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Open mike 11/04/2011

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, April 11th, 2011 - 222 comments
Categories: open mike - Tags:

Open mike is your post. For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose.

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Step right up to the mike…

222 comments on “Open mike 11/04/2011”

  1. chris73 1

    Its funny but I’ve been banging on for a while now about Labours problems (and of course being told how wrong I am) about how the direction of Labour is wrong, getting away from their background etc etc
    So its quite nice to see a Labour MP shares similar views:
    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/4870142/Labour-MP-leaves-list-to-gaggle-of-gays
    I wouldn’t put it quite like this but you get the point
     

    • The Voice of Reason 1.1

      The point being that you are homophobic, chris? Nice one.
      O’Connor has managed to burn off most of his support within caucus and the wider party. It’d be great if he wins the West Coast seat back, but if he has to attack the rainbow section of the party to do it, it’s probably better he doesn’t. Actually, attacking the miner’s union will probably make sure he doesn’t get back in, so fail all round, I would have thought.

      • sean 1.1.1

        Resorting to name calling because you don’t want to discuss his comment?  Exactly the same to people being called racist when they disagree with the Maori party.
         
        Given the screaming heap that Darren Hughes and Chris Carter went down in, many people would agree with Damien O’Connor.  And alternatively, if Labour becomes overridden with Unionists the same effect is going to happen.
         
        Given that National is at 54% in the latest CB poll, I would tend to say O’Connor has a lot of merit in what he is saying.  It can’t be all because of Phil Goff/Annette King’s incompetence.

        • Daveo 1.1.1.1

          I think it’s a bit rich for a man who lost the most working class seat in NZ to a guy who closely resembles toad of toad hall to be bleating on about how he represents real New Zealanders.

        • The Voice of Reason 1.1.1.2

          O’Connor’s remark was homophobic, Sean, and Chris agreed with it, so it’s not name calling to point that out. And I did discuss his comment, ya dickhead.

          Who gets called racist for disagreeing with the MP? Citation, please. There are plenty of unionists in the Labour caucus already, including a few who have never been full time union officials, just members. So what’s your point?

          • sean 1.1.1.2.1

            The point being, you laid into Chris calling him homophobic, when he wasn’t being.  Hate the game not the player…….
             
            O’Connor could have been more diplomatic in what he said (which is what Chris actually did), but the reality is its what a lot of people are thinking, but are too scared to say out loud because of the overbearing PC-ness that we have to put up with these days.
             
             

            • Mac1 1.1.1.2.1.1

              sean, if being PC means being inclusive and tolerant, then I’m PC.

              If being ‘non-PC’ is a cover for homophobia, bigotry in all its forms, prejudice, intolerance and hatred- then I’m glad I’m not in that number. Sorry for the tautology but I thought you might recognise at least one word here.

              sean, ‘non-PC’ is a code-word for these anti-social, un-Christian, values which good parents, teachers and ministers all teach against.

              Just though you should know which team you are supporting here.

              • millsy

                I bet you that those shoving Jews and Gypsies into the ovens at Dachau would have identified themselves as ‘non-PC’.

                • Mac1

                  The horrific thing was, millsy, that the shovers became the shovees, having bought themselves (at what cost?) three to six months reprieve.

                  I certainly can’t judge them, nor do I want to be in the situation where I could know enough.

                  Though it is said, as I muse on, that the people with the best chance of surviving the death camps were those who acted to help others survive.

                  • millsy

                    <p>Mac, I am talking about those who devised the \’Final Solution\’, not the poor people who \’co-operated\’.
                    I should have made myself more clearer. I have issues with that…</p>

                    • Mac1

                      millsy, I gathered you meant the devisers, so you were clear enough. I chose to read the meaning I gave it, having just seen a programme on Sky recently. Those planners were psychopathic and would not have cared about labels, except they were careful about putting things on paper, since some Germans objected to the slaughter of their own mentally ill, hence the use of code words such as ‘final solution’ and ‘firewood.’

                      There are only degrees of difference between ‘non-PC’ and ‘final solution’ as a linguistic cop-out.

                      anti-spam ‘misunderstanding’ !

                • sean

                  Godwins law already…..thanks, I won :-p

                  [lprent: pwned arguments or any variant on those sorry arsed flamewar starters are a very fast way to attract my moderating attention. This is strictly an agree to disagree forum. In my opinion having to resort to such hackneyed troll tactics indicates a inability to debate, so I reward repeating offenders with time to review their lack of skills.

                  You’ve been around for long enough to know that. But you have generally behaved this time around. Have a weeks rest. ]

            • The Voice of Reason 1.1.1.2.1.2

              Ah, diddums. O’Connor was homophobic, Chris73 was as well by agreeing with the comment and now you reckon people are too scared to come out and be openly homophobic because it’s all so PC these days. C’mon!

              Don’t know what planet you’re on. sean, but here on earth, people have been openly homophobic about Labour since at least the point at which Helen Clark became leader. If chris wanted to be diplomatic he could have done so, but he didn’t. As usual, he came up with a few concern troll lines and an endorsement of O’Connor’s stupid remarks. If he wants to weasel out of his own words, let him. But you are wasting your time trying to do it for him.

              • Vicky32

                and be openly homophobic because it’s all so PC these days. C’mon!

                Okay, I am coming out and saying, by your standards, I am ‘homophobic’. (Homophobia by the way, isn’t even a thing.) I hate that men who hate women (and no matter how they pretend for a while, gay men do, as gay men I know have freely told me) have power over others by threatening them with being thought bigots and the kind of people who set up Hitler’s death machinery.
                For goodness’ sake, grow up! What a disgusting comparison.

                • millsy

                  <p>Deb, here is DOC\’s words that are slightly edited, seeing as you have concerns about my allusions to the Holocaust:
                   
                  </p>
                  <p>
                  </p>
                  <blockquote>Labour leader Phil Goff says list MP Damien O\’Connor will be told to apologise to caucus for saying the party\’s list selection is run by \”self-serving Jews and a gaggle of gypsies\”.</blockquote>

                  • Vicky32

                    Sorry, Millsy, that’s even more childish! Although it’s conveniently forgotten now, Hitler’s concentration camps contained not only Jews, but gypsies, Slavs, gays, pacifists, Christians and people with intellectual and physical disabilities.
                    But that fact does not mean that you can claim that O’Connor was saying he’d like to throw gay men into concentration camps! It’s the same morally bankrupt argument I have seen equating ‘homophobia’ (which as I’ve said isn’t even a real thing!) with racism.
                    I’ma stick my neck out here and say that ‘gay is a choice’. Black isn’t. ‘Nuff said.

                    • Carol

                      ‘homophobia’ (which as I’ve said isn’t even a real thing!)
                      I’ma stick my neck out here and say that ‘gay is a choice’.

                       
                      Well if it was a choice, life would have been so much easier growing up back in the days when homophobia was an extremely oppressive force. I would have chosen to be heterosexual… I tried very hard to be that. I’ve seen many incidents of homophobia ever since then, and know people who’ve been bashed as a result of it and ones who’ve committed suicide.  It certainly does exist.
                       
                      And isn’t it a little contradictory to say that homophobia doesn’t exist, that gays were put in concetration camps during the 3rd Reich, and to say it’s a “choice”?
                       

          • Vicky32 1.1.1.2.2

            Who gets called racist for disagreeing with the MP?

            I have been called racist for saying that Louisa Wall is a Maori! To which I could only say wtf?
            I also, horrifyingly, agree with sean, that O’Connor has a point regarding the ‘rainbow’ people. I heard one of them on Nat Rad this morning, throwing such a tanty and screaming “homophobia!!!!” at the top of his lungs. Does Labour not get that bumping people up the party list because they’re gay or because they’re Maori actually is a very bad look. They may actually turn out to be very good MPs. But those of us who don’t belong to protected groups might well  think “Oh she’s there because she’s Maori, or he’s there because he’s gay. I think I’ll go with the Greens or Alliance, their candidate might also be gay, but they are not claiming credit solely for that!

            • Carol 1.1.1.2.2.1

              What evidence is there that the 3 gay MPs on the Labour list got bumped up because they are gay?  On the gaynz forum someone said that Louisa Wall and Lliane Dalzielle chose not to be on the list because they want to focus on the electorate campaign.

            • Jum 1.1.1.2.2.2

              Vicky32,
              I was listening to Radio New Zealand this morning and the person did not scream.  So don’t be so silly.

            • Anne 1.1.1.2.2.3

              Does Labour not get that bumping people up the party list because they’re gay or because they’re Maori actually is a very bad look.

              That’s bollocks!  Labour does nothing of the sort. What they try to do however is make sure the list is representative of all members of the Labour Party, regardless of race, creed or sexuality, and that it covers as wide a geographical spread as is possible.

              I think you are following the spin line that suits your personal prejudice Vicky 32.

            • lprent 1.1.1.2.2.4

              They don’t. The only person I can see trying to claim special privilege here is O’Conner.

              I haven’t seen anything to impress me with Damien O’Connor. That is almost certainly why he was so far down the list.

              Pass me the constitution. I am tired of idiots inside of the party using news media to play internal politics. I think it is time for the party members to start to ban them for their behavior. I am sure there will be a procedure to do exactly that.

              Let’s start a wee movement. Foulup as a MP in a way that uses tge media to relitigte a argument you lost by going to the media

              • Mac1

                These words come to mind from an older hand. Loyalty and discipline. Party before self. Cause before ambition. Thinking before reacting. Consulting. Process.

                I agree that some disciplinary measure should be invoked. 

                Wouldn’t mind giving the lecture that goes with it. 

              • PeteG

                Mustn’t show any sign of different thoughts or ideas outside the party. Toe the line, everyone must hum the same monotonous slogans. Of course within the party a little bit of robust debate is ok as long as it doesn’t stray too far from the ideologies, but the public shouldn’t see through the blandness.
                 
                If they try to clamp down on freedom of speech too much they risk becoming labeled
                a piddling of parlies.
                 
                 

                • lprent

                  The whole point about a party is that it is a forum to argue within. I support anyone dissenting inside the party. There are forums like this to engage in outside in the ongoing arguments across the Left.

                  But pulling a straight party matter outside in a manner designed to cause damage for political advantage against colleagues is just stupidity as far as I am concerned. Read my post on Chris Carter to find out exactly how much I dislike and despise it.

                  I am tired of tolerating Labour MP’s doing it. It is distracting, not particularly useful, and tends to waste a lot of my efforts in trying to get the party back on the treasury benches.

                  I want to take one of these arseholes abusing my trust and crucify them. Moreover, I would prefer if it is done by the membership. It is time to find out how to achieve that aim.

                  • PeteG

                    The risk you run is that, while going to great lengths to have a diverse (possibly too diverse) party list, you then want to suppress any outward sign of diversity.
                    Surely there should be a balance of freedom of open expression and party responsibility.
                     
                    I’d much rather hear and know what individual MPs think rather than getting fed
                    a groan of groupspeak, carefully controlled by a paranoia of power seekers.

                    • lprent

                      Inside the party. That is the whole point of joining and working for one. Cooperating brings greater benefits in terms of results to all than would be achievable with a group of individuals working against each other. That was the formation basis of the labour movement. For that matter it is the forming principle of companies and this site as well.

                      If people don’t want to adhere to that basic coop principle of arguing within the joint rules that they agreed to on joining or made later, then I can’t see why I need to exert effort for their benefit – however indirectly. I will use those rules to remove them from the cooperative – that expresses my opinion of their behavior quite succinctly.

                      I realize that you still cleave to that 18th century ideal of independent gentlemen all working independently for the great good. But political parties coalesced because it simply didn’t work for anything important.

                    • RedLogix

                      Lynn explained it to you very carefully. Try reading what he said again.
                       
                      Political parties are full of internal dissent and discussion, it is eternal and essential. But political parties are also required to show unity of purpose in action.
                       
                      O’Connor by giving into an emotional impulse to lash out and damage that unity has proven that he is unfit for public office.

                    • felix

                      a diverse (possibly too diverse) party list

                      Meaning what exactly? How, with representation as the aim, can a list be “too diverse”?

                    • PeteG

                      Too much emphasis on diversity, not enough emphasis on electability and ability to run a government.

                      Using a sports analogy, the All Black selectors don’t make sure their team represents every union and ethnic group in the country, they have a team strategy and select people with the ability and team skills to win. Ultimately with test rugby, and politics, winning is what is most important.

                      I guess it depends on whether people prefer a potpourri party or a great government.

                    • lprent []

                      If we were only interested in electability then we’d have a party of ineffective lightweights like National does.

                      The slate isn’t drawn up solely on electability reasons. It is drawn up to retain parliamentary skills, bring new blood in to gain those skills, to draw in representation for areas that would otherwise get overlooked (ie why Dunedin is over represented), and to ensure that when elected Labour is able to govern.

                      You can see the effect of your view in National’s current performance. They are clearly not able to govern effectively. probably the clearest symptom after the economy is how often they have used urgency in the house. Speaks of their lack of organizational skills.

                    • felix

                      Note my words “with representation as the aim”.

                      Your answer suggests otherwise.

                  • Carol

                    To me it’s not a matter of a person never criticising their party publicly – but then I’m not a member of any party.  However, these words by Mac1 strike a chord for me:

                    Cause before ambition.

                    At a time when we need MPs standing up for the people and public services struggling financially, and against NActMU policies that make it harder for working people, O’Connor’s criticisms of Labour seem to be all about his own status.  What’s he doing for Kiwi battlers?

                    • PeteG

                      What about these words that I just though of

                      Pointing out the obvious.

                       
                      I realise it’s not what a party will want to hear having just worked hard on and committing to a new party list, but O’Connor feels that the provinces are neglected, I’ve suggested provincial neglect, the location of Labour seats suggests a lack of appeal problem outside the main urban areas, and Labour are stuck with it for another election.

                      O’Connor may not have helped the cause for this year, but the medium term Labour cause should take heed.

                    • lprent

                      Yep, and there is that as well. With the exception of this I haven’t seen his head over the parapet in the last couple of years in public on anything else. That doesn’t mean much.

                      He could have been advocating on the behalf of his electorate, because he is probably an effective electorate MP (even they lose elections some time – ask Phil Goff).

                      But since the order of the list for the sitting MP’s is largely set up by the MP’s (but with a couple of exceptions not the final list position), he obviously doesn’t impress his colleagues with his skills.

            • felix 1.1.1.2.2.5

              I have been called racist for saying that Louisa Wall is a Maori!
               

              That’s not true Vicky32. You were called racist for saying that Louisa Wall was getting the nod of approval ahead of some other candidates because she is maori.

              • Vicky32

                No, someone actually attacked me in so many words for saying she’s a Maori… which made me wonder at the time if I had heard right, and she’s actually PI or something?
                And yes, according to what I had heard on the radio (Nat Rad), she was in fact getting the nod of approval ahead of say, Judith Tizard foe that reason. I’d even read here, someone applauding that fact.
                I used to vote Labour (I live in what was Helen Clark’s electorate.) But this year I’ll be voting Green. There’s much less chance of being labelled as a racist, for querying – er, racism? Or do you believe that only whites are and can be racist? If so, that shows appalling ignorance.

                  • Jum

                    I had to laugh watching Parliamentary questions today when the Speaker told a Labour questioner that if he expected a straight answer from John Key… which implies that the prime minister of this government does not tell the truth if he can get away with it.  Aint that the truth.

                • felix

                  I think you’re wrong about why you were called a racist, but I’m not going looking for the thread so I won’t go on about it. You could always find it and make me apologise of course, but whatever.
                   
                  Reading your reply to Carol’s comment below leaves me in no doubt as to your homophobic attitudes however.
                   
                  It also leaves me with the distinct impression that you’re quite mental.

            • Vicky32 1.1.1.2.2.6

              There’s no reply button under your sneer, Carol, and I take that as an omen.
              So, I am out of here. My advice, google ‘gay by choice’ and read the site.
              I didn’t say homophobia wasn’t a word, I said it isn’t a ‘thing’. It’s a word with no referent. I could invent a mental illness the main symptom of which is fear of women who’ve had three children. I could give it a scientific sounding name, get a friendly shrink to lobby to put it in the DSM, and Bob’s my aunty’s live-in lover!
              Doesn’t make it a real thing. The only fear I have of gays, is of their disproportionate career-ending social power.
              If you had your way, O’Connor would be ceremonially expelled from the Labour party, and maybe from the country. Shame on you!

      • William Joyce 1.1.2

        OMG – There you go again VOR. The last time you used this flawed accusation was over racism. You seem to enjoy leaping into the abyss of irrationality just so you can fire some unwarranted shots at someone.
        Nothing in the statement attributed to DO’C is insulting to gays – unless they find it offensive to be linked with unions and collectively called a gaggle.
        Some minority groups seem to be expecting “protected species” rights and cry foul when someone finds fault with one of them and hope that their issues will be advanced by playing on liberal guilty/empathy.
        VOR – stop being quick to take offence where there is none! And stop throwing around pejorative labels before you have analysed if it’s warranted.
        There is nothing offensive in what Chris73 said above.
         

        • Pascal's bookie 1.1.2.1

          So what is this fault that DO’C has found with whom? All this waltzing around the subject isn’t very straight shootery.

          I wish one of y’all would come out and say what’s on your mind.

          If someone said that straight white male christians were forming a posse to keep minorities off the list, would that be seen as insulting?

          What evidence does DO’C have that sexual orientation was a major consideration? Seeing he saw fit to bring it up, one should think he should make his case a bit more forthrightly rather than just relying on stereotypes to do the work.

          And shock horror, there are unionists in the Labour Party. Damien has been in parliament for nigh on 20 years. There may well be people voting in this election who weren’t born when he entered parliament. Has he only just discovered that he is in a Labour party?

          • William Joyce 1.1.2.1.1

            Groups or power blocks form because of shared interests and other affinities.
            DO’C merely used distinctives to identify two groups that he wanted to blame. “Them over there, they did it” – instead of “them” he identified the two groups but some common identifying characterists.
            DO’C did not say that because they were gay they ruined his selection.
            If he had said that by nature gays are nasty, secretive, bullies who take great joy victimising people – then that would be homophobic.

            • Pascal's bookie 1.1.2.1.1.1

              So why didn’t he say, ‘party insiders’, or ‘townies’, or ‘people who didn’t lose the west coast’.

              Because he chose to scapegoat gays that’s why. You seem to think that it is somehow wrong to question why he did that. He doesn’t seem to have presented much of a defence.

              • William Joyce

                Because in his twisted view of the situation there wasn’t any reason to identify “‘party insiders’, or ‘townies’, or ‘people who didn’t lose the west coast’.”
                He saw two groups and each group had an identifying characteristic that set them out from all the other people.
                If he said “party insiders” then people would say “which party insiders”, if he said “townies” then people would have asked “which townies?”
                Identifying gays and unionists was pretty specific. Even the MSM proved being specific could lead to identifying who he was taking about. The tv news flashed up the faces of the gays and unionists he was probably taking about.
                How would they have been able to do that if he said townies?

                • Pascal's bookie

                  You think they wouldn’t be able to find big city mps in the labour party?

                  His whole point was that provincial mps are left out. This point would have been stronger by saying townies. But he didn’t. He chose to scapegoat gays; for some reason, which remains unexplained.

                • Carol

                  That really doesn’t wash as an explanation as to why O’Connor, a sexual conservative it seems, chose to identfy some list MPs by sexuality & union affiliation.

                  • higherstandard

                    So would he have been better to say the Rainbow and union wings ?

                    • The Voice of Reason

                      He’d have been better to say nothing, HS.

                    • higherstandard

                      From a party perspective I think you’re quite right that politically it’s best if these arguments are not undertaken in public- but I doubt it’ll do him any harm as an electorate MP.

                      Labour has partitioned itself into particular silos over last couple of decades this is just O’Connor opening his mouth to suggest in his opinion two of those silos aren’t likely to be supportive of him.

                  • Vicky32

                    Please define ‘sexual conservative’. You make it sound like some kind of loathsome disease.
                    In other words, you are displaying prejudice.

                    • Carol

                      I mean by sexual conservative that O’Connor has voted to maintain the status quo with respect to Bills that aim to liberalise laws related to sexuality: ie The Civil Union Bill & the Prostitution Bill.  It seems to me a descriptive term identifying a conservative position on policy.

    • millsy 1.2

      Poor old Damien O’Connor has a problem with the nasty unionists in the Labour list…

      There is a solution for that.

      Piss off and join the National Party. Why does he think the Labour Party is called the ‘Labour Party”.

      It is supposedly the workers party and thats why there are trade union representatives in the Labour Party list it may not be PC but the voice of unions are as legitamite as the voice of any other group. They, are the ones who do the hard yards to keep the economy going. If he wants farmers and businesspeople on the list then he needs to join National, with his mate George Hawkins.

      Simple as that.

      • The Voice of Reason 1.2.1

        Spot on, Millsy. And you can bet O’Connor will singing a different tune when he needs unionists to canvass for him come election time. I really think his hissy fit shows exactly why he was going to be ranked so low.

      • Sam 1.2.2

        Labour ceased to be the “workers” party when failed university lecturers, third rate lawyers and teachers and homosexuals became its  MPs.   End of story.

    • vto 1.3

      Ha ha I see O’Connor has been labelled a “redneck” by a gay business leader, some Mr Martin. Proof certain that the mindless prejudice in fact sits on the other side of the pc fence.

      Proof again that unless you are gay or female you are not entitled to have an opinion on matters gay, unless in support. Otherwise you are a homophobe.

      Just like unless you are maori or female you are not entitled to have an opinion on matters maori, unless in support. Otherwise you are racist.

      Proof again that the value of opinions in NZ stem from race, gender and sexual orientation and not the subject matter. The oppressed have once again become the oppressors. Such a common failing…

      • millsy 1.3.1

        I would think that if you do not support the right of new zealander have sleep with whomever they wish, provided they are over 16 and the act is consensual, then that is, for all intents and purposes, homophobic.

      • Jum 1.3.2

        Vto,
        Golly, you seem to be yet another silly person who thinks it quite okay for a sitting parliamentary member to badmouth your own party in public when the sensible thing to do is approach the leadership, complain and sort out something.  Doesn’t the left get it; the only news that gets in the newspapers is talking up the rightwing and talking down the left – if they get ammunition to do so.  Or if they’re Key or Joyce, Brownlee or Parata, Worth or Lee, etc. who just lie or mislead.
         

  2. Last night’s Colmar Brunton poll result was interesting.  Those of the right have continuously run the line that Goff’s handling of Darren Hughes’ problems was the beginning of the end, there was an imminent leadership coup and Labour was dog tucker.

    I admit myself thinking that the matter should have been handled differently although I was certain that there would not be a coup.

    And now this latest poll shows a modest rise in support for Labour and a considerable increase in support for Goff as leader.

    What happened?  Could it be, as some commentators have said, that outside of the beltway ordinary kiwis actually liked seeing a leader with compassion who while twisting on the horns of a dilemma made a decision that was not “technically” perfect but was human?  Could Goff’s very candid interview where he admitted making mistakes have actually improved his standing?  Can his support for a mate whatever the consequences have caused his standing to rise?

    Having seen a lot of him over the years and recently I know that he relates to people very well.  If you get him out on the hustings he is extraordinarily good at engaging with people.  He is a very decent person.

    The Goffice needs to simplify the message however.  No asset sales is a good starter.  Keep the message simple and outline what a disaster current National policies will be for ordinary Kiwis.

    If they can achieve this then anything can happen at this year’s election.

    And one final point, we should view with suspicion the shrill rantings of the right. In fact it seems the shriller the ranting the less it is reality based.

    • PeteG 2.1

      The leadership hoo-ha emphasised that no one else wants to step up so it shouldn’t be surprising no alternative to Goff is recognised. He is still only 11%, that’s very mediocre and only a third compared to Labour’s 34%.

      • The Voice of Reason 2.1.1

        Here’s some more numbers for you, Pete:
        Goff’s personal support rises by 40%.
        And, that at a time when he, the party and Darren Hughes were under severe attack from spinners, lickspittles and, um, you.
         
         

    • Bored 2.2

      Mickey, you know my position on Goff, and by dint the Labour Party so I will not comment further on the leadership. What does bear some comment though is the fact that the left cant break the Nats hold on 50%. As the major centre left party what has Labour so signally failed to communicate to the general public. These are dire times, and it wont get better with Nact, what message are Labour missing?

      • Carol 2.2.1

        In the Stuff article on Damien O’Connor, Goff said he reckons Labour would get 40% in the election.  So, it seems to me that Goff is aiming for a Labour-Green coalition.

        • lprent 2.2.1.1

          That would be nice. But the Greens have a habit of getting fewer MP’s than their polling suggests largely because the youth demographics that they appeal to often doesn’t vote. It makes coalition building with them difficult when you have to get support from right of Labour.

          There may be stuff lurking below the surface, but so far I haven’t seen the greens doing a lot at the gettng the votes level this term. I am currently expecting that they will get about 6-7%, which would leave Labour with their traditional Labour-Green coalition problem.

          • Lanthanide 2.2.1.1.1

            Yeah, I don’t see Greens as getting any higher than 8% at the outset, not on their current polling.

    • sean 2.3

      Yeah but the problem is they are just rearranging the deck chairs – when they start eating into Nationals % points it will actually mean something.

  3. PeteG 3

    Dunedin is regarded as Labour territory with an easy stroll expected in the electorates. But it doesn’t seem to be an area Labour puts much importance on, or attracts top candidates.

    4. David Parker – Otago seat MP 2002-2005, list since
    29. Clare Curran, sitting MP, Dunedin South (not a great endorsement for her first term efforts)
    43. Glenda Alexander – remarkably missed Dunedin North candidacy but ranks higher than Clark
    45. Rino Tirikatene, candidate and rated a chance for Te Tai Tonga
    49. David Clark, candidate and almost assured of replacing Hodgson in Dunedin North
    54. Tat Loo, candidate for Clutha-Southland

    • What a silly thing to say.  PeteG you do not understand the function of lists obviously.

      Clare and David Clark will win their electorate seats easily, David Parker will be there, Rino has an outstanding chance in Te Tai Tonga and Glenda has a very good chance on the list.

      It is customary for candidates with strong electorates who are not on the front bench to be ranked lower.

      So support for a region has nothing to do with  list rankings.

      Good attempted spin though.

      • PeteG 3.1.1

        It’s ok for you to diss us here as just a convenience of list politics – where do you live? It’s not attempted spin – I’m noticing how much importance Labour put on Dunedin candidates. Which seems to be bugger all.
         
        It says to me that either Dunedin is taken for granted as easy seats, and/or that Dunedin attracts very mediocre candidates. It doesn’t give a lot of confidence that the area will be well represented.

        • lprent 3.1.1.1

          If he hadn’t said it then I would have. You are being an idiot. The list isn’t meant as a security blanket for MP’s in winnable seats. As far as I am concerned it is there to get fresh meat for the parliamentary grinder and to provide parliamentary continuity for skills.

          It isn’t there for providing comfort to spinners.

          • PeteG 3.1.1.1.1

            You’re being an idiot if you think that some voters at least won’t look at the list differently to how Labour insiders think it should be used.
             
            Front page ODT Dunedin North Candidate low on list.
            But who cares about party votes in the provinces.

            • lprent 3.1.1.1.1.1

              So? You could find exactly the same headline in every population centre, some quite a lot larger than my alta mater. including Manakau, Hamilton, Palmerston North, etc etc. Not to mention occupational groups, ethnicities, etc.

              It is a list with a limited number of slots. Every area thinks that they are under represented.

              You’d have to be an idiot not to realize that.

              as an aside: The Claire Traviette at the granny is arguing that incorrectly unionists are over represented, but their definition of a unionist is pretty damn loose. Quite how she put Kate Sutton as one is beyond me – perhaps she is counting union members? but it is no different to your spinning up what you wantto see.

            • mickysavage 3.1.1.1.1.2

              PeteG I was trying to be polite and Lprent has expressed my thoughts about you very clearly.  

              Rather than just harping on with your latest CT spin line how about arguing this:

              1.  List rankings do not always equate with importance to the party.
              2.  Electorate seats are way more important to gain and hold.

              Care to address these points?

              • PeteG

                1. People on the outside don’t give a toss how Labour like to use their list rankings, they see them with their own interests foremost. My main interest with this LAbour list is how it looks for Dunedin/Otago.
                 
                2. Under MMP party vote is way most important. Unless you put more priority on keeping people within the party happy and aren’t so worried about votes.

                I think Chris Trotter may have been right on NatRAd this morning when he said Labour are far too inward looking. Ignore how it may look from the outside if you like.

                Things don’t look shit hot for Labour right now against a mediocre government in very difficult economic times. Hello, anyone in there care to wonder how it might look from the outside?

                • Draco T Bastard

                  1.) Looks good to me – good strong candidates for good, strong Labour electorates.
                  2.) Party vote is important at the national level. Local level it’s the electorate vote that’s important.

                   

                • McFlock

                  Dunedin resident, non-Labour voter (they’re a bunch of fecking tories).

                  Stirring shite, peteG? Of course the ODT is spinning against the labs – you know when a labour government is turning blue? When the oddity editorials start praising its policies. While there’s even a hint that Labour will return to its socialist roots (even just dipping the big toe in) the odt will try to crap on it.

                  Frankly, not many people give a damn about the list, as far as I can see.

    • RobC 3.2

      What’s wrong? 5 in the top 50. Does Dunedin have more than 10% of NZ’s population?

      Or perhaps the absence at the top is more a reflection on Dunedin than Labour.

      Look forward to the same analysis when Nat’s list comes out.

      • PeteG 3.2.1

        How many MPs do you think Labour can get? Even if they manage to climb back up to 40% Tirikatene would just make it on the list at 45 and Clark would miss the cut.

        Dunedin North has co-leader of Greens, number one on the list.
        And number 5 (promoted to) for the current term for Act.

        I will be interested to see where the Nats puts Michael Woodhouse and Jacqui Dean. I don’t know who they will put up in Dunedin South.

        • felix 3.2.1.1

          What does number 5 on ACT’s list equate to in a real party? 30? 40?

          • The Voice of Reason 3.2.1.1.1

            It equates to unemployed, felix! As do Act list spots 3 and 4. There’s a small chance No2 will scrape in on the back of Hide, if National voters in Epsom can hold a pen at the same time as their noses.

            • Pascal's bookie 3.2.1.1.1.1

              But not if Epsom Green and Labour voters can also hold their noses.

              • felix

                Yep a coordinated effort needed here between Labour & Greens, and also within the Greens to make sure Dr Norman doesn’t do anything stupid. Like stand.

              • But not if Epsom Green and Labour voters can also hold their noses.

                And do a sign of the cross and ask for forgiveness at the same time!

        • RobC 3.2.1.2

          Fuck me. You’re really having problems today aren’t you?

          Parker, Curran and Clark are shoo-ins for Parliament. Rino maybe, Alexander prob not.

          So 3 or 4 Dunedin MPs out of say around 45. What is the fucking problem?

          • PeteG 3.2.1.2.1

            Labour aren’t exactly a shoo-in for Government. Doesn’t David Parker live in Oamaru?
             
            I’m interested in representation for Dunedin and Otago in parliament, that looks quite low on Labour’s priority list – if it’s considered at all. It’s likely my electorate MP will be close to or at the bottom of Labour’s rankings, below someone who lost to him in a bid to stand for Labour. Not a good look from down here.

            • The Voice of Reason 3.2.1.2.1.1

              So what? You’re not voting Labour anyway and the list ranking won’t make an iota of difference to the electorate result because nobody but you cares. And you’ll have forgotten all about it by tomorrow when you’ve got a fresh line to push.

            • Pascal's bookie 3.2.1.2.1.2

              Is the Labour candidate expected to win the seat Pete?

            • RobC 3.2.1.2.1.3

              Get a coffee you are being particularly dense this morning

              Hey, if Parker doesn’t count why put him in your list in your opening post?

              Lab isn’t a shoo-in … FFS … I’m talking (and so were you) about individuals getting into parliament.

              If Clark can’t win Dun Nth perhaps he doesn’t deserve to get into parliament.

              But anyway … Dun pop 125k, Otago pop 210k, NZ pop 4 million.

              If Labour have 3 possibly 4 MPs out of say 45 then the region is over-represented by Labour MPs. So again, what is your fucking problem?

              • PeteG

                I don’t have problem. Labour has a fucking problem does if it seriously wants to become government again. Doesn’t it?
                 
                At the moment it seems to have it’s head firmly entrenched somewhere looking only at it’s own internals. The response here to my admittedly parochial opinion supports that view.

                • felix

                  Labour has a problem because you don’t like the list for a party you won’t vote for anyway?
                   
                  In that case ACT is fucked because I think they’re a bunch of twats.
                   
                  Seriously, get that coffee. You’re typing gibberrish and getting angry in the morning.

                  • PeteG

                    You’re the one that sounds a bit tetchy. I don’t need drugs. Sounds like the troops are feeling a bit defensive this morning.

                    I think Act will struggle to survive this year too.

                    It is likely I’ll vote for Labour again, but looking less likely it will be this year.

                    • felix

                      Pete, I’ve warned you before that blindly repeating back what someone else has just said about you in lieu of a relevant response just makes you look weak.
                       
                      Tell me, what is this “fucking problem” Labour have with their list selections for Dunedin? Several people are asking you to clarify the issue.

                      You don’t like Labour. You aren’t going to vote for them. Why should anyone care what you think of the list? (Note: I’m addressing your work persona here. Who you vote for in your private life is not my concern)

                      And why are you refusing to explain your position?

                    • PeteG

                      1. One of my main areas of interest is representation of Dunedin/Otago, and the Labour list suggests to me that this area is low on their priorities. I’d like more for my own electorate than bottom of the list.
                       
                      2. The ODT felt the local list positions worthy of a front page story so I’m not the only person who noticed.
                       
                      Labour don’t have to care about what anyone thinks of what they do with their list. But there seems to be a bit of a raw nerve here. I’ve just expressed my parochial opinion. You don’t need to overreact.

                    • Pascal's bookie

                      Is the Labour candidate expected to win the seat, Pete?

                    • felix

                      You guys were pumping David Parker as a potential leader last week. Now he’s suddenly not worthy of representing your region?
                       
                      And neither is Clare Curran? Or David Clark?
                       
                      What exactly is the point you are skirting around, Pete?

                    • felix

                      “overreact”

                      “seems to be a bit of a raw nerve here”

                      No Pete, people are just asking you to back up your vague statements with reasoning or factual basis. As usual.

                      I’d like more for my own electorate than bottom of the list.

                      Soooo…. should Green supporters in Dunedin be pissed off about Hilary Culvert’s low ranking on the ACT list?

                      If not, why not? Don’t they deserve better representation for their region?

                    • Draco T Bastard

                      I’d like more for my own electorate than bottom of the list.

                      Not every politician running for an electorate can be at the top of the list so according to you every electorate ( 95% of them) that’s not at the top of the list has been insulted.
                      Fuck, you’re an idiot.

                    • PeteG

                      Neither the Greens nor Act are likely to win the electorate – although Labour shouldn’t be too complacent about that, Turei has a far bigger profile now and Clark has none. Woodhouse also could stand a chance, but that is in Clark’s favour, two potentially strong opponents splitting the vote against him.

                      In 2005 the Labour vote was slightly higher than Hodgson’s, 17915 to 17769.
                      In 2008 the party vote dropped to 14608, Hodgson’s to 17127.

                      Hodgson has generally been regarded as a very good MP for the electorate (I’ve voted for him in the past). An unknown replacement candidate ranked around the bottom of those likely to make it into parliament is not a good way of trying to keep Hodgson’s numbers up.

                      I don’t expect the local candidate to be top of the list, that’s ridiculous. But I expected they would at least rank above the union person not considered good enough to stand for the seat.

                    • RobC

                      “I don’t expect the local candidate to be top of the list, that’s ridiculous. But I expected they would at least rank above the union person not considered good enough to stand for the seat.”

                      Why??????

                      It could be both candidates are MP material – by ranking the one not contesting your electorate above the one that is might give them both a chance of entering parliament.

                      For someone bitching about regional representation, I’d expect you to think that might be a good thing.

                    • Colonial Viper

                      1. One of my main areas of interest is representation of Dunedin/Otago, and the Labour list suggests to me that this area is low on their priorities.
                       

                      PeteG you must have been ecstatic with ACT then when Hilary ‘Crazy Eyes’ Calvert entered Parliament. Another fine MP to represent Dunedin lolz

                    • PeteG

                      I’m more optimistic for how we’ll be represented by 49 on the Labour list than I am for the short term 5 on the Act list.

                • RobC

                  Pete, once again you start a thread and then shift the boundaries into irrelevancy as a discussion moves on.

                  Of course Labour has a fucking problem if it wants to become Govt. But that’s not why you started this thread.

                  Original post: “But it (Dunedin) doesn’t seem to be an area Labour puts much importance on, or attracts top candidates.”

                  2nd post: “I’m noticing how much importance Labour put on Dunedin candidates. Which seems to be bugger all.”

                  Further comment: “I’m interested in representation for Dunedin and Otago in parliament, that looks quite low on Labour’s priority list – if it’s considered at all.”

                  You have criticised Labour of regional neglect. A simple analysis shows IMO that criticism is misplaced. Either refute that analysis on some factual basis or admit you were wrong and move on.

                  PS Declaration of non-interest: I am not a member of the Labour Party and I don’t give a fuck what their internals look like.

                  • PeteG

                    A simple analysis shows IMO that criticism is misplaced.

                    What analysis? Why don’t you share it?
                     
                    The nature of blog discussions means it’s not uncommon for them to move away from the original points, especially when several opposing views divert from it.
                     

                    • RobC

                      Fuck me you are being particularly dumb today.

                      Go and read my 8.11 am post, towards the bottom, ref no 3.2.1.2.1.3  Or do you need it in braille?

            • felix 3.2.1.2.1.4

              Labour aren’t exactly a shoo-in for Government.
               

              How is this relevant to the ahem “point” you’re trying to make?

  4. Bored 4

    For those who did not notice it there has been a disgusting spectacle unfold in Washington during the last week. A bit of history, Obama brought in the concept of healthcare for all Americans with his election…fast forward and here we have the Republican side of the House holding Obama to ransom on the budget. Paraphrasing, the RWNJs are killing off the social budgets, and the right led by finance on Wall St are forcing the people of America to pay back “debt” created by Wall St by cutting government etc. Its the biggest rip off ever.

    • millsy 4.1

      Obama = Waste of space.

      His Nobel Prize should have been for allowing the opposition to set the agenda.

  5. Pascal's bookie 5

    I/S doing journalism, again.

    http://norightturn.blogspot.com/2011/04/crony-capitalism-iii.html

    Fuck he’s awesome.

    • Yep good post.
       
      The strange thing is the feeling of deja vu that I had reading I/S’s post.  Warner Bros engaged in the same sort of brinkmanship and persuaded our government to succumb meekly.
       
      Now it seems all the other corporates are lining up to do the same because they know the Government is a soft touch.
       
      Meanwhile in Provincial New Zealand protests are starting against poverty and the appearance of third world diseases
       
      This Government should hang its head in shame.
       

    • Roger 5.2

      Isn’t he just.
       
      Its good to see that someone is willing to dig a bit deeper than the surface considering this government seems to be spraying money at wealthy crybabies at every opportunity. I was wondering why nobody at the msm was investigating why Steven Joyce’s old company was hitting him up for a rule change considering the Warner Brothers shakedown which turned out to be a lie. These people holding the cabinet seats are a bunch of thieves and parasites that need to be removed before they hand over the country to their thieving mates.
      I love the way he sums it up also, much more eloquently than I could say it.

      • Idiot/Savant 5.2.1

        Its good to see that someone is willing to dig a bit deeper than the surface considering this government seems to be spraying money at wealthy crybabies at every opportunity. I was wondering why nobody at the msm was investigating why Steven Joyce’s old company was hitting him up for a rule change considering the Warner Brothers shakedown which turned out to be a lie.
        But they are – TVNZ has these same papers (I assume they lodged the same sort of OIA as I did), and published a story on them on Thursday night.  Other media has followed it up, and dug into some inconsistencies in the government’s story (though got it wrong over Key; he lied, but he didn’t make the decision). The difference is that I’m publishing the primary sources so people can read them.

  6. Carol 6

    Last week on The Standard, in a discussion on thre demise of public service TV and/or the government loan to MediaWorks, I praised the TV3 show The Good Wife (one of the best, quality US dramas that’s been on FTA TV in NZ recently. It was scheduled to show last night on TV3.  Without any advanced notice, TV3 pulled both House & The Good Wife and showed some old, oft repeated Adam Sandler movie instead.
     
    There’s been a large number of outraged protests on the TV3 forum for The Good Wife, a couple of them saying things like , “no wonder you needed a government bail-out”, if TV3 isn’t capable of keeping a really good show running.

  7. Bored 7

    From the Dom this morning Damian OConnor says the party’s new list is dominated by “self-serving unionists and a gaggle of gays”.
     
    Some fertile ground when considering that electorates like the West Coast tend to be conservative as sin, and working class to the core. They dont do the liberal Labour sectoral interest group thing. Then Labour wonders why they dont vote for them. Strange that.
     
    Labour have this problem because they have (quite rightly in my opinion) created a broad ranging church for all sorts BUT at the same time have allowed themselves to be seen as championing “favoured” groups at the expense of the rest of their flock. The perception out there is that if you criticise this you have broken the “PC” rules. Time to take OConnor seriously.
     
    PS PeteG, keep the fekk out of this one, its for lefties only.
     

    • Pascal's bookie 7.1

      But the problem surely lies in the party not sticking up for those voters as well.

      If Labour can only win the votes of working class ‘conservative’ battlers by kicking other marginalised groups in the teeth, then the problem isn’t that Labour is sticking up for those other groups, it’s that the conservatives don’t see how voting for Labour is also in their own interest.

      • Bored 7.1.1

        PB, here what you say. Its not a simple us or them, kick one side at the others expense. That is to miss OConnors point entirely. It is more about how Labour portrays a picture of caring for all equally, and how it absorbs the interests of sectoral groups  into the broader interest. Currently (even if it is not true) it is too easy for NACT to portray Labour as being about gay MPs and feminists which enables them to dodge the real issues entirely. Its a problem Labour have to resolve because it is costing them votes.

        • MrSmith 7.1.1.1

          Another good move by Labour, create a party scuffle, thrown in a bit of dog whistling, it get the medias attention plus lots of exposure for Damian, Goff and all the list MP’s. Keep this going for another two weeks the public will lap this up.
           
          I’m really starting to think they are getting there show together and lets face it folks this is politics.
           

          • Colonial Viper 7.1.1.1.1

            Perhaps Labour has figured out that people are dead frakkin bored of standard vanilla politics and they would like to see some real life and personality in how this country is led.
             
            Ahhh. Well that explains Winston’s solid ratings doesn’t it.

            • MrSmith 7.1.1.1.1.1

              Wonkey&Nact will run the election on personality politics, and apart from Wonkey (who has the personality of a dead fish) there are no other real personalities that I have seen in the national cabinet, anyway we couldn’t have someone else stealing his show.
               
              I hope Labour play him at his own game, endless dribble, distractions and sound bites that’s all he has, even Goff can do better than that and lets have a little humor please, christ we could use some.

      • Vicky32 7.1.2

        by kicking other marginalised groups in the teeth,

        WTF????????????????????? Please explain..

        • Carol 7.1.2.1

          Calling union leaders (who have a good record in working for their members) as “self-serving”, and MPs with a really good track record “a gaggle of gays” is hardly being complimentary.  And it’s also playing to prejudices against these  groups.

        • Pascal's bookie 7.1.2.2

          What I’m saying Vicky, is that left wing parties worthy of the name shouldn’t have to win the votes of ‘conservative’ right wingers by pandering to their bigotries.

          If a homophobe wants to vote for the left, they should be welcome to of course. But that vote should be earned in spite of their bigotry rather than because of it. 

          The same impulse that drives the left to stand up for the poor who are marginalised in society, must have them stand up for other marginalised groups.

          The right will try and pick various groups off by playing one against the other. That’s what we see in the claims that “the left has been taken over by a gay agenda’ or ‘iwi/kiwi’ or any of a number of other examples. It’s a pretty obvious divide and conquer maneuver.

          The way I think the left should beat it is to make the case that we are all in this together. Just as the left should be sticking up for all marginalised groups for the same reason; the right, at heart, attacks those groups for the same reason.

          They like to keep them marginalised to protect their own privilege, be that economic, social, cultural or whatever.  

          • PeteG 7.1.2.2.1

            The “left” are not in anything together, they factionalise and fight as much as the right, they are as quick as the right to try and jump on anyone who doesn’t toe their line. They stick up for marginalised groups that suit their purposes and gospel, and try to shout down anyone who points out their hypocrisy.

  8. vto 8

    Sheesh it is difficult to get demerits on Farrar’s website. But finally managed it when I suggested he is the Larry Flint of NZ, following a couple of recent postings. The site is, as many here describe, a sewer.

    • r0b 8.1

      It’s quite sad really, because DPF is a Nat insider and capable of very interesting posts, but he lets the value get lost and overwhelmed by the garbage, lies, and assorted loonies that make up the majority of Kiwiblog.

      Bravo to you anyway for trying to rattle the cage over there, and congratulations on your “demerits”. But I’d hate to feel you were missing out here at The Standard, so I can give you some “demerits” here too if you like. How many would you like? A Bazillion?

      • lprent 8.1.1

        I prefer to give a more personal bollocking ‘service’ than demerits. But we’re noted for our sysop customer focus.

        I find that it tends to help our lusers commentators to self-moderate themselves more effectively.

        😈 BOFH redux

      • vto 8.1.2

        Ha ha, dunno what I would do with a bazillion demerits.

        Anyways, this nat lot just seriously piss me off with their lies and conflicted positions and Farrar just regurgitates the crap. Deserves no cred or respect imo.

        Flames reignited again this morning when Minister Nick Smith suggests that getting decent controls on stopping farmers dumping their rubbish in the public estate (waterways) is “realistically some years away”.

        Well Nick Smith is a blatant liar. Treat the public like that and expect it straight back. Bullshitters.

        • RobC 8.1.2.1

          Heh. “Bullshitters” when you’re talking about the effluent off dairy farms. Witty.

        • Mac1 8.1.2.2

          Didn’t the Nats dump Ecan because they were too slow at getting things done, and now we have Dr Smith admitting that the Nats are too slow at getting decent controls?

          Why? They certainly know how to bulldoze, use Parliamentary procedures to shorten time frames. They know how to make up policy on the wing. What’s the delay?

          I wonder if the answer is that they don’t want to have decent controls- too many rich mates creaming it? (pun absolutely intended)

          • vto 8.1.2.2.1

            Exactly Mac1.

            The nats have given us the two state state. One for them and one for those of us not “in the loop”.

          • Bored 8.1.2.2.2

            For Nact when they say something is not efficient they really mean that it is slowing the flow of cash (to their pockets).
             
            That is a problem for democracy: speed and efficiency in a functioning democracy stand very low in the order of proceedings.

        • William Joyce 8.1.2.3

          Ha ha, dunno what I would do with a bazillion demerits.
          Create demerit derivatives, start trading in them, and when it all goes belly up  – get the government to bail you out, they have more than enough to go around.

  9. Dimpost pretty well sums up my feelings on the NZLP list, O’Connor’s comments and Goff’s handling of it all

    http://dimpost.wordpress.com/2011/04/11/that-took-a-lotta-class-2/

  10. tsmithfield 10

    After all the criticism Key got on this site for his estimate of 10000 homes that need replacing, after the quick assessment of Christchurch homes by EQC, it looks like Key’s numbers were pretty much on the money Admittedly, not all 12000 homes with over $100,000 in damage will need to be completely rebuilt. But I think its reasonable to assume a fairly high proportion of them probably will.

  11. Anne 11

    Matthew Hooten has just done an assassination job on Labour courtesy of Damian O’Conner –  political slot on Radio NZ. Should be online soon.

    Have to agree with Sue Bradford. Labour’s list process is cumbersome and badly in need of reform. 36 members of the moderation committee? That’s asking for trouble. Won’t comment on individual listings, except to say there are one or two top-drawer MPs who should be feeling justifiably annoyed.

    • millsy 11.1

      A possible solution to this would be open primaries to rank list candidates, which would allow voters to first choose who they want to see on the list, and to have candidates choose whether they want to be a list candidate or an electorate candidate, ie Andrew Little will have to decide whether he wants to go on the list, or contest NP.

      • Tigger 11.1.1

        Funny how no one ever gets headlines by saying National’s list is too full of straight, white men…

        • PeteG 11.1.1.1

          Wouldn’t it be better concentrating on being represented by people who are caopable of running a country rather than worrying about whether they represent enough minorities?
           
          Reasonable representation is important, competent government is more important.

          • Colonial Viper 11.1.1.1.1

            Gawd you are a larff and a harff
             
            You just wrote how it is better to be represented by people who do not represent the people (but who can competently run the country as their own little corporate interest).
             
            Get lost.

            (Hey Tigger…the NATs are not full of straight white men, that’s the amusing part)

            • Carol 11.1.1.1.1.1

              And is the Labour Party really THAT full of (out) gays?  3  on the Labour list is what TV3 quoted tonight.  Gower was talking about these power blocks on the list: 3 union leaders as one power block & 3 gays as another power block.  I didn’t realise I only had to find 2 other people who agreed with me to become a power block!
               
              And over at the gaynz forum, someone checked up how many geese in a gaggle – the answers differ from 5 to 7+ apparently, and when they’re flying they are called a “skein”.

            • Sam 11.1.1.1.1.2

              Better than a bunch of p******s!

          • RobC 11.1.1.1.2

            Dunedin-ites are a minority. You seem more than worried about that.

    • prism 11.2

      On a course I took there was a part involved with decision making.  There was a suggestion that having more than 16 was not useful.  Too many people and points from each couldn’t be talked through properly.  Labour’s panel sounds massive.  And the supporters of each faction would be likely to  think in a silo fashion.
       

  12. todd 12

    Contradictions and Lies

    http://thejackalman.blogspot.com/2011/04/contradictions-and-lies.html

    John Key says that we need to risk our environment to create jobs on deep sea oil rigs while National have sacked 3000 public servants and cut funding to TVNZ7, presumably because the Natz don’t agree with its content.

  13. prism 13

    Listening to rural news.  Another incursion from foreign weeds to worry about and cost us money fighting and trying to eradicate.  It’s called alligator weed, can have roots a metre deep, grows fast into a tangle of stems, can grow on land or in water ways.  So far seems in the north of the North Island but sounds like an incipient threat to the whole country.  We’d better watch out for it – question our local councils whether they have recognition literature, and alert experienced watchers.

  14. joe90 14

    Icelanders have voted against compensating investors for their losses in the failed Icesave.

    Final results showed the “no” side had just under 60 percent of the votes and the “yes” side about 40 percent.

    The result reflects Icelanders’ anger at having to pay for the excesses of their bankers, and complicates the country’s recovery from economic collapse.

    Now if only we could have a referendum on the SCF and AMI handouts.

  15. randal 15

    who heard finbar edwards on afternoons on friday. he virtually asked michelle boag for a job grooming john key and then he said that Phil Goff would nnot win this election.
    I never trusted him anyway and neither did the electorate when he tried to stand for parliament. they know a sooner when they see one.

    • Mac1 15.1

      I heard the bit you talk of, randal, but didn’t get that impression at all about seeking a job. What I heard was banter, all said with a smile. What you heard I suspect may have been filtered by your previous distrust.

      Edwards was linking his coaching skills to Boag’s PR skills as if to make the point that these skills are both needed in modern politics. At least, that’s how it came across to me. I’ve not read a transcript, which would have missed the smile in Edward’s voice anyway.

      I didn’t hear the Goff prediction which I would have remembered. I was driving at the time. You’re going back a long time to remember Edward’s political ambitions. So he lost. Most candidates do. I have, twice. Personal mistrust? Nah. The old FPP wisdom used to be that a candidate’s personal following was worth well less than a thousand votes. The rest of the voters went for the party.

  16. Draco T Bastard 16

    TELCON11: Crown Fibre fight turns to ‘national operating organisation’

    National organisation
    But the minister was already looking ahead, telling the audience that a “national operating arrangement” will be needed to link regional companies set up under the UFB.
    Mr Joyce said Telecom could be involved in such a national operating arrangement.
    Telecom has long pushed its Chorus division (which would be spun off if the company wins UFB contracts) as the obvious choice to manage a national fibre network, due to its manpower, expertise, and advantage in existing infrastructure.

    So, there we have it – Nationals UFB policy is just a means to restore Telecoms monopoly.

  17. Missy Poo 17

    Recently, I hosted my BFF from school days for a few days. She is a known activist / protester from the 80’s and now is a known union activist/organiser in the UK. A few days before she, and her lovely family, graced our shores my phone line went weird. Has the SIS once again (they did this in the 80’s, as well as search my flat) invaded my privacy by tapping my phone line?
    LOL – I would not be surprised. What fun. They still think I may be a threat to the security of our lovely land! ooo I would love to see the file they have on me.

    • Draco T Bastard 17.1

      Apparently, if they’re not presently investigating you, they’ll hand over your file – all you need do is ask.

    • William Joyce 17.2

      The file will come with a complementary pie of your choice and a men’s magazine – you can read it for the articles.

  18. Draco T Bastard 18

    Nuclear Power Subsidies: The Gift that Keeps on Taking

    Government subsidies to the nuclear power industry over the past fifty years have been so large in proportion to the value of the energy produced that in some cases it would have cost taxpayers less to simply buy kilowatts on the open market and give them away, according to a February 2011 report by the Union of Concerned Scientists.
    The report, Nuclear Power: Still Not Viable without Subsidies, looks at the economic impacts and policy implications of subsidies to the nuclear power industry—past, present, and proposed.

    Nuclear Power – still more expensive than any other power generating technique.

  19. Damien O’Connor’s ‘blurt’?
    Don’t forget folks – that a week IS a long time in politics, and the only poll that really counts is an election result.
    In my considered opinion,  as a former Botany by-election candidate – opposition to State asset sales  in particular,  is a WINNER.
    So – don’t get side-tracked by those who are arguably and unhelpfully ‘speaking out of turn’ – just continue to focus and campaign on the issues…
    Who was arguably the most effective ‘Leader’ in the Botany by-election?
    National Party Prime Minister – John Key – or Labour Party Leader – Phil Goff?
    Look at the FACTS – and YOU be the Judge?
    (If you haven’t seen this analysis of the Botany by-election by the NZ Herald’s CHIEF political reporter John Armstrong, or have forgotten it (as John Armstrong appeared to have done himself, some three weeks later), have another squiz at this: )
    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10710626

    Botany byelection loss holds silver lining for Labour Party
    By John Armstrong
    5:30 AM Monday Mar 7, 2011

    At last, Phil Goff has something to smile about.

    Exactly why the Labour leader is smiling might not seem immediately obvious given that National’s Jami-Lee Ross won Saturday’s Botany byelection in a canter, securing almost double the number of votes of his Labour counterpart.

    The answer is that everything is relative in politics. Labour did better than it hoped. National did not fare as well as it would have expected.
    ……………………..

    The complicating factor is Saturday’s abysmally low turnout. However, the non-vote would more likely be weighted in Labour’s favour.

    The 36.6 per cent turnout – half that of a general election – meant both major parties got fewer votes than at the 2008 election. Labour’s vote proved more robust. National’s vote halved from more than 17,000 to just over 8000. In comparison, Labour’s vote fell, but far less dramatically – from around 6500 to just over 4000.

    The net result is: Labour increased its share of the candidate vote in the seat from 21 per cent in 2008 to 28 per cent on Saturday.

    Moreover, it did so in the face of a number of handicaps – notably the party’s candidate, Michael Wood, committing one of politics’ great sins early on by saying he would not win the seat.  ………”

    Penny Bright
    http://waterpressure.wordpress.com

  20. “Draco T Bastard 17.1

    Apparently, if they’re not presently investigating you, they’ll hand over your file – all you need do is ask.”
    I asked – and they wouldn’t give me mine.
    Guess I must be doing something right!
    🙂
    Penny Bright
    http://waterpressure.wordpress.com

    • grumpy 20.1

      Surely then, that means (as Draco says above) that they are still investigating you.

      Been near the Ureweras lately?

      • Jum 20.1.1

        grumpy – keep taking the soma.  Key’ll lie to you as usual, but you’ll love it.  Could be because your rse is too close to the ground…

    • todd 20.2

      Yeah! They wouldn’t give me mine either. I think it is a scam, people (activists) who think they might have something on their file write in to get a copy and then automatically get placed on a investigate list. Cheeky sods!

  21. Jum 21

    Foreign Investment Decision [08/04/2011]
    PORTFOLIO: Treasury
    URL: http://www.treasurer.gov.au/displaydocs.aspx?doc=pressreleases/2011/030.htm&pageID=003&min=wms&Year=&DocType=0

    SNIPPET: After long and careful deliberations, I have today made an order under the Foreign Acquisitions and Takeovers Act 1975 (the Act) prohibiting the acquisition of ASX Limited (ASX) by Singapore Exchange Limited (SGX). The proposed acquisition has been subject to an ongoing examination by the Foreign Investment Review Board (FIRB), the Government’s independent advisory body, since it was announced on 25October 2010 and has been under formal consideration since the application was lodged on 11March 2011. However on this occasion I have decided that the proposal would not be in the national interest.

    Anything being planned by JKeyll and Joyce?  We know how much Key loves Singapore.

  22. Draco T Bastard 23

    Naomi Klein: Addicted to risk (TEDTalk, video)

  23. Draco T Bastard 24

    Mediaworks didn’t need our money

    This advice was ignored. Two weeks after the briefing was given, Economic Development Minister Gerry Brownlee wrote to John Key seeking permission to bring an urgent paper to Cabinet on the issue. The letter made no mention of the modelling at all, and accepted at face value the RBA’s claims that its members were too poor to pay, despite their books showing that the opposite was the case.

    I/S doing more uncovering of facts regarding the government loaning our money at preferential rates to big business.

    • Note that I’ve since amended that; advisers argued over who would lead on the issue, and while a letter for Brownlee was drafted (hence my mistake), it was Joyce who eventually fronted it to Cabinet.

  24. chris73 25

    Sorry was at work so couldn’t reply
    Yes I agreed with the spirit of his comment but as I said its not quite how I’d put it (I’m sure my comments in this area can be bought up) because being over-represented by the Rainbow wing and the unions is not representative of NZ today
    As I’ve said before it seems as if Labour has moved away from its roots and now it sounds like one of its own MPs is echoing the same sentiments
    But what I’d like you to do Voice of Reason is explain to me exactly how I’m being homophobic (just in case my gay sister-in-law and her partner are reading this, they might not invite me over to dinner)
    Oh and Millys, not cool bringing up the holocaust

    • Mac1 25.1

      chris73
      easy answer. Take all the relevant comments to your sister-in-law and her partner, and ask them whether you are homophobic.

      I carried on the discussion of the Holocaust. Very apposite. Very germane. Very respectful. See my comment following 1.1.1.2.1.1 and ff.

    • The Voice of Reason 25.2

      At work? Crikey, I’ll never lump you in with Tim and peteG again if you’ve got an actual job.
       
      The way I see it this; you agree with the sentiment, not the words. But the problem actually is the sentiment. The reason O’Connor is in the shit is because he expressed a homophobic sentiment, via a memorable phrase. You might choose to use different words, but if you genuinely think that teh gays are a problem, as O’Connor seems to, then you too have a wee problem.
       
       

      • William Joyce 25.2.1

        Except it was only homophobic to those unable to read, unable to understand the context, have no understanding of English and the meaning of words and  as are as irredeemably learning impaired as you seem to be VOR.
        It may be that he misunderstood what the politics were in the list selection process and lashed out at the wrong people but you cannot justifiably call it homophobic.
        In the same way that you can’t call someone racist or anti-Christian if they identify a power block in Rodney as being composed of mainly South African fundamentalist Christians. You could even call them a gaggle of SA fundies if you like.
        I know it’s a subtle point and goes beyond your ability to make the distinction (as you have now with homophobia and racism) but one would hope that you would take some instruction from your betters and not parrot the same sensationalist stance you see in the msm.

        • Carol 25.2.1.1

          Except O’Connor didn’t just identify a power block (of 3 people in each case?). The language O’Connor used was derogatory about gays & union leaders.  Seemed to be playing to homophobia to me.

          • William Joyce 25.2.1.1.1

            Except there is a distinction. He did not say anything derogatory about unions or gays. He did not attribute to them as a people group any unsavoury qualities. He just said – “them over there, they did it to me”
            He just used two characteristics so they could be identified – gay or union instead of “them”.
            “of 3 people in each case?” – I didn’t address the issue of whether he was right (I possibly think he was wrong) but he didn’t commit the “crime” of homophobia.
            “was derogatory about gays & union leaders” – how so? Gays don’t like being lumped in with unionists? They don’t like being called a gaggle?

            • Carol 25.2.1.1.1.1

              O’Connor used derogatory language about both union leaders and gays.  Lumping them together?  That’s a diversion.
               
              You seem to have a limited understanding of homophobia. It covers many kinds of behaviour, not just out and out nastiness.  More often than not it’s expressed through innuendo and smears of one kind or another, and they can be damaging:
               

              What is homophobia?
              There is no single definition for the term ‘homophobia’, as it covers a wide range of different viewpoints and attitudes. Homophobia is generally defined as hostility towards or fear of gay people, but can also refer to social ideologies which stigmatise homosexuality.1 2 Negative feelings or attitudes towards non-heterosexual behaviour, identity, relationships and community, can lead to homophobic behaviour and is the root of the discrimination experienced by many lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender (LGBT) people. Homophobia manifests itself in different forms, for example homophobic jokes, physical attacks, discrimination in the workplace and media representation.

               
              Yes, the use of the word “gaggle” was derogatory. It implies gays are a mindless bunch of chattering animals.  And it was based on no evidence.  Homophobic smears were used against the Clark government consistently: a long line of innuendos about lesbians & gays, who, it seems according to these smears, just are out to hi-jack government for their own selfish reasons.   And for some with a prejudiced leaning it’s enough to turn them against some politicians, with absolutely no evidence – just the derogatory language.

               
               

              • William Joyce

                1.Look at the construction of the comment – it does not single out gays as being the sole components of the gaggle – it also included unionists.
                2.Being labelled a gaggle is at the lesser end of offending and I would have thought gays or others should be able to not get so offended and move on.
                You lost your argument when you resorted to a dictionary…
                Negative feelings or attitudes towards non-heterosexual behaviour, identity, relationships and community,
                – Nobody has proved that he has these attitudes – they have just looked at his comments, not read them properly assumed they are homophobic and inferred attitudes. Go back to your dictionary and look up Eisegesis (the process of misinterpreting a text in such a way that it introduces one’s own ideas, reading into the text)
                Homophobia manifests itself in different forms, for example homophobic jokes, physical attacks, discrimination in the workplace and media representation.
                – He didn’t attack them because they were gay. He attacked them because he saw them, rightly or wrongly, as a group that he blamed and could be distinguished by a common characteristic – they were all gay. Just as the unionist groups were all unionists

                Homophobia is generally defined as hostility towards or fear of gay people
                – He did not exhibit hostility towards gay people per se but a group of people who were gay. There is a difference and the failure to grasp this is the foundation of a sort of PC Group-think.


                “Homophobic smears were used against the Clark government consistently: a long line of innuendos about lesbians & gays, who, it seems according to these smears, just are out to hi-jack government for their own selfish reasons.   And for some with a prejudiced leaning it’s enough to turn them against some politicians, with absolutely no evidence – just the derogatory language.”
                – Just because this happened does not make what he said homophobic. That’s like saying There are people doing evil in the world so my mother is also doing evil.

                • The Voice of Reason

                  “1.Look at the construction of the comment – it does not single out gays as being the sole components of the gaggle – it also included unionists.”

                  Ok, then, lets look, shall we?

                  What he said was “self-serving unionists and a gaggle of gays”. So you’d be wrong, William. But you’re used to that, eh.

                  • William Joyce

                    Thank you VOR to this correction – the gaggle was specific to the gays
                    “self-serving unionists and a gaggle of gays”.
                    So I stand corrected on the point I erroneously said that the gaggle was specific to the gays.
                     
                    So you’d be wrong, William. But you’re used to that, eh.
                     
                    Nice little Monday night wet dream for you but how does that add to or detract from the debate?
                     
                    Are you telling me, that there is such a long history of gays being called a gaggle that it has become such a loaded term. You know VOR – I have my own dream tonight. It’s a glorious dream. It’s a dream when white man and the black man will hold hands together; when the straight man and the gay man will hold hands.
                    And they will join me on that mountain top – for I have been to the mountain top. And I have looked out over the suburban houses of Auckland and I have looked into the promised land and I have seen the lion lay down with the lamb, I have seen white man call the the black man a nigger no more and the straight man call the gay man a gaggle no more.
                    anti-spam : past (past my bedtime)

              • higherstandard

                “Yes, the use of the word “gaggle” was derogatory. It implies gays are a mindless bunch of chattering animals. ”

                But isn’t the word gaggle commonly used within the gay community ?

        • Pascal's bookie 25.2.1.2

          But there actually is evidence of shenanigans in Rodney.

          If there wasn’t any evidence, and someone said shit about south african immigrants and what have you, then yeah, they could find themselves accused of bigotry.

          DO’C’s evidence seem to be, there are gay mps that got a better list spot than him, therefore they are all in cahoots together to keep poor Damien down.

          Maybe losing the west coast has something to do with his list spot? If he can’t win it back, then why should he get a cushy list spot?

          • William Joyce 25.2.1.2.1

            The charge of homophobia is about attributing to gay people, as a people group, attributes or reason why they should be marginalised.
            NOT about whether what he said was true or not.
            “south african immigrants and what have you, then yeah, they could find themselves accused of bigotry.” – Well some could indeed be accused of being a bigot but it wouldn’t make them one.
            “DO’C’s evidence seem to be, there are gay mps that got a better list spot than him” – With respect, you seem to make the same error the msm etc are making.
            It is possible for a group of people, with similar interests and a distinguishing characteristic, to form a “cohort” to achieve a purpose in their interests. So it is just quite possible that a group of people (who just happen to be gay) lobby to achieve their aims. Gay people are no more above this than anybody else.
            The problem is that DO’C seems to have seen enemies where there weren’t any not that he said evil things about gay people.

            • Pascal's bookie 25.2.1.2.1.1

              He chose to scapegoat gays. Not ‘townies’, or ‘Goff favourites’, or anything else. Except for ‘self serving unionists’ of course, he also blamed them. A phrase which you tell me isn’t derogatory.

              I’m thinking it’s not me that needs to read things a little closer.

              And if you think there isn’t also an implied call for gays to be marginalised within the Labour list when someone implies that their current presence there is due to some gaggling reflex, then you are not thinking as clearly as you claim to be able to do.

              It certainly seems to me that many of his defenders have been saying that Labour needs to get back to its roots and what not. They don’t explain, even though they are asked to, but it sure looks like they are saying, ‘less gays please’. Which would be marginalising, no?

              I’ve not looked at Kiwiblog. But I’ll go out on a limb and say that that dogs are barking there exactly as if they had heard a whistle.

              A whistle you claim wasn’t there.

              • William Joyce

                He chose to scapegoat gays.
                You’re right he was scapegoating in the sense he was looking for someone to blame for the failure to make it high on the list (then he spat the dummy).
                But there error you and the others are making is that he was not scapegoating gays as Hitler scapegoated Jews (as a people group, all of them, in their entirety because of an evil that arose from the nature of the jew).
                DO’C did nothing of the sort. He did not say that gay people were the cause of his downfall because of the evil that come out of their “gayness” – which would have been homphobic.
                DO’C did no say that these particular gay people were the cause of his downfall because of the evil that comes out of their “gayness” – which would have been homophobic.
                He said that a group of those people over there and the those people over there are to blame for his downfall.
                He just used a specific identifying so that everyone knew who he meant – the group that are gays and the group that are unionist.
                That is NOT homophobic.
                So that leaves the question – is he right?
                1.Are there these powers groups inside the selection process. Of course there are.
                The Gays, The unions, The Senior party wind people, the party backroom people, the pepperpot ladies from Mt Albert.
                2.Did one or more these groups edge him out? Does sound like it.
                 
                Not ‘townies’, or ‘Goff favourites’, or anything else. Except for ‘self serving unionists’ of course, he also blamed them. A phrase which you tell me isn’t derogatory.
                Sorry, I forgot the self-serving bit and didn’t mention it so I don’t think I was telling you it isn’t derogatory.
                 
                What has exercised me in this is that automatic PC_Group think that goes on, and the moral panic complete with pitch forks and torches any time somebody says something that could reflect badly on individual gay people, the gay community or their actions.
                 
                We hear something and it’s like we take off from and 0 to 100 in three seconds charging down the road in moral outrage while brains have been flung to the back of the car and play no part in the event.
                 
                I’m thinking it’s not me that needs to read things a little closer.
                And if you think there isn’t also an implied call for gays to be marginalised within the Labour list when someone implies that their current presence there is due to some gaggling reflex, then you are not thinking as clearly as you claim to be able to do.
                Again, the same mistake, he didn’t imply a “call for gays to be marginalised”
                – the accusation was that they prevented plum position on the list
                – the implication was NOT that gays should be marginalised but that these gays held disproportionate sway.
                They don’t explain, even though they are asked to, but it sure looks like they are saying, ‘less gays please’. Which would be marginalising, no?
                Yes, it would but I have no knowledge of that. I am only addressing a narrow and specific point regarding the misinterpretation of what DO’C and the limits to what you can with integrity infer from that statement – and leave the rest for another day.
                 

                • Pascal's bookie

                  He did not say anything derogatory about unions or gays. He did not attribute to them as a people group any unsavoury qualities.

                  That’s what you said, it’s been your whole point. If you forgot what he said, then it doesn’t lend any credibility to the idea that you have any clue as to what you are talking about. You kind of missed the boat mate. 

                  All sorts of people have been inferring that he was implying that ‘Labour should get back to its roots, ergo, less gays’. 

                  Perhaps you have been out of the country for a time, or in a coma, or some other thing that has meant that you are so divorced from what the fuck his comments mean in context. I couldn’t know your circumstance. But as noted, D’OC has been in parliament for nigh on 20 years. He knows how his comments would fit into the political discourse; this is what politicians do. Knowing how their language will be interpreted is a primary skill. 

                  Here is another thing you said:

                  There is nothing offensive in what Chris73 said above. 

                  That was in reference to Chris saying that Labour should get back to its roots, a statement you now say would be marginalising of gays given this particular context. You also defined homophobia as attempts at marginalising gays. 

                  Nighty night, it’s been real.

          • Sam 25.2.1.2.2

            Exactly, why should a failed electorate candidate “sneak” back into parliament as a”list” MP?  That is the major fault with MMP.
            Hooray for Lyn Dalziel, who also has backed herself in an electorate, not relying on being a “list” MP .  Having “six pence each way” is the coward’s way.
            Phil Goff and co should remove themselves from the list and demonstrate some backbone, somthing that is lacking in his caucus.

            • rosy 25.2.1.2.2.1

              “Phil Goff and co should remove themselves from the list and demonstrate some backbone, somthing that is lacking in his caucus.”

              As Should National?

        • The Voice of Reason 25.2.1.3

          William, it was really nothing. But thanks for the validation and do keep reading my stuff. I’m charmed that you keep tabs on my postings and I look forward to further critiques of my meagre efforts from one so learned as yourself.

          If you want to get really pompous, you’ll find some more learning impaired people here:
          http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/72639/gay-groups-demand-apology-over-mp%27s-comments
           
           

          • William Joyce 25.2.1.3.1

            To be honest, when we had our little spat of MLaws being a racist I determined early on that you were incapable of getting this distinction and after that day decided it was pointless showing you the error of your ways.
            However, even with the noblest of reasons not to we all sometimes give in to our more base nature and charge the red flag.
            So, don’t flatter yourself, I don’t monitor your posts but just recognised that same flawed reasoning again and threw caution to the wind.
            The fact that you included that link shows you don’t understand the nature of the debate or the players. Of course a reporter will be able to search high and low to find some “offended” people to get a quote – that’s what they do. It does not mean the quote stands up to rational scrutiny – it only proves that there is someone out there who is making the same mistake you are.
            Your argument can be just as wrong even if you find a million quotes from people who agree with you.
            By that reasoning John Key should be our next Pm because everybody loves him!

            • The Voice of Reason 25.2.1.3.1.1

              Christ, were you defending Lhaws? How sad. If that argument, which I don’t remember, upsets you, don’t under any circumstances google my exchange on racism with TravellerEv. That was epic. I just don’t like bigots, William. Can’t abide ’em.
               
              I linked to the news item, because I believe the wronged have the right to name the crime. ie. if the gay community define O’Connor’s statement as homophobic and call for an apology, then it’s probably homophobic and he should apologise. Which I note he has done and will do again tomorrow. Obviously, he doesn’t see it the way you do, now that he’s calmed down.
               

    • millsy 25.3

      Chris,

      1) See my comment all the way above.

      2) If you have an issue with unionists in the National Party, then I take it you also have issue with iwi aristocrats in the Maori Party, businessmen and farmers in the National Party, BRT plutocrats in ACT, and stoned hippies in the green party

  25. Jenny 26
    To my mind Darren O’Connor’s comments attacking the Labour Party as being run by “a gaggle of gays and self serving Trade unionists” were more in line with the sort of insults I would expect to come from Labour’s enemies in National and ACT.

    And as such, would seem on the surface of it, to be contrary to O’Connor’s continued position in parliament as a representative of the Labour Party, traditionally a party opposed to intolerance, and supportive of the aspirations of working people, and yes, their organisations the trade unions.

    I don’t expect to hear Labour MPs attacking both diversity and trade unions, in the same sentence, especially in election year.

    If this is truly what Darren O’Connors thinks, then he should gracefully step down as a Labour MP, and seek membership in an organisation in line with these views. The Labour Party is not it.
    (at least I hope it isn’t)

    • Sam 26.1

      Is the slight rise in Goff’s popularity caused by him (finally) sacking (or at least withdrawing support) from another “gay” MP?
      How many here in “the Standard” are “metro” males, living in AKL or WGTN and who have no idea how the Labour party  is viewed in mainstream New Zealand outside of the main centres?

      Labourites, outside of AKL, WGTN, ChCh and Dndn you don’t have representation.
      Maybe mainstream NZ and Danian O’Connor are right and you are wrong?  Think about it!

      • The Voice of Reason 26.1.1

        Sam, I think you will find that being urban heavy applies to all parties. Looking through the Labour list, I can find half a dozen rural or provincial candidates in the top 40 (ie. potentially electable) and that’s just the ones I know about. That doesn’t seem out of kilter at all.
         
        As for the Beckhamist tendencies of ‘the Standard’, again, I think you’ll find that contributors come from all sorts of circumstances and all sorts of places, such as the rural town I live in, and not everyone on the site supports Labour, anyway.

        • lprent 26.1.1.1

          I would hazard a guess that most of the commentators of the left do not. They might reluctantly force themselves to vote Labour if they have to. However there are a lot of lurkers who are Labour members. When I have time to write, that is who I try to write for.

          But I would agree about the higher proportion of people on the electable list outside the top five six urban centers compared to population. It is pretty deliberate – I know that we were considering it when we were voting on the Northland Auckland list.

          NZ is increasingly a urban culture and Labour finds organizing in the concentrated larger cities to be a lot easier than across a range of smaller towns. It used to be easier when the electorate sizes were somewhat smaller and towns actually fitted into an electorate. Amongst other uses the list allows to get representation from areas where it is hard to get electorate MP’s elected.

      • Carol 26.1.2

        Is the slight rise in Goff’s popularity caused by him (finally) sacking (or at least withdrawing support) from another “gay” MP?

        I find such anti-gay slurs & dog-whistles a disturbing part of the debate on this issue.  After decades of struggle against destructive homophobia, I think it’s good we finally get some out gay MPs (and hardly in a way that makes them dominant over heterosexual politicians). It’s disturbing that people think withdrawing support from them, merely because they are gay, is some kind of victory – looks like a regressive backlash to me – a desire to return to oppressive treatment of gays.

        And it’s just a destraction from the major economic and social issues we face. Gay Labour MPs are also part of that struggle for kiwi battlers. It doesn’t need to be either/or, but all of us together against the right wing destruction machine.

    • chris73 26.2

      I personally think he was using alliteration
       
       

      • Mac1 26.2.1

        Alliteration definitely was being used, to reinforce meaning, to catch attention and to be memorable. No excuse there, Chris73.

    • Colonial Viper 26.3

      Yes, O’Connor’s personal attack on his own party and the people within it was blatant and unacceptable.
       
      But there was another message there in his frustration as well. Labour is not being heard by the ordinary working class. Labour is not being heard by struggling New Zealanders up and down the breadth of the country.
       
      National have led us into a devastating economic slump hurting Maori, PI’s, women, youth the worst. While gifting state money and assets to the already wealthy.
       
      And what traction does Labour have in the polls as all this is hitting home? 31%, 32%, 33%. Worse in fact than when times were good under Labour in 2008 and the working class were still doing OK. In this environment, National should be easily pounded into the dust.
       
      So something is wrong, and even though O’Connor is an ass for saying what he said he got something right.
       
      Labour is still failing to connect.

      • Armchair Critic 26.3.1

        National have led us into a devastating economic slump hurting Maori, PI’s, women, youth the worst. While gifting state money and assets to the already wealthy.
        Fuckin’ aye.  Labour may well have bought a train set.  National have bought a bankrupt finance company, a bankrupt insurance company and the grass in an unusable stadium. I can see a use for the train set.  The other three?  Not so sure.

      • Salsy 26.3.2

        Ive been watching the stuff poll over the past couple of days. Nat and Lab were neck and neck for some time, then there was a swing to the right this morning..
        ACT 167 votes, 6.5%
        Greens 345 votes, 13.4%
        A Hone Harawira-led party 87 votes, 3.4%
        Labour 619 votes, 24.1%
        Maori Party 33 votes, 1.3%
        National 1027 votes, 39.9%
        New Zealand First 261 votes, 10.1%
        Progressive 10 votes, 0.4%
        United Future 23 votes, 0.9%
        Total 2572 votes

        • lprent 26.3.2.1

          On line polling is pretty useless. It really just reflects what groups have time to waste and who has net access and who is interested in online politics. Look at the Act vote in that poll for instance compared to the Maori party vote.

          But in any case I can’t use it – lightbox is evidently one of the things that doesn’t work on my iPad.

          • Salsy 26.3.2.1.1

            And flash which frustrates the crap out of us – though javascript should be all okay..

      • sean 26.3.3

        You forgot to mention that John Key caused both the Christchurch earthquakes and is responsible for the GFC due to his FX market manipulations last century.

        • Colonial Viper 26.3.3.1

          Sean apparently doesn’t understand that the financial instruments which caused the GFC included advanced derivatives whose development stem from the 1990’s.
           
          Did Key cause both Christchurch earthquakes? He merely used them for political gain and to hurt the city of Christchurch. But cause them? No, he is just a trader of other peoples’ fortunes.

      • Carol 26.3.4

        And what’s O’Connor doing for the working class? His criticisms of Labour seem to be all about his own status and a diversion from any attempts to address the crucial issues that will make things better for the working class.

  26. Jenny 27


    A risk taking granny?

    Herald Editorial: Drilling for oil a risk worth taking

    Granny sez:

    New Zealand needs a big oil discovery to show it has proven large reserves. That, combined with its attractive exploration regime, would entice other major explorers to come here. The potential benefit in tax and royalty income, jobs and regional development is enormous. If there is, as with virtually any activity, a risk, there is also the prospect of huge reward. It is not a possibility the country, including those protesting against Petrobras’ presence, can afford to pass up.

    Next week, I expect to read that the dare devils at the Herald, write that base jumping from inner city tower blocks is a common lunch time activity recommended by Herald editorial writers, again they might even admit that, ” as with virtually any activity, (there is) a risk”

  27. Drakula 28

    Jenny: O’Connor’s true home is ACT but it is really sad the extent to which the right wing biggots are always trying to gatecrash the Labour party.

    • todd 28.1

      I often wonder if the Labour party is failing on purpose because there is a certain amount of support for asset sales, oil exploration and beneficiary bashing etc amongst their ranks.

  28. sean 29

    At least having a gaggle of gay MPs is a step up from having MPs who book porn on their parliamentary credit cards.  Its a step in the right direction :p

  29. Colonial Viper 30

    PeteG represents the National Party panic that it’s closing on the last half of election year and Goff has now made double digit ratings.

  30. PeteG 31

    So you do have a sense of humour.
     
    The Nats have a lot more to worry about than Goff’s 11%.

    I don’t have anything to panic about, I’m not involved in a party stumbling from blunder to blunder. whose supporters are desperate to conjure up any smidgen of a sign that they stand a chance of regaining power.

    • Colonial Viper 31.1

      Yeah, thanks for that, I thought I smelt Right Wing fear and you confirmed it.

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  • Tax-free deployments for Kiwi troops
    Darroch Ball, New Zealand First List MP A Member’s bill has been proposed that would provide income tax exemptions for all New Zealand Defence Force (NZDF) personnel while on operational deployment overseas. The Income Tax (Exemption for Salary or Wages of NZDF Members on Active Deployment) Amendment Bill proposed by New Zealand First ...
    6 days ago
  • A balanced Zero Carbon Bill passed
    Rt Hon Winston Peters, New Zealand First Leader New Zealand First is proud to have brought common sense to the Climate Change Response (Zero Carbon) Amendment Bill, which passed its final reading in Parliament today. Party Leader Rt Hon Winston Peters says months of hard work went into negotiating a balanced ...
    7 days ago
  • Paramedics’ status to be recognised
    Jenny Marcroft MP, Spokesperson for Health New Zealand First has listened to calls to recognise paramedics as registered health professionals under the Health Practitioners’ Competence Assurance Act (the Act). Today, the Coalition Government announced plans for paramedics to be registered as health practitioners under the Act, and the establishment of a ...
    1 week ago
  • Week That Was: 2,000 teachers in two years
    We began the week by commemorating the New Zealand Wars and celebrating a major increase in the number of teachers. Then, we were busy supporting offenders into work and getting our rail back on track after years of underinvestment. And that's just the start! ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Winning an election one conversation at a time
    In October I was sworn in as the Mayor of Lower Hutt. It’s the privilege of my life to serve Hutt people as their Mayor. There is something really special to be able to serve the community where I was raised, and where I live.   ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Closer cooperation with Korean horse racing industry
    Rt Hon Winston Peters, Deputy Prime Minister, Minister for Racing Racing Minister Winston Peters met with Korea Racing Authority Chairperson Nak Soon Kim in Seoul today to discuss closer cooperation between the New Zealand and Korean horse racing industries. As part of the visit to the Seoul Racecourse, Mr Peters witnessed ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Otago to lead digital creativity
    Hon Shane Jones, Minister for Regional Economic Development The Provincial Growth Fund (PGF) is investing $10 million to establish Otago as the centre of New Zealand’s creative digital industry over the next ten years, Regional Development Minister Shane Jones announced today. “The initiative will bring us closer to the vision of ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Young Otago students encouraged to take on forestry careers
    Hon Shane Jones, Minister for Regional Economic Development The Provincial Growth Fund (PGF)’s skills and employment programme will help young Otago people into long-term forestry careers, Regional Economic Development Minister Shane Jones announced today. Te Ara Mahi will invest $63,000 in the 2020 school year to support eight 17 and 18 ...
    2 weeks ago
  • PGF backing Dunedin’s waterfront ambitions
    Hon Shane Jones, Minister for Regional Economic Development The Provincial Growth Fund (PGF) will support local plans to revitalise and stimulate economic development opportunities in Otago, Regional Economic Development Minister Shane Jones has announced. The four Regional Economic Development Ministers have approved an in-principle investment of $19.9 million towards the region’s ...
    2 weeks ago
  • M. Bovis eradication progress welcomed
    Mark Patterson, Spokesperson for Primary Industries New Zealand First is pleased to have received the Technical Advisory Group (TAG) report on the Coalition Government’s Mycoplasma bovis eradication efforts, which shows significant progress in the fight against the disease. New Zealand First Spokesperson for Primary Industries, Mark Patterson, says the report’s findings ...
    2 weeks ago
  • PGF boosts Otago’s engineering and manufacturing sector
    Hon Shane Jones, Minister for Regional Economic Development Hon David Parker, Minister for Trade and Export Growth The Provincial Growth Fund (PGF) is investing to support economic growth opportunities for Otago’s engineering and manufacturing sectors, Regional Development Minister Shane Jones and Trade and Export Minister David Parker announced today. Almost $20 million ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Minister Peters discusses Pacific challenges and denuclearisation in Seoul
    Rt Hon Winston Peters, Deputy Prime Minister, Minister of Foreign Affairs Foreign Minister Winston Peters and his South Korean counterpart, Kang Kyung-wha, discussed in Seoul today opportunities to work more closely in the Pacific and the situation on the Korean Peninsula. Mr Peters and Minister Kang confirmed New Zealand and the ...
    2 weeks ago
  • PGF supports high speed broadband for marae at Parihaka Pa
    Hon Shane Jones, Minister for Regional Economic Development  Hon Nanaia Mahuta, Minister for Māori Development The three marae in the historic Parihaka Pa complex in Taranaki have been upgraded to high speed broadband with the support of the Provincial Growth Fund (PGF), Regional Economic Development Minister Shane Jones announced today. “Connecting the ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Advancing Pacific Partnerships 2019 launched
    Hon Ron Mark, Minister of Defence Minister of Defence Ron Mark will today launch the Advancing Pacific Partnerships 2019 Defence Assessment  during a speech at Te Papa.  The Assessment outlines how Defence will partner with our Pacific Island neighbours and invest in Pacific regional security architecture. The Plan aligns with the Coalition ...
    2 weeks ago
  • PGF funding could transform Gisborne company into “beacon of employment” in two years
    A new Provincial Growth Fund investment could create about 80 new jobs in Gisborne over the next two years, turning a local small business into a “beacon of employment” in the process. Regional Economic Development Parliamentary Under-Secretary Fletcher Tabuteau said the PGF’s Te Ara Mahi funding stream would provide $1.6m ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Week That Was: Two years of progress
    This week, we’re taking action on climate change, expanding trades education – and celebrating two years of progress! ...
    3 weeks ago
  • Minister of Foreign Affairs to visit the Republic of Korea and Japan
    Rt Hon Winston Peters, Deputy Prime Minister, Minister of Foreign Affairs Minister of Foreign Affairs Winston Peters will travel to the Republic of Korea and Japan next week. “The Republic of Korea and Japan are two of New Zealand’s closest partners in the region with whom we share common values and ...
    3 weeks ago
  • New Zealand to lead Bougainville Referendum Regional Police Support Mission
    Rt Hon Winston Peters, Deputy Prime Minister, Minister of Foreign Affairs Minister of Foreign Affairs Winston Peters has announced today that New Zealand is leading a police support mission in Bougainville as the region prepares to vote in a non-binding referendum on its political future. “New Zealand has accepted an invitation ...
    3 weeks ago
  • We’re taking action on climate change
    “I refuse to accept the challenge of climate change is too hard to solve.” – Jacinda Ardern ...
    3 weeks ago
  • Shane Jones annoyed at “elevated sense of entitlement from a lot of immigrant leaders”
    New Zealand First MP Shane Jones is defending Immigration New Zealand (INZ) after it instructed officials to stop granting visas as an exception to instructions. He has also lashed out at immigrant leaders upset with the tightening of the rules, saying they had an “elevated sense of entitlement”. Members of ...
    3 weeks ago
  • New Zealand public likely to vote on euthanasia bill thanks to NZ First
    A change to the End of Life Choice Bill was passed in Parliament, meaning if politicians decide to vote for the law it must be approved by the public first. A binding referendum was a condition insisted on by New Zealand First, and Jenny Marcroft’s supplementary order paper (SOP) successfully ...
    3 weeks ago

  • Fisheries innovation projects supported
    Groups involved with innovative fisheries research projects are encouraged to apply for government support in the latest funding round from the Sustainable Food and Fibre Futures programme. Fisheries Minister Stuart Nash says the SFF Futures funding is designed to be flexible enough to support small or large projects across a ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    10 hours ago
  • Government fixes culturally arranged marriage visa issue
    The Government has fixed an issue affecting how Immigration New Zealand has processed visa applications for culturally arranged marriages, which will now see a consistent process applied which ensures people with legitimate arranged marriages can visit New Zealand while also preventing any rorting of the system. Earlier this year Immigration ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    14 hours ago
  • Extension for Royal Commission into Mosque attacks
    The Royal Commission into the Attacks on Christchurch Mosques will report back on 30 April 2020 to give it more time to hear submissions and consider information, Internal Affairs Minister Tracey Martin announced today. The Royal Commission was originally scheduled to report back to Government by 10 December 2019. “There has ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    16 hours ago
  • Terrorism and Trade on agenda as Foreign Minister visits the United States
    Foreign Minister Winston Peters will travel to Washington DC today to attend a ministerial meeting focused on defeating ISIS, and to continue pursuing New Zealand’s trade opportunities. Mr Peters will participate in a meeting of Foreign and Defence Ministers from key countries contributing to the Global Coalition to Defeat ISIS. ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    16 hours ago
  • Hoiho get extra support alongside 168 community conservation groups backing nature
    The recently crowned Bird of the Year, the hoiho/yellow eyed penguin, is getting a much needed helping hand alongside more than 168 other community conservation projects announced Minister for Conservation Eugenie Sage today. 168 community conservation projects throughout New Zealand are benefiting from $8 million in government grants, including $500,000 ...
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    17 hours ago
  • New safety measures for modified pistols
    Controls on assault rifles and semi-automatic firearms are to be broadened to include some types of pistols, under changes to a bill currently making its way through Parliament. Police Minister Stuart Nash has tabled a Supplementary Order Paper to the Arms Legislation Bill, which is currently before a Select Committee ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    18 hours ago
  • Minister of Defence to visit Singapore and Thailand
    Minister of Defence Ron Mark will travel to Singapore today to conduct a counterpart visit and to co-chair the third annual Singapore-New Zealand Defence Ministers’ Meeting with his counterpart, Minister for Defence Dr Ng Eng Hen. “Singapore is one of our most important defence partners in the region, and our ...
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    18 hours ago
  • Future secured for Salisbury School
    Nelson’s Salisbury School is to be rebuilt, creating a modern and suitable learning environment for students at the residential special school, Education Minister Chris Hipkins and Associate Education Minister Tracey Martin announced today. The school for girls aged 8-15, in Richmond, was earmarked for closure by National until the process ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    18 hours ago
  • Resource management reform options released
    The panel undertaking a comprehensive review of the Resource Management Act has identified the main issues to be addressed and options for reform and is calling for feedback to inform its final report.  In July the Government announced the comprehensive review of the resource management system, including the RMA - ...
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    20 hours ago
  • Criminal Cases Review Commission established
    An important safety valve has been added to New Zealand’s criminal justice system with the third reading of the Criminal Cases Review Commission Bill today. The Criminal Cases Review Commission (CCRC) will investigate claimed miscarriages of justice. “We’ve seen how our justice system can very occasionally get things spectacularly wrong, ...
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    1 day ago
  • Racing Industry destined to be on-track
    Racing Minister Winston Peters welcomes the tabling of the Racing Industry Transition Agency (RITA) 2019 Annual Report in Parliament today. He says the 2019 Annual Report marks the point when New Zealand’s racing industry’s decline was arrested and a turnaround started. RITA’s 2019 Annual Report recorded an industry net profit ...
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    2 days ago
  • New Zealand firefighter support to Queensland
    The New Zealand Government is today sending 21 firefighters to help fight the ongoing catastrophic Australian bushfires. “The fires in Australia are in some of the toughest, most challenging conditions ever,” says Internal Affairs Minister Tracey Martin.  “As of yesterday morning, there were 100 active bushfire-related incidents across Queensland and ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • Supporting all schools to succeed
      More frontline support for schools through a new education agency, as part of a redesigned Ministry of Education More support for principals and school boards including through a new centre of leadership and local leadership advisor roles New independent disputes panels for parents and students Management of school property ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • Reform to support better outcomes for Māori learners and whānau
    The Government’s reform of the Tomorrow’s Schools system is a watershed moment in education and an opportunity to create meaningful change for ākonga Māori and their whānau, Associate Education Minister Kelvin Davis said today. “Last year through Kōrero Mātauranga | Education Conversation, Māori teachers, parents, ākonga, whānau, hapū and iwi ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • Infrastructure pipeline growing
    Infrastructure Minister is welcoming the first of many updated project pipelines from the newly established New Zealand Infrastructure Commission today. The New Zealand Infrastructure Commission, Te Waihanga, has released an expanded pipeline of major capital projects – another crucial step towards delivering better infrastructure outcomes. “The first iteration of the ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    2 days ago
  • Tighter firearms law to further improve safety
    Tougher gun laws designed to improve public safety through firearms prohibition orders are proposed in a new document released for public input. Police Minister Stuart Nash says firearms prohibition orders (FPOs) would give new powers to Police to ensure high-risk individuals come nowhere near firearms. “We have already prohibited the ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    3 days ago
  • New TVNZ chair & directors confirmed
    Andy Coupe has been confirmed as TVNZ’s new Board Chair. “Mr Coupe has strong commercial and capital markets experience and TVNZ has benefited from his technical knowledge of business and finance, as well as his extensive governance experience,” the Minister of Broadcasting, Communications and Digital Media Kris Faafoi said.  Andy ...
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    3 days ago
  • Hutt Road cycle path officially opened
    Associate Minister of Transport Julie Anne Genter today officially opened a separated pathway, following the completion of the Kaiwharawhara Stream bridge, which will improve safety for cyclists and pedestrians along Hutt Road.  The $6.8m Hutt Road project provides a separated path for cycling and pedestrians, the replacement of informal parking ...
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    3 days ago
  • Announcement of new Ambassador to Russia
    Foreign Affairs Minister Winston Peters today announced the appointment of career diplomat Si’alei van Toor as New Zealand’s next Ambassador to Russia. “I’m pleased to appoint Ms van Toor to this position. She brings a wealth of experience to the role having previously served as Senior Trade Adviser to the ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update
    The Treasury’s 2019 Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update (HYEFU) will be released on Wednesday December 11, Finance Minister Grant Robertson says. The Coalition Government will publish the 2020 Budget Policy Statement at the same time, outlining the priorities for Budget 2020. Further details on arrangements for the release will ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • Giving a Boost to Kiwi small businesses
    A new initiative to better support small businesses through hands-on mentoring and advice has been launched by the Minister for Small Business. The first event in the Kiwi Business Boost series of regional workshops and online tools has been launched in Wairoa by Stuart Nash. “The Business Boost initiative combines ...
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    6 days ago
  • Nearly three quarters of Rolleston connected to UFB
    The latest Quarterly Connectivity Report shows that more and more New Zealanders are moving to Ultra-fast Broadband (UFB), with Rolleston having the highest uptake at 74 per cent, as at the end of September. “This means that nearly three quarters of Rolleston’s households and businesses have moved to ultra-fast services. ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • Historic day for landmark climate change legislation in New Zealand
    The passing of the Climate Change Response (Zero Carbon) Amendment Bill will help ensure a safe planet for our kids and grandkids, the Minister for Climate Change James Shaw said today. The landmark legislation which provides a framework to support New Zealanders to prepare for, and adapt to, the effects ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    6 days ago
  • Release of Oranga Tamariki Practice Review
    The review of Oranga Tamariki practice around the planned uplift of a Hastings baby in May shows significant failings by the Ministry and that the planned and funded changes to shift from a child crisis service to a proper care and protection service need to be accelerated, Children’s Minister Tracey ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    7 days ago
  • Minister wishes students success in exams
    Education Minister Chris Hipkins has wished students the best of luck for this year’s NCEA and New Zealand Scholarship exams which start tomorrow. Around 140,000 students will have participated in 119 NCEA and New Zealand Scholarship exams by the end of the exam period on 3 December. “I want to ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    7 days ago
  • New High Commissioner to the United Kingdom announced
    Foreign Affairs Minister Winston Peters today announced the appointment of Bede Corry as New Zealand’s next High Commissioner to the United Kingdom. “The appointment of a senior diplomat to this important role underlines the significance New Zealand places on our relationship with the United Kingdom,” said Mr Peters. “The United ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    7 days ago
  • New Police recruits making Auckland safer
    An innovative approach to boosting the number of frontline Police has seen 20 new officers graduate from one of the uncommon training wings in Auckland. Police Minister Stuart Nash says the graduation of 20 constables today means that 1,765 new Police officers have been deployed since the coalition government took ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    7 days ago
  • Over 1.2 million hours of community work helps local communities
    Corrections Minister Kelvin Davis says the 1.2 million hours of community work completed by offenders in the last financial year has helped local communities right across the country. “Community work sentences are a great way for people to pay something positive back to society. There is a massive benefit to ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    7 days ago
  • Te Huringa o Te Tai – Police Crime Prevention Strategy
    "A pathway for Police in leadership with Iwi Māori, to achieve the aspirations of Māori whānau." Police launch of Te Huringa o Te Tai, Pipitea Marae,  Thorndon Quay, Wellington Nau mai, haere mai. Tēnā koutou, tēnā koutou, ka nui te mihi, ki a koutou. Hello everyone, warm greetings to you all. ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Kiwis getting higher pay
    Working New Zealanders are getting more in their back pockets under the Coalition Government’s economic plan. Stats NZ data today shows average weekly ordinary time earnings are up by $83 since the Government took office. This shows that working New Zealanders are getting higher take-home pay, and that employers are ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • More support for schools to reduce energy consumption and environmental impact
    The Government is supporting schools to cut down their energy consumption and reduce environmental impacts, with a quarter of all schools having their lights replaced with LEDs, a sustainability contestable fund and a plan to improve the environmental sustainability of all schools in the future. Education Minister Chris Hipkins and ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • New Zealand’s manaakitanga highlighted in China
    Tourism Minister Kelvin Davis heads to China on Friday to lead the New Zealand Government presence at the China-New Zealand Year of Tourism closing ceremony. The ceremony will take place at Canton Tower in Guangzhou on Sunday 10 November. “The Year of Tourism has been mutually beneficial for both New ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Climate change research boost
    Should we plan for drought or deluge and how is CO2 released from the ocean’s floor? Several climate change projects were given a boost in the latest Marsden Fund investment of $83.6 million, Research, Science and Innovation Minister Megan Woods said today. “Climate change is long-term challenge that requires out-of-the-box ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Significant progress on Regional Comprehensive Economic Partnership (RCEP)
    Leaders of 16 countries negotiating the Regional Comprehensive Economic Partnership (RCEP) have announced the completion of negotiation on the text as well as agreement on virtually all market access issues between 15 countries. The leaders said they will work with India to resolve its outstanding concerns in a way that ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Learn how to stay safe on World Tsunami Awareness Day
    Civil Defence Minister Hon Peeni Henare says World Tsunami Awareness Day today (5 November) is a chance for all New Zealanders to learn more about the tsunami risk in our regions and the right actions to take to stay safe. “All of New Zealand’s coastline is at risk of tsunami. ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Formal recognition at last for paramedics’ frontline medical role
    New Zealand’s more than 1000 paramedics are to have their role as key frontline health professionals formally recognised and regulated in the same way as doctors and nurses, Health Minister David Clark says. The Government has agreed to regulate paramedics under the Health Practitioners Competence Assurance Act 2003. “Paramedic leaders ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Government improving protections for consumers and workers when businesses fail
    Changes to insolvency law announced by the Government today will include requirements to honour up to 50 per cent of the value of gift cards or vouchers held by consumers, Commerce and Consumer Affairs Minister Kris Faafoi says. “When a business is insolvent, these consumers are often left out of ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Outstanding public service recognised
    Six New Zealanders tonight received medals for their meritorious work in the frontline public service. The Public Service Medal, established by Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth II, is awarded annually. “For the second year this Government has recognised public servants who have made a real difference to the lives of New ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Global trade, business promotion focus of Shanghai meetings
    Minister for Trade and Export Growth David Parker heads to Shanghai today for the China International Import Expo and meetings focused on reforming the WTO. Over 90 New Zealand companies will be exhibiting at the second China International Import Expo (CIIE), which runs from 5-10 November. “China is one of New Zealand’s ...
    BeehiveBy beehive.govt.nz
    1 week ago
  • Drivers to get more time to gain full licence
    Drivers holding a current five-year learner or restricted car or motorbike licence, expiring between 1 December 2019 and 1 December 2021, will receive an automatic two-year extension, Associate Transport Minister Julie Anne Genter announced today. Over 144,000 drivers’ time-limited licences are due to expire in the next two years; 67,000 ...
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    1 week ago