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Open mike 15/10/2013

Written By: - Date published: 6:36 am, October 15th, 2013 - 415 comments
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Open mike is your post. For announcements, general discussion, whatever you choose. The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy). Step right up to the mike…

415 comments on “Open mike 15/10/2013 ”

  1. Morrissey 1

    The Hall of Hogwash

    Exhibit No. 4: JIM MORA

    * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

    “The United States has been a bulwark against totalitarianism, hasn’t it.”

    * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

    —Jim Mora, Radio NZ National, The Panel, Monday 14 October 2013

    I am sorry to report that, far from responding to such nonsense, guest Panelists Matt Nippert and Josie Pagani maintained a silence closely resembling stupidity.

    hogwash, n. 1. Worthless, false, or ridiculous speech or writing; nonsense. 2. Garbage fed to hogs; swill.
    hypocrisy, n. 1. the practice of professing standards, beliefs, etc., contrary to one’s real character or actual behaviour, esp. the pretence of virtue and piety 2. an act or instance of this

    More hogwash….
    No. 3 JOHN KERRY: “The best way to give these negotiations a chance is to keep them private.”
No. 2 DAVID CAMERON: “We never support, in countries, the intervention by the military.”
No. 1 BARACK OBAMA: “Madiba’s moral courage…people standing up for what’s right….aaaahhhh, the yearning for justice and dignity…”

    • on nipperts’ last appearance on that show..

      ..he derided any ideas about there being anything wrong/untoward with the new zealand justice system..

      ..does he not claim to be a ‘journalist’..?

      ..that nippert..?

      ..if so..w.t.f..!


      ..need i reel off the litany of current/past names..?

      ..from thomas to pora..?

      ..that comment from nippert is on my shortlist for brain-fart-of-the-year..(award-winning journalist sub-section..)

      ..and no..of course nippert was not ‘called’ on it..

      ..the stench was allowed to just float out on the airwaves..

      ..unquestioned/un-whiffed at..

      ..by anyone involved..

      ..phillip ure..

    • Chooky 1.2

      @ Morrissey Agreed …often ( but not always)find Jim Mora and his panel hard to listen to ..(.staus quo crap.)..without getting brain numbed, angry and switching off ….. or feeling I have been forced to swallow something non-nutritious, even at times, sickie sweet…(.toxic untruths or half truths)

    • greywarbler 1.3

      I didn’t know that Jim Mora went in for irony or being devil’s advocate! Way to go Jimmy boy.

  2. Morrissey 2

    Interesting things they keep off the News

    No. 2: U.S. drones have killed more than 2,500 Pakistanis

    Half of those killed in U.S. drone strikes are women and children.




    See also….
    No. 1: Guantanamo Bay captives

    Open mike 13/10/2013

    • Paul 2.2

      Do you want suggestions for this series or are you loaded with ideas already?

    • Paul 2.3

      WTC7 something very interesting not in the news

      • Te Reo Putake 2.3.1

        Right wing fantasies aren’t always news, Paul. Thankfully.

        • Morrissey

          I’m afraid I agree with Te Reo, Paul. I would love to think that those arch-criminals Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz et al. were involved but there is simply no evidence to support that. Like Norman Finkelstein, I accept that Dick Cheney is a criminal, a draft-dodger, a coward, a liar and a moral reprobate, but there is nothing to show he orchestrated or was involved in any way in the 9/11 attacks.

          Here’s Noam Chomsky on the subject….

        • muzza

          Voice, showing your inner weakness again bro!

          Don’t conflate the discussion points.

          WT7 housed the financial evidence which was going to be needed when Rumsfeld at al had to explain where $2.3T disappeared to, along with the Pentagon, receiving its miraculous hit, directly to the accounts department.

          Take a look at which agencies had presence in WT7, and what else was housed in there – “Pull it”!

          Hey, you’re a coincidence theorist!

    • joe90 2.4

      From an earlier post.

      The study by Stanford Law School and New York University’s School of Law calls for a re-evaluation of the practice, saying the number of “high-level” targets killed as a percentage of total casualties is extremely low — about 2%.


      TBIJ reports that from June 2004 through mid-September 2012, available data indicate that drone strikes killed 2,562 – 3,325 people in Pakistan, of whom 474 – 881 were civilians, including 176 children. TBIJ reports that these strikes also injured an additional 1,228 – 1,362 individuals,” according to the Stanford/NYU study.


      edit: Stanford/NYU study.


  3. Tuesday 15 October 2013 – heading off shortly to Auckland airport to pick up Graham McCready for the adjourned hearing of oral evidence from Kim Dotcom, his bodyguard and lawyer, plus the CEO of Sky City, which should confirm that the DEFENDANT John Banks KNEW that donations from Kim Dotcom and Sky City’s CEO were NOT anonymous.

    We should be at the Auckland District Court (Albert St) before 9.30am

    ‘Her Warship’ 😉

    PS: on the 6th Anniversary of the Urewera ‘Terror’ Raids, Vince Siemer will be in the Auckland High Court, giving evidence which proves how he and his wife were subjected to alleged unlawful detention, search and seizure by Police…..

    Can’t be in 2 places at once – but if anyone can go to the High Court to support Vince and Jane today – that would be GREAT!


    A 7-day trial in the Auckland High Court began Monday, 14 October, against 14 men in blue concerning the dawn 2008 raid on the offices of Spartan News Limited and home of Vince and Jane Siemer. A fifteenth defendant is the deputy registrar of the District Court who signed the undated police search warrant.

    No one was charged as a result of the raid, which was postulated on Vince Siemer publishing the suppressed police affidavit used to hold, without bail, 18 New Zealand citizens in the infamous October 2007 Tuhoe raids (4 of the 18 were eventually convicted of various weapons charges; charges were dropped on the other 14).

    Kim Dotcom has an extremely similar case against Police scheduled for trial in February 2014.

    Defence Counsel Austin Powell, of the “Constitutional and Human Rights Team” within Crown Law, will first cross-examine Vince Siemer Tuesday on the events of 21 February 2008 before the 14 police defendants tell their work stories. Two weeks ago that was expected to concern the twelve pages of items Police seized but never accounted for on the day. However, the week before trial, the police conceded they have been withholding evidence of examination reports on the 5 cell phones they seized, had taken 183 photos inside the home not previously accounted for and cannot find the data the police cloned from three computers they seized.

    Crown counsel Powell could only reply in a 7 October email, “I am not able to give priority to any more questions about discovery of documents. We are now a week out from the fixture and there is a great deal of preparation to do. I will attend to this and any other requests if time permits.”

    Then-Solicitor General David Collins approved the raids on Tuhoe in 2007 and against the Siemers in 2008 but the Court of Appeal ruled in 2011 he could not be sued by Siemers and Spartan News. Mr Collins was appointed a High Court judge in 2012.

    In addition to all phones and computers, the police seized tax and business accounts, cameras and even printers. The police claim their active investigation ceased three years ago but admit to still holding unspecified property. The biggest return of items to date was more than 4 years after the raid, on 21 September 2012.

    The public are encouraged to attend to catch a rare glimpse of the work stories behind the badges. ”

    Vince Siemer

  4. vto 4

    It is about time that business paid its way.

    If business wants convention centres, then business can pay for them. I find it incredibly rude that they even consider asking elderly ratepayers to pay for their business.

    Rude, don’t care who foots the bill as long as it is not them. Rude. And out of line.

  5. mmm!!!..it’s cunnliffe vs. key day…

    ..let combat commence..!

    ..(i’m sharpening quills..as we speak..)

    ..phillip ure..

    • Chooky 5.1

      phillip ure..(.on another topic) You are a Vegan?……what do Vegans eat to keep healthy?….my son is a vegetarian and now is considering Veganism!…request info

      (from shocked meat eater and dairy consumer)

      • phillip ure 5.1.1

        hi chooky..

        ..congratulations on having such an evolved offspring/fruit of the loins..

        ..as far as his healthy-longevity/making a serious effort to both help the planet..and stop the wholesale suffering..(from both animals..and consumers of them.. is concerned..going vegan will be the best decision of/in his life..

        ..and having myself been vegan for about 15 yrs..and vegetarian for 15 before that..

        ..(and knowing people who have been vegan for 30 + yrs..)

        ..has all necessitated/evolved into the gathering of necessary information/data..

        ..this archive can be all found @ http://whoar.co.nz/?s=vegan

        ..there you will get all the recipies you will need..(mm!!..gourmet japanese/thai etc vegan..)

        ..plus the all-important nutritional information..

        ..it is pretty much a primer on the subject..(and the compilation of it some of the work i am most ‘proud of’..it is an agit=prop tool of some potency..

        ..i would (not so) humbly submit..

        ..and as an aside to current vegetarians..

        .you get my utmost respect..for being where you are..

        ..especially if done for the ‘right’ reasons..(ie..animal-welfare/personal health/save the planet etc..

        ..but where you are..(and i was for 15 yrs..)..is a way-station on yr journey..

        ..a halfway house..

        ..and for the following reasons..

        ..personal health:..the fact is that eating animal bye-products is almost as bad for you as eating the actual animal flesh..(this increasingly confirmed by current/new research..u will find evidence-links to all my claims made here..in the archive..)

        ..animal welfare:..eating animal bye-products sustains/financially supports the wholesale horrors of the factory-farms/charnel-houses..so if vego for animal welfare reasons..?..

        ..mental-health:..it is common for vegetarians to feel better within themselves..when they stop eating animal-flesh..

        ..and personally..my/any expectation of ‘feeling netter’ from taking that vegan-step were minimal..

        ..silly me..!..i can testify to those long-time vegetarians that the feeling-better factor takes a giant leap..

        ..(in crude/blunt-terms..it is like ripping off another dietary-scab..(much as stopping meat was for you..eh..?..)

        ..saving the planet:..the well documented ‘costs’ of from humans farming/eating animals/animal bye-products..if you stop..you stop feeding that beast..

        (and as a berm-aside:..never mind the berms..stop mowing yr fucken lawns..!..eh..!..

        ..kilo for kilo..the lawnmower is one of the dirtiest machines on the planet..

        ..and if you crunch the numbers..

        you will see that if we all went vegan..and ended our anal-obsession with all lawns having a number-one cut..

        ..we could all drive s.u.v.’s ..

        ..with utter environmental-impunity..

        ..(sez it all really..eh..?..)

        ..and yes..my heart does sink a tad..

        ..when i see ‘green-leaders’..strutting around clad in the skins of butchered animals..

        ..and wiping the animal-grease/fat from their lips..

        ..with the backs of their hands..

        ..all the while claiming to be there ‘to save the planet’..eh..?


        ..but anyway chooky..the word-up to you wd be to join yr son on his journey..

        ..you too will share in all those benefits..

        ..that he has to look forward to..

        ..and if you actually nut it all out..with an open mind..

        ..save for desiring to eat flesh/fats..

        ..there are very few reasons not to go vegan.

        ..’tis the way of the future..


        phillip ure..

        • Chooky

          Thanks so much!!!!….you are convincing!!!!!…(sigh)…Will check out site and point son in the direction of it.

          I know being a meat eater is a beastly habit and isn’t nice . ( If I had to kill it myself instead of picking up a little pack in the super market…soul already departed …I would be a vegetarian.).

          Did try to be a vegetarian years ago myself but beans and rice all the time wound my energy levels down over 6 months…However just love Indian vegetarian food …so there is hope!!!!

          • tc

            many fantastic vegan cookbooks like ‘veganomicon’ that go beyond beans/rice.

            Personally enjoy Tempeh V Tofu and using ingredients like Tamarind with other spices to layer the flavour.

            Consider the oils like coconut, hemp and avacado also. we’re blessed down here with all the necessaries.

            • Rogue Trooper

              yes, coconut oil. Handy.

            • Chooky

              @ tc…thanks for info….actually for lunch I had a wrap with chillie beans, brown rice ,salad and Indian mango chutney ..it was yuuummm!!!!!…yesterday we had lentil samosas…..so it isn’t so difficult to be a Vegan…(.but I have always put it off until the next incarnation)….we will see….maybe a semi Vegan? …cant see myself becoming a strict one. ha ha…but it is probably very good for one’s health…quite apart from the ethical considerations

          • Naturesong

            Snacking throughout the day on live food (sprouts), seeds (sesame, pumpkin and sunflower) and nuts tend to help with the energy levels.
            Also, you will tend to eat a lot more food (volume) so regular snacking helps to space it out.
            Movements will be healthier and regular as clockwork.

            Living as a vegetarian requires a bit of research, some thought and changes to your shopping habits but your body (and thus your mind) will thank you for it.

        • Te Reo Putake

          Cheers, Phillip. I’ve been contemplating switching to a more vegan based diet and you’ve given me some, um, food for thought.

          • phillip ure

            chrs to all above..

            ..and as a berm-footnote..

            ..the fact/nugget of information that five years ago made me foreswear the lawnmower/lawn-mowing..

            ..is that..depending on the vehicle you drive..

            ..one hours’ use of a lawnmower..

            ..is the same environmental footprint..

            ..as driving a vehicle between a low of 250 kms..to a high of 650 kms..

            ..fucken whoar..!


            ..something for those who are trying to heed the ever-more-urgent/compelling change-or-die!-messages..and those who urge others to ‘go green’..

            ..yet who still mow themselves..

            ..a question to ask themselves in front of the bathroom mirror/when overcome by that urge to give their lawns a number one..

            ..and they can reinforce that logical/rational decision..

            ..while walking past the flesh/dairy-sections @ the supermarket..

            ..and funny story..!..my walked-down lawns..after five years..have turned already good soil into super-soil..

            ..and my mini-eco system has recenttly sprouted swan-plants everywhere..and they have trunks like broom-handles..

            ..and so now i/we have monarch butterflies etc..fluttering around..

            ..(and the sound of/from those wings flapping..are far more pleasing on the ear/soul..than the discordant clatter of a wheezing/belching lawn-mower..eh..?..)

            ..the birds also love our yard/’lawn’…so we get lots of bird-action..

            ..and really..from this p.o.v…the action of cutting lawn/collecting the clippings..making a pile of them..

            ..turning them into compost..to then spread back on the soill..

            ..is an act of utter/pointless group-madness..

            ..it’s already programmed to do that itself..eh..

            ..if we just leave well alone..

            ..and in the process..

            ..both help the environment..

            ..and reclaim a large chunk of our lives that are currently wasted in this self-imposed sisyphian-task..

            ..of doing battle with/trying to tame/control nature..

            ..just let it go..!..people..!

            ..phillip ure..

  6. David H 6

    And we could have become a true Banana republic complete with Russian weapons. If only Key had been in charge.
    Now there’s a scary thought Key with a Russki Nuc (presumably with Missiles intact) sub tied up feeding Ak’s power.

    They must have owed us a Lot of Rubles


    • Draco T Bastard 6.1

      Damn, should have taken the MiGs and a couple of diesel subs.

    • greywarbler 6.2

      David H
      Tanks for the memory eh! Instead we got Lada cars, they got butter for their larders. Hah good one!
      As for rubles, I think we would have preferred rubies.

      But the flexible nature of trade allowed us to keep trading with this, then, pariah country. Perhaps we should keep the spirit of multi-lateralism or whatever, alive and not sign up to constraining TPPA with it’s flashy front billboard of free trade, and dirty little dealers behind the scenes selling their real agendas.

      • Rogue Trooper 6.2.1

        oh how times have changed. (had a wee bright yellow Lada when I was 20, and a bright orange VW) anyway, been fortunate today, cycled into town to do errands (food for the worms) and was able to be home before it fair poured down.

  7. AsleepWhileWalking 7

    In case you missed it on the Feeds:
    http://hot-topic.co.nz/the-last-refuge-of-scoundrels/ (Or how to waste government money)

    Tomorrow, in the Appeal Court in Wellington (pdf), Justices Harrison, French and Miller will hear argument in the case of the NZ Climate Science “Education” Trust (NZCSET) versus the National Institute for Water and Atmospheric Research (NIWA), in the continuing effort of the cranks to litigate away warming in New Zealand over the last 150 years. According to the man who kicked off the whole process, Richard Treadgold of the “Climate Conversation” web site, the NZCSET bases its appeal on two main points:

    The focussed grounds are that all three NIWA temperature series resulted from serious mistakes of fact, which impugned the rationality of the Crown Entity’s decisions.

    This seems somewhat surprising, given that the judge in the original case was so scathing of the NZCSET’s expertise in his judgement delivered a year ago. One wonders how the Appeal Court will react to any attempt to relitigate the original decision, given Justice Venning’s findings. But then perhaps the whole appeal has rather more to do with the second basis for appeal:

    The Coalition is also seeking reversal of the High Court’s costs order.

  8. Tiger Mountain 8

    How low can you go? Not much lower in John Armstrong’s case. A truly rancid piece.

    • karol 8.1

      Interesting how Armstrong quotes NZ “leading political commentator” in support of his views.

      • Tiger Mountain 8.1.1

        Must have been edited Karol “leading” is missing in my current view. Armstrong’s position (tory supplicant) is well known and illustrated further by quoting Hollow Man Hooten in his ‘go easy on her’ Parata suckup.

    • greywarbler 8.2

      And the bit I got out of hearing comment from the Minimum of Education was that they had planned a new ground-breaking experiment in Christchurch to test a new approach in schooling.
      Their action was not to attend to the needs of children unsettled or traumatised by the loss of their normal daily life, the feeling of security and safety, the tipping over of many into the precariat, the loss of housing and local society, the loss of services even to having a toilet, the hardship for families without any fat to cushion the blows.

      And on top of that the knowledge that the comfortably off didn’t really care, didn’t think kindly towards them, saw them as a problem to be dealt with some time at the convenience of the planners and finance holders. Left to themselves without annoying questions about action, the powers that be will proceed at their own pace with little empathy it seems.

      I remember reading about how long it took Southern Italian authorities to provide for their poor people after a major earthquake destroyed their homes long established in an ancient slum area.
      Originally a hard life, precarious but settled into a known culture that was livable, to totally miserable with whole families being poked into small hotel rooms for years. This was outlined in Thomas Belmonte’s great book of his time in Naples ‘The Broken Fountain’.

    • Rogue Trooper 8.3

      Parata and Hooten, up a tree, H.A.N.G.I.N.G.
      (engaging writing by Armstrong though).

  9. greywarbler 9

    Yesterday I commented on Radionz item on this woman who has written a book that goes straight to the heart of NZ’s problems with poverty in its business thinking.

    Open mike 14/10/2013

    However, economist and professor Mariana Mazzucato argues that the state has a huge part to play in bringing new goods and services to market.
    Peter Day discusses her thought-provoking thesis with her. Her latest book is The Entrepreneurial State: Debunking public vs. private sector myths. She tweets on @MazzucatoM

    Today I want to highlight that she says that all countries that advance do so on the back of government involvement. The big innovations in the USA have been done on the back of government research and development. Left to the private sector, little new stuff happens.
    It is too costly for private companies to spend much on research because so much comes to nothing! But new things are needed to advance into the future with useful stuff, and to develop new ways of coping with whatever is happening, likely to happen – think green technology for instance.

    • Draco T Bastard 9.1

      I’m reading the book ATM, it’s the one I’ve been quoting over the last few days. It is rather enlightening about where the actual innovation has come from, who supported it and who benefited.

      • greywarbler 9.1.1

        Keep on quoting. There is so much to learn to get out of the mre we are in. I sometimes think that the only people doing any important learning and thinking are on TS. Silly really. But it’s just an impression I get.

        And a bit of whimsy. Do keep dropping pieces of smart thinking from her and similar others onto TS from time to time. They may be like the crumbs from Hansel and Gretel which we can follow leading to a good destination.

    • gorj 9.2

      …as Jacques Ellul wrote about 50 years ago. (The Technological Society)

  10. Pascal's bookie 10

    Ok then. All y’all truthers have convinced me, as Obama is busted in prepping a black flag op:


    2,500 facebook likes, can’t argue with that.

  11. karol 11

    Census stats released.

    Was embargoed til 10.45am today.

    NZ Herald is running a story on it and updating.

    Auckland’s population has grown by 110,000 people to 1.42 million people since the last census seven years ago, data published this morning shows.

    Census night data showed that all 21 local board areas in Auckland increased in population, and Waitemata, Upper Harbour, Rodney, Howick and Franklin were the fastest-growing areas.

    The population of Christchurch has dropped by almost 7000 since the devastating 2010 and 2011 earthquake sequence – but the number of people living in the Canterbury region has jumped by 17,000.

    New census figures out today provide the first snapshot into the population shift since the quakes.

    The Christchurch city population has gone from 348,456 in 2006 to 341,469 this year – a drop of 2 per cent.

    The Canterbury region numbers have gone from 521,0832 in 2006 to 539,433 this year.

    Outlying areas experienced huge growths.

    Selwyn District has experienced the largest population growth in the country, up nearly a third to 44,595 people.

    Waimakariri is up 17 per cent to 49,989.

    Will be watching how this info is processed by the media.

  12. aerobubble 13

    …Their sloppy cronyism approach ends up costing more than any anticipated benefits.

    Why? Short-termism gone mad? Why would nearly 50% of voters affirm a party this dysfunction on its core issue? the economy! Shonkey is not a good manager, he’s a fly boy pant sniffer type.

    yet still 50% of the voting public voted for inanity. How does the Herald do it? I mean its so right wing (the wrong kind) and so actively deranged in its appeals to poor managing solutions.

    We need a tax system that targets the wealthy less we forget what happens when a few own and control the super majority of the nation.

    Did you see Collins, her eyebrow was a shocker, like she was some deranged bag lady invited on Q&A to an opinion that no credible minister could.

  13. So Len Brown allegedly had sex with no condom with someone that isnt his wife at the auckland town hall, he shouldnt lose his job over this. A written warning and a divorce lawyer for his wife. The media should report news, not sleaze.

  14. fender 15

    Parata is on the ropes big-time, good work Hipkins, even the speaker found her answers “less than helpful”.

  15. What Len Brown should say

  16. fender 17

    Far out…all the Nats have anger problems…Nick Smith is spitting while doing his best Key/Bridges impersonation, his colleagues should have worn their raincoats…

  17. Ad 18

    Has Whaleoil just jumped the Shark?

    Either he’s right and the Mayor of Auckland is damaged by the allegations, or Whaleoil is about to have his ass sued off him.

    [karol: moved this comment from the “This is how it’s done thread – off topic. Tried to tidy things up by moving the replies, too.]

    [lprent: That’s correct. I have a SQL script for doing it as well at home. ]

  18. Puckish Rogue 19

    4/10 Len, now thats a burn

  19. These farmers should be forced to get their drinking water below their farms or from the stream they are putting the shit into – record fine lol put a zero on it I say.


    • Draco T Bastard 20.1

      Should have been forfeiture of the farms – especially the second one.

    • weka 20.2

      Maybe the fine should be a % of the business’ turnover? And yep to the drinking water.

      “Council’s investigation manager Patrick Lynch said it was “unbelievable” a farmer would choose to deliberately pump raw effluent straight into a waterway.”

      Where’s he been for the past few decades?

  20. ianmac 21

    Funny that Mr Bridges was far more subdued in answering in Question Time today, than he was during his hyperactive shouting display last night on Campbell Live. Perhaps he had taken his ritalin today?

  21. King Kong 22

    Am in the international Koru lounge in Auckland watching David Farrars phone run hot.

    This Len Brown thing looks like it might have legs.

  22. amirite 23

    You know New Zealand is fucked when the fat turd’s gossip is taken as absolute truth by the MSM.

    • Colonial Viper 23.1

      Fucking NZ Herald. I guess their editors see a market gap left by Truth.

      • Draco T Bastard 23.1.1

        What do you mean “left by Truth”? It’s more like the Truth was driven out of business by the NZHerald moving in to its bailiwick.

        • Colonial Viper

          I also see that the NZ Herald article has been courageously penned by “New Zealand Herald staff”.

          • Puckish Rogue

            Is it that much to expect our leaders to keep it in their pants?

            • Colonial Viper

              Oh fuck off.

              The most well known political leaders from Eisenhower to Kennedy to Lange have had extra-marital affairs. Grow up and learn a little bit about real life.

              • grumpy

                As Larry Flynt said about Bill Clinton – “at least we have a President who fucks”

              • Puckish Rogue

                It was hard to type that with a straight face true 🙂 but I bet if you replaced Len Brown with John Key you lefties would all over it like white on rice

                Plus theres the small matter of the threatning text she got, that puts it into a completely different catergory…

                Also shows how much of a typical leftie he really is: good at throwing around other peoples money but buys his mistress cheap knickers

              • grumpy

                To be fair, I’m looking at Brown in a different way now – I didn’t think he had it in him.

            • grumpy

              Rooting on the job is bad form, especially if it’s a junior employee (almost like incest).
              I see there’s a high ranking defence force guy up on Court Marshall for the same thing. Guess Banksie won’t get the firing squad though?

              • grumpy:

                Like incest?? are you nuts, she was 32 years old and a consenting adult,
                the only person who is allowed to be pissed off is lens wife.

              • Colonial Viper

                Yeah it’s like incest. I mean. WTF.

                The woman is supposedly 32. She hasn’t just left high school. She can make her own choices in life can she not.

                • grumpy

                  Mate, it’s regarded as “in the family”. Why do you think the Army guy in being charged? You can’t take advantage of employees – who knows what pressures have been placed on them?

                  • Colonial Viper

                    Sure, no one in a work place ever screwed a colleague or work mate before.

                    • grumpy

                      I feel your grief……..but he is the head honcho, sort of a higher standard sort of thing.

                    • Tracey

                      sure but when it is a superior who may or may not hold hiring and firing in his/her hands it can be different cv. NOT that that is suggested here.

                    • Colonial Viper

                      If Len Brown had spent on his Council credit card entertaining this woman, took her on Council paid trips, got her promotions etc, then that’s definitely relevant to his conduct on the job.

                      The rest of this is BS. Two grown up consenting adults getting it on, yaaawn.

                      sure but when it is a superior who may or may not hold hiring and firing in his/her hands it can be different cv. NOT that that is suggested here.

                      Ah yes there may be a case to be answered in situations where coercive pressure was being applied through seniority and hiring firing power.

                    • grumpy

                      ….but in the Council Chambers????? Just think of the poor minimum pay cleaners………where is Helen Kelly on this?

                    • Colonial Viper

                      lol grumpy yeah its too much for my gentle sensibilities

                    • karol

                      Brown’s statement. A personal and family issue

                      nothing to see here – move on

                      Doug Mackay doesn’t seem to see it as an employment issue.

                      Time for the sleaze-mongers to return to the sewer.

                    • Rogue Trooper

                      puh leaze, do not bring Helen (paragon of virtue) into this debacle, we plead.
                      (no condom, no mess).

                  • Tracey

                    but so far there is no evidence of coersion, it appears the woman herself has spoken to someone about it but n suggestion f misuse of power by Brown I suppose it might yet be made.

                  • McFlock

                    IIRC the Navy guy is being charged for lying about it on security vetting forms and alleged abusing his authority to intimidate his subordinate when she tried to end it.

                    Not an act of consensual sex.

              • Tracey

                nothing like incest. assuming it was consensual there is no wrong doing other than people’s perception of orality.

                incest is a crime. speaking of crimes. Slater knows no bounds to th depths he will stoop. I bet he knows of a number of dirty secrets of right wing MP’s and he will die before revealling them.

                ” A journalist sacked by the Herald on Sunday has been ordered to pay his former employer $7500 costs for an Employment Relations Authority hearing he lost.

                The newspaper was justified in sacking assistant editor Stephen Cook, who was being investigated as part of a police inquiry into drug dealing, authority member Rosemary Monaghan ruled last December.

                Cook was dismissed in December 2008 because he would not tell his newspaper bosses why he was under suspicion.

                They responded by saying they had lost trust and confidence in him, which made his position untenable.

                Cook’s work car had been seen outside an Auckland property under surveillance by the police drugs squad.

                Ms Monaghan said that in failing to provide material which could have cleared his name, Cook fed the suspicion that he was not being open and honest about his activities.

                She found Cook’s dismissal was justified, not because he was dishonest or had something to hide, but rather his reactions to his employer “reasonably” suggested that he did.

                Today she released a cost determination ordering Cook to pay $7500 to Herald on Sunday proprietor APN New Zealand Limited as a contribution to its costs.

                APN, in its memorandum of costs, pointed to the need to address Cook’s inclusion of irrelevant and prejudicial material. It also cited delay and disruptions resulting from unavailability of counsel for Cook, including two delays in starting and the scheduling of a further part-day to address matters Cook had raised at the last moment. “

              • Draco T Bastard

                Actually, from what I saw on the news, the high ranking defense guy is up on fairly major charges to do with the defense of the realm as well as sexual abuse.

              • NickS

                I see there’s a high ranking defence force guy up on Court Marshall for the same thing

                Except it’s not, because in that case the accused was blackmailing her into sex and using his position to threaten her partners continued employment in the military.

            • McFlock

              Why do you want mayors to be celibate?

              Does that mean that councillors are allowed to receive digital relief once a month?

              • Puckish Rogue

                Maybe Shane Jones was onto something? 🙂

              • tinfoilhat

                Not at all, but you’d expect grown ups in positions of responsibility like this to behave with some decorum and not go around rooting all and sundry. Honestly what is it about men of a certain age acting in this way……. Clinton, Lange, Brash etc etc. pathetic really.

              • tinfoilhat

                Not at all, but you’d expect grown ups in positions of responsibility like this to behave with some decorum and not go around rooting all and sundry. Honestly what is it about men of a certain age acting in this way……. Clinton, Lange, Brash etc. pathetic really.

              • grumpy

                FFS he has a wife – how much non celibacy do you want?

            • Tracey

              as opposed to Key who is screwing the country

              • Ramsay

                Come on – support the guy’s policies or not – it’s not good enough.

                Not telling them how to do their job but it would be good if one of the authors could put a post up about it soon (whatever their take).

                • Tracey

                  you want an author to right about whether or not the mayor of auckland has been extra maritally screwing an employee? There’s a few things I’ve wanted them to write about, so I could comment, but they didn’t.

                  Why dont you write it and submit is as a guest post.

          • Ramsay

            Is this a violation of the Gosman Ruling?

            (Complaining about Herald staff anonymity, that is).

            [lprent: Nope because…

            1. They truly are anonymous on editorials and Staff Reporter. Just like our Notices and Features when we’re doing the routine OpenMikes except they put in news content and opinion.

            2. The Gosman rule applies to assertions made here about people here. Just as I cannot police the Herald, I don’t police people making comments about the Herald either there or here (unless they cause legal issues or overstep the bounds of taste here).

            3. The rules are there to make this site easier to use. I’m not an ideologue and I don’t presume to demand how people should act off this site. I may merely comment on it ]

            • Draco T Bastard


              • Ramsay

                Just checked:

                “People using a pseudonym to comment who then claim that other people commenting/posting anonymously (or any words construed to mean that) will have their own comments treated as being anonymous. Since this site does not allow anonymous comments, they will receive an immediate long ban.”

                You’re right – technically – as an anonymous outside article isn’t a “post” or a “comment”.

                [lprent: “Since this site does not allow anonymous comments…” is also a dead giveaway. ]

                • Rogue Trooper

                  too much time on your hands, hopefully

                • Tracey

                  wow you are onto it. First pointing out no one has posted an article about Brown and now a violation of the rules (possibility thereof). A fine eye for detail.

                • Draco T Bastard

                  The bit that you missed was that the NZHerald has run articles that attacked the “anonymous” authors on The Standard while hypocritically publishing anonymous articles.

                • Tracey

                  not technically, actually.

    • grumpy 23.2

      Texts up now.

  23. Tiger Mountain 24

    Well the Herald spewspaper has a story too

    Hardly a hanging offence if true, but he should have been sacked by the voters for not supporting the wharfies, “Lenslide” may now be “Lenslider” and joins the boardroom bonker club of various other randy old goat politicians–Worth, insert other names here……. etc.

    • Rogue Trooper 24.1

      ba na na na dee dee dee di didit, ba na na na dee didit dee

      ma na ma na na na na na.

  24. King Kong 25

    You are right CV. Mayor of Auckland “porks the payroll” is not something that any Aucklander, other than the prurient working class filth that read the Truth, should be interested in.

    • Colonial Viper 25.1

      lol you still at it mate

    • Tiger Mountain 25.2

      If mild mannered Len was shagging at work one can only imagine what Banksie was up to in the back seat of the Bentley…..

    • Tracey 25.3

      “prurient working class filth that read the Truth” That would be Mr Slater and the folks at his blog when he was editor?

      • Anne 25.3.1

        I haven’t followed all the comments on the Len Brown matter but he has just issued a statement confirming he had a two year affair with a woman who was working on some project linked to the Council. She was not a Council employee.

        Since it’s come from the sleaziest blogger in the business, can someone locate the story which appeared a year or two ago detailing a story of an extra marital indulgence by the self same blogger who released this story. From memory he never denied it. Anyone else remember it? If it can be found lets give it another airing…

        Pot, kettle and all that.

    • Pascal's bookie 25.4

      Not an employee according to Brown;


      Brown confirmed the woman was not a council employee but served on a council advisory board and stood in this year’s election for a local board.

    • Sanctuary 25.5

      Can somone ban this fuckwit please?

    • bad12 25.6

      What ‘Truth’ is that, do you mean the one the ex Editor/Manager a true piece of filth in anyone’s books managed in a few short months to run into the ground,

      Lolz Blubber-boi the dysfunctional head case with the un-functional newspaper what a f**king loser that waste of space really is in the real world…

  25. weka 26

    From the sidebar

    Last November the body of Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat was exhumed for an autopsy to determine if he was poisoned. Sadly, it appears that he was:

    “Swiss radiation experts have confirmed they found traces of the radioactive agent polonium on the clothing of Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat, supporting the possibility he was poisoned.”


  26. MrSmith 27

    Give me a break, just received my insurance bill for my property in CHCH 50% increase on top of last years 20% increase.

    You just gotta love that free market at work, about all thats free in this market is there right to screw you when your down, can’t find another company to reinsure with so take it or leave it Jack, the people of CHCH are being walked all over by greedy insurance companies along with this government, roll on election day.

  27. grumpy 28

    Yahoo!!!!! Whale is now posting the text messages. Very much not a good look!
    Seems like she is younger – and Asian. Who would have thought?

  28. karol 29

    Simon Bridges under fire….Banksie in court, JK not getting much media attention. MSM probably chasing SB & JB for evening TV news……what does WO do?

    • Colonial Viper 29.1

      The Right are good at this stuff, and the MSM falls for it pavlovian like every time. Mind you, this is a good wee reminder of how dirty the NATs are going to fight next year.

      • karol 29.1.1

        I have political criticisms of Brown’s performance. I think his private behaviour probably has hurt others, especially the women involved. The sleazemongers don’t care about the latter.

        Meanwhile, there’s some significant political issues that don’t get enough in-depth attention.

        • Anne

          It looks like ‘the other woman’ went to sleazebag herself and has given him their text conversations. Seems Len Brown ended the affair month or two ago. She claims she received anonymous threatening messages.

          Well, an intelligent and mature woman would go to the police if it is true, not spill the beans in what looks to me like a spiteful vendetta.

      • chris73 29.1.2

        Yes the right are good at making lefties make tits on themselves, I can just see the RWNJ setting Len up with a two year sting operation timed to go off after the election

        Poor Len, he never stood a chance…

        • Rogue Trooper

          and, just how chummy are you with Cameron…

          • chris73

            Never met the guy but sent him some links to his web page, a youtube clip about a guy that made a double barrel pump action shot gun as I recall

            • Rogue Trooper

              handy, alas, not allowed a firearms license, for obvious reasons, however, crossbows are another target altogether, especially when compounded.

        • karol

          Nah – more like WO sits on stuff and then choices the timing to release it.

          Maybe I should rephrase that?

          • Rogue Trooper


          • Murray Olsen

            WhaleSpew’s best work is released when he’s sitting.

          • karol

            Actually, 3 News said, WO got the info about a month ago. And Chuang signed the affadavit this morning.

            What took so long for the release?

            • karol

              The timing is all. I thought Brown on Campbell Live tonight was suggesting that the timing of the release has been done to force him to stand down before he is inaugurated. Thus, I guess, the 2nd place candidate would be mayor without a new election?

              How cynical and undemocratic is that?

              • Treetop

                Had Brown lost there would be no story. This is why it did not come out prior to the election. Who ever is now behind Brown’s demise feel confident enough that Brown being elected mayor will become untenable.

                How hard are those who want Brown gone going to push?

        • Colonial Viper

          Len Brown is left wing? Nah, he’s strictly centrist.

  29. lprent 30

    Interesting. Just been looking at the real time analytics after getting a threshold CPU alert.

    I normally only get those if the database jams or a Labour leader resigns or is elected or we are having an election…

    What is going on with the Simon Bridges post? Way higher than anything else right now and a hell of a lot of people piling on at once. Looks like facebook.

    • lprent 30.1

      Oh – ~600 likes.

      • karol 30.1.1

        Bryce Edwards linked to it and a couple of other TS posts this afternoon here.

        • Colonial Viper

          Thank goodness blogs like The Standard (and WO) have no relevance to the MSM 😈

        • Rogue Trooper

          who has the time

        • lprent

          Bryce Edwards linked to it…

          We get those enough that the pattern is predictable. Just gives little bumps. This was a social media jump and started at ~1:30PM according to the CPU log rather than the 3:56PM start for bryce’s post. We just had a big spike in the last 15 minutes when it started going viral.

      • karol 30.1.2

        Maybe also because I put the link to the Youtube video of the interview in the post? the video’s gone from one or two views this morning to over 450 views this afternoon.

  30. Rogue Trooper 32

    Marine Le Pen’s NF Party Now The Largest in France
    (she threatens to sue if described as “extreme right”).
    hmmm, and the Greeks wish for the repayment of a loan to the NSDAP

  31. chris73 33


    – Heres one of the texts Dirty Len (yes its an Eastenders reference) sent to her, makes things different I feel

  32. Treetop 34

    Consensual sex is not an issue for me. Having sex at the office during working hours is not in the job description, nor is using the credit card for personal use in a relationship appropriate.

    I want to know:
    1. Was the sex during office hours on council premises?
    2. Was the mayoral credit card used for personal use as part of the relationship e.g gifts, dining?
    3. Was the other willing party silenced, bullied or threatened?

    • Rogue Trooper 34.1

      and, did they both orgasm

    • karol 34.2

      3 News said she’s been getting threatening txts from an anonymous number since Brown broke it off a few weeks’ back.

      • Rogue Trooper 34.2.1

        it’ll all come out in the wash; freakin’ sex aye, who wuld a thunk it.

      • Treetop 34.2.2

        The woman cannot ignore threatening txts. People are going to think that the mayor is involved in these txts.

        • Colonial Viper

          Agreed. So let us choose a suggested course of action for the woman.

          1) Go to the police.
          2) Go to Whaleoil.

          Your pick?

          • Anne

            Made that point five minutes ago CV. Gone into moderation. Second time in 24 hrs???

            In essence I’ve suggested a vendetta by the ‘other woman’. An intelligent and mature person would go to the police… not spill the beans to a sleazebag!

            (now lets see if it goes into mod again)

            • The Al1en

              I’m also in moderation, saying Brown has to go and what a let down he’s proven himself to be.
              Don’t expect to be agreed with, but it’s not like it’s a momentary indiscretion, it’s a two year long deceit. In politics, once you lose trust, you have nothing.

              • Colonial Viper

                Oh fuck let’s not go down this road UNLESS Brown has spent rate payers money on this woman with gifts, trips, career favours etc.

                Would you have thrown Eisenhower out of office? Kennedy? Lange? Clinton? And a bunch of others too???

          • Treetop

            Both options are just as bad.

    • Treetop 34.3

      Strike out 2. as Brown does not have a mayoral credit card.

  33. Len Brown should resign.
    He’s been exposed by his actions as a weak man, and if he tries to sit tight until the media storm blows itself out, it will only emphasise this further.
    If he cries on Campbell live, says he’s sorry and begs forgiveness, it’s more bullsh*t weakness.

    Gift horse to the tories when they were so under the cosh. No excuses, just get out.
    Fu*k, I dislike weak politicians.

    • Rogue Trooper 35.1

      like leaky ships, Into Darkness , such is the Wrath of a Khan scorned.

    • richard 35.2

      Um, what makes you think that Len is from the left? Chris Trotter writes an excellent analysis of Len’s outlook and while he may have been or is a member of the labour party, Trotter asserts that’s it’s the labour party of Roger Douglas that he joined – http://thedailyblog.co.nz/2013/10/14/leaving-politics-at-the-door-len-brown-wins-a-second-term/

      He showed how much he leans to the left during the wharfies dispute.

      So if this is a gift to the tories, they can have it.

      • The Al1en 35.2.1

        “what makes you think that Len is from the left?”

        If you can’t quote, just make it up, right?

        But if you’re asking, I think he’s a somewhat left centrist.

    • BM 35.3

      Len will only go kicking and screaming.

    • Anne 35.4

      Len Brown should resign.
      He’s been exposed by his actions as a weak man,

      On that basis, we would hardly have any politicians left. Some might say that would be a good thing.
      Btw, it’s been going on in high places since God made little apples. Secretaries and parliamentary bunnies are usually the primary sources.

      • The Al1en 35.4.1

        I’m not expecting anyone to agree with me, just like I don’t expect politicians to be whiter than white and anything other than human like the rest of us, but when caught out, they have to do the decent thing and walk away and not wait for the polls or results of focus groups to see how much they can get away with.

        But using your logic, it should be acceptable for all our elected representatives to be like Berlusconi.

        • karol

          I think if Brown goes now, Palino will become mayor, without an election. Looks like it’s been timed to attempt just that.

          No-one is clean here, including WO’s team.

          Let’s just wait and see how things play out.

          I do not want a loser right wing Mayor by un-elected default.

          • chris73

            Just remember that while no-one is clean this all started because of Len Brown, he instigated it, he continued it, its completely his fault so stop trying to spread the blame around

            • karol

              Oh. Yeah. Brown has not behaved well. He is the best of the standing candidates for Mayor. But I care more about democracy. And WO and co. and all thier supporters try to undermine it. That is far more despicable. I’m not spreading anything. SleazeOil does it all on his own.

            • Colonial Viper

              Hey chris73, did Len Brown just get elected as Bishop of Rome?

              No? Then wtf with the calls that his personal life is relevant to his office holding.

          • The Al1en

            It would be a very bad outcome for Auk if Palino won by default and WO is a tabloid scummer in the worst tradition.

            A new election is what I’d want as a voter.

            • karol

              Yep. If Brown’s conduct does require standing down, I want another election. I don’t think the evidence so far requires a stand down.

              • The Al1en

                I would stand down if it were me, though it wouldn’t be me because I can keep it in my pants and even as a dumb middle aged bloke, know these things rarely ever stay secret.

                What on earth was he thinking? He’s old enough to be her dads older brother. :grrrross:

        • JK

          For goodness sake – Len made a mistake, or was a hu(man) , call it what you will – its personal. Its not a hanging matter. And its not something that will interfere with his ability to be Mayor or to be political or to be a manager – all qualities he needs as Mayor. And he fronted up to his wife before this became public, which is saying something positive about him, her, and their family.

        • Chooky

          Berluscon was /is in a different league altogether !

  34. No wrath or scorn here, nor judgement on his moral failing, but at the very least a rerun of the vote is needed. If he’s brazen enough to run again and wins, then fair fight fair result.

  35. Rogue Trooper 38

    ab solved

  36. Sookie 39

    The worshipful mayor of Auckland is a complete and utter skeevy idiot who has played into the hands of gleeful rightwingers. Did he think he wouldn’t be found out with the blubbery whale sniffing around for any kind of scandal? It shouldn’t matter what people get up to in their private lives, but to most people it will look very bad. Especially shagging in his office. I am intrigued by the timing of this though, wouldn’t it have been more effective for the blubbery one to go public before the election?

    • karol 39.1

      Brown’s behaviour is not commendable. But repeating my comment from above, given WO had the info about a month ago.

      The timing is all. I thought Brown on Campbell Live tonight was suggesting that the timing of the release has been done to force him to stand down before he is inaugurated. Thus, I guess, the 2nd place candidate would be mayor without a new election?

      How cynical and undemocratic is that?

  37. Dan1 40

    I am fascinated that WO has been sitting on this story for some time. I remember a story way back of a High commissioner or someone similar of some country bonking his secretary on the table of the High commission. It wasn’t Clinton. Can someone please refresh my memory.
    The story sure takes the heat off the “young pup” from Tauranga!

    • The Al1en 40.1

      “The story sure takes the heat off the “young pup” from Tauranga!”

      And the alleged fraudster representing the divs of Epsom.

    • Chooky 40.2

      @ Dan1…it was the guy who held up the sausages in parliament wasn’t it ? ( no not Shearer…he held up the fish) ….McClay?…I could be wrong

      …everyone in NZ was gobsmacked at both sausages and table incidents …..didnt know whether to laugh or howl….but then he rapidly took off to Britain to be High Commissioner ( the perfect Nat solution)… .overseas and respectability ….the mirth was all over …all forgotten…almost…..not quite

    • RedBaronCV 40.3

      The allegations were about John Collinge High commissioner in London and past National party president. I believe the next High commissioner replaced the table.
      Story is at bottom of this link


      • Dan1 40.3.1

        Thanks RB. Oh the trappings of power!

        • RedBaronCV

          Yeh I think he used to tell them all that he would marry them. perhaps Len’s lady friend though she might be geeting a weeding as well.

      • Chooky 40.3.2

        @ Red Baron ….thanks …yes that was who it was …Collinge…but close on the heels of the sausage waving incident in parliament i think

  38. Morrissey 41

    Jim Mora calls U.S. “a bulwark against totalitarianism”
    Another very bad day for The Panel

    Radio NZ National, Monday 14 October 2013
    Jim Mora, Matt Nippert, Josie Pagani

    JIM MORA: Jessica Maddock is here, with what the WOOOOOORLD is talking about!
    JESSICA MADDOCK: Well first up is Richard Branson! He’s living permanently in the British Virgin Islands now, and he denies it has anything to do with a tax dodge!
    MORA: Hurr, hurr, hurr, hurr!
    JOSIE PAGANI: He’s a tax dodger.
    JESSICA MADDOCK: Well, since he gives all the money he makes now to charity I guess he thinks it probably all balances out.
    JOSIE PAGANI: He’s a tax dodger!
    MORA: Ahhhh, he would say that he can use the money BETTER, wouldn’t he.

    [Awkward silence for several seconds.]

    MORA: Okay, what else have you got?
    JESSICA MADDOCK: Well this is an unusual one! A man has died from guzzling mince!
    MORA: Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha! He died from guzzling mince?
    JESSICA MADDOCK: [voice betraying a slight edge of irritation] Y-y-y-yes.

    [A short discussion about the dangers of guzzling mince, then on to the next topic: self drive cars….]

    JESSICA MADDOCK: Not only the big car companies, but also Google is getting in on the act! But a British survey shows that only 29 per cent of people would buy one and a mere 21 per cent would feel safe in one.
    MORA: Ah yeah, watch that change though. I’d like the NSA to be in charge of it! Ha ha ha ha ha! Okay, what else?
    JESSICA MADDOCK: Prince William and Princess Kate are breaking with tradition and choosing their friends from university for the christening of Prince George.
    MORA: Oh really?
    JESSICA MADDOCK: Yes, the godparents will be chosen from their closest friends, who include Emilia d’Erlanger, Fergus Boyd, Hugh van Cutsem, Alasdair Coutts-Wood, and Alicia Fox-Pitt.

    [Lengthy silence]

    MORA: Hmmmmm….
    JOSIE PAGANI: Those are not really names of ordinary people, are they?
    MORA: No they’re aristocratic names! All right, anything else?
    JESSICA MADDOCK: Yes, a feminist has accused Lorde of racism in her song “Royals”.
    MORA: W-w-what??!!??!?
    JOSIE PAGANI: Surely not.
    JESSICA MADDOCK: Veronica Bayetti Flores says that Lorde lambasts things like gold teeth, Maybach cars and diamonds—all accoutrements of black rappers. She asks why Lorde doesn’t attack golf or polo or Central Park East.
    JOSIE PAGANI: Good Lord! It’s SILLY, isn’t it!
    MORA: It’s a questionable thesis that gold teeth and Maybach cars are the preserve of rappers, surely. All right, anything else?
    JESSICA MADDOCK: Plasma televisions will soon be a thing of the past.
    MORA: So plasma TV will soon be a thing of the past?
    JESSICA MADDOCK: [voice betraying real irritation] Y-y-yeah…

    . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4 o’clock news………………………..

    [After the break, the usual dispiriting crap……]

    1.) Penny Hulse skillfully deals with a series of bumptious and ridiculous questions from Mora. Somehow she maintains her equanimity throughout.
    2.) Josie Pagani launches into a wandery, poorly informed potted history of the Rwandan genocide, during which she makes the highly contentious statement that “Rwandans absolutely HATE Kofi Annan”.
    3.) A professor of dentistry scolds Jim Mora for approvingly quoting Kevin Milne’s braindead suggestion that people defraud dentists.

    [After the 4:30 news and weather, a welcome blast from the past, Neil Diamond’s “They’re coming to America”. This is by way of introducing the next once-over-lightly….]

    MORA: China’s official news agency has called for the creation of a “de-Americanised world”, saying the destinies of people should not be left in the hands of a hypocritical nation with a dysfunctional government.

    [Long pause….]

    MORA: Heaping criticism and caustic ridicule on Washington, the Xinhua news agency called the US a civilian slayer, prisoner torturer and meddler in others’ affairs, and said the ‘Pax Americana’ was a failure on all fronts.
    JOSIE PAGANI: [snorting] What on EARTH—-
    MORA: So what are we to MAKE of this? America has always been a bulwark against totalitarianism….

    It has to be noted that neither Josie Pagani nor Matt Nippert challenged this foolish propaganda statement, nor uttered even a murmur of dissent.

    • Rogue Trooper 41.1

      faaaaaaaaaaark! now that’s out of the system, gr8t piece Morrissey, especially the bit from the you-know-what news agency. Ha! (Maybachs, now, if I were still a petroleum-head, yet an old , mid-80’s SL500 would be about all I could afford). Did I ever tell you about the Merc diesel ambulance imported by a German dental technician that I remedied after it was erroneously filled with petrol…and the wonderful gig with a live band we enjoyed (Christina and I) held in his consulting rooms, just off Taranaki Street). no, guess not. 😀

  39. gobsmacked 42

    If we’re going to have a “Resign-athon”, with much sound and fury, then I suggest we start with those who have betrayed the public. Not their private partners.

    If Brown goes, and Banks remains, we all lose.

    If Key is faithful to his wife, but unfaithful to his country, does he keep his job, while half the mayors and MPs must lose theirs, because of their private lives?

    I don’t defend Brown, or like him much, but I sure as hell don’t want to live in a country where sex is a bigger crime than fraud and treason.

    • miravox 42.1

      “I sure as hell don’t want to live in a country where sex is a bigger crime than fraud and treason.”


      • The Al1en 42.1.1

        But you’d trust Len and take him at his word after keeping a two year affair secret?
        I know I couldn’t.

        • JK

          The Allen – at least he told his wife before it broke in the media

        • miravox

          I think he’s a more competent person for the job than John Palino, who I trust to give ratepayers’ money to his best mates, oops, business contacts.

          Am I disappointed in Brown? Yes, it’s all so cliched and sordid. Does it affect his ability to run the city? It may do – it all depends on who (if anyone) he’s compromised to keep the affair quiet.

          Otherwise, this is something for his family to work through. If it has affected relationships that reduce his ability to do his job, then the public should be concerned. Otherwise, outside of his personal relationships, it’s just info that Brown and the consenting adult he slept with, are two more flawed human beings.

          I’ll add this to the other info I know about him when I do the compare and contrasts with other politicians looking to impress.

  40. vto 43

    Don’t think much of that woman sticking herself into Len Brown’s marriage. So many women seem to just go and do this type of thing? Do they not think of their fellow women and the misery they cause?

    What a toad.

    • karol 43.1

      Of course, the guys are completely incapable of making decisions for themselves.

      • grumpy 43.1.1

        Correct! Stupid comment from vto

        • vto

          silly eggs. just trying to balance up the comments which so typically and heavily imbalancedly point the naughty finger at the guy rather than the girl, who usually comes across as squeaky clean and pressed against her will into the arms of the typically despicable man. rolly eyes..

    • Chooky 43.2

      +1vto….except that maybe she thought it was just a fling and would never come out….certainly not come out this way

      I feel sorry for his wife….but then again who knows….maybe she has had flings before also…and if not she may certainly be contemplating them for the future

      so then one feels sorry for the kids….but it is life and sometimes it is best to be prepared rather than kept in a cocoon

      Maybe everyone needs an overseas holiday until it all blows over !!!

      • Chooky 43.2.1

        ooops ….the plot thickens……on more information ……seems like the girlfriend may have let it out of the bag herself! ..and to Whaleoil!..in which case Len definitely should Not resign!….but take an overseas holiday with wifee and kids….

  41. karol 44

    There seems to be a few regular commenters, whose recent comments have gone into auto-moderation. I’m reluctant to release them, before Lynn can check why it’s happening.

    Edit: ah, there they are.

    [lprent: Just have a lock on the Len Brown against flooding coming in from some of the usual trolls. Releases are pretty fast (except when I’m travelling home of course). ]

  42. millsy 45

    So Len Brown cheated on his wife.

    Big deal. None of our business. He should be apologising to his wife, not everyone else. That is where the greasing should be focused.

    I smell a right wing smear campaign.

    Mayors should only forced from office because of serious misconduct. Having an affair is not serious misconduct.

    • chris73 45.1

      So you don’t have a problem with the threatening texts sent to the young lady, interesting how the left wing think when it happens to one of their own

      I bet that if this happened to a right wing politician you lot (all you lefties I mean) would be baying for blood

      • karol 45.1.1

        I do have a problem with threatening txts. Has it been proved who sent them? Or are you willing to convict on no evidence? Due process.

        • chris73

          Oh please spare me

          Len Browns a walking cliche:

          he hooked up with a young Asian women probably fulfilling some fantasy of his (especially if you read her account of the affair) and treats her pretty shabbily, she breaks it off and she then gets sent threatening texts

          Yeah I’m sure Len Brown had nothing to do with it, him being a paragon of virtue and all

          • gobsmacked

            “He hooked up with a young Asian woman”

            As opposed to John Palino and his Chinese girlfriend, 20 years younger? (yes, she is)

            Her age and ethnicity are irrelevant to me, but obviously it matters to you, so I guess Palino’s ruled out too. Who’s next for your vote, Minto or Penny?

            • chris73

              I was referring to the bit about Brown being a cliche, middle age white man scoring a young Asian women is a cliche but its only a cliche because it happens so often

              The problem for Len is that she wasn’t his girlfriend (like John Palino) but she was his mistress

              Yeah I know its difficult to defend the indefensible but remember he bought it all on himself

            • Rogue Trooper

              Penny (well, John is cool, yet something is not adding up there according to QoT).

          • Delia

            and it is OK with you that Slater and his mates roll out the whole affair in front of the Nation without caring one iota for his wife and children…as I said what goes around…

            • chris73

              You mean as much care that Len had for his own family?

              Heres the thing, 4/10 Len is a very public figure and he knows it, he knows hes being watched and yet he still decided to carry own with his mistress, the guy even had the balls to introduce her to movers and shakers (surely people who knew he was married to someone else) hes the person that brought his own family into this

              Unfortunately Dirty Lens family is caught in the crossfire but again thats because of Lens own actions, if Len didn’tt wanted this to happen he shouldn’t have pursued the women

      • millsy 45.1.2

        As I said before, if it is proven that it was Brown that sent the threatening texts, then that would be serious misconduct, and he should step down, but so far there is no proof that he sent the txts.

        • chris73

          Give it time, the stories only just been broken…enough time for Len to go on everyones favourite lefty show and have good “poor me” session

          Did Campbell ask him about the threatening texts?

      • Draco T Bastard 45.1.3

        There’s a problem with the threatening texts so we probably find out who sent them rather than assume that it was Len Brown.

        I bet that if this happened to a right wing politician you lot (all you lefties I mean) would be baying for blood

        Nope and you can check my comments here about the Labour MP that watched porn.

        In fact, the only people I know that get really upset about people having sex is the RWNJs. It’s the politics of envy – their not getting laid and they’re jealous.

        • chris73

          You can’t compare having a hand shandy over some tame porn to cheating on your wife and sending threatening texts to cover it up

          • McFlock

            you just accused LB of sending threatening texts.
            Got a helping of evidence for that?

          • Draco T Bastard

            It seems I just did.

            The problem isn’t the affair but societies damaging views on sex.

            • Rogue Trooper

              see Foucault; “too much made of sex” . (yes Cameron and David, that is why this site is The Standard ).

    • JK 45.2

      Yep – Millsy. It IS none of our business. and it doesn’t interfere with Len’s ability to be the Mayor.

  43. Anne 46

    I smell a right wing smear campaign.

    It’s there in large neon lights.

    Seven Sharp (no never watch it but they signalled it in advance) had a poll. Overwhelmingly in favour of Len Brown resigning. Metro editor said he wasn’t surprised. I wasn’t surprised either but for a different reason. Slater, Lusk and co. would have set their bush telegraph on high alert and lined up the moral Right in large numbers.

    • grumpy 46.1

      Maybe, but I think this is just as much a “sink John Campbell” exercise. The super soft interview by Campbell would have been predicted. Just wait for tomorrow and more info on the “threats” will emerge. An embarrassment to Campbell (who ignored that issue) as much as Brown (who is dead meat anyway).

    • chris73 46.2

      Seriously? Stop blaming the right and blame the 2 minute noodle mayor that couldn’t keep it in his pants

      I know its a difficult concept to grasp but if he didn’t cheat on his wife and threaten the mistress then there wouldn’t have been a scandal

      What is about the left that they seem incapable of owning up to their errors and always try to find someone else to blame…

  44. gobsmacked 47

    John Palino was the Right’s candidate in Auckland. He came a distant second to Brown.

    Palino’s campaign manager was … Slater’s dad.

    • Anne 47.1

      Aha. Thanks for that gobsmacked. Like father like son. Remember hearing about Slater senior back in the 80s. I think he was the chairman of the Auckland branch of the National Party at the time. Rather a nasty piece of work from all accounts. Didn’t he and Slater junior try to smear the current Nat. Party Chairman, Goodfellow after he ousted Slater senior?

      Edit: Yes they did and it’s always to do with sex. Couple of slimeballs both of them. And how about Palino? He must have known about it and approved their actions!

    • Rodel 47.2

      Slater What a sleazy loser..Loved Len Brown’s performance on Campbell…Masterful.I was moved to tears of compassion.

      Much better than Shagger Brash’s performance. Even better than Lange’s misedemeanours.
      Mine pale by comparison but who cares? Watch Len Brown’s popularity polls rocket like Clinton’s.
      Hey why do people get so exited about sex…Its the economy stupid!

      God I love the dramas that TV celebrities and slime bloggers can drag up.Campbell’s pietism was a bit overdone though.
      I can’t wait for Slater’s mosquito (I mean slug) attacks on Cunliffe.Should be worth a lot of votes.

    • Treetop 47.3

      An inside job. Those behind wanting Brown gone did not want Palino associated with Brown’s indiscretion as this may have cost Palino votes.

      They had to wait for the result as Brown may have lost. They will make Brown’s job untenable.

      Brown’s vision of a city rail loop jeopardised by blurred boundaries. The right want Brown gone because there aint no money for his train set.

      • chris73 47.3.1

        Yep those cunning righties, the way they tricked Brown into instigating the affair and then how they manipulated him into continuing it for two years…will they stoop to nothing?

        • Treetop

          Blurred boundaries and dirty tricks. The woman Brown had the affair with is the meat in the sandwhich and she may end up being fodder and she has to be so careful.

          My advise to her is get your own legal advise.

        • karol

          Or maybe they should just have revealed the affair during/before the elction campaign, then people could have had the choice to vote for Brown or someone else?

          Timing smells of a cynical ploy.

          Nats just seem to hate democracy.

          And Bevan Chaung was standing on the Cits & Rats ticket – politically aligned to the Nats and Palino.

          All a bit dodgy.

        • Draco T Bastard

          Quoting BLiP from Karol’s link:

          from Bevan Chuang of the Chinese Community Centre but without letting the audience know Bevan is a National Ltd™-linked candidate in the up-coming local board elections.

          Would it have been brown that instigated the affair?

  45. Murray Olsen 48

    The plot thickens. Are Communities and Residents the old Cits & Rats, aka Auckland Council National Branch?

    Bevan Chuang – Google+
    Bevan Chuang – The Burlesque Dancing Superwoman – Member of Ethnic People’s Advisory Panel, Auckland Council – Auckland Council – Hong Kong – Auckland

    Yep. Something smells badly here, and it’s not a fragrant oriental blossom either:

    Communities and Residents – Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    The Auckland Communities and Residents Incorporated, known as Communities and Residents (C&R), is an established right-leaning local bodyticket in Auckland, New Zealand. It formed in 1937 as Citizens & Ratepayers with a view to control the Auckland City Council and prevent the left-leaning Labour Pa…

  46. Delia 49

    Yes, that affair is wrong and the Auckland people can decide for themselves, but BlubberOil bringing down a whole family publically is no laughing matter either. What goes around Cameron.

    • chris73 49.1

      I’m sure he knows the score and while its sad the family is involved its only involved because of Len (cheap knickers) Browns actions

      If Len 4/10 Brown cared for his family as much as he’d like the public and media to care about his family we wouldn’t be having this discussion

      • Draco T Bastard 49.1.1

        I don’t see how having an affair can take away from caring for others.

        • chris73

          Considering the consequences of his actions towards his family I’d suggest he cares two-fifths of f**k all towards his family especially his wife

          • Draco T Bastard

            I suspect that there was no change in his actions towards his family and thus the consequences to his family are the result of the affair being made public which it wasn’t by him or his family.

  47. Murray Olsen 50

    If this affair is what I’m thinking, I hope someone ends up in prison for it. We’ll see.

  48. Anne 51

    Honey trap? Many a famous dignitary has fallen for that one.

    • chris73 51.1

      2 years is quite a long time to run a honey trap…

      • Anne 51.1.1

        Thought of that later.Too long for a honey trap. More like a set-up to bring Brown down and install Palino in his place.

        • chris73

          If only there had been a way to stymie the plan…like, oh I don’t know, not having the affair?

    • Chooky 51.2

      +1 …and some have been blackmailed into sticking with or marrying the ‘ honey trap’ in all probability…or suffered the consequences of not doing so……..

  49. Anne 52

    Wont let me edit so:

    … add anonymous threats but little ‘lady’ doesn’t go to the police. Interesting.

    • Treetop 52.1

      The source and content of the txts will be crucial to the case.

      It is not acceptable to intimidate or harass a person.

      There needs to be some sort of investigation to determine whether or not the txts are genuine. Hell we may never get to see them, recall the emails between Dunne and Vance.

      Will Key get involved in a city council matter, recall what he has said about Banks when he was mayor and how Key says he is not Banks leader.

  50. gobsmacked 53

    OK, I know people have busy lives and can’t always check out the background details, but for those trying to follow this grubby business, here are the basic facts:

    1) The Right wanted to defeat Brown (not sure why they’d bother, but never mind, that’s what they wanted)

    2) Various candidates were canvassed, none were credible, Nobody could win at the ballot box.

    3) Palino stood as a token Rightie. But obviously couldn’t win.

    4) Slater (father, son, who cares?) got dirt on Brown. BUT their problem was … Palino’s private history is even more “colourful”. So they couldn’t run with “Saint versus Sinner”.

    5) So their best option (in their warped thinking) was to wait until Brown had won, and then hit him.

    Therefore, the choice NOW (see all media parrots) is not “Who do you vote for Mayor?’ but “Should the Mayor resign”?. That’s a crucial difference. It’s not Brown versus fallible alternative, its Brown versus nobody.

    The aim is to change to a narrative they think they can win (i.e. Dump Brown), not one they would lose (i.e. Vote Palino).

    And – this is classic SOP for these guys – they try to win a dirt-fight in the media, not a straight fight at the ballot box. Hence the references to ‘online polls”, instead of real ones. The problem with real votes is that they can be counted. Whereas astroturf and noise can’t be.

    We’ve got to get wise to their Rove tactics, and not take them at face value ever. It’s gonna be a lot worse next year.

  51. History of Violence 54

    Basic Facts
    Well maybe Len should have shagged the help if he didn’t want it out in the open.
    And that covers points 1 to 5
    Next please, but try harder

  52. McFlock:

    I wish i lived in a gingerbread house.

  53. Jim 56

    Already thinking about who to vote for in 2014…

    Help Wanted Column:
    Long-term Green Party member, likes the cut of DC’s jib and the direction the party seems headed, seeks advice on how to decide between GP and LP for party vote. Any well-researched thoughts on the key policy differentiators?

    Thanks, Jim

  54. joe90 57

    Tricksy house goppits.

    But previously, House Republicans had made a small but hugely consequential move to block them from doing it.

    Here’s the rule in question:

    When the stage of disagreement has been reached on a bill or resolution with House or Senate amendments, a motion to dispose of any amendment shall be privileged.

    In other words, if the House and Senate are gridlocked as they were on the eve of the shutdown, any motion from any member to end that gridlock should be allowed to proceed. Like, for example, a motion to vote on the Senate bill. That’s how House Democrats read it.

    But the House Rules Committee voted the night of Sept. 30 to change that rule for this specific bill. They added language dictating that any motion “may be offered only by the majority Leader or his designee.”

    So unless House Majority Leader Eric Cantor (R-VA) wanted the Senate spending bill to come to the floor, it wasn’t going to happen. And it didn’t.


  55. risildowgtn 58

    The truth comes out “First home buyers, shut out of the market by new restrictions to lending rules, are better off not owning a home at all rather than purchasing one to find it’s no longer worth what they’ve paid, Prime Minister John Key says.”

    So those wanting to buy a house are better of renting are they Key?


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