Thanks for bringing this to my attention Qot. Much appreciated.
Without your assistance I would have missed this.
You are right this is a damn good speech. Keep up the good work Russel.
The only thing is, Key skewered him over the Emissions Trading Scheme. The fact of the matter is that the Pollution Trading Scheme, as it should accurately be called, is a Labour Party and National Government supported scheme to let the polluters off the hook. If I remember the debate properly, (and I do), at the time the Green Party had severe reservations about the PTS. Reservations that have been proved correct.
Now is the perfect time to rip the veil off and expose those who really support this dirty scheme.
Key in his reply, threatened Russel Norman that if the climate debate comes up in the election he will use the Pollution Trading Scheme to flay the Green Party.
The Green Party need to answer fire with fire.
And expose the Nats for their support for this scheme, that lets polluters off the hook to freely pollute at will. And dumps the bill on the taxpayers.
I call on the Green Party to put up private members bill calling for the complete repeal of the falsely named, Emissions Trading Scheme.
This will lead to a real debate on how to concretely cut back on our CO2 emissions, that is being held back though the use of this phoney scheme.
Let’s make New Zealand free to become a shining example to the world.
My proposed bill: The Green Party calls on parliament to completely abolish the Emissions Trading Scheme. the purpose of this bill to clear the ground for parliament to discuss a more proper and equable way to concretely cut our CO2 emissions.
Let’s have this debate in parliament. Right here. Right now, and during the elections. Without this terrible charade, clouding the issue.
Whether it is the National, or Labour Party version of the Pollution Trading Scheme both versions permit Business As Usual to carry on regardless. (Which was the intention).
Such an initiative if taken up by the Green Party caucus will earn them banner headlines and the respect of all sections of society. (Except the fossil fuel industry barons, who love this scheme.)
To win the debate on climate change the Green Party need to get rid of this dead albatross that the Labour and National Parties have draped on their shoulders.
Now which legislation do you want the Green Party to put into the ballot first Jenny, the ‘we ban all coal mining bill’ or ‘the we can the Emissions Trading Scam in favor of a carbon tax bill’,
Now you might have to wait for quite some time Jenny because there’s this little Parliamentary convention that Opposition Party’s don’t just get to propose Legislation, they have to go in a ballot Jenny, some go in and never see the light of day Jenny and that’s just the nature of ballots…
I will never win Lotto, because I never buy a ticket. Some bills go in the ballot and never see the light of day. Don’t you think the odds are much improved for a bill being drawn, if it is actually in the draw.
What are you really trying to say here, Bad?
For goodness sakes don’t put any bills like this in, in case they get drawn?
Yes Daveo what a loss indeed! Small wonder Shearer is so very afraid of him, he could never match sheer brilliance of this nature. But, incredibly, still looks as though Labour is content to settle for second (or third) best.
Given the limitations of the paradigm he operates from within and bearing in mind there are some fundamental aspects of that paradigm that are anathema to me…there was a lot in that speech that came across as positive and that would win my support.
And I’m aware he was accomodating the present Labour Party’s perspective and yet…well, let me put it this way: Dare I listen to David Shearer’s speech and compare the two? Nah. It would just blast away any positive feelings that Cunliffe’s speech has generated.
And the opening lines that referred to Melon(?) of the US Treasury(?) speaking in the 30’s? I was honestly thinking ‘Shearer, Shearer, Shearer’ – not ‘Key, Key, Key’. Was it deliberately ambigious? I don’t know. I can only state my reaction.
And politics ‘with people’ and not ‘to people’ – and being ‘hands on’ with regards to the levers of economic management sounds to me to be a million miles away from David Shearer’s ‘hands on’. His ‘hands on’ leaves me suspecting heavy handedness and interference in areas way beyond basic economic matters and has me gearing up for something a bit dirty, dodgy and unwelcome.
And wasn’t it soooo refreshing to hear a Labour Party mp express empathy for the unemployed rather banging on about the unemployed ‘doing their bit’ to earn the grace of a government and its conditional support?
And the snippet that brought Shearer to the forefront of my mind?
People will work harder, live a more moral life. Values will be adjusted…
It just dovetails right on into the likes of
My promise to you as Prime Minister is that I will always stand up for the hardworking, forgotten New Zealanders. You’re doing your bit, it’s time you had a Government that did its bit too.
and
A Government that says: you do your bit, we’ll do ours. That’s what a Labour Government will do. That’s what a government I lead will do
To me that’s a whole lot of ‘hands on’ and no obvious ‘hands up’. Be ‘good’ and exhibit the ‘correct’ forms of behaviour and we’ll be there for you. Otherwise…
Now contrast that with doing politics ‘with people’ and not ‘to people’.
Given the limitations of the paradigm he operates from within…
Yep, such as this bit:
change that sees unions, for example, as a core part of building better workplaces, not as a cost to be saved.
Still in the capitalist paradigm. It’s not that we need unions as that we need for our businesses to be cooperatives controlled by the workers for the workers rather than owned and controlled by a few for the benefit of a few (who probably don’t even work there).
Labour, under David Shearer, is called on again to take up its historic mission of hands-on Government, of big change, of a new era, and of a better way that does politics with our people, not to them;
That’s good but, so far, I haven’t seen any such commitment from Shearer.
“Finally, it is time we restored pride in being a Kiwi. So Labour’s new direction will be built on a strong, high-value economy and the values of social inclusion, tolerance, and diversity that are the hallmark of any great society.
Labour, under David Shearer, is called on again to take up its historic mission of hands-on Government, of big change, of a new era, and of a better way that does politics with our people, not to them; that empowers New Zealanders from the bottom up; that does not slash them from the top down; that builds a high-value economy; that delivers an inclusive society; that champions a sustainable environment; and that celebrates our unique identity.”
Pretty clear on many levels what is being said there.
Yes Cunliffe did mention ‘the environment’. Just as the Green Party mention ‘the environment’ but play down climate change.
I can’t help getting the feeling that Cunliffe has had his wings clipped, so as not to upset the Obama/Romney type gentleman’s agreement not to bring up climate change during the upcoming elections.
Yes and as usual it was the best speech out of the Labour camp. And after watching Meteria Turei and Julie Ann Genter, is there any wonder that this time around I will tick Green and NOT Red. But I am still going through the replies to Key’s Alcohol fueled? rant in Parliament. So now for some light relief, and with ALL translators running. I get to Hekia Parata’s speech it should be interesting.
Anyone who was at the town hall meetings last time in which Cunliffe was head to head against Shearer will know how Cunliffe can rock the hall and leave the rest of them just unable to follow. They can hate on him all they like, he’s the best speaker Labour has in the entire party.
Cunliffe is the primary opposite of Key; Key has got by for so long on jokes and winning a room with charm, while all the fun ruthless steel with officials gets done by Joyce and Brownlee. With Cunliffe you know it will be quite humorless and earnest, but you sure know what’s coming: it will be breakthrough government, bold and break and remake government. The fun ruthles steel will be right out in the open.
It will be what he did to Telecom, except across every portfolio. I would love to hear Russell Norman say what he would break and remake. Because I know there is only one person National fears getting the leadership of Labour and of the country, and it ain’t David Shearer.
Gareth Hughes makes some very good points about the first fines dished out via a Skynet file downloading/uploading decision:
The case was won by the Recording Industry Association of New Zealand (RIANZ) against an unnamed female Telecom customer who had downloaded a Rihanna song ‘Man Down’ and has ordered her to pay $616.57.
Leaving aside the question of whether it was smart for RIANZ to focus on downloading a Rihanna song in ‘defence’ of Kiwi artists or the music taste of the Telecom customer this first case raises a number of questions.
Reading the Tribunal’s decision the first thing that jumps out is the acknowledgment that there is insufficient evidence for the tribunal make detailed findings on her defence but that the Act creates a statutory presumption that an infringement notice constitutes an infringement of the rights holders work. …
The Telecom customers defence was that she didn’t realise downloading the ‘Man Down’ song was illegal, the second song ‘Tonight, Tonight’ wasn’t downloaded by her or anyone she knew and that the file downloading software possibly continued downloading ‘Man Down’ automatically leading to the subsequent ‘strike’ because she couldn’t remove the software. She accepts responsibility for the first song, deleted it and apologised.
It looks like she is being punished for not being able to uninstall the software and possibly for having an unsecured wireless account or anonymous file-downloading house-guest.
Chillingly the Tribunal notes the use of downloading software was ‘a deliberate act’ while this is so, as the Megaupload case has highlighted these types of file sharing sites can be used for legitimate lawful purposes and shouldn’t automatically be considered proof of online copyright infringement.
While this Telecom customer is now $616.57 poorer and RIANZ have a successful ruling from the Tribunal under their belt it’s hard to argue the Skynet law has been effective at reducing infringing or supporting artists.
<i…..Asking for it. By daring to be a woman to be in public life, Mary Beard was asking to be abused and harassed and frightened, and so is any person who dares to express herself whilst in possession of a pair of tits.
It’s an attitude so quotidian that only when you pause to pick it apart does its true horror become apparent. I am contacted, not every day, but most weeks, by young women who want to build lives as journalists or activists but are afraid of the possible backlash. Every time I receive one of these letters, I get a lurch of guilt: should I tell them the truth? Should I tell them that sometimes I’ve been so wracked with anxiety by the actions of trolls and stalkers that I’ve been afraid to leave the house, that I’ve had to call in the police, that there’s every chance they might too? Or should I tell them to be brave, to take it on the chin, to not be frightened, because their fear, their reticence to speak, is precisely what the trolls want to see most of all?….
…The internet is a young country. Its laws and customs are not yet decided. We don’t have to accept sexist hatred in silence any more. This week, with many victims sharing their stories of online harassment on the hashtag #silentnomore, the fightback began in earnest.
Special call to Brian Edwards, who is persisting in deriding those who use pseudonyms on the webs, on the grounds that he is able to use his real name and “what’s the difference’?
“Mary Beard was asking to be abused and harassed and frightened, and so is any person who dares to express herself whilst in possession of a pair of tits.
A pair of tits with long grey hair apparently makes it worse because it confuses the poor dears who can’t work out what sort of woman she’s meant to be. So they end up with ‘witch’.
If you are bad at processing complex information, this combination will fry your brain. (What, a woman past breeding age still up for it? As if sex was all about procreation. As Beard may tell you, even the Romans used contraceptives.) And perhaps in this frazzled state you might lash out at the person who has made you confront this enigma – the woman who really shouldn’t turn you on, but who somehow causes you to have filthy thoughts. (Sound anything like your mother?)
She can probably handle it, but I really feel for a lot of women who try to say anything controversial on the internet. They have the opposite problem – how can someone you might fancy possibly go on and on about things that are seriously challenging your world view?
“Special call to Brian Edwards, who is persisting in deriding those who use pseudonyms on the webs, on the grounds that he is able to use his real name and “what’s the difference’?”
Really? Is the tosser still pouting like a child on this issue? Hey, Edwards, two things….. 1, stop reading this shit then and 2, do you understand why voting is confidential and not public?
You know, what it really reflects is Edwards inability to objectively assess an issue. His assessment is completely and utterly tied up in his own circumstances and not been separated. A quite fundamental failure.
Another weird thing LPrent, the teaser in the comment lost it’s italics during moderation. I swear they were there when the finished comment appeared after I pressed “post”. Otherwise I would have edited because it annoys me when it is unclear who is saying what.
Past of course but present I’m not so sure because if the percentage of workers in NZ in a union is low (as I suspect but don’t know) then maybe giving the unions more representation is not a good way to go…
Too lazy or brain dead to do the research yourself to find out the answer to your question, instead you expect others to do it for you, a sense of entitlement perhaps…
National should probably take more on board the views of small to medium business owners first (but I wouldn’t hold my breath) but it also depends on how much tax revenue each sector generates I guess
Being the largest export earner then yes. Sure everybody should be listened to but to pay for things you do need money but listening doesn’t have to mean bending over backwards for someone
They only listen to the people who vote for them, hence the poor people of east Christchurch being left to live in shit while the farmers 40km away get immediate attention to everything and $400million for their privately owned businesses.
The world in NZ is unbalanced and slowly toppling. It is the leaning tower of milk biscuits.
Well democracy beats other tried and tested methods I guess, mind you its not like we have a decent form of democracy here…national, national, labour, labour, labour, national, labour, national, national, national, labour, labour etc etc
That’s the result of representative democracy. If we had participatory democracy you wouldn’t get that and we’d probably get more stable government as well.
Dead right, Chris! I’m hoping that we can move to a system where other parties get a fair go and can even be included in governing coalitions. Something that would stop the right gerrymandering election results and ‘winning’ while losing the popular vote. It could be based on proprtional representation. I’ve even thought of a name for it: Mixed Member Proportional. MMP, for short. Do you think it’ll catch on?
and when the largest party only has half or two thirds of the required support to form a government, the other parties in government become less “hangers on” and more “coalition partners”.
For all the David Shearer fans (and I know there are many)
When it comes to David Shearer I’m reminded of professional wrestling (seriously) in that the wrestlers portray persona’s IE baby-face, heel, naive, sneaky etc etc
But the best ones are those that are exaggerations of what they’re like in real life
The best examples of this would be The Rock and Stone Cold who both went through various persona’s before they found the fit and became superstars
So the “tough guy” act isn’t working then maybe he needs to exaggerate his own qualities like nice guy, competent manager etc etc
Strange analogy, but I think I see what you’re saying.
The problem with that scenario is that how Labour marketed him in the first place – competent manager, facilitator, hero. They couldn’t sell it whereas they think the tough guy approach is more appealing, for some reason.
It is strange but when you consider wrestlers and politicians both try to “sell” an image…the other lesson wrestling could teach Shearer is give the people what they want (not what the advisers want) in this instance CM Punk is a good example
He was packaged by the bookers as a straight-edge good guy but the public didn’t buy it and he soon morphed into a heel (and a damn good one) so I guess the question is what do the Labour members want?
The best examples of this would be The Rock and Stone Cold who both went through various persona’s before they found the fit and became superstars
And it doesn’t hurt that each of them were very much involved in the creation of their successful personas.
On the other hand Million Dollar Man Ted Dibiase was just given one to play with out-of-the-box and he was highly successful. I’m sure there’s some kind of analogy to be made there.
ooh ooh,
“I have gazed on the face of Agamemnon”, and he was found wanting (though this, too, was never proved; Ares seemed incapable of original thought, wants what Aphrodite wants; may as well worship the sun, we’ll rest safely in Electra Dreams)
-Somewhere near Orion there’s a Nestor ian Chryses.e.e (from an Odyssey beyond The Street Cafe, cumming as you are, soaked in Bleach any mule know dat you got a tight connection to my heart) 🙂 Love ya work! you thin white duke.Shock me to the core.
So your boredom negates your responsibility under the law? I think not.
I can’t possibly allow to persist a situation where my reputation is so sullied by false accusations of racism.
I ask you for a final time to atone for your error.
I think it’s pretty obvious to old hand forum users, that some posters, like kong, piss contest themselves into a corner and no matter how factually incorrect or clearly in the wrong, leave themselves no way back without destroying their web id in the process.
But not me.
Reading his contributions, I don’t think the commentator is at all at ‘one with him/herself’ to begin with, but still, direct, definitive statements like those expressed above reach out far and wide across the web, especially on such a notable site such as this, and if left unchallenged, so would my lack of a response – A bit like the PM when he sat by and let a c list breakfast tv host make racist comments about then Governor general and all other similar coloured skinned New Zealanders. Guilt by doing fuck all.
I accept I won’t get the apology I deserve, but again, that neither diminishes the falsehood or the potential negative impact it could have my charitable and business projects.
If he were a rich prick, my legal pit bull would be all over it already, but I suspect KK isn’t, so what’s the point? In this instance I’m content to let the regular contributors of the standard decide if I’m a racist or kk loses what little credibility he/she had.
If it’s all about picking the right battles to fight, I’ll keep my powder dry for just now.
My message to caucus is this ‘Give Cunliffe back his portfolios,give Cunliffe back his mana,
give back HIS rightful place as leader,that he won in the prior election process, in not doing
so demonstrates the lack of being an inclusive thinking caucus and one only for the ‘selected
few’, i, as a potential voter demand it.
Yes, you are right CV, i read the transcript and just felt annoyed at the lack of
recognition for the grass roots,members etc, by the current caucus, i vented.
My frustration is that we have a viable,astute,potential leader and he has been
tossed aside in order to save an incapable individual.
Since jobs and manufacturing are the problem we should be celebrating their demise.
Get over it!
Oh, I forgot, Ben want us all to be slaves of the industrial economy and the money-lenders, and spend our time working in jobs that provide no satisfaction and wreck the ling term future for everyone.
[lprent: Since you have made a vague attempt to pin your hobby horse to the post I will just move this thread to OpenMike.
However next time I see you do it this type of diversion again, I’ll not only push the whole thread into OpenMike and then ban you for quite a few months to prevent me from having to waste my time again.
This is what you got banned for the last time I had to do it. If you want to discuss something this divergent to the intent of the post – start it in OpenMike. Don’t be a lazy jerk and expect me to keep cleaning up behind you. ]
The Gormless Fool formerly known as Oleolebiscuitbarrell 11.1
Actually it’s quite a rational view of the New Zealand economy although the manner ‘AFew’ frames the comment does not quite address it that way,
There is in fact no way on this planet without severe Government intervention that ‘the market’ can or ever has provided enough employment in the New Zealand for all those wanting such employment,
Only a highly protected economy can provide that, or, an economy where the tax base is used to produce employment for all…
The Gormless Fool formerly known as Oleolebiscuitbarrell 11.1.2.1
Those of is who do not die of starvation, will be left to eat the beans and rice they have hoarded before the end comes and then fight it out with each other over what is left.
Misunderstand Him, no not at all, He is speaking from a position of CO2 release into the atmosphere and i fully understand the theory of the worse case scenario just as i also fully understand that politics and politicians are mostly reactionary in that until the first wave crashes through the international departure lounge of Wellington airport whereupon they will all start being ‘true believers’ CO2 release into the atmosphere will be at best given lip service…
Insanity is attempting to perpetuate a system that is rapidly destroying the Earth, and has no future because the energy necessary to run the in the future does not exist.
Of course intelligent discussion of issues is beyond your brain capacity so you persist in posting juvenile commentary.
The simple fact is, unless the global industrial system collapses very soon nobody will be able to survive on this planet beyond 2040. Even the IMF has said so.
Of course a brain-dead individual like you obviously cannot appreciate the ramifications of a 4oC or 6oC rise in average temperature in a matter of decades.
“Of course a brain-dead individual like you obviously cannot appreciate the ramifications of a 4oC or 6oC rise in average temperature in a matter of decades.”
Average temperature of NZ goes from 15C to 19C. Oh noes, we’re all going to die! Northern parts of Australia have this sort of average temperature and people manage to live there just fine. Even aborigines did, and they did it without fossil fuels.
I know you have a very small brain and cannot process information well but instead of thinking about NZ going from 15oC to 19oC you might like to consider the effect of arctic regions going from minus 2oc to plus 2oC.
In practice the Arctic regions are super-sensitive to small changes in temperature and tend to amplify them (albedo effect amongst many others) so the temperature of the artic regions is likely to rise by 10 or 20oC if the Earth’s average temperature rises by 4oC. Expect massive sea level rise (several metres) and out-of-control positive feedback that take the temperature up another 10oC, i.e. +16oC above the present average temperature. That is exactly what the latest research indicates.
As I have noted previously, most people are uninformed, stupid and stubborn.
As for the IMF citation, how about you doing a quick search.. You obviously need practice in doing research, since you do so little and do not even know very rudimentary stuff.
By the way, Australia has recently announced a new record average temperature of 40.3oC. That has been enough to devastate large swathes of the country. Meanwhile, the higher ocean temperatures are resulting in ever increasing damage due to flooding.
Those in favour of perpetuating present economic arrangements are in favour of ever greater devastation.
“As for the IMF citation, how about you doing a quick search.. You obviously need practice in doing research, since you do so little and do not even know very rudimentary stuff.”
You’re the one that made the claim. Don’t make me do work for you.
“In practice the Arctic regions are super-sensitive to small changes in temperature and tend to amplify them (albedo effect amongst many others) so the temperature of the artic regions is likely to rise by 10 or 20oC if the earth’s average temperature rises by 4oC.”
Citation please, because that sounds very extreme.
Anyway, even if the arctic / antarctic did go from -2C to 2C, it will still take a very long time for the ice sheets to melt. Even if they did and the water level rose by 60m, guess what, most of NZ is much higher than 60m above sea level! You’re acting like everyone is going to die, when patently they aren’t. Would life be difficult? Yes. Would life be impossible? Far from it.
“By the way, Australia has recently announced a new record average temperature of 40.3oC. That has been enough to devastate large swathes of the country.”
I’m not sure what “devastate large swathes of the country” is supposed to mean. Lets put it another way: how many people died because of this “average temperature of 40.3C”, I’m assuming you mean that for 1 day the average across the whole country reached that.
“Those in favour of perpetuating present economic arrangements are in favour of ever greater devastation.”
Yes, I agree. But that doesn’t mean everyone is going to be dead by 2050 as you seem to enjoy saying.
I don’t know about 20˚ (although there are certainly recorded Arctic temperature anomalies of that magnitude) being the average, but Arrhenius predicted polar amplification in 1896, so it certainly isn’t of out the ball-park.
Started skimming it and came to this little doozy:
“In other words, Obama and others in his administration knew near-term extinction of humans was already guaranteed.”
That’s in response to an increase of 6C. There’s no explanation as to how this would cause “near-term extinction”, it’s just blithely asserted that it will do so.
Go to Nature Bats Last and read Climate Change Summary and Update.
There are dozens of links and sources on NBL, all verifying what I have been saying for the past 12 years…. only it’s all happening a lot faster than I imagined possible a decade ago, when we were looking at severe ‘problems’ around 2100. Now we are staring down the barrel of a ‘gun’ pointed at us 2020. Indeed, there are a number of people extremely concerned that the central states of the US may become largely uninhabitable within 5 years.
That’s the trouble with taking the planet we live on into unknown territory for the sake of consumer crap and unnecessary travel.
Bill has done some excellent items on The Standard.
Seems they were soon forgotten. -like within two weeks.
By following a link from that site, the closest I could find was this:
“This came just after the World Bank said that 4 °Cs of warming will end the world as we know it. ”
If you then follow that link, they don’t say “end the world as we know it”, instead they talk about heat waves and the problems of rising sea levels. But they don’t say “nobody will be able to survive on the planet beyond 2040”.
If you have the actual quotation of the IMF saying that, please provide it, otherwise we will assume this is your usual hyberbole.
Hmmmm and I here I thought ‘Crazy’ was man developing a system that he then has to turn around and work for in order to survive….
Even more crazy is not recognising this and changing the system so that instead works for him. But then if we did that how would you know if you were doing ok if you couldn’t look elsewhere in the world and see people suffering poverty, war or working harder than you have to for less money.. right!?!
You don’t have to take part in the global economy. You can go buy some land and live self-sufficiently if you want. A lot of people do this. No one is forcing you to take part in the global economy.
It’s just that actually, being able to go to the store and buy some food is a lot more convenient than spending 3 months growing it yourself.
The great irony is that you have to be part of the system to escape from it. Those who loot and pollute the most end up with the most digits and can escape to almost whenever they want to.
Interestingly, now that most of the world is turning to shit environmentally, economically and politically, the rich dudes and dudettes decide to come to NZ to escape the worst effects of it all.
I wonder how many of the ‘peasants’ in Beijing who cannot even breathe the air dream of a life in the country with a piece of land.
“The great irony is that you have to be part of the system to escape from it.”
It’s not really ironic, it’s an obvious reality. We aren’t living in the 1600’s when you could sail a ship to America and find huge areas of fertile land that were free for the taking. All of the good land is already taken, if you want to possess it for yourself then you need to make some sort of trade to get there. Or you can try and take it by brute force if you think that will get you somewhere.
Lanth just admit that was a dumbarse comment (or not) and move on :).
It is no different than right wing idiots saying if you have a problem with a petroleum based economy just stop using petrol….. not very helpful
It’s really true: if you don’t want to be part of the global economy, you don’t have to be. Having the means not to be part of the global economy is another question.
It’s really true: if you don’t want to be part of the global economy, you don’t have to be. Having the means not to be part of the global economy is another question.
“It’s really true: if you don’t want to be part of the global economy, you don’t have to be. Having the means not to be part of the global economy is another question.”
Leaving aside that those two statements don’t make sense together, the first statement is not really true. It is VERY hard to be self sufficient to the extent that on can opt out of the global economy entirely, or even largely. That’s why hardly any one is doing it in industrialised nations. If you think it is possible, please show some examples.
Hard, yes.
Impossible: probably not. People were doing it in NZ right up until the 19th century.
I’m just not sure that there’s anyone who is nutty enough to try, although a few might come close, off-grid lifestylers getting all their produce from local farmers’ markets etc if they can’t grow or make it themselves.
No they weren’t McFlock. 19thC NZ was PRE-global economy. They didn’t have to take themselves out. It’s the taking out that’s the hard part, not living without it.
For instance, where would you get tools for growing food, if you didn’t buy them from places that were dependent on the global economy. I can think of a few people that make their own tools, but they still source their metals from the global economy. And none of them live local to me. So I’d need a way of travelling to them. A horse? Sure, but for any distance I’d also need a wagon or cart, to carry food and goods for trade. How is the wagon made? Tools? Not metal surely. Any idea how hard it is to make wagon wheels? I’m sure there are still people in NZ that can do this, but I bet they’re well hooked into the global economy.
See how this goes? It’s the same as with looking at transitioning off oil. You have to look at systems and networks and the interdependency of things.
Another example: where would you get seeds for growing food? Think about that.
Growing all your own food is very hard to do outside of a community that is also doing that (not to mention other human needs). It’s even hard to do within a society where that is the norm (you’ll have heard of crop failures). Almost no-one in NZ in the 1800s was living self-sufficiently. They were all living in communities that were based on interdependence (Maori and Tauiwi). Until we have that kind of interdependence on each other again we cannot live without the global economy. It will eventually come but the only question now is will we be pushed or will we jump or will we lie down and die after the party is over.
CW you’re taking a rather different view of “global economy” than I was.
For you, it basically means “if you buy something from a shop that is otherwise definitely local, you’re participating in the global economy” which is strictly true.
My perspective on this was rather more “if you’ve only got very limited contacts with the economy and are buying things that *could* have been provided locally (even if they actually weren’t) then that still counts”.
As for your specific talk about tools and metal work: just look at the amish communities in the US.
Sorry Lanth, but that seems to be a copout. My local supermarket is locally owned, can I buy from them and still not be part of the global economy? All their food that I buy *could* be grown locally.
The Amish communities are communities, see my points below. Also, they’re not in NZ, so the point is moot.
I’d still like to see you provide some specific examples, NZ ones, of people that are successfully living without “taking part in the global economy”.
I know lots of people that are attempting this, or working towards this, but it irks to see you suggesting that it’s easy or straightforward, or can be achieved to a large degree, when their hard work demonstrates otherwise.
No CW, it’s not a copout, because I am specifically talking about people who make an active effort to remove themselves from the global economy, I’m not talking about someone that “buys food from the local grocery so therefore aren’t involved in the global economy”.
“The Amish communities are communities, see my points below. Also, they’re not in NZ, so the point is moot.”
I only said it was possible to live without being part of the global economy. I never said anything about doing it by yourself or not being part of a community. Likewise I never said anything about doing it in NZ, so I’m not sure why you’re demanding that.
“I know lots of people that are attempting this, or working towards this, but it irks to see you suggesting that it’s easy or straightforward, or can be achieved to a large degree, when their hard work demonstrates otherwise.”
Well I’m not sure why it’s really a big deal anyway. I mean the whole reason it’s hard to extract yourself from the global economy is because actually the global economy is very efficient at doing lots of very important things. It also has a huge amount of waste, inefficiencies and injustices as part of it, but overall the benefit seems to outweigh the cost.
Isn’t it rather obvious that when PP said ‘man’ was referring to the human race in general? Lanth your response “You don’t have to take part in the global economy.” which you’ve later qualified with “Having the means not to be part of the global economy is another question.” seems to be pedantic and pointless.
So you’re saying that if ‘you’ are one of the small fraction of the population that has the means to escape form the global economy, then ‘you’ can escape from the global economy? Thanks for that. But PP wasn’t claiming it to be a logical impossibility, he was talking generally. For the vast majority who are not in that small fraction, choosing to not take part in the global economy in the face of the myriad of societal pressures against you is a hard road that only an even more tiny fraction is cut out for.
Love comments like this – not very well thought through though…… and where does one get the money outside of the ‘global economy’ to ‘buy’ this land to live sustainably…!?!
Unfortunately for me I care a great deal about my fellow man. I don’t want my children to grow up in this world that is designed to benefit a few, when another world that would benefit all is possible.
The problem is, with the way the system is, most people don’t have the time to stop working, take six months out of their lives and figure out why things aren’t working, what the actual problem is and what needs to happen to fix things. I am simply lucky enough to have been able to do this.
If you new how to solve poverty and war for good would you just sit back and say nothing.
If the system can’t provide simple needs for everyone when the resources exist to do so. Why are you so attached to it. I have read your comments on here and you don’t fall into the category of ‘I’m doing ok so the system works’.
You and others may think I am a loon but throughout history it has only been those that are crazy enough to think that they can change the world that have. As luck would have it I am just that crazy 😉
So I will continue pointing out the failings of the system that are only getting worse and get those who are open minded enough to think about better ways. Ways that can provide for everyone and actually improve living standards at the same time.
But then perhaps you actually believe that the Left have the answers despite they haven’t fixed the problems previously. If you believe that the please share how. Because if they can I can join the party sit back and relax and wait for the change that will fix the worlds (or even just the country if thats easier) problems to come.
I am sure the stress of marriage has killed people too but I don’t see many people wanting to ban that, in fact they want to make gay people suffer as well.
Lets see, your options for acquiring good fertile land that ownership has already been claimed by some other party.
1. Beg for it. Hey, maybe they’ll just give it to you.
2. Trade something for it. Perhaps some potatoes or intricately carved necklaces. More likely they’d want to trade the land for money, though.
3. Take it by force.
I’m a pretty big fella, 3 might work too, not really in my charachter though.
I have land. Had to get it the old fashioned way though.
…..Only after begging and potatoes failed. Never thought about necklaces though. Might save that one for next time. 🙂
You don’t have to take part in the global economy.
Did you not notice? That’s why they destroyed our manufacturing self sufficiency and greatly increased our reliance on international providers of basic utilities like banking systems and phones.
So yes, you can avoid taking part in the global economy, if you want to live back in the 1800’s,
Look no one is arguing that modern industrialised civilisation doesn’t have seriously good perks. I don’t think anyone here wants to go back to hand wringing their clothes for example.
What will be required are systems and technology which make life during the decline just as good as modern day life, albeit it will probably be in different dimensions.
Aternatively, I wonder how long one could simply “go bush” for?
Not me, I like mp3s and electric blankets, but a huntin’ shootin’ fishin’ type could possibly do quite well in the ranges, and nobody need ever know.
“but a huntin’ shootin’ fishin’ type could possibly do quite well in the ranges, and nobody need ever know.”
Until they run out of bullets. And yes, it is possible to mine minerals and make the moulds for the bullets and the bullets themselves*, but now we are talking about a very small number of people with that skill set and I doubt that anyone in NZ is doing it.
Why do you need bullets to hunt? Humanity has lived off the land without bullets for millennia. The maori even did it right in this country.
Now obviously there’s much less wildlife around these days than there was back then, so it would probably make it more difficult and would support many fewer people for any particular area of land. On the other hand there are many more introduced species around, if you don’t mind eating wild pigs, rats and possums etc.
Lanth, honestly, I don’t mean to be rude, but I think you have no idea what you are talking about. Humanity has lived off the land for millennia without bullets, but they weren’t 21stC Kiwis who’ve been raised in houses and with supermarkets and cars. And they didn’t do it as individuals, they did it in communities and with technologies and skills that were inbuilt and didn’t have to be learnt whilst one was starving or shivering. If you read anthropological and first hand accounts from hunter gatherer tribes, you will understand that there is a collective knowledge and wisdom that enables survival and thriving that cannot simply be learnt by one individual who wants to go bush for the rest of their lives. In fact to suggest that that is even possible, is the height of civilised ignorance and arrogance. Hunter gatherer peoples have highly sophisticated technologies that are apparently invisible to everyone else in this conversation. We’ve lost much of that, and it will take much to get it back.
There is a reason why people, including Maori, use guns now – they’re so much easier in terms of the ratio of energy expended to energy harvested. And there isn’t that much land outside of National Parks that could support a person for the rest of their life hunting with a bow, spear or snares that they make and maintain themselves. I’m not saying it couldn’t be done, I’m saying it is so difficult under today’s conditions, that your statement that anyone who wants to live outside the global economy can is a nonsense.
I suppose someone young and fit could survive indefinitely in NZ, on foot, by stealing lifestock. Doubt you could do it with kids in tow, or without that nice sharp knife that was imported from overseas 😉
Not to mention the problems with scurvy, or would they be cabbage rustling too?
Now cabbages rustling sounds good, easy to run down a young cabbage for the pot, i hear they don’t move to fast,
Reminds me of my first real road trip, 16 years old and 3 of us in a mark2 Zephyr up North some place and look at that Giant field of corn, lets grab a sack,
Lolz, turned out to be Maize, think the same thing probably happened to Ruth Richardson whereupon She came to the belief that there were no free lunches,
i wont go into the gory details of a wild turkey we came across at another venue, well it was outside of the fence, man that was one tough bird to chew…
CW, making bullets is easy. The basic design of the .22 cartridge is 150 years old. Think about the tech they had available in the 1860’s. Moulds, metal press tools, etc. some high precision for the day, but nothing fancy.
A garage workshop well set up could supply ammunition for dozens of hunter-gatherers.
In NZ there are also hundreds and hundreds of firearms enthusiasts who reload their own ammunition. Yes they buy in parts and materials, but its not a huge leap to having those items manufactured in NZ as well as gun powder.
Yes, of course. But you are talking about a community or society living without the global economy. I thought Lanth was saying that anyone who wanted to could live without it, and I’m just pointing to multiple examples that prove that is not true. You need a shift of mass numbers of people to make it possible.
Understood. I think Lanth is sorta forgetting that for many tens of thousands of years, man’s forefathers (hmmmm can’t figure out the gender neutral version) chose to live in co-operative groups, albeit relatively small. Tribes, hunter-gatherer parties, what have you.
And we know that for around 4000-5000 years, humans have congregated in large cities, creating vast empires.
Ancient people long figured out that you could sleep more safely together around a camp fire and when you had people taking turns on watch.
Basically, the crazy US “lone-wolf” style survivalist is fucked in the coming future; those who are a trusted part of strong cohesive communities are going to do the best.
Rogue: good on ya mate. Trust you had a very secure gun safe, or was it before those days 😉
Sorry CW, but I don’t know why you got hung-up on me insisting that an individual could live out of the global economy.
I said it was possible to do so. Full stop. I didn’t say “it is possible for a single individual to live by themselves fully self-sufficiently”.
Is it possible for an individual to live by themselves without the global economy? Yes. Is it much easier if they’re part of a community? Yes. Hell, most people participating in the global economy are doing it as part of a community, so I don’t see why that suddenly wouldn’t apply if you chose to live outside of it.
So taking your (presumably) libertarian ideals to an extreme, if someone managed to buy all the land in the world and then forced everyone off the land to live floating on the sea, you’d be ok with that because that’s just private property rights?
Hmmmm and I here I thought ‘Crazy’ was man developing a system that he then has to turn around and work for in order to survive….
Actually, it’s that we’ve developed a system which has the majority working to benefit the few in order to live in poverty. It is this system that is also causing the change within the environment that will render the middle latitudes uninhabitable.
Indeed, such job losses devastate ‘local communities’ i have been watching this happen for 30 years as we as a country embraced the Neo- liberal economic paradigm,
Such a paradigm that has now morphed into the treatment of those who are or become unemployed as near-criminals is an abhorence where a particular cohort of workers have for decades given their labour to an industry for scant reward only then to have the rug ripped from beneath their feet to be faced with the stark future of life on the ‘dole’,
Within the wave of closures of business that accompanied the Western financial meltdown within the country’s that have placed the greatest value upon this Neo-Liberal economic paradigm is also the re-alignment of industrial production to the country’s that have cleverly side-stepped the worst excesses of Neo-Liberalism, those who in effect are ‘the winners’ of the contest of free trade of a global nature,
The ‘prize’ for those who have won in such a ‘competition’ has been the continuation of the stripping of production from the Western Neo-Liberal economic bloc which will now occur within the ‘winning’ country’s…
Crying tho is not a reasoned solution, efforts should be made to convince both the Labour and Green Party’s that the Labour Department should be legislated to enforce such laws and be provided with the resources necessary to investigate and prosecute any and all employers who breach the LAW on the payment of the minimum wage,
Only when Government upholds the laws as set out by the Parliament will such situations as you highlighted cease to exist it is pathetic Neo-liberal Bullshit to believe that an emplyee trapped in such a situation can prosecute His or Her own case without suffering further sanctions from the employer at some point in the future…
As an after thought i am going to assume that such ‘wages’ are brought about by a contractual arrangement where the Farmer as the employer has given unto Himself the luxury of believing that the employee is a ‘contractor’ as opposed to being a waged worker,
Solution, Labour/Green Government legislate minimum standards for such ‘contractors’ across all industries where it has been identified as the prevailing practice for circumventing the labour laws prevailing to wage workers and the minimum wage and any other conditions of work that a wage worker would normally expect in a bargaining between a reasonable employer and reasonable employee…
@ Andre, My brother was a union man and he helped some farm workers here
in southland that were being exploited, the farmers had to pay the workers what
they were owed and pay the correct wages,i don’t know if those workers stayed
in their jobs or not though.
There are also alot of overseas workers now on farms and they dont want to rock
the boat and complain because of their visa requirements, they have to work,so
they are stuck between a rock and a hard place, the farmers that are involved
in this practice are shameful and they should be bought to justice.
These farm workers usually also send some money home to their families,which
is another reason they don’t complain, the farmers know that too.
You just get asked to do more work than you can fit in an 8 hour day, and because you are on a salary of say $30K pa you don’t get paid for the extra time.
Such people do not need the opportunity to return to the slave system. They need the opportunity to live productive lives outside the slave system.
Needless to say, no mainstream political party is prepared to offer such opportunities.
The other aspect is, that by continuing with manufacturing the people you mentioned destroy their children’s futures. Hardly a worthwhile deal I would have thought.
Afewknowthetruth, I am thinking of opening a parody twitter account posing as a hard core lefty who has completely lost the plot. Similar to the Cath Delahunty parody account.
Would you mind if I just cut and paste the stuff you write here?
What is a hared core leftie ? Is it something to do with that idiotic game called rugby, in which grown men run around with a ball and gormless twits pay money to watch them?
When your superior intellect and wisdom has taken you far above masses, anything outside of your ethereal dominion seems triffling and a waste of time.
I wouldn’t say that jobs and Manufacturing are the problem. You actually need these and the capability in order to make the transition to a better system.
Once you have the support mechanisms or new systems in place to still ensure that people can have the things they need and want then and only then can you start to remove the jobs and the requirement for people to have to work. Until then you still have to play the game – you still have to earn money to buy the things you need and want.
Vehicle safety expert, this morning on NR, said Traffic Police aren’t experts, they can’t just carry
out a WoF check, they don’t have the tools, changes to allow Police to seek out alterations to vehicles have no effect on safety (well duh maybe the new power has more than just safety in mind). Well firstly, Police turn up immediately when a accident happens, they have huge experience of crash scenes, and the causes. And boy racers do run around in safe vehicles that still cause a public nuisense due to the alterations they have, alterations that disappear when they do get a WoF. So I ask you why would an expert be so naive, so contrary to logic, experience, and real issues of car abuse and still be calling themselves an expert? Why did the interviewer not ask some obvious questions the whole time? Police are ignorant of vehicle safety, is that what you mean? Police need to do a full WoF check right there and then on some rural road? The only problem with cars are safety issues, really??? Have you lived in NZ, heard of ChCh boyracers, of the Hamilton Te Rapa???
another cupla’ spheres from the air;
NZ Property Council and Ak Council / s “speaking different languages”
Parata slips on the sea-monster; How capable John? or just another Please Don’t Let Me be Miss Understood beastie?
“Jum” never caught the rye’ forecast, maybe he is a classical ecaunomist lingering.
Wishbone Ash Atmosphere? Cut it out Lord. That’s The Way
now, where was I, oh that’s correct, J-A ZZ J-A ZZ, said she aint here but she sure went Fast
(feel like a soldier, look like a thief) It’s our day. Chop Chop.
…and on the travelator tonight we have…
Now listen (echo) you rich people, weep and wail because of the misery that is coming upon you. Your wealth has rotted, and moths have eaten your clothes. Your gold and silver are tarnished. Their tarnish will testify against you and eat your flesh like house, contents and fire insurance. You have hoarded wealth in the last days. Look! The wages you failed to pay the workmen who mowed your fields, willingly too I might add, are crying out against you. The cries of the harvesters (Claasy) have reached the ears of the Lord Almighty. You have lived on earth in luxury and self-indulgence. You have fattened yourselves in the day of slaughter. You have condemned and murdered innocent men, who were not opposing you. (See how the farmer waits for the land to yield it’s valuable crop and how patient he is for the autumn and spring rains; as an example of patience take the prophets who spoke in the name of the Lord. As you know, we consider blessed those who have persevered. You have heard of Job’s perseverance? )
The Lord is full of compassion and mercy.
No wonder the police struggle to get recruits or retain staff. Seems any drunk obnoxious brat can get away with disrespectful behaviour towards police and if the officer does anything about it they lose their job.
Its not that easy. Training kids to be obnoxious is a false economy, Police is always best done lightly with a large stick. The fact that after five years of Key he has now only just got around to giving Police the power to investigate cars reconfigured to be attention grabbing is just amazing. They can’t crush what they don’t catch.
Gordon Campbell withanother example of why it’s laughable when Nats start on with the bellyaching about how much the love they military and lefties hate them and don’t understand and shit.
“We live in a moment of history where change is so speeded up that we begin to see the present only when it is disappearing” -Stone the crows, ops,
-R.D Laing 😉
but that’s ok, Kmart and Buntings have lifted their sales game, the Commerce Commision finds power distribution company profits 5% above inflation, Shock and what Got Carter was the absence of loyalty of farmers supplying the meat co-ops as they sunsat on 100M losses. Had never heard of Thomas Tanner and the Seven Apostles until today in THE LIBRARY.It was the Summer of 69… http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/2013/jan/31/muppets-again-ricky-gervais ma na ma na dee dee di dee dee
Selected quotes from today’s Howick & Pakaranga Times:
“This coming year, according to the Chinese calendar, will be the Year of the Snake…….they are considered to be good mediators – keen, cunning, wise, intelligent and quick of wit – with business acumen, or able to trade away posessions……..Materialistic, snake people tend to prefer to have the best of everything but would rather aviod crowds………..known to suffer from stress, they prefer to live a peaceful existence, with plenty of time for relaxation – a heavy workload or busy schedule is not a snakes best friend!…………Happy New Year everyone.”
element is Water from the 10th on. Pahtay!
(xtatically, i also clean my own loo, modeled from guess who? Clue: he had the untouchables “re-labeled “children of god”. No I in team, better to be before the 8 ball mates)
Had a quiet chuckle about a completely irrelevant trend – UF is beginning to acquire more and more of the sub-0.5% “^” symbols. Starting in August, too, so Dunne doesn’t even have the parliamentary break as a complete excuse 🙂
Scary thing: if you read into the Roy Morgan, it says that confidence in the Key government is back up to Feb 2012 levels. 57% say that NZ is heading in the right direction.
7000 cows take to cruising the ocean waves, China here we come, short term gain for long term pain as China builds it’s dairy herd from the best stock all over the World,
In ten years time when that herd numbers 5 or 10 million Fonterra won’t be able to sell an ounce of baby formula into China unless of cause if it wants to take a bath on the price the Chinese are willing to pay,
Bits of old dead cow will be cheap in the supermarkets as farmers in both Canterbury and the East of the North Island de-stock in the face of drought conditions…
Only if you eat bits of dead cow, which i do coz it does wonders for my bowels, lolz things must be slow if i am discussing my ablution habits,
Chickens tho remain stubbornly pricey after the pre-Christmas price gouge, note to chicken producers, we aint buying them until the price goes back down, (which will probably be not long after they have squeezed the last egg possible out of the poor old chooks)…
It looks like Solid Energy’s plans to strip-mine Southland for dirty lignite are on the skids:
Energy experts are criticising plans made by state-owned miner Solid Energy, saying efforts to build a large export factory in Southland’s Mataura valley are uneconomic.
The state-owned miner’s lignite briquettes are expected to go on sale this year, but an ambitious plan to export the pellets overseas is now looking unlikely.
Which means less coal mined, and therefore lower emissions. Which can only be positive for our environment.
Meanwhile, the fact that Solid Energy was considering this plan at all shows that National’s corrupted ETS isn’t working. It was supposed to discourage the dirtiest of industries; instead the promise of subsidies for pollution seems to have encouraged them.
Idiot/Savant No Right Turn 31/01/13
What Idiot/Savant forgot to mention, was that even under Labour’s version, the ETS, Pollution Trading Scheme, didn’t discourage this “dirtiest of industries”. It was in fact under the last Labour Government that this “ambitious” initiative was begun and even championed.
It is not that unlikely that a Shearer led government will also encourage and champion such extreme fossil fuel initiatives. Including the strip mining of the Denniston Plateau and Deep Sea Oil Drilling, and onshore and offshore fracking.
What this means for the Green Party, is that the Greens will have to accept these policies if they want a coalition agreement with Labour.
This goes a long way to explaining why the Green Party website takes pains not to give climate change issues any prominent profile.
This is a necessary preparation for the sell out to come.
You heard it here first. Just try and pretend to look surprised, when it happens.
My view was that the ETS was never going to work it was and is simply a capitalist inspired take-over attempt on the Green Movement,
Jeanette F once flew into a public rage at such a questioning of the Emissions Trading Scam, (not long after that little exhibition She announced Her retirement),
i have always advocated for a localized carbon tax which should be spent into the economy (a) planting trees, even buying out the less productive land to plant upon, (b) research and development into ways of lowering carbon emissions for industry, and (c) research and development into the means of industrialized removal of carbon from the atmosphere…
600,000 living in cave like conditions or under plastic which makes a UN tent city seem quite luxurious,relying upon food charity for their daily needs,
North Korea??? Somalia???,
Nah that greatest of countries in the World Amerika,
Them and North Korea polar opposites on the political spectrum, but where it really counts,for those on the bottom of the economic heap, not an iota of difference…
but where it really counts,for those on the bottom of the economic heap, not an iota of difference…
Well if you are poor in the US you can still get alcohol, tobacco and firearms more easily than if you are poor in North Korea. That must count for something?
223? anyway, mad as a cleaver;
no lattes from Guatemala now Dr Ropata, no fool like an old fool new world boy on the old Kings Road, Sha na na : Havoc Rocks The History of The World in One Site, Scrumpy (make sure you imbibe ‘eaps of water throughout the night)
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Robert MacCulloch writes – The Reserve Bank has doubled staff numbers in five years to 510, with personnel costs rising to $80 million in 2023 from $32 million in 2018 – up by a whopping 150%. I guess when you print $50 billion and flood markets with liquidity, ...
The furore. In case you didn’t notice there was a controversy in the weekend involving dolphins in a little town off the South Island. Don’t panic, they haven’t declared independence and resumed whaling, this was simply a sailing event.The problem began when racing was cancelled on the opening day of ...
For 20 years or more, the case for a meaningful capital tax gains has been mulled over and analysed to death, including by the tax working group chaired by Sir Michael Cullen. More than once, the International Monetary Fund has said a CGT would be a good idea for New ...
TL;DR: My top 10 news and analysis links this morning include:Today’s must-read: The Public Health Communications Centre (PHCC) call for urgent preventive action and a risk assessment survey of long covid in this briefing noteLocal scoop: NZ road deaths surpass OECD rates, so why is the govt reversing safety plans? ...
This story was originally published by Grist and is part of Covering Climate Now, a global journalism collaboration strengthening coverage of the climate story. This story is part of a collaboration with Grist and WABE to demystify the Georgia Public Service Commission, the small but powerful state-elected board that makes critical decisions about everything from raising ...
This is a guest post from Robert McLachlan Global warming is accelerating; 2023 was off the charts. We need to stop burning fossil fuels. In New Zealand, transport accounts for half of all fossil fuels burnt. In the Emissions Reduction Plan, transport emissions fall 41% by 2035. As the ...
Labour productivity has been receding rapidly over the past two years, reversing a post-lockdown rise. Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāTL;DR: My six things to note in Aotearoa’s political economy as at 6:26am on Tuesday, March 26 include:Workers have been treading water in output per hour worked for 12 years, ...
TL;DR: The key events to watch in Aotearoa-NZ’s political economy in the week to April 2 include:Today, Parliament resumes sitting at 2pm for the second week of a two-week session. Officials for SIS and GCSB report their annual reviews in public to the Intelligence and Security Select Committee from 5.10pm.Tomorrow, ...
Faced with a barrage of criticism over the promised tax cuts from usually supportive commentators, Finance Minister Nicola Willis yesterday reaffirmed her intention to include them in this year’s Budget. The Government is up against it over the cuts just about every way it turns. Commentators like Fran O’Sullivan, Matthew ...
Here’s my pick of today’s substack posts as of 6:26pm on Monday, March 25: writes via his substack that Market-rate housing will make your city cheaper writes via his substack about the problems talking to double-cab ute (truck) drivers about their vehicles. today about moments of radicalisation in ...
Buzz from the Beehive Just before Christmas, Finance Minister Nicola Willis delivered something that was pitched as a mini-budget and brayed about the decisive action being taken to repair the Government books and support income tax relief in Budget 2024. In a statement headed Fiscal repair job underway. she introduced ...
My sister Belinda asked Dad yesterday what one word would describe Mum best. He said: vivacious.If you only knew her from the photos on the slideshow we've made for today,you might wonder about that, because the camera tended to lie with Mum.If ever she saw a camera pointed at her, she ...
There are two major public consultations closing in the next week, Auckland Council’s Long Term Plan (LTP), and the draft Government Policy Statement on Land Transport (GPS). Closing dates and times: LTP closes Thursday 28 February, at 11.59pm – a minute to midnight! GPS closes Tuesday 2 April, at 12pm noon – note that’s ...
From Kiwiblog’s David Farrar – Bryce Wilkinson writes: Senior Fellow Bryce Wilkinson’s analysis reveals that since March 2009, New Zealand has spent $158 billion more overseas than it has earned, but its NIIP has only fallen by $32 billion.Statistics New Zealand shows that receipts from overseas reinsurers have ...
Is she hinting that the Coalition Government will have to back down on key promises it made in Opposition? Brian Easton writes – The Minister of Finance, Nicola Willis, is telling an evolving story about her fiscal challenges. In Opposition she was confident that she could ...
Dear Nicola Willis,Right now you’ve probably got lots of competing demands coming at you. Ministers who’ve inherited quite a mess, or so you’ve told us, looking for money in the budget to improve things. I imagine that’s why they came to parliament - to make things better.You’ll have to make ...
The Local Government, Transport and Auckland Minister hasthreatened councils with intervention if they don’t merge water assets to take them off balance sheet, just as the now-repealed Three Waters plan directed. Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāTL;DR: My six things of note this morning for Monday, March 25 include:Simeon ...
A listing of 36 news and opinion articles we found interesting and shared on social media during the past week: Sun, March 17, 2024 thru Sat, March 23, 2024. Story of the week Thanks to John Mason having the stamina to sit down to watch "Climate - the Movie" ...
This morning the Q&A programme had Simeon Brown on to talk about National’s replacement for Three Waters. In case anyone’s forgotten the three are - drinking water, waste water, and sewerage. It’s quite important not to get them mixed up. In much the same way that you wouldn’t want to ...
Today’s newsletter comes with a mini-podcast conversation between me and my buddy Liv Tennet, talking about her time as a child actor in Lord of the Rings. It’s a conversation with a lot of giggles as she talks about falling off a horse, and becoming a meme. Read ...
The Desmog Climate Disinformation Database documents, "individuals and organisations that have helped to delay and distract the public and our elected leaders from taking needed action to reduce greenhouse gas pollution and fight global warming." It's a who's who of the organised climate change denial movement, in other words. In ...
Bob Edlin writes – A High Court judge has decided miscreants who have mana – or who claim to have mana – should be treated differently from miscreants who have none. It’s a ruling that suggests indigenous law-breakers have a better chance of securing a discharge without conviction ...
Welcome to the first, and possibly last, edition of Brickbats, Bouquets and Bull’s Wool. In which I’ll take a look at the events of the last week or so, and rate them.In such ratings the numbers usually have more to do with the opinions of the reviewer, than the actual ...
Roger Partridge writes – My earlier column this month, New Zealand’s highest court could be facing a turning point, prompted a flood of feedback from business readers and lawyers alike. A common query was what Parliament can do to restrain an overreaching judiciary. This week I discuss two steps Parliament ...
TL;DR: In today’s ‘six-stack’ of substacks at 6.16pm on Friday, March 22: writes about New Zealand's Building Boom—And What the World Must Learn From It over at his substack. challenges the Auckland Council’s use of a 3.8 degrees of warming forecast to oppose a wave-park and data centre project ...
Is she hinting that the Coalition Government will have to back down on key promises it made in Opposition?The Minister of Finance, Nicola Willis, is telling an evolving story about her fiscal challenges. In Opposition she was confident that she could deliver her promised income tax cuts. Appointed minister, she ...
Buzz from the Beehive Ministers of the Crown have drawn attention to one sector of the science sector which is unlikely to be subjected to heavy spending cuts, a state-funded broadcaster which is doing nicely, thank you, and a sporting event that had $5.4 million from the public purse puffed ...
Abbott’s Freestyle Libre sensors allow continuous glucose monitoring (CGM). The sensor is applied to the back of the patient’s arm, with a thin filament under the skin measuring glucose levels constantly. But it costs around $100 per sensor and must be replaced once every 14 days. Photo by BSIP/Universal Images ...
The Inspector General of Intelligence and Security (IGIS) recently released a report in which he exposes the existence of a foreign intelligence partner-controlled technological “capability” inside the headquarters of the GCSB, NZ’s 5 Eyes-affiliated signals intelligence collection and analysis agency. … Continue reading → ...
Peter Dunne writes – Nearly three decades after the introduction of MMP and multiparty governments there should be a greater level of understanding about their finer points than often appears to be the case. The reaction to the despicable outburst from the Deputy Prime Minister at the weekend highlights ...
The sweet kisses from fruit of summerHave slowly been turning dullerYou say, "those times"And "remember the daysWhen we went outside and there still was the shade?"Taking no reason into play…Autumn. Clear, blue days shortening to longer nights, growing colder. Aotearoa.That’s us. The temperature dropping, the looming car crash - so ...
Bryce Edwards writes – “It is often said that behind every great man is a great woman”. This is the pitch by the National Party Botany electorate branch to attend their “Ladies Afternoon Tea with Amanda Luxon”. For $110 including GST, you can turn up on Saturday 20 April ...
David Farrar writes – The Electoral Commission has published the expense returns for political parties for the 2023 election. I’ve put them in a table with how many votes a party got so we can see the spend per vote. National only spent $3.34 for every vote they got, almost ...
Winston Peters’ headline-making actions over the past week may have been a show of political power intended to strengthen his hand in Budget negotiations. It was no accident that his State of the Nation speech was as it was. He made it as New Zealand First Leader, not as Deputy ...
Photo: Lynn Grieveson / The KākāTL;DR: The five things that mattered in Aotearoa’s political economy that we wrote and spoke about via The Kākā and elsewhere for paying subscribers in the last week included:Former Labour Finance Minister Grant Robertson bowed out of politics this week, giving a series of exit ...
Graham Adams writes — If you love the law or sausages, as the saying goes, best not to look too closely at how they are made. And after watching the orgy of self-pity when Newshub’s closure was announced on February 28, television journalism should definitely be added to the list of those ...
Venerable New Zealand political commentator, Chris Trotter (https://bowalleyroad.blogspot.com/), is a sad creature these days. Once one of the most reliable Leftist writers out there – Economic Left at that – Trotter seems to have absorbed the worldview of Auckland culture-war obsessives. It is not for me to categorise what he ...
The cruelty of short-term memory loss is that each time you ask where she is, you get the fresh shock and grief of the news. That was Dad's day yesterday.Comfortingly, it seems to be less so today. Last night he looked crumpled, today he seems more settled. There's a card ...
Photo by Alvan Nee on UnsplashIt’s that new day of the week (Thursday rather than Friday) when and I co-host our ‘hoon’ webinar with paying subscribers to The Kākā for an hour at 5 pm. Jump on this link on YouTube Livestream for our chat about the week’s news ...
Buzz from the Beehive One minister is talking tough while a colleague – whose ministry had acted tough and drawn a barrage of flak – has shown an official softening. Some ministers are doing what Labour was good at, which is distributing public funds to causes regarded as worthy or ...
The Coalition Government’s plan to ‘get Auckland moving’ is a cuts cover-up that will ultimately cost Aucklanders more to move around the city, says Labour Auckland Issues spokesperson Shanan Halbert. ...
Slashing the Ministry of Pacific Peoples by 40% will have a devastating impact on pacific communities and further highlights how little this government cares about anything other than cutting taxes for the wealthiest few. ...
Labour has proposed an urgent inquiry to investigate the ever-increasing profits of supermarkets, aiming to lower costs for shoppers and food producers alike, says Labour Spokesperson for Commerce and Consumer Affairs Arena Williams and Primary Production Spokesperson Cushla Tangaere-Manuel. ...
With 14% of jobs on the line at the Ministry for Ethnic Communities, the responsible Minister Melissa Lee is failing to stand up for the very communities she’s meant to be representing. ...
COURT OF APPEAL: TRIFECTA OF VICTORY FOR NZ FIRST, TRIFECTA OF FAILURE FOR OPPONENTS For the third time since April 2020, New Zealand First has defeated the Serious Fraud Office and all those complicit in a malicious attack against a political party going about its lawful business in a lawful ...
The Green Party stands with people who live in public housing, people in dire housing need, experts and advocates in demanding better than the Government’s archaic approach to housing those who need our support the most. ...
New Zealand has recently lost the hosting rights of some major international sporting events including the America’s Cup, the Rugby Championship, Netball World Cup, and the Wellington Sevens. We are now at a huge risk of losing SailGP as well. And it won’t stop there. The recent issues with SailGP ...
A Member’s Bill drawn this week would modernise insurance law and make things fairer and more transparent for consumers, Christchurch Central MP Duncan Webb said. ...
The Minister for Disability Issues has confirmed she was aware of funding issues in mid-December and did nothing to stop it. On 14 March, she signed off on changes that were announced and implemented on 18 March without any consultation with disability communities. ...
Green Party MP Julie Anne Genter says her members' bill is an opportunity for the coalition government to plug the gap in electric vehicle incentives. ...
The National Government continues to talk about irresponsible tax cuts that will only drive up inflation, despite the country entering a technical recession. ...
The Minister for Disability Issues must act urgently to reinstate flexibility around the funding for disability support and apologise to disabled carers. ...
This story has been initiated by a leftie shill reporter who proactively sought to call a member of a former band, which disbanded twelve years ago, give their biased appraisal of what was said in my speech, and concocted a ham-fisted attempt at a story that does nothing but show ...
The Government has accepted Labour’s change to the Road User Charge (RUC) discount for hybrid vehicles, meaning there will still be some incentive for people to buy greener vehicles. ...
Many in the mainstream media have taken what was said in New Zealand First’s State of the Nation Speech in Palmerston North on Sunday and deliberately, deceitfully, and ignorantly misrepresented what I said and why I said it. The headlines and commentary on the news stated that I compared ‘co-governance ...
Kicking the most vulnerable people out of state housing and pushing them towards homelessness will result in a proliferation of poverty and trauma across our most vulnerable communities. ...
Te Pāti Māori co-leader and MP for Waiariki, Rawiri Waititi has penned a letter asking MPs to support his members bill to remove GST from all food. The bill is expected to go through its first reading in parliament this Wednesday. “I’m calling on all political parties to support my ...
Good afternoon. Thank you for, in your very busy lives, turning up to this meeting today. On October 14th last year New Zealanders overwhelmingly voted for change. That is exactly what this new government is bringing. New Zealand First campaigned to ‘take back our country’ and stop the disastrous economic ...
This year is about getting real with Kiwis and discussing the tough issues, as the National Government exacerbates inequality and divides New Zealand, Labour Leader Chris Hipkins said ...
The Government adding Significant Natural Areas (SNAs) to its already roaring environmental policy bonfire is an assault on the future of wildlife that makes Aotearoa unique. ...
After 12 years of fighting to protect our moana we are finding ourselves back at square one and back at court. Today, the Environmental Protection Agency is sitting in Hawera to reconsider an application from Trans-Tasman Resources to dig up 50 million tonnes of the seabed in South Taranaki. This ...
Minister Shane Jones’ decision to step away from a seabed mining project is evidence of the murky waters surrounding the Government’s fast-track legislation. ...
The growth of Treaty of Waitangi clauses in legislation caused so much worry that a special oversight group was set up by the last government in a bid to get greater coherence in the publicservice on Treaty matters. When ministers first considered the need for tighter oversight in 2021, there ...
The growth of Treaty of Waitangi clauses in legislation caused so much worry that a special oversight group was set up by the last government in a bid to get greater coherence in the publicservice on Treaty matters. When ministers first considered the need for tighter oversight in 2021, there ...
The Coalition Government’s miscalculation saga continues as it has forgotten an eyewatering $90 million gap in its interest deductibility cost figures, say Labour Finance spokesperson Barbara Edmonds and Revenue Spokesperson Deborah Russell. ...
He Pou a Rangi Climate Change Commission has today released advice that says if the Government doesn’t act now New Zealand is at risk of not meeting its climate goals. ...
The Coalition Government has today confirmed it is abandoning first home buyers who are struggling to get ahead, says Labour Finance spokesperson Barbara Edmonds. ...
Transport Minister Simeon Brown has welcomed the passing of legislation to move light electric vehicles (EVs) and plug-in hybrid electric vehicles (PHEVs) into the road user charges system from 1 April. “It was always intended that EVs and PHEVs would be exempt from road user charges until they reached two ...
New Zealand is strengthening its ability to combat illegal fishing outside its domestic waters and beef up regulation for its own commercial fishers in international waters through a Bill which had its first reading in Parliament today. The Fisheries (International Fishing and Other Matters) Amendment Bill 2023 sets out stronger ...
Economists Carl Hansen and Professor Prasanna Gai have been appointed to the Reserve Bank Monetary Policy Committee, Finance Minister Nicola Willis announced today. The Monetary Policy Committee (MPC) is the independent decision-making body that sets the Official Cash Rate which determines interest rates. Carl Hansen, the executive director of Capital ...
Apartment owners and buyers will soon have greater protections as further changes to the law on unit titles come into effect, Housing Minister Chris Bishop says. “The Unit Titles (Strengthening Body Corporate Governance and Other Matters) Amendment Act had already introduced some changes in December 2022 and May 2023, and ...
Foreign Minister Winston Peters will travel to Egypt and Europe from this weekend. “This travel will focus on a range of New Zealand’s traditional diplomatic and security partnerships while enabling broad engagement on the urgent situation in Gaza,” Mr Peters says. Mr Peters will attend the NATO Foreign ...
Transport Minister Simeon Brown is encouraging all road users to stay safe, plan their journeys ahead of time, and be patient with other drivers while travelling around this Easter long weekend. “Road safety is a responsibility we all share, and with increased traffic on our roads expected this Easter we ...
About 1.4 million New Zealanders will receive cost of living relief through increased government assistance from April 1 909,000 pensioners get a boost to Superannuation, including 5000 veterans 371,000 working-age beneficiaries will get higher payments 45,000 students will see an increase in their allowance Over a quarter of New Zealanders ...
Ensuring social housing is being provided to those with the greatest needs is front of mind as the Government restarts social housing tenancy reviews, Associate Housing Minister Tama Potaka says. “Our relentless focus on building a strong economy is to ensure we can deliver better public services such as social ...
The Kermadec Ocean Sanctuary will not go ahead, with Cabinet deciding to stop work on the proposed reserve and remove the Bill that would have established it from Parliament’s order paper. “The Kermadec Ocean Sanctuary Bill would have created a 620,000 sq km economic no-go zone,” Oceans and Fisheries Minister ...
Dam safety regulations are being amended so that smaller dams won’t be subject to excessive compliance costs, Minister for Building and Construction Chris Penk says. “The coalition Government is focused on reducing costs and removing unnecessary red tape so we can get the economy back on track. “Dam safety regulations ...
The coalition Government is expanding the medium-scale adverse event classification to parts of the North Island as dry weather conditions persist, Agriculture Minister Todd McClay announced today. “I have made the decision to expand the medium-scale adverse event classification already in place for parts of the South Island to also cover the ...
The passing of legislation giving effect to coalition Government tax commitments has been welcomed by Finance Minister Nicola Willis. “The Taxation (Annual Rates for 2023–24, Multinational Tax, and Remedial Matters) Bill will help place New Zealand on a more secure economic footing, improve outcomes for New Zealanders, and make our tax system ...
Science, Innovation and Technology Minister Judith Collins and Tertiary Education and Skills Minister Penny Simmonds today announced plans to transform our science and university sectors to boost the economy. Two advisory groups, chaired by Professor Sir Peter Gluckman, will advise the Government on how these sectors can play a greater ...
The Budget will deliver urgently-needed tax relief to hard-working New Zealanders while putting the government’s finances back on a sustainable track, Finance Minister Nicola Willis says. The Finance Minister made the comments at the release of the Budget Policy Statement setting out the Government’s Budget objectives. “The coalition Government intends ...
The coalition Government will look at options to address a zoning issue that limits how much financial support Queenstown residents can get for accommodation. Cabinet has agreed on a response to the Petitions Committee, which had recommended the geographic information MSD uses to determine how much accommodation supplement can be ...
Cabinet has agreed to a short extension to the final reporting timeframe for the Royal Commission into Abuse in Care from 28 March 2024 to 26 June 2024, Internal Affairs Minister Brooke van Velden says. “The Royal Commission wrote to me on 16 February 2024, requesting that I consider an ...
The coalition Government is delivering an $18 million boost to New Zealanders needing to travel for specialist health treatment, Health Minister Dr Shane Reti says. “These changes are long overdue – the National Travel Assistance (NTA) scheme saw its last increase to mileage and accommodation rates way back in 2009. ...
The Government is recognising the innovative and rising talent in New Zealand’s growing space sector, with the Prime Minister and Space Minister Judith Collins announcing the new Prime Minister’s Prizes for Space today. “New Zealand has a growing reputation as a high-value partner for space missions and research. I am ...
Foreign Minister Winston Peters has confirmed New Zealand’s concerns about cyber activity have been conveyed directly to the Chinese Government. “The Prime Minister and Minister Collins have expressed concerns today about malicious cyber activity, attributed to groups sponsored by the Chinese Government, targeting democratic institutions in both New ...
Independent Reviewers appointed for School Property Inquiry Education Minister Erica Stanford today announced the appointment of three independent reviewers to lead the Ministerial Inquiry into the Ministry of Education’s School Property Function. The Inquiry will be led by former Minister of Foreign Affairs Murray McCully. “There is a clear need ...
State Highway 1 across the Brynderwyns will be open for Easter weekend, with work currently underway to ensure the resilience of this critical route being paused for Easter Weekend to allow holiday makers to travel north, Transport Minister Simeon Brown says. “Today I visited the Brynderwyn Hills construction site, where ...
Introduction Good morning to you all, and thanks for having me bright and early today. I am absolutely delighted to be the Minister for Infrastructure alongside the Minister of Housing and Resource Management Reform. I know the Prime Minister sees the three roles as closely connected and he wants me ...
New Zealand stands with the United Kingdom in its condemnation of People’s Republic of China (PRC) state-backed malicious cyber activity impacting its Electoral Commission and targeting Members of the UK Parliament. “The use of cyber-enabled espionage operations to interfere with democratic institutions and processes anywhere is unacceptable,” Minister Responsible for ...
Foreign Minister Winston Peters and Defence Minister Judith Collins today announced New Zealand will provide logistics support for the upcoming Solomon Islands election. “We’re sending a team of New Zealand Defence Force personnel and two NH90 helicopters to provide logistics support for the election on 17 April, at the request ...
The European Union Free Trade Agreement Legislation Amendment Bill received Royal Assent today, completing the process for New Zealand’s ratification of its free trade agreement with the European Union. “I am pleased to announce that today, in a small ceremony at the Beehive, New Zealand notified the European Union ...
Public consultation on the terms of reference for the Royal Commission into COVID-19 Lessons has concluded, Internal Affairs Minister Hon Brooke van Velden says. “I have been advised that there were over 11,000 submissions made through the Royal Commission’s online consultation portal.” Expanding the scope of the Royal Commission of ...
Hardworking families are set to benefit from a new credit to help them meet their early childcare education (ECE) costs, Finance Minister Nicola Willis says. From 1 July, parents and caregivers of young children will be supported to manage the rising cost of living with a partial reimbursement of their ...
A specialised Independent Technical Advisory Group (ITAG) tasked with preparing and publishing independent non-binding advice on the design of a "green" (sustainable finance) taxonomy rulebook is being established, Climate Change Minister Simon Watts says. “Comprising experts and market participants, the ITAG's primary goal is to deliver comprehensive recommendations to the ...
Defence Minister Judith Collins has thanked the Chief of Army, Major General John Boswell, DSD, for his service as he leaves the Army after 40 years. “I would like to thank Major General Boswell for his contribution to the Army and the wider New Zealand Defence Force, undertaking many different ...
25 March 2024 Minister to meet Australian counterparts and Manufacturing Industry Leaders Small Business, Manufacturing, Commerce and Consumer Affairs Minister Andrew Bayly will travel to Australia for a series of bi-lateral meetings and manufacturing visits. During the visit, Minister Bayly will meet with his Australian counterparts, Senator Tim Ayres, Ed ...
Government commits almost $3 million for period products in schools The Coalition Government has committed $2.9 million to ensure intermediate and secondary schools continue providing period products to those who need them, Minister of Education Erica Stanford announced today. “This is an issue of dignity and ensuring young women don’t ...
Good morning, it’s great to be here. First, I would like to acknowledge the New Zealand Institute of Building Surveyors and thank you for the opportunity to be here this morning. I would like to use this opportunity to outline the Government’s ambitious plan and what we hope to ...
Minister for Pacific Peoples Dr Shane Reti has announced the Government’s commitment to the Auckland Secondary Schools Māori and Pacific Islands Cultural Festival, more commonly known as Polyfest. “The Ministry for Pacific Peoples is a longtime supporter of Polyfest and, as it celebrates 49 years in 2024, I’m proud to ...
Before moving onto the substance of today’s address, I want to recognise the very significant and ongoing contribution the Breast Cancer Foundation makes to support the lives of New Zealand women and their families living with breast cancer. I very much enjoy working with you. I also want to recognise ...
New Zealand has notched up a first with the launch of University of Canterbury research to the International Space Station, Science, Innovation and Technology and Space Minister Judith Collins says. The hardware, developed by Dr Sarah Kessans, is designed to operate autonomously in orbit, allowing scientists on Earth to study ...
Introduction Thank you for inviting me to speak with you today and I’m sorry I can’t be there in person. Yesterday I started in Wellington for Breakfast TV, spoke to a property conference in Auckland, and finished the day speaking to local government in Christchurch, so it would have been ...
The Coalition Government is contributing more than $1 million to support the establishment of an emergency multi-agency coordination centre in Northland. Emergency Management and Recovery Minister Mark Mitchell announced the contribution today during a visit of the Whangārei site where the facility will be constructed. “Northland has faced a number ...
New Zealanders have enjoyed a broader range of voices telling the story of Aotearoa thanks to the creation of Whakaata Māori 20 years ago, says Māori Development Minister Tama Potaka. The minister spoke at a celebration marking the national indigenous media organisation’s 20th anniversary at their studio in Auckland on ...
Commercial catch limits for some fisheries have been increased following a review showing stocks are healthy and abundant, Ocean and Fisheries Minister Shane Jones says. The changes, along with some other catch limit changes and management settings, begin coming into effect from 1 April 2024. "Regular biannual reviews of fish ...
Analysis by Keith Rankin. Keith Rankin, trained as an economic historian, is a retired lecturer in Economics and Statistics. He lives in Auckland, New Zealand. My earlier article – Can ‘Good’ be the Greater Evil? – looked at the issue of how wars should end, and how Good versus Evil ...
The only published and available best-selling indie book chart in New Zealand is the top 10 sales list recorded every week at Unity Books’ stores in High St, Auckland, and Willis St, Wellington.AUCKLAND1 AMMA by Saraid de Silva (Moa Press, $38)A stunning debut novel reviewed by Brannavan ...
From Steve Martin to Ricky Stanicky, a pick’n’mix of things worth watching and listening to this long weekend. This is an excerpt from our weekly pop culture newsletter Rec Room. Sign up here. If you’re at a loss for something to occupy yourself with this Easter, don’t panic: The Spinoff’s got ...
Jesus had dinner with his 12 disciples right before he died. Noted historian Madeleine Chapman finds out who really deserved to be there.First published in 2018 but let’s be honest, the subject is timeless. As you sit on your couch this Easter Sunday, eating a chocolate egg you know ...
The newly-promoted Northern League club is on a mission to return to the National League for the first time in two decades. Plenty about domestic football in New Zealand has changed in that time – but the sense that this amateur competition is not an entirely level playing field remains. ...
Comment: Every year on February 2, a dozen men in tuxedos and top hats approach the burrow of a groundhog in Gobbler’s Knob, Pennsylvania and entice the beaver-like rodent to emerge and predict the weather. If the groundhog, named Punxsutawney Phil, sees its own shadow when it is summoned, legend ...
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Auckland Council has put a deadline on new weather-impacted property owners applying for categorisation as government funding looks set to run out. Councillors have voted to support a deadline of September 30 for property owners who haven’t accessed support to come forward and engage with the council’s recovery office. It ...
NONFICTION 1 BBQ Economics by Liam Dann (Penguin Random House, $40) “It’s official,” wrote Dann nine days ago in the Herald, where he works as business editor at large, “we’re in recession.” Yeah, great. He delivered the bad stats: “GDP fell 0.1 percent in the December 2023 quarter, compared with ...
By Anneke Smith, RNZ News political reporter A petition urging the New Zealand government to provide urgent humanitarian assistance to the Palestinian people has been tabled in the House. More than 200 people gathered on Parliament’s forecourt today and they were met by MPs from Labour, the Greens and Te ...
Pacific Media Watch The Paris-based global media freedom watchdog RSF (Reporters Without Borders) has appealed for information about the “disappearance” of Palestinian journalist Bayan Abusultan. She was reportedly last seen on March 19 among people “sequestered” in this week’s raid and siege of Al Shifa hospital by Israeli troops in ...
EDITORIAL:The Jakarta Post It happens again and again; indigenous Papuans fall victim to Indonesian soldiers. This time, we have photographic evidence for the brutality, with videos on social media showing a Papuan man being tortured by a group of plainclothes men alleged to be the Indonesian Military (TNI) members. ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Robyn J. Whitaker, Director of the Wesley Centre for Theology, Ethics, and Public Policy & Associate Professor, New Testament, Pilgrim Theological College, University of Divinity A strange and eclectic range of activities takes place across these few weeks of the year. Some ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Panizza Allmark, Professor Visual & Cultural Studies, Edith Cowan University It’s Easter weekend, which means many of us will be kicking back with the greatest hits on repeat. But whether you’re a boomer, or an ‘80s or ’90s kid, you might be ...
RNZ Pacific Fiji’s Acting Public Prosecutor has filed an appeal against the sentences of former prime minister Voreqe Bainimarama and suspended police chief Sitiveni Qiliho in their corruption case. Bainimarama was granted an absolute discharge for attempting to pervert the course of justice while Qiliho received a conditional discharge with ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Arosha Weerakoon, Senior Lecturer and General Dentist, School of Dentistry, The University of Queensland Casezy idea/Shutterstock How does toothpaste work? What did people use before toothpaste was invented? – Amelia, age 7, Meanjin (Brisbane) Thanks for your ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Brett Hallam, Associate professor, UNSW Sydney IM Imagery/Shutterstock Solar SunShot is well named. The Australian government announced today it would plough A$1 billion into bringing back solar manufacturing to Australia, boosting energy security, swapping coal and gas jobs for those ...
Source: The Conversation (Au and NZ) – By Clare Dix, Research Fellow in Nutrition & Dietetics, The University of Queensland Easter is the time for chocolate. The shops are full of fantastically packaged and shiny chocolates in all shapes and sizes, making trips to the supermarket with children more challenging ...
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HARRY FEAR & ROGER FOWLER WERE IN GAZA AS THE BOMBS FELL
– COME AND HEAR THEIR “GAZA REPORT ” NEXT THURSDAY.
– FREE SOUTH AUCKLAND BUS DEPARTS FROM
THE MANGERE EAST COMMUNTY CENTRE, 372 MASSEY RD at 6pm…
Arriving early, for the 7pm Thursday 7 February meeting at the Auckland University Library
Lecture Room B28
Alfred St, City.
All welcome
Legendary reggae band ‘Unity Pacific’ will perform their hit song “We are all Palestinians”.
Hosted by Auckland University Students For Justice in Palestine.
Website: uoasjp.wordpress.com
Organised by Kia Ora Gaza.
Website: kiaoragaza.net
No door charge, but donations towards the costs will be gratefully accepted.
Harry is on a world speaking tour, while in NZ he will also speak in Wellington & Christchurch.
See the Kia Ora Gaza website or FaceBook for details
Jenny is obviously going soft on climate change: this comment doesn’t mention it once 😉
Well Russel Norman did ruin all her fun yesterday.
Thanks for this heads up QoT.
Thanks for bringing this to my attention Qot. Much appreciated.
Without your assistance I would have missed this.
You are right this is a damn good speech. Keep up the good work Russel.
The only thing is, Key skewered him over the Emissions Trading Scheme. The fact of the matter is that the Pollution Trading Scheme, as it should accurately be called, is a Labour Party and National Government supported scheme to let the polluters off the hook. If I remember the debate properly, (and I do), at the time the Green Party had severe reservations about the PTS. Reservations that have been proved correct.
Now is the perfect time to rip the veil off and expose those who really support this dirty scheme.
Key in his reply, threatened Russel Norman that if the climate debate comes up in the election he will use the Pollution Trading Scheme to flay the Green Party.
The Green Party need to answer fire with fire.
And expose the Nats for their support for this scheme, that lets polluters off the hook to freely pollute at will. And dumps the bill on the taxpayers.
I call on the Green Party to put up private members bill calling for the complete repeal of the falsely named, Emissions Trading Scheme.
This will lead to a real debate on how to concretely cut back on our CO2 emissions, that is being held back though the use of this phoney scheme.
Let’s make New Zealand free to become a shining example to the world.
My proposed bill: The Green Party calls on parliament to completely abolish the Emissions Trading Scheme. the purpose of this bill to clear the ground for parliament to discuss a more proper and equable way to concretely cut our CO2 emissions.
Let’s have this debate in parliament. Right here. Right now, and during the elections. Without this terrible charade, clouding the issue.
Whether it is the National, or Labour Party version of the Pollution Trading Scheme both versions permit Business As Usual to carry on regardless. (Which was the intention).
Such an initiative if taken up by the Green Party caucus will earn them banner headlines and the respect of all sections of society. (Except the fossil fuel industry barons, who love this scheme.)
To win the debate on climate change the Green Party need to get rid of this dead albatross that the Labour and National Parties have draped on their shoulders.
Will the Greens expose this dirty scheme?
Or is this as good as it gets?
Now which legislation do you want the Green Party to put into the ballot first Jenny, the ‘we ban all coal mining bill’ or ‘the we can the Emissions Trading Scam in favor of a carbon tax bill’,
Now you might have to wait for quite some time Jenny because there’s this little Parliamentary convention that Opposition Party’s don’t just get to propose Legislation, they have to go in a ballot Jenny, some go in and never see the light of day Jenny and that’s just the nature of ballots…
I will never win Lotto, because I never buy a ticket. Some bills go in the ballot and never see the light of day. Don’t you think the odds are much improved for a bill being drawn, if it is actually in the draw.
What are you really trying to say here, Bad?
For goodness sakes don’t put any bills like this in, in case they get drawn?
“We are all Palestinians”, captures it. (If we are not, we will be soon)
Now THAT is how one gives a speech.
Take a look at one of our Electorate MPs in action yesterday in Parliament.
http://youtu.be/ON6vInrDbhk
Ah, yes. He got my electorate vote the last couple of elections, and will get it again if I am living in his electorate again next year.
“Bottom up” government, eh?
“The strength of our ideas has always come from the grass roots.”
You see? He’s supporting the membership against the leader! Treason!
That’s a great speech from Cunliffe. He gets the left-wing economics, and he gets the need to democratise and listen to the grassroots. What a loss.
Yes Daveo what a loss indeed! Small wonder Shearer is so very afraid of him, he could never match sheer brilliance of this nature. But, incredibly, still looks as though Labour is content to settle for second (or third) best.
Definitely 3rd. Parker would have been 100% better than Shearer, Cunliffe a thousand times better and some.
Given the limitations of the paradigm he operates from within and bearing in mind there are some fundamental aspects of that paradigm that are anathema to me…there was a lot in that speech that came across as positive and that would win my support.
And I’m aware he was accomodating the present Labour Party’s perspective and yet…well, let me put it this way: Dare I listen to David Shearer’s speech and compare the two? Nah. It would just blast away any positive feelings that Cunliffe’s speech has generated.
And the opening lines that referred to Melon(?) of the US Treasury(?) speaking in the 30’s? I was honestly thinking ‘Shearer, Shearer, Shearer’ – not ‘Key, Key, Key’. Was it deliberately ambigious? I don’t know. I can only state my reaction.
And politics ‘with people’ and not ‘to people’ – and being ‘hands on’ with regards to the levers of economic management sounds to me to be a million miles away from David Shearer’s ‘hands on’. His ‘hands on’ leaves me suspecting heavy handedness and interference in areas way beyond basic economic matters and has me gearing up for something a bit dirty, dodgy and unwelcome.
And wasn’t it soooo refreshing to hear a Labour Party mp express empathy for the unemployed rather banging on about the unemployed ‘doing their bit’ to earn the grace of a government and its conditional support?
Text of the speech is here:
http://cunliffe.co.nz/parliamentary-speech-debate-on-prime-ministers-statement/
And the snippet that brought Shearer to the forefront of my mind?
It just dovetails right on into the likes of
and
To me that’s a whole lot of ‘hands on’ and no obvious ‘hands up’. Be ‘good’ and exhibit the ‘correct’ forms of behaviour and we’ll be there for you. Otherwise…
Now contrast that with doing politics ‘with people’ and not ‘to people’.
ta
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andrew_W._Mellon
Yet another bankster in the US government
Yep, such as this bit:
Still in the capitalist paradigm. It’s not that we need unions as that we need for our businesses to be cooperatives controlled by the workers for the workers rather than owned and controlled by a few for the benefit of a few (who probably don’t even work there).
That’s good but, so far, I haven’t seen any such commitment from Shearer.
And this –
“Finally, it is time we restored pride in being a Kiwi. So Labour’s new direction will be built on a strong, high-value economy and the values of social inclusion, tolerance, and diversity that are the hallmark of any great society.
Labour, under David Shearer, is called on again to take up its historic mission of hands-on Government, of big change, of a new era, and of a better way that does politics with our people, not to them; that empowers New Zealanders from the bottom up; that does not slash them from the top down; that builds a high-value economy; that delivers an inclusive society; that champions a sustainable environment; and that celebrates our unique identity.”
Pretty clear on many levels what is being said there.
Yes Cunliffe did mention ‘the environment’. Just as the Green Party mention ‘the environment’ but play down climate change.
I can’t help getting the feeling that Cunliffe has had his wings clipped, so as not to upset the Obama/Romney type gentleman’s agreement not to bring up climate change during the upcoming elections.
Yes and as usual it was the best speech out of the Labour camp. And after watching Meteria Turei and Julie Ann Genter, is there any wonder that this time around I will tick Green and NOT Red. But I am still going through the replies to Key’s Alcohol fueled? rant in Parliament. So now for some light relief, and with ALL translators running. I get to Hekia Parata’s speech it should be interesting.
Anyone who was at the town hall meetings last time in which Cunliffe was head to head against Shearer will know how Cunliffe can rock the hall and leave the rest of them just unable to follow. They can hate on him all they like, he’s the best speaker Labour has in the entire party.
Cunliffe is the primary opposite of Key; Key has got by for so long on jokes and winning a room with charm, while all the fun ruthless steel with officials gets done by Joyce and Brownlee. With Cunliffe you know it will be quite humorless and earnest, but you sure know what’s coming: it will be breakthrough government, bold and break and remake government. The fun ruthles steel will be right out in the open.
It will be what he did to Telecom, except across every portfolio. I would love to hear Russell Norman say what he would break and remake. Because I know there is only one person National fears getting the leadership of Labour and of the country, and it ain’t David Shearer.
Gareth Hughes makes some very good points about the first fines dished out via a Skynet file downloading/uploading decision:
Have these punitive companies never heard of warnings.
I doubt if they’re really looking at these law suites stopping people but as another revenue source.
Am having some odd experiences trying to post a comment this morning, LPrent.
Laurie Penny, on fighting internet misogyny:
http://www.newstatesman.com/laurie-penny/2013/01/take-back-net-its-time-end-culture-online-misogyny
<i…..Asking for it. By daring to be a woman to be in public life, Mary Beard was asking to be abused and harassed and frightened, and so is any person who dares to express herself whilst in possession of a pair of tits.
It’s an attitude so quotidian that only when you pause to pick it apart does its true horror become apparent. I am contacted, not every day, but most weeks, by young women who want to build lives as journalists or activists but are afraid of the possible backlash. Every time I receive one of these letters, I get a lurch of guilt: should I tell them the truth? Should I tell them that sometimes I’ve been so wracked with anxiety by the actions of trolls and stalkers that I’ve been afraid to leave the house, that I’ve had to call in the police, that there’s every chance they might too? Or should I tell them to be brave, to take it on the chin, to not be frightened, because their fear, their reticence to speak, is precisely what the trolls want to see most of all?….
…The internet is a young country. Its laws and customs are not yet decided. We don’t have to accept sexist hatred in silence any more. This week, with many victims sharing their stories of online harassment on the hashtag #silentnomore, the fightback began in earnest.
Special call to Brian Edwards, who is persisting in deriding those who use pseudonyms on the webs, on the grounds that he is able to use his real name and “what’s the difference’?
“Mary Beard was asking to be abused and harassed and frightened, and so is any person who dares to express herself whilst in possession of a pair of tits.
A pair of tits with long grey hair apparently makes it worse because it confuses the poor dears who can’t work out what sort of woman she’s meant to be. So they end up with ‘witch’.
She can probably handle it, but I really feel for a lot of women who try to say anything controversial on the internet. They have the opposite problem – how can someone you might fancy possibly go on and on about things that are seriously challenging your world view?
“Special call to Brian Edwards, who is persisting in deriding those who use pseudonyms on the webs, on the grounds that he is able to use his real name and “what’s the difference’?”
Really? Is the tosser still pouting like a child on this issue? Hey, Edwards, two things….. 1, stop reading this shit then and 2, do you understand why voting is confidential and not public?
doh
You know, what it really reflects is Edwards inability to objectively assess an issue. His assessment is completely and utterly tied up in his own circumstances and not been separated. A quite fundamental failure.
+1
+1
Another weird thing LPrent, the teaser in the comment lost it’s italics during moderation. I swear they were there when the finished comment appeared after I pressed “post”. Otherwise I would have edited because it annoys me when it is unclear who is saying what.
all classically rounded fillys welcome to pasture round ‘ere
The participation of Union Members in the process to select the Labour Leader will be a good thing.
When Unionists attend the dozen leadership debates around the country their bond with Labour will be strengthened.
What percentage of New Zealand workers are members of unions?
What percentage of Standard readers can be bothered to Google that for you?
dunno but they’re important to the Labour Party past and present.
Past of course but present I’m not so sure because if the percentage of workers in NZ in a union is low (as I suspect but don’t know) then maybe giving the unions more representation is not a good way to go…
“Maybe” no-one will pay attention to the weasel words of a lazy wingnut. That seems more likely.
Too lazy or brain dead to do the research yourself to find out the answer to your question, instead you expect others to do it for you, a sense of entitlement perhaps…
A wingnut doing his own reality-check? Pull the other one.
Funny a leftie thinks like that because I’m thinking that someone on here will know the answer therefore it’d be quicker to post the question here
A more judicious use of my time if you like
Definitely a sense of entitlement.
Indeed, an overblown sense of entitlement that far exceeds that one’s importance or use in the great scheme of things…
chris, how many New Zealanders are large business owners and should National ignore their views if the number is not huge?
National should probably take more on board the views of small to medium business owners first (but I wouldn’t hold my breath) but it also depends on how much tax revenue each sector generates I guess
What about farmers? There are bugger all farmers in NZ and they pay bugger all tax.
Should National pay any attention to their views?
I think most farmers are lazy, entitled, inherited spongers…but thats just my opinion
The embodiment of laziness. Do you have any opinions based on reality?
That wasn’t the question though chris. Should National listen to farmers or not?
Being the largest export earner then yes. Sure everybody should be listened to but to pay for things you do need money but listening doesn’t have to mean bending over backwards for someone
Workers are the largest export earner chris73, workers. And I don’t see this Government paying them much attention at all.
They only listen to the people who vote for them, hence the poor people of east Christchurch being left to live in shit while the farmers 40km away get immediate attention to everything and $400million for their privately owned businesses.
The world in NZ is unbalanced and slowly toppling. It is the leaning tower of milk biscuits.
And who do Labour listen to? Certainly not the members…
“They only listen to the people who vote for them”
Bollocks. They only listen to the people who pay them.
chris73: a democracy is a system of government supposed to give voice to individuals, not to the tax revenue that they generate.
Yeah but when did the National Party become a democracy?
Taking lessons from Labour?
Democracy is for ancient greeks but I guess it’ll have to do until something better comes along
Slaves had no effective say in the running of Ancient Greek democracy. So maybe it’s more relevant today than you might think?
“Think”? lol
Well democracy beats other tried and tested methods I guess, mind you its not like we have a decent form of democracy here…national, national, labour, labour, labour, national, labour, national, national, national, labour, labour etc etc
we get what people vote for, how do you reckon we should do it?
Good question, as stated above the Greeks had democracy but slavery, women were excluded, peasents excluded etc etc
Just doesn’t seem right having two party states
WTF are talking about?
There are more than two parties.
We haven’t had a one party government for bloody ages.
And this ‘seems right’ business. It’s what people vote for, getting what they vote for seems right to me.
I hope you put that concern to the MMP commission.
That’s the result of representative democracy. If we had participatory democracy you wouldn’t get that and we’d probably get more stable government as well.
“Just doesn’t seem right having two party states”
Dead right, Chris! I’m hoping that we can move to a system where other parties get a fair go and can even be included in governing coalitions. Something that would stop the right gerrymandering election results and ‘winning’ while losing the popular vote. It could be based on proprtional representation. I’ve even thought of a name for it: Mixed Member Proportional. MMP, for short. Do you think it’ll catch on?
Oh please, the Greens can’t go anywhere but Labour so Labour can dump on them whenever they like.
I mean do you see a scenario where the Greens would refuse to go into coalition with Labour especially if it went National could sneak back in?
National will hoover whatever support it can to get back in (i hope it doesn’t come down to winstonFirst)
Whatever way it falls your choice is Labour or National with some hangers on
nah.
That’s not ‘your choice’, that’s the likely outcome of elections given what everybody tends to choose.
and when the largest party only has half or two thirds of the required support to form a government, the other parties in government become less “hangers on” and more “coalition partners”.
Why should someone have less say in their governance just because they pay less nominal (after all, the percentage should be the same) tax?
Civilisation started going downhill when they let people who weren’t white Christian property-owning men have the vote.
Civilisation started going downhill when that damn monolith turned up…
🙂 Lol!
yeah that was funny 🙂
I was tossing up between that and something about crawling out of the primordial ooze…
“Lords of The Galaxy”
-Floyd (from The Great Gig in The Sky)
379,649 – 17.4% of the total employed force (March 2010 Household Labour Force Survey).
http://www.dol.govt.nz/er/starting/unions/union-membership-2010.pdf
Thank you
For all the David Shearer fans (and I know there are many)
When it comes to David Shearer I’m reminded of professional wrestling (seriously) in that the wrestlers portray persona’s IE baby-face, heel, naive, sneaky etc etc
But the best ones are those that are exaggerations of what they’re like in real life
The best examples of this would be The Rock and Stone Cold who both went through various persona’s before they found the fit and became superstars
So the “tough guy” act isn’t working then maybe he needs to exaggerate his own qualities like nice guy, competent manager etc etc
Strange analogy, but I think I see what you’re saying.
The problem with that scenario is that how Labour marketed him in the first place – competent manager, facilitator, hero. They couldn’t sell it whereas they think the tough guy approach is more appealing, for some reason.
It is strange but when you consider wrestlers and politicians both try to “sell” an image…the other lesson wrestling could teach Shearer is give the people what they want (not what the advisers want) in this instance CM Punk is a good example
He was packaged by the bookers as a straight-edge good guy but the public didn’t buy it and he soon morphed into a heel (and a damn good one) so I guess the question is what do the Labour members want?
The best examples of this would be The Rock and Stone Cold who both went through various persona’s before they found the fit and became superstars
And it doesn’t hurt that each of them were very much involved in the creation of their successful personas.
On the other hand Million Dollar Man Ted Dibiase was just given one to play with out-of-the-box and he was highly successful. I’m sure there’s some kind of analogy to be made there.
Hey LPRent,
I Can’t see the Standard from my home line ? (122.61.40.24 )
So being brown and beating a criminal automatically makes you competent in a portfolio?
[lprent: If you want to start a trash talk thread then do it in OpenMike. Don’t make me clean up behind you. ]
“King Kong 1.1
31 January 2013 at 9:27 am
So being brown and beating a criminal automatically makes you competent in a portfolio?”
Re-posted for posterity and defamation cases
Name names or gtfo with making shit up.
I dare you. 😉
Come on Kong, do be specific.
If you’re going to post about a ‘brown assaulting a criminal’, name them or look for an easier topic 😆
Um, I think “beating” in this case is a reference to an electoral fight, not a physical one…
I see KK confirms this…
I think you chaps have the wrong end of the stick. I refer to him defeating Phillip Field (who is a criminal) in the race for the seat.
Look at you racists jumping to the conclusion I was talking about physical violence just because he is brown.
😆
King Kong 1.1.1.2
31 January 2013 at 9:45 am
“Look at you racists”
Like I said, name names or gtfo with making shit up.
I dare you. 😉
You’re strange.
Let me guess under 5’7″ and a sufferer of short man syndrome.
Your post has publicly accused either me or the poster that is Mickeysavage of being a racist.
Retract and apologise I reckon, at the very least.
Or back up your claim with fact.
Simple as that.
I saw a KKK costume, a wooden cross and a can of petrol in the back of your car.
Now prove I didn’t.
I don’t own a car.
On top of that, being of Maori persuasion, I fing your patronising and aggresive tone to be racist.
“I fing your patronising and aggresive tone to be racist.”
Surely that would only make me patronising with an aggressive tone, not a racist?
But when one states
King Kong 1.1.1.2 31 January 2013 at 9:45 am
“Look at you racists”
That’s a definitive statement.
Stand by your claim and back it, or apologise.
You’re boring me now
ooh ooh,
“I have gazed on the face of Agamemnon”, and he was found wanting (though this, too, was never proved; Ares seemed incapable of original thought, wants what Aphrodite wants; may as well worship the sun, we’ll rest safely in Electra Dreams)
-Somewhere near Orion there’s a Nestor ian Chryses.e.e (from an Odyssey beyond The Street Cafe, cumming as you are, soaked in Bleach any mule know dat you got a tight connection to my heart) 🙂 Love ya work! you thin white duke.Shock me to the core.
So your boredom negates your responsibility under the law? I think not.
I can’t possibly allow to persist a situation where my reputation is so sullied by false accusations of racism.
I ask you for a final time to atone for your error.
“I ask you for a final time to atone for your error.”
Or what ??
“Or what ??”
The real question is by who?
I think it’s pretty obvious to old hand forum users, that some posters, like kong, piss contest themselves into a corner and no matter how factually incorrect or clearly in the wrong, leave themselves no way back without destroying their web id in the process.
But not me.
Reading his contributions, I don’t think the commentator is at all at ‘one with him/herself’ to begin with, but still, direct, definitive statements like those expressed above reach out far and wide across the web, especially on such a notable site such as this, and if left unchallenged, so would my lack of a response – A bit like the PM when he sat by and let a c list breakfast tv host make racist comments about then Governor general and all other similar coloured skinned New Zealanders. Guilt by doing fuck all.
I accept I won’t get the apology I deserve, but again, that neither diminishes the falsehood or the potential negative impact it could have my charitable and business projects.
If he were a rich prick, my legal pit bull would be all over it already, but I suspect KK isn’t, so what’s the point? In this instance I’m content to let the regular contributors of the standard decide if I’m a racist or kk loses what little credibility he/she had.
If it’s all about picking the right battles to fight, I’ll keep my powder dry for just now.
You are awsome.
I would love to take your legal Pitbull for a walk someday.
“You are awsome.”
At last something by you I agree with, even if you did spell it incorrectly.
“I would love to take your legal Pitbull for a walk someday.”
Kong, king of chimps, you just let me know when you have a brighter future worth risking.
KK at 10.10am
Now now King Kong that’s tallism and you are rather freakily tall aren’t you. Pity your brain doesn’t match your body size.
WTF are you congenitally defective????
Where’s the links to your defamation??
Gee King Kong you are slipping. You had the chance for a bit of misogyny as well as racism and you missed it. Not feeling well?
My message to caucus is this ‘Give Cunliffe back his portfolios,give Cunliffe back his mana,
give back HIS rightful place as leader,that he won in the prior election process, in not doing
so demonstrates the lack of being an inclusive thinking caucus and one only for the ‘selected
few’, i, as a potential voter demand it.
Uh, caucus and the Labour Leadership has no ability to give back what they cannot take away 😉
Yes, you are right CV, i read the transcript and just felt annoyed at the lack of
recognition for the grass roots,members etc, by the current caucus, i vented.
My frustration is that we have a viable,astute,potential leader and he has been
tossed aside in order to save an incapable individual.
Since jobs and manufacturing are the problem we should be celebrating their demise.
Get over it!
Oh, I forgot, Ben want us all to be slaves of the industrial economy and the money-lenders, and spend our time working in jobs that provide no satisfaction and wreck the ling term future for everyone.
[lprent: Since you have made a vague attempt to pin your hobby horse to the post I will just move this thread to OpenMike.
However next time I see you do it this type of diversion again, I’ll not only push the whole thread into OpenMike and then ban you for quite a few months to prevent me from having to waste my time again.
This is what you got banned for the last time I had to do it. If you want to discuss something this divergent to the intent of the post – start it in OpenMike. Don’t be a lazy jerk and expect me to keep cleaning up behind you. ]
I was coming to the view that you couldn’t get any crazier. Well done!
You’ve got to have goals in life mate 🙂
Actually it’s quite a rational view of the New Zealand economy although the manner ‘AFew’ frames the comment does not quite address it that way,
There is in fact no way on this planet without severe Government intervention that ‘the market’ can or ever has provided enough employment in the New Zealand for all those wanting such employment,
Only a highly protected economy can provide that, or, an economy where the tax base is used to produce employment for all…
You misunderstand Afewknowthetruth, bad 12.
Those of is who do not die of starvation, will be left to eat the beans and rice they have hoarded before the end comes and then fight it out with each other over what is left.
Afewknowthetruth is really looking forward to it.
Misunderstand Him, no not at all, He is speaking from a position of CO2 release into the atmosphere and i fully understand the theory of the worse case scenario just as i also fully understand that politics and politicians are mostly reactionary in that until the first wave crashes through the international departure lounge of Wellington airport whereupon they will all start being ‘true believers’ CO2 release into the atmosphere will be at best given lip service…
Insanity is attempting to perpetuate a system that is rapidly destroying the Earth, and has no future because the energy necessary to run the in the future does not exist.
Of course intelligent discussion of issues is beyond your brain capacity so you persist in posting juvenile commentary.
The simple fact is, unless the global industrial system collapses very soon nobody will be able to survive on this planet beyond 2040. Even the IMF has said so.
Of course a brain-dead individual like you obviously cannot appreciate the ramifications of a 4oC or 6oC rise in average temperature in a matter of decades.
“Even the IMF has said so.”
Citation please.
“Of course a brain-dead individual like you obviously cannot appreciate the ramifications of a 4oC or 6oC rise in average temperature in a matter of decades.”
Average temperature of NZ goes from 15C to 19C. Oh noes, we’re all going to die! Northern parts of Australia have this sort of average temperature and people manage to live there just fine. Even aborigines did, and they did it without fossil fuels.
I know you have a very small brain and cannot process information well but instead of thinking about NZ going from 15oC to 19oC you might like to consider the effect of arctic regions going from minus 2oc to plus 2oC.
In practice the Arctic regions are super-sensitive to small changes in temperature and tend to amplify them (albedo effect amongst many others) so the temperature of the artic regions is likely to rise by 10 or 20oC if the Earth’s average temperature rises by 4oC. Expect massive sea level rise (several metres) and out-of-control positive feedback that take the temperature up another 10oC, i.e. +16oC above the present average temperature. That is exactly what the latest research indicates.
As I have noted previously, most people are uninformed, stupid and stubborn.
As for the IMF citation, how about you doing a quick search.. You obviously need practice in doing research, since you do so little and do not even know very rudimentary stuff.
By the way, Australia has recently announced a new record average temperature of 40.3oC. That has been enough to devastate large swathes of the country. Meanwhile, the higher ocean temperatures are resulting in ever increasing damage due to flooding.
Those in favour of perpetuating present economic arrangements are in favour of ever greater devastation.
“As for the IMF citation, how about you doing a quick search.. You obviously need practice in doing research, since you do so little and do not even know very rudimentary stuff.”
You’re the one that made the claim. Don’t make me do work for you.
“In practice the Arctic regions are super-sensitive to small changes in temperature and tend to amplify them (albedo effect amongst many others) so the temperature of the artic regions is likely to rise by 10 or 20oC if the earth’s average temperature rises by 4oC.”
Citation please, because that sounds very extreme.
Anyway, even if the arctic / antarctic did go from -2C to 2C, it will still take a very long time for the ice sheets to melt. Even if they did and the water level rose by 60m, guess what, most of NZ is much higher than 60m above sea level! You’re acting like everyone is going to die, when patently they aren’t. Would life be difficult? Yes. Would life be impossible? Far from it.
“By the way, Australia has recently announced a new record average temperature of 40.3oC. That has been enough to devastate large swathes of the country.”
I’m not sure what “devastate large swathes of the country” is supposed to mean. Lets put it another way: how many people died because of this “average temperature of 40.3C”, I’m assuming you mean that for 1 day the average across the whole country reached that.
“Those in favour of perpetuating present economic arrangements are in favour of ever greater devastation.”
Yes, I agree. But that doesn’t mean everyone is going to be dead by 2050 as you seem to enjoy saying.
I don’t know about 20˚ (although there are certainly recorded Arctic temperature anomalies of that magnitude) being the average, but Arrhenius predicted polar amplification in 1896, so it certainly isn’t of out the ball-park.
Citation please? A couple of comments up you yourself use your own anecdotal story as justification. Double standard much?
Just go to ‘Nature Bats Last’ and read the article Climate Change update. It’s all there.
Go on. I dare you, become informed instead of spouting a lot of emotional drivel based on misinformation or no information.
Started skimming it and came to this little doozy:
“In other words, Obama and others in his administration knew near-term extinction of humans was already guaranteed.”
That’s in response to an increase of 6C. There’s no explanation as to how this would cause “near-term extinction”, it’s just blithely asserted that it will do so.
I wish MacPherson would do an article where he explains the mechanisms that would cause extinction. Not seen one so far.
I did a thorough search for to something about IMF. Couldn’t find it.
So how about you back up your argument with a source?
Go to Nature Bats Last and read Climate Change Summary and Update.
There are dozens of links and sources on NBL, all verifying what I have been saying for the past 12 years…. only it’s all happening a lot faster than I imagined possible a decade ago, when we were looking at severe ‘problems’ around 2100. Now we are staring down the barrel of a ‘gun’ pointed at us 2020. Indeed, there are a number of people extremely concerned that the central states of the US may become largely uninhabitable within 5 years.
That’s the trouble with taking the planet we live on into unknown territory for the sake of consumer crap and unnecessary travel.
Bill has done some excellent items on The Standard.
Seems they were soon forgotten. -like within two weeks.
By following a link from that site, the closest I could find was this:
“This came just after the World Bank said that 4 °Cs of warming will end the world as we know it. ”
If you then follow that link, they don’t say “end the world as we know it”, instead they talk about heat waves and the problems of rising sea levels. But they don’t say “nobody will be able to survive on the planet beyond 2040”.
If you have the actual quotation of the IMF saying that, please provide it, otherwise we will assume this is your usual hyberbole.
Humans .humans humans……http://t.co/zrE1Ugec
Hmmmm and I here I thought ‘Crazy’ was man developing a system that he then has to turn around and work for in order to survive….
Even more crazy is not recognising this and changing the system so that instead works for him. But then if we did that how would you know if you were doing ok if you couldn’t look elsewhere in the world and see people suffering poverty, war or working harder than you have to for less money.. right!?!
You don’t have to take part in the global economy. You can go buy some land and live self-sufficiently if you want. A lot of people do this. No one is forcing you to take part in the global economy.
It’s just that actually, being able to go to the store and buy some food is a lot more convenient than spending 3 months growing it yourself.
‘you can go and buy some land’
The great irony is that you have to be part of the system to escape from it. Those who loot and pollute the most end up with the most digits and can escape to almost whenever they want to.
Interestingly, now that most of the world is turning to shit environmentally, economically and politically, the rich dudes and dudettes decide to come to NZ to escape the worst effects of it all.
I wonder how many of the ‘peasants’ in Beijing who cannot even breathe the air dream of a life in the country with a piece of land.
“The great irony is that you have to be part of the system to escape from it.”
It’s not really ironic, it’s an obvious reality. We aren’t living in the 1600’s when you could sail a ship to America and find huge areas of fertile land that were free for the taking. All of the good land is already taken, if you want to possess it for yourself then you need to make some sort of trade to get there. Or you can try and take it by brute force if you think that will get you somewhere.
Lanth just admit that was a dumbarse comment (or not) and move on :).
It is no different than right wing idiots saying if you have a problem with a petroleum based economy just stop using petrol….. not very helpful
It’s not a dumbarse comment.
It’s really true: if you don’t want to be part of the global economy, you don’t have to be. Having the means not to be part of the global economy is another question.
Sorry Lanth I was just kidding.. not good at conveying attempts at humour on here.
Lanth, is your last name “Yossarian” per chance?
No.
“It’s really true: if you don’t want to be part of the global economy, you don’t have to be. Having the means not to be part of the global economy is another question.”
Leaving aside that those two statements don’t make sense together, the first statement is not really true. It is VERY hard to be self sufficient to the extent that on can opt out of the global economy entirely, or even largely. That’s why hardly any one is doing it in industrialised nations. If you think it is possible, please show some examples.
Hard, yes.
Impossible: probably not. People were doing it in NZ right up until the 19th century.
I’m just not sure that there’s anyone who is nutty enough to try, although a few might come close, off-grid lifestylers getting all their produce from local farmers’ markets etc if they can’t grow or make it themselves.
No they weren’t McFlock. 19thC NZ was PRE-global economy. They didn’t have to take themselves out. It’s the taking out that’s the hard part, not living without it.
For instance, where would you get tools for growing food, if you didn’t buy them from places that were dependent on the global economy. I can think of a few people that make their own tools, but they still source their metals from the global economy. And none of them live local to me. So I’d need a way of travelling to them. A horse? Sure, but for any distance I’d also need a wagon or cart, to carry food and goods for trade. How is the wagon made? Tools? Not metal surely. Any idea how hard it is to make wagon wheels? I’m sure there are still people in NZ that can do this, but I bet they’re well hooked into the global economy.
See how this goes? It’s the same as with looking at transitioning off oil. You have to look at systems and networks and the interdependency of things.
Another example: where would you get seeds for growing food? Think about that.
Growing all your own food is very hard to do outside of a community that is also doing that (not to mention other human needs). It’s even hard to do within a society where that is the norm (you’ll have heard of crop failures). Almost no-one in NZ in the 1800s was living self-sufficiently. They were all living in communities that were based on interdependence (Maori and Tauiwi). Until we have that kind of interdependence on each other again we cannot live without the global economy. It will eventually come but the only question now is will we be pushed or will we jump or will we lie down and die after the party is over.
CW you’re taking a rather different view of “global economy” than I was.
For you, it basically means “if you buy something from a shop that is otherwise definitely local, you’re participating in the global economy” which is strictly true.
My perspective on this was rather more “if you’ve only got very limited contacts with the economy and are buying things that *could* have been provided locally (even if they actually weren’t) then that still counts”.
As for your specific talk about tools and metal work: just look at the amish communities in the US.
Sorry Lanth, but that seems to be a copout. My local supermarket is locally owned, can I buy from them and still not be part of the global economy? All their food that I buy *could* be grown locally.
The Amish communities are communities, see my points below. Also, they’re not in NZ, so the point is moot.
I’d still like to see you provide some specific examples, NZ ones, of people that are successfully living without “taking part in the global economy”.
I know lots of people that are attempting this, or working towards this, but it irks to see you suggesting that it’s easy or straightforward, or can be achieved to a large degree, when their hard work demonstrates otherwise.
No CW, it’s not a copout, because I am specifically talking about people who make an active effort to remove themselves from the global economy, I’m not talking about someone that “buys food from the local grocery so therefore aren’t involved in the global economy”.
“The Amish communities are communities, see my points below. Also, they’re not in NZ, so the point is moot.”
I only said it was possible to live without being part of the global economy. I never said anything about doing it by yourself or not being part of a community. Likewise I never said anything about doing it in NZ, so I’m not sure why you’re demanding that.
“I know lots of people that are attempting this, or working towards this, but it irks to see you suggesting that it’s easy or straightforward, or can be achieved to a large degree, when their hard work demonstrates otherwise.”
Well I’m not sure why it’s really a big deal anyway. I mean the whole reason it’s hard to extract yourself from the global economy is because actually the global economy is very efficient at doing lots of very important things. It also has a huge amount of waste, inefficiencies and injustices as part of it, but overall the benefit seems to outweigh the cost.
Isn’t it rather obvious that when PP said ‘man’ was referring to the human race in general? Lanth your response “You don’t have to take part in the global economy.” which you’ve later qualified with “Having the means not to be part of the global economy is another question.” seems to be pedantic and pointless.
So you’re saying that if ‘you’ are one of the small fraction of the population that has the means to escape form the global economy, then ‘you’ can escape from the global economy? Thanks for that. But PP wasn’t claiming it to be a logical impossibility, he was talking generally. For the vast majority who are not in that small fraction, choosing to not take part in the global economy in the face of the myriad of societal pressures against you is a hard road that only an even more tiny fraction is cut out for.
Love comments like this – not very well thought through though…… and where does one get the money outside of the ‘global economy’ to ‘buy’ this land to live sustainably…!?!
Unfortunately for me I care a great deal about my fellow man. I don’t want my children to grow up in this world that is designed to benefit a few, when another world that would benefit all is possible.
The problem is, with the way the system is, most people don’t have the time to stop working, take six months out of their lives and figure out why things aren’t working, what the actual problem is and what needs to happen to fix things. I am simply lucky enough to have been able to do this.
If you new how to solve poverty and war for good would you just sit back and say nothing.
If the system can’t provide simple needs for everyone when the resources exist to do so. Why are you so attached to it. I have read your comments on here and you don’t fall into the category of ‘I’m doing ok so the system works’.
You and others may think I am a loon but throughout history it has only been those that are crazy enough to think that they can change the world that have. As luck would have it I am just that crazy 😉
So I will continue pointing out the failings of the system that are only getting worse and get those who are open minded enough to think about better ways. Ways that can provide for everyone and actually improve living standards at the same time.
But then perhaps you actually believe that the Left have the answers despite they haven’t fixed the problems previously. If you believe that the please share how. Because if they can I can join the party sit back and relax and wait for the change that will fix the worlds (or even just the country if thats easier) problems to come.
“You can go buy some land…”
With what shall I buy it, dear Lizza dear Lizza,
With what shall I buy it, dear Lizza with what?
with a loan , dear henry, dear henry, dear henry
with a loan, dear henry, dear henry, a loan
So kowtow to the banksters and sign a death contract to them? Sorta defeats the purpose yeah?
I, like many in this country, have a mortgage and as far as I am aware the banks have never killed anyone for not keeping up the payments.
Calling it a death contract might be overstating things.
I’m sure that the stress of the bank loan has killed people though.
I am sure the stress of marriage has killed people too but I don’t see many people wanting to ban that, in fact they want to make gay people suffer as well.
No, marriage hasn’t killed people – the financial stress caused by the banking system has caused marriages to break up though.
So rich people don’t divorce?
I’m sure that they do – just more likely to be for other reasons than financial stress.
And how will I pay that loan back, dear dufus, how?
Lets see, your options for acquiring good fertile land that ownership has already been claimed by some other party.
1. Beg for it. Hey, maybe they’ll just give it to you.
2. Trade something for it. Perhaps some potatoes or intricately carved necklaces. More likely they’d want to trade the land for money, though.
3. Take it by force.
Out of those, the one most likely to work is #2.
I’m a pretty big fella, 3 might work too, not really in my charachter though.
I have land. Had to get it the old fashioned way though.
…..Only after begging and potatoes failed. Never thought about necklaces though. Might save that one for next time. 🙂
Did you not notice? That’s why they destroyed our manufacturing self sufficiency and greatly increased our reliance on international providers of basic utilities like banking systems and phones.
So yes, you can avoid taking part in the global economy, if you want to live back in the 1800’s,
I’m talking about living self-sufficiently on a farm.
without diesel, fertiliser, tractor parts, water pumps or seed?
People do it. Most of the things you listed haven’t been around more than 500 years and yet people managed without them.
I never said it was easy.
In fact that was my whole point – going down to the shop and buying your food is much easier than growing it for 3 months.
Look no one is arguing that modern industrialised civilisation doesn’t have seriously good perks. I don’t think anyone here wants to go back to hand wringing their clothes for example.
What will be required are systems and technology which make life during the decline just as good as modern day life, albeit it will probably be in different dimensions.
i wring my clothes by hand thankyou!
😀
Aternatively, I wonder how long one could simply “go bush” for?
Not me, I like mp3s and electric blankets, but a huntin’ shootin’ fishin’ type could possibly do quite well in the ranges, and nobody need ever know.
I’ve read of a few hermit types in NZ that only have outside contact once a year or less.
What makes you think they’re not dependent on the global economy?
I’m assuming that if you only visit with civilization once or twice a year, you could very well go on without visiting it ever.
But you’re right, they could be buying huge stockpiles of ammo or tools etc on those visits.
“but a huntin’ shootin’ fishin’ type could possibly do quite well in the ranges, and nobody need ever know.”
Until they run out of bullets. And yes, it is possible to mine minerals and make the moulds for the bullets and the bullets themselves*, but now we are talking about a very small number of people with that skill set and I doubt that anyone in NZ is doing it.
*no idea about gunpowder though.
Why do you need bullets to hunt? Humanity has lived off the land without bullets for millennia. The maori even did it right in this country.
Now obviously there’s much less wildlife around these days than there was back then, so it would probably make it more difficult and would support many fewer people for any particular area of land. On the other hand there are many more introduced species around, if you don’t mind eating wild pigs, rats and possums etc.
Lanth, honestly, I don’t mean to be rude, but I think you have no idea what you are talking about. Humanity has lived off the land for millennia without bullets, but they weren’t 21stC Kiwis who’ve been raised in houses and with supermarkets and cars. And they didn’t do it as individuals, they did it in communities and with technologies and skills that were inbuilt and didn’t have to be learnt whilst one was starving or shivering. If you read anthropological and first hand accounts from hunter gatherer tribes, you will understand that there is a collective knowledge and wisdom that enables survival and thriving that cannot simply be learnt by one individual who wants to go bush for the rest of their lives. In fact to suggest that that is even possible, is the height of civilised ignorance and arrogance. Hunter gatherer peoples have highly sophisticated technologies that are apparently invisible to everyone else in this conversation. We’ve lost much of that, and it will take much to get it back.
There is a reason why people, including Maori, use guns now – they’re so much easier in terms of the ratio of energy expended to energy harvested. And there isn’t that much land outside of National Parks that could support a person for the rest of their life hunting with a bow, spear or snares that they make and maintain themselves. I’m not saying it couldn’t be done, I’m saying it is so difficult under today’s conditions, that your statement that anyone who wants to live outside the global economy can is a nonsense.
Lolz all the wild-life one will ever need is just over that fence there grazing in the paddock, don’t let the farmer see you tho…
lol, they don’t like rustlers round these parts.
I suppose someone young and fit could survive indefinitely in NZ, on foot, by stealing lifestock. Doubt you could do it with kids in tow, or without that nice sharp knife that was imported from overseas 😉
Not to mention the problems with scurvy, or would they be cabbage rustling too?
Now cabbages rustling sounds good, easy to run down a young cabbage for the pot, i hear they don’t move to fast,
Reminds me of my first real road trip, 16 years old and 3 of us in a mark2 Zephyr up North some place and look at that Giant field of corn, lets grab a sack,
Lolz, turned out to be Maize, think the same thing probably happened to Ruth Richardson whereupon She came to the belief that there were no free lunches,
i wont go into the gory details of a wild turkey we came across at another venue, well it was outside of the fence, man that was one tough bird to chew…
CW, making bullets is easy. The basic design of the .22 cartridge is 150 years old. Think about the tech they had available in the 1860’s. Moulds, metal press tools, etc. some high precision for the day, but nothing fancy.
A garage workshop well set up could supply ammunition for dozens of hunter-gatherers.
In NZ there are also hundreds and hundreds of firearms enthusiasts who reload their own ammunition. Yes they buy in parts and materials, but its not a huge leap to having those items manufactured in NZ as well as gun powder.
Yes, of course. But you are talking about a community or society living without the global economy. I thought Lanth was saying that anyone who wanted to could live without it, and I’m just pointing to multiple examples that prove that is not true. You need a shift of mass numbers of people to make it possible.
use to have a gun room in one of my first flats; approx a dozen firearms and press to make own shells and cartridges, I sh*t u not.
Understood. I think Lanth is sorta forgetting that for many tens of thousands of years, man’s forefathers (hmmmm can’t figure out the gender neutral version) chose to live in co-operative groups, albeit relatively small. Tribes, hunter-gatherer parties, what have you.
And we know that for around 4000-5000 years, humans have congregated in large cities, creating vast empires.
Ancient people long figured out that you could sleep more safely together around a camp fire and when you had people taking turns on watch.
Basically, the crazy US “lone-wolf” style survivalist is fucked in the coming future; those who are a trusted part of strong cohesive communities are going to do the best.
Rogue: good on ya mate. Trust you had a very secure gun safe, or was it before those days 😉
b4
Sorry CW, but I don’t know why you got hung-up on me insisting that an individual could live out of the global economy.
I said it was possible to do so. Full stop. I didn’t say “it is possible for a single individual to live by themselves fully self-sufficiently”.
Is it possible for an individual to live by themselves without the global economy? Yes. Is it much easier if they’re part of a community? Yes. Hell, most people participating in the global economy are doing it as part of a community, so I don’t see why that suddenly wouldn’t apply if you chose to live outside of it.
So taking your (presumably) libertarian ideals to an extreme, if someone managed to buy all the land in the world and then forced everyone off the land to live floating on the sea, you’d be ok with that because that’s just private property rights?
Actually, it’s that we’ve developed a system which has the majority working to benefit the few in order to live in poverty. It is this system that is also causing the change within the environment that will render the middle latitudes uninhabitable.
“Since jobs and manufacturing are the problem we should be celebrating their demise.”
You go tell that to the people living in communities devastated by factory closures and job losses.
Indeed, such job losses devastate ‘local communities’ i have been watching this happen for 30 years as we as a country embraced the Neo- liberal economic paradigm,
Such a paradigm that has now morphed into the treatment of those who are or become unemployed as near-criminals is an abhorence where a particular cohort of workers have for decades given their labour to an industry for scant reward only then to have the rug ripped from beneath their feet to be faced with the stark future of life on the ‘dole’,
Within the wave of closures of business that accompanied the Western financial meltdown within the country’s that have placed the greatest value upon this Neo-Liberal economic paradigm is also the re-alignment of industrial production to the country’s that have cleverly side-stepped the worst excesses of Neo-Liberalism, those who in effect are ‘the winners’ of the contest of free trade of a global nature,
The ‘prize’ for those who have won in such a ‘competition’ has been the continuation of the stripping of production from the Western Neo-Liberal economic bloc which will now occur within the ‘winning’ country’s…
Farmworker on talk radio.. 12 days on 2 days off 10/11 hours a day He actually gets $5.60 an hour in his pocket……….
Aha, which is in fact illegal, but, try and get the Labour department to prosecute the farmer and they all will suddenly take on ‘a blank’ look…
Slave labour ..These guys and girls are the engine of our economy and there treated as indentured slaves. Makes me cry……
Crying tho is not a reasoned solution, efforts should be made to convince both the Labour and Green Party’s that the Labour Department should be legislated to enforce such laws and be provided with the resources necessary to investigate and prosecute any and all employers who breach the LAW on the payment of the minimum wage,
Only when Government upholds the laws as set out by the Parliament will such situations as you highlighted cease to exist it is pathetic Neo-liberal Bullshit to believe that an emplyee trapped in such a situation can prosecute His or Her own case without suffering further sanctions from the employer at some point in the future…
As an after thought i am going to assume that such ‘wages’ are brought about by a contractual arrangement where the Farmer as the employer has given unto Himself the luxury of believing that the employee is a ‘contractor’ as opposed to being a waged worker,
Solution, Labour/Green Government legislate minimum standards for such ‘contractors’ across all industries where it has been identified as the prevailing practice for circumventing the labour laws prevailing to wage workers and the minimum wage and any other conditions of work that a wage worker would normally expect in a bargaining between a reasonable employer and reasonable employee…
@ Andre, My brother was a union man and he helped some farm workers here
in southland that were being exploited, the farmers had to pay the workers what
they were owed and pay the correct wages,i don’t know if those workers stayed
in their jobs or not though.
There are also alot of overseas workers now on farms and they dont want to rock
the boat and complain because of their visa requirements, they have to work,so
they are stuck between a rock and a hard place, the farmers that are involved
in this practice are shameful and they should be bought to justice.
These farm workers usually also send some money home to their families,which
is another reason they don’t complain, the farmers know that too.
Andre
Where please.
“Farmworker on talk radio.. 12 days on 2 days off 10/11 hours a day He actually gets $5.60 an hour in his pocket……….”
How is that done? Obviously they’re not being employed in a PAYE job.
You just get asked to do more work than you can fit in an 8 hour day, and because you are on a salary of say $30K pa you don’t get paid for the extra time.
Such people do not need the opportunity to return to the slave system. They need the opportunity to live productive lives outside the slave system.
Needless to say, no mainstream political party is prepared to offer such opportunities.
The other aspect is, that by continuing with manufacturing the people you mentioned destroy their children’s futures. Hardly a worthwhile deal I would have thought.
Afewknowthetruth, I am thinking of opening a parody twitter account posing as a hard core lefty who has completely lost the plot. Similar to the Cath Delahunty parody account.
Would you mind if I just cut and paste the stuff you write here?
What is a hared core leftie ? Is it something to do with that idiotic game called rugby, in which grown men run around with a ball and gormless twits pay money to watch them?
Do you enjoy anything?
When you wake up in the morning is there anything at all you look forward?
Why do you have an issue with a game that brings joy to many, you negative hater?
When your superior intellect and wisdom has taken you far above masses, anything outside of your ethereal dominion seems triffling and a waste of time.
I wouldn’t say that jobs and Manufacturing are the problem. You actually need these and the capability in order to make the transition to a better system.
Once you have the support mechanisms or new systems in place to still ensure that people can have the things they need and want then and only then can you start to remove the jobs and the requirement for people to have to work. Until then you still have to play the game – you still have to earn money to buy the things you need and want.
Vehicle safety expert, this morning on NR, said Traffic Police aren’t experts, they can’t just carry
out a WoF check, they don’t have the tools, changes to allow Police to seek out alterations to vehicles have no effect on safety (well duh maybe the new power has more than just safety in mind). Well firstly, Police turn up immediately when a accident happens, they have huge experience of crash scenes, and the causes. And boy racers do run around in safe vehicles that still cause a public nuisense due to the alterations they have, alterations that disappear when they do get a WoF. So I ask you why would an expert be so naive, so contrary to logic, experience, and real issues of car abuse and still be calling themselves an expert? Why did the interviewer not ask some obvious questions the whole time? Police are ignorant of vehicle safety, is that what you mean? Police need to do a full WoF check right there and then on some rural road? The only problem with cars are safety issues, really??? Have you lived in NZ, heard of ChCh boyracers, of the Hamilton Te Rapa???
another cupla’ spheres from the air;
NZ Property Council and Ak Council / s “speaking different languages”
Parata slips on the sea-monster; How capable John? or just another Please Don’t Let Me be Miss Understood beastie?
“Jum” never caught the rye’ forecast, maybe he is a classical ecaunomist lingering.
Wishbone Ash Atmosphere? Cut it out Lord. That’s The Way
now, where was I, oh that’s correct, J-A ZZ J-A ZZ, said she aint here but she sure went Fast
(feel like a soldier, look like a thief) It’s our day. Chop Chop.
…and on the travelator tonight we have…
Now listen (echo) you rich people, weep and wail because of the misery that is coming upon you. Your wealth has rotted, and moths have eaten your clothes. Your gold and silver are tarnished. Their tarnish will testify against you and eat your flesh like house, contents and fire insurance. You have hoarded wealth in the last days. Look! The wages you failed to pay the workmen who mowed your fields, willingly too I might add, are crying out against you. The cries of the harvesters (Claasy) have reached the ears of the Lord Almighty. You have lived on earth in luxury and self-indulgence. You have fattened yourselves in the day of slaughter. You have condemned and murdered innocent men, who were not opposing you. (See how the farmer waits for the land to yield it’s valuable crop and how patient he is for the autumn and spring rains; as an example of patience take the prophets who spoke in the name of the Lord. As you know, we consider blessed those who have persevered. You have heard of Job’s perseverance? )
The Lord is full of compassion and mercy.
-Hop Sing
“http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10862422”
No wonder the police struggle to get recruits or retain staff. Seems any drunk obnoxious brat can get away with disrespectful behaviour towards police and if the officer does anything about it they lose their job.
Its not that easy. Training kids to be obnoxious is a false economy, Police is always best done lightly with a large stick. The fact that after five years of Key he has now only just got around to giving Police the power to investigate cars reconfigured to be attention grabbing is just amazing. They can’t crush what they don’t catch.
Lol, it’s almost like they don’t want insubordinate dropkicks with anger issues.
Also one drink-driving conviction rules you out (not that I have one or checked it out or anything…)
On the bright side KP, since the cop has been fired, he can now do something productive with his life.
Gordon Campbell withanother example of why it’s laughable when Nats start on with the bellyaching about how much the love they military and lefties hate them and don’t understand and shit.
http://gordoncampbell.scoop.co.nz/2013/01/31/gordon-campbell-on-jonathan-colemans-defence-debacle/
Coming our way? More ‘pigs at the trough’
http://blacktrianglecampaign.org/2013/01/30/panorama-the-great-disability-scam/
arbeitsscheu shy shy, hush hush eye to eye
Fly by Wire
http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/israel-jets-bombs-military-target-in-syria-amid-fears-damascus-will-pass-arms-to-hezbollah/2013/01/30/bc9e60ca-6b3e-11e2-9a0b-db931670f35d_story.html
“We live in a moment of history where change is so speeded up that we begin to see the present only when it is disappearing” -Stone the crows, ops,
-R.D Laing 😉
but that’s ok, Kmart and Buntings have lifted their sales game, the Commerce Commision finds power distribution company profits 5% above inflation, Shock and what Got Carter was the absence of loyalty of farmers supplying the meat co-ops as they sunsat on 100M losses. Had never heard of Thomas Tanner and the Seven Apostles until today in THE LIBRARY.It was the Summer of 69…
http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/2013/jan/31/muppets-again-ricky-gervais ma na ma na dee dee di dee dee
-Constantine (cookie?)
I bet Laing wrote that quite some time ago. Most people don’t get to see the present at all nowadays, it’s already gone.
Selected quotes from today’s Howick & Pakaranga Times:
“This coming year, according to the Chinese calendar, will be the Year of the Snake…….they are considered to be good mediators – keen, cunning, wise, intelligent and quick of wit – with business acumen, or able to trade away posessions……..Materialistic, snake people tend to prefer to have the best of everything but would rather aviod crowds………..known to suffer from stress, they prefer to live a peaceful existence, with plenty of time for relaxation – a heavy workload or busy schedule is not a snakes best friend!…………Happy New Year everyone.”
element is Water from the 10th on. Pahtay!
(xtatically, i also clean my own loo, modeled from guess who? Clue: he had the untouchables “re-labeled “children of god”. No I in team, better to be before the 8 ball mates)
chow (in a laughter lines way)
Finally ?
http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/industries/8247005/Progress-made-in-Port-dispute
The latest Roy Morgan is out. National is at 46% still, Labour is stuck on 31.5%. The Greens are up 1.5% to 13.5%. A good poll for them.
http://www.roymorgan.com/news/polls/2013/4858/
Had a quiet chuckle about a completely irrelevant trend – UF is beginning to acquire more and more of the sub-0.5% “^” symbols. Starting in August, too, so Dunne doesn’t even have the parliamentary break as a complete excuse 🙂
So the Housing announcement hasn’t made much difference to Labour’s potential fortunes !
15% for the Green Party in November 2014, not impossible…
Only 15% you say.
20% – 25% party if Labour carry on like they are, I reckon.
Nah i prefer the thought of the Green party gradually picking up a % here and a % there of the ‘registered but did not vote crowd’…
Your way is better and would give the Greens a better chance of lasting more than one term in Government before self destructing.
Latest poll … National + Labour no change, Greens moving up.
http://www.roymorgan.com/news/polls/2013/4858/
I suppose the genius Shearer puppet-masters will have a Plan … 1) attack the Greens! 2) sack somebody and look tough!
(Alternative plan – actually believe in something, and be able to explain it. I know it’s a bit left field, but it might work).
edit … slowly composed while MickeyS was nipping in first
Just give Labour a bit more time boys and girls, don’t be impatient!
Ok, since the personality change 😉 I can never tell whether you are joking or being sarcastic or not 🙂
Heh, CW 🙂
Scary thing: if you read into the Roy Morgan, it says that confidence in the Key government is back up to Feb 2012 levels. 57% say that NZ is heading in the right direction.
Read and weep.
That’s pretty fucking depressing 🙁
Good poll for Key, good for the Greens and I’m waiting for a red alert post to tell us it’s good for Labour even though it really isn’t.
Sorry GS
🙂
7000 cows take to cruising the ocean waves, China here we come, short term gain for long term pain as China builds it’s dairy herd from the best stock all over the World,
In ten years time when that herd numbers 5 or 10 million Fonterra won’t be able to sell an ounce of baby formula into China unless of cause if it wants to take a bath on the price the Chinese are willing to pay,
Bits of old dead cow will be cheap in the supermarkets as farmers in both Canterbury and the East of the North Island de-stock in the face of drought conditions…
That’s good news isn’t it?
Only if you eat bits of dead cow, which i do coz it does wonders for my bowels, lolz things must be slow if i am discussing my ablution habits,
Chickens tho remain stubbornly pricey after the pre-Christmas price gouge, note to chicken producers, we aint buying them until the price goes back down, (which will probably be not long after they have squeezed the last egg possible out of the poor old chooks)…
‘
No Right Turn
What Idiot/Savant forgot to mention, was that even under Labour’s version, the ETS, Pollution Trading Scheme, didn’t discourage this “dirtiest of industries”. It was in fact under the last Labour Government that this “ambitious” initiative was begun and even championed.
It is not that unlikely that a Shearer led government will also encourage and champion such extreme fossil fuel initiatives. Including the strip mining of the Denniston Plateau and Deep Sea Oil Drilling, and onshore and offshore fracking.
What this means for the Green Party, is that the Greens will have to accept these policies if they want a coalition agreement with Labour.
This goes a long way to explaining why the Green Party website takes pains not to give climate change issues any prominent profile.
This is a necessary preparation for the sell out to come.
You heard it here first. Just try and pretend to look surprised, when it happens.
Yes Jenny, thank you Jenny, by the way, hows the formation of the ‘alternative green die in the ditch party’ going…
What surprise? I’ve been telling you that the coal train is speeding up, not slowing down.
My view was that the ETS was never going to work it was and is simply a capitalist inspired take-over attempt on the Green Movement,
Jeanette F once flew into a public rage at such a questioning of the Emissions Trading Scam, (not long after that little exhibition She announced Her retirement),
i have always advocated for a localized carbon tax which should be spent into the economy (a) planting trees, even buying out the less productive land to plant upon, (b) research and development into ways of lowering carbon emissions for industry, and (c) research and development into the means of industrialized removal of carbon from the atmosphere…
52 million unemployed,
600,000 living in cave like conditions or under plastic which makes a UN tent city seem quite luxurious,relying upon food charity for their daily needs,
North Korea??? Somalia???,
Nah that greatest of countries in the World Amerika,
Them and North Korea polar opposites on the political spectrum, but where it really counts,for those on the bottom of the economic heap, not an iota of difference…
Well if you are poor in the US you can still get alcohol, tobacco and firearms more easily than if you are poor in North Korea. That must count for something?
Lolz an early exit out the back door for most…
223? anyway, mad as a cleaver;
no lattes from Guatemala now Dr Ropata, no fool like an old fool new world boy on the old Kings Road, Sha na na : Havoc Rocks The History of The World in One Site, Scrumpy (make sure you imbibe ‘eaps of water throughout the night)
-Lucy lucy oh no, we not go… http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uD9ZRlvnh7w
the copper shell may seek
ft/s and J of kinetic energy at 100m.
nite ( and just to swear for a break; fuck there are some oily dicks creep on here) unfuckinbelievable no balls, else they would front the peacemaker…