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Open mike 28/05/2022

Written By: - Date published: 6:00 am, May 28th, 2022 - 77 comments
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77 comments on “Open mike 28/05/2022 ”

  1. Interesting fact considering the way the Azov fighters in Mariupol were portrayed as freedom fighters by media in New Zealand, and raises the question why we support these people in Ukraine at the same time as call them terrorists in New Zealand:

    "It was the first thing I noticed as news of the Christchurch shooting came in — the patch on the back of the shooter's rucksack, something that was also emblazoned on the cover of the rambling manifesto.

    It was far from the first time I'd seen it.

    I'd seen it on t-shirts sold by far-right fashion brands in France. I'd seen it in photos of shields held by white supremacists at the violent "Unite the Right" rally in Charlottesville in 2017. And, here in Ukraine, I'd seen it on the paraphernalia of the far-right Azov movement.

    It's a sonnenrad (sunwheel) or black sun: a symbol commonly used by the far-right, including outright neo-Nazis, originally adapted from a mosaic on the floor on the SS Generals' Hall.

    Seeing it in the context of Christchurch reminded me of just how interconnected the global far-right has become.

    A manifesto was sent to police believed to be sent from the Christchurch shooter.

    A wade through the swamp that is the manifesto shows a peculiar imagined version of Eastern Europe.

    And it is clear the shooter matters to some in that region's far-right."


    "But there's another country mentioned in the manifesto, the one I'm in right now: Ukraine.

    Ukraine is home to a resurgent far-right that uses the same symbolism as the Christchurch shooter, but it hasn't been mentioned much over the past few weeks.

    To some extent, this is fair — despite some speculation, we don't yet know for sure if he was even in Ukraine.

    Ukraine is home to the Azov movement, a far-right movement originally formed in 2014 as the Azov Battalion to fight Russian-led forces in eastern Ukraine. It quickly earned controversy as a place that accepted open neo-Nazis into its ranks."


    • Francesca 1.1

      We don't know for sure if he was in Ukraine, but its on public record that he told his mother he wanted to move to Ukraine.Yes, every country has its far right problem, but in Ukraine these groups have gained a disproportionate amount of power, and not by democratic means , but by sheer violence and the backing of Avakov, head of the Ministry of internal affairs, who has survived every change of govt since Yanukovich

      What Varchenko and the Interior Ministry assiduously avoid mentioning are the compelling grounds for concern about any cooperation between far-right vigilante groups and law enforcement bodies. Such grounds include the views at the basis of the National Corps and previous activities of groups linked with the Azov Civic Corps.


      Azov is not the only far right group getting govt funding C14 gets Ukrainian govt funding to hold summer camps for children


      C14, a group whose members have openly expressed neo-Nazi views and been involved in the recent violent attacks on Romany camps in Kyiv, and the far-right affiliated Svoboda political party, are the recipients of Youth and Sports Ministry grants for "national-patriotic education projects," according to a June 13 report by Hromadske Radio.

      So deplore the Russian invasion if you will, but portraying Ukraine's fight as one for democracy against autocracy, while ignoring and whitewashing Ukraine's encouragement of far right ideology comes with huge risks to us all

      • SPC 1.1.1

        Putin has wrapped up his autocracy with that of the state with his alignment with the Russian Orthodox Church – the partner of Tsars.

        He cultivated the support of the Njght Wolves.

        His and their Duginite tendency's are as close to ethnic fascism as anything in Ukraine and these are ones in power.

    • SPC 1.2

      That this is a fight between two white race nations with their own identity issues seems to have escaped you.

      We are witnessing the ethnic cleansing of nova russia regions of Ukrainians so those Russian identified can have their land – and this is what you notice.

    • Populuxe1 1.3

      You making huge speculative leaps and not understanding how the internet mimetics works does not make an "interesting fact".

  2. Descendant Of Smith 2

    I didn't and still don't get any sense that they were portrayed as heroes holding out. More that they were soldiers who had been cut off from support and were in a untenable position running out of food and ammunition.

    While the resistance of Ukraine as a whole has been portrayed as heroic against larger odds the commentary around the Azov battalion has been less emotive and the connection to the far right has been well discussed and documented and commented on.

    It is both possible to be a right wing supporter and bravely fight against an invading country just as it is to be a communist and bravely fight against an invading country. These things aren't contradictions.

    Overall I find the commentary on Azov doesn't shy away from their right-wing links nor in fact the right-wing influence in both Ukraine and Russia generally. Europe as a whole has much stronger, louder, visible – to suggest a phrase – "white-wing" groups and politics than we have. /This is just as true in Russia where many see themselves as the last great white Christian country. Again oft written about well before the current invasion.

    What you suggest is a fact is really only an opinion. That is part of the problem today – opinions are being described as facts and facts as opinions.


    • RedLogix 2.1

      This conflict has very little to do with race.

      It is primarily about a clash of values between authoritarian closed societies that treat their people as a population who exist only to serve the interests of the power elites – and open liberal societies in which the state exists to serve and protect the interest and freedoms of a people who are it's citizens.

      There are extremist ideologues on both the left and the right who openly embrace the closed authoritarian society because they fantasise this is the only way to impose their failed dreams on a captive population – so they can bully, coerce and murder their way to the utopia they believe is always for the greater good.

      Events of the past few years have flushed out plenty of left wing examples infesting this site.

      • KJT 2.1.1

        "left wing examples infesting this site”.

        C'mon don't be coy. Name one!

        • Incognito

          Let’s not. Let’s not start personal attacks and flame wars. Let’s address comments on their contents.


      • mikesh 2.1.2

        Bullshit. It's about (the prevention of) Western encroachment into territories which, at the very least, should remain neutral.

  3. Jester 3

    Good to read a positive story about someone working and being successful. So true what she says about the NZ tall poppy.

    Lotto wins over business success: Entrepreneur decries NZ's tall poppy syndrome – NZ Herald

    • Populuxe1 3.1

      My God! The amount of shit you get for owning a Ferrari.


      • joe90 3.1.1

        Two Ferraris, and a McLaren and a Porche and a Beamer etc etc…

        • Blade

          That picture should be on the bedroom wall of every young Lefty. On the opposite wall should be a picture of Tonga. In the middle should be a sign saying" New Zealand is heading in one direction, you should head in the other and enjoy the fruits of your labour if you are willing to work for it and change your mindset.

          • Blade

            In fact I would amend my above comment and say ''mind set'' is more important than work. Mindset covers a lot of ground. From changing subconscious beliefs that hinder one's life, to working magic in pursuit of your goals.

            Common mental blocks concerning wealth are:

            • I don't deserve it.
            • Money is dirty.
            • You need money to make money.
            • Rich people live off the backs of poor people.
            • Being wealthy means being selfish.
            • God hates rich people.
            • AB

              OK – let's replace these straw men you have thrown out there with some actual 'left' opinions:

              "I don't deserve it." Nobody deserves it if it is irrationally disproportionate to talent, effort and the social value created, which it commonly is. Complementing that, nobody deserves to be extremely poor either.

              "Money is dirty". Not intrinsically. It depends on how it is obtained and how it is used.

              "You need money to make money" – you don't, but you need it to turbocharge and accelerate the growth of your wealth

              "Rich people live off the backs of poor people" – see previous reply. Not always or entirely, but enormous and accelerating wealth is based on having the market power to extract from others a portion of the value they create.

              "Being wealthy means being selfish." The economic system itself requires selfishness. Individuals can be privately unselfish but systemically selfish. It's a mistake to focus on personal morality. The most we can say about personal morality is that becoming wealthy may make someone more selfish than they were before as their mind turns to retaining it. Or it may not do that.

              "God hates rich people" . We can't know if a personal God exists or not, let alone what his/her opinions are. We do know that human cultures and religions have always been suspicious of great wealth – and that worship of it is a fairly recent cultural phenomenon.

              • Blade

                You missed the point by a wide mile.

                You can't rationalise irrational subconscious fears. You can only remove the complex. It matters not what I think, or you think. Some people don't even know they have such beliefs. And those that have some realisation of what they believe still have to have an opposing belief entered into their mind until the problem complex loses its charge.

                You may be under the mistaken belief I think only Lefties have wrong beliefs about money. Not true, many Righties have the same problem.

            • Incognito

              If I were you I’d ask for my money back.

            • Incognito

              Are the mental blocks concerning wealth the same mental blocks concerning wellbeing or are the latter just bad habits?

          • Joe90

            Conceited nitwit nobody's ever heard of – RESPECT MAH PRIVILEGE!


    • KJT 3.2

      New Zealanders respect genuine inventers, entrepreneurs, and those who made their money through real hard work.

      Those who stumbled into lucrative bullshit jobs as financial "consultants”, housing speculators, inheriters of "Daddies money", and Ponzi scheme originators, not so much.

      It is the latter who tend to keep blethering about "Tall poppy syndrome".

      Those who genuinely "work hard for their money" share the general Kiwi contempt for blowhards.

      • Peter 3.2.1

        I can't remember the last time there was an article in the news about a Ferrari owning teacher or nurse upset at the 'tall poppy syndrome' thing they were going through.

        You reckon they should have worked harder? Or more effectively? Or charged each and every client $50, 508 like the subject of the current story?

        Imagine, 30 kids in my class x $50, 508 = $1,515,250. Ah, get rid of the Ford, get a Ferrari.

    • Bearded Git 3.3

      I'll happily drive her to the airport.

      • Jester 3.3.1

        I expect she can afford a chauffeur to drive her so you wont be needed. If you work hard and save up, maybe you will one day be able to afford a Ferrari too. Just cause she has done well, doesn't me you or I cant also do well.

    • Blade 3.4

      Yep, sensible wealthy people know to keep a low profile in New Zealand. Those who flaunt it soon learn the hard way, especially if they go broke.

      While the attitude towards wealth isn't as bad as it used to be, it still there. Labour relies on the ''envy factor'' as part of its political strategy. Sir Michael Cullen and David Parker are two fine examples of what the Left think about wealth.

      Sir Bob Jones said he used to get the finger about four times a week when he was in his Roller. I think Tui Teka got a pass when he drove his Roller because he was a bro… and he deserved it because of colonisation.

      From the link:

      ''Government officials have estimated 50,000 New Zealanders will leave the country over the next year to head off on an OE or for work as the borders reopen after two years of Covid-19 restricting travel.''

      More the question: How many are coming back? Talkback says not many.

      I can't see much improving under National, so I'm seriously thinking of moving to Perth. I went to an international removal company site online. They all have calculators for pricing container transport to your destination. I stopped at the beginning when a figure of $16,500 came up on the calculator. I think it's best to buy new in Australia.

      • KJT 3.4.1

        "The envy factor".

        “Talkback says”.

        You really do live in a bubble, don't you?

        Jones is a prime example of those who made money by pushing up land prices. While he tried to shaft the people who he was making money from, and benefit himself by playing political games. No wonder why he got the finger.

        • Blade

          Keep listening to National Socialist Radio, and be lead astray. I'm listening to real people from the street. People who have first hand knowledge from all types of industries and government departments. People who have been involved in all types of incidents that make the news.

          You meanwhile listen to random streams of thought within your limited intellect, and then have a cheek to say I live in a bubble.

      • so I'm seriously thinking of moving to Perth.

        Be sure to close the door on your way out.

        And I'm sure you'll be right at home with the Labor government of Western Australia.

        • Blade

          Will do. But first I'm waiting to see how National shapes up after assuming office in 2023.

          ''And I'm sure you'll be right at home with the Labor government of Western Australia.''

          Tells you something about the state of NZ, eh?

          BTW – will you be able to hack four or five terms of a Tory government? Just think, in that time some of the old timers on this blog will have passed on. The remaining posters will become more spiteful and frustrated as Labour fail time and again. In fact, it's possible this blog may not be around to enjoy a future Left leaning government. That's what happens when you create a blinkered loop and start believing your own bs instead of facing reality.

          • SPC

            So you believe that National will govern enzed for 4 or more terms after 2023 .. and so/and yet plan to live in Perth under a Labour government there.

            Will you come back if the next Labour government applies a CGT and wealth/estate taxation and so can fully fund public health?

          • KJT

            Very strange how Anti-socialism types, want to move to more Socialist States. LOL.

            • Blade

              ''And I'm sure you'll be right at home with the Labor government of Western Australia.''

              Tells you something about the state of NZ, eh?

    • SPC 3.5

      Puff piece by the Herald to promote limited tax cuts to the hard pressed middle, to enable large ones (removing the top rate, limiting the bright-line test and restoring tax deductibility for interest to landlords) to the deserving few.

      Presumably hoping this middle class does not realise they had better put it and more into health insurance because cutting taxes and underfunding public health will impact them too.

    • AB 3.6

      Rule of thumb: anyone complaining about the "tall poppy syndrome" is suffering from narcissistic dejection – they are sad, hurt and surprised to find that other people don't view them as self-evidently a superior being.

      There may be exceptions – I'm yet to encounter one.

  4. aj 4

    … and open liberal societies in which the state exists to only to serve the interests of the power elites

    … so they can bully, coerce and murder their way to the utopia they believe is always for the elite's good.

    FIFY. Describes the USA to a tee. Tweedle Dee / Tweedle Dum. It's all about money. Always has been, always will be.

    • RedLogix 4.1

      Why then are you not living in Russia? You love the place so much – yet here you are living in one of those nasty open liberal democracies you hate and you do nothing about it.

      BTW twisting someone’s words like that is a deeply dishonest bit of fuckery. But like all tankies you have no conscience so why should I be surprised.

  5. KJT 5

    Meanwhile the "useless" police and the "useless" police Minister carry on with the job of successfully doing something about gang related gun crime.

    Auckland gang shootings: Two arrests, Police seize restricted firearms, ammunition at New Windsor house – NZ Herald

    1500 firearms seized in police crackdown on gangs, organised crime – NZ Herald

    Operation Tauwhiro sees 64 firearms seized in Northland, 42 arrested | New Zealand Police

    Giving the lie to the bullshit flying around from our genuinely useless National politicians, the talking heads on TV and their parrots here..

  6. Poission 6

    US seizes Iranian tanker in Greek waters,offloads oil at sea.

    In Retaliation Iran seizes 2 Greek Tankers.

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It appears that the upgrade to Wordpress 6 is causing issues on the comment Reply feature. I'll look at that in a couple of hours lprent