Open mike 29/09/2010

46 comments on “Open mike 29/09/2010 ”

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1. Pascal's bookie 1

   29 September 2010 at 8:30 am

   We all know that the Tea Party people are not a bunch of astroturfed racist GOP crackers pissed off that a black mooslim from kenya is wrongfully sitting in the oval office so stop saying that.

   Instead they are simple but intelligent citizens deeply concerned about the deficit, that’s all, and they are not even partisan, they just prefer the GOP to the Dems because the GOP addresses their concerns better.

   So I guess they will turn on the GOP now and decide that voting for the Dems in Nov is better for addressing those concerns…

   http://www.tnr.com/blog/jonathan-chait/77981/the-pledge-increase-the-deficit

   Nah.
2. prism 2

   29 September 2010 at 9:44 am

   Objectively looking at the political entity we have in NZ it seems that our democracy isn’t prized by pollies or the public and is open to shonky redevelopment from crafty practitioners that rival leaky home builders. The public in general sit like fat slugs watching all this and seem happy to see the diminishing or arbitrary wiping of laws that provide some controls over the excesses and obssessive notions of politicians and their flunkeys. Who cares well not many. ‘You don’t know what you’ve got till it’s gone, The pay paradise put up a parking lot”. Refrain from the ’60s.

   Thinking Tolley, Brownlee, Key, Christchurch Commissioner, Christchurch emergency powers, Auckland Supershitty, excessive employment freedoms, etc.
   • rosy 2.1

     29 September 2010 at 10:31 am

     And on that note I’ll roll out my favourite quote. I’m taking back from the rednecks who incorrectly use it for in support of their ‘freedom’ (to carry guns etc.). It was written by a liberal who opposed to the Irish Union with Britain by a man who spent his life defending the rights of the Irish http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Philpot_Curran

     “It is the common fate of the indolent to see their rights become a prey to the active. The condition upon which God hath given liberty to man is eternal vigilance; which condition if he break, servitude is at once the consequence of his crime and the punishment of his guilt.” — John Philpot Curran: Speech upon the Right of Election for Lord Mayor of Dublin, 1790.
     • prism 2.1.1

       29 September 2010 at 11:05 am

       Thanks rosy and Bored – some things to think about and a good link to study.
       I’m all studied out on net at present so brain is tired. Finding out why my electric motor mower may have burnt out (not had long) and learned about the drop in voltage over long extension cords. Learning the hard way is expensive.

       Does anyone know the right wording of the proverb which I think is Chinese, possibly Confucian? There are three ways of learning. The first is to be taught by someone knowledgable, The second is to observe others’ experience in life and understand. and the third, and hardest, is to learn from personal experience!
       • Bored 2.1.1.1

         29 September 2010 at 1:04 pm

         No but another Taoist one goes along the lines of “the true path is obvious, crooked paths are popular”.
   • Bored 2.2

     29 September 2010 at 10:52 am

     Prism, I posted this in reply to Lanthe on the Emergency earthquake legislation, her boyfriend questioned whythe act was needed…

     Lanthe, your boyfriends question on why this law ever came to exist? Great question.

     Coming away from the circumstances which you and others say will be replicated, there are some underlying questions about our psyche as a people, our commitment to democracy and our need for assurance, certainty and protection.

     Maybe we are inclined toward authoritarian approaches to issues, maybe National have a strong paternalistic head of the family psyche. Maybe it shows we might happily shelve all of our concensual arrangements when trouble appears. Maybe it shows we are not averse to dictatorship if it “gets things done”. Mayhaps we are troubled children who have such need of haste that we willingly in the face of adversity jump from frying pan to fire.

     What I do know is that lasting results are concensual as opposed to imposed. They can take time and careful consideration. I see the new Act as a knee jerk reaction that displays a total lack of faith by all those in parliament for the capabilites of, and the foundation principles of the institution they represent.

     PS In the words of the cheesemaker in the advert “good things take time”.
     • Colonial Viper 2.2.1

       29 September 2010 at 11:14 am

       A couple of interesting ideas Bored. I suspect that people want to feel a string sense of direction, certainty, leadership from Govt. Seeminglessly endless rounds of consultation and compromise over non-mainstream issues are often not as valued as (Labour) might think it is It may actually suggest – actually as a Govt you don’t have a vision for the future yourself that you are determined in striding towards with confidence and effectiveness.

       (Look at how the Democrats in the US are about to get caned in a few weeks; the Republican obstruction and obfuscation tactics have worked brilliantly in forcing the Democrats to compromise compromise compromise)

       And that is also why a nanny/nursemaid metaphor was used by NATs to spin the negative frame, whereas a strong paternalistic head of the family psyche seems much more acceptable.

       Just wondering.
       • prism 2.2.1.1

         29 September 2010 at 11:37 am

         Could be that Labour has used consultation without action CV but the NACTs are using focus groups in a similar way aren’t they.

         Consultation with the public by Labour has often been used over the decades – I went to one about economic direction etc back in the 80’s?
         I had a feeling of utter futility there when at the end a summary of the discussions was read. My thought was listed as wanting lower taxes. Doh! Any idiot says that.

         My idiotic suggestion was that big employers should receive some tax relief for each employee from the government, possibly towards an R&D grant. It made sense to me as workers paying PAYE were a good source of revenue that would balance the tax relief to those enterprises.

         But it seems ideas that don’t come from Treasury or the favourite trick pony don’t get listened to. My latest is that GST should be coded with region of trade or even more local, classification numbers. Then a percentage of their GST turnover be returned to the area, to be spent on infrastructure and development in that area. Could be potable water, sports amenities, wider bridges etc. Go-ahead places trying to build business and jobs would be rewarded and all citizens would see and receive advantage of the area supporting and promoting business. Sort of “Oh that’s good they have fixed our drains from the money from the opera house”. Any chance of something so practical and identifiable by local people being taken up??
         • Bored 2.2.1.1.1

           29 September 2010 at 1:54 pm

           I was probably at that conference…they listened and recorded their way….and we all left the Labour Party. Your ideas sound too practical by half. And as you say you dont work for Treasury either so your ideas must be inferior. Now just be quiet and be a good well behaved person!
       • Bored 2.2.1.2

         29 September 2010 at 1:01 pm

         Cognative linguistics are a big part of the whole “strong father” model of leadership…have a listen to this link to get the whole framing of metaphors used by the “right”.

         http://www.radio4all.net/index.php/program/43731

         This is politically probably the MOST IMPORTANT thing I have listened to for years. It explains why people vote National and for “aspiration”.
     • Lanthanide 2.2.2

       29 September 2010 at 11:15 am

       FYI, I’m a guy.
       • True Blue 2.2.2.1

         29 September 2010 at 3:02 pm

         Are you Chris Carter?
   • Draco T Bastard 2.3

     29 September 2010 at 12:31 pm

     Paved Paradise by Joni Mitchel
3. Bored 3

   29 September 2010 at 12:49 pm

   Lanthe, Cool, so am I, but I have had the wrong gender assigned on the blogs…apologies if offended.
4. joe90 4

   29 September 2010 at 1:26 pm

   Tea party takes over the comic pages.
5. comedy 5

   29 September 2010 at 1:28 pm

   India may be on to something here……….

   http://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=10676781

   “For nearly four decades monkeys have held sway in New Delhi’s corridors of power and spread mayhem across the campus of the nearby All India Institute of Medical Sciences, India’s flagship research institution.

   Powerful policymakers walk warily down passageways in North and South Blocks that house among others the Prime Minister’s office and the Defence and Home Ministries, for fear of being set upon by monkeys, concealed in niches in the sandstone buildings built by the Colonial administration.”

   I’m sure feral monkeys attacking MPs would lead to an improvement amongst National and Labour MPs and the rest of the fools in parliament……. and if it doesn’t what the fuck stream it onto the net it’ll make for great viewing in the debating chamber when whomever’s speaking gets sconed by a monkey throwing its fresh turd at them
   • prism 5.1

     29 September 2010 at 1:39 pm

     That’s true comedy.
6. Draco T Bastard 6

   29 September 2010 at 2:42 pm

   Contempt for our constitution

   Gerry Brownlee’s reaction to yesterday’s open letter from legal academics condemning the Canterbury Enabling Act? Utter contempt. Here’s his response to NZPA:

   Earthquake recovery Minister Gerry Brownlee said the Act wouldn’t be changed and he was not worried by what “hand-wringing academics” thought.

   And to Radio New Zealand:

   The Minister of Earthquake Recovery, Gerry Brownlee, says that the Government doesn’t need to justify the law, and that any suggestion it will be misused is not worth responding to.

   Should we really be surprised that the petty dictators in NACT show such contempt for our democracy?
   • Bill 6.1

     29 September 2010 at 5:56 pm

     I’ve got a post pending that’s connected with all that, but from a slightly different angle. What’s not in the post though, is the fact that the media have dropped all coverage of CERRA again like it was a hot potato.

     Is it unreasonable to assume that when Gerry said, ‘Piss off!’, that our media obliged?
   • Armchair Critic 6.2

     29 September 2010 at 9:16 pm

     It was pretty disappointing. Here was Gerry with the opportunity to tell everyone that there was no way in the world he would even consider abusing the powers he has been given, and not only did he decline the opportunity, he went on the attack against his critics. While it’s not time for me to get my tinfoil hat out, it was hardly an inspiring response.
     I’ve wondered whether The Standard could have a section dedicated to the CERRA, at least until it expires. It could be a way to keep track of the various orders, and opinions on those orders, all in one place.
7. outofbed 7

   29 September 2010 at 4:56 pm

   Congratulations to James Shaw for being selected as the Green Party candidate for Wellington Central

   http://www.jamesshaw.net.nz
8. Jilly Bee 8

   29 September 2010 at 5:24 pm

   I’ve just heard Finlay McDonald [on Jim Mora’s Panel] this afternoon mention that how quickly the Government has taken on board the advice to change the give way rules at intersections, but still hasn’t enough evidence/research to lower the alcohol limit – hmmmmmm. I have family living in Melbourne and our son much prefers the N Z law – he reckons there usually is a stampede of right turning traffic, even at the [relatively] few traffic light intersections with a right turn filter, with cars running the red lights to turn right and not to have to wait for a further phase. Also, as I found when driving there a few months ago and being super aware of the law I found that sometimes the wait is extremely long to get a gap in the traffic on a busy main road in order to turn right. This was in the Kew/Hawthorn area. I can envisage road rage and impatience rearing its ugly head once this rule is enacted.
   • Carol 8.1

     29 September 2010 at 5:43 pm

     The current law may be OK if you grew up with it. But I left NZ before it come into being. When I returned to live in NZ after 20+ years overseas, I had real difficulty getting used to this law. It took a long time to remember it well enough to put it into practice. It just doesn’t come instinctively to me. For several years I would remind myself about the rule while driving, then, a minute later at an intersection, I would instinctively turn left immediately & get honked at.

     Really, I think it’s better to come into line with what most people are used to overseas. I still find it pretty tricky when the current left turn law conflicts with the right turning vehicle being prevented from turning due to on-coming traffic. Too messy IMO.

     I agree with Finlay McDonald on the relative quickness in changing this law, compared with the lack of change on drink driving laws.
     • Jilly Bee 8.1.1

       29 September 2010 at 6:11 pm

       Carol, I’m old enough to have coped with both rules – I got my drivers licence in 1959, yep – I was 15 and and just had to drive around the block, do a three point turn, take off on a slope without running backwards and answer a few Road Code questions! I’m sure we will cope with the change, but patience will certainly be a virtue.
       • ianmac 8.1.1.1

         29 September 2010 at 9:01 pm

         Me too Jilly. I suspect that a tester can tell in seconds the competency of a driver. I offered recently to share the driving with a woman wh was faced with a two way trip of 300km each way in a day. She drove first. She was absolutely appalling! Within a few Kms I took over the driving for the entire trip. I reckon testers can tell as well.
         • Lanthanide 8.1.1.1.1

           29 September 2010 at 10:30 pm

           My sister is doing Phd work on older drivers. A lot of them might think that they know that they aren’t the best drivers, but usually the ones that think that are actually a lot worse than what they think (hopefully that makes sense). As a consequence, a lot of older drivers only drive during 10am to 2pm during the day to avoid rush-hour traffic, and only around areas that they know. Diminished confidence on the road ends up being a vicious circle, where they restrict their driving further and further and end up losing the skills.

           Also married women tend to let their husbands do the driving, and then when their husbands die, find that they can’t cope with driving any more and end up losing their independence.
   • Armchair Critic 8.2

     29 September 2010 at 10:19 pm

     Steven Joyce wants us to stop giving way to the right. That’s a good idea. Took me a while to work out he was referring to the road rules, initially I thought he was talking about voting.
     • Lanthanide 8.2.1

       29 September 2010 at 10:31 pm

       Although one has to question how intersections, particularly traffic light patterns, have been developed over time with the current give-way rules in mind. Some intersections may now become impossible to get around during busy times.
       • Armchair Critic 8.2.1.1

         29 September 2010 at 10:49 pm

         It looks a lot like poorly thought through policy to me, like change for the sake of being seen to do something. I am still deciding whether I think it is a good idea or not (Mr Joyce has given me very little of substance to help me form an opinion). I’d like to know how this got to the top of the list of things to do to improve road safety.
9. Armchair Critic 9

   29 September 2010 at 9:58 pm

   Wonder what that lovely Mr Key thinks of his record of stopping people moving to Australia, ‘cos it ain’t looking good. And what does the equally lovely Mr Farrar think about the number of people departing for Australia since he posted this about it. Hey John, you’re the PM now, you need to provide an answer. It’s quite clear what you have done in the last two years – which is nothing. You thought it was a problem before the election and it’s obviously still a problem now. So what are you going to do? Let me guess…
   • Draco T Bastard 9.1

     29 September 2010 at 11:10 pm

     Ah, so since NACT came to power the brain drain has increased. Probably has to do with the lowering wages.
     • Armchair Critic 9.1.1

       30 September 2010 at 12:00 am

       Probably has to do with the lowering wages
       and probably a whole lot of other things that have not been improved by National’s inconsistent inaction.
     • Clint Heine 9.1.2

       30 September 2010 at 12:12 am

       Or that fact wages are getting better overseas. I negotiated without my union a quite nice little payrise.
   • Colonial Viper 9.2

     30 September 2010 at 12:03 am

     Good talent can always tell when management ‘leadership’ is actually confused and self serving.
10. Armchair Critic 10

    29 September 2010 at 10:40 pm

    I have no doubts at all that the promised savings after the reorganisation of Auckland will not occur.
    • Draco T Bastard 10.1

      29 September 2010 at 11:11 pm

      Most of Auckland realised that when we were told, by the dictators of NACT, that we were getting a SuperShitty whether we liked it or not.
      • Armchair Critic 10.1.1

        29 September 2010 at 11:59 pm

        Indeed, what they have delivered is worse service for a higher price. Funnily enough I don’t see that in their election promises.
11. Clint Heine 11

    30 September 2010 at 12:14 am

    Anybody else see that awfully nice endorsement for Cameron Slator from none other than Matt McCarten? http://supercitypicks.com/

Links to post

1. DJ Burt: posted on 25 July 2008 at 10:15 am
2. Jeremy Greenbrook: posted on 2 April 2009 at 6:51 pm
3. Fiji Truth Movement.: posted on 5 September 2009 at 9:36 am
4. Clare Curran: posted on 19 October 2009 at 8:17 am
5. Alastair Jamieson: posted on 14 February 2010 at 7:04 pm
6. Alastair Jamieson: posted on 31 March 2010 at 8:14 pm
7. LGD: posted on 20 May 2010 at 9:20 am
8. The Standard: posted on 28 September 2010 at 5:12 pm

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