button on different ASUS laptop ...
Dell laptops are renowned for their reliability, performance, and versatility. Whether you’re a student, a professional, or just someone who needs a reliable computing device, a Dell laptop can meet your needs. However, if you’re new to Dell laptops, you may be wondering how to get started. In this comprehensive ...
Two-thirds of the country think that “New Zealand’s economy is rigged to advantage the rich and powerful”. They also believe that “New Zealand needs a strong leader to take the country back from the rich and powerful”. These are just two of a handful of stunning new survey results released ...
In today’s digital world, screenshots have become an indispensable tool for communication and documentation. Whether you need to capture an important email, preserve a website page, or share an error message, screenshots allow you to quickly and easily preserve digital information. If you’re an Asus laptop user, there are several ...
A factory reset restores your Gateway laptop to its original factory settings, erasing all data, apps, and personalizations. This can be necessary to resolve software issues, remove viruses, or prepare your laptop for sale or transfer. Here’s a step-by-step guide on how to factory reset your Gateway laptop: Method 1: ...
“You talking about me?”The neoliberal denigration of the past was nowhere more unrelenting than in its depiction of the public service. The Post Office and the Railways were held up as being both irremediably inefficient and scandalously over-manned. Playwright Roger Hall’s “Glide Time” caricatures were presented as accurate depictions of ...
Roger Partridge writes – When the Coalition Government took office last October, it inherited a country on a precipice. With persistent inflation, decades of insipid productivity growth and crises in healthcare, education, housing and law and order, it is no exaggeration to suggest New Zealand’s first-world status was ...
Rob MacCulloch writes – In 2022, the Curriculum Centre at the Ministry of Education employed 308 staff, according to an Official Information Request. Earlier this week it was announced 202 of those staff were being cut. When you look up “The New Zealand Curriculum” on the Ministry of ...
Chris Bishop’s bill has stirred up a hornets nest of opposition. Photo: Lynn Grieveson for The KākāTL;DR: The six things that stood out to me in Aotearoa’s political economy around housing, poverty and climate from the last day included:A crescendo of opposition to the Government’s Fast Track Approvals Bill is ...
Monday left me brokenTuesday, I was through with hopingWednesday, my empty arms were openThursday, waiting for love, waiting for loveThe end of another week that left many of us asking WTF? What on earth has NZ gotten itself into and how on earth could people have voluntarily signed up for ...
Hello! Here comes the Saturday edition of More Than A Feilding, catching you up on the past week’s editions.State of humanity, 20242024, it feels, keeps presenting us with ever more challenges, ever more dismay.Do you give up yet? It seems to ask.No? How about this? Or this?How about this?Full story Share ...
Determining the hardest sport in the world is a subjective matter, as the difficulty level can vary depending on individual abilities, physical attributes, and experience. However, based on various factors including physical demands, technical skills, mental fortitude, and overall accomplishment, here is an exploration of some of the most challenging ...
The allure of sport transcends age, culture, and geographical boundaries. It captivates hearts, ignites passions, and provides unparalleled entertainment. Behind the spectacle, however, lies a fascinating world of financial investment and expenditure. Among the vast array of competitive pursuits, one question looms large: which sport carries the hefty title of ...
Introduction Pickleball, a rapidly growing paddle sport, has captured the hearts and imaginations of millions around the world. Its blend of tennis, badminton, and table tennis elements has made it a favorite among players of all ages and skill levels. As the sport’s popularity continues to surge, the question on ...
Abstract: Soccer, the global phenomenon captivating millions worldwide, has a rich history that spans centuries. Its origins trace back to ancient civilizations, but the modern version we know and love emerged through a complex interplay of cultural influences and innovations. This article delves into the fascinating journey of soccer’s evolution, ...
Tinting car windows offers numerous benefits, including enhanced privacy, reduced glare, UV protection, and a more stylish look for your vehicle. However, the cost of window tinting can vary significantly depending on several factors. This article provides a comprehensive guide to help you understand how much you can expect to ...
The pungent smell of gasoline in your car can be an alarming and potentially dangerous problem. Not only is the odor unpleasant, but it can also indicate a serious issue with your vehicle’s fuel system. In this article, we will explore the various reasons why your car may smell like ...
Our two-tiered system for veterans’ support is out of step with our closest partners, and all parties in Parliament should work together to fix it, Labour veterans’ affairs spokesperson Greg O’Connor said. ...
Stripping two Ministers of their portfolios just six months into the job shows Christopher Luxon’s management style is lacking, Labour Leader Chris Hipkins said. ...
It appears Nicola Willis is about to pull the rug out from under the feet of local communities still dealing with the aftermath of last year’s severe weather, and local councils relying on funding to build back from these disasters. ...
The Government is making short-sighted changes to the Resource Management Act (RMA) that will take away environmental protection in favour of short-term profits, Labour’s environment spokesperson Rachel Brooking said today. ...
Labour welcomes the release of the report into the North Island weather events and looks forward to working with the Government to ensure that New Zealand is as prepared as it can be for the next natural disaster. ...
The Labour Party has called for the New Zealand Government to recognise Palestine, as a material step towards progressing the two-State solution needed to achieve a lasting peace in the region. ...
Some of our country’s most important work, stopping the sexual exploitation of children and violent extremism could go along with staff on the frontline at ports and airports. ...
The Government’s Fast Track Approvals Bill will give projects such as new coal mines a ‘get out of jail free’ card to wreak havoc on the environment, Labour Leader Chris Hipkins said today. ...
Cuts to frontline hospital staff are not only a broken election promise, it shows the reckless tax cuts have well and truly hit the frontline of the health system, says Labour Health spokesperson Ayesha Verrall. ...
The Green Party has joined the call for public submissions on the fast-track legislation to be extended after the Ombudsman forced the Government to release the list of organisations invited to apply just hours before submissions close. ...
New Zealand’s good work at reducing climate emissions for three years in a row will be undone by the National government’s lack of ambition and scrapping programmes that were making a difference, Labour Party climate spokesperson Megan Woods said today. ...
More essential jobs could be on the chopping block, this time Ministry of Education staff on the school lunches team are set to find out whether they're in line to lose their jobs. ...
The Government is trying to bring in a law that will allow Ministers to cut corners and kill off native species, Labour environment spokesperson Rachel Brooking said. ...
Cancelling urgently needed new Cook Strait ferries and hiking the cost of public transport for many Kiwis so that National can announce the prospect of another tunnel for Wellington is not making good choices, Labour Transport Spokesperson Tangi Utikere said. ...
A laundry list of additional costs for Tāmaki Makarau Auckland shows the Minister for the city is not delivering for the people who live there, says Labour Auckland Issues spokesperson Shanan Halbert. ...
The Green Party has today launched a step-by-step guide to help New Zealanders make their voice heard on the Government’s democracy dodging and anti-environment fast track legislation. ...
The National Government’s proposed changes to the Residential Tenancies Act will mean tenants can be turfed from their homes by landlords with little notice, Labour housing spokesperson Kieran McAnulty said. ...
Green Party co-leader Marama Davidson is calling on all parties to support a common-sense change that’s great for the planet and great for consumers after her member’s bill was drawn from the ballot today. ...
A significant milestone has been reached in the fight to strike an anti-Pasifika and unfair law from the country’s books after Teanau Tuiono’s members’ bill passed its first reading. ...
New Zealand has today missed the opportunity to uphold the right to a clean, healthy, and sustainable environment, says James Shaw after his member’s bill was voted down in its first reading. ...
Today’s advice from the Climate Change Commission paints a sobering reality of the challenge we face in combating climate change, especially in light of recent Government policy announcements. ...
Minister for Disability Issues Penny Simmonds appears to have delayed a report back to Cabinet on the progress New Zealand is making against international obligations for disabled New Zealanders. ...
The Government’s newly announced review of methane emissions reduction targets hints at its desire to delay Aotearoa New Zealand’s urgent transition to a climate safe future, the Green Party said. ...
The Government must commit to the Maitai School building project for students with high and complex needs, to ensure disabled students from the top of the South Island have somewhere to learn. ...
Mental Health Minister Matt Doocey and his Government colleagues have made a meal of their mental health commitments, showing how flimsy their efforts to champion the issue truly are, says Labour Mental Health spokesperson Ingrid Leary. ...
Paul Goldsmith will take on responsibility for the Media and Communications portfolio, while Louise Upston will pick up the Disability Issues portfolio, Prime Minister Christopher Luxon announced today. “Our Government is relentlessly focused on getting New Zealand back on track. As issues change in prominence, I plan to adjust Ministerial ...
Recreational catch limits will be reduced in areas of Fiordland and the Chatham Islands to help keep those fisheries healthy and sustainable, Oceans and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones says. The lower recreational daily catch limits for a range of finfish and shellfish species caught in the Fiordland Marine Area and ...
Energy Minister Simeon Brown has welcomed an important milestone in New Zealand’s hydrogen future, with the opening of the country’s first network of hydrogen refuelling stations in Wiri. “I want to congratulate the team at Hiringa Energy and its partners K one W one (K1W1), Mitsui & Co New Zealand ...
The coalition Government is delivering on its commitment to improve resource management laws and give greater certainty to consent applicants, with a Bill to amend the Resource Management Act (RMA) expected to be introduced to Parliament next month. RMA Reform Minister Chris Bishop has today outlined the first RMA Amendment ...
Overseas models for regulating the oil and gas sector, including their decommissioning regimes, are being carefully scrutinised as a potential template for New Zealand’s own sector, Resources Minister Shane Jones says. The Coalition Government is focused on rebuilding investor confidence in New Zealand’s energy sector as it looks to strengthen ...
Emergency Management and Recovery Minister Mark Mitchell has today released the Report of the Government Inquiry into the response to the North Island Severe Weather Events. “The report shows that New Zealand’s emergency management system is not fit-for-purpose and there are some significant gaps we need to address,” Mr Mitchell ...
Justice Minister Paul Goldsmith is today travelling to Europe where he’ll update the United Nations Human Rights Council on the Government’s work to restore law and order. “Attending the Universal Periodic Review in Geneva provides us with an opportunity to present New Zealand’s human rights progress, priorities, and challenges, while ...
Associate Agriculture Minister, Mark Patterson, formally reopened the world’s largest wool processing facility today in Awatoto, Napier, following a $50 million rebuild and refurbishment project. “The reopening of this facility will significantly lift the economic opportunities available to New Zealand’s wool sector, which already accounts for 20 per cent of ...
Hon Andrew Bayly, Minister for Small Business and Manufacturing At the Southland Otago Regional Engineering Collective (SOREC) Summit, 18 April, Dunedin Ngā mihi nui, Ko Andrew Bayly aho, Ko Whanganui aho Good Afternoon and thank you for inviting me to open your summit today. I am delighted ...
The Government is delivering on its commitment to bring back the Three Strikes legislation, Associate Justice Minister Nicole McKee announced today. “Our Government is committed to restoring law and order and enforcing appropriate consequences on criminals. We are making it clear that repeat serious violent or sexual offending is not ...
Foreign Minister Winston Peters has today announced four new diplomatic appointments for New Zealand’s overseas missions. “Our diplomats have a vital role in maintaining and protecting New Zealand’s interests around the world,” Mr Peters says. “I am pleased to announce the appointment of these senior diplomats from the ...
New Zealand is contributing NZ$7 million to support communities affected by severe food insecurity and other urgent humanitarian needs in Ethiopia and Somalia, Foreign Minister Rt Hon Winston Peters announced today. “Over 21 million people are in need of humanitarian assistance across Ethiopia, with a further 6.9 million people ...
Minister for Arts, Culture and Heritage Paul Goldsmith is congratulating Mataaho Collective for winning the Golden Lion for best participant in the main exhibition at the Venice Biennale. "Congratulations to the Mataaho Collective for winning one of the world's most prestigious art prizes at the Venice Biennale. “It is good ...
The Government is reforming financial services to improve access to home loans and other lending, and strengthen customer protections, Commerce and Consumer Affairs Minister Andrew Bayly and Housing Minister Chris Bishop announced today. “Our coalition Government is committed to rebuilding the economy and making life simpler by cutting red tape. We are ...
“China remains a strong commercial opportunity for Kiwi exporters as Chinese businesses and consumers continue to value our high-quality safe produce,” Trade and Agriculture Minister Todd McClay says. Mr McClay has returned to New Zealand following visits to Beijing, Harbin and Shanghai where he met ministers, governors and mayors and engaged in trade and agricultural events with the New ...
Prime Minister Christopher Luxon has completed a successful trip to Singapore, Thailand and the Philippines, deepening relationships and capitalising on opportunities. Mr Luxon was accompanied by a business delegation and says the choice of countries represents the priority the New Zealand Government places on South East Asia, and our relationships in ...
New Zealand is demonstrating its commitment to reducing global greenhouse emissions, and supporting clean energy transition in South East Asia, through a contribution of NZ$41 million (US$25 million) in climate finance to the Asian Development Bank (ADB)-led Energy Transition Mechanism (ETM). Prime Minister Christopher Luxon and Climate Change Minister Simon Watts announced ...
The Government is today releasing a list of organisations who received letters about the Fast-track applications process, says RMA Reform Minister Chris Bishop. “Recently Ministers and agencies have received a series of OIA requests for a list of organisations to whom I wrote with information on applying to have a ...
Attorney-General Judith Collins today announced the appointment of Wellington Barrister David Jonathan Boldt as a Judge of the High Court, and the Honourable Justice Matthew Palmer as a Judge of the Court of Appeal. Justice Boldt graduated with an LLB from Victoria University of Wellington in 1990, and also holds ...
Education Minister Erica Stanford will lead the New Zealand delegation at the 2024 International Summit on the Teaching Profession (ISTP) held in Singapore. The delegation includes representatives from the Post Primary Teachers’ Association (PPTA) Te Wehengarua and the New Zealand Educational Institute (NZEI) Te Riu Roa. The summit is co-hosted ...
A stopbank upgrade project in Tairawhiti partly funded by the Government has increased flood resilience for around 7000ha of residential and horticultural land so far, Regional Development Minister Shane Jones says. Mr Jones today attended a dawn service in Gisborne to mark the end of the first stage of the ...
Foreign Affairs Minister Winston Peters will represent the Government at Anzac Day commemorations on the Gallipoli Peninsula next week and engage with senior representatives of the Turkish government in Istanbul. “The Gallipoli campaign is a defining event in our history. It will be a privilege to share the occasion ...
Science, Innovation and Technology and Defence Minister Judith Collins will next week attend the OECD Science and Technology Ministerial conference in Paris and Anzac Day commemorations in Belgium. “Science, innovation and technology have a major role to play in rebuilding our economy and achieving better health, environmental and social outcomes ...
Prime Minister Christopher Luxon held a bilateral meeting today with the President of the Philippines, Ferdinand Marcos Jr. The Prime Minister was accompanied by MP Paulo Garcia, the first Filipino to be elected to a legislature outside the Philippines. During today’s meeting, Prime Minister Luxon and President Marcos Jr discussed opportunities to ...
The Government has announced that $20 million in funding will be made available to Westport to fund much needed flood protection around the town. This measure will significantly improve the resilience of the community, says Local Government Minister Simeon Brown. “The Westport community has already been allocated almost $3 million ...
The Government is proud to support the first ever Repco Supercars Championship event in Taupō as up to 70,000 motorsport fans attend the Taupō International Motorsport Park this weekend, says Economic Development Minister Melissa Lee. “Anticipation for the ITM Taupō Super400 is huge, with tickets and accommodation selling out weeks ...
Local Government Minister Simeon Brown has announced an increase to the Rates Rebate Scheme, putting money back into the pockets of low-income homeowners. “The coalition Government is committed to bringing down the cost of living for New Zealanders. That includes targeted support for those Kiwis who are doing things tough, such ...
The Coalition Government is investing in a project to boost survival rates of New Zealand mussels and grow the industry, Oceans and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones has announced. “This project seeks to increase the resilience of our mussels and significantly boost the sector’s productivity,” Mr Jones says. “The project - ...
Benefit figures released today underscore the importance of the Government’s plan to rebuild the economy and have 50,000 fewer people on Jobseeker Support, Social Development and Employment Minister Louise Upston says. “Benefit numbers are still significantly higher than when National was last in government, when there was about 70,000 fewer ...
The Government’s commitment to doubling New Zealand’s renewable energy capacity is backed by new data showing that clean energy has helped the country reach its lowest annual gross emissions since 1999, Climate Change Minister Simon Watts says. New Zealand’s latest Greenhouse Gas Inventory (1990-2022) published today, shows gross emissions fell ...
The Government is bringing the earthquake-prone building review forward, with work to start immediately, and extending the deadline for remediations by four years, Building and Construction Minister Chris Penk says. “Our Government is focused on rebuilding the economy. A key part of our plan is to cut red tape that ...
Prime Minister Christopher Luxon and his Thai counterpart, Prime Minister Srettha Thavisin, have today agreed that New Zealand and the Kingdom of Thailand will upgrade the bilateral relationship to a Strategic Partnership by 2026. “New Zealand and Thailand have a lot to offer each other. We have a strong mutual desire to build ...
RMA Reform Minister Chris Bishop and Transport Minister Simeon Brown have today announced the Coalition Government’s intention to extend port coastal permits for a further 20 years, providing port operators with certainty to continue their operations. “The introduction of the Resource Management Act in 1991 required ports to obtain coastal ...
Today’s announcement that inflation is down to 4 per cent is encouraging news for Kiwis, but there is more work to be done - underlining the importance of the Government’s plan to get the economy back on track, acting Finance Minister Chris Bishop says. “Inflation is now at 4 per ...
Refreshed health guidance released today will help parents and schools make informed decisions about whether their child needs to be in school, addressing one of the key issues affecting school attendance, says Associate Education Minister David Seymour. In recent years, consistently across all school terms, short-term illness or medical reasons ...
Oceans and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones is streamlining high-level oceans management while maintaining a focus on supporting the sector’s role in the export-led recovery of the economy. “I am working to realise the untapped potential of our fishing and aquaculture sector. To achieve that we need to be smarter with ...
Associate Agriculture Minister Mark Patterson is speaking at the International Wool Textile Organisation Congress in Adelaide, promoting New Zealand wool, and outlining the coalition Government’s support for the revitalisation the sector. "New Zealand’s wool exports reached $400 million in the year to 30 June 2023, and the coalition Government ...
The Government is making legislative changes to make it easier for new early learning services to be established, and for existing services to operate, Associate Education Minister David Seymour says. The changes involve repealing the network approval provisions that apply when someone wants to establish a new early learning service, ...
Changes to the Resource Management Act will align consenting for coal mining to other forms of mining to reduce barriers that are holding back economic development, Resources Minister Shane Jones says. “The inconsistent treatment of coal mining compared with other extractive activities is burdensome red tape that fails to acknowledge ...
Trade, Agriculture and Forestry Minister Todd McClay has concluded productive discussions with ministerial counterparts in Beijing today, in support of the New Zealand-China trade and economic relationship. “My meeting with Commerce Minister Wang Wentao reaffirmed the complementary nature of the bilateral trade relationship, with our Free Trade Agreement at its ...
Asia Pacific Report Students and activist staff at Australia’s University of Sydney (USyd) have set up a Gaza solidarity encampment in support of Palestinians and similar student-led protests in the United States. The camp was pitched as mass graves, crippled hospitals, thousands of civilian deaths and the near-total destruction of ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By James B. Dorey, Lecturer in Biological Sciences, University of Wollongong Australian teddy bear bees are cute and fluffy, but get a look at that massive (unbarbed) stinger! James Dorey Photography Most of us have been stung by a bee and we ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Jen Roberts, Senior Lecturer, School of Humanities and Social Inquiry, University of Wollongong Aussie~mobs/FlickrVictor Farr, a private in the 1st Infantry Battalion, was among the first to land at Anzac Cove just before dawn on April 25 1915. Victor Farr ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Gregory Moore, Senior Research Associate, School of Ecosystem and Forest Sciences, The University of Melbourne Gregory Moore I had the good fortune to care for the sugar gum at The University of Melbourne’s Burnley Gardens in Victoria where I worked for ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By John Hawkins, Senior Lecturer, Canberra School of Politics, Economics and Society, University of Canberra BagzhanSadvakassov/Upsplash, CC BY-SA Australia’s inflation rate has fallen for the fifth successive quarter, and it’s now less than half of what it was back in late 2022. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Rachel Ong ViforJ, ARC Future Fellow & Professor of Economics, Curtin University Just when we think the price of rentals could not get any worse, this week’s Rental Affordability Snapshot by Anglicare has revealed low-income Australians are facing a housing crisis like ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Meighen McCrae, Associate Professor of Strategic & Defence Studies, Australian National University American and Australian stretcher bearers working together near the front line during the Battle of Hamel in 1918.Australian War Memorial While the AUKUS alliance is new, the Australian-American partnership ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Tracey Holmes, Professorial Fellow in Sport, University of Canberra When the news broke last weekend that 23 Chinese swimmers had tested positive to a banned drug in early 2021 and were allowed to compete at the Tokyo Olympic Games six months later ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Cally Jetta, Senior Lecturer and Academic Lead; College for First Nations, University of Southern Queensland Australian War MemorialAboriginal and Torres Strait Islander readers are advised this article contains names and images of deceased people, as well as sensitive historical information ...
RNZ News Melissa Lee has been ousted from New Zealand’s coalition cabinet and stripped of the Media portfolio, and Penny Simmonds has lost the Disability Issues portfolio in a reshuffle. Climate Change and Revenue Minister Simon Watts will take Lee’s spot in cabinet. Simmonds was a minister outside of cabinet. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By David Lindenmayer, Professor, Fenner School of Environment and Society, Australian National University laurello/Shutterstock Some reports and popular books, such as Bill Gammage’s Biggest Estate on Earth, have argued that extensive areas of Australia’s forests were kept open through frequent burning by ...
Analysis - Christopher Luxon framing the demotion of two ministers as the portfolios getting "too complex" is a charitable way of saying they weren't up to the job. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Michelle Grattan, Professorial Fellow, University of Canberra With Jim Chalmers’s third budget on May 14, Australians will be looking for some more cost-of-living relief – beyond the tax cuts – although they have been warned extra measures will be modest. As ...
Analysis: Melissa Lee has lost the media portfolio and her spot in Cabinet after multiple failed attempts to find solutions for a media industry in crisis. On Wednesday, the Prime Minister announced Lee would be losing her spot in Cabinet along with her media and communications ministerial portfolio. The job ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Simon Wilmot, Senior Lecturer, Film, Deakin University Among the many Australian who served during the second world war, there is a small group of people whose stories remain largely untold. These are the Muslim men and women who, while small in number, ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Kelly Saunders, PhD Candidate, University of Canberra There has been much analysis and praise of Justice Michael Lee’s recent judgement in Bruce Lehrmann’s defamation case against Channel Ten. Many people were openly relieved to read Lee’s “forensic” and “nuanced” application of law ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Kathy Gibbs, Program Director for the Bachelor of Education, Griffith University zEdward_Indy/Shutterstock Around one in 20 people has attention-deficit hyperactivity disorder (ADHD). It’s one of the most common neurodevelopmental disorders in childhood and often continues into adulthood. ADHD is diagnosed ...
The Fairer Future coalition of anti-poverty groups say Whaikaha must be properly funded going forward, and that to argue that poor financial management of the new Ministry is a red herring by the Prime Minister. ...
The Taxpayers’ Union is today congratulating Hon. Paul Goldsmith on his appointment as Minister for Media and Communications and urges him to rule out state intervention in the private media sector. ...
Asia Pacific Report The West Papuan resistance OPM leader has condemned Australian Prime Minister Anthony Albanese and US President Joe Biden, accusing their countries of “six decades of treachery” over Papuan independence. The open letter was released today by OPM chairman Jeffrey P Bomanak on the eve of ANZAC Day ...
Welcome to The Spinoff Books Confessional, in which we get to know the reading habits and quirks of New Zealanders at large. This week: writer and one of Time Magazine’s 100 most influential people of 2024, Lauren Groff.The book I wish I’d writtenIf I wish I’d written a ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By David Fechner, Research Fellow, Social Marketing, Griffith University mavo/Shutterstock Imagine having dinner at a restaurant. The menu offers plant-based meat alternatives made mostly from vegetables, mushrooms, legumes and wheat that mimic meat in taste, texture and smell. Despite being given that ...
“Three Strikes is a dead-end policy proposed by a dead-end government. The Three Strikes law ignores the causes of crime, instead just brutalising people already crushed by the cost of living.” ...
By Don Wiseman, RNZ Pacific senior journalist An Australian-born judge in Kiribati could well face deportation later this week after a tribunal ruling that he should be removed from his post. The tribunal’s report has just been tabled in the Kiribati Parliament and is due to be debated by MPs ...
With its clear mandate for police use, political nuances, and nuanced public trust, Denmark's insights provide valuable considerations for Australia and New Zealand. ...
Books editor Claire Mabey reviews poet Louise Wallace’s debut novel. A famous poet once said to me that he’s always suspicious when a poet publishes a novel. I never really understood why but maybe it’s something to do with cheating on your first form. Louise Wallace is a poet. She’s ...
For a few months at the turn of the millennium, TrueBliss burned bright as the biggest pop stars in the country. Alex Casey chats to two superfans who still hold the flame. During a humble backyard wedding in Nelson, 1999, one of the cordially invited guests had to excuse themselves ...
How will the recent wave of job cuts impact ethnic diversity in the media? In November last year, I was working a very busy day in the newsroom of a large online news site, interviewing whānau about their concerns over the imminent closure of one of the few puna reo ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Ruth Knight, Researcher, Queensland University of Technology Have you ever felt sick at work? Perhaps you had food poisoning or the flu. Your belly hurt, or you felt tired, making it hard to concentrate and be productive. How likely would you be ...
Despite heavy criticism and an ongoing select committee process, the Police Minister says the Government will forge ahead with a ban on gang patches. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Sam Whiting, Lecturer – Creative Industries, University of South Australia Shutterstock Everyone has a favourite band, or a favourite composer, or a favourite song. There is some music which speaks to you, deeply; and other music which might be the current ...
A new survey says ‘outlook not great’ for those charged with building infrastructure, while RMA changes delight farmers and depress environmentalists, writes Anna Rawhiti-Connell in this excerpt from The Bulletin, The Spinoff’s morning news round-up. To receive The Bulletin in full each weekday, sign up here. First RMA changes announced ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Olli Hellmann, Associate Professor of Political Science, University of Waikato Getty Images When New Zealanders commemorate Anzac Day on April 25, it’s not only to honour the soldiers who lost their lives in World War I and subsequent conflicts, but also ...
A leaked document shows the Canterbury/Waitaha arm of health agency Te Whatu Ora is scurrying to save $13.3 million by July. The “financial sustainability target”, which was “allocated” to Waitaha, is consistent with what’s happening in other districts, says Sarah Dalton, executive director of the Association of Salaried Medical Specialists. ...
A look at the state of the previous government’s affordable housing scheme, and what could come next.Remind me: What’s KiwiBuild again?First announced in 2012, KiwiBuild was a flagship policy of the Labour Party heading into both its 2014 and 2017 election campaigns. With Jacinda Ardern as prime minister, ...
Labour in opposition will be shocked to learn which party had six years in power but squandered any chance to make real change. Grant Robertson’s valedictory speech was a predictably entertaining trip down memory lane. The acid-tongued incoming Otago University chancellor administered a sick burn to the coalition government. He ...
Taiwan’s semiconductor industry is seen some as its ‘silicon shield’ against invasion – but how will overseas expansion affect that protection? The post The state of Taiwan’s silicon shield appeared first on Newsroom. ...
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UK Results
UK
LAB 30.4……CON 36.9……..LD 7.9……….UKIP 12.6…….SNP 4.7……..GRN 3.8
LAB + 1.5……CON + 0.8……LD – 15.2……UKIP + 9.5……SNP + 3.1……GRN + 2.8
England
LAB 31.6…….CON 41.0…….LD 8.2……….UKIP 14.1……….GRN 4.2
LAB + 3.6……CON + 1.4……LD – 16.0……UKIP + 10.7……GRN + 3.2
Scotland
LAB 24.3……..CON 14.9……..LD 7.5……….UKIP 1.6………SNP 50.0………GRN 1.3
LAB – 17.7……CON – 1.8……LD – 11.3……UKIP + 0.9……SNP + 30.0……GRN + 0.7
Wales
LAB 36.9…….CON 27.2…….LD 6.5……….UKIP 13.6………PC 12.1……..GRN 2.6
LAB + 0.6……CON + 1.1……LD – 13.6……UKIP + 11.2……PC + 0.8……GRN + 2.1
Haven’t been able to find any English Regional percentage breakdowns yet (ie North-East, West Midlands, South-West, Greater London etc – but, then, that’s probably a plus from your point of view)
Be pretty cool if the National Party was getting 36.9% of the vote. No wonder the Conservatives fight proportionality, tooth and nail.
So does UK Labour. They are very comfy in a two party system.
Does that mean Labour’s vote increased from the last election?
Certainly does (though it’s cold comfort).
Labour’s share of the vote up 1.5 percentage points and raw number of votes up from 8.6 million (2010) to 9.3 million (2015).
Doesn’t it put paid to the idea that moving left was wrong?
Possibly
Unless it’s presented by the LP
UK Labour “moved left”? Must’ve blinked and missed it.
Trp said something about it yesterday, and I think it’s been in the media, as a reason for Labour doing badly (I’m rolling my eyes), but it sounded like the same old beat up to me, as you point out there wasn’t a real shift.
the reason the polls were so ‘out’..is because of the achilles-heel of pollsters..
..how they just ignore those who actually decide any election..
..the ‘undecideds’..
..all of which makes polling perhaps the most unscientific of practices..
..and as so many recent examples have shown/proven..
..both wildly inaccurate and irrelevant as far as any clear prediction of outcomes is concerned..
..the best they can hope for is the broadest of brush-strokes..
Yep, the Undecideds certainly comprise one of the reasons being touted for the “terrible night for us pollsters” (Chief Executive of YouGov ).
Others include: (1) the “Shy Conservative” (though they arguably overlap with the Undecideds – about which, more below), (2) The suggestion that Polls were, in fact, correct but last-minute swing to the Tories, (3) That Pollsters may have been “herding” (ie skewing their polls towards an average) – some analysts are suspicious about just how closely-aligned the various polls were in the final days, (4) Claims that the Final Result was, in fact, within the margin-of-error for most polls, (5) Becoming more challenging to contact a representative sample of voters, (6) The large-ish minority of Labour supporters (28% in one Ipsos-Mori Poll) who told pollsters they preferred Cameron as PM (speculation they could comprise a whole new category of “shy Tory”), (7) Current polling methods haven’t adjusted to the new era of electoral politics (ie the much greater fluidity of the electorate in recent years).
In terms of the argument that a disproportionate number of “Don’t Knows” went Tory on Election Day,…….. a couple of weeks back, I was looking through the detailed breakdowns of a particular poll and noticed that the Undecideds – when pushed to name which Party they were leaning towards – went heavily Conservative. Tories led Labour by more than 10 points among this group. It’s true that Undecideds are somewhat less likely to get out and actually vote on the Day than respondents who name a party on initial prompting, but 10+ points would still have some impact on the final result (not necessarily “shy” but certainly “hidden” Tories).
Tactical voting is another potential – not so much a last-minute swing to the tories, but a redistribution of votes on the right to make them count.
This nicely illustrates UK Labour’s woes…
Labour were targeting 106 marginal seats – most were Tory-held, some LibDem-held.
Have a look at what happened in the most marginal Tory seats of all.
15 Most Marginal Tory Seats of 2010 (ie with smallest 2010 majorities over Labour)
Seat……………….2010 Tory maj over Lab…….2015 % Swing……………….Status
Warwickshire North…………….54……………..CON + 2.1…….LAB – 4.0……….Con Hold
Thurrock……………………………..92……………..CON – 3.1…….LAB – 4.0……….Con Hold
Hendon………………………………106…………….CON + 6.7……LAB – 0.6………Con Hold
Cardiff North………………………194…………….CON + 4.9……LAB + 1.2………Con Hold
Sherwood…………………………..214…………….CON + 5.8……LAB – 2.9……….Con Hold
Stockton South…………………..332…………….CON + 7.8……LAB – 1.3……….Con Hold
Lancaster & Fleetwood……….333…………….CON + 3.2……LAB + 7.0………Lab Gain
Broxtowe……………………………389…………….CON + 6.2…….LAB – 1.1………Con Hold
Amber Valley………………………536…………….CON + 5.4…….LAB – 2.7………Con Hold
Wolverhampton SW……………691…………….CON + 0.5…….LAB + 4.2……..Lab Gain
Waveney…………………………….769…………….CON + 2.1…….LAB – 1.0……..Con Hold
Carlisle……………………………….853…………….CON + 5.0…….LAB + 0.5………Con Hold
Morecombe & Lunesdale……866…………….CON + 4.0…… LAB – 4.6……..Con Hold
Weaver Vale……………………….991…………….CON + 4.6…….LAB + 5.2……..Con Hold
Lincoln………………………………1058……………CON + 5.1…… LAB + 4.3……..Con Hold
Labour won only 2 of the 15 seats it should have absolutely blitzed. And in a majority of the 13 ultra-marginals it failed in – its vote share actually fell while the Tories’ % rose.
Exactly Swordfish-great analysis. My sister lives in Lincoln and will be devastated. The turnout in Lincoln was 63%-pathetic in a marginal. Shows how disillusioned the UK electorate really is.
What has been missed a bit by the analysts is that Labour polled quite well in the north of England compared with last time. That is reflected in the Lancaster vote above, in Burnley and in a number of other results.
Yeah, I was only going to include Tory seats with majorities of less than 1000, but the City of Lincoln’s my old stomping ground. First went to the UK in 1983 in my late teens and spent most of the time in Lincoln/Nottingham area (where I had/have some distant relatives). Did some scrutineering for the Lincoln Labour Party on Election Day – sat next to a very large Tory woman from the Shire* – (and watched one or two Lincoln City games (“The Red Imps”) at Sincil Bank – bottom half of the 4th Division, trend towards pin-striped football Kit in 83 for some bizarre reason, possibly growing obsession with Corporate culture / Thatcherism of more than a few Football Club Execs).
Lincoln’s always been a bellwether seat, clearly still is.
* Yeah, I know, sexist of me to mention her weight. I feel bad about it, but there you go.
john armstrong has done a column enthusing over little dragging labour to the right/tory-lite..
(i’m not gonna link to it..)
Not that bad an article, really. Armstrong has at least spotted the danger for his masters:
“The other lesson to take from Wednesday night’s function – and one National would be wise to heed – is Little’s capacity to surprise, something he first did with his “cut the crap” jibe at John Key. While well imbued with core Labour values, Little is less hung-up about what means are used to reach the goals associated with those values.”
I thought it is an okay article, too – TRP. Phil Ure is just twisting what he has read.
Little has an enormous job to make Labour into a workable election campaign “machine” again – and he’s going about it thoughtfully, carefully, and maybe a bit slowly for some but if you look back at his various statements you’ll see he’s positioning Labour as the Party for Work and Jobs – along with all the other social values that underpins Labour.
So quit sniping at him and let him get on with that job.
“.. Phil Ure is just twisting what he has read…”
really..?
so little isn’t moving labour right..?
little is not endorsed as labour leader by rightwing-trouts..?
little didn’t promise to shed those ‘radical-ideas’ (!) of the 2014-campaign..?
am i imagining all that..?
Your quotation marks around “radical ideas”, followed by that smarmy little (!), implies this is a quote from Andrew Little. It would be helpful if you provided a citation for that quote, otherwise people might think you were still deliberately twisting things no one has actually said.
i disagree with yr interpretation of the use of the marks..
and if you don’t mind – i wd rather not engage with you..(for already stated previously reasons..)
You may engage however you wish, but if you don’t want people to point out that you’re implying things that aren’t true and which you can’t back up you should probably either back up your statements, use clearer punctuation, or stop making up lies to suit your political agenda.
Political Agendas
The irony
🙄
I have taken the position of ignoring everything that p u writes on the basis that anyone who refuses to use punctuation and write in coherent sentences and paragraphs can have nothing to say of interest.
It just takes too much time out of my life to read people who write in a stream of thought, blurting manner. Give me someone who makes the effort to write clearly and thoughtfully and, even if I almost always disagree, I will take the time to take their thought on board.
yawn..!..
Me too Hateatea, and completely agree about the value of inention in communicating. I sometimes will attempt to read one of his comments in a situation like this (where someone has responded to him in a meaningful way). Sometimes I read the first two lines or so to see if I can make any sense. If he drops vegan links in I’ll have a look because they’re usually fundamentalist and need challenging. I virtually never read the long ones, or even the whole of the short ones. Life’s too short :->
double-yawn…!
Yep, same here. Some of the subthreads is keyboard-mashing causes can be pretty funny, though.
Especially when he gets called on making shit up and then argues that someone has misinterpreted his intentionally-unorthodox punctuation, grammar, and sentence contstruction.
Double quotation marks would imply a quote. Single ones I would take to mean an implication that some policies were radical ideas rather than a quote, but as you point out it can be hard to tell with phil.
My understanding is that Little is suggesting backing of from certain policies that they’ve recevied feedback are wrong. I wouldn’t have seen Little as seeing those as radical policies, so without some back up, I’ll take it as phil’s interpretation.
It’s funny really, because Little is more likely to take Labour left, and the left calling him a right mover just playes into the right wing spinners’ agenda.
double are quotes which phil used, singles can be used imo to imply irony, sarcasm, disbelief – the exclamation mark implied to me extreme – irony, sarcasm or disbelief.
I’m seeing single quotes around radical ideas
yep me too – but double around the initial quote commented on.
For me if I write, Little didn’t promise to shed those ‘radical ideas’ etc then I’m saying the ideas are not so radical in my opinion although Little may have thought or even believe they are. What phil means he can explain if he wants but that’s how I read it. Whether he actually promised radical ideas or not is a fair point that Stephanie has raised and tttt {(to tell the truth) just made that up 🙂 } I don’t know if he did or not…
the clarity is murky
yep to that too, that’s pretty much how I took it.
The specific usage of ” vs ‘ isn’t set in stone (hell I have an English degree and I don’t know the “rules” around them).
I would happily accept the idea that phil was paraphrasing the “radical ideas” quote – but then what’s the point of putting “(!)” afterwards?
To me, the obvious interpretation of that is “what a shocking thing to say”. I don’t know why it’s there if pu isn’t trying to imply that Little did indeed say capital gains etc were “radical” ideas.
yep. I got called out on the use of double quotes a while back for something sarcastic I said about something Key had said and someone had a go at me because they thought I was literally making up quoting Key when I thought it was obvious I was taking the piss. I agree there are no set rules, which is why I talked about my impressions of phil’s comment. At this point, in all good conscience I can’t keep talking seriously about punctuation in this context (-;
“I would happily accept the idea that phil was paraphrasing the “radical ideas” quote – but then what’s the point of putting “(!)” afterwards?
To me, the obvious interpretation of that is “what a shocking thing to say”.”
It’s one interpretation. I read it as ironically expressing “shock horror” at the very notion of radical ideas in general.
Who really knows though. As far as I can tell, phil is the owner-operator of a punctuation system entirely of his own devising.
(And that’s not a slight on phil btw. It’s all punc rock to me.)
u get the chocolate fish..felix..
.’b’ is the correct answer…
…the owner-operator of a punctuation system entirely of his own devising.
Splitter!
is it a batchelors’ degree..?
from memory you learn that stuff at masters’ level..
@ oan..
“.. Splitter
A temporary fold at the tip/end of a penis usually caused by sitting in a uncomfortable position Ex. Crossed legs or wearing tight pants.
Resulting in a split stream while taking a piss..”
never had that happen..
..whoar..!
..oh..!..hang on..maybe…
” is often speech” ‘writing’
But since the advent of “bald neutralising” ” ” have often been used to highlight disagreement with the quoted idea – a bit like sic.
Stove on ” ”
https://books.google.co.nz/books?id=f1BxO9yu1NIC&pg=PA34&lpg=PA34&dq=stove+bald+neutralising&source=bl&ots=T7S3At5K1W&sig=ea-ci-iQ1oY_YRhQtusOZHw-Dy0&hl=en&sa=X&ei=irZNVcnxKuHHmAXy3ID4Dg&ved=0CBwQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=stove%20bald%20neutralising&f=false
Absolutely, a big “Aye” Jenny
Armstrong is right about Phil Twyford performing well.
rightwinger roughan has a (partial)-solution to/for the ak property-bubble..
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=11445580
and can i ask why labour don’t/didn’t have roughans’ idea as policy..?
..did they not think of it..?
..or did they shy away because it would financially effect/hurt all those property-owning/’investor’ labour mp’s..?
..if neither of those…
..why the f. not have this as policy..?..(in the 2014 election..and now..)
For real Kiwi’s especially Aucklanders who are interested in the Ports of Auckland battle between the Council & the POA there is an excellent article in today’s Herald here.:-
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11445757
Also the POA publicity machine recently stated that it was essential to have the extended wharf other wise the new cruise ship ‘Quantum of the Seas’ would not be able to berth and New Zealand would miss out on lots of $$$$$$$ ‘cos the company would cancel the visit. ???????
What they didn’t say is that this new vessel whilst a little bigger in displacement is actually similar in size to the ‘Queen Mary II’ which has been here recently with no problems about berthing. She is just two metres shorter than the Quantum but draws 10.1m against the
Quantum’s 8.8m. The other difference is that QMII is rated at 30Knots against the Q’s 22.
Go figure. If Bullshit was a brass band etc.
TRP you are delusional if you think little has any traction with public as the polls high light labour is now seen as perennial losers globally ( UK Au Nz) No longer is any one buying core labour values beyond those areas trapped on govt handouts ( Scotland Qld etc) , the world has moved on, labours time ( 70 years ago ) has come and gone. All we are seeing now is a slow death, A left shift will simply accelerate the inevitable
so, really what would your alternative be?
we can’t all be landlords and bosses, really we still need a few people to work and get the various jobs that need doing done. You know, like Nurses, teachers, cleaners, admin staff, peeps working in Fonterra factories and the likes. If labour is dead as you say, who will look out for the workers? Surely not National? They have, over the last 7 years and previously under Shipley, shown that they do not believe workers worthy of consideration and might even consider the New Zealand Worker (resident and citizens) to be utterly replaceable by cheap, imported slave type labour from Asia and elsewhere?
What do you tell your children then, if you have any? Move overseas, cause here in NZ you are not going to have a chance to survive?
There needs to be a balance between (to parapharase Bush II) The Haves and The Have Nots or else we are going back to the dark ages where the workers were effectively owned by the Lord of the Manor.
Is that the future that you hope for Red Delusion?
Really what about a 40 hour week, overtime pay, accident compensation, retirement benefits, unemployment benefits, equal education opportunities, public health care and the likes do you not like and think we can do away with?
I’m looking forward to following the nature of work enquiry/report, as it will inform greatly as to how the country should proceed in the upcoming years.
I also look forward to the 40 hour week reducing to 35 or 30 hours for similar pay – this should be a major push from Labour to improve work-life balance (imagine a 4 day week for the same length shifts and same pay!) and also decrease unemployment as mechanisation increases.
The 32 hour week should have happened back in the 1980s. Instead we had the First Act Government attacking working hours and wages.
+ 1 yep – fuck with computers we were promised 25 hours weeks or even less – we’ve been sucked in severely
hi sabine. i think both you and red delusion can be correct.
i was bought up in a staunch labour household, (my grandfather was an organizer all his life) and constantly told that labour were the party for the working person.
i dont think that relevance is true today.
the radical shift in the 80s to the neo liberal agenda was the final nail in the ciffin for me.
having labour move away from the workers doesnt mean we have to go without 40hour week, overtime etc
i do think the workers you listed do need representing but i feel we dont identify as strongly with our occupations as we used to do.
pollys are there to get elected or re-elected. so we will not be getting a visionary or a radical shake-up from the labour party.
you can argue that proposing raising the retirement age is an anti worker move.
also you can argue that it is a long overdue fiscally responsible move.
as to who is to represent these workers, politically, good question.
probably the mana crew, as i see the greens looking to move right and be seen as respectable enough not to scare the horses.
is simon bridges over-exuberant in his use of hair-oil..?
and does that have an environmental-impact..?
..and is that why he is so ‘oily’..?..in so so many ways..?
He’s trying for that Superman hairdo, where the hair never moves. But he’s looking more like Hosking’s misbarbered look.
spiv is as spiv does..
shouldn’t you be apologising for being sexist with that comment @PU ?
for calling bridges an oily-spiv..?
i don’t think so…
🙂 – I’d be calling him a lot worse, but then if we delved into it too much, we’d have to start having an in depth discussion on power relations (where Bridges is actually a 40 watt banana masquerading as something quite a few people think is worthwhile), and I’d be living in utter, absolute fear of being ‘sanctioned’.
in labours casting around for the reasons why they lost in 2014..
..i hope they don’t discount how toxic to so many of their erstwhile voters/supporters was their policy to raise the superannuation-age…
..and that heaping too much blame on the capital gains tax ‘rejection’..
..is pointing the bone at the wrong target..
And now they want to alienate the few voters that they have left, with this bullshit stunt.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=11445759
Looks like LabourNZ will go the same way as LabourUK as just another also ran.
They’d be better off saying that they will be introducing compulsory voting. At least then people would be more willing to accept the penalties.
Inplementing compulsory voting (which I am against) would be a gutsy, definitive, concrete policy statement. Not just talking about considering a policy of talking about policy. So unlikely to come out of Labour.
FYI – here is the EVIDENCE which proves the improvement in ‘transparency’ at Auckland Council, for which. in my opinion, I can claim some credit as a result of my uncompromising ‘one person rates revolt’?
http://www.aucklandcouncil.govt.nz/EN/newseventsculture/OurAuckland/mediareleases/Pages/councilmovestoimprovetransparency.aspx
Council moves to improve transparency
8/05/2015
Auckland Council has launched a section on its website providing information on a variety of council activities as part of a commitment to more openness and transparency.
The proactive publication of information on the More about the council webpage, which can be found via the Auckland Council Media centre helps to provide Aucklanders with better, timelier and more accurate information about how council works.
The first release of information includes Auckland Council Group staff numbers, information about annual average rates increases, debt, efficiency savings and progress updates on the NewCore project.
It also includes contracts awarded by the council with a value of $100,000 and greater from 1 July 2014 to 31 March 2015 and spends with suppliers with a value of $100,000 and more from 1 October 2014 to 31 March 2015.
All of the information in the section will be updated regularly to ensure it remains relevant and current.
Auckland Council CEO Stephen Town says the proactive publication of information aims to strengthen Aucklanders’ trust in the council.
“Central government and other local authorities already have similar initiatives, meaning Auckland Council will now be aligned with best practice across the public sector in New Zealand in making information more accessible to the public,” he says.
“In the future we will also be providing more details about how we work and what we do, including information about employee costs, travel expenses, key statistics about council activities and other useful information as and when it becomes available.”
In addition to the proactive publication of information, the council also today began publishing on its website Local Government Official Information and Meeting Act (LGOIMA) responses where the council deems the information to be in the interests of the wider public.
More about the council and LGOIMA responses are available to view now.
______________________________________________________________________________________
http://www.aucklandcouncil.govt.nz/EN/newseventsculture/mediacentre/Pages/moreaboutthecouncil.aspx#awarded
Awarded contracts and supplier spend
We will regularly publish details of awarded contracts and spend with suppliers.
These reports are for Auckland Council (excluding CCOs) and will be updated twice a year, in April and October.
Awarded contracts report
For contracts valued at $100,000 and greater awarded by the council during the period stated (including provisional spending commitments in some instances), this report lists:
a description of the goods and/or services being supplied
the general type of goods and/or services being supplied
the name of the successful supplier
the start date and end date of the contract.
Awarded Contracts Report (PDF 313KB)
Supplier spend report
This report lists the total spend per supplier (across all contracts and purchase orders) for the period stated, where the total is greater than $100,000.
Supplier spend report (PDF 265KB)
All procurement activity at Auckland Council, including tendering and awarding contracts, is subject to the Auckland Council Procurement Policy.
For reasons related to commercial sensitivity and privacy, we do not publish the details of sole traders (ie. individuals who are not contracting through a company).
Detailed information about spend and contracts may be commercially confidential.
We believe that the information we provide in the reports is accurate at the time of publication (subject to the report disclaimers). The information is subject to change if projects, priorities and timeframes are varied for awarded contracts or if financial reconciliations or adjustments are made in respect of prior payments.
______________________________________________________________________________________
This, in my opinion, is a VERY belated start, for which I should not have had to put my freehold home ‘on the line’.
Penny Bright
http://www.pennybright4mayor.org.nz
is this a ‘brain-fart’..?..or not..?
‘Labour has proposed withholding state support such as tax credits and Working For Families – from people who are not enrolled to vote.’
(this is an idea proposed by tim barnett..)
more from barnett:..
‘Asked if withheld state support could include benefits – Mr Barnett said there could be more of an issue with targeting such a defined group.’
..is this what passes for ‘new ideas’ in labour..?
Where did you find this, Phillip Ure ?
And remember, Tim Barnett is the general secretary – he is neither Leader nor President – and has just ordinary member’ s voting rights on policy stuff.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11445759
It was part of Labour’s submission to the Justice and Electoral Select Committee.
From the Herald article:
Mr Barnett said the submission was from the party, which did not set policy, and wanted the committee to investigate the idea – not necessarily recommend it.
“It’s not party policy, it’s merely saying, what are the things that could be done? And in Australia that is the system which they formally adopt.
“There is widespread concern, not just Labour, with non-enrolment … there is pretty compelling evidence that there is a continuing pattern of people not enrolling.”
“And in Australia that is the system which they formally adopt.”
Yeah but Australia is also the country currently introducing fascist policy that means citizens lose social security entitlements if they don’t vaccinate their children. Just to make that really clear, they’re targeting beneficiaries as a class of people. So probably not the best country to use as a comparison at this time.
Gotta say the similarity to the vaccination idea is interesting too. The irresponsibility of those parents is astonishing, of course, so I suppose something has to be done. I suspect that beneficiaries are targeted in the enrolment suggestion because they make up a large number of the non- enrolled. If I get a chance later I’ll do some digging or maybe someone else can do some research on what and why Labour are proposing it. For me, footy calls. Ciao.
If this was about irresponsible parenting, the Australian government would make vaccination mandatory across the board. You don’t vaccinate your kids then you get fined and eventually go to prison. But it’s not about that at all, it’s about buying into narratives that beneficiaries are bad parents and punishing them accordingly.
There is nothing wrong with small numbers of unvaccinated kids. If governments want to improve vaccination numbers they can introduce better health policy so that the people who aren’t vaccinating but probably would given the chance can access better health care. But hey, why bother addressing education and poverty issues when you can just bene bash.
<blockquoteThere is nothing wrong with small numbers of unvaccinated kids.
You’ve been proven wrong on that several times already.
So the theory of herd immunity is wrong then? Herd immunity does not work? Do say more, Mr Scientific one. How about the medical ethics framework of patient consent before any treatment? Is that wrong too?
I didn’t say that did I?
How about the ethics of inflicting others with disease which could easily have been avoided?
Oh fuck off with your distractions Draco the Scientific and answer the questions.
Does herd immunity require that 100% of persons be immunised for it to work.
Secondly. Do you believe that medical treatment must ethically obtain fully informed patient consent wherever possible, or do you believe that patient consent is a violable nice to have.
Why should I answer questions when you’re twisting my words?
Herd immunity breaks down when it dips below a certain level. This is evidenced in practice in the U.S. recently re: outbreaks of measles.
Any way, you’re completely shit at science CV so not surprised at your confusion.
http://business.financialpost.com/fp-comment/lawrence-solomon-the-untold-story-of-measles
Several decades following the vaccine’s introduction, the measles death rate rose, largely because the vaccine made adults, expectant mothers and infants more vulnerable
Early in the last century, measles killed millions of people a year. Then, bit by bit in countries of the developed world, the death rate dropped, by the 1960s by 98% or more. In the U.K., it dropped by an astounding 99.96%. And then, the measles vaccine entered the market
After the vaccine’s introduction, the measles death rate continued to drop into the 1970s. Many scientists credit the continued decline entirely to the vaccine. Other scientists believe the vaccine played a minor role, if that, noting that most infectious diseases similarly petered out during the 20th century, including some, like scarlet fever, for which vaccines were never developed.
The credit for the century-long decline, scientists generally agree, goes to improved nutrition and improved health care, side effects of the West’s growing affluence. In the U.S., the death rate dropped by about 98%, from about 10 per 100,000 population a century ago to one fifth of one person by 1963, the year measles vaccines made their American debut. Both before and after vaccination started, victims tended to be poor
‘If you really want to know just how ignorant Lawrence Solomon is about vaccines, all you have to do is to take a look at this:
The CDC credits the vaccine with the elimination of measles deaths, but measles deaths ended a decade before the vaccine was in widespread use across the U.S., and deaths had all but ended prior to the first child receiving a shot. While the vaccine can perhaps take modest credit for accelerating the decline in the mid-1960s, it is a stretch to claim that eradication would not have occurred without the vaccine, particularly since the 20th century also saw the die-off of diseases like scarlet fever, for which no vaccine was ever developed.
This is an incredibly intellectually dishonest antivaccine talking point, so intellectually dishonest that it shocks me that anyone with half a brain can seriously argue it. Let’s just put it this way: Anyone who pulls out this tired old dishonest trope is so intellectually bankrupt that I don’t really feel obligated to do anything other than link to a post I did a long time ago about this trope, which I derogatorily labeled the “vaccines didn’t save us” lie.
It’s amazing that in 2014 the same old long discredited antivaccine tropes have found a new mouthpiece, but they have. And that mouthpiece is Lawrence Solomon. It’s not “conservative skepticism” that is falling short. It’s Lawrence Solomon. Sadly, it’s not surprising.’
http://scienceblogs.com/insolence/2014/07/07/a-conservative-failure-of-skepticism-over-vaccines/
Doc you have too much riding on your methods and practices and so you stick to your guns because that is all you have…
Q. Care to contest the graph ?
http://www.abc.net.au/science/articles/2015/04/24/4222316.htm
The move to an artificially created vaccine for whooping cough is behind an increase in cases of the deadly disease in the US, a new study suggests.
The findings highlight the need to do similar research in Australia where whooping cough cases have spiralled upward in the past decade, co-author Associate Professor Manoj Gambhir, from the University of Monash, says.
According to the authors of the study
“These results demonstrate that the resurgence in pertussis in the U.S. can be explained by past changes in vaccination policy. However, the authors’ findings also suggest that the efficacy of the currently-used acellular vaccine, while lower than that of the whole-cell vaccine, is not much lower (around 80% protection for the first three doses of acellular vaccine versus 90% for whole-cell), and booster doses may be sufficient to curtail epidemics while novel vaccine research continues.”
I believe that those are reasonable conclusions to make.
I do note that your rather transparent attempt to smear vaccination against pertussis.
I believe that those are reasonable conclusions to make
I believe people who accept the use of terms such as ‘doses’ and ‘booster shots’ when attempting to explain or accepting the manufactured explanation of ‘herd immunity’ are void of logical reasoning
I do note that your rather transparent attempt to smear vaccination against pertussis.
Q. Do you realise you just illustrated my belief – ‘void of logical reasoning’?
Q Do you realise you’re an ill informed anti vax troll
…ill-informed anti vax tr*ll who cites Big Pharma funded research and appeals to the authority of Big Pharma funded scientists.
Like a clown, only boring and lame.
Further illogical reasoning from an alleged medical ‘professional’
That you don’t / won’t /can’t recall previous conversations which you and I have been involved in where I stated openly and succinctly my position causes me greater concern for any patients you have may have treated
I have called you out on your ‘bed side manner’ previously and you have shown it once again with an irrational abusive comment
Forgetful illogical abusive and egocentric are not desirable traits of those in the medical profession
To refresh your memory – I am anti compulsion and pro informed consent
@ The murphy troll
1. I am pro informed consent also.
2. The drivel you post has far less to do with informed consent and far more to do with promoting an anti vaccination position through half truths, mistruth and misrepresentation.
3. I don’t need to nor do I have any wish to be polite to a troll on a political website as you may or may not have understood by now that the opinions expressed on this website are often done so with vigour.
@ The murphy troll
That you believe I am a trolll serves only to enforce my understanding of your state of mind
1. I am pro informed consent also.
Q. Are you really ?
Q. Which information do you pass on to your patients before you stab them with chemicals that have side effects and adverse reactions which you clearly don’t understand the dangers of ?
If your version of ‘informed consent’ is reflected through contributions on this site you have no comprehension of what ‘informed consent’ is nor any right to claim that you do and should not be practicing medicine nor administering chemicals
2. The drivel you post has far less to do with informed consent and far more to do with promoting an anti vaccination position through half truths, mistruth and misrepresentation.
You can’t recall what I have posted
3. I don’t need to nor do I have any wish to be polite to a troll on a political website as you may or may not have understood by now that the opinions expressed on this website are often done so with vigour.
You should proof read before you post comments not that it would assist with the glaring contradictions you repeatedly make
@ The Murphy Troll
1. I am pro informed consent also.
Q. Are you really ?
A. Yes
Q. Which information do you pass on to your patients before you stab them with chemicals that have side effects and adverse reactions which you clearly don’t understand the dangers of ?
If your version of ‘informed consent’ is reflected through contributions on this site you have no comprehension of what ‘informed consent’ is nor any right to claim that you do and should not be practicing medicine nor administering chemicals
Q. Do you think you language leaves anyone in any doubt as to your anti vaccination credentials.
2. The drivel you post has far less to do with informed consent and far more to do with promoting an anti vaccination position through half truths, mistruth and misrepresentation.
You can’t recall what I have posted
A. yes I can… this site also has a very good search engine.
Q. Do you think you language leaves anyone in any doubt as to your anti vaccination credentials.
No because there are some who can read and comprehend english and accept the position I have stated previously including again to you today
What should leave no doubt is your lack of acknowledgement / appreciation of side effects adverse reactions and deaths caused by the ‘drug industry’ of which vaccination is a component sponsored by the the FDA / CDC
2. The drivel you post has far less to do with informed consent and far more to do with promoting an anti vaccination position through half truths, mistruth and misrepresentation.
Stop projecting and start using the search engine you referred to
See if the search engine can tell you how many people in the USA alone die each year due to the ‘medical industry’ approved drugs in particular that are ‘approved’ by the FDA
Q. FDA approved drugs kill / injure [ ] people per year in the USA ?
Q. How many of your patients do you inform such easily identified statistics of before you prescribe /administer chemicals to them ?
Credentials indeed
@ The murphy troll
Oh no the chemicals the chemicals !!
Just a little something to get the murphey troll frothing…
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11447327
No doubt it is all a plot by the FDA and CDC ..
Oh no the chemicals the chemicals !!
You claim to be a medical professional yet post and comment like an illiterate
Q. What is the pupose of the link ?
Two kids from the same family at different schools – So what
No mention that ‘immunity’ is achieved through the body contracting a disease naturally
Quarantine is sensible and implicitly covers off natural immunity to those who understand how natural immunity is achieved
No mention of the how many of the 124 from last year were already ‘vaccinated’
You appear to still have no idea of what ‘herd immunity’ is or how it is achieved
Hint: You wont find it through vaccination
Hint2: Doses / Boosters
Summary:
A non event article which provides no useful information and appears to serve no purpose whatsoever
Bravo
@The murphey troll
Q. What is the pupose of the link ?
A: To get you frothing
Two kids from the same family at different schools – So what
No mention that ‘immunity’ is achieved through the body contracting a disease naturally
Quarantine is sensible and implicitly covers off natural immunity to those who understand how natural immunity is achieved
A: 🙄 although congratulations for finally outing your anti vaccination credentials
No mention of the how many of the 124 from last year were already ‘vaccinated’
A: None, this information is available on the public health website
Summary:
The murphy troll’s medical/scientific knowledge is woeful….. but oh no ! the chemicals the chemicals and the FDA/CDC MONEYMEN ILLUMINATI…Gaia will save us all.
A: To get you frothing
Not only do you not understand ‘herd immunity’ which as an alleged medical professional is shameful but you do not even understand the even simpler definition of ‘trolll’
A: 🙄 although congratulations for finally outing your anti vaccination credentials
You either can’t read or you don’t comprehend the position I take has been stated very clearly to you on multiple occasions
Indications are you’re experiencing some sort of mental incapacity which is what I referred to earlier
Either way I hope you are no longer practicing and if you are I would suggest someone lodge a complaint to have your license removed for the public good
You should be struck off with the exhibition you put in through your comments
A: None, this information is available on the public health website
Yet you chose not to link to it then use a weak attempt at transference about getting me frothing – Oh dear
The murphy troll’s medical/scientific knowledge is woeful….. but oh no ! the chemicals the chemicals and the FDA/CDC MONEYMEN ILLUMINATI…Gaia will save us all.
WOW……You are disqualified as if you weren’t already
@ The MT
😆 and 🙄
No I haven’t Draco. I’ve had conversations with pro-vaxxers on this site where I’ve made the argument that the govt should be putting effort into reaching people who would otherwise vaccinate but don’t due to poverty, inability to access, lack of awareness etc, instead of having a go at the people that choose not to vaccinate via informed consent processes. And that argument has been supported. In fact the NZ govt has processes in place that allow people to opt out. That’s because the very small numbers (maybe 3% at a guess) who consciously choose to not vaccinate via an education process don’t matter.
But I don’t really want to go another round on this. The actual point I was making is that the kind of coercion the Austrialian govt is using is discriminatory and therefore they’re not a good example to use for forcing parts of the population to do something against its will.
Unvaccinated people put those who can’t be vaccinated at increased risk as has been explained to you.
There’s no such thing as choosing not to vaccinate from informed consent. If you’re properly informed you choose to vaccinate. It really is that simple. Choosing not to vaccinate from ‘informed consent’ ends up with shit like this happening:
and this:
These points are actually why I’m for compulsory vaccination. It bypasses the ignorance that some people confuse for being informed, protects those that can’t be immunised and prevents political parties from attacking minority groups for political point scoring.
“Unvaccinated people put those who can’t be vaccinated at increased risk as has been explained to you.”
I was talking about public health policy, not abstract theory. And like I said, my point was about what it means to target groups of people by class. I’m not interested in a debate about forcing health care on people.
What abstract theory are you talking about?
And I pointed out that compulsory vaccination prevents the targeting that you want to stop. At which point I think I’ll just point you to this comment from OAB.
Unvaccinated people put those who can’t be vaccinated at increased risk as has been explained to you.
Go do some more reading
http://www.abc.net.au/science/articles/2015/04/24/4222316.htm
I’m not quite sure why an avowed anti-Big Pharma activist is citing Dr. Manoj Gambhir, given his close ties to the medical establishment and career-long support for vaccination programs. Under any other circumstances they’d be howling about his (wholly imagined) corruption and bias.
It smacks of desperation. Probably dishonesty, too.
“And I pointed out that compulsory vaccination prevents the targeting that you want to stop”
Yep, and I call that facism.
@ OAB The murphy troll continues to demonstrate his stupidity for all to see.
He is very unlike Weka who wishes to engage in a reasonable manner.
on the matter of pertussis vaccine it has always been one of the more problematic bacteria to get a strong and long lasting immune response to it with vaccines which is why researchers continue to try and look for improvements. It’s a hideous illness to contract in the very young and even in teens/adults can hang about for a long time.
Most of us are probably due for a booster.
http://www.australianprescriber.com/magazine/32/2/36/8
@The Murphey
You should probably read that article yourself as it has nothing to do with what I said.
@OAB
That seems to be an Ad Hominem rather than an argument.
I’m with Weka on this issue: compulsory medication is counter-productive and opposed by the medical profession. Targeting people by class is an abomination.
@Draco – nah, just providing evidence of cherry-picking. Big Pharma can’t be trusted, until whoops! Suddenly they can!
@Draco – nah, just providing evidence of cherry-picking. Big Pharma can’t be trusted, until whoops! Suddenly they can!
Your interpretation is incorrect as well as senseless
If you applied even simplistic reasoning you should be able to work out why
@Draco – to be clear, it was a response to TM’s citation of the Gambhir study.
The Murphey, 7th March: the fraudulent and corrupt practices of the pharmaceutical and vaccine industry
The Murphey, 10th May: *cites a Big Pharma funded study conducted by Big Pharma employees*
QED.
The Murphey, 7th March: the fraudulent and corrupt practices of the pharmaceutical and vaccine industry
The Murphey, 10th May: *cites a Big Pharma funded study conducted by Big Pharma employees*
Comprehension is as weak as your interpretations and logic are
Q. What is it you are seeking to prove / disprove exactly ?
😆
Proof is what Mathematicians do. I’m just calling attention to your tactics.
I’m just calling attention to your tactics
Q. What is it you are seeking to achieve in doing so ?
@OAB
So how do we get everyone to vaccinate while not targeting people by class?
I agree that compulsion has negative overtones that will get some peoples backs up. Better education can certainly help but, as the anti-vaxxers have shown, even that will be taken badly by some people.
Then you need to be clear about that reference to The Murphy and others.
Thing is, what you said came across as an Ad Hominem against Gambhir while the study itself and its findings seemed quite reasonable.
@DtB I see what you mean – I’d hoped to avoid that by putting ‘wholly imagined’ in parentheses, and the links to ‘Big Pharma’ are only defamatory if you buy into that narrative.
Still, it was unclear.
Don’t use carrots/sticks that rely on class, e.g. benefits.
Heck, carrots/sticks are a bad way to go anyway – personally I’d ban the advertising of prescription meds, and take a damned close look at the boundary between “alternative” therapies and “practising medicine without a license”, and make “doctor” a restricted title, alongside public nuisance/recklessness charges against purveyors of some of the more dishonest anti-vax propaganda.
IMO the problem isn’t the number of nutters, it’s the avenues they have for publicity and claiming equivalence with legitimate researchers.
Mr Barnett said the submission was from the party ..
Can clarification be sought as to who exactly comprised this collective group of people called “the party” who had put together the submission?
I will ask friends and workmates who are NZLP members as to whether they are indeed “the party” who were *party* to that submission.
If you look at Andrew Little’s twitter you will see this is not Labour Party policy and not something he supports. The submission is from Tim Barnett and I don’t know how it went through. If this is Tim’s idea then he is in the wrong job IMO. This is an appalling idea and reeks of beneficiary bashing.
Fine to have enrolment forms to give out at government offices, but starving people into submission is not acceptable. If you want the poor to vote then maybe you should make sure your policies address their needs.
I hope Mr Barnett will face consequences for publicly putting his foot in his party’s mouth. Need way better message discipline than that. NZ does not need another party suggesting right-wing policies. He’s welcome to resign and join another which does, if it’s important to him.
Tim is way brighter than to propose this off his own back. I suspect this is someone else’s brainfart. And a brainfart it is …
Interesting. Hope that person is visibly disciplined then. You guys really cannot afford any more of this.
so how come this brainfart ended up in the herald, again making the labour party look like the party of brainfarts?
really,
can someone speak to the guys in the party that have any say and make it clear to them that brainfarts are not helpful, and should only be uttered in the confines of ones most private room?
please
thanka
Mr Barnett said the submission was from the party
Dim-post, some time ago, still on the money:
I just saw that. WTF are they thinking. Demanding that people behave in certain ways because they receive some state support paves the way for more right wing “do as I say” tactics.
Receiving some form of state support doesn’t give governments the right to run anyone’s life and feeds the meme that state support identifies reckless, lazy, uncaring people who need to be told what to do. Where is the evidence that supports this ? Why don’t they target the asset rich tax dodger who is also living off their fellow taxpayer and is selfish uncaring etc etc.
Oh and this is likely to alienate women
Can’t they spell stupid
It’s not ‘tactics’. It’s the law. Enrolment is compulsory in NZ and it makes sense for the government to try and enforce that law at a point at which they interact with the wilfully non enrolled. Enrolling is easy. Making receiving a state benefit conditional on taking a couple of minutes to sign a form isn’t particularly onerous.
Having said that, there is clearly going to be a minority who don’t want to enrol for compelling reasons. Visa overstayers, for example.
i actually see that proposal as a potent-example of the authoritarian-left running out of control…
..a w.t.f..!
It may be the law but when people are so disenchanted and disinterested (or dodging debt collectors or abusive spouses) that they don’t bother compulsion is only going to increase resentment. Leave the enforcement to someone else.
Who is ‘someone else’? Both enrolment and benefits are administered by the government. So who else do you have in mind? Contractors?
Maybe I should have said “leave promoting this option to another party”.
And yes it may be the law but at this point, this is policing only one sub group that doesn’t enrol ? Are they even the biggest sub group? Do we know? Why target only this one? What happens if people enrol and don’t keep it up to date? What about people who are dropped off unbeknown to them?
Why not go around the schools and demand that all 17 year olds or university students enrol before they can receive tuition. Or you have to be enrolled to get a drivers licence, WOF, CAR rego, passport, house insurance or if you have an IRD number you have to be enrolled if eligible ? Have a bank account?
All good points. I suspect that this is indeed a target group that figures highly in the non enrolled numbers. Haven’t got time now, but if I get a chance, I’ll see if I can find the full submission and work out what is intended. Might be worth a post.
Thanks TRP – if it’s a goal then a broadbrush rather than specific targeting has to be better.
I imagine this idea has been mooted out of frustration with potential Labour voters who just don’t bother to get on the roll let alone actually vote. However I don’t think its the right way to go about it. Providing an incentive to enroll is a much better idea but how do you do that? You can’t offer money because all the people who have voluntarily enrolled (the bulk of the population) would be up in arms and rightly so.
Some may say the incentive would be in good policies but that ignores the fact that Labour and the Greens have consistently produced policies that would have assisted the poor, the unemployed and those who, for one reason or another, have been left feeling disenfranchised. But the potential recipients don’t even bother to acquaint themselves of such policies.
I guess the answer is acquiring money, money and more money so you can “sell” them to a resistant public. Oh dear…
Making receiving a state benefit conditional on taking a couple of minutes to sign a form isn’t particularly onerous.
Q. Onerous for whom ?
This is a prevalent kind of comfy authoritarian middle class led Labour thinking, piling requirements on to beneficiaries and the under class so that they will maybe vote for you. And if you don’t comply you get your already miserable benefit taken off you or docked. It’s fucking absurd. But this is what the Labour Party has come to.
Yep. And irrespective of the value of investigating such a policy, the timing is beyond belief. Labour need to be rebuilding trust with voters, and this just undermines that.
Not particularly onerous for ‘The State’ ….
To force people to comply ….
To the demands of ‘The State’ ….
Whatever the demands consist of….
It is ‘The Law’ …..
You want more people voting you give thrm decent people and policies to vote for.
It isnt rocket science.
Seems to have eluded some thus far
Beneficiaries don’t even vote for Labour anymore so it’s obviously not a ploy to get more votes from us. Just add it to the bashing list.
“Making receiving a state benefit conditional on taking a couple of minutes to sign a form isn’t particularly onerous.”
Except as you point out for overstayers. Or people with highly dysfunctional lives for whom this kind of bureaucracy IS onerous. I’m sure we’ve had this conversation before, and your comment seems either largely ignorant of the realities of some of the most vulnerable people in NZ, or you think the impact on them is worth the gains of the policy. Both are politically unproductive as well as being punitive.
I forgot another sub group above. Why not make people enrol when they go for some form of medical treatment. That costs the state plenty and nothing onerous about signing a form while you wait and wait.
If it is a requirement which applies equally to unenrolled millionaires, then I’m all for it.
and why shouldn’t it? Why just target those on a particular sub group of
state support. And while they are there we could target vaccination measures, contraception for any kids they have that are 16 and over. and all the other welfare indignities. if it’s good enough for one group then it’s good enough for all.
One nation you know..
You could do that, tax all income at %100 if you aren’t enrolled to vote. Makes more sense than the take away the benefit option. At least it is somewhat equitable and not just a stick to hit the vunerable with…
You can’t see your WINZ case officer until you make an appointment. (It’s a security precaution). What do you mean you don’t have money to get the phone or internet connected to make an appointment? See your WINZ case officer to sort that out. You’ll need to make an appointment.
The comfy middle class don’t have a fucking clue on how the other half of NZ live, is the issue.
Exactly – those on a benefit frequently don’t have the resouces to even contact the state
+1000 CV
Ok, so you have an appointment. But I don’t have a car and there’s not cheap public transport and the appointment is during the day when my mate with their car is at work.
Why did you miss your appointment? My kid was sick. Why didn’t you phone? I have no credit on my phone until next pay day.
etc, etc, etc ad nauseum
The list of barriers to what trp said is huge. His ignorance or lack of care on this matter is actually pretty gobsmacking for a leftie.
And once you’ve missed a couple of appointments even for reasons out of your control you get classed as a waste of time and its pretty much all over from there.
Or I have three kids under 5, no child support because father has done a runner , live 5 miles from the nearest library (or maybe in the wilds of the provinces 50 miles) don’t have a mate with a car and there is no public transport.
” You can fill out the ‘forms’ online”
“I don’t have the money for a computer let alone the internet”
“You can use the internet for free at the local library”
“I don’t have money for transport”
“Do you live close enough to walk”
“I am on an ‘invalid’ benefit”
” We will continue to send the paper forms by post”
Catch 22
It’s actually a requirement that beneficiaries have a phone nowadays. This despite the fact that many beneficiaries can’t actually afford a phone. Even topping up a prepay by the minimum of $20 can be daunting.
nope the state benefits should not depend on wether someone has the money to call for an appointment, then find the way to a Winz office (no car could be an issue, busses? cost a lot of money that no benefit caters for, somone to look after the kids – ah just fuck it).
Oh so maybe they could go to a Library and use the computer there? And down load the paperwork to fill out and stuff….? See above, no car, no transport etc etc etc etc etc etc etc
Benefits should be given to people in Need. The only factor that should count in the giving out of benefits to people should be NEED! not an enrollment to the electoral votes.
The people that I know that did not vote the last time, where White, Male, Working, MIddle Class and they could not be fucked!
The ones that I know voted, included the mother on a 0 hour contract and winz benefits. The elderly lady that paid herself a taxi to get to vote, the rumanian migrants and so on and so on.
Again the ones that did not vote, white, working, male, middleclass and a can’t be arsed or fucked attitude. Go figure.
hi trp, can you or anyone else enlighten me as to why enrollment is compulsory?
cheers.
Once again – I just have to let you all know that probably what Tim Barnett was saying is NOT Labour Party policy, nor do I ever think it will be Labour Party policy, and they would not be stating its Labour Party policy.
Whoever it was putting up that submission was merely making a suggestion to the select committee.
I think the basic point is this: a comment from the general secretary :
“” <> “”
and it is not at all clear from that Herald story as to who in the Labour Party might have made such a submission – but it is quite clear that Tim Barnett is saying this is NOT a current LP policy, but its something other countries are doing and is this something NZ should look at. A question. Not a recommendation.
Its bad enough when the MSM twists things that Labour people say – its blinkin’ lousy when supposedly leftwing posters on The Standard do it too.
i wd submit that a component of a labour party ‘ submission to the Justice and Electoral Select Committee’…
..is not a matter of no significance…
(or are you saying it is..?..)
and how exactly is the reporting of this fact of this submission..’twisting things”..?
..this is what the submission – by the labour party (authored by whoever..?..won’t the proud parent stand up..?..)- to the Justice and Electoral Select Committee..said..
..and the comparison with australia – used by barnett – is putting the cart before the horse/comparing apples and oranges.. – as aust has compulsory-voting..we don’t..
..and jenny – if national were proposing something like this – would you not be protesting that..?..in this forum..?
Oops – dunno what happened to it, but my post above didn’t include the Barnett quote – about it being just a question to the committee, a request to investigate it – and that it is NOT Labour policy.
This is what he said. (And incidentally, I don’t agree with him on this matter, and I bet heaps of other Labour people don’t either !)
“It’s not party policy, it’s merely saying, what are the things that could be done? And in Australia that is the system which they formally adopt.”
Why would we want to follow the policies of a country that elected someone who might be related to a 20th century family called Abbottini, neighbours of Mussolini?
this is now the lead-story on the herald online..
..isn’t that great publicity for labour..?..(these things stick in peoples’ minds..)
and i think my original question:..’is this a brain-fart’?..
has been answered..in the affirmative..
not a brain fart but a testing of the waters
why “test” polluted “waters”..?
please..!..tell me what you think is possibly ‘good’ about this idea..?
..tell me how it is not just a total authoritarian brain-fart..
did I say anything was good about it?
you test waters to see what the reaction is going to be like and then adjust your plans accordingly – and to ensure there is no further misunderstanding from you – I do not like the idea or the ideology behind it – I hope that is sufficient for an understanding, of what i am saying, from you.
Its not a brain-fart PU – from any official Labour Party policy or statement.
It was just one person’s comment.
Can you please get that into your head. refer to my post at 12.2
it wasn’t “just a comment”..j.k..
..it was a labour party submission to a select committee..
..there is a difference..eh..?
I miss the good old days when Labour said good/constructive things would happen that would benefit people’s lives, and then shortly afterwards, they did. When did it get so muddled and complicated? Is there any way we could go back to that kind of politics?
Yeah yeah I know, things have “changed” and only “dinosaurs” want clear policy statements or action anymore. Hooray for TXTSPK and rumours… mumble mumble…
“Labour has proposed withholding state support such as tax credits and Working For Families from people who are not enrolled to vote.
The measure could be justified if it lifts New Zealand’s low voter turnout, the party says.
Getting the vote out is a priority for Labour and in its submission to the Justice and Electoral Select Committee, written by Labour’s general secretary Tim Barnett, the party argues for the idea to be considered.”
http://m.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11445759
It makes it pretty clear who made the submission…if the Herald got it wrong….sue them.
If this is even remotely a Labour policy…well…ffs…has Labour gone all “club them and drag em by the hair” on us?
For some people…not voting is a concious action.
A declaration that there are none worth voting for.
Perhaps….non voting and non enrollment should be seen as a criticism of the whole godamn political circus.
Those who would rule should do better.
maybe such confusion would not be coming up if the supposed leftwing party of New Zealand would finally come up with something that would exite people.
You know….like building houses for young people so they can get married and have kids. ( i know of a few couples that would love to rent a nice place to start their lifes together, alas they are not making enough to cover $ 2200 per month before any expenses or food).
You know…. like promoting long tenancies in private rentals so that families with kids could send their kids to THE ONE SCHOOL for like two years in a row, instead of having to pack up and move about ever friggin 6 month.
You know…..like upping the benefits for unemployed, single parents, the young ones etc etc etc could have a phone to phone WINZ for an appointment and eat….I know its a novelty.
I only want Labour to speak about these things…not about finding a way to punish the already punished for not being on the electoral roll….
How does Labour suppose to punish those not on the roll and not on a benefit? Like National punishes Tax Evader? With even bigger loopholes?
ffs…this is why no one is bothering to Labour and some of their die hard supporters anymore, because of some fuckwit that wants to out do Paula Bennett.
http://ecosalon.com/25-percent-of-cars-cause-90-percent-of-air-pollution-study-finds/
It’s poor people driving which causes the problems. Ban them from the roads.
I’d also like to see rich people who drive Hummers and Porsche cayenne’s banned.
#buildroadsboosteconomy
If roads weren’t so rough, the older engines wouldn’t work so hard. Resurface all roads to be glass smooth.
I hadn’t really considered that until I started riding my bike. On that I can feel the rough roads slowing me down, making it harder.
It’s not banning poor people, but banning older vehicles. Sure, that will impact on poor people most under current conditions but we should be questioning if everyone should have a car anyway as doing so costs so much. Or perhaps that should be a question of if anyone should have cars.
A government with guts would make it law that all personal cars would be electric in 10/15 years. Just have to put ruc charges on them to pay for the roads.
Need to go to RUCs on all vehicles anyway so as to kill the subsidies that trucks get from cars.
I’m looking at heat exchange from brick paved back yards.
Wikipedia on geothermal energy is interesting. What other countries do to use this for domestic use rather than just industrial as we do is interesting. (I don’t think Maori use, which extends back centuries is being counted here.)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geothermal_heating
This is the sort of thing that progressive, thoughtful, and smart countries are doing to use technology that could be thought of as green and sustainable.
The cities of Reykjavík and Akureyri pipe hot water from geothermal plants under roads and pavements to melt snow. Geothermal desalination has been demonstrated.
Geothermal systems tend to benefit from economies of scale, so space heating power is often distributed to multiple buildings, sometimes whole communities.
This technique, long practiced throughout the world in locations such as Reykjavík, Iceland,[5] Boise, Idaho,[6] and Klamath Falls, Oregon[7] is known as district heating.[8] Turkey seems to be high in this use.
Background –
” Most high temperature geothermal heat is harvested in regions close to tectonic plate boundaries where volcanic activity rises close to the surface of the Earth. In these areas, ground and groundwater can be found with temperatures higher than the target temperature of the application….
even cold ground contains heat, below 6 metres (20 ft) the undisturbed ground temperature is consistently at the Mean Annual Air Temperature[3] and it may be extracted with a heat pump.”…
“Direct geothermal heating is far more efficient than geothermal electricity generation and has less demanding temperature requirements, so it is viable over a large geographical range.
If the shallow ground is hot but dry, air or water may be circulated through earth tubes or downhole heat exchangers which act as heat exchangers with the ground.”
Buggered if I can find it but I recall reading about a project in either Germany or The Netherlands using roads to heat houses.
Found this though.
http://www.icax.co.uk/asphalt_solar_collector.html
Try this link – there’s loads of info in the WWW on this topic: http://www.solaroad.nl/en/faq/
@ swordfish (above) went to sincil bank in February-saw the imps lose to chester 1-0.
Looking at an old BBC History magazine I saw they were recalling an earlier September attack on New York than 2001. This was in 1920 when ‘a cart packed with explosives was detonated’ outside the headquarters of JP Morgan. The perpetrators,causing 38 deaths, were never confirmed but may have been followers of the Italian anarchist Luigi Galleani.’
The site 23 Wall Street still bears the shrapnel scars of 90 years ago.
War and Peace and the Steady-State Economy
In fact, that latter bit is inevitable. There’s no real difference between and the feudal society that preceded it. both are about putting a few people above everyone else in wealth and power and having everyone else pay for it.
Shakes head in disbelief….
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11445759
“Labour has proposed withholding state support such as tax credits and Working For Families from people who are not enrolled to vote.
The measure could be justified if it lifts New Zealand’s low voter turnout, the party says.”
Yup. And is being discussed above at 12 and 13.
Is Labour, or rather the hierarchy (cf. membership), trying immensely hard at working, full steam ahead and on the offensive, on connecting with ‘voters’ ?
Whatever was said in that select committee meting, tinfoilhat and Kiwiri – that is NOT Labour policy, nor has anyone raised it as a possible Labour policy.
Forget about the UK. Worry about us.
Labour is going 1984 again.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11445759
As if National is not punishing beneficiaries enough already.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=11445665
It predates the internet (so hard to find links), but i remember Roger Douglas doing pretty much exactly the same thing.
IN 1984 we were taken unawares and they hid the economic agenda behind the antinuclear credentials. If they do the same again what are they going to fob us off with to try to pretend to be a Labour party.
It’s good of you to run with The Herald‘s framing of the issue. When they say “proposed”, what exactly did Labour say?
So, not “proposed” then.
come on oan..!..don’t give us the raw prawn..
..it was indeed ‘proposed’..in a labour party submission to the electoral reform select committee..
..and we have the party secretary seemingly pimping it to the media..
..so it was ‘proposed’..with bells on…eh..?
Yes, Phil, people who want to spin it in a negative light (something you and The Herald have in common) will spin it in a negative light.
As Chomsky says, the key is to severely limit the areas that can be discussed, and allow robust discussion withing those narrow constraints.
Bravo.
please do enlighten us with the ‘positive’ aspects of this pile of steaming shit of an idea..
..i am not the only one seeming to be unable to see them..
..do bring us up to speed..
..and nothing is being ‘spun’..
..this is a proposal in a labour party submission to a parliamentary select committee..
..what are you finding so difficult to understand about that..?
..i am not spinning it..i am seriously slagging it..
..for the piece of shite idea it is..
..and i am gobsmacked that it got that far through the labour party internal processes..without someone ring alarm bells..
..so many bloody questions raised with just that..
..it only took me a nano-second to smell the rot..
..who/which grouping within labour think this is a ‘goer’..?
..and pushed it through..?
..are there no internal checks and balances within labour..?
That’s the way: it’s important to confine all ideas to the ones you approve of, and a good way to do that is to pretend discussion of outliers is exactly the same as supporting them.
Nice one.
As for the merits of the proposal. I think that before penalising non-enrolled voters, we should penalise anyone who adopts a deliberate strategy of voter discouragement.
“…a deliberate strategy of voter discouragement.”
The expression “political suicide” comes to mind.
Godallmighty….this is so depressing…
+1 PU.
I can’t imagine how this appalling idea got to the submission stage. It may not be current policy, or even likely to become policy, but the idea that someone in a senior position in the Labour Party should even consider it is a good idea is beyond me. Very, very damaging.
it will be used in parliament as a routine by the right..against labour..
No evidence Barnett sought coverage. Media will have been covering the committee, and the Labour Partry should simply be smart enough by now to not provide leads to them like this.
“…the Labour Partry should simply be smart enough by now to not provide leads to them like this.”
You’d think, wouldn’t you?
Maybe someone in the Labour Party is really smart…or thinks he/she is?
There seem more than a few in there who are not as smart as they believe. I wish they would get out of the way.
Not that I agree with the proposal to look at the idea (or maybe I do – seems logical to look at things that may provide the desired outcome) but it’s not in the realms of beneficiary bashing is it?
I thought working for families was an employment-related payment?
i just saw this tweet..
“..Sam Lotu-Iiga quoted Nelson Mandela as he opened a private prison run by a company with a terrible human rights record & I wish I was joking..”
It’s worth taking a look at the comments on this crazy website National have set up to somehow try and get populous buy-in of this change the flag diversion.
http://www.standfor.co.nz/#entries
Roughly 3/5 comments disagree with the proposed change altogether. This could turn into another Northland type misfire for Key and another nail in his coffin.
Something I hadn’t considered is raised by this comment:
“…the government tell us the cost to change the flag is $26,000,000 for referendum but the cost to change every flag in every school, building, businesses, NZ Army uniforms, vehicles, NZ Police, NZ Navy the list would be endless – it’s a joke. $26 million is only the start”
good point sage..!
..chrs 4 the heads-up…
The archdruid has been very provocative over his last few posts I have thought but the logic is inescapable and like all great writers with ideas he presents them with a style and content that I find complete and beautiful.
http://thearchdruidreport.blogspot.co.nz/2015/05/the-whisper-of-shutoff-valve.html
There’s pictures on John Key’s facebook page of him handling a puppy and showing it to Prince Harry https://www.facebook.com/pmjohnkey
Kinda weird.. is it that hair/fur thing again..