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Open mike 16/10/2014

Written By: - Date published: 6:30 am, October 16th, 2014 - 155 comments
Categories: open mike - Tags:

Shearer Cunliffe square-1Open mike is your post.

The Standard is not a conspiracy – just a welcome outlet for the expression of views. Leaders that command respect will not be undermined by this.

The usual rules of good behaviour apply (see the Policy).

Step up to the mike …

155 comments on “Open mike 16/10/2014 ”

  1. jpwood 1

    From the Newspeak Land Herald, apparently it is undemocratic for the party members to elect their own leader, the MPs have a greater mandate from the wider Labour public (a Roughanesque editorial surely) –


    • Paul 1.1

      Yes, it has all the hallmarks of Roughan.

    • Manuka - Ancient Order of Rawsharks 1.2

      Another unsigned editorial.
      What’s with these Herald editors that they’re so reluctant to put their name, or any sort of sig, to their own op-eds?

      • Paul 1.2.1

        People keep naming it Granny Herald.
        My grandmother was far kinder and not at all mean spirited.

        • phillip ure

          i much prefer ‘evil old witch’ herald..

          ..’granny’ is far too kind to the rag…

          • Paul

            The Herald has more of an angry male feel to it.

          • LynWiper

            Totally agree!, ‘eow’ is much more appropriate! Good point Paul, what’s the male equivalent of witch, with negative connotations?

          • Chooky Shark Smile

            …the Herald is clearly an old boys club…(not a “Granny” or a “Evil Old Witch”)….it should be called

            ‘Old Boys Herald’
            ‘Cabal Herald’
            ‘Herald Cabal’
            ‘Evil Empire Herald’
            ‘Herald Nact Fart’
            ‘Herald Ol’Boys Fart’

            • swordfish

              @ Paul “an angry male feel to it”

              @ Chooky “an old boys club”

              In what ways are Fran O’Sullivan and Audrey Young males ?

              • Chooky Shark Smile

                well you have got me there..ok gender neutral

                ( i dont actually read the Herald…and cancelled my online feed after the Donghua Liu Affair attempt to roll Cunliffe …never read it anyway)

                How about;

                The…’Herald Howler’, ‘Herald Horse Shiter’, ‘Herald Sycophant’, ‘Herald Hypocrite’, ‘Herald Taint’, ‘Herald Right Turn’, Herald Dissimulator’, ‘Herald Mendacity’…..?

              • wekarawshark

                “In what ways are Fran O’Sullivan and Audrey Young males ?”

                These days you don’t have to have a penis to mix with the boys, although having a vagina does mean that you will always be limited. What matters now is whether you play the game or not.

                • Colonial Rawshark

                  From the media side of things, the one place where women appear to be limited right now is having their own prime time or late night talk/interview show. That’s been a notable and long standing absence.

                  • bearded rawshark

                    Kim Hill anyone? Mary Wilson?

                    The 2 best people on air happen to be women, with Wallace coming in a close 3rd

                    • Murray Rawshark

                      Mihi Forbes is my favourite. She’s head and shoulders above any other telejournalist.

                    • Colonial Rawshark

                      Day time radio is fine; still not quite prime time TV, though.

                    • Chooky Shark Smile

                      agreed Murray Rawshark….Mihi Forbes as pre-emininet telejournalist…she should have her own show

                    • wekarawshark

                      NZ probably hasn’t recovered from when they put Kim Hill on her own prime time show and the producers did all that weird shit with the hard angle shots and grimness. KH is edgy enough, you don’t need to present her in something that accentuates that (or parodies it).

                    • greywarshark

                      @ bearded and weka rawsharks

        • GregJ

          I’d rather call it what it actually is – a squalid little rag. 👿

          • halfcrown

            ” a squalid little rag”

            That’s good, but I prefer mine

            Pathetic squalid excuse for shithouse paper.

            Would never buy the shit or the other excuses for shithouse paper in this country.

            • David H

              I call it a perfect Fish ‘n’ Chip wrapper.

              It’d be too rough for shit house paper scratch your ass up something rotten.

              • halfcrown

                “It’d be too rough for shit house paper scratch your ass up something rotten.”

                That’s right, Agree 100%, and that is why I said It’s “Pathetic squalid excuse for shithouse paper”.

                I certainly would not use it as Fish n Chip wrapper, I might catch something.

          • phillip ure

            @ greg..

            ..maybe insert ‘rightwing’ in between ‘little’ and ‘rag’..?

        • Tracey

          how about pimp for the national party

      • Te Reo Putake 1.2.2

        “What’s with these Herald editors that they’re so reluctant to put their name, or any sort of sig, to their own op-eds?”

        Because they’re following a couple hundred years of global journalistic tradition?

    • Draco T Bastard 1.3

      If the public want a greater say in the election of the leader they can get off their arse and join the party.

      • Kiwiri - Raided of the Last Shark 1.3.1

        NZH is more worried that their right-wing and unthinking constituency might start to get clever ideas and begin asking for Nats party members to be able to vote for the choice of their leader, rather than have someone like a Boag arrange for a Brian Neeson to be conveniently dispatched and a key puppet parachuted in.

        Of course, the puppet than organises to have a whole bunch of MPs to fall on their sword for a nice sum of money to clear the decks for tobacco, alcohol and big corporate lobbyists.

      • What I have been saying for sometime. Im fed up,to the teeth at these Right-Wing blow hards telling Labour Party members how to manage “ourparty” .
        And let me tell you I bloody well tell when the are in front of me ,And to listen to what my wife tell them cannot be repeated in decent publication,believe me!!

    • AmaKiwi 1.4

      The Newspeak Land Herald remembers fondly the last time the caucus picked the leader, Captain Mumblefuck. A brilliant choice for National.

      I count on the Herald to advise me what NOT to do.

      • Clemgeopin 1.4.1

        The caucus needs to have a paradigm shift and understand that the members who put them there are supreme and not them.

        • Colonial Rawshark

          For some, that is a lesson that will only be appreciated with the application of a big stick.

  2. Rawmadness Natshark 2

    No these editorials pop up all the time slagging labour, got to be someone connected to National I’m sure. They are to often and too many, but never about any other party. It’s almost to the point legal action should be taken but what you could take them to court for I have no idea? Mikey? Frankly the continued attacks are
    just putting me off even opening the Herald these days. It’s just full of shit.

    I saw WOBF has a slagging off of Mikey Savage on his site, he apparently doesn’t understand depression and then goes on to call Greg a teat sucker for all his legal aide he was paid.

    I wonder if Winz hassle slatter as they do non National pets.

    • Paul 2.1

      Never buy the Herald.

      • TheContrarian 2.1.1

        Can’t remember the last time I bought a newspaper. I think the last time was the SST about 3 years ago and discovered the entire thing was almost completely news free.

      • phillip ure 2.1.2

        some pol-studs/journalism student should dig in there..

        ..do/run an audit of herald editorials over the last 12 months..

        ..and grade/define them for quantity and quality of biases…

        ..could be illuminating..

        ..even a total/comparison of anti-labour and anti-govt editorials could be interesting..

      • Kiwiri - Raided of the Last Shark 2.1.3

        A big thank you to the Herald Editorial today which has inspired this question that can be put to each of the nominee for the Labour leadership:

        – Will you “convince the party to ditch the rules that have put [the Labour Party] in this mess?”



        • Clemgeopin

          Here are a few examples of some excellent comments under that article:

          *Bearing in mind the political stance of this newspaper before the election, the Labour Party would be ill-advised to take any advice from an anonymous editorial. What Labour is doing is democratic. I know this is alien to the National Party and its supporters but this country is, at least in name, still a democracy although the major policy announcements and hints AFTER the election give a lie to this.

          *Wow, yet another attack on democracy. The party belongs to the members, who deserve and expect a voice in who will lead us. Many of us toiled long hard hours this year for neither pay nor glory because we believed Labour policies were best for New Zealand.
          When the next three years prove us right, the Herald just may discover that whomever is selected will indeed appeal to the wider electorate despite its best efforts to discredit that person.
          Have you apologised yet for Armstrong’s hysterical call for Cunliffe to resign over the manufactured scandal regarding his routine, 11-year old letter of inquiry concerning Donghua Liu? The credibility of any opinion emanating from the Herald regarding Labour leadership is laughable at best.

          *What Labour has is a much better and fairer democratic process where all the party members have a say. This is certainly a much superior method than the choosing of a leader either solely by the caucus members often for secretly promised cabinet positions, or having a leader indirectly imposed by powerful outside forces for their own political interests. I definitely prefer the transparent and robust method adopted by Labour rather than the secretive and dodgy method adopted by National and other parties. We live in an enlightened democratic society, not in North Korea.

          *Why doesn’t The Herald keep the hell out of it? Isn’t there something more important to write about.
          How about Key possibly lying about us going to war? Or wanting to change our flag during the 100 year anniversary of WW1.
          Those are the matters that are foremost in people’s minds, not how Labour chose their leader.
          Do your jobs, or is dissing Key not on your agenda?

          *Surprise surprise, the tory Newspapers put their oar in to that which is none of their business and underhandedly continue to undermine and assassinate the labour party in favour of their corporate owners favourite, the National Party and its leader the anti democratic liar Key. None of the Herald’s business how the Labour Party party chooses its leader, the Heralds editors biased “opinions”, much like those of the Doms and Fairfax are utterly biased and completely irrelevant.
          Sooner or later Kiwis will get sick of having their opinions manipulated by the failed main stream press and they will fade from view as social media and citizen journalism take over from their corporate PR agenda. The sooner the better and good riddance. We all know tories hate democracy and seek to undermine it at every opportunity. This editorial is just another example.

          *Can you just let them get on with it. If you do not like the way the Labour Party is run take out membership and lobby from within. I disagree with everything you say here, I think competition is healthy.

          • Kiwiri - Raided of the Last Shark

            Thanks. I did not look through the end of the page to read the comments.

      • AmaKiwi 2.1.4

        +1 (Never buy the Herald)

  3. Ad 3

    Can’t complain too hard about the NZHerald.
    Without the leadership contest they wouldn’t be getting any media coverage at all.

    Btw when’s the next major poll out?

  4. Pat O'Dea 4

    After two record breaking dry summers in a row. Are we in for another summer time drought?

    Dry weather has caused national hydro lake storage levels to drop sharply in the past month, down to 85 per cent of national average, as power demand rose in part because of farm irrigation.

    Meridian Energy’s latest monthly report shows that hydro storage was down from 94 per cent of average to 85 per cent in the month to October 13.

    Meridian said its own hydro lake inflows in September were just 51 per cent of average, the lowest September inflow for 15 years. That was a big drop from the high inflows seen in July and August which was the wettest on record.

    Overall, inflows were 114 per cent of average so far this financial year.

    Falling hydro storage saw a lift in wholesale electricity futures prices. Yesterday wholesale electricity prices in the North Island were up to $78 a megawatt hour and more than $84 a mwh at the top of the South Island.

    Asked if there was any concern about the ability to supply hydro power, given the present storage levels, Meridian said yesterday that there was “plenty of other generation in the market”.


    Yes you read that last bit right. Looks like we will be burning more coal at Huntly this summer.
    And there, in a nutshell, is encapsulated one of the ironies of the anthropocene. As extreme weather events like droughts, (and floods) become more common and more extreme due to greenhouse warming putting more energy into the system – what do we do to compensate?

    We put more greenhouse gases into the atmosphere.

    • vto 4.1

      “Meridian said its own hydro lake inflows in September were just 51 per cent of average, the lowest September inflow for 15 years. That was a big drop from the high inflows seen in July and August which was the wettest on record.”

      Recall the west coast suffered a drought (well, a west coast version of drought) right then for a few weeks. It has since been relatively inundated. Those low inflows are an anomaly but they make for good softening of consumers and other stakeholders for subsequent announcements needed for Meridian’s capitalist purposes i.e. raising prices, burning coal, etc as you suggest Pat.

      We are also in an el nino weather pattern so the southern alps will be saturated from here on. Super dry out east. All very normal swings in the weather systems but watch for the cries of 1 in 100 year events – the cries of bullshit and deception to suit the ends of the bloated and destructive capitalists in our midst .

      Quite why such capitalists build a business up to be so heavily dependent on matters of such variance I do not know – I thought they were meant to be smart. Methinks not that smart, just going google-eyed at the sight of dollars fluttering just in front of their noses like some tasty dangling carrot. Such fools. I prefer to follow the hippies ….


    • Draco T Bastard 4.2

      Watch as power prices go up with more record profits.

    • left for deadshark 4.3

      Pat,not sure you’ve had a chance to read the april edition of National Geographic.(can coal ever be clean)worth a read.

  5. les 5

    I guess we’ll hear from YanKey poodle dandy that we’re off to the 3rd Iraqui War any day now. The’regular meeting’ of the NZ Chief of Defence with Obama and other western hawks yesterday pretty much confirms it.

  6. Draco T Bastard 6

    The Lock Has Evolved: Open Doors With Your Phone

    There’s also an iPhone-only Kevo app that helps you manage virtual keys and track who comes and goes. You can hand out as many 24-hour temporary keys as you’d like, but Kevo charges you $2 each for more than two permanent digital keys.

    Seems to translate to: Business has found another way to spy on you and have you pay for the privilege.

    I’m not against electronic locking mechanisms, I’m against businesses being in control of the keys.

  7. Not a PS Shark Sashimi 7

    Discipline. We need discipline in Public. Whatever excuses MPs had in the immediate aftermath of the election result they should know better now.
    Shearer’s meltdown over Cunliffe resigning? WTF
    Mallard today coming out is sympathy with Judas Collins? WTF

    Parker, acting leader would do himself no harm by publicly berating MPS who have a need to prove their stupidity in Public. Parker, King, Coatsworth and Barnett have the duty to impose discipline. Do your job please.

    • RedLogix 7.1

      Mallard today coming out is sympathy with Judas Collins? WTF

      Yeah I read that. Has Mallard done anything in living memory the left might take some satisfaction from – or has he been the source of one embarrassment and betrayal after another?

      He’s been sitting in the safest of Labour seats for more than 25 years now – and in that time exactly what has he achieved?

      • ianmac 7.1.1

        “”It does show what I would describe as extreme prejudice,” he (Trevor) said, saying that, “former ministers had previously only been denied the title if they had been criminally charged.”
        The Herald suggests that Trevor was backing Collins. I think Trevor was having a crack at the Key bias rather than pro Collins. (Though we do hope she is found guilty.)

        • RedLogix

          In which case – who is gaming who here?

          The Herald has clearly framed this as Mallard supporting Collins. If that’s a complete misrepresentation of what Mallard was saying – then someone has a problem.

          • Bill Drees

            Mallard is old enough to be responsible for the outcome of any dialogue he has with Journalists. He was sympathising with Colins (fool) and having a dig at Key ( who is the Justice Spokesperson?) .
            Mallard, like Shshshshearer, thinks he is an elder statemen whose views on all things should be of interest.
            Coatsworth should them they are Labour MP and that if they keep this up they will not age another day on this party.

        • boldsirbrian

          @ ianmac (7.1.1 )

          You’ve got it ianmac. Really clever of Mallard (With apologies for breaking ‘unofficial rules’ around here that Mallard cannot be praised)

          Mallard is keeping the topic alive, rubbing salt into the wounds, under the disguise of ‘support’, just in case Key’s subtle (and poor) attempt of ‘oversight’ excuse is accepted. Neatly attacks Collins, and National disagreements at the same time. Mallard neatly steps away, (with smirk attached) unable to be criticised by National “Hell, I was only giving support” It’s classic Mallard.

          • Colonial Rawshark

            Great Thorndon Bubble interpretation. Anyone else anywhere else, see it this way?

            • boldsirbrian

              @ Colonial Rawshark (

              ask me if I am surprised at this response

              f.f.s Colonial, whatever Mallards politics are, one thing is certain. Any “support” Mallard gives Collins, is not the kind of support I’d want if I was drowning and such a “supporter” offered to give me a hand.

              But far be it for me to pop that Thorndon bubble of yours.

      • Colonial Rawshark 7.1.2

        By the way, did I mention that IMO regardless of what happens, the next Labour Leadership, whoever that is (probably except if it is Grant Robertson) is fucked. And probably the one after that too (again, with the exception of Grant Robertson).

        • Clemgeopin

          Why ‘ with the exception of Grant Robertson’ ?

          • Colonial Rawshark

            Like last leadership primary, he’s the preferred choice of the major caucus stirrers.

            • Bill Drees

              In which case the “winner”, probably Little, has to undertake some form of bloodletting. Cunliffe couldn’t do it last Dec because of the proximity to the elections. There is a lot of young guns who are fed up to the back teeth with the antics of Mallard Cosgrove Shearer Nash King and Robertson.
              Tbe battle today is the battle to get that mob put.

              A few young ones think its clever to suck up to them: wise up Ardern Hipkins Faafoi.

              • wekarawshark

                How would Little go about this? Doesn’t caucus control most things?

                • Colonial Rawshark

                  Correct. The next Leader has fuck all ability to control the likes of “Mallard Cosgrove Shearer Nash King and Robertson.”

                  Cunliffe couldn’t do it last Dec because of the proximity to the elections.

                  Which turned out to be wrong thinking strategically. Despite the short term costs to Labour, it should have been done, and we might even have had a better result on election day – and Cunliffe would still be Leader.

                  Hindsight 20/20 though.

                  • wekarawshark

                    It’s not the wrong thinking strategically if caucus control everything. What choice did he have?

                    So this is a numbers game. Has anyone done the maths on the factions? eg if Little wins will he be able to choose his deputy?

                    • Tracey

                      i dont get how the new leader if not the one wanted by those who didnt want cunliffe, can get rid of anyone… can caucus vote by majority to make someone resign… or similar?

                    • wekarawshark

                      as I understand it, caucus chooses the deputy on the recommendation of the leader, and caucuc chooses the cabinet and ranking within caucus.

                      So, it’s numbers game. eg Does Little have the numbers of people that would support him in his choice of deputy?

                      AFAIK the only way an MP can be made to resign is if they bring the party into disrepute or similar. I’m betting it’s a pretty high bar. I think it’s dealt with by the party rather than the MPs or leader.

                      That leaves the cabinet and rankings. Demoting the deadwood means they have less power*. I assume this is also a numbers game, but more complex than the deputy choice. Any Labour person care to elucidate?

                      *they could still shit stir, but then there will be candidate and list selections in a few years which is time for the membership to step up.

                      That’s me pegging together from various conversations. It’s still quite stunning that all these processes aren’t in the public domain.

                    • Colonial Rawshark

                      The membership have to step up NOW by signing on board new members who are not stuck in these MP’s small circle of inner loyalists. THEN officer positions on the LEC and at least some of the local branches need to be taken over.

                      That all has to be done *well before* any credible challenge to a sitting MP can be mounted.

                    • wekarawshark

                      Yes I agree that is a good and very important plan. Are you saying that my theory about the numbers game in caucus isn’t true?

                    • Colonial Rawshark

                      Actually, I don’t really know much about the rules in the caucus manual. Or how they are enforced.

                    • Not a PS Shark Sashimi


                      I’ve just seen a note stating that ” Unfinancial members will have until Tuesday 11th November to renew their membership.”

                      Get on with it boys and girls.

      • wekarawshark 7.1.3

        “He’s been sitting in the safest of Labour seats for more than 25 years now – and in that time exactly what has he achieved?”

        People know who he is.

        • phillip ure

          “..exactly what has he achieved?”..

          ..he wanted to bring the moa back to life..?

          ..he likes to flash his family-jewels clad in lycra..?

          ..he has a name that screams out for nicknames..?

          ..(i’m struggling here..!..)

      • Tracey 7.1.4

        he has put the knife in at the end suggesting key knows she has done something wrong…

        • Bill Drees

          Key got evidence collins was doing the numbers to work out how and when to roll him. All leaders are rolled- Collins knows it. All leaders want to determine the time and style of their departure-that is what puts Key in conflict with Collins.

          Key was pissed with Collins helping HER buddies out sell HIS buddies Fonterra in China: but he could have lived with it. He was very very very pissed that she was doing the numbers on him: unforgivable.

          The SFO is the excuse to kill her off.

      • alwyn 7.1.5

        “safest of Labour seats for more than 25 years now”
        21 years actually, but what are a few facts among friends.
        He won Pencarrow, the precursor of Hutt South, in 1993.
        There would be a good chance that if Trevor goes Labour would lose the seat. He does much, much better than does the Labour Party.

        • GregJ

          Losing Naenae took a big chunk of Labour vote with it. Of course Petone and Alicetown have gentrified some time ago – and gaining the Western Hills (Korokoro, Normandale, Maungarekei, Kelston) will also have added to National support (I’ll be interested to see the booth results but National won the Western, Central and Southern booths in 2011).

          I think National would quite liked to have taken this seat but the message didn’t quite get through to all of its supporters. Given that there will be no boundary changes for 2017 it will probably fall to National (almost certainly if Mallard doesn’t run).

      • AmaKiwi 7.1.6

        About 20 years ago a Aus friend told me most of the former state premiers were in jail. He named 4 or 5.

        I have nothing but contempt for people with honors and titles, particularly those in business and politics. The white old boys and girls patting themselves on the back.

        Collins proves calling an MP “honorable” is usually a contradiction of terms.

        A dear friend received a lesser honor for her long career in disease prevention (at average pay). That I respected. Thousands of people are better off because of her tireless efforts.

      • Murray Rawshark 7.1.7

        I think he closed a few schools. Is that an achievement?

        • Clemgeopin

          and Probably floored Tau and made him see stars? But no one said who won!

          • Murray Rawshark

            I ran into Tau Henare in St Lukes mall just after that Rayban/grundies thing. He looked like quite a timid and weak person. I wouldn’t regard flooring him as much of an achievement.

  8. Molly 9

    NEF (New Economics Foundation) has an article about the failure using of inflation rates to show the impact on the varying income levels in Britain.

    They have pointed to a Real Britain Index to track the differences in affordability for different income levels.

    The Real Britain Index: a more accurate measure of living standards

    Real Britain Index graphic

    • GregJ 9.1

      Thanks Molly – some interesting stuff on their site. I shall explore further.

      Does anyone know if something similar is being done for NZ?

  9. ianmac 10

    Dita De Bonigets it right – again:
    “To support his case for involving ourselves in the Iraq conflict, the Prime Minister has raised the spectre of a beheading on the streets, and told us that ‘officials’ have a desire for tighter legislation to be passed under urgency. It would be interesting to know precisely which officials have come up with this wish list; are they our own, working independently to assess the security risk to New Zealand specifically?”

    • key lied 17 times on camera over this one..

      ..trying to spin this obama-led war-planning council..as ‘just a routine meeting’..

      ..this was all stitched up way before the election..

      ..back when key was telling us all the lie that he ‘had no plans to go to war’..

      ..(maybe i am being uncharitable here..maybe he was saying that he had no actual ‘plans’ on paper..?..yet..?..d’yareckon..?..

      ..he is quite slippery with his word-meanings..eh..?..)

  10. joe90 11

    The plan to resolve materials issues, they’ll just work them out, eventually.

    Contamination levels for fusion will improve with additional materials research, he believes. “It’s been a chicken-and-egg situation. Until we’ve had a good working fusion system, there has not been money to go off and do the hard-core materials research,”



    • Murray Rawshark 11.1

      All the fusion proposals I’ve ever seen have been this enthusiastic before they’ve actually run anything. Once they’ve built a prototype and turned it on, they always find new problems. They remind me of a young guy trying out new lines from a how to pick up chicks book – he’ll be super enthusiastic about each new line, until he tries it.

      I hope we get there one day, but I’m pretty cynical about progress reports on new proposals.

  11. Jan 12

    Sorry to hark back but just started reading – newspapers and their bias – although owned by Otago Daily Times the Greymouth Star gives us West Coasters hope. Editorials are a delight, always have been, strong support for the left can be found, whilst making sure to keep in bosses good books, so it’s not one-sided (take note city editors) . Election campaign coverage was a case in point, the Nats stood a candidate with a very shady past over a mayoralty that saw ratepayers saddled with 12% rate rises, and investment funds that disappeared (there are still calls for a SFO investigation). The Star made sure all this was aired to the candidate’s fury who tried to turn it onto the other mayors, who of course weren’t standing for Parliament. She had completely lost all support in the district, and it was only due to the nothern part of the electorate that she gained any support – where they don’t see the Star but do have the Herald !

  12. Barfly 13

    Oh happy day my Labour Party new members pack has arrived in the mail…..When I enquired at Labour HQ about the process on 1st October I was told that over 2000 new members had applied to join in the previous week….I assume (rightly or wrongly) they were mainly like me…that is joining to support David Cunnliffe in his battle for the leadership.

    Bah…Homer Simpson moment “du-oh!!” Now I have to bloody think about who to support after my reason for joining has withdrawn from the race 🙁

    • lprent 13.1

      Do what I do. I have a small contribution that goes out every month from my bank account that, as well as feeding some money to Labour, also pays my membership.

      What would be nice is if they ever got to the point where it was a just a bank account that I put my membership number (whatever that is) in and it pushes rather than having Labour pulling it. That is how I pay bills, and it makes it possible to close accounts.

      Shortly I’m going to have to make a decision on the last three pull debits when I shut an account. Greenpeace is sure to allow me to change to direct push. Labour and Unicef?? ummm I think that if I can’t send direct to their bank accounts then they may be cut off.

    • Rodel 13.2

      Me too. As I don’t want to vote for any of the current contenders I shall scrawl ‘Cunliffe’ across the voting paper.
      Won’t do any good, no one will take any notice but I will have expressed my thoughts.

  13. veutoviper 14

    Where in the world is ……. Cathy Odgers?

    H/T to Russell Brown and Bernard Hickey’s Tweets, here is the latest (14 Oct) from Naked Capitalism:


    Cruising the world including Manhattan costume shops it seems ….

    This (long but worthwhile reading) article is a follow-up to NC’s earlier one on Odgers’ business connections. The comments at the end are not to be missed with Odgers replying to the writer of the article. Methinks there will be more to come.

    PS – apologies if someone has already posted this. I have little time to read blogs comprehensively at present.

  14. RTM 15

    In 2012 and now again in 2014, a high-profile Tongan-NZ artist has made a very public protest against homelessness. His performance has provoked hysterical responses from sections of the public – and from some members of the police force: http://readingthemaps.blogspot.co.nz/2014/10/spitting-on-artist.html

  15. wekarawshark 16

    Any thoughts on the browser addon HTTPS Everywhere?


    HTTPS Everywhere is a Firefox, Chrome, and Opera extension that encrypts your communications with many major websites, making your browsing more secure. Encrypt the web: Install HTTPS Everywhere today.

    HTTPS Everywhere is produced as a collaboration between The Tor Project and the Electronic Frontier Foundation. Many sites on the web offer some limited support for encryption over HTTPS, but make it difficult to use. For instance, they may default to unencrypted HTTP, or fill encrypted pages with links that go back to the unencrypted site. The HTTPS Everywhere extension fixes these problems by using a clever technology to rewrite requests to these sites to HTTPS.

  16. heh..!..i just took my/our very very small dog..(think 375g weetbix pkt with legs..)..

    ..on his first scooter-ride…

    ..tucked into my jacket..with his head sticking out at my neck-level..

    ..blatting down the rd..

    ..it went well..

    ..he seemed to really enjoy it…

    ..he looked at me like he was saying/thinking..

    ..’that is quite the upgrade..!

    ..whatever will you come up with next..?..’

    • Clemgeopin 17.1

      Did you belt him?

      • phillip ure 17.1.1

        no..he was secure inside my jacket..

        ..a place he’s used to spending time in..

        ..(cold mornings..etc..)

        • Clemgeopin

          What if he unexpectedly wees like a sieve…or worse, surprises you suddenly with some serious poo?….Serious question!

          • phillip ure

            um..!..he’s not that kinda dog…?

            ..i am sure he wd be mortified at the very idea of peeing/crapping on me..

            ..he is far too smart/classy..

            ..do you have much experience with dogs..?

            ..or are you runnning on urban-myths/fears..?

            • Clemgeopin

              Good to know. I was half joking, half serious.
              Yep, I had a large Rhodesian Ridge Back and a corgi, then two border coolie cross siblings from SPCA as pups (the previous owner was charged with cruelty) now all in doggy heaven.
              At present I have a sch-noodle (Schnauzer-poodle) and a Cavoodle (Cavalier King Charles Spaniel and the Miniature Poodle) both quite dear, in both sense of the term!

              Dogs are so lovely and LOYAL, unlike some contemporary politicians in the news now!

              • the small dog is a teacup poodle…

                ..a small teacup poodle..

                ..he is a hoot..!

                ..has a great personality..

                ..my 16 yr old mongrel died a couple of weeks ago..

                ..my lovely lucy..

                ..and today was the first day i was able to face taking small dog walking in the park..where we all used to walk each day..

                ..i thought i wd be ok..

                ..but i blubbed like a baby..again..

                ..i kept looking around for her ..

                ..i so so miss her..

                • Clemgeopin

                  I know how you feel because I have felt similar sorrow and longing four times now. Actually, five times. I didn’t mention a lovely mongrel I had as my very first dog. One gets so attached to them. They are so obedient, grateful, protective and show so much love. They make you very happy if looked after well….Helps in the GNH!…Some of the the labour caucus members should each have a dog so that they don’t bitch so much and can educate themselves about loyalty to their elected leader and the party at good times and bad.

                  • (found this today..)

                    “..Science proves that you love your dog like a baby..”


                    • joe90

                      “The Power of the Dog”

                      There is sorrow enough in the natural way
                      From men and women to fill our day;
                      And when we are certain of sorrow in store,
                      Why do we always arrange for more?
                      Brothers and Sisters, I bid you beware
                      Of giving your heart to a dog to tear.

                      Buy a pup and your money will buy
                      Love unflinching that cannot lie —
                      Perfect passion and worship fed
                      By a kick in the ribs or a pat on the head.
                      Nevertheless it is hardly fair
                      To risk your heart for a dog to tear.

                      When the fourteen years which Nature permits
                      Are closing in asthma, or tumour, or fits,
                      And the vet’s unspoken prescription runs
                      To lethal chambers or loaded guns,
                      Then you will find — it’s your own affair —
                      But . . . you’ve given your heart to a dog to tear.

                      When the body that lived at your single will,
                      With its whimper of welcome, is stilled (how still!)
                      When the spirit hat answered your every mood
                      Is gone — wherever it goes — for good,
                      You will discover how much you care,
                      And will give your heart to a dog to tear.

                      We’ve sorrow enough in the natural way,
                      When it comes to burying Christian clay.
                      Our loves are not given, but only lent,
                      At compound interest of cent per cent.
                      Though it is not always the case, I believe,
                      That the longer we’ve kept’em, the more do we grieve;

                      For, when debts are payable, right or wrong,
                      A short-time loan is as bad as a long —
                      So why in — Heaven (before we are there)
                      Should we give our hearts to a dog to tear?

                      Rudyard Kipling

                    • Clemgeopin

                      Nice stuff Phil. Thanks.

                      “Pets hold a special place in many people’s hearts and lives, and there is compelling evidence from clinical and laboratory studies that interacting with pets can be beneficial to the physical, social and emotional wellbeing of humans,” said Lori Palley, DVM, of the MGH Center for Comparative Medicine and co-lead author of the report. “Several previous studies have found that levels of neurohormones like oxytocin – which is involved in pair-bonding and maternal attachment – rise after interaction with pets, and new brain imaging technologies are helping us begin to understand the neurobiological basis of the relationship, which is exciting.”

                      Joanna Rothkopf
                      Joanna Rothkopf is an assistant editor at Salon, focusing on sustainability. Follow @JoannaRothkopf or email jrothkopf@salon.com.

              • AmaKiwi

                US President Harry Truman: “If you want a friend in Washington, get a dog.”

                • Clemgeopin

                  So true! What a sad indictment on the politicians, their dirty politics and disloyal deeds!…the buggers earn such big money and act so small towards one another and the country. We need a rule that no MP can be a member for more than four terms. That will eliminate a whole lot of crooked carrier opportunists and deadwood. What do you think?

  17. joe90 18


    He’ll need a pair of doggles.

  18. Mark 19

    The latest Roy Morgan has Labour at 22.5 and the Greens at 17.5. That gap ever gets completely closed and Labour is finished.

    • Sable 19.1


      • Colonial Rawshark 19.1.1

        The gap between Labour and Greens is 14%+. That’s the gap taken by the only poll which matters.

        Mind you, if Labour was going at all well, that gap should be as high as 25%.

    • Chooky Shark Smile 19.2

      wow …that is good!…at least the Greens have got it together …i hope they hit the 40% mark!…and then it wont matter who is the Leader of the Labour Party…when i leave the Labour Party I am going to join the Green Party

    • i’ve worked out why the green vote is always lower than the polls predict…

      ..and it will solve a raft of other problems for progressives too..

      ..(as in bye-bye dunne..etc..etc..)

      ..i’ll write up in the morning..

  19. Sable 20

    Seems Wellington Shitty Council is out to prove its the worst in the country yet again. This time its spying on campers with a view to handing out big fat fines which no doubt will be added to its already bulging coffers. What ever happened to friendly welcoming New Zealand?

    • ianmac 20.1

      That’s what happens when nasty things escape from the Sable. Should’ve locked the door.

      • Chooky Shark Smile 20.1.1

        lol…horse has bolted….Wellington City Council always was mercenary…especially parking tickets…all the money goes to pay for those ghastly overpasses and underpasses and tunnels and motorways through its heart..it is a roading engineers paradise

        …and now they are going to throw away millions of dollars of perfectly good electric trolley buses and upgrade to buses which spew out toxic fumes

        talk about turning paradise into a nightmare

        • Colonial Rawshark

          Yep got stung bad one summer holidaying in WGN. Never again.

        • phillip ure

          @ chooky..

          ..and a ‘green’ mayor..y’say..?

          • Chooky Shark Smile

            yup….and as a long time resident of that city …. I love Wellington!!! …the harbour and the ever changing moods of the sky…the storms, the wild coastline…the bush skylines and the pristine days, the cafes, the multi cultural cuisine …the compactness of the easily walked city… the youth and the vibrant artistic and creative people living on the frisson of two tectonic plates …perfect place for an absolutely booming IT industry

            ..it is just that when politicians ( no matter what their persuasion) and roading engineers get together …town planning mayhem results… and traffic utliity takes over all aesthetic considerations …

            …the spoilage of such a geographical site would not happen in Europe

    • Draco T Bastard 20.2

      Which campers? I understand that freedom campers are a major problem with littering and, literally, shitting up places.

      • wekarawshark 20.2.1

        The solution to that is to regulate the tourism industry, not remove the rights of NZers.

  20. Olwyn 21

    Today on the bus, I think I suddenly grasped the perspective of Labour’s right wingers. I was thinking about Shearer’s recent claim that the LP had been hijacked. Then I remembered Puddleglum quoting Shane Jones as saying, ““I’ve never said this on the record, but I was deeply influenced in a positive way by the figures of the Lange Government. I didn’t do my due diligence to discover how much the Labour Party had changed.”


    It seems to me that these people think that the neo-liberal, globalist faction wrested the LP off the old fashioned, unenlightened socialists and that it is now theirs: that the Clark years were merely a transition, allowing people a period of acclimatisation to the new system. Where I see a need to “get the party back” they see the threat of counter-revolution. If I am right then it is very unfortunate that they hold this view at a time when the people who think they are Labour’s constituency desperately need allies in the public sphere.

    • Anne 21.1

      Great stuff Olwyn. You’re bang on. A misguided and erroneous interpretation of what David Cunliffe, his supporters and many of us who comment here are trying to achieve. What it also shows is that they are mindlessly pigeon-holing individuals because of age, background and historical political engagements.

      I had a personal experience last year, involving David Shearer, with what I now recognise was probably caused by exactly the sentiment to which you refer. I mentioned it a few days ago in a comment. Here is the relevant excerpt:

      Mt Albert was the strongest LEC in NZ up to when Shearer was handed the seat on a plate by Goff.

      I can attest to that. I was one of a group of young activists who built up the Mt Albert Labour Party in the 1970s and 80s and Helen Clark’s suppporters continued the good work when we moved on to other places. In August of last year I attended a memorial service for the Labour incumbent prior to Helen (Warren Freer) who had also been an old friend of my deceased father. I was taken aback to find myself on the receiving end of “unfriendly glares” from David Shearer. He apparently knew who I was and appeared unhappy about my presence. It Ieft me feeling embarrassed and angry as I had even more right to be there than himself.

      • Olwyn 21.1.1

        That shows a terrible lack of respect, to you, to his electorate and to the party that he purports to represent. Moreover, as the neo-liberal chickens come home to roost, with beggars on the streets, joblessness, homelessness, and worse poverty than in places that are officially under austerity, they are the ones looking like yesterday’s men.

  21. ianmac 22

    Dirty Politics. Action Stations has an open letter to send to Party Leaders demanding that the enquiry into Dirty Politics be actioned.
    I think I got the right URL.

  22. Clemgeopin 23

    EBOLA : Oh, dear! “Let us see! ”

    Watch from 7:07 minutes onwards and listen to Obama at the end of that at 10:35minutes, a three minute segment. ! More importantly listen to the poignant three letter comment by Hillary Barry on Obama’s revelation that he shook hands with, embraced and kissed the colleagues of an Ebola infested nurse.


    Hope everything works out fine for Obama, and the people he has met so far and the heads of governments that he would be meeting soon. Scary stuff as I don’t believe the scientists and doctors know everything about Ebola yet!

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