The Bill of Rights is not a set of absolutes. Context is still important – for example we had no problem with the NZ government effectively preventing me from associating with my frail and elderly father for over 2 years during the COVID crisis.
Nor do I imagine that criminal entities like the Mongrel Mob that actively repudiate the law enjoy quite the same protection under the Bill of Rights as say a political party or a union.
For an example of the way an association is banned overseas, you could look at the neo-Nazi groups in Germany. Where any and all associated symbolism is illegal to buy, sell or possess, and groups are legally not allowed to form.
It doesn't work in preventing the groups forming (haters will always hate), but it does give the police effective powers to raid and shut down groups: e.g.
These are political groupings (albeit, unsavoury ones to the majority of us), rather than criminal ones (by that I mean that they aren't engaged in full-scale drug dealing and associated criminal activity) – but the mechanism of suppression would be the same.
It doesn’t work in preventing the groups forming (haters will always hate), but it does give the police effective powers to raid and shut down groups:
Basically it doesn’t work in Germany (as you point out yourself). It won’t work here.
I’d bet that you can’t find a case where suppression of that kind has ever worked anywhere at any time over a timescale of a few generations. All it does is to push groups underground and typically makes it larger and longer lived. It is roughly the equivalent of putting makeup over a cyst to hide it…
I think that it's arguable that it doesn't work in Germany. It certainly doesn't work 100% – and nothing (apart from North Korean style social suppression) would or could.
I do believe that it has a suppressant effect, and a social stigma effect (people in general in Germany really, really dislike Nazi symbolism and disapprove of the people who choose to associate themselves with it).
Given that National have yet to release any details about how this would potentially work in the NZ legislative context; combined with the current resistance from Courts to impose serious sentences for actual crime (as opposed to a theoretical 'consorting with' crimes) – I don't believe that it's likely to be an effective policy in tackling gang crime in NZ.
But, it sure has popular appeal with a large swathe of the population who (rightly or wrongly) are feeling highly unsafe in the current gang warfare environment.
Please note, many of these are Labour supporters – or centrists who voted for Ardern in 2020. We're not talking about right-wing gun nuts – but ordinary people who are concerned that the next 'random' shooting is going to hit their house, car or kids; or ordinary small business owners who are getting to the point where their business is uninsurable because of the risk of ram raids.
In my own Auckland electorate, there have been two drive-by shootings, and 4 ram-raids on shops in the local (small) shopping centre 5 minutes walk from me. You bet that I'm not feeling anything like as safe as I did 3 years ago. I try not to do knee-jerk reactions – but I really do understand the visceral fear that some families are experiencing.
All you need to do is get the Attorney-General to state that, as David Parker has done in this link, "I have concluded that any limitation they pose on rights are reasonably justifiable under s 5 of the Bill of Rights Act.".
Hard times call for hard measures, Iprent. If Labour and successive governments had really gotten heads around L&O we wouldn't be in this situation.
Legal niceties aside, how will it be policed? We'd need a quasi citizens group with limited legal powers given present police numbers? National are just tinkering.
Why not just brand them domestic terrorists and move from there? Probably because it would cause too much pain in certain sections of society.
The man himself and the exceptions to Nationals tinkering and proposed gang legislation.
Why not just brand them domestic terrorists and move from there? Probably because it would cause too much pain in certain sections of society.
You haven’t read the NZBORA? It is really short and clear. Declaring them to be domestic terrorists makes very little differences to anyone’s rights within our legal system. It doesn’t give anyone an ability to trample over freedoms to association.
After all any such law wouldn’t be hard to take an reapply it to the domestic terrorism (as I see it) of Groundswell, or NZ Initiative.
Besides, I fail to see why this has the National party piddling in their bloomers. The police have dealt with exactly this kind of issue multiple times in the past. We still have various types of gangs, drug cartels, picket lines, rampant criminal capitalism, rebellious youth, synthetic drugs etc etc.
Society and the police deal with them over and over again despite the idiotic chicken-littles and their pathetic posturing.
The National party dickhead laws passed on each of those occasions that have done exactly nothing.
What works is to just deal with the problem using the usual processes with some time and patience. It isn’t like any of this is a new problem.
Legal niceties aside… We’d need a quasi citizens group with limited legal powers given present police numbers?
I’d be happy to demonstrate to any such body why they shouldn’t exist. I have a large set of resistance strategies for dealing with socially retarded wannabe brown-shirts that I have spent decades wanting to test. I have restrained myself from doing so – because of those legal niceties. Remove the legal niceties, and I’ll be happy to demonstrate why the legal niceties are something that is pretty essential to maintain.
I’m not exactly a pacifist. To learn some of the required techniques was among the three reasons that I joined the army in my youth. While I’m probably getting to be a bit old to be really active, I’m sure that I can help out any resistance with ideas and techniques.
Tighhtly framed laws like the RICO type seem to have some success in the US. There are serious predicate offences including 'Terrorism'. This makes me wonder if our terrorist laws could be used.
Looking at the success that joint ops – Customs, overseas justice & policing agencies and our own police seem to have against the importation of drugs does make me wonder if there is a key need for a tweak to our domestic laws. Perhaps going down the RICO way with investigations of criminal enterprises rather than individual crime might be a way. I am sure that many of these gangs would have little trouble in in fulfilling the predicate crime requirements.
Though the going after gangs has elements of a moral panic.
While we just cannot have drive-by shootings because of the risk to innocent people, when it comes to crime and impact on the wealth and welfare of the country the diversion away and starving of our tax system by various means has more impact on a Govt's ability to fund its programmes. Tax evasion. Some of these programmes may be ones that would nip in the bud, the conditions leading to gangs being seen as attractive.
I don't think so. National's argument is 'freedom' as in 'not compelled to'.
No one is compelled to belong to a gang (or any other social or political group). It's a choice you make. Even if you choose to belong, no one is compelled to wear affiliation patches, etc. – you can choose to *not* wear them. Choices have consequences.
Not at all the same argument.
In the oooold days public servants who actually interacted with the public (lots didn't, purely backroom boys and girls), were forbidden to wear any affiliation pins, jewellery, etc.) IIRC, this was originally instituted to stop the wearing of Masonic emblems (but am open to correction, here)
The reasoning was that the Public Service should be absolutely politically and socially neutral. It fell over in the 70s/80s, when employees wanted to 'express their solidarity' with various political causes – rainbow pins, anti-nuclear badges, pride emblems, etc.). I still feel it's wrong. Neutrality is an important principle.
So, there is some social history on the side of stopping people wearing insignia in public spaces.
Mitchell spokesman on National Law and Order is challenged by Jack to explain the detail of the Gang "solution." What a crash! Mitchell is a superficial empty vessel.
Yes! Presented with evidence that the Western Australian laws were not all that effective by Jack Tame, and upon which the Natz had based their ridiculous fear-mongering, he couldn't answer, so just ignored it.
A train wreck of an interview – though I suspect the Natz were sensible to send Mercenary Mitchell rather than Luxon – he'd have been a complete disaster!
The new pop-up circuit is run by Saudi Arabia’s PIF as part of Vision 2030, the cultural project that is also a way of buying influence, outreach and soft power: art, music, sport, a football club.
[…]
So we watched as one by one players at the Centurion Club pretended to have sound reasons for joining the breakaway, and then just gave up and effectively said it was for the money. Phil Mickelson looked notably baffled and sweaty, projecting all the calm moral authority of an evangelical Republican presidential candidate squinting into the police cruiser headlights as he’s hauled out of a Las Vegas ditch in a rubber gimp vest.
Mickelson said he was, like, really worried about the fate of Jamal Khashoggi, because that was totally bad, and in the same breath talked about how he’s really enjoying hiking and skiing and improving his work-life balance. Lee Westwood talked about people being “scared of change”
Many golfers who are anti the Saudi deal (as am I) have come up with pearlers like this in the golf news comments…"should I lay up and use my wedge in, or use the bonesaw?,"
I wanted to see where in Wellington is flooded at the moment. Like most of us I resorted to Uncle Google which offered me some stories. One of them was at this link from a radio station.
If you care to look you will notice that it doesn't have any date on the story. Never mind. It looked like quite a good review.
It seemed to be quite a full account and to tell me what I wanted to know. Anyone who reads it will probably get quite a long way into the story before they begin to get suspicious about it. You will realise that it isn't referring to today when you see reference to schools being closed but I just assumed the story was from Friday. It isn't until I read about a slip on SH1 at Pukerua Bay that I got intrigued. SH1 is now Transmission Gully and isn't anywhere the old road through Pukerua Bay. Further on I find comments from Kapiti Coast Mayor Ross Church! He hasn't been Mayor since 2016.
Shouldn't news outlets remove old stories from their websites? And shouldn't they date everything they put there? At least people like me won't worry about people who live up the coast from here based on a many year old story.
Would prefer old news items to remain available online – imho they're a useful source of searchable info; see Papers Past. "Those who cannot learn from history…" etc.
Yes, ideally old stories should be clearly date/time-stamped, just like comments here.
Suspect that the fact that there appears to be no vaccination offered to children under 12 in South Africa will be a factor, here. Teen vaccination rates are also way below adult ones.
Youth vaccination rates are concerning, with only 37 per cent of young people aged 18-34-years having taken a COVID-19 shot and nearly 30 per cent of 12–17-year-olds.
DoJ is waiting for all that evidence to come out through these Hearings, then they can go at them and it's far harder for anyone to 'plead the 5th' for Insurrection charges – but those charges are coming and they are coming for Trump himself.
'Only around one-tenth of those arrested—71 individuals—have received criminal sentences, while the rest are waiting for their trials or haven’t yet reached plea agreements.'
For God's sake man. Upon the goading of the President, they smashed their way into the seat of government in an attempt to lynch the Vice President and the leader of the house.
‘Gang crackdown’ wins votes, doesn’t solve problems [14 Oct. 2019]
As the number of gang members rises and meth floods the country, politicians are reverting to the well-worn promise to crack down on gangs. Laura Walters reports on why the discussion needs to change.
…
National leader Simon Bridges is calling for a crackdown on gangs, saying the Government has been “soft on crime”.
The rise and development of gangs in New Zealand [2010; PDF] The Political Response (excerpts from pages 680-684)
Despite their appearance within New Zealand cities since the 1950s, gangs
did not become an issue of distinct political concern until the early 1970s. This was most obviously demonstrated by populist calls before the 1974 election to ‘take the bikes off the bikies’. [And crush 'em?]
…
Under the assertive leadership Robert Muldoon, the National government introduced a series of laws giving police greater power to target gangs’ unruly behaviour, but it was social initiatives that were to define the era. Initially, Muldoon oversaw the implementation of detached youth workers to try and transform gangs from negative forces into pro social ones. Primarily this was done by encouraging gang efforts toward establishing
work cooperatives to make use of government funded work schemes that had been established to tackle rising unemployment.
…
Indeed, given political realities that exist with times of hardship, I believe that social policies targeting gangs may be more likely to occur in times of economic prosperity, when the wider public are more amenable to offering assistance to marginal groups. But, either way, the cancelling of the work schemes also signalled the collapse of the political belief that the gang situation needed social redress as well as a law and order focus; and the latter once again rose to monopolise the country’s gang response.
…
While the gangs had been difficult to counter, they had proven to be an effective means by which to garner electoral advantage. I argue that with a mix of good intentions and cynical politicking, political leaders have done more to create wider public fear of gangs than the actions of the gangs themselves.
…
The political response to the rise of LA-style street gangs in the new
millennium contrasted with this suppressive approach. With the government commissioning a study on the phenomenon – the first in more than two decades – the social causes of gang formation once again came to the fore. I have, however, suggested that this political change may prove temporary. Certainly, the politics around patched gangs have remained largely unchanged. Although certain legislative attempts at banning patches garnered a great deal more scrutiny than gang laws of the past, the broad cross party support for organised crime legislation is evidence that the perception of gang dominated organised criminal activity remains firmly entrenched. Any political turnaround to a more balanced and evidence-based appraisal and approach to patched gangs appears unlikely.
Penrose argument doesn't stack up to me. He says there is something quantum mechanical going on which produces consciousness, but we know there is no microscopic difference between human brains and most kinds of animal brains. They are both made up of the same kinds of cells.
What is different is the macroscopic structure of those brains and those differences should therefore explain the difference in intelligence between humans and animals. To me this suggests there is some quite significant part of intelligence which follows from human genome. Whereas if Penrose is correct and its about the microstructure of the brain then there should be a smaller intelligence gap between humans and animals than is present.
I also believe there is a certain very basic level of rudimentary intelligence in some creatures which has been simulated at the neurological level by computer. Again if Penrose is correct this should be insufficient to describe those creatures thinking.
The lead story on TV3 (Newshub) was the growing, disturbing threats to the PM online. Worth watching.
But they fudged the issue. Vaccine mandates are not the prime motivation. Nor is any other policy, like gun reform. These can be subject to robust debate, including protest, without death threats.
Christchurch councillor Sarah Templeton correctly identified the issue. Misogyny.
After all, she has been subject to the same online vitriol, and she has no role whatsoever in deciding government policy on anything. What she does have is a vagina.
Graham Adams writes about the $55m media fund — When Patrick Gower was asked by Mike Hosking last week what he would say to the many Newstalk ZB callers who allege the Labour government bribed media with $55 million of taxpayers’ money via the Public Interest Journalism Fund — and ...
Note: this blog post has been put together over the course of the week I followed the happenings at the conference virtually. Should recordings of the Great Debates and possibly Union Symposia mentioned below, be released sometime after the conference ends, I'll include links to the ones I participated in. ...
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New Zealand is said to be suffering from ‘serious populist discontent’. An IPSOS MORI survey has reported that we have an increasing preference for strong leaders, think that the economy is rigged toward the rich and powerful, and political elites are ignoring ‘hard-working people’. The data is from February this ...
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The absolute brass neck of this guy.We want more medical doctors, not more spin doctors, Luxon was saying a couple of weeks ago, and now we’re told the guy has seven salaried adults on TikTok duty. Sorry, doing social media. The absolute brass neck of it. The irony that the ...
Buzz from the Beehive Oceans and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones relishes spatting and eagerly takes issue with environmentalists who criticise his enthusiasm for resource development. He relishes helping the fishing industry too. And so today, while the media are making much of the latest culling in the public service to ...
Having written, taught and worked for the US government on issues involving unconventional warfare and terrorism for 30-odd years, two things irritate me the most when the subject is discussed in public. The first is the Johnny-come-lately academics-turned-media commentators who … Continue reading → ...
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More essential jobs could be on the chopping block, this time Ministry of Education staff on the school lunches team are set to find out whether they're in line to lose their jobs. ...
The Government is trying to bring in a law that will allow Ministers to cut corners and kill off native species, Labour environment spokesperson Rachel Brooking said. ...
Cancelling urgently needed new Cook Strait ferries and hiking the cost of public transport for many Kiwis so that National can announce the prospect of another tunnel for Wellington is not making good choices, Labour Transport Spokesperson Tangi Utikere said. ...
A laundry list of additional costs for Tāmaki Makarau Auckland shows the Minister for the city is not delivering for the people who live there, says Labour Auckland Issues spokesperson Shanan Halbert. ...
The Green Party has today launched a step-by-step guide to help New Zealanders make their voice heard on the Government’s democracy dodging and anti-environment fast track legislation. ...
The National Government’s proposed changes to the Residential Tenancies Act will mean tenants can be turfed from their homes by landlords with little notice, Labour housing spokesperson Kieran McAnulty said. ...
Green Party co-leader Marama Davidson is calling on all parties to support a common-sense change that’s great for the planet and great for consumers after her member’s bill was drawn from the ballot today. ...
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Minister for Disability Issues Penny Simmonds appears to have delayed a report back to Cabinet on the progress New Zealand is making against international obligations for disabled New Zealanders. ...
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The Government must commit to the Maitai School building project for students with high and complex needs, to ensure disabled students from the top of the South Island have somewhere to learn. ...
Mental Health Minister Matt Doocey and his Government colleagues have made a meal of their mental health commitments, showing how flimsy their efforts to champion the issue truly are, says Labour Mental Health spokesperson Ingrid Leary. ...
Māori are yet to see anything from this Government except cuts, reversals and taking our people backwards, Māori Development spokesperson Willie Jackson said. ...
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Science, Innovation and Technology and Defence Minister Judith Collins will next week attend the OECD Science and Technology Ministerial conference in Paris and Anzac Day commemorations in Belgium. “Science, innovation and technology have a major role to play in rebuilding our economy and achieving better health, environmental and social outcomes ...
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The Government is proud to support the first ever Repco Supercars Championship event in Taupō as up to 70,000 motorsport fans attend the Taupō International Motorsport Park this weekend, says Economic Development Minister Melissa Lee. “Anticipation for the ITM Taupō Super400 is huge, with tickets and accommodation selling out weeks ...
Local Government Minister Simeon Brown has announced an increase to the Rates Rebate Scheme, putting money back into the pockets of low-income homeowners. “The coalition Government is committed to bringing down the cost of living for New Zealanders. That includes targeted support for those Kiwis who are doing things tough, such ...
The Coalition Government is investing in a project to boost survival rates of New Zealand mussels and grow the industry, Oceans and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones has announced. “This project seeks to increase the resilience of our mussels and significantly boost the sector’s productivity,” Mr Jones says. “The project - ...
Benefit figures released today underscore the importance of the Government’s plan to rebuild the economy and have 50,000 fewer people on Jobseeker Support, Social Development and Employment Minister Louise Upston says. “Benefit numbers are still significantly higher than when National was last in government, when there was about 70,000 fewer ...
The Government’s commitment to doubling New Zealand’s renewable energy capacity is backed by new data showing that clean energy has helped the country reach its lowest annual gross emissions since 1999, Climate Change Minister Simon Watts says. New Zealand’s latest Greenhouse Gas Inventory (1990-2022) published today, shows gross emissions fell ...
The Government is bringing the earthquake-prone building review forward, with work to start immediately, and extending the deadline for remediations by four years, Building and Construction Minister Chris Penk says. “Our Government is focused on rebuilding the economy. A key part of our plan is to cut red tape that ...
Prime Minister Christopher Luxon and his Thai counterpart, Prime Minister Srettha Thavisin, have today agreed that New Zealand and the Kingdom of Thailand will upgrade the bilateral relationship to a Strategic Partnership by 2026. “New Zealand and Thailand have a lot to offer each other. We have a strong mutual desire to build ...
RMA Reform Minister Chris Bishop and Transport Minister Simeon Brown have today announced the Coalition Government’s intention to extend port coastal permits for a further 20 years, providing port operators with certainty to continue their operations. “The introduction of the Resource Management Act in 1991 required ports to obtain coastal ...
Today’s announcement that inflation is down to 4 per cent is encouraging news for Kiwis, but there is more work to be done - underlining the importance of the Government’s plan to get the economy back on track, acting Finance Minister Chris Bishop says. “Inflation is now at 4 per ...
Refreshed health guidance released today will help parents and schools make informed decisions about whether their child needs to be in school, addressing one of the key issues affecting school attendance, says Associate Education Minister David Seymour. In recent years, consistently across all school terms, short-term illness or medical reasons ...
Oceans and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones is streamlining high-level oceans management while maintaining a focus on supporting the sector’s role in the export-led recovery of the economy. “I am working to realise the untapped potential of our fishing and aquaculture sector. To achieve that we need to be smarter with ...
Associate Agriculture Minister Mark Patterson is speaking at the International Wool Textile Organisation Congress in Adelaide, promoting New Zealand wool, and outlining the coalition Government’s support for the revitalisation the sector. "New Zealand’s wool exports reached $400 million in the year to 30 June 2023, and the coalition Government ...
The Government is making legislative changes to make it easier for new early learning services to be established, and for existing services to operate, Associate Education Minister David Seymour says. The changes involve repealing the network approval provisions that apply when someone wants to establish a new early learning service, ...
Changes to the Resource Management Act will align consenting for coal mining to other forms of mining to reduce barriers that are holding back economic development, Resources Minister Shane Jones says. “The inconsistent treatment of coal mining compared with other extractive activities is burdensome red tape that fails to acknowledge ...
Trade, Agriculture and Forestry Minister Todd McClay has concluded productive discussions with ministerial counterparts in Beijing today, in support of the New Zealand-China trade and economic relationship. “My meeting with Commerce Minister Wang Wentao reaffirmed the complementary nature of the bilateral trade relationship, with our Free Trade Agreement at its ...
Prime Minister Christopher Luxon today paid tribute to Singapore’s outgoing Prime Minister Lee Hsien Loong. Meeting in Singapore today immediately before Prime Minister Lee announced he was stepping down, Prime Minister Luxon warmly acknowledged his counterpart’s almost twenty years as leader, and the enduring legacy he has left for Singapore and South East ...
Prime Minister Christopher Luxon held a bilateral meeting today with Singapore Prime Minister Lee Hsien Loong. While in Singapore as part of his visit to South East Asia this week, Prime Minister Luxon also met with Singapore President Tharman Shanmugaratnam and will meet with Deputy Prime Minister Lawrence Wong. During today’s meeting, Prime Minister Luxon ...
Foreign Minister Winston Peters has made further appointments to the Board of Antarctica New Zealand as part of a continued effort to ensure the Scott Base Redevelopment project is delivered in a cost-effective and efficient manner. The Minister has appointed Neville Harris as a new member of the Board. Mr ...
Finance Minister Nicola Willis will travel to the United States on Tuesday to attend a meeting of the Five Finance Ministers group, with counterparts from Australia, the United States, Canada, and the United Kingdom. “I am looking forward to meeting with our Five Finance partners on how we can work ...
The coalition Government has today announced purrfect and pawsitive changes to the Residential Tenancies Act to give tenants with pets greater choice when looking for a rental property, says Housing Minister Chris Bishop. “Pets are important members of many Kiwi families. It’s estimated that around 64 per cent of New ...
State Highway 1 (SH1) through Wellington City is heavily congested at peak times and while planning continues on the duplicate Mt Victoria Tunnel and Basin Reserve project, the Government has also asked NZ Transport Agency (NZTA) to consider and provide advice on a Long Tunnel option, Transport Minister Simeon Brown ...
Prime Minister Christopher Luxon and Foreign Minister Winston Peters have condemned Iran’s shocking and illegal strikes against Israel. “These attacks are a major challenge to peace and stability in a region already under enormous pressure," Mr Luxon says. "We are deeply concerned that miscalculation on any side could ...
Hundreds of people in little over a week have turned out in Northland to hear Regional Development Minister Shane Jones speak about plans for boosting the regional economy through infrastructure. About 200 people from the infrastructure and associated sectors attended an event headlined by Mr Jones in Whangarei today. Last ...
Health Minister Dr Shane Reti has today thanked outgoing Health New Zealand – Te Whatu Ora Chair Dame Karen Poutasi for her service on the Board. “Dame Karen tendered her resignation as Chair and as a member of the Board today,” says Dr Reti. “I have asked her to ...
The NZ Transport Agency (NZTA) has signalled their proposed delivery approach for the Government’s 15 Roads of National Significance (RoNS), with the release of the State Highway Investment Proposal (SHIP) today, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says. “Boosting economic growth and productivity is a key part of the Government’s plan to ...
New Zealand is renewing its connections with a world facing urgent challenges by pursuing an active, energetic foreign policy, Foreign Minister Winston Peters says. “Our country faces the most unstable global environment in decades,” Mr Peters says at the conclusion of two weeks of engagements in Egypt, Europe and the United States. “We cannot afford to sit back in splendid ...
Prime Minister Christopher Luxon has announced the Australian Governor-General, His Excellency General The Honourable David Hurley and his wife Her Excellency Mrs Linda Hurley, will make a State visit to New Zealand from Tuesday 16 April to Thursday 18 April. The visit reciprocates the State visit of former Governor-General Dame Patsy Reddy ...
Associate Health Minister David Seymour has announced that Medsafe has approved 11 cold and flu medicines containing pseudoephedrine. Pharmaceutical suppliers have indicated they may be able to supply the first products in June. “This is much earlier than the original expectation of medicines being available by 2025. The Government recognised ...
New Zealand and the United States have recommitted to their strategic partnership in Washington DC today, pledging to work ever more closely together in support of shared values and interests, Foreign Minister Winston Peters says. “The strategic environment that New Zealand and the United States face is considerably more ...
April 11, 2024 Joint Declaration by United States Secretary of State the Honorable Antony J. Blinken and New Zealand Minister of Foreign Affairs the Right Honourable Winston Peters We met today in Washington, D.C. to recommit to the historic partnership between our two countries and the principles that underpin it—rule ...
Foreign Minister Winston Peters has announced further New Zealand cooperation with the United States in the Pacific Islands region through $16.4 million in funding for initiatives in digital connectivity and oceans and fisheries research. “New Zealand can achieve more in the Pacific if we work together more urgently and ...
Kia Ora Gaza A passionate haka reverberated through Auckland International Airport as a medical team of three New Zealand doctors received an emotional farewell from a big crowd of supporters before flying to Turkey to join the international Freedom Flotilla to Gaza. The doctors, who left Auckland yesterday, hope to ...
With submissions closing today, Macassey-Pickard says groups around the country have been supporting a huge range of people to make their submissions. ...
Our response to the new legislation is informed by targeted conversations with practitioners working in the system and through an implementation lens. ...
The new ‘Fast-track Approvals Bill’ would give just three Ministers the power to approve or deny development projects. They would avoid the usual checks and balances that are in place to protect rivers, land, the ocean, and communities. ...
COMMENTARY:By Eugene Doyle Helen Clark, how I miss you. The former New Zealand Prime Minister — the safest pair of hands this country has had in living memory — gave a masterclass on the importance of maintaining an independent foreign policy when she spoke at an AUKUS symposium held ...
The government's released the list of organisations provided with information on how to apply - just hours before public submissions on the bill close. ...
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The Mental Health Foundation provides support and resources for those facing the loss of their job, so it’s wrong in the very week the Government adds another 1000 jobs to its tally of cuts, that this is happening. ...
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The Opposition intends to introduce non-consorting laws that would stop convicted gang members from associating with one another.
Apparently once issued, the specified gang offenders would be prohibited from associating or communicating with one another for up to three years.
Does that mean we can't have family get togethers at Christmas or funerals?
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/national-party-favours-non-consorting-laws-to-disrupt-gangs-from-the-inside-out/QFJXAHQDYZEEIB7CCCTUCTQ2T4/
They're confused.
https://twitter.com/antihobbes/status/1535712452322598912
That is a ridiculous concept for law.
Are they also planning on repealing the Bill of Rights Act? Which is pretty much what they would have to do to pass this.
The Bill of Rights is not a set of absolutes. Context is still important – for example we had no problem with the NZ government effectively preventing me from associating with my frail and elderly father for over 2 years during the COVID crisis.
Nor do I imagine that criminal entities like the Mongrel Mob that actively repudiate the law enjoy quite the same protection under the Bill of Rights as say a political party or a union.
For an example of the way an association is banned overseas, you could look at the neo-Nazi groups in Germany. Where any and all associated symbolism is illegal to buy, sell or possess, and groups are legally not allowed to form.
It doesn't work in preventing the groups forming (haters will always hate), but it does give the police effective powers to raid and shut down groups: e.g.
https://www.reuters.com/article/germany-security-neo-nazi-idUSKBN28B4E9
These are political groupings (albeit, unsavoury ones to the majority of us), rather than criminal ones (by that I mean that they aren't engaged in full-scale drug dealing and associated criminal activity) – but the mechanism of suppression would be the same.
Basically it doesn’t work in Germany (as you point out yourself). It won’t work here.
I’d bet that you can’t find a case where suppression of that kind has ever worked anywhere at any time over a timescale of a few generations. All it does is to push groups underground and typically makes it larger and longer lived. It is roughly the equivalent of putting makeup over a cyst to hide it…
I think that it's arguable that it doesn't work in Germany. It certainly doesn't work 100% – and nothing (apart from North Korean style social suppression) would or could.
I do believe that it has a suppressant effect, and a social stigma effect (people in general in Germany really, really dislike Nazi symbolism and disapprove of the people who choose to associate themselves with it).
Given that National have yet to release any details about how this would potentially work in the NZ legislative context; combined with the current resistance from Courts to impose serious sentences for actual crime (as opposed to a theoretical 'consorting with' crimes) – I don't believe that it's likely to be an effective policy in tackling gang crime in NZ.
But, it sure has popular appeal with a large swathe of the population who (rightly or wrongly) are feeling highly unsafe in the current gang warfare environment.
Please note, many of these are Labour supporters – or centrists who voted for Ardern in 2020. We're not talking about right-wing gun nuts – but ordinary people who are concerned that the next 'random' shooting is going to hit their house, car or kids; or ordinary small business owners who are getting to the point where their business is uninsurable because of the risk of ram raids.
In my own Auckland electorate, there have been two drive-by shootings, and 4 ram-raids on shops in the local (small) shopping centre 5 minutes walk from me. You bet that I'm not feeling anything like as safe as I did 3 years ago. I try not to do knee-jerk reactions – but I really do understand the visceral fear that some families are experiencing.
Why would you have to do that?
All you need to do is get the Attorney-General to state that, as David Parker has done in this link, "I have concluded that any limitation they pose on rights are reasonably justifiable under s 5 of the Bill of Rights Act.".
That's all, now just move along.
https://www.justice.govt.nz/assets/Documents/Publications/20210914-NZ-BORA-Advice-COVID-19-Public-Health-Response-Amendment-Bill.pdf
Hard times call for hard measures, Iprent. If Labour and successive governments had really gotten heads around L&O we wouldn't be in this situation.
Legal niceties aside, how will it be policed? We'd need a quasi citizens group with limited legal powers given present police numbers? National are just tinkering.
Why not just brand them domestic terrorists and move from there? Probably because it would cause too much pain in certain sections of society.
The man himself and the exceptions to Nationals tinkering and proposed gang legislation.
https://www.newstalkzb.co.nz/on-air/the-sunday-session/audio/christopher-luxon-our-objective-here-is-to-dismantle-and-disrupt-gangs/
You haven’t read the NZBORA? It is really short and clear. Declaring them to be domestic terrorists makes very little differences to anyone’s rights within our legal system. It doesn’t give anyone an ability to trample over freedoms to association.
After all any such law wouldn’t be hard to take an reapply it to the domestic terrorism (as I see it) of Groundswell, or NZ Initiative.
Besides, I fail to see why this has the National party piddling in their bloomers. The police have dealt with exactly this kind of issue multiple times in the past. We still have various types of gangs, drug cartels, picket lines, rampant criminal capitalism, rebellious youth, synthetic drugs etc etc.
Society and the police deal with them over and over again despite the idiotic chicken-littles and their pathetic posturing.
The National party dickhead laws passed on each of those occasions that have done exactly nothing.
What works is to just deal with the problem using the usual processes with some time and patience. It isn’t like any of this is a new problem.
I’d be happy to demonstrate to any such body why they shouldn’t exist. I have a large set of resistance strategies for dealing with socially retarded wannabe brown-shirts that I have spent decades wanting to test. I have restrained myself from doing so – because of those legal niceties. Remove the legal niceties, and I’ll be happy to demonstrate why the legal niceties are something that is pretty essential to maintain.
I’m not exactly a pacifist. To learn some of the required techniques was among the three reasons that I joined the army in my youth. While I’m probably getting to be a bit old to be really active, I’m sure that I can help out any resistance with ideas and techniques.
I am aware of the US anti consorting law RICO.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racketeer_Influenced_and_Corrupt_Organizations_Act
Tighhtly framed laws like the RICO type seem to have some success in the US. There are serious predicate offences including 'Terrorism'. This makes me wonder if our terrorist laws could be used.
Looking at the success that joint ops – Customs, overseas justice & policing agencies and our own police seem to have against the importation of drugs does make me wonder if there is a key need for a tweak to our domestic laws. Perhaps going down the RICO way with investigations of criminal enterprises rather than individual crime might be a way. I am sure that many of these gangs would have little trouble in in fulfilling the predicate crime requirements.
Though the going after gangs has elements of a moral panic.
While we just cannot have drive-by shootings because of the risk to innocent people, when it comes to crime and impact on the wealth and welfare of the country the diversion away and starving of our tax system by various means has more impact on a Govt's ability to fund its programmes. Tax evasion. Some of these programmes may be ones that would nip in the bud, the conditions leading to gangs being seen as attractive.
What happened to"freedom of association"?
Nationals stated rational for removing compulsory Union membership.
Mind you I have long given up expecting moral consistency from National.
I think that you'll find that National were arguing there that no one should be required to join an association (union in that case).
It really is a completely separate issue from banning 'criminal' associations, which is what they are discussing here.
No lack of consistency.
Please note, this doesn't imply I agree with National – but I don't believe your comparison holds water.
Well said. Two separate issues.
Freedom of association.
Cuts both ways.
I don't think so. National's argument is 'freedom' as in 'not compelled to'.
No one is compelled to belong to a gang (or any other social or political group). It's a choice you make. Even if you choose to belong, no one is compelled to wear affiliation patches, etc. – you can choose to *not* wear them. Choices have consequences.
Not at all the same argument.
In the oooold days public servants who actually interacted with the public (lots didn't, purely backroom boys and girls), were forbidden to wear any affiliation pins, jewellery, etc.) IIRC, this was originally instituted to stop the wearing of Masonic emblems (but am open to correction, here)
The reasoning was that the Public Service should be absolutely politically and socially neutral. It fell over in the 70s/80s, when employees wanted to 'express their solidarity' with various political causes – rainbow pins, anti-nuclear badges, pride emblems, etc.). I still feel it's wrong. Neutrality is an important principle.
So, there is some social history on the side of stopping people wearing insignia in public spaces.
Mitchell spokesman on National Law and Order is challenged by Jack to explain the detail of the Gang "solution." What a crash! Mitchell is a superficial empty vessel.
From 6:45 minutes.
https://www.tvnz.co.nz/shows/q-and-a/live
Yes! Presented with evidence that the Western Australian laws were not all that effective by Jack Tame, and upon which the Natz had based their ridiculous fear-mongering, he couldn't answer, so just ignored it.
A train wreck of an interview – though I suspect the Natz were sensible to send Mercenary Mitchell rather than Luxon – he'd have been a complete disaster!
Pommy snark is the best snark.
The new pop-up circuit is run by Saudi Arabia’s PIF as part of Vision 2030, the cultural project that is also a way of buying influence, outreach and soft power: art, music, sport, a football club.
[…]
So we watched as one by one players at the Centurion Club pretended to have sound reasons for joining the breakaway, and then just gave up and effectively said it was for the money. Phil Mickelson looked notably baffled and sweaty, projecting all the calm moral authority of an evangelical Republican presidential candidate squinting into the police cruiser headlights as he’s hauled out of a Las Vegas ditch in a rubber gimp vest.
Mickelson said he was, like, really worried about the fate of Jamal Khashoggi, because that was totally bad, and in the same breath talked about how he’s really enjoying hiking and skiing and improving his work-life balance. Lee Westwood talked about people being “scared of change”
https://www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/2022/jun/11/in-their-naked-self-interest-liv-golfers-are-being-refreshingly-true-to-the-sports-roots
Many golfers who are anti the Saudi deal (as am I) have come up with pearlers like this in the golf news comments…"should I lay up and use my wedge in, or use the bonesaw?,"
Non denominational electoral fuckery.
/
https://twitter.com/ForwardCarolina/status/1535360883525812225
https://twitter.com/ForwardCarolina/status/1535362495338225667
I wanted to see where in Wellington is flooded at the moment. Like most of us I resorted to Uncle Google which offered me some stories. One of them was at this link from a radio station.
https://www.thehits.co.nz/news/wellington-dealing-with-serious-flooding-event-following-torrential-rain/
If you care to look you will notice that it doesn't have any date on the story. Never mind. It looked like quite a good review.
It seemed to be quite a full account and to tell me what I wanted to know. Anyone who reads it will probably get quite a long way into the story before they begin to get suspicious about it. You will realise that it isn't referring to today when you see reference to schools being closed but I just assumed the story was from Friday. It isn't until I read about a slip on SH1 at Pukerua Bay that I got intrigued. SH1 is now Transmission Gully and isn't anywhere the old road through Pukerua Bay. Further on I find comments from Kapiti Coast Mayor Ross Church! He hasn't been Mayor since 2016.
Shouldn't news outlets remove old stories from their websites? And shouldn't they date everything they put there? At least people like me won't worry about people who live up the coast from here based on a many year old story.
Would prefer old news items to remain available online – imho they're a useful source of searchable info; see Papers Past. "Those who cannot learn from history…" etc.
Yes, ideally old stories should be clearly date/time-stamped, just like comments here.
On second thoughts I agree with keeping them.
They should date them though, and preferably highlight the date. Mana seems to get flooded a couple of times a year.
SLIP ON 58. Below Seaview.
Mana new world flooded.
And here we are. New variants nailing more kids than over eighties.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-06-09/child-covid-19-cases-jump-in-south-africa-discovery-health-says#xj4y7vzkg
Suspect that the fact that there appears to be no vaccination offered to children under 12 in South Africa will be a factor, here. Teen vaccination rates are also way below adult ones.
https://www.unicef.org/southafrica/press-releases/unicef-welcomes-50-cent-covid19-vaccination-coverage-south-africa
If anyone else is tuning into the January 6th Congressional Hearings the good question to be answered is this:
– Where did the money come from?
– Who paid for this over two-month effort to reverse the results of an election that President Joe Biden won by over eight million votes?
– And who paid for what almost became a military coup as well as a violent insurrection?
C'mon Dems: Follow The Money.
It was more a protest that got out of hand by a bunch of idiots.
Insurrection indeed.
You'd be the last one I'd have expected to defend these criminals who attempted to overthrow an elected government.
I guess you take it easy on any of your clients if they'e right wingers.
Did I say they shouldn't be charged?
They should absolutely be charged but throwing words around like insurrection and coup is just giving them more credit then they deserve.
Compare Jan 6th to the Capital Hill protests, I know which one was more dangerous yet where are the arrests?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capitol_Hill_Occupied_Protest#Shootings
DoJ is waiting for all that evidence to come out through these Hearings, then they can go at them and it's far harder for anyone to 'plead the 5th' for Insurrection charges – but those charges are coming and they are coming for Trump himself.
Hopefully they can hurry it up:
https://time.com/6133336/jan-6-capitol-riot-arrests-sentences/
'Only around one-tenth of those arrested—71 individuals—have received criminal sentences, while the rest are waiting for their trials or haven’t yet reached plea agreements.'
For God's sake man. Upon the goading of the President, they smashed their way into the seat of government in an attempt to lynch the Vice President and the leader of the house.
Insurrection? Indeed!
Goading:
https://www.newsweek.com/fact-check-did-trump-say-peacefully-patriotically-march-capitol-1561718
"I know that everyone here will soon be marching over to the Capitol building to peacefully and patriotically make your voices heard"
You really think think that a bunch of unarmed yahoos led by this guy was going to somehow take control of the government?
Hes been charged and convicted, as it should be
https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/qanon-shaman-key-figure-jan-attack-sentenced-wednesday/story?id=81203981
This is all the Democratic party has and they're going to milk it for all its worth
Unarmed my arse. The treasonous clowns arrived tooled up and ready to kill.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/stun-guns-stinger-whips-crossbow-what-police-found-capitol-protesters-n1254127
https://www.everytown.org/were-guns-present-at-the-january-6th-capitol-insurrection/
How many people did the protestors kills?
None, because everyone eacuated
Yes it looks like everyones evacuated, I especially like the masked guy leaning up against the wall obviously in fear for life
https://opb-opb-prod.cdn.arcpublishing.com/resizer/8_iUz3LQZBTcErxi3li2UuQGN9I=/767×0/smart/cloudfront-us-east-1.images.arcpublishing.com/opb/MSZ7XS2RJZA7POOO3VDIHJ4Q2I.jpg
fear for his life
Fuck…
And the next time you snap one of your keeps with a weapon you'll ask how many screws did they stab before deciding whether or not to charge them.
lol
Whats a keeps and whats a screw?
I'll have a go. A keep is an inmate and a screw is a prison officer.
Whats a prison officer?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prison_officer
From the link you provided:
'The term "corrections officer" or "correction officer" is used in the U.S. and New Zealand.'
I'm interested to know why you are so sensitive about the use of the term, prison officer.
It is in common usage and everyone knows what it means.
I'm interested to know why you don't seem to care about being wrong, even when corrected.
Weren't you a teacher at some point?
Perhaps you are captured by this quaint idea prison officers are correcting people rather than just locking them up in prison.
Or that my work contact says Corrections Officer or that I work for the Department of Corrections or that my boss is the Minister Of Corrections
So you were the type of teacher that didn't bother with checking if the information you were passing onto your students was actually correct?
Close enough is good enough eh
work contact? work contract
Fuck…
kills? Fuck…
Never mind, even a corrector can't be correct all the time..
^*my work contRact
This is getting beyond a joke.
I'm off to bed.
""I know that everyone here will soon be marching over to the Capitol building to peacefully and patriotically make your voices heard""
You took that statement at face value, Puckish?
Gracious!
At least they're having a go…
The more things change…
Fascinating yarn about a Google engineer who'd been conversing with AI chat bot LaMDA. He reckoned LaMDA was becoming sentient.
https://archive.ph/qgVxc (wapo)
Without taking a firm position on this, Roger Penrose argues that consciousness is not a computation.
Penrose argument doesn't stack up to me. He says there is something quantum mechanical going on which produces consciousness, but we know there is no microscopic difference between human brains and most kinds of animal brains. They are both made up of the same kinds of cells.
What is different is the macroscopic structure of those brains and those differences should therefore explain the difference in intelligence between humans and animals. To me this suggests there is some quite significant part of intelligence which follows from human genome. Whereas if Penrose is correct and its about the microstructure of the brain then there should be a smaller intelligence gap between humans and animals than is present.
I also believe there is a certain very basic level of rudimentary intelligence in some creatures which has been simulated at the neurological level by computer. Again if Penrose is correct this should be insufficient to describe those creatures thinking.
The lead story on TV3 (Newshub) was the growing, disturbing threats to the PM online. Worth watching.
But they fudged the issue. Vaccine mandates are not the prime motivation. Nor is any other policy, like gun reform. These can be subject to robust debate, including protest, without death threats.
Christchurch councillor Sarah Templeton correctly identified the issue. Misogyny.
After all, she has been subject to the same online vitriol, and she has no role whatsoever in deciding government policy on anything. What she does have is a vagina.