Open mike 17/11/2024

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, November 17th, 2024 - 40 comments
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40 comments on “Open mike 17/11/2024 ”

  1. SPC 1
    17 November 2024 at 9:00 am

    Considering what is known, as to abuse in state care and the cover-up and the unknown consequence of the Hobson's Choice ACT agenda. It is time to improve the machinery of governance.

    We need to place the AG (and SG and Crown Law and police oversight) outside of Cabinet and accountable to the GG.

    And with it, the whole orbit of the Crown regime, from the Waitangi Tribunal and Human Rights Commission to Ombudsmen and Auditor General and the Public Service.

    The PM should be required to inform the GG of the government plans from week to week, as in the UK. The GG then in Privy Council and later providing feedback (exercise the Crowns right to provide advice). This can satisfy some of the requirements of UNDRIP.

    Our governments need some sense of accountability.

    Our nation is nearly 200 year old and needs to develop some maturity.

    Reply
    • gsays 1.1
      17 November 2024 at 9:24 am

      Good suggestions going forward.

      Where does pressure for accountability come from today? Clearly not the opposition, their hands have blood on them.

      The MSM media, with Smale's reportage an exception, seem reluctant to do anything that doesn't keep their advertiser's happy.

      I look around here at a diverse collection of lefties, and don't see a lot of enthusiasm (Trump's doing his distraction job very well), I ask around my circle of friends and colleagues and get zip.

      No surprises but I come back to this neo-liberal mindset that reckons $ are more valuable than people.

      Reply
    • Incognito 1.2
      17 November 2024 at 11:38 am

      Our governments need some sense of accountability.

      MMP governments (in NZ) are only accountable to a 51% majority or more to repeal/pass legislation as they see fit. The governing parties are accountable to a coalition contract. The MPs are accountable to their party leadership (to various internal degrees) and then only to themselves.

      Our nation is nearly 200 year old and needs to develop some maturity.

      How would we ago about achieving this? Our nation, like so many others, is fracturing and atomising because the repulsive forces are getting stronger than the attracting ones, breaking existing bonds and vaporising cohesion, belonging, and kinship.

      Reply
      • gsays 1.2.1
        17 November 2024 at 12:01 pm

        With all due respect, when talking about accountability for covering up the abuse in State Care, we are not talking about election results nor coalition agreements.

        Governments govern all of us, the rich, sick, elderly, poor etc not just those that vote for them.

        Maybe the case is to get Iran to hold them to account again.

        Reply
  2. bwaghorn 2
    17 November 2024 at 9:10 am

    https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/533976/treaty-principles-bill-haka-mps-must-uphold-standards-of-parliament-luxon-says

    Loving the pathetic tut tutting of the white wing government parties and sycophants, surely as the haka has been a part of Maori politics since forever it has a place in parliament?

    Wonder how long it took to get the piss smell out of seymours seat!!!

    Reply
  3. Jenny 3
    17 November 2024 at 9:36 am

    Craig Mokhiber is the senior human rights official who resigned in protest from the UN over the UN’s inaction to halt the genocide in Gaza.

    Mokhiber tells us that it is very possible, that at the next approving of UN credentials of each country, next year, Israel, despite all the attempts of the Western powers to prevent it, will be expelled from the UN General Assembly by a vote of the overwhelming majority of the world's nations.

    @32:43 minutes;

    …..Just to go back a little bit, you know suspending or expelling a country from the UN under the normal provisions of the charter requires uh agreement of the Security Council, and we know the US and the UK will never ever agree, and they will veto any such effort. So the way they got around this in the South Africa case during apartheid was, the US the UK and France vetoed the effort to suspend South Africa they vetoed it in the Security Council, the president of the General Assembly and the majority of the General Assembly then went forward and they said, 'Okay. we don't have the power to do that, but we can suspend their participation in the in the General Assembly, which is basically the parliament of the of the UN.

    And the way they did that, was when the credentials committee was approving participation for each country at the beginning of the session of the General Assembly they denied that approval to South Africa.

    They can do the same thing to Israel. Now that process has already taken place for the current General Assembly…..

    …..when this happens it's going to happen in the beginning of the next session it's, going to happen in the Fall, [Spring in NZ]. If it if it is going to happen that's when it would would happen. And the head of the credentials committee will will also change.

    …..Now what will the US? I mean Israel obviously. But what will the US and the UK do between now and then to try to peel off votes?

    You can bet they're going to use every carrot and stick.

    But it's still possible, and I think what is most compelling here, is that what they cannot deny is that there's never been a country in the history of the UN that's been more deserving of as a minimum of suspension from the general assembly……

    [A following long list of Israeli crimes and breaches of the UN Charter and attacks on UN personal and institutions]

    If it is not, and I just say this; If Israel is not at least suspended from the General Assembly, the credibility of that institution tanks…..

    I am hoping and believing that it is still possible for this actually to occur between now and and next Fall…..

    [AI generated transcript lightly edited for clarity and parsed for brevity]

    I highly rate this video, Craig Mokhiber provides a small bright ray of hope piercing the darkness, for some sort of resolution, or possibly even an end, to the seemingly endless genocide in Gaza.

    Personally speaking, I admire Craig Mokhiber's ability to keep so much information and facts straight in his head, about the International justice system and how it works, (or doesn't work). Craig Mokhiber has an ability to explain and lay bare in exquisite detail the arcane workings of the International Rules Based Order, how it operates, how it is administered. its weaknesses, its strengths, how it is manipulated and undermined, how it resists these attempts at being undermined. All the panoply of current actors and individuals and organisations that parade across its stage.

    Craig Mokhiber mourns that this and other international legal actions by the UN the World Court and the ICC will not save the tens of thousands of Palestinians presently being murdered and starved in Israel's genocidal war against them, but will achieve some redress for the survivors.

    I highly recommend watching this video, I hope you get as much out of it as I did. 'J'

    23,727 views Nov 17, 2024

    #TheElectronicIntifada #TheElectronicIntifadaPodcast

    It’s been 293 days since the International Court of Justice in The Hague ordered Israel to halt all killing and other genocidal acts against the Palestinian people. And it was 177 days ago that the chief prosecutor of the International Criminal Court issued arrest warrants for Benjamin Netanyahu and Yoav Gallant, two of the Israeli leaders directly responsible for the genocide. But Israel is only accelerating its extermination of Palestinians through continued bombing and starvation and expanding its attack on Lebanon, while the ICC has failed to issue any arrest warrants. We speak to Craig Mokhiber about why all paths to accountability for Israel appear to be blocked……

    Reply
  4. tWig 4
    17 November 2024 at 10:04 am

    The UN may as well, especially after Trump pulls funding from the UN. Not a big believer in the US funding anything international, except for US arms manufacture, in his rush to dismantle Federal spending.

    Reply
  5. koina 5
    17 November 2024 at 11:30 am

    Not much really changes when there is a Government change?

    Nothing has really changed in NZ since Nov last year.

    Nothing has really changed in the UK since May.

    Nothing much will really change under Trump.

    I am convinced the Left actually does better and is more united in opposition.

    The Right in opposition are like rabid dogs on methamphetamine because they hate

    the thought that White Right wing power is being ursurped by the inferior Left.

    In Power the Right are just as arrogant and prejudiced yet less vitriolic and toxic

    because they have the power they crave so need not hate on minorities so much.

    So yes life for the left is better in opposition

    Reply
    • Patricia Bremner 5.1
      17 November 2024 at 12:38 pm

      Ask David Letele if he agrees with you.

      CoC are vicious and systematic in their removal of worker and Maori rights.

      So I challenge your comments.

      The Left are better managers by far, because they listen to the science advice and don't always put the almighty dollar first.

      Give examples of the Left being" vitriolic and toxic"

      I think you are trolling here.sad

      Reply
  6. joe90 6
    17 November 2024 at 12:10 pm

    Perhaps there are uses for AI that aren't as sinister AF.

    .

    O2 has today unveiled the newest member of its fraud prevention team, ‘Daisy’. As ‘Head of Scammer Relations’, this state-of-the-art AI Granny’s mission is to talk with fraudsters and waste as much of their time as possible with human-like rambling chat to keep them away from real people, while highlighting the need for consumers to stay vigilant as the UK faces a fraud epidemic.

    https://news.virginmediao2.co.uk/o2-unveils-daisy-the-ai-granny-wasting-scammers-time/

    Reply
    • Kay 6.1
      17 November 2024 at 2:38 pm

      I play scrabble against an AI bot named Zoey. Sometimes I beat her, and my scrabble game is definitely improving.

      I'd like to think it's not too sinister?

      Reply
  7. joe90 7
    17 November 2024 at 12:24 pm

    From free speech absolutist to anti free speech authoritarian.

    /

    Reply
  8. joe90 8
    17 November 2024 at 1:25 pm

    Masha Gessen cites former Hungarian anti-communist dissident Bálint Magyar.

    This Is the Dark, Unspoken Promise of Trump’s Return

    […]

    For those bewildered by why so many Americans apparently voted against the values of liberal democracy, Balint Magyar has a useful formulation. “Liberal democracy,” he says, “offers moral constraints without problem-solving” — a lot of rules, not a lot of change — while “populism offers problem-solving without moral constraints.” Magyar, a scholar of autocracy, isn’t interested in calling Donald Trump a fascist. He sees the president-elect’s appeal in terms of something more primal: “Trump promises that you don’t have to think about other people.”

    Around the world, populist autocrats have leveraged the thrilling power of that promise to transform their countries into vehicles for their own singular will. Vladimir Putin and Viktor Orban vowed to restore a simpler, more orderly past, in which men were men and in charge. What they delivered was permission to abandon societal inhibitions, to amplify the grievances of one’s own group and to heap hate on assorted others, particularly on groups that cannot speak up for themselves. Magyar calls this “morally unconstrained collective egoism.”

    Trump’s first term, and his actions in the four years since, tracked the early record of Putin and Orban in important ways. Looking closely at their trajectories, through the lens of Magyar’s theories, gives a chillingly clear sense of where Trump’s second term may lead.

    https://archive.li/O2NyX (nyt)

    Reply
    • SPC 8.1
      17 November 2024 at 4:39 pm

      “Trump promises that you don’t have to think about other people.”

      Fast tracking.

      Reply
    • joe90 8.2
      17 November 2024 at 7:01 pm

      What they delivered was permission to abandon societal inhibitions, to amplify the grievances of one’s own group and to heap hate on assorted others, particularly on groups that cannot speak up for themselves.

      Like this drip who's indignant because her kid told her he's not allowed to say retard at school but it's her right to use the word however she pleases..

      .

      @atrupar

      classy stuff at the latest school board meeting in my hometown of Forest Lake, Minnesota (the same town Pete Hegseth is from) these people are more emboldened than ever to be their absolute worst selves

      https://xcancel.com/atrupar/status/1857817046236455211

      Reply
    • Morrissey 8.3
      18 November 2024 at 8:55 am

      Zelensky wanted to sue for peace just a few weeks after the special military operation began; that moral colossus Boris Johnson was dispatched to Kyiv to stop such nonsensical talk.

      A peace-loving U.S. senator, who dwells on the same lofty moral plane as BoJo, summed up the bravery of the sponsors of this proxy war perfectly: "When we said we wanted to fight Russia down to the last Ukrainian, we meant it."

      https://x.com/RnaudBertrand/status/1769956089183846548

      Reply
  10. Subliminal 10
    17 November 2024 at 2:59 pm

    National has just introduced legislation that would allow prosecution and conviction for any protest that the govt of the day deemed to be offensive. It carries a penalty of 14 yrs imprisonment!?

    It is precisely these types of laws that the Starmer govt in the UK is currently using against direct action protests in support of Palestine that target weapons manufacturers such as Elbit Systems. It has also been used to justify a raid on and confiscation of hard drives and phones from Asa Winstanley of the Electronic Intifada.

    It has been and likely will again be used to jail direct action activists protesting climate change.

    The fact that Labour in the UK has used this legislation at least as much if not more than the previous Tory govt shows that no govt can be trusted not to abuse these wide ranging powers.

    “Essentially, this law allows the government to criminalise people based on its own misconceptions, conspiracy theories, and outright fantasies of their motivations (and its belief that we “ought to know” about their weirdo fantasies). It would have allowed Muldoon to jail John Minto and all of HART for 14 years for being foreign agents. It would have allowed them to jail every anti-nuclear protestor who blocked a street or rowed a canoe in front of a ship, and everyone who wrote a letter to the editor under a false name advocating against nuclear ship visits. It potentially – depending on what weird fantasies the SIS and Federated Farmers have – allows them to jail every member of the climate, environmental, and indigenous rights movements.”

    https://norightturn.blogspot.com/2024/11/nationals-tyrannical-foreign.html?m=1

    Reply
  11. Muttonbird 11
    17 November 2024 at 4:57 pm

    Secondary Principals Council head Kate Gainsford said schools had been bombarded with advice from the ministry, the New Zealand Qualifications Authority and police about the potential for disruption related to the hīkoi.

    She said much of the information – about safety and how best to manage delays – was useful and timely, but Seymour casting aspersions over schools' neutrality on a political issue was unprecedented.

    "Given his inflammatory comments and the timing of the advice that's coming out, the amount of advice that's coming out and the focus of the advice coming out. It is open to the interpretation – absolutely – that the minister is using the Ministry of Education's communications to advance a particular line that is of interest particularly to him," Gainsford said.

    A statement from the ACT Party last week encouraged parents to write to their school boards to remind them of their obligations for neutrality under the public service's integrity and conduct standards.

    "Parents may also consider whether their representatives on their school's board deserve re-election," the statement said.

    Incredible to see commander of small, light-touch government threaten students, teachers, principles, and school board members not to go near Hikoi mō Te Tiriti. The associate minister telling schools what they can and cannot teach on a field trip. I wonder where the minister is on this? Hiding, I suspect.

    Seymour is terrified of direct action, particularly when Māori direct action is supported by others.

    https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/political/533984/treaty-principles-bill-seymour-s-allegations-around-students-taking-part-in-hikoi-inflammatory

    Reply
  12. Patricia Bremner 12
    17 November 2024 at 5:36 pm

    It smacks of something?????? Thin edge of the authoritarian wedge.

    Reply
  13. Mike the Lefty 13
    17 November 2024 at 6:21 pm

    Just want to relate that I mixed with a lot of people who were at the gathering point of the Treaty bill protest in Palmerston North today, although I couldn't actually attend it due to being at work.

    People seemed engaged, positive and friendly, far from the negative bogans who urinated in public places, spat at police and abused everyone at a parallel protest nearly two years ago.

    The people today had anger, but they also had dignity and concern for their fellow citizens. They were real Kiwis, I was proud to be amongst them.

    Reply
    • Anne 13.1
      17 November 2024 at 7:45 pm

      Tell you what. Have watched that magnificent Haka in parliament a dozen times now. Debbie Ngarewa-Parker and Hana Rawhiti Maipi Clarke not only looked splendid they sounded splendid. Contrast that with the seated dour bunch of ignorant peasantry they were facing.

      Which reminds me. Where is the deputy leader of the Act Party? Haven't set eyes on her for so long I've forgotten her name.

      Reply
    • Patricia Bremner 13.2
      17 November 2024 at 9:51 pm

      yes

      Reply
  14. joe90 14
    17 November 2024 at 7:23 pm

    Republicans are quibbling…

    Out of Oklahoma's 1,984 precincts, roughly 260 precincts cast the majority of votes for Harris.

    There were a handful of precincts throughout the state that actually garnered a tie vote among the two candidates and thus deemed a purple precinct.

    https://www.oklahoman.com/story/news/politics/elections/2024/11/11/oklahoma-election-map-of-all-red-counties-goes-viral-is-it-accurate/76200869007/

    Reply
  15. Koff 15
    17 November 2024 at 8:06 pm

    On a bike ride this morning up the Southport Spit in the Gold Coast and passed hundreds of Maori and pakeha supporters on a mini hikoi from Main Beach to the Seaway. A small contingent of indigenous Australians with them, carrying Aboriginal flags. Loads of flags, banners and placards. I knew that 1 in 5 (175,000) Maori live in Oz, with 65,000 in Queensland alone, but have never been sure about the strengths of their ties with whanau and whenua. Lots of smiles and waves as I passed (maybe because I was wearing a NZ logoed cap?) I called out a Kia Ora and Toitu te Tiriti to everyone who passed by.

    Reply
  16. Obtrectator 16
    17 November 2024 at 11:57 pm

    Some handy tips here:

    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2024/nov/17/how-to-survive-the-broligarchy-20-lessons-for-the-post-truth-world-donald-trump

    Could become relevant to li'l ol' NZ sooner than we think if Trump acolyte Smirkmore keeps up his current pace.

    Reply

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