Property porn vs. reality

Written By: - Date published: 8:46 am, April 10th, 2017 - 92 comments
Categories: class war, economy, housing - Tags: , , , ,

The Stuff and Herald websites are infested with property porn these days. “How this 18 year old bought 3 Auckland houses” (with just a small gift of $1 million from her parents). That sort of thing. People must click on this nonsense or there wouldn’t be so much of it. Bread and circuses, but what it really does is show how rare it is for any young person to buy a house these days – effectively impossible without significant help of some kind.

So anyway, bravo Liam Dann for providing a dose of reality:

Young house hunters should just give up

Last week’s property statistics were horrible for anyone hoping to get on the property ladder in Auckland.

If you convert that 12.3 per cent rise into dollars (which, unfortunately, is what we have to pay for things with) the average value of a house in the Auckland region rose by $114,000 in the past 12 months.

I’m not sure how many flat whites that is, but if I was young and contemplating the Auckland housing market I’d waste my money on something a bit stronger.

Normal people should probably just give up. If you are on any kind of regular wage then scrimping and saving to buy a house is futile.

Based on the case studies we’ve seen in the media in the past few weeks some young people are so desperate to own a home they are gearing every aspect of their life towards it. They are effectively learning to become property investors in order to get into the market. This is a terrible way to resolve the housing crisis. The last thing New Zealand needs is more property investors.

To quote Dr Oliver Hartwich from economic think tank The New Zealand Initiative: “Booming property markets create a mirage of wealth, not wealth itself.” That’s not a lefty liberal, millennial view. That’s the view of most economic and financial market experts in this country.

The next Government, regardless of which party forms it, needs to confront housing inequality. Otherwise New Zealand will eventually have its own Brexit or Donald Trump-style backlash. …

Yup.

Read that in conjunction with a couple of background pieces, NZ ‘half a million houses’ short, and Auckland needs to double number of new homes – data, (and Bernard Hickey’s 2009 open letter to younger generations is also well worth a re-read).

If only we had a government that could build some bloody houses!

92 comments on “Property porn vs. reality”

  1. gsays 1

    We also could do with some MSM that isn’t owned by banks.

    Surely these ‘property porn’ articles should have a banner on them that shows they are ads or advertorial.

  2. BM 2

    If only we had a government that could build some bloody houses

    I’m still waiting to see how Labour is going to fix “the housing crisis”? not just talking points but an actual plan with a timeline.

    • Ad 2.1

      The policies are the stuff you vote on.
      You get business plans once people are in power and have budgets in front of them.

      Which parts of Labour’s housing plan do you disagree with?

      • BM 2.1.1

        The policies are the stuff you vote on.
        You get business plans once people are in power and have budgets in front of them.

        Right there I’d say that’s a term gone, so 3 years before the great Labour housing plan kicks into action.

        If Labour is actually serious, they’d have at least fleshed out how they are actually going to go about building 100,000+ homes.

        I’m not that interested in the nitty gritty of budgets but I’d expect to see a feasible plan before I voted for labour otherwise I’d be struggling not to think they’re full of it and just playing politics.

        Things I want to see explained are

        1. Land
        2. Materials
        3. Trades

        • Ad 2.1.1.1

          It will be at least two years to see lots of houses built that can be attributable to a Labour-led government.

          Might possibly be boring for you people who like it all simple, but:

          – The most successful state development this century, Hobsonville, took a complete false start from Anderton and MED to get going, and houses were in the ground about 4 years after.

          – There is no capacity in the public sector to run a really large scale Public Works-type housing build scheme. A new government will take a while to build it up again.

          – The domestic construction sector is pretty stretched and the apprenticeships to gear it up are small compared to the need.

          The fastest thing the state can do – and even this can be slow on Appeal – is secure large tracts of land through the Public Works Act for housing purposes. eg collections of older housing on Wellington’s Adelaide Road or Auckland’s Dominion Road, for multi-storey flats and apartments. One good apartment block on Auckland’s Albert Street takes a year through design and consents, and about 18 months to build and fit out.

          Don’t let anyone tell you it will be fast. The word “fast” can’t be found in “construction”.

          All you can go on at election day is policies, plus some sense of how good the Ministers will be in the hot seat.

          • BM 2.1.1.1.1

            I agree with what you’re saying this is a hard fix and it’s going to take a long time.

            Which is why comments such as If only we had a government that could build some bloody houses! is idiotic beyond belief.

            The real sticking point is going to be getting enough people to construct housing, for me, there are only a few options.

            I) Government buys out a couple of building companies and then uses this newly created government entity to build states houses which can then also be
            used as a vehicle to train up as many apprentices as possible.

            The private sector is run off its feet and doesn’t have the time to train people, the government needs to step in here and do it as fast as possible.

            2) Not sure if feasible, but make changes to the building code to incorporate as many of the overseas building standards as possible, that way builders can just jump on a plane with their gear get off the plane and start building.
            Wouldn’t it be great if you could get some of those massive American firms down here building whole towns, they bring the guys and the materials and away they go.

            3) Hire the Chinese to come and build everything.

            • Barfly 2.1.1.1.1.1

              “Which is why comments such as If only we had a government that could build some bloody houses! is idiotic beyond belief.”

              Maybe if we have a government that ends the mass importation of people as a GDP stimulus then.

            • Psycho Milt 2.1.1.1.1.2

              I agree with what you’re saying this is a hard fix and it’s going to take a long time.

              And yet you prefer a government that has done and intends to do a total of 0 about it to one which has at least stated an intent to do something about it. Go figure.

            • Draco T Bastard 2.1.1.1.1.3

              Which is why comments such as If only we had a government that could build some bloody houses! is idiotic beyond belief.

              The government used to build houses – lots of them. We didn’t have so much of a housing issue then so it’s obviously not idiotic.

              The private sector is run off its feet and doesn’t have the time to train people,

              It has the time – it just doesn’t want the expense as that cuts into profits.

              Not sure if feasible, but make changes to the building code to incorporate as many of the overseas building standards as possible

              Wow, I can image the whinging of the building industry as they had to up their game.

              Wouldn’t it be great if you could get some of those massive American firms down here building whole towns, they bring the guys and the materials and away they go.

              Hire the Chinese to come and build everything.

              Yeah, no.

              We need to be able to support ourselves in a sustainable way and using foreign labour and businesses like that isn’t sustainable either financially or economically.

            • Keepcalmcarryon 2.1.1.1.1.4

              What crap BM.
              Firstly we are short on tradies because it’s easier for big developers to import labour than train and use locals under the nats neoliberal job exporting mantra.
              Your options are selectively shit.
              what about ” turn off the immigration tap?” ” build apartment complexes” ” tax investors and land bankers properly” ” begin re nationalising banks”
              all doable if government actually wanted to fix the problem.

          • Greg 2.1.1.1.2

            I disagrees there will be a case for automation and
            Modernisation
            Of the building industry and it won’t come from national
            The other side is house hold debt is a basket case after 9years of BM
            government a dig fat zero

          • Draco T Bastard 2.1.1.1.3

            One other thing the government could do is buy some 3D printing machines that can build houses, start up some R&D to produce them and put in place the necessary regulation of them.

            As you say, the construction industry is stretched so we need to train more builders but we also need to reduce the number of builders needed.

            Don’t let anyone tell you it will be fast. The word “fast” can’t be found in “construction”.

            QFT

          • Gosman 2.1.1.1.4

            The question then becomes why doesn’t the State just do this already and release land for development.

            • Draco T Bastard 2.1.1.1.4.1

              It did – when it compulsory acquired the houses in Avondale for a motorway.

              Oh, wait…

              Then, of course, it’s not really the government’s job to make developers rich. It’s the governments job to make the development sustainable which simply releasing land won’t do. It’s obvious to those with half a brain that it’s not more sprawl that we need but to build up.

        • Anthony Rimell 2.1.1.2

          BM:
          Things I want to see explained are

          1. Land
          2. Materials
          3. Trades

          BM: For your assistance, and straight from Labour’s web-site.

          “Create an Affordable Housing Authority to fast-track development in our cities

          Labour will establish an Affordable Housing Authority to work with the private sector to cut through red tape and get new homes built fast. It will partner with private developers, councils and iwi to undertake major greenfields and revitalisation projects, building affordable homes with KiwiBuild and the private market. These homes will be part of great communities built around parks, shopping centres and transport links.

          Build 100,000 affordable homes across the country

          Labour’s KiwiBuild programme will build 100,000 high quality, affordable homes over 10 years, with 50% of them in Auckland. Standalone houses in Auckland will cost $500,000 to $600,000, with apartments and townhouses under $500,000. Outside Auckland, houses will range from $300,000 to $500,000.

          Growing the Building Workforce

          Increased house-building will require a larger workforce. Labour’s Dole for Apprenticeships policy will subsidise employers to take on around 4,000 young people for on the job training in fields including building and construction. Labour’s policy of three years free post-school education will see tens of thousands more people study in all fields, including building and construction. KiwiBuild is projected to create 5,000 new jobs at its peak.

          Remove barriers that are stopping Auckland growing up and out

          Labour will remove the Auckland urban growth boundary and free up density controls. This will give Auckland more options to grow, as well as stopping landbankers profiteering and holding up development. New developments, both in Auckland and the rest of New Zealand, will be funded through innovative infrastructure bonds.”

    • ianmac 2.2

      Way back then, you could get your first house on a Housing Corporation Loan at modest interest. My sister did so in the 50s, built a 4 bedroom house and 40 years later she was paying $3.50 per week to end the loan as inflation had turned her huge 1pound.10shillings per week into such a tiny amount.
      Today could her sons get such a deal?

      • BM 2.2.1

        Probably not.

        The issue is though even if super cheap loans were available where’s the land, the materials and the builders going to come from.?

        If you ain’t got those three you haven’t got a house.

        • mauī 2.2.1.1

          Housing NZ has acres of bare land sitting there waiting to be developed after they went on bulldozing spree under the nats. People are rightly wondering what the hell is going on.

          The materials are controlled by a monopoly, the government can break that by entering the market.

          If the government incentives new builds then you get more builders doing that and rejecting alteration work as they’re milking it on government contracts. I really don’t think this is that hard.

          • Gosman 2.2.1.1.1

            They should sell the land then if they can’t develop it themselves.

            • Draco T Bastard 2.2.1.1.1.1

              No they shouldn’t. They should build on it and rent out houses cheaply – as is their actual purpose for existing.

              • ropata

                NZ has lost a lot of builders, hundreds of chippies have been screwed over by dodgy developers and the building supplies cartel. National’s leaky homes debacle (and its stupid deregulation of timber treatment) killed off a lot of the industry. The demise of apprenticeships doesn’t help. The requirement for Master Builder certs doesn’t help either. Also Councils should accept some liability if their building inspectors are useless.

                The speed of the Christchurch residential rebuild was encouraging, but this crisis doesn’t affect Nat voters so it’s bottom of their priority list. Pizza is more important to Blinglish

                • BM

                  Framing timber is never supposed to get wet.

                  The issue was more about the cladding systems not the timber.

                  • ropata

                    Yeah but houses are not 100% weathertight they are supposed to breathe. Crappy cladding was one factor, over reliance on silicone and use of untreated timber were definitely a part of it
                    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=3250748

                  • Draco T Bastard

                    Wow, you do talk some bollocks.

                    The framing timber will get wet because the air is wet and it’s in an enclosed dark space which means that untreated timber will simply rot.

                  • McFlock

                    That would be because responsible architects and engineers are happy if the structure is destroyed because only one element fails?

                    • BM

                      I don’t quite understand the point you’re making?

                    • McFlock

                      yeah, I can tell.

                      A building with failed cladding is one thing.

                      A building with failed cladding and rotten structure is another thing entirely – having experienced delayed cladding repairs, my brother ended up going overboard and replacing the perished timber with H4 studs lol. Only just got it in time. Helluva a lot more work than paint and plaster inside.

                      If you just go “well, the cladding should have been replaced earlier”, you’re right. But it doesn’t actually stop the problem happening again, because sooner or later someone will have a financial thing, or some other reason for delays a few months or years longer than strictly desirable. With treated timber the penalty for failure (or being an imperfect human) is less severe.

                    • BM

                      A cladding system like cement board or poly when direct fixed to untreated timber will fail.

                      Brick veneer houses with an air cavity and eaves will not.

                      I’m guessing your brother’s house was poly or cement board?

                    • McFlock

                      nope. Just old. It was a do-er upper.

                      But that’s the thing: you’re parsing the specific instance with guesses here, and talking about flashings for KJT’s specific experiences there… all you do is demonstrate that there are many reasons the cladding might leak, sometimes even for a long time.

                      There are therefore many reasons that framing should be treated to minimise rot.

                  • KJT

                    Bullshit. Water always gets in. It was a combination of both.
                    You would be surprised how many older houses had leaks. I can say this for a fact after renovating so many of them. However ventilation and rimu framing, and later boric treatment of pine, saved them.

                    Stupid cladding and flashing systems specified by cladding manufacturers after a quick buck, privatised building inspection and untreated timber were all to blame.
                    Leaving the poor bloody builder, and homeowner to carry the can, of course.

                    The politicians ultimately responsible for the fiasco should have been held personally responsible.

                    But, as usual, the advocates of personal responsibility, for others, never take personal responsibility. That is only for the “poor people”.

                    • BM

                      Did water get in because the flashings failed?, cladding rotted?, roof leaked because it was rusty?

                      These are issues that arise because of lack of maintenance not so much building design.

                    • ropata

                      Wow all the homeowners out of pocket $200K+ will be so glad to know it wasn’t the fancy mediterranean designs that were all the rage in the 90s (and the fly by night developers) are not to blame.

                    • Draco T Bastard

                      The politicians ultimately responsible for the fiasco should have been held personally responsible.

                      But, as usual, the advocates of personal responsibility, for others, never take personal responsibility. That is only for the “poor people”.

                      QFT

                    • KJT

                      Water ALWAYS gets in.

    • lprent 2.3

      …but an actual plan with a timeline.

      You mean just like the ‘plans’ that National has been lying with? Rather pointless isn’t it?

      National show a complete failure of imagination because of their ideological stupidity that prevents them from actually doing anything constructive. Their limit of ‘planning’ appears to end at giving their donors at SkyCity more room by forcing TVNZ to give up their space to mythic convention centre at that does nothing for Auckland.

      Similarly they refuse to curtail immigration now that our nett migration figures are so high due to kiwis coming back. I guess because they get so many donations from well-heeled immigrants.

      But building houses for those who need them using the resources of the state appears to violate their religion. Regardless of the fact that this has been the only way that NZ has ever gotten enough houses to adequetely house our population over the last century.

      National appears to only have plans on how to get donors, and how to try to create the pretence that they ever do anything constructive. Nick Smith, with housing and environment is just the classic for National on the latter. How many times now in the last 3 years has he promised that the house build rate (not the meaningless consent rate) in Auckland would increase?

      Labour has already had housing plan up for many years. Until Labour can change regulation, legislation, and actually budget for it – that is as far as an opposition can go.

      National as the government can go a lot further. They appear to do what you do – try to blame everyone else. As a strategy it is great for spinning PR – and generally lying. But is that how YOU run a organisation or a business?

      • Draco T Bastard 2.3.1

        They appear to do what you do – try to blame everyone else. As a strategy it is great for spinning PR – and generally lying.

        QFT

        • marty mars 2.3.1.1

          + 1 yep a great nesting spot for the depraved and despicable – ignore the nothing the gnats are doing and then whine about the opposition.

        • greywarshark 2.3.1.2

          I would imagine that when National is interviewing for new MPs they have a test to check if the hopeful can sell an unpopular policy by lying.

          Listening to Nick Smith saying untenable things with a firm tone and apparent certainty and then Paula Bennett on the notion that anything that goes wrong in the regions is due to local authorities not attending to duties, and nothing to do with central government, just gets my toes twitching. Oh for winklepickers as the shoe fashion now.

  3. roy cartland 3

    What’s the point of building houses without any rules around who gets to buy them? If I was one of these speculators, I’d just buy all the new ones as well.

    If you aren’t living in it, you pay. Heaps.

  4. Keith 4

    We are now 40000 houses short in Auckland worse than when National finally started taking this crisis vaguely seriously 2 or 3 years back.

    40000. See, you can never catch up, the theory of supply and demand being the problem in Auckland can never be fixed the way this country is run, it is there to exacerbate and feed the housing frenzy, designed to keep investors happy and house prices at bay.

    It is also no small detail that we don’t have the infrastructure for an extra 40000 dwellings, much less what we have now. By my observations and use of it Auckland’s southern motorway it now runs more or less at peak capacity for 12 hours or more in parts and were it not for Auckland’s clogged suburban streets to use to avoid our motorways it would be even worse. The Waterview tunnel IS delayed because NZTA KNOW the North Western will be gridlocked by it at least and are simply putting off the evil day.

    Many of our beaches are polluted and simply dangerous to swim at, not because of sharks but because of raw sewer that spews into them. Why, because our sewerage system was not designed to handle the population.

    And yet the FOREIGN (not kiwis coming home) immigration tap remain fully open as does the tourism.

    And now the Otago Lakes District houses are some 14 times more than the annual low wage in NZ.

    The only plan is cheap growth through massive uncontrolled immigration to keep National in power. Any thought for New Zealanders by addressing these problems could cause the housing bubble to burst and National know its curtains for them if that happens. So National put National first.

    • Hanswurst 4.1

      And yet the FOREIGN (not kiwis coming home) immigration tap remain fully open as does the tourism.

      Surely Kiwis coming home would put exactly the same strain on existing infrastructure as foreigners arriving.

      • Keith 4.1.1

        Obviously nowhere near as bad and there is nothing we can do about that now is there?

        But what we can control is non kiwi’s but the Nats attitude is yeah, nah, fuck it it will harm the housing bubble and cheap labour pool.

    • fisiani 4.2

      40,000 houses short. Seriously Where did they go? Are 40,000 families homeless? How can you expect to be taken seriously when you spew up such a ridiculous number>

    • fisiani 4.3

      If only we had a government that could build some bloody houses. We do!
      National has a comprehensive package of measures underway to address the challenge of housing supply and affordability.

      Our package includes:

      Creating special housing areas in high demand areas across New Zealand to fast-track the building of homes.
      A $1 billion Housing Infrastructure Fund to accelerate new housing in the high-demand areas where it’s needed most. The new fund will focus squarely on financing infrastructure like roads and water needed to support new housing.
      Setting up independent Urban Development Authorities to speed up housing development in high-demand areas – they’ve proved successful in many other countries.
      Reforming the Resource Management Act to make it easier for councils and developers to get houses consented and built.
      Tightened rules to ensure people buying and selling property for profit pay their fair share of tax.
      Requiring Councils to ensure land supply for housing keeps pace with growth.
      Passed legislation to restrict Council development charges to reduce the cost of building.
      There are no quick fixes – these issues are longstanding – but there are positive signs we’re making good progress.

      Our results so far:

      85,000 new houses to be built in this term of Parliament.
      40 houses built every working day in Auckland, four times what it was when we were elected.
      Over 28,000 building consents issued in year to May 2016 – double the number of five years ago.
      Over 2,000 homes to be built on Crown land we’ve freed up in Auckland and Christchurch.
      209 special housing areas created across New Zealand to speed up development of an estimated 70,000 homes.
      12,000 New Zealanders helped into their first home in the year to March 2016 with HomeStart grants from the Government of up to $20,000 for a couple to put towards buying their first home.
      Around 2,000 homes to be built on redeveloped Housing New Zealand land over the next two years.
      42,000 apprentices currently in training and we’re funding 8,000 more apprentices and trades training places across the country over the next four years.
      40,000 more people working in the construction industry across the country than two years ago.
      The best way to address housing affordability is to build more houses and build them faster and we have a comprehensive programme underway to help make this happen

      • UncookedSelachimorpha 4.3.1

        I guess that long post explains why affordable housing is so completely out of reach for so many people.

        Remember John Key was making strong statements about NZ’s housing crisis in 2007. And it has only gotten worse, much, much worse.

      • Barfly 4.3.2

        Joseph Goebbels ghost is alive and living in you isn’t he. “The big lie” just keep repeating it

      • KJT 4.3.3

        Fisiani fiction.

        • saveNZ 4.3.3.1

          Yep in till people start quoting code of compliance amounts (not the ‘futures of resource or building consenting)’ and deducting all the buildings that are being knocked down or just being re built due to leaky housing, earth quakes and floods – aka not really an extra house at all!

          I’m pretty sure that there are few ‘new’ houses in real terms, which is why we have a housing crisis that the Natz are not aware of.

          Not buying that Fisiani fiction either!

      • patricia 4.3.4

        Building thousands of houses in the over $600K price range is never going to address the lack of housing for low income or homeless people. What is needed is the construction of a great quantity of HNZ homes.

  5. jcuknz 5

    I got a nice leaflet the other day outlining Labour’s ideas …. Little was dressed properly as opposition leader should be rather than in a pink vest and the text was full of great ideas….. then I remembered the ‘No tax increases’ they announced recently and shook my head in disbelief. You got to be joking for sure.

    • Barfly 5.1

      Remember JK increasing GST? That wasn’t a tax increase it was a “rebalancing”. No one has gotten labour to rule out “rebalancing” taxes have they?

  6. saveNZ 6

    They need to stop immigration apart from refugees (who actually need a new country to live in) until there is enough houses already built and for sale at a level a teacher can afford.

    Building more houses for economic development and economic migrants is not only NOT going to get the average person a house in this country, it is going down a road that can not be undone, that the rest of the world have. Thankfully we in NZ don’t have that problem and we still have clean water and air and our kids don’t live disconnected in a concrete jungle. That will go with more people.

    NZ evolved without predators. Our native birds can’t even fly. We have a unique ecosystem and like the Amazon, isn’t about time people value that – and not see a piece of forest or undeveloped land and think what a waste, we could fit another 25,000 people or cows in there?

    Already we are cutting down an ancient Kauris so that someone can put in double car parking in Titirangi and our RMA law is designed to do that. And anyone (migrant or not) who disagrees is going to get a criminal conviction under the National government and there is much more to come with the water irrigation schemes and so forth.

    Those that look down on the Palm plantations in Indonesia and think that’s bad. Have a look in your own country.

    • Once ..whatever 6.1

      “They need to stop immigration apart from refugees (who actually need a new country to live in) until there is enough houses already built and for sale at a level a teacher can afford.”
      But, but, but that’d surely destroy that private tertiary export sector – you know….the one where international students from poor families (having had the importance of education drummed into them) beg, borrow, mortgage the family home come to NZ to do shitty courses – where they’re lied to, given false information, pay enormous fees (to consultants, INZ and education institutions), and are then blamed and either deported, or have visa applications declined so that the next intake can keep the bullshit going. “Flushing the pool” as one lawyer put it. We can even change the rules midway through the game to ensure it keeps the ticket clippers and bullshit artists happy.
      No matter the consequences:
      – the damage done to NZ’s reputation
      – the indebtedness of the student and/or family
      – the driving down of wages where students are driven to do whatever in order to survive (and try and pay back their debt)
      – the enabling of abusers pimps, traffickers, bad employers, etc.

      No no no – fuck the refugees! We’ve got to keep the education export sector going, just as we do the fishing industry abusing the rules and its employees
      (/sarc)

  7. Herodotus 7

    Perhaps there are others out there who are seeing changes in the market.
    From my observationsin the sector there has been a change over the last 5-6 months as builders are not having the demand for design and build. To those not on the sector that means that builders have to fund the spec homes, as with a design and build the client funds the build with progress claims. Putting strain on the builders cash flow also increasing the stock available to the market. This with my observation of properties increasingly not selling at auctions.
    and over the last week or so the herald’s number of articles like this
    From $30k deposit to $1m planned portfolio in a year: one couple’s story
    But what wasn’t included in a very misleading headline was “”We borrowed 60 per cent of the purchase price. The rest of it came from parents as an equity gift,” he said.”
    http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11835327

    • Barfly 7.1

      Yeah it’d be Herald click bait or just headlining a meme of “there is no housing problem” …or both

  8. adam 8

    And still no talk about the impact of this free market on housing producing incredibly large inflationary pressures on low and middle income families. Out of touch much….

    • Once ..whatever 8.1

      +1
      Spin doctors, the gNatzis and Granny Herald are working on an explanation as we post.
      Granny is in meltdown. Just before I came in here to TS, I saw a headline – internet housing porn (the subject of this post). However when I returned to Granny, once again it had vanished in Barry Soper style. I imagine they’re tearing their hair out now wondering how they can reconcile Dann’s article .v. the porn they temporarily shuvved on the website. (it was about some 23yo that had ‘almost lost all hope’ – until probably rich mummy and daddy came to the rescue as guarantor or deposit – something they’d failed to ascertain at time of publication).
      Indeed! – out of touch much. Well NO ekshully – by design, right up until the time some ‘feral’ calls bullshit and makes them look a bit ridiculous

  9. Janet 9

    The main type of immigrant we get now are the acquisitive kind not the kind our nation was built by; the ones who wanted to build a better country and who slaved and sacrificed to do so. I largely built my own house – hands and money – on weekends and holidays and in between ! Does nobody do that anymore , it saves a lot of money?
    Step one: shut immigration down to only the experience we actually need here. Burst the bubble if there is a bubble to burst and let the avaricious speculators suffer.
    Step two : Heavily tax ill gotten speculative gains which will help fund the next step because this is a true example of
    “He who possess a surplus possess the goods of another”

  10. Wow so many want to shut down immigration or at least the wrong kind of immigration when they got here because of immigration and if relatives were overseas that’d be bleating on about reuniting families and stuff.

    Good old kiwi pricks are doing the property porn you know not the immigrants ffs.

    Meanwhile the real issues and causes of the property shit sandwich of capitalism, exploitation and commodification gets swamped by dire immigrant stories

    • saveNZ 10.1

      What dire immigrations stories? There are none. Capitalism has led to neoliberalism and that ponzi scheme needs more people to keep it afloat. The MSM loves immigration, occasionally we get a story about someone who has their workers working for nothing or someone buys and sells a house on the same day for $300k extra, but apart from these small grumblings on immigration, the MSM love and support it.

      MSM are running the property porn stories to tell the next generation that not all is lost with the current system, they too (with parents help) can step aboard the property express and earn $1000 a day from their property purchase to make up for their declining wages. Neoliberalism works for all see!

      The new neoliberal economists like Morgan, think that by taxing the proceeds everything will be peachy as well. (However looking at the UK tells a different story).

      The issue for the Natz and free marketer puppets is that we did not have enough competition. You know when the crap job was there and people had a working welfare system they could say no. The only way to get capitalism working was to get more people in to ‘compete’ against each other. Otherwise neoliberalism dies as the 1% gather all the money, they take it off everyone else and then it just stops because no more new money. Quantitive easing only goes so far.

      See Kiwi’s are not competitive enough. We need a boot up our arses – like being made homeless unless you too compete for your spot on the street or make that job fighting out 200 other applicants and of course welfare was made to be below the cost of living as a punishment.

      And with the competition for houses, apparently we are 500,000 short, our intake of migrants was not surprisingly around 500,000.

      It’s the more subtle version on housing, but in keeping with “the mother of all budgets” against the unemployed to make them competitive, and the employment contracts bills to make the employed more competitive. Now we need the consumer shortages to make people better consumers.

      The neoliberals need the shortages and competition to make their theories work. It’s a disgusting but effective ruse that the righties and free marketer puppets are using successfully.

      You can be pro migrants but against neoliberal immigration in my view. That’s the space that the left seem to be missing.

    • ropata 10.2

      Immigration is not the only factor but it’s a big one. Should be cut by 50% as Auckland cannot sustain current levels, infrastructure is already in crisis mode and people are living in cars FFS

      However I don’t blame immigrants for wanting to come here, good on them. The Nat’s mismanagement, collaboration with the FIRE industry, and free market dogma has completely fscked up the NZ property market. The fact it’s in the newspaper shows that this national disaster is even beginning to affect upper middle class urban liberals. I expect English will have some tricks up his sleeve to try and paper over the crisis in time for the election.

  11. McFlock 11

    At least they’ve got a current one this time.

    Fair cop to him, worked hard, saved, got the deposit that would buy a house in the regions.

    But then he was also only paying $50/wk room and board from his parents, so that’s a fair few grand from them as well.

    • dv 11.1

      And the bank lent a 19 year old 200k.
      Bet the parents have guaranteed the loan!!

    • Antoine 11.2

      Well, it’s one person’s experience.

      It may be useful inasmuch as it reminds some young people that houses can be much much cheaper in the regions.

      A.

      • McFlock 11.2.1

        Actually, the big reminder is that putting off tertiary education can be the best option if you can get a fulltime job.

      • Sabine 11.2.2

        and unemployment is sky high in the regions.

        and oh, btw, speculators have arrived in the regions, buying houses up, keeping them empty or with rents demands that are simply not relative to the market.

        I.e. a commercial property in Whakamaru empty for at least a year now and then some, for 28.000 a year, plus Gst, plus outgoings, plus line costs for electricity and such.

        lol.

        and Taupo….so expensive that the only businesses catering to tourists on the waterfront are KFC, Mac Donald, Lone Star, Hollywood Cafe, Burger Fuel etc….cause there is no one that could afford the leases privately. But Taupo also offering a grant of up to 25.000 a year for businesses to settle in the region. The disconnect is just mind blowing.

        its not just houses that are out of the reach anywhere (Rotorua with its empty statehouses right next to the big Mall Development) but also commercial properties .
        It seems that what is build is not build to be rented / tenanted but is build for speculative gain and as tax write offs.

        • saveNZ 11.2.2.1

          Yep soon NZ will just be a strip mall with off shore chains and food outlets in all the major streets and only because the corporations can somehow pay zero taxes around the world semi- legitimately in many cases.

          Often the people running the franchise or what have you are pretty much indebted labourers for the head honchos running the show. They then feel the need to cut corners and costs. pay the minimum and barely keep their heads above water too. Since it’s all tax deductible it’s really the local tax payers supporting the routs.

          Local businesses or locals paying real taxes can’t really compete.

          The richest people seem to play with stuff that is not even real – like John Key a futures or foreign exchange trader or what ever he was. But he was known as the smiling assassin so presumably before he decided to be NZ PM he loved to screw people over back in the day .

          We now have the legacy of his dream of the NZ tax haven where billionaires are lured in by hiding their loot and can buy a forest, farm or two and a ski lodge in NZ on route and the helipad negates the need to see the growing homeless on the streets.

          It’s hard to see how that is sustainable as an economy but I guess you only need to think in the short term these days as a PM. When the going gets rough you can bail out with life long tax payer perks, selfies with presidents and another clip on the CV and networking ladder and giving tired and washed out ‘motivational’ speeches to big business for big $$$.

        • Antoine 11.2.2.2

          Sure, if a young person wants to buy cheap in the provinces then they need to find an area where houses are still cheap _and_ they can find work. Obviously the likes of Taupo and Queenstown are right out.

          (This approach certainly wouldn’t have worked for me at the same age, but when it works for some people that is great.)

  12. Not related but ,…

    RIP John Clarke.

    Weve lost an icon.

  13. The answer is prefab houses made in the factory then erected on sight. London did it in the post wars years ,To day with the technology we have we could have well built houses mass produced ,Phil Twyford
    will know all about this .Labour will certainly be /looking at the way they could erect safe well constructed houses in the factory, which will also
    employ many semiskilled workers .

  14. AsleepWhileWalking 14

    The answer is sweat equity with subsidies for those who are impaired. Stop the bloody consumer consciousness that requires lifetime payment, including retirement.

    The other answer is to stop subsidies to landlords via the Accommodation Supplement. Market rent is clearly not market rent once the government becomes involved and we would be fair better off paying a lump sum for a home than ever spiraling rents.

    • saveNZ 14.1

      That’s where a UBI might work. Without being chained into geographical areas for crappy jobs, people could live in the back of beyond and probably not cost the tax payer any different if you removed all other subsidies like accommodation benefit.

      The difference would be quality of life and relief from the relentless bureaucracy of welfare and subsidies (from accommodation, working for families and DPB, unemployment etc) for citizens.

      It could kick start a new economy of people following their dreams and callings. Many jobs of the future are not even dreamed of at present. Look at the Internet and where that has taken the world. It’s really only been mainstream for 25 years, but now taken over everything.

      And any one who shares Bill English views of the benefits of a low wage economy – look fucking around – even those who have money and accommodation are not better off with run down schools, health system, Typhoid, desperate petty criminals, 60 hour working weeks and poisoned water.

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