I see the conservative press are telling us that it’s time to stop talking about dirty politics because we should be talking about policy and nobody really cares anyway. We peons should be grateful for such sage advice.
I still think National will win the election, which will leave us in the strange position of having an openly corrupt government by public consent.
That is the thought that horrifies me, especially since such consent would come from a little over half of the voting population. Given the deepening inequality in this country, it would effectively be a vote for the powerful to dominate the powerless, and for constitutional safeguards to be treated as PR measures, and nothing more.
Interesting, but it’s odd that there’s little emphasis on journalistic ethics. You would think that adhering to the four basic principles, or at least attempting to, would be required for someone to be classed as a journalist.
Slater hasn’t minimised harm, acted independently or been accountable. Not only has he not been these things, he has actively worked against such standards – the Len Brown case alone is enough to damn him.
I honestly would not be surprised if none of this matters to our tedious, tory judiciary.
The thought is just horrifying, and our best chance is, as Chooky says, to urge all those who would vote left to vote. I don’t think that upper middle class NZ fully appreciates the need for democratic safeguards. National’s TV ad all but dog-whistles to this indifference, featuring white, triumphalist rowers proudly defeating the enemy within. Such hubris encourages the idea that safeguards are for losers, and that winners are unnecessarily hampered by them. We desperately need a strong showing from the left in this election, for democracy’s sake.
@ Tom Jackson(1.1.1.1.1) ….Disagree!…It was very close last time when many Labour people did not vote . ( people were still angry with Phil Goff being leader and leading the charge against asset sales when he once supported them under Labour/Roger Douglas…it was too much to swallow)
This time people will vote! Cunliffe is a good and compassionate leader for Labour. He is well able to stand up against Key!
( There are many ‘undecided’ who do not want to declare to the pollsters…I myself refuse to talk to pollsters …there are others who lie…and others who will not disclose ( the ‘undecideds’)…after all we live in a surveillance society under John Key’s NACT…people are paranoid)
Bugger the POLLSTERS! ( they are too often wrong as Jim Bolger found out!)
We have to FOCUS on winning!!!… and calling the media to ACCOUNT
……we want the TRUTH! This election must be about HONESTY and NOT SPIN!….
….we must FIGHT for this Labour /Left coalition WIN!.
The guy is, like most of these right wing morons, an economic illiterate. Actual economics is much more reasonable and cautious than these clowns think.
What a shame you didn’t have the testicles to use that slogan/anti labour smear and front it to DC when he was on here answering questions.
Shame you bottled it and went, dear mr Cunliffe instead.
You’re worse than the right wing nuggets that come on here. Shame on you.
That won’t be easy. Key is punching at shadows – he can’t see his enemy and he doesn’t know what might come next.
But he has to get on with it. Key’s line this week that the ‘‘cowardly hacker has stolen your election’’ is a good start, but National needs much more than that. Key has looked unsure on television all week – he’s looked unconvincing. The nice guy has gone.
So, for Key, it all starts tomorrow with the official National campaign launch. He needs a big-bang policy to get people talking.
These National fanbois in the MSM really seem to have NFI just how much damage that National have done to our democracy and need to be removed to prevent further damage. To them it’s all about winning – no matter the cost to our society.
Both! Considering that journalists have dirt on each other and play all that stupid ‘what plays in Vegas, stays in Vegas’ game. I’d be bloody surprised if he didn’t.
Fisher seemed almost self-muzzled on The Nation this morning, as a commentator. Either he is protecting what HOS will publish tomorrow from the person with the docs who is not whaledump, or he is scared. Was very odd to me.
Steven Joyce is continuing has black op’s dirty politics regimen even though his leader has said the opposition can’t win on policy and that’s why they continue the dirty political attacks on John Key, Ha Ha,
On Whaleoil 20th the attack from Joyce was made against Labour candidate and grandson of Sir Walter Nash, the highly successful Stuart Nash.
On Whaleoil Cameron Slater openly rejects any issue of dirt is being placed against Stuart Nash, with a statement ” he is a good guy” which shows that Joyce is behind much of this dirty Politics campaign all along.
National contuse their dirty politics and says they are not! Lies, Lies, Lies.
by Cameron Slater on August 20, 2014 at 9:30am
Steven Joyce has made allegations that Whaleoil is going to release information about Stuart Nash. Joyce says it is to balance things up. This should be called out for what it is.
It is an out and out lie.
Steven Joyce is a disgrace for suggesting this because he has lied to protect his own interests.
Nash wrote two articles for the Truth and I talk to him occasionally like I do with many on the left. I know nothing at all about Stuart Nash doing anything other than he is a bloody good politician who scares National. Nash is winning a National seat because he is a far better politician that Steven Joyce ever will be, and Joyce is having a sook because he will never be as popular as Nash.
Steven Joyce should be far more worried about people like Bill English trying to claim the moral high ground when everyone knows what lengths he, Boag and McCully have gone to in political battles over the years. That coming out would be truly damaging.
Given the last time I spoke to Steven Joyce was several years ago when I sledged him out about Twitter at a National party conference in Auckland it is highly unlikely he’d know what I was up to.
Doodlehead
was that on ZB with Hosking ? I thought he said Whaleblog(or whatever it’s called) was going to release it
Ed for clarity
Soleman
That was my understanding as well
http://keepingstock.blogspot.com/ Keeping Stock
Yep; that was what was said. Whaledump would be releasing something about Nash to show how balanced the hackers are; as if…
Mark
Ouch!
Rem
Whaledump I heard
kiwibattler
Yes – I think Cam has jumped the gun on this (unless someone can find a link showing Joyce mentioning it is whaleoil).
Ross15
You are both right. I heard the interview and they were talking about whaledump and Joyce said he expected there to be continued releases up until the election. He said he’d heard today there would be a “balance up” with a release concerning Stuart Nash.
I think Cam needs to do a retraction on what he has said above about Joyce.
izhoui
Nah. Game playing.
Fat Sally
Nash is a good bloke. He will win Napier comfortably. Well ahead in the polls.
THE APE
thats what i thought to – well according to ZB anyway
Goldie
But I thought that Cam Slater was a puppet of the evil Tories? And according to Nicky Hagar, Cam Slater is a tool of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy?
And here he is publicly bagging Steven Joyce…
tjb
And so it goes on, every day until Sept 19 we are going to have this junk news drip fed
so_ruggef
Jumped the gun Cam, zb reporting whale dump to release info. But when you say you have nothing on Nash didnt you used to call him a serial rooter back in the day?
Sir Brucey
Isnt Joyce also one of those scum list MPs? Why doesnt he test his popularity and support in an electorate battle !!!
LesleyNZ
Not in my book. Steven Joyce and Bill English are OK with me.
Snoop
Easy to just pull this post … 🙂
Stuff like this makes me hate Dot.Com even more …
Becos his “WhaleDump-Dump” is now getting confused with the real Whale …
Bruce from taihape
Get your facts right Slater. Paranoia setting in?
Coffee Connoisseur
“Get your facts right Slater. Paranoia setting in?”
Collins backside is all burnt and Joyce cannot contain his glee.
Key looks really ill, I bet he can’t wait till he and Bronie are lying back sipping pina colada in Hawaii and dirty politics is just a memory.
We will remember these liars and soothsayers at voting time
Stephen Price (Media Law Journal) has some great commentary around Dirty Politics. They are a bit long but it would be great to see them broken into parts and made feature posts here on TS.
Now look here, the only reasons that justify baying for a politician’s resignation is if they don’t know their Shakespeare, or they are accused of buying a bottle of wine that they didn’t actually buy, or they are named “David Cunliffe”.
Our NGO placed our IOA at the office of the Prime Minister two days ago for a confirmation list of all the last four years of emails we sent the Prime Minister( all 54) of them. (No response for replies and assistance were ever received from the P.M.)
Of course we don’t expect our IOA to be received back before a week or two perhaps, (ha ha)
Thinking back maybe we should also send the request also now to Judith Collins to see if we get them quicker eh?
The press secretary of Cabinet minister Gerry Brownlee has admitted posting anonymously to the Whale Oil blog as the impact of Dirty Politics continues to hit the election campaign.
Nick Bryant was named in Dirty Politics as the person who had used the pseudonym “Former Hack” to post anonymous comments encouraging blogger Cameron Slater’s campaign against a public servant which resulted in death threats.
The Herald was able to confirm the use of Mr Bryant’s ministerial computer through details obtained from an individual other than the hacker who also accessed information from Whale Oil during the Denial of Service attack.
[…]
Mr Hager’s book links Mr Bryant to another anonymous name – but the Herald has found the email account linked to messages from the person is actually registered in the name of yet another ministerial staff member.
“…Nicky Wagner, who was already facing a real struggle holding her Christchurch Central seat for National. She may as well not even bother campaigning now that citizens of the earthquake-stricken city know they rate as “scum” in the mind of Slater. She will not be the only one cursing Slater. Christchurch was National’s success story in 2011. National’s strong party vote in the city was a tribute to John Key’s unique ability to draw votes from across the political spectrum.
But Christchurch is gone. It would be rich irony if the city became National’s graveyard in 2014.”
Christchurch has gone, and so has Dunedin after Cunliffe’s fine policy announcements yesterday, raptuously received on yesterday’s front page of the ODT
There were two articles about the Labour policies for Dunedin in the ODT yesterday, the frontpage was indeed very enthusiastic, while the “election 2014” one consisted mainly of Woodhouse/ Joyce quotes.
Woodhouse, being the Private Health Industry’s representative in Parliament, was particularly dismissive of the plan to upgrade Dunedin Hospital:
Dunedin list MP and former chief executive of Dunedin’s Mercy Hospital Michael Woodhouse, was also scathing of Labour’s promise to fast-track the Dunedin Hospital rebuild, calling it ”irresponsible”… ”If there was any neglect it was by the [last] Labour government[“]… ”I’ve run hospitals. I know how hard it is to master-plan for a new facility and I don’t believe it’s appropriate for anyone … to make bold but irresponsible claims about timing.”
The staffer’s must have been coached by someone though.
Maybe Ede, & Lusk?
Maybe some others too, inside MSM.
Who were actually steering the dirty politics black op’s and spin doctoring?
Joyce at the helm like Key no doubt, but cleverly keeping themselves detached as to not be connected, but all coming out now.
They always looked so smug we instinctively knew they were up to something but had no proof.
Thank you Nicky Hager Nat’s on longer have the protective secrecy any more, while they are now flying blind into a Kim.com storm cloud, with an on going investigation up their arse opps!
I’m just going to make an association. If any of you are familiar with the Jeff Gannon stuff from GWBs days you will recognise the tactics and strategy here. This is a corporate designed strategy to defeat democracy.
That is too much grist for my mind mill – I can quite feel my cogs and spindles seizing up as I read. It would take one more familiar with international moneylaundering techniques than myself, to follow all the slippery twists and turns. Difficult to argue with the conclusion though:
Anyhow, there must, of course, be some reasonably innocent explanation for these very unfortunate recurring Odgers associations with major international white collar crime, other than that Odgers is a crook. Coming up with something else that’s plausible stumps me, I must admit. For instance, Odgers doesn’t appear to be an idiot; not, at any rate, in the formal sense of having a very low IQ. Whatever the explanation is, it will have to be something more complicated than that.
So, worst case: Odgers is a crook, directly involved in Russian mafia moneylaundering, a $1Billion US Ponzi scheme, and the largest pension fraud in Australian history. If that’s how it is, then Key, via Whale Oil, looks a little too close to her.
Best case: Odgers is a monumentally oblivious idiot, with an astonishing knack for working with, or for, large-scale fraudsters, again and again.
Hmmm, Slater seems to have decided to declare war on the media and is trying to blackmail, browbeat and bully them with sinister threats of blackmail.
What an idiot. Making personal enemies with people who can ask Key questions about Slater from here until September 20th is really, really dumb. Key must now be be furious at how close he personally and his party generally has allowed itself to come to Slater, who is out of control. Slater seems to think he represents some kind of new order in the media, and he and his Brownshirts can use the tactics of street thugs to subvert and supplant the traditional media. Paul Buchanan is right – Slater and his band of thugs represent a existential threat to democracy. Slater and his thugs don’t want contingent consent in a democratic structure – they want to humiliate, delegitimise and smash all opposition to their point of view. Simply, he has to be stopped at all costs.
There is also now a clear schism within the media itself. The hard right broadcasters like Plunkett, Hoskings, Henry etc etc have clearly cast in their lot with Slater and abandoned any pretense of being journalists. They should be sen for what they are – hard-right propagandists who despise democracy and would welcome a one party state of the right..
Yeah #DirtyPolitics has literally driven some of these guys over the edge, Plunkett trying to incoherently accuse Paddy Gower of something (no-one has really figured it out yet…) over the phone was just cringe-worthy.
…. and if things go wrong at this election, he’s gone anyway – or even if things are so tight we have a Natzi government unable to do anything because the margins are so thin. (I actually didn;t think this gubbamint was going to last this long – it’s been sailing along with Blind Faith)
Collins is inherently retributive – a nouveau riche, self-entitled, very ugly, holier-than-thou person. She won’t be able to resist. I heard this morning (The Nation I think – with the sage Peddy Gear) that the beneficiary of all this will be Pulla Bent. Let’s hope so, because a competent Cunliffe or even a jack-Russell should be able to put that beast down without too much trouble.
It gets worse, Naked Capitalism is right on to Ian Taylor, family patriarch Geoff Taylor, accusing them and their shelf companies of quite a lot of things;
“Other investors include Hugh Green Investments and dairy entrepreneur Geoff Taylor. Taylor is a director, along with Ian Holland, Simon Perry and Peter Schuyt.”
And check out the fact that NZ legislation to fix this issue in NZ with shell companies and the problems that they cause is taking a while…
well, I must be a left wing conspiracy theorist — I noticed Vanuatu figured so much around Taylor story link you posted and I couldn’t help but jump to conclusions tho I have no idea what they are as yet !!
I am new to this site, but an observation, there is a propensity for many of the contributors to use extreme hyperbole and blame the government, the MSM or any body else for everything There is also a gross use of the “collective we”. Not everybody is unhappy, a great majority of kiwis left or right are just getting on with life, celebrating their good fortune ( not necessarily material) and facing up to the challenges that come their way . Here however many, (not all ) seem to use this site as a medium for their unchallengeable ideology, spew hate or seek to externalise their own failures or jealousy and further seek comfort in this by rationalising that every one else thinks the same and if not god help them. This is not all bad though,such sites be it whaleoiil, the standard, daily blog are entertaining while also acting as a pressure valve for the more extremes in our society, as does democracy I guess, so keep on keeping on
If you are an honest and mildly intelligent discussant, you will learn to be discerning in who you engage with, who are worth the time. So focus your judgement.
If you had read the site policy, you will note that people who make sweeping statements about this site tend to get scorched out. Moderation here isn’t like Kiwiblog or Whaleoil as you will soon discover.
You will also get to recognize that the commenters are diverse, at least as diverse as those within Labour, and more. Don’t presume any specific politic. Learn the spectrum of those you want to deal with.
And finally, no one is going to waste time with the drivel you ended with. Stand up, sharpen up, package your facts, and bring your best stuff every day. This is a sport to be played well.
If you want to play the concern tr*ll – or whatever the neutral-observer-with-objective-critique equivalent is – , then it might have been an idea to employ a different pseudonym. Rather gives the game away.
Sorry about being reactive but, John Keys office said this today.
Fewer Kiwis leaving for Australia, more coming home.
In the year to July, fewer people left for Australia than any time since 1995 – and more Kiwis are voting with their feet and coming home.
So when the Australian economy and political society turns to shit, National will take credit for it. Wow, what will this guy take credit for next? Higher temperatures mean NZ can grow more tropical crops – A national party initiative?
And the media has a go at Cunliffe for taking 3 days off, where a quick look at Key’s schedule over the past 12 months would have probably shown 3 months off.
Fair points, I would argue site is left however agree it is not purely labour
I also hear your point on the sport aspect of site, that’s why site is so entertaining
Would argue however that views are well argued, little synthesis goes on, even the more scholarly of contributors simply start with a conclusion, then reference articles that support their line of thought or ideology
No different on the right, my point is poles would indicate many people don’t think this way, hence views on these type of sites tend to be more extreme and satisfy the needs of contributors, provide entertainment but little else
Dont get worked up over pseudronym, could easily be blue delusion
@Rich 12.36
The Delusion comment talks about finding entertainment on these sites and talks about poles. I’m so shallow I immediately thought of pole dancing. 😉 I am so glad this person dropped in to put us right in our place.
By the way I like your face construction, I am going to add it to my group of home-made ones. :>)
Yes Big relief to casual workers with multijobs.
Casualisation of the workforce is big with National’s unemployment figures.
During Labour’s government NZ had the lowest rate of unemployment in the OECD, lower even than South Korea.
What is it now under English & co.?
They’ll need to careful otherwise a lot of people will arrange a primary job that pays sod all and a very lucrative untaxed secondary job. Either that or they are raising unrealistic expectations for some.
Agreed. Axing secondary tax is the first Labour policy I really like. The way it works is a really good initiative to not try different things. They should look at the obscene Key tax on paperboys (paperkids?) as well.
I heard this quote on This Way Up, obviously Churchill, and thought that its warning sounded very appropriate for now. I have taken out some wording to make it more generally applicable. It was given I think on 18 June 1940.
But if we fail, then the whole world, including the United States, including all that we have known and cared for, will sink into the abyss of a new dark age made more sinister, and perhaps more protracted, by the lights of perverted science.
Let us therefore brace ourselves to our duties, and so bear ourselves, that if the [human world and its environment] last for a [further] thousand years, [all people] will still say, This was their finest hour.
The speech was delivered to the Commons at 3:49 pm,[6] and lasted 36 minutes. Churchill – as was his habit – made revisions to his 23-page typescript right up to and during the speech. The final passage of his typescript was laid out in blank verse format, which Churchill scholars consider reflective of the influence of Old Testament psalms on his oratory style.
A long speech, so people with a short attention span would have difficulty grasping the precepts. Perhaps we with our short span might have difficulty meeting the challenges Britain did, the first being finding the time and concentration to think about it all. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/This_was_their_finest_hour
edited
Those Lusk – Slater emails are a little bit interesting – reveals the minds of the men. Parts are almost homo-erotic in their shared effusive enjoyment of guns and money, pushing one or the other on the other. Not that homo’s shouldn’t be homos or effusive, it’s the kind of faux developmental homo you might find in male relationships of an adolescent kind. Kids with guns, might be accurate. I gotta be honest, I don’t know any males like those two. Is it common for guys of that age to be talking like that to each other, and if it isn’t, is it just the political industry that attracts that type? I don’t suppose anyone will confirm. It’d be like asking how often one masturbates. I just though I’d ask in case anyone asks me to a political rally and when politely refusing I can say I have to stay home and wash my hair and not seem odd to them.
Also the glaringly flippin obvious:
Covert operations 101 rule 1#
When discussing evil plans, don’t put it in writing and definitely don’t use electronic medium to send messages. If you can’t manage that, don’t reply to replies of email discussion, start new mail for each reply, so fragmenting the paper trail.
Even John Key knows that rule. To get that rule wrong shows that a person would have to be under the spell of their own hype and when that happens it doesn’t even matter if you spell it out, they can’t comprehend it.
I am absolutely amazed at their incompetence. They left a trail a dog with a skunk sitting on its nose could follow. I can’t believe their arrogance. They are nasty, incompetent, well resourced amateurs. This is what will save us from them in the end.
A key factor that causes disadvantage to the opposition parties is that the economy is “good” in terms of the numbers we hear in the media.
So why is it good? Because Christchurch had an earth quake and so National got to do the rather dodgy accounting of writing off some assets, then borrowing some money, and building them back again – then taxing the increased activity and then calling the result a GDP increase and a surplus.
As long as National keeps control of that narrative it is still in a strong position.
If one of the other parties was to really take them to task on it (exactly how that would be done would depend on the party) things could start to look different.
I have heard little bits of this sort of argument (around debt going up) but they don’t seem to be framed quite right.
The good news is I think that the guys actually made this point in the whaledump, so one could highlight that.
Quick question and please excuse me for yet to come up-to-date:
Are the Leaders’ Debates taking place and, if so, when?
If Prime Minister John Key doesn’t want to turn up, please organise for an article to be sent from the Prime Minister’s Office so that David Cunliffe can debate with the said item.
Remember that the huge gap in the funding of EQC happened because the Government with held the money.
Result 1:EQC have had to drastically reduce settlement of claims.
Result 2: Government can hide the debt so that there appears to be a surplus to crow about. Bill gets away with the fraud. MSM does not touch the issue.
Yes yeshe. That where I had my info from though I think it had been raised at Question Time. I think that it should have raised a storm but at the moment some little book is being discussed blotting out such concerns.
it will come ianmac, I am sure of it. So much in process I think … and many more are watching because of the ‘little book’. John Campbell won’t drop it, we can be certain of that much at least.
Stephen Franks continues to run amok on The Panel Radio NZ National, Friday 22 August 2014
Jim Mora, Stephen Franks, Bernard Hickey, Julie Moffett
Long-time sufferers of the light, not so bright, chat show The Panel will be all too aware of its grim line-up of commentators from the far right. It’s a long list, and extremely depressing to anyone who cares about the quality of our public broadcasting. Those commentators include: Nevil “Breivik” Gibson, Jordan Williams, Chris Wikaira, Barry Corbett, Michael Bassett, Neil Miller, John Bishop, Jock Anderson, John Barnett, and the superficially jolly but deeply nasty Whale Oil lackey David Farrar. They rarely contribute anything insightful or witty; the exceptions are John Bishop, who can string together an intelligent argument occasionally, and Jock Anderson, who has a disarming bonhomie and sharp sense of humor. The rest of them, though, make for a grim and often gruesome listening experience. Jordan Williams is allowed free rein to push his cynical “Taxpayers Union” stunts whenever he is on, and—this is still possibly the single most absurd moment in the history of the program—Michael Bassett croaked with Stygian malice that Nicky Hager was a Holocaust-denier, with not a word of demur uttered by host Jim Mora, producer Susan Baldacci or anyone else in the studio.
Today, once again, another on this seemingly endless roster of extreme right wing ideologues was allowed the run of the Radio NZ studios for an hour or more. Yes, the great legal scholar and moral philosopher and Sensible Sentencing Trust supporter Stephen Franks was on again, and he did not disappoint. Indeed, he delivered several of his trademark deranged, wandery lectures and topped it off with a blackly humorous paean to the destruction Vietnam—one of the most hilarious, monstrously hypocritical moral homilies I have ever heard, anywhere, and made all the more hilarious by his contention that the Vietnamese think the Americans weren’t hard enough on them.
Only at the end of the program did anyone—Bernard Hickey, actually—do anything to counter the phenomenal amount of bilge Franks was spouting.
Franks’s dismal performance began during the pre-show, when host Jim Mora read a letter from a listener expressing concern about how the loss of confidence and trust in politicians is leading to a loss of trust in public institutions in general….
JIM MORA: Do you think honestly—I know this is a Panelly type situation and we’re getting serious before 4 o’clock—but do you think there is something in this? BERNARD HICKEY: I’m a little bit skeptical. People say they don’t respect politicians, but in my experience they do respect them whenever they meet them face to face. STEPHEN FRANKS: This is the result of a long stream of very cynical books. It’s very rare to see a politician portrayed as noble. This cynicism seeps into public attitudes. I think most politicians have good motives and there is very little corruption in New Zealand. ….[He continues pretentiously and inanely for a while longer. For a short time after he is finished, there is an uneasy silence….]
Both Jim Mora and Bernard Hickey were too polite to give voice to what must have immediately occurred to them, i.e., that most non-National Party politicians do indeed have good motives and are not corrupt—with the glaring exception of David (“Grave Robber”) Garrett, Rodney (“The Perk-Taker”) Hide and John (“I donnnnnn’t remember”) Banks, i.e., politicians who made up the grotesque ACT party shambles that Franks represented in parliament.
But Mora and Hickey said nothing, and Franks got away with another few minutes of pompous drivel, unchallenged.
After the 4 o’clock news, on The Panel proper, Mora apologetically announced that he was going to talk about Nicky Hager’s book Dirty Politics again. Mora’s attitude was interesting; I have no doubt that Franks had said something unpleasant and admonitory to him off air about that, which led to Mora’s clear nervousness in broaching the subject….
JIM MORA: Stephen, um, to what extent do you think the landscape is changing? STEPHEN FRANKS: I have genuinely tried to avoid reading it. I defended the News of the World phone hacks, but there’s a good reason why much of this is illegal, and I want to see the law enforced…. [He continues on with a confused, rambling Jamie Whyte-style free-ranging rumination.]
In his “Soapbox” segment, Franks spoke about some university students he recently met, and expressed his grave concern about their failure to see the merits of America’s destruction of Vietnam. (No, you did not read that wrongly; Franks really IS that deranged)…..
STEPHEN FRANKS: I’d rather hoped that they might rebel against the ghastly consensus that war can only be spoken about in hushed tones as if it’s all terribly shameful, and there’s a defeatism and a pacifism in our intelligentsia that means our commemorations usually talk about war as failure on all sides. …[Here he pauses to underline that he is thinking seriously]…But, uh, I think we’re in a world where we might need some of the martial values. We look at a man who was beheaded by a culture that sees sacrifice of innocence as just a routine tactic. Ahhhhmmm, if you were a Kurd, or a Yaziri, or a Christian in Iran, or a North Korean, or in the last century a Czech or a Pole or an Ethiopian or anyone who’s been invaded and dominated, ahhhhmmm, you might think that you need to celebrate courage and self-sacrifice and the virtues, ahhhhhmmmm….
BERNARD HICKEY: But there’s a cynicism about that now because the initial response was to jump in in a martial way. It seemed to make it a lot worse.
STEPHEN FRANKS:[irate tone] Well, I don’t think that that’s established at all. I mean, one of the things that was interesting in this debate was that the young people all universally condemned the Vietnam War, but I doubt that ANY of them have talked to any of the Vietnamese refugees who have settled here, in fact it sticks in my head that, at the height of the Vietnam War there were 400,000 or 350,000 refugees overseas out of Vietnam, two years later there were FOUR MILLION that had fled, a million probably or no one knows how many PERISHED, and if you spend a bit of time in Vietnam and probe enough because they don’t want to talk about the war, you’ll find plenty of people who will say the only thing wrong about the Vietnam War was that the wrong side was allowed to win. So you know, I think there’s a cultural overlay in New Zealand that just doesn’t WANT to examine the possibility that we’ve had a hundred years reaction to a ghastly First World War like All Quiet on the Western Front, and we don’t celebrate the virtues of Just War.
MORA: Putting the Vietnam War aside, because, well, we probably don’t have time to talk about it although you’ve raised an interesting point, ahhh, doesn’t increased attendances in recent years at Anzac Day services suggest that we still do appreciate valor, actually?
STEPHEN FRANKS: Uh, I think it does. I think ordinary people don’t have that kind of syrupy, maudlin regret. I think they ARE wanting to honor some the things that humans have traditionally honored, like courage and self-sacrifice.
MORA: All right. Stephen Franks, thank you. Bernard Hickey on the Panel, a quarter to five. Miley Cyrus’s forthcoming show in Auckland: pornography and the promotion of substance abuse dressed up as pop music, says Family First. We’ll ask Dita Di Boni about that, but first of all, your opinions please. Does it bother you, the subject matter?
STEPHEN FRANKS: It seems tawdry to me and I applaud Bob McCroskery for having the courage to be unfashionable and say parents ought to be a bit disgusted.
BERNARD HICKEY: I’m deeply uncomfortable with it. It just seems like something from another planet.
MORA: More and more youngsters don’t have the moral framework to condemn it, they don’t have the religion which used to condemn it. So is this a kind of moral degradation or not?
(Jim Mora, remember, is a man who chuckles at the plight of political dissidents.)
DITA DI BONI: Well, a lot of people sheet it home to Madonna. But there’s really no comparison. It’s a completely different ball game. She wasn’t marketed to children and she expressed female sexuality to women, which Miley Cyrus says she is doing, but that’s nonsense. She is a product of a marketing system, of an industry, whereas Madonna really tried to make her own way but, I don’t know about you guys, but every straight man I’ve ever talked to does not find Madonna sexy. She’s scary, because it’s a different idea of sexuality. Miley Cyrus is very cynically marketed to very young girls, it’s a nonsense message….
STEPHEN FRANKS:[speaking very quietly, to convey deep moral seriousness] It’s a very strange thing to have reached this stage. It was so easy to scoff at the slippery slope and ummmm, and the anti-Patricia Bartlett position was just universal.
DITA DI BONI: Yes.
STEPHEN FRANKS: But it IS very difficult for a society to cope with this kind of attack on values. Of course this is exactly the dilemma that isn’t a dilemma for Islamic countries…..[continues pompously for another minute or so]
Just before the end of the program, Jim Mora brought up the subject of Labour’s plan to revive the Dunedin Railway Workshops. The Ayn Rand worshipper’s response was one of instant, dogmatic dismissal: Government has no business investing in any industry, he growled. Bernard Hickey, for once, stirred himself to respond to Franks’s nonsense instead of just ignoring him and hoping he’d stop….
BERNARD HICKEY: Yet we’ve got $400 million to spend on irrigation problems. STEPHEN FRANKS:[snorting] Railway is a sunset industry. BERNARD HICKEY: Oooooh, I’m not so sure about that….
Sadly, the music swelled up and saved Franks from an on-air keelhauling. Maybe next time the comparatively sensible guest, whoever it is, will act sooner….
I sent the ever jovial Mein Host of the program the following email….
Why did you not challenge Stephen Franks’ brutal and ignorant raving?
Dear Jim,
During his confused and highly selective broadside against “cultures that sacrifice innocence”, Stephen Franks forgot to mention the Israeli oppression of Palestinians. Maybe he was too busy skiing to take note of the latest onslaught—or does he support their daily oppression and killing?
I am sure many listeners were also flabbergasted and disgusted by his equally ignorant comments about the “wrong side being allowed to win in Vietnam”.
you left that student army guy off yr rightie-list..and boag..and ‘neo-liberalism?..y’know yr soaking in it!’ edwards-the-elder..and the guy who lost his his legs on the mountain..
..and mccormick is lurching right at some kinda warp-speed…
..and there are some new ones..
..the other day a hideous rightwing pr-trout smarmed her way thru her first appearance.
..she was ghastly in the extreme…
..i find increasingly i choose to take the dogs to the park..
..rather than endure the likes of franks/the above..
..and you are right..mora never challenges him/them..
..no matter what hysterical rightwing drivel/outright/easily-disproved lies/propaganda they may spout/spew out..
you left that student army guy off yr rightie-list..and boag..and ‘neo-liberalism?..y’know yr soaking in it!’
Thanks, Phillip. I would have put them on that list if I’d remembered. I did it off the top of my head. There are several more of them as well.
edwards-the-elder..and the guy who lost his his legs on the mountain..
Brian Edwards and Mark Inglis are conservative, but I don’t think they are as blindly ideological or as brutal as extremists like Franks, Bassett, Williams and Farrar.
..and mccormick is lurching right at some kinda warp-speed…
He is, but he’s a right wing Labour supporter more than he is a hard right nutcase like Stephen Franks. In fact, whenever the producers have been careless enough to pair McCormick with one of those cranks, McCormick has forcefully contested his (or her) narrative—much to the consternation of the dithering host.
If this corrupt and frightening government gets back in because Kelvin Davis knocks Hone Harawira out of the race I, for one, will never forgive the Labour Party. Never. Anyone else feel like this?
Very much, but I don’t think it’s likely. We need Mana in parliament, and we need Greens, both because of their policies and the fact that they will pull Labour to the left. We need Labour because of their numbers and not a lot else. I’ll never forget 1984, which has culminated in the crooked rubbish that tries to pass itself off as governance today.
Actually Morrissey your ignorance re Vietnam is incredible. You’ve obviously never been there. Any number of private conversations with the locals will convince anyone with an open mind that the wrong side won. But why let your blind ideological animus be contradicted by real people. Much more comfortable to cling to your stupid leftie groupthink.
Really Monty? I have been there. The locals have forgiven the carnage that the US has caused to their country but they are still in their own unique way in control of their country.
Really Micky you should be ashamed of yourself -talk about a useful idiot. The way their country is controlled isn’t unique -it’s called a communist dictatorship you dick. Can you think of any more examples? Get back to me if you can’t.
Hallo All, it has been a while, and I took a break, while my mate kept posting a few bits here now and then.
I admit I deserved a break, which Lprent defined correctly as a “ban”, to sort my mind and soul out a bit, as I got a bit worked up, more than I should have, on Israel, Palestine and the rest of the drama that still goes on.
But I have been keeping onto things, and one topic is DR BRATT, there will be more on Dr Bratt, a Bratt Attack of sorts, coming soon, that questionable MSD and WINZ Principal Health Advisor they use, to kick sick, injured and disabled off benefits and to urge them into whatever work there may be.
We are short shifted, shafted, that is us with serious illness, disability and injury, and they add to insult, most the parties, I am ANGRY.
So I will not blow my top, just hope that lprent will not throw me out too soon again, and I will work on some comments soon, that will inform more about the shit that goes on in welfare, which is rather “warfare”. What many do not realise is, that Paula Bennett is afraid of the election result and her job, so she has instructed her departments to keep calm, not make too harsh decisions, and to keep most lulled into indifference or a false sense of security. Should the Nats get a third term, get a warm jumper, all on benefits, you will get the worst that has happened in this country since Ruthanasia (look that up on Wiki, please).
Apologies, but these are the “fighters” that I respect and will die for, they are the soul of revolution and ground breaking change. You will hate me for past comments and over the top reactions. I apologise, but forget not the purpose of us being here, also the reason of revolution. Who still stands for that cause?
I stand for that and more, so take your choice and stand please, we will continue to fight on:
Excuse me, please, I post this for the future of the people that CARE, that actually understand history and that is for Europe, UK and South America and also South Africa. We all need to learn and improve, we can all work together and be one, and so, learn and understand, please, this is not a message of division and hatred, it is an attempt to reconnect and be ONE:
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Story of the Week... Toon of the Week... Coming Soon on SkS... Climate Feedback Claim Review... SkS Week in Review... Poster of the Week... Story of the Week...
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A new-look Police graduation ceremony to take account of COVID19 health rules has marked the completion of training for 57 new constables. Police Minister Stuart Nash attended this afternoon's ceremony, where officers of Recruit Wing 337 were formally sworn in at the Royal New Zealand Police College without the normal support of ...
Mobile traders and truck shops must adhere to responsible lending requirements Interest rate cap on high-cost loans Lenders prohibited from offering further credit to an applicant who has taken two high-cost loans in the past 90 days The Minister of Commerce and Consumer Affairs, Kris Faafoi, has signalled an end ...
94% of firms say wage subsidy had positive impact on cashflow 62% of firms say support helped to manage non-wage costs like rent A survey of business that have received the Government’s wage subsidy show it has played a significant role in saving jobs, and freed up cash flow to ...
New legislation introduced to Parliament today will support growth and assist businesses on the road to economic recovery, said Revenue Minister Stuart Nash. “The Taxation (Annual Rates for 2020-21, Feasibility Expenditure, and Remedial Matters) Bill proposes that businesses can get tax deductions for ‘feasibility expenditure’ on new investments,” said Mr ...
Sport and Recreation Minister Grant Robertson has welcomed the first release of funds from the $265 million Sport Recovery Package announced as part of Budget 2020. Sport NZ has announced that $4.6 million in funding will go to the Wellington Phoenix, NZ Warriors, Super Rugby teams and the ANZ Premiership ...
An iconic New Zealand tourism attraction and the country’s 31 Regional Tourism Organisations are the first recipients of support from the $400 million Tourism Sector Recovery Plan, to help position the sector for recovery from COVID-19, Tourism Minister Kelvin Davis announced today. The plan includes a Strategic Tourism Assets Protection ...
The Government will legislate to ensure businesses that suffered as a result of the COVID-19 response will get help to resolve disputes over commercial rent issues, Justice Minister Andrew Little announced today. A temporary amendment to the Property Law Act will insert a clause in commercial leases requiring a fair ...
The Minister for Small Business says new data from Xero highlights the urgency of prompt payment practices to small and medium enterprises as we move into economic recovery. Last month Government ministers wrote to significant private enterprises and the banking industry to request they join efforts by government agencies to ...
Young people in Waikato will be the first to have free access to period products in schools in another step to support children and young people in poverty,” Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern said. During term 3, the Ministry of Education will begin providing free period products to schools following the ...
The Minister of Police Stuart Nash has issued the following statement in response to charges filed against three Police officers this morning in the New Plymouth District Court. “Any incident involving a loss of life in Police custody is taken very seriously. The charges today reflect the gravity of the ...
$196 million for Crown Research Institutes $150 million for R&D loan scheme $33 million for Māori research and development opportunities $12 million for the Nationally Significant Collections and Databases $10 million to help maintain in-house capability at Callaghan Innovation New Zealand’s entrepreneurs, innovators and crown researchers will benefit from a ...
Further temporary changes to NCEA and University Entrance (UE) will support senior secondary school students whose teaching and learning have been disrupted by COVID-19. “The wellbeing of students and teachers is a priority. As we are all aware, COVID-19 has created massive disruption to the school system, and the Government ...
Minister for Racing Winston Peters today announced that the terms for the directors of the Racing Industry Transition Agency (RITA) have been extended to 30 June 2021. Due to the COVID-19 crisis the transition period has been extended to ensure that the Racing Industry Bill can complete its progress through ...
The deadline for landlords to include detailed information in their tenancy agreements about how their property meets the Healthy Homes Standards, so tenants can see the home they are renting is compliant, has been extended from 1 July 2020 to 1 December 2020. The Healthy Homes Standards became law on 1 July 2019. The Standards are ...
Justice Minister Andrew Little today announced details of further appointments to the Criminal Cases Review Commission. “I am pleased to announce Paula Rose QSO OStJ as Deputy Chief Commissioner for a term of five years commencing on 15 June 2020,” said Andrew Little. “I am also pleased to announce the ...
The Targeted Training and Apprenticeships Fund (TTAF) will pay costs of learners of all ages to undertake vocational education and training The fund will target support for areas of study and training that will give learners better employment prospects as New Zealand recovers from COVID-19 Apprentices working in all industries ...
The Emissions Trading Scheme (ETS) will finally start to cut New Zealand’s greenhouse gas pollution as it was originally intended to, because of changes announced today by the Minister for Climate Change, James Shaw. The changes include a limit on the total emissions allowed within the ETS, rules to ensure ...
Minister for Pacific Peoples Aupito William Sio says the Queen’s Birthday 2020 Honours List provides an abundance of examples that Pacific people’s leadership capability is unquestionable in Aotearoa. “The work and the individuals we acknowledge this year highlights the kind of visionary examples and dedicated community leadership that we need ...
The Government is backing a new $27 million project aimed at boosting sustainable horticulture production and New Zealand’s COVID-19 recovery efforts, says Agriculture Minister Damien O’Connor. “Our horticulture sector has long been one of New Zealand’s export star performers, contributing around $6 billion a year to our economy. During and ...
Applications have opened for 2021 Ngā Karahipi Uru Rākau – Forestry Scholarships, which will support more Māori and women to pursue careers in forestry science, says Forestry Minister Shane Jones. “I’m delighted Te Uru Rākau is offering Ngā Karahipi Uru Rākau – Forestry Scholarships for the third year running. These ...
The Queen’s Birthday 2020 Honours List once again highlights the dedication by many to looking after our native plants and wildlife, including incredible work to restore the populations of critically endangered birds says Minister of Conservation Eugenie Sage. Anne Richardson of Hororata has been made an Officer of the New ...
The Government will invest $10 million from the One Billion Trees Fund for large-scale planting to provide jobs in communities and improve the environment, Agriculture Minister Damien O’Connor and Forestry Minister Shane Jones have announced. New, more flexible funding criteria for applications will help up to 10 catchment groups plant ...
Organisations that support women are invited to apply to a new $1,000,000 fund as part of the Government’s COVID-19 response. “We know women, and organisations that support women, have been affected by COVID-19. This new money will ensure funding for groups that support women and women’s rights,” said Minister for ...
Healthier waterways are front and centre in a new project involving more than 300 King Country sheep, beef and dairy farmers. The Government is investing $844,000 in King Country River Care, a group that helps farmers to lift freshwater quality and farming practice, Agriculture Minister Damien O’Connor announced today. “Yesterday ...
A major funding package for libraries will allow them to play a far greater role in supporting their communities and people seeking jobs as part of the economic recovery from COVID-19. “Budget 2020 contains over $60 million of funding to protect library services and to protect jobs,” says Internal Affairs ...
A jobseekers programme for the creative sector and four new funds have been set up by the Government to help our arts and music industry recover from the blow of COVID-19. Thousands of jobs will be supported through today’s $175 million package in a crucial economic boost to support the ...
Minister for Veterans Ron Mark has welcomed the First Reading of a Bill that will make legislative changes to further improve the veterans’ support system. The Veterans’ Support Amendment Bill No 2, which will amend the Veterans’ Support Act 2014, passed First Reading today. The bill addresses a number of ...
Views sought on Order in Council to help fast track the reinstatement of the Christ Church Cathedral The Associate Minister for Greater Christchurch Regeneration, Hon Poto Williams, will be seeking public written comment, following Cabinet approving the drafting of an Order in Council aimed at fast-tracking the reinstatement of the ...
The law setting out New Zealanders’ basic civil and human rights is today one step towards being strengthened following the first reading of a Bill that requires Parliament to take action if a court says a statute undermines those rights. At present, a senior court can issue a ‘declaration of ...
Foreign Affairs Minister Winston Peters today reiterated the deep concern of the New Zealand Government following confirmation by China’s National People’s Congress of national security legislation relating to Hong Kong. “New Zealand shares the international community’s significant and long-standing stake in Hong Kong’s prosperity and stability,” Mr Peters said. “New Zealand ...
Thousands of artists and creatives at hundreds of cultural and heritage organisations have been given much-needed support to recover from the impact of COVID-19, Prime Minister and Minister for Arts, Culture and Heritage Jacinda Ardern announced today. “The cultural sector was amongst the worst hit by the global pandemic,” Jacinda ...
Key New Zealand assets will be better protected from being sold to overseas owners in a way contrary to the national interest, with the passage of the Overseas Investment (Urgent Measures) Bill. The Bill, which passed its third reading in Parliament today, also cuts unnecessary red tape to help attract ...
Setting higher health standards at swimming spots Requiring urban waterways to be cleaned up and new protections for urban streams Putting controls on higher-risk farm practices such as winter grazing and feed lots Setting stricter controls on nitrogen pollution and new bottom lines on other measures of waterway health Ensuring ...
The Government is on the verge of reaching its target of state sector boards and committees made up of at least 50 percent women, says Minister for Women Julie Anne Genter and Minister for Ethnic Communities Jenny Salesa. For the first time, the Government stocktake measures the number of Māori, ...
Does a move to Covid-19 Level 1, that Cabinet is considering tomorrow (Monday, June 8), mean back-to-normal for 290,000 rental property owners and managers, Tenancies War spokesman Mike Butler said today. The Covid-19 Response (Urgent Management) Act, ...
ANALYSIS:By Denis Muller of theUniversity of Melbourne When a newspaper with the authority of The New York Times chooses to publish a party-political essay calculated to further inflame the violence wracking cities across America, serious questions arise. On June 3 the Times published in its opinion section an ...
For all The Spinoff’s latest coverage of Covid-19 see here. Read Siouxsie Wiles’s work here. New Zealand is currently in alert level two – read The Spinoff’s giant explainer about what that means here. For official government advice, see here.The Spinoff’s coverage of the Covid-19 outbreak is made possible thanks to donations from Spinoff Members. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Kate Noble, Education Policy Fellow, Mitchell Institute, Victoria University Three quarters of a million Australian children are likely to be experiencing employment stress in the family as a result of COVID-19. This is on top of around 615,000 children whose families were ...
Spice up the classic banana muffin with a subtle touch of star anise.These muffins came about one rainy Saturday when the cupboards were bare and there was nothing much left in the fruit bowl aside from some very sad-looking bananas. Fortunately we know sad bananas result in the best kind ...
For years, Work and Income has been telling New Zealanders they couldn’t get the benefit until their redundancy payments ran out. Turns out, it was wrong.What’s all this then?Work and Income has long told New Zealanders receiving redundancy payments that they weren’t eligible for the benefit until their redundancy money ...
New Zealand writer Anna Rankin reports from Los Angeles. Last Friday afternoon, I went downtown to a protest outside the enormous Los Angeles Police Department headquarters on 1st Street. The LAPD had set up cordons, placing orange cones across streets to block traffic. Arms crossed, they stood with a wide ...
Until the sudden closure of Bauer Media in April, Simon Farrell-Green was the editor of HOME, New Zealand’s oldest architecture magazine. Here he explains what comes next.Being the editor of a major architecture magazine was the best job I ever had. I got it in 2016, after a career spent ...
A global success story or an overly generous, unsustainable scheme that is doing lasting damage to our fish stocks? Ethan Neville looks at the ongoing debate over New Zealand’s fishing quota management system. The management of our fisheries is a touchy topic – and why wouldn’t it be? New Zealanders ...
By RNZ News Thousands of people were protesting across Australia today to oppose the deaths of Indigenous people in police custody. It comes as Black Lives Matter protests are held around the world after the death of George Floyd at the hands of a white police officer in the US ...
Wrapping everyone in a blanket of love, whakapapa and mauri for Matariki is the brave, exuberant and generous fabric art of Maungarongo Te Kawa, writes Amanda Thompson.E te AtuaNau enei rau harakeke he taongaTukuna ki a matouKia tika o matou mahiKo Papatuanuku e takoto neiTuturu WhakamauaKia tina, tinaHui eTaiki e.‘Karakia ...
For all The Spinoff’s latest coverage of Covid-19 see here. Read Siouxsie Wiles’s work here. New Zealand is currently in alert level two – read The Spinoff’s giant explainer about what that means here. For official government advice, see here.The Spinoff’s coverage of the Covid-19 outbreak is made possible thanks to donations from Spinoff Members. ...
One press statement from the Beehive yesterday sounded more like advertising – or a barker’s pitch – than a Government announcement. Another advised of two diplomatic appointment, one of them – has the woman who landed the post done something wrong? – to protest-troubled and politically volatile Hong Kong. And ...
It’s not often that someone graduates from university one year and becomes a senior economist commentating on national media the next. George Driver investigates the meteoric rise of the high-flying Brad Olsen.Google “senior economist Brad Olsen” and you’ll find him quoted in no fewer than 167 articles in the past ...
As public sentiment turned against Uber Eats, a new local operation emerged promising a more ethical alternative to help New Zealand’s struggling hospitality industry. But now Eat Local NZ has suspended trading after falling out with its Australian partner Mr Yum. So what happened?A dispute between local hospitality platform Eat ...
By Budi Sutrisno in Jakarta As the death of George Floyd, an African-American man who died while being arrested in the United States, sparks a global outcry, Indonesian rights advocates and young people have stepped forward to remind fellow citizens that racism has long been an issue at home as ...
Edward Cullen became a vampire to survive the Spanish flu pandemic of 1918. Now a new Twilight novel looms and Laura Surynt, a New Zealander living in the UK, wants to live forever too. As I lay in bed this morning watching Instagram stories, Tayi Tibble told my reluctant little Capricorn ...
Over the lockdown period, thousands of people joined a Facebook group dedicated to remembering the nightlife of inner-city Auckland. Its creator Simon Grigg explains why it touched a chord in lockdown.Within a few days of The Lost Nightlife of Inner-city Auckland Facebook page accidentally going live on May 12, we ...
Throughout Anglo colonial states there is a constant habit of defining people who aren’t white as a problem, writes Aaron Smale in this personal essay. It was a balmy summer evening in the capital and cops were standing over a young brown man. I was walking down Courtenay Place on ...
"The countdown clock ticks 2, then 1, then the prime minister raises her drink": dystopia, by Ōtautahi writer Laura Borrowdale. You stand in the centre of the room, and around you, the guests seem to swirl and blend into one. There’s a mouth, gaping and red, filled with laughter. A ...
Martin Luther King Jr said in 1963: “America has given the Black people a bad cheque, a cheque which has come back marked ‘insufficient funds’." Six generations of egregious police violence later, the sentiment out of which those bad cheques were born could be shifting. In the wake of egregious police violence, ...
WATCH: In a candid interview on Sky Sport, Dame Susan Devoy talks on her concern for rising sports stars, the state of NZ squash, and the spectre of racism. Dame Susan Devoy is proudly still “a little terrier who fights for the underdog”. “I have been doing it all my life and ...
Of the huge funding boost coming for early childhood education, Playcentre has been left with just the crumbs, writes Kate Barber. Amidst all the celebration of the $430m funding boost for early childhood education (ECE) announced in this year’s budget, little attention was paid to the plight of Playcentre. The ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Vikrant Minhas, PhD candidate, University of Adelaide Although bacteria are single-celled and microscopically small, they still need energy to survive, just like us. One of the most efficient ways of acquiring energy for bacteria is through sweet, soluble carbohydrates: sugars. In fact, ...
PACIFIC PANDEMIC DIARY:By David Robie Three cartoonists had especially poignant takes on the tragic and toxic political aftermath of martyr George Floyd’s brutal killing under the knee of a white American policeman in Minneapolis last week. The Boston Globe’s Christopher Weyant featured a split frame contrasting a red-capped “Make ...
Are central bankers jealous that epidemiologists are the rock stars of the current crisis?There is talk that both the British and New Zealand central banks might institute negative interest rates as part of the policy response to the Covid shock. While Sweden’s central bank ended its five year experiment ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Monika Sarder, Senior Strategic Analyst, Monash University Algorithmic decision-making has enormous potential to do good. From identifying priority areas for first response after an earthquake hits, to identifying those at risk of COVID-19 within minutes, their application has proven hugely beneficial. But ...
LISTEN: This week's Extra Time podcast discusses racism in sport and the role of athletes and organisations in making a stand for good. Former Silver Fern and Black Fern Louisa Wall believes today's sports stars must have a social conscience and stand up against discrimination and divisiveness. Sport and politics, once ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Emma Thomas, Associate professor, Flinders University We have seen ten days of protests in the United States over the death of George Floyd. While thousands of people have gathered to express their outrage peacefully, some demonstrations have been marred by vandalism and ...
40 percent of millennials have one, and an increasing number of GenXers and Baby Boomers do too. Two Cents' Worth delves into the world of side hustles. ...
Auckland writer Caroline Barron has a terrific book out today called Ripiro Beach: A Memoir of Life After Near Death. Here, she writes about the memoirs that have been a balm, a lesson, or both. Throughout my life, I’ve sought solace between the covers of books, particularly memoirs. There, I’ve learnt ...
An exclusive interview with Steve McSteverson about his traumatic and tragic ordeal this week.Many New Zealanders are struggling with the news that a children’s book not commissioned or authorised by Jacinda Ardern was advertised in a newsletter for children’s books. This horrific attack on New Zealanders whose ears are permanently ...
Air New Zealand staff are dismayed and angered at the company’s announcement to cut a further $150 million from their wage bill. On Friday, the company’s Chief Executive Officer, Greg Foran, made the announcement to employees, who are still ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Dr. Bodean Hedwards, Lecturer, Monash University This week the leaders of India and Australia reaffirmed their mutual interest in closer diplomatic and economic ties. Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi told Australian Prime Minister Scott Morrison during their long-delayed Thursday “virtual summit”: ...
The Herald reported this morning that MediaWorks was on the verge of selling its TV assets to US TV giant Discovery – but an internal email and senior source suggest the story may have been premature.A senior MediaWorks source has emphatically denied a report in the NZ Herald that a ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Gery Karantzas, Associate professor in Social Psychology / Relationship Science, Deakin University Life in lockdown has been tough on many relationships. But negotiating the transition back to “normal” as restrictions continue to lift could also be a challenge for couples. So what ...
A slight bounce in the economy is brightening the outlook as the country heads into the winter months, Radio NZ reports. Retail spending is up and NZ shares rose on Thursday for a third day running. Key indicators have led some economists to point to a faster recovery than expected. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Geoff Hanmer, Adjunct Professor of Architecture, University of Adelaide HomeBuilder is a good idea gone bad. It is possibly the most complex and least equitable program the government could have devised to deliver construction jobs. It gives $25,000 to people who already ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Peter Keller, Professor of Cognitive Science, Western Sydney University The coronavirus pandemic has silenced the world’s concert halls and opera theatres. Organisations specialising in live performance face an existential crisis under current restrictions on social gatherings, with up to 75% of people ...
Finance Minister Grant Robertson, wearing his Sport and Recreation ministerial hat, can show he can be a big spender and draw voters’ attention to his largess each time he dispenses money from the funds under his control – or the control of an agency within his ministerial bailiwick. Yesterday he ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Pi-Shen Seet, Professor of Entrepreneurship and Innovation, Edith Cowan University Scott Morrison wants to overhaul the skills workforce to ensure a better post-COVID-19 recovery. But there may not be enough people with the necessary skills to do so. And travel restrictions, which ...
As we transition out of a Covid-focused world and prepare for what comes next, New Zealand’s ICT industry is gearing towards growth.From app development helping track the Covid-19 virus to website engineering keeping businesses in touch and online, ICT knowledge has been crucial to keeping New Zealand working over the ...
Analysis: As New Zealand eases restrictions, it no longer has international precedent to look towards and must decide on its own how to reopen the economy while reducing the risk of a second wave of infections, Marc Daalder reports While most of the country eagerly awaits a likely move to ...
Ten days is too long. That from insurance claimant advocate, Ali Jones. EQC has today made contact with homeowners via email after accidentally releasing confidential details of 8000 insurance claims on May 26. Jones says although she has not received ...
The only published and available best-selling indie book chart in New Zealand is the top 10 sales list recorded every week at Unity Books’ stores in High St, Auckland, and Willis St, Wellington.AUCKLAND1 Girl, Woman, Other by Bernadine Evaristo (Penguin Classics, $24)Winner of the 2019 Booker Prize. The other day, ...
Simon Day discovers how the voluntary carbon market allows both individuals and companies to offset their emissions at the same time as investing in native forest regeneration.When Celia Wade-Brown sold her first batch of carbon credits earned from the native forest on her Wairarapa farm, she had two customers: Z ...
Simon Day discovers how the voluntary carbon market allows both individuals and companies to offset their emissions at the same time as investing in native forest regeneration.When Celia Wade-Brown sold her first batch of carbon credits earned from the native forest on her Wairarapa farm, she had two customers: Z ...
Analysis by Keith Rankin. Keith Rankin. The conversation around the 2020 covid19 pandemic has been widely framed as ‘health versus the economy’. It has been quite political, with people leaning to the left emphasising ‘health’, and people leaning to the right emphasising ‘the economy’. A couple of weeks ago ...
Sam Brooks pays tribute to Alex Rider, and the new TV series that (finally) captures the spirit of the books.“What if James Bond was a teenager?”The concept for Anthony Horowitz’s Alex Rider series is so simple but so brilliant. There’s a reason why the franchise has managed to sustain 12 ...
Analysis - The PM resists pressure to move immediately to level 1, Winston Peters' tactics play into the hands of the Opposition and the government at last works out a commercial rent solution, writes Peter Wilson. ...
Source: Council on Hemispheric Affairs – Analysis-Reportage By COHAFrom Washington DC Federal charges against the four protectors of the Venezuelan Embassy, who defended the building in Washington DC against violent opposition crowds for several weeks between April 10 and May 16 of 2019, were completely dropped in a case that ...
Source: Council on Hemispheric Affairs – Analysis-Reportage By COHA Editorial TeamFrom Washington DC The Council on Hemispheric Affairs (COHA) joins the Black Alliance for Peace[1] and other pro-democracy organizations throughout the world in calling for the United Nations to address the systemic violations of human rights by the police and ...
Being shot by police had a profound, transformational effect on Rob Mokaraka’s life in more ways than you’d expect. A new documentary, airing on Māori TV at 7.30pm on Sunday, explores the work he’s done to heal his own mind and to ensure nobody has to go through the same ...
Human rights watchdog TAPOL has condemned the demand by Indonesian prosecutors seeking 17 and five years imprisonment for West Papuan activists Buchtar Tabuni and Irwanus Uropmabin. On June 2, the Jayapura District Prosecutor’s Office issued 33 pages containing charges against the defendant Irwanus Uropmabin. In the document, the Public Prosecutor ...
The arrival of Dan Carter is far from the first time the ever-struggling Auckland team has hoped to turn around its fortunes with a star signing, writes Jamie Wall.New Zealand rugby Twitter is a generally desolate place, especially lately given that there’s been nothing to talk about ever since the ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Robyn J. Whitaker, Senior Lecturer in New Testament, Pilgrim Theological College, University of Divinity US President Donald Trump delivered an address this week in which he threatened military action on the nation. Then he walked to the nearby St John’s Episcopal Church ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Vincent Ho, Senior Lecturer and clinical academic gastroenterologist, Western Sydney University Why do we burp? We sometimes also burp before meals, why does this happen? — Ahaana, age 7 That is a really interesting question, Ahaana! There ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Justine Bell-James, Associate Professor, TC Beirne School of Law, The University of Queensland After years of litigation, Australia’s highest court will today make a major decision on the fate of the controversial proposed expansion to the New Acland Coal mine in Queensland. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Nicholas Williams, Associate Professor in Urban Ecology and Urban Horticulture, University of Melbourne Tomorrow is the first World Green Roof Day. Cities around the world will celebrate the well-documented environmental, economic and social benefits of green roofs. New ground-level green spaces are ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Elise Klein, Senior Lecturer, Crawford School of Public Policy, Australian National University Robodebt isn’t the only measure the government should consider withdrawing. Late last Friday, after a long press conference from the prime minister which avoided any mention of the topic, the ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Richard Holden, Professor of Economics, UNSW Harvard University’s Alberto Alesina died suddenly of a heart attack on May 23. He was 63. His long-time colleague and friend Larry Summers wrote that before him, “there was no academic field of political economy. Today, ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Julian Meyrick, Professor of Creative Arts, Griffith University What keeps democracies together? As America burns, Brazilians die and Europe braces for another wave of the coronavirus, the question assumes an alarming immediacy. If the answer is complicated in one way, it is ...
Open mike 23/08/2014 
Open mike is your post.
Tom Farr in an excellent article on Medium presents in-depth the central arguments around prostitution decriminalisation, unionisation, and its conceptualisation as work, specifically from a socialist perspective The Coronavirus (Covid-19) pandemic facing numerous countries across the world is undoubtedly a dire time for anyone who in some way depends on ...1 hour ago
You’ve got to wonder why the New Zealand Police undertook an armed response teams (ARTs) trial in the first place? Of course there was the Christchurch mosque terrorism attack, but that was an isolated incident and therefore cannot be used as an excuse to arm Police. What this trial does ...9 hours ago
A chronological listing of news articles linked to on the Skeptical Science Facebook Page during the past week: Sun, May 31 through Sat, June 6, 2020 Editor's Choice The world must seize this opportunity to meet the climate challenge As current and former central bankers, we believe the pandemic offers ...16 hours ago
The 60 Years of New Zealand Television celebrations, such as they were, seemed to rely heavily on the classics: here we go again with Lynn of Tawa, A Week of It and the Country Calendar spoofs. Wonderful highlights of our televisual past, to be sure, but after hearing Paul Holmes’ ...1 day ago
The Two Americas Collide: You gotta love the Americans marching for George Floyd and the fragile promises of the US Constitution. But, you also gotta keep your eye on the pale rider in the White House, and understand that behind him Hell follows.THE FRAGILITY of democracy’s promise is becoming clearer ...2 days ago
Oliver Twist, famously asked for ‘more’. He did not challenge the system of workhouses – Dickens did – nor the authority of Beadle Bumble. He was only nine. I am often struck how critics of the current income maintenance system are like Oliver Twist. They ask for more, but they ...2 days ago
New Zealand’s history as a sheep-farming nation means the command “Get in behind!” has long had a particular resonance — but not usually for journalists. However, in late March, as panic over the coronavirus pandemic surged around the world, Dr Gavin Ellis — former editor-in-chief of the NZ Herald — ...2 days ago
When the New Zealand Police started using Armed Response Teams - gangs of heavily-armed police cruising Māori-Pacifica neighbourhoods in juiced-up gun-trucks - they told us it was a "trial". But it turns out that those armed police - who were mainly doing traffic stops and bail checks, rather than the ...2 days ago
Another study comparing effect in children from nonendemic areas (Dagang) and endemic fluorosis area (Jinghai) about 80km apart in the Tianjin area of China. Hardly sampling the same population. Anti-fluoride campaigners still use studies from ... 4 days ago
For a good part of my adult life I have studied civil-military relations. I have studied authoritarian and democratic variants, and I have studied them across countries and regions. I have also worked in and with several US security agencies and have lectured on the theme at a number of ...4 days ago
by The Spark “The system is broken”—the words of a young black man in Minneapolis watching flames destroy a police precinct demonstrators had torched. Broken? Yes, it is! What else could you say about a system whose police for nine minutes casually knelt on a black man’s neck, watching until ...5 days ago
Like the rest of the world, I have been aghast at what I have seen of, and read and heard about, what is happening currently in the United States. It seems incredible that a once great country should be suffering the worst effects and the highest number of deaths worldwide ...6 days ago
Image credit: Writing an Article vs. Writing a Blog Post: What’s the Difference? I notice a few regulars no longer allow public access to the site counters. This may happen accidentally when the blog format is ... 6 days ago
It’s almost painful to watch. Let’s be honest, maybe a pleasure too, in some quarters, but painful nonetheless. Because the fact is, for a democracy to function properly, any sitting Government does need honest and proper Opposition so that it doesn’t get ahead of itself. That’s what we should ...1 week ago
Hon Shane Jones, NZ First List MP based in Northland New Zealand First MP Hon Shane Jones has today announced his candidacy for the electorate of Northland. Speaking at a New Zealand First meeting in Kerikeri, Northland, Mr Jones said it was a privilege to be selected by the Party ...7 hours ago
We started the week by announcing free apprenticeships to support Kiwis into work and to help get New Zealand moving again - and we ended the week by extending the wage subsidy to 40,000 more businesses, helping to protect businesses and workers alike. ...2 days ago
The Green Party is urging the New Zealand Police to rule out the use of Armed Response Teams, following their recent trial in communities around Aotearoa. ...3 days ago
This summer presents a great opportunity for New Zealanders to get out into nature with bookings on Great Walks for 2020/21 set to open next week, says Minister of Conservation Eugenie Sage. Bookings for the Great Walks will open between 9 and 11 June, excluding Milford and Routeburn tracks which ...2 days ago
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The Spanish-owned contractor behind the stalled Transmission Gully Public Private Partnership is accused of abandoning projects in Australia. ...4 hours ago
ANALYSIS: By Denis Muller of the University of Melbourne When a newspaper with the authority of The New York Times chooses to publish a party-political essay calculated to further inflame the violence wracking cities across America, serious questions arise. On June 3 the Times published in its opinion section an ...9 hours ago
For all The Spinoff’s latest coverage of Covid-19 see here. Read Siouxsie Wiles’s work here. New Zealand is currently in alert level two – read The Spinoff’s giant explainer about what that means here. For official government advice, see here.The Spinoff’s coverage of the Covid-19 outbreak is made possible thanks to donations from Spinoff Members. ...10 hours ago
New Zealand writer Anna Rankin reports from Los Angeles. Last Friday afternoon, I went downtown to a protest outside the enormous Los Angeles Police Department headquarters on 1st Street. The LAPD had set up cordons, placing orange cones across streets to block traffic. Arms crossed, they stood with a wide ...16 hours ago
Tania Tapsell is replacing MP Anne Tolley as National's candidate for the East Coast. ...1 day ago
One press statement from the Beehive yesterday sounded more like advertising – or a barker’s pitch – than a Government announcement. Another advised of two diplomatic appointment, one of them – has the woman who landed the post done something wrong? – to protest-troubled and politically volatile Hong Kong. And ...1 day ago
Throughout Anglo colonial states there is a constant habit of defining people who aren’t white as a problem, writes Aaron Smale in this personal essay. It was a balmy summer evening in the capital and cops were standing over a young brown man. I was walking down Courtenay Place on ...2 days ago
"The countdown clock ticks 2, then 1, then the prime minister raises her drink": dystopia, by Ōtautahi writer Laura Borrowdale. You stand in the centre of the room, and around you, the guests seem to swirl and blend into one. There’s a mouth, gaping and red, filled with laughter. A ...2 days ago
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I see the conservative press are telling us that it’s time to stop talking about dirty politics because we should be talking about policy and nobody really cares anyway. We peons should be grateful for such sage advice.
yep..!..they are all lined up..and singing from the same songsheet..
this line from armstrong was particularly gag-inducing..
“..A clear majority of committed voters still seem to prefer Key’s and Bill English’s brand of moderate and largely painless conservatism…”
‘moderate and largely painless’..eh..?
..of course the stats/facts on pollution/poverty etc/et al make a total lie of armstrongs’ ‘moderate and largely painless’ claim/bullshit.
..i guess that’s one way of looking at how 30 yrs of national/labour neo-lib has driven us as far up shit creek as we currently are…
..to ask/advocate for even more of the same..
With input from Key’s no 1 fan John Roughan.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/election-2014/news/article.cfm?c_id=1503581&objectid=11312940
Democracy under attack!!! The sky is falling!!!!! Oh noes, people are seeing behind the curtain!
They must have decided that yesterday was getting too dangerous, with Key caught out on video contradicting himself.
I see that Duncan Garner recovered from his fit of pique at being targeted by Slater and once more has his nose firmly clamped between Key’s buttocks.
I still think National will win the election, which will leave us in the strange position of having an openly corrupt government by public consent.
I still think National will win the election, which will leave us in the strange position of having an openly corrupt government by public consent.
That is the thought that horrifies me, especially since such consent would come from a little over half of the voting population. Given the deepening inequality in this country, it would effectively be a vote for the powerful to dominate the powerless, and for constitutional safeguards to be treated as PR measures, and nothing more.
In that case withdraw civic co-operation.
And just think how brazen people like Slater will be if that happens. They will think they are untouchable.
Well, they will be. By legal means, at least.
The nadir will be the courts declaring him a journalist after all this.
have you read this Tom ? fine analysis and questioning if new materials can be placed before the Court in current proceedings … by Steven Price
http://www.medialawjournal.co.nz/
Interesting, but it’s odd that there’s little emphasis on journalistic ethics. You would think that adhering to the four basic principles, or at least attempting to, would be required for someone to be classed as a journalist.
Slater hasn’t minimised harm, acted independently or been accountable. Not only has he not been these things, he has actively worked against such standards – the Len Brown case alone is enough to damn him.
I honestly would not be surprised if none of this matters to our tedious, tory judiciary.
If National wins you will see them release all the information they have on the Left. Not just the bits that has been leaked so far.
Over the past week they have come to see that they are not untouchable.
I suspect this is the beginning of the end for this bunch of criminals (for that is what they are).
What price WhaleOil now? Who is going to go anywhere near him now?
If TricKey and co get in then the Megalomania will run rampant, and they will literally sell our country out from under us to their mates.
The thought is just horrifying, and our best chance is, as Chooky says, to urge all those who would vote left to vote. I don’t think that upper middle class NZ fully appreciates the need for democratic safeguards. National’s TV ad all but dog-whistles to this indifference, featuring white, triumphalist rowers proudly defeating the enemy within. Such hubris encourages the idea that safeguards are for losers, and that winners are unnecessarily hampered by them. We desperately need a strong showing from the left in this election, for democracy’s sake.
@ Tom Jackson(1.1.1.1.1) ….Disagree!…It was very close last time when many Labour people did not vote . ( people were still angry with Phil Goff being leader and leading the charge against asset sales when he once supported them under Labour/Roger Douglas…it was too much to swallow)
This time people will vote! Cunliffe is a good and compassionate leader for Labour. He is well able to stand up against Key!
( There are many ‘undecided’ who do not want to declare to the pollsters…I myself refuse to talk to pollsters …there are others who lie…and others who will not disclose ( the ‘undecideds’)…after all we live in a surveillance society under John Key’s NACT…people are paranoid)
Bugger the POLLSTERS! ( they are too often wrong as Jim Bolger found out!)
We have to FOCUS on winning!!!… and calling the media to ACCOUNT
……we want the TRUTH! This election must be about HONESTY and NOT SPIN!….
….we must FIGHT for this Labour /Left coalition WIN!.
“we must FIGHT for this Labour /Left coalition WIN!.”
Yes Chooky, not fight and smear against it like some are intent on doing until polling day. +1.5
roughan is particularly happy/clappy about the outcomes from that national/labour rightwing/neo-lib/fuck-the-poor! ‘consensus’ of the last 30 yrs..
..culminating in the current asset-stripping bunch of bastards..
“..New Zealand has enjoyed a healthy economic consensus for 30 years..”
..’healthy’ for roughan and his ilk…
..’sick’ for so many others/the environment..
The guy is, like most of these right wing morons, an economic illiterate. Actual economics is much more reasonable and cautious than these clowns think.
Remember Roughan was such a poor journalist that his biography of Key mentioned nothing at all about the links with Slater.
That’s an excellent and well-made point, Paul.
+111
it wasn’t actually a ‘biography’ of key that roughan did..
…’biography’ claims a realistic look..warts/critical and all..
..what roughan did on key..was an exercise in hagiography..
..at least he is consistent..
Some should take Hagers book and Keys book to a meeting of Keys and ask him to autograph them both.
Pardon me.
Roughan’s hagiography of Key.
I’m sure Roughan is already working on an updated edition detailing all the new revelations about John Key’s life as our PM.
“that national/labour rightwing/neo-lib/fuck-the-poor! ‘consensus’”
“yrs of national/labour neo-lib”
What a shame you didn’t have the testicles to use that slogan/anti labour smear and front it to DC when he was on here answering questions.
Shame you bottled it and went, dear mr Cunliffe instead.
You’re worse than the right wing nuggets that come on here. Shame on you.
+100…have to agree The Allen
On the christmas card list you are 😉
lol…It will be a MERRY CHRISTMAS!….. under a Cunliffe Labour/ Left coalition !
Merry Christmas in advance!
Red and Green are, funny enough, the traditional colours of xmas.
yes lol …bring on the champagne ! …a toast to Cunliffe ( better go and do some work)
Cheers, I’ll settle on a bottle of raspberry scrumpy, which coincidentally, to the horror of some self absorbed ‘pundits’, is also red. 🙂
Enjoy the work, or enjoy your skive – Your call.
factcheck 4 u..chooky..
..when cunnliffe appeared on here it was made clear to all by the moderator..that such-worded questions would not pass muster..
..and as it was..a politely-worded question on poverty…was not answered by cunnliffe..
..tho’ he answered the four before it..and the one following..
..so..really..you and that idiot can just take yr fake-argument..
..and blow it out yr butts…eh..?
..every neo-lib-consensus word i said is true/accurate/historical-fact…
..and that you and the idiot are in agreement..going on both yr past analytical-records here..
..signifies very little..eh..?
All I got was wah, wah.
And factcheck lol. Like pete’s retarded hate child.
Do better.
Oh, you should try Garner’s BS:
These National fanbois in the MSM really seem to have NFI just how much damage that National have done to our democracy and need to be removed to prevent further damage. To them it’s all about winning – no matter the cost to our society.
You’ve got to wonder if Slater and his crew have stuff on some journalists.
Or is it simply that the media is owned by large foreign corporates?
Both?
Both! Considering that journalists have dirt on each other and play all that stupid ‘what plays in Vegas, stays in Vegas’ game. I’d be bloody surprised if he didn’t.
“So, for Key, it all starts tomorrow with the official National campaign launch. He needs a big-bang policy to get people talking.”
His and Collins resignations Now that would get the country talking. Asking who of the toxic’s that are left would be the next ‘Dear Leader’?
the horror sub-plot running, according to Gower on The Nation this morning, is the emergence of Paula Bennett as next leader …
Well, she does come across now as one of the less pugnacious and authoritarian National MPs, even if that’s not saying much.
I was waiting for everyone to GUFFAW – and they DIDN’T – This world is becoming just too strange to live in!!!
Key has looked unsure on television all week – he’s looked unconvincing. The nice guy has gone.
The day of the Jekyll
The Dirty Politics IS their policy!
http://minimalistmum.blogspot.co.nz/2014/08/dirty-politics-expose-is-issue.html
Herald reveals WO commentor.
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&obj
ectid=11313039
And in that same article Slater threatens the reporter, David Fisher:
“Slater did not return calls. He did send an email saying: “Time for all your emails to come out Fish.”
Looks like dickheads like Slater are unable to learn.
Fisher seemed almost self-muzzled on The Nation this morning, as a commentator. Either he is protecting what HOS will publish tomorrow from the person with the docs who is not whaledump, or he is scared. Was very odd to me.
Steven Joyce is continuing has black op’s dirty politics regimen even though his leader has said the opposition can’t win on policy and that’s why they continue the dirty political attacks on John Key, Ha Ha,
On Whaleoil 20th the attack from Joyce was made against Labour candidate and grandson of Sir Walter Nash, the highly successful Stuart Nash.
On Whaleoil Cameron Slater openly rejects any issue of dirt is being placed against Stuart Nash, with a statement ” he is a good guy” which shows that Joyce is behind much of this dirty Politics campaign all along.
National contuse their dirty politics and says they are not! Lies, Lies, Lies.
by Cameron Slater on August 20, 2014 at 9:30am
Steven Joyce has made allegations that Whaleoil is going to release information about Stuart Nash. Joyce says it is to balance things up. This should be called out for what it is.
It is an out and out lie.
Steven Joyce is a disgrace for suggesting this because he has lied to protect his own interests.
Nash wrote two articles for the Truth and I talk to him occasionally like I do with many on the left. I know nothing at all about Stuart Nash doing anything other than he is a bloody good politician who scares National. Nash is winning a National seat because he is a far better politician that Steven Joyce ever will be, and Joyce is having a sook because he will never be as popular as Nash.
Steven Joyce should be far more worried about people like Bill English trying to claim the moral high ground when everyone knows what lengths he, Boag and McCully have gone to in political battles over the years. That coming out would be truly damaging.
Given the last time I spoke to Steven Joyce was several years ago when I sledged him out about Twitter at a National party conference in Auckland it is highly unlikely he’d know what I was up to.
Doodlehead
was that on ZB with Hosking ? I thought he said Whaleblog(or whatever it’s called) was going to release it
Ed for clarity
Soleman
That was my understanding as well
http://keepingstock.blogspot.com/ Keeping Stock
Yep; that was what was said. Whaledump would be releasing something about Nash to show how balanced the hackers are; as if…
Mark
Ouch!
Rem
Whaledump I heard
kiwibattler
Yes – I think Cam has jumped the gun on this (unless someone can find a link showing Joyce mentioning it is whaleoil).
Ross15
You are both right. I heard the interview and they were talking about whaledump and Joyce said he expected there to be continued releases up until the election. He said he’d heard today there would be a “balance up” with a release concerning Stuart Nash.
I think Cam needs to do a retraction on what he has said above about Joyce.
izhoui
Nah. Game playing.
Fat Sally
Nash is a good bloke. He will win Napier comfortably. Well ahead in the polls.
http://www.shipmodels.co.nz/ Graeme
I thought he said Whaledump. Now we are all confused!
THE APE
thats what i thought to – well according to ZB anyway
Goldie
But I thought that Cam Slater was a puppet of the evil Tories? And according to Nicky Hagar, Cam Slater is a tool of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy?
And here he is publicly bagging Steven Joyce…
tjb
And so it goes on, every day until Sept 19 we are going to have this junk news drip fed
so_ruggef
Jumped the gun Cam, zb reporting whale dump to release info. But when you say you have nothing on Nash didnt you used to call him a serial rooter back in the day?
Sir Brucey
Isnt Joyce also one of those scum list MPs? Why doesnt he test his popularity and support in an electorate battle !!!
LesleyNZ
Not in my book. Steven Joyce and Bill English are OK with me.
Snoop
Easy to just pull this post … 🙂
Stuff like this makes me hate Dot.Com even more …
Becos his “WhaleDump-Dump” is now getting confused with the real Whale …
Bruce from taihape
Get your facts right Slater. Paranoia setting in?
Coffee Connoisseur
“Get your facts right Slater. Paranoia setting in?”
you have to remember that along with the ‘dirty politics’ shitstorm going on..
..national is also wracked by internicene-warfare..
..over the current/future control of the party..
..with joyce leading one faction..and collins the other..
..(and with slater/lusk etc firmly in the collins camp..)
..and believe it or not..joyce is deemed to be ‘the moderate’ of the two..
..i dunno about that claim..to me the shadings seem remarkably similar..
..it always pays to keep this in mind when evaluating any statements from one faction about the other..(and any slater musings..)
..that there is all this really really ‘dirty politics’ on an ongoing basis..within national..
..and that any statement may well be all about that..more than anything else..
..’game of thrones’..indeed..!
..are we nearing the ‘thrones’ bloodbath-scene within national..?
Joyce sees the word profit, and nothing else.
The only relevant Slater is KELLY surfing in Tahiti https://www.facebook.com/KellySlater
Collins backside is all burnt and Joyce cannot contain his glee.
Key looks really ill, I bet he can’t wait till he and Bronie are lying back sipping pina colada in Hawaii and dirty politics is just a memory.
We will remember these liars and soothsayers at voting time
Your comment is quite hard to follow, disturbed. You don’t clearly differentiate between quotes from others and your comments.
Please read this.
From Whaledump
Cameron Slater (24/2/2011)
[On National Party delegates]
“dodgy, lying cheating cunts…firstly at the branch level, secondly at the region and thirdly with Goodfellow”
Sounds like a fair appraisal to me.
Although when Cunliffe looked around him at the list conference…
Damn and he’s supposed to be on their side. But what else would you expect from a narcissistic misanthrope?
Stephen Price (Media Law Journal) has some great commentary around Dirty Politics. They are a bit long but it would be great to see them broken into parts and made feature posts here on TS.
http://www.medialawjournal.co.nz/
Stephen Price is good value.
Further unministerial behaviour by Collins.
‘Whale Oil blogger Cameron Slater got a response to an Official Information Act request from Justice Minister Judith Collins in just 37 minutes.’
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11313041
It’s ok. It wasn’t her, it was her office. /sarc
Now look here, the only reasons that justify baying for a politician’s resignation is if they don’t know their Shakespeare, or they are accused of buying a bottle of wine that they didn’t actually buy, or they are named “David Cunliffe”.
Pull yourself together.
Paul,
Our NGO placed our IOA at the office of the Prime Minister two days ago for a confirmation list of all the last four years of emails we sent the Prime Minister( all 54) of them. (No response for replies and assistance were ever received from the P.M.)
Of course we don’t expect our IOA to be received back before a week or two perhaps, (ha ha)
Thinking back maybe we should also send the request also now to Judith Collins to see if we get them quicker eh?
What do you reckon?
And a Brownlee staffer named as having commented on WO blog under a pseudonym:
Shesh they were all at it. I bet there are a whole lot of Nat staffers feeling very nervous right now …
Look at the encouragement coming from the top.
This might be why we haven’t much from the usual suspects in recent days. Crawled back under their rocks till the storm passes?
Replanning new attacks. For the smarter ones, their goal now is to position for 2017 not to win 2014.
and hasn’t it been lovely ! 🙂
Mickey there needs to be a good conversation with LPrent about protocols for engaging with a Labour-Green government.
The schadenfreude and hypocrisy-charges will be significant for upholding the reputation of The Standard.
“Shesh they were all at it. I bet there are a whole lot of Nat staffers feeling very nervous right now”
And if they all get the Boot Paula will be pissed, as it will screwup her ‘Unemployment is dropping” meme.
I think Armstrong in the Herald today is right:
“…Nicky Wagner, who was already facing a real struggle holding her Christchurch Central seat for National. She may as well not even bother campaigning now that citizens of the earthquake-stricken city know they rate as “scum” in the mind of Slater. She will not be the only one cursing Slater. Christchurch was National’s success story in 2011. National’s strong party vote in the city was a tribute to John Key’s unique ability to draw votes from across the political spectrum.
But Christchurch is gone. It would be rich irony if the city became National’s graveyard in 2014.”
It’s here: http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11313037
Christchurch has gone, and so has Dunedin after Cunliffe’s fine policy announcements yesterday, raptuously received on yesterday’s front page of the ODT
BG
There were two articles about the Labour policies for Dunedin in the ODT yesterday, the frontpage was indeed very enthusiastic, while the “election 2014” one consisted mainly of Woodhouse/ Joyce quotes.
http://www.odt.co.nz/news/dunedin/313305/labour-promises-reopen-hillside
Woodhouse, being the Private Health Industry’s representative in Parliament, was particularly dismissive of the plan to upgrade Dunedin Hospital:
http://www.odt.co.nz/news/dunedin/313352/policies-damaging-joyce-says
Napier is also gone for National and word on the street is Foss is behind in Tukituki
The expose IS the real issue…
http://minimalistmum.blogspot.co.nz/2014/08/dirty-politics-expose-is-issue.html
Well said, Jessica.
I have not yet read Hager’s book, but have read the Whaledump posts to date, and your blog sums up my feelings far better than I could have.
I recommend others read your blog post.
PS – I also skimmed your other recent on your blog, and will be back to read them more thoroughly.
Oops, edited and ended up with two versions.
Edit was to PS to read
PS – I also skimmed your other recent posts on your blog, and will be back to read them more thoroughly.
Nice post, Jessica. Totally agree.
Yep Micky
The staffer’s must have been coached by someone though.
Maybe Ede, & Lusk?
Maybe some others too, inside MSM.
Who were actually steering the dirty politics black op’s and spin doctoring?
Joyce at the helm like Key no doubt, but cleverly keeping themselves detached as to not be connected, but all coming out now.
They always looked so smug we instinctively knew they were up to something but had no proof.
Thank you Nicky Hager Nat’s on longer have the protective secrecy any more, while they are now flying blind into a Kim.com storm cloud, with an on going investigation up their arse opps!
I’m just going to make an association. If any of you are familiar with the Jeff Gannon stuff from GWBs days you will recognise the tactics and strategy here. This is a corporate designed strategy to defeat democracy.
as in TPPA, just for example …
Some more grist for the mill:
http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2014/08/new-zealand-prime-minister-john-key-the-whale-oil-blog-and-international-organized-crime.html
That is a very disturbing read.
Excellent article, thank you.
That is too much grist for my mind mill – I can quite feel my cogs and spindles seizing up as I read. It would take one more familiar with international moneylaundering techniques than myself, to follow all the slippery twists and turns. Difficult to argue with the conclusion though:
Hmmm, Slater seems to have decided to declare war on the media and is trying to blackmail, browbeat and bully them with sinister threats of blackmail.
What an idiot. Making personal enemies with people who can ask Key questions about Slater from here until September 20th is really, really dumb. Key must now be be furious at how close he personally and his party generally has allowed itself to come to Slater, who is out of control. Slater seems to think he represents some kind of new order in the media, and he and his Brownshirts can use the tactics of street thugs to subvert and supplant the traditional media. Paul Buchanan is right – Slater and his band of thugs represent a existential threat to democracy. Slater and his thugs don’t want contingent consent in a democratic structure – they want to humiliate, delegitimise and smash all opposition to their point of view. Simply, he has to be stopped at all costs.
There is also now a clear schism within the media itself. The hard right broadcasters like Plunkett, Hoskings, Henry etc etc have clearly cast in their lot with Slater and abandoned any pretense of being journalists. They should be sen for what they are – hard-right propagandists who despise democracy and would welcome a one party state of the right..
Yeah #DirtyPolitics has literally driven some of these guys over the edge, Plunkett trying to incoherently accuse Paddy Gower of something (no-one has really figured it out yet…) over the phone was just cringe-worthy.
Anybody who has read Dirty Politics knows why John Key will not sack Judith Collins.
She knows where the bodies are buried.
Through her close friend Cameron Slater, she knows exactly how much John Key is involved in dirty politics.
If she goes, he goes.
Both of them are a spent force now; there is no coming back from this one.
…. and if things go wrong at this election, he’s gone anyway – or even if things are so tight we have a Natzi government unable to do anything because the margins are so thin. (I actually didn;t think this gubbamint was going to last this long – it’s been sailing along with Blind Faith)
Collins is inherently retributive – a nouveau riche, self-entitled, very ugly, holier-than-thou person. She won’t be able to resist. I heard this morning (The Nation I think – with the sage Peddy Gear) that the beneficiary of all this will be Pulla Bent. Let’s hope so, because a competent Cunliffe or even a jack-Russell should be able to put that beast down without too much trouble.
Check THIS out!
‘Naked Capitalism’ blog outs Cathy Odgers ‘Cactus Cate’.
‘Chop chop Cathy ……
Penny Bright
+100 thanks Penny…will check it out!
http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2014/08/new-zealand-prime-minister-john-key-the-whale-oil-blog-and-international-organized-crime.html
It gets worse, Naked Capitalism is right on to Ian Taylor, family patriarch Geoff Taylor, accusing them and their shelf companies of quite a lot of things;
http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/?s=taylor
http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2012/11/at-least-half-of-the-21500-companies-revealed-by-the-guardianicij-offshore-investigation-have-connections-with-rogue-agent-gt-group.html
Now go to NZ herald and have a look at this puff piece on the PM;
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/john-key-the-unauthorised-biography/news/article.cfm?c_id=1502247&objectid=10523316
“Other investors include Hugh Green Investments and dairy entrepreneur Geoff Taylor. Taylor is a director, along with Ian Holland, Simon Perry and Peter Schuyt.”
And check out the fact that NZ legislation to fix this issue in NZ with shell companies and the problems that they cause is taking a while…
This is worse than I thought.
thx rich. here be flaming dragons.
rich .. and did you see whaledump tweet today — “In Vanuatu. Don’t hold any important briefings while I’m gone.” Hmmm.
Yes I thought there might be some follow up as it’s a little vague.
well, I must be a left wing conspiracy theorist — I noticed Vanuatu figured so much around Taylor story link you posted and I couldn’t help but jump to conclusions tho I have no idea what they are as yet !!
Think I need a day away … wry sigh … 🙂
I am new to this site, but an observation, there is a propensity for many of the contributors to use extreme hyperbole and blame the government, the MSM or any body else for everything There is also a gross use of the “collective we”. Not everybody is unhappy, a great majority of kiwis left or right are just getting on with life, celebrating their good fortune ( not necessarily material) and facing up to the challenges that come their way . Here however many, (not all ) seem to use this site as a medium for their unchallengeable ideology, spew hate or seek to externalise their own failures or jealousy and further seek comfort in this by rationalising that every one else thinks the same and if not god help them. This is not all bad though,such sites be it whaleoiil, the standard, daily blog are entertaining while also acting as a pressure valve for the more extremes in our society, as does democracy I guess, so keep on keeping on
Dear Red Delusion,
If you are an honest and mildly intelligent discussant, you will learn to be discerning in who you engage with, who are worth the time. So focus your judgement.
If you had read the site policy, you will note that people who make sweeping statements about this site tend to get scorched out. Moderation here isn’t like Kiwiblog or Whaleoil as you will soon discover.
You will also get to recognize that the commenters are diverse, at least as diverse as those within Labour, and more. Don’t presume any specific politic. Learn the spectrum of those you want to deal with.
And finally, no one is going to waste time with the drivel you ended with. Stand up, sharpen up, package your facts, and bring your best stuff every day. This is a sport to be played well.
Ad
If you want to play the concern tr*ll – or whatever the neutral-observer-with-objective-critique equivalent is – , then it might have been an idea to employ a different pseudonym. Rather gives the game away.
Yeah I laughed at that too.
Redel has the same pomposity of jamiwhite- doesn’t ring true
Sorry about being reactive but, John Keys office said this today.
Fewer Kiwis leaving for Australia, more coming home.
In the year to July, fewer people left for Australia than any time since 1995 – and more Kiwis are voting with their feet and coming home.
So when the Australian economy and political society turns to shit, National will take credit for it. Wow, what will this guy take credit for next? Higher temperatures mean NZ can grow more tropical crops – A national party initiative?
National will take credit for anything if they think that they can make them look good. Anything else they’ll blame on Labour.
one of gowers’ worst efforts..to date..(nation interview of robertson/norman..)
..all about playing wedge-politics..
..and all about trying to show what a clever dick he is..
..a fail..on all levels..
Key and Cronies should be in the Dock!
Collins Slater Lusk Ede Joyce Odgers no doubt others!
Hawaii. How much time does Key spend there each year and how much time does he spend in NZ. Anybody know?
He has to spend time aboard, on holiday, else how would his Office get anything done.
True enough.
And the media has a go at Cunliffe for taking 3 days off, where a quick look at Key’s schedule over the past 12 months would have probably shown 3 months off.
Dear Ad
Fair points, I would argue site is left however agree it is not purely labour
I also hear your point on the sport aspect of site, that’s why site is so entertaining
Would argue however that views are well argued, little synthesis goes on, even the more scholarly of contributors simply start with a conclusion, then reference articles that support their line of thought or ideology
No different on the right, my point is poles would indicate many people don’t think this way, hence views on these type of sites tend to be more extreme and satisfy the needs of contributors, provide entertainment but little else
Dont get worked up over pseudronym, could easily be blue delusion
why have your brought Poland into your argument ?
Easy mistake for a person who does not have English as their first language, yeshe. ;~)
thought maybe it was a right wing thing I didn’t understand … 🙂
@Rich 12.36
The Delusion comment talks about finding entertainment on these sites and talks about poles. I’m so shallow I immediately thought of pole dancing. 😉 I am so glad this person dropped in to put us right in our place.
By the way I like your face construction, I am going to add it to my group of home-made ones. :>)
greywarbler — poll dancing is what farrar does. :>}
@ yeshe 4.39
Like
Labour to “axe secondary tax”
Well done!!!
Yes Big relief to casual workers with multijobs.
Casualisation of the workforce is big with National’s unemployment figures.
During Labour’s government NZ had the lowest rate of unemployment in the OECD, lower even than South Korea.
What is it now under English & co.?
They’ll need to careful otherwise a lot of people will arrange a primary job that pays sod all and a very lucrative untaxed secondary job. Either that or they are raising unrealistic expectations for some.
That incentive exists now. In what way is it affected by Labour’s proposal?
Agreed. Axing secondary tax is the first Labour policy I really like. The way it works is a really good initiative to not try different things. They should look at the obscene Key tax on paperboys (paperkids?) as well.
I heard this quote on This Way Up, obviously Churchill, and thought that its warning sounded very appropriate for now. I have taken out some wording to make it more generally applicable. It was given I think on 18 June 1940.
The speech was delivered to the Commons at 3:49 pm,[6] and lasted 36 minutes. Churchill – as was his habit – made revisions to his 23-page typescript right up to and during the speech. The final passage of his typescript was laid out in blank verse format, which Churchill scholars consider reflective of the influence of Old Testament psalms on his oratory style.
A long speech, so people with a short attention span would have difficulty grasping the precepts. Perhaps we with our short span might have difficulty meeting the challenges Britain did, the first being finding the time and concentration to think about it all.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/This_was_their_finest_hour
edited
Those Lusk – Slater emails are a little bit interesting – reveals the minds of the men. Parts are almost homo-erotic in their shared effusive enjoyment of guns and money, pushing one or the other on the other. Not that homo’s shouldn’t be homos or effusive, it’s the kind of faux developmental homo you might find in male relationships of an adolescent kind. Kids with guns, might be accurate. I gotta be honest, I don’t know any males like those two. Is it common for guys of that age to be talking like that to each other, and if it isn’t, is it just the political industry that attracts that type? I don’t suppose anyone will confirm. It’d be like asking how often one masturbates. I just though I’d ask in case anyone asks me to a political rally and when politely refusing I can say I have to stay home and wash my hair and not seem odd to them.
Also the glaringly flippin obvious:
Covert operations 101 rule 1#
When discussing evil plans, don’t put it in writing and definitely don’t use electronic medium to send messages. If you can’t manage that, don’t reply to replies of email discussion, start new mail for each reply, so fragmenting the paper trail.
Even John Key knows that rule. To get that rule wrong shows that a person would have to be under the spell of their own hype and when that happens it doesn’t even matter if you spell it out, they can’t comprehend it.
I am absolutely amazed at their incompetence. They left a trail a dog with a skunk sitting on its nose could follow. I can’t believe their arrogance. They are nasty, incompetent, well resourced amateurs. This is what will save us from them in the end.
A key factor that causes disadvantage to the opposition parties is that the economy is “good” in terms of the numbers we hear in the media.
So why is it good? Because Christchurch had an earth quake and so National got to do the rather dodgy accounting of writing off some assets, then borrowing some money, and building them back again – then taxing the increased activity and then calling the result a GDP increase and a surplus.
As long as National keeps control of that narrative it is still in a strong position.
If one of the other parties was to really take them to task on it (exactly how that would be done would depend on the party) things could start to look different.
I have heard little bits of this sort of argument (around debt going up) but they don’t seem to be framed quite right.
The good news is I think that the guys actually made this point in the whaledump, so one could highlight that.
Quick question and please excuse me for yet to come up-to-date:
Are the Leaders’ Debates taking place and, if so, when?
If Prime Minister John Key doesn’t want to turn up, please organise for an article to be sent from the Prime Minister’s Office so that David Cunliffe can debate with the said item.
Remember that the huge gap in the funding of EQC happened because the Government with held the money.
Result 1:EQC have had to drastically reduce settlement of claims.
Result 2: Government can hide the debt so that there appears to be a surplus to crow about. Bill gets away with the fraud. MSM does not touch the issue.
ianmac .. it is fraud — did you see Campbell Live piece last week … xlnt visuals/graphics of accounting in question …
http://www.3news.co.nz/More-to-Govt-accounts-than-meets-the-eye/tabid/817/articleID/357540/Default.aspx
Yes yeshe. That where I had my info from though I think it had been raised at Question Time. I think that it should have raised a storm but at the moment some little book is being discussed blotting out such concerns.
it will come ianmac, I am sure of it. So much in process I think … and many more are watching because of the ‘little book’. John Campbell won’t drop it, we can be certain of that much at least.
Not sure Key can keep saying no-one is interested, Blighty seems to be.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/aug/23/-sp-new-zealand-election-john-key-alleged-dirty-politics
Stephen Franks continues to run amok on The Panel
Radio NZ National, Friday 22 August 2014
Jim Mora, Stephen Franks, Bernard Hickey, Julie Moffett
Long-time sufferers of the light, not so bright, chat show The Panel will be all too aware of its grim line-up of commentators from the far right. It’s a long list, and extremely depressing to anyone who cares about the quality of our public broadcasting. Those commentators include: Nevil “Breivik” Gibson, Jordan Williams, Chris Wikaira, Barry Corbett, Michael Bassett, Neil Miller, John Bishop, Jock Anderson, John Barnett, and the superficially jolly but deeply nasty Whale Oil lackey David Farrar. They rarely contribute anything insightful or witty; the exceptions are John Bishop, who can string together an intelligent argument occasionally, and Jock Anderson, who has a disarming bonhomie and sharp sense of humor. The rest of them, though, make for a grim and often gruesome listening experience. Jordan Williams is allowed free rein to push his cynical “Taxpayers Union” stunts whenever he is on, and—this is still possibly the single most absurd moment in the history of the program—Michael Bassett croaked with Stygian malice that Nicky Hager was a Holocaust-denier, with not a word of demur uttered by host Jim Mora, producer Susan Baldacci or anyone else in the studio.
Today, once again, another on this seemingly endless roster of extreme right wing ideologues was allowed the run of the Radio NZ studios for an hour or more. Yes, the great legal scholar and moral philosopher and Sensible Sentencing Trust supporter Stephen Franks was on again, and he did not disappoint. Indeed, he delivered several of his trademark deranged, wandery lectures and topped it off with a blackly humorous paean to the destruction Vietnam—one of the most hilarious, monstrously hypocritical moral homilies I have ever heard, anywhere, and made all the more hilarious by his contention that the Vietnamese think the Americans weren’t hard enough on them.
Only at the end of the program did anyone—Bernard Hickey, actually—do anything to counter the phenomenal amount of bilge Franks was spouting.
Franks’s dismal performance began during the pre-show, when host Jim Mora read a letter from a listener expressing concern about how the loss of confidence and trust in politicians is leading to a loss of trust in public institutions in general….
JIM MORA: Do you think honestly—I know this is a Panelly type situation and we’re getting serious before 4 o’clock—but do you think there is something in this?
BERNARD HICKEY: I’m a little bit skeptical. People say they don’t respect politicians, but in my experience they do respect them whenever they meet them face to face.
STEPHEN FRANKS: This is the result of a long stream of very cynical books. It’s very rare to see a politician portrayed as noble. This cynicism seeps into public attitudes. I think most politicians have good motives and there is very little corruption in New Zealand. ….[He continues pretentiously and inanely for a while longer. For a short time after he is finished, there is an uneasy silence….]
Both Jim Mora and Bernard Hickey were too polite to give voice to what must have immediately occurred to them, i.e., that most non-National Party politicians do indeed have good motives and are not corrupt—with the glaring exception of David (“Grave Robber”) Garrett, Rodney (“The Perk-Taker”) Hide and John (“I donnnnnn’t remember”) Banks, i.e., politicians who made up the grotesque ACT party shambles that Franks represented in parliament.
But Mora and Hickey said nothing, and Franks got away with another few minutes of pompous drivel, unchallenged.
After the 4 o’clock news, on The Panel proper, Mora apologetically announced that he was going to talk about Nicky Hager’s book Dirty Politics again. Mora’s attitude was interesting; I have no doubt that Franks had said something unpleasant and admonitory to him off air about that, which led to Mora’s clear nervousness in broaching the subject….
JIM MORA: Stephen, um, to what extent do you think the landscape is changing?
STEPHEN FRANKS: I have genuinely tried to avoid reading it. I defended the News of the World phone hacks, but there’s a good reason why much of this is illegal, and I want to see the law enforced…. [He continues on with a confused, rambling Jamie Whyte-style free-ranging rumination.]
In his “Soapbox” segment, Franks spoke about some university students he recently met, and expressed his grave concern about their failure to see the merits of America’s destruction of Vietnam. (No, you did not read that wrongly; Franks really IS that deranged)…..
STEPHEN FRANKS: I’d rather hoped that they might rebel against the ghastly consensus that war can only be spoken about in hushed tones as if it’s all terribly shameful, and there’s a defeatism and a pacifism in our intelligentsia that means our commemorations usually talk about war as failure on all sides. …[Here he pauses to underline that he is thinking seriously]…But, uh, I think we’re in a world where we might need some of the martial values. We look at a man who was beheaded by a culture that sees sacrifice of innocence as just a routine tactic. Ahhhhmmm, if you were a Kurd, or a Yaziri, or a Christian in Iran, or a North Korean, or in the last century a Czech or a Pole or an Ethiopian or anyone who’s been invaded and dominated, ahhhhmmm, you might think that you need to celebrate courage and self-sacrifice and the virtues, ahhhhhmmmm….
BERNARD HICKEY: But there’s a cynicism about that now because the initial response was to jump in in a martial way. It seemed to make it a lot worse.
STEPHEN FRANKS: [irate tone] Well, I don’t think that that’s established at all. I mean, one of the things that was interesting in this debate was that the young people all universally condemned the Vietnam War, but I doubt that ANY of them have talked to any of the Vietnamese refugees who have settled here, in fact it sticks in my head that, at the height of the Vietnam War there were 400,000 or 350,000 refugees overseas out of Vietnam, two years later there were FOUR MILLION that had fled, a million probably or no one knows how many PERISHED, and if you spend a bit of time in Vietnam and probe enough because they don’t want to talk about the war, you’ll find plenty of people who will say the only thing wrong about the Vietnam War was that the wrong side was allowed to win. So you know, I think there’s a cultural overlay in New Zealand that just doesn’t WANT to examine the possibility that we’ve had a hundred years reaction to a ghastly First World War like All Quiet on the Western Front, and we don’t celebrate the virtues of Just War.
MORA: Putting the Vietnam War aside, because, well, we probably don’t have time to talk about it although you’ve raised an interesting point, ahhh, doesn’t increased attendances in recent years at Anzac Day services suggest that we still do appreciate valor, actually?
STEPHEN FRANKS: Uh, I think it does. I think ordinary people don’t have that kind of syrupy, maudlin regret. I think they ARE wanting to honor some the things that humans have traditionally honored, like courage and self-sacrifice.
MORA: All right. Stephen Franks, thank you. Bernard Hickey on the Panel, a quarter to five. Miley Cyrus’s forthcoming show in Auckland: pornography and the promotion of substance abuse dressed up as pop music, says Family First. We’ll ask Dita Di Boni about that, but first of all, your opinions please. Does it bother you, the subject matter?
STEPHEN FRANKS: It seems tawdry to me and I applaud Bob McCroskery for having the courage to be unfashionable and say parents ought to be a bit disgusted.
BERNARD HICKEY: I’m deeply uncomfortable with it. It just seems like something from another planet.
MORA: More and more youngsters don’t have the moral framework to condemn it, they don’t have the religion which used to condemn it. So is this a kind of moral degradation or not?
(Jim Mora, remember, is a man who chuckles at the plight of political dissidents.)
DITA DI BONI: Well, a lot of people sheet it home to Madonna. But there’s really no comparison. It’s a completely different ball game. She wasn’t marketed to children and she expressed female sexuality to women, which Miley Cyrus says she is doing, but that’s nonsense. She is a product of a marketing system, of an industry, whereas Madonna really tried to make her own way but, I don’t know about you guys, but every straight man I’ve ever talked to does not find Madonna sexy. She’s scary, because it’s a different idea of sexuality. Miley Cyrus is very cynically marketed to very young girls, it’s a nonsense message….
STEPHEN FRANKS: [speaking very quietly, to convey deep moral seriousness] It’s a very strange thing to have reached this stage. It was so easy to scoff at the slippery slope and ummmm, and the anti-Patricia Bartlett position was just universal.
DITA DI BONI: Yes.
STEPHEN FRANKS: But it IS very difficult for a society to cope with this kind of attack on values. Of course this is exactly the dilemma that isn’t a dilemma for Islamic countries…..[continues pompously for another minute or so]
Just before the end of the program, Jim Mora brought up the subject of Labour’s plan to revive the Dunedin Railway Workshops. The Ayn Rand worshipper’s response was one of instant, dogmatic dismissal: Government has no business investing in any industry, he growled. Bernard Hickey, for once, stirred himself to respond to Franks’s nonsense instead of just ignoring him and hoping he’d stop….
BERNARD HICKEY: Yet we’ve got $400 million to spend on irrigation problems.
STEPHEN FRANKS: [snorting] Railway is a sunset industry.
BERNARD HICKEY: Oooooh, I’m not so sure about that….
Sadly, the music swelled up and saved Franks from an on-air keelhauling. Maybe next time the comparatively sensible guest, whoever it is, will act sooner….
I sent the ever jovial Mein Host of the program the following email….
Why did you not challenge Stephen Franks’ brutal and ignorant raving?
Dear Jim,
During his confused and highly selective broadside against “cultures that sacrifice innocence”, Stephen Franks forgot to mention the Israeli oppression of Palestinians. Maybe he was too busy skiing to take note of the latest onslaught—or does he support their daily oppression and killing?
I am sure many listeners were also flabbergasted and disgusted by his equally ignorant comments about the “wrong side being allowed to win in Vietnam”.
Yours sincerely,
Morrissey Breen
Northcote Point
you left that student army guy off yr rightie-list..and boag..and ‘neo-liberalism?..y’know yr soaking in it!’ edwards-the-elder..and the guy who lost his his legs on the mountain..
..and mccormick is lurching right at some kinda warp-speed…
..and there are some new ones..
..the other day a hideous rightwing pr-trout smarmed her way thru her first appearance.
..she was ghastly in the extreme…
..i find increasingly i choose to take the dogs to the park..
..rather than endure the likes of franks/the above..
..and you are right..mora never challenges him/them..
..no matter what hysterical rightwing drivel/outright/easily-disproved lies/propaganda they may spout/spew out..
..mora never says boo!..
you left that student army guy off yr rightie-list..and boag..and ‘neo-liberalism?..y’know yr soaking in it!’
Thanks, Phillip. I would have put them on that list if I’d remembered. I did it off the top of my head. There are several more of them as well.
edwards-the-elder..and the guy who lost his his legs on the mountain..
Brian Edwards and Mark Inglis are conservative, but I don’t think they are as blindly ideological or as brutal as extremists like Franks, Bassett, Williams and Farrar.
..and mccormick is lurching right at some kinda warp-speed…
He is, but he’s a right wing Labour supporter more than he is a hard right nutcase like Stephen Franks. In fact, whenever the producers have been careless enough to pair McCormick with one of those cranks, McCormick has forcefully contested his (or her) narrative—much to the consternation of the dithering host.
If this corrupt and frightening government gets back in because Kelvin Davis knocks Hone Harawira out of the race I, for one, will never forgive the Labour Party. Never. Anyone else feel like this?
Very much, but I don’t think it’s likely. We need Mana in parliament, and we need Greens, both because of their policies and the fact that they will pull Labour to the left. We need Labour because of their numbers and not a lot else. I’ll never forget 1984, which has culminated in the crooked rubbish that tries to pass itself off as governance today.
Actually Morrissey your ignorance re Vietnam is incredible. You’ve obviously never been there. Any number of private conversations with the locals will convince anyone with an open mind that the wrong side won. But why let your blind ideological animus be contradicted by real people. Much more comfortable to cling to your stupid leftie groupthink.
Really Monty? I have been there. The locals have forgiven the carnage that the US has caused to their country but they are still in their own unique way in control of their country.
Something called “monty” seems a tad bewildered….
Any number of private conversations with the locals will convince anyone with an open mind that the wrong side won.
No doubt you also think the wrong side won in South Africa in 1994. And the wrong side won in the American Civil War.
How many million more Vietnamese do you think the U.S. should have slaughtered? Perhaps you don’t have a limit worked out?
….blind ideological animus…. stupid leftie groupthink…
Quick! Somebody get this inarticulate fool a spittoon!
Labour broadcast totally pantsed National’s talking head.
Really Micky you should be ashamed of yourself -talk about a useful idiot. The way their country is controlled isn’t unique -it’s called a communist dictatorship you dick. Can you think of any more examples? Get back to me if you can’t.
Hallo All, it has been a while, and I took a break, while my mate kept posting a few bits here now and then.
I admit I deserved a break, which Lprent defined correctly as a “ban”, to sort my mind and soul out a bit, as I got a bit worked up, more than I should have, on Israel, Palestine and the rest of the drama that still goes on.
But I have been keeping onto things, and one topic is DR BRATT, there will be more on Dr Bratt, a Bratt Attack of sorts, coming soon, that questionable MSD and WINZ Principal Health Advisor they use, to kick sick, injured and disabled off benefits and to urge them into whatever work there may be.
We are short shifted, shafted, that is us with serious illness, disability and injury, and they add to insult, most the parties, I am ANGRY.
So I will not blow my top, just hope that lprent will not throw me out too soon again, and I will work on some comments soon, that will inform more about the shit that goes on in welfare, which is rather “warfare”. What many do not realise is, that Paula Bennett is afraid of the election result and her job, so she has instructed her departments to keep calm, not make too harsh decisions, and to keep most lulled into indifference or a false sense of security. Should the Nats get a third term, get a warm jumper, all on benefits, you will get the worst that has happened in this country since Ruthanasia (look that up on Wiki, please).
Apologies, but these are the “fighters” that I respect and will die for, they are the soul of revolution and ground breaking change. You will hate me for past comments and over the top reactions. I apologise, but forget not the purpose of us being here, also the reason of revolution. Who still stands for that cause?
I stand for that and more, so take your choice and stand please, we will continue to fight on:
One good piece worth counting and citing:
I will deliver MORE soon!
Excuse me, please, I post this for the future of the people that CARE, that actually understand history and that is for Europe, UK and South America and also South Africa. We all need to learn and improve, we can all work together and be one, and so, learn and understand, please, this is not a message of division and hatred, it is an attempt to reconnect and be ONE:
Much more there comes from!