Open mike 14/09/2011

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, September 14th, 2011 - 87 comments
Categories: open mike - Tags:

Open mike is your post. For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the link to Policy in the banner).

Step right up to the mike…

87 comments on “Open mike 14/09/2011”

  1. rosy 1

    So… what’s NZ’s position on voting for non-member state status at the UN if they don’t go to the Security Council for full recognition?

    The U.S has already said it will veto at the Security Council, but maybe the General Assembly is a different matter.

    The truth is that, by itself, a positive UN vote will not change the lives of too many Palestinians. But a negative response would be a disaster, boosting Israeli hardliners, weakening Palestinian peacemakers and choking the near-dead two-state solution.

  2. Topical image to send to friends and foes

  3. John Dalley 3

    @WJ. LoL

  4. It is worth noting that key, as prime minister of this country, at the opening of the RWC chose not to make any greeting or any attempt in te reo Māori. He deliberately decided not to

    “I could have of course, and for the most part I generally do, but I decided not to on that occasion.”

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/5614656/PM-I-could-have-said-kia-ora-I-didn-t

    So why not? At the biggest occasion this country has seen for a while, vacant key decided not to.

    I see a three way explanation

    1. he doesn’t give a shit
    2. nothing between his ears
    3. he was astucually making a point

    The point being – that tangata whenua should be happy to allow our culture to be used as window dressing for the grand illusion and when the dust has all settled it will be back to business, back to pretending to care about Mäori whilst dismantling everything Mäori care about.

    This, going around at the moment, sums it up

    “Miss half a game of rugby because a train breaks down: personal apology from John Key and compensation up for discussion.

    Have your doors kicked in, automatic rifles pointed at your kids, and four years of your life stolen because of police incompetence. Apology and compensation immediately ruled out.”

    http://mars2earth.blogspot.com/2011/09/that-tongue-is-forked.html

    • It was Key’s speech, he should say what he wants. I don’t think politicians must have a regulated quota of everything that should be included in every speech.

      I don’t mind other people using whatever languages they like in their speeches. I don’t mind people greeting me in the language of their choice. But like anyone else I should be able to use the language/s of my choice when I speak. So should Key.

      I’m comfortable with traditional Maori culture, sometimes I think it’s quite moving, but it can be overdone, and done too much, especially when some people deem it a necessity rather than a natural inclusion.

      • Bill 4.1.1

        It wasn’t Key’s speech. This wasn’t some private affair. It was a speech by the PM of NZ. And in that role, he doesn’t (or shouldn’t) get to just say ‘what he wants’. It’s all about appropriate deportment etc befitting of the occasion/situation.

        • Pete George 4.1.1.1

          His speech sounded befitting to me.

          And I thought there was more than adequate attention given to Maori culture in the opening ceremony – of Maori by Maori, seemed befitting too.

          • logie97 4.1.1.1.1

            Jokey Hen deemed that he didn’t have enough time to include even a simple mihi.
            He did apparently have enough time to make the most important statement as far as he was concerned however. This most dignified of gentlemen – couldn’t acknowledge the head if the IRB next to him. That’s because he wasn’t talking to the world – he was talking to the louts in the ground and he gave it to them full on – “GO THE ALL BLACKS”.

            Just how many world leaders in an international forum like that would have finished their opening speech in such an undignified way… he appeared to be like some excited adolescent – yet to grow up.

          • Morrissey 4.1.1.1.2

            His speech sounded befitting to me.

            Key was obviously intoxicated, and he boorishly refused to speak even one word of Te Reo. Yet you say that this is “befitting” conduct.

            I have seen several other people keel-haul you on this forum for your fatuous and ignorant views; your immediate endorsement of Key, no matter how loutishly he behaves, only serves to underline how smug and complacent you are.

            • Pete george 4.1.1.1.2.1

              Most boorishness I have seen related to Key is on this blog.

              Most of New Zealand seems to fit your category of “smug and complacent” with “fatuous and ignorant views”on Key. Keep bathing in bitterness if you like, but it’s likely to reman a paltry pool.

              • Morrissey

                Most of New Zealand seems to fit your category of “smug and complacent” with “fatuous and ignorant views”on Key.

                You have merely reheated my post and bounced it back, sans thought. That’s quite sad, seeing you’re actually running for public office.

                I hope you treat public debates in Dunedin with a deal more seriousness and rigour than you have managed here.

                • It shouldn’t be difficult, that will be with people prepared to debate.

                  • felix

                    Most of us are here to do just that, Anakin.

                    The problem is you behave as if this place is a soapbox for your thoughts to air untested, and as if anyone who disagrees with you has a nefarious motive.

                    • Joke of the day. If anyone tests ideas soapboxed here they get incessantly niggled and accused of having nefarious motives.

                      I’ve never minded having my ideas tested, why do you think I keep coming here? It’s not to have conversations with you, you’re just a convenient prop.

                    • felix

                      Pete, you do have a motive you fool – you’re running for office!

                      Accordingly you get criticised for the quality of your ideas, and it’s your problem if and you can’t handle it.

                      I’ve demonstrated this many, many times but it’s straight down the memory hole with you as you move on to the next slogan of the day.

                    • Yes felix, you’ve demonstarted how clever you are many many times.

                    • felix

                      Only in a relative sense Pete.

                      But this is typical of your level of engagement here: as soon as your ideas are criticised you cry foul and pretend it’s all about you personally.

                      Don’t you understand that people genuinely disagree with your ideas, Anakin?

                  • Morrissey

                    It shouldn’t be difficult, that will be with people prepared to debate.

                    You have the perfect forum to debate here. So far, you have failed to engage at all.

                    Robotically defending the emptiness of John Key is not “debate”.

                    Having said that, your evident eagerness to toe the party line will see you go a long way in national politics. Oh, sorry, I forgot—you’re in Benighted No Future….

      • marty mars 4.1.2

        the point is he DID say what he wanted – why is the question

        nice that you are comfortable – all sorted then

        Do you think MP’s have an obligation to actively understand Māori culture and values when they get elected to the House? As a potential voter I ask you, as a potential member of Parliment, to outline what you have done in this regard, please.

        • Pete George 4.1.2.1

          I have some understanding of Maori culture and values, enough for someone who is standing to represent people who are on general roll. I’ll leave most undertanding and representing of Maori interests to those who are standing on rolls where people with more of a Maori interest have chosen to vote.

          I don’t expect Pita Sharples or Hone Harawira to actively understand my culture and values either. New Zealand is multicultural, it would be nonsensical to expect all cultures to fully understand every other culture.

          • marty mars 4.1.2.1.1

            I’m pretty sure Pita and Hone understand the values of the dominant culture whether you expect them to or not.

            I am not sure what ‘some understanding’ means, can you give me an idea say around your understanding of the Treaty of Waitangi or any attempt made to learn te reo Māori for instance.

          • marty mars 4.1.2.1.2

            Can you confirm that it your Party’s policy to “leave most understanding and representing of Maori interests to those who are standing on rolls where people with more of a Maori interest have chosen to vote.”

            • Pete George 4.1.2.1.2.1

              I speak for myself here as usual, unless I make it clear I’m speaking for the party.

              Arts, Culture & Heritage

              As New Zealanders enjoy and recognise their cultural diversity; the celebration of those cultures, their histories and the arts associated with them has risen to be of great importance. UnitedFuture is committed to promoting an environment where the cultural identities of a diverse people are recognised and actively upheld.

              It is UnitedFuture’s position to:

              Recognise the special place of Maori and Pacific culture in New Zealand society.

              http://www.unitedfuture.org.nz/arts-culture-heritage/

              Treaty of Waitangi

              UnitedFuture recognises the Treaty of Waitangi as the founding document of New Zealand and believes it still has an important role to play. The Treaty provides the framework for a unique relationship between tangata whenua and the many other people of diverse cultures who make New Zealand their home.

              http://www.unitedfuture.org.nz/treaty-of-waitangi/

              Authorised by Hon Peter Dunne MP, leader UnitedFuture NZ, Parliament Buildings

              Maori culture is not something I see a need to put a lot of focus on in a general electorate in Dunedin. Neither will I pretend to be an expert on Auckland Public Transport, or Taranaki dairy farming. Other things are more important to most people here.

              I am focussing on violence and child abuse issues that do have a strong Maori connection. I work together with people Maori backgrounds that are capable of representing their cultural interests, and I contribute my own experience based on my own culture.

              • “The Treaty provides the framework for a unique relationship between tangata whenua and the many other people of diverse cultures who make New Zealand their home.”

                Quite true, I’d suggest you mull over that policy a bit more because I can’t see Auckland Public Transport or Taranaki dairy farming in there and you obviously don’t understand what ‘unique relationship’ means. You really just don’t care – just like key – yet you are all tears and weeping when the negative effects of not caring come in. Effects have causes and effects have to be dealt with, no argument there, but I expect politicans to look at the causes too. What have you learned about the causes pete, from the interactions you have had with Māori, what have they told you?

                • You really just don’t care

                  Nonsense, you’re jumping to conclusions because I won’t climb on board your Maori Correctness bandwagon.

                  What have you learned about the causes pete, from the interactions you have had with Māori, what have they told you?

                  I’m being told quite a bit, daily on forums I’m involved with. There are many complex causes. One contributing factor we are working on is a shared Maori and non-Maori culture of silence. We need to speak up about important things. We don’t need to be told what we should say in speeches.

                  • ‘Maori Correctness bandwagon’ I’m putting that up there with Pablo’s ‘doing a Mutu’.

                    play your politics but I wasn’t telling anyone to do anything – I asked the question – big difference – a lesson every budding politician should know. I still think you are delusional maybe deliberately, maybe not – for me I will vote for a different party than the one you represent but I do thank you for answering my questions.

                  • felix

                    Ooh, that is good.

                    Does the hairpiece know you’re throwing around terms like “Maori Correctness” Pete?

                    Are you a mole?

                  • Morrissey

                    One contributing factor we are working on is a shared Maori and non-Maori culture of silence.

                    Perhaps he’s talking about the silence of “Sir” Jerry (“Saw nothing, heard nothing, know nothing”) Mateparae.

                    He is a very silent Maori.

                    Though he may well have to speak at his war crimes trial.

      • felix 4.1.3

        In this role he’s supposed to speak for all of us, to the world.

        It seems to me that he was actually speaking to NZ voters, for himself.

        • Pete George 4.1.3.1

          How many languages do you think he should have used?

          • Draco T Bastard 4.1.3.1.1

            Just one – NZ lingua which just so happens to include Maori and English.

            • DavidW 4.1.3.1.1.1

              For the benefit of those whose analytical abilities stop at the first full stop, Signing is also an official language in NZ. (Part of the “NZ lingua” as it were). I don’t see the deaf or their apologists making a fuss that Key did not sign part of his delightfully short and appropriately adequate speech. Some of you need to get something useful to do instead of this predictably boring negativity that is blighting your demented souls.

              • freedom

                I did notice that the Sign Interpreter John Key has made wide and varied use of over his term in office was noticeably absent from RWC proceedings

          • Kevin Welsh 4.1.3.1.2

            ANYTHING would be better than the usual gibberish he comes out with.

          • felix 4.1.3.1.3

            “How many languages do you think he should have used?”

            Not really the point, Pete.

            The point is that he made a decision not to use any te reo. We’re just asking why, when speaking on behalf of NZ in an official capacity, he would consciously make such a decision.

            • Pete George 4.1.3.1.3.1

              He probably consciously (and subconsciously) made many decisions on what to say and what not to say. What’s your point?

              Apart from a few MC nitpickers and someone who likes to try and score points based on what people don’t say I doubt anyone is worried about it.

              • felix

                I told you what the point is – it wasn’t “his” speech, he was supposed to be representing New Zealand to the world. And he did so poorly.

                I realise you’re speaking on behalf of a party in Government so you can’t criticise Key publicly, but even a straight white conservative middle-aged middle-class man like yourself should be able to recognise that in his official capacity, the PM of NZ has a responsibility do do better than “Come in and grab a beer, we’re watching the footy!”.

                I see the self-serving populist politician in you coming to the fore too, Pete, in that last sentence. Only concerned with what you think others might be concerned with, and pouring scorn on anyone who disagrees.

                Oops. Thought you had a “new way of doing politics”.

                • I can criticise Key publicly if I want to, I have before. I don’t see a need to here.

                  Your’e the master of pouring scorn, as you demonstrate again here.

                  • felix

                    If you’re going to assume the mantle of “the bigger person” then you really ought to address the points raised.

                    Otherwise it just looks like cynical posturing.

                    • Don’t you read before jumping in with your daily dissing? I’ve addressed the points raised. I’ll repeat.

                      I don’t think Key should have to include in a short speech everything that might avoid annoying nitpicking critics that would never be happy. You’re a prime example, you diss what he says, and you diss what he doesn’t say. You come across as more than a bit dissperate.

                      I don’t think everything done by government, nor every speech made by anyone from government, should have to include Maori tokenism. Maori representatives are quite capable of speaking for and with their own culture. The opening ceremony included more than adequate levels of Maori culture.

                    • felix

                      I’m not asking for tokenism Pete.

                      Can you get your head around that?

                    • But you are. Can’t you get your head around that?

                      it wasn’t “his” speech, he was supposed to be representing New Zealand to the world. And he did so poorly.

                      In your opinion. He didn’t say “hi” or “gidday” or “hey bro” either.

                      My guess is that no matter how many token phrases and how much token representation Key included in his speech you would have come up with something he didn’t say to grizzle about.

                    • “annoying nitpicking critics that would never be happy”

                      I’m assuming you are talking about me because you’ve mentioned it a few times – you are a ‘nit’ pete and I sure as hell enjoy picking you.

                      do you think Mäori have too many rights or something – that seems to be what you are implying, like “what are you moaning for there was plenty of Mäori stuff in there, you should be bloody happy” and why add the “hey bro” in there – what’s that about? Why don’t you say what you really think instead of the ‘token’ innuendo?

            • Ianupnorth 4.1.3.1.3.2

              I’d go as far as saying about 19 – to represent the languages of the other countries (acknowledging that, for example, English could do NZ, four of the six nation teams, Canada, the US, Namibia; French could do Canada and France, etc….)
              Surely acknowledging each country in their own lingo would be too hard for a genius like Key?

              • felix

                That would’ve been a wonderful gesture, Ian.

                Bit much to expect from someone who can’t manage a “kia ora” though.

        • Mac1 4.1.3.2

          I think you’re right, Felix. “Go the All Blacks” was directed at NZ voters.

          I also think that Key did not want to associate Brand Key with Maori culture- a form of dog whistle by omission. The people who would have ‘heard’ this message are the same as the bold heroes who attacked the kaihoe of the waka on the wharf.

          • felix 4.1.3.2.1

            Precisely. Even Key admits it was a deliberate decision not to use any te reo in his speech.

            His moves are very calculated when it comes to knowing which audience he’s speaking to and what they want to hear. He made the decision not to use any te reo for a reason and I think it’s exactly the reason you describe.

            • The Gormless Fool formerly known as Oleolebiscuitbarrell 4.1.3.2.1.1

              A dog whistle by omission. WTF? Anything he says is a dog whistle. Anything he doesn’t say is also a dog whistle. Any wind expelled from his body is a dog whistle. As is any wind or liquid.

              • felix

                It’s not my fault that you don’t understand the terms used in this discussion Ole.

                • freedom

                  * polite applause from the gallery *

                  (I am wondering if our old friend biscuithead is One Anonymous Bloke that invaded the Ten Years Later post with some serious wackiness, expressed a [faulty] familiarity with the respondants’ views and ideals, yet has nothing to say on any other issue at all, ever ! )

                  • The Gormless Fool formerly known as Oleolebiscuitbarrell

                    Umm. No. Why would I have done that? Because I was worried it would make me unpopular or something?

                    And if 911 conspiracy has become received wisdom in your world and denial of it wackiness, you need to spend less time on the internet.

                    • freedom

                      ‘And if 911 conspiracy has become received wisdom in your world and denial of it wackiness, you need to spend less time on the internet.”

                      Mr biscuit, please do not put words in my mouth
                      i can do that for myself, along with the odd foot as we have witnessed here 🙂

    • Vicky32 4.2

      I see a three way explanation
      1. he doesn’t give a shit
      2. nothing between his ears
      3. he was astucually making a point

      Four. He hasn’t a clue where to begin!

  5. Adrian 6

    Thank God Key didn’t try to speak Te Reo, can you imagine how he would have sounded with being pissed as usual. Now we just have to win the ” Wib Illis Trobee “.

  6. Dave 7

    So what I really want to know is what happend to the plastic waka the country was up in arms about. I havent seen anything on it I cant just whip down and have a look im in the south but it would be good to know what the story is were our money went.

    • sophie 7.1

      I’ve been wondering that myself Dave.

      • Janice 7.1.1

        Me too.

        • Chris 7.1.1.1

          Pretty sure it was only ever going to be coming for the last few weeks of the world cup. So not meant to be around yet.

          • freedom 7.1.1.1.1

            when first announced Chris it was to be a ‘flagship marriage of technology and culture’ situated on the Waterfront for all people to enjoy during the entire event. This got whittled back to a $120,000 a day dinner hall for some VIP’s. Certainly it has a very small stage where some performances will take place and it is going to have some trade hall display stands to show some NZ tourism posters and maybe a few photos of great moments in Corporate welfare. There are rumoured to be a few hours a day it will be open to the public BUT it is primarily a venue that has been made available to Corporate Clients for Corporate Entertainment.

            Not really worth it if you consider what $2 million dollars can buy if you purchase food for hungry families, or Adult Education classes, or paid for kids dental work, or maybe a few Army Corps Engineers. Or it could have funded a wider Te Reo Maori education strategy. No , when you add that $2 million to the other tens of millions we have spent, as the IRB reaps the real monies from TV rights etc, why bother considering the complex and troubled community of New Zealand. Let’s just give those fat wallets and wide waistlines another 18 nights of gorging and grandstanding.

            • freedom 7.1.1.1.1.1

              p.s. does anyone know who recieves the income generated from this venture. It is bound to be substantial and as the Government paid for it don’t we get to know where the cash goes?

            • Deadly_NZ 7.1.1.1.1.2

              Oh and when they are finished with it, it will be scrapped cos NO-ONE wants to pay for the storage..

  7. joe90 8

    Slate: “Let Him Die”

    Wolf Blitzer put a terrific question to Rep. Ron Paul at last night’s CNN/Tea Party Express Republican debate in Tampa, Fla. What should happen, the moderator asked hypothetically, if a healthy 30-year-old man who can afford insurance chooses not to buy it—and then becomes catastrophically ill and needs intensive care for six months? When Dr. Paul ducked, fondly recalling the good old days before Medicare and saying that we should all take responsibility for ourselves, Blitzer pressed the point. “But, Congressman, are you saying the society should just let him die?” At that point, the rabble erupted in cheers and whoops of “Yeah!”

  8. Herodotus 9

    Interesting bumper sticker I noticed ” Don’t blame me, I voted Labour” had a wee chuckle !!!

  9. freedom 10

    At a very recent International Hearing (that shall remain nameless 😉 ) when i joined the on-line panel on Day One my first words were ” Kia ora my name is… ”
    and lo’ the others recognised and identified me immediately as a New Zealander.
    Many even referred to me as Kiwi.

    Key was pissed, forgot the protocol that would have been carefully explained to him, held onto the lecturn like it was a tiller in a squall, called the Webb Ellis Cup a Trogty and forgot to introduce his guest.
    All in all not a New Zealand Prime Minister’s best day on a World stage.
    ——————-
    regarding the Plastic Waka (cannot find the link with the listed dates)
    RWC2011 finishes on October 23 and the Waka is installed for 18 (very expensive) days,
    so that makes installation of the Waka sometime before October 5
    http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/4852407/Govt-funding-of-plastic-waka-slammed

  10. kriswgtn 11

    Driving into Palmerston North I saw quite afew Nat billboard signs with

    Hapeta(tick)
    National (tick)

    blah blah

    Then

    “A brighter future”

    I dont think people can be so fuking dumb to believe this bullshit a second time

    but then………………………………………………………………..

    • The Voice of Reason 11.1

      Saw some in central HB with ‘building a brighter future’. The implication being they’ve moved on from aspirational, they’re actually gonna do something this term. Nothing good, natch, but something.

    • Bill 11.2

      In WINZ office today. “A Brighter Future” as a blaring footer to some poster or other that I wasn’t paying much attention to in the passing. But I did notice that not so quietly ironic footer

  11. Microsoft comes up with something original?
    Mac is about to suck big time. Windows 8 is going to take over again.
    http://kiwi-linkwhore-simplexity.wordpress.com/2011/09/14/microsoft-comes-up-with-something-original/

    Police solve reckless driving with a coffee
    South Dunedin has turned into a haven for empty headed asocials with their tuned up skylines to break as many road rules as possible.
    http://kiwi-linkwhore-simplexity.wordpress.com/2011/09/14/police-solve-reckless-driving-with-a-coffee/

    Greece/Europe/World doomed
    There is no hope. No way to avoid it. Just close your eyes and get hit by the downward force of the world’s economy.
    http://kiwi-linkwhore-simplexity.wordpress.com/2011/09/14/greeceeuropeworld-doomed/

    Surprise! Gov’t money not spent correctly
    A shocker in The Press today. It seems that money reserved by the Government for a Maori and Pacific Islander family wellbeing plan is not really going to the people who it’s intended for.
    http://kiwi-linkwhore-simplexity.wordpress.com/2011/09/13/surprise-gov%E2%80%99t-money-not-spent-correctly/

    Blog: http://kiwi-linkwhore-simplexity.wordpress.com/

    [ You’re welcome to participate in discussion here, but not to advertise. Will let it through this time, not again. r0b]

  12. Cassie 13

    >It is worth noting that key, as prime minister of this country, at the opening of the RWC chose not to make any greeting or any attempt in te reo Māori.

    And outside NZ – the outside world the ceremony was meant to impress, as a showcase for the country – precisely no one noticed. Or realised it might be a deal in some way. Or gave a damn.

    • McFlock 13.1

      “And outside NZ – the outside world the ceremony was meant to impress, as a showcase for the country – precisely no one noticed. Or realised it might be a deal in some way. Or gave a damn.”
       
      But that’s kind of the point – at the very least, even if including PC nonsense (as tories like to call it) wasn’t his cup of tea, as minister for tourism Key should be aware of our international brand, that which differentiates us from any other damned country. A lot of people wouldn’t really notice or care if the Shell or Coca Cola logos were used incorrectly or ommitted once or twice, but it harms brand cohesion. At a “showcase for the country”. This dickhead of a PM fails on so many levels it’s like a spectacular traffic accident.

  13. freedom 14

    I am sure he will be relaxed about it asa he does not talk about security issues
    meanwhile the local media has the current position of the SAS in Kabul
    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10751784

  14. OK, here’s a thought. After Bill English’s brother landed himself a nice contract at the Ministry of Health, tasked with getting rid of over 400 jobs comes this news
    http://www.rotoruadailypost.co.nz/news/end-of-successful-era-on-health-board-as-chief-goe/1101194/
     

    Lakes District Health Board chief executive Cathy Cooney has resigned after a decade at the helm.

    Mrs Cooney’s resignation takes effect from June 30 next year.

    Now, I know that CEO’s have to give long periods of notice, but nine months? The cynic in me suspects some people have been tipped off about changes that will happen in the next financial year. How long before Lakes DHB does a ‘Southland’ and gets merged with either BOP or Waikato? How long before Tairawhiti DHB becomes a part Hawkes Bay DHB? What about Wanganui as a part of Midcentral?
     
    My prediction – 12 DHB’s by the end of 2012.

    • Adele 15.1

      Ian,

      It could actually be less than that. Regionalisation is definitely a real possibility. In terms of Midlands a regional dhb would incorporate not just Lakes, BOPDHB, and Waikato but also Tairawhiti and Taranaki. In terms of Auckland, perhaps Auckland, Waitemata and South. Many PHOS have already coagulated into mass structures.

      Regionalisation isn’t necessarily a bad thing, as some back office functions merging would create efficiencies and probably save money – which then could be redirected towards the front-line.

      On the downside would be the impact on local communities, whereas before they had a relatively easy path to management, in a regional environment the path becomes a state highway with a series of toll gates to manoeuvre through. Also, there would be a loss of jobs, mainly back office and management.

  15. Peter 16

    Clean renewable Energy Abounds in Canada

    http://www.vancouversun.com/business/Clean+renewable+energy+abounds+under+Canadians+feet+report/5399731/story.html

    No doubt it is the same in NZ but we will go “fracking” instead

  16. Jenny 17

    The “financialisaion” of food is good say Feds:

    http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/farming/5626342/Opposing-views-on-the-price-of-milk-at-todays-special-inquiry

    At the government’s Special Inquiry into the affordability of milk, Guy Ritchie, the head of the right wing Farmers Federation defends the high price of milk by saying that it is a result of the “financialisation of the food industry” which in the context of his argument is something the Fed supports.

    Below are some selected quotes on the Feds submission to the inquiry:

    Ritchie will tell the committee that a complex range of global factors has resulted in the rapid increase of the price of milk and other foods, including the financialisation of the food industry and increasing domination of transnational companies in the production, processing, distribution, and retailing of food.

    A Federated Farmers spokesman said the farmer lobby group would defend its case that the domestic dairy markets in New Zealand were operating effectively under existing legislation.

    Federated Farmers will recommend the committee conclude Kiwis are not paying too much for milk relative to other countries.

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  • The rot at the top.
    When military leaders cover up and lie to elected civilian authorities, the foundation of democratic civil-military relations is undermined because it is those authorities who are entrusted to hold the military accountable to the public that they mutually serve. But this is only true if civilian political authorities take their ...
    KiwipoliticoBy Pablo
    11 hours ago
  • Challenging the voting age in court
    The Make It 16 campaign to lower the voting age is launching this afternoon, and they have already announced plans to challenge the law in court:The campaign, named "Make it 16" will launch at Parliament on Friday, with plans to take their case to the High Court, testing the rights ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    11 hours ago
  • Israel’s elections herald a long siesta
    by Daphna Whitmore The long years of Netanyahu’s reign are drawing to an end. For years he has epitomized reactionary zionism as he oversaw hundreds of thousands of Jewish settlers seize land in the West Bank. There are now 700,000 settlers, putting an end to the myth that Israel was ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    12 hours ago
  • Petrol companies promise prices will come back down once peace is restored to the Middle East
    BP, Z and Mobil all insist that petrol price hikes are temporary, “in a very literal sense.” The nation’s major petrol providers are trying to allay customer fears over prices, promising that they’ll move to lower them again “immediately” when the Middle East is returned to its formerly peaceful state. ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 day ago
  • All Blacks unveil boat for Rugby World Cup 2019
    South African coach Rassie Erasmus says he has no idea what they’re going to do about the boat. In a highly anticipated press conference this afternoon, All Blacks coach Steve Hansen has finally unveiled the team’s boat for its Rugby World Cup 2019 campaign. In a press conference that went ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 day ago
  • An increasingly shoddy coverup
    The Operation Burnham inquiry continued to question senior NZDF staff today, and their shoddy coverup over their knowledge of civilian casualties continue to fall apart. If you recall, first, we were asked to believe that it was all a series of "mistakes and errors": a senior officer with multiple degrees ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 day ago
  • If we are to avoid making the earth uninhabitable, we need to rapidly decarbonise our civilisation, and cut emissions to zero as quickly as possible. This seems like an impossible task, but its not. Pushing hard on a few technologies and trends will let us halve emissions in a decade:Greenhouse ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 day ago
  • A further attack on transparency
    The Local Government Act 2002 Amendment Bill (No 2) had part of its committee stage yesterday. its a generally tedious bill about the nitty-gritty of local government reorganisation. But it includes a clause making the Local Government Commission subject to the Ombudsmen Act, and hence the OIA. Great! Except of ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 day ago
  • Ihumātao and Treaty settlements
    Yesterday Ihumātao's mana whenua reached a consensus that they would like their land back, and asked the government to negotiate with Fletcher's for its return. The government's response? Try and undermine that consensus, while talking about how doing anything would undermine existing Treaty settlements. The first is just more bad ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 days ago
  • Protecting our history
    Its Suffrage Day, the 126th anniversary of women winning the right to vote (but not stand in elections) in New Zealand. And to celebrate, the government has bought Kate Sheppard's house in Christchurch:The government has bought Kate Sheppard's former home in Christchurch for more than $4 million. The Ilam villa ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 days ago
  • Climate Change: Ostracising the coal-burners
    The UN climate summit is happening in new York next week, and unlike previous years, coal-burners and denier-states are not being invited to speak:Leading economies such as Japan and Australia will not be invited to speak at next week’s crunch UN climate change summit, as their continued support for coal ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 days ago
  • Jojo Tamihere Salutes Herr Goff.
    Get Back Jojo! The elation in Mayor Phil Goff’s camp may be easily imagined as they watched social media light up in indignation at challenger John Tamihere’s "Sieg Heil to that" quip. Just when JT’s notoriously right-wing, sexist and homophobic stains were beginning to fade back into his ‘colourful’ past, ...
    2 days ago
  • Hard News: A fun but flawed weed documentary
    Patrick Gower is good value when he's high. Not that I've ever, you know, got stoned with him. But in the second part of his documentary Patrick Gower on Weed, he does what you'd expect in a modern weed documentary and immerses himself – first with a doctor, then a ...
    2 days ago
  • Candidate Survey: Western Bay of Plenty – Local Body Elections 2019
    We surveyed candidates on their attitudes to issues facing the Western Bay Region, find out what they think: “Closing the Gap” Tauranga, one of the area groups of Income Equality Aotearoa NZ Inc., has surveyed all candidates in the three local body elections to discover attitudes to some basic issues ...
    Closing the GapBy Tracey Sharp
    2 days ago
  • Project Nettie calls on scientists to defend biology
    Please spread widely, and sign, to support science and rationalism over the new irrationalism sweeping universities and institutions.  PROJECT NETTIE Sexual reproduction, the generation of offspring by fusion of genetic material from two different individuals, evolved over 1 billion years ago. It is the reproductive strategy of all higher animals ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    2 days ago
  • I’m glad I don’t live in Auckland
    Just when I was thinking that Palmerston North's mayoral race (which includes a convicted child molester / public wanker and a convicted child beater) was the worst in the country, Auckland mayoral candidate John Tamihere opened his mouth:Auckland mayoral candidate John Tamihere is being slammed for using the words "sieg ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 days ago
  • Index of Power Update, 2018-19: China #2
    We reprint below an article from the excellent website the Economics of Imperialism by Tony Norfield This is an update of the statistics for my Index of Power, using data for 2018-19 and discussing what a country’s ranking reflects. The major change is that China’s rank has shifted up and ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    2 days ago
  • Climate Change: A history lesson
    Why is New Zealand climate change policy so crap? The Herald this morning has a long article on the twists and turns of climate change policy in New Zealand [paywalled / depaywall script], which shows where we've been. The short version is that the government first began worrying about this ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 days ago
  • What the All Blacks Mean to Us
    The All Blacks have been, for more than a century, arguably the most successful International sports team in the world. But they are more than that; even for those Kiwis who are immune to the charms of rugby (and there are more than a few), the All Blacks are ambassadors ...
    Bryan GouldBy Bryan Gould
    3 days ago
  • No one is born into the wrong body
    A short and incredibly powerful speech from a young lesbian woman. No one is born in the wrong body. ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    3 days ago
  • Contempt
    Back in June, the UK Court of Appeal ruled that that country's continued arms sales to Saudi Arabia were unlawful. So you'd expect that the UK government stopped approving them, right?Of course not:The government has apologised for breaching a court ruling against the sale of weapons to Saudi Arabia that ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    3 days ago
  • Covering up the cover-up
    Yesterday NZDF officials were put on the stand about the lies they had told over Operation Burnham, making implausible claims that it was all a big mistake. But along the way, we learned they had already been put on the spot about it by a previous Defence Minister, who had ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    3 days ago
  • Not as important as they think they are
    Farmers have been whining a lot lately, about the methane targets in the Zero Carbon Bill, about Canterbury's proposed nitrogen limits, and about the government's new proposals to stop them from shitting in our lakes and rivers. These policies are "throwing farmers under the tractor", they will force farmers off ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    3 days ago
  • Behind Every Good Woman Should Stand – Another Good Woman.
    Alone, Alone, All, All, Alone: To argue that the Prime Minister is the victim of her advisers’ failure to keep her informed may offer Jacinda some measure of exoneration – but only at the cost of casting her as a hopeless political ingénue. A star-dusted muppet, whose only purpose is to ...
    4 days ago
  • Poor quality, poorly educated kiddie ‘Journalists’ spreading fake news
    In times of hysteria about the “World coming to an end” and “rising sea levels” so-called ‘Journalists’ who can barely spell words longer than four letters are having a ball! Though the majority of the Public have worked out that manmade climate change is nothing short of pseudo-science, and the ...
    An average kiwiBy admin@averagekiwi.com
    4 days ago
  • Chris Trotter on the BFD
    I don't want to give pblicity to certain parts of the internet that are better left to fester in their own irrelevance (I know, a bit like this place) but the listing of Chris Trotter as a 'author' on Cameron Slater's spinoff website, the BFD requires some explanation.Now, I don't ...
    4 days ago
  • Sex is not a spectrum
    The text below is a Twitter thread by Heather Heying that explains the essence of sexual reproduction and it long evolutionary history. She is an evolutionary biologist and a “professor-in-exile” after she and her husband, Bret Weinstein, stood up to supporters of an enforced “Day of Absence” for white staff and teachers ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    4 days ago
  • Climate Change: Trees, aviation, and offsets
    With crunch time for new Zealand climate policy approaching, most of the New Zealand media have got on board with a global reporting effort to cover the issue. There's one strand of stories today about polling and what it shows about changing public attitudes to the crisis, but the strand ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    4 days ago
  • Pissing-Off The Israelis Is A High-Risk Strategy.
    Dangerous Foes: For those readers of Bowalley Road who feel disposed to dismiss any prospect of an Israeli destabilisation of New Zealand politics, the example of the United Kingdom repays close attention. Ever since the election of Jeremy Corbyn as leader of the British Labour Party, the Israelis have sanctioned, funded and ...
    4 days ago
  • Something to go to in Wellington
    Make It 16, the youth-led campaign to lower New Zealand's voting age, is holding an official campaign launch at Parliament this Friday from 16:30. If you'd like to attend, you can register using EventBrite here. ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    4 days ago
  • A founding member responds to Peace Action Wellington
    by Don Franks It was a lovely sunny Wellington afternoon with blue skies above  the beaches.  In Courtenay Place, political activists packed out a stuffy upstairs room for an important meeting. The assembled pacifists, anarchists, communists and independent young radicals of Peace Action Wellington felt the need for a mission ...
    RedlineBy Admin
    4 days ago
  • “Mistakes and errors”
    Current and former NZDF top brass are being publicly grilled this week by the hit and run inquiry over their public responses to allegations of civilian casualties. Previously, they've claimed there were no casualties, a position which led them to lie to Ministers and to the public. Now, they're saying ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    4 days ago
  • “Homosexuality is same-sex attraction and relationships, not heterosexuals with delusions of gende...
    by Rafael D. Quiles (gender-critical gay man from Puerto Rico) The writing on the wall is right in people’s faces and people just don’t see it or don’t want to. What could actually possess a heterosexual male to want to feminize himself and claim that he is a lesbian? Because ...
    RedlineBy Admin
    5 days ago
  • Trump: “Where’s my favourite dictator?”
    From the Wall Street Journal:Inside a room of the ornately decorated Hotel du Palais during last month’s Group of Seven summit in Biarritz, France, President Trump awaited a meeting with Egyptian President Abdel Fattah Al Sisi. Mr. Trump looked over a gathering of American and Egyptian officials and called out in ...
    5 days ago
  • Magdalen Burns, 1983-2019, fighter for women’s liberation
    by the Redline blog collective At Redline we are very saddened to hear of the death of Magdalen Burns who passed away on the morning of Friday, September 13 (British time). Magdalen was a great fighter for the rights of women in general and lesbian women in particular, a defender ...
    RedlineBy Admin
    6 days ago
  • Parliament and the Executive
    The Brexit issue has certainly brought with it a series of apparently difficult constitutional issues, many of them concerning the respective roles of the executive and parliament. Most of them arise because of the unwillingness of MPs, despite their professions to the contrary, to be bound by a constitutional rarity ...
    Bryan GouldBy Bryan Gould
    7 days ago
  • The Abigail Article; Martyn Bradbury’s Article, and My Response
    . . This blogpost is different to my usual format of reporting on issues… Since July 1011, I have blogged on a variety of political issues; near always political and/or environmental; mostly highly critical of the previous National Government. Other issues included Israeli occupation of Palestinian lands and repression of ...
    Frankly SpeakingBy Frank Macskasy
    7 days ago
  • Police will have to wear silly Buckingham Palace hats from now on, says Police Minister
    Those close to the Police Minister believe the initiative may be the result of Nash “seeing a great deal” on AliExpress. In a move that comes seemingly out of nowhere, Police Minister Stuart Nash announced this afternoon that he expects all frontline staff to don bearskin hats, famously worn by ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 week ago
  • A sensible crackdown
    The government has released its Arms Legislation Bill, containing the second tranche of changes to gun laws following the March 15 massacre. And it all looks quite sensible: a national gun register, higher penalties for illegal possession and dealing, tighter restrictions on arms dealers and shooting clubs, and a shorter ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • California bans private prisons
    Private prisons are a stain on humanity. Prison operators explicitly profit from human misery, then lobby for longer prisons terms so they can keep on profiting. And in the US, prison companies run not only local and state prisons, but also Donald Trump's immigration concentration camps. Faced with this moral ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Why PPPs are a bad idea
    When National was in power, they were very keen on Public-Private Partnerships (PPPs) - basicly, using private companies to finance public infrastructure as a way of hiding debt from the public. They were keen on using them for everything - roads, schools, hospitals. But as the UK shows, that "service" ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • A Movement That No Longer Moves.
    Moving And Shaking: There was a time when people spoke matter-of-factly about the “labour movement” – a political phenomenon understood to embrace much more than the Labour Party. Included within the term’s definition was the whole trade union movement – many of whose members looked upon the Labour Party as ...
    1 week ago
  • NZ ‘left’ politically embracing extreme postmodernism
    by Philip Ferguson Much of the left, even people who formally identify as marxists, have collapsed politically in the face of postmodern gender theory of the sort pioneered by American philosopher Judith Butler. For Butler even biological sex is socially constructed. “If the immutable character of sex is contested, perhaps ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    1 week ago
  • The obvious question
    The media is reporting that the (alleged) Labour party sexual assaulter has resigned from their job at Parliament, which means hopefully he won't be turning up there making people feel unsafe in future. Good. But as with everything about this scandal, it just raises other questions. Most significantly: why the ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • The moment I found out that you found out, I acted swiftly
    By Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern I am every bit as angry as you are. I am every bit as disappointed as you must be. The people with power, oversight and the ability to do something about these processes within the Labour Party should be ashamed. Whoever those people are, I ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 week ago
  • This is why people hate property developers
    Property developers think there is an "oversupply" of houses in Auckland:High turnover rates and falling prices may be a sign that there are too many new houses going in to some parts of Auckland, commentators say. [...] Property developer David Whitburn said there was a "bit of an oversupply" in ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Australia to Pacific: “Fuck you, you can all drown”
    World leaders are meeting in New York in two weeks for the 2019 Climate Action Summit, where they are expected to announce new and more ambitious targets to stop the world from burning. But the Australian Prime Minister won't be there, despite being in the USA at the time:Scott Morrison ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Implausible ignorance
    Labour Party president Nigel Haworth resigned yesterday over the party's sexual assault scandal. But while that's good news, its unlikely to take away the stench of a coverup. Because according to Paula Bennett in Parliament yesterday, pretty much everyone in the Prime Minister's office was involved as well:I have been ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Labour’s Fatal Flaw.
     Two-Faced? Labour insiders' commitment to the neoliberal status quo puts them at odds with their party’s membership; its trade union affiliates; and a majority of Labour voters, but this only serves to strengthen the perception they have of themselves as a special elite. Among the lesser breeds, they’ll talk up a ...
    1 week ago
  • Ten reasons the Tories do NOT want an election
    There has been a lot of talk about Boris Johnson wanting an election, and he has blustered with great gusto about 'chicken' Jeremy Corbyn refusing one, but I think there are many reasons why he is secretly glad he has been refused the opportunity:The Tories are an utter rabble,tearing themselves ...
    1 week ago
  • Prorogation Illegal, rule Scottish judges
    Scottish appeal court judges have declared that Boris Johnson’s decision to suspend parliament in the run-up to the October Brexit deadline is unlawful. The three judges, chaired by Lord Carloway, Scotland’s most senior judge, overturned an earlier ruling that the courts did not have the powers to interfere in the prime ...
    1 week ago
  • Let me explain what I meant by Everyday New Zealanders
    By Simon Bridges. The following is a press release from the office of Simon Bridges, leader of The National Party. Key ora, New Zealand. Happy Maori Language Week. Look, I’m writing to you today because I want to clear something up. There’s been a lot of kerfuffle around some things ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 week ago
  • Yes, the SIS is subject to the Public Records Act
    I understand there's some stuff going round about how the SIS "was removed from the list of public offices covered by the Public Records Act in 2017". The context of course being their records derived from US torture, which will be disposed of or sealed. The good news is that ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • An evidence-based discussion of the Canadian fluoride/IQ study
    Dr. Christopher Labos and Jonathan Jarry discuss the recent Canadian fluoride/IQ research. They provide an expert analysis of the paper and its problems. Click on image to go to podcast. The critical debate about the recent ...
    1 week ago
  • Climate Change: Australia in denial
    Australia is burning down again, and meanwhile its natural disaster minister is denying climate change:Australia’s minister responsible for drought and natural disasters, David Littleproud, has said that he doesn’t “know if climate change is manmade”. Clarifying earlier comments that the question is “irrelevant” when considering the Coalition government’s response to ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Philippines activist speaking on the Duterte tyranny
    Auckland Philippines Solidarity is excited to host Professor Judy Taguiwalo for a speaking tour of NZ in September. She is a well-known activist in the Philippines and was a political prisoner under the Marcos dictatorship. Professor Taguiwalo briefly served as a Cabinet member under President Duterte but was forced from ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    1 week ago
  • Disgust
    I have no special insights to offer on the Labour sexual assault coverup. All I have is disgust. Disgust that an organisation could fail its people so badly. Disgust that they punished the victims rather than the perpetrator. Disgust that its party hacks are apparently blaming the victims for demanding ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Speak Up for Women calls out Greens’ censorship
    This open letter to the Green Party was penned after an opinion piece by Jill Abigail, a feminist and founding member of the party, was censored by the Greens’ leadership. (Redline has reprinted her article here).The intolerance of the Green Party leaders and their acceptance of the misogyny of gender ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    1 week ago
  • Member’s Day: End of Life Choice, part 3
    Today is a Member's day, and David Seymour's End of Life Choice Bill continues its slow crawl through its committee stage. They're spending the whole day on it today, though the first hour is likely to be spent on voting left over from last time. After that they'll move on ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Flight to Los Angeles turned back after passengers decide they don’t want to go anymore
    An ambitious plan to fly to Los Angeles petered out into a brief sight-seeing trip and a desire to return home and get some sleep before work tomorrow. Air New Zealand has confirmed a flight to Los Angeles last night was turned back about a quarter of the way into ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 week ago
  • Indigenous Futures: defuturing and futuring – an analytical framework for policy development?
    There appears to be consensus – by omission – that the concept of indigenous futures should be accepted at face value. So I scavenged the internet to see if I could locate an academic descriptor or a framework around how we think about it as a concept, and whether it ...
    EllipsisterBy Ellipsister
    1 week ago
  • Cadbury rumoured to be releasing the Pineapple Trump
    Here’s another novelty chocolate to shove in your gob, New Zealand Cadbury could be seeking to make itself great again with a rumoured new release: Pineapple Trumps, a spin on its classic chocolate-encased pineapple treat and do-it-yourself tooth remover. The global confectionery manufacturer and bumbling “before” character in an infomercial, ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 week ago
  • The coming resource war.
    During my time in the Pentagon I had the privilege of sitting down with military leaders and defence and security officials from a variety of Latin American nations. Sometimes I was present as a subordinate assistant to a senior US defence department official, sometimes as part of a delegation that ...
    KiwipoliticoBy Pablo
    1 week ago
  • Māori Language Week with The Civilian
    Kia ora, Aotearoa. It’s that magical time of year. Te Wiki o te Reo Māori. In English, the week that frightens talk radio. As you probably know by now, all your favourite media outlets are participating, some more successfully than others. Stuff has changed its name to Puna for the ...
    The CivilianBy admin
    1 week ago
  • Will Horizons act on climate change?
    Local body elections are coming up next month. And it looks like all Palmerston North candidates for Horizons (the Manawatu-Whanganui Regional Council) want to take action on climate change:Climate change is set to be a key issue in Palmerston North for the next three years if those wanting to get ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • BORA reform is stalled
    Eighteen months ago, the government promised to strengthen the Bill of Rights Act, by explicitly affirming the power of the courts to issue declarations of inconsistency and requiring Parliament to formally respond to them. So how's that going? I was curious, so I asked for all advice about the proposal. ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    1 week ago
  • Corbyn and Brexit
    As the Brexit saga staggers on, the focus is naturally enough on the Prime Minister and his attempts to achieve Brexit “do or die”. But the role played by the Leader of the Opposition is of almost equal interest and complexity. The first problem for Jeremy Corbyn is that he ...
    Bryan GouldBy Bryan Gould
    1 week ago
  • A ditch for him to die in
    Last week, English Prime Minister Boris Johnson boldly declared that he would rather die be dead in a ditch than delay Brexit. Unfortunately for him, the UK parliament accepted the challenge, and promptly dug one for him. The "rebellion bill" requires him to ask for and secure yet another temporary ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • Warning! Warning! Danger Jacinda Ardern! Danger Marama Davidson! Warning!
    Lost In Political Space: The most important takeaway from this latest Labour sexual assault scandal, which (if I may paraphrase Nixon’s White House counsel’s, John Dean’s, infamous description of Watergate) is “growing like a cancer” on the premiership, is the Labour Party organisation’s extraordinary professional paralysis in the face of ...
    2 weeks ago
  • Union solidarity with Ihumatao land occupation
    by Daphna Whitmore Every Sunday for the past two months unionists from First Union, with supporters from other unions, have set out to the Ihumatao land protest, put up gazebos and gas barbeques, and cooked food for a few hundred locals and supporters who have come from across the country. ...
    RedlineBy Daphna
    2 weeks ago
  • Climate Change: The wrong kind of trees?
    Newsroom today has an excellent, in-depth article on pine trees as carbon sinks. The TL;DR is that pine is really good at soaking up carbon, but people prefer far-less efficient native forests instead. Which is understandable, but there's two problems: firstly, we've pissed about so long on this problem that ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago
  • No freedom of speech in Turkey
    Canan Kaftancioglu is a Turkish politician and member of the opposition Republican People's Party (CHP). Like most modern politicians, she tweets, and uses the platform to criticise the Turkish government. She has criticised them over the death of a 14-year-old boy who was hit by a tear gas grenade during ...
    No Right TurnBy Idiot/Savant
    2 weeks ago

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