Open Mike 11/05/2017

85 comments on “Open Mike 11/05/2017 ”

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1. Ed 1

   11 May 2017 at 6:37 am

   A house built on sand……

   Property – NZ’s biggest industry: report

   Property has directly contributed $29.8b to the economy in the 2015-2016 financial year, employed 160,800 people and in the past 10 years has overtaken manufacturing to become the country’s largest industry.

   The industry’s direct contribution accounted for 13 per cent of New Zealand’s gross domestic product (GDP) – ahead of manufacturing’s $25.2b (11 per cent).

   Property – NZ’s biggest industry
   • Ed 1.1

     11 May 2017 at 9:02 am

     So if we leave out the property boom, National’s 3% increase in GDP is only 2.6%?

     It appears that to get that figure the construction work associated with earthquakes may have been included, but much actual construction will have been from Christchurch and other quakes. So much for a vibrant economy or property industry – relying on inwards reinsurance from overseas is not sustainable long term.

     And that increase in GDP? I own a house, but it doesn’t feel any larger, warmer or useful – but I know that my children will struggle to afford anything similar in their time.

     I had to search a bit for the link – try this:
     http://www.nzherald.co.nz/property/news/article.cfm?c_id=8&objectid=11853126
     (Sorry I don’t know how to put that in shortened form)
2. gsays 2

   11 May 2017 at 7:59 am

   Does anyone else smell a rat in regard to the myrtle rust in Keri Keri?

   We were told emphatically that the rust was blown here and landed in a nursery in Keri Keri.
   Blown here, for the first time.
   Just happened to land in a business where they or people they trade with could have imported the rust.
   • Wyndham 2.1

     11 May 2017 at 8:18 am

     You’re right gsays.
     It seems amazing that wind blown spores can selectively land on one row of plants in a Northland nursery. One would expect the large array of myrtle species, both native and also those introduced to this country, to be affected on a grand scale.
     Is it not more likely that the spores were transported by some other means?
     ?
   • saveNZ 2.2

     11 May 2017 at 10:41 am

     Exactly, suddenly in a time of poor bio security, poor regulation of imports, record tourists and overseas investors, we suddenly start having diseases that have ‘blown in’ having never done so before.

     Yep right!

     But hey, will be a good opportunity for some to buy land cheap as growers go out of business!

     Anyone know the outcome of the PSA court case against the government?

     https://www.tvnz.co.nz/one-news/new-zealand/kiwifruit-claim-documents-highly-critical-of-government-6226403
3. gsays 3

   11 May 2017 at 8:23 am

   the first report i heard on rnz, asured us that the spores were wind blown.
   says who?

   what would a garden centre/nursery import from oz?
4. Robert Guyton 4

   11 May 2017 at 8:36 am

   If someone had brought plant material into the country through ‘alternative’ channels, they’d have simply burned the infected plants, rather than alerting the authorities, I’d have thought. A row of myrtles amongst non-myrtles would fit the pattern described by the report. Who’s to know that there isn’t widespread sign now. We will see. The rust is wind-dispersed. Raoul Island caught it that way, I believe. In any case, we are experiencing a tsumani of infestations from foreign organisms now, as predicted: marmorated stink bug, giant willow aphid, guava moth, myrtle rust… what’s next, I wonder.
   • gsays 4.1

     11 May 2017 at 8:41 am

     I had been boasting the other day, the feijoa were bullet proof, bird proof, long lasting and tasty.

     Now aphids and stink bugs with marmalade are heading this way.

     Seriously though, do you believe the infestation was wind blown, Robert?
     • Robert Guyton 4.1.1

       11 May 2017 at 8:49 am

       gsays – I have up until now, but will take a closer look. It certainly happened fast. Only last week I learned about the Raoul Island case. Two days later, this Northland one. Of course, the spores would have to have arrived earlier, but winds have been pretty varied and vigorous around the globe of late, due to the increasingly energised climate. I’m expecting much more of this sort of thing. Invasive species will be the norm. Our approach to them has to change drastically. We won’t be able/can’t stop what’s coming (or is already here, incubating.) In my opinion.
       • marty mars 4.1.1.1

         11 May 2017 at 9:51 am

         So true – we have to rethink the whole thing and improve just about everything. This is perhaps another subtle yet devastating effect of cc. big worry cos we have shitloads to lose.
       • Draco T Bastard 4.1.1.2

         11 May 2017 at 1:46 pm

         We won’t be able/can’t stop what’s coming (or is already here, incubating.)

         I’ve come to the conclusion that we shouldn’t even try to stop it. Evolution will fix things – we just need to get out of the way.

         That said, I do believe we should be doing something about all the bloody possums but to my mind the best option there is to introduce an arboreal predator that can and will see them as food.
         • Robert Guyton 4.1.1.2.1

           11 May 2017 at 1:57 pm

           The Papua New Guinean harpogornis eagle. Perfect for the job.
           • weka 4.1.1.2.1.1

             11 May 2017 at 1:59 pm

             I now an old lady who swallowed a fly…
           • Draco T Bastard 4.1.1.2.1.2

             11 May 2017 at 2:05 pm

             I did consider the Haast Eagle – needs some serious technology though to bring it back from the dead.

             BTW, the Papuan Eagle is Harpyopsis
             • Robert Guyton …

               11 May 2017 at 2:32 pm

               Thanks, Draco, Harpyopsis. That whole, Harpagornis moorei, pouakai, “bird-snatches-frail-grandparent-in-front-of-family” thing is going to make selling the Haast Eagle a tough task. Still, there always have to be sacrifices for the sake of the environment, don’t there.

               (devilish emoticon)
               • Draco T Bastard …

                 11 May 2017 at 2:48 pm

                 That whole, Harpagornis moorei, pouakai, “bird-snatches-frail-grandparent-in-front-of-family” thing is going to make selling the Haast Eagle a tough task.

                 But it is an iconic native bird found nowhere else 😈
                 • Robert Guyton …

                   11 May 2017 at 3:01 pm

                   That settles it then, we’ll have a flock. Frail oldies are a dime a dozen and there seem to be hordes of grandchildren out there. All for the sake of conservation, mind.
         • weka 4.1.1.2.2

           11 May 2017 at 1:58 pm

           Those two paragraphs contradict each other. Either we step back and let nature do it, or we intervene. And if we intervene, then the debate becomes about where and how we intervene. There are some pretty compelling reasons in NZ not to give up intervening, in particular because of the uniqueness of much of the fauna and flora here. But also in terms of paradigms and world views, nature does better when humans understand themselves as part of the landscape.
           • Draco T Bastard 4.1.1.2.2.1

             11 May 2017 at 2:17 pm

             The possums (and rabbits really) are a problem caused by intervention and need intervention to ‘fix’.

             But it is a a serious concern as to what type of intervention should be used.
           • Robert Guyton 4.1.1.2.2.2

             11 May 2017 at 3:05 pm

             ” nature does better when humans understand themselves as part of the landscape.”
             Hmmmm…
             Perhaps, Non-human life maintains its integrity when humans understand themselves as part of the landscape.
             Parsing can lead to greater (or lesser) clarity of thought 🙂
     • Cricklewood 4.1.2

       11 May 2017 at 8:50 am

       Its the most likely scenario, Cyclone debbies track then arrival in NZ was perfect in terms of a storm system that would spread the fungus.
       Its highly unlikely to have come as a result of imported plants from aus at a basic level there is no financial gain to be had importing plant material from aus. If its something new you can sell it and if its something we already have a complete waste of time.

       Given that its a propagation nursery conditions for fungus to establish are perfect with 2 twice daily water. Id imagine it will take much longer to become apperent in the wild.
     • David Mac 4.1.3

       11 May 2017 at 8:55 am

       With my bush science hat on I think the spores being carried on the wind is a viable story. The prevailing winds and currents seem to favour the Eastcoast of the Far North. It’s where the early adventurers found themselves encountering NZ, the winds brought waka and sailing ships to this region. Kupe, Tasman, Cook the wind carried them to the Far North.
     • Cricklewood 4.1.4

       11 May 2017 at 8:57 am

       You are really going to dislike guava moth it renders the fruit damn near unusable.
       • Sabine 4.1.4.1

         11 May 2017 at 11:30 am

         i was lucky, my feijoa is good. But i know a lot of growers who have not been so lucky and literally all their fruit is invested an can only be tossed.
     • Draco T Bastard 4.1.5

       11 May 2017 at 1:40 pm

       Fun facts about fungi

       Spores of a wheat rust have been reported to have been dispersed 1,243 miles (2000 km) by the wind.

       So, yeah, most definitely possible.
       • weka 4.1.5.1

         11 May 2017 at 2:00 pm

         They reckon that some fungi species reached NZ by air.
   • John up North 4.2

     11 May 2017 at 8:50 am

     I hear you there Robert. Globalisation hard at work = privatise profit + socialise costs.

     Can’t remember off the top of my head but the percentage of containers checked by customs or bio-security compared to the numbers pouring in is very, very small. So just like our immigration policies, the door is WIDE OPEN for a simple bug or spore to (remember Psa?) cause huge financial damage whilst trashing our environment. And like our rivers etc…. this govt awaits at the cliff bottom while scratching it’s arse.
   • The decrypter 4.3

     11 May 2017 at 8:54 am

     Asian flu is next.
   • keepcalmcarryon 4.4

     11 May 2017 at 3:16 pm

     “marmorated stink bug, giant willow aphid, guava moth, myrtle rust” I thought you were reciting the National front bench for a second there, had to do a double take.
     • Robert Guyton 4.4.1

       11 May 2017 at 3:35 pm

       I think I see what you mean, calm: “constipated thick thug”, “Gerry behemoth”, that sort of thing?
       • keepcalmcarryon 4.4.1.1

         11 May 2017 at 4:33 pm

         Thats it! Name the front bench after your favourite introduced pest species to celebrate Nationals border control cutbacks. 🙂
5. Robert Guyton 5

   11 May 2017 at 8:56 am

   Every native organism we have here, or the ancestors of, must have ‘blown in’ or washed up on our shores at some point. That process has never stopped and now with the addition of human industry as described by John up North, it’s all on for a more intense round of ‘re-wilding’. In my view, the gates have opened and we have to be adroit in our thinking to ride this wave.There are benefits to be reaped, but building “walls” is going to be a waste of time and money, in all but a few cases.
   • marty mars 5.1

     11 May 2017 at 9:58 am

     Its natural as in humans are part of nature.

     I don’t think embracing the change and trying to make the best of it has too much wrong with it except I’m not doing that. I’m going to fight and work to protect the biodiversity that is here and unique. I don’t accept acceptance.
     • Robert Guyton 5.1.1

       11 May 2017 at 10:57 am

       Marty – I understand your passion for unique organisms and feel that too, at my deepest level. The balance between what you are saying and what I’m saying is difficult to maintain, even describe. That though, is the challenge. I’m keen on the conversation.
   • Wyndham 5.2

     11 May 2017 at 10:03 am

     Robert,
     The scale of the current introduction of ‘pests’ is massive. Every container, every jumbo-jet plane carries the potential to deliver fresh incursions. The very speed of transition from one country to another ensures that even fragile organisms are given an extra chance of survival and re-establishment in our country. Mother Nature has never had to cope with an onslaught on such a scale. Whilst adaptation to occasional arrivals over a long time period is possible (and probable), dealing with our present situation is another matter. I suggest that the beautiful system of balance that has existed in natural ecosystems for millenia is gravely threatened.
     Tourism, worldwide, is a two-edged sword. What to do ?
     By the way Robert, am a keen follower of your excellent contributions.
     • Robert Guyton 5.2.1

       11 May 2017 at 11:06 am

       Thanks, Wyndham. Your suggestion about the grave threat to the natural ecosystem is challenging to reply to, especially when I want to say that this situation we find ourselves in as as natural as any other in time and space. It looks degraded and debased, but only because of our anthropocentric point of view. What we humans can do with this situation, is shape it, as we have shaped the world in recent millennia, but do so mindfully, with a different goal in mind. That’s our opportunity. I believe we can do it, and will do it am and am well aware that we have made the job extremely difficult by our behaviour. We are now having to face the consequences of our choice to treat the world this way but we are not bound to continue along that path, I believe. There are many signs of understanding evident now. Masanobu Fukuoka called for a “new Genesis”, Fred Pearce’s book, “A New Wild” details where we sit with regard invasive organisms and has some enlightened suggestions around how we can accommodate the inevitable.
   • weka 5.3

     11 May 2017 at 10:17 am

     Ticks that carry Lyme disease is the one I’m keeping an eye on. It’s spreading through Europe now and the US is having a bumper year of ticks. That one alone is good enough for me to want much tighter controls on our borders, Lyme destroys lives without actually killing people. I’m good with working with the mix of introduced and native ecosystems we have already, but I can’t see any good reason to have a free for all, so where it the line?
     • Robert Guyton 5.3.1

       11 May 2017 at 11:09 am

       Not a free for all, weka, we have to manage, that’s what humans do but effective management, management toward a certain end, that’s what we have to plan for now. How do we want this world to be? We have to know that before we start to apply ourselves to manipulating the pieces of it. I reckon.
     • Sabine 5.3.2

       11 May 2017 at 11:30 am

       well when and if the ticks arrive here, then we finally have a good use of the possums.
       • weka 5.3.2.1

         11 May 2017 at 12:05 pm

         lolz, true, and that’ll really throw the cat among the pigeons. Bu knowing our luck we’ll find a way to kill all the possums just before the ticks arrive 😉
     • grumpystilskin 5.3.3

       11 May 2017 at 11:45 am

       this’ll freak you out then.
       https://sites.newpaltz.edu/ticktalk/social-attitudes/story-by-smaranda-dumitru/
       • weka 5.3.3.1

         11 May 2017 at 12:07 pm

         Saucy conspiracies about Plum Island, I like!
   • weka 5.4

     11 May 2017 at 10:22 am

     sent you an email 🙂
   • Robert Guyton 5.5

     11 May 2017 at 3:34 pm

     oops! wrong spot
6. Robert Guyton 6

   11 May 2017 at 9:00 am

   The best thing we can do, as a country, is diversify, make more complex, fill every niche with a wide a range of organisms as possible – if we continue to develop the simplistic environment we have now: grass and browsing animals, pinus radiata, we will be screwed. The best way to defend against incoming threats from nature, is to grow a thicket.
   • Cricklewood 6.1

     11 May 2017 at 9:11 am

     Exactly let the grass turn to meadows filled with all manor of species, plant forest with great variation from all over the world and let nature do its thing. Vast biodiversity will take hold us in good stead as the climate changes and pressue comes on our exisiting flora and fauna.
     • Robert Guyton 6.1.1

       11 May 2017 at 9:16 am

       And have people living amongst all that, making a living from the bounty. There’s a farmer near Wanaka who has “opened” his farm to innovative thinkers who have established themselves there, planting his creek sides, for example, with hazel and other useful species, set up their beehives and are harvesting what they’ve established, in return for managing the riparian planting to the benefit of the farmer and the environment. That sort of integrated industry is our future, imo. A benefit to all; humans and non-humans alike.
       • greywarshark 6.1.1.1

         11 May 2017 at 10:23 am

         Robert G
         People like you talking and writing about systems, practices being, or already set up and working for everyone’s good, spark us all up with hope and a desire to see more around us. So keep supplying examples that we can follow or encourage. You cheer us and inspire us. Kia ora e hoa.
         • Robert Guyton 6.1.1.1.1

           11 May 2017 at 11:11 am

           That’s kind of you, Grey and thanks for being part of the conversation. They’re not as good if they just occur inside of just one head.
         • greywarshark 6.1.1.1.2

           11 May 2017 at 11:27 am

           Further to above to Robert Guyton do you know anyone raising pigeons so that we can have some means of communicating when our old and known ones go belly-up?

           The reliance on cellphones and computers is dangerous and makes us vulnerable in my view. Wonderful tech, but the problems of invisible information requiring machinery and applications to reveal it are going to accumulate. The tech, the complexity, the price, the need for renewal of energy, of apps, the hidden pathways through the devices filing system, the need to protect info against hacking or instant destruction or malicious malfunction, It just about drives me mad, and I am distressed that companies and government are wanting to send/do everything on line.

           The loss of the old tech copper telephone wire is being forced on us, the destruction of the postal system is proceeding, gradually chipped away. Everything we had organised and paid or our country to do for us is to be dismantled or sol and put in the hands of private corporations who will charge us to breathe eventually. And it is happening literally I understand, in smog-laden places like China and anywhere you have to buy breathing gear. Like everyone having asthma, a distressing affliction.

           Making what was once a simple one off bank transaction now requires a useable cellphone so the bank can confirm the transaction through repeating a code, as in 0900 donation lines.. Soon technology will be requiring not only to look into our eyes, it will want to check our dna, read our minds as we imagine a special code…………………..

           So trained pigeons will help us to keep our lines of communication open when the dead hand of big business and unlimited greed of thieves, Big Brother and oppressors close round us and squeeze us unbearably.
           • One Two 6.1.1.1.2.1

             11 May 2017 at 1:23 pm

             That is an observant comment, greywarshark

             Constant consuming of technology is feeding the technological dictatorship, while simultaneously devouring vast quantities of resources..

             Ultimately it will fail, and when it does, most will not have the basic skills/tools required for human existence…
             • greywarshark …

               11 May 2017 at 2:38 pm

               Yeah One Two I’m afraid for myself along with others. Have you seen the survivalist sites online. I thought that the USA was always a bit OTT but seeing their democracy machine malfunctioning, to the extent that switched on it just gives loud farts, I am not so sanguine about things.
           • Robert Guyton 6.1.1.1.2.2

             11 May 2017 at 2:23 pm

             That’s right, Greywarshark, communicating is and will be vital. Keep your options open as long as possible, meanwhile locate and secure older technologies and familiarize yourself with their use. Same for other functions: measuring, counting (nothing beats an abacus) and so on. It’s fun to gather useful things, rather than ornaments and trying them aligns your thinking with the original users and even the inventors; that’s got to be good for the brain.
           • Rosemary McDonald 6.1.1.1.2.3

             11 May 2017 at 2:32 pm

             “…do you know anyone raising pigeons so that we can have some means of communicating when our old and known ones go belly-up?”

             Not so long ago a small truck stopped at our place to buy eggs (of the free range variety). On the truck were dozens of cages of racing/homing pigeons being driven from their home cotes to be released to make the return journey under their own steam.

             So the basic infrastructure is, fortunately, still in existence.
             • greywarshark …

               11 May 2017 at 2:35 pm

               Good to know thanks.
   • David Mac 6.2

     11 May 2017 at 9:33 am

     One of the problem areas I suspect many of us have noticed in our own gardens is the wide variety of wasp type insects that have appeared over recent years. When I was a boy, there were the yellow and black ones and soldier flies. Now there seem to be all sorts of critters with stings sticking out of their abdomens.

     For the last few years I haven’t been able to do the Swan plant/Monarch butterfly thing without protecting the caterpillars and chrysalises with netting. The new wasps on the block kill them all dead.
     • Robert Guyton 6.2.1

       11 May 2017 at 11:15 am

       They might be ichneumon wasps, David, purposely introduced by the agricultural industry to control white butterfly but attacking native caterpillars as well – our Yellow and Red Admirals have suffered hugely from their predation, and other species too, I’ll bet, including the exotic Monarch.
       • In Vino 6.2.1.1

         11 May 2017 at 6:08 pm

         If you mean Asian paper wasps, I am amazed to hear that they were deliberately introduced.
         Because they feed on milkweed, Monarch Butterfly caterpillars are poisonous to most predators (or so I read in a School Journal..)
         But they are definitely not poisonous to Asian paper wasps, which gobble everything up, until they stop foraging late in autumn. The South African praying mantis also gobbles up the Monarch. Was it also deliberately introduced?
         Our NZ mantis disappears from areas where the South African variety appears. The South African mantises out-breed and probably gobble up the NZ ones.
         Evolution can be quite destructive!
         Some 20 years ago I read that NZ could expect swarms of pesky insects because winters were no longer cold enough. The Asian paper wasp and South African praying mantis seem between them to have put the kybosh on swarms of most species of insects.
         • Robert Guyton 6.2.1.1.1

           11 May 2017 at 7:10 pm

           Ichneumon’s, the wasps Pteromalus puparum and Apanteles glomeratus aren’t stingers, they are ovipositor-bearers, that is, their stingy-looking-thing is n fact an egg-laying tube that they use to deposit eggs into the soft bodies of caterpillars, especially but not exclusively, white butterfly. They are small wasps and quite beautiful if you like waisted-insects.
           I’ve only ever seen one African mantis here in Southland. It arrived on the clothing of a girl who had flown in from the North Island. So odd was this sight that we called a photographer from the regional newspaper to record the event. As she was preparing to take the photo, of the mantis sitting on the girl’s collar, it ran, straight up her nostril. Good times!
           • In Vino 6.2.1.1.1.1

             12 May 2017 at 8:37 pm

             Beware, The South African praying mantis will eventually get there by itself. The female especially has a curvier shape.. After a year or two, there are no NZ mantises left. Apparently the NZ male gets attracted to the South African female, cannot impregnate her, but tends to get eaten by her anyway. Added to the outnumbering thing, the invasive species soon wipes out the native one.
             Glad to hear that the Asian paper wasp was not deliberately introduced. Maybe that species has not yet reached you in the South?
             • In Vino …

               12 May 2017 at 8:50 pm

               Also – the German wasp is much less noticeable up here in the Waikato. I wonder if it is because the Asian paper wasp has got in first and removed most of the protein diet that the German wasp used to thrive on.
   • marty mars 6.3

     11 May 2017 at 10:06 am

     No I disagree.

     If you have competing plants and animals within a niche they work it out by one coming out on top. Think marram grass. Lovely sand holder, very strong, robust and successful. Now endemic species are not as successful when competing against marram – the spinifex and pingao goes and marram is what you get.

     The biosphere worked here for many more reasons than the introduced thinking could even concieve of.
     • weka 6.3.1

       11 May 2017 at 10:12 am

       The invasives are our friends approach has its merits, but it does guarantee extinction of many native species esp when applied to animals. It also means the end of native ecosystems. I think there is a middle ground though. Protect native spaces where possible and the spaces that are in dire need of biodiversity, let nature lead the way. No reason why humans can’t be part of the food chain and make way more intelligent choices around land use than we already do, apart from the fact that none of us can agree on anything 😉

       I do support much strong nation borders though, in part for this reason. We pay a very high price for globalisation.
     • Robert Guyton 6.3.2

       11 May 2017 at 11:21 am

       It did, Marty, but it wasn’t prepared for one particular invader – Agricultural Man, Civilized Man, Homo Monoculturalist. Our ecosystem here had a serious flaw and has suffered the consequences of its specialization. Much is lost/has changed. There’s no going back but all is not lost. We can, if we wish, manage this new situation differently. I’d like to see it done mindfully and have it result in vibrancy, complexity and abundance. Why was marram deployed? Agriculture. Who wants to, or needs to, stabilize dunes?
7. The decrypter 7

   11 May 2017 at 9:22 am

   They try to diversify up north ,but every thicket of dope this bloody govt find they tear out. Next they’ll blame lay about pretty bloody hope less nz youth for bringing it in on aussie dope seed. Mark my words.
8. esoteric pineapples 8

   11 May 2017 at 9:32 am

   Here’s a few American progressive commentators that keep me up-to-date with what is happening for anyone interested

   Comedian/political commentator Jimmy Dore
   https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC3M7l8ved_rYQ45AVzS0RGA

   The Young Turks (TYT)

   https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC1yBKRuGpC1tSM73A0ZjYjQ

   Plus Tom Hartmann on The Big Picture

   https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCY8x1K2FMBw-jm-WCPbcHEg

   Ring of Fire

   https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCYWIEbibRcZav6xMLo9qWWw

   Mike Malloy

   http://www.mikemalloy.com/

   Keith Olbermann

   https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCsEukrAd64fqA7FjwkmZ_Dw
9. Ad 9

   11 May 2017 at 9:54 am

   From Peter Malcolm at Closing the Gap:

   “The bottom line is that better public services alone aren’t enough because what poorer families really need are higher incomes — and that can only be achieved through much bolder policies than the government is talking about,” he said

   “For starters, we need a steeply progressive tax regime that targets the wealthiest, plus significant increases in the minimum wage and living-wage level benefits,” he said. “It’s hard to see how $321 million and some tax tweaks can accomplish that.”

   He’s off base.
   Increasing incomes is not necessarily mitigated by taxing the wealthy.
   It’s most quickly mitigated by paying people more.

   As with the Australian budget presented Tuesday, with this budget Labour will find that they have very few areas with which to oppose Prime Minister English or Minister Joyce.
   • adam 9.1

     11 May 2017 at 11:44 am

     Is that not the trap myself and Bill have been talking about? When the only game in town is liberalism, then the liberal parties not only look the same, they can’t do very much different from each other. If the labour party was actually a social democratic party then gloves would be off. This race to the center, is the death of ideas with an ever increasing conservatism, which does nothing but hurt the poor.
     • Draco T Bastard 9.1.1

       11 May 2017 at 2:00 pm

       +111
     • tc 9.1.2

       11 May 2017 at 2:51 pm

       +++++ the middle is awash with the same shit that sees us where we are today.

       An actual left party is required to level the playing field, remove the ticket clippers and rebuild nz into a self sufficient economy that looks after its citizens health, education and wellbeing.

       Not hard just requires bollocks.
     • Ad 9.1.3

       11 May 2017 at 3:41 pm

       If the current New Zealand parliamentary spectrum doesn’t appeal because it’s all a “race to the centre”, then your ideas are not registering in this country in any politically meaningful sense. So your ideas really are dead.

       Alternatively, you might want to have a look at which policies from which parties currently in parliament will help the poor, since that’s the criteria you list.
       • gsays 9.1.3.1

         12 May 2017 at 9:00 am

         Or some parties outside parliament, who wants to, say,
         feed children in schools,
         bring troops back from Afghanistan,
         put a teacher aid in all classes…..
         • Ad 9.1.3.1.1

           12 May 2017 at 9:02 am

           And best of luck to them in September.
10. kea 10

    11 May 2017 at 11:28 am

    “This is the first British general election in decades in which there is anything approaching a real political choice. For that reason, even the most liberal elements within the corporate media are jettisoning the pretence of neutrality and objectivity. The stakes are simply too high.

    In fact, their bias has become so overt that even a veteran BBC and Channel 4 reporter like Michael Crick is becoming exasperated and letting vent on Twitter.

    Crick’s outrage has been triggered by the media’s complicity in allowing British prime minister Theresa May to stage-manage her election campaign. The media are submitting questions for vetting (without admitting the fact to viewers), and failing to report that in most cases only hardcore Tory party supporters, not members of the public, are being allowed near her.

    One should not be surprised that the Conservatives want to rig the campaign trail to make their candidate look good. The problem is that the corporate media are conspiring to help them do it.

    Why would the media be so willing to mollycoddle May and keep her from embarrassing herself? Doesn’t the media feed off the high and mighty being brought low by gaffes and pratfalls?

    That might be true if nothing was really at stake, as has been the case in the last few decades of elections. But if May loses, Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn will be in power instead. The elites are so sure they are firmly in control of everything that they are determined to make sure that doesn’t happen.

    May, it is clear, is a weak public performer. That is why she has refused to debate Corbyn, and why BBC interviewers are giving her softball questions. She is even pampered with an interview on the BBC with her banker husband, Philip, posing as though they are royalty.”
    .. snip..
    http://www.jonathan-cook.net/blog/2017-05-10/media-cant-hide-that-theyre-in-bed-with-may/
    • Bill 10.1

      11 May 2017 at 12:15 pm

      I wonder what kind of a boost will be recorded in the polls after Sanders endorses Corbyn during his upcoming visit to the UK? 😉

      On the May front – there was a public meeting in Aberdeenshire that was booked as a child’s birthday party by the Tory MEP landowner that the estate’s tenants were then ‘encouraged’ to attend.
      • McFlock 10.1.1

        11 May 2017 at 12:36 pm

        I hope corbyn gets a boost – it looks like the Labour average is beginning to plateau after the local body elections.
11. Draco T Bastard 11

    11 May 2017 at 1:51 pm

    You fools, it’s getting away

    😈
    • ianmac 11.1

      11 May 2017 at 7:45 pm

      Too late!
12. Glenn 12

    11 May 2017 at 2:50 pm

    The latest YouGov/Evening Standard poll of London voters shows that Labour continue to lead in the capital by 41% to the Conservatives’ 36%.

    Elsewhere, the Liberal Democrats are on 14%, UKIP are 6%

    https://yougov.co.uk/news/2017/05/10/voting-intention-london-conservatives-36-labour-41/
    • McFlock 12.1

      11 May 2017 at 3:16 pm

      Well, yeah, Labour do well in urban seats. But it’s FPP, not proportional representation.
    • Ad 12.2

      12 May 2017 at 9:04 am

      The most likely outcome of the UK election will be a landslide victory to the Conservatives and a very significant increase from their current 17 majority in the House of Commons. After that point who really cares who is in the Opposition?
13. McFlock 13

    11 May 2017 at 3:15 pm

    Another in stuff’s list of “honest, you can buy property today” articles.

    They do the usual “five years ago” thing, but here’s a line I don’t understand at all:

    He found a $190,000 home in Masterton that had a sleepout with no resource consent, and negotiated with the vendor to take $20,000 off the asking price. He was able to use the difference as the effective deposit for the loan.

    He was earning less than $30,000 at the time.

    How is a lower price an “effective deposit”?
    • gsays 13.1

      12 May 2017 at 9:06 am

      Perhaps the ‘article’ would be more accurately described as an advertorial, considering who owns the paper.
14. Draco T Bastard 14

    11 May 2017 at 3:51 pm

    Bryan Gould: What I would Have Said in the Herald

    The paper’s conclusions are accepted by almost all leading economists, including Lord Adair Turner (former Chair of the Financial Services Authority in London­­­) and Professor Richard Werner of Southampton University, and were foreshadowed (in a 2008 paper) by the Reserve Bank of New Zealand itself.

    Brash, however, seems unable to understand the process described by the Bank of England. I had earlier thought that his denial that commercial banks were responsible for creating most of the money in circulation had to be either a deliberate attempt to mislead or the consequence of simple ignorance. But, since he states that he “is aware” of the Bank of England paper (and has therefore presumably read it), I can only assume that his continued denial of what that paper tells us is the consequence of intellectual limitations.

    It is very frustrating that what is now a virtually undisputed truth has been continually confused by palpable errors in Brash’s contributions and that they have been lent some unjustified credibility by their publication in the Herald.
    • ianmac 14.1

      11 May 2017 at 7:13 pm

      As I am a non-economist what Bryan writes makes sense and is validated by some very learned people.
      Perhaps Don is fading intellectually.
      Thanks for the link Draco.

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