For sure, kids were buzzing out this morning when explained that both vessels were built in NZ and one of them looked puzzled when told Oracle had Aussies on board.
It’s the engineering that buzzes me out, the harnessing of natural energy.
So you don’t care about child poverty.
I would love the Labour Party to come out and offer a socialist alternative. Then like Corbyn the Labour Party would rise to 45.
For the many, not the few.
So Ed, Paul you don’t care about climate change because you care about child poverty, most people can care about more than one thing, is this to difficult for you to grasp likewise many people believe child poverty is better solved through other means than socialism, that does not mean you dont care about child poverty but is a typical arrogant and sanctimonious attack strategy of LWNJ
A bit too far before. Still, maybe Bingles can call in a favour and get a nationwide tour of sports trophies going with spontaneous parades thrown in, a bit nearer election time.
I am conflicted about the America’s Cup. On the one hand, it is completely over hyped here, a perfect case study in the white middle class echo chamber that is our news and current affairs in NZ.
Yet on the other hand, it is an impressive triumph of NZ high technology. Don’t forget Oracle is backed by a Silicon valley billionaire, and have the likes of Airbus Industries doing their aerodynamics. Money is no problem for a team backed by one of a superpower’s richest men using all the most high tech companies in the Western world.
TNZ has taken on this technology and beaten it, and I would much prefer it if our image was this sort of technology (along with Rocket Lab) than one of being sleepy hobbits in middle earth tending polluting dairy farms.
TNZ has taken on this technology and beaten it, and I would much prefer it if our image was this sort of technology (along with Rocket Lab) than one of being sleepy hobbits in middle earth tending polluting dairy farms.
…much prefer it if our image was this sort of technology (along with Rocket Lab) than one of being sleepy hobbits in middle earth tending polluting dairy farms.
Fuck, yes. Still can’t bear to watch rich people’s hobbies being made the centre of a jingoistic spectacle on the news though. It’s worse than golf.
I go along with that, and as Sanctuary said, we should be promoting that. I have had the privilege over the years to work with some mighty clever engineers, graduates of our universities so I am not surprised we have taken on Silicon Valley and beating them.
Just one wish as a sailing nut I would like to see this “boat” race, if you could call it that, get back to some traditional racing sailing boats as this is not sailing as far I am concered, Fuck it is more like a cycle race on the water.
“Ooching and pumping should never have been banned in the first place.
The rules were changed to prevent more active sailing, because athletic young sailors were using it, to beat old farts sitting in their boats like potato sacks.
– A universal student allowance
– Major programme of sealing unsealed rural roads
– Properly invest in rail to give it a much bigger role in the regional economy
– 25% of government royalties for mining, petroleum, and water to stay in the region of origin. Specifically singles out Coca Cola, Suntory, Oravida, and Fiji Water
yes but if they are down the bottom of the list it doesn’t matter, not so when they are near the top , i know nat voters who are thinking of changing due to bennet being 2ic
Little was quick to jump on National for not having any new policy, saying the party was out of ideas and out of steam.
However, after 9 long years in opposition (and with less than 3 months till the election) Labour’s own policy page is looking rather bare.
Last election Labour had a radical Kiwisaver plan, which with being compulsory along with the uncapped variable saving rate, created a bit of voter unease. Yet with less than 3 months till the election, voters are still unclear if Labour have now dropped that policy?
When will Labour present their full policy package?
It’s a bit rich slamming National for running out of steam and new ideas when Labour itself currently has little on offer.
If you don’t know what Labour’s policies already released are, that’s on you. It’s normal for political parties to release policy over time. Labour’s 2014 Kiwisaver policy was announced at about this time in the election cycle. But by all means don’t let reality get in the way of your need to say Labour are shit.
“If you don’t know what Labour’s policies already released are, that’s on you.”
You seem to be confused. It’s not that I don’t know what Labour’s policies already released are, it’s that the cupboard is looking rather bare. Moreover, a number of them fall short.
“Labour’s 2014 Kiwisaver policy was announced at about this time in the election cycle.”
Implying we can expect their 2017 Kiwisaver policy soon?
It’s not that Labour are “shit ” but they clearly aren’t at the peak of their game.
These sort of forums can help build consensus among supporters giving the party a better indication of our expectations.
I think Labour should be doing more to win and that of course includes having a full policy package that will widely resonate, thus help build their support.
It seems you disagree. So lets see what others have to say.
My position is that at this point in the election cycle we need to support parties to do the right thing, not bash them or undermine them. This doesn’t mean we can’t critique them, it means that we criticise constructively.
You appear to think that constant negative criticism will make them better but I don’t know many people that respond well to that. Mostly I think that some people will read all the Labour bashing and either not vote or vote NZF or Mana or TOP in protest because they’ve been assured that Labour are useless. That shit will lose us a tight election. Or lessen the chance of Labour/Greens governing without NZF.
“My position is that at this point in the election cycle we need to support parties to do the right thing”
Great! Do you believe not having a full policy package at this point of the election cycle is doing the right thing? And do you deem someone who is asking about that as someone bashing Labour?
I highlighted Labour’s own policy page is looking rather bare. That last election Labour had a radical Kiwisaver plan which created a bit of voter unease, thus suggesting the unease remains as it’s still unclear. And finished with pointing out how Labour came across.
Do you find that to be too harsh? Can we not have that kind of discussion on here?
The Chairman
Instead of shafting Labour for not having a full policy package – that you agree with – why don’t you make a list of policies that you think are necessary? Do some work yourself instead of the lazy NZ thing of just sniping from the sidelines at the people engaging in the action.
Let’s have a discussion about what you and we would like and start asking Labour what they are going to do about each one as a separate enquiry so they have to concentrate.
And if you think that lazy NZs doesn’t apply to you, then ignore that and give us the list. There is too much time spent getting up each other’s nose at present. There is no time for that now.
First off, I’m not shafting Labour for not having a full policy package that I agree with. I was highlighting they don’t have a full policy package.
As for making a list, I’ve put forward policy proposals for discussion on here before, but it isn’t just up to me. This is something we can all participate in. But to keep it simple I’d suggest we stick to one at a time.
Moreover, at this stage we’ve yet to establish if there is a consensus for Labour to present and run with a fully policy package.
Therefore, instead of you sniping from the sidelines at me, why don’t you participate in the discussion and tell us where you stand on Labour having a full policy package?
“Do you believe not having a full policy package at this point of the election cycle is doing the right thing?”
I think in terms of organisation that they are doing the best they can (mostly), and that they know a shit load more about what will work than you or I do. Would I like more policy? Of course, but you can’t get blood out of a stone. I don’t believe they are twiddling their thumbs or ignorant of process.
“And do you deem someone who is asking about that as someone bashing Labour?”
No. I deem someone who puts the boot in every chance they get to be bashing Labour.
I wasn’t playing the ‘poor me’ card. Merely highlighting McFlock’s intent. Rather than solely discuss the topic at hand (Labour’s policy) McFlock is intent on attacking me.
Disappointingly, you agreeing with McFlock plays into that (making me the topic).
“I think in terms of organisation that they are doing the best they can (mostly), and that they know a shit load more about what will work than you or I do.”
In terms of organisation it’s clear they aren’t doing the best they can. They had more policies last election, hence showing they are capable of doing more.
“Would I like more policy? Of course, but you can’t get blood out of a stone. I don’t believe they are twiddling their thumbs or ignorant of process”
Great, you agree. However, if you don’t believe they are twiddling their thumbs or ignorant of process what do you believe the hold up is?
The election is only months away and they must give time for the policy to get out there (having people talk and come to terms with it) thus time for momentum to build. So while they may know a shit load more about what will work than you or I do, why do you think this is being overlooked or dropped?
I’ll tell you what another pitfall is in not having a full policy page, it comes across as if they have something to hide.
“No. I deem someone who puts the boot in every chance they get to be bashing Labour.”
So this line of questioning is alright, yet you also seem to be implying I’m bashing Labour? Excuse me for being confused.
You also gripe on about negative criticism opposed to constructive criticism but failed to clarify if you believe what I’ve initially stated was too harsh?
“These sort of forums” can also be used by beige concern trolls to focus attention on perceived motes in Labour’s eye while ignoring the massive planks in National’s.
I wouldn’t mind it if you actually had a fucking point, but no, you’re all about the disingeuous question followed by the passive-aggressive barb. BM’s a cock, but they’re still more useful and entertaining than you.
I don’t care what you “expect”, or what vapid tautologies you want to put out instead of actual political insight. A full policy package that widely resonates will build support, you say? That’s fucking amazing, you’re a political genius.
Do you think the most important bit for a manifesto to gain support is being “full” or merely “resonating”? I suspect it’s the “resonate” bit. Clean water, healthy homes, regional development, all good solid stuff. Of course, none of this will “resonate” with you because you’re not the voter equivalent of a bell, more like a small beige pile of crap. Any clapper that comes in contact with you will simply produce a soft “splat” and get covered in shit.
You almost never offer a specific opinion, and even when you do it’s as vague as possible: you want a full policy manifesto, for example, but what would you want to put in it? Way to avoid the issues, dude.
You’re nothing but air and concerns. How is wanting you to actually make a decent point and actually contribute to discussions “trying to shut [you] up”? It’s not. It’s the opposite: make a point, share a strong but reasoned position. You’re terrified of showing an opinion, and you suck everyone else’s ideas and attention with your “concerns”.
“Just because I air my concerns doesn’t make me a troll.
Effectively, you’re trying to shut me up.”
Have to agree with McFlock here. Playing ‘poor me’ won’t go down well. Nor does continually reframing the criticism of your incessant negativity as ‘airing concerns’ make for genuine dialogue.
The more you do that shit, the more troll-like you become.
“You almost never offer a specific opinion, and even when you do it’s as vague as possible…”
I put forward opinions and answer questions, but that is you attempting to make the discussion about me again.
“You’re nothing but air and concerns. How is wanting you to actually make a decent point and actually contribute to discussions “trying to shut [you] up”? “
If you genuinely want to have a decent discussion, lets see if you can refrain from taking personal pot shots. In others words, play the ball and not the man.
Before we go filling the policy void, lets see if we can obtain a consensus on whether or not they should run with a full policy package?
I’ve already put forward a number of reasons why they should. So if you disagree, lets here why?
“Do you think the most important bit for a manifesto to gain support is being “full” or merely “resonating?”
A full policy package allows voters to see the larger picture of where Labour stand. So it’s important. But so to is having policy that widely resonates. Therefore, attempting to have both should be the goal.
And while a number of their policies are OK, polls indicate there not resonating wide enough. Hence why I’ve been advocating for more to be done.
There’s enough evidence in political science that most people do not vote according to policy. Publish all you want (as Lab did in 2014) but it will not win an election.
Does that mean that having no policy or having crap policy won’t diminish chances? I would have thought that for LW parties at least that while not sufficient, good policy was a prerequisite (which is different to what you are saying I know).
People vote on confidence. Apparently policy plays a very small part in that for non-wonks. We are not a reporesentative crowd.
The best I heard it explained is: watch a politician on TV with the sound turned off. That’s what people are voting on. Hence it causes way more damage for Bill English to have Hilary Barry interacting in a clearly ‘WTF?!’ way than any amount of detailed figures about tax promises, hip operations or ‘affordable’ houses.
Helps explain why an unflappable sociopath like Key prospered so well.
“When will Labour present their full policy package?”
More to the point, WHEN will National present their full policy package? If remember correctly also at the last election there was none, just vague talk about “tax cuts”. They put all their energy into destroying Cunliffe (my, wasn’t people sucked in with all that being a man bullshit) aided by crap lying journalist’s like Armstrong and Gower.
Or it could be an old fashioned tribal power grab.
When Mohammed bin Salman was just 12 he began sitting in on meetings led by his father Salman, the then governor of Saudi Arabia’s Riyadh Province. Some 17 years later, at 29 and already the world’s youngest defence minister, he plunged his country into a brutal war in Yemen with no end in sight.
Now the kingdom of Saudi Arabia is jousting dangerously with its regional foe Iran, led by a man seemingly in a big hurry to become the Middle East’s most powerful leader.
If you are been recorded at work, is the employer obliged to inform you?
By this I mean camera in chiller or over till.
Do they have to inform you in writing?
I’m not really current with that, but they never used to. As long as it didn’t get audio or up your skirt / down your top it was fine, criminal law-wise. Dunno how it goes with the employment relationship. Check it out with your union rep (even if you’re not a member, check it out with a union).
Being recorded at work goes right to the heart of “good faith” in an employment relationship.
From the Employment Relations Act 2000
(4)(1A)The duty of good faith in subsection (1)—
(a) is wider in scope than the implied mutual obligations of trust and confidence; and
(b) requires the parties to an employment relationship to be active and constructive in establishing and maintaining a productive employment relationship in which the parties are, among other things, responsive and communicative; and
(c) without limiting paragraph (b), requires an employer who is proposing to make a decision that will, or is likely to, have an adverse effect on the continuation of employment of 1 or more of his or her employees to provide to the employees affected—
(i) access to information, relevant to the continuation of the employees’ employment, about the decision; and
(ii) an opportunity to comment on the information to their employer before the decision is made.
So if the employer is engaging in covert recording, its unlikely to be “establishing and maintaining a productive employment relationship” and is also likely to be contrary to the “mutual obligations of trust and confidence”
So in other words, if you know you’re being recorded, and that there’s a legitimate business reason for it (stock theft, money disappearing etc) then it’s unlikely to be an issue.
If you are aware that cameras have suddenly been installed, and no reason given for it, then it’s likely to be a lack of good faith.
Who is your union? You could always contact the CTU if you’re not getting any response from your union.
thank you james.
i am entering the 4th month with new employer in hospitality.
i assume, after a little googling, etu is the union to join.
the reference i made earlier, was to unite, left a couple of fone messages and e-mail. it turns out they cover fast food workers, not restaurant staff.
am waiting to renegotiate my contract as am out of the first 90 days, and employer assured me at start of contract we would revisit the contract after 3 months.
I negotiated every 2nd weekend off, 3 month contract review and a couple of other small details and shook hands.
Boss has gone back on the 2nd weekend of a few times.
This why I want to get new contract and get this stuff in writing this time.
Irks me as I have more than honoured my end of the deal and offered systems, recipes and a few cost cutting ideas.
I realise word is no longer bond.
Unfortunately that is the way these days. Can’t trust anyone to honour their word. Hard life lessons especially when it comes to employment matters.
You make it sound like there wasn’t a contract written in the first place? Forgive my imprudence, but I wonder why you signed a written agreement (if there was one) that didn’t include what had been negotiated?
If there’s no written agreement, that’s illegal and is something you should raise with the Labour Inspectorate.
There is a fairly generic contract, several pages. Blanks where position and wages are entered.
The boo boo I made was to not take it home and sleep on the decision and pencil in what was talked about.
Both the business owners are decent people.
Food budget blow outs, financial pressure has caused them to make cuts and as we all know, wages (hours) are a great place to start.
As you say and I am finding not everyone takes their word as seriously as I do.
The media seems to have lost interest in the intern issue for now, too busy chasing English (he keeps feeding them daily stories).
There are still important issues on the interns that Andrew Little wasn’t open and honest about on Q+A yesterday. He said “people closely associated with the Labour Party were involved without approval or authority or any mandate they went ahead and did stuff” and did nothing? He claims to have only acted last Monday as if it was the moral thing to do – acting on minor complaints from some interns.
It looks like Little is avoiding being honest while questioning English’s integrity.
How much did he really know about scheme? Did he quietly approve but is now distancing himself? He must have had contact with Mccarften who was supposedly running Little’s outreach programme in Auckland.
If Little didn’t do anything even though he knew an unauthorised scheme was being run how much of a disconnect is there between the Labour leadership and head office in Wellington, and at least part of Auckland Labour including MPs who seem to have been actively involved?
double yawn. This is the man who thought that Dickson and co were equalling responsible for what’s gone down with National as Barclay and the senior Nats who lied and covered up. He wouldn’t know integrity if came gift-wrapped in beige.
That’s a cop out. You alleged something, it’s false, you have made no attempt to substantiate it, and are diverting from withdrawing it.
Is making an allegation and then when called out on it demanding someone prove otherwise acceptable conduct here now?
What I might say now has no bearing on what you based your allegation on. You made something up. You mentioned integrity in the same comment. Do you have any?
Fantastic. In the absence of you telling us what your actual position is, I’ll assume I was pretty close to the mark when I said you believe that Dickson and co are just as responsible as the National party liars and people doing the covering up.
And mate, I’ve got years of time on this site of backing up my statements and engaging honestly so I think I’ll let that stand as a sign of my integrity. You don’t like my opinion of your politics? Tough shit. I suggest you start being honest about what they are and then you might get some respect from me (probably still won’t respect the politics though).
hi pete, if you are trying to start a fire that has gone out, you need dry kindling and some decent fuel.
witness prime minister and his constant stoking of the blaze.
(no need for bellows and petrol as used by PM in the clutha debarclay)
“There’s not doubt that Bill English stumbled and fudged, and Barclay did some stupid things over a period of time, but those involved in the employment dispute, making complaints and going to the media are not beyond criticism either.”
So having read the link I actually think that Weka’s summary is a pretty good summary of what you wrote. Sure you never said [i]”that Dickson and co were equaling responsible for what’s gone down with National as Barclay and the senior Nats who lied and covered up.”[/i] but the whole article is best summed up by that statement. I mean if that wasn’t your intent, why were you quoting remarks from people calling Dickson horrible names, especially with apparently no commentary on why those remarks were made or anything around the circumstances…
Also I do like that you try to pretend you are non-biased and comment on political issues rationally; but you post a lot about attacking Labour and on how National’s faux pas are not really that bad, and there are other factors, and… blah blah blah
Good summation there. That’s how I remembered his post too.
PG disingenuous as always, and still won’t say what he thinks about the relative responsibilities of Dickson and co compared to the National Party liars.
I actually don’t know. I don’t have inside information, I only observe from the outside. Do you have inside information? If not how do you judge the relative responsibilities right now (not last year).
What would you say if a Dirty Politics type campaign was under way designed to bring down the Prime Minister? Would that worry you? Or if it’s only a National PM wouldn’t it matter to you?
Depends on what you mean by Dirty Politics, because I’ve seen you in the past define that as people being mean to each other.
I’ve watched Dickson being interviewed. It’s true she could be a very cunning woman who presents herself as principled but is in fact as nasty and unscrupulous as the PM, Barclay and the board. But I doubt it, she came across as genuine in her manner, her choice of words and restraint, and in the story she told. Beyond the party politics she looks like she is telling the truth. Which doesn’t mean that people didn’t organise to make certain things happen, but I don’t get the sense of her or the other locals as being out and out liars. I also trust Reid as a journalist. Then there is the whole he said/she said aspect, and that one is easy. Barclay has blatantly lied multiple times, so I’m going to take her word over his.
And so on. No need for inside information. That level was up to the National Party board and they fucked that up majorly. I generally trust people at a basic level until they prove otherwise. English and Barclay are now proven liars, the board have shown themselves to be unprincipled. Some of those people have broken the law. I’ve yet to see anything that shows that Dickson or Davie or the other locals who tried to get things sorted out have done anything other than do the right thing, and certainly nothing even close to what Nats have done.
Feel free to present some evidence otherwise, but in the absence of that I’ll also guess that your centrism stops you from condemning National to the extent they deserve and you look around to see if the others were evil too and then do a cop out by saying you don’t know enough to judge when to everyone else it’s blatant.
Do you have inside information? If not how do you judge the relative responsibilities right now (not last year).
Relative responsibilities are easy to judge: did someone make a secret recording, pay someone hush money about the secret recording, or otherwise pressure that person to not pursue a criminal act?
yes -> they bear some responsibility for the crime or its cover-up
no -> no responsibility is theirs.
It’s actually pretty simple. There might be wider systemic issues at play, but at the end of the day responsibility goes to the perpetrator, not the victim.
Lol, Pete you ask me what appears to be a genuine question, I answer it at length, you side steps all that, and now try to make out that in 2014 you didn’t run the same shit minimising lines about Dirty Politics as you’re running now about the Barclay affair. And how Labour does it too, and how saying horrible things about someone is Dirty Politics. FFS, it’s all there on record on TS, and many people here remember that about you because it went on for a long time. You really are a numpty of the highest order.
We get the media we deserve. Whatever is clicking well on the Herald’s front page, that’s what we’ll get. After a few more than 1 intern were interviewed the slave/slum story was revealed for the all smoke and no fire beat-up it is.
The Todd thing won’t go away because it keeps generating fresh headlines. With more probing, fresh deception keeps popping up. The media are loving it, it’s a front-page headline factory.
“It looks like Little is avoiding being honest while questioning English’s integrity.”
This is a concern I was pointing out to weka the other day. It was good that Little has fronted on this, however it looks as if it’s starting to unravel, which could result in Labour digging a larger hole.
In this case though Little has claimed the moral high ground stepping and dealing with problems as soon as they arose – but avoiding explaining how much he knew about the scheme and when he knew, and also trying to minimise the party’s involvement when it appears to have been a full on campaign scheme for Auckland Labour.
There was either a major disconnect between Auckland and Wellington, or they are fine with working independently, or Little is not admitting greater involvement.
The fellowship was called the 2017 Labour campaign fellowship, thus as it was using the Labour name it’s something the party should have kept tabs upon.
The failure of which would explain Little’s embarrassment.
When some-one “leaves the farm”, there’s not too much you can do about it, aye?
In the interview, Little states that the Labour Fellowship Programme was run without authority or approval. He basically acknowledges that the party was blindsided – that shit was done in their name without their knowledge.
As far as I can figure, McCarten and (from a post he did on TDB) Bradbury were the idiots who (I assume) thought they could manufacture a Corbyn/Sanders type thing in NZ by the simple act of enlisting volunteers who’d be enthusiasts of Sanders/Corbyn.
From reading the Bomber piece and a rudimentary “planning” doc that was released by (I think) Newshub, the whole thing strikes me as fucking madness slathered in deceit.
Will it hurt Labour in the media? Possibly. But much less than it could if they just continue to be up front. Will it hurt them financially? Yup.
Will a couple of arse-hole authoritarian leftists disappear forever? I’m very hopeful on that front 🙂
I can’t imagine anyone wanting to touch McCarten with a barge-pole after this (assuming I’m reading the whole debacle correctly).
As for Bomber (and by association TDB), how much can you shred credibility before there’s nothing left to shred? Would you willfully associate yourself or your writing with a site run by a person with no credibility?
Well I try not to go there unless I see something interesting. There are still people writing there who I respect. And let’s not forget that TS has some reputation problems of its own 😉
I’ve had dealings with Matt McCarten in the past, so yeah, I have “got a fucken clue about that man”. And I know this isn’t a popular position to have, but I’ve no regard for him.
Rush to his defence if you must. (I don’t really care). Fact is, he just got disembarked, but not before he willfully or otherwise threw a fucking firework into the ship’s magazine.
“He basically acknowledges that the party was blindsided”
Indeed.
Will it hurt Labour? Some damage has already been done, yet it’s too early to fully gauge. As for whether it will do more damage, that depends on what more (if anything) comes out.
“He basically acknowledges that the party was blindsided – that shit was done in their name without their knowledge.’
Except that Little has said he knew about it: “This started out as an idea at the beginning of the year. I certainly became aware of it, um when it was raised with me.”
And he knew more about it: …”people closely associated with the Labour Party were involved. Without without approval or authority or any mandate they went ahead and did stuff.”
But then “The next I became aware was about May this year when the party was getting messages from students about to arr… within days of arriving, um, ah, the party stepped in straight away to people associated with it saying what is going on, there’s no approval for this, this is not the party thing.”
Does he expect us to believe that he discovered details of an unauthorised scheme in May, but did nothing about it until interns started complaining publicly last week?
Little isn’t being up front about what knowledge he had, and when he knew about things.
Cosgrove seems to have been on message for Labour on Newstalk ZB today:
” Oh well as I understand Matt McCarten, who used to be employed by the Labour Party came up with one of his you know you beaut ideas and Matt’s sort of characterised as a guru, god only knows why, he destroyed the New Labour Party, he destroyed the Alliance and everything he touches turns to the proverbial.”
Bill English is though, aye! And Key, he was a one!
John Key on Barclay from March 2016:
“From time to time, when you get a change of MP, you will get changes to staff, because the style’s a bit different, so I don’t have any other details other than that.” This was after he authorised a payout and he’d talked to English about it.”
“Pete George / June 26, 2017
That could be seen as a lie. How different is it to how many politicians talk?
Is it a hanging offence? Or just business as usual?”
Bill’s simply following-on with Key’s “business as usual”. Or is that a hanging offence?
PG – you are purposely putting the worst interpretation on what Little said. He was aware of the initial idea, but it moved out of Labour Party control. You expect him to keep tabs on it all after it was no longer a Labour Party thing? Sorry, there is a gap there that excuses Little and your prevarications fail to prove any guilt at all. No doubt you will bore us by persisting…
Pete I read your post. It does not prove a thing. Photos of possible interns at local meetings is not evidence of any sort of conspiracy.
Labour has become involved and is sorting the problem out. A number of us are hosting the interns.
I have been to the Marae and it is a really comfortable nice place.
I cant help but feel a whole lot of “Meh” about this issue.
It pales into insignificance when compared to allegations of possible obstruction of justice and illegal tape recording and use of parliamentary money to pay off a complainant.
Thanks for the link Pete. That clears stuff up for me. What I couldn’t quite figure out before, was how a “Labour Fellowship Programme” became a “Campaign for Change”. Turns out that the Fellowship Programme was…
People closely associated with the Labour Party had got them here and made promises to them
(…)
Without authority, approval or mandate they went ahead and did stuff. The next I became aware was about May this year when the party was getting messages from students about what was (unclear) within days of arriving …the party stepped in straight away to people who were associated with it and said “What is going on? There’s no approval for this. This is not a party thing”. The party was given assurances. ‘We’ve got funding, we’ve got a programme sorted out and nothing to worry about.’
Then we got the complaints this week and the minute that happened, because we were aware the Labour Party name was associated with it … it’s not about legal technicalities, I take a very dim view of those who hide behind legalities and say it it moral responsibility that is the most important thing, we take responsibility.
(…)
This week and in the weeks that follow, there are still questions to be asked, and we’ll get on top of that.
So it’s easy enough to join the dots with regards putting names to actions – and may they sink without a trace, never to be seen again. And absolutely all credit to Andrew Little on this one.
Much less impressed with those around these parts who came rushing at my curiosity with bullshit and wavy arms over the weekend. But hey, that’s life.
Disingenuous means deceitful and dishonest. I was being genuine marty. (Maybe you mean something else?)
The bullshit I had in mind was more to do with comments the likes of Lynn was throwing at me. The wavy armed stuff was to do with the idea coming from some That I should shut the fuck up because I was buying into some right wing anti-Labour spin.
Little’s statement aligns exactly with what I was saying.
I have no idea why some think of the Labour party as being some monolithic entity while also discussing factions inside it. Personally I find this trait a bit schizo.
In this case you have people floating an idea and going ahead without a sanction because they thought it was a good idea. This happens all of the time because basically Labour and most political parties are mainly a volunteer organisation.
What appears to have been unusual in this case was using the party name. And that confusing those who know fuckall about how Labour actually operates in Auckland. Relying on news reports from journos who usually know less about the internals of political parties than they do themselves is somewhat wierd as well.
At any one time there will be dozens of efforts running across the country that are barely known about even in the region or even electorate they are running in. Sometimes these are actually from one party or another, sometimes just groups of volunteers from across parties.
I tend to work ssmuch as is possibke mostly with facts that I can verify myself when it comes to the people in political groups.
If Little’s statement aligns exactly with what you were saying and also explains what I was trying to get to the bottom of, then there was obviously miscommunication or some-such going on.
Your comments from the weekend suggested the Fellowship Programme was an initiative of NZ Labour and possibly the Greens as well as others (your City Vision comparison) – ie, that it was not solely a NZ Labour initiative.
And that’s a whole big bit different from someone having “left the farm” as it were to indulge in a bit of craziness, that had no endorsement and (it seems) next to no funding, in spite of claims about a ‘mystery backer’.
What do you mean schizo? would that be schizoaffective or schizophrenic ? because while they are similar they are different and using that term is dissmissive and probably not what you mean’t to describe.
“The wavy armed stuff was to do with the idea coming from some That I should shut the fuck up because I was buying into some right wing anti-Labour spin.”
Really curious who on the standard said you should shut up?
If you really are curious, then go and look at the responses that were following on from my comments in various threads over the two or three days I was commenting on this stuff. (shrug)
I was in some of those convos and I didn’t see anyone telling you to shut up. Might have missed that of course but I suspect what you are calling stfu I would call criticism.
The victims that suffered the most in the recent Labour intern situation are those poor souls that want to see a National government come September. It’s proximity to the Todd Thing made people suspicious. Once scratched it didn’t bleed. A fizzer. It resulted in journalists asking ridiculous questions of interns: “Are you sure you’re happy?”
Yeah, I was disappointed to see Marama hop on and whip the dead horse. I’m wondering if Maori are thinking she could be spending less time in National strategy meetings and a bit more time on her own marae.
It’s a dead horse, whipping it along gets them no closer to the finish line. I hope they make it a cornerstone of their campaign but I think they’ll work out in a day or 2 that the horse has no pulse.
Don’t forget it’s yet to be established if Labour broke the law, which will guarantee further headlines if so.
Moreover, reportedly there was a secret backer who funded this and a potential leaker in the midst, which is potentially a recipe for disaster. Hence, we could yet see more on this.
Ahhh – no longer concerned for Labour’s welfare? Salivating at what you think is the scent of blood? Your true nature revealed, so-called Chairman. (Good luck with that wishful thinking, by the way.)
No I’m not salivating at the scent of blood. I was warning not to become too complacent as there may be more to come, thus the concern is one wouldn’t want to see them caught out on the back-foot thinking it was a dead and buried “fizzer”.
And as it happens, turns out there was more to come.
IMPORTANT, can someone who has twitter please advise media that they are asking the wrong questions about Barclay.
Media need to ask why Barclay was recording her (and it’s not because of a personality clash) and if it involved another senior politician.
Have been told it’s so much bigger, but bound by confidentiality agreement so was unable to be told more, but if those questions are addressed, more will come out. NZ is a small place JS
Yep much bigger and plenty still to come out. Why did Bill ring and tell her she had been recorded after Todd told him? Was that bills job? I don’t think so. Why not listen to The tape? Plausable deniability. Why did Todd want him to listen? Was bill mentioned on the tape?
I also think there is more to this. Apparently Melanie Reid said as much when interviewed yesterday (there’s more to come out). I’m happy enough if they string that out over the next couple of months 😉
Deserts are like that. Kuwait’s labour law says employers must send workers home when the temperature hits 50 degrees C. Funny how often the official max daytime temp was 49 degrees during summer…
Ditto in Arab Emirates Psycho. As you say amazing how often temp stopped at 49degrees. Though out at Al Ain it is very very dry. 35degrees in say Saigon is unbearable because of the high humidity.
Grades 1 to 5 were cancelled on Monday in Yakutsk, the world’s coldest city, which is located in the permafrost region in the Sakha Republic. It was the first time temperatures reached minus 45C (minus 49F) this winter, triggering the closure for younger students.
In fact, thermometers can sink much lower in Yakutsk. The lowest temperature recorded in Yakutsk was minus 64.4C
If your read the article carefully it’s clear that shutting junior schools at -45degC and senior schools at -50degC is a routine safety precaution implying this sort of temperature is quite normal.
I don’t think Hone is helping Mana get traction in the polls and I can’t believe that that the majority of Mana supporters think this is a good idea.
“NZ Drug Foundation @nzdrug 3h3 hours ago
More
FFS, Hone now advocating the Singapore drug model where they beat people with a cane for cannabis possession”
I know Hone is strongly opposed to any drug use at all, but this punitive response is so appalling. I don’t really understand how someone as smart as Hone can think executing drug dealers and caning cannabis users is a good way of dealing with drug problems. I just don’t get it.
He didn’t say what NZ Drug Foundation are claiming i.e. he’s not suggesting that cannabis possession should be punished with caning. He did reiterate the death penalty for Chinese importers of P. Which is bad enough and should be criticised for its own sake, but that’s not the same thing. I can’t believe how much progressives are willing to skew the truth at the moment (it’s happening in the immigration debate too).
Actually I can believe it. I think we are all pretty stressed and tense, internationally because of Tr*mp and climate change, and more so in NZ because of the election. It’s still not good, and I’m not enjoying having to spend so much time fact-checking what *progressives are saying.
Death sentence, or changing NZ extradition arrangements so that Chinese people would be deported to China where they may face a death sentence? (Currently NZ will not deport to a country for an offence that may carry a death penalty)
No idea. He doesn’t have an actual policy with detail (even superficially) as far as I can see (haven’t checked the Mana website though). It’s a talking point to get attention for something, either the P thing, or Mana in the election. Both I guess with more emphasis on the latter.
P (and other drugs) need to be talked about. How to deal with havoc some drugs cause (either through their use, or in terms of indirect consequences) needs to be talked about. So that’s all good.
But I parted company with Hone and his approach to drugs way back with the Smokefree by 2025 thing.
We have a major problem in NZ with methamphetamine importation we either need to legalize it or go the other way with life imprisonment with hard labour.
When you have 21 year old Asian’s importing $191 million dollars worth of the stuff and getting 8 years in jail, which equates to 4 years the punishment does not fit the crime.
Politicans, judges and the police do not understand the damage this drug is doing to our communities. I agree with Hone about executing Asian P Importers, they have no morals neither do the NZ Gangs distributing this vile drug.
I have got increasingly angry about this through the day. I have friends that support Mana but there is no way any of them would support this from Hone.
I’ve just read it now. The main new thing there for me is the implication that it’s Chinese immigrants that are bringing P into the country. So that’s another complicating issue.
By talking point I didn’t mean he was being cynical and manipulative, I expect he does believe that harsh penalties are justified given the seriousness of the situation. I just meant that I doubt he is serious about writing this as policy. It’s not like Mana are going to have that kind of influence and he knows damn well that it would never get the agreement of other parties, so it’s an easy talking point to bring up without having to be real about it. As garibaldi says, he’s probably trying to grab some power, which is understandable. But also for me unforgivable. That and his equivocating about the Mp and National, which I also lay at the door of Labour. I’m just sick of the bloody lot of them 😉
I didn’t say that it was you that said it was manipulative and cynical, I was saying that if this was just a ploy to get attention then I thought it was manipulative and cynical.
Actually, what I really think is that it was a racist and ignorant appeal to rednecks. I am so angry about this I will not be commenting any further as I don’t want to fight with people who I otherwise respect. I will just say this – the “war on drugs,” as promoted initially by Bush, has led to untold misery world wide, and has done nothing to reduce drug use. In fact, it has led to the explosion of drugs like meth. What Hone is suggesting is straight out of the rulebook including blaming a specific ethnic group for the problem.
Saying it doesn’t matter because he doesn’t really mean it is crap. Of course it matters. He is promoting hatred against a specific ethnicity and more severe penalties for drug use. We already have far too many people in prison in NZ for drug related crime. He’ll get support for his extreme ideas from those who don’t have a clue about addiction and then it becomes so much harder to talk about what is really required because people can’t be bothered looking at the research.
I have Māori friends and family in Northland and I know about the problems with meth in the area. There are also big problems with alcohol and violence. There is also a high level of poverty. Dealing with the poverty and providing much better mental health and addiction services is what is required.
I have spent all my life fighting racism and promoting human rights and prison reform. I have worked in the drug and alcohol addiction fields. What Hone is doing here is unforgivable as far as I am concerned.
“I didn’t say that it was you that said it was manipulative and cynical, I was saying that if this was just a ploy to get attention then I thought it was manipulative and cynical.”
Yes, I was just trying to clarify that in my original point I didn’t think that HH was doing this as a cynical ploy, I think he probably does genuinely believe at least some of what he is saying, but because it’s Mana it’s easy for him to use this as a talking point (e.g. there’s no change they are writing an actual Bill or even a policy). In other words trying to get attention isn’t inherently cynical if one also believes in what one is saying.
“Actually, what I really think is that it was a racist and ignorant appeal to rednecks.”
Even if HH doesn’t hold personal racism against Chinese people, it’s an appalling piece of political racism given the context in NZ.
I’m pretty much in agreement with you on the drug issues. I’m not excusing HH, I think it does matter, and like you this is probably the turning point for me in terms of supporting Mana or him. I also have concerns about his position on the Mp and National. He’s playing games with that, and while I can understand why he might want to do that, what he’s doing is unsupportable from a LW perspective.
Okay, thanks. Have watched the interview and can see how the Drug Foundation came to that conclusion in that Hone said that he supports the Singapore 3 stage sentencing structure for drugs with execution the most serious punishment. In Singapore the punishment for cannabis use includes caning.
But really, my point was that this punitive approach to drugs is a very bad policy no matter how you look at it. It doesn’t help addicts and it doesn’t stop drug use. There’s plenty of research out there but for some reason Hone is going with the George Bush War on Drugs approach. It is really stupid, and it just allows rednecks to dominate discussion of an important issue.
I have worked as a social worker with drug addicts in London and in Australia, and this stuff from Hone makes me upset and angry. I can see why the Drug Foundation feel the same.
“But really, my point was that this punitive approach to drugs is a very bad policy no matter how you look at it.
To be fair Hone was only advocating a punitive approach from importers/pushers not users/addicts….and only at the extreme end of punishment if you’ve got a hint of the Tat Loo about you.
I haven’t seen the video, just read the article. I guess for me I go, ‘do I believe that HH personally or Mana politically would push for a policy of caning cannabis users, esp given how that would affect Māori?’. No, I don’t. So I went to see what was going on. Same with the water thing the other day. On and on it goes.
I agree with the rest about drug policy 🙂 and also understand why people are reacting to it. I’m in two minds about bothering to fact check Mana stuff now, if he’s going to be this stupid.
How about walking in Hone’s shoes for a bit? He’s been fighting the destruction of many families/lives in the North caused by drug addiction for years and years. He has seen us all talking about it and tut-tutting whilst the problem keeps growing. He knows how absolutely fucking useless we are at helping/investing in fixing the problem. Why not suggest some ott methods when you know damn well that pakeha NZ is not going to deal to the problem?
He knows full well no-one listens anyway! Maybe, just maybe this might get some sort of message through.
We, as a Country, just aren’t prepared to throw the resources at this problem to fix it. It would take $billions to do it properly.
And that would be an infrastructure investment – building people’s personal strength and minds and achievable goals – and get them off wasteful drugs, wasting money, time, lives, personalities, partners and children’s lives. A real social investment in the true sense. But actually it is the perception of caring Gnats peddle.
There have been a number of high profile P related murders in his community and he has obviously had enough. What is the answer as what we are doing is not working ?
That’s how I took the first interview garibaldi, when I thought he was suggesting an ott idea to raise attention. And generally I like his radical. But his lack of clarity on drug users is hugely problematic, as is a politician wanting the death penalty. I have no idea if he is serious or if he thinks that because Mana have no say he can say these things. But either way he should have taken more care, and in this election I’ve got lessening patience for the bullshit.
No Pride in Prisons @noprisonpride Jun 24
The police have been trying to beat, shoot, and incarcerate the crystal meth crisis away for more than a decade. That approach doesn’t work.
No Pride in Prisons @noprisonpride Jun 24
Shrugging his shoulders + saying “Fuck it, just kill them” is an admission he’s given up trying to actually solve the crystal meth problem.
No Pride in Prisons @noprisonpride Jun 24
Hone’s so-called drug policy should be seen as the surrender to the right and dumb, brute force that it is.
There are enlightened, researched and thoughtful drug policies that actually work, without the need to be racist, deport or execute people.
Uriohau @uriohau Jun 24
Hone’s racist zero tolerance war on drugs is stupid policy it doesn’t work its repressive and it expand will expand mass incarceration.
How would it expand mass incarceration? I doubt that there area that many people bringing P into the country and even less are being caught.
I also doubt that he is taking a RW approach to this in the sense that he will want all those other progressive things to still be done too that the right won’t do (although I doubt he’s in favour of decriminalising). As per usual, it’s all sound bite stuff and the media playing the political bullshit game.
Sorry, just feeling particularly worn down by it all at the moment. Hoping we are at peak fucked up and can find a way to start talking to each other again.
I’m thinking about it like this; relatively harm-free drug use is decriminalised and treated as a health issue. Step over the line to dealing grimly destructive drugs like meth and opiates … you get hammered.
For political parties media time is coveted. Regularly making the 6pm news, Q & A or Breakfast TV is almost enough by itself to see that person promoted. For a small party it is virtually impossible to get any of this free exposure. Peter Dunne would love to be peddling his barrow. Gareth Morgan managed to get a bit of exposure recently, cost him a million. Hone has about $8.50 in his media budget.
He’ll crank his position back to reality when it suits. State something like:
“Yes that is what I said, I have to start talking in extremes to get this horrid problem noticed. Decades of asking for help has achieved absolutely nothing, we’re going backwards.”
Hone doesn’t want to put people against the wall and shoot them. He wants media exposure. Seems to be working pretty well so far and he still has his $8.50.
It is a big call to assume you know what Hone is thinking David. I think it is wise to take people at their word until they actually say something different.
And the $8.50 thing – not sure that is such a good angle. But just my view.
Hi Marty, yes assumptions on my part. A chance of making an ass of myself. I didn’t get there by considering what Hone thinks but by considering what all politicians are thinking right now. ‘How can we get a plug for our party on the news tonight?’ Yep, I’m guessing the Mana campaign is $ poor… and cunning rich.
I think this “no pink hamburger” kerfuffle has more legs – it actually affects lots of restaurants and bars. So far Winston is making the running this angle. Very similar to the “showerhead” problem from the last year of the Clark government:
“It’s just nanny state gone mad” etc.
I agree with you on GST.
I think the government Treasury’s accounts are now addicted to it, now that they’ve sold off most of the power companies.
Maybe a really adventurous state would simply nationalise fresh water, form its own company, and really make some tax. Every iwi leaders’ head would explode, but at least the benefits would be distributed to New Zealanders.
[TheStandard: A moderator moved this comment to Open Mike as being off topic or irrelevant in the post it was made in. Be more careful in future.]
A random question on something I’ve always been curious on: Why does “the Left” (using a broad brush) hate on White people, in particular White Men? There seems to be tacit permission on the left that racism is wrong, unless you’re white?
A random question on something I’ve always been curious on: There seems to be tacit permission on the left (using a broad brush) that racism is wrong, unless you’re white? Why is racism towards white people tolerated yet other racism is condemned?
And that’s an excuse? Isn’t racism simply racism regardless of skin colour? Obama held power in the US so is is ok to pour hate on him.. Other races hold power. China probably holds more economic power than the US, so is it ok to be racist to Chinese?
There’s also the issue of how is the Left going to win over White voters if they are hated? Hating white voters while asking them to vote for your candidate is ultimately self defeating.
Mc Grath. Consider this. Let’s say there are 90 white people and 10 black people and they decide to have a democracy ie one person – one vote. How much sway would the black people get? Racism immediately rears its ugly head. The majority must make allowances for the minority if there is to be any fairness in a democracy.
OK it’s a bit simplistic but this may explain what you see as reverse racism.
Obama proved that theory wrong by persuading White voters to vote for him two terms in a row. If skin colour was the only issue, all white voters would have voted Republican. Look at Winston Peters as well. Based on “skin theory”, white voters wouldn’t touch him with a barge pole. Polls suggest otherwise.
Also: Making allowances is one thing, saying I’m black/brown and therefore I can racially down on White is a totally different ballgame & is ultimately self-defeating.
i don’t see “the right” talking about how white men are the great problem in society. Also, personal attacks are often the first sign you’ve lost the debate.
Yeah, I should probably have resisted the smb line. But two people had tried to give him a straight answer that he could have gone on from, and he’s still full of “skin theory”.
Anyone with even the most malfunctioned hypocrisy detector would probably have thought twice about using a “broad brush” reference to open a discussion about bigotry and slurs, ffs.
Fortunately in this country we have a well developed sense of fairness.
The majority did support LBGT rights, treaty settlements and looking after disabled people. It is the politicians who have lagged behind on those issues.
I don’t think short termism serves, or has served, the Left well. Corbyn and Sanders would have to just about divide themselves to fill cabinet posts, let alone parliaments.
Roars rather than whispers are called for. Yet we don’t even get Finlay MacDonald v. Stephen Franks on Nat.Rad. 4 pm (where no one much will hear them).
The institutional Left is milk and piss, here and now. 1935 had a legion of roarers. What is lacking here is venom. Desperate belief. Money hasn’t bought off the belief, just the venom. Or, to say, enough.
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Peter McKenzie has a piece on Newsroom this morning about how local body politics is awash with property developer cash. 70% of all the donations in the 2016 Wellington mayoral election came from property developers. And its pretty obvious what they want in exchange:That’s particularly important in local government, according ...
Source: Unknown, twitter user Recently, I wrote a (relatively) short paper titled as above, to explore what self-determination could like in a practical sense. Maybe I’m a bit of an international trade truther or something, but I absolutely believe trade is at the heart of achieving peace and self-determination. Since ...
In the 1960s, after I had graduated with a first-class Oxford postgraduate law degree, I joined the British Foreign Office as the top entrant of my year. There, I worked for a couple of years on European affairs and was eventually posted to the Embassy in Brussels. After this exposure ...
Alone, Alone. All, All Alone: Will it be a good or a bad thing, when humanity’s bright blue spacecraft is stricken by the civilisation-destroying problem of Climate Change, that no Huston Control will be standing-by to rescue the crew?“WE HAVE A PROBLEM, HUSTON.” These were the words used by the ...
I heard a 45 minute interview with Monica Lewinsky talking to TED’s Chris Anderson on BBC Radio 4 over the weekend, and have listened to it another two times out walking. I recommend it. Highly. Man, I am so impressed with how this woman has integrated her life experiences and ...
Jonathan Haidt and Greg Lukianoff, The Coddling of the American Mind: how good intentions and bad ideas are setting up a generation for failure, London, Penguin, 2019, 352pp; reviewed by Gearóid Ó Loingsigh Jonathan Haidt and Greg Lukianoff’s book The Coddling of the American Mind is a timely book, whose ...
When the Justice Committee reported back on the Administration of Justice (Reform of Contempt of Court) Bill, free speech advocates breathed a sigh of relief. As originally introduced, the Bill reitered the ancient offence of "scandalising the court" - basicly, a special sedition law protecting judges from criticism. The select ...
Eighteen months ago, the government promised to strengthen the Bill of Rights Act, by explicitly affirming the power of the courts to issue declarations of inconsistency and requiring Parliament to formally respond to them. Since then - crickets. Which raises the obvious question: are they actually going to do this, ...
Back in March, the Ministry of Justice conducted a public consultation exercise on whether to hold a review of the Official Information Act. 285 people submitted on it. Now, Stuff has trawled through those submissions, and the case for reform is strong:The Justice Ministry asked Kiwis what they thought was ...
National's prisoner voting ban has gone down as one of the worst laws in New Zealand history. Passed after a farcical debate (including this farcial speech from ACT MP Hilary Calvert), it has subsequently been found to be inconsistent with the Bill of Rights Act by the High Court, Court ...
Divided Loyalties: Can the Prime Minister, Jacinda Ardern, be relied upon? That’s what the boys and girls at Foggy Bottom and the Pentagon needed to be reassured about. Because, from the perspective of Washington, it’s looking more and more like Jacinda Ardern and her Labour Party comrades are getting ready ...
This handy Queer Theory Glossary is from thetranswidow.com In case you’ve had trouble keeping up with the spate of new queer theory terms, here’s a handy glossary for your reference. Queer – A straight person with an interesting haircut. Non-binary/genderqueer – A chubby young female, typically 16-28, who has ...
by Daphna Whitmore US social psychologist and author Jonathan Haidt spoke on 1 August in Auckland to a crowd of around one thousand people. He is best known for his bookThe Coddling of the American Mind which examines the new climate of trigger warnings and acute sensitivity of Gen Z. ...
What an extraordinarily depressing experience it is to be compelled to watch, at 12,000 miles distance, the contortions and machinations of the British political class as they set about their determined attempt to overturn the decision taken by the British people that they wish to leave the European Union. The ...
The winter grazing issue is becoming a highly sensitised one that I hope will not become so politicised that it delays solutions and results in the suicides of some very stressed farmers.Winter grazing has hit the headlines after a determined campaign, including the release of a video of some very ...
by Don Franks Way back when British guitar virtuoso Joe Brown was a beginning session guy he got to back a visiting American artist. Young Joe was an able technician but had yet to learn some points of professionalism. Part way through “Five foot high and rising” Joe tired of ...
Since scientists started studying climate change, they have warned that it will reduce food production. And now, its happening:The climate crisis is damaging the ability of the land to sustain humanity, with cascading risks becoming increasingly severe as global temperatures rise, according to a landmark UN report compiled by some ...
The Abortion Legislation Bill just passed its first reading, 94-23. Its a far bigger margin than I expected, even allowing for the Winston factor, and it reflects the overwhelming support there is in this country for reform. but that support isn't a new thing - it has existed for literally ...
The Justice Committee has called for submissions on the Referendums Framework Bill. The Bill does what it says on the label - establishes a framework for referenda. Things you may want to address in your submission: Whether the bill should apply only at the 2020 election, or whether it should ...
The Thompson and Clark / MBIE spying scandal continues to result in fallout, this time in the form of a report on the implementation of MBIE's "Operation Exploration", its internal operation to enforce the infamous Anadarko Amendment which criminalised protests against the oil industry. MBIE's enforcement operation was tainted by ...
So, Winston Peters is defending his last-minute demand for a referendum on abortion by claiming he was "blindsided" by the bill. Really? The bill is a government bill. It has been working through the cabinet approval process since December last year. As part of that process, NZ First was consulted, ...
The Green Part has been accused of lack of transparency in two recent situations. The first was the claimed media lockdown during Green's annual conference and the second was Julie Ann Genter's refusal to release a letter she had sent to Phil Twyford.I do get frustrated when journalist's succumb to ...
Opportunities to dodge tax are shrinking with the completion of a new tax agreement with Switzerland, Revenue Minister Stuart Nash announced today. Mr Nash and the Swiss Ambassador David Vogelsanger have today signed documents to update the double tax agreement (DTA). The previous DTA was signed in 1980. “Double tax ...
‘Original Sin’ of Land Confiscation at Ihumātao is a wrong that can be put right by Government says Justice & Peace Commission of Catholic Diocese of Auckland ...
New Zealand Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern told a press conference on August 19 that her government is likely to impose new restrictions on prisoners’ rights to send letters. She said the law could be changed in “weeks.” ...
Heart-warming images of House Speaker Trevor Mallard cradling a baby in Parliament have been welcomed around New Zealand, but the Public Service Association warns most families can only dream of such support in the workplace. ...
Applying New Zealand’s international human rights commitments, particularly those in the United Nations Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples, can help in resolving the situation at Ihumātao, Chief Human Rights Commissioner Paul Hunt says. ...
Climate campaigners impersonating bank staff have taken to the streets this week to expose ANZ Bank’s sponsorship of the fossil fuel industry. In the series of satirical actions in Wellington, Dunedin, and Auckland, the ‘bank staff’ promoted ...
Auckland Action Against Poverty joins the Children’s Commissioner , The Green Party , The New Zealand Drugs Foundation , Child Poverty Action Group and other organisations in the calls for an immediate end to the drug testing benefit sanctions. ...
Negotiations between Port Otago workers represented by the Rail and Maritime Transport Union (RMTU) and the Maritime Union of New Zealand (MUNZ) and management failed today and the unions have issued notice of an overtime ban from Saturday 7th September. ...
Queenstown Lakes District Council’s comments that it has applied for a consent to pollute waterways to avoid 'prosecutions by the Otago Regional Council' are unacceptable,’ Fish & Game New Zealand Chief Executive Martin Taylor says. ...
On March 15, the real world impact of online hate became abundantly, horrifically clear. As a shooter opened fire at two Christchurch mosques, the online image board 8chan anticipated, celebrated and amplified his killing spree. ...
Friday, 23 August: Government delegates from around the world, including New Zealand, are meeting in New York for the third of four meetings at the United Nations to agree a Global Oceans Treaty that could help to protect 30% of our oceans by 2030. Greenpeace ...
The excuses about a reportedly unwanted $57,000 payrise for Dunedin City Council CEO Sue Bidrose are laughable, says the New Zealand Taxpayers’ Union. ...
The Auckland Ratepayers’ Alliance has launched the “Ratepayer Protection Pledge” committing to no more than 2% annual rate hikes over the next Council term, and has written to all Mayoral and Council candidates asking them to sign. The pledge will ...
This Saturday, Pakuranga Hunt Day at the Ellerslie Racecourse will see anti-horse racing protesters demonstrating at the corner of Ascot Avenue and Greenlane East. ...
Mayoral candidate John Tamihere will meet with Pacific Island leaders and community elders today at Puhunui Reserve in South Auckland to commit to a Pasefika Cultural Centre. ...
Cruel and invalid Forced Swim Tests carried out at Victoria University of Wellington, will be exposed at the University Open Day today, so prospective students can be warned about the flawed and unethical research being conducted at the institute. ...
The organiser of the annual YWCA Equal Pay Awards has expressed her disappointment with the latest Gender Pay Gap figure for New Zealand workers. The figure rose slightly from 9.2% in 2018 to 9.3% for the quarter ended 30 June 2019. ...
The Council of Licenced Firearm Owners (COLFO) is urging firearms owners to pass on information to the Royal Commission of Inquiry into the Attack on Christchurch Mosques now that the period for submissions has been extended to 27 September. ...
An application was filed in the Employment Relations Authority in Wellington today, seeking an injunction to prevent the Board of the New Zealand Nurses Organisation from removing the President from office. ...
The Government’s commitment to support literacy and numeracy training in the workplace is a strong signal from Government on recognising the importance of upskilling, reskilling and increasing productivity alongside their commitment to address the challenges ...
“The infrastructure sector sees a major role for the New Zealand Infrastructure Commission/Te Waihanga in lifting the nation’s sagging infrastructure performance,” says Paul Blair, incoming CEO of Infrastructure NZ. ...
The AA is calling on the Government to bring forward critical highway projects while time is spent properly developing the plans for a rapid transit system in Auckland. ...
Between 2015/16 and 2017/18, DHBs spent $280 million treating patients due to adverse drug reactions, reveals the New Zealand Taxpayers’ Union in its latest briefing paper on health productivity . ...
The Pay Equity Coalition Auckland (PECA) is pleased the gender pay gap has decreased slightly. Statistics released today show the gap is now 11.9%, nearly 2 percent less than last year. ...
The Council of Licenced Firearm Owners (COLFO) is urging firearms owners to make sure they pass on any information they have to the Royal Commission of Inquiry into the Attack on Christchurch Mosques before submissions close tomorrow (Friday). ...
The big electricity companies consider solar energy “disruptive” and want pricing to suppress it. In contrast, advocates of local energy say that solar, energy efficiency, and other local energy solutions are the cheapest ways to reduce carbon emissions. ...
The Earthquake Commission and Shine Lawyers are delighted to announce that EQC has reached an agreement with the Gibling family, agreeing to cover the cost of repairs of remaining earthquake damage on their property. ...
Four months into the inquiry, the Royal Commission is gathering significant information and continues to receive valuable submissions from the public, from current and former State servants, experts and community groups. ...
While Fish & Game New Zealand is pleased to see Federated Farmers Environment Spokesperson Chris Allen say that 'we all want good, fresh water', he conveniently overlooks some key facts. ...
What: Wellington demo “Save the Amazon Forest/Salve a Amazônia!” When: Friday, 6 September 2019 from 12:30-13:30 Where: Embassy of Brazil in Wellingtona ...
Rt Hon Trevor Mallard, Speaker of the New Zealand House of Representatives, welcomes the visit of His Excellency Eduardo Ferro Rodrigues, President of the Assembly of the Republic of Portugal. ...
A cross political Mental Health and Addictions Wellbeing group will be launched on Wednesday 28 August hosted by Sir John Kirwan and Moe Milne (ONZM) who have both been at the forefront of our country’s often difficult conversations about mental ...
Confirmation that the government will be progressing an independent Parliamentary Budget Office is great news for democracy and transparency, Federated Farmers says. ...
At first glance, Simon Bridges’ strident opposition to the government’s proposal to establish an independent office to cost political parties’ election spending plans looks childish and petty. ...
Euthanasia-Free NZ is appalled that Parliament spent so little time debating Part 2 of the End of Life Choice Bill and voted to leave it full of holes. ...
Jordan Williams, a spokesman for the Auckland Ratepayers’ Alliance and its nationwide sister group the New Zealand Taxpayers’ Union is slamming Auckland Mayor Phil Goff for his comments today that John Tamihere would need the Government’s support to ...
A ‘one size fits all’, inflexible and punitive regulatory regime for water quality just gets backs - and costs - up and most importantly will not work, Federated Farmers says. ...
Mediation yesterday between secondary principals and the government has resulted in a deal that the principals' negotiating team is recommending to its members. ...
Clubs New Zealand welcomes the decision of Justice Minister Andrew Little to put forward a bill amending the Sale and Supply of Alcohol Act to allow all licensed premises to remain open for Rugby World Cup matches. ...
The Australia and New Zealand Ministerial Forum on Food Regulation has ordered a review looking at labelling of added sugars in food and drinks. An option under investigation is ‘a pictorial approach applied to sugary beverages / sugar-sweetened beverages’ ...
Labour market data released by Statistics New Zealand today indicates that a gender pay gap persists in New Zealand, despite improvement in some areas. ...
In the midst of the 6th Great Extinction Event the coalition, STOP Trashing Our Planet is urging voters to take full responsibility for the legacy we are leaving our children. ...
LGNZ will carefully consider the proposed National Policy Statement on Urban Development (NPS-UD) to assess if it meets the Government’s aim of enabling urban development or simply adds more red tape to the planning process. ...
At school camp, the children are banned from having phones, laptops, lollies, chocolate, money, cotton clothing or independent thoughts. They, are, however, allowed home baking – but it’s gotta be hearty. How hearty are you? We are packing for a school camp. If you’re thinking that the middle of winter is ...
Phil Goff’s rival has already pledged an 0800-Jacinda homeless hotline and an 18-lane harbour bridge. What’s next? The two most important people in the 2019 campaign for the Auckland mayoralty faced each other down on Wednesday night across the desk in the NZME debate: Bernard Orsman and Simon Wilson. Correction: it ...
Split Level View Finder: Theo Schoon and New Zealand Art is the exhibition that sparked a protest over issues of cultural appropriation and institutional representation. Theo Schoon is a divisive historical figure. But is his art any good? Martin Patrick reviews.British novelist L.P. Hartley once wrote that “the past is ...
Ahead of debuting her solo show at New Zealand Fashion Week, Korean-NZ couture designer Cecilia Kang talks about growing up ‘feminine’, being influenced by the LGBTQ+ community, and why an ‘administrative error’ at Fashion Week left her so shaken up. ‘I like something big,” says Cecilia Kang, gesturing to the giant ...
The Labour Party is distancing itself from one of its members who is strongly pro-Beijing and has caused controversy in the Chinese community by standing for local office in Auckland. ...
Faced with staff shortages, equipment failures, cancer risks, and a jump in critical calls that can leave them traumatised, some firefighters are wondering if it’s time to hang up the hose. Gareth Shute reports on the dissatisfaction inside Fire and Emergency New Zealand.The state of our nation’s fire service is ...
“She comes over. You’re my mother, she says. Yes, I say. I don’t know you, she says”: a mother and child seaside story by Wellington author Jan Pryor. Photo by Peter Black. ...
On Monday the government announced its new five-year strategy to reduce the Māori prison population. Emilie Rākete looks at another ‘kaupapa Māori’ prison initiative that degrades prisoners and asks if Corrections are capable of seeing it through.On August 19th, the Department of Corrections announced Hōkai Rangi, its new strategy intended ...
By Michael Andrew The Indonesian media is contributing to resentment and racism toward Papuans, according to a human rights researcher and former journalist. Andreas Harsono of Human Rights Watch Jakarta told Pacific Media Watch many Indonesian journalists either view Papuans as enemy “separatists” or deviants and their reporting tends to convey these ...
Analysis - The prime minister puts a stake in the ground over petrol prices, National balks at having its election promises costed and the government puts millions into helping the homeless. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Danilo Ignacio de Urzedo, PhD candidate, University of Sydney Record fires are raging in Brazil’s Amazon rainforest, with more than 2,500 fires currently burning. They are collectively emitting huge amounts of carbon, with smoke plumes visible thousands of kilometres away. Fires in ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Sean Docking, Post-doctoral researcher, La Trobe University Basketball fans around the world were recently sickened by the footage of NBA star Kevin Durant’s Achilles tendon rupturing during a game. But while many think it’s only elite athletes who suffer from Achilles tendon ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Bruce Mountain, Director, Victoria Energy Policy Centre, Victoria University The possibility of blackouts affecting half of Victoria has attracted plenty of attention to a document once read only by industry insiders and policy wonks: the Electricity Statement of Opportunities. The Statement, updated ...
George Clooney sold his tequila company for a billion dollars – but is the stuff any good? The Spinoff finds out. Imagine being so stupidly sexy you sneeze and sell a billion-dollar booze company. That’s what George Clooney did last year, flicking off the tequila business he started accidentally with an ...
The departure of "two Pākehā men" from the government's justice reform group will not hurt the quality of its final report, another member of the team says. ...
Combatting internet-related harm is being stymied by inter-industry disagreement and a lack of information about the extent and nature of the problem, a new report says. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Tim Harcourt, J.W. Nevile Fellow in Economics and host of The Airport Economist, UNSW Amid the tributes to former deputy prime minister Tim Fischer and the stories of his authenticity, courage and quirky interests – like trains and military history – what ...
Current leader of the National Party, Simon Bridges.Analysis by Dr Bryce Edwards – Is Simon Bridges really trying to channel Donald Trump? Or is he taking his cue from Scott Morrison? Or is he looking to emulate Boris Johnson? Whatever the inspiration, there’s been a clear change in the ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Michelle Grattan, Professorial Fellow, University of Canberra [embedded content]Michelle Grattan talks about the sad news of the passing of former Deputy Prime Minister Tim Fischer with University of Canberra Vice-Chancellor Professor Deep Saini. They also discuss Scott Morrison’s recent announcement about joining ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Gabriel Crowley, Adjunct Principal Research Fellow, James Cook University In February, about 600,000 cattle were killed by catastrophic flooding across north Queensland’s Carpentaria Gulf plains. The flood waters rose suddenly, forming a wall of water up to 70km wide. Record depths were ...
Simon Day dined alone at Monique Fiso’s Wellington restaurant Hiakai, and discovered it was the perfect way to appreciate the meaning of this special food. “Would you like a few more minutes with your phone?” the waitress at Hiakai asked sympathetically as I mashed a final goodbye text to my wife ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Emma Willamson, Adjunct Senior Research Fellow, Monash University Australia’s gender pay gap is diminishing, says a new report, but some contributors to it seem harder to overcome than others. For me, the finding hit close to home. The report, by KPMG for ...
The only published and available best-selling indie book chart in New Zealand is the top 10 sales list recorded every week at Unity Books’ stores in High St, Auckland, and Willis St, Wellington.AUCKLAND1 Te Tiriti o Waitangi: The Treaty of Waitangi by Toby Morris with Ross Calman, Mark Derby, and ...
Honey producer Comvita has confirmed a full year net loss of $27.7m with China market access restrictions and tougher regulations locally affecting the company's sales. ...
James Elliott realises John Tamihere's uncosted bridge proposal wasn't actually a metaphor, but a fine example of 'folks is mighty generous with money what they ain’t got'. ...
A new poem by Oamaru-born poet Nick Ascroft.SupermanHalfway up the ascent zigzagging from Royal Terrace to upper Stuart Street carrying four too-heavy grocery bags I begin to understand that I will not make it. My huffing personage – from the fingers, white with the strain, to a face the colour of rhubarb – will ooze into the pavement and roll slowly ...
The Real Pod assembles to dissect the week in reality television and real life, with special thanks to Nando’s.Sound the alarm, because it’s time for another absolute chaos pod. We’re talking haunted dolls in Waipu, we’re talking giant hands taking over Wellington, we’re talking soft serve cones dipped in powdered Milo. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Tony Press, Adjunct Professor, Institute for Marine and Antarctic Studies, University of Tasmania This week, the ABC revealed that the Australian Defence Force wants to roll out military technology in Antarctica. The article raises the issue of what is, or is not, ...
New Zealand teacher aides say their pay reflects an outdated idea of what they do. Elizabeth McLeod hears from four TAs, and one parent, about the classroom realities they face every dayCleaning up poo, defusing violent situations, copping physical and verbal abuse: these are the realities of a teacher aide’s ...
The lanky sidekick from Jono and Ben journeys around New Zealand trying to solve small town problems. Does he succeed?Guy Williams, hardly a shy, retiring type, has been screaming out for his own vehicle for years. A loud, lanky, fearless comic, he’s spent nearly a decade in MediaWorks purgatory, sat ...
Ballot Box.Analysis by Dr Bryce Edwards – The nature of New Zealand general election campaigns could be significantly changed with the proposed establishment of an “umpire” to adjudicate over political party manifesto policies. A suggestion has been put forward by the Government for the establishment of a parliamentary watchdog ...
Editor’s Note: Here below is a list of the main issues currently under discussion in New Zealand and links to media coverage.New Zealand Parliament Buildings, Wellington, New Zealand.Today’s content by Dr Bryce Edwards.Ihumātao Delphine Herbert and Dan Satherley (Newshub): Tainui to buy Ihumātao land – sources Danielle ...
Extinction Rebellion takes a tour of downtown Wellington to point out the coal industry stalwarts and ask why they’re still there in the face of a climate emergency. “There are coal companies in Wellington??”That’s the incredulous response every single time we mention taking the public on a tour of the biggest ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Rachel A. Ankeny, Professor of History and Philosophy, and Deputy Dean Research (Faculty of Arts), University of Adelaide The South Australian government recently announced its intention to lift the long-standing statewide moratorium on genetically modified (GM) crops, following a statutory six-week consultation ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Vicki Sentas, Senior Lecturer, UNSW Law, UNSW Being strip searched by the police can be intrusive, humiliating and harmful. Typically, strip searches involve being required to strip naked in front of police officers, who often give the direction to “squat and cough”, ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Louise Remond, Clinical Psychologist, University of Technology Sydney Hi, I was just wondering if something’s wrong with me because I’m never happy and never want to do anything and I’m getting really lazy and I really hate school. Thanks – Anonymous ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Luke Zaphir, Researcher for the University of Queensland Critical Thinking Project; and Online Teacher at Education Queensland’s IMPACT Centre, The University of Queensland From as early as Grade 3 teachers start teaching children how to put across their own points of view. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Richard Holden, Professor of Economics, UNSW It’s four years since then Prime Minister Tony Abbott warned Australia had been heading to “a Greek-style economic future”. He was referring to what he said had been happening under the previous Labor government. When Labor ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Samia Khatun, Senior Lecturer, SOAS, University of London Some 1,000 kilometres inland from Sydney, over the Blue Mountains, past the trees that drink the tributaries of the Darling River, there stands a little, red mosque. It marks where the desert begins. The ...
Open Mike 26/06/2017 
. . Former Police, Corrections, and Justice Minister in the previous John Key government, Judith Collins, has been ridiculed on social media after posting a comment on Twitter that was patently untrue; . Wrong!! National did not remove Prisoners’ ability to vote. Parliament voted through a Private Member’s Bill ...16 hours ago
Speaker Trevor Mallard was left to look after Jones, while his usual caretaker, Winston Peters, underwent surgery. A truly adorable scene from Parliament yesterday has gone viral, after Speaker Trevor Mallard cradled an extremely drunk Shane Jones in his arms while the House was in session. Loud “awwww”s could be ...1 day ago
Western media have defended their decision not to cover the fires so as not to give them any oxygen. Social media outrage continues to grow around the sentiment that mainstream western media is devoting too little coverage to an ongoing series of fires in the Amazon rainforest, and in doing ...1 day ago
A Long Time Ago, In A Parallel Universe Far, Far Away: The political journalist scratched his head in confusion. Only then did he notice the name of the building: ‘The Jacinda Ardern Presidential Library and Public Resource Centre’. Making his way inside to the information desk, he asked the librarian ...1 day ago
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Nothing from me tody - I'm off to Christchurch to pretend to be other people for a weekend. Normal bloggage should resume on Tuesday. ...2 days ago
Spark is bracing for a customer backlash as rugby fans all across the country struggle to get a picture on their wireless router. With the Rugby World Cup fast approaching, an elderly Taranaki couple are furious after being told that they still won’t be able to watch the tournament, even ...2 days ago
Several explosions have been reported across Auckland, as well-meaning environmentalists have already begun purchasing too much petrol Starting from next week, customers will no longer need a car to purchase petrol directly from the pump, a development that two major fuel providers are billing as an opportunity to help fight ...2 days ago
A new study claims to find that a mother’s exposure to fluoridated water during pregnancy may decrease the IQ of male children – but is it correct? (Photo: Getty Images) Anti-fluoride campaigners are promoting ... 2 days ago
Television advertising has a huge impact on our lives. Even if we don’t recognise that, we know it has to be true, since otherwise why would advertisers spend so much on it? Its significance, however, is greater than simply the influence it has on what we purchase and consume. It ...4 days ago
by Jan Rivers More than 30 years ago a Commission of Inquiry was held in New Zealand to investigate, amongst other things, whether women with cervical cancer were aware that they had been part of a research project and whether they were properly informed of the treatment options ...4 days ago
Everyone Wants To Be Fuhrer: When fascist groups are discussed, the image conjured-up in the minds of most New Zealanders is one of pathetic misfits. This negative impression is reinforced by the latter’s idiotic embrace of the swastika. Even in the second decade of the twenty-first century, the baleful legacy ...5 days ago
In the previous two posts, I laid out the context and set the theoretical framework to answer a question: whether indigenous economies should take the LEAP. This final part outlines ways to conceive of practicing mana motuhake within the existing legal system by carving out special jurisdictions that enable Indigenous ...6 days ago
Fully Informed? Labour’s 2017 promises raised expectations that were little short of revolutionary. Unfortunately, they were never adequately shaken through the fiscal sieve. The hard economic work was not done – and it shows. Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern’s critics have long complained that her grasp of the way the New ...7 days ago
You cannot expect to pound communities into the ground day after day, year after year, decade after decade and just expect them to take it lying down. There’s a point at which the place will explode. And we’re faced with some very big ructions on both sides of the Atlantic ...1 week ago
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Going Down? Once truth and propaganda become fused in the minds of one’s followers, debate and discussion become redundant. If one’s opponents are all outrageous liars, then engaging with them in any way is pointless. Rather than waste its time, a political party should, instead, target all its messages at ...1 week ago
We need to fundamentally reframe our systems settings to address the drivers causing and underpinning inequality; structural change in systems especially financial. The Equality Network Hui was held in Wellington on 27 June 2019. The hui covered important topics such as child poverty; a living wage; taxation; public health; mental ...1 week ago
The views-per-page for some of my recent postings:Depressing, isn't it? Provide thoughtful and wise commentary on the mainstream of British politics and no-one notices. Make a passing reference to Tommy DICKHEAD Robinson in a thread title and you get hundreds of views. Write something about anti-Semitism and you get another ...1 week ago
The government has announced plans to move the Treaty of Waitangi and other taonga to a new site. Great news! So where are they going? Right next to the old one:The new plan will see a new 22,000-square-metre archive built on the former site of Defence House - the former ...1 week ago
Back in June, StatsNZ went public about a project to track population data on an hourly level by using people's cellphones. It wasn't as bad as it initially looked - they were receiving no individual data, only counts by suburb - but there was still a huge consent problem, so ...1 week ago
I did an interview on the TVNZ Breakfast Show about the situation in Hong Kong. I tried to frame the issue as a collective action problem between two sides with very different end games. The video is here. Because of time constraints we could not discuss the fact that the ...2 weeks ago
Image Credit: Wild Rose College A new study reporting the ranges of values for kidney and liver parameters in a healthy population is being actively misrepresented by anti-fluoride campaigners. The Fluoride Action Network’s (FAN) latest ... 2 weeks ago
Alone, Alone. All, All Alone: Will it be a good or a bad thing, when humanity’s bright blue spacecraft is stricken by the civilisation-destroying problem of Climate Change, that no Huston Control will be standing-by to rescue the crew?“WE HAVE A PROBLEM, HUSTON.” These were the words used by the ...2 weeks ago
Divided Loyalties: Can the Prime Minister, Jacinda Ardern, be relied upon? That’s what the boys and girls at Foggy Bottom and the Pentagon needed to be reassured about. Because, from the perspective of Washington, it’s looking more and more like Jacinda Ardern and her Labour Party comrades are getting ready ...2 weeks ago
This handy Queer Theory Glossary is from thetranswidow.com In case you’ve had trouble keeping up with the spate of new queer theory terms, here’s a handy glossary for your reference. Queer – A straight person with an interesting haircut. Non-binary/genderqueer – A chubby young female, typically 16-28, who has ...2 weeks ago
The winter grazing issue is becoming a highly sensitised one that I hope will not become so politicised that it delays solutions and results in the suicides of some very stressed farmers.Winter grazing has hit the headlines after a determined campaign, including the release of a video of some very ...2 weeks ago
The Green Part has been accused of lack of transparency in two recent situations. The first was the claimed media lockdown during Green's annual conference and the second was Julie Ann Genter's refusal to release a letter she had sent to Phil Twyford.I do get frustrated when journalist's succumb to ...2 weeks ago
Opportunities to dodge tax are shrinking with the completion of a new tax agreement with Switzerland, Revenue Minister Stuart Nash announced today. Mr Nash and the Swiss Ambassador David Vogelsanger have today signed documents to update the double tax agreement (DTA). The previous DTA was signed in 1980. “Double tax ...2 weeks ago
On Newshub Nation: Simon Shepherd interviews Children's Commissioner Andrew Becroft and international children's rights expert Laura Lundy ...12 hours ago
Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern has promised to help Muslim women who are interested in politics. ...7 hours ago
At school camp, the children are banned from having phones, laptops, lollies, chocolate, money, cotton clothing or independent thoughts. They, are, however, allowed home baking – but it’s gotta be hearty. How hearty are you? We are packing for a school camp. If you’re thinking that the middle of winter is ...14 hours ago
Phil Goff’s rival has already pledged an 0800-Jacinda homeless hotline and an 18-lane harbour bridge. What’s next? The two most important people in the 2019 campaign for the Auckland mayoralty faced each other down on Wednesday night across the desk in the NZME debate: Bernard Orsman and Simon Wilson. Correction: it ...15 hours ago
Split Level View Finder: Theo Schoon and New Zealand Art is the exhibition that sparked a protest over issues of cultural appropriation and institutional representation. Theo Schoon is a divisive historical figure. But is his art any good? Martin Patrick reviews.British novelist L.P. Hartley once wrote that “the past is ...15 hours ago
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A reminder from Emmerson for all NZers ..
https://mobile.twitter.com/rodemmerson/status/875789296728289280/photo/1
Thanks Ed. Like you I don’t feel it, but it is apparent that some people get a lot of enjoyment from watching sport.
Team NZ This morning – Beautiful.
Awesome sailing, 100% fly time. Such a pleasure to watch.
One win to go …. here is hoping there is no repeat of the last challenge (I doubt there will be).
Going to be a buzz if it comes home. Not to mention great for NZ and Auckland assuming that is where we defend it.
Please see Emmerson’s cartoon above.
It was drawn for people like you.
I must concede that I don’t think Oracle has got any answers to team NZ this time. Well done Team NZ.
It’s got to be a showcase for kiwi innovation and tech (for some companies at least) on the world stage.
For sure, kids were buzzing out this morning when explained that both vessels were built in NZ and one of them looked puzzled when told Oracle had Aussies on board.
It’s the engineering that buzzes me out, the harnessing of natural energy.
I agree that there is more to life than sporting trophies- but I’m also smart enough to know that you can enjoy it without detriment to other items.
Most people will agree with this.
But I reiterate that this (and the lions tour) will create a real feel good factor before the elections.
Would love for little to come out and be a grumpy old man like you paul (ed) – he would drop to low 20’s
So you don’t care about child poverty.
I would love the Labour Party to come out and offer a socialist alternative. Then like Corbyn the Labour Party would rise to 45.
For the many, not the few.
So Ed, Paul you don’t care about climate change because you care about child poverty, most people can care about more than one thing, is this to difficult for you to grasp likewise many people believe child poverty is better solved through other means than socialism, that does not mean you dont care about child poverty but is a typical arrogant and sanctimonious attack strategy of LWNJ
Poverty has never been solved by any means other than socialism.
You solve poverty by making sure everyone has enough. Socialism.
QFT
All of the other means tried always seem to create more poverty while making a few people very, very rich. Strange coincidence eh?
A bit too far before. Still, maybe Bingles can call in a favour and get a nationwide tour of sports trophies going with spontaneous parades thrown in, a bit nearer election time.
I am conflicted about the America’s Cup. On the one hand, it is completely over hyped here, a perfect case study in the white middle class echo chamber that is our news and current affairs in NZ.
Yet on the other hand, it is an impressive triumph of NZ high technology. Don’t forget Oracle is backed by a Silicon valley billionaire, and have the likes of Airbus Industries doing their aerodynamics. Money is no problem for a team backed by one of a superpower’s richest men using all the most high tech companies in the Western world.
TNZ has taken on this technology and beaten it, and I would much prefer it if our image was this sort of technology (along with Rocket Lab) than one of being sleepy hobbits in middle earth tending polluting dairy farms.
QFT
…much prefer it if our image was this sort of technology (along with Rocket Lab) than one of being sleepy hobbits in middle earth tending polluting dairy farms.
Fuck, yes. Still can’t bear to watch rich people’s hobbies being made the centre of a jingoistic spectacle on the news though. It’s worse than golf.
Nothing is worse than golf.
Just chill and cheer up PM
Ain’t no thang – you can usually channel-hop the news to avoid the America’s Cup, rugby and stories about royals, so my blood pressure is safe.
Well done to the sailors, boat builders and engineering boffins.
I go along with that, and as Sanctuary said, we should be promoting that. I have had the privilege over the years to work with some mighty clever engineers, graduates of our universities so I am not surprised we have taken on Silicon Valley and beating them.
Just one wish as a sailing nut I would like to see this “boat” race, if you could call it that, get back to some traditional racing sailing boats as this is not sailing as far I am concered, Fuck it is more like a cycle race on the water.
Lets go back to lead mines doing 6 knots. So exciting.
Not over till its over though.
It would be cool to hold it on Lake Wanaka
at what point does using pedal powered hydraulics to “trim” the wing become “ooching” ?
http://www.sailingscuttlebutt.com/2016/03/06/50860/
This article suggests Oracle was “pumping” in AC34 and suggests that it was not precluded in the rules.
“Ooching and pumping should never have been banned in the first place.
The rules were changed to prevent more active sailing, because athletic young sailors were using it, to beat old farts sitting in their boats like potato sacks.
The New Zealand First campaign opening leaders’ speech:
http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA1706/S00420/speech-peters-nz-first-campaign-launch.htm
A few highlights:
– A universal student allowance
– Major programme of sealing unsealed rural roads
– Properly invest in rail to give it a much bigger role in the regional economy
– 25% of government royalties for mining, petroleum, and water to stay in the region of origin. Specifically singles out Coca Cola, Suntory, Oravida, and Fiji Water
And not a mention of any sport at all!
yeah but other than Winston we get the likes of ron marks and possible jones the arrogant self serving fool,
Yes bwaghorn, that is the biggest problem with NZF….. too many clowns/fools/underpants kings in tow.
“too many clowns/fools/underpants kings in tow.”
Surely that’s the case with any political party in NZ with more than one or two candidates.
Edit.. actually a problem with all political parties in NZ on second thoughts.
yes but if they are down the bottom of the list it doesn’t matter, not so when they are near the top , i know nat voters who are thinking of changing due to bennet being 2ic
Labour slams PM’s conference speech
http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2017/06/labour-slams-pm-s-conference-speech.html
Little was quick to jump on National for not having any new policy, saying the party was out of ideas and out of steam.
However, after 9 long years in opposition (and with less than 3 months till the election) Labour’s own policy page is looking rather bare.
Last election Labour had a radical Kiwisaver plan, which with being compulsory along with the uncapped variable saving rate, created a bit of voter unease. Yet with less than 3 months till the election, voters are still unclear if Labour have now dropped that policy?
When will Labour present their full policy package?
It’s a bit rich slamming National for running out of steam and new ideas when Labour itself currently has little on offer.
… and given your opening sentence was a reported critique about National policy….
… National’s policy is?
The critique about National was they have nothing new.
Don’t you think Labour should be better than that?
Moreover, don’t you believe we should call them out on that?
Speaking out is a way for us to hold their feet to the fire, which will hopefully lead to them upping their game.
Thanks for your concern.
If you don’t know what Labour’s policies already released are, that’s on you. It’s normal for political parties to release policy over time. Labour’s 2014 Kiwisaver policy was announced at about this time in the election cycle. But by all means don’t let reality get in the way of your need to say Labour are shit.
“If you don’t know what Labour’s policies already released are, that’s on you.”
You seem to be confused. It’s not that I don’t know what Labour’s policies already released are, it’s that the cupboard is looking rather bare. Moreover, a number of them fall short.
“Labour’s 2014 Kiwisaver policy was announced at about this time in the election cycle.”
Implying we can expect their 2017 Kiwisaver policy soon?
It’s not that Labour are “shit ” but they clearly aren’t at the peak of their game.
These sort of forums can help build consensus among supporters giving the party a better indication of our expectations.
I think Labour should be doing more to win and that of course includes having a full policy package that will widely resonate, thus help build their support.
It seems you disagree. So lets see what others have to say.
My position is that at this point in the election cycle we need to support parties to do the right thing, not bash them or undermine them. This doesn’t mean we can’t critique them, it means that we criticise constructively.
You appear to think that constant negative criticism will make them better but I don’t know many people that respond well to that. Mostly I think that some people will read all the Labour bashing and either not vote or vote NZF or Mana or TOP in protest because they’ve been assured that Labour are useless. That shit will lose us a tight election. Or lessen the chance of Labour/Greens governing without NZF.
“My position is that at this point in the election cycle we need to support parties to do the right thing”
Great! Do you believe not having a full policy package at this point of the election cycle is doing the right thing? And do you deem someone who is asking about that as someone bashing Labour?
I highlighted Labour’s own policy page is looking rather bare. That last election Labour had a radical Kiwisaver plan which created a bit of voter unease, thus suggesting the unease remains as it’s still unclear. And finished with pointing out how Labour came across.
Do you find that to be too harsh? Can we not have that kind of discussion on here?
The Chairman
Instead of shafting Labour for not having a full policy package – that you agree with – why don’t you make a list of policies that you think are necessary? Do some work yourself instead of the lazy NZ thing of just sniping from the sidelines at the people engaging in the action.
Let’s have a discussion about what you and we would like and start asking Labour what they are going to do about each one as a separate enquiry so they have to concentrate.
And if you think that lazy NZs doesn’t apply to you, then ignore that and give us the list. There is too much time spent getting up each other’s nose at present. There is no time for that now.
First off, I’m not shafting Labour for not having a full policy package that I agree with. I was highlighting they don’t have a full policy package.
As for making a list, I’ve put forward policy proposals for discussion on here before, but it isn’t just up to me. This is something we can all participate in. But to keep it simple I’d suggest we stick to one at a time.
Moreover, at this stage we’ve yet to establish if there is a consensus for Labour to present and run with a fully policy package.
Therefore, instead of you sniping from the sidelines at me, why don’t you participate in the discussion and tell us where you stand on Labour having a full policy package?
“Do you believe not having a full policy package at this point of the election cycle is doing the right thing?”
I think in terms of organisation that they are doing the best they can (mostly), and that they know a shit load more about what will work than you or I do. Would I like more policy? Of course, but you can’t get blood out of a stone. I don’t believe they are twiddling their thumbs or ignorant of process.
“And do you deem someone who is asking about that as someone bashing Labour?”
No. I deem someone who puts the boot in every chance they get to be bashing Labour.
I wasn’t playing the ‘poor me’ card. Merely highlighting McFlock’s intent. Rather than solely discuss the topic at hand (Labour’s policy) McFlock is intent on attacking me.
Disappointingly, you agreeing with McFlock plays into that (making me the topic).
“I think in terms of organisation that they are doing the best they can (mostly), and that they know a shit load more about what will work than you or I do.”
In terms of organisation it’s clear they aren’t doing the best they can. They had more policies last election, hence showing they are capable of doing more.
“Would I like more policy? Of course, but you can’t get blood out of a stone. I don’t believe they are twiddling their thumbs or ignorant of process”
Great, you agree. However, if you don’t believe they are twiddling their thumbs or ignorant of process what do you believe the hold up is?
The election is only months away and they must give time for the policy to get out there (having people talk and come to terms with it) thus time for momentum to build. So while they may know a shit load more about what will work than you or I do, why do you think this is being overlooked or dropped?
I’ll tell you what another pitfall is in not having a full policy page, it comes across as if they have something to hide.
“No. I deem someone who puts the boot in every chance they get to be bashing Labour.”
So this line of questioning is alright, yet you also seem to be implying I’m bashing Labour? Excuse me for being confused.
You also gripe on about negative criticism opposed to constructive criticism but failed to clarify if you believe what I’ve initially stated was too harsh?
“These sort of forums” can also be used by beige concern trolls to focus attention on perceived motes in Labour’s eye while ignoring the massive planks in National’s.
I wouldn’t mind it if you actually had a fucking point, but no, you’re all about the disingeuous question followed by the passive-aggressive barb. BM’s a cock, but they’re still more useful and entertaining than you.
I don’t care what you “expect”, or what vapid tautologies you want to put out instead of actual political insight. A full policy package that widely resonates will build support, you say? That’s fucking amazing, you’re a political genius.
Do you think the most important bit for a manifesto to gain support is being “full” or merely “resonating”? I suspect it’s the “resonate” bit. Clean water, healthy homes, regional development, all good solid stuff. Of course, none of this will “resonate” with you because you’re not the voter equivalent of a bell, more like a small beige pile of crap. Any clapper that comes in contact with you will simply produce a soft “splat” and get covered in shit.
Wow!
What a load of self-opinionated crap.
If you genuinely “don’t care” I suggest you stop reading my comments.
I do care that your entire purpose here seems to be to concern troll your way through the election.
Typical of you to conveniently misunderstand a sentence, though.
Just because I air my concerns doesn’t make me a troll.
Effectively, you’re trying to shut me up.
If supporters can’t publicly air their concerns what does that make us? China?
help help I’m being oppressed! /sarc
Get a life.
You almost never offer a specific opinion, and even when you do it’s as vague as possible: you want a full policy manifesto, for example, but what would you want to put in it? Way to avoid the issues, dude.
You’re nothing but air and concerns. How is wanting you to actually make a decent point and actually contribute to discussions “trying to shut [you] up”? It’s not. It’s the opposite: make a point, share a strong but reasoned position. You’re terrified of showing an opinion, and you suck everyone else’s ideas and attention with your “concerns”.
“Just because I air my concerns doesn’t make me a troll.
Effectively, you’re trying to shut me up.”
Have to agree with McFlock here. Playing ‘poor me’ won’t go down well. Nor does continually reframing the criticism of your incessant negativity as ‘airing concerns’ make for genuine dialogue.
The more you do that shit, the more troll-like you become.
“You almost never offer a specific opinion, and even when you do it’s as vague as possible…”
I put forward opinions and answer questions, but that is you attempting to make the discussion about me again.
“You’re nothing but air and concerns. How is wanting you to actually make a decent point and actually contribute to discussions “trying to shut [you] up”? “
If you genuinely want to have a decent discussion, lets see if you can refrain from taking personal pot shots. In others words, play the ball and not the man.
Before we go filling the policy void, lets see if we can obtain a consensus on whether or not they should run with a full policy package?
I’ve already put forward a number of reasons why they should. So if you disagree, lets here why?
dude, one good policy is better than a full manifesto of crap. So much for just another in a long line of vapid discussion points.
point demonstrated.
“Do you think the most important bit for a manifesto to gain support is being “full” or merely “resonating?”
A full policy package allows voters to see the larger picture of where Labour stand. So it’s important. But so to is having policy that widely resonates. Therefore, attempting to have both should be the goal.
And while a number of their policies are OK, polls indicate there not resonating wide enough. Hence why I’ve been advocating for more to be done.
Which policies did you like? What policies do you think will “resonate”?
Personally, I’m not too worried about the polls at this stage – it’ll be a coalition government, not Labour governing alone.
There’s enough evidence in political science that most people do not vote according to policy. Publish all you want (as Lab did in 2014) but it will not win an election.
Does that mean that having no policy or having crap policy won’t diminish chances? I would have thought that for LW parties at least that while not sufficient, good policy was a prerequisite (which is different to what you are saying I know).
People vote on confidence. Apparently policy plays a very small part in that for non-wonks. We are not a reporesentative crowd.
The best I heard it explained is: watch a politician on TV with the sound turned off. That’s what people are voting on. Hence it causes way more damage for Bill English to have Hilary Barry interacting in a clearly ‘WTF?!’ way than any amount of detailed figures about tax promises, hip operations or ‘affordable’ houses.
Helps explain why an unflappable sociopath like Key prospered so well.
Nice subthread. Good analysis Sacha thanks.
“The critique about National was they have nothing new.”
Do you agree?
And if you do, what was their old policy?
“Do you agree?”
Yes.
National’s policies largely don’t appeal to me. But it’s no excuse for Labour not having more.
“When will Labour present their full policy package?”
More to the point, WHEN will National present their full policy package? If remember correctly also at the last election there was none, just vague talk about “tax cuts”. They put all their energy into destroying Cunliffe (my, wasn’t people sucked in with all that being a man bullshit) aided by crap lying journalist’s like Armstrong and Gower.
Here’s an excellent interview on what is going on between Saudi Arabia and Qatar
Or it could be an old fashioned tribal power grab.
When Mohammed bin Salman was just 12 he began sitting in on meetings led by his father Salman, the then governor of Saudi Arabia’s Riyadh Province. Some 17 years later, at 29 and already the world’s youngest defence minister, he plunged his country into a brutal war in Yemen with no end in sight.
Now the kingdom of Saudi Arabia is jousting dangerously with its regional foe Iran, led by a man seemingly in a big hurry to become the Middle East’s most powerful leader.
http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/the-most-dangerous-man-in-the-world-a6803191.html
If you are been recorded at work, is the employer obliged to inform you?
By this I mean camera in chiller or over till.
Do they have to inform you in writing?
I’m not really current with that, but they never used to. As long as it didn’t get audio or up your skirt / down your top it was fine, criminal law-wise. Dunno how it goes with the employment relationship. Check it out with your union rep (even if you’re not a member, check it out with a union).
Cheers Mcflock.
I will give the union another go, haven’t had a lot of luck getting a response from them in the past about other issues.
Being recorded at work goes right to the heart of “good faith” in an employment relationship.
From the Employment Relations Act 2000
(4)(1A)The duty of good faith in subsection (1)—
(a) is wider in scope than the implied mutual obligations of trust and confidence; and
(b) requires the parties to an employment relationship to be active and constructive in establishing and maintaining a productive employment relationship in which the parties are, among other things, responsive and communicative; and
(c) without limiting paragraph (b), requires an employer who is proposing to make a decision that will, or is likely to, have an adverse effect on the continuation of employment of 1 or more of his or her employees to provide to the employees affected—
(i) access to information, relevant to the continuation of the employees’ employment, about the decision; and
(ii) an opportunity to comment on the information to their employer before the decision is made.
So if the employer is engaging in covert recording, its unlikely to be “establishing and maintaining a productive employment relationship” and is also likely to be contrary to the “mutual obligations of trust and confidence”
So in other words, if you know you’re being recorded, and that there’s a legitimate business reason for it (stock theft, money disappearing etc) then it’s unlikely to be an issue.
If you are aware that cameras have suddenly been installed, and no reason given for it, then it’s likely to be a lack of good faith.
Who is your union? You could always contact the CTU if you’re not getting any response from your union.
thank you james.
i am entering the 4th month with new employer in hospitality.
i assume, after a little googling, etu is the union to join.
the reference i made earlier, was to unite, left a couple of fone messages and e-mail. it turns out they cover fast food workers, not restaurant staff.
am waiting to renegotiate my contract as am out of the first 90 days, and employer assured me at start of contract we would revisit the contract after 3 months.
Good luck.
Did you get it in writing that the agreement would be revisited after the 90 days, or was it a verbal statement?
ETu would be the one to join. The old Service and Food Workers Union would have been the one to join, and they almagamated with ETu
I negotiated every 2nd weekend off, 3 month contract review and a couple of other small details and shook hands.
Boss has gone back on the 2nd weekend of a few times.
This why I want to get new contract and get this stuff in writing this time.
Irks me as I have more than honoured my end of the deal and offered systems, recipes and a few cost cutting ideas.
I realise word is no longer bond.
Unfortunately that is the way these days. Can’t trust anyone to honour their word. Hard life lessons especially when it comes to employment matters.
You make it sound like there wasn’t a contract written in the first place? Forgive my imprudence, but I wonder why you signed a written agreement (if there was one) that didn’t include what had been negotiated?
If there’s no written agreement, that’s illegal and is something you should raise with the Labour Inspectorate.
There is a fairly generic contract, several pages. Blanks where position and wages are entered.
The boo boo I made was to not take it home and sleep on the decision and pencil in what was talked about.
Both the business owners are decent people.
Food budget blow outs, financial pressure has caused them to make cuts and as we all know, wages (hours) are a great place to start.
As you say and I am finding not everyone takes their word as seriously as I do.
The media seems to have lost interest in the intern issue for now, too busy chasing English (he keeps feeding them daily stories).
There are still important issues on the interns that Andrew Little wasn’t open and honest about on Q+A yesterday. He said “people closely associated with the Labour Party were involved without approval or authority or any mandate they went ahead and did stuff” and did nothing? He claims to have only acted last Monday as if it was the moral thing to do – acting on minor complaints from some interns.
It looks like Little is avoiding being honest while questioning English’s integrity.
How much did he really know about scheme? Did he quietly approve but is now distancing himself? He must have had contact with Mccarften who was supposedly running Little’s outreach programme in Auckland.
If Little didn’t do anything even though he knew an unauthorised scheme was being run how much of a disconnect is there between the Labour leadership and head office in Wellington, and at least part of Auckland Labour including MPs who seem to have been actively involved?
https://yournz.org/2017/06/26/interns-worked-with-labour-mps/
Yawn 🙄
double yawn. This is the man who thought that Dickson and co were equalling responsible for what’s gone down with National as Barclay and the senior Nats who lied and covered up. He wouldn’t know integrity if came gift-wrapped in beige.
Talking about integrity, that’s a false claim. if you can’t substantiate it can you please retract it.
Why don’t you clarify your position on who was responsible?
That’s a cop out. You alleged something, it’s false, you have made no attempt to substantiate it, and are diverting from withdrawing it.
Is making an allegation and then when called out on it demanding someone prove otherwise acceptable conduct here now?
What I might say now has no bearing on what you based your allegation on. You made something up. You mentioned integrity in the same comment. Do you have any?
Fantastic. In the absence of you telling us what your actual position is, I’ll assume I was pretty close to the mark when I said you believe that Dickson and co are just as responsible as the National party liars and people doing the covering up.
And mate, I’ve got years of time on this site of backing up my statements and engaging honestly so I think I’ll let that stand as a sign of my integrity. You don’t like my opinion of your politics? Tough shit. I suggest you start being honest about what they are and then you might get some respect from me (probably still won’t respect the politics though).
You seem to have conceded that you made things up. You assume incorrectly, you were wide of the mark.
Am I allowed to say whatever I ‘assume’ about you? You could then state what your actual position is?
You can assume whatever you like Pete, but you’d be wrong in this case.
weka – you have it right
Cheers for digging up the link, couldn’t be bothered going over there myself.
hi pete, if you are trying to start a fire that has gone out, you need dry kindling and some decent fuel.
witness prime minister and his constant stoking of the blaze.
(no need for bellows and petrol as used by PM in the clutha debarclay)
Lol so true
double lol, great metaphor gsays.
“There’s not doubt that Bill English stumbled and fudged, and Barclay did some stupid things over a period of time, but those involved in the employment dispute, making complaints and going to the media are not beyond criticism either.”
https://yournz.org/2017/06/23/more-on-the-barclay-saga/
Thanks for confirming I said nothing like what weka alleged.
So having read the link I actually think that Weka’s summary is a pretty good summary of what you wrote. Sure you never said [i]”that Dickson and co were equaling responsible for what’s gone down with National as Barclay and the senior Nats who lied and covered up.”[/i] but the whole article is best summed up by that statement. I mean if that wasn’t your intent, why were you quoting remarks from people calling Dickson horrible names, especially with apparently no commentary on why those remarks were made or anything around the circumstances…
Also I do like that you try to pretend you are non-biased and comment on political issues rationally; but you post a lot about attacking Labour and on how National’s faux pas are not really that bad, and there are other factors, and… blah blah blah
Good summation there. That’s how I remembered his post too.
PG disingenuous as always, and still won’t say what he thinks about the relative responsibilities of Dickson and co compared to the National Party liars.
I actually don’t know. I don’t have inside information, I only observe from the outside. Do you have inside information? If not how do you judge the relative responsibilities right now (not last year).
What would you say if a Dirty Politics type campaign was under way designed to bring down the Prime Minister? Would that worry you? Or if it’s only a National PM wouldn’t it matter to you?
Depends on what you mean by Dirty Politics, because I’ve seen you in the past define that as people being mean to each other.
I’ve watched Dickson being interviewed. It’s true she could be a very cunning woman who presents herself as principled but is in fact as nasty and unscrupulous as the PM, Barclay and the board. But I doubt it, she came across as genuine in her manner, her choice of words and restraint, and in the story she told. Beyond the party politics she looks like she is telling the truth. Which doesn’t mean that people didn’t organise to make certain things happen, but I don’t get the sense of her or the other locals as being out and out liars. I also trust Reid as a journalist. Then there is the whole he said/she said aspect, and that one is easy. Barclay has blatantly lied multiple times, so I’m going to take her word over his.
And so on. No need for inside information. That level was up to the National Party board and they fucked that up majorly. I generally trust people at a basic level until they prove otherwise. English and Barclay are now proven liars, the board have shown themselves to be unprincipled. Some of those people have broken the law. I’ve yet to see anything that shows that Dickson or Davie or the other locals who tried to get things sorted out have done anything other than do the right thing, and certainly nothing even close to what Nats have done.
Feel free to present some evidence otherwise, but in the absence of that I’ll also guess that your centrism stops you from condemning National to the extent they deserve and you look around to see if the others were evil too and then do a cop out by saying you don’t know enough to judge when to everyone else it’s blatant.
The more I read your contributions, PG, the more I see you as an obfuscatory prevaricator.
“Depends on what you mean by Dirty Politics, because I’ve seen you in the past define that as people being mean to each other.”
Another false claim/misrepresentation. You mentioned integrity?
Relative responsibilities are easy to judge: did someone make a secret recording, pay someone hush money about the secret recording, or otherwise pressure that person to not pursue a criminal act?
yes -> they bear some responsibility for the crime or its cover-up
no -> no responsibility is theirs.
It’s actually pretty simple. There might be wider systemic issues at play, but at the end of the day responsibility goes to the perpetrator, not the victim.
Lol, Pete you ask me what appears to be a genuine question, I answer it at length, you side steps all that, and now try to make out that in 2014 you didn’t run the same shit minimising lines about Dirty Politics as you’re running now about the Barclay affair. And how Labour does it too, and how saying horrible things about someone is Dirty Politics. FFS, it’s all there on record on TS, and many people here remember that about you because it went on for a long time. You really are a numpty of the highest order.
I remember you doing that Pete – come on don’t go the bill english way with the truth.
We get the media we deserve. Whatever is clicking well on the Herald’s front page, that’s what we’ll get. After a few more than 1 intern were interviewed the slave/slum story was revealed for the all smoke and no fire beat-up it is.
The Todd thing won’t go away because it keeps generating fresh headlines. With more probing, fresh deception keeps popping up. The media are loving it, it’s a front-page headline factory.
“It looks like Little is avoiding being honest while questioning English’s integrity.”
This is a concern I was pointing out to weka the other day. It was good that Little has fronted on this, however it looks as if it’s starting to unravel, which could result in Labour digging a larger hole.
Ha, if we’re going to point out politicians that are economical with the cold hard truth we’d run out of fingers long before politicians.
In this case though Little has claimed the moral high ground stepping and dealing with problems as soon as they arose – but avoiding explaining how much he knew about the scheme and when he knew, and also trying to minimise the party’s involvement when it appears to have been a full on campaign scheme for Auckland Labour.
There was either a major disconnect between Auckland and Wellington, or they are fine with working independently, or Little is not admitting greater involvement.
Yes dear, btw weve chosen you as our new spare bedroom wall colour.
Should look nice as it goes with most things without being strong or committed one way or another.
btw weve chosen you as our new spare bedroom wall colour.
You mean the one downstairs or under the house where we store all our useless junk?
@David Mac
Some can lie and get away with it while others are called to account.
True colours showing there chairman? Sad.
It would be sad to see Labour dig and fall into a larger hole.
Yeah but you and your mate pucepete keep digging that hole – wonder why…
No. Little was the one on Q&A.
I was the one warning of the concern.
Thanks for your concern.
Cool.
I think the gnats need a better dead cat.
I’m starting to think that TC is a low end, long game astroturfer 😉
+ 1
TC and pompous Pete tag teaming.
It’s possible that he doesn’t know exactly what McCrafton’s been up to.
If so, that would highlight a failure to keep tabs on it.
Lol or they are separate people dum dum dummmmm
The fellowship was called the 2017 Labour campaign fellowship, thus as it was using the Labour name it’s something the party should have kept tabs upon.
The failure of which would explain Little’s embarrassment.
When some-one “leaves the farm”, there’s not too much you can do about it, aye?
In the interview, Little states that the Labour Fellowship Programme was run without authority or approval. He basically acknowledges that the party was blindsided – that shit was done in their name without their knowledge.
As far as I can figure, McCarten and (from a post he did on TDB) Bradbury were the idiots who (I assume) thought they could manufacture a Corbyn/Sanders type thing in NZ by the simple act of enlisting volunteers who’d be enthusiasts of Sanders/Corbyn.
From reading the Bomber piece and a rudimentary “planning” doc that was released by (I think) Newshub, the whole thing strikes me as fucking madness slathered in deceit.
Will it hurt Labour in the media? Possibly. But much less than it could if they just continue to be up front. Will it hurt them financially? Yup.
Will a couple of arse-hole authoritarian leftists disappear forever? I’m very hopeful on that front 🙂
That’s optimistic 🙂 I wouldn’t be surprised if McCarten disappears for a while. Can’t see that happening with Bradbury so long as TDB is a goer.
I can’t imagine anyone wanting to touch McCarten with a barge-pole after this (assuming I’m reading the whole debacle correctly).
As for Bomber (and by association TDB), how much can you shred credibility before there’s nothing left to shred? Would you willfully associate yourself or your writing with a site run by a person with no credibility?
Well I try not to go there unless I see something interesting. There are still people writing there who I respect. And let’s not forget that TS has some reputation problems of its own 😉
That is a horrible thing to say about McCarten. You haven’t got a fucken clue about that man and his contribution.
I’ve had dealings with Matt McCarten in the past, so yeah, I have “got a fucken clue about that man”. And I know this isn’t a popular position to have, but I’ve no regard for him.
Rush to his defence if you must. (I don’t really care). Fact is, he just got disembarked, but not before he willfully or otherwise threw a fucking firework into the ship’s magazine.
Your analysis doesn’t align with mine. It all sounds a bit personal from your end to me.
“He basically acknowledges that the party was blindsided”
Indeed.
Will it hurt Labour? Some damage has already been done, yet it’s too early to fully gauge. As for whether it will do more damage, that depends on what more (if anything) comes out.
Mike Treen was also very much involved.
“He basically acknowledges that the party was blindsided – that shit was done in their name without their knowledge.’
Except that Little has said he knew about it: “This started out as an idea at the beginning of the year. I certainly became aware of it, um when it was raised with me.”
And he knew more about it: …”people closely associated with the Labour Party were involved. Without without approval or authority or any mandate they went ahead and did stuff.”
But then “The next I became aware was about May this year when the party was getting messages from students about to arr… within days of arriving, um, ah, the party stepped in straight away to people associated with it saying what is going on, there’s no approval for this, this is not the party thing.”
Does he expect us to believe that he discovered details of an unauthorised scheme in May, but did nothing about it until interns started complaining publicly last week?
Little isn’t being up front about what knowledge he had, and when he knew about things.
Cosgrove seems to have been on message for Labour on Newstalk ZB today:
” Oh well as I understand Matt McCarten, who used to be employed by the Labour Party came up with one of his you know you beaut ideas and Matt’s sort of characterised as a guru, god only knows why, he destroyed the New Labour Party, he destroyed the Alliance and everything he touches turns to the proverbial.”
https://yournz.org/2017/06/26/cosgrove-bus-follows-labour-over-mccarten/
McCarten only announced he was leaving Labour on 12 June. And then last week said he was having no more to do with the scheme.
Someone has told me “McCarten’s a voluntary scapegoat”.
Little is certainly not living up to the moral standards he suggested he adheres to.
Bill English is though, aye! And Key, he was a one!
John Key on Barclay from March 2016:
“From time to time, when you get a change of MP, you will get changes to staff, because the style’s a bit different, so I don’t have any other details other than that.” This was after he authorised a payout and he’d talked to English about it.”
“Pete George / June 26, 2017
That could be seen as a lie. How different is it to how many politicians talk?
Is it a hanging offence? Or just business as usual?”
Bill’s simply following-on with Key’s “business as usual”. Or is that a hanging offence?
It seems little different to Andrew Little being frugal with the truth regarding the intern issue.
I don’t think either are good. What about you?
You reckon Bill English and John Key were, “frugal” with the truth?
Yes, I suppose you do.
Frugal.
Complete strangers, more like. Divorcees. Deniers.
PG – you are purposely putting the worst interpretation on what Little said. He was aware of the initial idea, but it moved out of Labour Party control. You expect him to keep tabs on it all after it was no longer a Labour Party thing? Sorry, there is a gap there that excuses Little and your prevarications fail to prove any guilt at all. No doubt you will bore us by persisting…
I’m not putting the worst interpretation, I’m saying that Little hasn’t been open and honest. It looks like he’s trying to hide something.
The evidence shows that it was a Labour Party thing, and Little must have known more about it than he has said.
https://yournz.org/2017/06/27/little-and-labour-mps-with-interns/
Pete I read your post. It does not prove a thing. Photos of possible interns at local meetings is not evidence of any sort of conspiracy.
Labour has become involved and is sorting the problem out. A number of us are hosting the interns.
I have been to the Marae and it is a really comfortable nice place.
I cant help but feel a whole lot of “Meh” about this issue.
It pales into insignificance when compared to allegations of possible obstruction of justice and illegal tape recording and use of parliamentary money to pay off a complainant.
Cheers Mcflock.
I will give the union another go, haven’t had a lot of luck getting a response from them in the past about other issues.
Thanks for the link Pete. That clears stuff up for me. What I couldn’t quite figure out before, was how a “Labour Fellowship Programme” became a “Campaign for Change”. Turns out that the Fellowship Programme was…
People closely associated with the Labour Party had got them here and made promises to them
(…)
Without authority, approval or mandate they went ahead and did stuff. The next I became aware was about May this year when the party was getting messages from students about what was (unclear) within days of arriving …the party stepped in straight away to people who were associated with it and said “What is going on? There’s no approval for this. This is not a party thing”. The party was given assurances. ‘We’ve got funding, we’ve got a programme sorted out and nothing to worry about.’
Then we got the complaints this week and the minute that happened, because we were aware the Labour Party name was associated with it … it’s not about legal technicalities, I take a very dim view of those who hide behind legalities and say it it moral responsibility that is the most important thing, we take responsibility.
(…)
This week and in the weeks that follow, there are still questions to be asked, and we’ll get on top of that.
So it’s easy enough to join the dots with regards putting names to actions – and may they sink without a trace, never to be seen again. And absolutely all credit to Andrew Little on this one.
Much less impressed with those around these parts who came rushing at my curiosity with bullshit and wavy arms over the weekend. But hey, that’s life.
I said your curiosity was disingenous. I’m sorry you thought that was bullshit and arm wavey. Haven’t changed my opinion.
Disingenuous means deceitful and dishonest. I was being genuine marty. (Maybe you mean something else?)
The bullshit I had in mind was more to do with comments the likes of Lynn was throwing at me. The wavy armed stuff was to do with the idea coming from some That I should shut the fuck up because I was buying into some right wing anti-Labour spin.
Little’s statement aligns exactly with what I was saying.
I have no idea why some think of the Labour party as being some monolithic entity while also discussing factions inside it. Personally I find this trait a bit schizo.
In this case you have people floating an idea and going ahead without a sanction because they thought it was a good idea. This happens all of the time because basically Labour and most political parties are mainly a volunteer organisation.
What appears to have been unusual in this case was using the party name. And that confusing those who know fuckall about how Labour actually operates in Auckland. Relying on news reports from journos who usually know less about the internals of political parties than they do themselves is somewhat wierd as well.
At any one time there will be dozens of efforts running across the country that are barely known about even in the region or even electorate they are running in. Sometimes these are actually from one party or another, sometimes just groups of volunteers from across parties.
I tend to work ssmuch as is possibke mostly with facts that I can verify myself when it comes to the people in political groups.
If Little’s statement aligns exactly with what you were saying and also explains what I was trying to get to the bottom of, then there was obviously miscommunication or some-such going on.
Your comments from the weekend suggested the Fellowship Programme was an initiative of NZ Labour and possibly the Greens as well as others (your City Vision comparison) – ie, that it was not solely a NZ Labour initiative.
And that’s a whole big bit different from someone having “left the farm” as it were to indulge in a bit of craziness, that had no endorsement and (it seems) next to no funding, in spite of claims about a ‘mystery backer’.
What do you mean schizo? would that be schizoaffective or schizophrenic ? because while they are similar they are different and using that term is dissmissive and probably not what you mean’t to describe.
“The wavy armed stuff was to do with the idea coming from some That I should shut the fuck up because I was buying into some right wing anti-Labour spin.”
Really curious who on the standard said you should shut up?
If you really are curious, then go and look at the responses that were following on from my comments in various threads over the two or three days I was commenting on this stuff. (shrug)
I was in some of those convos and I didn’t see anyone telling you to shut up. Might have missed that of course but I suspect what you are calling stfu I would call criticism.
The victims that suffered the most in the recent Labour intern situation are those poor souls that want to see a National government come September. It’s proximity to the Todd Thing made people suspicious. Once scratched it didn’t bleed. A fizzer. It resulted in journalists asking ridiculous questions of interns: “Are you sure you’re happy?”
Yep a fizzer.yet some gnat supporters want to keep it going.
Yeah, I was disappointed to see Marama hop on and whip the dead horse. I’m wondering if Maori are thinking she could be spending less time in National strategy meetings and a bit more time on her own marae.
It’s a dead horse, whipping it along gets them no closer to the finish line. I hope they make it a cornerstone of their campaign but I think they’ll work out in a day or 2 that the horse has no pulse.
National strategy includes maori party strategy, looking after elite iwi interests with sinecures and troughs like whanau ora.
Marama will attempt to distance themselves as spin which being a parata clone shes good at
Don’t become to complacent Marty (and David) .
Don’t forget it’s yet to be established if Labour broke the law, which will guarantee further headlines if so.
Moreover, reportedly there was a secret backer who funded this and a potential leaker in the midst, which is potentially a recipe for disaster. Hence, we could yet see more on this.
Ahhh – no longer concerned for Labour’s welfare? Salivating at what you think is the scent of blood? Your true nature revealed, so-called Chairman. (Good luck with that wishful thinking, by the way.)
No I’m not salivating at the scent of blood. I was warning not to become too complacent as there may be more to come, thus the concern is one wouldn’t want to see them caught out on the back-foot thinking it was a dead and buried “fizzer”.
And as it happens, turns out there was more to come.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/national/politics/94124107/labour-council-member-stands-down-as-intern-debacle-probed
IMPORTANT, can someone who has twitter please advise media that they are asking the wrong questions about Barclay.
Media need to ask why Barclay was recording her (and it’s not because of a personality clash) and if it involved another senior politician.
Have been told it’s so much bigger, but bound by confidentiality agreement so was unable to be told more, but if those questions are addressed, more will come out. NZ is a small place JS
Yep much bigger and plenty still to come out. Why did Bill ring and tell her she had been recorded after Todd told him? Was that bills job? I don’t think so. Why not listen to The tape? Plausable deniability. Why did Todd want him to listen? Was bill mentioned on the tape?
For sures Marty, sounds like you are on to it. Let’s see if media do their job, because there is so much more to this than what we already know.
And she was not being taped because Todd didn’t like her, it’s way deeper than that.
I also think there is more to this. Apparently Melanie Reid said as much when interviewed yesterday (there’s more to come out). I’m happy enough if they string that out over the next couple of months 😉
Clever Weka 😀
This is the Reid interview eh? http://www.radionz.co.nz/national/programmes/sunday/audio/201848765/melanie-reid-investigative-journalism
yes, haven’t listened yet.
Cool cheers.
It’s interesting what political William’s get up to on the job and in their spare time……
Bennett adores Bill, Collins is sweet on Barclay and herself.
Especially herself. #mwah
ARIZONA HEATWAVE pics, melted wheelie bins, cooked eggs, melted fences and signs.
Today temp a roasting 46 degrees C.
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-06-25/epic-pictures-arizonas-heatwave-everything-literally-melting
Deserts are like that. Kuwait’s labour law says employers must send workers home when the temperature hits 50 degrees C. Funny how often the official max daytime temp was 49 degrees during summer…
Ditto in Arab Emirates Psycho. As you say amazing how often temp stopped at 49degrees. Though out at Al Ain it is very very dry. 35degrees in say Saigon is unbearable because of the high humidity.
Grades 1 to 5 were cancelled on Monday in Yakutsk, the world’s coldest city, which is located in the permafrost region in the Sakha Republic. It was the first time temperatures reached minus 45C (minus 49F) this winter, triggering the closure for younger students.
http://siberiantimes.com/other/others/news/n0529-too-cold-for-school-in-yakutsk-as-temperature-hits-minus-45c/
From your own link:
In fact, thermometers can sink much lower in Yakutsk. The lowest temperature recorded in Yakutsk was minus 64.4C
If your read the article carefully it’s clear that shutting junior schools at -45degC and senior schools at -50degC is a routine safety precaution implying this sort of temperature is quite normal.
I don’t think Hone is helping Mana get traction in the polls and I can’t believe that that the majority of Mana supporters think this is a good idea.
“NZ Drug Foundation @nzdrug 3h3 hours ago
More
FFS, Hone now advocating the Singapore drug model where they beat people with a cane for cannabis possession”
A good response, that i agree with, to Hone
https://tewhareporahou.wordpress.com/2017/06/25/hone-harawira-and-the-war-on-drugs/
Yes, I saw that article. It is very good.
I know Hone is strongly opposed to any drug use at all, but this punitive response is so appalling. I don’t really understand how someone as smart as Hone can think executing drug dealers and caning cannabis users is a good way of dealing with drug problems. I just don’t get it.
He didn’t say what NZ Drug Foundation are claiming i.e. he’s not suggesting that cannabis possession should be punished with caning. He did reiterate the death penalty for Chinese importers of P. Which is bad enough and should be criticised for its own sake, but that’s not the same thing. I can’t believe how much progressives are willing to skew the truth at the moment (it’s happening in the immigration debate too).
http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2017/06/harawira-serious-about-executing-chinese-p-dealers.html
Actually I can believe it. I think we are all pretty stressed and tense, internationally because of Tr*mp and climate change, and more so in NZ because of the election. It’s still not good, and I’m not enjoying having to spend so much time fact-checking what *progressives are saying.
Death sentence, or changing NZ extradition arrangements so that Chinese people would be deported to China where they may face a death sentence? (Currently NZ will not deport to a country for an offence that may carry a death penalty)
No idea. He doesn’t have an actual policy with detail (even superficially) as far as I can see (haven’t checked the Mana website though). It’s a talking point to get attention for something, either the P thing, or Mana in the election. Both I guess with more emphasis on the latter.
P (and other drugs) need to be talked about. How to deal with havoc some drugs cause (either through their use, or in terms of indirect consequences) needs to be talked about. So that’s all good.
But I parted company with Hone and his approach to drugs way back with the Smokefree by 2025 thing.
We have a major problem in NZ with methamphetamine importation we either need to legalize it or go the other way with life imprisonment with hard labour.
When you have 21 year old Asian’s importing $191 million dollars worth of the stuff and getting 8 years in jail, which equates to 4 years the punishment does not fit the crime.
Politicans, judges and the police do not understand the damage this drug is doing to our communities. I agree with Hone about executing Asian P Importers, they have no morals neither do the NZ Gangs distributing this vile drug.
Re the talking point theory – in some ways that is worse IMO. Cynical, manipulative, and not giving a fuck about the consequences.
I assume you read the link Marty posted?
https://tewhareporahou.wordpress.com/2017/06/25/hone-harawira-and-the-war-on-drugs/
I have got increasingly angry about this through the day. I have friends that support Mana but there is no way any of them would support this from Hone.
I’ve just read it now. The main new thing there for me is the implication that it’s Chinese immigrants that are bringing P into the country. So that’s another complicating issue.
By talking point I didn’t mean he was being cynical and manipulative, I expect he does believe that harsh penalties are justified given the seriousness of the situation. I just meant that I doubt he is serious about writing this as policy. It’s not like Mana are going to have that kind of influence and he knows damn well that it would never get the agreement of other parties, so it’s an easy talking point to bring up without having to be real about it. As garibaldi says, he’s probably trying to grab some power, which is understandable. But also for me unforgivable. That and his equivocating about the Mp and National, which I also lay at the door of Labour. I’m just sick of the bloody lot of them 😉
I didn’t say that it was you that said it was manipulative and cynical, I was saying that if this was just a ploy to get attention then I thought it was manipulative and cynical.
Actually, what I really think is that it was a racist and ignorant appeal to rednecks. I am so angry about this I will not be commenting any further as I don’t want to fight with people who I otherwise respect. I will just say this – the “war on drugs,” as promoted initially by Bush, has led to untold misery world wide, and has done nothing to reduce drug use. In fact, it has led to the explosion of drugs like meth. What Hone is suggesting is straight out of the rulebook including blaming a specific ethnic group for the problem.
Saying it doesn’t matter because he doesn’t really mean it is crap. Of course it matters. He is promoting hatred against a specific ethnicity and more severe penalties for drug use. We already have far too many people in prison in NZ for drug related crime. He’ll get support for his extreme ideas from those who don’t have a clue about addiction and then it becomes so much harder to talk about what is really required because people can’t be bothered looking at the research.
I have Māori friends and family in Northland and I know about the problems with meth in the area. There are also big problems with alcohol and violence. There is also a high level of poverty. Dealing with the poverty and providing much better mental health and addiction services is what is required.
I have spent all my life fighting racism and promoting human rights and prison reform. I have worked in the drug and alcohol addiction fields. What Hone is doing here is unforgivable as far as I am concerned.
“I didn’t say that it was you that said it was manipulative and cynical, I was saying that if this was just a ploy to get attention then I thought it was manipulative and cynical.”
Yes, I was just trying to clarify that in my original point I didn’t think that HH was doing this as a cynical ploy, I think he probably does genuinely believe at least some of what he is saying, but because it’s Mana it’s easy for him to use this as a talking point (e.g. there’s no change they are writing an actual Bill or even a policy). In other words trying to get attention isn’t inherently cynical if one also believes in what one is saying.
“Actually, what I really think is that it was a racist and ignorant appeal to rednecks.”
Even if HH doesn’t hold personal racism against Chinese people, it’s an appalling piece of political racism given the context in NZ.
I’m pretty much in agreement with you on the drug issues. I’m not excusing HH, I think it does matter, and like you this is probably the turning point for me in terms of supporting Mana or him. I also have concerns about his position on the Mp and National. He’s playing games with that, and while I can understand why he might want to do that, what he’s doing is unsupportable from a LW perspective.
Okay, thanks. Have watched the interview and can see how the Drug Foundation came to that conclusion in that Hone said that he supports the Singapore 3 stage sentencing structure for drugs with execution the most serious punishment. In Singapore the punishment for cannabis use includes caning.
But really, my point was that this punitive approach to drugs is a very bad policy no matter how you look at it. It doesn’t help addicts and it doesn’t stop drug use. There’s plenty of research out there but for some reason Hone is going with the George Bush War on Drugs approach. It is really stupid, and it just allows rednecks to dominate discussion of an important issue.
I have worked as a social worker with drug addicts in London and in Australia, and this stuff from Hone makes me upset and angry. I can see why the Drug Foundation feel the same.
Update:
http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2017/06/drug-foundation-head-slams-harawira-s-execution-policy.html
“But really, my point was that this punitive approach to drugs is a very bad policy no matter how you look at it.
To be fair Hone was only advocating a punitive approach from importers/pushers not users/addicts….and only at the extreme end of punishment if you’ve got a hint of the Tat Loo about you.
I haven’t seen the video, just read the article. I guess for me I go, ‘do I believe that HH personally or Mana politically would push for a policy of caning cannabis users, esp given how that would affect Māori?’. No, I don’t. So I went to see what was going on. Same with the water thing the other day. On and on it goes.
I agree with the rest about drug policy 🙂 and also understand why people are reacting to it. I’m in two minds about bothering to fact check Mana stuff now, if he’s going to be this stupid.
That’s it for me with Hone.
I have forgiven him all sorts of shit because of all the good stuff he’s done in the past but now he has gone too far.
Pretty much feeling the same way tbh.
This is better from the Drug Foundation, good on them,
http://www.newshub.co.nz/home/politics/2017/06/drug-foundation-head-slams-harawira-s-execution-policy.html
How about walking in Hone’s shoes for a bit? He’s been fighting the destruction of many families/lives in the North caused by drug addiction for years and years. He has seen us all talking about it and tut-tutting whilst the problem keeps growing. He knows how absolutely fucking useless we are at helping/investing in fixing the problem. Why not suggest some ott methods when you know damn well that pakeha NZ is not going to deal to the problem?
He knows full well no-one listens anyway! Maybe, just maybe this might get some sort of message through.
We, as a Country, just aren’t prepared to throw the resources at this problem to fix it. It would take $billions to do it properly.
And that would be an infrastructure investment – building people’s personal strength and minds and achievable goals – and get them off wasteful drugs, wasting money, time, lives, personalities, partners and children’s lives. A real social investment in the true sense. But actually it is the perception of caring Gnats peddle.
Agree liberal wet lefty pakeha will never allow such policies, now in the Phillipines a different matter
There have been a number of high profile P related murders in his community and he has obviously had enough. What is the answer as what we are doing is not working ?
That’s how I took the first interview garibaldi, when I thought he was suggesting an ott idea to raise attention. And generally I like his radical. But his lack of clarity on drug users is hugely problematic, as is a politician wanting the death penalty. I have no idea if he is serious or if he thinks that because Mana have no say he can say these things. But either way he should have taken more care, and in this election I’ve got lessening patience for the bullshit.
No Pride in Prisons @noprisonpride Jun 24
The police have been trying to beat, shoot, and incarcerate the crystal meth crisis away for more than a decade. That approach doesn’t work.
No Pride in Prisons @noprisonpride Jun 24
Shrugging his shoulders + saying “Fuck it, just kill them” is an admission he’s given up trying to actually solve the crystal meth problem.
No Pride in Prisons @noprisonpride Jun 24
Hone’s so-called drug policy should be seen as the surrender to the right and dumb, brute force that it is.
There are enlightened, researched and thoughtful drug policies that actually work, without the need to be racist, deport or execute people.
Uriohau @uriohau Jun 24
Hone’s racist zero tolerance war on drugs is stupid policy it doesn’t work its repressive and it expand will expand mass incarceration.
How would it expand mass incarceration? I doubt that there area that many people bringing P into the country and even less are being caught.
I also doubt that he is taking a RW approach to this in the sense that he will want all those other progressive things to still be done too that the right won’t do (although I doubt he’s in favour of decriminalising). As per usual, it’s all sound bite stuff and the media playing the political bullshit game.
Sorry, just feeling particularly worn down by it all at the moment. Hoping we are at peak fucked up and can find a way to start talking to each other again.
I’m thinking about it like this; relatively harm-free drug use is decriminalised and treated as a health issue. Step over the line to dealing grimly destructive drugs like meth and opiates … you get hammered.
Executing brewery owners is probably a bit excessive.
Even though alcohol still causes the majority of drug related problems.
I am against the death penalty, anyway.
holy shit hes jumped the shark!!! bye bye hone and mana
For political parties media time is coveted. Regularly making the 6pm news, Q & A or Breakfast TV is almost enough by itself to see that person promoted. For a small party it is virtually impossible to get any of this free exposure. Peter Dunne would love to be peddling his barrow. Gareth Morgan managed to get a bit of exposure recently, cost him a million. Hone has about $8.50 in his media budget.
He’ll crank his position back to reality when it suits. State something like:
“Yes that is what I said, I have to start talking in extremes to get this horrid problem noticed. Decades of asking for help has achieved absolutely nothing, we’re going backwards.”
Hone doesn’t want to put people against the wall and shoot them. He wants media exposure. Seems to be working pretty well so far and he still has his $8.50.
It is a big call to assume you know what Hone is thinking David. I think it is wise to take people at their word until they actually say something different.
And the $8.50 thing – not sure that is such a good angle. But just my view.
Hi Marty, yes assumptions on my part. A chance of making an ass of myself. I didn’t get there by considering what Hone thinks but by considering what all politicians are thinking right now. ‘How can we get a plug for our party on the news tonight?’ Yep, I’m guessing the Mana campaign is $ poor… and cunning rich.
All good.
Looking at six to nine metre sea level rises by 2100 now according to the latest studies. Good interview on the subject here
Thanks for the link. Interesting and revealing segment/interview.
It’s 6 – 9 meters that will accompany 1.5 – 2 degrees and may rise by that amount over 100 or 200 years.
Here’s the entire presentation that featured, given by Eric Rignot at Victoria Uni in Feb of this year. (Intros take up the first 5 min)
Very good video. I had missed it and these are guys I know, respect and follow closely.
I think this “no pink hamburger” kerfuffle has more legs – it actually affects lots of restaurants and bars. So far Winston is making the running this angle. Very similar to the “showerhead” problem from the last year of the Clark government:
“It’s just nanny state gone mad” etc.
[Off-topic dribble – moved to Open Mike, BLiP]
I agree with you on GST.
I think the government Treasury’s accounts are now addicted to it, now that they’ve sold off most of the power companies.
Maybe a really adventurous state would simply nationalise fresh water, form its own company, and really make some tax. Every iwi leaders’ head would explode, but at least the benefits would be distributed to New Zealanders.
[TheStandard: A moderator moved this comment to Open Mike as being off topic or irrelevant in the post it was made in. Be more careful in future.]
A random question on something I’ve always been curious on: Why does “the Left” (using a broad brush) hate on White people, in particular White Men? There seems to be tacit permission on the left that racism is wrong, unless you’re white?
Apologies for duplication. Message flashed back saying it wasn’t posted and it didn’t initially appear.
Maybe it’s racist – have you checked? I mean REALLY checked?
A random question on something I’ve always been curious on: There seems to be tacit permission on the left (using a broad brush) that racism is wrong, unless you’re white? Why is racism towards white people tolerated yet other racism is condemned?
Because white people hold the power.
And that’s an excuse? Isn’t racism simply racism regardless of skin colour? Obama held power in the US so is is ok to pour hate on him.. Other races hold power. China probably holds more economic power than the US, so is it ok to be racist to Chinese?
There’s also the issue of how is the Left going to win over White voters if they are hated? Hating white voters while asking them to vote for your candidate is ultimately self defeating.
Mc Grath. Consider this. Let’s say there are 90 white people and 10 black people and they decide to have a democracy ie one person – one vote. How much sway would the black people get? Racism immediately rears its ugly head. The majority must make allowances for the minority if there is to be any fairness in a democracy.
OK it’s a bit simplistic but this may explain what you see as reverse racism.
Obama proved that theory wrong by persuading White voters to vote for him two terms in a row. If skin colour was the only issue, all white voters would have voted Republican. Look at Winston Peters as well. Based on “skin theory”, white voters wouldn’t touch him with a barge pole. Polls suggest otherwise.
Also: Making allowances is one thing, saying I’m black/brown and therefore I can racially down on White is a totally different ballgame & is ultimately self-defeating.
Geez, you took that and ran with it, didn’tcha.
Who said skin colour was the only issue?
Who said “the left” hates white people?
Oh, you did.
Folks tried to give you some perspective on how racism manifests in power imbalances, and the points went straight over your tiny little head.
i don’t see “the right” talking about how white men are the great problem in society. Also, personal attacks are often the first sign you’ve lost the debate.
lolnice: calls left wing racist, complains about personal attacks.
Suck my balls.
The prosecution rests.
Copy that: everyone on the left is racist against white people because I was mean to McGrath the racism dog.
Sorry about that, everyone, the revolution has been cancelled. My bad.
Well, McFlock, I’ve noticed that you can be a bit naughty at times..
McGrath has yet to show that his humour is conscious.
Yeah, I should probably have resisted the smb line. But two people had tried to give him a straight answer that he could have gone on from, and he’s still full of “skin theory”.
Anyone with even the most malfunctioned hypocrisy detector would probably have thought twice about using a “broad brush” reference to open a discussion about bigotry and slurs, ffs.
Fortunately in this country we have a well developed sense of fairness.
The majority did support LBGT rights, treaty settlements and looking after disabled people. It is the politicians who have lagged behind on those issues.
http://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/preach+to+the+choir
[TheStandard: A moderator moved this comment to Open Mike as being off topic or irrelevant in the post it was made in. Be more careful in future.]
I don’t think short termism serves, or has served, the Left well. Corbyn and Sanders would have to just about divide themselves to fill cabinet posts, let alone parliaments.
Roars rather than whispers are called for. Yet we don’t even get Finlay MacDonald v. Stephen Franks on Nat.Rad. 4 pm (where no one much will hear them).
The institutional Left is milk and piss, here and now. 1935 had a legion of roarers. What is lacking here is venom. Desperate belief. Money hasn’t bought off the belief, just the venom. Or, to say, enough.