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Open mike 24/03/2015

Written By: - Date published: 6:34 am, March 24th, 2015 - 107 comments
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107 comments on “Open mike 24/03/2015 ”

  1. tc 1

    Looking at granny you wouldn’t realise a crucial buy election occurs in 4 days.

    Audrey doesn’t miss the chance to be second online with DC’s breakup including a rehash of election events because thats sooo relevent, all after another cricket non story leads.

    Simply appalling bias on show for all to see from granny who don’t even bother to mask it anymore.

  2. logie97 2

    St Bedes students.
    It may have been said already, but if those students had been injured as a result of their prank, their parents would already be suing the school and blaming the school for failing in the duty of care. Who’d be a teacher with parents like these around.

    • ianmac 2.1

      I think that the Judgement was over whether due process had been followed. The right to a fair “trial” rather than saying that the punishment was wrong.

      • logie97 2.1.1

        ianmac, you will know as well as any, in the field of education there is a duty of care – in loco parentis. This is particularly relevant to EOTC as well as general school times but particularly on school camps, trips. And parents who are accompanying/supporting as helpers on such trips are duty bound to support the supervision of children (and are not there on a junket holiday to just see what their little darlings are doing). And in the interests of children’s safety, schools have codes of conduct for all participants.

        I bet the school’s RAM for this trip did not specifically include “What if a child decides to do something stupid like get on to a baggage conveyor belt and gets injured…? Teacher is now required to organise appropriate medical care and is taken away from his duties of managing the trip and the safety of the rest of the team. Again those sorts of eventualities are catered for in a code of conduct.

        • ianmac 2.1.1.1

          Yes logie. The immediate reaction of those in charge is a must to keep all in care safe and in good order. I support the school action. But from a legal point of view, once safety is established then a fair “trial” should be held. There are numerous cases where kids on a school trip get drunk and are sent home straight away. Fair enough.
          (In this case I have it on good authority that the two boys concerned were already on a good behaviour bond after serious misconduct at last year’s Regatta.) Silly beggars!

          • greywarshark 2.1.1.1.1

            These young chaps were 17 or 18 years apparently. When criminals of that age are referred to they are called ‘men’, emphasising that their age means they are old enough to behave as responsible adults. So these are not silly little youngsters. I suggest they are the brattish result of being indulged children who have displayed good aptitude at a sport and spent insufficient time on learning about society and culture, self-discipline and wisdom, and of co-operating with a group.

            They are individualistic, hedonistic and a bit on the amoral side, because mummy and daddy will always come along and insist they be excused for as much as possible. Those are the sort of parents who have boys who become roastbusters, whose child’s girlfriend dies in his bed and the family lies about it, have an interesting background themselves and then their child becomes a big-time athlete who disciplines himself to overcome disability but loses control, shoots wildly and kills his girlfriend. The sportsmen who take drugs to give them advantage and lie about it. This is the pattern.

            Pushing the envelope to favour themselves is normal for these tunnel-visioned parents with money. They are the product of the post WW2 wealth wave that is asperashunal and brooks no restraints.

            • vto 2.1.1.1.1.1

              “They are the product of the post WW2 wealth wave that is asperashunal and brooks no restraints”

              Yep. I can’t help but feel that the current generations plying our shores have much in their make-up which is not in step with many many previous generations. I can’t help thinking our generations are anomalies. Poor anomalies which will not be judged well by history.

            • In Vino 2.1.1.1.1.2

              I would put in a word for the poor Boards of Trustees. (BOTs) They are usually really well-meaning people, but Tomorrow’s Schools has put them into an invidious position. Many people do just a 3-year term (and all are abominably underpaid for what they do), some do 6 yrs, a few do 9, and very few do 12+. Few gather the institutional knowledge that the old Department of Education had. (That Department used to do much of the work that our BOTs do, but cost-cutting Rogernomes put all that burden onto underpaid and under-informed BOTs.)
              That is why things go wrong when Principals do not follow correct procedure. The BOT generally do not know enough to correct them. How could they?
              Yet most will be gone in 3 years, so the BOT cannot be realistically brought to account.
              This is a really stupid system of school governance.

    • Sans Cle 2.2

      Perhaps a bit of a naive question, but how does one go about getting a case heard in the High Court in the space of a day or two? What process was gone through to get such an immediate hearing for the St. Bede’s parents?

      • grumpy 2.2.1

        You can get an injunction pretty quick.

        • North 2.2.1.1

          If you’re lawyered up well enough which demands that you are actually rich…..not just doing OK…..rich. My guess is there’d be bugger all change out of 10 grand for that superb effort. Maybe more than 10 grand. This access to The Law is not something the ordinary person gets. What an excellent cup o’ tea it must have been with the barrister/s afterwards – “Don’t mess with THESE daddies and laddies !”

      • Murray Rawshark 2.2.2

        You ask the judge down at the club to do it for you. Or maybe the one you were chatting to at the Brownlee barbecue.

        • Molly 2.2.2.1

          According to this Herald article we have several of St Bede’s old boys in Parliament:

          Mr Dunne has tweeted his support for the boys. While there actions were not “a harmless prank”, Mr Dunne said it was “not for the school to resolve”.

          “The boys’ irresponsible conduct is for their parents, Police and Aviation Security to deal with, not the college,” he wrote.

          “Schools often assume too much authority in cases like this for reputational reasons only.”

          A spokesman for Mr Dunne said he would not make further comment on the matter.

          Mr Carter could not be reached for comment.

          Former St Bede’s College students now in Parliament:
          • Gerry Brownlee
          • Peter Dunne
          • Clayton Cosgrove
          • Damien O’Connor
          • David Carter
          • Matt Doocey

          Your Brownlee’s barbecue quip is very apt.

          • Murray Rawshark 2.2.2.1.1

            Having 5% of our MPs from one school shows that we are hardly egalitarian when it comes to representation. Or anything else. My Brownlee comment was not accidental 🙂

            I think Dunne is factually wrong. The school is in loco parentis, as they used to tell us when they gave us six of the best. We told them that not all of our parents bashed us and refused to be caned. That was Whangarei Boys’ High and eventually caning was stopped. On the other hand, I do think the school overreacted.

    • Murray Rawshark 2.3

      Next thing they’ll be suing the school when their thick Tory offspring fail their exams. What have these kids learned? As long as they lawyer up, they can do what they like and teachers are inferior beings. Schools are not for learning, but for networking with other microencephalic Tories so you can get a director’s chair later in life. Or a safe NAct seat.

      • Philip Ferguson 2.3.1

        My guess is that these are also the kind of folks who bang on about how the working class are the agents of their own misfortune and the law is too soft on “crims”, etc etc etc.

        At the same time, ensuring that their own kids never learn that actions have consequences.

        Consequences are for other people, not their precious little offspring.

        While the well-to-do have always had one law and morality for themselves and another law and morality for the hoi-polloi, I think it has gotten worse. Once upon a time, they used to pretend there weren’t different laws for different folks, based on class; now they kind of flaunt it. They’re no longer uncomfortable or embarrassed by their own double standards.

        (Personally, I don’t care that these guys played around on the luggage conveyor belt; people are only young once and anyone who has lived did some silly things in their teens; I don’t think they should have been punished by the school at all. My problem is the appalling double standards and the recourse to litigation because these were middle class kids.)

        Phil

        Phil

        • logie97 2.3.1.1

          Philip Ferguson.
          ” I don’t think they should have been punished by the school at all. ”
          Teachers really enjoy that sort of comment. Any other comments you feel you should make regarding what happens at school and how they should be run. You have probably had various “codes of conduct” sent home with your children to discuss with you and sign and not really absorbed them.

          If children get injured on school trips, you sound like you may be the sort who would be straight to the principal’s door threatening litigation.

          “Codes of Conduct” have been introduced for a reason – the collective good, not the individual’s.
          This from St Bede’s Code.
          “…Abide by all school and societal rules and laws.
          Any serious breach of this code of conduct will result in you being sent home/withdrawn from the team, tournament or trip at your own expense.”

          • Murray Rawshark 2.3.1.1.1

            Young men jumping on things is pretty much expected. I can’t see that it’s a serious breach at all. Play on.

            On the other hand, there is a huge double standard here. If the boys had been from St Paul’s on a league trip, or from Kaikohe College, they probably would have been arrested and charged with something ridiculous. Because they’re from a posh school and their parents have money, they lose nothing. That’s what concerns me, not whatever internal mechanisms the saintly school may or may not have.

            • logie97 2.3.1.1.1.1

              They broke the bloody law by getting on the conveyor belt. There are notices a plenty in that area. That is not trivial.

    • millsy 2.4

      Personally I think the school over reacted here.

      A lot of these school principals are trying to copy so-called zero tolerance policies in the US school system where pupils get kicked out/arrested for the slighest transgression, and harmless pranks that would have drawn a lesser punishement 20-30 years ago now end up with suspensions and explusions. Look at things such as sniffer dogs in schools and CCTV cameras, pricipals wanting to go through cellphones and computer, etc and so on. Our schools are being turned gradually into neo-liberal mini-prisons, with increasingly authortarian principals.

      At least with the cane, you got your six of the best and that was the end of the matter, now school officals are going all out to curb the future prospects of their students.

      I am glad I finished my schooling in the late 1990’s. When I was in 7th form/Year 13, I turned up to class very tired (I had huge sleeping issues when I was a child/teenager), and the next day my teacher took me aside and told me that if I showed up to school stoned (I have never used dope in my life) she would take the matter to the deputy principal. Nowadays I would have been frogmarched to the sick bay for a piss test, and probably would have been suspended.

      It seems to me that schools are more and more tending to teach students to keep their heads down in the new neo-liberal order, Any dissent will not be tolerated.

  3. gsays 3

    go the nz cricket team.
    the most anticipated odi in a generation.

    following after saturdays brilliant performance i hope for another win.

    i am wanting south africa to show their brittleness under pressure from brendon mccullums aggressive captaincy and tactics.

  4. Pasupial 4

    This is a bit sad:

    Former Labour leader David Cunliffe and his wife, Karen Price, have separated after more than 30 years of marriage.

    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=11421917

    It must have been a very stressful last couple of years for them.

    • cancerman 4.1

      I had imagined [redacted] had been done to relieve stress?

      [Stephanie: this kind of shitty, potentially defamatory innuendo will not be tolerated. One warning.]

    • Skinny 4.2

      A good woman who stood by her man through thick and thin. In the clear light of day a bit of space is always a good idea.

      • Puckish Rogue 4.2.1

        Well she seems like shes highly intelligent, very successful and good at what she does so now she can get on with it without an anchor dragging her down

        As for the Cunliffe well as the son of a minister hes probably aware that you reap what you sow

        • weka 4.2.1.1

          You’re a fuckwit PR.

          • felix 4.2.1.1.1

            +1 I’ve no idea why he is allowed to comment here. (Well, except that every time he gets banned he immediately reappears with a new sim card and name)

          • adam 4.2.1.1.2

            Now Weka, PR is a heathen of the first order.

            A epigone who indulges in propaganda for the merchants of hate

            A godless creature who embraces voracity, over humanity.

            Wit and fornication may be his debased desire – he however loves – the hell he creates, little point adding him towards purgatory.

          • The Lone Haranguer 4.2.1.1.3

            Very eloquently put Weka.

            The breakdown of a long term relationship is a sad thing as its the end of the dream and doesnt really need additional comments from individuals who only know the parties involved via the media.

            Leave them to work their own path forward.

          • Puckish Rogue 4.2.1.1.4

            So you don’t get a bit sick of politicians (both sides of the house) who parade their families on TV and present themselves as family men for votes all the while they’re [you should not rely on Slater as verification for anything. Comment deleted – MS]

            • weka 4.2.1.1.4.1

              Are you saying that the Cunliffes split because DC was unfaithful?

              I have zero interest in who politicians choose to share sexual pleasure with. It’s none of my business. It’s weird that you think it’s your business. It’s also weird that you praise a woman as being intelligent and competent and then undermine her by implying she is a victim of her husband’s supposed infidelity. I’ll amend my statement, your a disingenuous fuckwit.

              • Puckish Rogue

                Not saying that at all as I have no proof but he presented himself as a good, family man yet six months later is now seperating so at the time he was lying to everyone for the sake of some votes

                I have zero interest in who politicians choose to [Warning – MS]

                • rawshark-yeshe

                  please, may I add to Weka’s comment … you are a misogynistic disingenuous fuckwit. and if you can’t work out why, you are even thicker than you pretend not to be.

                  • Puckish Rogue

                    you don’t get it but then you’re on the left so its not surprising

                    • McFlock

                      Well, you’re claiming to not be interested whilst lasciviously spreading innuendo and speculation about someone’s sex life, so you must be an unregenerate tory.

                    • weka

                      Misogynistic, disingenuous, fuckwit trole.

                      Keep it up, you know how the moderators love people who slur left wing politicians just because they can.

                    • weka

                      Misogynistic, disingenuous, fuckwit trole, and unregenerate Tory.

                      Anyone got any thing else to add?

                    • McFlock

                      PR is a pustulent cyst, bursting its morbidity across the visage of humanity, with the sole objective of contaminating all who come into range with a vile corruption that festers in one’s character and and turns gentle human warmth into brittle, cold scales that flake into a neoliberal abyss of jealousy and paranoid despair…

                      oh, and they’re a bit of a dick, too.

                    • Pasupial

                      Thank you Weka & McFlock, you’ve summed up PR most eloquently. You did, however, omit the; complete inability to learn, that makes engaging with him such a waste of time.

                • Draco T Bastard

                  Just because a couple has split doesn’t mean that they’re not good family people. I’ve plenty of people who’ve split from their partner and are still good parents and very family orientated. I’ve also known people who were still with the person who they married and shouldn’t have been allowed anywhere near their family.

                  It’s not being married that makes a person a good person, it’s if they’re an arsehole or not.

                  • Molly

                    +100

                    Started writing a reply to PR, but couldn’t be bothered. Thanks for pointing out the obvious.

        • Paul 4.2.1.2

          What a horrible comment

  5. AsleepWhileWalking 5

    MSN now working fervently to demonise online alternative media

    http://www.thedailysheeple.com/digital-terrorists-and-cyberbullies-this-cnn-clip-shows-the-propaganda-push-to-demonize-all-anonymous-and-free-speech-on-the-web_032015

    “A few snippets that stood out right away:

    “…grappling with the issue in terms of hate speech…”

    “…there’s an issue when people can say things anonymously…”

    “The real crisis right now… when you have some of the other companies that allow for encrypted conversations between individuals uh, without, uh, the opportunity for law enforcement or intelligence to know how a communication goes…”

    Abraham goes on to say it is because we’ve seen that people go from Twitter to talking with ISIS soldiers that no one should have any privacy on the Internet… and that’s just in the first minute or so of the clip. He advocates companies taking away all capability for private communications and anonymous speech.

    • saveNZ 5.1

      Scary stuff.

      Someone told me once that people who do not trust themselves are not capable of trusting others.

      The other problem is that the people making these statements often are not tech users. They are old foggies with too much power, too many minions, and too much time to try to control everything.

      Funny they want privacy for their own offences but want to spy on everyone else to make sure they are not being caught out and to black mail and influence others.

      All of which are criminal offences.

      It’s a problems when our own governments become the criminals.

      • Colonial Rawshark 5.1.1

        Yep. The power elite want to know everything about you and everything that you do, as you do it.

        And they want you to know nothing about them, because “national security.”

  6. joe90 6

    Organised crime extorts money from the poor.

    According to whistleblower Nicholas Wilson, HSBC has been integrally involved in a fraudulent scheme to illegally overcharge British shoppers in arrears for debt on store cards at leading British high-street retailers. Without knowing, hundreds of thousands of Britons have been defrauded of a total of one billion pounds worth of money, reveals Wilson, a former debt recovery specialist who uncovered the crimes.

    https://medium.com/@NafeezAhmed/death-drugs-and-hsbc-355ed9ef5316

    btw, as with most successful criminals the bankers probably avoid prosecution the old fashioned way…….

    https://www.emptywheel.net/2015/03/21/have-the-banks-escaped-criminal-prosecution-because-theyre-spying-surrogates/

    • greywarshark 6.1

      I thought it interesting that I owed $8 to one department store, which I have dealt with for years and paid properly. But I knew there was another purchase coming into next month’s statement, held back and didn’t pay the $8 and they sent me a warning letter and charged me $15 for it. What a scam. What a waste of time, paper and my money. And they charge interest on balances anyway.

      • Murray Rawshark 6.1.1

        A shop would lose my business for that. It’s the only way they’ll learn.

      • Colonial Rawshark 6.1.2

        didn’t pay the $8 and they sent me a warning letter and charged me $15 for it. What a scam.

        well, it’s extortionate loan sharking at an approximately 1200% p.a. interest rate. Basically the fuckers have decided that they are in the business of fining customers for profit.

        • greywarshark 6.1.2.1

          Well they actually sent me a physical letter. So there was a cost for the item. But it was unnecessary. And they charge extortionate interest anyway.

      • Colonial Rawshark 6.1.3

        deleted – double comment

  7. veutoviper 7

    I just cannot resist reposting this Twitter thread with a wonderful picture of the National Northland candidate. It would make a great Caption Competition.

    Background to the photo is here.

    http://t.co/2InhGhZ5rw

    For balance, Felix Marwick also posted this picture of Winston.

    • Murray Rawshark 7.1

      That’s the sort of balance I approve of. The stupid looking drongo Tory vs the suave and charming sort of Tory.

    • saveNZ 7.2

      @Veutoviper

      Great links. Yes I think the Nats would love to get us back to Roman times, slavery, feasting, unbridled power.

      Love the comment about Winston – “the bachelor”.

      The juxtaposition is great, roman slob, vs, the bachelor

    • miravox 7.3

      2nd link to the ‘tall poppy’ (oh how I hate that phrase) business awards –

      There were no entries in the manufacturing and primary category.

      I reckon that signifies Northland’s economic state right there.

      • veutoviper 7.3.1

        Thanks for pointing that out – I had not noticed that. Say it all really ….

  8. ScottGN 8

    Even the Herald feels obliged to call out Bill English on the total bullshit spin lines he’s trotted out after the Sallies pretty much bulldozed his half-baked plans for social housing.
    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/politics/news/article.cfm?c_id=280&objectid=11421893

    • Olwyn 8.1

      I was surprised when I came to the conclusion of that article to find that I was not being lead into a “reasonable” plug for the developers. The NZH can occasionally surprise. Here is the profile of one of HNZ’s consultants with regard to implementing their plan, who does not, prima facie, appear to fit the “improving things for the clients” claim.

      http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11418202

      • Murray Rawshark 8.1.1

        It makes me sick that government departments employ crooks like McKenna. He belongs in prison, not in a high paying job. The MPI is the same, with ex-army sex offenders.

        • Olwyn 8.1.1.1

          I agree, especially with regard to the capacity in which he is employed – like a fox being employed to design chicken coops.

  9. Adrian 9

    Nice one, vv. There’s a scoutmaster if I ever saw one.

  10. greywarshark 10

    Did someone else hear Mike Williams have a go at Mike Lee at the end of Radionz slot with Matt and Mike yesterday? If he did something that turned out to be a mistake, I would think that it was an urgent measure at the time because of the chaos created by the privatisation and trough-trampling excitement of the financial pigs of that time.

    I didn’t think that Mike Lee should be painted as an ogre. I haven’t time to look it all up. But the barb from Mike Williams gave me a pain.

  11. Pasupial 11

    I’ve been following this story of late, as it has the potential to be a real nightmare for the EU. The sums involved would only scratch the surface of the Greek debt, but would open Germany up to claims from all other occupied nations:

    Greece’s leftwing prime minister Alexis Tsipras stood beside German leader Angela Merkel and demanded war reparations over Nazi atrocities in Greece on Monday night… It was believed to be the first time a foreign leader had gone to the capital of the reunified Germany to make such a demand.

    Merkel was uncompromising, while appearing uncomfortable and irritated. “In the view of the German government, the issue of reparations is politically and legally closed,” she said.

    http://www.theguardian.com/business/2015/mar/23/tsipras-raises-nazi-war-reparations-claim-at-berlin-press-conference-with-merkel

    Of course it is not just about the German government’s legal opinion. If this ends up going to an international court; Greece does have a real case (for repayment of forced loans as well reparations for war crimes). Past cases have been deferred on the basis on Germany not then being reunified, and nominal payments which Germany chooses to view as being final; though an impartial court might not agree.

    • Murray Rawshark 11.1

      West Germany paid substantial reparations to the state of Israel. Much of the infrastructure that allows them to carry out fascistic activities against Palestinians was built with money from reparations for fascistic activities against Jews. But then, Israel always gets treated as a special case.

      • Colonial Rawshark 11.1.1

        The Germans killed 26M Russians in WWII.

        Think about that compensation case…

        • Pasupial 11.1.1.1

          I’m sure that Tsipras will be discussing this with Putin next month:

          Tsipras, it has been announced, is to visit Russia on 8 April – exactly a month before he had been expected to go to Moscow.

          The original plan had been for him to attach bilateral meetings to his attendance at the Kremlin’s second world war Victory Day celebrations on 8 May. Tsipras may well go to Moscow for the festivities in May – another occasion that could underline the distance between Germany and Greece, as Chancellor Angela Merkel has already said she will sit this particular jamboree out.

          As to why Tsipras’s visit to Moscow has been brought forward, there should be little mystery there. He will meet President Vladimir Putin just weeks before the money from Brussels is due to run out. There have been reports that Russia has offered, or could offer, a bailout if the European Union declines. Both in the timing of the trip and its presumed purpose, Greece is saying to Europe, and specifically to Germany: be careful, Athens has a choice.

          http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/mar/23/greece-russia-putin-eu-orthodox-bloc-alexis-tsipras

          Though the phrase; “out of the frying pan and into the fire”, would seem to apply here.

          • Kiwiri - Raided of the Last Shark 11.1.1.1.1

            And on that note, from Russia:

            Russian Parliament Set to Request €4 Trillion in WWII Reparations From Germany

            2/3/15 at 12:58 PM

            Extracts:

            “Practically, Germany paid nothing to the USSR for its wave of destruction and savagery during the Second World War,” said Degyaterov.

            “After the Yalta convention the USSR took back some German assets – largely looted furniture, clothes and industrial equipment, as well as some spoils of war – but largely there was no compensation of the war’s economic blow to the USSR,” Degyaterov added.

            The Russian MP expressed his hope that other countries will join the ranks of his task force and request reimbursement from Germany, extending an open invite to willing representatives of Belarus, Ukraine and other former Soviet republics.

            The chairman of the Russian parliament’s defence committee, admiral Vladimir Komoedov has applauded Degtyarev’s initiative, lamenting the loss of “human capital” to the Soviet union as a result of the war.

            “It is no secret that if there had not been a war, the Russian population would be 300-400 million today and we would be in a completely different economic condition,” Komoedov said.

            http://www.newsweek.com/russian-parliament-set-request-eu4-trillion-wwii-reparations-germany-304163

            • Colonial Rawshark 11.1.1.1.1.1

              As I recall, after WWII the Soviets did end up “borrowing” a large part of Berlin and its surrounds for extended USSR use. That would have to be factored in.

  12. Karen 12

    Interesting post from Bryan Bruce this morning on supporting Winston. The Nats are obviously in panic mode as they had a GDP graph from his post removed as it was “their” property.
    http://bryanbruce.co.nz/feature/ethics-values/importance-voting-winston

    • Kiwiri - Raided of the Last Shark 12.1

      Andrew Little did well this morning on Radio NZ, speaking straight up, being realistic, referring to the polls, and chuckling, while making the airtime go a long way.

      • greywarshark 12.1.1

        I heard part of that. Suzie was pressing Andrew Little and doing a good job of that and he remained cool answered the questions, made his points, sounded like a straight-up, balanced man that one could believe. I think he sounded very good.

  13. felix 13

    List of questions for Question Time today: http://www.parliament.nz/en-nz/pb/business/qoa/00HOH_OralQuestions/list-of-questions-for-oral-answer

    Looking at questions 2 & 3, and at questions 8 & 11, it seems to me that Labour and the Greens could be doing more co-ordination beforehand. They’ve essentially wasted two questions between them.

    • Kiwiri - Raided of the Last Shark 13.1

      +1

      And, for the future, including NZ First as well.

      • felix 13.1.1

        Yep. Got to be able to work together in opposition if they’re going to work together in govt

        • Colonial Rawshark 13.1.1.1

          Certainly that’s what the public thinks. Dunno if its sunk into the heads of the Labour caucus and their staffers yet. After 2 decades of MMP.

  14. Philip Ferguson 14

    The Netanyahu victory is another nail in the coffin of a two-state ‘solution’.

    It’s interesting that colonial powers are usually prepared to make *political* concessions – ending of apartheid in South Africa; ending of the pattern of anti-Catholic/nationalist discrimination in the north of Ireland, and incorporation of the once supposedly dangerous ‘terrorists’ (ANC/MK, IRA/SF) into the reworked political power structure. The Israeli ruling elite, however, or certainly its dominant elements – preferred to destroy Arafat, after all he’d done for them, and destroy any possibility of a two-state solution.

    I always supported a one-state solution – the dismantling of the Zionist state and the creation of a new society free of discrimination against either Jew or Palestinian – and I’m not surprised that the Israeli ruling elite have opted for the Greater Israel ‘solution’, but the contrast with what other oppressing powers have done is quite stark.

    https://rdln.wordpress.com/2011/09/09/is-there-a-two-state-solution-to-israel-palestinian-conflict-2/

    Phil

    • saveNZ 14.1

      @Phillip

      That’s what happens when the ‘crazies’ control the message. They just keep getting elected, spinning every dial they can get away with and more.

      What’s going to happen when someone finally says ‘NO” and Netanyahu has nuclear weapons?

      +1

      • Colonial Rawshark 14.1.1

        When recent heads of the Shin Bet and Mossad say that the Israeli Government is on the wrong track, people better start paying attention.

    • swordfish 14.2

      As I argued in a comment on The Daily Blog yesterday, Israel’s always been the rejectionist party in the so-called Peace Process and that’s largely because it has no incentive to obey International Law. It enjoys an almost entirely cost-free Occupation of Palestinian Territory.

      The EU pays the bills in the West Bank, the Palestinian Authority does the dirty work for Israel (providing “security” for their occupiers) and, of course, the US fully protects Israel diplomatically at the UN and other international forums while also providing massive financial and military support.

      Israel gets to have their cake and eat it too.

      Which is why boycotts and sanctions need to be part of the solution. The only way to push Israeli elites (and the wider population) towards fulfilling their obligations under International Law (full withdrawal to June 67 border / Just resolution of the Refugee Question) is to make the State of Israel pay the price. A brutal, illegal occupation that’s been going on for nigh on half a century. It’s utterly insane.

      • Murray Rawshark 14.2.1

        Yes. I won’t buy Israeli products and I refuse to have anything to do with Israeli universities or Israeli science foundations. I have had invitations but I turn them down automatically.

  15. felix 15

    Bill English in parliament thinks it’s an outrage that single people are living in two-bedroom state housing.

    God forbid that anyone should have a spare room for their kids/friends to stay in when they visit. God forbid anyone should have a spare room for a hobby. God forbid anyone should have a spare room for studying.

    And before you dicks get on your high horses about the cost, this is from the man who bills the taxpayer for the rent he charges himself for living in his own house.

    • Karen 15.1

      Not to mention having somewhere for grandkids to stay during the school holidays.

      This government is unbelievably mean spirited with absolutely no concept of the value of supporting families and communities.

    • Kiwiri - Raided of the Last Shark 15.2

      How many rooms are there in that taxpayer-sponsored mansion in Karori?

  16. fisiani 16

    Black Caps into the World Cup Final. Amazing what happens with a National government.

    • Murray Rawshark 16.1

      And Sabin into…..oops, can’t say. Truly amazing.

      • gsays 16.1.1

        hi murray, how do you know you cant say anything?

        ive made this point before, if all details are suppressed, how does anyone know they cant talk about sabin?

        it reeks of catch 22.

        do we all meekly do what we think we are supposed to do?

        and well done the kiwi cricket team. a tad tense for my liking but it will do.
        congrats to de villiers and his team for playing aggressively and in great spirit.

        • felix 16.1.1.1

          I agree, as far as I know nobody has said we can’t talk about Sabin. There is no way they possibly could.

        • Murray Rawshark 16.1.1.2

          I agree with your point, but this is lprent’s blog and I follow his lead here. I say plenty in other places. This is the most disgusting thing I can remember happening in Aotearoa since the invasion of the Urewera. If something like that happened under Key, the details would probably be suppressed as well.

          If I were in Northland I’d probably put up a few posters.

          • gsays 16.1.1.2.1

            hi murray and felix, yes i accept that as this is someones blog, it’s their rules.

            where is the courage from other members of the wider media; websites, community papers etc.

            i would like the suppression order explained.
            this can be done without sordid details or alluding to anyone.

    • Lanthanide 16.2

      “Amazing what happens with a National government.”

      Yep, they and their acolytes keep trying to take credit for every good thing that happens in the country regardless of how irrelevant the government is to those outcomes, while ignoring the mountain of bad shit they’re directly responsible for.

    • Olwyn 16.3

      What an odd way for a Tory to celebrate a win at cricket – to drop by here and gloat, as if the game was actually won by a man who finds hammering in a nail challenging. Haven’t you got any Tory mates to clink glasses with?

    • millsy 16.4

      I didn’t know that the government had nationalized (no pun intended) the New Zealand cricket team.

      But good on the Black Caps. Only a few years ago they would have capitulated in a situation like this, but they dug deep and made it home.

      Imagine the contrast with the disastrous centenary season 20 years ago, where, despite being a world beating side on paper, and thanks to infighting, the team was completely taken apart each time it set foot on the cricket field.

      And Daniel Luca Vettori, a man who made his debut at the Basin Reserve v England, in a team struggling to recover from the blows of that season, and can now end his playing career on a high — a World Cup final

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