Open Mike 13/10/2016

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, October 13th, 2016 - 216 comments
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216 comments on “Open Mike 13/10/2016 ”

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  1. Paul 1
    13 October 2016 at 6:46 am

    Storm clouds brewing……

    Liam Dann: Are the banks bracing for a storm?

    The prudence of the banks is heartening on one level – we need the major banks to stay strong through any economic downturn that may eventuate.
    That strength was a blessing for Australasia during the Global Financial Crisis.
    But its also a little worrying to consider just what they are bracing for.
    Do they see a significant property market correction coming? There’s no shortage of commentators and economists who have delivered similar warnings.
    A long range weather forecast is one thing, watching the biggest ships the sea batten down for a storm is another thing altogether.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11727593

    BNZ plans restructure, won’t say how many jobs could be impacted

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11727398

    NZ’s big banks see profits dip

    http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/business/315452/nz's-big-banks-see-profits-dip

    • Paul 1.2
      13 October 2016 at 6:59 am

      I would point you to this

      The fact is that New Zealand is highly vulnerable to any world economic slowdown. Our government debt has skyrocketed since Key and his crew have taken over. It’s over $120 billion. You can watch it grow here. In addition our private debt has soared. We Kiwis are slaves to mortgages, rent and credit cards.

      Why isn’t big media informing us about what’s going on with the world’s economy? Are the owners and drivers of our media that shallow, that bound to their class interests, that they can’t bear to tell the truth?

      Have we learnt nothing from 2007/8? Don’t trust big media to educate you. Do it yourself, check out some of the links in this post and learn about what’s about what’s going to happen.

      Then buckle up, people, it’s going to be a rough landing.

      https://thestandard.org.nz/keep-calm-and-carry-on/

      • Stunned mullet 1.2.1
        13 October 2016 at 7:12 am

        If you keep saying there’s going to be a financial melt down you will undoubtedly be right sooner or later.

      • ianmac 1.2.2
        13 October 2016 at 8:56 am

        There seems to be rumbling coming from the World Economy. NZ high against the pound etc. And why has Putin “ordered” Russians home? Why are our Banks preparing to cover themselves?
        I don’t know because I am an Economic Illiterate.

        • save nz 1.2.2.1
          13 October 2016 at 9:41 am

          @Ianmac – the banks have lent too much foreign money and some of the lending is fraudulent or over valued. For example with the SHA zoned by the government, overnight the land was worth millions more. Then the owners sold for those millions more and the banks lent on the new values. However it was the same land, and the same land has no or few houses on it years later. So the bank lending was always reliant on development, development is reliant on more people living there and more people living there and buying houses is reliant on them having secure jobs and wealth…

          The government never got around to putting legislation and investment in place to provide more secure jobs and wealth for enough people …. to pay the debts for the houses… that the bank lent on.

          Under neoliberalism that opposite is happening, less jobs for more people… less secure wealth… Executives are given short term incentives to save money to get their bonuses… easiest way is to cut jobs, but long term the company will grind to a halt because without investment in quality people then businesses go under.

          • ianmac 1.2.2.1.1
            13 October 2016 at 10:06 am

            Thanks Save NZ. So the Bank positioning is to bank against the “grinding to a halt.” Uggh! The withdrawl of Government funding to essential services is another alarm bell. Key/Joyce/English cannot warn us as this would be an admission of defeat.

      • Red 1.2.3
        13 October 2016 at 11:04 am

        It’s rude to point Paul

        I just would like to point out however Tomorrow it may rain but it may not, just a rumbling

  2. Garibaldi 2
    13 October 2016 at 7:04 am

    Judith Collins is not fit to be an MP let alone a minister of the Crown. Her latest brainfart is unacceptable and she should be removed from office immediately.

    • Stunned mullet 2.1
      13 October 2016 at 7:11 am

      Do tell…….

      I haven’t heard anything out of the ordinary, not that I take much notice of what she says.

    • marty mars 2.2
      13 October 2016 at 7:32 am

      agreed – she is an utter disgrace and shows her very limited thinking capacity. Typical lazy gnat – blame parents for child poverty –

      “I don’t just see monetary poverty,” she said. “I see a poverty of ideas, a poverty of parental responsibility, a poverty of love, a poverty of caring.Ms Collins then said that in New Zealand there was money available to everyone who needed it. “I can tell you that it’s not just a lack of money, it’s primarily a lack of responsibility – I know it’s not PC – but, you know, that’s just me.”

      http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/315510/collins-criticised-over-child-poverty-comments

      yep the dirty politics queen, friend to the scum, sweet talker to the rwnjs – a disgusting person and reason enough to work hard and replace this govt – collins is not fit for public office.

      • Takere 2.2.1
        13 October 2016 at 11:41 am

        She and her brethren are dodging the real issue(s) all the time now.
        One law for all …. you’d think with all of the bs about the Nat’s being responsible “managers” they would of been on top of Tax Evasion?
        Here’s a report backed up with evidence … $1.24 billion of tax was evaded in 2014, while just $33.55 million were cases for fraud were for welfare payments.

        http://www.interest.co.nz/personal-finance/84038/tax-professor-calls-independent-inquiry-how-tax-evaders-and-benefit

      • Grim 2.2.2
        13 October 2016 at 11:48 am

        Thought she was talking about the national government?

        “I don’t just see monetary poverty,” she said. “I see a poverty of ideas, a poverty of parental responsibility, a poverty of love, a poverty of caring.Ms Collins then said that in New Zealand there was money available to everyone who needed it. “I can tell you that it’s not just a lack of money, it’s primarily a lack of responsibility – I know it’s not PC – but, you know, that’s just me.”

    • tc 2.3
      13 October 2016 at 10:45 am

      Nah, keep her in the limelight as it’s very important for the people to see the calibre of a nat senior minister sooo important to this regime that she is still around after her many indiscretions.

    • Stunned mullet 3.1
      13 October 2016 at 7:14 am

      What is this appocolypse you speak of ?

      Does it have anything to do with the imbeseals who post here.

  4. Tory 4
    13 October 2016 at 7:20 am

    It’s imbecile, I am picking an imbeseal is something the Green Party wants protected from set nets…

    • marty mars 4.1
      13 October 2016 at 7:33 am

      yeah well they are endangered 🙂

    • Garibaldi 4.2
      13 October 2016 at 8:08 am

      Good to see you can spell imbecile Tory, now look in the mirror.

      • Tory 4.2.1
        13 October 2016 at 8:20 am

        I’m not sure I understand your point as I am wearing a moron filter…..

        • weka 4.2.1.1
          13 October 2016 at 8:30 am

          Doesn’t that keep you in a permanent existential crisis?

          • Puckish Rogue 4.2.1.1.1
            13 October 2016 at 8:55 am

            In case anyone is in a permanent existential crisis or want to get out of it:

            http://www.wikihow.com/Deal-with-an-Existential-Crisis

            With pictures!

          • Tory 4.2.1.1.2
            13 October 2016 at 8:59 am

            I Prefer Transcendence; if in fact we are nothing we are everything, to remember the Self is to forget the self, to forget the self is to be enlightened by the ten thousand things……

            • Puckish Rogue 4.2.1.1.2.1
              13 October 2016 at 9:07 am

              Conan laughs at your philosophy:

              “Let teachers and priests and philosophers brood over questions of reality and illusion. I know this: if life is illusion, then I am no less an illusion, and being thus, the illusion is real to me. I live, I burn with life, I love, I slay, and am content.”

              • Tory …
                13 October 2016 at 9:29 am

                “My proudest moment here wasn’t when I increased profits by 17%, or cut expenditure without losing a single member of staff. No. It was a young Greek guy, first job in the country, hardly spoke a word of English, but he came to me and he went ‘Mr. Brent, will you be the Godfather to my child?’. Didn’t happen in the end. We had to let him go, he was rubbish. He was rubbish.”

  5. Morrissey 5
    13 October 2016 at 7:50 am

    Who exactly writes these ghastly, politically servile “news” bulletins
    for the likes of Daniel Faitaua to uncomprehendingly recite to camera?
    Breakfast Television 1, Thursday 13 October 2016

    Anyone bored enough or unfortunate enough to have been watching TV1 at 7 o’clock this morning would have witnessed the pleasant but vacuous newsreader Daniel Faitaua blankly, dutifully, reading out a little propaganda nugget which might well have been written for him by the Saudi Arabian or Turkish Foreign Ministries or the U.S. State Department:

    The Syrian regime’s Russian-backed ASSAULT on Aleppo CONTINUES.”

    At 7:30 a.m. Faitaua was back at it, blandly reading: “the devastating attack by the Russian-backed Syrian regime CONTINUES…”

    I might have missed it, but I can remember no occasion when any TV1 newsreader ever recited the following words in 2014: “The Israeli regime’s U.S.-backed ASSAULT on Gaza CONTINUES. … the devastating attack by the U.S.-backed Israeli regime CONTINUES…”

    • mikesh 5.1
      13 October 2016 at 9:24 am

      As I understand it the Russians are attacking the ISIS forces who are occupying Aleppo illegally.

      • Stunned Mullet 5.1.1
        13 October 2016 at 10:50 am

        As I understand it the IDF is attacking Hamas who are firing missiles at Israel.

        • Colonial Viper 5.1.1.1
          13 October 2016 at 10:57 am

          Wait – has Hamas killed tens of thousands of Israelis in the last year (some by beheading, burning and drowning, then putting it up on the internet), just like ISIS has killed tens of thousands of Syrians in the last year (some by beheading, burning and drowning, then putting it up on the internet)?

          Or are you just an idiot?

          NB Israel took the land of the Palestinians and ethnically cleansed it. Israel is the illegal occupying force.

    • Wayne Mapp 5.2
      13 October 2016 at 9:44 am

      Morrissey

      You won’t hear that because the US is not bombing Gaza and never has, whereas the Russians are actually currently bombing Aleppo. Not hard to figure out, except perhaps for a Russian apologist.

      • Stuart Munro 5.2.1
        13 October 2016 at 11:09 am

        True about Aleppo – but US aid buying IDF bombs muddies that water good.

      • swordfish 5.2.2
        13 October 2016 at 2:44 pm

        Wayne Mapp: “the US is not bombing Gaza and never has”

        (1) Israel only carries out its periodic carpet-bombing campaigns / massacres in Gaza (and Lebanon and the West Bank) when it’s sure it will receive a tacit Green Light from the US.

        (2) Most of the weaponry deployed by Israel in these massacres is either US-manufactured or bought with the billions in US aid to Israel.

        For example, in their report ” “Rain of Fire: Israel’s Unlawful Use of White Phosphorus in Gaza”, Human Rights Watch found that the white phosphorus shells repeatedly and indiscriminately fired by the IDF over densely populated neighbourhoods in Gaza during 2008-09 Operation Cast Lead were entirely US-manufactured.

        More broadly, leading Human Rights groups have concluded that Israel committed a series of War Crimes (based on the definition under International Law) in its regular “operations” against Gaza over the last decade. And yet – despite US law prohibiting military assistance to countries that engage in human rights violations – each year, the US Govt approves more than $3 billion in new weaponry and military financing for Israel.

        In just one recent year, for instance, this included F-35 stealth fighters, 14,500 kits to upgrade “dumb” bombs into precision-guided munitions, over 12,000 unguided bombs, over 3,000 hellfire missiles and 50 Super Penetrator “bunker buster” bombs, designed to hit targets underground.

        Basically, each time the IDF commit yet another massacre of civilians, they have their weaponry and munitions fully replenished by the US.

    • save nz 5.3
      13 October 2016 at 9:45 am

      Maybe the US wants a war with Russia as bravado to prove to the world they are still relevant after getting no where in the middle east? But what about China and North Korea? So many countries to invade, so little victory so far.. add on Mexico to invade if Trump gets in.

    • Paul 5.4
      13 October 2016 at 3:53 pm

      Repeaters , not reporters.

  6. marty mars 6
    13 October 2016 at 7:56 am

    Yep they are coming for everything in a last ditch orgy of excess – last chance for a while to accumulate so they are digging deep.

    “The production and consumption of natural Andean and Amazonian ancestral products in Peru is threatened by the “biopiracy” of foreign companies who have filed over 11,690 patents for the domestic produce of the region, effectively poaching the natural heritage of the country. The resources are said to be rich in nutrients and vitamins and range from those with anti-aging properties to those that act as natural aphrodisiacs.

    Small farmers could be among those worst affected if foreign companies obtain the patents. “Campesinos have been guardians of seeds and diversity generation after generation, from our ancestors to our fathers we have inherited the seeds,” said Director of the National Association of Ecological Products of Peru Moises Quispe.

    “We campesinos are very conscious about it. These seeds are part of our lives, and if there’s a new owner who patents them for their own economic interests, it’s a very worrying situation.””

    https://intercontinentalcry.org/corporate-biopiracy-peru-threatens-indigenous-knowledge/

    • Draco T Bastard 6.1
      13 October 2016 at 9:28 am

      It’s how capitalism works – by stealing off of everyone else.

      • marty mars 6.1.1
        13 October 2016 at 9:29 am

        Yep that is why I agree with you that it must go.

        • Red 6.1.1.1
          13 October 2016 at 11:09 am

          Don’t get Draco started, please

          • Draco T Bastard 6.1.1.1.1
            13 October 2016 at 12:22 pm

            Why?
            Are you afraid that your tightly held beliefs will be challenged by reality?

            • Red 6.1.1.1.1.1
              13 October 2016 at 1:12 pm

              No just hearing the same old same old does sap your wil to live

              • Draco T Bastard …
                13 October 2016 at 2:02 pm

                The same old, same old only comes from the RWNJs that want to keep us the way we are. In fact, National seems to want to take us back to the 15th century and feudalism.

                • Stunned Mullet …
                  13 October 2016 at 2:32 pm

                  Didn’t know there was feudalism in 15th century NZ ?

                  • Draco T Bastard …
                    13 October 2016 at 3:39 pm

                    Did you know that the RWNJs in the 19th and 20th centuries were trying to make us more British than the British? The model that they wanted to copy was the failed aristocracy.

                    Same attitude still seems to apply in the RWNJs.

                • Red …
                  13 October 2016 at 3:26 pm

                  Did fuedal overlords run 1.5b surpluses

                  • Draco T Bastard …
                    13 October 2016 at 3:37 pm

                    Yes, once inflation is taken into account. Hell, Adam Smith reckons there was one lord who could have dined 30, 000 lords and ladies at his dinner table.

                    Of course, he did have the same poverty levels in the majority of people that National has as well.

                  • Siobhan …
                    13 October 2016 at 3:48 pm

                    They spent their surpluses on Wars.
                    Wars paid for by taxing peasants and serfs.
                    I know this wasn’t done with cash, rather produce, free labour etc…but its the same difference, it’s ‘surplus’ being diverted, while the welfare needs of the peasants are ignored.

  7. Ad 7
    13 October 2016 at 8:12 am

    I was kind-of hoping for Trump to run a stronger case against Hillary.

    I was expecting that he would be far superior in the debates, and she would win the electoral college largely through Democrat Party superior vote-collecting capacity.

    But putting a misogynist up against a feminist has gone badly.

    Trump is beginning to look like the best Democratic Party renewal programme for the Senate that we have seen for many, many years.

    • Nic the NZer 7.1
      13 October 2016 at 1:26 pm

      Yes, he has also ‘renewed’ the republican party by sending many of the neo-con members back to their original political allies in the democratic party.

  8. Nic the NZer 8
    13 October 2016 at 8:45 am

    Just discovered a new and actually quite exciting twitter account, ‘New Real Peer Review’.

    Best recent tweet “Gender scholar puzzled over the fact that most females are women and most males are men”

    • Puckish Rogue 8.1
      13 October 2016 at 8:48 am

      Nice

    • mikesh 8.2
      13 October 2016 at 9:30 am

      “Gender” is a grammatical term. Nouns and adjectives, in some languages, have genders. People have sexes. “Sex” is not a four letter word.

      • weka 8.2.1
        13 October 2016 at 10:22 am

        Yes, but ‘sex scholar’ would have a different connotation.

      • Nic the NZer 8.2.2
        13 October 2016 at 10:44 am

        The actual paper in question does not even go into gender in grammatical terms at all. Most people master Genders meaning in the real world during pre-school, others conduct ‘serious’ academic research on the subject in higher education.

        ‘The second is the fact that, usually, sex and gender come together in the way that is expected, I.e. the fact that most females are women and most males are men needs to be explained.’

        or

        ‘It will be concluded that, even in our postmodern world with its technological opportunities the division into the two sexes is extraordinarily persistent’

        One can quite vividly see the authors of these statement struggling with the fact that words actually have commonly held meaning (Something routinely denied by postmodern literature).

        “Sex” is clearly a 3 letter word if you can count. I don’t seem to have the context for that joke, probably its not a funny one (in case its hilarious please explain it).

        • Psycho Milt 8.2.2.1
          13 October 2016 at 12:28 pm

          … the fact that most females are women and most males are men needs to be explained.

          It’s the fact that people who can’t write are able to work as academics that needs to be explained. The above doesn’t get any less funny if it’s written correctly as “most women are female and most men are male.”

          • Nic the NZer 8.2.2.1.1
            13 October 2016 at 1:17 pm

            That is not an equivalent statement though, correct English though it may be. This may have important implications for what pressing question the author of those words is puzzled about.

  9. aom 9
    13 October 2016 at 8:59 am

    Kim Hill is a breath of fresh air on RNZ’s Morning Report. This morning’s treasure was the interview with Judith Collins. Kim started by handing the Minister a shovel, then passed over replacements ones as Collins dug herself ever more deeply into the hole of her own making. The coup was letting the Minister ventilate non-stop at length then advising listeners where Judith Collins’ credibility could be checked.

  10. pat 10
    13 October 2016 at 9:35 am

    “…Since the financial crisis in 2008, people have been fleeing the centre-ground across the Western political system and the political establishment are yet to confront this with any real, substantive solutions. Whether it is Bernie Sanders and Donald Trump in America, Jeremy Corbyn and the historic Brexit vote or the rise of the far-right in Europe – more and more people are fleeing an intellectually and morally bankrupt centre-ground.
    Votes are gushing to the political fringes because since the financial crash, establishment politicians have failed to come up with any meaningful solutions to the problems that ordinary working people face every single day. Politicians on both the centre-left and the centre-right across the West have failed to make neoliberalism and globalisation work for the masses.”

    Gordon Campbell presents another excellent piece on the current political landscape…..where is the alternative, and why have all parties failed to construct and present one in the 8 years post GFC, let alone the past three decades??

    http://gordoncampbell.scoop.co.nz/2016/10/11/gordon-campbell-on-how-the-political-centre-is-a-mirage/

  11. Gangnam Style 11
    13 October 2016 at 10:05 am

    The Sound radio just reported that Housing NZ is pretty much broke? Can’t seem to find anything on web at present.

  12. Colonial Viper 12
    13 October 2016 at 10:21 am

    Top level Democratic strategist emails show understanding of and complicity with producing “an unaware and compliant citizenry.

    But apparently the “compliance” of the citizenry is fading and it is a “problem” that “demands some serious, serious thinking.”

    Thanks go to wikileaks and Julian Assange

    How does this get handled in the general? Secretary Clinton is not an entertainer, and not a celebrity in the Trump, Kardashian mold; what can she do to offset this? I’m certain the poll-directed insiders are sure things will default to policy as soon as the conventions are over, but I think not. And as I’ve mentioned, we’ve all been quite content to demean government, drop civics and in general conspire to produce an unaware and compliant citizenry. The unawareness remains strong but compliance is obviously fading rapidly. This problem demands some serious, serious thinking – and not just poll driven, demographically-inspired messaging.

    (bold mine)

    https://wikileaks.org/podesta-emails/emailid/3599

    • McFlock 12.1
      13 October 2016 at 12:54 pm

      Actually, the full email reads like something you or I might have written – sort of a “told you so” commentary on the situation.

      It opens:

      Well, we all thought the big problem for our US democracy was Citizens United/Koch Brothers big money in politics. Silly us; turns out that money isn’t all that important if you can conflate entertainment with the electoral process.

  13. James Thrace 13
    13 October 2016 at 10:43 am

    Talking with a friend who is being evicted from their rental property as the Chinese landlords are bringing their parents over to live in nz. They were quite upfront with their plan.

    The children live here and are nz residents.
    The grandparents will be the babysitters for the grandchildren.
    Parents are currently 54 and 55 years old.
    The parents children are both working and will be supporting their parents.
    At the ten year mark both parents will be applying for national super.

    This, is fundamentally wrong. The parents are loaded, and will be complying with the requirement for funding to get the parental category visa.

    If they have the funds to apply for the parental category visa, why should they be able to claim national super?

    Easiest way to remove that ability is to simply state that people who were granted residency under parental category are ineligible for national super. Simple and effective.

    • Stunned Mullet 13.1
      13 October 2016 at 10:48 am

      Why single out the Chinese ?

      I know of Indian, South African, Zimbabwean, English and all flavours of imigrants doing exactly the same thing.

    • Colonial Viper 13.2
      13 October 2016 at 10:51 am

      Easiest way to remove that ability is to simply state that people who were granted residency under parental category are ineligible for national super. Simple and effective.

      and when they become NZ citizens, what then?

      Do you suggest that this category of NZ residents also be denied the vote?

      And of course, all this is simply micro-managing a much bigger problem.

      It is time to drive down immigration numbers by 90% plus, as Winston Peters suggested.

      This, is fundamentally wrong. The parents are loaded, and will be complying with the requirement for funding to get the parental category visa.

      Hey here’s a bright idea that the Left can raise: means testing NZ Super.

      • alwyn 13.2.1
        13 October 2016 at 11:48 am

        “Hey here’s a bright idea that the Left can raise: means testing NZ Super”.
        That would really piss off Jim Anderton, wouldn’t it?
        He was collecting it when he was getting a ministerial salary. The traditional “I’m entitled” attitude of his class. I wonder if Michael Cullen collects it?
        At least Bob Jones never applied for it and tells off wealthy people who do claim it.

      • Pasupial 13.2.2
        13 October 2016 at 11:57 am

        CV
        Just how strange is it for you being; the token Asian in NZ First? I don’t know if you’ve formally joined the party yet, but you certainly parrot their positions frequently. And as you’ve; burnt your bridges with Labour, and the Green Party doesn’t want anything to do with you, then I can’t see you’ve got many other options (except starting your own party I guess, but that’s a pretty lonely proposition).

        I can’t imagine that you will just become politically disengaged from the electoral system. Even though you have stated that you think (contemporary representative ballot-box) democracy is inadequate to the challenges facing it this millenium, I don’t think you were recommending a military coup by that. Direct action maybe?

        • Stunned Mullet 13.2.2.1
          13 October 2016 at 12:07 pm

          Isn’t [deleted] the token asian in Mana ?

          [Banned for 2 weeks for referring to an author by their real world identity] – Bill

          • Pasupial 13.2.2.1.1
            13 October 2016 at 12:52 pm

            Stunned Mullet
            Last I heard; MANA were falling back to a Māori seat only strategy, their partnership with the IP is history (as is the IP itself – there were only two nominations for their exec last month; so both were elected unopposed). I can’t really see where CV would fit in there (yes, I too know his offline name; but tend to avoid using it unless he has that day).

            Anyway, the MANA movement is as much about empowering the powerless generally, as it is about Nga Tino Rangatiratanga. See the continued involvement of Trinder and Minto (who might be non-Māori seat candidates next election, so I guess that’s some precedent for CV’s involvement):

            http://mananews.co.nz/wp/?p=9704

            It is not so far-fetched that some Asians (say; exploited sub minimum wage fastfood workers), might turn to MANA for representation (if none of the other parties thought there were the votes to be got from advocating for noncitizens). Whereas NZF are reknowned for their racist anti-immigration stances (though not for their consistency). Also, CV hasn’t been repeating MANA talking points, but has been for NZF.

            • Colonial Viper 13.2.2.1.1.1
              13 October 2016 at 3:46 pm

              NZF talking points on reducing immigration perhaps, but mainly because they are the only party willing to slash immigration to the bone.

              And the equivalent of one jumbo jet entering and leaving the country a day is more than enough, thanks.

              It’s time to transition away from this utterly unsustainable fuel burning aviation reliant foreign tourism enterprise.

              • DoublePlusGood …
                14 October 2016 at 12:01 am

                It’s also that we just don’t have the resources to keep up with the infrastructure needed for the population growth and that higher population is not sustainable either.

        • Colonial Viper 13.2.2.2
          13 October 2016 at 12:09 pm

          I think non-violent resistance against the world destroying capitalist direction we’re all being told to run in might be an idea.

      • Nic the NZer 13.2.3
        13 October 2016 at 3:20 pm

        “Hey here’s a bright idea that the Left can raise: means testing NZ Super.”

        Please dear god no. Has the left not lost enough elections based on unwanted super anuation reforms yet?

        • Colonial Viper 13.2.3.1
          13 October 2016 at 3:48 pm

          Well if the Left think that rich Chinese immigrants shouldn’t get NZ super (which is fair enough), then a means test is going to have to be instituted.

          And once you institute a means test for super, why not make that means test universal?

          Unless of course we simply mean to make it a modern day poll tax for the Chinese.

          • McFlock 13.2.3.1.1
            13 October 2016 at 3:51 pm

            OK, I’m pretty sure that your last line is meant sarcastically.

            The rest of 13.2.3.1 and 13.2 is impossible to tell, because it’s you.

            • Colonial Viper 13.2.3.1.1.1
              13 October 2016 at 4:03 pm

              Well, how can we be sure that some of these wealthy older Chinese coming in to NZ don’t have criminal backgrounds, and that’s why they’re so keen on leaving and coming here?

              Stories of Chinese wanting to take $$$ of hard currency out of China that they have obtained through fraudulent means are common enough that the Chinese Govt is working hard to stomp out the practice.

              Maybe it’s time that NZ implement some extreme vetting for these people before we accept them into our country. They seem to be placing unjustifiable burdens on our health and social welfare system as many commentators on this post have recognised.

              So it’s a suggestion which I think would make a lot of sense to a lot of people.

          • Chooky 13.2.3.1.2
            13 October 2016 at 4:06 pm

            there is not enough super for everybody…it should be restricted to New Zealanders who have been paying taxes for it all their lives

            ( are elderly NZers flocking to live in China and applying for Chinese super?…or don’t they have super over in China for the elderly?)

            young new Zealanders can not afford to pay for their NZ tertiary education and NZ houses ( because they have been taken up by recent rich immigrants) …let alone get well paying jobs ….and on top of this pay for super for the New Zealand elderly!!!!

            …young New Zealanders should not have the burden of paying for recent elderly foreign immigrants

            • alwyn 13.2.3.1.2.1
              13 October 2016 at 6:17 pm

              “it should be restricted to New Zealanders who have been paying taxes for it all their lives”

              Only those ones? Is that really how you are going to cut it off? No taxes paid, no super is the Chooky credo.
              You must mean that people who have been on benefits during their younger days won’t get anything then.
              People who stayed at home raising families will have to miss out as well.
              Are you really sure you mean what you are saying?
              God you really are a hard-hearted SOB.

              • Chooky …
                13 October 2016 at 10:25 pm

                stupid argument from you alwyn (look in the mirror and you will find the answer to your final insult)

                … every NZer pays taxes for being a NZer and living here…what about GST? ( or in the case of NZ students overseas they pay taxes and extra interest on student loans)

                ( the country is tax ridden …except for those who evade and avoid and hide their incomes…generally the wealthy )

                …even those on benefits pay taxes (GST) on their fruit and veges and everything else when they can least afford it

                ….and especially people, generally women, who have stayed at home raising families have paid taxes indirectly( with their life’s blood)….do they get paid a living wage for bringing up the kids and looking after the elderly?…they should be paid by the State ( do they…NO…so for them tax is a double whammy)

                …so yes all NZers should get super if they have lived here most of their lives and contributed to New Zealand society… they have all paid taxes

                • alwyn …
                  14 October 2016 at 11:07 am

                  “( or in the case of NZ students overseas they pay taxes and extra interest on student loans)”
                  No wonder your arguments make so little sense.
                  Somehow you seem to see the repayment of a loan, and paying interest on a loan as being “taxes”.
                  On that logic you would have to argue that anyone who borrows money to buy a house wasn’t repaying a loan and paying interest on the loan. They were, by your strange argument, “paying taxes”.
                  You do, finally, come round to being rather more generous on who is to get the super. However the way you seem to justify it is more than a little irrational.

            • Nic the NZer 13.2.3.1.2.2
              14 October 2016 at 12:52 am

              “there is not enough super for everybody…it should be restricted to New Zealanders who have been paying taxes for it all their lives”

              This is based on an incorrect assumption (that NZ can run out of money) in practice it does not work like this. The only super crisis in NZ is caused by NZ actually trying to deal with the make believe super crisis often discussed in the media. The make believe NZ super crisis is trying to cut the government deficit by limiting the governments total super payment obligations. This is also what Kiwi-Saver, the Cullen Fund and so on are about.

              In practice if the government succeeds in under-funding retirees they will in turn not be able to fund their retirement. By funding their retirement they will on the other hand provide ample opportunities for NZ’s workforce to cater to their needs. If the government under-funds retirees on the other hand and they can’t afford to live then they miss-out on their consumption (what they can buy to live on) and the workforce misses out on its work opportunity and income. That would be a tragedy for everybody involved and would also be more difficult to deal with as the private sector would lose some capacity to cater to the retired as this occurred. Also any spending the government does will eventually return to it to be collected as tax as it gets spent or earned. This will always provide ample income to actually fund any borrowing the government undertook to fund the super payments to begin with (not that the government can actually go broke anyway).

              It would also be possible to have a retirement crisis as too much of the active workforce was needed to assist the retired with their needs. This argument however is ridiculous (this is quite clearly not happening) and nobody is making it. The only super crisis in NZ will be caused if NZ tries to deal with its make believe super crisis. The make believe super crisis is entirely premised on economic models which claim all government deficit spending is inflationary (in the long run) but this is quite clearly more fiction than observable fact of the actual economy.

              • pat …
                14 October 2016 at 7:57 am

                “The increasingly secretive central bank does not reveal how much it costs to print each bill, but based on international parameters, José Manuel Puente, an economist and professor with the Institute of Higher Administration Studies, estimates that the cost of paper, ink and printing of each note is about 20% more than their face value. “They are not worth what they cost. It’s a joke. But that’s the way things are,” he said.”

                https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/oct/11/venezuela-on-the-brink-a-journey-through-a-country-in-crisis

                • Nic the NZer …
                  14 October 2016 at 8:32 am

                  Thanks Pat. I think UK penies cost more than their nominal value to issue also. Most spending however (in most coumtries is electronic account entries) so obviously does not suffer such an issue.

                  Yes, Venezuela has a significant inflation and problems arising from that. The question is what is the cause however. Is it government spending or on the other hand is it political instability causing shortages and supply issues (some intentional by opponents of the government), or is it some cause (exchange rate arbitrage) from the heavy use of US dollers by their economy?

                  So if its government over spending then this implies their economy is operating beyond capacity, does it not? Is it then?

                  BTW, all examples of hyper inflation I know about were caused by some significant drop in real supply side capacity. That includes Weimar confiscation of German industrial capacity as war reparations and Mugabe well known handing over of farm lands to African Native ownership.

                  • pat …
                    14 October 2016 at 8:43 am

                    lol..thats an interesting chicken and egg proposition…however even if you were correct it remains the relationship between realised (not potential) capacity and money supply….but print away.

                    • Nic the NZer …
                      14 October 2016 at 4:32 pm

                      Why does money supply come into it? Its a relationship between productive capacity and utilisation of that capacity causing suppliers to increase prices. The money supply is only a poor proxy for describing capacity utilisation rates of the economy, and difficult to limit spending via to boot!

                    • pat …
                      14 October 2016 at 4:52 pm

                      “The money supply is only a poor proxy for describing capacity utilisation rates of the economy, and difficult to limit spending via to boot!”
                      Money supply is indeed used as a proxy, poor or otherwise for describing capacity utilisation rates and it is for that simple reason that changing the supply rate changes the description even though the utilisation rate can remain unchanged.

                    • Nic the NZer []
                      14 October 2016 at 5:56 pm

                      Not clear to me what you are trying to say here.

                      In terms of using money as a proxy for capacity utilisation it probably doesn’t help that such modelling assumes that equilibrium is reached and therefore full capacity utilisation of the economy is always reached, because this is nonsense! That is the only basis for the QToM, a nonsense assumption not any form of scientific evidence.

                      On the other hand there is reasonable evidence that changes in the unemployment rate (a more direct proxy for capacity utilisation) does correlate well with changes in inflation.

              • alwyn …
                14 October 2016 at 11:17 am

                “It would also be possible to have a retirement crisis as too much of the active workforce was needed to assist the retired with their needs. This argument however is ridiculous (this is quite clearly not happening)”.
                The argument being made is not that it IS happening. The argument is that it WILL happen in the future. With the declining birth-rate, the huge bulge in the elderly from the retiring baby boomers and the great increase in the life expectancy of the population that there will be a massive increase in the ratio of retired people to the number of working people.
                That is expected to happen in New Zealand between now and about 2040. This is just the same thing that has been happening in Japan.
                The solution isn’t saving now and still retiring at the same age. It requires that people work longer and keep producing.
                After all, the only things that can be consumed are those that are produced. If a retired person is no longer producing their consumption can come only from the goods produced by those who are still working.

                • Nic the NZer …
                  14 October 2016 at 4:25 pm

                  If cutting the government deficit by saving up a large stock of investments is the answer then this was never the question, was it? Neither was it the question if we are trying to get people to save for their own retirement.

                  On the other hand if we want to boost capacity for elderly care then increasing their spending capacity now probably is an answer to that question.

  14. Muttonbird 14
    13 October 2016 at 10:48 am

    Meanwhile in Natland the finance minister shows his head for business…

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11728095

    In Natland:

    The rent collected from state houses was also not enough to assist the tenants’ “increasingly complex high needs”

    In Natland:

    Without changes, HNZ would “struggle to grow social housing supply in the areas of highest need”.

    In Natland:

    Treasury says HNZ corporation will run out of money by early next year.

    • Grim 14.1
      13 October 2016 at 12:01 pm

      Is HNZ a for profit organisation? national framing the debate as always and the media enabling them.

      Funky idea, find a region with high unemployment, not hard

      Setup a training institution,

      train and employee the locals to build their own houses, and the required infrastructure to support the local community. Extend this to supportive industries like forestry or quarry’s and stone masonry, Empower people instead of taking away their ability to support themselves.

  15. Colonial Viper 15
    13 October 2016 at 10:56 am

    How to get former President Clinton to your conference: pay over US$6M

    In what appears an amusing instance of the Clinton Foundation caught (with its pants down) in a glorious pay-to-play moment, in one of today’s leaked Podesta emails from November 2011, Ira Magaziner, who is Vice Chairman and CEO of the Clinton Health Access Initiative, sent an email to John Podesta and Amitabh Desai, Director of Foreign Policy at the Clinton Foundation, in which he said that “CHAI [Clinton Health Access Initiative] would like to request that President Clinton call Sheik Mohammed to thank him for offering his plane to the conference in Ethiopia and expressing regrets that President Clinton’s schedule does not permit him to attend the conference.”

    He appears to be referring to Sheikh Mohammed Hussein Ali Al-‘Amoudi, a Saudi Arabian and Ethiopian billionaire businessman, whose net worth was estimated at Forbes at $8.3 billion as of 2016.

    He is also a prominent donor of the Clinton Health Access Initiative.

    To this the response by Desai is a very simple one: “Unless Sheikh Mo has sent us a $6 million check, this sounds crazy to do.”

    At this point, Bill Clinton’s former chief advisor and current president of the infamous Teneo Holding Doug Band, chimes in that it probably is a good idea: “If he doesn’t do it Chai [Clinton Health Access Initiative] will say he didn’t give the money bc of wjc [William Jefferson Clinton].”

    Finally, John Podesta chimes in: “I agree with Doug and this seems rather easy and harmless and not a big time sink.”

    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-10-12/clinton-foundation-moment-unless-saudi-sheikh-gave-us-6-million-sounds-crazy-do

  17. Pasupial 17
    13 October 2016 at 11:44 am

    I was commenting yesterday (Open Mike comment #19) about protestors being run over in the USA:

    http://www.rgj.com/story/news/crime/2016/10/10/driver-plows-through-reno-protesters-under-arch/91883894/

    Which made me think about this case in Aotearoa:

    Former police officer and National MP for Whanganui Chester Borrows is confident he won’t be found guilty on a charge of injuring two TPP protesters and says he wouldn’t step down from Parliament if he was… pleaded not guilty, and was remanded at large until a case review hearing in September…

    incident happened on March 22, when he was driving a car at an anti-TPP protest in Whanganui’s Liverpool St… It is alleged he injured two female protesters with his vehicle…

    In a statement released at the time he was charged, Borrows said he would defend the matter.

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/82715740/MP-Chester-Borrows-in-court-over-protester-incident

    He’s pretty forgettable, so I couldn’t recall his name at first (googling “national MP assault” gives a couple of million choices – it took a while to refine the search till he popped up). Nothing new shows up for; “Chester Borrows case review hearing”, has anyone heard of any developments in this case?

    My suspicion is that Borrows’ lawyers are trying to push the case out past the 2017 election, at which point he can safely take his sentence: “The maximum penalty for careless driving causing injury is three months’ jail, or a fine of up to $4500. An MP must resign from Parliament if convicted of a crime with a maximum penalty of two or more years’ jail time.” So even if convicted, he wouldn’t be obligated to leave parliament. However, he might find it harder to get re-elected if the case does go to trial before the election.

    • te reo putake 18.1
      13 October 2016 at 1:04 pm

      But wait … there’s more! That’s the problem with saying you like to molest women, sooner or later some of the women you molested will confirm that its true.

      http://www.bbc.com/news/election-us-2016-37639839

      • Andre 18.1.1
        13 October 2016 at 1:14 pm

        It appears his propensity to molest women is the only thing he’s told us the truth about.

      • joe90 18.1.2
        13 October 2016 at 2:16 pm

        The thug responds.

        Trump yelled at @mega2e when she confronted him with these stories. pic.twitter.com/iZdGb3G3Dc— southpaw (@nycsouthpaw) October 12, 2016

        https://twitter.com/nycsouthpaw/status/786338751706378240/photo/1

      • joe90 18.1.4
        13 October 2016 at 5:39 pm

        And yet another woman comes forward.

        We walked into that room alone, and Trump shut the door behind us. I turned around, and within seconds, he was pushing me against the wall, and forcing his tongue down my throat.

        Now, I’m a tall, strapping girl who grew up wrestling two giant brothers. I even once sparred with Mike Tyson. It takes a lot to push me. But Trump is much bigger—a looming figure—and he was fast, taking me by surprise, and throwing me off balance. I was stunned. And I was grateful when Trump’s longtime butler burst into the room a minute later, as I tried to unpin myself.

        The butler informed us that Melania would be down momentarily, and it was time to resume the interview.

        I was still in shock, and remained speechless as we both followed him to an outdoor patio overlooking the grounds. In those few minutes alone with Trump, my self-esteem crashed to zero. How could the actions of one man make me feel so utterly violated? I’d been interviewing A-list celebrities for over 20 years, but what he’d done was a first. Did he think I’d be flattered?

        I tried to act normal. I had a job to do, and I was determined to do it. I sat in a chair that faced Trump, who waited for his wife on a loveseat. The butler left us, and I fumbled with my tape recorder. Trump smiled and leaned forward. “You know we’re going to have an affair, don’t you?” he declared, in the same confident tone he uses when he says he’s going to make America great again. “Have you ever been to Peter Luger’s for steaks? I’ll take you. We’re going to have an affair, I’m telling you.” He also referenced the infamous cover of the New York Post during his affair with Marla Maples. “You remember,” he said. “Best Sex I Ever Had.”

        Melania walked in just then, serene and glowing. Donald instantly reverted back to doting husband mode, as if nothing had happened, and we continued our interview about their wedded bliss. I nodded at his hollow words and smiled at his jokes, but I was nauseated. It didn’t seem to register to him in the slightest that what he’d done might have hurt or offended me, or his wife.

        An hour later, I was back at my hotel. My shock began to wear off, and was replaced by anger. I kept thinking, Why didn’t I slug him? Why couldn’t I say anything?

        edit: turn the volume down – damned auto play

        http://people.com/politics/donald-trump-attacked-people-writer/

        • Colonial Viper 18.1.4.1
          13 October 2016 at 10:41 pm

          Has Melania Trump personally and politically attacked this outspoken “bimbo” (using Hillary Clinton’s phrasing) just as Hillary Clinton did to the women who accused Bill Clinton of sexual assault?

          • marty mars 18.1.4.1.1
            13 October 2016 at 10:52 pm

            She may still be in shock at the number of allegations coming out. Possibly she is consoling the man she loves in his darkest hour.

            • Colonial Viper 18.1.4.1.1.1
              13 October 2016 at 10:56 pm

              Personally, I think Hillary came to terms with Bill’s predatory sexual nature decades ago. The perpetrator and the enabler. What a combo.

              Boy the Clinton campaign is on the rocks now.

              Hillary employed strategies to help Wal Mart avoid raising their poverty level wages according to The Intercept.

              Also learnt that Hillary was on the board of Wal Mart for 6 years. Fine employers, the Waltons.

      • Morrissey 18.1.5
        13 October 2016 at 6:02 pm

        The English had their own version of Donald J. Trump. This bloke was also a raving egomaniac as well as being, like Trump, about as funny as a mass grave…..

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mJ4a0ODPBM

    • Macro 18.3
      13 October 2016 at 9:20 pm

      It only takes one courageous soul to take a stand to embolden others:

      By late Wednesday evening the list of new allegations against Trump included:

      Two Miss USA contestants who claimed Trump deliberately walked in on them when they were naked in a dressing room.
      Two women who allege Trump groped or kissed them without consent – one in the first-class seat of an aircraft.
      A claim by a woman that she was groped at a Trump event at his Mar-A-Lago estate in Florida.
      A People magazine reporter who says Trump forced himself on her shortly before she was due to interview him and his wife in 2005.
      An incident in which Trump appears to sexualize a 10-year-old girl.
      The encounter with the young girl surfaced in a video of a 1992 Entertainment Tonight Christmas special in which Trump appeared, according to CBS News. Trump was 46 at the time.

      There has been a steady trickle of women relating similar instance of Trump’s sexual predation where he felt he was secure in in position of wealth and power. Even now he threatens to sue those who make allegations against him – and this would have been his modus operandii against the women who felt they were alone thus keeping them silent until now. But as with Crosby, Rolf Harris, et al, who also felt secure in their power, it will come to a bad end.

  19. Andre 19
    13 October 2016 at 12:27 pm

    The one and only (probably) teen African-American Trump supporter in Illinois somehow made it onto the LA Times tracking poll panel. Which is why that poll has skewed massively towards Trump.

    http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2016/10/12/one_of_trump_s_african_americans_in_illinois_is_messing_up_the_l_a_times.html

  20. Grim 20
    13 October 2016 at 1:08 pm

    Today all information is supplied to us, the best we can do is seek credible sources, and vet the information they supply to us based on our own rational and the truths we hold dear. Propagating misinformation and lies based on our own confirmation bias is a trap we all fall into, I have fallen for lies and been manipulated into believing falsehoods and yes it hurts when you find out, cognitive dissonance is real and blinds us all at times.
    In this age of social media manipulation it is imperative we hold to account those we follow even more so than those we oppose. When someone or something effects you emotionally or appeals to you in some way, stop and ask yourself why, and examine how this was present and supplied to you,

  21. save nz 21
    13 October 2016 at 2:03 pm

    From TDB about the spying, sounds appalling…

    “Not only will the SIS and GCSB have the legal protection to break any bloody law they like – THEY CAN EXTEND THIS POWER TO ANY OTHER STATE AGENCY THEY DESIGNATE TO HAVE THAT POWER!!!!

    Are you listening yet sleepy hobbits?

    Not only will the state spies be able to break any law legally – they can deputise different agencies to have the same power.

    ARE YOU LISTENING YET?

    Look, this is an extraordinary abuse of power the likes we’ve honestly never ever seen before. NO state agency should have the power to break any law they like and they sure as hell shouldn’t be allowed to tag in any other agency to have the same powers.

    As more and more NZers suddenly wake up to this appalling legislation and its ramifications – people are going to be outraged.”

  22. joe90 22
    13 October 2016 at 2:12 pm

    Uday ain’t too bright.

    The Trump campaign sent a fundraising email Wednesday morning claiming that “all the momentum” was on their side — and they used what appears to be a map showing only male voters’ preferences to prove it.

    http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/eric-trump-tweets-map-if-only-men-voted

  23. Chooky 23
    13 October 2016 at 2:15 pm

    ‘NZ Court hears closing arguments in Kim Dotcom’s US extradition appeal hearing’

    https://www.rt.com/viral/360986-kim-dotcom-extradition-us/

    …”Dotcom faces copyright infringement and money laundering charges over his now defunct file sharing website Megaupload. New Zealand’s High Court in Auckland has heard the extradition appeal over the last four weeks.

    Lawyers for Dotcom contended in their closing arguments that there was not enough evidence to show he conspired to commit a crime, according to Reuters.

    Dotcom took to Twitter to express his delight that the hearing has finished and thanked his lawyers for their work.

    He also revealed his focus is now on the launch of Megaupload 2 and Bitcache – a blockchain powered service that links file transfers to bitcoin microtransactions, both planned for next year…

    and

    ‘Kim Dotcom runs ‘Trump vs Clinton vs Putin’ Twitter poll, result is something you’d expect’

    https://www.rt.com/viral/362353-putin-clinton-trump-kimdotcom-poll/

  24. save nz 24
    13 October 2016 at 2:48 pm

    The irony of a homeless person finding shelter in an artwork about homelessness which the council workers removed on the advice of police in spite of council permits for artwork…

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11726953

  25. joe90 25
    13 October 2016 at 2:50 pm

    It’s called hubris.

    Trump's advisers wanted to hire an investigator to probe his past. He said no. https://t.co/gHlkEiIKv1— Mother Jones (@MotherJones) October 13, 2016

    http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2016/05/trump-said-no-opposition-research-vetting

  26. TheExtremist 26
    13 October 2016 at 3:49 pm

    Good grief….it just gets worse and worse:
    http://www.bbc.com/news/election-us-2016-37639839

    “Trump ‘groped woman like an octopus'”

    Shudder….

  27. james 27
    13 October 2016 at 3:57 pm

    Nationals good management delivers 1.8 Billion surplus.

    Waiting for lefties to tell us what a bad job they have done.

    Lots of money in the kitty for next year.

    • Muttonbird 27.1
      13 October 2016 at 4:26 pm

      It’s a trade off though, isn’t it?

      The consequences being increasing social stress – spikes in crime, homelessness, and housing unaffordability being three very visible indicators currently trending.

      • james 27.1.1
        13 October 2016 at 5:11 pm

        Of course – however there are lots of positives out there as well – but I know you are incapable of seeing them – but if you open your eyes they are out there.

        Many New Zealanders are more than happy and confident that the country is doing well. You know its great to look things that we should all be grateful for as well.

        • Muttonbird 27.1.1.1
          13 October 2016 at 5:15 pm

          You are doing a fine job as cheerleader. I apologise for turning your attention to those less fortunate than yourself – I know you don’t like thinking about them.

    • Siobhan 27.2
      13 October 2016 at 4:30 pm

      Big spend up for Election year….for tax cuts…that’s not wise governance, that’s short term bribery.

      Shiny baubles for National Voters.

      But no plan for economic growth. Which is why there are traditional National Business folk who are not that thrilled with this neo-liberal National Government.

      Though another earthquake would save them I guess.

      Meantime, with Public debt, we’re hitting around half a trillion dollars worth of gross debt, that’s an average of $100,000 for every New Zealander.

      You’d think such a ‘fiscally’ responsible Government would keep an eye on that.

      • james 27.2.1
        13 October 2016 at 5:07 pm

        “Which is why there are traditional National Business folk who are not that thrilled with this neo-liberal National Government.”

        http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11716154

        A quote from the traditional business folk who you say are not thrilled with this government:

        “An overwhelming majority agree the Government’s current economic management is good.”

        But you keep telling yourself that we are not happy.

        • Siobhan 27.2.1.1
          13 October 2016 at 6:11 pm

          You would think Business would want affordable houses for their workers.

          You would think business would want people investing in business not housing.

          You would think that business would want investment in R and D.

          From the Herald, Mood of the Boardroom……
          “The Government’s Business Growth Agenda has produced short term results but some CEOs are questioning whether it will be successful in the long term.

          The CEOs suspect the Government may have an eye on retaining power (next year) rather than promoting sustainable economic measures.”

          http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11716940

    • dv 27.3
      13 October 2016 at 4:31 pm

      Debt
      NZ$ 114,859,082,834
      That is 114 billion

    • Whispering Kate 27.5
      13 October 2016 at 4:50 pm

      If they have such a huge surplus, why then is Housing New Zealand going broke, has Bill cooked the books I wonder – explain please.

      • BM 27.5.1
        13 October 2016 at 4:57 pm

        They’re not going broke, the issue is with Phil Twyford who an idiot and doesn’t understand financing.

        http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=11728095

        • save nz 27.5.1.1
          13 October 2016 at 5:52 pm

          National have such a great record with Solid Energy…

          Maybe they have given all the state house cronies all the money… how many advisor fees, how many P fees, how many unoccupied ghost state houses….

        • Macro 27.5.1.2
          13 October 2016 at 6:02 pm

          I think you will find that it is Bill who is the idiot:
          “A Treasury paper showed Housing NZ was due to run out of cash for development and maintenance by February.”

          “”HNZC modelling indicates that it is likely to exhaust its cash balance by February 2017 based on its planned development activity.”

          This was despite the Government’s decision to forgo dividends from HNZ for the next two years.

          The documents showed this would no longer make a difference because HNZ was now unlikely to produce any dividends.

          HNZ’s financial situation was partly the result of the transfer of 2800 state houses to the Tamaki Regeneration Company, a Government-council entity, this year.

          The transfer meant $1.6 billion was removed from HNZ’s balance sheet and it was now collecting $34m less in rent a year.

          English has been asked for comment.”
          You should read further than the Headline idiot!

          • BM 27.5.1.2.1
            13 October 2016 at 6:47 pm

            Do you not understand Bill English explanation?

            • pat 27.5.1.2.1.1
              13 October 2016 at 7:02 pm

              when is a surplus not a surplus?

              if the government accounts were a business what would the shareholders think of a board that announced a profit on the back of reduced investment, deferred maintenance, a reduction in product development and staff training and the sale of core assets, and how would the future viability of that business be viewed?

              What was that about Bill’s explanation?

        • Muttonbird 27.5.1.3
          13 October 2016 at 7:31 pm

          Isn’t it fascinating the government has gone from demanding ‘fiscal responsibility’ from HNZ, to suddenly forgoing the once crucial dividend, to now throwing several hundred million at them in the space of a few short months? All this without a plan or coherent announcement.

          It’s obvious from many examples now that when the opposition says ‘jump’, the government says ‘how high?’

          • Sacha 27.5.1.3.1
            13 October 2016 at 9:21 pm

            More like “how low can we get away with?”
            Then Farrar fills em in,
            palm greased with silver.

    • Paul 27.6
      13 October 2016 at 8:32 pm

      National.
      Great for the super rich.
      Dreadful for the rest of us.

    • Stuart Munro 27.7
      14 October 2016 at 1:14 am

      National’s pathological lying pretends their non-performance is better than it is.

      The people, living in the real economy, know better.

      There are in the world objective truths, and subjective ones. There is no objective truth in National’s claims of economic continence, only subjective ones. Thus, only their crawliest sycophants credit their assertions.

  28. Morrissey 28
    13 October 2016 at 8:59 pm

    Which is more inane: this light chat show on public radio
    or Seven Sharp with New Zealand’s Sean Hannity?
    The Panel pre-show, RNZ National, Thursday 13 October 2016, 3:58 p.m.
    Jim Mora, James Elliott, Lisa Scott, Julie Moffett, Jesse Mulligan

    JIM MORA: Ha ha ha ha ha! Hmm, hmm.

    JESSE MULLIGAN: Ha ha!

    JULIE MOFFETT: No one ever looks HAPPY when they’re running, though, DO they?

    JESSE MULLIGAN: No, ho, they DON’T! [snicker]

    JULIE MOFFETT: Ahhh, and finally, uh, how are your selfie skills? Are you doing the old selfies a lot, James, or—?

    JAMES ELLIOTT: Yeah, my children encourage me to do that and then they normally put it on an app and then do something funny with my face so I’m a little bit confli—

    JIM MORA: Yeah I’ve had that.

    JAMES ELLIOTT: —little bit conflicted about that.

    JULIE MOFFETT: So-o-o, have they also tried the High Five selfie?

    JIM MORA: Hmmm….

    JESSE MULLIGAN: Naahh, how’s that?

    JULIE MOFFETT: Maybe this is NEW. So basically, a guy in the States decided—he MUST have had a lot of time on his hands—threw his phone up, took, you know, must have clicked the clicker at the same time while he was clapping his hands, and got a selfie of himself clapping his hands that he’d taken himself.

    JIM MORA: It’s pretty impressive.

    JULIE MOFFETT: So it’s basically hands-free selfie.

    JESSE MULLIGAN: Hmmmm….

    JIM MORA: That MUST be hard to DO.

    JULIE MOFFETT: It WOULD be hard to do, and apparently people have been IMITATING him and—-

    JESSE MULLIGAN: A ha ha HA!

    JULIE MOFFETT: —breaking their phones.

    JIM MORA: Breaking their phones.

    JULIE MOFFETT: They drop them.

    JESSE MULLIGAN: You like to send us a hands-free selfie—

    JULIE MOFFETT: He, he! High Five!

    JESSE MULLIGAN: The Panel at Radio NZ dot co dot NZ. Jim’ll make a gallery over the course of the next hour, while Lisa Scott and James Elliott chat about the issues facing the WORLD—

    JIM MORA: HA! If we can get Lisa in the building!

    JESSE MULLIGAN: Heh, indeed! And tomorrow on MY show, we put your food questions to Julie Biuso, send ’em THROUGH! Jesse at Radio New Zealand dot co dot NZ. Anything you want to know about FOOD, we can help….

    It only got worse after four o’clock. More tomorrow…

    http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/thepanel/audio/201819849/the-panel-pre-show-for-13-october-2016

    • Red 28.1
      13 October 2016 at 10:51 pm

      Why do you listen and watch all this shite if it upsets you so , remedy switch off

      • Gangnam Style 28.1.1
        14 October 2016 at 5:20 am

        Like an ostrich.

      • Morrissey 28.1.2
        14 October 2016 at 6:25 pm

        Come on Red, are you really serious when you ask such a question? No doubt people like you upbraided Molière for wasting his time transcribing and sending up the hypocrisies and idiocies of people he found appalling.

        I do agree with you that these people constitute nothing more than “shite”, but in spite of my distaste for them, I have a duty….

        http://www.foreveroldies.com/johnwayne3.jpg

  29. Chooky 29
    13 October 2016 at 10:47 pm

    Sorry all you f…..s looks like Trump is going to WIN!

    ‘Astrologers predict the election: Trump is from Mars, Clinton is from Venus’

    https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/oct/12/astrologers-predict-us-election-trump-clinton-zodiac

    “Dozens of astrologers are coming together to predict who will be president, anticipating a ‘potentially explosive’ October surprise that could shape the result”

    ( read more )

    • TheExtremist66 29.1
      14 October 2016 at 7:28 am

      Good thing astrology is a pile of steaming horseshit then

      • Chooky 29.1.1
        14 October 2016 at 9:51 am

        lol…I was waiting for the cockroaches to come out of the woodwork…but AOB must be away and McFlock safely tucked up in bed like a good boy

        …however it is good to see you on the case The Extremist66…(lol heartily again)

  30. Red 30
    13 October 2016 at 10:52 pm

    Trump will win people understand him good and bad, Clinton they just see a fake

    • Pasupial 30.1
      13 October 2016 at 11:13 pm

      Speaking of fake; do you believe a single word that you type, Red? Or are you just here for the shits and giggles?

      You are certainly not skilled enough to be a professional threadjacker (and your words are such shit that I can’t help picturing you giggling vapidly as you bang them out).

    • Chooky 30.2
      14 October 2016 at 9:56 am

      +100 Red…there is a oligarchy witch hunt against Trump from both the elite establishment in the Democrats and the Republicans…they are scared shitless of him

      …sure he is a bad mouth but that is as far as it goes imo

      …whereas the Clintons have real corrupt form and worse from a way back …which most peop-le are ignorant of

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ACyGsAAjfCI

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