Operation 8 documentary

17 comments on “Operation 8 documentary ”

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1. Brett Dale 1

   27 May 2011 at 4:10 pm

   Who made the doco and is their relationship to the defendants, also what is their political ideology?
   • lprent 1.1

     27 May 2011 at 4:51 pm

     Have a look at Rocky’s post that I linked to up above. From memory most of that was either in the post (part of which I have quoted) or in the comments.

     I’d like to tackle the accusation that the film makers have blurred the line between activism and journalism. The two are not mutually exclusive – look at the Hollow Men or Someone Else’s Country or many other examples of the like that I’m sure you can all think of. Examples of brilliant journalism, but nonetheless carried out by people who have their own political biases and agendas.

     Also think about the film makers as they came into this project. Their last film was “The Last Resort”, a documentary about the sell-off of prime New Zealand land to private entities, using the Mahia camp-ground as their central example. The film makers obviously had a left bias, but neither had really been involved with the “activist scene” before. In the journey to make this documentary, they were faced with a stone wall of silence by the police. In interviewing and following the stories of many people, the film makers would have come to know and really feel some of the injustices perpetuated by the New Zealand Police against the people of Tuhoe, and many political activists including the defendants in Operation 8 and other activists interviewed like John Darroch and myself.

     But I really fail to see any point in your question. This is a documentary. It is not meant to be a news article.  While the documentary makers offered opportunities to the police and others to state their side, there was a dearth of take up. Part of that would have been the court case. But that has already dragged on for three and half years with the police fighting any examination of their behavior (and from what I know I can see why).
2. Robert Atack 2

   27 May 2011 at 8:07 pm

   I felt sort of cheated when I heard of the raids, as I knew about 4 people who were raided, even donated over 50 DVDs to the house in upper Willis Street that was seen being broken into (via the wrong door) by the men in black, I had been abusing the idiot politicians for 8 years, had been laying out way scarer information, that (if they were listening) would have pressed some big buttons.
   I had even contacted the SIS several times (they have ‘my’ DVDs in their library), but no knock on the door, which sort of hammered home how insignificant they thought the threat of peak oil is.
   Though I spent about an hour with 2 ‘Ds’ from Auckland once, we had a good talk about where I was coming from and where we were going, I think I managed to depress them, I think I’m down as a harmless nut
   But that was in the ignore/laugh/attack stages of denial … ‘we’ are moving into acceptance mode now.
   Maybe one day mine and others efforts will be recognised by the GDP and they will make the criminals in charge pay, retrospectively.
   Pete and co should get the hell out of Dodge while the getting is good.
   • Squirrel 2.1

     28 May 2011 at 9:02 am

     Look at it from the perspective of a terror cop – the group who were predominantly targeted were Anarchists and Maori sovereignty activists who explicitly challenge the legitimacy of the state and its monopoly on power. Whereas peak oil folk talk about sustainability, community organizing and building resiliency – it can mean the same as what Anarchists and Maori Sovereignty activists want but it sounds a lot less scary. Also Anarchists and Maori sovereignty activists tend to look and dress scarier than peak oil types.

     If you want to get come under surveillance and face police repression here are a couple of quick tips.

     1: Organize a protest which harms a capitalist enterprise in some way (eg a picket)

     Well actually thats all you have to do from my experience.
     • weka 2.1.1

       28 May 2011 at 9:15 am

       Having a full face moko probably helps too.
     • Robert Atack 2.1.2

       28 May 2011 at 5:05 pm

       I walked around town dressed as death, from the greeds HQ in Courtney Place to Parliament Buildings and back, with a scythe over my shoulder with http://www.oilcrash.com written on it, I knocked on the doors of Parliament.
       One of the main reasons for my site is to record who knew what when, I gave up informing the clowns about 2 years ago
       This was my last effort
       On March 3 2008 I delivered 122 DVDs containing 16 YouTube clips and a 65 minute lecture by the late Dr Peter Lloyd called ‘Peak Oil Meets Climate Change’. http://oilcrash.com/articles/you_tube.htm

       The DVD is still available Ben if you want a copy, though there might be a few still around parliament, I’m sure they didn’t take them home 😉 I mean they wouldn’t want their children finding out how pathetic their parents are.

       My hope is enough people will read the utter contempt the last 11 years worth of politicians have treated us and all the information they where given. And make them answer for their crimes, the cops raided the wrong people on the 15th that is for sure.

       I’ve always thought I would know when they were taking me seriously, when the DPS knocked on my door at 3 am, with a load of porn to stick on my computer and a few bags of pot to hide under my bed.
3. weka 3

   27 May 2011 at 10:36 pm

   3 locations in the SI 🙁 Hope the dvd is out sooon.
   • lprent 3.1

     27 May 2011 at 11:25 pm

     Organizing a theatrical release is ‘interesting’ – I am watching one happen now with Lyn. Keep an eye on the films page because it can change at any time – even better have a look for a mailing list.
     • weka 3.1.1

       28 May 2011 at 9:16 am

       I think the local theatre would probably show it, will phone them this week.
4. Treetop 4

   28 May 2011 at 2:54 pm

   The court case will not get to court due to the lapse of time. It will be a win for police being so incompetent in the operation over 18 months. Where have I seen this level of top brass incompetence before? Oh implementing Dame Bazley’s recommendations into her inquiry into police sexual misconduct.
   • terryg 4.1

     30 May 2011 at 12:20 am

     Indeed Treetop, and its about as far from ‘good enough” as is possible to be

     Although I’m not sure which of these things is worse:

     – that 4 years ago Dame MB found the police (paraphrasing) have a rape culture

     – that the police have done nothing to amend said rape culture

     – that the AOS (Assholes On Steroids?) point loaded machine guns at children

     police humour: “you dont have to be a rapist to work here, but it helps”

     I heard a very interesting take on the “terror” raids, from a friends brother-in-law – an ex-army guy who never says what he did (but once while drunk said how far he used to run) and nowadays is a supplier to MOD & police. He said that the army have known about this for decades, have always had men on the inside monitoring them, and that there had been and was no threat – it really was what it looked like (as did the wikileaks cable).

     He also said the army were mightily pissed off when the police got involved – basically the cops got all excited with their post-9/11 super-powers, wanted to play hero, ran off half-cocked and fucked up pretty much everything the army had in place. And very likely “radicalised” a whole bunch of stroppy buggers (Tuhoe are not known for taking shit) that werent otherwise involved, thereby hugely exacerbating the problem they thought they were solving.
5. Sam 5

   28 May 2011 at 4:29 pm

   Was the “then” police minister advised before the raids took place?
   Does anybody know?
   • lprent 5.1

     28 May 2011 at 5:01 pm

     It was likely that whoever it was would have been briefed. I know that Helen Clark was briefed on it shortly before the raids because of the involvement of the security forces and the use of the terrorism legislation.

     But that doesn’t make a lot of difference. They would have been told, but they do not have any direct operational control. Especially for the police operational matters are solely under the control of the police themselves. You should look at the new Policing Act sometime and you will see how strong the separation is. They also call those things briefs for a reason so there wouldn’t have been enough information for a politician to make even a judgement. The court is planning to take about 12 weeks, and most of that will be from material from prior to the arrests (because they found piss-all).

     Suffice it to say, the decision to make that raid wouldn’t have been made by politicians then or now. They do however bear some responsibility for giving the police some Acts that make bugger all sense and appear to have been written purely to inflate the ego’s of some of the idiots in the special police groups to do with counter insurgency and terrorism.
     • Sam 5.1.1

       28 May 2011 at 10:47 pm

       Thanks for that, I wasn’t in NZ when these raids happened.
       After the raids, was there any comment from the then government, or was the excuse “we cannot comment because it is before the courts” used to say nothing?
       • lprent 5.1.1.1

         28 May 2011 at 11:57 pm

         Pretty much the “before the courts”. The only real comment was from the solicitor general when he gave a judgement on the terrorism charges as he tossed them out as unworkable.

         But I wouldn’t have expected anything different from wither that government or this one. It simply isn’t something that I’d like to see happening – the police taking orders from politicians. Bad enough when it was happening with the buddy system that Muldoon used.
         • Treetop 5.1.1.1.1

           29 May 2011 at 2:05 pm

           Can you elaborate on the buddy system that Muldoon used?

           Are you talking about how Muldoon handled Erebus (Collin’s diary disappearing), Crewe murders (planting of cartridge case), Colin Moyle (no police charge laid), all had police incompetence.
6. Foolsgold 6

   29 May 2011 at 9:12 am

   Too bad there is no Hamilton showing, since there were people affected here in the Waikato.

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