John Roughan, fan boy for John Key, tells the media they ” can be too precious about its rights.”
Unbelievable. He is a total disgrace to the tradition of a free press.
Just the corporate’s lackey.
Sounds like he’s annoyed Hager spoke to the Guardian.
“It worries me that Hager would write this stuff for an overseas audience, not on account of New Zealand’s reputation – that’s not a journalist’s concern – but from the effect on his readers, which is a journalist’s only concern.”
You mean someone might spill the beans to the world that Planet Key isn’t perfect. Heaven forbid.
@ Paul
John Rough-and? could be very wise Paul. When he says he is worried at “the effect on his readers, which is a journalist’s only concern.” he may be coming from a position supportive of Labour. How?
Well he might know his readers tiny minds very well and have realised how scrambled their ideas would be by these revelations. And that they would stay glued limpet-like or rush back to the safety of National, avoiding Labour like a plague because it was causing them angst and stress. He knew they would never want to take in the whole mess and be forced to examine the very basis of their beliefs in society. They felt unsafe, National was saying it would keep them safe. QED they would vote for National and eschew Labour! And that worried him, how kind. This man is machiavellian.in his understandings.
‘You mean someone might spill the beans to the world that Planet Key isn’t perfect. Heaven forbid.’ It’s not the world that mightily concerned him, it was us voter-sheeple massed in a flock facing the all-seeing-eye dogs, all clustered on the pimple on the bottom of the world, that he was psychoanalysing.
I wrote a comment for John suggesting that his rant might have been lifted from the works of Frank of Fiji fame. Everything is good here. Nothing to worry your pretty little heads about.
Whereas many of the Guardians readers will have heard of Greenwald and a few will be aware of Hager, I am sure none will have heard of that fearless journalist John Roughan!
green mayor of wellington (finally!) makes good on her first election campaign pledge to ‘help the homeless’ of wellington..
ed:..wade-brown slept in a sleeping bag..in a cardboard box for the night..
..oh! the humanity..!
..she is such an inspiration..
..and we are told the homeless of wellington wept with gratitude when they heard of this sacrifice/effort made by their ‘caring’ mayor..their ‘leader’..
Aside from paying lip service to the homeless as a reason to bash the greens, again, tell me what do you do, specifically, to assist street sleepers and squash poverty?
“i’m not the fucken mayor..with the power to ‘do something’..(..and especially having promised to ‘do something’..)”
You could donate to charity, hand out food and warm drinks or give a blanket or clothing. There’s always something can be done by the people, but all you have is the usual puism. Id the issue, slag those in the firing line, yet do nothing to help those in need.
“..you mindless/simplistic fool…”
And yet I’ve shown three ways, in the absence of government will, that you didn’t think of to help the homeless, so simplistic maybe, but mindless is way off… Quelle surprise.
“..(and no..i am not commencing a dialogue with you..)”
You’re funny in a ha ha way sometimes. Not your jokes or caption contest entries, they’re as flat as roadkill, but gems like these crack me up.
Of course you are. All I do is hit the nail on the head and you can’t help yourself.
Chat later. lulz
TA.
One “cause celebre overnighter” with a top quality sleeping bag and a fresh clean cardbard box roughing it for one night is doing nothing for the homeless:
– unless she invited a bunch of her new cardboard box friends to shift into the spare room at her place for a few months
– unless she was being sponsored (ala World Vision 40 hour Famine) to get money to support a shelter
– unless she was announcing more $$$ for the City Mission to help meet the needs of the homeless
Its all about as dopey as Al Gore flying around the world in his private jet to tell folk bout the dangers of global warming
“and..”..Its all about as dopey as..’..self-referring ‘greens’ who eat animals..?”
Why is green voters eating meat dopey?
And self referring? What’s that all about?
“..and they were all wearings the skins of dead animals…”
“…these are the ‘green’/aware members of the parliamentary circus…”
And why is it wrong for green mps to wear leather shoes and sheepskin coats?
Having green values isn’t determined by what you eat or wear on your feet. It’s way more advanced than veganism.
I’m picking your societal quirks determine your position and foster the obvious hatred for the greens.
So settle petal, it’s your problem, not theirs.
I dont think the Green manifesto is a vegan one Phillip.
Heck if it was, then they would struggle to get to 5% of the vote. Theres many meat eating, milk drinking folk out there who support the Greens sustainability goals but dont plan to give up on their leather shoes anytime soon.
But they might take the bus to the rugby if theres no easy car parking close to the stadium. 🙂
“..Theres many meat eating, milk drinking folk out there who support the Greens sustainability goals but dont plan to give up on their leather shoes anytime soon…”
..the wade-brown syndrome writ large..?
..a solar-panel and a prius ‘ll do ya..eh..?
..no need for anything else..
..the planet may be frying ‘cos of animal-farming..
Haha, good reply Phillip, but it wont win any debates.
You should differentiate between the “ordinary folk” who recognise that being less wasteful than we were is a good thing (thats the vast majority of people) and those minority few who hold to a higher ideal so go vegan and I guess must wear hemp everythings. And moan about those who dont follow their philosophies
Somewhere in the middle is the Green Party.
Now the Vegans cant change society beyond one person at a time, but a green movement can change a country, altho in smaller steps than the vegans would like.
For the record, we only have 4 V8 cars now (and a couple of 4 cylinder cars too) , but we did install a solar heater on the last home we owned.
so its a big yes to solar power, and a big no to the Prius 🙂
Thanks for calling out Wade-Brown on her shallow self-publicity gig. One fabulously calm Wellington night with a full belly, luxury sleeping bag and, no doubt, loads of security thrown in is nothing but a joke.
As for ‘green Mayor’ label – the only thing that is green about Wade-Brown are the people who think she is. In reality, Wellington’s Mayor, like most of the Council, is bought and sold by the business chamber of commerce and a cartel of property developers.
phillip ure
Hey not so much of the sneer. It is a good and unusual example of dramatising by a leader of the too-often ignored problems out there. If you think she could have done better, could you demonstrate how to her, with your own public protest? Possibly you have a disablement. If you can’t act out, act in and write now to the paper, thank her, and then tell about the difficulties you or your group experience and include a tip how people can do to improve and help you.
But is she doing nothing if she is sleeping out?? She has to go up against a good number at Council and in the public who would like to sweep the homeless under a carpet, and then they wouldn’t even provide a carpet. It’s getting enough of backing. making a case that the public will back so you can put pressure on, it’s all ‘political’. Which is a word that key hates, which I think means something that isn’t directly beneficiial to people who are comfortable. Why should they be made even slightly uncomfortable for the benefit of people who they consider subordinate to ‘their’, entitled, life.
This economist Amartya Sen is a Nobel Prize winner – special one for economists. http://www.prospectmagazine.co.uk/sound-and-vision/amartya-sen-poverty-and-the-tolerance-of-the-intolerable
20/1/2014 Sen took as his title “Poverty and the Tolerance of the Intolerable”. No country in the world, he declared, is “free from poverty”, though in India, the country of his birth, where there is a “massive disparity between the privileged and the rest”, extreme deprivation is particularly deeply entrenched. India, he said, is an example of a country with a large middle class which is able to tolerate, with something approaching equanimity, the serious poverty in its midst.
(Although the situation in India is extreme—Sen referred to the “special nature of the neglect of its poor” —there is no reason for those of us elsewhere in the world, especially the developed world, to be complacent. “Blaming the victims” of poverty, he observed, is as common today as it was in the era of the Poor Law.)
Something is starting to bug me about an aspect of this (and the last) election analysis.
Hager (in the Guardian link from Roughams article) repeats the received truth that those who don’t vote tend to natural left voters and that leaves an accentuated vote for the right.
Here’s my problem.
In elections where turnout is as low as 50%, left parties are winning absolute majorities under a proportional representation system embedded within an overarching neo-classical/liberal environment. (Scotland)
So, the problem cannot be as simple as stated. I’m not contesting that more people in working class areas (left voters) tend to stay at home. But the conclusion – that that necessarily (inevitably?) favours the right – simply isn’t true.
It might be true in NZ though. Because something happens in another country doesn’t mean it’s the equvialent here. There are things about the Scottish situation that have no parallel here (eg the Union and Scottish antipathy for the English). I’m assuming that during the neoliberal revolution in the UK, while Scotland was hit very hard, it didn’t have the same degree of culture shift that NZ had (Scotland had an obvious external enemy whereas NZ took a decade to realise that the enemy was within and then where could we go with that?).
At a guess, have NZ political parties done analysis on polling booths and socio economic status and voting patterns? That would tell something. That National previously liked low voter turnout means something too (although I have a feeling that this election one of the reason for increased turnout was National getting right wingers out to vote, which is part of why this election has been confusing).
Yeah, well, there is no hatred of ‘the English’. So let’s get that out of the way first.
Then there is the fact that I drew attention to similarities, which is somewhat different to claiming things are identical.
Also, I don’t quite buy your ‘external/internal’ enemy framing. Scotland voted for Tony Blair’s Labour Party in British elections.
But in 2011(?) they gave the ‘lefter than Labour’ SNP a majority in the Hollyrood elections on a turnout of approx 50%. The unchallenged contention…it’s almost an article of faith… that the level of the non-vote leads to an increased proportion of votes falling to the right (in the US, in NZ and by logical extension ‘everywhere’if proponents of that view are to be believed) dictates that the Scottish Labour Party should have done well in that election. It didn’t.
Yes and Blair’s invasion of Iraq in 2003 turned many Labour voters towards supporting the SNP and for independence.
Thatcher broke the Tories vote in Scotland and Blair severely damaged Labour’s hold on working class Scots.
I didn’t use the word hatred, nor the word identical. Perhaps you could reread my comment with that in mind and look for the intent rather than focussing on semantics.
edit: your original comment appeared to be saying that because these things are true in Scotland they might be true in NZ. I pointed out that that didn’t follow, and that some pretty significant differences might be the reason.
Weka, all I did was point to a rather obvious counter example that evidently contradicts the current ‘received wisdom’ on the matter.
Whether you prefer to defend current notions, and so accept the obvious flow on effect (ie, the nonsense that suggests either a party must win the center vote by tacking to the right [think: Shearer et al] or get the non-vote out by tacking to the left [think: many of the arguments posited on ‘ts’]) is entirely up to you.
Meanwhile, the results of Scottish elections absolutely demonstrate that tacking left, even within a broader, right leaning, neo-liberal environment does not necessarily mean losing votes to the right from those who are already intending to vote.
Further, it’s an illustrative example of a low voter turnout not having a deleterious effect on the left.
I’m not defending current notions (I have my own critiques of them), I’m challenging your basic premise that the situation in Scotland is pertinent to the situation in NZ. I get the case you are making, but unless you are willing to look at the substantive differences and how they might affect voter turnout and voter preference I can’t see where the discussion can go.
Please stop misinterpreting my comments and ascribing flow on arguments to them that are of your own thinking not mine.
If someone believes that low voter turnout favours the right, and if someone believes that to be true in any and all neo-liberal environments (and there are many people on the left currently ascribing to that view), then it follows that there will be competing views on the left as to whether the center or the non-voter should be chased, with the repercussions vis a vis policy that is inherent to both camps of thought.
On the other hand, if there is an example that could quite reasonably be held to contradict that either/or scenario… and oh fuck!…there is!
If it’s unreasonable to hold it up as an example, then those who think that are free to run through some convincing reasons as to why it should be seen as so unreasonable, by offering substantive examples of dynamics with effects that could be reasonably seen as greater than that of the prevailing ‘truth’ with regards voters/turnout and right wing advantage.
In the absence of any such convincing critique, the Shearers of the world – those who claim modern politics is necessarily all about contesting the center, and therefore about moderate ‘middle of the road’ policies – can be said to be havering on the basis that they’re ignoring really existing examples to the contrary.
Show me the right wing social agenda of the SNP by way of a list of their social policies that demonstrate they are to the right of Labour. Then explain to me how their progressive tax on house sales is right wing; how their blocking of the bedroom tax is right wing; how their historical front footing over the poll tax is right wing; how their opposition to bombing isis is right wing…
Finally, understand that they are not drawing support ‘from the left of’ Labour, but that they are cleaning up Labour’s hitherto solid voting base.
One of the first thing Salmond wanted to do after independence was cut corporation tax.
The fact of the matter is that the SNP, while considerably more left-wing than they used to be, still has a Tartan Tory element to the party. And, in many ways, Salmond was from that Tartan Tory faction. He buddy up with Rupert Murdoch (and apparently Putin did much to restore Russian pride and you’ve got to admire that). He remarked once that Thatcher’s economic policies were okay for Scotland. He considered a welfare benefit cap might be a good idea. Salmond is definitely of the right of the SNP, with a lingering remain of that Tartan Toryness.
The SNP looks far more attractive as a left-wing party with Nicola in charge.
So, I’d be careful with what analogies you draw from the SNP. Because they won their majority with the leadership in the hand of the more centrist faction (Salmond), which would seem to suggest you would advise Labour to go with Shearer or Parker?
Well, at least you know or suspect that your conclusion is wrong. So is your reasoning.
Yes, the SNP threatened to cut corporation tax post independence – seen as a right wing policy that encourages a race to the bottom as states get pitted against one another to attract business HQ etc.
I guess – and I’m only guessing – that the SNP reckoned they had that balanced with other monies, so that social services wouldn’t suffer, and that they were punting that the overall $ (sic) amount from having more corporate HQs paying less tax would leave the public coffers healthier than if they kept their tax rate on a par with, or above that of England and Wales….as well as leading to greater immigration and so, economic growth…that in itself delivers a higher $ (sic) tax take. Or maybe they should have left their tax rate above that of England and Wales where it’s slated to drop to 20% from 2015?
Anyway…they commit to keeping the NHS in Scotland fully public and free. They commit to retaining free tertiary education. They commit to the retention of state provided old age care. They introduce progressive house taxation. They wanted to introduce a future fund from oil revenue. They aim to cut carbon emissions by 42% by 2020. They want rid of nuclear power and nuclear weapons…and so on and so on.
And all that when the leader is, in your opinion, a Tartan Tory who may have made some lamentable comments and indulged in some dodgy dealings. You imagine, then, what’s in store with Nicola Sturgeon as leader if your interpretation is correct?
They didn’t show up at Westminster for key votes on the bedroom tax! & their economic policy in the case of independence was basically a cross between Ireland’s low tax “Celtic Tiger” (before that went south) and the Nordic resource extraction economies – it wasn’t very “left wing”.
I’m not arguing the SNP are right wing exactly, I’m saying that if you think they are the “left” in Scotland you are very much oversimplifying.
And it’s not the case that the SNP is “cleaning up” Labour’s base. SNP does well for Holyrood, Labour for Westminister. Scottish voters are reasonably sophisticated and many seem to vote differently between Westminster & Holyrood.
I think the SNP are a component of the left in Scotland. And evidence suggests they are to the left of the Scottish and British Labour Parties.
I dunno about turning up to vote on the bedroom tax, or even if there would have been a point. But there was a point in annulling its impact, which is what they did. Andrew George’s Affordable Homes Bill made it through a second reading vote by 306 to 231, a majority of 75. And 4 of the 6 SNP members did not turn up to vote.
And it’s perfectly understandable that the same person who votes Labour in Westminster elections, votes SNP in Hollyrood elections…Scotland exerts about a 1/10th of the raw voting impact of England and Wales in UK wide elections and there is no way the SNP are taking votes from Labour in England and Wales.
But the more left parties in Scotland (greens, scottish socialist party, snp) are experiencing skyrocketing membership numbers while Labour’s membership is (by Labour’s own admission) stagnant. To put into perspective, the SNP (from a population base of about 5 million) is now the third largest party in UK terms (population base of some 55 or 60 million).
Richard, Pretty Wow from Fran.“The issue is too big to be swept under the carpet by mere politics and a focus on chasing whistleblowers instead of the real issues.”
And so say all of us!
Wow, the first part of Armstrong’s article is nothing less than an outright ode to how great National and King Key are.
Key’s prime ministership has been bedevilled by the ongoing embarrassment flowing from the GCSB.
No, it has been embarrassed at getting caught lying to NZ about how far it’s going with it’s spying on NZers.
By announcing the new structure now, Key may also have headed off any criticism or recommendations made by the Inspector General of Intelligence and Security, Cheryl Gwyn, once she has completed the inquiry into whether information was released by the SIS for political purposes.
So Armstrong is suggesting (hoping?) that Key will get away with being held accountable – again.
If it really wants to be viewed as a broad-based party then it is going to have to take positions which are in line with National’s thinking.
No they don’t. They really don’t have to be National Lite. In fact, I’d say that their being National Lite is what’s losing them the votes.
Key may be making a personal commitment to tackling child poverty. But National is starting a long way from behind.
A special ministerial committee on poverty toiled away to minimal effect during the last term.
But then it was an initiative of the Maori Party. Its contribution to the debate on poverty was to commission reports and papers which largely went unread.
Translation: Because it was an initiative of the Māori Party it could safely be ignored by National but Key’s now feeling the pressure to do something.
That is roughly the same as the cost of National’s intended tax cut.
And about how much National gave to the rich in their last round of tax cuts.
When is the government going to take the decline of small town and rural nz seriously. We don’t all want to live in a stinking traffic jam of a city. I’d like to know if centralization of population is the goal or if its willful blindness because there’s not many votes outside the cities.
I certainly don’t I’m feely sure they don’t. Just pissed that I’ve worked hard gone with out got a free hold house buy 42 and just had 8% wiped off its value at the stroke of QV’s pen
But the US armed and trained many of the people in ISIS.
They and are probably still providing support to the parts of ISIS attacking and destabilising the Assad government. Further US actions and support for the Shia Baghdad Govt has given Sunni regions north of Baghdad political, social and tribal reasons to support ISIS.
I know people who as they get older have moved because the hospital systems have been downgraded in rural towns. More work to encourge business to small town Nz.
Employment creates employment so when government pulls jobs out of a area the Ohura prison being a example and the slow death of rail being another it has a knock on effect in the community.
Basically, but let’s put it more directly than this. Spending into a community creates jobs. The private sector won’t spend into communities. So if the government wants to sort out unemployment in provincial communities, it must spend into them.
The corollary of this is that BM is lying through his teeth when he says Government cannot turn up and announce a pile of jobs. Government of course can, has and done so very effectively in NZ’s past.
Then you need to get together with the rest of the folk in whatever small town you live in and get busy.
Only you and the other town folk can turn your small town around
The government will not be riding in on a white horse to save the day.
The governments job is to keep the country as a whole running and to provide a safe a prosperous environment for the majority of it’s citizens without bankrupting the country.
Problem solving on a micro level is up to the individual/individuals, not the government.
“Getting busy and getting off your chuff” doesn’t create jobs, BM. Spending into communities creates job.
BM you are still avoiding the core issue – the private sector doesn’t care about declining provincial communities. So the government must. Or as b waghorn says – why have government at all.
Why don’t you believe in the role of government in creating sustainable employment BM? Many rural communities are under serviced with public services. There are jobs which can be created right there.
BM also continues to ignore facts – government has very successfully created industry and economic activity in rural NZ before.
Problem solving on a micro level is up to the individual/individuals, not the government.
This is utterly false, especially when thousands, tens of thousands of people are in the same societal circumstances.
It is up to government to identify the needs of its citizens and to provide services and support to each one.
Government has more than enough money to do so, and the country certainly has unused resources that it can employ to deliver this support and services.
That’s easy – can foreign investment/ownership, can the private banks creating money and have the government create and spend money into the economy. Do that and it would be impossible for the country to go bankrupt.
Of course, the banksters won’t like that as it stops them from becoming the new aristocrats.
“Employment creates employment so when government pulls jobs out of a area the Ohura prison being a example and the slow death of rail being another it has a knock on effect in the community.”
So true, Many years ago I use to call on a couple of clients in Ohura.
Use to arrive about lunchtime. have lunch in the cafe next to the supermarket call on the garage and fill the car, have a short break walk up the road and have a look in the shops etc. before driving on to Stratford.
Last Feb we had a photographic trip down that way, the first time for over 20 years. We saw one ghost town after another. Ohura there is nothing, no shops and the garage is now a second hand shop. All the little settlements have gone.
Sad really as these were vibrant communities.
@ b waghorn
We are blindly following USA. I have forgotten how many large cities and ports have registered as bankrupt or similar there. It was unheard of once but no longer. It’s dismissed as just the business cycle moving on. Businesses become defunct new ones rise, it’s a cleansing, renewing process, sort of like a natural season, spring following winter. Remember Clint and Michael Moore’s film.
Using intellect, running a whole-of-country economic plan, is anathema to NACTS. Douglas still is nostalgic about his great leap forward if only all his plan could be put in place. He is not satisfied with the harm he has already caused. There were some good things but they don’t happen to have been good for most people. This is a seagull economy. All the big birds are watching for the advantage, when there’s a crust they all swoop down but the most aggressive get there first. The aggressive losers stick out their bills, and run at the others to keep their distance. And the little birds clean up the crumbs in the few seconds the others are away fighting over the crust. And when the gulls have finished they fly over your head and poop on your shoulder.
Part of the problem for places like Taumarunui were I am is that we are in a large area dominated buy farmers who vote nats know matter what. So we can be taken for granted buy them and ignored buy the rest. Small town nz has no power.
Can a group of you get together to support getting someone on the local council or the community council. Between planning giant dams and planning coastal subdivisions and mining there might be a space to fit in something human sized and helpful to the general public. And you introduce the policy. It might take a few years to get through!
I hope she rubs sore loser Hone’s nose in it. Bradford was never taken seriously by Mana. Her stance against the Internet/Mana hook up should have been better listened too. Unfortunately Hone was too thick.
I agreed with Bradford when the IMP was initiated.
One of her main arguments, as I recall, was that it takes time to build a party and a movement, and that IMP would interfere with the building and focus that had already gone on in/with Mana.
I hope that Bradford is way more sensible and forward thinking than attempting to, as you put it, “rub sore losers Hone’s nose in it.” I don’t see that approach as being in any way helpful.
Mana can still continue with the building and focus it has had over the last few years. NZ needs such a Mana Party.
+ 1 Karol
I am sure that Sue still has a lot of respect for Hone, and she is not the type to gloat. Mana and Hone both have a future in NZ politics I hope.
I would have liked her to show political wisdom after her years at it, and shut her gob before not after the election. Then was the time to quietly slide out if she didn’t like it but with discretion, not mouth.
Sue making her stance so publicly didn’t help anyone. My impression of Hone is that he was one of the more intelligent MPs. You don’t have to be thick to make a mistake.
A moment of hypocrisy from Kim Hill mars an excellent interview
Radio New Zealand National, Saturday 11 October 2014
This morning, Kim Hill interviewed Karen Armstrong, an expert on world religion and author of Fields of Blood: Religion and the History of Violence. She launched the Charter for Compassion as a global peace initiative in 2009.
As usual with Kim Hill, this was a thoughtful and constructive half hour or so. There was only one jarring moment, which prompted this writer, i.e., moi, to send her the following email….
Dear Kim,
You asked Karen Armstrong whether she believed “Muslims should condemn more strongly ISIS and Al Qaeda.”
Why did you not ask her whether Christians and Jews should condemn the marauding gangs of Uzi-toting illegal settlers in the Occupied West Bank?
Yours sincerely,
Morrissey Breen
Northcote Point.
Keep listening, fellas! She might just read it out on air.
Yes, I heard that too, that is also a question that should have been asked. That question was a bit unusual for her, she doesn’t normally go with the knee-jerk journalism querys that afflict us on every level. Never mind I’m waiting for the Dave Dobbyn Don Mcglashin interview.
I visited in my early 20,s fell in love with the place and have gone back regularly ever since
I have bought some property , am studying Spanish with my family and am on the road to residency, Uruguay is quite open when it comes to immigration, you should look into it (especially if you are a single guy the Women are fun, friendly,open & Beautiful but VERY fiery in general !)
although you probably wouldn’t appreciate the average Uruguayans dietary habits ?
One down pointcan be the prevalence of “machismo”, It takes an assertive women to deal with it sometimes, particularly in the urban areas,rural men and gauchos are usually a little more conservative.
My wife and daughters have slapped a lot men over the years, The flip side is the receivers of said slaps will almost always bow out gracefully at that point & usually with a vote of respect for the “dama de fuego” or “chica ardiente” in question !
Chica ardiente is better than chica caliente. 🙂
Or maybe not, depending on the situation.
If my health allowed, I’d retire to Brazil. Unfortunately, it doesn’t. I prefer their attitude to life to that of the NAct lovers who have ruined Aotearoa. Brazil still has a sense that it’s developing as a nation. Aotearoa seems to be undergoing a process of destruction. I imagine Uruguay would be a cross between the south of Brazil and Chile.
What he says about being poor is amazing.
“Poor are the ones who describe me so. My definition of poor is those who need to much. Because those who need too much are never satisfied.”
Inspirational.
David Shearer on the Nation saying that he, Robertson, Parker &co should have a veto over the leadership prerefence of the membership.
Shearer and his bitter buddies hate hate the membership having a say.
Time for Shearer to get out of Labour.
Watching The Nation oh dear me David Shearer should take his family’s advice and not stand as leader. Listening to him brings back those painful memories when he was last leader, that frustrating feeling of willing an answer out of him.
He couldn’t help but turn venomous against Cunliffe, however for DC losing the confidence of his deputy is quite a telling blow. I believe DC needs to call it quits and allow overwhelming support for Andrew Little.
Contracting out allows more money to be made off the American taxpayer, all flowing into private hands. Clean and legal too.
I have a friend who is ex NZ military working (4 years ago) a security adviser to some American outfit in Iraq. Big money, huge danger with bounty on his head. Wars are a licence to print money something the Yanks know all about.
While we take notice of the goings on in the House, most kiwis don’t. It doesn’t really matter his preformance in the house, it’s the MSM who decide who governs. In saying that Little could do worst than screaming at and abusing Key during oral question time, and perhaps giving very few interviews. I believe too much footage for Gower and his bent cohorts just allows them to edit and run any bulshit angle they want.
Bit old school, but what really needs to happen in the interest of politic’s being serious and not a bloody game, is that a anti media super hero comes forward and gives one of these smart asre journalists a serious roughening up, they’ll all get the message instantly to pull their fucking heads in.
Plenty of Countries where the media wouldn’t be getting away with distorting political outcomes like this current batch of MSM are doing here.
What’s the name of that movie Charles Bronson was the lead in?
Quite right Phillip.
Watching Shearer and Little on TV is like watching two bumbling bureaucrats searching for deckchairs.
Backstories that involve cleaning up corpses after the mercenaries, and stiff arming workers into treacherous deals with bosses are appropriate skillsets for the Party of Capital not the Party of Labour.
One can see the dirty politics machinations going on to manage the primary to reclaim total control of the Party for the Blairite Caucus Majority.
They and the whole right wing so hate the ideas of party democracy when the bureaucracy knows perfectly well what workers need (to be more productive of profits).
Workers don’t need the primary because that’s the only thing that can rescue the sinking ship and put those who actually do the Labour in charge of the Party.
What really annoys me about the attacks on Cunliffe from caucus members is that they never say WHY they do not like him. Darien Fenton, who I do respect for her work with unions, has made it clear that she opposed Cunliffe becoming the leader and still does. Why, Darien?
They blame Cunliffe for the the election result without saying what it was that he insisted on doing in the campaign that they did not agree with.
The reason I have gone off Grant Robertson completely is that he was willing to use the “sorry for being a man” as a reason for Cunliffe not being popular, but didn’t say that the statement had been taken out of context and used by the MSM to attack Cunliffe relentlessly. To me, that was inexcusable.
Parker has said he no longer has confidence in Cunliffe, but won’t say why. He has taken no responsibility for the unpopularity of some of the policy he promoted eg raising the age eg entitlement to superannuation.
Agree with all your sentiments, Karen – the question really is, why can the Caucus not act in a professional manner and do their jobs without playing stupid games. You would think that it was a contest for Class President, not for Leader of the Labour Party. These people are all on huge money courtesy of US, the taxpayers. Why can’t they knuckle down and concentrate on the work at hand instead of sniping about who they “like” and “don’t like” personally. Everyone in the outside business world manages that, why can’t they?? Who the HELL do they think they are? Get your snouts down to work, I say! Criticising David Cunliffe and saying if he is Leader it would be very divisive, David Shearer showed us all who he really is on “The Nation” today – an unprofessional, petty and small person who holds grudges. I have never heard David Cunliffe running down colleagues in this way. For that alone, Shearer is totally unsuitable to be Leader.
my thoughts exactly. I cringed when I heard the unprofessional simpleton.
I had whole heartedly supported him when he took over from Goff. After hearing this morning’s interview, and his public statements, I am very glad he isn’t the leader of the Labour party! It is he and other anti Cunliffe caucus cabal that are dividing the Labour party and are damaging it.
At least Little was a little more smarter and statesmanlike in his interview.
“At least Little was a little more smarter and statesmanlike in his interview’
Not a lot smarter or statesmanlike, but just a little bit better than Shearer.
I completely disagreed with Little’s put down of Kim Dot Com/IMP.
Bet he would have had a different take if Hone had won in spite of all the parties that ganged up against him and had IMP won 3 or 4 MPs and were needed to prop up a Labour led coalition.
I just read littles nation interview on nbr It lacked the waffle that usually stops me from getting to the end of it he made clear points and opinions I hope he stays that way.
If Cunliffe wins, he should should show no mercy/hand of compromise to the RW disloyal, caucus cabal unlike the grace he showed the last time. Put them on the back bench for at least a few months
What Boag does is up to her. She is a loyal National Supporter. Comments by people like her, may be genuine, but just as easily (as we have learnt from Dirty Politics) could be playing games. I’m quite capable of forming my own opinion, without any “help” from Ms Boag.
~~~~~~~
….the fact that Little has “put down … Kim Dot Com/IMP” ….puts him in the right wing camp of the Labour Party
Whatever that means. Could you please be more specific about how that may be a good or bad thing with regard to his vision for Labour, and the policies that he will champion?
If you don’t know what the right wing camp of Labour means, it means the side of the Labour Party which since the 1980s continues to advantage the position and interests of financial capital in the economy, the position of large transnational corporates in the economy, and the ongoing corporatisation of the state, vs that of the bottom 50% of workers and citizens.
I’ve learnt in life that there are rarely people that I can not agree with on some policies, even if I disagree with them on many others. I could not stand Robert Muldoon. I thought he was obnoxious, bigoted and vile. He attacked sectional interest groups one at a time. He split the country over the Springbok tour. He was an economic nincompoop. And yet for his true interest in doing something personal about gangs, and for his decision to ignore official advice in the Arthur Thomas injustice, I admire his actions.
I’ve also learnt to distrust labels. Your basic argument against Little is
(1) Right wing Camp is bad
(2) Little is in Right Wing Camp
(3) Hey Presto. Little is bad
Your label is totally unhelpful.
So I will ask again. And emphasise the word ‘specific’ this time.
Could you please be more specific about how that may be a good or bad thing with regard to his vision for Labour, and the policies that he will champion?
Smearing Little by labelling him “right wing” is Whaleoil 101. I’m more interested in the specific policies that you disagree with, and evidence that Little supports those policies.
For f, sake, we cannot blame Little for supposed events over the last 35 years!
What the f. has Little said that will advantage the position and interests of financial capital in the economy?
What the f. has Little said that will advantage the position of large transnational corporates in the economy?
Cut the Whaleoil smears out. Put up a little evidence. With those specifics you may have a small hope of convincing somebody. There is a 50/50 chance that I may even agree with you on some or all of them.
But condescending smears that others may not know what the right wing camp of Labour means, followed by a ‘definition’ of what “right wing” is, that basically means nothing with regard to the views of Little, without evidence, deserves ridicule. Is this the sort of stuff that went on in Dunedin?
ALL of the candidates will have some very sound reasons why they would make a good leader. I’ll vote after I have heard them all. And whether they are a “North or South” candidate, I’ll be more interested in how the candidates can use internal differences of style, to the benefit of Labour, rather than see those differences as requiring amputation from an already weak body.
I m a 43 year old white blue collar worker if labour can’t appeal to people like me they have no chance. As far as kdc goes he was a light weight in a heavy weight fight ie talked a big fight but had no knockout punch.
I completely disagreed with Little’s put down of Kim Dot Com/IMP.
Do you have a reference for that? I will probably agree with you.
I have a warm spot for both the Mana and Internet Parties. I do wish that Dotcom was not on the bench at the “Moment of Truth”, with his distracting laughs, but otherwise it was not him that sabotaged the IMP vote …. that responsibility rests with both the National and Labour parties.
That Dotcom supported the policies of Mana, should be sufficient for sufficient for all current Opposition Parties not to slag him off. He could have been a useful friend.
And look where they both are now… holding down very important positions. Shearer also relegated all Cunliffe’s supporters to the back bench. I call that petty spite.
I agree with this too, Karen. I have the feeling that David Cunliffe hasn’t “joined the club” and has a wider perspective than those of the caucus who think that the membership are out of touch. Sure, we members are not totally conversant with all the nuts and bolts of Parliament but we sure as hell know what we stand for. We are not prepared to compromise on social justice just to make our party more attractive to a few fickle voters when we have thousands of non-voters who are disengaged because they don’t see a party that inspires them to vote.
Well said, Karen. All of this stuff fills me with mistrust. While these people allegedly “don’t like” or “don’t have confidence” in Cunliffe, I feel as if both policy and utterances are being pitched over our heads to ‘more important people,’ and that the task is to try and win us over to whatever the ‘more important people’ would like, which does not include Cunliffe, or anyone else that the ‘more important people’ feel the need to screw over. The general damning of the IMP has the same tone. “No, no, it’s OK More Important People, we’re definitely not going there.” I really don’t like it, and am getting close to the end of my tether with the Labour Party.
In future I think we should refer to them as MIPs. (More Important People). Or of you like… the spim.
Who shall we include? Well, the MSM of course are more important than us – especially the Beltway boys and girls. Then there are the top civil servants – people like the States Services Commissioner (Rennie is it?) They’re so important. Throw in the big corporate types who ladle out the dosh – they’re very important. And special mention must go to the Police Commissioner (and understudies) and the Security heads – oh God, they’re so much more important than us. And that’s not even starting on the off-shore Dads and Mums…
In fact when you think about it EVERYBODY is more important than us. (deep sarcasm)
Thanks for listing them Anne – I am never sure who they are, I just notice MP’s responding to some ‘them’ or other more than to us – in the same way as you know that a guy running down the street with a scared look on his face is running away from some scary thing, even though you don’t know exactly what scary thing.
When fury rules the day as it has done for me since I read Dirty Politics then if you can dredge up a bit of humour… it always helps.
I’m sure the above list are all Beltway Cocktail Circuit regulars (the BCCs) and when you throw in the senior diplomats from all over the place then you have a large room full of MIPs. The MPs – especially the old hands – love mixing with them. It makes them feel ever so important. 🙄
The reason why is because Cunliffe is supported by the members which means that the Labour caucus may actually have to start listening to those members rather than their buddies in the corporate world.
I would love a proper explanation from the ABC MPs as to exactly what their problem with DC is. Why he is apparently so bad they have ripped the Labour Party apart and ground it into the dust just to pursue their vendetta against him.
They’ve never had any issue with trashing him publicly before, so why not just come out and tell us?
Open invitation here to Trevor Mallard, Phil Goff, Annette King, Clayton Cosgrove, Chris Hipkins, David Shearer, Jacinda Ardern and Kris Faafoi – get some balls, get out of the shadows and explain yourselves.
Often issues of Leadership are. Petty grievances should be the easiest a true leader could fix. If they are indeed petty, it is probably a larger black mark against Cunliffe ability to lead.
Yes there are issues that Cunliffe needs to fix up in terms of the operation and leadership of both office and caucus. But these are all FIXABLE issues in terms of skills, behaviour, leadership paradigms and getting the right people in.
This discussion thread has been excellent in terms of identifying that the Labour caucus’ beef with Cunliffe seems quite mysterious and deserves serious explanation.
Why didn’t he? Simple – because this was his first time at Leader and it was a bloody steep learning curve on the job. He spent months trying to sort out the Leaders Office and then he was straight into the campaign.
Why is that difficult to understand. The main point is – Cunliffe is an outstanding leader for the party – as long as he recognises what needs to be done differently now, and what he needs to do differently.
If the caucus won’t tell the true leader what the petty problems are, but tell him everything is hunky dory, they are not easy to fix. I’d also make the point that it is very hard to satisfy petty egotists whatever you do, and there is no shortage of these in the Labour caucus.
It’s an election process now. There is no responsibility for voters to provide any reason why they choose a particular candidate. It will be the responsibility of all four (5?) candidates to convince the voters to place their vote with them.
I think it comes down to plain self-serving ambition and/or self preservation. As an enthusiastic supporter of Cunliffe from day one, I nevertheless am disappointed in his apparent inablility to stare them down like Helen Clark did in the 90s. I may be wrong but my impression is that Cunliffe gave in to them which is ironic given the policy planks which played a significant part in Labour’s defeat initially came from that section of caucus!
They are in such strong denial, they can’t see the role they played in destabilising Labour and allowing ‘Dirty Politics’ to do the rest.
Well said. If Cunliffe wins, he should should show no mercy/hand of compromise to the RW disloyal, caucus cabal unlike the grace he showed the last time. Put them on the back bench for at least a few months.
If Cunliffe wins, he should should show no mercy/hand of compromise to the RW disloyal, caucus cabal unlike the grace he showed the last time. Put them on the back bench for at least a few months
He might look lonely on the front bench by himself?
Cunliffe showed is compromising accomodating side and the ABCs ran over it with a truck. Does Cunliffe have what it takes to show another leadership style as it is required? He needs to if he is going to do what it takes to be the right PM in very difficult times.
Cunliffe has every chance of convincing the voters to re-elect him Leader. To do so, he will need to convince them that he has identified all the errors that we should have known in foresight, and all the errors we now know in hindsight. And how he is going to carry on doing all the good things he did, and not do those things that are now seen in error.
Perhaps the last paragraph is too complicated. Instead of fixing it up, I’ll paraphrase. Cunliffe is redeemable. It’s up to him.
The “disloyalty” is now answered. Parker will be a candidate.
The ‘disloyal’ tag was always unfair. Any comment that could be construed as ‘disloyal’ was made after the election.
Seems to me that silencing debate (“shut up”) is the wrong approach. If there is a TRUE desire to talk through ALL the issues. This is the one chance when a full and frank exchange of views can be understood to be more about getting the right candidate, than about expectations of ‘loyalty’. It’s quite impossible to be loyal to all four candidates, when there is only one vote to give.
I think the President of the Labour party has said no talking about the candidates during the campaign or addressing things through the media.
I am going with that. It is never helpful when Labour is open about internal divisions in public. They open themselves up to being criticized for a lack of unity.
Mr Parkers comments after the election, when he knew DC would be standing again for leader, were completely unhelpful and against what the party president requested we do. If Mr C is re-elected then Parker has ensured the Nats can be unrelenting in their cries of “Labour Caucus is divided”.
Whatever caucuses opinion is of their leader carries very little weight with me. As a paid up member, I claim the right to come to my own decision.
David Parker’s comments preceded the President’s request.
Regardless, an election by itself shows that there will be four (or 5?) possible “divisions”. The election is “unhelpful”?
We can all pretend or we can be honest.
I see all this not as major divisions, but about 4 or 5 extremely capable people all dedicated to a Party that they are willing to lead. Of course John Key will say that the “Labour Caucus is divided”, or “Labour is committing suicide, or whatever. That’s politics. What John Key says about Labour will only be just another sledge that he adds to every one of his sentences, that he is “quite relaxed about” at the end of the day.
Well said. The stupid cocky caucus should realise that it is the members of the party that put them up as candidates and helped elect/select them in the first place!
A strong front line keeps the attack at bay, (being undermined). I reckon that when Cunliffe has a loyal deputy he will GROW in confidence and he will perform to his potential.
@10.5 I mentioned Cunliffe as leader and Little as deputy; little could unite caucus. Little as deputy and McCarten as chief of staff would work very well together. This duo would be loyal to Cunliffe as leader. A weekly chat with leader to sort out the disenchanted in caucus would not go amiss.
Agreed Karen. And further is the constant “attacks” from the ABCs yet to date I do not know any specifics which supports that. Everyone knows yet cannot point to what. I like Trevor and do not understand how or why he would be “underming” DC or anyone else.
How was Cunliffe’s “Sorry for being a man” supposedly taken out of context, exactly?
I think this statement was one of the most serious examples of Cunliffe assisting National in the election campaign. I’m sure he won many votes from the statement, especially the audience he was talking to. But for every vote he won, I expect he would have lost a dozen.
I hope the Labour review of the election considers this issue seriously, to determine how much of a problem it actually was.
From a conversation from a young female voter today, from a family with strong Labour voting history. “I had no idea why I would want to vote Labour. I didn’t know what they stood for. Cunliffe was a wet rag. He couldn’t get his message across in the debates with Key. How could he possibly run the country”
What Labour needed at the time, was some serious attention being placed on promoting a vision for the Party, and providing voters with a reason why they would like to support the Party. That did not happen, which remains an indictment on both Cunliffe and his election advisors. There was more of an appearance of trawling for votes from sectional interest groups.
I kind of agree with the assessment of the debates. While comments here were largely of the opinion that Cunliffe “won” the debates, the real conclusion is more complicated. If we are talking about a debate, then the comments that Cunliffe “won” may be correct. But ‘winning a debate’ and ‘providing a message for voters to choose Labour’ are two completely different beasts. It’s like winning the battle, at the expense of losing the war.
Cunliffe was chosen, almost solely because he was seen to be the one person capable of winning the anticipated debates with the masterful John Key. Nobody else could do it. (I say almost, because there is no denying that Cunliffe is highly intelligent, and a charming person on a face to face level) But now (in hindsight) I have come to the conclusion that far too much was made of the need to ‘win’ the debates with Key. That is a media construction that does not have to be followed. I am coming around to the proposition that a Leader such as Little (and possibly Robertson) could ignore the media’s demand that the media treat the debates like a prize boxing match – and ignore the temptation to score “smart” points off John Key, and simply do what they can do best – return to the Labour vision again and again and again, – and show how key policies will meet that agenda.
I think that Cunliffe won his ‘wet rag’ tag, with comments like his “sorry’ comment. There is probably only one way that he could regain my respect …. and that is by calling for a Commission of Inquiry into the injustice that has been done to Peter Ellis. Surely something can be done about this stain on our justice system while Peter Ellis is still alive?
Mr Botany B the main problem with Mr C’s sorry about being a man is how the msm spun it……………….. the main reason why Labour lost was the unrelenting campaign of negatively and spin agaisn’t DC.
Just consider this if the media had of reverse the positive spin on Key and applied it to Cunliffe and vica a versa, who would have won the election. IMHO Cunliffe and Labour.
Boldsirbrian I agree with you so far as the debates being a media construct that do little to explain Labour’s vision. Unfortunately the media are not interested in Labour’s vision, so it is almost impossible to get MSM coverage for anything except a quick response when something controversial has happened.
Labour did fall down in its advertising campaign, but I don’t know that Cunliffe was to blame for that, and I agree with Andrew Little that there was too much policy for voters to get their heads around.
The “sorry for being a man” was taken out of context. I had a listen to the whole speech online at the time and it actually inspired me to volunteer for the Labour Party this election. At that same meeting Paula Bennet evidently played on her phone through all the speeches – why wasn’t that reported in the MSM?
At that same meeting Paula Bennet evidently played on her phone through all the speeches – why wasn’t that reported in the MSM?
That’s interesting Karen. Remember in 2008 Helen Clark was seen checking her cell phone for messages (once) while seated in an audience at some function or another?
The video was played over and over again and the meme was: she had committed a very serious offence. Dirty Politics started years ago…
I am struggling to work out what context could ever justify such a ludicrous apology. No use blaming this one on the MSM
Perhaps he will address the subject in his electioneering.
I’ll repeat that it is really important that Labour get on top of this one in the Labour review. There are obviously people like you Karen, who were ‘inspired’ by an unnecessary put down of men. My anecdotal experience, found that the predominant response (from men especially) was the worst reaction that a politician could receive: being mocked.
So we (You and I, Karen) are firmly in two camps. Was the comment helpful or not for Labour?. If it was unhelpful, can we blame the media as ankerawshark suggests; or would the right ‘context’ somehow make it ok? Perhaps the Labour Party have far too few women supporters, and are willing to sacrifice a proportion of an abundance of male members, for women who may be inspired?
The answer is important. Perhaps Labour already know from their internal polling. And if I am wrong in thinking that the comment was overwhelmingly more detrimental than beneficial, I’ll eat humble pie, at the same time as I hand in my membership. A Party that supports such a comment, is not one that I personally wish to remain with.
I can imagine that if gay bashing were still common, and Cunliffe said he was sorry for being hetero, Robertson would join the chorus against him. I thought the way Cunliffe said that was a bit silly, but once he had spoken, caucus should have stood behind him. All of them, even the women, repeating “I’m sorry for being a man too” and explaining what it meant would have been far better than what they did.
Just a reminder – still time to plan to get there.
The 2014 Bruce Jesson Lecture
Mike Joy – Paradise Squandered; New Zealand’s Environmental Asset Stripping
Wednesday 15 October, 6.30pm
Maidment Theatre
Alfred Street
The University of Auckland
The Maidment Bar will open from 5.30pm
New Zealand’s lakes, rivers and most of our groundwater are in a critical state. Decades of misguided regulation and a free-for-all on diffuse pollution have encouraged agricultural intensification and driven our increasing reliance on imported feed and fertiliser.
The inevitable consequences have been devastating environmental impacts as well as increasing economic and biosecurity risks.
The solutions are many but require a paradigm shift; a move away from dependence on imported feed and fertiliser to keeping nutrients on farm and adding value to products, and strong leadership to move away from short-term thinking that accepts the massive ecological debt we are running up.
Mike Joy MSc(Hons), PhD in Ecology is a Senior Lecturer in Ecology and Environmental Science at the Ecology Group-Institute of Agriculture and Environment, Massey University, Palmerston North. He has received a number of awards, including the Ecology in Action award from the New Zealand Ecological Society; an Old Blue award from the Royal Forest and Bird protection Society; Environmental New Zealander of the Year from North and South magazine and the Manawatu Evening Standard Person of the Year.
Presented by Politics and International Relations and the Bruce Jesson Foundation
Euthanasia – the right to die with dignity. Will we people ever get these political nitwits who supposedly are the cream of the crop to represent our opinions and needs in parliament and have them facilitated? We need them there to actually listen and devise strategies so that we maintain the standards we aspire to for human beings, but have more control of our own lives. While we have a bunch of sharp dealers, money mad and aspirational for their own comfort, the chances are against thoughtful and well-planned policy being passed. But I could be wrong eh!
http://www.3news.co.nz/tvshows/campbelllive/cancer-patient-chooses-death-on-own-terms-2014100920
In the USA. Last night, a story from the United States captured the attention of millions last night on Facebook.
The video of American woman Brittany Maynard has been watched by more than a million people – she has chosen the day she will die.
Ms Maynard has a terminal illness, but rather than spend her last months suffering, she’s moved her family to Oregon, one of just five US states that allows terminal patients to choose euthanasia.
She has chosen November 1 – two days after her husband’s birthday.
In Australia one of the states had police raiding people’s houses looking for the good drug that people had obtained and put aside ready for when they decide to pass away after they have done everything, got organised and feel content to accept death. But no this personal moment must be degraded by venal politicians, interfering medicos, religious dictators, and acts of aggression by the state. Disappointing, disgraceful.
We put of pets down when we know they are in pain and it’s the right thing to do. But rather our loved one suffer in pain. I put it down to the high religious influence in NZ.
@ Skinny
I think it’s a following of rote spiritual and ethical learning without much intellectual thought. And not wishing to face the reality of a situation, and being resigned about things. People say oh well, that’s how it is, at the end of the day we can’t help it happening, it’s nature isn’t it and other anodyne phrases.
(And here are some synonyms that I think also apply to a large number of NZs. –
bland, inoffensive, innocuous, neutral, unobjectionable, unexceptionable, unremarkable, commonplace, dull, tedious, run-of-the-mill.)
They are good people for sure, but rarely spark enough to think and act to make changes, or get something radically different. Lack of that spark makes us easy to push around, and accepting of everything, and we sure don’t like any offering of criticism or advice.)
“They are good people for sure……..” (agreed) – good, lazy, laid back, complacent, anodyne (as you say – good word), disinterested, disengaged.
A big societal change, which isn’t surprising after 30 years of neoliberalism.
We like to think of ourselves as compassionate, caring, concerned, etc., however I’ve begun to question that. We are when it comes to all being in the same waka (such as at times of natural disasters), or when shit hitting a fan becomes widespread.
Otherwise I’ve come to realise we’re actually no more compassionate or engaged, or concerned for the welfare of others, or community than many places elsewhere. (If we were, there’d have been a bigger turnout on election day).
Can you imagine (for example), most of the population of a small/average town/village volunteering at polio clinics, taking in homeless, feeding the homeless here in NZ? I can’t! At one time I could have.
It’s a self-congratulatory, but a completely fukd idea of the reality. It’s not surprising though when a good many of the aging boomers have reached their comfort zone and naturally want to preserve it, and when subsequent generations have grown up knowing, AND EXPERIENCING nothing other than the rise of individualism, greed is good, the commodification of all and everything.
Given the Koiwoi laid beck ettitude, its the easy option – that is until it all turns to shit. (Fear not though – we have an oikon to lead us all thru’ it by the name of Yavridge Bloke Honist John).
This is not the NZ I knew – and strangely enough its not even the NZ my 30ish yo kids knew – and its becoming a NZ I no longer want to know.
That sounds a bit defeatist – it’s not. I just don’t particularly want to be around when that muddle class awaken (and as someone elsewhere in here noted re the Muldoon era where you couldn;t find anyone that admitted voting for the prick).
The more this neo-liberal, selfish, greed-driven, no-such-thing-as-sussoighty, self perpetuating – but also – self-defeating nightmare goes on, the nastier the outcome is likely to be.
And it’s not just sleepy fucking Hobbits that need to wake up, but the NZ Labour Party as well
:h1
/endrave
:h2
/back to planning escape
:h3
/reminder to send a sympathy card to NZ Labour when they don’t get their shit together
Still are Tim
Good to hear you are still hanging on there. It’s amazing how 30 years can wipe out so much good principle and belief about what the spirit of our country was. And its hard to realise that though some of it was impatience with ferry workers and others going on too many strikes, and some ingrained efficiencies that needed checking, a lot of it was just snobbery as seen in the rude words about guys going to work in cardigans their wives had knitted etc. We were relatively self suffficient then and appreciated quality, and hand knitted wool. Now it is appearance imported polyester jackets. We like the look of the beautiful Easter egg, covered with foil but empty inside.
And we still have Labour losing the election because they are too stolid to find their way round a corner. A boot in the bum is what they needed. Strategic standing using MMP tactics as National does. Not quite in the spirit but still not outlandish except from Labour’s imagination. Why not call in some Standardistas as a focus group? There is always pollitics stew simmering here. Something hot and tasty would have been served up for their consideration.
And now David Parker is presenting the same stolid face that Michael Cullen presented. If Michael had worked out some fancy tax cuts that would have ended up increasing the velocity of money through the economy, and a few extra jobs, and a bit over for Christmas, probably Labour wouldn’t have lost but for his chewing gum called tax deduction. Labour haven’t come out of the last century. And we are already 14 years into the next. WTF.
In a country where we are still riding on Ernest Rutherford’s doings, while cutting down science funding here in favour of giving money to rich people buying things overseas and houses here as the great leap forward, it makes me puke. Do I want to live in such a dumb place. That thinks it is business minded, but can only do a couple of things that were going when we first were colonised, the rest has gone out of our hands to be exploited by cleverer people than us in the main. And the country is losing its soul.
a lot of it was just snobbery as seen in the rude words about guys going to work in cardigans their wives had knitted etc. We were relatively self suffficient then and appreciated quality, and hand knitted wool.
It’s one of the amusing aspects of reading some of the novels that I’ve read where the author goes on about how these fabulous wealthy people with great style all have hand crafted this and polished that. And I recall a few years ago when an upper market car firm had the technicians signing the hand crafted parts of the motors that they made. I kept thinking but the machine made stuff is actually better and then I realised that it was a statement that basically translates to: I’m so rich I can waste peoples time and effort without concern.
DTB
Ever looked through Paul Fussells’s book on Class in the USA? Quite funny how the different classes regard anything from the culture of that income and asperashuns.
Actually signing stuff you made would be good. I wear all this cheap clothing produced by hard working driven people, mostly women from overseas. And sometimes I think about them sitting in lines at their machines. And I think there were exposes one called China Blue? But they have great skills and I try to mentally appeciate those when I remember. Applies to a lot of the things we get these days, when all physical labour is passe’. Even managing money has been mechanised, with computers set to buy and sell when certain monetary points are reached.
And something just recently has been produced that takes away jobs in favour of mechanisation. Those of us who still respect humanity and care about our society have to group together.
WH Auden –
We must love one another or die”
and Benjamin Franklin
“We must indeed all hang together, or most assuredly we shall all hang separately.”
“We put of pets down when we know they are in pain and it’s the right thing to do. But rather our loved one suffer in pain. I put it down to the high religious influence in NZ.”
AFAIK most people support euthanasia in principle so I think the hold up in legislation is more likely to be that we haven’t yet solved the issues around coersion and the overlap with suicide. ie it’s ethics that are holding us up. Not insurmountable but not insignificant either.
Do you think the ethics haven’t been talked about? The work is too hard that’s the trouble. It takes time away from giving largesse to the wealthy (friends) or dealing criminals who can’t be let off and have to be punished somehow (enemies) and the business of dealing with the broad mass of people is approached reluctantly.
All the problems could be solved by going into select committee, asking for input from regions open to interested people, not just the ossified. Then listening to limited time submissions where they have to stick to facts, not gerrymander on their opinions and beliefs.
Of course ethics have been talked about, but not across the population publicly. We probably need a dedicated period of time of taking the issue to the public, lots of media attention, time for an in depth look, talking to a range of people, medical, ethical, care givers, patients, families etc. By issue, I mean the legislation and the practicalities. That would need a political party to spearhead it – can’t see that being done at the moment, so that leaves lobbying until it gains momentum.
Myself, I wouldn’t be comfortable with this being handed over to a select committee process without the above happening, esp with the current govt.
If you want parties to support it, you have to get the population on board too. I think most people support euthanasia in principle, but haven’t yet been presented with the details of how it would work in practice.
True. The public never get a chance to get their teeth, so to speak, into the various concerns. When it is discussed there will be someone from the hospice service that rubbishes it, someone from religion who doesn’t countenance it, someone who has had an experience of need who supports it and the whole matter is left floating.
In general the public need to have the chance to discuss legislation, a group in each town who sort of monitors what’s going on, is informed and thoughtful, necessarily of course. And particularly with important matters like this. Also with some of the practices being adopted for prisoners, that go against the better standards of human behaviour that we have espoused in modern times.
The last thing I listened to (a while ago) was a hospice nurse who basically said that everyone with a terminal illness can have a good death experience with the right support. Vested interests I guess (as in she believes in her profession, but I suspect there were religious believes too).
I haven’t gone looking, but I’ve not seen good discussion about the practicalities of protecting vulnerable people. To my mind that’s going to be the stumbling block and is the thing that needs to get into the public for dicussion. Once that’s resolved many people’s hesitations will go away.
Re religion, where the mainstream ones stand on this? I assume the Catholics are against it, what about the Anglicans and Presbyterians? The Buddhists would be great to have involved, all that preparing for how one dies.
andrew murray 3.55 pm
You are underestimating the human complexities involved in dying. If it was to be just as quick and straightforward as you think it ought to be, there would be a lot more suicide jumping off cliffs into the sea. But that creates problems, concerns, what if you don’t die straight away and endure agony for ages, not really the imagined end. And then people’s lives may be put at risk while they search for you, because it’s not tidy for a country to have people going off and dying in unknown places, even if they never cared two hoots about you while alive.
Then there are the people around, in the area, very sad to have people committing suicide near your place. If you die on your own, who finds you, who buries you, who ties up the ends of your life? So there are the people who want to know where the body is, the people who actually grieve, the people who want to inherit but can’t until the body is found or seven years gone, or can’t claim a widow’s, single benefit etc. Your bones and bits will be gathered up and given a cremation probably, who pays for that – the people. And some sort of marker for your remains to give respect to your being. And an entry to be put in the records that you came, you saw, and you conked out!
Suicide can be an incredibly selfish thoughtless thing to do. If children are left, what a burden to bear. Why, and do they blame the other parent and so on. If choosing euthanasia, there is often some plan, others would be involved. We aren’t islands, the last person in our world. There are things to be thought about, things that you should do before you leave the world that has nurtured you, even if to one’s mind not well. What is needed is a planned procedure, not an exhaustive one, but so the person can go with a clear path, satisfied to have finished and be done. And perhaps with a resigned and loving smile and kiss. Then it would be a good death to have.
edited
I believe Andrew Little’s candidacy will derail David Cunliffe’s attempt to stay as leader. Eventually, DC will have to withdraw, which will make easier for Grant Robertson to win.
The next few weeks should be watched with interest by the membership.
Sounded to me like he just announced his resignation from caucus will probably be forthcoming post-leadership contest. (Unless he or Parker are leader that is)
Anyone around here still want to say that Shearer is an honest, compassionate, wise and intelligent man who went into politics in order to serve unselfishly for the benefit of others less fortunate than himself, after watching that?
As opposed to…….
Labour is in the shape that it is precisely because Labour’s front bench doesn’t know better. Labour’s caucus has a shockingly dysfunctional and toxic organisational culture.
Terrorism can never be defeated by military means alone. But how do you go about negotiating with people who have blood on their hands? Britain’s chief broker of the Northern Ireland peace deal explains how it can – and must – be done (for a start, always shake hands)
[…]
Above all, what these experiences demonstrate is that there isn’t really an alternative to talking to the terrorists if you want the conflict to end. Hugh Orde, the former chief constable in Northern Ireland, rightly says, “There is no example that I know of, of terrorism being policed out” – or fully defeated by physical force – anywhere in the world. Petraeus said that it was clear in Iraq that “we would not be able to kill or capture our way out of the industrial-strength insurgency that was tearing apart the very fabric of Iraqi society”. If you can’t kill them all, then sooner or later you come back to the same point, and it is a question of when, not whether, you talk. If there is a political cause then there has to be a political solution.
defeating terrorism and insurgencies is thousand year old knowledge. It starts with not screwing over the ordinary people who are their support base, and bringing that support base closer to you, to push for a more moderate approach.
Unless it turns out that the terrorism and insurgency is politically useful to you for other reasons of course. In that case, you would just fuel it by killing tribal families and civilians on a daily basis to grow the hate of the ordinary people against your forces, and drive up recruitment and sympathy for terrorist/insurgency forces.
One problem is that so many in the military believe that they can win. They just need to apply a little more force. Vietnam, Northern Ireland, and Gaza are all examples of this. They remind me of ACT idiots who blame the GCP on lack of doctrinal purity.
I would like each of the candidates for the LP leadership to answer the following questions. Please feel free to improve the quality of the questions and add some more.
1. What if anything, in your opinion, was wrong about the direction of Labour policies in the last election?
2. What changes would you personally like to see in the general direction of Labour policy?
3. If you are voted in as leader and the membership and the caucus insists the party should move in the opposite direction to that which you support, how will you cope with this?
4. If you are not voted in as leader and the agreed party policy moves in the opposite direction to your wishes, then are you able to unreservedly support the party line and its leader?
5. Who do you believe should determine the direction of the party- the leader (together with caucus) or the total membership?
6. What are your views on the way in which the TPPA and the deep sea drilling issues should be handled?
7. What are your views on the way controversial policies such as the increase in the age of eligibility of superannuation should be handled?
8. It is obvious that Labour would need to form a coalition to be in Government. Using the hindsight of the recent election, how do you think the pre-election relationships between possible coalition partners be optimised to present a stable alternative to the voting public.
good questions, and they should certainly be asked, but overall, policy did not win or lose Labour the election. Being a poor cultural fit with Kiwis and being socially disconnected from the vast majority of Kiwi voters, is what nailed Labour.
(having said that the BS retirement age policy and the badly executed CGT policy messaging were definitely hindrances).
Just since that Parker has thrown his hat in the ring…………..holy moly…………4 candidates.
The vote will be heavily diluted.
IMHO anyone who has criticised DC in public should be out. Not matter how “bad” he is, they should have stfu.
I am thinking of emailing Moira Coastworth to ask what disciplinary action will be taken by the party after D S on the Nation this morning. We were told to shut up about the candidates.
There was an email from Moira Coatsworth. I may have done her/it a dis-service by saying “shut up”.
I can’t remember the exact words, but how I interpreted it was that we shouldn’t bag the candidates and that we are not to express negativity through the media about the candidates.
Oh, that one. That email was even-handed and fine. I didn’t sense anything calling for people to shut-up. It was more of a ‘being mindful’ kind of tone.
Having said that, it is quite interesting to think this through:
(1) Did Parker read that email before or after Moira’s email?
(2) In accordance with good sense and common decency, did Parker cross the line in terms of the letter or even spirit of that statesman(person)ship-like email from Moira?
(3) With regard to the answer in response to (2), whether in the affirmative or negative, such an answer would set the precedence for other caucus or party members to be judged accordingly.
(4) If the answer to (2) is no, then that means it would be quite ok for people to call out, as Parker did, as to who be regarded as “untenable” to be leader.
(5) If the answer to (2) is yes, when will Parker be disciplined?
Stuff has a poll about who you would prefer as the next Labour leader. I think this poll is a bit stupid and the results are highly suspect as it is an open poll for everyone, including Labour’s and Cunliffe’s enemies!
The actual Labour leadership contest that is rightfully open to the Labour members, not to the general public and Labour’s opponents.
For instance, for National, I would ‘prefer’ Aaron Gilmore as their leader…(or may be Maurice W or Judith C or Bhakshi K or….)
The money to help the stricken nations trying to deal with Ebola isn’t rolling in fast enough! And a warning is given that if the pandemic gets out of hand it will badly affect the world’s economy!!
An item on a link – sounds a downer. Our gummint says we need more uni money going into science so we Can GetAhead as a country,.
In USA they in one area have increased grad places from 30,000 to 56,000 but at the same time the projects funded have gone from 30% to 10% or something and a lot of scientists are having to do basic work that PhD should not be doing. They have the credentials, they have the ability but can’t get the work. Crazy old capitalism. Screws you every time. That’s very roughly the gist. Get the real facts from the link. http://io9.com/meet-the-new-underclass-people-with-ph-d-s-in-science-1644006710
It does. The people who produce stuff and actually keep society functioning get screwed over while the people who speculate with money or get interest and dividends from holding money/shares do ever better. The result will be the collapse of society and it appears that’s what most of us want as we vote for the political parties (National, Act, etc) that will bring about that collapse.
I am very lucky to have a permanent position. I wouldn’t advise anyone to aim for a career in science at the moment. You work your guts out to learn about things, gain unique abilities and then have to put up with disrespect from both smarmy gits like Key and conspiracy freaks who get their pseudoscience off youtube. You only get a permanent position if you’re very lucky, and you end up with a huge student loan to pay off.
DTB and Murrayrawshark
That’s how it is eh! So we can’t keep going hoping for better days. This is the end of the Rogernomics trial. And it’s been a failure. We have known for a while but have looked away quickly at NZ lying injured, and passed on our way. Now we have to turn into Good Samaritans and pick up the country, dress the wounds, get it some crutches, and help it move again.
The bible has some good, relevant stories in it, apart from tribes warring and calvinist threats of doom, and skewed ideas retreating as far as you can go from Christianity.
And I don’t go to church regularly now, but might go to Bahai or Quaker. Very sincere.
I can’t stand being preached at now, knowing that the original message and thought has been written down, passed on by some other human, partly digested and brought forward again to the faithful, in altered form. Chinese whispers is like the stuff being preached, the further from the source, the more likely that some dictate or fillip has been added.
It is with heartfelt sadness that my family have heard of the death of Labour Party stalwart Paul Jellicich /Paul was famous for the Labour Picnics he organized and his Lamb spits were famous .
Our thoughts are with his wife Dorothy ,My wife and I have fond memories of you both and are just glad that we enjoyed dinner together just a few weeks ago.
Our love and thoughts are with you Dorothy .
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It's been a busy seven days as we start to rebuild New Zealand together. From delivering extra support for small businesses, to investing in our artists and arts organisations, to cutting red tape on home DIY projects, we're rolling out our plan to get the economy and New Zealand moving ...
Deputy Prime Minister Winston Peters says alert level 2 restrictions have to be discussed during today's Cabinet meeting. Thousands gathered across the country, including at Parliament, yesterday forBlack Lives Matter marcheswhere social distancing and mass gathering rules were flouted. Mr Peters said the breaching of Alert Level 2 rules at ...
Rt Hon Winston Peters, Deputy Prime Minister, Minister of State Owned Enterprises KiwiRail’s Northland rail upgrade steps up another gear today and will help Northland recover from the impacts of COVID-19, State Owned Enterprises Minister Winston Peters says. The Government is investing $204.5 million through the Provincial Growth Fund to ...
“Today and every day we stand in solidarity with George Floyd’s family, friends and community who feel pain and fear about his untimely death at the hands of Minneapolis police”, said Green Party Co-leader and Māori Development spokesperson Marama Davidson. ...
Fletcher Tabuteau, Parliamentary Under-Secretary for Regional Economic Development Hon Eugenie Sage, Minister of Conservation The West Coast forests of Mount Te Kinga at Kotuku Whakaoho/Lake Brunner are the latest predator free project to receive Government funding, announced Minister of Conservation Eugenie Sage and Under Secretary for Regional Economic Development Fletcher ...
The Green Party says major freshwater reforms announced today provide the strongest ever protections of our waterways, to help ensure the next generation can swim in the rivers of Aotearoa. ...
The Green Party has begun the process for a Select Committee inquiry into student accommodation, which has been exposed during COVID-19 as an under-regulated sector that straddles students with unfair debt. ...
Rt Hon Winston Peters, Deputy Prime Minister, Minister of Foreign Affairs Hon Megan Woods, Minister of Research, Science and Innovation Hon Dr David Clark, Minister of Health Foreign Affairs Minister Winston Peters, Research, Science and Innovation Minister Megan Woods, and Health Minister David Clark today announced a COVID-19 vaccine strategy, ...
Budget 2020 is about rebuilding together, supporting jobs, getting business moving and the books back into the black. It’s an integral part of our COVID-19 economic response, and our plan to grow our economy and get New Zealand moving again.Here’s a quick look at the five top things you ...
The Green Party is pleased to reveal its candidate list for the upcoming election. With a mix of familiar faces and fresh new talent, this exceptional group of candidates are ready to lead the Greens back into Government. ...
The Coalition Government has approved $206 million in essential upgrades at Ōhakea Air Base. Defence Minister Ron Mark said the money would be spent on improving old infrastructure. He said safety issues would be addressed, as well as upgrades to taxiways, accommodation and fresh, storm and waste water systems. "This ...
Rt Hon Winston Peters, Leader of New Zealand First “I am not persisting with this case just for myself, but for all people who have had their privacy breached. Privacy of information is a cornerstone of our country’s democracy. Without it our society truly faces a bleak future. We now ...
Hon Tracey Martin, Minister for ChildrenA major increase in funding and availability of support will improve the incomes and reduce the pressure on 14,000 caregivers looking after more than 22,000 children.Children’s Minister Tracey Martin says that caregivers – all those looking after someone else’s children both in and ...
Forestry Minister Shane Jones has introduced a Bill to Parliament that he says will "force more transparency, integrity and respect" for the domestic wood-processing sector through the registration of log traders and practice standards. The Forests (Regulation of Log Traders and Forestry Advisers) Amendment Bill had its first reading in ...
This summer presents a great opportunity for New Zealanders to get out into nature with bookings on Great Walks for 2020/21 set to open next week, says Minister of Conservation Eugenie Sage. Bookings for the Great Walks will open between 9 and 11 June, excluding Milford and Routeburn tracks which ...
Extra 40,000 businesses to be eligible for wage subsidy extension Small business cashflow support application period extended The Government is today announcing further support for businesses that continue to be affected by the global COVID-19 pandemic, as the broader economy becomes one of the most open in the world following ...
The Coalition Government has confirmed five Lockheed Martin C-130J-30 Super Hercules transport aircraft will be purchased to replace the existing fleet, Defence Minister Ron Mark announced today. “Last year, Cabinet selected these aircraft as the preferred option to replace the current Hercules fleet. Procurement of the Super Hercules has been ...
The Minister of Conservation Eugenie Sage is celebrating World Environment Day with an announcement of a major step towards Wairarapa Moana being recognised as an internationally significant wetland. “Wairarapa Moana is an ecosystem of 10,000 hectares of wetland and open water that provides a home for indigenous fish, birds and ...
New public housing that will save tenants money in energy bills, and provide warmer, healthier and more comfortable homes, is setting the standard for the Government’s future public housing programme, Housing Minister Megan Woods said. Dr Woods opened the new Kāinga Ora – Homes and Communities complex, which has a ...
A new-look Police graduation ceremony to take account of COVID19 health rules has marked the completion of training for 57 new constables. Police Minister Stuart Nash attended this afternoon's ceremony, where officers of Recruit Wing 337 were formally sworn in at the Royal New Zealand Police College without the normal support of ...
Mobile traders and truck shops must adhere to responsible lending requirements Interest rate cap on high-cost loans Lenders prohibited from offering further credit to an applicant who has taken two high-cost loans in the past 90 days The Minister of Commerce and Consumer Affairs, Kris Faafoi, has signalled an end ...
94% of firms say wage subsidy had positive impact on cashflow 62% of firms say support helped to manage non-wage costs like rent A survey of business that have received the Government’s wage subsidy show it has played a significant role in saving jobs, and freed up cash flow to ...
New legislation introduced to Parliament today will support growth and assist businesses on the road to economic recovery, said Revenue Minister Stuart Nash. “The Taxation (Annual Rates for 2020-21, Feasibility Expenditure, and Remedial Matters) Bill proposes that businesses can get tax deductions for ‘feasibility expenditure’ on new investments,” said Mr ...
Sport and Recreation Minister Grant Robertson has welcomed the first release of funds from the $265 million Sport Recovery Package announced as part of Budget 2020. Sport NZ has announced that $4.6 million in funding will go to the Wellington Phoenix, NZ Warriors, Super Rugby teams and the ANZ Premiership ...
An iconic New Zealand tourism attraction and the country’s 31 Regional Tourism Organisations are the first recipients of support from the $400 million Tourism Sector Recovery Plan, to help position the sector for recovery from COVID-19, Tourism Minister Kelvin Davis announced today. The plan includes a Strategic Tourism Assets Protection ...
The Government will legislate to ensure businesses that suffered as a result of the COVID-19 response will get help to resolve disputes over commercial rent issues, Justice Minister Andrew Little announced today. A temporary amendment to the Property Law Act will insert a clause in commercial leases requiring a fair ...
The Minister for Small Business says new data from Xero highlights the urgency of prompt payment practices to small and medium enterprises as we move into economic recovery. Last month Government ministers wrote to significant private enterprises and the banking industry to request they join efforts by government agencies to ...
Young people in Waikato will be the first to have free access to period products in schools in another step to support children and young people in poverty,” Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern said. During term 3, the Ministry of Education will begin providing free period products to schools following the ...
The Minister of Police Stuart Nash has issued the following statement in response to charges filed against three Police officers this morning in the New Plymouth District Court. “Any incident involving a loss of life in Police custody is taken very seriously. The charges today reflect the gravity of the ...
$196 million for Crown Research Institutes $150 million for R&D loan scheme $33 million for Māori research and development opportunities $12 million for the Nationally Significant Collections and Databases $10 million to help maintain in-house capability at Callaghan Innovation New Zealand’s entrepreneurs, innovators and crown researchers will benefit from a ...
Further temporary changes to NCEA and University Entrance (UE) will support senior secondary school students whose teaching and learning have been disrupted by COVID-19. “The wellbeing of students and teachers is a priority. As we are all aware, COVID-19 has created massive disruption to the school system, and the Government ...
Minister for Racing Winston Peters today announced that the terms for the directors of the Racing Industry Transition Agency (RITA) have been extended to 30 June 2021. Due to the COVID-19 crisis the transition period has been extended to ensure that the Racing Industry Bill can complete its progress through ...
The deadline for landlords to include detailed information in their tenancy agreements about how their property meets the Healthy Homes Standards, so tenants can see the home they are renting is compliant, has been extended from 1 July 2020 to 1 December 2020. The Healthy Homes Standards became law on 1 July 2019. The Standards are ...
Justice Minister Andrew Little today announced details of further appointments to the Criminal Cases Review Commission. “I am pleased to announce Paula Rose QSO OStJ as Deputy Chief Commissioner for a term of five years commencing on 15 June 2020,” said Andrew Little. “I am also pleased to announce the ...
The Targeted Training and Apprenticeships Fund (TTAF) will pay costs of learners of all ages to undertake vocational education and training The fund will target support for areas of study and training that will give learners better employment prospects as New Zealand recovers from COVID-19 Apprentices working in all industries ...
The Emissions Trading Scheme (ETS) will finally start to cut New Zealand’s greenhouse gas pollution as it was originally intended to, because of changes announced today by the Minister for Climate Change, James Shaw. The changes include a limit on the total emissions allowed within the ETS, rules to ensure ...
Minister for Pacific Peoples Aupito William Sio says the Queen’s Birthday 2020 Honours List provides an abundance of examples that Pacific people’s leadership capability is unquestionable in Aotearoa. “The work and the individuals we acknowledge this year highlights the kind of visionary examples and dedicated community leadership that we need ...
The Government is backing a new $27 million project aimed at boosting sustainable horticulture production and New Zealand’s COVID-19 recovery efforts, says Agriculture Minister Damien O’Connor. “Our horticulture sector has long been one of New Zealand’s export star performers, contributing around $6 billion a year to our economy. During and ...
Applications have opened for 2021 Ngā Karahipi Uru Rākau – Forestry Scholarships, which will support more Māori and women to pursue careers in forestry science, says Forestry Minister Shane Jones. “I’m delighted Te Uru Rākau is offering Ngā Karahipi Uru Rākau – Forestry Scholarships for the third year running. These ...
The Queen’s Birthday 2020 Honours List once again highlights the dedication by many to looking after our native plants and wildlife, including incredible work to restore the populations of critically endangered birds says Minister of Conservation Eugenie Sage. Anne Richardson of Hororata has been made an Officer of the New ...
The Government will invest $10 million from the One Billion Trees Fund for large-scale planting to provide jobs in communities and improve the environment, Agriculture Minister Damien O’Connor and Forestry Minister Shane Jones have announced. New, more flexible funding criteria for applications will help up to 10 catchment groups plant ...
Organisations that support women are invited to apply to a new $1,000,000 fund as part of the Government’s COVID-19 response. “We know women, and organisations that support women, have been affected by COVID-19. This new money will ensure funding for groups that support women and women’s rights,” said Minister for ...
Healthier waterways are front and centre in a new project involving more than 300 King Country sheep, beef and dairy farmers. The Government is investing $844,000 in King Country River Care, a group that helps farmers to lift freshwater quality and farming practice, Agriculture Minister Damien O’Connor announced today. “Yesterday ...
A major funding package for libraries will allow them to play a far greater role in supporting their communities and people seeking jobs as part of the economic recovery from COVID-19. “Budget 2020 contains over $60 million of funding to protect library services and to protect jobs,” says Internal Affairs ...
A jobseekers programme for the creative sector and four new funds have been set up by the Government to help our arts and music industry recover from the blow of COVID-19. Thousands of jobs will be supported through today’s $175 million package in a crucial economic boost to support the ...
Minister for Veterans Ron Mark has welcomed the First Reading of a Bill that will make legislative changes to further improve the veterans’ support system. The Veterans’ Support Amendment Bill No 2, which will amend the Veterans’ Support Act 2014, passed First Reading today. The bill addresses a number of ...
Views sought on Order in Council to help fast track the reinstatement of the Christ Church Cathedral The Associate Minister for Greater Christchurch Regeneration, Hon Poto Williams, will be seeking public written comment, following Cabinet approving the drafting of an Order in Council aimed at fast-tracking the reinstatement of the ...
The law setting out New Zealanders’ basic civil and human rights is today one step towards being strengthened following the first reading of a Bill that requires Parliament to take action if a court says a statute undermines those rights. At present, a senior court can issue a ‘declaration of ...
Foreign Affairs Minister Winston Peters today reiterated the deep concern of the New Zealand Government following confirmation by China’s National People’s Congress of national security legislation relating to Hong Kong. “New Zealand shares the international community’s significant and long-standing stake in Hong Kong’s prosperity and stability,” Mr Peters said. “New Zealand ...
Thousands of artists and creatives at hundreds of cultural and heritage organisations have been given much-needed support to recover from the impact of COVID-19, Prime Minister and Minister for Arts, Culture and Heritage Jacinda Ardern announced today. “The cultural sector was amongst the worst hit by the global pandemic,” Jacinda ...
Key New Zealand assets will be better protected from being sold to overseas owners in a way contrary to the national interest, with the passage of the Overseas Investment (Urgent Measures) Bill. The Bill, which passed its third reading in Parliament today, also cuts unnecessary red tape to help attract ...
Setting higher health standards at swimming spots Requiring urban waterways to be cleaned up and new protections for urban streams Putting controls on higher-risk farm practices such as winter grazing and feed lots Setting stricter controls on nitrogen pollution and new bottom lines on other measures of waterway health Ensuring ...
The Government is on the verge of reaching its target of state sector boards and committees made up of at least 50 percent women, says Minister for Women Julie Anne Genter and Minister for Ethnic Communities Jenny Salesa. For the first time, the Government stocktake measures the number of Māori, ...
For all The Spinoff’s latest coverage of Covid-19 see here. Read Siouxsie Wiles’s work here. New Zealand is currently in alert level two – read The Spinoff’s giant explainer about what that means here. For official government advice, see here.The Spinoff’s coverage of the Covid-19 outbreak is made possible thanks to donations from Spinoff Members. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Kate Noble, Education Policy Fellow, Mitchell Institute, Victoria University Three quarters of a million Australian children are likely to be experiencing employment stress in the family as a result of COVID-19. This is on top of around 615,000 children whose families were ...
Spice up the classic banana muffin with a subtle touch of star anise.These muffins came about one rainy Saturday when the cupboards were bare and there was nothing much left in the fruit bowl aside from some very sad-looking bananas. Fortunately we know sad bananas result in the best kind ...
For years, Work and Income has been telling New Zealanders they couldn’t get the benefit until their redundancy payments ran out. Turns out, it was wrong.What’s all this then?Work and Income has long told New Zealanders receiving redundancy payments that they weren’t eligible for the benefit until their redundancy money ...
New Zealand writer Anna Rankin reports from Los Angeles. Last Friday afternoon, I went downtown to a protest outside the enormous Los Angeles Police Department headquarters on 1st Street. The LAPD had set up cordons, placing orange cones across streets to block traffic. Arms crossed, they stood with a wide ...
Until the sudden closure of Bauer Media in April, Simon Farrell-Green was the editor of HOME, New Zealand’s oldest architecture magazine. Here he explains what comes next.Being the editor of a major architecture magazine was the best job I ever had. I got it in 2016, after a career spent ...
A global success story or an overly generous, unsustainable scheme that is doing lasting damage to our fish stocks? Ethan Neville looks at the ongoing debate over New Zealand’s fishing quota management system. The management of our fisheries is a touchy topic – and why wouldn’t it be? New Zealanders ...
By RNZ News Thousands of people were protesting across Australia today to oppose the deaths of Indigenous people in police custody. It comes as Black Lives Matter protests are held around the world after the death of George Floyd at the hands of a white police officer in the US ...
Wrapping everyone in a blanket of love, whakapapa and mauri for Matariki is the brave, exuberant and generous fabric art of Maungarongo Te Kawa, writes Amanda Thompson.E te AtuaNau enei rau harakeke he taongaTukuna ki a matouKia tika o matou mahiKo Papatuanuku e takoto neiTuturu WhakamauaKia tina, tinaHui eTaiki e.‘Karakia ...
For all The Spinoff’s latest coverage of Covid-19 see here. Read Siouxsie Wiles’s work here. New Zealand is currently in alert level two – read The Spinoff’s giant explainer about what that means here. For official government advice, see here.The Spinoff’s coverage of the Covid-19 outbreak is made possible thanks to donations from Spinoff Members. ...
One press statement from the Beehive yesterday sounded more like advertising – or a barker’s pitch – than a Government announcement. Another advised of two diplomatic appointment, one of them – has the woman who landed the post done something wrong? – to protest-troubled and politically volatile Hong Kong. And ...
It’s not often that someone graduates from university one year and becomes a senior economist commentating on national media the next. George Driver investigates the meteoric rise of the high-flying Brad Olsen.Google “senior economist Brad Olsen” and you’ll find him quoted in no fewer than 167 articles in the past ...
As public sentiment turned against Uber Eats, a new local operation emerged promising a more ethical alternative to help New Zealand’s struggling hospitality industry. But now Eat Local NZ has suspended trading after falling out with its Australian partner Mr Yum. So what happened?A dispute between local hospitality platform Eat ...
By Budi Sutrisno in Jakarta As the death of George Floyd, an African-American man who died while being arrested in the United States, sparks a global outcry, Indonesian rights advocates and young people have stepped forward to remind fellow citizens that racism has long been an issue at home as ...
Edward Cullen became a vampire to survive the Spanish flu pandemic of 1918. Now a new Twilight novel looms and Laura Surynt, a New Zealander living in the UK, wants to live forever too. As I lay in bed this morning watching Instagram stories, Tayi Tibble told my reluctant little Capricorn ...
Over the lockdown period, thousands of people joined a Facebook group dedicated to remembering the nightlife of inner-city Auckland. Its creator Simon Grigg explains why it touched a chord in lockdown.Within a few days of The Lost Nightlife of Inner-city Auckland Facebook page accidentally going live on May 12, we ...
Throughout Anglo colonial states there is a constant habit of defining people who aren’t white as a problem, writes Aaron Smale in this personal essay. It was a balmy summer evening in the capital and cops were standing over a young brown man. I was walking down Courtenay Place on ...
"The countdown clock ticks 2, then 1, then the prime minister raises her drink": dystopia, by Ōtautahi writer Laura Borrowdale. You stand in the centre of the room, and around you, the guests seem to swirl and blend into one. There’s a mouth, gaping and red, filled with laughter. A ...
Martin Luther King Jr said in 1963: “America has given the Black people a bad cheque, a cheque which has come back marked ‘insufficient funds’." Six generations of egregious police violence later, the sentiment out of which those bad cheques were born could be shifting. In the wake of egregious police violence, ...
WATCH: In a candid interview on Sky Sport, Dame Susan Devoy talks on her concern for rising sports stars, the state of NZ squash, and the spectre of racism. Dame Susan Devoy is proudly still “a little terrier who fights for the underdog”. “I have been doing it all my life and ...
Of the huge funding boost coming for early childhood education, Playcentre has been left with just the crumbs, writes Kate Barber. Amidst all the celebration of the $430m funding boost for early childhood education (ECE) announced in this year’s budget, little attention was paid to the plight of Playcentre. The ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Vikrant Minhas, PhD candidate, University of Adelaide Although bacteria are single-celled and microscopically small, they still need energy to survive, just like us. One of the most efficient ways of acquiring energy for bacteria is through sweet, soluble carbohydrates: sugars. In fact, ...
PACIFIC PANDEMIC DIARY:By David Robie Three cartoonists had especially poignant takes on the tragic and toxic political aftermath of martyr George Floyd’s brutal killing under the knee of a white American policeman in Minneapolis last week. The Boston Globe’s Christopher Weyant featured a split frame contrasting a red-capped “Make ...
Are central bankers jealous that epidemiologists are the rock stars of the current crisis?There is talk that both the British and New Zealand central banks might institute negative interest rates as part of the policy response to the Covid shock. While Sweden’s central bank ended its five year experiment ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Monika Sarder, Senior Strategic Analyst, Monash University Algorithmic decision-making has enormous potential to do good. From identifying priority areas for first response after an earthquake hits, to identifying those at risk of COVID-19 within minutes, their application has proven hugely beneficial. But ...
LISTEN: This week's Extra Time podcast discusses racism in sport and the role of athletes and organisations in making a stand for good. Former Silver Fern and Black Fern Louisa Wall believes today's sports stars must have a social conscience and stand up against discrimination and divisiveness. Sport and politics, once ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Emma Thomas, Associate professor, Flinders University We have seen ten days of protests in the United States over the death of George Floyd. While thousands of people have gathered to express their outrage peacefully, some demonstrations have been marred by vandalism and ...
40 percent of millennials have one, and an increasing number of GenXers and Baby Boomers do too. Two Cents' Worth delves into the world of side hustles. ...
Auckland writer Caroline Barron has a terrific book out today called Ripiro Beach: A Memoir of Life After Near Death. Here, she writes about the memoirs that have been a balm, a lesson, or both. Throughout my life, I’ve sought solace between the covers of books, particularly memoirs. There, I’ve learnt ...
An exclusive interview with Steve McSteverson about his traumatic and tragic ordeal this week.Many New Zealanders are struggling with the news that a children’s book not commissioned or authorised by Jacinda Ardern was advertised in a newsletter for children’s books. This horrific attack on New Zealanders whose ears are permanently ...
Air New Zealand staff are dismayed and angered at the company’s announcement to cut a further $150 million from their wage bill. On Friday, the company’s Chief Executive Officer, Greg Foran, made the announcement to employees, who are still ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Dr. Bodean Hedwards, Lecturer, Monash University This week the leaders of India and Australia reaffirmed their mutual interest in closer diplomatic and economic ties. Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi told Australian Prime Minister Scott Morrison during their long-delayed Thursday “virtual summit”: ...
The Herald reported this morning that MediaWorks was on the verge of selling its TV assets to US TV giant Discovery – but an internal email and senior source suggest the story may have been premature.A senior MediaWorks source has emphatically denied a report in the NZ Herald that a ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Gery Karantzas, Associate professor in Social Psychology / Relationship Science, Deakin University Life in lockdown has been tough on many relationships. But negotiating the transition back to “normal” as restrictions continue to lift could also be a challenge for couples. So what ...
A slight bounce in the economy is brightening the outlook as the country heads into the winter months, Radio NZ reports. Retail spending is up and NZ shares rose on Thursday for a third day running. Key indicators have led some economists to point to a faster recovery than expected. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Geoff Hanmer, Adjunct Professor of Architecture, University of Adelaide HomeBuilder is a good idea gone bad. It is possibly the most complex and least equitable program the government could have devised to deliver construction jobs. It gives $25,000 to people who already ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Peter Keller, Professor of Cognitive Science, Western Sydney University The coronavirus pandemic has silenced the world’s concert halls and opera theatres. Organisations specialising in live performance face an existential crisis under current restrictions on social gatherings, with up to 75% of people ...
Finance Minister Grant Robertson, wearing his Sport and Recreation ministerial hat, can show he can be a big spender and draw voters’ attention to his largess each time he dispenses money from the funds under his control – or the control of an agency within his ministerial bailiwick. Yesterday he ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Pi-Shen Seet, Professor of Entrepreneurship and Innovation, Edith Cowan University Scott Morrison wants to overhaul the skills workforce to ensure a better post-COVID-19 recovery. But there may not be enough people with the necessary skills to do so. And travel restrictions, which ...
As we transition out of a Covid-focused world and prepare for what comes next, New Zealand’s ICT industry is gearing towards growth.From app development helping track the Covid-19 virus to website engineering keeping businesses in touch and online, ICT knowledge has been crucial to keeping New Zealand working over the ...
Analysis: As New Zealand eases restrictions, it no longer has international precedent to look towards and must decide on its own how to reopen the economy while reducing the risk of a second wave of infections, Marc Daalder reports While most of the country eagerly awaits a likely move to ...
Ten days is too long. That from insurance claimant advocate, Ali Jones. EQC has today made contact with homeowners via email after accidentally releasing confidential details of 8000 insurance claims on May 26. Jones says although she has not received ...
The only published and available best-selling indie book chart in New Zealand is the top 10 sales list recorded every week at Unity Books’ stores in High St, Auckland, and Willis St, Wellington.AUCKLAND1 Girl, Woman, Other by Bernadine Evaristo (Penguin Classics, $24)Winner of the 2019 Booker Prize. The other day, ...
Simon Day discovers how the voluntary carbon market allows both individuals and companies to offset their emissions at the same time as investing in native forest regeneration.When Celia Wade-Brown sold her first batch of carbon credits earned from the native forest on her Wairarapa farm, she had two customers: Z ...
Simon Day discovers how the voluntary carbon market allows both individuals and companies to offset their emissions at the same time as investing in native forest regeneration.When Celia Wade-Brown sold her first batch of carbon credits earned from the native forest on her Wairarapa farm, she had two customers: Z ...
Analysis by Keith Rankin. Keith Rankin. The conversation around the 2020 covid19 pandemic has been widely framed as ‘health versus the economy’. It has been quite political, with people leaning to the left emphasising ‘health’, and people leaning to the right emphasising ‘the economy’. A couple of weeks ago ...
Sam Brooks pays tribute to Alex Rider, and the new TV series that (finally) captures the spirit of the books.“What if James Bond was a teenager?”The concept for Anthony Horowitz’s Alex Rider series is so simple but so brilliant. There’s a reason why the franchise has managed to sustain 12 ...
Analysis - The PM resists pressure to move immediately to level 1, Winston Peters' tactics play into the hands of the Opposition and the government at last works out a commercial rent solution, writes Peter Wilson. ...
Source: Council on Hemispheric Affairs – Analysis-Reportage By COHAFrom Washington DC Federal charges against the four protectors of the Venezuelan Embassy, who defended the building in Washington DC against violent opposition crowds for several weeks between April 10 and May 16 of 2019, were completely dropped in a case that ...
Source: Council on Hemispheric Affairs – Analysis-Reportage By COHA Editorial TeamFrom Washington DC The Council on Hemispheric Affairs (COHA) joins the Black Alliance for Peace[1] and other pro-democracy organizations throughout the world in calling for the United Nations to address the systemic violations of human rights by the police and ...
Being shot by police had a profound, transformational effect on Rob Mokaraka’s life in more ways than you’d expect. A new documentary, airing on Māori TV at 7.30pm on Sunday, explores the work he’s done to heal his own mind and to ensure nobody has to go through the same ...
Human rights watchdog TAPOL has condemned the demand by Indonesian prosecutors seeking 17 and five years imprisonment for West Papuan activists Buchtar Tabuni and Irwanus Uropmabin. On June 2, the Jayapura District Prosecutor’s Office issued 33 pages containing charges against the defendant Irwanus Uropmabin. In the document, the Public Prosecutor ...
The arrival of Dan Carter is far from the first time the ever-struggling Auckland team has hoped to turn around its fortunes with a star signing, writes Jamie Wall.New Zealand rugby Twitter is a generally desolate place, especially lately given that there’s been nothing to talk about ever since the ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Robyn J. Whitaker, Senior Lecturer in New Testament, Pilgrim Theological College, University of Divinity US President Donald Trump delivered an address this week in which he threatened military action on the nation. Then he walked to the nearby St John’s Episcopal Church ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Vincent Ho, Senior Lecturer and clinical academic gastroenterologist, Western Sydney University Why do we burp? We sometimes also burp before meals, why does this happen? — Ahaana, age 7 That is a really interesting question, Ahaana! There ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Justine Bell-James, Associate Professor, TC Beirne School of Law, The University of Queensland After years of litigation, Australia’s highest court will today make a major decision on the fate of the controversial proposed expansion to the New Acland Coal mine in Queensland. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Nicholas Williams, Associate Professor in Urban Ecology and Urban Horticulture, University of Melbourne Tomorrow is the first World Green Roof Day. Cities around the world will celebrate the well-documented environmental, economic and social benefits of green roofs. New ground-level green spaces are ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Elise Klein, Senior Lecturer, Crawford School of Public Policy, Australian National University Robodebt isn’t the only measure the government should consider withdrawing. Late last Friday, after a long press conference from the prime minister which avoided any mention of the topic, the ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Richard Holden, Professor of Economics, UNSW Harvard University’s Alberto Alesina died suddenly of a heart attack on May 23. He was 63. His long-time colleague and friend Larry Summers wrote that before him, “there was no academic field of political economy. Today, ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Julian Meyrick, Professor of Creative Arts, Griffith University What keeps democracies together? As America burns, Brazilians die and Europe braces for another wave of the coronavirus, the question assumes an alarming immediacy. If the answer is complicated in one way, it is ...
For all The Spinoff’s latest coverage of Covid-19 see here. Read Siouxsie Wiles’s work here. New Zealand is currently in alert level two – read The Spinoff’s giant explainer about what that means here. For official government advice, see here.The Spinoff’s coverage of the Covid-19 outbreak is made possible thanks to donations from Spinoff Members. ...
Good morning and welcome to The Bulletin. In today’s edition: Millions of dollars divvied up by Sport NZ, MSD’s problem with wrongly denied payments grows, and internal coalition battles emerge in time for election.It’s Friday, and there hasn’t been a lot of it recently, so we’re going to start with ...
The Government picks Waitomo caves as 'strategic tourism asset' and grants $4m to Tourism Holdings, boosting shares another 7.8 percent. Facebook staff and alumni revolt over Zuckerberg's inaction on Trump ...
This week's biggest-selling New Zealand books, as recorded by the Nielsen BookScan NZ bestseller list and described by ReadingRoom literary editor Steve Braunias.NON-FICTION 1 Vegful by Nadia Lim (Nude Food, $55) 2 Stop Surviving Start Fighting by Jazz Thornton (Penguin Random House, $38) 3 So Delish! by Simone Anderson ...
Anomalies in the policy for superannuitants with overseas pensions are an indictment on the justice process in New Zealand, write Susan St John and Dr Claire Dale Along with many others, the Retirement Policy and Research Centre has worked assiduously for more than a decade to alert the public, policy-makers ...
A new study indicates native plants, despite their tendency to grow more slowly than exotic species like Pinus Radiata, are better at storing carbon in the soil for longer periods of time. ...
Open mike 11/10/2014 
Open mike is your post.
A chronological listing of news articles linked to on the Skeptical Science Facebook Page during the past week: Sun, May 31 through Sat, June 6, 2020 Editor's Choice The world must seize this opportunity to meet the climate challenge As current and former central bankers, we believe the pandemic offers ...6 hours ago
The 60 Years of New Zealand Television celebrations, such as they were, seemed to rely heavily on the classics: here we go again with Lynn of Tawa, A Week of It and the Country Calendar spoofs. Wonderful highlights of our televisual past, to be sure, but after hearing Paul Holmes’ ...22 hours ago
The Two Americas Collide: You gotta love the Americans marching for George Floyd and the fragile promises of the US Constitution. But, you also gotta keep your eye on the pale rider in the White House, and understand that behind him Hell follows.THE FRAGILITY of democracy’s promise is becoming clearer ...1 day ago
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John Roughan, fan boy for John Key, tells the media they ” can be too precious about its rights.”
Unbelievable. He is a total disgrace to the tradition of a free press.
Just the corporate’s lackey.
Sounds like he’s annoyed Hager spoke to the Guardian.
“It worries me that Hager would write this stuff for an overseas audience, not on account of New Zealand’s reputation – that’s not a journalist’s concern – but from the effect on his readers, which is a journalist’s only concern.”
You mean someone might spill the beans to the world that Planet Key isn’t perfect. Heaven forbid.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=11340635
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/sep/24/new-zealand-elections-dirty-tricks-helped-john-key-win-another-term
@ Paul
John Rough-and? could be very wise Paul. When he says he is worried at “the effect on his readers, which is a journalist’s only concern.” he may be coming from a position supportive of Labour. How?
Well he might know his readers tiny minds very well and have realised how scrambled their ideas would be by these revelations. And that they would stay glued limpet-like or rush back to the safety of National, avoiding Labour like a plague because it was causing them angst and stress. He knew they would never want to take in the whole mess and be forced to examine the very basis of their beliefs in society. They felt unsafe, National was saying it would keep them safe. QED they would vote for National and eschew Labour! And that worried him, how kind. This man is machiavellian.in his understandings.
‘You mean someone might spill the beans to the world that Planet Key isn’t perfect. Heaven forbid.’ It’s not the world that mightily concerned him, it was us voter-sheeple massed in a flock facing the all-seeing-eye dogs, all clustered on the pimple on the bottom of the world, that he was psychoanalysing.
Don’t think Roughan is actually that clever.
I wrote a comment for John suggesting that his rant might have been lifted from the works of Frank of Fiji fame. Everything is good here. Nothing to worry your pretty little heads about.
Whereas many of the Guardians readers will have heard of Greenwald and a few will be aware of Hager, I am sure none will have heard of that fearless journalist John Roughan!
green mayor of wellington (finally!) makes good on her first election campaign pledge to ‘help the homeless’ of wellington..
ed:..wade-brown slept in a sleeping bag..in a cardboard box for the night..
..oh! the humanity..!
..she is such an inspiration..
..and we are told the homeless of wellington wept with gratitude when they heard of this sacrifice/effort made by their ‘caring’ mayor..their ‘leader’..
..cont..
http://whoar.co.nz/2014/green-mayor-of-wellington-finally-makes-good-on-her-first-election-campaign-pledge-to-help-the-homeless-of-wellington/
Aside from paying lip service to the homeless as a reason to bash the greens, again, tell me what do you do, specifically, to assist street sleepers and squash poverty?
i’m not the fucken mayor..with the power to ‘do something’..
(..and especially having promised to ‘do something’..)
..you mindless/simplistic fool…
..and the labour mayor of auckland..len brown..he also made those promises when first campaigning for the job..
..since then..?
..yeah..nah..eh..?
..and it’s a rare day i agree with tau henare about anything..
..but on the panel on nat-rad he let rip at the pile of stinking bullshit that it is when pollies/luvvies ‘sleep rough’ for a nite..
..and in the process pretend to themselves they are ‘doing something’ for the homeless…
..and in the case of people like wade-brown/brown..who actually have in their hands the power to ‘do something’..
..and this is all that they do..?
..that is pretty puke-inducing..
..and a benchmark in mealy-mouthed hypocrisy..
..(and no..i am not commencing a dialogue with you..)
“i’m not the fucken mayor..with the power to ‘do something’..(..and especially having promised to ‘do something’..)”
You could donate to charity, hand out food and warm drinks or give a blanket or clothing. There’s always something can be done by the people, but all you have is the usual puism. Id the issue, slag those in the firing line, yet do nothing to help those in need.
“..you mindless/simplistic fool…”
And yet I’ve shown three ways, in the absence of government will, that you didn’t think of to help the homeless, so simplistic maybe, but mindless is way off… Quelle surprise.
“..(and no..i am not commencing a dialogue with you..)”
You’re funny in a ha ha way sometimes. Not your jokes or caption contest entries, they’re as flat as roadkill, but gems like these crack me up.
Of course you are. All I do is hit the nail on the head and you can’t help yourself.
Chat later. lulz
TA.
Well put Phillip.
One “cause celebre overnighter” with a top quality sleeping bag and a fresh clean cardbard box roughing it for one night is doing nothing for the homeless:
– unless she invited a bunch of her new cardboard box friends to shift into the spare room at her place for a few months
– unless she was being sponsored (ala World Vision 40 hour Famine) to get money to support a shelter
– unless she was announcing more $$$ for the City Mission to help meet the needs of the homeless
Its all about as dopey as Al Gore flying around the world in his private jet to tell folk bout the dangers of global warming
and..”..Its all about as dopey as..’..self-referring ‘greens’ who eat animals..?
..i went to the green party campaign launch in ak..
..and there was one (for me) sobering-moment..
..i was looking down the line of green mp’s all sitting in a row…
..and they were all wearings the skins of dead animals…
..y’know..!…these are the ‘green’/aware members of the parliamentary circus…
Would you rather they had been eaten alive?
“and..”..Its all about as dopey as..’..self-referring ‘greens’ who eat animals..?”
Why is green voters eating meat dopey?
And self referring? What’s that all about?
“..and they were all wearings the skins of dead animals…”
“…these are the ‘green’/aware members of the parliamentary circus…”
And why is it wrong for green mps to wear leather shoes and sheepskin coats?
Having green values isn’t determined by what you eat or wear on your feet. It’s way more advanced than veganism.
I’m picking your societal quirks determine your position and foster the obvious hatred for the greens.
So settle petal, it’s your problem, not theirs.
The Greens would be better focusing on the message outlined in Naomi Klein’s recent book.
http://www.theguardian.com/books/2014/sep/19/this-changes-everything-capitalism-vs-climate-naomi-klein-review
I dont think the Green manifesto is a vegan one Phillip.
Heck if it was, then they would struggle to get to 5% of the vote. Theres many meat eating, milk drinking folk out there who support the Greens sustainability goals but dont plan to give up on their leather shoes anytime soon.
But they might take the bus to the rugby if theres no easy car parking close to the stadium. 🙂
I guess they are “Greens of Convenience”
“..Theres many meat eating, milk drinking folk out there who support the Greens sustainability goals but dont plan to give up on their leather shoes anytime soon…”
..the wade-brown syndrome writ large..?
..a solar-panel and a prius ‘ll do ya..eh..?
..no need for anything else..
..the planet may be frying ‘cos of animal-farming..
..but fuck it..!
..let’s eat an animal now..!
.and do you like my new boots/jacket..?
and ‘greens of convenience’..?
..i think more careerist/opportunism..
..pretty base reasons to be there..really..
Haha, good reply Phillip, but it wont win any debates.
You should differentiate between the “ordinary folk” who recognise that being less wasteful than we were is a good thing (thats the vast majority of people) and those minority few who hold to a higher ideal so go vegan and I guess must wear hemp everythings. And moan about those who dont follow their philosophies
Somewhere in the middle is the Green Party.
Now the Vegans cant change society beyond one person at a time, but a green movement can change a country, altho in smaller steps than the vegans would like.
For the record, we only have 4 V8 cars now (and a couple of 4 cylinder cars too) , but we did install a solar heater on the last home we owned.
so its a big yes to solar power, and a big no to the Prius 🙂
I think it was a good thing that they covered their bodies for the occasion Phillip. 🙂
i’d have preferred strategically placed leaves…
Thanks for calling out Wade-Brown on her shallow self-publicity gig. One fabulously calm Wellington night with a full belly, luxury sleeping bag and, no doubt, loads of security thrown in is nothing but a joke.
As for ‘green Mayor’ label – the only thing that is green about Wade-Brown are the people who think she is. In reality, Wellington’s Mayor, like most of the Council, is bought and sold by the business chamber of commerce and a cartel of property developers.
phillip ure
Hey not so much of the sneer. It is a good and unusual example of dramatising by a leader of the too-often ignored problems out there. If you think she could have done better, could you demonstrate how to her, with your own public protest? Possibly you have a disablement. If you can’t act out, act in and write now to the paper, thank her, and then tell about the difficulties you or your group experience and include a tip how people can do to improve and help you.
i ‘sneer’ at politicians who make promises to help the poorest..
while campaigning..
..and then when elected..do nothing…
..in fact i’d do more than ‘sneer’..
..i’d curse the fuckers…
But is she doing nothing if she is sleeping out?? She has to go up against a good number at Council and in the public who would like to sweep the homeless under a carpet, and then they wouldn’t even provide a carpet. It’s getting enough of backing. making a case that the public will back so you can put pressure on, it’s all ‘political’. Which is a word that key hates, which I think means something that isn’t directly beneficiial to people who are comfortable. Why should they be made even slightly uncomfortable for the benefit of people who they consider subordinate to ‘their’, entitled, life.
This economist Amartya Sen is a Nobel Prize winner – special one for economists.
http://www.prospectmagazine.co.uk/sound-and-vision/amartya-sen-poverty-and-the-tolerance-of-the-intolerable
20/1/2014
Sen took as his title “Poverty and the Tolerance of the Intolerable”. No country in the world, he declared, is “free from poverty”, though in India, the country of his birth, where there is a “massive disparity between the privileged and the rest”, extreme deprivation is particularly deeply entrenched. India, he said, is an example of a country with a large middle class which is able to tolerate, with something approaching equanimity, the serious poverty in its midst.
(Although the situation in India is extreme—Sen referred to the “special nature of the neglect of its poor” —there is no reason for those of us elsewhere in the world, especially the developed world, to be complacent. “Blaming the victims” of poverty, he observed, is as common today as it was in the era of the Poor Law.)
How many times has the Herald told Cunliffe to resign?
Add one more time.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=11340638
Herald is so very biased, arrogant and unfair towards Cunliffe. That could alone be reason enough to support him.
10+
The Granny helping National with their Dirty Politics.
And Granny’s little helper inside the Labour Party?
@TheNationTV3
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11340711
Read that instead. It will counteract the feeling the DC resign article will give you.
then actually read this.. from Armstrong ignore his usual starting gloats go lower the later half is an attack on National coming from him.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/opinion/news/article.cfm?c_id=466&objectid=11340687
Interesting how focused some MSM journos become when they are negatively implicated.
Also very good to see them following up on the Collins-related accusations.
And Jason Ede, and John Key’s involvement in the Lusk-Slater smear machine?
.
@ karol (4.1)
First of all, we have to find Jason Ede (And Cathy Odgers)!
Something is starting to bug me about an aspect of this (and the last) election analysis.
Hager (in the Guardian link from Roughams article) repeats the received truth that those who don’t vote tend to natural left voters and that leaves an accentuated vote for the right.
Here’s my problem.
In elections where turnout is as low as 50%, left parties are winning absolute majorities under a proportional representation system embedded within an overarching neo-classical/liberal environment. (Scotland)
So, the problem cannot be as simple as stated. I’m not contesting that more people in working class areas (left voters) tend to stay at home. But the conclusion – that that necessarily (inevitably?) favours the right – simply isn’t true.
It might be true in NZ though. Because something happens in another country doesn’t mean it’s the equvialent here. There are things about the Scottish situation that have no parallel here (eg the Union and Scottish antipathy for the English). I’m assuming that during the neoliberal revolution in the UK, while Scotland was hit very hard, it didn’t have the same degree of culture shift that NZ had (Scotland had an obvious external enemy whereas NZ took a decade to realise that the enemy was within and then where could we go with that?).
At a guess, have NZ political parties done analysis on polling booths and socio economic status and voting patterns? That would tell something. That National previously liked low voter turnout means something too (although I have a feeling that this election one of the reason for increased turnout was National getting right wingers out to vote, which is part of why this election has been confusing).
Yeah, well, there is no hatred of ‘the English’. So let’s get that out of the way first.
Then there is the fact that I drew attention to similarities, which is somewhat different to claiming things are identical.
Also, I don’t quite buy your ‘external/internal’ enemy framing. Scotland voted for Tony Blair’s Labour Party in British elections.
But in 2011(?) they gave the ‘lefter than Labour’ SNP a majority in the Hollyrood elections on a turnout of approx 50%. The unchallenged contention…it’s almost an article of faith… that the level of the non-vote leads to an increased proportion of votes falling to the right (in the US, in NZ and by logical extension ‘everywhere’if proponents of that view are to be believed) dictates that the Scottish Labour Party should have done well in that election. It didn’t.
Yes and Blair’s invasion of Iraq in 2003 turned many Labour voters towards supporting the SNP and for independence.
Thatcher broke the Tories vote in Scotland and Blair severely damaged Labour’s hold on working class Scots.
I didn’t use the word hatred, nor the word identical. Perhaps you could reread my comment with that in mind and look for the intent rather than focussing on semantics.
edit: your original comment appeared to be saying that because these things are true in Scotland they might be true in NZ. I pointed out that that didn’t follow, and that some pretty significant differences might be the reason.
Weka, all I did was point to a rather obvious counter example that evidently contradicts the current ‘received wisdom’ on the matter.
Whether you prefer to defend current notions, and so accept the obvious flow on effect (ie, the nonsense that suggests either a party must win the center vote by tacking to the right [think: Shearer et al] or get the non-vote out by tacking to the left [think: many of the arguments posited on ‘ts’]) is entirely up to you.
Meanwhile, the results of Scottish elections absolutely demonstrate that tacking left, even within a broader, right leaning, neo-liberal environment does not necessarily mean losing votes to the right from those who are already intending to vote.
Further, it’s an illustrative example of a low voter turnout not having a deleterious effect on the left.
I’m not defending current notions (I have my own critiques of them), I’m challenging your basic premise that the situation in Scotland is pertinent to the situation in NZ. I get the case you are making, but unless you are willing to look at the substantive differences and how they might affect voter turnout and voter preference I can’t see where the discussion can go.
Please stop misinterpreting my comments and ascribing flow on arguments to them that are of your own thinking not mine.
If someone believes that low voter turnout favours the right, and if someone believes that to be true in any and all neo-liberal environments (and there are many people on the left currently ascribing to that view), then it follows that there will be competing views on the left as to whether the center or the non-voter should be chased, with the repercussions vis a vis policy that is inherent to both camps of thought.
On the other hand, if there is an example that could quite reasonably be held to contradict that either/or scenario… and oh fuck!…there is!
If it’s unreasonable to hold it up as an example, then those who think that are free to run through some convincing reasons as to why it should be seen as so unreasonable, by offering substantive examples of dynamics with effects that could be reasonably seen as greater than that of the prevailing ‘truth’ with regards voters/turnout and right wing advantage.
In the absence of any such convincing critique, the Shearers of the world – those who claim modern politics is necessarily all about contesting the center, and therefore about moderate ‘middle of the road’ policies – can be said to be havering on the basis that they’re ignoring really existing examples to the contrary.
The assumption that the SNP is (a) lefter then Labour and (b) drawing it’s voting support from the left of Labour is not supported by the evidence.
Show me the right wing social agenda of the SNP by way of a list of their social policies that demonstrate they are to the right of Labour. Then explain to me how their progressive tax on house sales is right wing; how their blocking of the bedroom tax is right wing; how their historical front footing over the poll tax is right wing; how their opposition to bombing isis is right wing…
Finally, understand that they are not drawing support ‘from the left of’ Labour, but that they are cleaning up Labour’s hitherto solid voting base.
One of the first thing Salmond wanted to do after independence was cut corporation tax.
The fact of the matter is that the SNP, while considerably more left-wing than they used to be, still has a Tartan Tory element to the party. And, in many ways, Salmond was from that Tartan Tory faction. He buddy up with Rupert Murdoch (and apparently Putin did much to restore Russian pride and you’ve got to admire that). He remarked once that Thatcher’s economic policies were okay for Scotland. He considered a welfare benefit cap might be a good idea. Salmond is definitely of the right of the SNP, with a lingering remain of that Tartan Toryness.
The SNP looks far more attractive as a left-wing party with Nicola in charge.
So, I’d be careful with what analogies you draw from the SNP. Because they won their majority with the leadership in the hand of the more centrist faction (Salmond), which would seem to suggest you would advise Labour to go with Shearer or Parker?
Which I don’t think is what you meant at all.
Well, at least you know or suspect that your conclusion is wrong. So is your reasoning.
Yes, the SNP threatened to cut corporation tax post independence – seen as a right wing policy that encourages a race to the bottom as states get pitted against one another to attract business HQ etc.
I guess – and I’m only guessing – that the SNP reckoned they had that balanced with other monies, so that social services wouldn’t suffer, and that they were punting that the overall $ (sic) amount from having more corporate HQs paying less tax would leave the public coffers healthier than if they kept their tax rate on a par with, or above that of England and Wales….as well as leading to greater immigration and so, economic growth…that in itself delivers a higher $ (sic) tax take. Or maybe they should have left their tax rate above that of England and Wales where it’s slated to drop to 20% from 2015?
Anyway…they commit to keeping the NHS in Scotland fully public and free. They commit to retaining free tertiary education. They commit to the retention of state provided old age care. They introduce progressive house taxation. They wanted to introduce a future fund from oil revenue. They aim to cut carbon emissions by 42% by 2020. They want rid of nuclear power and nuclear weapons…and so on and so on.
And all that when the leader is, in your opinion, a Tartan Tory who may have made some lamentable comments and indulged in some dodgy dealings. You imagine, then, what’s in store with Nicola Sturgeon as leader if your interpretation is correct?
They didn’t show up at Westminster for key votes on the bedroom tax! & their economic policy in the case of independence was basically a cross between Ireland’s low tax “Celtic Tiger” (before that went south) and the Nordic resource extraction economies – it wasn’t very “left wing”.
I’m not arguing the SNP are right wing exactly, I’m saying that if you think they are the “left” in Scotland you are very much oversimplifying.
And it’s not the case that the SNP is “cleaning up” Labour’s base. SNP does well for Holyrood, Labour for Westminister. Scottish voters are reasonably sophisticated and many seem to vote differently between Westminster & Holyrood.
I think the SNP are a component of the left in Scotland. And evidence suggests they are to the left of the Scottish and British Labour Parties.
I dunno about turning up to vote on the bedroom tax, or even if there would have been a point. But there was a point in annulling its impact, which is what they did. Andrew George’s Affordable Homes Bill made it through a second reading vote by 306 to 231, a majority of 75. And 4 of the 6 SNP members did not turn up to vote.
And it’s perfectly understandable that the same person who votes Labour in Westminster elections, votes SNP in Hollyrood elections…Scotland exerts about a 1/10th of the raw voting impact of England and Wales in UK wide elections and there is no way the SNP are taking votes from Labour in England and Wales.
But the more left parties in Scotland (greens, scottish socialist party, snp) are experiencing skyrocketing membership numbers while Labour’s membership is (by Labour’s own admission) stagnant. To put into perspective, the SNP (from a population base of about 5 million) is now the third largest party in UK terms (population base of some 55 or 60 million).
Richard, Pretty Wow from Fran.“The issue is too big to be swept under the carpet by mere politics and a focus on chasing whistleblowers instead of the real issues.”
And so say all of us!
And Richard, Mr Armstrong seems to have developed a post election dose of reality. Funny that?
Wow, the first part of Armstrong’s article is nothing less than an outright ode to how great National and King Key are.
No, it has been embarrassed at getting caught lying to NZ about how far it’s going with it’s spying on NZers.
So Armstrong is suggesting (hoping?) that Key will get away with being held accountable – again.
No they don’t. They really don’t have to be National Lite. In fact, I’d say that their being National Lite is what’s losing them the votes.
Translation: Because it was an initiative of the Māori Party it could safely be ignored by National but Key’s now feeling the pressure to do something.
And about how much National gave to the rich in their last round of tax cuts.
When is the government going to take the decline of small town and rural nz seriously. We don’t all want to live in a stinking traffic jam of a city. I’d like to know if centralization of population is the goal or if its willful blindness because there’s not many votes outside the cities.
You assume they care.
I certainly don’t I’m feely sure they don’t. Just pissed that I’ve worked hard gone with out got a free hold house buy 42 and just had 8% wiped off its value at the stroke of QV’s pen
What do you expect government to do?
Glad you voted for war, BM?
http://thedailyblog.co.nz/2014/10/11/what-have-we-done/
Well, you’ve got to do your bit.
Part of being involved in the international community, ISIS are scum and need to be exterminated,
But the US armed and trained many of the people in ISIS.
They and are probably still providing support to the parts of ISIS attacking and destabilising the Assad government. Further US actions and support for the Shia Baghdad Govt has given Sunni regions north of Baghdad political, social and tribal reasons to support ISIS.
@ colonial..
..you seem to be expecting logic/rational thought from bm…
..good luck with that..eh..?
so we need to exterminate the “muslim scum”
because they think we are “non muslim scum” that must be exterminated
and you think thats going to work out well for anybody ?
I know people who as they get older have moved because the hospital systems have been downgraded in rural towns. More work to encourge business to small town Nz.
Do people in small towns lack the ability to create work?
This may come as a shock, but there’s no such thing as the Ministry for Jobs.
Some public servant isn’t going to suddenly turn up and announce “Hey everybody, here’s a pile of jobs”.
If people want work, they’re going to have to get off their chuff and find it themselves.
Employment creates employment so when government pulls jobs out of a area the Ohura prison being a example and the slow death of rail being another it has a knock on effect in the community.
Basically, but let’s put it more directly than this. Spending into a community creates jobs. The private sector won’t spend into communities. So if the government wants to sort out unemployment in provincial communities, it must spend into them.
The corollary of this is that BM is lying through his teeth when he says Government cannot turn up and announce a pile of jobs. Government of course can, has and done so very effectively in NZ’s past.
Why should government turn up and say here’s a pile of jobs.
All that means is that the NZ taxpayer has to subsidize whatever small town which was lucky enough to hit the jobs jackpot.
Facts are most of these small towns only exist because of industry that sprouted up within that area.
Once the industry goes, the town dies, it’s a phenomenon which happens world wide.
People have to except that.
Why do we have to except it pure capitalism do’s not appear to work if we carry on down this track there will be slums in this country in my life time
Then you need to get together with the rest of the folk in whatever small town you live in and get busy.
Only you and the other town folk can turn your small town around
The government will not be riding in on a white horse to save the day.
So if government is not here to solve problems why have them.
Not in neoliberal NZ.
But in countries that don’t follow the Randian cult religion …
@waghorn
Neoliberals don’t believe in society or governments.
Their bible is Atlas Shrugged.
Their messiah John Galt.
The governments job is to keep the country as a whole running and to provide a safe a prosperous environment for the majority of it’s citizens without bankrupting the country.
Problem solving on a micro level is up to the individual/individuals, not the government.
Assuming you are a true believer in the Randian cult an these are your mantras.
There is no alternative.
No is no such thing as society.
Do you watch Fox News?
“Getting busy and getting off your chuff” doesn’t create jobs, BM. Spending into communities creates job.
BM you are still avoiding the core issue – the private sector doesn’t care about declining provincial communities. So the government must. Or as b waghorn says – why have government at all.
Why don’t you believe in the role of government in creating sustainable employment BM? Many rural communities are under serviced with public services. There are jobs which can be created right there.
BM also continues to ignore facts – government has very successfully created industry and economic activity in rural NZ before.
When you are a true believer like BM, no amount of evidence can be used.
His views are faith based.
This is utterly false, especially when thousands, tens of thousands of people are in the same societal circumstances.
It is up to government to identify the needs of its citizens and to provide services and support to each one.
Government has more than enough money to do so, and the country certainly has unused resources that it can employ to deliver this support and services.
That’s easy – can foreign investment/ownership, can the private banks creating money and have the government create and spend money into the economy. Do that and it would be impossible for the country to go bankrupt.
Of course, the banksters won’t like that as it stops them from becoming the new aristocrats.
Answer to b waghorn @8.45 am
“Employment creates employment so when government pulls jobs out of a area the Ohura prison being a example and the slow death of rail being another it has a knock on effect in the community.”
So true, Many years ago I use to call on a couple of clients in Ohura.
Use to arrive about lunchtime. have lunch in the cafe next to the supermarket call on the garage and fill the car, have a short break walk up the road and have a look in the shops etc. before driving on to Stratford.
Last Feb we had a photographic trip down that way, the first time for over 20 years. We saw one ghost town after another. Ohura there is nothing, no shops and the garage is now a second hand shop. All the little settlements have gone.
Sad really as these were vibrant communities.
Don’t take any notice of BM. He’s one of Whalespew’s fanboys and his full name is Bloody Moron. All he can do is spout slogans,
I stayed in Ohura for four months. Most of it, apart from where I stayed, seemed to be quite nice. It’s a shame that it’s died.
@ b waghorn
We are blindly following USA. I have forgotten how many large cities and ports have registered as bankrupt or similar there. It was unheard of once but no longer. It’s dismissed as just the business cycle moving on. Businesses become defunct new ones rise, it’s a cleansing, renewing process, sort of like a natural season, spring following winter. Remember Clint and Michael Moore’s film.
Using intellect, running a whole-of-country economic plan, is anathema to NACTS. Douglas still is nostalgic about his great leap forward if only all his plan could be put in place. He is not satisfied with the harm he has already caused. There were some good things but they don’t happen to have been good for most people. This is a seagull economy. All the big birds are watching for the advantage, when there’s a crust they all swoop down but the most aggressive get there first. The aggressive losers stick out their bills, and run at the others to keep their distance. And the little birds clean up the crumbs in the few seconds the others are away fighting over the crust. And when the gulls have finished they fly over your head and poop on your shoulder.
Part of the problem for places like Taumarunui were I am is that we are in a large area dominated buy farmers who vote nats know matter what. So we can be taken for granted buy them and ignored buy the rest. Small town nz has no power.
Can a group of you get together to support getting someone on the local council or the community council. Between planning giant dams and planning coastal subdivisions and mining there might be a space to fit in something human sized and helpful to the general public. And you introduce the policy. It might take a few years to get through!
Su Bradford tweeted she is on TV3’s The Nation’s panel this morning ” responding to Key, Labour i/views etc”
Good to see The Nation is using one or two truly left wing commentators.
I hope she rubs sore loser Hone’s nose in it. Bradford was never taken seriously by Mana. Her stance against the Internet/Mana hook up should have been better listened too. Unfortunately Hone was too thick.
I agreed with Bradford when the IMP was initiated.
One of her main arguments, as I recall, was that it takes time to build a party and a movement, and that IMP would interfere with the building and focus that had already gone on in/with Mana.
I hope that Bradford is way more sensible and forward thinking than attempting to, as you put it, “rub sore losers Hone’s nose in it.” I don’t see that approach as being in any way helpful.
Mana can still continue with the building and focus it has had over the last few years. NZ needs such a Mana Party.
+ 1 Karol
I am sure that Sue still has a lot of respect for Hone, and she is not the type to gloat. Mana and Hone both have a future in NZ politics I hope.
I would have liked her to show political wisdom after her years at it, and shut her gob before not after the election. Then was the time to quietly slide out if she didn’t like it but with discretion, not mouth.
maybe she will tell us why she was initially so opposed to the very idea..
..i never heard any actual reasons beyond objections to dotcom being rich..
..and having lived an extravagant lifestyle..
..and of course..her having pulled the/her crew of experienced activists from the ensuing (amateur-clusterfuck) campaign..
..was not without its’ own negative effects/outcome..on that campaign..
..i wonder if she will accept her own soupcon of responsibility for the ensuing defeat..?
..but really.i wd like to hear what were those original virulent objections based on..?
@ skinny..
..having seen bradfords’ interaction with the party..
..i can tell you that yr claim that she ‘was never taken seriously by Mana’..
..is a pile of fresh/steaming horse-shit…
As someone who once helped write one of their policy’s I say you are smoking too much bob hope!
Mana is/was a dictatorship with the leader having the final say.
Too much, or not enough, but deffo one of the two.
Except that Mana increased their party vote by 10,000 this election.
Sue making her stance so publicly didn’t help anyone. My impression of Hone is that he was one of the more intelligent MPs. You don’t have to be thick to make a mistake.
A moment of hypocrisy from Kim Hill mars an excellent interview
Radio New Zealand National, Saturday 11 October 2014
This morning, Kim Hill interviewed Karen Armstrong, an expert on world religion and author of Fields of Blood: Religion and the History of Violence. She launched the Charter for Compassion as a global peace initiative in 2009.
As usual with Kim Hill, this was a thoughtful and constructive half hour or so. There was only one jarring moment, which prompted this writer, i.e., moi, to send her the following email….
Dear Kim,
You asked Karen Armstrong whether she believed “Muslims should condemn more strongly ISIS and Al Qaeda.”
Why did you not ask her whether Christians and Jews should condemn the marauding gangs of Uzi-toting illegal settlers in the Occupied West Bank?
Yours sincerely,
Morrissey Breen
Northcote Point.
Keep listening, fellas! She might just read it out on air.
Yes, I heard that too, that is also a question that should have been asked. That question was a bit unusual for her, she doesn’t normally go with the knee-jerk journalism querys that afflict us on every level. Never mind I’m waiting for the Dave Dobbyn Don Mcglashin interview.
feel like some inspiration , or some assurance that not ALL politicians are hopeless ?
watch a REAL leader in action !
The poorest president in the world: Jose Mujica
mujica has a clear/simple logic i love..
..re cannabis:..he wanted to take crime right out of the picture..
..so he sets up a state-grown/supplied system..(with all the ongoing job-creation that involves..yoo-hoo..!..provincial new zealand..!)
..and sets the retail price at no more than $2 per gram..
..what is not to love about this man..?
..i want him to be president of the world..
Im in the middle of preparing to emigrate there
I visited in my early 20,s fell in love with the place and have gone back regularly ever since
I have bought some property , am studying Spanish with my family and am on the road to residency, Uruguay is quite open when it comes to immigration, you should look into it (especially if you are a single guy the Women are fun, friendly,open & Beautiful but VERY fiery in general !)
although you probably wouldn’t appreciate the average Uruguayans dietary habits ?
You Lucky Lucky Bastard.
One down pointcan be the prevalence of “machismo”, It takes an assertive women to deal with it sometimes, particularly in the urban areas,rural men and gauchos are usually a little more conservative.
My wife and daughters have slapped a lot men over the years, The flip side is the receivers of said slaps will almost always bow out gracefully at that point & usually with a vote of respect for the “dama de fuego” or “chica ardiente” in question !
Chica ardiente is better than chica caliente. 🙂
Or maybe not, depending on the situation.
If my health allowed, I’d retire to Brazil. Unfortunately, it doesn’t. I prefer their attitude to life to that of the NAct lovers who have ruined Aotearoa. Brazil still has a sense that it’s developing as a nation. Aotearoa seems to be undergoing a process of destruction. I imagine Uruguay would be a cross between the south of Brazil and Chile.
What he says about being poor is amazing.
“Poor are the ones who describe me so. My definition of poor is those who need to much. Because those who need too much are never satisfied.”
Inspirational.
hes a very inspirational man and one of my personal heros !
David Shearer on the Nation saying that he, Robertson, Parker &co should have a veto over the leadership prerefence of the membership.
Shearer and his bitter buddies hate hate the membership having a say.
Time for Shearer to get out of Labour.
+1
And the rest of the MPs and members who think that the members shouldn’t have a say. They should wander off and join their natural home – National.
Watching The Nation oh dear me David Shearer should take his family’s advice and not stand as leader. Listening to him brings back those painful memories when he was last leader, that frustrating feeling of willing an answer out of him.
He couldn’t help but turn venomous against Cunliffe, however for DC losing the confidence of his deputy is quite a telling blow. I believe DC needs to call it quits and allow overwhelming support for Andrew Little.
Shearer has some interesting views on outsourcing war.
Views that Donald Rumsfeld and Bush’s neocons would admire.
http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/1998/09/15/outsourcing_war
Contracting out allows more money to be made off the American taxpayer, all flowing into private hands. Clean and legal too.
I have a friend who is ex NZ military working (4 years ago) a security adviser to some American outfit in Iraq. Big money, huge danger with bounty on his head. Wars are a licence to print money something the Yanks know all about.
yes..you did say you wd be pimping for little from day one when he stood..
..so no surprises there..
..and still no answer to the question of what to do about both little and roberston being so hopeless/hapless in debate etc..?
..how key will wipe the floor with them..
..whereas key and his ministers fear cunliffe..
..they just laugh at little/robertson….
..how to factor in/explain away those facts.. into yr support for little..?
While we take notice of the goings on in the House, most kiwis don’t. It doesn’t really matter his preformance in the house, it’s the MSM who decide who governs. In saying that Little could do worst than screaming at and abusing Key during oral question time, and perhaps giving very few interviews. I believe too much footage for Gower and his bent cohorts just allows them to edit and run any bulshit angle they want.
Bit old school, but what really needs to happen in the interest of politic’s being serious and not a bloody game, is that a anti media super hero comes forward and gives one of these smart asre journalists a serious roughening up, they’ll all get the message instantly to pull their fucking heads in.
Plenty of Countries where the media wouldn’t be getting away with distorting political outcomes like this current batch of MSM are doing here.
What’s the name of that movie Charles Bronson was the lead in?
Party Party?
“..While we take notice of the goings on in the House, most kiwis don’t…”
but they do get to see the edited-clips on the six ‘o clock news..
..so it most certainly does matter…
..and then there are the televised debates..
..which in many ways help define an election..
..and can you just imagine how little wd go..?
..’urm..um..ah…ur…!’..
..it wd be embarrassing..
Quite right Phillip.
Watching Shearer and Little on TV is like watching two bumbling bureaucrats searching for deckchairs.
Backstories that involve cleaning up corpses after the mercenaries, and stiff arming workers into treacherous deals with bosses are appropriate skillsets for the Party of Capital not the Party of Labour.
One can see the dirty politics machinations going on to manage the primary to reclaim total control of the Party for the Blairite Caucus Majority.
They and the whole right wing so hate the ideas of party democracy when the bureaucracy knows perfectly well what workers need (to be more productive of profits).
Workers don’t need the primary because that’s the only thing that can rescue the sinking ship and put those who actually do the Labour in charge of the Party.
Nope, that was Parker signing his political death certificate.
I wish that they would stop commenting on each other.
I have concerns about AL as we may be getting another Shearer……………..inexperienced, an unknown quantity.
I think we should just stick with Cunliffe.
Cunliffe as leader and Little as deputy. Little’s job needs to be uniting caucus, he has abilities in this area.
yep. Fully agree.
What really annoys me about the attacks on Cunliffe from caucus members is that they never say WHY they do not like him. Darien Fenton, who I do respect for her work with unions, has made it clear that she opposed Cunliffe becoming the leader and still does. Why, Darien?
They blame Cunliffe for the the election result without saying what it was that he insisted on doing in the campaign that they did not agree with.
The reason I have gone off Grant Robertson completely is that he was willing to use the “sorry for being a man” as a reason for Cunliffe not being popular, but didn’t say that the statement had been taken out of context and used by the MSM to attack Cunliffe relentlessly. To me, that was inexcusable.
Parker has said he no longer has confidence in Cunliffe, but won’t say why. He has taken no responsibility for the unpopularity of some of the policy he promoted eg raising the age eg entitlement to superannuation.
Very good comment Karen.
Actually leads to some new and interesting questions too.
Agree with all your sentiments, Karen – the question really is, why can the Caucus not act in a professional manner and do their jobs without playing stupid games. You would think that it was a contest for Class President, not for Leader of the Labour Party. These people are all on huge money courtesy of US, the taxpayers. Why can’t they knuckle down and concentrate on the work at hand instead of sniping about who they “like” and “don’t like” personally. Everyone in the outside business world manages that, why can’t they?? Who the HELL do they think they are? Get your snouts down to work, I say! Criticising David Cunliffe and saying if he is Leader it would be very divisive, David Shearer showed us all who he really is on “The Nation” today – an unprofessional, petty and small person who holds grudges. I have never heard David Cunliffe running down colleagues in this way. For that alone, Shearer is totally unsuitable to be Leader.
my thoughts exactly. I cringed when I heard the unprofessional simpleton.
I had whole heartedly supported him when he took over from Goff. After hearing this morning’s interview, and his public statements, I am very glad he isn’t the leader of the Labour party! It is he and other anti Cunliffe caucus cabal that are dividing the Labour party and are damaging it.
At least Little was a little more smarter and statesmanlike in his interview.
“At least Little was a little more smarter and statesmanlike in his interview’
Not a lot smarter or statesmanlike, but just a little bit better than Shearer.
I completely disagreed with Little’s put down of Kim Dot Com/IMP.
Bet he would have had a different take if Hone had won in spite of all the parties that ganged up against him and had IMP won 3 or 4 MPs and were needed to prop up a Labour led coalition.
I just read littles nation interview on nbr It lacked the waffle that usually stops me from getting to the end of it he made clear points and opinions I hope he stays that way.
the fact that Little is purportedly supported by Michelle Boag should cause ALARM!
….the fact that Little has “put down … Kim Dot Com/IMP” ….puts him in the right wing camp of the Labour Party
.
@ Chooky Shark Smile (11.2.1.1.1.1)
If Cunliffe wins, he should should show no mercy/hand of compromise to the RW disloyal, caucus cabal unlike the grace he showed the last time. Put them on the back bench for at least a few months
What Boag does is up to her. She is a loyal National Supporter. Comments by people like her, may be genuine, but just as easily (as we have learnt from Dirty Politics) could be playing games. I’m quite capable of forming my own opinion, without any “help” from Ms Boag.
~~~~~~~
….the fact that Little has “put down … Kim Dot Com/IMP” ….puts him in the right wing camp of the Labour Party
Whatever that means. Could you please be more specific about how that may be a good or bad thing with regard to his vision for Labour, and the policies that he will champion?
Mr. Botany (B.)
If you don’t know what the right wing camp of Labour means, it means the side of the Labour Party which since the 1980s continues to advantage the position and interests of financial capital in the economy, the position of large transnational corporates in the economy, and the ongoing corporatisation of the state, vs that of the bottom 50% of workers and citizens.
.
@ Colonial Rawshark (11.2.1.1.1.1.1.1)
I’ve learnt in life that there are rarely people that I can not agree with on some policies, even if I disagree with them on many others. I could not stand Robert Muldoon. I thought he was obnoxious, bigoted and vile. He attacked sectional interest groups one at a time. He split the country over the Springbok tour. He was an economic nincompoop. And yet for his true interest in doing something personal about gangs, and for his decision to ignore official advice in the Arthur Thomas injustice, I admire his actions.
I’ve also learnt to distrust labels. Your basic argument against Little is
(1) Right wing Camp is bad
(2) Little is in Right Wing Camp
(3) Hey Presto. Little is bad
Your label is totally unhelpful.
So I will ask again. And emphasise the word ‘specific’ this time.
Could you please be more specific about how that may be a good or bad thing with regard to his vision for Labour, and the policies that he will champion?
Smearing Little by labelling him “right wing” is Whaleoil 101. I’m more interested in the specific policies that you disagree with, and evidence that Little supports those policies.
For f, sake, we cannot blame Little for supposed events over the last 35 years!
What the f. has Little said that will advantage the position and interests of financial capital in the economy?
What the f. has Little said that will advantage the position of large transnational corporates in the economy?
Cut the Whaleoil smears out. Put up a little evidence. With those specifics you may have a small hope of convincing somebody. There is a 50/50 chance that I may even agree with you on some or all of them.
But condescending smears that others may not know what the right wing camp of Labour means, followed by a ‘definition’ of what “right wing” is, that basically means nothing with regard to the views of Little, without evidence, deserves ridicule. Is this the sort of stuff that went on in Dunedin?
ALL of the candidates will have some very sound reasons why they would make a good leader. I’ll vote after I have heard them all. And whether they are a “North or South” candidate, I’ll be more interested in how the candidates can use internal differences of style, to the benefit of Labour, rather than see those differences as requiring amputation from an already weak body.
Mr. Botany (B.)
Labour has a strong body, but an unreliable cockus.
I m a 43 year old white blue collar worker if labour can’t appeal to people like me they have no chance. As far as kdc goes he was a light weight in a heavy weight fight ie talked a big fight but had no knockout punch.
.
@ Clemgeopin (11.2.1.1)
I completely disagreed with Little’s put down of Kim Dot Com/IMP.
Do you have a reference for that? I will probably agree with you.
I have a warm spot for both the Mana and Internet Parties. I do wish that Dotcom was not on the bench at the “Moment of Truth”, with his distracting laughs, but otherwise it was not him that sabotaged the IMP vote …. that responsibility rests with both the National and Labour parties.
That Dotcom supported the policies of Mana, should be sufficient for sufficient for all current Opposition Parties not to slag him off. He could have been a useful friend.
Mr. Botany (B.)
http://www.3news.co.nz/tvshows/thenation/interview-labour-mp-andrew-little-2014101112
@ Clemgeopin (11.2.1.1.2.1)
Thank you for the reference.
I agree with you. I also completely disagreed with Little’s put down of Internet Mana.
Mr. Botany (B.)
Glad you agree!
Shearer also got rid of Lianne Dalziel and Charles Chauvel…both supporters of Cunliffe were relegated to the back benches and then left
And look where they both are now… holding down very important positions. Shearer also relegated all Cunliffe’s supporters to the back bench. I call that petty spite.
I agree with this too, Karen. I have the feeling that David Cunliffe hasn’t “joined the club” and has a wider perspective than those of the caucus who think that the membership are out of touch. Sure, we members are not totally conversant with all the nuts and bolts of Parliament but we sure as hell know what we stand for. We are not prepared to compromise on social justice just to make our party more attractive to a few fickle voters when we have thousands of non-voters who are disengaged because they don’t see a party that inspires them to vote.
Remember it is caucus living on $150K pa plus expenses which is out of touch with the nation, not the other way around.
+100 TMM and CR
Well said, Karen. All of this stuff fills me with mistrust. While these people allegedly “don’t like” or “don’t have confidence” in Cunliffe, I feel as if both policy and utterances are being pitched over our heads to ‘more important people,’ and that the task is to try and win us over to whatever the ‘more important people’ would like, which does not include Cunliffe, or anyone else that the ‘more important people’ feel the need to screw over. The general damning of the IMP has the same tone. “No, no, it’s OK More Important People, we’re definitely not going there.” I really don’t like it, and am getting close to the end of my tether with the Labour Party.
+1
In future I think we should refer to them as MIPs. (More Important People). Or of you like… the spim.
Who shall we include? Well, the MSM of course are more important than us – especially the Beltway boys and girls. Then there are the top civil servants – people like the States Services Commissioner (Rennie is it?) They’re so important. Throw in the big corporate types who ladle out the dosh – they’re very important. And special mention must go to the Police Commissioner (and understudies) and the Security heads – oh God, they’re so much more important than us. And that’s not even starting on the off-shore Dads and Mums…
In fact when you think about it EVERYBODY is more important than us. (deep sarcasm)
Edit: phew… nice to get that off my chest.
Thanks for listing them Anne – I am never sure who they are, I just notice MP’s responding to some ‘them’ or other more than to us – in the same way as you know that a guy running down the street with a scared look on his face is running away from some scary thing, even though you don’t know exactly what scary thing.
When fury rules the day as it has done for me since I read Dirty Politics then if you can dredge up a bit of humour… it always helps.
I’m sure the above list are all Beltway Cocktail Circuit regulars (the BCCs) and when you throw in the senior diplomats from all over the place then you have a large room full of MIPs. The MPs – especially the old hands – love mixing with them. It makes them feel ever so important. 🙄
The reason why is because Cunliffe is supported by the members which means that the Labour caucus may actually have to start listening to those members rather than their buddies in the corporate world.
+1
I would love a proper explanation from the ABC MPs as to exactly what their problem with DC is. Why he is apparently so bad they have ripped the Labour Party apart and ground it into the dust just to pursue their vendetta against him.
They’ve never had any issue with trashing him publicly before, so why not just come out and tell us?
Open invitation here to Trevor Mallard, Phil Goff, Annette King, Clayton Cosgrove, Chris Hipkins, David Shearer, Jacinda Ardern and Kris Faafoi – get some balls, get out of the shadows and explain yourselves.
1000+.
I have heard whispers as to why they don’t like him (sorry guys, can’t be more specific) and frankly they seem petty to me.
.
@ankerawshark (11.6.1)
Often issues of Leadership are. Petty grievances should be the easiest a true leader could fix. If they are indeed petty, it is probably a larger black mark against Cunliffe ability to lead.
Mr. Botany (B.)
Yes there are issues that Cunliffe needs to fix up in terms of the operation and leadership of both office and caucus. But these are all FIXABLE issues in terms of skills, behaviour, leadership paradigms and getting the right people in.
This discussion thread has been excellent in terms of identifying that the Labour caucus’ beef with Cunliffe seems quite mysterious and deserves serious explanation.
.
@ Colonial Rawshark (11.6.1.1.1)
But these are all FIXABLE issues
I agree. That is what I said. Then why didn’t he?
Mr. Botany (B.)
Why didn’t he? Simple – because this was his first time at Leader and it was a bloody steep learning curve on the job. He spent months trying to sort out the Leaders Office and then he was straight into the campaign.
Why is that difficult to understand. The main point is – Cunliffe is an outstanding leader for the party – as long as he recognises what needs to be done differently now, and what he needs to do differently.
The petty things were the complaints against Cunliffe.
.
@ ankerawshark (11.6.1.1.2)
That is what I understood you to mean.
Mr. Botany (B.)
If the caucus won’t tell the true leader what the petty problems are, but tell him everything is hunky dory, they are not easy to fix. I’d also make the point that it is very hard to satisfy petty egotists whatever you do, and there is no shortage of these in the Labour caucus.
Good call.
.
@Blue (11.6)
It’s an election process now. There is no responsibility for voters to provide any reason why they choose a particular candidate. It will be the responsibility of all four (5?) candidates to convince the voters to place their vote with them.
Mr. Botany (B.)
+100 karen
I think it comes down to plain self-serving ambition and/or self preservation. As an enthusiastic supporter of Cunliffe from day one, I nevertheless am disappointed in his apparent inablility to stare them down like Helen Clark did in the 90s. I may be wrong but my impression is that Cunliffe gave in to them which is ironic given the policy planks which played a significant part in Labour’s defeat initially came from that section of caucus!
They are in such strong denial, they can’t see the role they played in destabilising Labour and allowing ‘Dirty Politics’ to do the rest.
Well said. If Cunliffe wins, he should should show no mercy/hand of compromise to the RW disloyal, caucus cabal unlike the grace he showed the last time. Put them on the back bench for at least a few months.
@ Clemgeopin (11.7.1.1)
If Cunliffe wins, he should should show no mercy/hand of compromise to the RW disloyal, caucus cabal unlike the grace he showed the last time. Put them on the back bench for at least a few months
He might look lonely on the front bench by himself?
Mr. Botany (B.)
At least a couple or three….Cosgrove and Shearer for sure.
But he will have will have two of the South Auckland MPs and N Mahota 9excuse any spelling errors with him and probably more. Not too lonely.
Cunliffe showed is compromising accomodating side and the ABCs ran over it with a truck. Does Cunliffe have what it takes to show another leadership style as it is required? He needs to if he is going to do what it takes to be the right PM in very difficult times.
.
@ Colonial Rawshark (11.7.1.1.2)
Cunliffe has every chance of convincing the voters to re-elect him Leader. To do so, he will need to convince them that he has identified all the errors that we should have known in foresight, and all the errors we now know in hindsight. And how he is going to carry on doing all the good things he did, and not do those things that are now seen in error.
Perhaps the last paragraph is too complicated. Instead of fixing it up, I’ll paraphrase. Cunliffe is redeemable. It’s up to him.
Mr. Botany (B.)
Parker should never have said that in public. Huge disloyalty.
Shearer, should shut up too.
The only one who has appeared dignified is Little.
Cunliffe should stay though as he is the best performer.
.
@ ankerawshark (11.8)
The “disloyalty” is now answered. Parker will be a candidate.
The ‘disloyal’ tag was always unfair. Any comment that could be construed as ‘disloyal’ was made after the election.
Seems to me that silencing debate (“shut up”) is the wrong approach. If there is a TRUE desire to talk through ALL the issues. This is the one chance when a full and frank exchange of views can be understood to be more about getting the right candidate, than about expectations of ‘loyalty’. It’s quite impossible to be loyal to all four candidates, when there is only one vote to give.
Mr. Botany (B.)
Mr Botany B,
I think the President of the Labour party has said no talking about the candidates during the campaign or addressing things through the media.
I am going with that. It is never helpful when Labour is open about internal divisions in public. They open themselves up to being criticized for a lack of unity.
Mr Parkers comments after the election, when he knew DC would be standing again for leader, were completely unhelpful and against what the party president requested we do. If Mr C is re-elected then Parker has ensured the Nats can be unrelenting in their cries of “Labour Caucus is divided”.
Whatever caucuses opinion is of their leader carries very little weight with me. As a paid up member, I claim the right to come to my own decision.
.
@ ankerawshark (11.8.1.1)
David Parker’s comments preceded the President’s request.
Regardless, an election by itself shows that there will be four (or 5?) possible “divisions”. The election is “unhelpful”?
We can all pretend or we can be honest.
I see all this not as major divisions, but about 4 or 5 extremely capable people all dedicated to a Party that they are willing to lead. Of course John Key will say that the “Labour Caucus is divided”, or “Labour is committing suicide, or whatever. That’s politics. What John Key says about Labour will only be just another sledge that he adds to every one of his sentences, that he is “quite relaxed about” at the end of the day.
Mr. Botany (B.)
Well said. The stupid cocky caucus should realise that it is the members of the party that put them up as candidates and helped elect/select them in the first place!
A strong front line keeps the attack at bay, (being undermined). I reckon that when Cunliffe has a loyal deputy he will GROW in confidence and he will perform to his potential.
Yep, and he needs the correct Chief of Staff. Is McCarten that guy. There are damn few signs of it.
@10.5 I mentioned Cunliffe as leader and Little as deputy; little could unite caucus. Little as deputy and McCarten as chief of staff would work very well together. This duo would be loyal to Cunliffe as leader. A weekly chat with leader to sort out the disenchanted in caucus would not go amiss.
“I reckon that when Cunliffe has a loyal deputy he will GROW in confidence and he will perform to his potential.”
Who chose his current deputy?
I think caucus choose the deputy.
ta. So the leader needs the numbers then. Interesting. Is caucus choosing a constutional issue or more a matter of habit?
Agreed Karen. And further is the constant “attacks” from the ABCs yet to date I do not know any specifics which supports that. Everyone knows yet cannot point to what. I like Trevor and do not understand how or why he would be “underming” DC or anyone else.
.@ Karen (11)
How was Cunliffe’s “Sorry for being a man” supposedly taken out of context, exactly?
I think this statement was one of the most serious examples of Cunliffe assisting National in the election campaign. I’m sure he won many votes from the statement, especially the audience he was talking to. But for every vote he won, I expect he would have lost a dozen.
I hope the Labour review of the election considers this issue seriously, to determine how much of a problem it actually was.
From a conversation from a young female voter today, from a family with strong Labour voting history. “I had no idea why I would want to vote Labour. I didn’t know what they stood for. Cunliffe was a wet rag. He couldn’t get his message across in the debates with Key. How could he possibly run the country”
What Labour needed at the time, was some serious attention being placed on promoting a vision for the Party, and providing voters with a reason why they would like to support the Party. That did not happen, which remains an indictment on both Cunliffe and his election advisors. There was more of an appearance of trawling for votes from sectional interest groups.
I kind of agree with the assessment of the debates. While comments here were largely of the opinion that Cunliffe “won” the debates, the real conclusion is more complicated. If we are talking about a debate, then the comments that Cunliffe “won” may be correct. But ‘winning a debate’ and ‘providing a message for voters to choose Labour’ are two completely different beasts. It’s like winning the battle, at the expense of losing the war.
Cunliffe was chosen, almost solely because he was seen to be the one person capable of winning the anticipated debates with the masterful John Key. Nobody else could do it. (I say almost, because there is no denying that Cunliffe is highly intelligent, and a charming person on a face to face level) But now (in hindsight) I have come to the conclusion that far too much was made of the need to ‘win’ the debates with Key. That is a media construction that does not have to be followed. I am coming around to the proposition that a Leader such as Little (and possibly Robertson) could ignore the media’s demand that the media treat the debates like a prize boxing match – and ignore the temptation to score “smart” points off John Key, and simply do what they can do best – return to the Labour vision again and again and again, – and show how key policies will meet that agenda.
I think that Cunliffe won his ‘wet rag’ tag, with comments like his “sorry’ comment. There is probably only one way that he could regain my respect …. and that is by calling for a Commission of Inquiry into the injustice that has been done to Peter Ellis. Surely something can be done about this stain on our justice system while Peter Ellis is still alive?
Mr. Botany (B.)
Mr Botany B the main problem with Mr C’s sorry about being a man is how the msm spun it……………….. the main reason why Labour lost was the unrelenting campaign of negatively and spin agaisn’t DC.
Just consider this if the media had of reverse the positive spin on Key and applied it to Cunliffe and vica a versa, who would have won the election. IMHO Cunliffe and Labour.
Boldsirbrian I agree with you so far as the debates being a media construct that do little to explain Labour’s vision. Unfortunately the media are not interested in Labour’s vision, so it is almost impossible to get MSM coverage for anything except a quick response when something controversial has happened.
Labour did fall down in its advertising campaign, but I don’t know that Cunliffe was to blame for that, and I agree with Andrew Little that there was too much policy for voters to get their heads around.
The “sorry for being a man” was taken out of context. I had a listen to the whole speech online at the time and it actually inspired me to volunteer for the Labour Party this election. At that same meeting Paula Bennet evidently played on her phone through all the speeches – why wasn’t that reported in the MSM?
That’s interesting Karen. Remember in 2008 Helen Clark was seen checking her cell phone for messages (once) while seated in an audience at some function or another?
The video was played over and over again and the meme was: she had committed a very serious offence. Dirty Politics started years ago…
I got the Paula Bennett story from Miriam Pierard’s report of the symposium which appeared on the Daily Blog. It’s worth a read.
http://thedailyblog.co.nz/2014/07/05/guest-blog-miriam-pierard-dreams-become-reality-when-we-take-action-a-response-to-the-nz-womens-refuge-symposium-and-the-attacks-on-david-cunliffe/
@ ankerawshark (11.10.1)
@ Karen (11.10.2)
I also listened to the speech.
I am struggling to work out what context could ever justify such a ludicrous apology. No use blaming this one on the MSM
Perhaps he will address the subject in his electioneering.
I’ll repeat that it is really important that Labour get on top of this one in the Labour review. There are obviously people like you Karen, who were ‘inspired’ by an unnecessary put down of men. My anecdotal experience, found that the predominant response (from men especially) was the worst reaction that a politician could receive: being mocked.
So we (You and I, Karen) are firmly in two camps. Was the comment helpful or not for Labour?. If it was unhelpful, can we blame the media as ankerawshark suggests; or would the right ‘context’ somehow make it ok? Perhaps the Labour Party have far too few women supporters, and are willing to sacrifice a proportion of an abundance of male members, for women who may be inspired?
The answer is important. Perhaps Labour already know from their internal polling. And if I am wrong in thinking that the comment was overwhelmingly more detrimental than beneficial, I’ll eat humble pie, at the same time as I hand in my membership. A Party that supports such a comment, is not one that I personally wish to remain with.
Mr. Botany (B.)
I can imagine that if gay bashing were still common, and Cunliffe said he was sorry for being hetero, Robertson would join the chorus against him. I thought the way Cunliffe said that was a bit silly, but once he had spoken, caucus should have stood behind him. All of them, even the women, repeating “I’m sorry for being a man too” and explaining what it meant would have been far better than what they did.
As for Parker, he can fuck off to ACT.
http://www.silverdoctors.com/non-official-cover-respected-german-journalist-blows-whistle-on-how-the-cia-controls-the-media/
Just a reminder – still time to plan to get there.
The 2014 Bruce Jesson Lecture
Mike Joy – Paradise Squandered; New Zealand’s Environmental Asset Stripping
Wednesday 15 October, 6.30pm
Maidment Theatre
Alfred Street
The University of Auckland
The Maidment Bar will open from 5.30pm
New Zealand’s lakes, rivers and most of our groundwater are in a critical state. Decades of misguided regulation and a free-for-all on diffuse pollution have encouraged agricultural intensification and driven our increasing reliance on imported feed and fertiliser.
The inevitable consequences have been devastating environmental impacts as well as increasing economic and biosecurity risks.
The solutions are many but require a paradigm shift; a move away from dependence on imported feed and fertiliser to keeping nutrients on farm and adding value to products, and strong leadership to move away from short-term thinking that accepts the massive ecological debt we are running up.
Mike Joy MSc(Hons), PhD in Ecology is a Senior Lecturer in Ecology and Environmental Science at the Ecology Group-Institute of Agriculture and Environment, Massey University, Palmerston North. He has received a number of awards, including the Ecology in Action award from the New Zealand Ecological Society; an Old Blue award from the Royal Forest and Bird protection Society; Environmental New Zealander of the Year from North and South magazine and the Manawatu Evening Standard Person of the Year.
Presented by Politics and International Relations and the Bruce Jesson Foundation
Key starts the drumbeat for war.
I did not vote for this government.
Hope the 47% are relaxed about this.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11340983
Euthanasia – the right to die with dignity. Will we people ever get these political nitwits who supposedly are the cream of the crop to represent our opinions and needs in parliament and have them facilitated? We need them there to actually listen and devise strategies so that we maintain the standards we aspire to for human beings, but have more control of our own lives. While we have a bunch of sharp dealers, money mad and aspirational for their own comfort, the chances are against thoughtful and well-planned policy being passed. But I could be wrong eh!
http://www.3news.co.nz/tvshows/campbelllive/cancer-patient-chooses-death-on-own-terms-2014100920
In the USA. Last night, a story from the United States captured the attention of millions last night on Facebook.
The video of American woman Brittany Maynard has been watched by more than a million people – she has chosen the day she will die.
Ms Maynard has a terminal illness, but rather than spend her last months suffering, she’s moved her family to Oregon, one of just five US states that allows terminal patients to choose euthanasia.
She has chosen November 1 – two days after her husband’s birthday.
In Australia one of the states had police raiding people’s houses looking for the good drug that people had obtained and put aside ready for when they decide to pass away after they have done everything, got organised and feel content to accept death. But no this personal moment must be degraded by venal politicians, interfering medicos, religious dictators, and acts of aggression by the state. Disappointing, disgraceful.
We put of pets down when we know they are in pain and it’s the right thing to do. But rather our loved one suffer in pain. I put it down to the high religious influence in NZ.
@ Skinny
I think it’s a following of rote spiritual and ethical learning without much intellectual thought. And not wishing to face the reality of a situation, and being resigned about things. People say oh well, that’s how it is, at the end of the day we can’t help it happening, it’s nature isn’t it and other anodyne phrases.
(And here are some synonyms that I think also apply to a large number of NZs. –
bland, inoffensive, innocuous, neutral, unobjectionable, unexceptionable, unremarkable, commonplace, dull, tedious, run-of-the-mill.)
They are good people for sure, but rarely spark enough to think and act to make changes, or get something radically different. Lack of that spark makes us easy to push around, and accepting of everything, and we sure don’t like any offering of criticism or advice.)
“They are good people for sure……..” (agreed) – good, lazy, laid back, complacent, anodyne (as you say – good word), disinterested, disengaged.
A big societal change, which isn’t surprising after 30 years of neoliberalism.
We like to think of ourselves as compassionate, caring, concerned, etc., however I’ve begun to question that. We are when it comes to all being in the same waka (such as at times of natural disasters), or when shit hitting a fan becomes widespread.
Otherwise I’ve come to realise we’re actually no more compassionate or engaged, or concerned for the welfare of others, or community than many places elsewhere. (If we were, there’d have been a bigger turnout on election day).
Can you imagine (for example), most of the population of a small/average town/village volunteering at polio clinics, taking in homeless, feeding the homeless here in NZ? I can’t! At one time I could have.
It’s a self-congratulatory, but a completely fukd idea of the reality. It’s not surprising though when a good many of the aging boomers have reached their comfort zone and naturally want to preserve it, and when subsequent generations have grown up knowing, AND EXPERIENCING nothing other than the rise of individualism, greed is good, the commodification of all and everything.
Given the Koiwoi laid beck ettitude, its the easy option – that is until it all turns to shit. (Fear not though – we have an oikon to lead us all thru’ it by the name of Yavridge Bloke Honist John).
This is not the NZ I knew – and strangely enough its not even the NZ my 30ish yo kids knew – and its becoming a NZ I no longer want to know.
That sounds a bit defeatist – it’s not. I just don’t particularly want to be around when that muddle class awaken (and as someone elsewhere in here noted re the Muldoon era where you couldn;t find anyone that admitted voting for the prick).
The more this neo-liberal, selfish, greed-driven, no-such-thing-as-sussoighty, self perpetuating – but also – self-defeating nightmare goes on, the nastier the outcome is likely to be.
And it’s not just sleepy fucking Hobbits that need to wake up, but the NZ Labour Party as well
:h1
/endrave
:h2
/back to planning escape
:h3
/reminder to send a sympathy card to NZ Labour when they don’t get their shit together
Still are Tim
Good to hear you are still hanging on there. It’s amazing how 30 years can wipe out so much good principle and belief about what the spirit of our country was. And its hard to realise that though some of it was impatience with ferry workers and others going on too many strikes, and some ingrained efficiencies that needed checking, a lot of it was just snobbery as seen in the rude words about guys going to work in cardigans their wives had knitted etc. We were relatively self suffficient then and appreciated quality, and hand knitted wool. Now it is appearance imported polyester jackets. We like the look of the beautiful Easter egg, covered with foil but empty inside.
And we still have Labour losing the election because they are too stolid to find their way round a corner. A boot in the bum is what they needed. Strategic standing using MMP tactics as National does. Not quite in the spirit but still not outlandish except from Labour’s imagination. Why not call in some Standardistas as a focus group? There is always pollitics stew simmering here. Something hot and tasty would have been served up for their consideration.
And now David Parker is presenting the same stolid face that Michael Cullen presented. If Michael had worked out some fancy tax cuts that would have ended up increasing the velocity of money through the economy, and a few extra jobs, and a bit over for Christmas, probably Labour wouldn’t have lost but for his chewing gum called tax deduction. Labour haven’t come out of the last century. And we are already 14 years into the next. WTF.
In a country where we are still riding on Ernest Rutherford’s doings, while cutting down science funding here in favour of giving money to rich people buying things overseas and houses here as the great leap forward, it makes me puke. Do I want to live in such a dumb place. That thinks it is business minded, but can only do a couple of things that were going when we first were colonised, the rest has gone out of our hands to be exploited by cleverer people than us in the main. And the country is losing its soul.
It’s one of the amusing aspects of reading some of the novels that I’ve read where the author goes on about how these fabulous wealthy people with great style all have hand crafted this and polished that. And I recall a few years ago when an upper market car firm had the technicians signing the hand crafted parts of the motors that they made. I kept thinking but the machine made stuff is actually better and then I realised that it was a statement that basically translates to: I’m so rich I can waste peoples time and effort without concern.
DTB
Ever looked through Paul Fussells’s book on Class in the USA? Quite funny how the different classes regard anything from the culture of that income and asperashuns.
Actually signing stuff you made would be good. I wear all this cheap clothing produced by hard working driven people, mostly women from overseas. And sometimes I think about them sitting in lines at their machines. And I think there were exposes one called China Blue? But they have great skills and I try to mentally appeciate those when I remember. Applies to a lot of the things we get these days, when all physical labour is passe’. Even managing money has been mechanised, with computers set to buy and sell when certain monetary points are reached.
And something just recently has been produced that takes away jobs in favour of mechanisation. Those of us who still respect humanity and care about our society have to group together.
WH Auden –
We must love one another or die”
and Benjamin Franklin
“We must indeed all hang together, or most assuredly we shall all hang separately.”
“We put of pets down when we know they are in pain and it’s the right thing to do. But rather our loved one suffer in pain. I put it down to the high religious influence in NZ.”
AFAIK most people support euthanasia in principle so I think the hold up in legislation is more likely to be that we haven’t yet solved the issues around coersion and the overlap with suicide. ie it’s ethics that are holding us up. Not insurmountable but not insignificant either.
Do you think the ethics haven’t been talked about? The work is too hard that’s the trouble. It takes time away from giving largesse to the wealthy (friends) or dealing criminals who can’t be let off and have to be punished somehow (enemies) and the business of dealing with the broad mass of people is approached reluctantly.
All the problems could be solved by going into select committee, asking for input from regions open to interested people, not just the ossified. Then listening to limited time submissions where they have to stick to facts, not gerrymander on their opinions and beliefs.
Of course ethics have been talked about, but not across the population publicly. We probably need a dedicated period of time of taking the issue to the public, lots of media attention, time for an in depth look, talking to a range of people, medical, ethical, care givers, patients, families etc. By issue, I mean the legislation and the practicalities. That would need a political party to spearhead it – can’t see that being done at the moment, so that leaves lobbying until it gains momentum.
Myself, I wouldn’t be comfortable with this being handed over to a select committee process without the above happening, esp with the current govt.
If you want parties to support it, you have to get the population on board too. I think most people support euthanasia in principle, but haven’t yet been presented with the details of how it would work in practice.
True. The public never get a chance to get their teeth, so to speak, into the various concerns. When it is discussed there will be someone from the hospice service that rubbishes it, someone from religion who doesn’t countenance it, someone who has had an experience of need who supports it and the whole matter is left floating.
In general the public need to have the chance to discuss legislation, a group in each town who sort of monitors what’s going on, is informed and thoughtful, necessarily of course. And particularly with important matters like this. Also with some of the practices being adopted for prisoners, that go against the better standards of human behaviour that we have espoused in modern times.
The last thing I listened to (a while ago) was a hospice nurse who basically said that everyone with a terminal illness can have a good death experience with the right support. Vested interests I guess (as in she believes in her profession, but I suspect there were religious believes too).
I haven’t gone looking, but I’ve not seen good discussion about the practicalities of protecting vulnerable people. To my mind that’s going to be the stumbling block and is the thing that needs to get into the public for dicussion. Once that’s resolved many people’s hesitations will go away.
Re religion, where the mainstream ones stand on this? I assume the Catholics are against it, what about the Anglicans and Presbyterians? The Buddhists would be great to have involved, all that preparing for how one dies.
Does no one else see this as an act of extreme betrayal to our individual sovereignty.
Even in our last act we plead the permission of someone else.
Euthanasia seems an entirely appropriate course of action but fuck asking for permission…
andrew murray 3.55 pm
You are underestimating the human complexities involved in dying. If it was to be just as quick and straightforward as you think it ought to be, there would be a lot more suicide jumping off cliffs into the sea. But that creates problems, concerns, what if you don’t die straight away and endure agony for ages, not really the imagined end. And then people’s lives may be put at risk while they search for you, because it’s not tidy for a country to have people going off and dying in unknown places, even if they never cared two hoots about you while alive.
Then there are the people around, in the area, very sad to have people committing suicide near your place. If you die on your own, who finds you, who buries you, who ties up the ends of your life? So there are the people who want to know where the body is, the people who actually grieve, the people who want to inherit but can’t until the body is found or seven years gone, or can’t claim a widow’s, single benefit etc. Your bones and bits will be gathered up and given a cremation probably, who pays for that – the people. And some sort of marker for your remains to give respect to your being. And an entry to be put in the records that you came, you saw, and you conked out!
Suicide can be an incredibly selfish thoughtless thing to do. If children are left, what a burden to bear. Why, and do they blame the other parent and so on. If choosing euthanasia, there is often some plan, others would be involved. We aren’t islands, the last person in our world. There are things to be thought about, things that you should do before you leave the world that has nurtured you, even if to one’s mind not well. What is needed is a planned procedure, not an exhaustive one, but so the person can go with a clear path, satisfied to have finished and be done. And perhaps with a resigned and loving smile and kiss. Then it would be a good death to have.
edited
I believe Andrew Little’s candidacy will derail David Cunliffe’s attempt to stay as leader. Eventually, DC will have to withdraw, which will make easier for Grant Robertson to win.
The next few weeks should be watched with interest by the membership.
You don’t understand preferential voting do you?
+1 draco. cunliffe will not withdraw.
He could, if in doing so he can establish a better position for himself after the vote is all said and done.
When it was DC vs GR, I was expecting a close race, and honestly had no idea who would win.
But now the AL has entered, I think DC is going to come third and AL will ultimately win out.
I had no idea DP had also entered the race; so have no idea who will win now. I’d be happy with anyone but GR.
CP In your opening sentence did you mean to write “I hope” rather than “I believe” ? Nice try.(not)
Lamia retweeted
Andy Milne @AndyBMilne 14 mins14 minutes ago
Depressing stat of the day: 43% of homes sold in Chch bought by investors. http://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/business/your-property/10604802/Investors-snatch-up-citys-homes
The raptor rebellion has begun.
http://io9.com/watch-as-a-hawk-knocks-a-drone-out-of-the-sky-1644813211
ha ha, awesome! Would love to know how big the drones are.
From the owners blog, via his youtube account, this is the quadrocopter he was flying.
edit: from his flickr account
ok, so nearly half a metre at its widest point, so just about as big as NZ hawk.
Pre-flight handling gives some scale.
“Labour’s David Shearer says being leader of the opposition may be the worst job he’s ever had,”
http://www.3news.co.nz/nznews/david-shearer-considers-standing-for-labour-leadership-2014101111#ixzz3FnazmKX0
Coincidence: He was the worst leader the labour party ever had.
Next time at the supermarket, pick up a couple of kippers, cause snapper you aint.
Sounded to me like he just announced his resignation from caucus will probably be forthcoming post-leadership contest. (Unless he or Parker are leader that is)
Anyone around here still want to say that Shearer is an honest, compassionate, wise and intelligent man who went into politics in order to serve unselfishly for the benefit of others less fortunate than himself, after watching that?
As opposed to…….
No, undermining DC in public on National TV is.
Same goes to DP and Cosgrove.
These idiot senior MPs should know better.
Labour is in the shape that it is precisely because Labour’s front bench doesn’t know better. Labour’s caucus has a shockingly dysfunctional and toxic organisational culture.
Hmm…
.
Terrorism can never be defeated by military means alone. But how do you go about negotiating with people who have blood on their hands? Britain’s chief broker of the Northern Ireland peace deal explains how it can – and must – be done (for a start, always shake hands)
[…]
Above all, what these experiences demonstrate is that there isn’t really an alternative to talking to the terrorists if you want the conflict to end. Hugh Orde, the former chief constable in Northern Ireland, rightly says, “There is no example that I know of, of terrorism being policed out” – or fully defeated by physical force – anywhere in the world. Petraeus said that it was clear in Iraq that “we would not be able to kill or capture our way out of the industrial-strength insurgency that was tearing apart the very fabric of Iraqi society”. If you can’t kill them all, then sooner or later you come back to the same point, and it is a question of when, not whether, you talk. If there is a political cause then there has to be a political solution.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/oct/07/-sp-how-to-talk-to-terrorists-isis-al-qaida?
( The author is former diplomat and Blair adviser Jonathan Powell )
defeating terrorism and insurgencies is thousand year old knowledge. It starts with not screwing over the ordinary people who are their support base, and bringing that support base closer to you, to push for a more moderate approach.
Unless it turns out that the terrorism and insurgency is politically useful to you for other reasons of course. In that case, you would just fuel it by killing tribal families and civilians on a daily basis to grow the hate of the ordinary people against your forces, and drive up recruitment and sympathy for terrorist/insurgency forces.
What has the west been doing again?
One problem is that so many in the military believe that they can win. They just need to apply a little more force. Vietnam, Northern Ireland, and Gaza are all examples of this. They remind me of ACT idiots who blame the GCP on lack of doctrinal purity.
the Pentagon Papers showed that the US military knew that it couldn’t win in Vietnam. Didn’t stop it pretending otherwise though.
I would like each of the candidates for the LP leadership to answer the following questions. Please feel free to improve the quality of the questions and add some more.
1. What if anything, in your opinion, was wrong about the direction of Labour policies in the last election?
2. What changes would you personally like to see in the general direction of Labour policy?
3. If you are voted in as leader and the membership and the caucus insists the party should move in the opposite direction to that which you support, how will you cope with this?
4. If you are not voted in as leader and the agreed party policy moves in the opposite direction to your wishes, then are you able to unreservedly support the party line and its leader?
5. Who do you believe should determine the direction of the party- the leader (together with caucus) or the total membership?
6. What are your views on the way in which the TPPA and the deep sea drilling issues should be handled?
7. What are your views on the way controversial policies such as the increase in the age of eligibility of superannuation should be handled?
8. It is obvious that Labour would need to form a coalition to be in Government. Using the hindsight of the recent election, how do you think the pre-election relationships between possible coalition partners be optimised to present a stable alternative to the voting public.
good questions, and they should certainly be asked, but overall, policy did not win or lose Labour the election. Being a poor cultural fit with Kiwis and being socially disconnected from the vast majority of Kiwi voters, is what nailed Labour.
(having said that the BS retirement age policy and the badly executed CGT policy messaging were definitely hindrances).
Just since that Parker has thrown his hat in the ring…………..holy moly…………4 candidates.
The vote will be heavily diluted.
IMHO anyone who has criticised DC in public should be out. Not matter how “bad” he is, they should have stfu.
I am thinking of emailing Moira Coastworth to ask what disciplinary action will be taken by the party after D S on the Nation this morning. We were told to shut up about the candidates.
The vote will be heavily diluted.
It’s. A. Preferential. Vote.
For those playing at home: https://twitter.com/stephanierodgrs/status/518529618047795200
We were told to shut up about the candidates.
Who are “We”?
Told by who?
Is there an email that I have overlooked in my mailbox? Or there is something on the internet – link?
There was an email from Moira Coatsworth. I may have done her/it a dis-service by saying “shut up”.
I can’t remember the exact words, but how I interpreted it was that we shouldn’t bag the candidates and that we are not to express negativity through the media about the candidates.
Sorry if I have mis-lead.
Oh, that one. That email was even-handed and fine. I didn’t sense anything calling for people to shut-up. It was more of a ‘being mindful’ kind of tone.
Having said that, it is quite interesting to think this through:
(1) Did Parker read that email before or after Moira’s email?
(2) In accordance with good sense and common decency, did Parker cross the line in terms of the letter or even spirit of that statesman(person)ship-like email from Moira?
(3) With regard to the answer in response to (2), whether in the affirmative or negative, such an answer would set the precedence for other caucus or party members to be judged accordingly.
(4) If the answer to (2) is no, then that means it would be quite ok for people to call out, as Parker did, as to who be regarded as “untenable” to be leader.
(5) If the answer to (2) is yes, when will Parker be disciplined?
(6) ……. any more to add … go ahead, readers ….
I think the email from Moira was good. No problem with that.
It said that the comments should not be denigrating or disrespectful…..
So the question is, is saying you have “no confidence” in one of the candidates denigrating or disrespectful?
It is pretty damming of DC.
Does the interim leader set the precedence? Surely all the members, including caucus need to take responsibility for their own actions.
Personally, I do hope that after a fair contest Grant Robertson wins.
i wd like to formally announce my candidacy for the leadership of the labour party…
Screw it me too. why not.
Didn’t know you were a member Phil! (can’t do the smiley face, but consider a smiley face done!)
i thought i’d join tomorrow..
..face it..i’m a better public speaker than at least three of them..
..i’m better looking than all of them..
..and i have a brace of progressive policy-ideas..
..that will have that missing million clamouring to get into the polling-booth..
..i’ll betcha the other candidates have none of that on offer..
I don’t think the missing million are radical vegan lefties so you’ll have moderate yourself heavily if you are going to win them over.
@ wag..
..can do..
..the policies will do that..
Martin McKee article in the BMJ – social media attacks on public health
Stuff has a poll about who you would prefer as the next Labour leader. I think this poll is a bit stupid and the results are highly suspect as it is an open poll for everyone, including Labour’s and Cunliffe’s enemies!
The actual Labour leadership contest that is rightfully open to the Labour members, not to the general public and Labour’s opponents.
For instance, for National, I would ‘prefer’ Aaron Gilmore as their leader…(or may be Maurice W or Judith C or Bhakshi K or….)
Here is the stuff poll:
http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/
Clem @ 27 the DB poll is likely more accurate. DC initially out ahead. Now AL slightly ahead with GR trailing a long way behind………….
The money to help the stricken nations trying to deal with Ebola isn’t rolling in fast enough! And a warning is given that if the pandemic gets out of hand it will badly affect the world’s economy!!
An item on a link – sounds a downer. Our gummint says we need more uni money going into science so we Can GetAhead as a country,.
In USA they in one area have increased grad places from 30,000 to 56,000 but at the same time the projects funded have gone from 30% to 10% or something and a lot of scientists are having to do basic work that PhD should not be doing. They have the credentials, they have the ability but can’t get the work. Crazy old capitalism. Screws you every time. That’s very roughly the gist. Get the real facts from the link.
http://io9.com/meet-the-new-underclass-people-with-ph-d-s-in-science-1644006710
It does. The people who produce stuff and actually keep society functioning get screwed over while the people who speculate with money or get interest and dividends from holding money/shares do ever better. The result will be the collapse of society and it appears that’s what most of us want as we vote for the political parties (National, Act, etc) that will bring about that collapse.
I am very lucky to have a permanent position. I wouldn’t advise anyone to aim for a career in science at the moment. You work your guts out to learn about things, gain unique abilities and then have to put up with disrespect from both smarmy gits like Key and conspiracy freaks who get their pseudoscience off youtube. You only get a permanent position if you’re very lucky, and you end up with a huge student loan to pay off.
DTB and Murrayrawshark
That’s how it is eh! So we can’t keep going hoping for better days. This is the end of the Rogernomics trial. And it’s been a failure. We have known for a while but have looked away quickly at NZ lying injured, and passed on our way. Now we have to turn into Good Samaritans and pick up the country, dress the wounds, get it some crutches, and help it move again.
The bible has some good, relevant stories in it, apart from tribes warring and calvinist threats of doom, and skewed ideas retreating as far as you can go from Christianity.
And I don’t go to church regularly now, but might go to Bahai or Quaker. Very sincere.
I can’t stand being preached at now, knowing that the original message and thought has been written down, passed on by some other human, partly digested and brought forward again to the faithful, in altered form. Chinese whispers is like the stuff being preached, the further from the source, the more likely that some dictate or fillip has been added.
The good thing about the underclass with PhDs is that they can do more than use their cell phones to crowd source the revolution.
It is with heartfelt sadness that my family have heard of the death of Labour Party stalwart Paul Jellicich /Paul was famous for the Labour Picnics he organized and his Lamb spits were famous .
Our thoughts are with his wife Dorothy ,My wife and I have fond memories of you both and are just glad that we enjoyed dinner together just a few weeks ago.
Our love and thoughts are with you Dorothy .